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Speaker 1: Life Audio, Jesus came in as an Israeli. He came

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Speaker 1: as a Jew. Now he came to his own. His

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Speaker 1: own received him, not to those who did receive him. Gentiles,

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Speaker 1: you got it, And now you're making Jews jealous because

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Speaker 1: you know the God of Israel and most of our

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Speaker 1: team doesn't.

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Speaker 2: Joel Rosenberg, thank you for doing my podcast.

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Speaker 1: Please would Greg great to be with you.

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Speaker 3: You know, we.

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Speaker 2: Always go straight to the big topics of what's going

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Speaker 2: on in the world, But why don't we just start

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Speaker 2: by talking about your childhood a little bit, like who

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Speaker 2: were you? Like a smart little kid? He seemed to

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Speaker 2: me like you'd sit in the front of the class.

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Speaker 2: You'd always have the answers.

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Speaker 3: Was that you was?

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Speaker 2: Because I was in the back of the room creating

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Speaker 2: kids at the back of my walking people maybe like you,

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Speaker 2: I don't know, But.

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Speaker 3: Were you that kid?

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Speaker 1: No? I was not that kid. I was a little

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Speaker 1: maybe a little doing a little bit better than average,

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Speaker 1: But I was not you know, the salutatorian, the valedictorian.

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Speaker 2: That was not me.

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Speaker 1: Look, I'm one of the few Jews that was born

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Speaker 1: and raised in America, Greg, that did not get the

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Speaker 1: financial gene Okay, I'm not your stockbroker, not your CPA,

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Speaker 1: I'm not your accountant. But I didn't get the medical gene.

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Speaker 1: I'm not your doctor. I'm not your chiropractor. I'm not

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Speaker 1: you know, I don't own a movie company like I

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Speaker 1: didn't get any of the good Jewish jobs. And I'm

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Speaker 1: still a little bitter. But no, I was. I was

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Speaker 1: a creative kid.

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Speaker 3: I was.

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Speaker 1: I was a bit of a class clown, but I

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Speaker 1: you know, I was interested in sports. Yeah, baseball and wrestling,

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Speaker 1: played a season football, but I was too little.

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Speaker 2: Do you want to arm wrestle right now?

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Speaker 1: Arm wrestling wasn't one of them.

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Speaker 2: But I would only well, well, I would only ask

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Speaker 2: if I was sure I could win. Yeah, so, and

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Speaker 2: I'm not certain I would win, so I'm not going

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Speaker 2: to do it. I am wrestled Mill Gibson once. We

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Speaker 2: were doing in an interview at Angel Stadium, and I

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Speaker 2: just had this crazy addea, shit, I'm Ruslim, and I

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Speaker 2: think he would have won. I just stopped really quickly.

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Speaker 2: So you you were into sport.

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Speaker 1: I was, and and I liked making people laugh.

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Speaker 3: I was, yeah, you are very witty, Joel.

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Speaker 1: Well, I try to keep up with you. I try

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Speaker 1: to keep you on your toes the best I can.

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Speaker 3: Well.

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Speaker 2: I like the way that you weave your humor because

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Speaker 2: you deal with some very weighty, heavy subjects, and I

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Speaker 2: think when you can bring humor in and and have

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Speaker 2: little moments of lightness, that actually helps listener, the viewer

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Speaker 2: to you know, take in all that information.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, a spoonful of sugar makes the medicine. I've read

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Speaker 1: that somewhere exactly. When I was growing up, I really

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Speaker 1: did want to write for Saturday Night Live. I want

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Speaker 1: to write Carson. I didn't stand up, but I but

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Speaker 1: I that was an aspiration, and I realized the Lord

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Speaker 1: didn't think that was a good idea. I didn't. I

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Speaker 1: wasn't good enough for that. But I do think having

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Speaker 1: a sense of humor and it's a penning part of

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Speaker 1: a gift of encouragement when it's used in the spirit,

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Speaker 1: and I think the Lord has used that in a

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Speaker 1: mix of Bible teaching and Bible prophecy especially, You're right,

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Speaker 1: some of these things are very heavy and they're also odd,

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Speaker 1: you know, since most pastors don't I'm not a pastor,

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Speaker 1: but most pastors don't teach Bible prophecy. So when you're

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Speaker 1: speaking about it, you have to acknowledge, at least internally,

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Speaker 1: that people aren't entirely sure that they want to go

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Speaker 1: where you're talking them.

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Speaker 2: Let me just interrupt you for a moment. I want

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Speaker 2: to hear more about your childhood. But you said a

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Speaker 2: lot of pastors don't teach on Bible prophecy. That is

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Speaker 2: really true now. Thirty years ago, even fifty years ago,

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Speaker 2: and that Jesus movement was happening, it was common to

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Speaker 2: hear messages about the return of Christ and specifically about

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Speaker 2: the Rapture. Of course, the tough selling book of the

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Speaker 2: seventies was The Late Great Planet Earth. Then there was

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Speaker 2: the amazing success of the Left Behind books. But nowadays

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Speaker 2: it seems like it's rare to hear a sermon about

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Speaker 2: the end times from of the pulpit. Why do you

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Speaker 2: think that is well?

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Speaker 1: I think that even though twenty seven percent of the

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Speaker 1: Bible is prophecy, you know the reason, why don't people

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Speaker 1: teach it? I don't think. I think a lot of

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Speaker 1: pastors don't understand it. They haven't studied it. A lot

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Speaker 1: of Bible colleges and seminaries aren't teaching it. Maybe there's

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Speaker 1: a class but you know, out of four years of

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Speaker 1: Bible college or seminary, that's not that much. It's complicated.

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Speaker 1: It takes extra time to prepare for it, and if

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Speaker 1: you don't have a context for it, that's a problem.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 1: Some people just don't believe it. They think it's all

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Speaker 1: metaphor and algory.

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Speaker 2: But even non believers today, I think, more than ever

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Speaker 2: are saying, wait, a second World War three, I'm going

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Speaker 2: to I heard this somewhere before. I'm wn' I heard

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Speaker 2: Christians talk about this. They hear words like armageddon thrown

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Speaker 2: about in mainstream discourse.

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Speaker 3: And it seems to me.

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Speaker 1: The President of the United States on World War three

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Speaker 1: and Biden spoke of armageddon.

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Speaker 2: He did he used the actual word armageddon. We know

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Speaker 2: it's weird because there's actually a blessing attached to specifically

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Speaker 2: the study of Revelation. Blessed are they that read here

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Speaker 2: and keep the words of this book. The word blessing

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Speaker 2: promises God is going to bless you as you do it.

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Speaker 2: And I think what is true specifically of revelation is

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Speaker 2: true principally of the study of all prophecy. He gave

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Speaker 2: us these things. You know, it seems to me, God's

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Speaker 2: desire is not to conceal, but to reveal, because revelation

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Speaker 2: means the unveiling. So why should we not understand these things?

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Speaker 2: What would you say to maybe somebody who's a pastor

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Speaker 2: out there who is afraid to attack this topic, Like,

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Speaker 2: is there maybe a go to book? Like start with

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Speaker 2: this book apart from the Bible, of course, Like, start

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Speaker 2: with this book. It's a really good primer teaching end

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Speaker 2: times events. Maybe it's something you've written or something you're

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Speaker 2: aware of.

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Speaker 1: Sure, but I want to first say that I think

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Speaker 1: a lot of pastors if they maybe they have and

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Speaker 1: studied it, maybe they don't understand it, maybe they don't

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Speaker 1: believe it. But there's the other part, which is they

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Speaker 1: don't want to look like a lunatic. This is a

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Speaker 1: big problem because a lot of people who do teach

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Speaker 1: prophecy or are passionate about it, they seem like they're

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Speaker 1: from Roswell, New Mexico. They seem like they've built their

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Speaker 1: website at area fifty one. You know it's read flames

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Speaker 1: and everything is in capital letters and ninety seven exclamation points.

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Speaker 1: And people are like or their date setting and they're

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Speaker 1: eighty eight. You know you mentioned the other. And I

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Speaker 1: have a box actually of books like this eighty eight

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Speaker 1: Reasons Why Jesus Coming in eighty eight. I have the sequel,

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Speaker 1: which was the eighty nine Reasons Why He's Actually Coming

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Speaker 1: in eighty nine. Both sold millions. I had a book

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Speaker 1: called called nineteen ninety five I think it was or

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Speaker 1: ninety four, maybe it was ninety five. I think, you know,

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Speaker 1: a five hundred page book about why it's going to

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Speaker 1: come on, the Jesus coming on this exact time. So

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Speaker 1: all of that helps discredit the whole concept of prophecy.

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Speaker 1: And so I think a lot of pastors are like,

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Speaker 1: I don't want to go there. So where would I start.

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Speaker 1: There's a great book call The End by a wonderful

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Speaker 1: Shot Marsh exactly. He's a Dallas theological seminary, uh professor

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Speaker 1: or a social professor.

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Speaker 2: Mark's a friend of mine, and and I know that book,

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Speaker 2: and and he's a really good source to go to.

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Speaker 3: I agree he is.

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Speaker 1: And and I think that, uh, he's solid, he's calm,

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Speaker 1: he drinks decalf. I think I mean he's you know,

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Speaker 1: he's not like you know, you know, and which is

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Speaker 1: again that feeling of you deal with people who were

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Speaker 1: interested in prophecy, and some of them they just don't

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Speaker 1: seem balanced. H it's because they're not so that that

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Speaker 1: that is a real I would say it's lame and

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Speaker 1: accessible this book the end, but it's but it's written

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Speaker 1: by a true scholar, and he's a pastor, so he's

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Speaker 1: also thinking, how do I take the academic and actually

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Speaker 1: teach it and make it accessible for other pastors.

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Speaker 2: Well, isn't that the goal of all preaching to take

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Speaker 2: those things that are maybe hard to understand and make

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Speaker 2: them understandable.

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Speaker 1: It is absolutely, But I would you reference late Great

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Speaker 1: Planet Earth that's sold more than ten million copies. There

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Speaker 1: was something very positive about it because it helped people

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Speaker 1: connect what was happening in the world at that time

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Speaker 1: in early seventies with what a lot of prophecy says. However,

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Speaker 1: it did overreach, and so while many people came to

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Speaker 1: faith in Christ because of that book, thinking Wow, the

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Speaker 1: Bible is real, it's relevant. It's telling me what's happening

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Speaker 1: right now, I get I ought to follow Jesus. On

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Speaker 1: the other hand, there were people who struggled with their faith.

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Speaker 1: Faith I don't know. I've never personally met someone who

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Speaker 1: lost their faith but because of it, but he extrapolated

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Speaker 1: into some things that seemed obvious to him. It just

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Speaker 1: turned out to be wrong. So over time it had

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Speaker 1: it had two effects, to draw people to the Bible

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Speaker 1: and to prophecy and to the Lord. But for others

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Speaker 1: like no, that's he's wrong. Therefore I'm not listening to

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Speaker 1: any of it, and that's a risk.

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Speaker 2: I don't think there's anything wrong with Like I told

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Speaker 2: you Rea, you know, I try to teach Bible prophecy

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Speaker 2: in a way that ten years from now, if someone

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Speaker 2: listens to this message, I won't be.

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Speaker 3: Embarrassed by it.

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Speaker 2: So I think we can offer our ideas and our

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Speaker 2: interpretations and our theories. Like we might say, well, okay,

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Speaker 2: from my understanding of scripture, and we would both agree

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Speaker 2: with this. We believe that Magog is Russian. Okay, But

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Speaker 2: you know that is not an essential doctrine of the

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Speaker 2: Christian faith. But it is an interpretation based on many sources,

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Speaker 2: many things that can support it. But it's okey to

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Speaker 2: say now I think this. Now it may be different,

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Speaker 2: But here's what we do know. A large force from

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Speaker 2: the north of Israel will attack her, and this will

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Speaker 2: be a sign of the end time. So we can

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Speaker 2: say that was certainty, but give ourselves a little wiggle

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Speaker 2: room and maybe something will happen geopolitically or around the

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Speaker 2: world that will change a little. And we have seen

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Speaker 2: some surprising things happen in even recent days. Every years ago,

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Speaker 2: you know, the Bible talks about the ten nations united

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Speaker 2: under Antichrist. Many thought that was what was called the

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Speaker 2: common market, but now we see it a little bit differently.

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Speaker 2: So that's okay, give yourself some room to interpret. But

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Speaker 2: then we want to stand strong on the essentials, which

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Speaker 2: are Christ is coming back. He did tell us to watch,

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Speaker 2: he did tell us to be ready. Let's not miss

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Speaker 2: the points.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's why we teach what the Bible actually says. Yes,

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Speaker 1: then we interpret it in light of scripture. Then we

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Speaker 1: can say my sense of it is that it could

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Speaker 1: mean this, but as long as we have to be

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Speaker 1: clear that this part is our sense. But let's make

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Speaker 1: sure people actually understand prophecy. That's another piece is some

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Speaker 1: people who get a little too hopped up on prophecy.

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Speaker 1: They're trying to persuade you, and I find that teaching

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Speaker 1: prophecy is not the same as the gospel, the Gospel.

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Speaker 1: I implore you to listen and to make a decision.

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Speaker 1: Today's the day of salvation, right, this is right in

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Speaker 1: your wheelhouse. With prophecy, I don't to persuade people. I

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Speaker 1: feel like, just teach it what it says, and teach

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Speaker 1: it how to understand it, interpret it in light of

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Speaker 1: other scripture that is critical. Then I can add, well,

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Speaker 1: this is where we're trending geopolitically, so therefore it could

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Speaker 1: mean this, It could mean that I would watch for this.

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Speaker 1: But as long as that part my own, my own personal,

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Speaker 1: not a biblical understanding of of of other context of

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Speaker 1: the scripture. As long as that's clear, that's so less important.

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Speaker 1: And yet I think for some prophecy teachers, they they

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Speaker 1: get an inflated sense of self that there's somehow supposed

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Speaker 1: to understand exactly what it means. Even the people who

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Speaker 1: wrote the prophecies in the scriptures did not understand exactly

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Speaker 1: what they were saying or when it was going to happen.

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Speaker 1: The scriptures tell us this, right, and they you know,

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Speaker 1: the New Testament tells us that Old Testament prophets long

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Speaker 1: to understand and to see the days that they were

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Speaker 1: writing about they didn't fully understand that. So this is

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Speaker 1: just a level of humility and caution that will help

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Speaker 1: the seeds of the scriptures that we teach the prophecies

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Speaker 1: be planted in as healthy an environment as possible, and

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Speaker 1: then if anything that we have said helps, great I

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Speaker 1: remember Tim Lahay, Doctor Tim Lahay was one of the

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Speaker 1: great Bible prophecy experts of the twentieth century.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 1: It was his idea to create the Left Behind novel

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Speaker 1: series sold sixty five million copies. And by the way,

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Speaker 1: I would distinguish even late great planet Earth. You were

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Speaker 1: in environment gray as you came to faith, and you

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Speaker 1: were an environment where people were teaching prophecy. But the

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Speaker 1: Roman Catholic Church doesn't teach it. Much of the reform

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Speaker 1: theological movement doesn't teach most of it, and so it's

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Speaker 1: a pretty relatively narrow in the grand scheme of all

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Speaker 1: of you two and a half billion Christians of pastors

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Speaker 1: that are teaching it. So you happen to be swimming

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Speaker 1: in an environment where it was very much alive and

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Speaker 1: it very much helped your faith. But all that to say,

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Speaker 1: I remember getting to know doctor tim Lahay wife was

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Speaker 1: working for his wife and yeah, Beverly, and so my

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Speaker 1: wife was running their annual Christian women's conventions, I concern

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Speaker 1: Women for America. So we would move in like for

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Speaker 1: a week before this convention as Lynn had to do

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Speaker 1: all this work, and I just got to, you know,

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Speaker 1: hang out in the hotel. And Tim, Hey, he didn't

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Speaker 1: have anything.

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Speaker 3: To do either.

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Speaker 1: He was just there to support his wife. So we

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Speaker 1: got to hang out. That's the first person I ever

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Speaker 1: knew that taught about prophecy, and it happened to be

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Speaker 1: one of the world's are arguably the world's expert. Now

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Speaker 1: he was trying to explain to me, not persuade me,

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Speaker 1: but explain to me. This is nineteen ninety two, ninety three,

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Speaker 1: those few years he was trying to explain to me

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Speaker 1: Gog and Maggog. He was trying to say that Russia

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Speaker 1: will become the major threat to Israel, form an alliance

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Speaker 1: with Iran and the other countries, and I come against Israel.

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Speaker 1: In the last days. He gave me a copy of

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Speaker 1: a paperback book that he written years before, and I'm

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Speaker 1: thinking to myself, I mean, I don't say it, but

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Speaker 1: inside I'm feeling a little snarky. Well, you're the big

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Speaker 1: expert on Bible, obviously, but have you read the newspaper, Tim,

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Speaker 1: You know doctor Lelay is what I call him. But

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Speaker 1: you know the Soviet Union is falling apart, a million

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Speaker 1: Jews are coming out. You're trying to tell me that

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Speaker 1: Russia and Iran are going to form some alliance and

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Speaker 1: be a hostile actor towards Israel. You have any idea

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Speaker 1: what's happening in the real world. But he wasn't. Yes,

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Speaker 1: he did understand the real world, but he didn't try

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Speaker 1: to persuade me. He just taught me and he gave

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Speaker 1: me a book. Well, ten years later, I'm working for

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Speaker 1: Natan Sharansky, who had just finished being the Deputy Prime

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Speaker 1: Minister of Israel, and he's telling me a story. We're

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Speaker 1: on a flight from Washington, New York City, and he's

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Speaker 1: telling me a story, just as I'm working for him

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Speaker 1: as a media advisor. He says, yeah, a couple of

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Speaker 1: years ago, Joel. And by the way, just for your

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Speaker 1: audience that may not know not. Tan Sharansky was born

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Speaker 1: and raised in the Soviet Union Jewish, a real hero

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Speaker 1: of human rights for Jews and for others, but was

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Speaker 1: put in the Gulag the prisons of the KGB for

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Speaker 1: nine years for being a jewis Ish human rights tactivists.

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Speaker 1: So he gets released. Eventually he becomes the Deputy Prime

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Speaker 1: Minister of Visual and now I'm sitting with him, amazing,

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Speaker 1: my family escaped out of Russia. So I considered him

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Speaker 1: a great hero, as do most Jews. So he's telling me, yeah,

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Speaker 1: a couple of years ago, Joel I won't do his accent.

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Speaker 1: Prime mister net and Yahoo sent me to Moscow. He says,

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Speaker 1: not done. I want you to go to go to Moscow.

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Speaker 1: And Transky was like, I don't want to go to Moscow.

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Speaker 1: Did Moscow? Don't want to go back? No, no, no,

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Speaker 1: you're the right guy. I want you to go meet

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Speaker 1: with this guy named Vladimir Putin. Wowansky's like what yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's the new head of the KGB, they call it

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Speaker 1: the FSB. I want you to talk to him and

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Speaker 1: give him this file and show him that we know

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Speaker 1: that the Russians are selling nuclear technology to Iran. I'm

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Speaker 1: fear this was two thousand, wow, the summer of two thousand,

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Speaker 1: so this is about eight years after getting to know

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Speaker 1: Tim Lahey. And so I'm listening to a man who

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Speaker 1: was sent by the Prime Minister visual to the to

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Speaker 1: me a Putin who was not the who was just

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Speaker 1: becoming the president of Russia, but in the in the story,

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Speaker 1: he's only the head of you know, the new KGB.

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Speaker 1: And and Shransky's explaining to me how net Nyaho was

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Speaker 1: worried that Russia, the Russian Iranian alliance is emerging and

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Speaker 1: it's going to become one of the most dangerous threats

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Speaker 1: to Israel. And I don't say it to Shransky because

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Speaker 1: it's not my place, but I'm thinking this is what

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Speaker 1: Tim Lahay was talking about. So as soon as I

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Speaker 1: finished that assignment, I go home and I'm like, honey,

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Speaker 1: where's that book? Like I think you put it in

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Speaker 1: the garage and I'm like, you know, And I finally

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Speaker 1: find this old out of print book by Tim Lahay

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Speaker 1: and I read it and I'm like, all right, he

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Speaker 1: was onto something because he was just studying the scriptures.

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Speaker 1: He wasn't he wasn't dating what he was telling me

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Speaker 1: by the current moment. He's just saying this is going

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Speaker 1: to happen at some point. And that began to teach

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Speaker 1: me several things. One he was right about more than

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Speaker 1: I realized I was a young whipper snapper and I

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Speaker 1: thought my new stuff and I didn't. But more importantly,

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Speaker 1: just teach it. Yeah, drop it as a seed. It

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Speaker 1: may be, it may be in snarky, cynical soil, but

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Speaker 1: God can bring it to life in the future. And

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Speaker 1: that's an important principle on Bible prophecy. It's not the

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Speaker 1: same as the Gospel, and we just have to be

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Speaker 1: committed to teaching it without trying to necessarily persuade people

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Speaker 1: right on the prophet So.

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Speaker 2: Let's go back to what doctor Lahay was writing about

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Speaker 2: and what turned out to be true in real time.

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Speaker 2: This alliance with Russia and Iran was in nineteen thirty five,

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Speaker 2: Persia changed their name to Iran. Right, Okay, So Persia

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Speaker 2: is one of the allies that marches with may Goog.

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Speaker 2: So if may Gog is Russia, and we believe it is,

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Speaker 2: this is the Bible is prophesign an alliance that did

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Speaker 2: not happen until how many years later.

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Speaker 1: It basically starts in the early nineteen nineties, right about

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Speaker 1: the time that Tim Hey is Doctoray is telling me this. Why, well,

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Speaker 1: because what happened is when the Soviet Union imploded and

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Speaker 1: it ended, and it was just now Russia. It wasn't

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Speaker 1: the Soviet Union anymore, the Soviet Empire and the million

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Speaker 1: Jews left. In the years that followed, the Russian leadership thought,

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Speaker 1: we got a problem. We have weapons, but we have

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Speaker 1: no money. Right, We're a bankrupted country, but we have

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Speaker 1: all these weapons from the Cold War Iran. Iran's leadership thought,

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Speaker 1: we have a problem. We've just fought an eight year

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Speaker 1: war with the Rock. We have money, oil, money, but

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Speaker 1: we don't have any weapons. So they thought, who's got

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Speaker 1: weapons and needs money? The Russians. This was a match

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Speaker 1: made in hell that they two sides saw that they

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Speaker 1: needed each other, and the Russians were like, sure, buy

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Speaker 1: our weapons, that'd be fantastic. And this began around nineteen

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Speaker 1: ninety four ninety five. But when Vladimir Putin takes over

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Speaker 1: two thousand, he accelerates the relationship with Iran. At this moment,

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Speaker 1: I start thinking, I start I'm almost trembling with the

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Speaker 1: feeling of things are getting set into motion that I

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Speaker 1: learned about eight nine years ago I didn't believe now,

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Speaker 1: and this gets me into the idea of I should

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Speaker 1: write about this. And so after I helped Benjamin Netnya

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Speaker 1: who go Nowhere. I was in a junior advisor and

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Speaker 1: his comeback campaign in the fall of two thousand. He

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Speaker 1: didn't come back for nine more years. This was part

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Speaker 1: of my failed political consulting line.

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Speaker 2: Now it's the longest serving prime minister I believe in

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Speaker 2: the history of history.

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Speaker 1: Exactly, and I played absolutely no role. I was no

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Speaker 1: help at all and bless his heart. So anyway, that's

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Speaker 1: where I began to think about writing a series of novels,

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Speaker 1: because what I liked about the Tim Lahay model was

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Speaker 1: study the prophecies, and there's a wide range of ways

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Speaker 1: to teach.

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Speaker 3: Yes.

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Speaker 1: Novels give you a way to say, this is not

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Speaker 1: exactly the way it's going to be. But what if

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Speaker 1: it gets you thinking with a different part of your brain.

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Speaker 1: Novels fire up your imagination and get you to think

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Speaker 1: emotionally and get think wow, wow, what if and you

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Speaker 1: just start chewing on it differently than if you read

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Speaker 1: an editorial in the newspaper or even a nonfiction book

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Speaker 1: on prophecies. So and you're going to reach a much

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Speaker 1: wider audience. We've sold five million copies of these books,

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Speaker 1: and again it's not sixty five million copies that they sold.

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Speaker 1: But we're in a season where there is much less

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Speaker 1: interest in prophecy than there was in the eighties and nineties, seventies,

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Speaker 1: eighties and nineties, but it's still important and so interest

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Speaker 1: or not, I just feel like this is part of

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Speaker 1: what I'm supposed to be doing. And whether it's podcasting,

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Speaker 1: whether it's preaching and teaching, or whether it's television on

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Speaker 1: TBN or novels, I'm looking for every possible way to

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Speaker 1: engage people that might be very skeptical.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's interesting to think about world readers because you've

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Speaker 2: met a lot of inflouid people. You mentioned that Ya who.

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Speaker 2: Of course you've become friends with former CIA director Mike Pompeo,

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Speaker 2: Vice President Pence on many others, And it's interesting to

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Speaker 2: think about a person in a position of authority believing

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Speaker 2: these things. You know, I met Marco Rubio ten years ago.

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Speaker 2: I was speaking at a couple's conference in Hawaii and

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Speaker 2: someone said, Marco Rubio is here and would like to

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Speaker 2: meet you, And I said, the Marco Rubio, Senator Marco Rubio. Yes,

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Speaker 2: So we met him and his wife, Jeanette. Beautiful couple.

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Speaker 2: Love the Lord love the Bible, and Marco had a

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Speaker 2: particular interest in the end Times, and so I had

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Speaker 2: written a commentary and revelation, and so he gathered a

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Speaker 2: bunch of his buddies who like to study the Bible,

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Speaker 2: and I'm going through revelation in End Times events with them.

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Speaker 2: And then now, look, Marco is the Secretary of State.

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Speaker 1: It's amazing, you know.

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Speaker 3: So that's an incredible thing.

432
00:22:04,725 --> 00:22:07,685
Speaker 1: And let me just add just a small piece in there,

433
00:22:07,764 --> 00:22:10,084
Speaker 1: and then you continue with your thought, which is he

434
00:22:10,284 --> 00:22:12,764
Speaker 1: became interested in my novels. And when he was running

435
00:22:12,764 --> 00:22:17,164
Speaker 1: for president, he was actively The Associated Press actually snapped

436
00:22:17,165 --> 00:22:18,764
Speaker 1: a picture of him getting on a plane. He has

437
00:22:18,804 --> 00:22:20,564
Speaker 1: a stack of books he just bought, and one of

438
00:22:20,564 --> 00:22:22,925
Speaker 1: them was a book called The Twelfthy Mom that was

439
00:22:22,965 --> 00:22:27,324
Speaker 1: a political thriller about Iranian eschatology that they think some

440
00:22:27,645 --> 00:22:30,844
Speaker 1: savior is coming. And anyway, he and I end up

441
00:22:31,084 --> 00:22:33,044
Speaker 1: because of that. I reached out to him and we

442
00:22:33,165 --> 00:22:36,764
Speaker 1: ended up meeting several times, becoming friends and of friends.

443
00:22:36,764 --> 00:22:39,044
Speaker 1: I don't want to overstate it, but we got to

444
00:22:39,125 --> 00:22:43,125
Speaker 1: know each other and had similar conversations as well as

445
00:22:43,365 --> 00:22:46,084
Speaker 1: one of the future of America. You're right, though, but

446
00:22:46,484 --> 00:22:49,444
Speaker 1: when you meet people earlier in their careers and you

447
00:22:49,484 --> 00:22:52,804
Speaker 1: have no idea. But if God opens those doors and

448
00:22:52,844 --> 00:22:55,404
Speaker 1: you build a relationship and you can be somewhat helpful,

449
00:22:55,484 --> 00:23:00,404
Speaker 1: you hope on spiritual things, on biblical issues. You know.

450
00:23:00,604 --> 00:23:02,844
Speaker 1: That's how I met Pence and Mike and Karen was

451
00:23:02,965 --> 00:23:05,125
Speaker 1: they were readers of the novels. They weren't. He wasn't

452
00:23:05,165 --> 00:23:07,965
Speaker 1: the Vice president, yet he never even imagined it. Mike

453
00:23:08,004 --> 00:23:10,244
Speaker 1: Pompeo was a member of the House of Representatives, but

454
00:23:10,244 --> 00:23:13,004
Speaker 1: he wasn't the CIA director, he wasn't the Secretary of State.

455
00:23:14,445 --> 00:23:17,884
Speaker 1: So yeah, God sometimes opens crazy you know.

456
00:23:17,965 --> 00:23:20,604
Speaker 2: Coming back to net Yahu, I've heard him give speeches

457
00:23:21,165 --> 00:23:24,884
Speaker 2: or he alludes to Ezekiel thirty seven and the return

458
00:23:24,965 --> 00:23:27,364
Speaker 2: of the Jews to their homeland. So it seemed to

459
00:23:27,405 --> 00:23:30,604
Speaker 2: me listening to this that he believed this was a

460
00:23:30,645 --> 00:23:35,045
Speaker 2: prophecy that has been fulfilled. Modern Israel is a fulfillment

461
00:23:35,084 --> 00:23:37,605
Speaker 2: of that prophecy of the Jews attorney to their land

462
00:23:37,844 --> 00:23:40,524
Speaker 2: and a sign of the last days. But does he

463
00:23:40,844 --> 00:23:43,885
Speaker 2: believe the rest of what Ezekiel says? Well, you wonder

464
00:23:43,965 --> 00:23:46,205
Speaker 2: if net Yak who look at make ag and think

465
00:23:46,604 --> 00:23:49,524
Speaker 2: could this be Russia? You know, does a bad accent

466
00:23:49,764 --> 00:23:52,685
Speaker 2: or imitation that you could probably do net Yahu.

467
00:23:52,604 --> 00:23:54,725
Speaker 1: No, I can. He doesn't have a I don't know

468
00:23:54,764 --> 00:23:57,325
Speaker 1: anyone who who does a good impression of him.

469
00:23:57,484 --> 00:23:59,764
Speaker 3: No, he well, he has great commanded the English language.

470
00:23:59,804 --> 00:24:01,604
Speaker 1: Does he went to school yeah, here.

471
00:24:01,445 --> 00:24:03,845
Speaker 2: In the nineteenth But I wonder have you ever had

472
00:24:03,885 --> 00:24:06,764
Speaker 2: a discussion with him about that or heard him talk

473
00:24:06,804 --> 00:24:11,085
Speaker 2: about a prophecy in the future of Israel.

474
00:24:11,284 --> 00:24:15,244
Speaker 1: No, we've only spoken about what he's also spoken about publicly,

475
00:24:15,324 --> 00:24:18,764
Speaker 1: which is his belief that Ezekiel thirty seven, the value

476
00:24:18,804 --> 00:24:21,685
Speaker 1: of the dry bones, is what happened. That he actually

477
00:24:21,725 --> 00:24:23,924
Speaker 1: spoke at Auschwitz on one of the I think the

478
00:24:24,044 --> 00:24:28,484
Speaker 1: sixtieth or sixty of Auschwitz, in which he said there

479
00:24:29,564 --> 00:24:32,484
Speaker 1: this was the value of dry bones, I'm paraphrasing. And

480
00:24:32,844 --> 00:24:35,205
Speaker 1: out of this, when we thought we were dead and

481
00:24:35,284 --> 00:24:38,284
Speaker 1: buried as a people, out of this, the state of

482
00:24:38,324 --> 00:24:41,764
Speaker 1: Israel was reborn. I haven't actually ever talked to him

483
00:24:41,764 --> 00:24:48,644
Speaker 1: about the Ezekiel thirty eight thirty nine. You know, Sharansky

484
00:24:48,685 --> 00:24:51,205
Speaker 1: has read several of my books, including a novel called

485
00:24:51,205 --> 00:24:54,365
Speaker 1: The Ezekiel Option, and I told him this came came out.

486
00:24:54,445 --> 00:24:56,244
Speaker 1: You know, I'm not saying he believes it. I'm just

487
00:24:56,284 --> 00:24:58,805
Speaker 1: saying I told him that when I gave it to him.

488
00:24:58,844 --> 00:25:01,324
Speaker 1: This is this came out of our conversation. I'm not

489
00:25:01,324 --> 00:25:03,885
Speaker 1: sure if you're aware of this, but there are prophecies

490
00:25:03,965 --> 00:25:06,125
Speaker 1: that say Russia and Iran is going to form this alliance,

491
00:25:06,165 --> 00:25:11,004
Speaker 1: and you gave me the idea in part. So again,

492
00:25:11,125 --> 00:25:15,524
Speaker 1: I think we just keep teaching to those who have

493
00:25:15,604 --> 00:25:17,884
Speaker 1: ears to hear it, and even if they don't have

494
00:25:17,925 --> 00:25:19,804
Speaker 1: ears to hear, you still share it when you can.

495
00:25:20,725 --> 00:25:24,044
Speaker 1: I think I think God put me in Washington, d C.

496
00:25:24,205 --> 00:25:27,244
Speaker 1: For twenty four years before going to Israel and not

497
00:25:27,564 --> 00:25:32,044
Speaker 1: in the Bible Belt. I was learning to study prophecy

498
00:25:32,084 --> 00:25:35,045
Speaker 1: and explain prophecy and starting to teach prophecy and write

499
00:25:35,044 --> 00:25:38,884
Speaker 1: about prophecy in Washington, d C. The most cynical city

500
00:25:39,564 --> 00:25:45,285
Speaker 1: in America, right, And so you cannot assume something that

501
00:25:45,365 --> 00:25:49,284
Speaker 1: if you're a preacher in East Texas, you know they're

502
00:25:49,324 --> 00:25:51,884
Speaker 1: all gonna get what you're saying because we've been teaching

503
00:25:51,925 --> 00:25:55,484
Speaker 1: it since you were four years Well you're trying, you know,

504
00:25:56,125 --> 00:25:58,165
Speaker 1: not that good, you know, But if you go down

505
00:25:58,244 --> 00:26:02,204
Speaker 1: like Tyler, Texas, you can't say Tyler I've been there.

506
00:26:02,244 --> 00:26:03,565
Speaker 1: I've taught a lot of times. It was like it's

507
00:26:03,685 --> 00:26:07,965
Speaker 1: Tiler textas Joel people. I was just an Amarilla. It's

508
00:26:07,965 --> 00:26:11,284
Speaker 1: not Amarillo, it's Amarilla. And they gave me boots. I

509
00:26:11,284 --> 00:26:15,885
Speaker 1: think there's snake skin boots. I had never worn a boot.

510
00:26:16,084 --> 00:26:19,124
Speaker 1: You should. They gave me a beautiful pair. And to

511
00:26:19,205 --> 00:26:21,324
Speaker 1: a Yankee for crying out out so I thought, wow,

512
00:26:21,365 --> 00:26:26,364
Speaker 1: God bless you. But the point is when you speak

513
00:26:26,524 --> 00:26:30,284
Speaker 1: in an environment where everybody believes you, you you talk different.

514
00:26:32,084 --> 00:26:34,804
Speaker 1: And when you live and you're trying to explain prophecy

515
00:26:35,365 --> 00:26:40,324
Speaker 1: in the most cynical, hostile city toxicity in America, you

516
00:26:40,484 --> 00:26:43,205
Speaker 1: have to think differently and you have to explain differently.

517
00:26:43,685 --> 00:26:46,645
Speaker 1: And I would explain just again in political context, when

518
00:26:46,685 --> 00:26:49,924
Speaker 1: you hear Ted Cruz talk about politics, who's a Texan

519
00:26:49,965 --> 00:26:52,044
Speaker 1: and as it comes from a very red state, he

520
00:26:52,165 --> 00:26:55,925
Speaker 1: talks differently than Marco Rubio, who comes from Florida, which

521
00:26:55,965 --> 00:26:58,924
Speaker 1: was for a long time a purple states. It's the

522
00:26:59,004 --> 00:27:03,564
Speaker 1: same philosophy, but it's different tone. You're you're trying to

523
00:27:03,844 --> 00:27:07,565
Speaker 1: appeal to people differently. Cruise is speaking to people who

524
00:27:07,564 --> 00:27:10,764
Speaker 1: believe him. Marco is talking to some people who believe him,

525
00:27:10,764 --> 00:27:13,324
Speaker 1: but a lot of people who don't or aren't sure.

526
00:27:13,965 --> 00:27:17,965
Speaker 1: And I think God took me down the prophecy school,

527
00:27:18,125 --> 00:27:20,764
Speaker 1: as it were, in a place where I had to

528
00:27:20,844 --> 00:27:22,884
Speaker 1: learn how to talk to people who were like, you

529
00:27:23,244 --> 00:27:26,604
Speaker 1: freaking got to be kidding me, There's no way. And

530
00:27:26,645 --> 00:27:29,965
Speaker 1: I think the Lord has created a different a different

531
00:27:29,965 --> 00:27:31,365
Speaker 1: tone in the way I talk about it. And also

532
00:27:31,484 --> 00:27:34,725
Speaker 1: humor became a big part of it, because if you

533
00:27:34,764 --> 00:27:38,205
Speaker 1: take yourself a little too seriously, people are going to

534
00:27:38,244 --> 00:27:38,484
Speaker 1: think you.

535
00:27:38,804 --> 00:27:40,885
Speaker 2: Well. When we do our crusades, you know, I've done

536
00:27:40,965 --> 00:27:45,565
Speaker 2: crusades all around the United States, and my favorite places

537
00:27:45,645 --> 00:27:49,124
Speaker 2: are the more secular spots. We had a tremendous crusade

538
00:27:49,244 --> 00:27:51,924
Speaker 2: in New York City at Medicine Square Garden. We had

539
00:27:51,925 --> 00:27:56,284
Speaker 2: a really great one in Seattle, where I've heard there

540
00:27:56,324 --> 00:28:00,605
Speaker 2: are more dogs than Christians and so but I remember.

541
00:28:00,284 --> 00:28:02,524
Speaker 1: The pente more coffee companies than.

542
00:28:02,725 --> 00:28:06,764
Speaker 2: More lots of coffee. But the percent of response was

543
00:28:06,844 --> 00:28:10,084
Speaker 2: way higher in Seattle than it was when I did

544
00:28:10,244 --> 00:28:13,164
Speaker 2: a harvest cruise state in Georgia or in some of

545
00:28:13,205 --> 00:28:16,684
Speaker 2: the Southern states. I love those people, and but you know,

546
00:28:16,725 --> 00:28:19,084
Speaker 2: there's this there can be a jaded this where they

547
00:28:19,324 --> 00:28:22,044
Speaker 2: I've read this from my childhood. But when you're talking

548
00:28:22,084 --> 00:28:25,044
Speaker 2: to a completely secular person and you know, I wasn't

549
00:28:25,084 --> 00:28:26,644
Speaker 2: raising the church, and.

550
00:28:26,564 --> 00:28:28,445
Speaker 1: So I think that helps you. Yeah, I mean God

551
00:28:28,645 --> 00:28:31,884
Speaker 1: created a testimony that you this wasn't all embedded in

552
00:28:32,165 --> 00:28:33,764
Speaker 1: this is the way it's said, this is the way

553
00:28:33,804 --> 00:28:37,044
Speaker 1: it's done. No, you You that was quite a road

554
00:28:37,125 --> 00:28:39,325
Speaker 1: and you had a hard life and when you came

555
00:28:39,365 --> 00:28:41,404
Speaker 1: to it, you're like, Okay, how do I appeal to

556
00:28:41,405 --> 00:28:42,045
Speaker 1: people like me?

557
00:28:42,965 --> 00:28:43,925
Speaker 3: That's right exactly.

558
00:28:44,045 --> 00:28:45,565
Speaker 1: I grew up in the Northeast, as I said, the

559
00:28:45,565 --> 00:28:47,805
Speaker 1: New York New Jersey thing. No, you're not getting any

560
00:28:47,844 --> 00:28:51,525
Speaker 1: cultural points for being a follower of Jesus in Texas.

561
00:28:51,565 --> 00:28:54,005
Speaker 1: You would, in Georgia, you would, in Mississippi you would,

562
00:28:54,045 --> 00:28:57,205
Speaker 1: but you do not get any There's no uh, there's

563
00:28:57,245 --> 00:29:00,045
Speaker 1: no benefits to your life, your business, your your your

564
00:29:00,084 --> 00:29:05,005
Speaker 1: your personality, or your your your social identity in the

565
00:29:04,805 --> 00:29:07,965
Speaker 1: in the unity by being a devout follow of Jesus.

566
00:29:08,005 --> 00:29:09,604
Speaker 1: Just the opposite. So you have to learn how to

567
00:29:10,084 --> 00:29:12,485
Speaker 1: operate in a place where everybody either hates you or

568
00:29:12,525 --> 00:29:13,805
Speaker 1: at least a skeptical of you.

569
00:29:14,005 --> 00:29:17,405
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I remember hearing I met that Yahouh

570
00:29:18,165 --> 00:29:21,525
Speaker 2: in Israel is funny because as with the bunch of pastors,

571
00:29:21,965 --> 00:29:24,005
Speaker 2: and the guy who invited me said, I want you

572
00:29:24,045 --> 00:29:27,165
Speaker 2: to ask a question of the Prime Minister was very excited,

573
00:29:27,205 --> 00:29:28,125
Speaker 2: and that's very nervous.

574
00:29:28,725 --> 00:29:30,164
Speaker 3: And so why were we nervous?

575
00:29:30,365 --> 00:29:33,285
Speaker 2: Because he's the Prime Minister of Israel and.

576
00:29:33,325 --> 00:29:34,644
Speaker 1: You're an ambassador of Jesus.

577
00:29:34,645 --> 00:29:37,045
Speaker 2: I know, but I was nervous, Okay, can I say?

578
00:29:37,205 --> 00:29:37,325
Speaker 3: So?

579
00:29:37,405 --> 00:29:40,364
Speaker 1: I had that I don't know if I've heard I

580
00:29:40,365 --> 00:29:40,924
Speaker 1: think I'd.

581
00:29:40,805 --> 00:29:43,245
Speaker 2: Been teaching through Esther and so I had this kind

582
00:29:43,245 --> 00:29:45,765
Speaker 2: of esther thought in my mind, like you know, who

583
00:29:45,765 --> 00:29:48,205
Speaker 2: knows that God has not put you there for such

584
00:29:48,245 --> 00:29:50,604
Speaker 2: a time as this. And then I combined no, and

585
00:29:50,645 --> 00:29:52,325
Speaker 2: then the guy who asked me to ask the question

586
00:29:52,445 --> 00:29:55,684
Speaker 2: gave me a question. So I combined our two questions

587
00:29:56,165 --> 00:29:58,645
Speaker 2: and I asked him and he looked at me and said,

588
00:29:58,685 --> 00:30:01,565
Speaker 2: I don't understand what you're but you're asking me and

589
00:30:01,565 --> 00:30:04,925
Speaker 2: everyone started laughing. And so I was humiliated in front

590
00:30:04,925 --> 00:30:08,605
Speaker 2: of the Prime mini. But but I had a point

591
00:30:08,645 --> 00:30:10,485
Speaker 2: about that. Oh yeah, I've all. I heard him say

592
00:30:10,485 --> 00:30:13,485
Speaker 2: in that meeting that the greatest friend of Israel is

593
00:30:13,525 --> 00:30:17,285
Speaker 2: the evangelical Christian, and I think it's so important because

594
00:30:17,285 --> 00:30:21,565
Speaker 2: I'm not a Jewish, I'm a gentile. And when I

595
00:30:21,565 --> 00:30:24,445
Speaker 2: did my twenty three and media test, I was hoping,

596
00:30:24,965 --> 00:30:27,404
Speaker 2: is there some Jewish blood of me somewhere? And I

597
00:30:27,485 --> 00:30:31,285
Speaker 2: found out I'm hopelessly gentile. I am like I am

598
00:30:31,405 --> 00:30:34,445
Speaker 2: white trash, I'm just well, no, I'm.

599
00:30:34,165 --> 00:30:35,604
Speaker 3: Scottish and Irish.

600
00:30:35,685 --> 00:30:38,165
Speaker 2: But I was taught and Chuck Smith was my pastor,

601
00:30:38,645 --> 00:30:42,964
Speaker 2: and Chuck Smith loved the Jewish people. Chuck Smith loved Israel.

602
00:30:43,005 --> 00:30:46,245
Speaker 2: He took this to Israel, and a whole generation of

603
00:30:46,285 --> 00:30:49,685
Speaker 2: young preachers picked that up from him. And now these

604
00:30:49,725 --> 00:30:54,124
Speaker 2: are our convictions that we've adopted us for ourselves. You know,

605
00:30:54,165 --> 00:30:57,125
Speaker 2: I think it's so important for us to build bridges

606
00:30:57,165 --> 00:30:58,245
Speaker 2: to the Jewish community.

607
00:30:58,525 --> 00:30:58,684
Speaker 3: You know.

608
00:30:58,765 --> 00:31:02,604
Speaker 2: After October seventh, I was asked to speak at the

609
00:31:02,725 --> 00:31:08,565
Speaker 2: Museum of Tolerance in Last Angeles to an exclusively Jewish audience.

610
00:31:09,084 --> 00:31:11,485
Speaker 2: And I was honored and a little intimidated. I like,

611
00:31:11,525 --> 00:31:14,885
Speaker 2: what do I say? So I wrote a little talk

612
00:31:15,445 --> 00:31:18,565
Speaker 2: and I just said to these people, you know, what

613
00:31:18,685 --> 00:31:21,404
Speaker 2: a tragedy was, how sorry we were. But here's what

614
00:31:21,485 --> 00:31:24,645
Speaker 2: amazed me. The rabbi who introduced me said to this

615
00:31:25,165 --> 00:31:28,805
Speaker 2: group gathered, he said, this man referring to me has

616
00:31:28,885 --> 00:31:32,844
Speaker 2: done more for our people in Israel than most.

617
00:31:32,604 --> 00:31:33,125
Speaker 3: Of you here.

618
00:31:33,205 --> 00:31:34,844
Speaker 2: And I was kind of shocked that he said that,

619
00:31:34,885 --> 00:31:36,725
Speaker 2: because I didn't know that he knew much about me

620
00:31:37,205 --> 00:31:39,765
Speaker 2: or what I've done or said. But what we did

621
00:31:39,925 --> 00:31:43,165
Speaker 2: was we just told the folks there that we love them.

622
00:31:43,925 --> 00:31:46,165
Speaker 2: But I thought, I'm not going to hide my testimony,

623
00:31:46,685 --> 00:31:48,965
Speaker 2: and I said, you know, my love for the Jewish

624
00:31:49,045 --> 00:31:52,644
Speaker 2: people came after I came into a relationship with Jesus Christ.

625
00:31:52,645 --> 00:31:55,485
Speaker 2: I was a confused kid going the wrong way in life.

626
00:31:55,525 --> 00:31:59,445
Speaker 2: I heard about Jesus. I began to read the Bible,

627
00:31:59,725 --> 00:32:02,805
Speaker 2: learn your history. That's where my love came for you

628
00:32:03,205 --> 00:32:06,084
Speaker 2: and for the book that came through you, et cetera.

629
00:32:06,285 --> 00:32:09,365
Speaker 2: And after I was done speaking, a number of them said,

630
00:32:09,365 --> 00:32:11,805
Speaker 2: why don't you come on our team? So I saw

631
00:32:11,844 --> 00:32:14,645
Speaker 2: that as a compliment, but I thought it was really

632
00:32:14,685 --> 00:32:17,165
Speaker 2: important for us to go and in a tangible way

633
00:32:17,245 --> 00:32:19,124
Speaker 2: say we care about you. One thing our church has

634
00:32:19,165 --> 00:32:23,885
Speaker 2: done is we just purchased a bulletproof ambulance for Israel.

635
00:32:23,925 --> 00:32:26,805
Speaker 2: We did this with Samaritan spirits. That's giving quite a

636
00:32:26,805 --> 00:32:30,005
Speaker 2: few of them at the request of Israel, and we're

637
00:32:30,005 --> 00:32:33,364
Speaker 2: giving this ambulance to them in the name of Jesus Christ.

638
00:32:33,445 --> 00:32:36,445
Speaker 2: You know these are This is from your Christian friends

639
00:32:36,685 --> 00:32:40,445
Speaker 2: in America at a harvest. But I see that that

640
00:32:40,725 --> 00:32:45,725
Speaker 2: there's something called replacement theology that has gained some prominence

641
00:32:45,725 --> 00:32:49,445
Speaker 2: in the church, where this is not what is being taught.

642
00:32:49,805 --> 00:32:52,005
Speaker 2: We're told that Israel is not in the land. Is

643
00:32:52,005 --> 00:32:56,605
Speaker 2: a fulfillment of Bible prophecy, and there is no emphasis

644
00:32:56,604 --> 00:33:00,445
Speaker 2: on the importance of us building bridges to the Jewish people,

645
00:33:00,525 --> 00:33:02,844
Speaker 2: loving them, reaching them with the gospel themes that you

646
00:33:02,965 --> 00:33:08,165
Speaker 2: talk about often, maybe just plain replacement theology and why

647
00:33:08,365 --> 00:33:11,285
Speaker 2: Christians should love Jewish people.

648
00:33:11,725 --> 00:33:16,165
Speaker 1: Sure, let's start with how much time did you say

649
00:33:16,165 --> 00:33:18,444
Speaker 1: you had, because that's the quiet a question. All right,

650
00:33:18,725 --> 00:33:20,364
Speaker 1: here's the short version. Then you can pull on the

651
00:33:20,365 --> 00:33:25,325
Speaker 1: threads if you'd like. Let's start with replacement theology at

652
00:33:25,365 --> 00:33:30,164
Speaker 1: the simplest level. That means pastors, theologians, others who believe

653
00:33:30,285 --> 00:33:36,644
Speaker 1: that the Church has replaced Israel in God's plan and

654
00:33:36,685 --> 00:33:41,965
Speaker 1: purpose for the world. That's not true. But there's a

655
00:33:42,084 --> 00:33:44,845
Speaker 1: dual track. Of course, the church is the central thing

656
00:33:44,844 --> 00:33:49,445
Speaker 1: that God is doing in this world. Since the Messianic

657
00:33:49,485 --> 00:33:52,124
Speaker 1: Age began, not the Millennial Kingdom, but the Messy Age

658
00:33:52,285 --> 00:33:56,205
Speaker 1: when Jesus came, died, rose again. Of course, the Church

659
00:33:56,285 --> 00:33:58,604
Speaker 1: is what he's building in this world. But there are

660
00:33:58,604 --> 00:34:00,644
Speaker 1: prophecies that go back to the Book of Genesis, the

661
00:34:00,685 --> 00:34:03,285
Speaker 1: first book of the Bible, that says God is raising

662
00:34:03,365 --> 00:34:06,445
Speaker 1: up the nation of Israel, and the Christians are told

663
00:34:06,485 --> 00:34:08,925
Speaker 1: by Paul in the one of the letters to Corinthians,

664
00:34:09,205 --> 00:34:12,725
Speaker 1: look to Israel. Learn from Israel, both the good and

665
00:34:12,805 --> 00:34:15,405
Speaker 1: the bad, and in the mistakes we've made. But God

666
00:34:15,565 --> 00:34:18,884
Speaker 1: is raising up Israel in these last days, as the

667
00:34:18,965 --> 00:34:22,005
Speaker 1: prophet said he would. So there's really two God has

668
00:34:22,045 --> 00:34:26,965
Speaker 1: two things going on simultaneously. Now. The reason people who

669
00:34:27,005 --> 00:34:30,925
Speaker 1: are replacement theologians who believe that God is done with Israel,

670
00:34:30,925 --> 00:34:34,205
Speaker 1: He's done with the Jewish people. He's only focused on

671
00:34:34,245 --> 00:34:36,525
Speaker 1: the Church. The reason they say that is because, well,

672
00:34:36,605 --> 00:34:40,325
Speaker 1: you Jews. Jesus was Jewish. Sure he came to Israel,

673
00:34:40,365 --> 00:34:47,285
Speaker 1: but you rejected him. Therefore he's rejecting you. Well, on

674
00:34:47,365 --> 00:34:50,765
Speaker 1: a simple basis, if a person doesn't think it through,

675
00:34:50,845 --> 00:34:53,165
Speaker 1: they would say, oh, well, I guess that would make sense.

676
00:34:53,205 --> 00:34:55,445
Speaker 1: If the Jewish people reject their messiah. He's going to

677
00:34:55,485 --> 00:34:58,525
Speaker 1: reject them. Didn't he punish them? Yes he did. Didn't

678
00:34:58,565 --> 00:35:00,245
Speaker 1: he kick us all out of the land, Yes he did.

679
00:35:00,245 --> 00:35:02,805
Speaker 1: Didn't he destroy our temple well through the Romans, as

680
00:35:02,925 --> 00:35:05,245
Speaker 1: Jesus said would happen. But that's not the same as

681
00:35:05,485 --> 00:35:09,525
Speaker 1: rejecting the Jewish people forever. The reason we know that

682
00:35:09,605 --> 00:35:12,165
Speaker 1: God didn't reject the Jewish people forever is because the

683
00:35:12,205 --> 00:35:16,525
Speaker 1: apostle Paul existed. Paul came to faith, he was sauld

684
00:35:16,525 --> 00:35:19,245
Speaker 1: that he comes to faith in Jesus. After the death

685
00:35:19,405 --> 00:35:24,405
Speaker 1: of Jesus, Jews hand Jesus over to the Romans, after

686
00:35:24,445 --> 00:35:28,405
Speaker 1: the Romans crucified Jesus, but also after Jesus has resurrected.

687
00:35:28,685 --> 00:35:33,765
Speaker 1: If God rejected the Jews forever at the crucifixion, because

688
00:35:33,805 --> 00:35:35,965
Speaker 1: the Jews had rejected the Messiah and turned them over

689
00:35:36,005 --> 00:35:39,364
Speaker 1: to rome to cruise by him, then no Jewish person

690
00:35:39,365 --> 00:35:42,605
Speaker 1: would have ever gotten saved from that point forward, because

691
00:35:42,645 --> 00:35:45,205
Speaker 1: God would be done with us. But that is entirely

692
00:35:45,245 --> 00:35:47,805
Speaker 1: not true, starting with you, not starting with the possible.

693
00:35:48,085 --> 00:35:52,485
Speaker 1: The disciples, all the disciples were Jewish, and all of

694
00:35:52,525 --> 00:35:55,404
Speaker 1: them believed he was a Messiah, but they didn't believe

695
00:35:55,445 --> 00:35:59,245
Speaker 1: he was God until the resurrection. And in John twenty

696
00:35:59,325 --> 00:36:02,365
Speaker 1: we see when they actually become full born again believers

697
00:36:02,405 --> 00:36:06,645
Speaker 1: because Jesus breathed the Holy Spirit into them. They're following him,

698
00:36:06,685 --> 00:36:09,125
Speaker 1: but they don't fully get it. They think he's a

699
00:36:09,165 --> 00:36:14,485
Speaker 1: political messiah, not God himself until the resurrection. So first

700
00:36:14,485 --> 00:36:17,205
Speaker 1: of all, how did those guys get saved? But you say, ah, wow,

701
00:36:17,245 --> 00:36:20,725
Speaker 1: that's different. Well, Saul was a persecutor of the church,

702
00:36:20,925 --> 00:36:22,605
Speaker 1: he was a Jewish leader.

703
00:36:22,405 --> 00:36:23,885
Speaker 3: At the highest levels.

704
00:36:24,725 --> 00:36:27,445
Speaker 1: He gets saved, and then most of us either got

705
00:36:27,485 --> 00:36:29,525
Speaker 1: saved or grew in our faith because of him, and

706
00:36:29,525 --> 00:36:33,925
Speaker 1: then a million Jews today believe in Jesus. So what

707
00:36:33,965 --> 00:36:36,525
Speaker 1: we're seeing is that God has not done with us spiritually.

708
00:36:37,085 --> 00:36:41,485
Speaker 1: But the rebirth of Israel nineteen forty eight is evidence

709
00:36:41,565 --> 00:36:44,565
Speaker 1: that the prophecies of Ezekiel thirty six, of Ezekiel thirty seven,

710
00:36:44,645 --> 00:36:47,605
Speaker 1: of Isaiah, of Jeremiah, of Daniel, all of these are

711
00:36:47,645 --> 00:36:51,045
Speaker 1: coming to pass in our lifetime. So I would say

712
00:36:51,125 --> 00:36:56,525
Speaker 1: I'm somewhat sympathetic to Christians from seventy a d. To

713
00:36:57,365 --> 00:36:59,965
Speaker 1: the early nineteen hundreds, of the mid nineteen hundreds, who,

714
00:37:00,085 --> 00:37:02,925
Speaker 1: like I don't really know if those prophecies about the

715
00:37:02,965 --> 00:37:06,765
Speaker 1: rebirth of Israel and all Israel getting saved. That seems

716
00:37:06,805 --> 00:37:10,125
Speaker 1: so unlikely that that must be metaphor it must be

717
00:37:11,005 --> 00:37:15,245
Speaker 1: an analogy. It can't really be literally true, because I

718
00:37:15,245 --> 00:37:17,844
Speaker 1: get it. A thousand years ago they didn't see any

719
00:37:17,845 --> 00:37:20,165
Speaker 1: evidence of this. Five hundred years ago, they didn't see

720
00:37:20,165 --> 00:37:23,045
Speaker 1: anything of them. But it's really hard. In the last

721
00:37:23,005 --> 00:37:25,445
Speaker 1: one hundred years and you've got a million Jews coming

722
00:37:25,485 --> 00:37:27,765
Speaker 1: to faith, that's just the last fifties, and then the

723
00:37:28,245 --> 00:37:32,245
Speaker 1: literal state of Israel being reborn, replacement theology has been

724
00:37:32,365 --> 00:37:35,685
Speaker 1: disproven one hundred percent. Now there's another piece here, which

725
00:37:35,725 --> 00:37:38,605
Speaker 1: is people who are what I would say are soft replacement.

726
00:37:38,685 --> 00:37:42,165
Speaker 1: They don't mean God hates the Jews. They don't mean

727
00:37:42,205 --> 00:37:45,325
Speaker 1: that God is done with the Jews spiritually or even

728
00:37:45,365 --> 00:37:48,965
Speaker 1: in terms of national Israel. But they'll tell me, but

729
00:37:49,125 --> 00:37:52,245
Speaker 1: current Israel has nothing to do with Bible prophecy. It's

730
00:37:52,285 --> 00:37:55,485
Speaker 1: not part of the prophetic reveal. One of the people

731
00:37:55,685 --> 00:37:58,045
Speaker 1: that I've had this conversation with is a person who

732
00:37:58,125 --> 00:38:02,005
Speaker 1: I greatly admire, and this is John Piper. Now John Piper,

733
00:38:03,005 --> 00:38:07,565
Speaker 1: he believes in Jewish evangelism, in the national rebirth of

734
00:38:07,605 --> 00:38:10,525
Speaker 1: Israel at some point. But I had the dinner dinner

735
00:38:10,565 --> 00:38:12,725
Speaker 1: with him a few years ago and his wife and

736
00:38:12,765 --> 00:38:15,925
Speaker 1: some of his senior colleagues at the Bible College and

737
00:38:15,965 --> 00:38:20,844
Speaker 1: seminary that he found in Minnesota, And I said, so, John,

738
00:38:20,925 --> 00:38:23,965
Speaker 1: if I understand you correctly, you love the Jews, you

739
00:38:24,005 --> 00:38:26,765
Speaker 1: stand with the Jews, you believe in Jewish evangelism, and

740
00:38:26,805 --> 00:38:28,884
Speaker 1: you believe in the future of national Israel, that Israel

741
00:38:28,925 --> 00:38:31,925
Speaker 1: will be prophetically reborn. But if I understand correctly from

742
00:38:31,965 --> 00:38:34,725
Speaker 1: reading all your stuff, you don't believe that current Israel

743
00:38:34,765 --> 00:38:37,325
Speaker 1: has anything to do with Bible prophecy. He said, that's correct.

744
00:38:38,205 --> 00:38:41,645
Speaker 1: He said, so you're the ultimate sovereignty guy. That's a

745
00:38:41,685 --> 00:38:44,725
Speaker 1: big passionate point that you make God a sovereign. I

746
00:38:44,765 --> 00:38:48,485
Speaker 1: agree with you. But you think that for nineteen hundred

747
00:38:48,765 --> 00:38:52,165
Speaker 1: plus years Israel, the Jews were out of the land,

748
00:38:52,205 --> 00:38:54,725
Speaker 1: and then we just sort of got back after almost

749
00:38:54,725 --> 00:38:56,965
Speaker 1: two thousand years without God's sovereignty.

750
00:38:57,085 --> 00:38:59,645
Speaker 3: He said, no, no, no, no, on the heels of the Holocaust, right.

751
00:38:59,605 --> 00:39:02,605
Speaker 1: Right, I mean we were almost dead and buried. No, no, no,

752
00:39:02,605 --> 00:39:05,325
Speaker 1: of course that was God's sovereign acts. It's okay, so

753
00:39:05,645 --> 00:39:08,285
Speaker 1: sovereign act but it's not connected to Bible prophecy that

754
00:39:08,365 --> 00:39:11,325
Speaker 1: said we would come back, that said we rebuild the country. Well,

755
00:39:11,725 --> 00:39:13,965
Speaker 1: I just think there's not any proof of that. And

756
00:39:14,005 --> 00:39:16,445
Speaker 1: I said, but why do you And he said, I'll

757
00:39:16,485 --> 00:39:21,645
Speaker 1: tell you very clearly and simply why. The Mosaic law,

758
00:39:21,885 --> 00:39:25,485
Speaker 1: the law Moses says if the Jewish people chronically reject

759
00:39:25,565 --> 00:39:28,085
Speaker 1: and resist God and his word, he's going to kick

760
00:39:28,165 --> 00:39:29,685
Speaker 1: us out of the land, or kick you out of

761
00:39:29,685 --> 00:39:32,925
Speaker 1: the land. He said, but if they repent, if you

762
00:39:33,005 --> 00:39:36,285
Speaker 1: repent as a nation, he'll bring you back. So the

763
00:39:36,365 --> 00:39:39,325
Speaker 1: nation of Israel is not yet repentant, and therefore it

764
00:39:39,405 --> 00:39:43,765
Speaker 1: cannot be anything connected to prophecy. He said, Ah, that's

765
00:39:43,805 --> 00:39:46,525
Speaker 1: a great point, John, You're absolutely right. That is what

766
00:39:46,565 --> 00:39:48,725
Speaker 1: the law of Moses says. He said, Well, there you go.

767
00:39:48,765 --> 00:39:51,645
Speaker 1: I said, okay, okay, not there I go. What's the

768
00:39:51,685 --> 00:39:54,405
Speaker 1: purpose of the law. The purpose of the law is

769
00:39:54,405 --> 00:39:55,805
Speaker 1: to prove to us we can't do it.

770
00:39:55,885 --> 00:39:56,364
Speaker 3: That's right.

771
00:39:56,925 --> 00:39:59,765
Speaker 1: So under the law of Moses, we are guilty.

772
00:39:59,765 --> 00:40:00,165
Speaker 3: As Jews.

773
00:40:00,245 --> 00:40:01,885
Speaker 1: We should not we don't have a right to go

774
00:40:01,965 --> 00:40:05,725
Speaker 1: back to Israel. But we're back in Israel. Why are

775
00:40:05,765 --> 00:40:07,045
Speaker 1: we back in Israel if we don't have a right

776
00:40:07,085 --> 00:40:08,365
Speaker 1: to go there, and we weren't there for more than

777
00:40:08,445 --> 00:40:10,485
Speaker 1: nineteen hundred years. I said, the reason is because of

778
00:40:10,525 --> 00:40:13,085
Speaker 1: the prophets. God said to the prophets, even though you

779
00:40:13,085 --> 00:40:15,325
Speaker 1: don't have a right to go back, I will bring

780
00:40:15,365 --> 00:40:18,405
Speaker 1: you back. I will bring you back. I will plant you,

781
00:40:18,525 --> 00:40:21,245
Speaker 1: I will help you rebuild the ancient ruins. I will

782
00:40:21,365 --> 00:40:23,765
Speaker 1: make the desert bloom. I will, I will, I will.

783
00:40:23,805 --> 00:40:26,845
Speaker 1: That's God sovereignly saying, even though you don't have the

784
00:40:26,965 --> 00:40:28,925
Speaker 1: right to do it, even though you won't be repentant,

785
00:40:29,005 --> 00:40:31,364
Speaker 1: I have a plan for you, and I will do it,

786
00:40:31,445 --> 00:40:34,165
Speaker 1: and then you will know. This is the language always

787
00:40:34,165 --> 00:40:37,325
Speaker 1: of Ezekiel, especially I will do this, and then you

788
00:40:37,365 --> 00:40:39,285
Speaker 1: will know that I am the Lord. I said. Now,

789
00:40:39,485 --> 00:40:43,765
Speaker 1: look what's happened. Jews are coming to faith after after

790
00:40:43,805 --> 00:40:45,285
Speaker 1: the rebirth of monerstanies Suld.

791
00:40:45,365 --> 00:40:48,085
Speaker 2: Tell me you've said this before, but how many Jews

792
00:40:49,045 --> 00:40:52,245
Speaker 2: believe in Jesus in the native I mean, I know

793
00:40:52,285 --> 00:40:55,005
Speaker 2: you can't pinpoint it to an exact number, but I

794
00:40:55,085 --> 00:40:57,685
Speaker 2: know there's been a dramatic increase of those that you know,

795
00:40:57,765 --> 00:40:59,205
Speaker 2: we're maybe forty years ago.

796
00:40:59,405 --> 00:41:01,685
Speaker 1: So I was born in sixty seven so that's almost

797
00:41:01,685 --> 00:41:04,885
Speaker 1: fifty eight years ago. And at that point the best

798
00:41:05,245 --> 00:41:08,285
Speaker 1: j Wish missiologists would say is there were maybe two

799
00:41:08,405 --> 00:41:13,165
Speaker 1: thousand Jewish people on planet Earth who believed that Jesus

800
00:41:13,325 --> 00:41:17,285
Speaker 1: is the Messiah, that he is God in nineteen sixty seven. Today,

801
00:41:17,365 --> 00:41:19,805
Speaker 1: based on research we've done with the Southern Baptist Research

802
00:41:19,925 --> 00:41:23,205
Speaker 1: arm Our Ministry, the Joshua and others help fund research

803
00:41:23,245 --> 00:41:26,805
Speaker 1: to say, we just want to know, just in America alone,

804
00:41:27,325 --> 00:41:30,765
Speaker 1: how many people who are even joical flowers of Jesus

805
00:41:31,925 --> 00:41:35,364
Speaker 1: have a Jewish heritage ethnic heritage. And it turns out

806
00:41:35,485 --> 00:41:37,965
Speaker 1: it's eight hundred and seventy one thousand. Wow, so it's

807
00:41:37,965 --> 00:41:40,765
Speaker 1: almost nine hundred thousand. Then you add about thirty thousand

808
00:41:40,805 --> 00:41:43,285
Speaker 1: Jews in Israel who believe in Jesus, and then people

809
00:41:43,285 --> 00:41:46,405
Speaker 1: in Brazil and Europe and elsewhere. So worried about a million.

810
00:41:46,525 --> 00:41:49,605
Speaker 1: So we've gone from two thousand to a million in

811
00:41:49,645 --> 00:41:53,565
Speaker 1: the last sixty years or so. This is dramatic. So

812
00:41:54,445 --> 00:41:56,805
Speaker 1: back to the conversation with John Piper, I said, so

813
00:41:57,165 --> 00:42:02,205
Speaker 1: John now Ezekiel thirty seven specifically says, I will bring

814
00:42:02,245 --> 00:42:05,005
Speaker 1: you back the value of the dry bones, and then

815
00:42:05,165 --> 00:42:07,404
Speaker 1: I will pour out my spirit, and then you will

816
00:42:07,405 --> 00:42:09,445
Speaker 1: know that I said. Now, let me give you two

817
00:42:09,445 --> 00:42:11,645
Speaker 1: examples that show that this has happened in the past.

818
00:42:11,885 --> 00:42:14,925
Speaker 1: First is the exodus out of Egypt. So God brings

819
00:42:14,965 --> 00:42:18,165
Speaker 1: the Jewish people, the nation of Israel, out of Egypt supernaturally.

820
00:42:18,845 --> 00:42:22,645
Speaker 1: But how many of them were repentant? Almost none, I

821
00:42:22,685 --> 00:42:26,125
Speaker 1: mean Caleb and Joshua, yes, But the entire older generation

822
00:42:26,245 --> 00:42:30,045
Speaker 1: dies in the wilderness in unrepentant. So when does the

823
00:42:30,165 --> 00:42:33,125
Speaker 1: nation repent? We can see it in the Book of Joshua.

824
00:42:33,205 --> 00:42:38,085
Speaker 1: When God supernaturally parts not the Red Sea in this case,

825
00:42:38,085 --> 00:42:42,205
Speaker 1: but in the Jordan River. The nation Visium goes into

826
00:42:42,245 --> 00:42:46,325
Speaker 1: the land, and once they're in the land in sight

827
00:42:46,405 --> 00:42:50,125
Speaker 1: of Jericho, their main enemy, they suddenly realize, we haven't

828
00:42:50,125 --> 00:42:53,565
Speaker 1: circumcised ourselves. We haven't circumcised our children. That's the central

829
00:42:53,645 --> 00:42:59,245
Speaker 1: part of the Moses Covenant. So they circumcise themselves. That's repentance,

830
00:43:00,125 --> 00:43:03,525
Speaker 1: that's real repentance. It's also crazy to do it when

831
00:43:03,525 --> 00:43:05,565
Speaker 1: you're in enemy territory, when you're in the site, if

832
00:43:05,565 --> 00:43:06,605
Speaker 1: you're going to be why don't you do that on

833
00:43:06,645 --> 00:43:08,165
Speaker 1: the side on the other side of a big river

834
00:43:08,525 --> 00:43:11,645
Speaker 1: that takes you know, I said, you can see national repentance,

835
00:43:12,325 --> 00:43:14,325
Speaker 1: and they are already in the land. But let me

836
00:43:14,325 --> 00:43:17,685
Speaker 1: give you a better example. When the Babylonian exile. Now

837
00:43:17,685 --> 00:43:21,405
Speaker 1: the Babylonian Jews are now in Persia, but King Cyrus

838
00:43:21,405 --> 00:43:24,285
Speaker 1: sends them all back with money, with political support, with

839
00:43:24,405 --> 00:43:27,005
Speaker 1: military help. They come back. We read it in the

840
00:43:27,045 --> 00:43:29,885
Speaker 1: book of Ezra and the Amiah. In they Amiah, we

841
00:43:30,045 --> 00:43:33,605
Speaker 1: literally read the nation is back, the walls are built,

842
00:43:33,925 --> 00:43:37,045
Speaker 1: and Ezra's reading the word of God, the law to

843
00:43:37,165 --> 00:43:41,844
Speaker 1: the people, and the priests are explaining what everyone says,

844
00:43:42,285 --> 00:43:44,885
Speaker 1: what the meaning of the word, and people start to weep.

845
00:43:44,965 --> 00:43:48,525
Speaker 1: They are repenting. Where are they in exile? No, they're

846
00:43:48,605 --> 00:43:51,485
Speaker 1: back in the land. I said, this is what Ezekiel's

847
00:43:51,485 --> 00:43:56,165
Speaker 1: speaking of. So you're John, You're right that we don't

848
00:43:56,165 --> 00:43:58,005
Speaker 1: have we as you don't have a right to come

849
00:43:58,045 --> 00:44:02,405
Speaker 1: back because we're not nationally repentant. But what the prophets

850
00:44:02,445 --> 00:44:04,925
Speaker 1: tell us is that God will bring us back anyway,

851
00:44:05,245 --> 00:44:08,645
Speaker 1: and then he will help us understand the grace that

852
00:44:08,685 --> 00:44:11,165
Speaker 1: he's showing us as he pours out his spirit. And

853
00:44:11,165 --> 00:44:15,205
Speaker 1: then and the rebirth of Israel will be asential component

854
00:44:15,765 --> 00:44:18,805
Speaker 1: of even Jews who don't yet believe in Jesus, at

855
00:44:18,885 --> 00:44:22,165
Speaker 1: least believing. Oh there's a God, he has done this

856
00:44:22,205 --> 00:44:25,925
Speaker 1: for us. That's a long explanation. I appreciate you let

857
00:44:26,005 --> 00:44:28,045
Speaker 1: me at least share it, but I but my point

858
00:44:28,085 --> 00:44:30,364
Speaker 1: is we're at a time where we really have to help.

859
00:44:30,725 --> 00:44:33,725
Speaker 1: There's a lot there's a lot more pastors and people

860
00:44:34,245 --> 00:44:39,005
Speaker 1: who who believe what John believes, not what you and

861
00:44:39,085 --> 00:44:43,085
Speaker 1: I believe. And we've got to find ways to engage.

862
00:44:43,165 --> 00:44:46,565
Speaker 1: Even within the Southern Baptist movement, even within the Calvary movement,

863
00:44:46,565 --> 00:44:50,605
Speaker 1: there are there are voices that just don't quite get this. Okay,

864
00:44:50,725 --> 00:44:53,045
Speaker 1: let's not be mad at them. Let's let's start explaining

865
00:44:54,605 --> 00:44:58,805
Speaker 1: what this is. And those Christians who do love Israel

866
00:44:58,845 --> 00:45:03,005
Speaker 1: and do stand with Israel good, But let's not forget that. Ultimately,

867
00:45:03,005 --> 00:45:05,125
Speaker 1: the way to bless Israel is to make sure every

868
00:45:05,205 --> 00:45:09,765
Speaker 1: Jew who has at least heard the Gospel, because it

869
00:45:09,845 --> 00:45:13,965
Speaker 1: does us as a team no good to have political

870
00:45:14,005 --> 00:45:17,085
Speaker 1: and moral and financial support from the Christian community. If

871
00:45:17,085 --> 00:45:20,045
Speaker 1: we end up going to hell because nobody taught us.

872
00:45:20,965 --> 00:45:24,165
Speaker 1: Oh Jesus, this Jesus that is motivating us to love you,

873
00:45:25,765 --> 00:45:27,805
Speaker 1: he actually is your Messiah.

874
00:45:27,885 --> 00:45:30,085
Speaker 2: Well, like Paul says, you know, I'm not ashamed of

875
00:45:30,125 --> 00:45:32,565
Speaker 2: the Gospel of Christ. It's the power of God too.

876
00:45:32,605 --> 00:45:36,445
Speaker 2: Everyone who believes to the Jew first, also to the gentile.

877
00:45:36,605 --> 00:45:40,045
Speaker 1: So but there are pastors and people and theologians who

878
00:45:40,165 --> 00:45:42,605
Speaker 1: are ashamed of the Gospel when it comes to Jews.

879
00:45:42,645 --> 00:45:46,805
Speaker 1: They somehow think, I don't want to offend you. They

880
00:45:46,885 --> 00:45:49,125
Speaker 1: have no problem telling an African or a Chinese person

881
00:45:49,165 --> 00:45:52,525
Speaker 1: or Brazilian Jesus is the only way of salvation. To

882
00:45:52,565 --> 00:45:54,965
Speaker 1: a Jew, I don't really want to go there, sir,

883
00:45:55,405 --> 00:45:57,125
Speaker 1: But that's because of Christian Jewish history.

884
00:45:57,125 --> 00:46:00,045
Speaker 2: And that's but one of the things I encourage people

885
00:46:00,045 --> 00:46:02,405
Speaker 2: to do is go to Israel. See it for yourself.

886
00:46:02,485 --> 00:46:05,045
Speaker 2: See the land and one of the places you need

887
00:46:05,085 --> 00:46:07,445
Speaker 2: to visit. It is not just a garden tomb, not

888
00:46:07,525 --> 00:46:10,405
Speaker 2: just gsemine, not just the amount of olives. Go to

889
00:46:10,445 --> 00:46:13,965
Speaker 2: Yad Vashem and understand the history of the Jewish people.

890
00:46:14,685 --> 00:46:18,525
Speaker 2: You see how anti Semitism it's so parallel to today,

891
00:46:18,845 --> 00:46:22,805
Speaker 2: starting with the caricatures, starting with the you know, the

892
00:46:22,885 --> 00:46:26,045
Speaker 2: effect on the businesses where they would force the Jewish

893
00:46:26,045 --> 00:46:29,085
Speaker 2: people to wear the little star armband. Then they put

894
00:46:29,125 --> 00:46:31,205
Speaker 2: him in a ghetto then they routed them from the

895
00:46:31,245 --> 00:46:35,845
Speaker 2: ghettos to the concentration camps, and they had no idea

896
00:46:35,885 --> 00:46:39,045
Speaker 2: what was happening there. And it was a process that

897
00:46:39,125 --> 00:46:40,125
Speaker 2: the Nazis engaged.

898
00:46:40,405 --> 00:46:43,125
Speaker 1: And then the Nazi soldiers in Auschwitz, for example, are

899
00:46:43,565 --> 00:46:47,565
Speaker 1: murdering Jews six days a week, putting them in ovens,

900
00:46:48,085 --> 00:46:51,605
Speaker 1: and then they're going to church and singing hymns on Sunday.

901
00:46:52,605 --> 00:46:55,725
Speaker 1: No Jew could imagine that the New Testament wasn't a

902
00:46:55,765 --> 00:46:59,405
Speaker 1: handbook of anti Semitism and extermination. But this is how

903
00:46:59,445 --> 00:47:03,565
Speaker 1: the devil has worked to keep my people, the Jewish people,

904
00:47:03,725 --> 00:47:08,565
Speaker 1: from the great hope that we could ever have, which

905
00:47:08,605 --> 00:47:09,964
Speaker 1: is our own messiahs Jesus.

906
00:47:09,965 --> 00:47:10,805
Speaker 3: Who is Jesus.

907
00:47:11,685 --> 00:47:14,445
Speaker 2: Let's say you're an unbelieving Jew, and let's say I

908
00:47:14,525 --> 00:47:16,845
Speaker 2: sit down and we're having a cup of coffee, and

909
00:47:16,925 --> 00:47:18,765
Speaker 2: I want to reach you with the Gospel. I'm a

910
00:47:18,805 --> 00:47:22,565
Speaker 2: gentile Christian, but but I want to share Jesus with you.

911
00:47:22,845 --> 00:47:25,285
Speaker 2: Is there something I would do differently with you than

912
00:47:25,325 --> 00:47:28,685
Speaker 2: I would do with just well, just say, a garden

913
00:47:28,765 --> 00:47:29,765
Speaker 2: variety nonbeliever.

914
00:47:30,045 --> 00:47:31,765
Speaker 3: Is there something specific.

915
00:47:31,325 --> 00:47:33,365
Speaker 2: I should be aware of, like with you, as a

916
00:47:33,405 --> 00:47:38,325
Speaker 2: Jewish person, with the history of persecution tragically done in

917
00:47:38,365 --> 00:47:41,285
Speaker 2: the name of the church. And you know, we know

918
00:47:41,405 --> 00:47:45,005
Speaker 2: that was a misrepresentation of the gospel, but we can't

919
00:47:45,165 --> 00:47:48,325
Speaker 2: argue with history. So is what what do I need

920
00:47:48,365 --> 00:47:50,885
Speaker 2: to know when I'm approaching you with the gospel?

921
00:47:51,045 --> 00:47:53,645
Speaker 1: Well, I think there's there's there's one question you have

922
00:47:53,645 --> 00:47:56,005
Speaker 1: to ask first. Do you already have a relationship with me?

923
00:47:56,205 --> 00:47:58,285
Speaker 1: Are we already friends or are you meeting me for

924
00:47:58,285 --> 00:48:03,245
Speaker 1: the first time. At a certain level, it doesn't matter,

925
00:48:03,285 --> 00:48:07,005
Speaker 1: but Jews tend to need to know that you love me,

926
00:48:07,165 --> 00:48:10,085
Speaker 1: that you're standing with me. That helps a lot because

927
00:48:10,085 --> 00:48:12,405
Speaker 1: we're very alone in this world right now, especially post

928
00:48:12,445 --> 00:48:15,445
Speaker 1: October seventh, and we feel very much endangered, and we

929
00:48:15,485 --> 00:48:18,525
Speaker 1: also have we are suspicious of Christians that they're coming

930
00:48:18,565 --> 00:48:21,805
Speaker 1: after our souls. They don't really care about us as

931
00:48:21,965 --> 00:48:25,125
Speaker 1: people that were just some sort of project a target

932
00:48:25,245 --> 00:48:28,365
Speaker 1: for this and that's a problem. But the more that

933
00:48:28,685 --> 00:48:33,165
Speaker 1: Christians are you know, you specifically, but Christians in generally

934
00:48:33,165 --> 00:48:37,045
Speaker 1: are showing the love of Jesus, then we are much

935
00:48:37,085 --> 00:48:39,925
Speaker 1: more open to listening to what do you why? Why

936
00:48:40,085 --> 00:48:42,845
Speaker 1: why do the people who love Jesus love me? So

937
00:48:42,965 --> 00:48:46,525
Speaker 1: let's take that as an example. So one thing. But

938
00:48:46,565 --> 00:48:48,405
Speaker 1: even if you just met somebody and you said hey,

939
00:48:48,485 --> 00:48:50,645
Speaker 1: you know, like in your case, you'd be like, oh,

940
00:48:50,645 --> 00:48:52,725
Speaker 1: you're Greg Laurie, you're an evangelist. I don't believe what

941
00:48:52,765 --> 00:48:55,125
Speaker 1: you believe. But but I'm you know, I'm a little

942
00:48:55,165 --> 00:48:59,365
Speaker 1: bit curious, like why I would I would pull up

943
00:48:59,365 --> 00:49:01,005
Speaker 1: my phone and I would say, can I just read

944
00:49:01,045 --> 00:49:03,525
Speaker 1: you one passage of scripture and just tell me who

945
00:49:03,565 --> 00:49:07,605
Speaker 1: this is? Who who am I describing? And I would

946
00:49:07,645 --> 00:49:10,725
Speaker 1: read from Isaiah fifty three and I would say, well,

947
00:49:11,125 --> 00:49:13,365
Speaker 1: who do you think that is? And they will almost

948
00:49:13,405 --> 00:49:16,165
Speaker 1: always say, well, obviously that's Jesus, but I don't believe

949
00:49:16,165 --> 00:49:19,285
Speaker 1: in the New Testament. Well that's not the New Testament. Well,

950
00:49:19,285 --> 00:49:22,125
Speaker 1: obviously it is. Well, no, this is Isaiah, this is

951
00:49:22,165 --> 00:49:27,445
Speaker 1: your Hebrew. Probably no, no, give me that because it's

952
00:49:27,485 --> 00:49:30,805
Speaker 1: so obviously Jesus. But most Jews have never heard of

953
00:49:30,845 --> 00:49:31,725
Speaker 1: Isaiah fifty three.

954
00:49:31,805 --> 00:49:35,844
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a text. Philip hws to reach the Theopian Unitch.

955
00:49:35,965 --> 00:49:38,845
Speaker 1: Yeah, the book and the Ethiopian that he was like

956
00:49:38,845 --> 00:49:41,285
Speaker 1: the Treasury secretary and he was on the road to Gaza,

957
00:49:41,365 --> 00:49:43,605
Speaker 1: the one positive mentioned of Gaza in the entire book

958
00:49:43,925 --> 00:49:48,325
Speaker 1: of the Bible. But that guy is actually reading it himself,

959
00:49:48,685 --> 00:49:51,085
Speaker 1: and he's like, I'm not figuring it. I'm not getting this.

960
00:49:51,365 --> 00:49:53,805
Speaker 1: But of course he didn't know the story of Jesus.

961
00:49:53,805 --> 00:49:58,165
Speaker 1: It was so fresh. Now most Jews have never read

962
00:49:58,165 --> 00:50:00,765
Speaker 1: the New Testament, but they've never read the Old Testament either,

963
00:50:01,005 --> 00:50:06,045
Speaker 1: most Jews and so but if you read, uh, you

964
00:50:06,085 --> 00:50:10,925
Speaker 1: know Isaiah fifty three was just all about the torture

965
00:50:11,165 --> 00:50:17,364
Speaker 1: and isolation and ridicule and death of the Messiah. They

966
00:50:17,485 --> 00:50:20,205
Speaker 1: I can't tell you how many Jews we know who goes.

967
00:50:20,965 --> 00:50:23,725
Speaker 1: I don't want to. I'm not interested in the New Testament.

968
00:50:24,285 --> 00:50:26,645
Speaker 1: I'm not interested in talking about Jesus. You're like, well,

969
00:50:27,045 --> 00:50:30,245
Speaker 1: are we talking about Jesus? Well, obviously, really obviously, because

970
00:50:30,365 --> 00:50:33,645
Speaker 1: because actually it's not. I mean, it is Jesus. You're right,

971
00:50:33,685 --> 00:50:36,805
Speaker 1: but this is your prophecies. That is one of the

972
00:50:37,045 --> 00:50:39,205
Speaker 1: interesting ways, just because just getting.

973
00:50:38,885 --> 00:50:43,485
Speaker 2: That right that those are you read, well, they pierced

974
00:50:43,525 --> 00:50:44,405
Speaker 2: my hands on my feet.

975
00:50:44,565 --> 00:50:46,444
Speaker 3: Yeah, where do you think that came from?

976
00:50:46,645 --> 00:50:49,045
Speaker 1: Exactly? Well, So one of the things I say is

977
00:50:49,165 --> 00:50:50,685
Speaker 1: I don't have my phone with me but right now,

978
00:50:50,685 --> 00:50:57,045
Speaker 1: but Bible prophecy is like a phone number and Messianic

979
00:50:57,045 --> 00:51:01,165
Speaker 1: prophecy in particular, So Messianic prophecy is guiding us to

980
00:51:01,645 --> 00:51:05,165
Speaker 1: eliminate options of who the Messiah could be and guidance

981
00:51:05,205 --> 00:51:08,125
Speaker 1: this one particular person. And this is similar to a phone.

982
00:51:08,125 --> 00:51:10,725
Speaker 1: If you if you pick up your phone, and so

983
00:51:10,765 --> 00:51:13,845
Speaker 1: I have an American phone which is based in northern Virginia.

984
00:51:13,925 --> 00:51:17,005
Speaker 1: So it starts with one seven zero three. So if

985
00:51:17,045 --> 00:51:20,005
Speaker 1: you or your audience starts dialing one seven zero three,

986
00:51:20,125 --> 00:51:23,405
Speaker 1: what are the computers doing? Well, now they've decided that

987
00:51:23,605 --> 00:51:27,805
Speaker 1: the entire world isn't where Joel is. Joel's phone is,

988
00:51:28,165 --> 00:51:30,645
Speaker 1: the entire United States is not where Joel is. We

989
00:51:30,685 --> 00:51:32,565
Speaker 1: are now in the state of Virginia, and we're not

990
00:51:32,605 --> 00:51:35,165
Speaker 1: just in most of Virginia. We're in northern Virginia. Just

991
00:51:35,245 --> 00:51:38,165
Speaker 1: four numbers and you already have northern Virginia. Now every

992
00:51:38,285 --> 00:51:42,285
Speaker 1: number the computer. What are the computer doing. It's eliminating options.

993
00:51:42,645 --> 00:51:46,125
Speaker 1: When you get to number ten, well eleven, but you

994
00:51:46,525 --> 00:51:48,685
Speaker 1: you you get me. Now you won't get me. You'll

995
00:51:48,685 --> 00:51:52,485
Speaker 1: get my voicemail. But the just the beginning of it,

996
00:51:52,525 --> 00:51:54,605
Speaker 1: just the seven oh three. But that's a miracle in

997
00:51:54,605 --> 00:51:56,325
Speaker 1: a world of seven and a half billion people, How

998
00:51:56,365 --> 00:51:59,325
Speaker 1: can you find one person's number. The same thing is

999
00:51:59,365 --> 00:52:02,645
Speaker 1: true with the profits in the Messianic profits. So let's

1000
00:52:02,725 --> 00:52:05,005
Speaker 1: just let's take our extra sketch for a second. Clean

1001
00:52:05,045 --> 00:52:07,965
Speaker 1: the board. Yes, let's start with Isaiah and nine. I

1002
00:52:08,005 --> 00:52:09,885
Speaker 1: would sit with a Jewish person as I have, and

1003
00:52:09,925 --> 00:52:12,285
Speaker 1: I say, okay, let's look at Isaiah and nine. This says,

1004
00:52:13,005 --> 00:52:15,045
Speaker 1: first of all, the people living in great darkness, they're

1005
00:52:15,045 --> 00:52:17,085
Speaker 1: going to see a great light. Okay, So God is

1006
00:52:17,125 --> 00:52:19,605
Speaker 1: gonna appear to them in some way, right, right, And

1007
00:52:19,645 --> 00:52:21,565
Speaker 1: where's that going to happen. Oh, it's gonna happen in

1008
00:52:21,605 --> 00:52:25,885
Speaker 1: the galley. Okay. Interesting. So now, for unto us, a

1009
00:52:26,005 --> 00:52:28,805
Speaker 1: child is born. Now this is a very famous I

1010
00:52:28,805 --> 00:52:30,605
Speaker 1: would say to you, if you're a Jewish, I would say,

1011
00:52:30,645 --> 00:52:33,245
Speaker 1: this is a very famous Messianic prophecy. But it's saying

1012
00:52:33,645 --> 00:52:34,765
Speaker 1: a child is coming.

1013
00:52:34,965 --> 00:52:35,125
Speaker 3: Yes.

1014
00:52:35,405 --> 00:52:37,884
Speaker 1: Now that means we're not looking for an angel. We're

1015
00:52:37,885 --> 00:52:40,085
Speaker 1: not looking for a ghost, we're not looking for a

1016
00:52:40,165 --> 00:52:42,685
Speaker 1: vision in the sky. We're actually looking for a human

1017
00:52:42,765 --> 00:52:46,205
Speaker 1: being to come. Now, for unto us, a child is born,

1018
00:52:46,325 --> 00:52:48,605
Speaker 1: a sun is given. Okay, now we are so we're

1019
00:52:48,645 --> 00:52:53,364
Speaker 1: eliminating ghosts, we're eliminating angels, we're eliminating spiritual visions. We're

1020
00:52:53,405 --> 00:52:56,685
Speaker 1: talking about a human being. Now, we're eliminating women as

1021
00:52:56,725 --> 00:53:00,045
Speaker 1: the Messiah. Right now we're down to men. Okay, well

1022
00:53:00,085 --> 00:53:03,005
Speaker 1: half the population is fair enough. Now let's keep going.

1023
00:53:03,165 --> 00:53:07,685
Speaker 1: His name is going to be wonderful counselor principiece, but

1024
00:53:07,725 --> 00:53:11,965
Speaker 1: it's gonna be also el Giboor, Mighty God. This child,

1025
00:53:12,045 --> 00:53:15,165
Speaker 1: this human being is going to be called Mighty God.

1026
00:53:15,605 --> 00:53:18,845
Speaker 1: That's weird, right, It doesn't explain it right then, But

1027
00:53:18,925 --> 00:53:22,045
Speaker 1: we're looking for somebody who is gonna be spending time

1028
00:53:22,085 --> 00:53:25,405
Speaker 1: in the galley, who's a human being who comes as

1029
00:53:25,445 --> 00:53:28,725
Speaker 1: some dramatic baby being born, but also is gonna be

1030
00:53:28,805 --> 00:53:32,685
Speaker 1: called by a lot of people God. Right, let's just

1031
00:53:32,685 --> 00:53:35,404
Speaker 1: set that one aside for a second. Okay, Now, let's

1032
00:53:35,445 --> 00:53:38,445
Speaker 1: go to Micah chapter five. Micah five. Let's read that.

1033
00:53:38,525 --> 00:53:40,765
Speaker 1: We read that, we say, okay, oh, he's actually be

1034
00:53:40,805 --> 00:53:44,925
Speaker 1: born Henna. He's gonna serve and minister and live in

1035
00:53:44,965 --> 00:53:47,285
Speaker 1: the gallerley. But he's actually be born in a very

1036
00:53:47,285 --> 00:53:51,525
Speaker 1: specific place, Bethlehem, Bethlehem, Pennsylvania. But you know, there are

1037
00:53:51,565 --> 00:53:54,845
Speaker 1: dozens of Bethlehems in America, hundreds in the world. No Bethlehem,

1038
00:53:55,725 --> 00:53:58,525
Speaker 1: uh Efrata in Judea. That's a very specific place. And

1039
00:53:58,565 --> 00:54:00,285
Speaker 1: by the way, it's a very little town, so you.

1040
00:54:00,365 --> 00:54:02,245
Speaker 2: Be little among the thousands of Judah.

1041
00:54:02,405 --> 00:54:04,844
Speaker 1: Yes, so I said, this is David's hometown. Now that's

1042
00:54:04,885 --> 00:54:08,565
Speaker 1: a very little place. So's all right. So now we

1043
00:54:08,645 --> 00:54:11,645
Speaker 1: know he's gonna be born in the specific Bethlehem as

1044
00:54:11,685 --> 00:54:16,125
Speaker 1: a human, as a boy, and he's gonna be called God.

1045
00:54:16,885 --> 00:54:18,485
Speaker 1: Let's just set that out a cider. Let's go to

1046
00:54:18,565 --> 00:54:22,685
Speaker 1: Daniel nine. Daniel nine says that forgiveness is coming, atonement

1047
00:54:22,845 --> 00:54:26,805
Speaker 1: for our sins is coming, everlasting life is coming. But

1048
00:54:27,005 --> 00:54:29,325
Speaker 1: it says the anointed One, the Messiah, is gonna be

1049
00:54:29,365 --> 00:54:32,205
Speaker 1: cut off. Yes, what does that mean, Well, it doesn't

1050
00:54:32,245 --> 00:54:34,845
Speaker 1: exactly say, but it does say this is gonna happen

1051
00:54:34,885 --> 00:54:39,885
Speaker 1: before the Temple is destroyed and Jerusalem is destroyed. Now

1052
00:54:39,965 --> 00:54:44,205
Speaker 1: let's just stop there. We haven't done a ten month study,

1053
00:54:44,245 --> 00:54:46,445
Speaker 1: we haven't done a seminary degree on prophety. We're just

1054
00:54:46,525 --> 00:54:48,965
Speaker 1: saying these are our basic fact. These are the numbers

1055
00:54:49,005 --> 00:54:51,645
Speaker 1: we're putting into the phone. Now. I said, now I'll

1056
00:54:51,645 --> 00:54:55,725
Speaker 1: say to somebody, let's just take some guesses what that's saying.

1057
00:54:55,845 --> 00:55:02,685
Speaker 1: Is if the Messiah from Bethlehem hasn't come before Jerusalem

1058
00:55:02,725 --> 00:55:05,485
Speaker 1: is destroyed and the Temple is destroyed in seventy eight,

1059
00:55:05,565 --> 00:55:09,405
Speaker 1: he's not coming. It has to be before. That's what Daniel,

1060
00:55:09,565 --> 00:55:15,485
Speaker 1: your prophet, that's what he says. Now, let's remember that Israel,

1061
00:55:15,565 --> 00:55:19,365
Speaker 1: you guys gave away Bethlehem to the palaces. There's no

1062
00:55:19,605 --> 00:55:22,844
Speaker 1: Jews being born in Bethlehem anymore. So if he's if

1063
00:55:22,845 --> 00:55:27,005
Speaker 1: he didn't come, he's not coming. Now, let's just let's

1064
00:55:27,005 --> 00:55:29,125
Speaker 1: just spit ball here. Let's just play an association game.

1065
00:55:29,165 --> 00:55:31,485
Speaker 1: Can you think of anyone that maybe I don't know,

1066
00:55:31,525 --> 00:55:34,605
Speaker 1: two and a half billion people in the world, says hey,

1067
00:55:34,645 --> 00:55:37,445
Speaker 1: he was this guy. This one person was born in Bethlehem,

1068
00:55:38,005 --> 00:55:41,125
Speaker 1: he lived in Galley and people call him God. Just

1069
00:55:41,245 --> 00:55:42,844
Speaker 1: you spin it out if you can think of it.

1070
00:55:42,965 --> 00:55:45,925
Speaker 1: Just just just give me just listening. Let's think of it.

1071
00:55:45,965 --> 00:55:48,964
Speaker 1: Let's create a list of options. Oh no, no, there's

1072
00:55:49,005 --> 00:55:53,005
Speaker 1: only one option. You don't have to believe it. But

1073
00:55:53,165 --> 00:55:55,085
Speaker 1: this is what the phone numbers lead. This is the

1074
00:55:55,125 --> 00:55:57,685
Speaker 1: phone numbers are leading you. These just propherties that we

1075
00:55:57,805 --> 00:55:59,924
Speaker 1: there are three hundred of them, but we're just talking

1076
00:55:59,965 --> 00:56:03,365
Speaker 1: about a few where is that leeting. Just consider for

1077
00:56:03,405 --> 00:56:09,725
Speaker 1: the possibility maybe they were buys are wrong. Maybe maybe

1078
00:56:10,485 --> 00:56:14,525
Speaker 1: it's Jesus. Let's just consider that for a moment, and

1079
00:56:14,605 --> 00:56:16,205
Speaker 1: why don't we spend a little time reading about the

1080
00:56:16,205 --> 00:56:19,404
Speaker 1: life of Jesus. That is actually not a terrible way

1081
00:56:19,765 --> 00:56:20,725
Speaker 1: to have a conversation.

1082
00:56:20,885 --> 00:56:23,325
Speaker 2: So if you have a pre existing relationship, it's good

1083
00:56:23,325 --> 00:56:24,844
Speaker 2: if they know you love them, you care.

1084
00:56:24,965 --> 00:56:26,404
Speaker 1: That's one of the most important things.

1085
00:56:26,405 --> 00:56:27,885
Speaker 3: And that's true of all evangels.

1086
00:56:27,845 --> 00:56:30,445
Speaker 2: And I have to say in general, people don't care

1087
00:56:30,485 --> 00:56:32,565
Speaker 2: how much you know unless they know how much you care.

1088
00:56:32,685 --> 00:56:35,485
Speaker 2: You know, so that's really important, but especially with a

1089
00:56:35,605 --> 00:56:38,565
Speaker 2: Jewish friend, you know, to let them know we care

1090
00:56:38,605 --> 00:56:40,925
Speaker 2: about you, we care about your people, your plight, what

1091
00:56:41,005 --> 00:56:46,125
Speaker 2: you're going through, and then showing them through Old Testament scriptures.

1092
00:56:46,205 --> 00:56:48,645
Speaker 2: Every verse you've quoted is an Old test work.

1093
00:56:49,445 --> 00:56:50,925
Speaker 1: We did not get to Marthew, we did not get

1094
00:56:50,925 --> 00:56:52,364
Speaker 1: to Mark, we did not get to Loot, we did

1095
00:56:52,365 --> 00:56:55,605
Speaker 1: not get to John. We kept it on Jewish turf,

1096
00:56:56,645 --> 00:56:58,364
Speaker 1: and we just now most of them have not read

1097
00:56:58,365 --> 00:57:01,845
Speaker 1: these things. I once had this conversation in my own home.

1098
00:57:02,045 --> 00:57:04,525
Speaker 1: We had a Christmas party in Israel when we first

1099
00:57:04,565 --> 00:57:08,045
Speaker 1: moved there. When we asked our Jewish Israeli believing friends,

1100
00:57:08,605 --> 00:57:10,404
Speaker 1: a Christmas party is bad? Are that? Is that gonna

1101
00:57:10,405 --> 00:57:13,285
Speaker 1: be offensive? Because we like Christmas, but the Bible doesn't

1102
00:57:13,285 --> 00:57:15,404
Speaker 1: teach us that we have to celebrate with the tree

1103
00:57:15,525 --> 00:57:19,245
Speaker 1: and the lights and movements. They said no, actually, uh,

1104
00:57:19,285 --> 00:57:22,405
Speaker 1: you know, Israelis have seen home alone. They're kind of

1105
00:57:22,445 --> 00:57:24,765
Speaker 1: they're kind of curious. They've never celebrated Christmas. But if

1106
00:57:24,805 --> 00:57:28,205
Speaker 1: you had a Christmas party, and we do it with

1107
00:57:28,285 --> 00:57:30,885
Speaker 1: a white elephant gift exchange, we do it with a

1108
00:57:30,925 --> 00:57:36,085
Speaker 1: little an actual competition to design your Christmas cookies. If

1109
00:57:36,125 --> 00:57:38,645
Speaker 1: you've inviting people over, and then you know, just before

1110
00:57:38,645 --> 00:57:41,245
Speaker 1: the white elephant gift exchange, which is really why they'll

1111
00:57:41,245 --> 00:57:45,765
Speaker 1: be there, you had somebody in Hebrew read a little

1112
00:57:45,765 --> 00:57:50,485
Speaker 1: bit of Luke sorry, Isaiah and nine and Micah five

1113
00:57:51,365 --> 00:57:54,285
Speaker 1: and then maybe Luke too, just to kind of and

1114
00:57:54,325 --> 00:57:55,845
Speaker 1: you said, this is why we believe what we believe.

1115
00:57:55,885 --> 00:58:00,325
Speaker 1: But okay, just so we did that. This one guy

1116
00:58:00,365 --> 00:58:04,205
Speaker 1: gets up and he goes after this whole evening he

1117
00:58:04,245 --> 00:58:06,925
Speaker 1: gets he's in my face, like a classic Israeli Jew.

1118
00:58:06,965 --> 00:58:09,565
Speaker 1: He's like, are you telling me? Are you telling me?

1119
00:58:10,365 --> 00:58:13,725
Speaker 1: Are you saying that the Messiah, our Messiah has to

1120
00:58:13,805 --> 00:58:16,085
Speaker 1: be born in Bethlehem. Is that what you're saying. I said, No,

1121
00:58:16,205 --> 00:58:18,605
Speaker 1: that's not what I'm saying. That's what I said. I'm

1122
00:58:18,605 --> 00:58:22,645
Speaker 1: not saying that. The prophet micas say that. I went

1123
00:58:22,685 --> 00:58:25,125
Speaker 1: to high school here, I went to grade school. We

1124
00:58:25,165 --> 00:58:27,765
Speaker 1: studied the Bible in school. They never taught us that

1125
00:58:29,405 --> 00:58:31,045
Speaker 1: it's there. You can see it. I can see it.

1126
00:58:31,165 --> 00:58:32,805
Speaker 1: How come they didn't teach us that. How come they

1127
00:58:32,805 --> 00:58:34,365
Speaker 1: didn't teach us that our Messiah has to be born

1128
00:58:34,365 --> 00:58:37,365
Speaker 1: in Bethlehem? I said, I don't know. He goes Joel.

1129
00:58:37,525 --> 00:58:39,485
Speaker 1: You need to go to the education minister. You need

1130
00:58:39,525 --> 00:58:41,165
Speaker 1: to yell at him. You need to say, why aren't

1131
00:58:41,165 --> 00:58:43,685
Speaker 1: this being taught? This is important to us. Yes, I said,

1132
00:58:43,725 --> 00:58:45,845
Speaker 1: I don't know that that's my role. I think maybe

1133
00:58:45,845 --> 00:58:48,525
Speaker 1: that's your role. Yeah, And I said but but and

1134
00:58:48,565 --> 00:58:50,725
Speaker 1: then I used that thing. I said, look, you know,

1135
00:58:51,045 --> 00:58:55,005
Speaker 1: the Messiah cannot come anymore. Why not because you guys

1136
00:58:55,005 --> 00:58:57,445
Speaker 1: gave away Bethlehem to the Palestinis. There's no Jews being

1137
00:58:57,445 --> 00:58:57,925
Speaker 1: born there.

1138
00:58:58,565 --> 00:58:59,405
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh.

1139
00:58:59,565 --> 00:59:02,405
Speaker 1: He was like furious. Now I wish I could tell

1140
00:59:02,445 --> 00:59:06,245
Speaker 1: you that that led him into the Kingdom hasn't yet

1141
00:59:06,725 --> 00:59:09,565
Speaker 1: the but he literally didn't know and it bothered him.

1142
00:59:09,805 --> 00:59:12,085
Speaker 1: These are important basic truths. We didn't even get to

1143
00:59:12,085 --> 00:59:16,525
Speaker 1: Isaiah fifty three. Right, we're just doing some of the basics.

1144
00:59:16,885 --> 00:59:21,525
Speaker 1: But Jews don't most Jews, American, Israeli, we don't. We

1145
00:59:21,565 --> 00:59:24,445
Speaker 1: do not know this. So we're not rejecting a doctrine

1146
00:59:24,485 --> 00:59:28,045
Speaker 1: that we've heard, processed and said, no, that's not true.

1147
00:59:28,645 --> 00:59:33,725
Speaker 1: We're rejecting the history of Jewish Christian relations. And Christians

1148
00:59:33,725 --> 00:59:36,285
Speaker 1: are violating Romans ten. How can they call on the

1149
00:59:36,365 --> 00:59:38,525
Speaker 1: name of someone they haven't heard, How can they call

1150
00:59:38,565 --> 00:59:41,045
Speaker 1: on how can they hear if no one tells them?

1151
00:59:41,285 --> 00:59:43,485
Speaker 1: This is what the problem is. The church isn't The

1152
00:59:43,565 --> 00:59:46,005
Speaker 1: church isn't telling Some of the church at least is

1153
00:59:46,245 --> 00:59:53,285
Speaker 1: providing support to Israel political, moral, financial, But so much

1154
00:59:53,325 --> 00:59:55,845
Speaker 1: of the church, the Catholic Church, the Orthodox Church, even

1155
00:59:56,005 --> 00:59:59,485
Speaker 1: at the Reform movement, and even much of Evan Jelicalism,

1156
01:00:00,965 --> 01:00:05,285
Speaker 1: isn't telling our people the basics. And you would never

1157
01:00:05,765 --> 01:00:07,885
Speaker 1: you know, your whole life is based on Everybody needs

1158
01:00:07,885 --> 01:00:13,325
Speaker 1: to hear. Everybody needs a friend who loves Jesus. And

1159
01:00:13,405 --> 01:00:15,485
Speaker 1: even if they don't know me personally, I want at

1160
01:00:15,565 --> 01:00:18,005
Speaker 1: least get them to come to a stadium or listen

1161
01:00:18,045 --> 01:00:20,685
Speaker 1: to a podcast or watch a video and at least

1162
01:00:20,725 --> 01:00:24,445
Speaker 1: tell them throw the seeds out there and see where

1163
01:00:24,485 --> 01:00:27,405
Speaker 1: they land, and trust the Lord's going up. But most

1164
01:00:27,445 --> 01:00:31,085
Speaker 1: of the church at this stage twenty twenty five, greg

1165
01:00:31,845 --> 01:00:35,685
Speaker 1: aren't taking your heart and applying it to Jews. Many

1166
01:00:35,685 --> 01:00:39,085
Speaker 1: aren't even applying it to Muslims, or our ministry is trying.

1167
01:00:41,245 --> 01:00:43,765
Speaker 1: That's the largest issue. But even those who do, who

1168
01:00:43,805 --> 01:00:46,325
Speaker 1: believe in the Great Commission, who believe in world missions,

1169
01:00:46,925 --> 01:00:51,245
Speaker 1: they aren't even trying to reach the Jesus's own people.

1170
01:00:51,765 --> 01:00:55,245
Speaker 1: Jesus came in as an Israeli, he came as a Jew.

1171
01:00:56,085 --> 01:00:59,205
Speaker 1: Now he came to his own his own received him.

1172
01:00:59,245 --> 01:01:03,045
Speaker 1: Not to those who did receive him Gentiles, not exactly

1173
01:01:03,125 --> 01:01:07,005
Speaker 1: white trash, but I understand what your background the way

1174
01:01:07,045 --> 01:01:10,885
Speaker 1: you say it, but you got it. And now you're

1175
01:01:10,925 --> 01:01:13,605
Speaker 1: making Jews jealous because you know the God of Israel

1176
01:01:13,725 --> 01:01:17,965
Speaker 1: and most of our team doesn't speaking. We've got to inspire,

1177
01:01:18,365 --> 01:01:21,845
Speaker 1: not just challenge or criticize, but inspire the church who

1178
01:01:21,885 --> 01:01:24,925
Speaker 1: loves Israel and at least gets that to make sure

1179
01:01:24,965 --> 01:01:27,845
Speaker 1: that every Jew in the world has at least heard.

1180
01:01:28,805 --> 01:01:31,205
Speaker 2: Well that phrase you years make them jealous. That's an

1181
01:01:31,245 --> 01:01:37,125
Speaker 2: actual biblical phrase that the Gentiles would provoke the chosen people,

1182
01:01:37,165 --> 01:01:38,645
Speaker 2: the Jews, to jealousy.

1183
01:01:38,725 --> 01:01:41,045
Speaker 3: So years ago I was in Israel leading it to her.

1184
01:01:41,485 --> 01:01:43,845
Speaker 2: I had a guide. I often used his name as David.

1185
01:01:43,885 --> 01:01:48,205
Speaker 2: I actually liked him. He was in classic Israeli and

1186
01:01:48,405 --> 01:01:51,125
Speaker 2: he loved to argue with me, and he and he

1187
01:01:51,125 --> 01:01:54,205
Speaker 2: would sit in the front of the bus and debate

1188
01:01:54,285 --> 01:01:57,485
Speaker 2: me and contradict everything I said. But I really like

1189
01:01:57,605 --> 01:02:00,765
Speaker 2: this guy. Our conversations went on forever. Once I asked them, David,

1190
01:02:00,965 --> 01:02:03,325
Speaker 2: let me ask you a question. Can you be a

1191
01:02:03,405 --> 01:02:06,965
Speaker 2: Jew and believe in Jesus and still be a Jew? Nokay,

1192
01:02:07,045 --> 01:02:08,245
Speaker 2: let me ask you another question.

1193
01:02:08,605 --> 01:02:11,925
Speaker 3: Can you be an atheist and still be a Jew? Yes?

1194
01:02:12,525 --> 01:02:17,365
Speaker 2: Can you be a Satanist worship the devil and still

1195
01:02:17,365 --> 01:02:17,885
Speaker 2: be a Jew?

1196
01:02:18,005 --> 01:02:18,325
Speaker 3: Yes?

1197
01:02:18,725 --> 01:02:22,365
Speaker 2: So can you believe in Jesus as your Messiah and

1198
01:02:22,445 --> 01:02:23,405
Speaker 2: still be a Jew? No?

1199
01:02:23,645 --> 01:02:25,205
Speaker 3: I just thought that's not rational.

1200
01:02:25,485 --> 01:02:27,885
Speaker 2: But so anyway, we went of our debates at the

1201
01:02:27,885 --> 01:02:30,525
Speaker 2: front of the bus, and one day we came to

1202
01:02:30,565 --> 01:02:32,925
Speaker 2: the end of our tour, and I never felt like

1203
01:02:32,965 --> 01:02:36,365
Speaker 2: I made any progress at David frankly. But the driver,

1204
01:02:36,805 --> 01:02:40,885
Speaker 2: whose name Isnphtilly, he said, and he's spoken sort of

1205
01:02:40,885 --> 01:02:43,525
Speaker 2: broken English. I was listening to what you were saying

1206
01:02:43,565 --> 01:02:46,605
Speaker 2: to David. Yes, he goes, I like what you're saying,

1207
01:02:46,685 --> 01:02:50,405
Speaker 2: I am jealous of your relationship with God. Use the

1208
01:02:50,525 --> 01:02:53,525
Speaker 2: verbiage that Paul uses, and he says, I would like

1209
01:02:53,565 --> 01:02:56,005
Speaker 2: you to come to my home and meet my family

1210
01:02:56,245 --> 01:02:59,645
Speaker 2: and tell my family what you've told David. So Kathy

1211
01:02:59,685 --> 01:03:02,045
Speaker 2: and I went to his home. Oh it was a

1212
01:03:02,085 --> 01:03:05,885
Speaker 2: beautiful meal. We filled up immediately on the first course,

1213
01:03:06,005 --> 01:03:09,405
Speaker 2: not realizing there were like three other courses coming. So

1214
01:03:09,485 --> 01:03:13,085
Speaker 2: I was so full and sleepy. And now he has

1215
01:03:13,125 --> 01:03:16,605
Speaker 2: this whole family gathered. There's like thirty people in a room.

1216
01:03:16,725 --> 01:03:19,445
Speaker 2: Some of them are serving in the Israeli military. And

1217
01:03:19,485 --> 01:03:22,325
Speaker 2: he says, now tell my whole family what you told me.

1218
01:03:22,765 --> 01:03:25,925
Speaker 2: And I did. And it all started from a conversation

1219
01:03:26,205 --> 01:03:29,325
Speaker 2: and he saw something in my relationship with God that,

1220
01:03:29,405 --> 01:03:32,885
Speaker 2: in his words, made him jealous. So it's an illustration.

1221
01:03:33,445 --> 01:03:35,245
Speaker 2: Well you just said, but let me just sif cairious.

1222
01:03:35,285 --> 01:03:36,405
Speaker 2: I'm going to wrap this up.

1223
01:03:37,125 --> 01:03:39,245
Speaker 1: I love that though, and thank you, thank you that

1224
01:03:39,325 --> 01:03:42,365
Speaker 1: you are showing your love for Jewish people in lots

1225
01:03:42,405 --> 01:03:45,525
Speaker 1: of practical ways, including helping buy a bulletproof ambulance, because

1226
01:03:45,565 --> 01:03:47,845
Speaker 1: sometimes you have to drive an ambulance into harm's way

1227
01:03:47,965 --> 01:03:50,245
Speaker 1: under fire and you're trying to evacuate people out and

1228
01:03:50,285 --> 01:03:53,125
Speaker 1: you don't want everybody on the first responder team to

1229
01:03:53,205 --> 01:03:55,885
Speaker 1: die trying to So thank you, because when you show

1230
01:03:55,925 --> 01:03:59,685
Speaker 1: the love of Jesus, you tend to have an open

1231
01:03:59,725 --> 01:04:03,325
Speaker 1: door to at least explain why do you who love Jesus?

1232
01:04:03,445 --> 01:04:05,045
Speaker 1: Why are you loving us when the rest of the

1233
01:04:05,045 --> 01:04:05,645
Speaker 1: world hates.

1234
01:04:06,085 --> 01:04:08,445
Speaker 2: And I think that's true of all evangelism. I mean,

1235
01:04:08,485 --> 01:04:12,645
Speaker 2: I think the thing reaching people, it's first, just care,

1236
01:04:12,885 --> 01:04:15,845
Speaker 2: care about them. People can tell if you care, build

1237
01:04:15,885 --> 01:04:19,685
Speaker 2: a bridge to them, and then that effectively earns you

1238
01:04:19,725 --> 01:04:22,285
Speaker 2: the right to share the gospel. Thanks for all this time.

1239
01:04:22,165 --> 01:04:22,645
Speaker 1: My goodness.

1240
01:04:22,645 --> 01:04:26,565
Speaker 2: Thanks for having a lot of great insights into the

1241
01:04:26,605 --> 01:04:30,285
Speaker 2: importance of Israel, the importance of our relationship with the

1242
01:04:30,365 --> 01:04:34,445
Speaker 2: Jewish people, evangelizing them, and what's happening in the world.

1243
01:04:34,485 --> 01:04:36,365
Speaker 3: So thanks for doing what you do.

1244
01:04:36,685 --> 01:04:40,205
Speaker 2: You're uniquely gifted to do this, I think being a

1245
01:04:40,285 --> 01:04:44,205
Speaker 2: novelist and you are a theologian. To combine those two

1246
01:04:44,285 --> 01:04:47,805
Speaker 2: things together which means that you take that which is

1247
01:04:47,845 --> 01:04:51,525
Speaker 2: hard for many people to understand, and the imaginative part

1248
01:04:51,565 --> 01:04:55,085
Speaker 2: of you, the humorous part of you, makes it accessible

1249
01:04:55,125 --> 01:04:58,525
Speaker 2: to regular people. That's a rare gift, and that's something

1250
01:04:58,565 --> 01:05:01,485
Speaker 2: that people need to hear because it instead of Jesus,

1251
01:05:02,485 --> 01:05:04,845
Speaker 2: the common people heard them gladling. You know, I've never

1252
01:05:04,965 --> 01:05:08,285
Speaker 2: tried to press people with my speaking, obviously, but I

1253
01:05:08,285 --> 01:05:10,725
Speaker 2: do want them to understand what I'm saying, and I

1254
01:05:10,765 --> 01:05:13,485
Speaker 2: want to speak in a way that regular people can

1255
01:05:13,605 --> 01:05:15,285
Speaker 2: just get this. And I think a lot of people

1256
01:05:15,285 --> 01:05:18,765
Speaker 2: listening to us talk, maybe you've gotten some insights into

1257
01:05:18,845 --> 01:05:20,605
Speaker 2: some things they wondered about before.

1258
01:05:21,085 --> 01:05:24,285
Speaker 1: I hope, so I appreciate it. I'm blessed as you know,

1259
01:05:24,365 --> 01:05:27,725
Speaker 1: as you are. It's one thing to have a calling.

1260
01:05:27,925 --> 01:05:31,605
Speaker 1: And when God says when you speak, speak, you know,

1261
01:05:31,885 --> 01:05:33,685
Speaker 1: it's a gift that God has given you, so speak

1262
01:05:33,725 --> 01:05:35,685
Speaker 1: as though it's the very words of God. So the

1263
01:05:35,685 --> 01:05:37,365
Speaker 1: more you stick to the words of God, the better

1264
01:05:37,605 --> 01:05:41,525
Speaker 1: you're an actual pastor. I'm not so I'm using journalism

1265
01:05:41,685 --> 01:05:46,765
Speaker 1: or fiction to try to draw people to the actual scriptures.

1266
01:05:46,805 --> 01:05:49,165
Speaker 1: But one of the keys is having good teams. And

1267
01:05:49,245 --> 01:05:51,565
Speaker 1: you've got a great team here at Harvest. I've been

1268
01:05:51,605 --> 01:05:54,445
Speaker 1: blessed with having several teams. The Joshua Fund is our

1269
01:05:54,445 --> 01:05:57,285
Speaker 1: ministry to bless Israel and her neighbors in the name

1270
01:05:57,285 --> 01:05:59,845
Speaker 1: of Jesus, strengthen the local church, get the gospel out

1271
01:06:00,125 --> 01:06:03,445
Speaker 1: and raise up the church. All Israel News, all Arab

1272
01:06:03,485 --> 01:06:06,205
Speaker 1: News is our way of explaining what's really happening day

1273
01:06:06,205 --> 01:06:08,965
Speaker 1: to day. And then our show on TBN, the Rosenberg

1274
01:06:08,965 --> 01:06:13,405
Speaker 1: Report again just a weekly TV version of what's really

1275
01:06:13,445 --> 01:06:17,925
Speaker 1: happening in the church, in the Middle East, in the region,

1276
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Speaker 1: in the world, in the war. But all that requires

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Speaker 1: people around you that love the Lord and are really

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Speaker 1: good at what they do. And I'm very blessed my

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Speaker 1: wife and the teams that I get to lead are

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Speaker 1: passionate about this stuff and they really help me. Do

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Speaker 1: you know a person by himself is you can only

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Speaker 1: get so much done. But when we've got teams to

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Speaker 1: help you take that message and drive it much further,

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Speaker 1: that's those fun teams to work.

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Speaker 3: Well. Thanks for doing it. Keep doing what you're doing.

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Speaker 1: Thanks, thank you, thank you. I appreciate it very much.