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Speaker 1: Life audio, and I'm going out a park on the corner.

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Speaker 1: All these kids are cruising and I hear the voice

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Speaker 1: of God. I don't say it very often, like it's

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Speaker 1: almost an audible thing. Build it and they'll come. I went,

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Speaker 1: that's the Kevin coshnermany.

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Speaker 2: So I'm here with my friend Michael W. Smith. Really

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Speaker 2: a true legend. He has had a forty year career.

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Speaker 2: He's been nominated for Grammys fifteen times? Is that right? Fifteen?

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Speaker 2: I think I don't know, okay? And one four times?

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Speaker 2: Is that right? Three? Three? Is that all? Come on?

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Speaker 1: Man?

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Speaker 2: Three Grammys, forty double awards? Does that sound right? Eighteen million?

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Speaker 2: This is just designed to embarrass you. Eighteen million albums

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Speaker 2: sold more than thirty six number one songs on the radio.

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Speaker 2: But the best thing about Michael W. Smith is he

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Speaker 2: has given his gift to God and he glorifies the

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Speaker 2: Lord with his life, with his music, with all that

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Speaker 2: the Lord has given. Well, Michael, thanks for being here.

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Speaker 2: You're welcome, man. It's honor. You just got off a

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Speaker 2: plane and here you are. You know, I was thinking

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Speaker 2: about how you first were introduced to Christian music, in particular,

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Speaker 2: I saw you talk about it. You went into some

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Speaker 2: little bookstore and you saw we call Him Marinatha one

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Speaker 2: that was called The Everlasting.

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Speaker 1: Living Jesus Music.

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Speaker 2: Very unusual title. Yes, And of course I was there

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Speaker 2: at Calbrey Choppel and watching those bands live, you know,

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Speaker 2: and then that album came out, and so you were

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Speaker 2: what state were you in when you saw this?

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Speaker 1: Thirteen thirteen, I was writing songs. I was still playing baseball,

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Speaker 1: and you want to be a professional baseball player.

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Speaker 2: But I kept writing songs.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And I was buying all the Elton John and

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Speaker 1: the Beatles and so Sage and so music was sort

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Speaker 1: of starting to really take the whole told me because

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Speaker 1: I kept thinking, maybe this is what I'm supposed to do.

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Speaker 1: And then at thirteen, I walked in that store looking.

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Speaker 2: For a Beatles record and it was your favorite Beatles record.

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Speaker 1: Oh gosh, that's a hard one, hard day's night.

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Speaker 2: Maybe, yeah, I love Really it was the beginning.

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Speaker 1: I remember going to Davidson's Record shopping buying the forty five.

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Speaker 2: I still have it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, thanks to my mom and dad. I want to

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Speaker 1: hold your hand.

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Speaker 2: And I saw her standing there.

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Speaker 1: I have had both those singles.

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Speaker 2: Ya, those are great songs. Yeah, I stood the test

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Speaker 2: of Time, Billy Joel Too meaning artists scenes from an

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Speaker 2: Italian restaurant. That whole piece is in crowd, brilliant.

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Speaker 1: But when I got when I saw that record and

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Speaker 1: it said that the big bread Marion office eye, and

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Speaker 1: I flipped it over and they all had long hair

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Speaker 1: singing about Jesus. And I remember, and I remember, I

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Speaker 1: can tell you every detail about that moment.

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Speaker 2: I remember going, that's what I wow did just from

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Speaker 2: looking at the cover because of the music.

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Speaker 1: Because I would think I was saying. Then fifteen, I

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Speaker 1: knew that's what God wanted me to do. But I

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Speaker 1: kept loving the and John records and loving the Kansus

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Speaker 1: records and going, well, why can't you make pop music

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Speaker 1: and sing about Jesus? And so when I saw that

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Speaker 1: they were doing it, then yeah, you know that might

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Speaker 1: it might not be my style because I was up

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Speaker 1: sort of more in the pop vein and stuff, but

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Speaker 1: that was my goal. I'm going to go get a

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Speaker 1: record deal. I'm going to make pop music.

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Speaker 2: Thirteen said I'm going to get a record deal.

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Speaker 1: Well, no, I said, that's what I want to do. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: at fifteen, I knew that God, that God really was

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Speaker 1: calling me to do that.

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Speaker 2: I'll never forget it. You're raising the Christian home. I

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Speaker 2: was you wrote a book talking about things you learned

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Speaker 2: from your father. Yeah, and what was your father's name? Paul? Paul?

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Speaker 2: And so at what age were you when you made

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Speaker 2: a commitment of Christ where you understood what you were

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Speaker 2: doing or was it consistent back to your youth?

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Speaker 1: No, I knew what I was doing when I was ten.

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Speaker 1: It was a it was a it was an epiphany.

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Speaker 1: I mean I was like, it was like I was

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Speaker 1: with my buddies on the back pew wow, had heard

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Speaker 1: the message over and all of a sudden, the light

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Speaker 1: bulb went off, and I remember going, oh, my gosh,

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Speaker 1: he really is who he said he was.

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Speaker 2: Wow.

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Speaker 1: And I got up and walked down the aisle, and

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Speaker 1: all my buddies were going, what's he doing, dude?

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Speaker 2: What are you doing? You know?

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Speaker 1: And it was real And then fifteen that's only second

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Speaker 1: time I walked down the aisle and I told Stan Franklin,

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Speaker 1: who was my pastor who baptized me. I said, I

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Speaker 1: think God's called me in the music, and he laid

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Speaker 1: hands on me and prayed for me.

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Speaker 2: Wow.

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Speaker 1: And then I lost my way at seventeen, I thought

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Speaker 1: I could play with a fire, and I get burned.

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Speaker 1: From seventy five to seventy nine, I almost died from

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Speaker 1: a drug overdose.

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Speaker 2: I've written all let's the first time. So seventeen is

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Speaker 2: the age I was when I came to Christ. So,

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Speaker 2: but seventeen was the age you were at when you

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Speaker 2: had a prodigal turn? What was it that pulled you

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Speaker 2: away away from your faith or was there something that

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Speaker 2: was drawing you? I know it evolved dropping I think.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think that. I mean, the whole thing began

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Speaker 1: at thirteen, and the Jesus movement found it in the

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Speaker 1: Canova Westrontiaca of all places. And so but while I

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Speaker 1: was thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, all my buddies were smoking pot

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Speaker 1: and drinking fire. So all my friends were college age,

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Speaker 1: and we were all meet almost every single night, having

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Speaker 1: Bible studies and playing Jesus music in people's living rooms.

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Speaker 1: And I was on fire with this big wooden cross.

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Speaker 1: I was a Jesus freak.

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Speaker 2: And then all those.

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Speaker 1: People all went off to college and got married, and

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Speaker 1: I didn't have a support team, and I just and

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Speaker 1: I started kind of hanging out with the wrong people. Yeah, maybe,

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Speaker 1: you know, maybe I can do a little bit of that.

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Speaker 1: Maybe I could play with the fire. And I got deceived.

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Speaker 1: This is my favorite name for the devil. I mean,

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Speaker 1: he's the great deceiver, and I think he was trying

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Speaker 1: to kill me and he sucked me in. And then

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Speaker 1: all of a sudden that the fourth year of that

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Speaker 1: prodigal period, when I almost lost my life from crazy

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Speaker 1: drug overdose, I knew that there was a call all

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Speaker 1: my life and Devil's trying to take them out. So

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Speaker 1: I'm here, I believe with every fower of my being

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Speaker 1: because of my mom and dad who never gave up

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Speaker 1: on me and pray for me every Yeah, probably not

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Speaker 1: to the extent, probably not the deep stuff, but they

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Speaker 1: knew I was in trouble and they never kicked me

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Speaker 1: out of the house. He never came down on me.

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Speaker 1: They just kept loving me. And yeah, so what was

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Speaker 1: the drug that you almost overdose times? It was THC.

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Speaker 1: It was some wow tranquilizer and I thought it was

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Speaker 1: cocaine and it was something else. My blood's rushing out

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Speaker 1: inside of my nose and the guys trying to clean

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Speaker 1: me up, and the two days I was like, you know,

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Speaker 1: my brain was fried.

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Speaker 2: Wow, And that's when I knew.

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Speaker 1: That's when I begin to pray, God, do whatever you

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Speaker 1: have to do to get my attention, because I think

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Speaker 1: You've got to call my life and I'm supposed to

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Speaker 1: live and bring Kingdom down to earth. And long story short,

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Speaker 1: I hit rock bottom nineteenth November in nineteen seventy and

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Speaker 1: I'd lost my joy. I got depressed. It's really never

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Speaker 1: been depressed in my life.

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Speaker 2: And I had rock bottom and.

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Speaker 1: I convulsed and twisted and I having probably had a

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Speaker 1: nervous breakdown on my linoleum floor in that apartment in

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Speaker 1: Nashville and for three and a half hours from like

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Speaker 1: midnight till three thirty in the morning. And then I

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Speaker 1: was just like I was sore, so worn out, and

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Speaker 1: I felt like be on a shallow doubt that Abba

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Speaker 1: was laying on the floor with me with his arm

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Speaker 1: around me. So it's gonna be okay.

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Speaker 2: And I haven't been the.

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Speaker 1: Same, yeah, since that day.

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Speaker 2: So you know in your book The Way of the Father,

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Speaker 2: lessons I learned from my dad teos about God. So

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Speaker 2: your father really reflected the Father and the prodigal Son's story.

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Speaker 2: Welcome the Son home, even when he went astray. So

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Speaker 2: your dad, Paul was key in that. Both my sons

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Speaker 2: went prodigal, both got into drugs. And my oldest son, Christopher,

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Speaker 2: has been in heaven some time now, many years, like

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Speaker 2: eighteen years. And in fact, I remember after it happened,

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Speaker 2: you called me. I don't know if you remember that,

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Speaker 2: but I really appreciated that. And but he got into drugs,

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Speaker 2: but recommitted his life to christ was walking with the

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Speaker 2: Lord when the Lord called him home unexpectedly. But his

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Speaker 2: younger brother was really in the drugs. Jonathan and Christopher

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Speaker 2: was having a conversation with him, and he said, Jonathan,

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Speaker 2: what's it going to take for you to not do

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Speaker 2: this anymore? I've already been down this road. You don't

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Speaker 2: want to do this. What's it going to take? And

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Speaker 2: Jonathan determined he was going to have another conversation with

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Speaker 2: his brother Christopher, and then Christopher was gone. And I'm

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Speaker 2: not saying that's what it took, but the reality is

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Speaker 2: is that event changed Jonathan's life and he recommitted his

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Speaker 2: life to the Lord. He's a pastor now at our church.

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Speaker 2: He's been walking with the Lord for many years. But

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Speaker 2: you know those sometimes it's been said when you get

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Speaker 2: to the end of yourself, you get to the beginning

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Speaker 2: of God. You know quick?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Great? Yeah? Yeah. So have you carried the lessons you

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Speaker 2: learned from your father Paul onto being a parent yourself?

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Speaker 2: I think I have. You seem like you'd be a

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Speaker 2: really good dad to me. I love you. It does

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Speaker 2: Michael W. Smith ever lose his temper? Do you yell? Yes?

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Speaker 1: From time to time? Yes, but you know, not too often,

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Speaker 1: but I do. I mean, you know, you know way

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Speaker 1: we all do, you know? And I love you a dad.

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Speaker 1: I love being a grandfather.

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Speaker 2: How many grand kids do you have? Twenty? Last time

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Speaker 2: I saw you was not that many.

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Speaker 1: Well we thought we were holding at eighteen, but you know,

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Speaker 1: it went up two more.

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Speaker 2: Do you know all their names? I do. That's incredible birthdays.

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Speaker 1: I have to look at the calendary.

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Speaker 2: Wow. Yeah, now you know all twenty names. That's impressive. Yeah. No,

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Speaker 2: what a blessing that is.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So you got into music. You love the mayor not

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Speaker 2: the record you're I think you started out as a

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Speaker 2: session player, right, but you weren't really we would call

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Speaker 2: it artists. Yeah, you were writing songs. So I was

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Speaker 2: writing songs.

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Speaker 1: That's sort of That's how I got started, was I

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Speaker 1: wrote a song for Truth, and then I wrote a

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Speaker 1: song for Sandy Patty was just how much just gets

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Speaker 1: your name? And then I met a girl named Amy

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Speaker 1: Grant and started writing songs for her Age to Age record.

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Speaker 2: Yes, so you were a keyboard player, and did she

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Speaker 2: sort of launch you and the music?

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Speaker 1: I would say I wouldn't be here if for her.

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Speaker 2: And have you been able to do that for any

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Speaker 2: other artists as you've been successful like people.

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Speaker 1: You Well, I have, but I mean I don't want

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Speaker 1: to brag about that, but I mean there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of people that well. Jarza Clay Ratt Marr was on

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Speaker 1: the road with me, Jordan Smith from American Idol. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: willing to do little on the Christmas tour. Gosh, I

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Speaker 1: can go on Leland too, right, I mean, who's that

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Speaker 1: Leland too?

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Speaker 2: Leland?

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Speaker 1: I mean we actually didn't go on the road together,

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Speaker 1: but we we wrote songs together, and I record a

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Speaker 1: lot of the songs.

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Speaker 2: You know. So one of the people you worked with

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Speaker 2: early on or maybe later in your career, it was

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Speaker 2: Billy Graham and you know, and I was actually there

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Speaker 2: at that time. I've been on this board for probably

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Speaker 2: thirty years and I was helping him at that point

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Speaker 2: because Billy was in his later years and I was

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Speaker 2: just starting our Crusade ministry. So he said, I want

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Speaker 2: you to help me with my messages and help make

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Speaker 2: them more contemporary. So I was going through his messages

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Speaker 2: and I was giving him fresher illustrations. I remember one time,

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Speaker 2: this marks it in time where it was I found

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Speaker 2: a lyric from Smashing Pumpkins called rat in a Cage

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Speaker 2: and so I don't remember the lyrics, but it was

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Speaker 2: something to the effect I'm just a rat in a cage.

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Speaker 2: Something too other lad or two. So I put it

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Speaker 2: in there and I put a little note Billy Smashing

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Speaker 2: Pumpkins is the name of a band, because I didn't

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Speaker 2: want to think it was literally someone smashing pumpkins. And

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Speaker 2: it was in Minneapolis when he delivered that line. It

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Speaker 2: was one of the greatest moments of my life because

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Speaker 2: it was like anything I could do to help Billy.

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Speaker 2: You know, we all loved him, but I know that

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Speaker 2: he decided he wanted to reach younger people. This was

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Speaker 2: a conflict on the board. I was on the board

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Speaker 2: at the time, and there were board members that were

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Speaker 2: adamantly against it. I would say, no, you guys got

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Speaker 2: to do this, this is the best thing.

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Speaker 1: And it was you Cleveland Stadium nineteen ninety four.

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Speaker 2: Did you guys ever do an event? It seems like, oh,

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Speaker 2: where was it? Georgia? Did you do it at Georgia

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Speaker 2: as well? Well?

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Speaker 1: Well, probably, I'm trying to think, because I know we

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Speaker 1: did Minneapolis, we did we.

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Speaker 2: I mean Cleveland was the beginning of many.

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Speaker 1: So every Billy Graham crusade from that point on Saturday

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Speaker 1: night was night and so I did probably ten, eleven, twelve.

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Speaker 2: Thirteen, and then a phased out.

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Speaker 1: I got a little older, and they pulled in some

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Speaker 1: younger bands to do it, and that night was That's

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Speaker 1: the top five for me anything in my life was

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Speaker 1: that night.

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Speaker 2: You would do a particular song before he would come

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Speaker 2: out and speakudn't you? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: And I'm trying to think, I'm trying to remember what

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Speaker 1: that song is. I should know what that song was.

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Speaker 1: Think I may not have introduced him.

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Speaker 2: That night was I find your Way you and the

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Speaker 2: song about finding your way home or something, I'll lead

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Speaker 2: you home. I'll lead you home. That's it. That's what

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Speaker 2: I recollected. That's it. Yeah. Yeah. And then and the

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Speaker 2: funny thing is I remember, like you guys would be

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Speaker 2: out and do your thing, and then Billy would come out.

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Speaker 2: When I thought was so cool is Billy didn't like

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Speaker 2: dress in a contemporary way. He just stressed like Billy,

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Speaker 2: which was a suit. Yeah, And he came out and

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Speaker 2: he probably got the biggest applause of the night.

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Speaker 1: Oh he did, because he was just standing ovations.

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Speaker 2: Yes. Yeah, And you got to know him too, didn't

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Speaker 2: he I did. That's a privilege, the stories of just

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Speaker 2: tell me a couple uh well, nothing like Billy laying

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Speaker 2: ANNs on you and praying for it.

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Speaker 1: But I would go visit him, yes, and his home,

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Speaker 1: in his home yeah, uh montreat. I would play that

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Speaker 1: attitude piano and love on him and Ruth. Ruth were

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Speaker 1: still alive, and then Ruth passed and then it was

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Speaker 1: Billy and then I would just I just kept going back,

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Speaker 1: maybe couple times a year, sometimes three, and we would

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Speaker 1: just talk. And then he got weak and they just

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Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, he's in a wheelchair and

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Speaker 1: so and then but he always prayed for me, you know,

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Speaker 1: And so then I started setting up the piano beside

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Speaker 1: his wheelchair in the bed, bring electric piano. I play.

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Speaker 1: Always favorite him. And then the last two times he

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Speaker 1: couldn't pray for me, because that's all I have prayed

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Speaker 1: for him. It's just like you should have going. I

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Speaker 1: can't believe I'm doing this, you know. But he I

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Speaker 1: know he could hear me, and he would I could

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Speaker 1: hear him try and go home because we put the

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Speaker 1: headphones in so I could hear me a little better,

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Speaker 1: you know, And so I always kind of feel back.

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Speaker 2: I always called him Billy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and but but out of respect, I think he's

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Speaker 1: probably the one to just call me billy.

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Speaker 2: You know, you want to call him doctor Graham. That's

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Speaker 2: what his team called him. He said that they called

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Speaker 2: me Billy. It just Billy is such a it's a

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Speaker 2: southern though. You know, there's Johnny's, there's Billy's, there's and

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Speaker 2: it seems too personal. But but he did want you

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Speaker 2: to just call him Billy. He did.

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Speaker 1: I think we kind of had a lot of things

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Speaker 1: in common, and on some level, he's got five kids,

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Speaker 1: I got five kids. He travels, I travel keeping a

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Speaker 1: family together, and we would talk a lot about our kids. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and then we I guess we talked about a lot

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Speaker 1: of a lot of stuff. You know, sometimes we talk

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Speaker 1: about very few times about politics, but just world affairs,

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Speaker 1: what's going on in the world. But he would always

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Speaker 1: bring it back to this going you know, just Jesus

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Speaker 1: is the only answer there is, and and.

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Speaker 2: We would edify each other. He would really have me.

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Speaker 2: So when I would walk out there, I.

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Speaker 1: Just kind of felt like I was ten feet doggling.

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Speaker 2: I feel he's the most godly men I ever met.

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Speaker 2: I've met a lot of godly men as you have,

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Speaker 2: and women, and but I just felt like, you know,

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Speaker 2: as he got older, he just became sweeter and and

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Speaker 2: he was to me, It's like, I think, as close

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Speaker 2: as you could get on earth, just sitting down with

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Speaker 2: Jesus and having a conversation, you just reflected Christ. I

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Speaker 2: remember one time in this home, Ruth was very ill

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Speaker 2: at this point, and Dennis that a Genian, you know him.

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Speaker 2: Of course, he came over and Billy asked him to play.

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Speaker 2: So Dennis played Uh Handles Messiah, And as he was

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Speaker 2: playing it on the guitar, He's playing it on his guitar.

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Speaker 1: Dom Do Do Doom, Doom.

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Speaker 2: And Billy is is just looking at Ruth and Ruth

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Speaker 2: is just like, even though she was very ill, she

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Speaker 2: was almost like glowing. And I thought, Wow, there's this

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Speaker 2: story here. What's this all about? And then Billy at

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Speaker 2: the song at the end of the song leaned over

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Speaker 2: to Ruth and said, that's a song they played on

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Speaker 2: our first date. Wow. Because he took her to see

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Speaker 2: Andlesmith's and it was such a sweet moment. He loved.

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Speaker 2: They loved each other so much. I saw them disagree too.

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Speaker 2: That was fun, you know, over nothing. She was she

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Speaker 2: was opinionated, she'd speak her mind. She would speak her mind. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And you got to know George W.

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Speaker 1: Bush?

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Speaker 2: And is that because you showed the same initial was

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Speaker 2: that the how did you get an?

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Speaker 1: I met George W through his dad. Oh wow, George

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Speaker 1: h W Yeah. And so I played a Christmas special

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Speaker 1: NBC Christmas in Washington in nineteen eighty nine. President was there,

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Speaker 1: Barbara Bush and met them before there on the front road.

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Speaker 1: I was dying on heaven. I'm playing for the President

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Speaker 1: United States and now. And then after the show we

365
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Speaker 1: thought was over, we back having a party celebrating the thing.

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Speaker 1: And then I had got the President NBC and the

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Speaker 1: Secret Service guy come up says, the President was requesting

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Speaker 1: you and your wife to come to the White House.

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Speaker 1: So we got in the car, ran every red light

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Speaker 1: and pulled up in front of the White House and

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Speaker 1: walked in.

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Speaker 2: How cool.

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Speaker 1: And Barber's telling stories. I'm with the President, NBC and

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Speaker 1: George Herbert Walker Bush and he's giving us the play

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Speaker 1: by play of his conversation with Garbichef on the ship. Wow,

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Speaker 1: he had just gotten back from that.

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Speaker 2: My goodness.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it was like, this is not happening. Then

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Speaker 1: we go in the east room. He said, hey, Michael,

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Speaker 1: won't you listen to some Christmas carols? And so I

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Speaker 1: lost all Christmas carols. And so then he started touching

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Speaker 1: base with me and writing me and said, just let

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Speaker 1: me know when you're Washington, car you got to come

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Speaker 1: and see me. Does this guy do not have anything

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Speaker 1: else to do? And he was me minute?

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Speaker 2: I mean.

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Speaker 1: And so I'd call Patty pre sock assistant, and I

388
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Speaker 1: would go have hot dogs and we'd sit in all

389
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Speaker 1: the office and we chat. I probably visited Dad as much,

390
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Speaker 1: if not more than W.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but I'm the crazy crazy w.

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Speaker 1: Story is that we go to Kenny Buckport because seniors said,

393
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Speaker 1: you got to come to Kenny buck Port.

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Speaker 2: That's great.

395
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Speaker 1: So Devi and I go out and there's George W's

396
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Speaker 1: there and Laura and they're big tennis players and they

397
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Speaker 1: are very competitive. And so it was me and his

398
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Speaker 1: partner in the Texas Rangers, and I've totally gone blank

399
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Speaker 1: on who it was, but it was him and I

400
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Speaker 1: playing father and son and.

401
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Speaker 2: It was fierce. Man.

402
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Speaker 1: They played to win and we beat him and they

403
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Speaker 1: weren't happy.

404
00:19:21,564 --> 00:19:22,324
Speaker 2: That's so funny.

405
00:19:22,445 --> 00:19:24,845
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I thought this would be the last time

406
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Speaker 1: I got invited, but that's where I met w and

407
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Speaker 1: then I got to know him that he obviously became

408
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Speaker 1: governor and then he becomes president, and then I was

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Speaker 1: on the President's prayer team, you know, and prayer for

410
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Speaker 1: the president.

411
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Speaker 2: And then I was on a council for the president.

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Speaker 1: Just a great thing, but honoring people the people don't

413
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Speaker 1: ever hear about that are changing the world, and that

414
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Speaker 1: was I was on that committee for over two years,

415
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Speaker 1: almost three years, and that was that was awesome.

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Speaker 2: Have you met any other presidents?

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Speaker 1: I'll spend some time with Reagan. Yeah, oh no way, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: not a lot. We were the other three, I think

419
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Speaker 1: three four times.

420
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Speaker 2: He was still President.

421
00:20:03,604 --> 00:20:07,205
Speaker 1: No, after we got out out, I met Carter, he

422
00:20:07,324 --> 00:20:11,604
Speaker 1: was already out. So the only really in Obama. You know.

423
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Speaker 1: I met Trump this one time at the Prayer breakfast,

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Speaker 1: you know, but I don't really know him. So but

425
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Speaker 1: it's interesting that the Bush thing, how all that happened,

426
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Speaker 1: and I just remained a friend of the family and

427
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Speaker 1: I still am.

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Speaker 2: That's great. Well, I think that, you know, it's an

429
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Speaker 2: awesome thing to stand in the Oval Office and just

430
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Speaker 2: look around and the history that's in there, and you know,

431
00:20:38,645 --> 00:20:42,164
Speaker 2: you've got some amazing people there, and so what a

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00:20:42,205 --> 00:20:44,644
Speaker 2: great open door. You know. Thinking of Billy Graham, I mean,

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Speaker 2: he had an impact of dramatic impact on the whole

434
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Speaker 2: Bush family. He effectively played a key role in George W.

435
00:20:51,804 --> 00:20:54,244
Speaker 2: Bush coming to Christ, or at least recommitting this I've

436
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Speaker 2: to Christ. And of course he was there in the

437
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Speaker 2: Washington Cathedral after nine to eleven at the request of

438
00:21:01,645 --> 00:21:06,644
Speaker 2: President Bush. George W. Bush, and you know, really influenced

439
00:21:06,725 --> 00:21:09,684
Speaker 2: that family. Yeah, so that's that's a great thing that

440
00:21:09,725 --> 00:21:13,644
Speaker 2: they had. That behind you was a portrait of Johnny Cash.

441
00:21:13,725 --> 00:21:15,204
Speaker 2: I'm sure you met him.

442
00:21:15,685 --> 00:21:18,205
Speaker 1: I did actually did a Christmas show with him with

443
00:21:18,284 --> 00:21:23,484
Speaker 1: Billy Wow, Billy is June and Johnny, George bever Luchet,

444
00:21:24,165 --> 00:21:26,844
Speaker 1: Billy and Ruth and Amy Grant.

445
00:21:27,044 --> 00:21:30,325
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, no, wonderful. I'm sure I saw.

446
00:21:31,484 --> 00:21:33,244
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was the record like in the eighties or

447
00:21:33,244 --> 00:21:35,484
Speaker 1: something earlier, but I think it was the late eighties.

448
00:21:35,524 --> 00:21:38,404
Speaker 1: But I just I couldn't believe. I was like, oh

449
00:21:38,445 --> 00:21:41,405
Speaker 1: my gosh, I'm on this bull stage. I don't think

450
00:21:41,405 --> 00:21:42,965
Speaker 1: it was at the Cove. It might have been at

451
00:21:43,004 --> 00:21:46,324
Speaker 1: the Coke what the Cove was back then? And there's

452
00:21:46,484 --> 00:21:49,484
Speaker 1: Johnny and he was just so delightful and so was June,

453
00:21:49,564 --> 00:21:51,725
Speaker 1: and it was it was a good moment.

454
00:21:52,205 --> 00:21:55,444
Speaker 2: He had such a special voice. You know. People say, well,

455
00:21:55,445 --> 00:21:58,004
Speaker 2: he's country. He is country, of course, but I just

456
00:21:58,044 --> 00:22:00,644
Speaker 2: feel like, there he's just Johnny Cash. Yeah, he's like

457
00:22:00,725 --> 00:22:03,484
Speaker 2: in his own category because no one really sounded quite

458
00:22:03,604 --> 00:22:07,605
Speaker 2: like but nobody, you know, he And even as he

459
00:22:07,685 --> 00:22:12,644
Speaker 2: was older, even when Johnny's health was failing, he's still

460
00:22:13,244 --> 00:22:15,965
Speaker 2: I still like you've been listening to those songs, because

461
00:22:16,284 --> 00:22:20,044
Speaker 2: he would interpret a song and present it in such

462
00:22:20,044 --> 00:22:23,284
Speaker 2: a way where it just it kind of touches you.

463
00:22:23,284 --> 00:22:25,925
Speaker 2: You know, the songs he chosen, the songs he wrote,

464
00:22:25,965 --> 00:22:30,404
Speaker 2: as well, and so what like talking with him privately,

465
00:22:31,165 --> 00:22:32,964
Speaker 2: what was he like hanging out?

466
00:22:33,084 --> 00:22:36,205
Speaker 1: Was very not it's just very gracious. I don't think

467
00:22:36,205 --> 00:22:39,445
Speaker 1: he knew much about me and this earlier in my career,

468
00:22:39,484 --> 00:22:43,364
Speaker 1: and I don't didn't expect him to. But he was

469
00:22:43,645 --> 00:22:46,804
Speaker 1: very cordial and he's very sweet. And I think Debbie

470
00:22:46,844 --> 00:22:50,405
Speaker 1: was there and he had meant to have and and yeah,

471
00:22:50,484 --> 00:22:54,084
Speaker 1: he's the legend and my favorite, I mean, my favorite

472
00:22:54,084 --> 00:22:56,125
Speaker 1: thing I go. I mean, I love the opposite, all

473
00:22:56,125 --> 00:22:58,084
Speaker 1: the old stuff. But I went back and listened to

474
00:22:58,165 --> 00:23:01,244
Speaker 1: her again the other day. It's like, because I have

475
00:23:01,324 --> 00:23:04,925
Speaker 1: a song kind of like that, and I was working

476
00:23:04,965 --> 00:23:05,924
Speaker 1: with my produce You're going to.

477
00:23:07,645 --> 00:23:08,725
Speaker 2: And I can't wait for you hear it.

478
00:23:09,084 --> 00:23:11,764
Speaker 1: But I said, let's go back and let's go back

479
00:23:11,885 --> 00:23:14,325
Speaker 1: and watch the video of her because I want them

480
00:23:14,324 --> 00:23:16,564
Speaker 1: to hear because we're sort of trying to kind of

481
00:23:16,564 --> 00:23:18,884
Speaker 1: skew it in that sort of production. But it was

482
00:23:19,004 --> 00:23:21,644
Speaker 1: I forgot how amazing it is.

483
00:23:22,165 --> 00:23:24,764
Speaker 2: Yeah, the video was as powerful as the song was

484
00:23:26,044 --> 00:23:29,764
Speaker 2: because he showed these old images of himself when he

485
00:23:29,885 --> 00:23:33,404
Speaker 2: was the young, vibrant Johnny, and then he showed himself

486
00:23:33,405 --> 00:23:37,605
Speaker 2: as he was and I was a little shocked by that. Actually, well,

487
00:23:37,604 --> 00:23:39,524
Speaker 2: members of his family didn't want him to do it

488
00:23:40,125 --> 00:23:42,605
Speaker 2: because they thought it didn't present him in the best light.

489
00:23:43,244 --> 00:23:45,564
Speaker 2: But I thought it was a beautiful thing to do

490
00:23:45,645 --> 00:23:48,244
Speaker 2: at that stage in his career. He's making a statement,

491
00:23:49,004 --> 00:23:52,284
Speaker 2: you can have this empire of dirt. I don't want it.

492
00:23:52,365 --> 00:23:55,324
Speaker 2: You know, he's talking about what really matters to him.

493
00:23:55,925 --> 00:23:59,284
Speaker 2: We all need to come to the conclusion. I recently

494
00:23:59,324 --> 00:24:03,004
Speaker 2: did an interview with Rick Rubin. Yeah I heard that. Yeah,

495
00:24:03,044 --> 00:24:05,924
Speaker 2: so it's it's coming out soon's Yeah, I want to.

496
00:24:05,925 --> 00:24:06,324
Speaker 2: I want to.

497
00:24:06,405 --> 00:24:07,284
Speaker 1: I want to see that part.

498
00:24:07,365 --> 00:24:10,405
Speaker 2: He's a really cool guy, and I really very talented. Well,

499
00:24:10,564 --> 00:24:13,205
Speaker 2: no kidding, because I actually know about his work because

500
00:24:13,405 --> 00:24:16,044
Speaker 2: I'm a huge Johnny Cash fan, Okay, and I thought

501
00:24:16,084 --> 00:24:19,284
Speaker 2: that Johnny's American recordings were the best work of his life.

502
00:24:19,484 --> 00:24:22,244
Speaker 2: I kind of feel like Johnny's musical careers like book

503
00:24:22,405 --> 00:24:25,885
Speaker 2: ended Early Johnny, which I loved, and then Later Johnny,

504
00:24:25,925 --> 00:24:28,484
Speaker 2: which I loved, and and Rick, you know, you know

505
00:24:28,564 --> 00:24:31,284
Speaker 2: the story. Johnny was playing this really small venue and

506
00:24:31,365 --> 00:24:33,645
Speaker 2: Rick went to see him and said, Hey, I think

507
00:24:33,685 --> 00:24:35,725
Speaker 2: I could produce you and do something with you. And

508
00:24:35,764 --> 00:24:38,084
Speaker 2: Johnny's looking at this guy with long hair and a beard, like,

509
00:24:38,445 --> 00:24:39,764
Speaker 2: what are you going to do for me that no

510
00:24:39,844 --> 00:24:43,405
Speaker 2: other producer's? Dad said, come over to my house and

511
00:24:43,564 --> 00:24:46,645
Speaker 2: I'll set up some recording the equipment and just play

512
00:24:46,645 --> 00:24:49,445
Speaker 2: your guitar and sing your favorite songs. Well, he ended

513
00:24:49,524 --> 00:24:53,685
Speaker 2: up using those recordings for the actual because he thought

514
00:24:53,685 --> 00:24:56,205
Speaker 2: they were capturing something. So I talked to Rick about

515
00:24:56,205 --> 00:24:58,804
Speaker 2: that and I said, I heard a story that you

516
00:24:58,844 --> 00:25:03,244
Speaker 2: guys did communion together before you would record. He says, oh, yeah,

517
00:25:03,284 --> 00:25:05,564
Speaker 2: that's true. And I said, so, what's the origin of that.

518
00:25:05,645 --> 00:25:09,405
Speaker 2: He said, it was actually my idea that I had

519
00:25:09,445 --> 00:25:13,284
Speaker 2: seen some preacher talking about it on television how important

520
00:25:13,284 --> 00:25:16,044
Speaker 2: communion was. And so I said, Johnny, could we do that?

521
00:25:16,645 --> 00:25:19,484
Speaker 2: And we had communion every time we went into record,

522
00:25:20,044 --> 00:25:22,565
Speaker 2: and then even after you were done recording, we get

523
00:25:22,604 --> 00:25:25,804
Speaker 2: on the phone in two communion together. Wow. So Rick

524
00:25:25,965 --> 00:25:31,044
Speaker 2: is very open wow two spiritual things, very open to

525
00:25:31,084 --> 00:25:34,205
Speaker 2: the gospel. We had a very interesting conversation. I think

526
00:25:34,244 --> 00:25:39,085
Speaker 2: you would be interested. I definitely. So he said, tell

527
00:25:39,125 --> 00:25:43,324
Speaker 2: me about Christian music. I said, well, contemporar Christian music.

528
00:25:43,685 --> 00:25:46,365
Speaker 2: He says, I've just started listening to it. I said, really.

529
00:25:46,405 --> 00:25:49,484
Speaker 2: He goes yeah. I wasn't really that aware of it

530
00:25:49,844 --> 00:25:52,564
Speaker 2: until recently, and so I told him kind of the

531
00:25:52,564 --> 00:25:56,244
Speaker 2: origin story, how we're a covered chapel and the Jesus

532
00:25:56,365 --> 00:26:00,204
Speaker 2: movement was happening. A love song came out and Larry Norman.

533
00:26:00,405 --> 00:26:02,404
Speaker 2: I was kind of telling about all these different people,

534
00:26:02,804 --> 00:26:07,565
Speaker 2: and he said yeah, and then he said, I listened

535
00:26:07,564 --> 00:26:10,484
Speaker 2: to this some of this music, and I feel that

536
00:26:10,725 --> 00:26:13,724
Speaker 2: a lot of it kind of sounds the same, and

537
00:26:13,764 --> 00:26:18,445
Speaker 2: I feel like there needs to be more like conflict

538
00:26:18,564 --> 00:26:21,445
Speaker 2: or things they're dealing with and struggling with. It just

539
00:26:21,484 --> 00:26:24,844
Speaker 2: seems too tidy and neat, almost like a Hallmark movie

540
00:26:24,885 --> 00:26:26,684
Speaker 2: to me, I thought. I said, Okay, I see what

541
00:26:26,725 --> 00:26:29,205
Speaker 2: you're saying. I said, well, some of the earlier music

542
00:26:29,244 --> 00:26:32,364
Speaker 2: goes up maybe a little more graphic. I recited some

543
00:26:32,445 --> 00:26:34,605
Speaker 2: of the lyrics of that song from Larry and Armo.

544
00:26:35,365 --> 00:26:36,645
Speaker 2: Why aren't you looking to Jesus?

545
00:26:36,725 --> 00:26:36,844
Speaker 1: Right?

546
00:26:37,484 --> 00:26:41,084
Speaker 2: I gone to Rhiann Valentine's Day and all that, and

547
00:26:41,685 --> 00:26:43,724
Speaker 2: he was listening and then he said, I want to

548
00:26:43,725 --> 00:26:47,605
Speaker 2: do an outlaw Christian record. I go really, because yeah,

549
00:26:47,604 --> 00:26:52,324
Speaker 2: I said, you should definitely do that. That's fascinating, isn't it. Well, Like,

550
00:26:52,445 --> 00:26:55,284
Speaker 2: I mean, you've been there really from the beginning. You

551
00:26:55,405 --> 00:26:58,445
Speaker 2: discovered it as it was just starting to blossom. Then

552
00:26:58,484 --> 00:27:01,725
Speaker 2: it exploded, then it became an industry, and now it's huge.

553
00:27:02,324 --> 00:27:04,925
Speaker 2: As you look at and I know you're a big

554
00:27:04,965 --> 00:27:08,565
Speaker 2: part of it, but you're an artist and you look

555
00:27:08,604 --> 00:27:11,364
Speaker 2: at you have things you like and maybe things you

556
00:27:11,405 --> 00:27:13,644
Speaker 2: don't like. I don't want you to miss anyone or

557
00:27:13,685 --> 00:27:17,645
Speaker 2: critique anyone, But how do you feel about the general

558
00:27:17,685 --> 00:27:20,804
Speaker 2: direction that Christian music is taking right now? Do you

559
00:27:20,925 --> 00:27:23,685
Speaker 2: like what you're seeing? Well, I wish there was more

560
00:27:23,725 --> 00:27:24,804
Speaker 2: of this less of that.

561
00:27:24,925 --> 00:27:27,604
Speaker 1: Well, I like it that it's popular, and I like

562
00:27:27,645 --> 00:27:30,685
Speaker 1: it because there's millions of people here in the gospel

563
00:27:30,725 --> 00:27:33,085
Speaker 1: for the first time that's true, like the force right thing.

564
00:27:33,165 --> 00:27:37,684
Speaker 1: I mean, that's just a phenomena. I think there's some

565
00:27:37,725 --> 00:27:41,084
Speaker 1: healthy things and I've got some concerns. Yeah, you know,

566
00:27:41,165 --> 00:27:44,804
Speaker 1: it just and it's maybe the social media thing, and

567
00:27:44,804 --> 00:27:48,445
Speaker 1: it just feels like there's a lot of celebrity and

568
00:27:48,445 --> 00:27:50,644
Speaker 1: I don't think we're called to be a celebrity. And

569
00:27:51,405 --> 00:27:54,484
Speaker 1: you can sit there and talk all day long that

570
00:27:54,484 --> 00:27:58,324
Speaker 1: you're not a celebrity, but action speak louder than words

571
00:27:58,365 --> 00:28:00,084
Speaker 1: a little bit, you know, But you know, it's just

572
00:28:00,165 --> 00:28:02,484
Speaker 1: my opinion, and I don't. Again, I don't. I don't

573
00:28:02,524 --> 00:28:04,644
Speaker 1: want to know anybody out of the bus. I go

574
00:28:04,685 --> 00:28:07,004
Speaker 1: back and look at the stuff I did in the

575
00:28:07,044 --> 00:28:09,685
Speaker 1: early days. How many records do we sell? How many

576
00:28:09,685 --> 00:28:11,164
Speaker 1: people are coming to the show? Did we sell out

577
00:28:11,205 --> 00:28:14,084
Speaker 1: the arena? You know, all those immature things that I

578
00:28:14,125 --> 00:28:15,685
Speaker 1: sort of went through, And I don't really care about

579
00:28:15,685 --> 00:28:19,525
Speaker 1: that stuff anymore, you know, so thank god, I'm growing up.

580
00:28:19,564 --> 00:28:23,205
Speaker 2: I'm not all there yet, but you know, I'll just

581
00:28:23,244 --> 00:28:23,524
Speaker 2: say this.

582
00:28:23,645 --> 00:28:26,085
Speaker 1: One of my greatest goals in life, and I'm almost there,

583
00:28:26,125 --> 00:28:28,645
Speaker 1: is that I'll never ever be offended by anyone ever again.

584
00:28:29,205 --> 00:28:31,844
Speaker 2: Wow, And I'm getting there, you know. Really, I'm going

585
00:28:31,885 --> 00:28:33,084
Speaker 2: to try to offend you right now.

586
00:28:34,764 --> 00:28:37,965
Speaker 1: Come on, let's do it. But no, I think there's some.

587
00:28:39,405 --> 00:28:39,645
Speaker 2: Yeah.

588
00:28:39,725 --> 00:28:43,124
Speaker 1: And again I'm trying not to be judgmental. And I

589
00:28:43,165 --> 00:28:45,045
Speaker 1: know I'm like, I'm not the new kid on the block.

590
00:28:45,125 --> 00:28:47,285
Speaker 1: You know, I've been doing this for forty three years.

591
00:28:47,285 --> 00:28:48,805
Speaker 2: Well that's why you should say something.

592
00:28:48,885 --> 00:28:50,765
Speaker 1: Well, I do because I feel like I feel like

593
00:28:51,005 --> 00:28:53,445
Speaker 1: I had this crazy I've known this for a long time.

594
00:28:54,925 --> 00:28:58,045
Speaker 1: Don finto my mentor, who's ninety six years old, Wow,

595
00:28:59,485 --> 00:29:02,164
Speaker 1: has talked to me about this for years that I

596
00:29:02,205 --> 00:29:03,325
Speaker 1: think I'm supposed to father.

597
00:29:04,165 --> 00:29:06,365
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's part part of my role.

598
00:29:07,285 --> 00:29:08,844
Speaker 1: And I think I'm going to continue to make records.

599
00:29:08,885 --> 00:29:11,285
Speaker 1: I think my best work is and I'm having a

600
00:29:11,405 --> 00:29:14,724
Speaker 1: lot of fun doing it. But I don't really care

601
00:29:14,805 --> 00:29:16,644
Speaker 1: if it sales. I don't care if it's the number one.

602
00:29:16,645 --> 00:29:17,605
Speaker 2: I don't care if it's on the radio.

603
00:29:17,645 --> 00:29:20,565
Speaker 1: It's like, so all that stuff is a very freaking

604
00:29:20,565 --> 00:29:22,485
Speaker 1: place to be. I get lots of people, lots of

605
00:29:22,485 --> 00:29:24,725
Speaker 1: these kids comeing. How'd you do it? You're married to

606
00:29:24,725 --> 00:29:27,925
Speaker 1: the same woman for almost forty five years this September.

607
00:29:28,685 --> 00:29:32,845
Speaker 1: How do you surrouse success? And I feel like I'm

608
00:29:32,844 --> 00:29:34,084
Speaker 1: supposed to sew into these We.

609
00:29:34,685 --> 00:29:37,084
Speaker 2: Answer to that question because that is a good question.

610
00:29:38,245 --> 00:29:41,645
Speaker 2: How have you had a long lasting marriage and survived

611
00:29:41,685 --> 00:29:45,445
Speaker 2: all of this? Yeah? Well others haven't. Yeah.

612
00:29:45,165 --> 00:29:47,325
Speaker 1: Uh, well, first of all, I married a great woman, Okay,

613
00:29:47,525 --> 00:29:53,124
Speaker 1: who's a woman of God. Yes, I mean just like

614
00:29:53,844 --> 00:29:57,365
Speaker 1: makes me raise my game up because every morning when

615
00:29:57,405 --> 00:29:59,884
Speaker 1: I walk into the kitchen, she's said the word just

616
00:29:59,925 --> 00:30:03,245
Speaker 1: the old testban dude, She's just in the word every singlemore.

617
00:30:04,165 --> 00:30:05,204
Speaker 2: Her prayer. Life's amazing.

618
00:30:05,245 --> 00:30:07,965
Speaker 1: She's three prayer groups. We have a prayer groups that's

619
00:30:07,965 --> 00:30:13,045
Speaker 1: been together for thirty five years. I've had a mentor

620
00:30:13,965 --> 00:30:15,365
Speaker 1: for forty two years.

621
00:30:15,485 --> 00:30:16,885
Speaker 2: That's a ninety six year old guy.

622
00:30:17,285 --> 00:30:19,565
Speaker 1: He's still alive and still kicking and sharp as ever.

623
00:30:19,725 --> 00:30:20,045
Speaker 2: Wow.

624
00:30:21,205 --> 00:30:25,924
Speaker 1: And then just who do you surround yourself? You surround

625
00:30:25,925 --> 00:30:29,165
Speaker 1: yourself with good people? Are you surrounding yourself with nots

626
00:30:29,165 --> 00:30:33,645
Speaker 1: of good people? And there's ramifications of both of those.

627
00:30:35,165 --> 00:30:38,365
Speaker 1: Surround yourself with great people. Then you got a good

628
00:30:38,445 --> 00:30:40,805
Speaker 1: chance of being able to do this pretty well.

629
00:30:41,165 --> 00:30:43,605
Speaker 2: You know, well, younger Michael found out what happened when

630
00:30:44,084 --> 00:30:46,525
Speaker 2: you got around the wrong people that influenced you in

631
00:30:46,565 --> 00:30:50,285
Speaker 2: a bad way. But then later, God, I think you've

632
00:30:50,325 --> 00:30:53,445
Speaker 2: just revealed part of it, which is you're grounded and

633
00:30:53,525 --> 00:30:57,644
Speaker 2: connected with real people. It's very easy in what you do,

634
00:30:57,725 --> 00:31:01,645
Speaker 2: and even what I do, is to be isolated and

635
00:31:01,725 --> 00:31:04,245
Speaker 2: be in sort of a bubble. And you know, your

636
00:31:04,285 --> 00:31:07,005
Speaker 2: wife's and prayer groups, and you're you have a mentor,

637
00:31:07,084 --> 00:31:09,805
Speaker 2: you have someone you listen to, someone who probably could

638
00:31:09,844 --> 00:31:13,724
Speaker 2: correct you if necessarily you could ask advice from. I

639
00:31:13,765 --> 00:31:16,485
Speaker 2: know you're involved in the church. We've talked about that before.

640
00:31:16,805 --> 00:31:18,884
Speaker 2: Because a lot of times when you're you know, you

641
00:31:18,925 --> 00:31:21,604
Speaker 2: can be a Christian artist traveling all the time, not

642
00:31:21,725 --> 00:31:24,805
Speaker 2: be a part of a church, not be reading your

643
00:31:24,805 --> 00:31:28,204
Speaker 2: Bible every day, not be just living really like a

644
00:31:28,245 --> 00:31:32,164
Speaker 2: normal Christian to start with, because it becomes a career.

645
00:31:32,205 --> 00:31:35,124
Speaker 2: And it's not bad that it's your career, but I

646
00:31:35,165 --> 00:31:38,245
Speaker 2: think it needs to start from your relationship with God

647
00:31:38,325 --> 00:31:39,445
Speaker 2: for it to be effective.

648
00:31:40,165 --> 00:31:45,285
Speaker 1: Well, you have to fight for it, because I'll just

649
00:31:45,325 --> 00:31:48,965
Speaker 1: go on record and say it's a it's a wonderful

650
00:31:49,405 --> 00:31:54,084
Speaker 1: and a strange life. Yes, I mean, it's the perksure golly,

651
00:31:54,365 --> 00:31:56,485
Speaker 1: the fact I get to do what I love to do,

652
00:31:57,604 --> 00:32:00,725
Speaker 1: and that, in my humble opinion, I think music is

653
00:32:00,765 --> 00:32:05,084
Speaker 1: the most powerful universal language in the world, and that

654
00:32:05,205 --> 00:32:08,684
Speaker 1: you're music has completely changed millions of people. That blows

655
00:32:08,685 --> 00:32:13,565
Speaker 1: my mind, and I know that's not me. But then

656
00:32:13,685 --> 00:32:16,685
Speaker 1: it's the sort of accolades and all the people put

657
00:32:16,725 --> 00:32:19,965
Speaker 1: you on a pedestal and to done, and then you

658
00:32:20,084 --> 00:32:24,805
Speaker 1: try to lower the temp on the celebrity thing, and

659
00:32:24,925 --> 00:32:28,045
Speaker 1: sometimes that doesn't always work, and then you don't go anywhere.

660
00:32:28,525 --> 00:32:30,885
Speaker 1: And then and then I like being by myself. If

661
00:32:30,965 --> 00:32:35,364
Speaker 1: I'm an introvert and an extrovert you know, yeah, and so,

662
00:32:36,365 --> 00:32:38,884
Speaker 1: but I know every night I do. I do it

663
00:32:38,965 --> 00:32:42,245
Speaker 1: every night when I go out there on God. I

664
00:32:42,285 --> 00:32:45,165
Speaker 1: know this is not about me. So two things I'm

665
00:32:45,205 --> 00:32:48,925
Speaker 1: gonna walk. I'm I'm clothing myself with humility to me

666
00:32:49,765 --> 00:32:53,005
Speaker 1: and let my posture be beautiful to you. And any

667
00:32:53,805 --> 00:32:57,525
Speaker 1: admiration or any stuff coming at me, I just I

668
00:32:57,604 --> 00:33:00,084
Speaker 1: deflect it. I just deflect the glory because I know

669
00:33:00,165 --> 00:33:02,405
Speaker 1: this is not about me. So may you be glorified

670
00:33:02,725 --> 00:33:04,605
Speaker 1: everything I say and everything I do.

671
00:33:05,725 --> 00:33:07,965
Speaker 2: Well, you know, coming back to Billy Graham, I mean,

672
00:33:07,965 --> 00:33:10,445
Speaker 2: he is one of the probably the most famous person

673
00:33:10,445 --> 00:33:13,325
Speaker 2: I ever met. And I spent time with him as

674
00:33:13,325 --> 00:33:15,325
Speaker 2: you did. And I remember one time we did a

675
00:33:15,365 --> 00:33:18,644
Speaker 2: crew say, well he's preached. I was just there Portland, Oregon.

676
00:33:19,245 --> 00:33:21,685
Speaker 2: So we come off the stage and there are people

677
00:33:21,725 --> 00:33:24,084
Speaker 2: lined up on both sides, you know, just in awe

678
00:33:24,205 --> 00:33:26,885
Speaker 2: of Billy. Like it's almost like Moses was walking into

679
00:33:26,925 --> 00:33:28,404
Speaker 2: the midst of the bill. He's kind of had his

680
00:33:28,485 --> 00:33:31,084
Speaker 2: head down. And we get in the car and so

681
00:33:31,165 --> 00:33:34,045
Speaker 2: Billy's in the back seat, Franklin's sitting next to him.

682
00:33:34,245 --> 00:33:37,644
Speaker 2: I'm writing Shotgun. You may remember T. W. Wilson, he

683
00:33:37,725 --> 00:33:40,325
Speaker 2: was driving the car. So we're driving out, so I

684
00:33:40,445 --> 00:33:43,045
Speaker 2: turned around back. I said, Billy, that was a great

685
00:33:43,084 --> 00:33:47,325
Speaker 2: message tonight. He looks at me and says, well, it's

686
00:33:47,565 --> 00:33:53,205
Speaker 2: just gospel. We turn back around. Well, I know, they

687
00:33:53,245 --> 00:33:57,084
Speaker 2: thought maybe i'll talk about a particular point. Billy said,

688
00:33:57,245 --> 00:34:00,965
Speaker 2: I loved it when you said Christ can resensitize your conscience.

689
00:34:01,084 --> 00:34:04,445
Speaker 2: And Billy said, well he can. I just turned back around,

690
00:34:04,604 --> 00:34:08,565
Speaker 2: So here's my lesson. And he didn't want to be complimented.

691
00:34:08,645 --> 00:34:11,484
Speaker 2: He did his job now. But then we go back

692
00:34:11,525 --> 00:34:15,205
Speaker 2: to his hotel room and someone gave us some roast

693
00:34:15,205 --> 00:34:17,405
Speaker 2: beef sandwiches at the beginning of the night, which were

694
00:34:17,445 --> 00:34:20,085
Speaker 2: not completely cold. So we go back to his home.

695
00:34:20,125 --> 00:34:23,005
Speaker 2: We're going to eat these sandwiches. Billy disappears in a room,

696
00:34:23,085 --> 00:34:25,885
Speaker 2: comes back out in his pajamas, in his dress shoes,

697
00:34:26,245 --> 00:34:28,844
Speaker 2: so I guess he left his slippers at home. He

698
00:34:28,925 --> 00:34:31,645
Speaker 2: was surrounded by these guys he's known for years. They're

699
00:34:31,645 --> 00:34:35,365
Speaker 2: telling old stories, they're laughing, like he wanted to be

700
00:34:35,565 --> 00:34:39,405
Speaker 2: just regular guy. And I thought, this is really an

701
00:34:39,405 --> 00:34:41,805
Speaker 2: important key. And I was with him at public places

702
00:34:41,805 --> 00:34:45,285
Speaker 2: and people would approach him. He was always approachable. How

703
00:34:45,325 --> 00:34:47,685
Speaker 2: are you in fact, when you talk to Billy, you know,

704
00:34:47,725 --> 00:34:49,645
Speaker 2: you would ask him questions. So Billy, tell me about

705
00:34:49,645 --> 00:34:51,605
Speaker 2: when you met gold in my ear, or tell me

706
00:34:51,605 --> 00:34:54,605
Speaker 2: about when you met Muhammad Ali. And he would say

707
00:34:54,645 --> 00:34:56,605
Speaker 2: a couple of things, and then he'd say, tell me

708
00:34:56,645 --> 00:35:01,205
Speaker 2: about yourself. But it was genuine, right. Those are great qualities.

709
00:35:01,925 --> 00:35:05,205
Speaker 2: So that's good to be aware of that, you know.

710
00:35:05,485 --> 00:35:08,725
Speaker 2: I think in the early days of the Jesus Movement,

711
00:35:09,125 --> 00:35:13,125
Speaker 2: a lot of our songs spoke to non believers. Really,

712
00:35:13,165 --> 00:35:16,445
Speaker 2: I think in its inception, it was designed to just

713
00:35:16,565 --> 00:35:20,365
Speaker 2: express what we were experiencing. So these musicians, you know,

714
00:35:20,445 --> 00:35:22,605
Speaker 2: wrote these songs that talked about it. Love sung. As

715
00:35:22,645 --> 00:35:25,125
Speaker 2: an example, they had a song two Hands, you may

716
00:35:25,165 --> 00:35:28,485
Speaker 2: remember it. The lyrics. We're all gathered here because we

717
00:35:28,565 --> 00:35:30,965
Speaker 2: all believe. If there's a doubt or in the crowd,

718
00:35:31,005 --> 00:35:33,405
Speaker 2: we ask you not to leave. Give a listen to

719
00:35:33,445 --> 00:35:36,125
Speaker 2: the story, hear the message that we bring. Let the

720
00:35:36,205 --> 00:35:38,884
Speaker 2: face all up inside you lift your voice with us

721
00:35:38,925 --> 00:35:42,285
Speaker 2: and sing, accept them with your whole heart, and use

722
00:35:42,325 --> 00:35:44,805
Speaker 2: your own two hands. With one, reach out to Jesus

723
00:35:45,085 --> 00:35:47,325
Speaker 2: with the other. Bring a friend. So if you would

724
00:35:47,365 --> 00:35:49,365
Speaker 2: go to church, you would sit there and kind of

725
00:35:49,365 --> 00:35:51,925
Speaker 2: hear the gospel, and so what I would like to

726
00:35:51,965 --> 00:35:54,605
Speaker 2: see more of in Christian music. I love the praise,

727
00:35:54,725 --> 00:35:58,085
Speaker 2: I love the worship. It's fantastic. We have it in

728
00:35:58,165 --> 00:36:01,685
Speaker 2: the Crusades, and I think it just moves people powerfully

729
00:36:01,885 --> 00:36:05,125
Speaker 2: and prepares their heart for the gospel. But I would

730
00:36:05,165 --> 00:36:09,445
Speaker 2: like to hear more songs almost addressed to a non believer,

731
00:36:10,005 --> 00:36:13,645
Speaker 2: say this is what has happened. Could be testimony, it

732
00:36:13,685 --> 00:36:17,005
Speaker 2: can be gospel proclamation done in an artistic way.

733
00:36:17,205 --> 00:36:18,725
Speaker 1: You know, I totally agree.

734
00:36:19,005 --> 00:36:21,405
Speaker 2: You know, you should write a song about when you

735
00:36:22,165 --> 00:36:25,645
Speaker 2: were seventeen years old and having the drug over this

736
00:36:25,725 --> 00:36:28,085
Speaker 2: because no one would expect a song like that from you,

737
00:36:28,605 --> 00:36:30,485
Speaker 2: but I mean that's part of your life and kind

738
00:36:30,485 --> 00:36:33,725
Speaker 2: of like you know, because it's been said, success builds

739
00:36:33,765 --> 00:36:37,405
Speaker 2: walls and failure builds bridges. You know, when you're all

740
00:36:37,445 --> 00:36:39,045
Speaker 2: that in the bag of chips and I've had all

741
00:36:39,085 --> 00:36:41,765
Speaker 2: these great things happen. Okay, you're successful. Who can relate

742
00:36:41,805 --> 00:36:44,965
Speaker 2: to that? But when you talk about struggles and failures,

743
00:36:45,525 --> 00:36:46,725
Speaker 2: everyone can relate to that.

744
00:36:46,925 --> 00:36:49,725
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have a couple songs like that on my record.

745
00:36:50,005 --> 00:36:53,845
Speaker 1: You're writing, Yeah, wow, it's not released yet, but okay,

746
00:36:54,005 --> 00:36:57,085
Speaker 1: pretty like that pretty raw. Well, that's that would be

747
00:36:57,125 --> 00:37:01,245
Speaker 1: surprising and powerful, and so I encourage you to continue

748
00:37:01,285 --> 00:37:03,725
Speaker 1: on doing that. Than you So you started something called

749
00:37:03,805 --> 00:37:04,404
Speaker 1: rocket Town.

750
00:37:04,445 --> 00:37:05,205
Speaker 2: Tell me what that is?

751
00:37:05,645 --> 00:37:09,405
Speaker 1: You do? Crazy story nineteen ninety one. I was in

752
00:37:09,405 --> 00:37:12,125
Speaker 1: a little red Miata. Thought I was having a midlife crisis.

753
00:37:12,165 --> 00:37:17,045
Speaker 1: Probably not, but there was a cruising problem in Franklintonnessee,

754
00:37:17,165 --> 00:37:22,045
Speaker 1: where I live, and they started doing curfews, and I

755
00:37:22,245 --> 00:37:26,405
Speaker 1: just thought, and let me just back up and say that.

756
00:37:26,765 --> 00:37:29,445
Speaker 1: I thought, if the whole music thing doesn't work out

757
00:37:29,485 --> 00:37:32,445
Speaker 1: for me, I'm going to be a youth pastor.

758
00:37:32,485 --> 00:37:34,844
Speaker 2: Wow, that's so cool because of what I went through.

759
00:37:35,165 --> 00:37:38,405
Speaker 1: Yeah, I can identify, and I think I can so

760
00:37:38,445 --> 00:37:41,645
Speaker 1: I can identify the whole drug thing whatever whatever. Nineteen

761
00:37:41,685 --> 00:37:44,605
Speaker 1: ninety one, I just released Go I Show a Man record,

762
00:37:45,525 --> 00:37:46,964
Speaker 1: and I going out and I park on the corner.

763
00:37:47,005 --> 00:37:51,285
Speaker 1: All these kids are cruising and I hear the voice

764
00:37:51,285 --> 00:37:53,005
Speaker 1: of God. I don't say it very often, like it's

765
00:37:53,045 --> 00:37:57,005
Speaker 1: almost an audible thing. Build it and they'll come. I went,

766
00:37:58,445 --> 00:37:59,525
Speaker 1: that's the Kevin costnerman.

767
00:38:01,445 --> 00:38:02,924
Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel it's fill of dreams.

768
00:38:02,965 --> 00:38:04,965
Speaker 1: I can't hear it. Build it, they'll come. Build it.

769
00:38:05,005 --> 00:38:05,404
Speaker 2: They'll come.

770
00:38:06,045 --> 00:38:08,485
Speaker 1: And I thought, and I started flushing out my egg

771
00:38:08,565 --> 00:38:13,485
Speaker 1: on bill facility and impact the youth of the city,

772
00:38:13,965 --> 00:38:16,885
Speaker 1: not just Franklin, but Nashville, and I did all this research.

773
00:38:16,925 --> 00:38:18,925
Speaker 1: They said it wouldn't work. We opened up in ninety

774
00:38:18,925 --> 00:38:22,245
Speaker 1: four in a little coffee house and we moved to

775
00:38:22,285 --> 00:38:26,365
Speaker 1: this church that gave us their building, and we had

776
00:38:26,605 --> 00:38:29,205
Speaker 1: six hundred people show up the first night. No advertisement

777
00:38:29,325 --> 00:38:31,405
Speaker 1: had the big things waving in the air, the big lights,

778
00:38:31,445 --> 00:38:34,765
Speaker 1: you know, and it was back then it was the rave.

779
00:38:35,125 --> 00:38:37,605
Speaker 1: The rays were the big thing, the whole dancing thing.

780
00:38:37,765 --> 00:38:40,085
Speaker 1: So we just tried to pull kids in, tried to

781
00:38:40,125 --> 00:38:46,364
Speaker 1: make it very non Christian from you know.

782
00:38:46,365 --> 00:38:48,805
Speaker 2: Being like a Bible club.

783
00:38:48,925 --> 00:38:51,285
Speaker 1: We were trying to attract kids who don't know the Lord,

784
00:38:52,085 --> 00:38:54,445
Speaker 1: and we made lots of mistakes God trying to be

785
00:38:54,525 --> 00:38:57,245
Speaker 1: all things to all people. And then it's a long story.

786
00:38:57,285 --> 00:38:58,725
Speaker 1: I'm going to write a book about it one day.

787
00:38:58,725 --> 00:38:59,525
Speaker 2: But what are we closing?

788
00:38:59,605 --> 00:39:03,765
Speaker 1: Ninety seven Columbine happened. We were still meeting people kids

789
00:39:03,805 --> 00:39:06,645
Speaker 1: in coffee houses, and Columbine happened. And I came back

790
00:39:06,685 --> 00:39:10,285
Speaker 1: and thought, if we had had a rocket town in Littleton, Colorado,

791
00:39:10,285 --> 00:39:12,364
Speaker 1: I think we could have prevented that tragedy. So we

792
00:39:12,405 --> 00:39:17,845
Speaker 1: reopened and I had a very good friend who I

793
00:39:17,845 --> 00:39:20,245
Speaker 1: can't say his name, I'll tell you later, who said

794
00:39:20,245 --> 00:39:23,125
Speaker 1: I'll match whatever you can raise. Wow in three months,

795
00:39:23,125 --> 00:39:26,525
Speaker 1: and we raised two point three million dollars and then

796
00:39:26,885 --> 00:39:29,565
Speaker 1: he matched it with two point four George Herbert walker

797
00:39:29,605 --> 00:39:33,285
Speaker 1: Bush was my campaign chairman, AH, and we built this

798
00:39:33,365 --> 00:39:36,325
Speaker 1: facility in downtown Nashville. We had to move one time,

799
00:39:36,405 --> 00:39:39,364
Speaker 1: just three blocks away, and we're still in the heart

800
00:39:39,405 --> 00:39:42,685
Speaker 1: of Nashville. Everything is brand new around us. They've torn

801
00:39:42,765 --> 00:39:45,405
Speaker 1: everything down and we're right in the heart of it.

802
00:39:45,445 --> 00:39:47,525
Speaker 1: And we're seeing kids come to Christ every single week.

803
00:39:47,605 --> 00:39:49,805
Speaker 2: So that's been going on a long time, long time.

804
00:39:50,285 --> 00:39:52,445
Speaker 2: There's a quote you gave him an interview. The greatest

805
00:39:52,525 --> 00:39:55,525
Speaker 2: joy of my life is not another music award, but

806
00:39:55,685 --> 00:39:59,485
Speaker 2: hearing a kid tell me I was contemplating suicide, but

807
00:39:59,565 --> 00:40:01,844
Speaker 2: I came to Rocket Town, heard the truth, and got

808
00:40:01,925 --> 00:40:04,285
Speaker 2: love done. That's a good statement. Don't get much better

809
00:40:04,285 --> 00:40:05,444
Speaker 2: than that. And you've seen that happen.

810
00:40:06,645 --> 00:40:07,685
Speaker 1: Weeks happened.

811
00:40:07,725 --> 00:40:10,285
Speaker 2: What's more important saving life?

812
00:40:10,405 --> 00:40:11,605
Speaker 1: Yeah?

813
00:40:11,645 --> 00:40:11,925
Speaker 2: Wow.

814
00:40:13,405 --> 00:40:16,404
Speaker 1: We have indoor skate park and there's there's a church

815
00:40:16,445 --> 00:40:18,885
Speaker 1: that beats here. We have a we have a music studio,

816
00:40:18,925 --> 00:40:21,085
Speaker 1: we have a dance deal. We have after school programs

817
00:40:21,445 --> 00:40:23,965
Speaker 1: and out kids were starving. We have a food program.

818
00:40:24,165 --> 00:40:26,404
Speaker 1: We have a lot of kids for the projects that come.

819
00:40:26,685 --> 00:40:27,565
Speaker 2: But we have all.

820
00:40:28,045 --> 00:40:30,805
Speaker 1: We got them all and they love it because they

821
00:40:31,085 --> 00:40:36,245
Speaker 1: come because they're not judged, and every staff member knows

822
00:40:36,925 --> 00:40:41,885
Speaker 1: everything about them. Their dog's name, everything, typical kid, bomb's prostitute,

823
00:40:42,005 --> 00:40:42,645
Speaker 1: dad's in jail.

824
00:40:44,085 --> 00:40:44,685
Speaker 2: You know so.

825
00:40:45,525 --> 00:40:48,565
Speaker 1: And we're seeing some really beautiful things happen.

826
00:40:48,685 --> 00:40:49,805
Speaker 2: Have you met Alice Cooper?

827
00:40:50,005 --> 00:40:50,845
Speaker 1: I haven't know Alice.

828
00:40:51,045 --> 00:40:53,205
Speaker 2: So Alice, he's got We kind of the same thing.

829
00:40:53,525 --> 00:40:54,765
Speaker 2: It's such a similar story.

830
00:40:54,925 --> 00:40:57,165
Speaker 1: He's been he's been to rocket Town. I've been to

831
00:40:57,205 --> 00:40:59,445
Speaker 1: his plate. He thought, we've we've talked a lot.

832
00:40:59,525 --> 00:41:02,885
Speaker 2: He was overdosing an a He said, a rock of

833
00:41:03,005 --> 00:41:06,485
Speaker 2: cocaine the size of a softball, and it was so bad,

834
00:41:06,845 --> 00:41:08,965
Speaker 2: he said, he looked in the marinsaw blood coming out

835
00:41:09,005 --> 00:41:10,445
Speaker 2: of his eyes. He said, I don't know if I

836
00:41:10,565 --> 00:41:14,045
Speaker 2: so hallucinated it or if it was real, but all

837
00:41:14,045 --> 00:41:15,405
Speaker 2: I knew was I was going to die. And he

838
00:41:15,485 --> 00:41:18,845
Speaker 2: called out to God and he got right with the Lord.

839
00:41:19,365 --> 00:41:22,605
Speaker 2: And then later he started something very similar to what

840
00:41:22,645 --> 00:41:26,165
Speaker 2: you're talking about. I love that. Yeah. So now let

841
00:41:26,165 --> 00:41:29,965
Speaker 2: me ask you some kind of I don't know how

842
00:41:30,005 --> 00:41:31,045
Speaker 2: to describe these questions.

843
00:41:31,085 --> 00:41:32,965
Speaker 1: Well, on theology on me, I'll be in trouble.

844
00:41:33,445 --> 00:41:38,045
Speaker 2: Yes, okay, what's what's the order of end time events? No?

845
00:41:38,085 --> 00:41:42,485
Speaker 2: Just explain explain the sovereignty of God? No, kidd okay,

846
00:41:42,605 --> 00:41:45,445
Speaker 2: So here's some simple questions. Okay. Now, you've been a

847
00:41:45,445 --> 00:41:47,365
Speaker 2: lot of famous people. You don't brag I like that

848
00:41:47,405 --> 00:41:49,485
Speaker 2: about you, but you have been a lot of famous people.

849
00:41:50,725 --> 00:41:55,085
Speaker 2: Who were you most starstruck by? Like? Oh, whoa tongue tied? Maybe,

850
00:41:55,245 --> 00:41:56,165
Speaker 2: like I don't know what to say.

851
00:41:56,405 --> 00:42:00,605
Speaker 1: Probably John Williams, Who's my musical hero. Who's what a

852
00:42:00,725 --> 00:42:05,325
Speaker 1: talent writers? You see that documentary on him, nievable cry

853
00:42:05,485 --> 00:42:06,085
Speaker 1: every time I'm watching.

854
00:42:06,165 --> 00:42:08,485
Speaker 2: I didn't realize how many songs he had written until

855
00:42:08,485 --> 00:42:09,085
Speaker 2: I watched that.

856
00:42:09,485 --> 00:42:12,725
Speaker 1: Melodies the melodies, and he's still my musical hero.

857
00:42:12,965 --> 00:42:16,765
Speaker 2: Wow. When you write a song, do you usually start

858
00:42:16,765 --> 00:42:19,364
Speaker 2: with a melody? With the lyric? Does it vary from

859
00:42:19,445 --> 00:42:19,965
Speaker 2: song to song?

860
00:42:20,085 --> 00:42:22,325
Speaker 1: Usually a melody? Sometimes there's an idea that I mean,

861
00:42:22,365 --> 00:42:24,725
Speaker 1: I don't know. One day, I'm one hour, I'm writing

862
00:42:24,765 --> 00:42:27,525
Speaker 1: a worship song. The next day, I'm writing some jazz number,

863
00:42:27,565 --> 00:42:30,325
Speaker 1: and then I'm writing a cinematic piece of music. You know,

864
00:42:30,765 --> 00:42:34,685
Speaker 1: I've scored films, yes, you know. I've done two instrumental records.

865
00:42:34,725 --> 00:42:36,605
Speaker 1: You know, I just never know what's going to come out,

866
00:42:36,725 --> 00:42:39,884
Speaker 1: you know. So, but John's been the he's been.

867
00:42:40,205 --> 00:42:42,765
Speaker 2: Have you met him? I have? So that was how

868
00:42:42,805 --> 00:42:44,445
Speaker 2: you were a star trek By I was little. Did

869
00:42:44,485 --> 00:42:45,165
Speaker 2: you say to him?

870
00:42:45,485 --> 00:42:48,325
Speaker 1: I just said, you have no I mean, do you

871
00:42:48,365 --> 00:42:48,884
Speaker 1: know who you are?

872
00:42:48,925 --> 00:42:49,565
Speaker 2: I don't think so.

873
00:42:49,845 --> 00:42:52,725
Speaker 1: And that's okay. You know, you just had no idea,

874
00:42:52,805 --> 00:42:54,685
Speaker 1: have a bunch of an influence. You've been in my life.

875
00:42:54,685 --> 00:42:56,884
Speaker 1: Thank you. That's what do you do. You can't really

876
00:42:56,885 --> 00:42:59,365
Speaker 1: start a cors I just think, well, thank you very much.

877
00:42:59,405 --> 00:43:00,205
Speaker 1: I appreciate that.

878
00:43:00,285 --> 00:43:02,885
Speaker 2: So, yeah, the guy I was the most star struck

879
00:43:02,925 --> 00:43:04,925
Speaker 2: by is on it. I was on a beach in

880
00:43:05,005 --> 00:43:09,605
Speaker 2: Malli and I'm sitting there. In my backpack is a cassette.

881
00:43:09,645 --> 00:43:12,365
Speaker 2: This marks it in time of the Beatles Love Songs.

882
00:43:12,405 --> 00:43:15,205
Speaker 2: It was a re release of their love songs. Who

883
00:43:15,245 --> 00:43:18,365
Speaker 2: sits behind Me? George Harrison? Why I hear his voice?

884
00:43:18,365 --> 00:43:22,765
Speaker 2: That familiar Liverpudlian accent. So I was so nervous. What

885
00:43:22,845 --> 00:43:25,045
Speaker 2: do I say that George Harrison, because I'm a huge

886
00:43:25,045 --> 00:43:28,565
Speaker 2: Beatles fan. So I turned around and I said, appreciate

887
00:43:28,605 --> 00:43:31,005
Speaker 2: all the music you've done over the years. He's just

888
00:43:31,045 --> 00:43:34,405
Speaker 2: wearing sunglasses. He just looks at me. He doesn't even respond.

889
00:43:34,725 --> 00:43:38,445
Speaker 2: He literally didn't acknowledge my existence. I turned back around.

890
00:43:38,525 --> 00:43:41,925
Speaker 2: It's ky like Billy in the car. Now, I think, okay,

891
00:43:42,005 --> 00:43:44,805
Speaker 2: forget it. So then the day went by. We're down

892
00:43:44,805 --> 00:43:48,165
Speaker 2: to the beach and actually it's funny. His son Danny

893
00:43:48,525 --> 00:43:50,645
Speaker 2: didn't know how to boogie board, and my oldest son,

894
00:43:50,725 --> 00:43:52,805
Speaker 2: Christopher was really good at it. So he spent the

895
00:43:52,885 --> 00:43:56,364
Speaker 2: day showing Danny how to catch waves. So it's time

896
00:43:56,405 --> 00:43:59,165
Speaker 2: to leave, and this is the era of the Traveling Woolberries.

897
00:43:59,805 --> 00:44:01,525
Speaker 2: So I brought that up and said, oh, you know,

898
00:44:02,205 --> 00:44:04,844
Speaker 2: I wasn't giving up of this guy. You know, I

899
00:44:04,885 --> 00:44:07,485
Speaker 2: love the Woolberg's. Then he came to life. Then he

900
00:44:07,605 --> 00:44:11,005
Speaker 2: started talking and oh, you're going to love the next record,

901
00:44:11,085 --> 00:44:14,045
Speaker 2: and so it's a nice conversation. Then I read I

902
00:44:14,085 --> 00:44:16,245
Speaker 2: was looking at a biography on him and it said

903
00:44:16,365 --> 00:44:19,965
Speaker 2: George never liked to talk about the Beatles, and I

904
00:44:20,005 --> 00:44:21,404
Speaker 2: brought the long topic cut.

905
00:44:23,765 --> 00:44:24,245
Speaker 1: That's good.

906
00:44:24,565 --> 00:44:30,245
Speaker 2: So what what makes you angry? Uh?

907
00:44:30,765 --> 00:44:34,045
Speaker 1: Probably the injustice that goes on in the world. There's

908
00:44:34,085 --> 00:44:40,965
Speaker 1: a lot of it. Sex slave, Yeah, the trafficking just

909
00:44:41,205 --> 00:44:44,445
Speaker 1: boils my blood. Yeah, and people get by with it.

910
00:44:46,005 --> 00:44:49,005
Speaker 2: Yeah, So a lot of injustice in this world, there is.

911
00:44:50,445 --> 00:44:55,765
Speaker 2: So what makes you laugh? My grandkids? Yeah, same for me. Yeah.

912
00:44:56,205 --> 00:44:58,445
Speaker 2: Now this is you've heard this question before. It was

913
00:44:58,525 --> 00:45:00,925
Speaker 2: kind of an interesting one. If you could have dinner

914
00:45:01,325 --> 00:45:07,365
Speaker 2: with anyone alive or gone, maybe three other guests, you

915
00:45:07,445 --> 00:45:09,125
Speaker 2: and three other guests, who would you want to have

916
00:45:09,205 --> 00:45:12,885
Speaker 2: dinner with? Hang out with, like three three guys anyway,

917
00:45:12,925 --> 00:45:16,845
Speaker 2: could be C. S Lewis. I would say, he can't

918
00:45:16,845 --> 00:45:17,525
Speaker 2: have Jesus.

919
00:45:17,765 --> 00:45:18,605
Speaker 1: He can't have Jesus.

920
00:45:18,645 --> 00:45:20,205
Speaker 2: We know he's going to be number one. I would

921
00:45:20,205 --> 00:45:20,765
Speaker 2: say C.

922
00:45:21,005 --> 00:45:22,165
Speaker 1: S Lewis is probably a pick.

923
00:45:22,285 --> 00:45:24,565
Speaker 2: Charles Neston, Yeah, he's cool.

924
00:45:24,925 --> 00:45:27,245
Speaker 1: And Ronald Reagan. Oh yeah, when you got to meet

925
00:45:27,245 --> 00:45:29,085
Speaker 1: Reagan for But I.

926
00:45:29,085 --> 00:45:30,085
Speaker 2: Would go to that dinner.

927
00:45:32,325 --> 00:45:34,485
Speaker 1: Uh. I'm a huge Wagon fan.

928
00:45:34,685 --> 00:45:37,925
Speaker 2: Yeah, me too. And I to watch Charlton Heston well

929
00:45:38,005 --> 00:45:38,605
Speaker 2: so am I too?

930
00:45:38,685 --> 00:45:42,445
Speaker 1: Yeah the movies, But but I love going back and

931
00:45:42,485 --> 00:45:46,245
Speaker 1: watching these YouTube clips of Reagan, these little snippett of

932
00:45:46,285 --> 00:45:49,645
Speaker 1: the speeches that are unbelievable, just amazing.

933
00:45:50,005 --> 00:45:52,725
Speaker 2: He was incredible. He was I mean, I was thinking,

934
00:45:52,965 --> 00:45:55,525
Speaker 2: if they were going to put another face, I'm Mount Rushmore.

935
00:45:55,645 --> 00:45:56,205
Speaker 2: It should be.

936
00:45:56,165 --> 00:45:57,045
Speaker 1: Rich, should Began.

937
00:45:57,325 --> 00:46:00,445
Speaker 2: I mean I can there's other others you could consider,

938
00:46:01,045 --> 00:46:04,965
Speaker 2: but Ronald Reagan, I mean he changed things in the

939
00:46:05,045 --> 00:46:09,485
Speaker 2: nation in a significant way. He is one of a kind.

940
00:46:09,685 --> 00:46:12,525
Speaker 2: So like, when what's your favorite kind of go to

941
00:46:12,685 --> 00:46:15,725
Speaker 2: food when you're hungry, Like, oh man, this is because

942
00:46:15,765 --> 00:46:19,005
Speaker 2: you're so skinny. Have you ever been overweight?

943
00:46:20,045 --> 00:46:23,725
Speaker 1: Oh? Maybe in the early days. Yeah, maybe. When I

944
00:46:23,765 --> 00:46:25,925
Speaker 1: first moved to Nashville, I was like one eighty or

945
00:46:26,005 --> 00:46:28,285
Speaker 1: something like that. But I lost it, you know, I

946
00:46:28,325 --> 00:46:32,725
Speaker 1: got to metabolism to you. You know, I love sushi.

947
00:46:33,005 --> 00:46:35,285
Speaker 1: I have to be careful with parasites and that kind

948
00:46:35,285 --> 00:46:38,045
Speaker 1: of thing, you know. And because I've had some issues

949
00:46:38,085 --> 00:46:41,245
Speaker 1: with you, especially when you got to be We'll go

950
00:46:41,285 --> 00:46:43,005
Speaker 1: out with Frank and we're all around the world and

951
00:46:43,085 --> 00:46:45,245
Speaker 1: eating all this crazy Asian food and gas, they gotta

952
00:46:45,245 --> 00:46:46,045
Speaker 1: be really careful.

953
00:46:45,845 --> 00:46:48,964
Speaker 2: An loves the McDonald's. They believe me, I mean, it's real.

954
00:46:49,605 --> 00:46:52,205
Speaker 2: He actually wrote a post the other day and he's

955
00:46:52,205 --> 00:46:56,765
Speaker 2: say McDonald's, please keep the fried apple pie and make

956
00:46:56,805 --> 00:46:59,765
Speaker 2: sure it's the fried one. Then he says it's actually

957
00:46:59,925 --> 00:47:02,485
Speaker 2: lower calorie than the big one. I did never knew this,

958
00:47:02,925 --> 00:47:07,005
Speaker 2: and it was like a whole post he had cleating

959
00:47:07,125 --> 00:47:11,085
Speaker 2: with McDonald's to keep that bread. It's amazing. It's amazing.

960
00:47:11,405 --> 00:47:12,485
Speaker 2: So sushi, that's it.

961
00:47:13,245 --> 00:47:18,085
Speaker 1: You know, this is what I really love. It comes

962
00:47:18,125 --> 00:47:20,005
Speaker 1: to food. Deb and I have a new hobby and

963
00:47:20,125 --> 00:47:21,645
Speaker 1: we've had it for five or six years. We build

964
00:47:21,645 --> 00:47:23,805
Speaker 1: a greenhouse on our farm. We have a two hundred

965
00:47:23,845 --> 00:47:26,805
Speaker 1: acre farm twenty minutes of our house, and with this

966
00:47:27,125 --> 00:47:30,805
Speaker 1: massive garden. And like the other day, I picked two

967
00:47:30,885 --> 00:47:33,485
Speaker 1: hundred green beans and thought I'd got them all, and

968
00:47:33,525 --> 00:47:36,165
Speaker 1: then found another one hundred and fifty. I picked eight squash,

969
00:47:36,285 --> 00:47:40,605
Speaker 1: I picked four zucchini. And you take that food and

970
00:47:40,685 --> 00:47:44,165
Speaker 1: you eat it that night. It doesn't get any better.

971
00:47:44,965 --> 00:47:47,805
Speaker 1: You're eating food right out of your garden. That's my

972
00:47:47,925 --> 00:47:49,965
Speaker 1: favorite thing to do when it comes to see that.

973
00:47:50,125 --> 00:47:54,565
Speaker 2: And the green beans can be really sweet, can't they can? Amazing? Yeah,

974
00:47:55,565 --> 00:47:59,845
Speaker 2: So I asked Marco Rubio, what is your favorite go

975
00:47:59,925 --> 00:48:04,245
Speaker 2: to food? Chicken, palm and pizza.

976
00:48:04,485 --> 00:48:05,165
Speaker 1: That's amazing.

977
00:48:05,165 --> 00:48:06,205
Speaker 2: Those are comfort food.

978
00:48:06,285 --> 00:48:08,965
Speaker 1: So I do love pizza, but I like healthy pizza,

979
00:48:09,005 --> 00:48:10,525
Speaker 1: you know, but I don't eat a lot of bread.

980
00:48:10,685 --> 00:48:13,165
Speaker 2: What is healthy pizza like? What would your pizza order be?

981
00:48:13,725 --> 00:48:17,245
Speaker 1: Uh, it would probably be be well, it would be

982
00:48:18,245 --> 00:48:19,285
Speaker 1: dough from Italy?

983
00:48:19,845 --> 00:48:20,924
Speaker 2: Okay, okay?

984
00:48:21,965 --> 00:48:24,885
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know you can go Costco and you

985
00:48:24,925 --> 00:48:27,205
Speaker 1: can you can find some of these things where this

986
00:48:27,445 --> 00:48:28,485
Speaker 1: dough is from Italy.

987
00:48:28,605 --> 00:48:31,565
Speaker 2: Italy. It makes a difference to me.

988
00:48:31,725 --> 00:48:35,165
Speaker 1: I can taste the difference, soil, I can get it.

989
00:48:35,205 --> 00:48:39,285
Speaker 2: How about their tomatoes, Like a tomato from Italy. It's

990
00:48:39,325 --> 00:48:41,485
Speaker 2: not the most beautiful thing you've ever seen, but the

991
00:48:41,565 --> 00:48:44,485
Speaker 2: flavor at the flavor, well, it's a fruit, isn't it? Well,

992
00:48:44,605 --> 00:48:45,404
Speaker 2: it is it is?

993
00:48:45,605 --> 00:48:48,645
Speaker 1: It is? Okay, but yeah, I would take it. I

994
00:48:48,685 --> 00:48:51,165
Speaker 1: would take it something from Italy, and then I would

995
00:48:51,165 --> 00:48:54,205
Speaker 1: add other things like basil from our garden.

996
00:48:54,765 --> 00:48:55,645
Speaker 2: I would put.

997
00:48:55,445 --> 00:48:58,565
Speaker 1: Garlic on it, yes, and I would probably put olive

998
00:48:58,565 --> 00:48:59,885
Speaker 1: oil on it because I'm a big alder.

999
00:49:00,325 --> 00:49:01,565
Speaker 2: I want a pepperoni pizza.

1000
00:49:01,645 --> 00:49:02,565
Speaker 1: That's not going to be the one that.

1001
00:49:04,805 --> 00:49:08,805
Speaker 2: Sounds pretty good though. I think anything pizza I love it.

1002
00:49:08,845 --> 00:49:13,485
Speaker 2: But the pizza in Italy is so amazing. And it's great.

1003
00:49:13,645 --> 00:49:17,365
Speaker 2: So Keith, tell me what like when you're listening to

1004
00:49:17,405 --> 00:49:20,125
Speaker 2: the do you listen to the radio? Like not much,

1005
00:49:20,245 --> 00:49:23,085
Speaker 2: not that much, but you hear songs everywherever while we

1006
00:49:23,125 --> 00:49:26,325
Speaker 2: go we hear songs? Are there songs like? I have

1007
00:49:26,325 --> 00:49:29,805
Speaker 2: a thing on Apple It's Gregg's playlist and it just

1008
00:49:29,885 --> 00:49:33,525
Speaker 2: picks songs that it thinks I will like and a

1009
00:49:33,525 --> 00:49:35,125
Speaker 2: lot of the times it's pretty good. I think these

1010
00:49:35,165 --> 00:49:37,125
Speaker 2: are good because I have a lot of It'll be

1011
00:49:37,165 --> 00:49:40,285
Speaker 2: like a Frank Sinatra song, a Beatles song, and then

1012
00:49:40,685 --> 00:49:42,844
Speaker 2: some of the random thing because I like all kinds

1013
00:49:42,885 --> 00:49:45,285
Speaker 2: of things. And I guess maybe if you go next,

1014
00:49:45,645 --> 00:49:47,965
Speaker 2: it just found out, Oh he doesn't like that song.

1015
00:49:48,005 --> 00:49:50,125
Speaker 2: I'm not sure how it works, right, But like what

1016
00:49:50,365 --> 00:49:52,325
Speaker 2: is if you hear a song on the radio go

1017
00:49:52,365 --> 00:49:54,485
Speaker 2: oh I love this and you still lean in it

1018
00:49:54,565 --> 00:49:57,285
Speaker 2: and to listen even though you've heard it a million times.

1019
00:49:58,085 --> 00:50:00,605
Speaker 2: You mentioned I want to hold your hand? Did you?

1020
00:50:00,965 --> 00:50:03,805
Speaker 2: I did earlier? What would be like a song? Oh,

1021
00:50:03,845 --> 00:50:04,565
Speaker 2: I love that song?

1022
00:50:04,645 --> 00:50:08,605
Speaker 1: I would say. I would say probably anything from the eighties, Yeah, eighties,

1023
00:50:08,645 --> 00:50:11,125
Speaker 1: like like I'm I have a hard time fun things

1024
00:50:11,125 --> 00:50:11,605
Speaker 1: that I like.

1025
00:50:11,685 --> 00:50:16,925
Speaker 2: Honestly, I did too, but like I'm loving the new.

1026
00:50:16,965 --> 00:50:20,965
Speaker 1: Keith Urban record. Oh well, and it's yacht rock. Yes,

1027
00:50:21,045 --> 00:50:24,965
Speaker 1: and you will know. There's maybe two new songs everything. Yes,

1028
00:50:25,125 --> 00:50:27,844
Speaker 1: you will know, and it's incredible.

1029
00:50:27,965 --> 00:50:31,364
Speaker 2: I heard him do a recording of Summer Breeze by

1030
00:50:31,365 --> 00:50:34,645
Speaker 2: Seals and Cross on that record. It's very close to

1031
00:50:34,725 --> 00:50:36,365
Speaker 2: the original, Yes it is. I always thought that was

1032
00:50:36,365 --> 00:50:37,605
Speaker 2: a great song, great song.

1033
00:50:38,005 --> 00:50:40,685
Speaker 1: Yeah, so there's a bunch of great songs on that record.

1034
00:50:40,725 --> 00:50:42,685
Speaker 2: I didn't even know there was yacht rock until I

1035
00:50:42,805 --> 00:50:44,965
Speaker 2: saw some dunk on it. Oh yeah, I know that.

1036
00:50:45,165 --> 00:50:46,285
Speaker 2: I mean sure that music.

1037
00:50:46,365 --> 00:50:49,525
Speaker 1: It's a strange title that they've called this whole thing

1038
00:50:49,605 --> 00:50:50,045
Speaker 1: yacht rock.

1039
00:50:50,125 --> 00:50:52,645
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, but that's a certain sound I was.

1040
00:50:52,765 --> 00:50:54,565
Speaker 2: You know, I'm a little older than you, so I'm

1041
00:50:54,565 --> 00:50:58,485
Speaker 2: more into like mid sixties music, seventies music, but I

1042
00:50:58,605 --> 00:51:02,085
Speaker 2: like music from the eighties. Were you at any Loo fan?

1043
00:51:02,645 --> 00:51:04,125
Speaker 2: That was yeah, Jeff Lynn, that.

1044
00:51:04,445 --> 00:51:10,725
Speaker 1: Lynn and Doodie Brothers, Michael McDonald. I loved British music. Yeah,

1045
00:51:10,965 --> 00:51:13,325
Speaker 1: just a lot of that stuff was contagious, you know,

1046
00:51:13,445 --> 00:51:16,165
Speaker 1: but the eighties they were just great moments from the

1047
00:51:16,165 --> 00:51:17,805
Speaker 1: eighties were the melodies.

1048
00:51:17,885 --> 00:51:18,924
Speaker 2: Career was taking off.

1049
00:51:18,925 --> 00:51:21,485
Speaker 1: Two of the eighties it started taking off.

1050
00:51:21,565 --> 00:51:24,685
Speaker 2: That had been sort of your pop career es right.

1051
00:51:24,485 --> 00:51:27,444
Speaker 1: Well, eighties and through the nineties. The worship record didn't

1052
00:51:27,445 --> 00:51:30,005
Speaker 1: come out till two thousand and one, which was released

1053
00:51:30,045 --> 00:51:32,805
Speaker 1: on nine eleven, believe it or not, of all days.

1054
00:51:32,845 --> 00:51:35,964
Speaker 1: But yeah, I was a worship leader for nineteen years

1055
00:51:36,005 --> 00:51:39,605
Speaker 1: and still doing pop music, you know. But yeah, the

1056
00:51:40,285 --> 00:51:42,605
Speaker 1: British thing was a big thing for me, like I loved. Yes,

1057
00:51:44,525 --> 00:51:46,205
Speaker 1: I was a big Kansas fan because.

1058
00:51:45,965 --> 00:51:50,965
Speaker 2: I loved became a Christian. Yeah, I met Carrie. Yeah, yeah,

1059
00:51:51,125 --> 00:51:54,365
Speaker 2: long time ago. He formed a band after Kansas called eighty.

1060
00:51:54,925 --> 00:51:56,205
Speaker 2: It was like a Christian.

1061
00:51:55,925 --> 00:51:57,205
Speaker 1: Had all those records.

1062
00:51:57,285 --> 00:52:00,085
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so we had them at our church and

1063
00:52:00,125 --> 00:52:02,525
Speaker 2: they're doing their own songs, and I said, can you

1064
00:52:02,565 --> 00:52:04,765
Speaker 2: do carry On my Wayward Sun? He goes at church.

1065
00:52:04,805 --> 00:52:08,725
Speaker 2: I said absolutely, And the guitar solo one carry on

1066
00:52:08,765 --> 00:52:11,725
Speaker 2: my Wayward Son that carried does this insane? So they're

1067
00:52:11,725 --> 00:52:15,605
Speaker 2: playing it. They blew our entire sound system out. I

1068
00:52:15,605 --> 00:52:18,325
Speaker 2: think maybe it was worth to hear that song.

1069
00:52:18,485 --> 00:52:20,045
Speaker 1: I bet that was a great I thought that it

1070
00:52:20,085 --> 00:52:22,444
Speaker 1: would be thinking that song that bothers me in church.

1071
00:52:22,565 --> 00:52:25,045
Speaker 2: You know, it's pretty carry On My Wayward son, There'll

1072
00:52:25,085 --> 00:52:27,365
Speaker 2: be peace when you were done, you know. So it

1073
00:52:27,445 --> 00:52:30,805
Speaker 2: worked out pretty well. So what is your Are you

1074
00:52:30,845 --> 00:52:31,565
Speaker 2: a coffee guy?

1075
00:52:31,925 --> 00:52:35,125
Speaker 1: I'm not a coffee not a comedy guy, green tea guy,

1076
00:52:35,365 --> 00:52:39,565
Speaker 1: loved to both dev and I are green tea drinkers.

1077
00:52:39,685 --> 00:52:43,965
Speaker 2: Wow, you're a very healthy person. I think I may

1078
00:52:43,965 --> 00:52:47,285
Speaker 2: be the opposite of that. You and all these food

1079
00:52:47,765 --> 00:52:51,485
Speaker 2: I like t fine, but I like coffee. And but

1080
00:52:51,645 --> 00:52:54,525
Speaker 2: though your description of your perfect pizza was pretty APPEALI

1081
00:52:54,565 --> 00:52:57,364
Speaker 2: and I have to say, so, are you a movie fan?

1082
00:52:58,805 --> 00:53:00,925
Speaker 1: I am going to have a heart time finding something

1083
00:53:00,925 --> 00:53:01,205
Speaker 1: that I.

1084
00:53:01,245 --> 00:53:04,485
Speaker 2: Love movies today? What are some like? I define my

1085
00:53:04,565 --> 00:53:08,165
Speaker 2: favorite movie as if I see it on TV, even

1086
00:53:08,205 --> 00:53:11,085
Speaker 2: though I've seen it a million times, if I keep

1087
00:53:11,125 --> 00:53:13,325
Speaker 2: watching it, that means it's one of my favorite films.

1088
00:53:13,605 --> 00:53:16,645
Speaker 2: Like Tombstone. If Tombstone's on my TV, I'm gonna watch

1089
00:53:16,645 --> 00:53:19,645
Speaker 2: it till the commercial because it does so many amazing lights.

1090
00:53:19,725 --> 00:53:23,565
Speaker 2: Or Brave Heart or The Patriot, I'm gonna just watch

1091
00:53:23,605 --> 00:53:26,005
Speaker 2: that movie. Right. Do you have movies like that? Like?

1092
00:53:26,045 --> 00:53:27,884
Speaker 2: What would they be? Well? Writers have Lost Stars?

1093
00:53:27,965 --> 00:53:31,005
Speaker 1: My fast of all time? Yeah, that's eighties, isn't that

1094
00:53:31,445 --> 00:53:32,525
Speaker 1: eighty one?

1095
00:53:32,445 --> 00:53:34,325
Speaker 2: Yeah? And then I just.

1096
00:53:34,365 --> 00:53:36,525
Speaker 1: Loved the Star Wars, you know, Yeah, it got all

1097
00:53:36,605 --> 00:53:38,685
Speaker 1: track a little bit, you know, Empire strikes back, you see.

1098
00:53:38,725 --> 00:53:40,805
Speaker 1: I think probably the best of all of them. Right,

1099
00:53:41,165 --> 00:53:43,565
Speaker 1: So I was a Star Wars fan. I still like

1100
00:53:43,725 --> 00:53:46,925
Speaker 1: any Ad Jones and Last Crusade, Jean Greenery and hair Support.

1101
00:53:47,045 --> 00:53:49,525
Speaker 2: Did you you met John Williams? Did you ever meet Spielbert?

1102
00:53:49,925 --> 00:53:50,805
Speaker 1: I never met Spielberg.

1103
00:53:50,885 --> 00:53:51,245
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1104
00:53:51,525 --> 00:53:56,165
Speaker 1: I loved ET, still love ET. I mean Schindler's List.

1105
00:53:56,485 --> 00:53:59,005
Speaker 1: I mean it's a movie, The Dar. I mean, it's

1106
00:53:59,045 --> 00:54:01,805
Speaker 1: so hard to watch. I'll never forget. I was in

1107
00:54:01,925 --> 00:54:03,645
Speaker 1: I was in Orange County. I was at a movie

1108
00:54:03,645 --> 00:54:07,325
Speaker 1: theater all by myself. I saw a long time ago,

1109
00:54:07,405 --> 00:54:10,245
Speaker 1: and it just and I've not been able. I don't

1110
00:54:10,285 --> 00:54:11,965
Speaker 1: think I've watched the whole thing since then.

1111
00:54:12,045 --> 00:54:15,725
Speaker 2: Yeah, I rewatched it recently, and I thought this is

1112
00:54:15,805 --> 00:54:17,884
Speaker 2: such because it was shot in black and white. Yeah,

1113
00:54:18,365 --> 00:54:21,245
Speaker 2: except that opening scene with a little girl. They had

1114
00:54:21,245 --> 00:54:23,685
Speaker 2: her in a red coat, and so you're kind of

1115
00:54:23,725 --> 00:54:26,405
Speaker 2: following this little girl in the red coat, and then

1116
00:54:26,485 --> 00:54:28,925
Speaker 2: at the end you're hoping she survives, of course, and

1117
00:54:28,965 --> 00:54:31,925
Speaker 2: then you see she was killed by the Nazis, And

1118
00:54:31,965 --> 00:54:35,565
Speaker 2: that was a really powerful way to personalize it, and

1119
00:54:36,245 --> 00:54:40,245
Speaker 2: you know, amazing performances and heartbreaking. But the scene at

1120
00:54:40,285 --> 00:54:43,565
Speaker 2: the end when Chindler says I could have saved just

1121
00:54:43,645 --> 00:54:46,805
Speaker 2: one more I've used that as an illustration for evangelism,

1122
00:54:46,845 --> 00:54:51,045
Speaker 2: you know, Yeah, we can reach one more person. Who

1123
00:54:51,085 --> 00:54:54,805
Speaker 2: are people that you've some unexpected people maybe you've been

1124
00:54:54,805 --> 00:54:58,365
Speaker 2: able to share the gospel with. Do those opportunities come

1125
00:54:58,445 --> 00:54:59,765
Speaker 2: up when you meet different folks?

1126
00:55:00,365 --> 00:55:03,805
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot, well not as much as I'd like. Yeah,

1127
00:55:05,645 --> 00:55:07,805
Speaker 1: I will never forget when I don't know why I

1128
00:55:07,925 --> 00:55:10,565
Speaker 1: go to this story every time. I'll never forget being

1129
00:55:12,045 --> 00:55:14,005
Speaker 1: I was hosting the VH one count Down, which I

1130
00:55:14,125 --> 00:55:16,885
Speaker 1: caught a lot of flak for, was being Luther Vandross.

1131
00:55:16,965 --> 00:55:19,605
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, hosting the VH one count Down during my

1132
00:55:19,645 --> 00:55:20,245
Speaker 1: Why would.

1133
00:55:20,085 --> 00:55:21,085
Speaker 2: You catch flak for that?

1134
00:55:21,165 --> 00:55:23,965
Speaker 1: Well, because there was a Budwiser commercial and so I

1135
00:55:24,005 --> 00:55:26,405
Speaker 1: had stores in Alabama pulled my records.

1136
00:55:26,485 --> 00:55:27,885
Speaker 2: Wow, all that kind of.

1137
00:55:28,165 --> 00:55:29,885
Speaker 1: That's a whole And I would never debate because I

1138
00:55:29,885 --> 00:55:32,605
Speaker 1: didn't think there was anything to debate, saying all that

1139
00:55:33,125 --> 00:55:35,485
Speaker 1: I'm in the makeup here and there's this beautiful woman

1140
00:55:35,525 --> 00:55:37,725
Speaker 1: doing my makeup, and I said, God, just keep me focused.

1141
00:55:37,765 --> 00:55:39,485
Speaker 1: Keep me focused on just and I got a lot,

1142
00:55:39,645 --> 00:55:42,365
Speaker 1: I got team around me, but she's doing my makeup.

1143
00:55:42,365 --> 00:55:46,085
Speaker 1: We just start talking and then she says, can I

1144
00:55:46,205 --> 00:55:48,844
Speaker 1: just ask you a question? I said yeah. She said,

1145
00:55:49,605 --> 00:55:51,205
Speaker 1: there's something different value.

1146
00:55:52,765 --> 00:55:53,125
Speaker 2: Really.

1147
00:55:56,205 --> 00:55:59,245
Speaker 1: I said, well, do you want to know what it is?

1148
00:55:59,485 --> 00:56:01,885
Speaker 1: She said I do, And I said, I'm in love

1149
00:56:01,925 --> 00:56:05,885
Speaker 1: with Jesus and he loves me and he loves you.

1150
00:56:05,965 --> 00:56:06,844
Speaker 1: And she started to cry.

1151
00:56:07,005 --> 00:56:07,405
Speaker 2: Wow.

1152
00:56:08,925 --> 00:56:11,205
Speaker 1: I never knew what happened because it was sort of

1153
00:56:11,245 --> 00:56:12,965
Speaker 1: like they got me out of the chair when I

1154
00:56:13,085 --> 00:56:15,365
Speaker 1: was like to meet you, and it was kind of

1155
00:56:15,405 --> 00:56:19,285
Speaker 1: that big So the seed moment, I've never forgotten her,

1156
00:56:19,765 --> 00:56:22,765
Speaker 1: and I hope and trust that she gave a Hart's

1157
00:56:22,765 --> 00:56:23,125
Speaker 1: An award.

1158
00:56:23,605 --> 00:56:26,364
Speaker 2: That's the best kind of witness when you effectively earn

1159
00:56:26,445 --> 00:56:28,485
Speaker 2: the right to share your faith by the way that.

1160
00:56:28,485 --> 00:56:29,685
Speaker 1: You live, and that's what we do.

1161
00:56:29,885 --> 00:56:30,844
Speaker 2: Rocket down. Yeah.

1162
00:56:31,245 --> 00:56:35,245
Speaker 1: To me, it's like, yeah, this is my second greatest

1163
00:56:35,285 --> 00:56:36,645
Speaker 1: goal other than not being offended.

1164
00:56:37,085 --> 00:56:38,125
Speaker 2: Like when Don Finto.

1165
00:56:38,325 --> 00:56:40,884
Speaker 1: When Don Finto walks into a room, yeah, the whole

1166
00:56:40,885 --> 00:56:44,845
Speaker 1: atmosphere changes, just like and it's not because e Drike's carriagejees,

1167
00:56:44,965 --> 00:56:47,445
Speaker 1: you know, you've got the sort of got them to

1168
00:56:47,485 --> 00:56:49,964
Speaker 1: go up there's something And I want to be able

1169
00:56:49,965 --> 00:56:52,445
Speaker 1: to walk into a room of people I've never met

1170
00:56:52,485 --> 00:56:55,885
Speaker 1: and they go, whata what's going on here? That's amazing,

1171
00:56:55,965 --> 00:56:59,925
Speaker 1: That's what That's a big dream in prayer of mine.

1172
00:57:00,205 --> 00:57:03,165
Speaker 2: Wow, that's a great goal, you know, Michael, I want

1173
00:57:03,205 --> 00:57:06,205
Speaker 2: to just thank you for, you know, being such a

1174
00:57:06,205 --> 00:57:08,845
Speaker 2: great model. You talked about being like a father figure.

1175
00:57:08,925 --> 00:57:11,445
Speaker 2: You know, you've been a great model, not just in

1176
00:57:11,565 --> 00:57:14,845
Speaker 2: Christian music, but just in the church as a representative

1177
00:57:14,885 --> 00:57:18,285
Speaker 2: of Jesus Christ and the many environments you've been in

1178
00:57:18,325 --> 00:57:22,445
Speaker 2: that could turn many ahead and sabotage many a career,

1179
00:57:22,525 --> 00:57:26,325
Speaker 2: sabotage many a marriage, and you've held your course and

1180
00:57:26,365 --> 00:57:29,565
Speaker 2: you've been faithful. And I'm going to thank you for

1181
00:57:29,605 --> 00:57:33,045
Speaker 2: doing that because it's great to have you out there

1182
00:57:33,045 --> 00:57:33,965
Speaker 2: representing us.

1183
00:57:34,245 --> 00:57:35,325
Speaker 1: Well, thank you.

1184
00:57:35,405 --> 00:57:36,685
Speaker 2: And you know how I know you're one of the

1185
00:57:36,725 --> 00:57:41,125
Speaker 2: good guys because you're dressed all in white. Well I'm

1186
00:57:41,165 --> 00:57:43,165
Speaker 2: not going to forget that. Yeah, And I don't know

1187
00:57:43,205 --> 00:57:45,445
Speaker 2: what that says about me being dressed in black. But

1188
00:57:46,365 --> 00:57:52,285
Speaker 2: in closing, who is Jesus Christ to you and why

1189
00:57:52,285 --> 00:57:56,405
Speaker 2: should a person follow him?

1190
00:57:56,605 --> 00:57:58,045
Speaker 1: Well, he's the lover of my soul.

1191
00:57:59,405 --> 00:58:01,205
Speaker 2: And as Dawn.

1192
00:58:02,845 --> 00:58:05,005
Speaker 1: Spoke about it the other day on his little Facebook page,

1193
00:58:05,245 --> 00:58:09,565
Speaker 1: it's the Romans three thing. It's like, it's like he knew,

1194
00:58:10,725 --> 00:58:14,765
Speaker 1: he knew that we couldn't. We couldn't do it. We

1195
00:58:14,805 --> 00:58:17,045
Speaker 1: couldn't do it. Obviously, the law is there for a reason.

1196
00:58:17,045 --> 00:58:20,485
Speaker 1: But he knew we couldn't do it. So by faith,

1197
00:58:21,765 --> 00:58:25,005
Speaker 1: he's going to make us righteous. That's astounding to me.

1198
00:58:26,165 --> 00:58:28,845
Speaker 1: And I'm going to give you righteousness. If you have faith,

1199
00:58:29,005 --> 00:58:33,085
Speaker 1: I'm going to give you righteousness. That's the greatest news.

1200
00:58:33,405 --> 00:58:38,005
Speaker 1: That's what the world needs to hear. And I just

1201
00:58:38,005 --> 00:58:39,605
Speaker 1: just if I wake up everyonere and going God, I

1202
00:58:39,685 --> 00:58:42,445
Speaker 1: just can't believe up such a mess and still trying

1203
00:58:42,485 --> 00:58:45,925
Speaker 1: to pull together. And you just love me regardless. And

1204
00:58:45,965 --> 00:58:49,965
Speaker 1: so he's the perfect father. He's a good father. Not

1205
00:58:50,125 --> 00:58:54,965
Speaker 1: to borrow from the song and uh and I know

1206
00:58:55,085 --> 00:58:56,885
Speaker 1: it be on the shadow of doubt. It doesn't matter

1207
00:58:56,885 --> 00:59:00,125
Speaker 1: how I feel. Sometimes you don't. You don't feel it.

1208
00:59:00,165 --> 00:59:02,605
Speaker 1: Sometimes there's some weeks ago back on God, where are you?

1209
00:59:02,685 --> 00:59:02,805
Speaker 2: Like?

1210
00:59:03,605 --> 00:59:05,725
Speaker 1: Why do I feel like I'm in the funk? I

1211
00:59:06,405 --> 00:59:09,245
Speaker 1: feel a little off? What is that? But I know

1212
00:59:09,445 --> 00:59:12,685
Speaker 1: in the midst of all that he still loves me.

1213
00:59:14,205 --> 00:59:16,325
Speaker 2: Well, thanks for doing this, you welcome, Thank you for

1214
00:59:16,525 --> 00:59:17,645
Speaker 2: hanging out with you. It's good