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Speaker 1: Welcome to Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager. Here thousands of

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Speaker 1: hours of Dennis's lectures courses in classic radio programs. Had

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Speaker 1: to purchase Dennisprager's Rational Bibles go to Dennisprager dot com.

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Speaker 2: There's another element here that I'd just like to throw

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Speaker 2: in for a minute, and that's the issue of faith.

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Speaker 2: God had spoken to Abraham, right, God had told him

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Speaker 2: to move out to begin with, and God had told

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Speaker 2: him already that through you, all the families of the earth.

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Speaker 3: Will be blessed.

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Speaker 2: So then why didn't he simply rely on God? Why

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Speaker 2: didn't he just say, Hey, nothing's going to happen to me, now,

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Speaker 2: are you Sarah? Sorry, We've got it made. God's on

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Speaker 2: our side. He promised me such and such. She's appeared

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Speaker 2: to me. That's an interesting question, and I think there's

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Speaker 2: an answer to it, and there's an important answer in

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Speaker 2: this I haven't seen in the commentaries. This is an

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Speaker 2: answer that I come to but with deep conviction, and

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Speaker 2: that is you can't rely on God if you can

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Speaker 2: help yourself, you can't. Although that is a basic religious principle.

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Speaker 2: God is not a celestial butler. You must do what

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Speaker 2: you can do for you. You cannot say God will

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Speaker 2: bail me out. Oh, yes, Sarah, no problem. Let's go

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Speaker 2: into Egypt. You know, they look at pretty women and they

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Speaker 2: take them and kill the husbands. But I do won't

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Speaker 2: happen to us because God's on our side. You cannot

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Speaker 2: speak like that. Even even Abraham, who's been talked to

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Speaker 2: by God personally, can't talk like that. And that's critical

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Speaker 2: stuff that you can't walk around saying God's going to

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Speaker 2: bail me out of a circumstance. What does faith in

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Speaker 2: God therefore entail is a very great question, and I'm

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Speaker 2: going to talk about that to a certain extent today too,

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Speaker 2: But please beware of that question. Yes, why didn't Pharaoh

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Speaker 2: kill Abraham when he finally did realize that he was

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Speaker 2: her wife her husband? Because because he knew that he

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Speaker 2: had gotten whatever he had gotten him.

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Speaker 3: It's not fully clear.

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Speaker 2: Some say impotent, some say some sort of venereal disease,

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Speaker 2: some say some disease.

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Speaker 3: It's not fully clear.

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Speaker 2: He was just he was just hit by God and

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Speaker 2: he knew it was from God. How he knew it

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Speaker 2: was from God? I don't know either. That's not knowable.

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Speaker 2: But the assumption I have to take the stories at

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Speaker 2: face value. By the story, we see that Pharaoh knew

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Speaker 2: that it was from God and understood immediately what was

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Speaker 2: the issue. And at that point he wasn't about to

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Speaker 2: fiddle around with God. But but it isn't. But you

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Speaker 2: make an interesting point there. Maybe Pharaoh wasn't as bad

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Speaker 2: as Abraham had made him.

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Speaker 3: Out to be. Then you have a good question.

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Speaker 2: See what if you're you suspect that they may kill

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Speaker 2: you and take your wife, but in fact maybe they won't.

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Speaker 2: That enters the realm of the non understandable.

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Speaker 3: By the way, here's another interesting question.

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Speaker 2: Why didn't Abraham answer Pharaoh? There's total silence, absolute silence.

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Speaker 2: Pharaoh yells at Abraham, why didn't you tell me? You

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Speaker 2: got me? You got me ruined by God? Here I

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Speaker 2: ended up with your wife? Why didn't you tell me?

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Speaker 2: And Abraham says nothing. My suspicion is he had nothing

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Speaker 2: that he could say. What's he gonna say? Well, frankly,

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Speaker 2: I think you are such slime and your society is

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Speaker 2: so miserable that if I would have announced it, you'd

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Speaker 2: have killed me. What is he gonna tell the truth?

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Speaker 2: You understand, there are times when it is better to

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Speaker 2: shut up than to make a lie as an excuse,

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Speaker 2: because the only answer is the truth, and the truth

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Speaker 2: won't get him anywhere. It's not going to help, and

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Speaker 2: it's only going to be insulting to a man who's

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Speaker 2: already had a pretty rough time of it and looks

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Speaker 2: like the honorable victim. Though the record of Pharaoh's does

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Speaker 2: not lead one to assume that they all felt that way. Well,

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Speaker 2: this beautiful woman is a man's wife, and therefore I

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Speaker 2: will certainly not touch her. Listen, what if King David,

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Speaker 2: who wasn't a pharaoh Doe when he saw a beautiful

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Speaker 2: woman who was his.

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Speaker 3: Top general's wife, he got him killed?

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Speaker 2: Riah the Hittite, Okay, you don't have to go to Pharaoh's.

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Speaker 3: Here was a Jewish.

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Speaker 2: King doing exactly that. Hey, it's a beautiful woman. I'm

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Speaker 2: gonna send this man off, right, So I think it

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Speaker 2: was pretty widespread practice and fair to say that that's

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Speaker 2: exactly what would have happened. Yeah, right, he was shown

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Speaker 2: exactly he had been hit by God. And that's the

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Speaker 2: reason you're saying that he not because he had this

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Speaker 2: great moral conscience. Oh God, how could you think, Abraham

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Speaker 2: that I Pharaoh this moral.

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Speaker 3: Civil creature would ever do such a thing.

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Speaker 2: It's almost laughable.

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Speaker 3: I don't believe he's his honorable victim.

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Speaker 2: I think it's laughable. I think that's what he said

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Speaker 2: because he thought it was from God. By the way,

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Speaker 2: isn't it interesting how this is a precursor of the

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Speaker 2: plagues on Pharaoh later. That's exactly what it says. God

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Speaker 2: bore plagues on Pharaoh's has like a dress rehearsal. I

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Speaker 2: just want to see how many plagues work on a

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Speaker 2: pharaoh until I.

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Speaker 3: Get what I want.

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Speaker 2: But it is fascinating this precursor type of idea, isn't

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Speaker 2: it anybody else on this? Yes, yeah, exactly my point.

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Speaker 2: It was totally common, especially of a stranger.

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Speaker 3: Exactly.

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Speaker 4: Yes, Yes, God did bail him out of it.

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Speaker 3: That is true.

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Speaker 2: In the final analysis, it was necessary. But you the

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Speaker 2: human can't rely on that. You can't act as if

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Speaker 2: God will bail you out. If God does, God does,

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Speaker 2: but you must act. I mean, I hate cliches, but

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Speaker 2: God helps those who help themselves. I think is a

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Speaker 2: very very valid one. And there's a very basic Hebrew

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Speaker 2: principal ALTI smokelanes. Do not rely on a miracle? Yeah,

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Speaker 2: does it speak at all about the value of a

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Speaker 2: man versus a woman. In ancient times, it certainly does.

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Speaker 2: Women were property into a very large extent. Well, all

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Speaker 2: I see, No, I would not make that inference. I

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Speaker 2: would not infer that Abraham was saying, well, she's only

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Speaker 2: a woman, so we can get rid of her, and

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Speaker 2: I'm a man, and therefore my life is I don't

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Speaker 2: think so. I mean, I can't prove it, but I

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Speaker 2: don't think that that was the issue. I think that

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Speaker 2: the issue was this is the only way to save ourselves,

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Speaker 2: and literally ourselves. Because you're finished. If I'm gone, I

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Speaker 2: have more to tell you about what sister means. But

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Speaker 2: now I would like to take a vote. How many

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Speaker 2: think Abraham did wrong thing? Okay, so it was somewhat

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Speaker 2: convincing of an argument. If you still think it's wrong,

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Speaker 2: I'm just curious. Well, someone representing the wrong position, just joking,

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Speaker 2: I was play on words. Well, somebody representing the position

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Speaker 2: that it was wrong. Please tell me why you still

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Speaker 2: think it was wrong. Yeah, sin was lack of reliance

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Speaker 2: and faith of God. Who else still think it's wrong? Yes,

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Speaker 2: I said he's leaving a famine. And also, by the way,

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Speaker 2: you know, we don't know. This stuff is condensed time.

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Speaker 2: He may not have realized that that was the law

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Speaker 2: in Egypt when he left to go to Egypt. He

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Speaker 2: may have gotten there and realized that, have you never

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Speaker 2: gone to a place and then realized what sort of

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Speaker 2: place it was, rather than knowing it beforehand. That's my

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Speaker 2: suspicion that that was what happened. He got to a place,

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Speaker 2: saw the morals of the place and said, oh, oh,

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Speaker 2: look at where we are. Okay, let me yes, here

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Speaker 2: is her final Here is her question, which I'll opposes

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Speaker 2: the final one from that perspective, Whether he said which

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Speaker 2: is a good way of summarizing it. Whether he said

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Speaker 2: that sarahi is is his sister or his.

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Speaker 3: Wife she's taken by Pharaoh? Is that clear?

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Speaker 2: Her fate is identical in either case. It's actually worse

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Speaker 2: if he says his husband, because then he's dead and

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Speaker 2: he has she has no hope of getting out. At

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Speaker 2: least the other way. Maybe he could bribe Pharaoh five

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Speaker 2: years later or something. But her question is what kind

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Speaker 2: of man is it? What kind of love is it

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Speaker 2: for a wife to know that another man is sleeping

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Speaker 2: with my wife? Okay, would you rather be dead and

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Speaker 2: never see your wife again. Or would you or would

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Speaker 2: you rather have this miserable circumstance. Let me tell you something.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's for you to answer, enough for me

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Speaker 2: to answer for you. I will only tell you this.

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Speaker 2: Much of life does not consist between a miserable alternative

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Speaker 2: and a beautiful alternative. Much of life consists of a

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Speaker 2: miserable alternative and a more miserable alternative. It is so

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Speaker 2: important to understand that. Remember what I told you about Genesis.

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Speaker 2: It's real life. This is real life. You won't have

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Speaker 2: this dilemma. I promise you. You'll have different ones between

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Speaker 2: miserable and more miserable countries. Happen? Should the United States

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Speaker 2: of America have supported a right wing corrupt dictator when

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Speaker 2: the alternative was a communist takeover? My arguments were yes,

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Speaker 2: because I didn't think that the alternative was democracy in

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Speaker 2: some cases, but communism.

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Speaker 3: And I thought that communism was worse.

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Speaker 2: Than a miserable right wing hoodlum because far more people die,

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Speaker 2: because communism lasts much longer than right wing who and

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Speaker 2: so whatever. I'm not going to get into the argument now,

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Speaker 2: but I'm merely saying I remember having that argument. On

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Speaker 2: a global scale, just during the Cold War. She is

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Speaker 2: not too long ago. And I kept saying that was

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Speaker 2: the choice not between democracy and this right wing bumpkin,

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Speaker 2: but between a right wing bumpkin and a left wing totalitarian.

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Speaker 2: And it happens very often. And that's what that realism

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Speaker 2: strikes me. Is very powerful in this particular thing. I

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Speaker 2: don't think he was pleased to know that his wife

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Speaker 2: was in Pharaoh's place. By the way, as it happens,

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Speaker 2: Pharaoh probably didn't.

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Speaker 3: Sleep with her.

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Speaker 2: Apparently, the implication is that he was about to, or that,

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Speaker 2: you know, she went into the thing, but before he

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Speaker 2: could do anything, he got real sick.

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Speaker 1: This episode of timeless wisdom will continue right after this.

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Speaker 1: Now back to more of Dennis Prager's timeless wisdom.

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Speaker 3: Yes, this is yeah, Now this is interesting.

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Speaker 2: This is the worst case reading of Abram's conduct, that

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Speaker 2: it wasn't just to save his life, but to become

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Speaker 2: a very rich man. However, however, I'll tell you what

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Speaker 2: mitigates against that. Number One, that the fact remains that

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Speaker 2: his life was involved. Number Two, you will see later

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Speaker 2: that he is not a materialist, that he that he

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Speaker 2: refuses all wealth on two occasions which will come to okay,

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Speaker 2: which I think might actually argue on his behalf in

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Speaker 2: that way. But you're right. The worst case descriptions of

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Speaker 2: Abram say, look at that gives his wife to you

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Speaker 2: become a rich guy. No, let me let me go

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Speaker 2: on now, okay, why tell the story? Why tell this story?

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Speaker 2: Remember I always ask in a biblical text, why is

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Speaker 2: it related?

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Speaker 3: What is there to be learned?

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Speaker 2: I think for a number of reasons. Number one, tell

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Speaker 2: you the type of world in which Abraham lived. It

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Speaker 2: is very important for us to understand what the monotheistic

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Speaker 2: battle was against. When you look at what the Torah

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Speaker 2: eventually developed in terms of morality, and then look at

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Speaker 2: the world that it came from, it.

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Speaker 3: Becomes far far more of an achievement and a necessity.

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Speaker 2: I think that's one reason. I think another one is

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Speaker 2: the honesty of the text. Jewish heroes are never perfect,

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Speaker 2: whatever one is to say, even if it was the

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Speaker 2: right thing, he doesn't look perfect in this thing. I

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Speaker 2: mean there is You are left the reader is not

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Speaker 2: left with a view of Abraham as saintly, but as

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Speaker 2: a very food guy who sits down, very pragmatically and

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Speaker 2: weighs the issues. I agree with that in the final analysis,

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Speaker 2: But I don't leave with a saintly view of Abraham.

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Speaker 2: I don't leave with a bad view of him. I

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Speaker 2: agree with it, but I want you to understand that.

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Speaker 2: And it's part of the torrest thing to present the

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Speaker 2: great Jews as flawed, real human beings, from Abraham to Isaac,

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Speaker 2: to Jacob, to Joseph, to Moses, or to King David. Finally, okay,

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Speaker 2: and that, by the way, as I've said to you,

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Speaker 2: I think in the past, it gives me at any rate,

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Speaker 2: it lends credibility to the text that I'm reading. I

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Speaker 2: also I can.

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Speaker 3: Relate, then can't every one of you, whether you agree

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Speaker 3: with him or not?

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Speaker 2: Do you not relate to him? But if the man

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Speaker 2: had made said, look, I have but one life, and

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Speaker 2: to give it up for the chastity of my beautiful woman,

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Speaker 2: whom I know is equal to me, even though the

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Speaker 2: rest of civilization understands that women are chapel. But I, Abraham,

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Speaker 2: the father of white people, know that she has created

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Speaker 2: in the images I mean that could have been done,

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Speaker 2: couldn't have been done.

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Speaker 3: But who would relate to him?

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Speaker 2: Then you'd go wow? And then turn the page. You see,

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Speaker 2: though that's very important. This is a real life character

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Speaker 2: with a miserable decision.

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Speaker 5: Famine, pharaoh or death. Okay, that's the great You know

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Speaker 5: he didn't even have They used to have those things

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Speaker 5: with the doors. Behind one was a lion, behind one

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Speaker 5: was a princess.

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Speaker 2: He had, one had a lion, one had a tiger,

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Speaker 2: and one had a rhinoceros. So it's very different. That's

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Speaker 2: most of life is like that. It is not the

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Speaker 2: princess or the lion. It's the lion or another miserable

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Speaker 2: for stunken animal. And so you know that's however, having

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Speaker 2: said all that, one final thing here, Gunther Plout thinks

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Speaker 2: he's sin. I didn't want to tell.

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Speaker 3: You that before we had the second vote.

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Speaker 2: I want to read to you what Gunther Plout writes,

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Speaker 2: whom I respect dearly. Okay, he has a whole thing

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Speaker 2: on it.

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Speaker 3: And then he.

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Speaker 2: Writes, since both Sarah and Farah were put in jeopardy

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Speaker 2: by Abraham, the proper judgment would seem to support enough

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Speaker 2: Monod's comment it was a sin. The rabbis generally assumed

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Speaker 2: it was a sin. Isn't that interesting? And I don't

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Speaker 2: agree with that? But and but Plout says, it seems

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Speaker 2: to support it. If he were here, Rabbi clout, ah,

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Speaker 2: that's that's a great question. Well, can you do a

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Speaker 2: sin and still do the right thing? Yes, Nah, that's

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Speaker 2: a great question, And I'll tell you. I'll tell you

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Speaker 2: an interesting thing on that. I one of the one

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Speaker 2: interesting recurrent theme on religion on the line that I've

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Speaker 2: had with the clergy was this question. I'd say, is

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Speaker 2: it always wrong to lie? And most of the clergy

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Speaker 2: would say, especially the Catholic priests on this particular issue

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Speaker 2: I remember best, would say, yes, lying is a sin.

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Speaker 2: So I'd say, what if a man is chasing a woman,

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Speaker 2: you know he wants to rape her, and you know

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Speaker 2: where she ran, and the rapist says to you, excuse me, sir,

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Speaker 2: could you please tell me where the woman I want

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Speaker 2: to rape ran? What do you say? And they said,

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Speaker 2: you try to do the best you can without lying.

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Speaker 2: And I said, tell the biggest whopper you could possibly

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Speaker 2: come up with, because it's not even a question. And

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Speaker 2: they come back and say, look, telling a lie is

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Speaker 2: always a sin. It might be necessary on occasion, but

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Speaker 2: it's still a sin. And there is something to that

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Speaker 2: I have come In other words, I have moved, I'd

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Speaker 2: still tell the lie, but I wouldn't say that I

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Speaker 2: didn't sin I did the right thing, but in the circumstances.

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Speaker 3: It has a sinful element.

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Speaker 2: I maybe has a sinful element is a better word

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Speaker 2: that said I sinned, but it wasn't pure.

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Speaker 3: The truth is, you should tell the truth.

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Speaker 2: You may have to not tell the truth on occasion,

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Speaker 2: but there is a danger obviously that the moment you

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Speaker 2: say this case, I have to tell a lie.

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Speaker 3: What case don't you have to tell a lie? It's

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Speaker 3: still a lie. And I'll give you another example.

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Speaker 2: Why was it that King David was not given the

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Speaker 2: task of building the Holy Temple? It is Jewish traditions

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Speaker 2: throughout that it's because he killed too many people. As

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Speaker 2: a warrior. He had to be a warrior. He was

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Speaker 2: in right wars, he was in correct wars. The wars

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Speaker 2: were not immral war. But still the man who used

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Speaker 2: the sword shouldn't build a temple. So his son, Solomon,

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Speaker 2: King Solomon builds the temple. And I who am very

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Speaker 2: anti pacifist, very who believe that moral wars are moral wars,

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Speaker 2: fighting Nazis was a beautiful act. Nevertheless, killing is a tragedy.

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Speaker 2: Let's put it this way. If sinful isn't good, tragic

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Speaker 2: is what Abraham did remains tragic, though right I would

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Speaker 2: say that about capital punishment.

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Speaker 3: I am for capital punishment.

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Speaker 2: But there isn't any part of me that does not

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Speaker 2: acknowledge the tragedy, the awfulness of taking a human life deliberately.

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Speaker 2: I know that it's not something I jump for joy over.

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Speaker 2: It's an to me in necessity, a moral necessity. And

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Speaker 2: that's that's what I think Plout and Ethmonodes are saying here,

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Speaker 2: and it is a valid point.

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Speaker 3: It was.

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Speaker 2: It was a tragedy that he had to give his

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Speaker 2: wife to another man, as if she were property. But

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Speaker 2: there was no choice. That's the point, and that's that's

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Speaker 2: the power of this story. Just stuck in there. It's

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Speaker 2: if the Torah is a teacher, and Tora means teacher.

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Speaker 2: That's what it's about, folks. Here's real life. It doesn't

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Speaker 2: defend Abraham to Torah. That's part of the beauty of it.

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Speaker 2: There's no defense of Abraham here, and there's no condemnation

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Speaker 2: none whatsoever. Read it as you wish. Some say he sinned,

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Speaker 2: some say he didn't, Some say it was necessary. That's

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Speaker 2: the beauty of this text. You have to learn from it. Okay.

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Speaker 2: So it's a wonderful and by the way it happens

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Speaker 2: later twice, that's what's part of the fascinating element of Genesis.

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Speaker 3: But I'm taking it in the order and I'm not

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Speaker 3: jumping around.

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Speaker 2: Okay, we are up to let's see thirteen. What verse

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Speaker 2: on thirteen? Huh oh we are oh, okay, one minute,

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Speaker 2: one minute, one minute, one minute. Okay, now wait wait

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Speaker 2: oh thirteen one yes, thank you?

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Speaker 3: All right.

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Speaker 2: From Egypt, Abram went up to the negative with his

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Speaker 2: wife and all that he possessed, together with Loath.

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Speaker 3: Okay. Now, Abram was very rich in cattle, silver, and go.

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Speaker 2: And he proceeded by stages from the neg of as

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Speaker 2: far as Bethel to the place where his tent had

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Speaker 2: been formerly between Bethel and I. You recall that when

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Speaker 2: I mentioned that earlier, the sight of the Althar, which

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Speaker 2: he had built there at first, and there Abram invoked

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Speaker 2: the lord by name Loat, who went with Abram also

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Speaker 2: had flocks and herds and tents, so that the land

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Speaker 2: could not support them staying together. That apparently was the

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Speaker 2: way it was in that world. If you had a

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Speaker 2: lot of sheep and cattle and so on.

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Speaker 3: You had to be in different areas. That's I guess

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Speaker 3: because of the grazing and whatever other factors.

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Speaker 2: The land could not support them staying together, for their

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Speaker 2: possessions were so great that they couldn't remain together. So

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Speaker 2: there was quarreling between the herdsmen of Abram's cattle and

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Speaker 2: those of Loat's cattle, the Canonites and the Parazites within

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Speaker 2: dwelling in the land. Abram said to Lot, let there

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Speaker 2: be no strife between you and me, between my herdsmen

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Speaker 2: and yours, for where kinsman. Remember this is uncle Abram

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Speaker 2: talking to nephew Loat, is not the whole land before you.

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Speaker 3: Let's separate. It's clear he did not think much of

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Speaker 3: his nephew.

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Speaker 2: He wanted to get rid of him. Let us separate.

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Speaker 2: If you go north, I'll go south. If you go south,

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Speaker 2: I will go north. In other words, I'll do anything

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Speaker 2: to get rid of you. Wherever you want to go,

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Speaker 2: you choose, I mean, is now what it means? Isn't

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Speaker 2: that obvious? It's really it's one of those things to

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Speaker 2: be inferred. But it's correct. Lot looked about him and

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Speaker 2: saw how well watered was the whole plaine. You gotta

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Speaker 2: love this.

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Speaker 3: How well watered was the whole plane of the Jordan.

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Speaker 2: Okay, all of it. This was before the Lord had

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Speaker 2: destroyed Sidman Gamora.

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Speaker 3: Here's one of those parenthetical sentences.

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Speaker 2: I love them, just.

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Speaker 3: To help you keep up the narration.

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Speaker 2: Remember, then it became desolate, because the reader at this

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Speaker 2: time has already seen.

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Speaker 3: A desolate Sudoman Gomorrah.

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Speaker 2: It was already as if you ever gone down to

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Speaker 2: sid Doma, it's a big salt nothing. So how could

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Speaker 2: load look at the place where Sidona is and go wow?

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Speaker 2: Is that fertile and rich? So it's explaining you this

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Speaker 2: is before it was destroyed. It was really rich. By

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Speaker 2: the way, it happens to be archaeologically valid that there

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Speaker 2: was a time when it was extremely fertile and green

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Speaker 2: and wet. Just want you to know that. It's an

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Speaker 2: interesting point. So this was before God destroyed Sadom and Gomorrah.

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Speaker 2: All the weight at Sohar, like the garden of the

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Speaker 2: of the Lord, like the land of Egypt. Slot chose

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Speaker 2: for himself the whole plain of Jordan, and Lot journeyed eastward.

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Speaker 2: Thus they parted from each other Abram remained in the

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Speaker 2: land of Canan, while Loat settled in the cities of

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Speaker 2: the Plain, pitching his tents near Sidome.

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Speaker 3: A wise choice.

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Speaker 2: Now, the inhabitants of Sidon were very wicked sitters against

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Speaker 2: the lord.

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Speaker 3: Now this is interesting.

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Speaker 2: There's a phenomenal amount of irony in Genesis, constant irony.

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Speaker 2: Why does Loath choose He goes according to what seems

403
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Speaker 2: to be the most fertile area and picks what Sidon.

404
00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:27,360
Speaker 2: It would be as if somebody had left you off

405
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Speaker 2: in California said choose anywhere to live, and you've got

406
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:35,720
Speaker 2: the telescopic vision, and you go Las Vegas because it

407
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 2: looked so glamorous. And that's what he loved, the glamour.

408
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:45,080
Speaker 2: It looked unbelievably rich, and he'll take it. But even

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Speaker 2: the next sentence tells he was a miserable place to live.

410
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Speaker 2: But Loath didn't care. Load cared about money. This is

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Speaker 2: an example that I said earlier to show that money

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Speaker 2: was not that interesting. Remember he was the uncle. As

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Speaker 2: the uncle, he could have said to Loath, listen, I'm

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Speaker 2: gonna go to Sidome and that area and the Jordan

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Speaker 2: Plain where it's where I know it's rich, and you

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Speaker 2: go elsewhere. But no, the uncle said to the nephew,

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Speaker 2: you choose now by the way, as you will see

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Speaker 2: with Moses, except in reverse order. We have here error Uh,

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Speaker 2: the stories of Abraham after God picks him, whereas we

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Speaker 2: have the stories of Moses before God picks him. Okay,

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Speaker 2: but the stories nevertheless fill you in. You want to

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Speaker 2: know who the father of Monotheism is, who the father

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Speaker 2: of the patriarch of.

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Speaker 3: The Jews is.

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Speaker 2: So there's a lot to tell you about. So too

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Speaker 2: with Moses. I want to know who was who was

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00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 2: this redeemer of the Jews from Egypt? I want it?

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Speaker 2: Why did God choose? Now you're finding out about the

429
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:57,480
Speaker 2: choice of Abraham later. Remember that I told you I

430
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Speaker 2: had a theory as to why there was silence before,

431
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Speaker 2: But now there is.

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Speaker 3: This is who God chose.

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Speaker 2: And there is probably more story, more stories about Abram

434
00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 2: than anybody else except perhaps Joseph and Uh and Moses,

435
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:16,600
Speaker 2: and probably more than Joseph. I'd like to add up

436
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,000
Speaker 2: the words. It would be interesting to find out. It's

437
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:23,000
Speaker 2: a huge amount about Abraham. So one of the stories

438
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:26,840
Speaker 2: is here that he's a peacemaker, he sees there's an argument,

439
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:31,440
Speaker 2: and he's totally self sacrificing. Let's not argue. You loath

440
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:34,560
Speaker 2: and your herdsman. Choose what you want, and you go

441
00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 2: where you want, and there's no problem. And he solves

442
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 2: the problem. Lot ends up in Sidome, which was a

443
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:41,320
Speaker 2: poor choice.

444
00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,320
Speaker 1: This episode of timeless wisdom will continue right after this.

445
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 1: Now back to more of Dennis Prager's timeless wisdom.

446
00:27:55,800 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 2: Okay, one other thing. You see the next sentence fourteen

447
00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:08,000
Speaker 2: verse fourteen. And the Lord said to Abram, after Lot

448
00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 2: had parted from him, raise your eyes and look out

449
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:13,840
Speaker 2: from where you are to the north and the south,

450
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:14,879
Speaker 2: to the east and the west.

451
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:16,560
Speaker 3: For I will give.

452
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:18,879
Speaker 2: For I give all the land that you see to you,

453
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 2: you and your offspring forever. I will make your offspring

454
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:26,120
Speaker 2: as the dust of the earth, so that if one

455
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:29,440
Speaker 2: can count the dust of the earth, then your offspring

456
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 2: too can be counted. That's how numerous your offspring will be.

457
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:37,480
Speaker 2: Up Walk about the land through its length and its breath,

458
00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 2: for I give it to you. And abramoved his tent

459
00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:43,920
Speaker 2: and came to dwell at the oaks of Mamree, which

460
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 2: are in Favorn, and he built an altar there to God.

461
00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:50,320
Speaker 2: Notice verse fourteen, where it said, and God said to Abraham.

462
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 2: God said all these things after Loath had parted from him.

463
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,960
Speaker 2: One of the commentators makes the point that for God

464
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:01,360
Speaker 2: to complete all of what he had to say with Abraham,

465
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:03,960
Speaker 2: he had to get rid of all of his family.

466
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:08,200
Speaker 2: They were a burden from the past. The last links

467
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:13,040
Speaker 2: to his father's family of idle worshipers was the nephew Loath.

468
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:16,360
Speaker 3: See it's so interesting.

469
00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:21,080
Speaker 2: Why would those words there and God said after departed,

470
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:25,000
Speaker 2: Because only then could God relate. It's something for us

471
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:28,440
Speaker 2: to know. Maybe sometimes we too need to.

472
00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 3: Leave our origin to talk to God. It's something to

473
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 3: think about.

474
00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 2: There is another thing of phenomenal importance here, and that

475
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 2: is the land in Judaism. There is no parallel fully

476
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:54,920
Speaker 2: to this in Islam, and none whatsoever in Christianity, which

477
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 2: is not to say better or worse, simply to say

478
00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 2: that it is there is no parallel. The importance of

479
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:09,120
Speaker 2: the land to Judaism cannot be overstated. And I say

480
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 2: this is one who does not live in that land.

481
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:16,280
Speaker 2: So I certainly am not saying this with any acts

482
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 2: to grind or promoting my own choice in life, but

483
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 2: intellectual honesty demands that we acknowledge how important the land

484
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:32,080
Speaker 2: of Israel is to Judaism, so much so that the

485
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:36,520
Speaker 2: rabbis later said, Jew moves to Israel, it.

486
00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 3: Is as if he has fulfilled the entire tory.

487
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 2: Now, of course they say that about twenty other things too,

488
00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:47,720
Speaker 2: so you know you have to take it slightly tongue

489
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:48,160
Speaker 2: in cheek.

490
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:52,840
Speaker 3: But they meant to say, this is where it's at,

491
00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 3: that this is what.

492
00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:59,360
Speaker 2: God intended for the Jews to build a holy society.

493
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 2: But you can only build a holy society in a place.

494
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 2: Judaism is profoundly physical. It is the most corporeal religion

495
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:17,240
Speaker 2: of the monotheistic religions. It is bound to land, bound

496
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:22,440
Speaker 2: to people, bound to family, bound to law.

497
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:26,640
Speaker 3: It is not metaphysical a religion.

498
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 2: It has metaphysical elements, but the religion itself is uniquely physical.

499
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 2: That is why the mets both are physical. The laws

500
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:46,560
Speaker 2: of Judaism are very physical. And you will take this meat,

501
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 2: and you will eat this way, and you will slaughter

502
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:56,640
Speaker 2: this way, and you will take this branch of palm,

503
00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:01,760
Speaker 2: and you will take this citron, this etro, and you

504
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:04,160
Speaker 2: will wash your hands this way.

505
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 3: It is a very physical religion.

506
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 2: You will wear fringes on your garment, and you will

507
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:17,960
Speaker 2: go three times a year up the mountain in Jerusalem

508
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 2: to bring the sacrifices.

509
00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 3: It's a very physical religion.

510
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,440
Speaker 2: And the reason is because as we live in a

511
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 2: physical world, and if you don't invest the physical with holiness,

512
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:35,719
Speaker 2: if you separate holiness and physical, then you will have

513
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:36,600
Speaker 2: a bad world.

514
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:43,560
Speaker 3: The purpose of Judaism is to sanctify the non sanctified.

515
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 2: It's to sanctify the physical, which is not sacred. You

516
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:54,520
Speaker 2: make the land sacred. After all, that land was lived

517
00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 2: on by Canonites and Perizites and others, and it wasn't sacred.

518
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:02,000
Speaker 3: You make it sacred. And that is why God.

519
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:06,560
Speaker 2: Warns the Jews in Deuteronomy and elsewhere, if you live

520
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 2: as bad as the others who.

521
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,760
Speaker 3: Lived in their live, the land will vomit you out.

522
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 2: And those are the words it uses, just as it

523
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:21,520
Speaker 2: vomited them out. You Jew are here, you seed of Abraham,

524
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:26,440
Speaker 2: are here to lead a sacred life on this soil.

525
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 2: That's what I have made you for. That's what I

526
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 2: have chosen this area for that we have tried, and

527
00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 2: I am as guilty as any Jew to much more

528
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 2: spiritualized Judaism than it is.

529
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:48,880
Speaker 3: It's filled with the spiritual, but it's not just the spiritual.

530
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:52,760
Speaker 2: It is very physical, and that is why it can

531
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:57,720
Speaker 2: be seen by some people as as a lower form

532
00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 2: in some ways of religiosity being preoccupied.

533
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:03,880
Speaker 3: What is it that Jesus is reputed to have said?

534
00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 3: It is not, And tell me if it's Jesus or

535
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:09,080
Speaker 3: if it's someone else. I believe it's in Matthew.

536
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 2: It is not what goes into your mouth that matters,

537
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 2: but that which comes out.

538
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:15,399
Speaker 3: Of your mouth the art.

539
00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:19,160
Speaker 2: It's not an argument here with Jesus or whoever or

540
00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 2: is attributing death to Jesus.

541
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:22,880
Speaker 3: It is a statement of difference.

542
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 2: Judaism holds that what goes into your mouth is important.

543
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:30,600
Speaker 2: Of course, what goes out of your mouth is important,

544
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:34,400
Speaker 2: but what goes in is also important. That you must

545
00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:40,759
Speaker 2: lend to time, to space and to place sanctity.

546
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 3: This is the beginning of it.

547
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 2: This land I give you, and this is the land

548
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:52,279
Speaker 2: over which the battle for humanity will take place, as

549
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:58,239
Speaker 2: I God see it. That's Judaism. The Jew embodies it.

550
00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:03,000
Speaker 2: The Jew is physical, and the land is physical. That

551
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:05,399
Speaker 2: is part of the reason I'll talk about this much

552
00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:08,759
Speaker 2: later on. Why I don't believe that Torah talks about

553
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:13,960
Speaker 2: it hereafter. Whereas what happens after you die is a

554
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:17,279
Speaker 2: very major theme in the New Testament, it is not

555
00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 2: talked about in the Toro. It is simply ignored. The

556
00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 2: physical Sank define this physical world as the preoccupation of

557
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:31,480
Speaker 2: the thorough and it starts with the land.

558
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,719
Speaker 3: God promises in sixteen as I just read to you

559
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 3: that excuse me one second.

560
00:35:53,760 --> 00:35:59,080
Speaker 2: God promises to Abram that his seed will be numerous,

561
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:03,239
Speaker 2: and yet Sarah has still just Sarah can't give birth.

562
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:06,040
Speaker 3: Here is an.

563
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,800
Speaker 2: Example, by the way of where you could imagine Abram's

564
00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 2: standing there and going huh. And by the way he

565
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 2: does that, he actually asks God later on, how exactly are.

566
00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:19,880
Speaker 3: You going to do it? You will see it is

567
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 3: It adds again the humanity of it.

568
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:24,800
Speaker 2: Even if it's God speaking to you, and it doesn't

569
00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:25,400
Speaker 2: make sense.

570
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:29,560
Speaker 3: It still doesn't make sense, even if it's God. That's

571
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:33,799
Speaker 3: what's so remarkable about a little bit. Now, all of

572
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:39,120
Speaker 3: this is there is completely stopped for a moment. Remember

573
00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:41,920
Speaker 3: the Tower of Bible story just came out of nowhere.

574
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 2: And then back to the other story, you have that

575
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:47,200
Speaker 2: affair amount here and here all of a sudden, Chapter

576
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:49,520
Speaker 2: fourteen exactly the same thing.

577
00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:50,880
Speaker 3: And I will not read the whole chapter.

578
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:53,920
Speaker 2: This is one of the times I'll just summarize now

579
00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:56,640
Speaker 2: when I'm offel King of Shinar. Let me you know

580
00:36:56,840 --> 00:37:02,120
Speaker 2: enough Shanar Our yoth Meleth of e Lasar Cadella Omer,

581
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 2: the king of Elam, and so on and so on.

582
00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:08,160
Speaker 2: We're there where the kings of nations.

583
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 3: They all started fighting with each other.

584
00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:14,120
Speaker 2: That's most of chapter fourteen, the names of kings and

585
00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:15,400
Speaker 2: places where they fought.

586
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:20,440
Speaker 3: But it ends with fourteen eleven.

587
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:26,520
Speaker 2: The invaders seized all the wealth of Siddom and Gomorrah

588
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:30,920
Speaker 2: and all their provisions and went their way. They also

589
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:36,560
Speaker 2: took Loat, the son of Abram's brother, and his possessions,

590
00:37:36,560 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 2: and departed, for he had settled in Sidom.

591
00:37:39,120 --> 00:37:43,280
Speaker 3: In case you forgot, okay, Siddom lost the war.

592
00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:49,759
Speaker 2: People were taken away, and that included Abram's nephew Lot,

593
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:55,239
Speaker 2: whom he was just dying to hear from now verse thirteen.

594
00:37:56,760 --> 00:38:00,200
Speaker 2: In chapter fourteen, a fugitive brought the news to Abram

595
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:02,600
Speaker 2: the Hebrew all of a sudden, By the way, Abram's

596
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:05,200
Speaker 2: called a Hebrew which is the first time it's used,

597
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:09,400
Speaker 2: and all the research I have done has led me

598
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:13,719
Speaker 2: to believe that nobody knows what it means. There are

599
00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:16,359
Speaker 2: those in sam short some of you now that it's

600
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 2: related to a nomadic people of the time called the Abiru.

601
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:26,160
Speaker 2: There's total debate whether that's true. To me, what strikes

602
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 2: me is the most logical is to look at the

603
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:32,800
Speaker 2: word in Hebrew, and in Hebrew lavor means to pass,

604
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:38,360
Speaker 2: to go on to if you will wander, and that's

605
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 2: really both I think literally and hermoneutically. What Jews are

606
00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 2: wanderers and started off as wanderers. They got the Torah's

607
00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 2: wanderers and have been wanderers for a good part of

608
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:58,319
Speaker 2: their history. It's really Abraham the other the wanderer.

609
00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:01,560
Speaker 3: Anyway, he got the news right.

610
00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:05,920
Speaker 2: He was at the oaks of Mamre, the Amurit kingsman,

611
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:09,040
Speaker 2: kinsmen of Eshkola and Nanair and so on, these being

612
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,480
Speaker 2: Abram's allies. When Abram heard that his kinsman who's that loath,

613
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,200
Speaker 2: had been taken captive, he mustered his retainers born into

614
00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:19,640
Speaker 2: his household, numbering three hundred and eighteen in and pursued

615
00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:23,240
Speaker 2: as far as done at night, he and his servants

616
00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:25,839
Speaker 2: deployed against them and defeated them, and he pursued them

617
00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:28,640
Speaker 2: as far as Cloap, which is north of Damascus.

618
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:30,000
Speaker 3: That's quite a trip, by the way.

619
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:33,560
Speaker 2: So that was a good, good little battle just to

620
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:33,960
Speaker 2: get his.

621
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:39,080
Speaker 3: Nephew, whom he didn't like. He brought back all the possessions.

622
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:43,960
Speaker 3: He also brought back kins. Now, if fat doesn't give.

623
00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:46,840
Speaker 2: It away, here is in one of those rare moments,

624
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:51,880
Speaker 2: I am convinced of deliberate humor. Brought back possession, Miami,

625
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:56,400
Speaker 2: brought love and his possessions, and the women and the

626
00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:59,640
Speaker 2: rest of the people. So which gives you can off

627
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:03,520
Speaker 2: see perhaps some women back again. Oh yes, and brought

628
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:08,160
Speaker 2: back at any rate. This is important because it tells

629
00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:12,000
Speaker 2: you another thing about Abraham. First, he was the peacekeeper. Right,

630
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:14,840
Speaker 2: what have we seen about Abraham? These are important things.

631
00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:17,879
Speaker 3: We saw that Abraham was a peace lover.

632
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 2: He made peace between the battle between his men and

633
00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 2: loats men. Wherever you want to go, please, just so

634
00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:27,080
Speaker 2: long as we have peace. And now though he's a

635
00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:32,840
Speaker 2: war maker, so is so was Moses. And there's a

636
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:36,840
Speaker 2: very big lesson here. I am convinced a great leader

637
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,160
Speaker 2: has to know when to fight and has to know

638
00:40:39,200 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 2: when to make peace. Moses new when to kill an Egyptian,

639
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:47,720
Speaker 2: and Moses new when to just speak up and make peace.

640
00:40:49,239 --> 00:40:52,520
Speaker 2: You can't only be a peace lover and you can't

641
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:56,200
Speaker 2: only be a war lover. You have to know when

642
00:40:56,560 --> 00:41:00,239
Speaker 2: both are necessary. It's as true today as it was

643
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 2: when this was written. A leader who is a pacifist

644
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:07,279
Speaker 2: won't work. I'm talking about the leader of all is

645
00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:10,640
Speaker 2: a given movement. In the case of Gandhi, the peace

646
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:16,960
Speaker 2: a peaceful or non violent resistance was very appropriate, but

647
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 2: it's a separate issue.

648
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:20,320
Speaker 3: He was not against the vile of nation, being against

649
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:23,160
Speaker 3: the English. Non violent resistance against the.

650
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:27,680
Speaker 2: Nazis would have been suicidal. You have to know him

651
00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:30,160
Speaker 2: to fight and when to make peace, and it depends

652
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 2: on who your enemy is. At any rate, Abraham obviously

653
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:34,240
Speaker 2: knows how to fight.

654
00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:36,600
Speaker 3: Okay.

655
00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:40,800
Speaker 2: When he returned from defeating Kidullah, Homer and the kings

656
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:43,560
Speaker 2: with him, the king of Sidom came out to meet

657
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:45,240
Speaker 2: him in the valley of Chevet.

658
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 3: Let's say it was with a Hebrew seventeen. Sometimes the English.

659
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:55,799
Speaker 2: Got Cheve okay, which is the valley of the King

660
00:41:56,239 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 2: and maid said that king of Chalem or Salem brought

661
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:03,680
Speaker 2: out bread and wine. Okay, this king did. He was

662
00:42:03,719 --> 00:42:07,440
Speaker 2: a priest of God Most High. Now that's very interesting.

663
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:16,799
Speaker 2: This was a monotheist king. A non jew monotheist is

664
00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:21,080
Speaker 2: described here. It happens later too. Just wanted to point

665
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:24,600
Speaker 2: that out to you. And he blessed him, saying to

666
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 2: bless the Abram of God most High, creator of heaven

667
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:31,120
Speaker 2: and earth. And blessed be godmost High, who's delivered your

668
00:42:31,160 --> 00:42:34,080
Speaker 2: foes unto your hand. And Abram gave him a tenth

669
00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:40,120
Speaker 2: of everything. Okay, which is impressive. Again again the generosity.

670
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:39,879
Speaker 3: Of the man.

671
00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:44,560
Speaker 2: Then the king of Sadome, it's a slight country distinction

672
00:42:44,680 --> 00:42:47,720
Speaker 2: to the cadullah Omer. The king of Saddam said to Abram,

673
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:50,360
Speaker 2: give me the persons and take the possessions for yourself.

674
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:54,520
Speaker 2: But listen to this, Abram said to the King of Sadom.

675
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 2: And here is where I've said to you earlier that

676
00:42:57,360 --> 00:42:59,120
Speaker 2: it shows that he was not materialistic.

677
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:02,319
Speaker 3: I swear to the Lord God most High, creator on earth.

678
00:43:02,840 --> 00:43:05,440
Speaker 2: I will not take so much as a thread or

679
00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:09,160
Speaker 2: a sandal strap of what is yours. You shall not

680
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 2: say it is I who made Abram rich, but rather,

681
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:15,279
Speaker 2: who is it who made Abram rich?

682
00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 3: God? Okay, it's interesting.

683
00:43:18,080 --> 00:43:20,880
Speaker 2: He refused all of what he was to be given

684
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:23,719
Speaker 2: for me, nothing but what my servants have used up

685
00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:25,400
Speaker 2: as for the share of the men, and went with

686
00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:30,840
Speaker 2: me an heiress Cola Monrae let them take their share. Okay,

687
00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 2: we are up to chapter fifteen, and we have something

688
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:38,480
Speaker 2: very new.

689
00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:44,800
Speaker 3: For the first time. Abraham will speak to God.

690
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:50,120
Speaker 2: The whole time, if you notice, God has been speaking

691
00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:50,880
Speaker 2: to Abram.

692
00:43:51,560 --> 00:43:57,719
Speaker 3: Finally Abram speaks. Sometime later, this is fifteen to one.

693
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 2: The word of the Lord came to Abram in a vision, saying, now,

694
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:04,759
Speaker 2: by the way, this is God speaking in a vision.

695
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:06,520
Speaker 3: And later you will see the God's book when he

696
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:07,200
Speaker 3: was asleep.

697
00:44:08,480 --> 00:44:12,160
Speaker 2: There is one exception to these, and that is Moses,

698
00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:16,000
Speaker 2: where it even says not in a vision and not

699
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:20,320
Speaker 2: in a dream, but face to face God spoke to Moses.

700
00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:25,560
Speaker 3: The communication to Moses was unique. In other words, what you.

701
00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:28,799
Speaker 2: And I don't know what divine revelation directly is, obviously

702
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:31,719
Speaker 2: unless any of you know told me otherwise after class,

703
00:44:33,200 --> 00:44:36,160
Speaker 2: and I have a fine, fine doctor.

704
00:44:35,840 --> 00:44:39,919
Speaker 3: That I wouldn't. No, I'm joking about that part.

705
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:41,360
Speaker 2: But I wouldn't be curious if any of you had

706
00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:44,560
Speaker 2: direct revelation at any rate.

707
00:44:46,160 --> 00:44:52,919
Speaker 6: There are levels of revelation, which means therefore that in

708
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 6: some way even those who get.

709
00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:02,919
Speaker 2: Divine revelation don't get it as clearly as let's say

710
00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:08,600
Speaker 2: Moses did. There is still a human fog perhaps in

711
00:45:08,719 --> 00:45:12,239
Speaker 2: the way others may have gotten revelations. It's just an

712
00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:13,440
Speaker 2: interesting point.

713
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:14,239
Speaker 3: To dwell upon.

714
00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:18,520
Speaker 2: It isn't God revealed themselves spoke to Moses, both to Isaac.

715
00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:20,920
Speaker 3: Abraham j But it's all the same. It is not.

716
00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:22,680
Speaker 3: And here is one example.

717
00:45:24,400 --> 00:45:27,760
Speaker 2: He came to Abram in a vision, saying, fear not, Abram,

718
00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:34,160
Speaker 2: I am a shield to you. Your reward shall be

719
00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:37,640
Speaker 2: very great. And now remember what I said.

720
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:38,000
Speaker 3: Listen.

721
00:45:38,280 --> 00:45:42,480
Speaker 2: But Abram said to God, O, Lord God, what can

722
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:46,560
Speaker 2: you give me, seeing that I shall die childless? And

723
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:49,560
Speaker 2: then one in charge of my whole of my household

724
00:45:50,160 --> 00:45:55,000
Speaker 2: is the one from Damascus, Eliezer he had hired. As

725
00:45:55,040 --> 00:46:00,120
Speaker 2: it were, what made this Eliezer the head of his household,

726
00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:04,160
Speaker 2: who by ancient Near Eastern law that inherits the household

727
00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:09,920
Speaker 2: because you don't have a son. So here is an

728
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:13,200
Speaker 2: interesting thing. Let me ask you if God spoke to you,

729
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:16,840
Speaker 2: first of all, you'd be so thrilled to know that

730
00:46:17,239 --> 00:46:20,000
Speaker 2: God was there and knew you. It's like Whitty Allen

731
00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:22,600
Speaker 2: said that I mentioned this on the radio. If God

732
00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:26,120
Speaker 2: would only sneeze, I would be happy. I just want

733
00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:30,520
Speaker 2: to sneeze. That's how we moderns feel, right, a lot

734
00:46:30,560 --> 00:46:33,960
Speaker 2: of us. That's all I want is a sneeze. But

735
00:46:34,080 --> 00:46:38,200
Speaker 2: it's interesting you would think, therefore God speaks to him, Now,

736
00:46:38,239 --> 00:46:39,720
Speaker 2: why would he ask a question?

737
00:46:40,640 --> 00:46:42,760
Speaker 3: And I mean this, I'm not sure I have an answer.

738
00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:45,840
Speaker 2: If he knows that God is God, God is the

739
00:46:45,920 --> 00:46:48,719
Speaker 2: creator of the universe and promises things.

740
00:46:49,160 --> 00:46:52,399
Speaker 3: What's the question? Okay, I mean this is the.

741
00:46:52,440 --> 00:46:56,160
Speaker 2: You know, the God who made the earth and sun

742
00:46:56,880 --> 00:47:01,200
Speaker 2: and moon and planets and stars probably can give me

743
00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:01,680
Speaker 2: a child.

744
00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:05,120
Speaker 3: There's a good chance based on his track record.

745
00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:09,000
Speaker 2: So you would think that you wouldn't have all these

746
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:10,200
Speaker 2: questions to God.

747
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 3: On the other hand, it's very normal.

748
00:47:13,120 --> 00:47:16,080
Speaker 2: It doesn't make sense, as I said earlier, even if

749
00:47:16,120 --> 00:47:20,120
Speaker 2: God says it. If it doesn't make sense, people will ask.

750
00:47:21,080 --> 00:47:27,080
Speaker 2: And this, by the way, is I think virtually uniquely Jewish.

751
00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 3: Of having those talk to by.

752
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:35,240
Speaker 2: God answer back, and Jews do this to this day.

753
00:47:36,040 --> 00:47:40,440
Speaker 2: I mean now, with absolute sincerity. Jews have a very

754
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:44,160
Speaker 2: vibrant those who think about God. Many Jews have been

755
00:47:44,200 --> 00:47:53,239
Speaker 2: thoroughly secularized, tragically, but a very vibrant relationship mainly anger. Yes,

756
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:55,640
Speaker 2: I would say that the number of Jews who are

757
00:47:55,680 --> 00:47:58,279
Speaker 2: angry with God is probably greater than the number of

758
00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:02,680
Speaker 2: Jews who love God. I'm not saying that's good at all.

759
00:48:02,719 --> 00:48:04,800
Speaker 2: I don't think it's good. I think you can have both.

760
00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:07,600
Speaker 2: I think it's gone overboard. But I would say most

761
00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:09,799
Speaker 2: Jews are walking around saying, Oh God, I could you

762
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:11,840
Speaker 2: let six million die? Oh God, how do you let

763
00:48:11,960 --> 00:48:18,160
Speaker 2: kids with cancer? Etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. But it's very part

764
00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:18,960
Speaker 2: of our tradition.

765
00:48:19,440 --> 00:48:22,280
Speaker 3: Our patriarchs answered back, He.

766
00:48:22,160 --> 00:48:25,640
Speaker 2: Answers back, the first person spoken to, the first Jew,

767
00:48:25,680 --> 00:48:28,720
Speaker 2: at least spoken to by God answers back. Remember Noah

768
00:48:28,719 --> 00:48:35,000
Speaker 2: didn't answer back an arc certainly, sir. Remember we went

769
00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:37,680
Speaker 2: through that, his total silence the whole time.

770
00:48:38,640 --> 00:48:42,399
Speaker 3: You name it the day the Wood. I'm your man,

771
00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:44,120
Speaker 3: not Abraham.

772
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 2: Abraham has got already some Jewish characteristics that it is

773
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:51,919
Speaker 2: a fascinating It is a fascinating thing.

774
00:48:53,400 --> 00:48:56,759
Speaker 3: So he says, exactly how am I going to do that?

775
00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:01,600
Speaker 3: What can you give me? Since I'm gonna die childless

776
00:49:02,040 --> 00:49:04,680
Speaker 3: and worse. The one who's in charge is this guy

777
00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:06,200
Speaker 3: from Damascus, Eliezer.

778
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:12,279
Speaker 2: Abram said further, since you have granted me no offspring,

779
00:49:12,680 --> 00:49:15,600
Speaker 2: my steward, that's Eliezer, will be my heir.

780
00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:17,760
Speaker 3: The word of the Lord.

781
00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:22,840
Speaker 2: Came to him in a reply, share, that's not true.

782
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:25,279
Speaker 2: The word of the Lord, just for to see who

783
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:28,359
Speaker 2: was following the word of the Lord came to him

784
00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:31,080
Speaker 2: in reply that one shall.

785
00:49:30,760 --> 00:49:31,800
Speaker 3: Not be your heir.

786
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:36,359
Speaker 2: None but your very own issue shall be your heir,

787
00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:40,839
Speaker 2: your own seed that comes from you. He took him

788
00:49:40,880 --> 00:49:44,279
Speaker 2: outside and said, look toward heaven. But I wonder if

789
00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 2: it's still the vision or he got up. Now it's

790
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:48,760
Speaker 2: interesting he took him outside, Was it in the vision

791
00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:52,879
Speaker 2: or not? Look toward heaven and count the stars if

792
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:56,360
Speaker 2: you're able to count them, And he added, so shall

793
00:49:56,400 --> 00:50:00,480
Speaker 2: your offspring be. And because he put his trust in

794
00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:05,640
Speaker 2: the Lord, God reckoned it to his Abraham's merit.

795
00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:08,320
Speaker 3: I would say the number of times.

796
00:50:07,880 --> 00:50:12,560
Speaker 2: That Genesis fifteen six has been cited to me by Christian.

797
00:50:14,840 --> 00:50:15,760
Speaker 3: Pastors that I've.

798
00:50:15,600 --> 00:50:19,840
Speaker 2: Been dialogue it probably by now has entered the thousands.

799
00:50:20,640 --> 00:50:24,720
Speaker 2: This is about as frequently as cited Hebrew Bible phrase

800
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:31,160
Speaker 2: as Protestants in particular will cite. And because he put

801
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:34,600
Speaker 2: his trust in God, God reckoned it to his merit

802
00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:40,280
Speaker 2: or considered it meritorious, or however the translation might be, Evelyn,

803
00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:41,960
Speaker 2: what translation do you have on that?

804
00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 3: Good? So what does it say? Fifteen six?

805
00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:55,160
Speaker 2: Okay, which is in some ways more fully literally accurate.

806
00:50:55,640 --> 00:50:59,080
Speaker 3: Abraham believed in God, and God credit to him his righteousness.

807
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:05,520
Speaker 2: Christians use this, Protestants use this, not Catholic, but Protestants

808
00:51:05,600 --> 00:51:11,120
Speaker 2: use this as one of their basic text phrases for

809
00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:15,880
Speaker 2: the belief that faith is what saves rather than works,

810
00:51:16,680 --> 00:51:20,960
Speaker 2: because they say, look, this is what God said about Abram,

811
00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:23,200
Speaker 2: that it was his faith.

812
00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:27,759
Speaker 3: In him that he counted toward his merit. Now I

813
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:28,920
Speaker 3: don't read that from it.

814
00:51:29,239 --> 00:51:32,040
Speaker 2: What I do read is that it is critical that

815
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:36,640
Speaker 2: you be faithful, but not that faith alone is the issue. Again,

816
00:51:36,680 --> 00:51:38,880
Speaker 2: I don't want to get into a theological argument on

817
00:51:39,239 --> 00:51:42,840
Speaker 2: the most one of the most ongoing of these debates.

818
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:49,160
Speaker 2: But it is true that God here is stating the

819
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:50,600
Speaker 2: importance of faith.

820
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:53,680
Speaker 3: Now what does faith mean?

821
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:57,759
Speaker 1: This episode of Timeless Wisdom will continue right after this.

822
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:07,640
Speaker 1: Now back to more of Dennis Prager's Timeless Wisdom.

823
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:12,240
Speaker 2: There are two elements to faith with regard to God.

824
00:52:12,880 --> 00:52:18,600
Speaker 2: One is I believe God exists. The other is I

825
00:52:18,680 --> 00:52:23,080
Speaker 2: believe in God. But when people say I believe in God,

826
00:52:23,160 --> 00:52:25,400
Speaker 2: they usually mean I believe God exists.

827
00:52:25,960 --> 00:52:27,920
Speaker 3: That's not the issue.

828
00:52:28,560 --> 00:52:31,360
Speaker 2: To believe God exists is not what the Biblical faith

829
00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:36,359
Speaker 2: is about. The Hebrew Bible takes faith in God as

830
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:41,840
Speaker 2: a given. Faith in God means trusting in God.

831
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:43,279
Speaker 3: You get.

832
00:52:43,320 --> 00:52:46,280
Speaker 2: The difference is all the difference in the world. Listen,

833
00:52:46,680 --> 00:52:50,120
Speaker 2: you know your next door neighbor exists. There's no question

834
00:52:50,200 --> 00:52:54,279
Speaker 2: about that. Question is do you trust him? That's the

835
00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:55,240
Speaker 2: issue with God.

836
00:52:56,280 --> 00:52:59,000
Speaker 3: There is no issue in the Bible whether God exists.

837
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:02,880
Speaker 2: It would be absurd, it would be an intrinsic absurdity.

838
00:53:02,920 --> 00:53:04,120
Speaker 3: Of course God exists.

839
00:53:04,560 --> 00:53:06,440
Speaker 2: There are those who may believe in other gods, but

840
00:53:06,480 --> 00:53:09,520
Speaker 2: there's no question about a God existing. The question is

841
00:53:09,560 --> 00:53:14,359
Speaker 2: do you have trust in this God. That's what Abraham had.

842
00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:19,600
Speaker 2: He's old, his wife is old. He's promised the sentences

843
00:53:19,640 --> 00:53:23,399
Speaker 2: who number the stars in the sky, and he believes that.

844
00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:27,959
Speaker 3: So the issue for Abraham was never is there a God?

845
00:53:28,160 --> 00:53:29,200
Speaker 3: Who's he talking to?

846
00:53:30,080 --> 00:53:34,480
Speaker 2: Of course he believed God exists. The question is do

847
00:53:34,560 --> 00:53:36,080
Speaker 2: I believe in God?

848
00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:37,839
Speaker 3: Do I trust him?

849
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:40,880
Speaker 2: And that he did, That's what the merit here was

850
00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:44,640
Speaker 2: that has talked about in this very important little verse,

851
00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:48,040
Speaker 2: and that, by the way, is our modern dilemma.

852
00:53:48,840 --> 00:53:49,959
Speaker 3: A lot of people.

853
00:53:49,640 --> 00:53:53,760
Speaker 2: Believe in God but don't have faith in him.

854
00:53:54,120 --> 00:53:59,560
Speaker 3: That's that's a big difference. That's really worthy of an

855
00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:00,560
Speaker 3: entire evening on.

856
00:54:00,840 --> 00:54:03,319
Speaker 2: Its own, and I won't I won't develop it at

857
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:06,200
Speaker 2: any length, but I do want you to think about

858
00:54:06,280 --> 00:54:10,680
Speaker 2: that issue, the difference between knowing God exists or believing

859
00:54:10,719 --> 00:54:14,320
Speaker 2: God exists and on the other hand, actually having faith

860
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:19,600
Speaker 2: in God's word. That's the issue that It's the issue

861
00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:21,960
Speaker 2: for the Jews, the issue for the Muslim, it's the

862
00:54:22,000 --> 00:54:23,000
Speaker 2: issue for the Christian.

863
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:26,760
Speaker 3: Do you have faith that God means what he says?

864
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:28,600
Speaker 3: And that takes faith.

865
00:54:29,360 --> 00:54:32,719
Speaker 2: I believe God exists, it's a little difficult sometimes to

866
00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:36,400
Speaker 2: believe that God really will work things out in this world.

867
00:54:36,760 --> 00:54:41,239
Speaker 2: It looks too miserable, it looks too messy. That's the

868
00:54:41,360 --> 00:54:43,640
Speaker 2: question in life. And when I read this, I get

869
00:54:43,719 --> 00:54:46,120
Speaker 2: more faith. I told you that this stuff builds my

870
00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:50,400
Speaker 2: own faith. I understand. Now that's the issue. The issue

871
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:53,920
Speaker 2: was he's not an atheist, Abraham. The issue was that

872
00:54:53,960 --> 00:54:55,600
Speaker 2: he believed him. And by the way, God had no

873
00:54:55,680 --> 00:55:02,920
Speaker 2: track record to be believed. That's very important. God has

874
00:55:03,000 --> 00:55:05,520
Speaker 2: a track record. If God came to a Jew today,

875
00:55:06,560 --> 00:55:08,720
Speaker 2: a new Abraham said, you know, listen, I'm gonna promise

876
00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:11,719
Speaker 2: you the following that Jew could say, I believe you

877
00:55:11,880 --> 00:55:13,040
Speaker 2: because listen.

878
00:55:13,520 --> 00:55:17,960
Speaker 3: Three two hundred years of Jews staying alive proves.

879
00:55:17,680 --> 00:55:20,839
Speaker 2: To me that your which we're going to come up to,

880
00:55:21,360 --> 00:55:25,800
Speaker 2: is true. I understand that you're good for your word,

881
00:55:26,400 --> 00:55:29,879
Speaker 2: including the miserable stuff you promised. You're good for your word.

882
00:55:30,600 --> 00:55:34,000
Speaker 2: But Abraham had no basis of saying that. All he

883
00:55:34,080 --> 00:55:36,360
Speaker 2: knows is he's been thrown out of his father's house.

884
00:55:36,719 --> 00:55:39,319
Speaker 2: He was very happy and wealthy. He got thrown out

885
00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:42,640
Speaker 2: of there. He has no more relatives left. He gets

886
00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:47,080
Speaker 2: stuck with Pharaoh, gets embarrassed at the least in Egypt,

887
00:55:47,120 --> 00:55:50,880
Speaker 2: with his wife in bed with the king, is gallivanting

888
00:55:50,920 --> 00:55:54,680
Speaker 2: around the world, ends up having to rescue his nephew,

889
00:55:54,960 --> 00:55:58,320
Speaker 2: whom he couldn't stand to begin with, and in the meantime,

890
00:55:58,360 --> 00:56:00,600
Speaker 2: he's getting older, his wife is getting older, and God

891
00:56:00,719 --> 00:56:03,719
Speaker 2: keeps telling him, you see that's sand, and the next

892
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:04,719
Speaker 2: time you see.

893
00:56:04,520 --> 00:56:07,160
Speaker 3: Those stars, it's a little overkill here.

894
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:10,000
Speaker 2: And he finally says, well, you know, it's all a

895
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:12,920
Speaker 2: little difficult, and then God answered him back, and then

896
00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:16,560
Speaker 2: finally it's clear if he still has faith. That's the issue.

897
00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:19,719
Speaker 2: Do you have faith in God? So God did make

898
00:56:19,719 --> 00:56:23,000
Speaker 2: a promise to you. God did make a promise collectively,

899
00:56:23,800 --> 00:56:27,640
Speaker 2: that's the issue. I believe in God's collective promises. God

900
00:56:27,680 --> 00:56:31,120
Speaker 2: didn't make a promise to Dennis. But I do believe

901
00:56:31,160 --> 00:56:33,480
Speaker 2: that God made a promise to the Jewish people. If

902
00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:35,840
Speaker 2: I didn't believe that, I would not be Jewish, I

903
00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:38,600
Speaker 2: would not stay Jewish after the Holocaust, if I did

904
00:56:38,680 --> 00:56:41,440
Speaker 2: not believe that God were involved with the Jewish people.

905
00:56:42,440 --> 00:56:46,360
Speaker 3: I think it's an interesting decision to stay Jewish after Hitler,

906
00:56:46,719 --> 00:56:48,520
Speaker 3: but it's not a very rational one.

907
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:53,480
Speaker 2: There has to be, in the final analysis, some really

908
00:56:53,480 --> 00:56:57,680
Speaker 2: good reason that you would risk it again, given the

909
00:56:57,719 --> 00:57:01,640
Speaker 2: suffering that is involved often in being a Jew, and.

910
00:57:01,640 --> 00:57:02,520
Speaker 3: That I believe in.

911
00:57:03,040 --> 00:57:06,080
Speaker 2: I do believe, and this, as I say, the studying

912
00:57:06,080 --> 00:57:08,719
Speaker 2: of this increases my belief each time.

913
00:57:10,120 --> 00:57:15,640
Speaker 7: Well, God does say that to him in fifteen six,

914
00:57:16,240 --> 00:57:21,120
Speaker 7: or actually the Torres says it of him.

915
00:57:21,240 --> 00:57:24,040
Speaker 2: Then God said to him, I am the Lord who

916
00:57:24,040 --> 00:57:26,680
Speaker 2: brought you out from or of the Chaldeans to give

917
00:57:26,720 --> 00:57:33,040
Speaker 2: you this land as a possession. And he said, it's interesting.

918
00:57:33,520 --> 00:57:37,280
Speaker 2: He still has questions. Right after he's praised for having

919
00:57:37,320 --> 00:57:42,640
Speaker 2: all this faith. Two verses later, he asks God the following, God,

920
00:57:43,040 --> 00:57:43,560
Speaker 2: how will.

921
00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:47,200
Speaker 3: I know that I am to possess? It? Isn't that interesting?

922
00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:50,360
Speaker 3: I just find you know, it's not.

923
00:57:51,040 --> 00:57:54,320
Speaker 2: These are not snotty questions like some of my callers

924
00:57:54,400 --> 00:57:58,520
Speaker 2: on KBC. You know, it's just it's a very nice

925
00:57:58,560 --> 00:58:02,520
Speaker 2: way of posing the thing. Excuse me, God, how exactly

926
00:58:02,920 --> 00:58:03,200
Speaker 2: will it?

927
00:58:03,240 --> 00:58:04,120
Speaker 3: Will it come about?

928
00:58:04,760 --> 00:58:08,240
Speaker 2: In other words, he posed it not as challenge but

929
00:58:08,360 --> 00:58:09,440
Speaker 2: as curiosity.

930
00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:13,040
Speaker 3: I was just wondering, how is it gonna happen?

931
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:20,640
Speaker 2: So the answer is real helpful, God answered, bring me

932
00:58:20,720 --> 00:58:22,040
Speaker 2: a three year old heifer.

933
00:58:23,320 --> 00:58:26,360
Speaker 3: Maybe that's that's what you call a non sequitur.

934
00:58:28,040 --> 00:58:31,840
Speaker 2: A three year old she goat and a three year

935
00:58:31,840 --> 00:58:34,800
Speaker 2: old ram eternal dove and a young bird.

936
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:39,880
Speaker 3: There are a few moments.

937
00:58:39,560 --> 00:58:42,720
Speaker 2: Like this that a good humorist could make a tremendous

938
00:58:42,760 --> 00:58:47,000
Speaker 2: film without in any way any way departing from the text.

939
00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:48,800
Speaker 3: Another one is with Moses.

940
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:54,120
Speaker 2: Moses, Moses says to God finally at the burning bush,

941
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:58,880
Speaker 2: who are you? What's your name? That's exactly what he asks,

942
00:58:59,840 --> 00:59:05,360
Speaker 2: and God answered, I am who I am? And I

943
00:59:05,480 --> 00:59:10,560
Speaker 2: always imagine at that moment Moses things, Now, I know, Gee,

944
00:59:10,640 --> 00:59:13,160
Speaker 2: that's that's really clear. Thank you very much.

945
00:59:13,680 --> 00:59:19,400
Speaker 3: Just ends the whole issue, and you have this. It's

946
00:59:19,520 --> 00:59:20,720
Speaker 3: exactly the same thing.

947
00:59:20,800 --> 00:59:23,240
Speaker 2: Here. Look, how am I gonna know that I'm gonna

948
00:59:23,240 --> 00:59:24,200
Speaker 2: possess this land?

949
00:59:24,360 --> 00:59:26,920
Speaker 3: I'll tell you how. Bring me a turtle, dove and

950
00:59:27,080 --> 00:59:27,800
Speaker 3: a she goat.

951
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:33,520
Speaker 2: Isn't that terrific? I just had bt Wanity do the

952
00:59:33,600 --> 00:59:34,240
Speaker 2: next verse.

953
00:59:34,480 --> 00:59:39,360
Speaker 3: He brought up all these and cut them into.

954
00:59:39,640 --> 00:59:43,040
Speaker 2: Placing each half opposite the other. But he did not

955
00:59:43,120 --> 00:59:45,919
Speaker 2: cut up the bird. Birds of prey came down upon

956
00:59:45,960 --> 00:59:50,080
Speaker 2: the carcasses, and Abram drove them away. Now, in all seriousness,

957
00:59:51,280 --> 00:59:53,840
Speaker 2: Abram must have known what was about to happen, or

958
00:59:53,880 --> 00:59:54,360
Speaker 2: he would.

959
00:59:54,200 --> 00:59:55,640
Speaker 3: Have truly been confused.

960
00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:59,640
Speaker 2: Because if you ever answered anybody that question, uh, you know, well,

961
00:59:59,680 --> 01:00:01,520
Speaker 2: just bring me a turtle, love and couple of she goats,

962
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:04,760
Speaker 2: they would not understand what you meant. The assumption is

963
01:00:04,800 --> 01:00:10,560
Speaker 2: that Abraham actually did that These were These were ways

964
01:00:10,640 --> 01:00:14,640
Speaker 2: in which major religious deals, as.

965
01:00:14,600 --> 01:00:18,040
Speaker 3: It were, were cut in the old days, very old days,

966
01:00:18,520 --> 01:00:19,520
Speaker 3: in the age world.

967
01:00:19,800 --> 01:00:23,560
Speaker 2: In other words, he knew something was about to happen.

968
01:00:25,800 --> 01:00:26,520
Speaker 3: As the sun was.

969
01:00:26,520 --> 01:00:29,320
Speaker 2: About to set, A deep sleep fell upon Abram, you

970
01:00:29,360 --> 01:00:34,960
Speaker 2: see again, and a great dark dread descended upon him.

971
01:00:35,440 --> 01:00:38,440
Speaker 3: He was in fear for good reason.

972
01:00:39,680 --> 01:00:43,160
Speaker 2: And God said to Abram, know well that your offspring

973
01:00:43,200 --> 01:00:45,960
Speaker 2: shall be strangers in a land not theirs.

974
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:48,000
Speaker 3: Right.

975
01:00:48,800 --> 01:00:52,280
Speaker 2: We're talking of course about Egypt, and they will be

976
01:00:52,480 --> 01:00:58,080
Speaker 2: enslaved and oppressed four hundred years. But I will execute

977
01:00:58,240 --> 01:01:02,440
Speaker 2: judgment on the nation they shall serve, and in the

978
01:01:02,560 --> 01:01:07,360
Speaker 2: end they will go free with great wealth. As for you,

979
01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:11,400
Speaker 2: because you know there is an element of that, he

980
01:01:11,520 --> 01:01:14,360
Speaker 2: was wondering, how am I involved in all of this?

981
01:01:14,640 --> 01:01:18,360
Speaker 2: As for you, you shall go to your father's in peace.

982
01:01:19,640 --> 01:01:23,200
Speaker 2: You will be buried at a ripe old age, and

983
01:01:23,240 --> 01:01:27,080
Speaker 2: they shall return here. That is your descendants in the

984
01:01:27,160 --> 01:01:31,560
Speaker 2: fourth generation. For the iniquity of the Amorites is not

985
01:01:31,720 --> 01:01:39,600
Speaker 2: yet complete. It's a very important statement. The jew who

986
01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:40,560
Speaker 2: are the Amorites?

987
01:01:40,840 --> 01:01:42,960
Speaker 3: One of the people living in Canan.

988
01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:48,360
Speaker 2: I am not going to kick out those people until

989
01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:53,200
Speaker 2: they deserve to be You Jews cannot come into the

990
01:01:53,240 --> 01:01:59,000
Speaker 2: Holy Land and dispossess innocent people. You will have to

991
01:01:59,080 --> 01:02:02,200
Speaker 2: wait till they're miserable enough to deserve it.

992
01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:09,320
Speaker 3: And that's a very important moral lesson. Even though you

993
01:02:09,400 --> 01:02:11,840
Speaker 3: are my chosen people and I have this great mission

994
01:02:11,880 --> 01:02:15,560
Speaker 3: to humanity, I can't I God can't do an immoral

995
01:02:15,640 --> 01:02:17,720
Speaker 3: act for a greater moral purpose.

996
01:02:18,240 --> 01:02:21,760
Speaker 2: I can't this possess innocent people from the land to

997
01:02:21,880 --> 01:02:25,960
Speaker 2: make my holy people in the land. You understand how

998
01:02:26,000 --> 01:02:32,320
Speaker 2: important that is. You can't do sinful things for greater goods.

999
01:02:33,800 --> 01:02:36,280
Speaker 2: It's one of the greatest possible.

1000
01:02:35,880 --> 01:02:38,800
Speaker 3: Lessons in life. That's Lenin's old.

1001
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:44,680
Speaker 2: Line when making the Russian Revolution the Bolshevik revolution. In

1002
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:47,120
Speaker 2: order to what is it, in order to make on,

1003
01:02:47,320 --> 01:02:51,440
Speaker 2: let's see, you gotta break eggs. So the eggs were

1004
01:02:51,480 --> 01:02:56,880
Speaker 2: people break people for the greater progress of Soviet society.

1005
01:02:57,560 --> 01:02:58,760
Speaker 3: Uh huh.

1006
01:02:59,160 --> 01:03:02,200
Speaker 2: When the Amorites are bad and in any event would

1007
01:03:02,240 --> 01:03:05,000
Speaker 2: self destruct as bad nations do self.

1008
01:03:04,680 --> 01:03:09,200
Speaker 3: Destruct, that we know from history, then you'll go in

1009
01:03:09,440 --> 01:03:10,720
Speaker 3: and not until them.

1010
01:03:11,200 --> 01:03:15,800
Speaker 2: This obviously was not for Abram Abram. This was not

1011
01:03:15,840 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 2: an issue for him. This is an issue for us.

1012
01:03:19,520 --> 01:03:24,440
Speaker 2: This line was for Jews later, much later than Abram,

1013
01:03:24,720 --> 01:03:28,880
Speaker 2: to understand what the moral element of going into the

1014
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:34,520
Speaker 2: Promised Land is about. You can't dispossess innocent people, and

1015
01:03:34,600 --> 01:03:37,640
Speaker 2: there are a lot of contemporary things.

1016
01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:40,320
Speaker 3: To be learned from that. I dare say, but I.

1017
01:03:40,240 --> 01:03:43,320
Speaker 2: Don't want to get into the most sensitive issue in

1018
01:03:43,400 --> 01:03:50,480
Speaker 2: Jewish life, because it is just not germane right now, Okay,

1019
01:03:51,200 --> 01:03:51,600
Speaker 2: when the.

1020
01:03:51,560 --> 01:03:53,160
Speaker 3: Sun set it was very dark.

1021
01:03:53,200 --> 01:03:57,439
Speaker 2: There appeared a smoking oven and a flaming torch which

1022
01:03:57,520 --> 01:04:00,920
Speaker 2: passed between those pieces, the pieces of the animals that

1023
01:04:00,960 --> 01:04:01,720
Speaker 2: he had cut.

1024
01:04:01,520 --> 01:04:03,840
Speaker 3: Up on that day.

1025
01:04:03,920 --> 01:04:09,040
Speaker 2: The Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, to your offspring,

1026
01:04:09,120 --> 01:04:12,280
Speaker 2: I give this land from the River of Egypt, that's

1027
01:04:12,320 --> 01:04:16,720
Speaker 2: the Nile, to the great river, the River Euphrates.

1028
01:04:16,560 --> 01:04:18,720
Speaker 3: Which is of course in modern Iraq.

1029
01:04:20,080 --> 01:04:23,360
Speaker 2: That's the land given to the Jews thro Abraham, to

1030
01:04:23,400 --> 01:04:28,120
Speaker 2: the Jews, from the Nile to the Euphrates, which is

1031
01:04:28,120 --> 01:04:29,520
Speaker 2: of course vaster.

1032
01:04:30,600 --> 01:04:33,240
Speaker 3: Than Israel w or without a west.

1033
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:38,200
Speaker 2: Bank, even with Jordan, the Canaites, the Kenesites, the Cammanites,

1034
01:04:38,240 --> 01:04:42,160
Speaker 2: the Hittites, the Perizites, the Rifaim, the Ammorites, the Cannonites,

1035
01:04:42,200 --> 01:04:44,480
Speaker 2: the Gegashites, and the Jebusides.

1036
01:04:44,520 --> 01:04:48,360
Speaker 3: Those were the nations living there. One word on this

1037
01:04:48,440 --> 01:04:51,439
Speaker 3: and then and with this all conclude, we'll just have.

1038
01:04:51,360 --> 01:04:54,360
Speaker 2: To pick up at chapter of Perfect the Works that

1039
01:04:54,520 --> 01:05:15,560
Speaker 2: chapter sixteen, in verse eighteen, God makes a convenant. This

1040
01:05:15,640 --> 01:05:19,000
Speaker 2: is called the Convenant of the Pieces, brief the Inhabitant

1041
01:05:19,480 --> 01:05:20,000
Speaker 2: in Hebrew.

1042
01:05:20,840 --> 01:05:23,560
Speaker 3: This is the first covenant God makes with the Jews.

1043
01:05:23,960 --> 01:05:29,280
Speaker 2: It is the second covenant God makes with humanity. Remember

1044
01:05:29,320 --> 01:05:33,520
Speaker 2: the first covenant with the Rainbow, that I make a

1045
01:05:33,560 --> 01:05:36,160
Speaker 2: covenant that I won't destroy the world again.

1046
01:05:36,400 --> 01:05:39,280
Speaker 3: Okay, it's an interesting.

1047
01:05:38,880 --> 01:05:43,280
Speaker 2: Point that is raised by a plout here which I

1048
01:05:43,320 --> 01:05:50,360
Speaker 2: would like to read to you. In a society in

1049
01:05:50,400 --> 01:05:53,800
Speaker 2: which the capriciousness of the gods was taken for granted,

1050
01:05:53,880 --> 01:05:59,280
Speaker 2: writes not Sarna, the Covenant between the Pieces, like the

1051
01:05:59,360 --> 01:06:04,480
Speaker 2: Covenant with Noah, set religion on a bold, new, independent course.

1052
01:06:06,880 --> 01:06:12,320
Speaker 2: Do you understand why the gods of the world acted capriciously?

1053
01:06:12,960 --> 01:06:15,600
Speaker 2: They did what they want, just like people do what

1054
01:06:15,640 --> 01:06:20,480
Speaker 2: they want. People are generally unpredictable. If you or worse,

1055
01:06:21,040 --> 01:06:25,160
Speaker 2: they're predictable, you bribe them, they'll do this what did

1056
01:06:25,320 --> 01:06:27,000
Speaker 2: ancient people do with their gods.

1057
01:06:27,040 --> 01:06:29,040
Speaker 3: They bribe them.

1058
01:06:29,240 --> 01:06:35,240
Speaker 2: Sacrifices were bribes much more than they were thanks or

1059
01:06:35,320 --> 01:06:36,320
Speaker 2: sin offerings.

1060
01:06:36,920 --> 01:06:39,760
Speaker 3: They were bribes. I'll give you this, so you give

1061
01:06:39,800 --> 01:06:42,600
Speaker 3: me this. Okay. That was the way they were.

1062
01:06:44,040 --> 01:06:47,720
Speaker 2: What Sarna is saying and Cloud brings here is brilliantly

1063
01:06:48,480 --> 01:06:54,360
Speaker 2: a covenant means notis no matter what you do, this

1064
01:06:54,640 --> 01:07:00,960
Speaker 2: is what I God promise. I promise you I am predictable.

1065
01:07:01,360 --> 01:07:05,320
Speaker 2: I'm telling you right now, to you, Noah, I will

1066
01:07:05,360 --> 01:07:09,240
Speaker 2: never destroy the world again. To you, Abraham, I am

1067
01:07:09,280 --> 01:07:14,680
Speaker 2: telling you, no matter how you act, your children act,

1068
01:07:14,800 --> 01:07:17,840
Speaker 2: it will not affect the fact that I will make

1069
01:07:17,960 --> 01:07:22,600
Speaker 2: you a big people and give you this land. Okay,

1070
01:07:23,280 --> 01:07:28,600
Speaker 2: are you with me? That's predictability. That's a covenant. However,

1071
01:07:29,120 --> 01:07:33,680
Speaker 2: the uniqueness of this covenant, is will say, is that

1072
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:38,880
Speaker 2: there are no obligations on man. These first two covenants,

1073
01:07:39,040 --> 01:07:41,920
Speaker 2: unlike later covenants with the Jews, which make demands on

1074
01:07:41,960 --> 01:07:45,400
Speaker 2: the Jews, are only demands upon God.

1075
01:07:46,400 --> 01:07:49,200
Speaker 3: Abraham doesn't have to do a thing. Noah didn't have

1076
01:07:49,240 --> 01:07:49,840
Speaker 3: to do a thing.

1077
01:07:51,800 --> 01:07:56,080
Speaker 2: Both convenants have one outstanding feature in common. They obligate

1078
01:07:56,160 --> 01:08:00,800
Speaker 2: God but demand nothing of man. In contradistinction to many

1079
01:08:00,880 --> 01:08:05,080
Speaker 2: later references to brit By the way, when a Jewish

1080
01:08:05,480 --> 01:08:09,919
Speaker 2: boy baby on the eighth day has a brisk which

1081
01:08:10,000 --> 01:08:13,400
Speaker 2: is or brit that doesn't mean circumcision.

1082
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:17,559
Speaker 3: It means covenant. It's too bad it's called let's go

1083
01:08:17,600 --> 01:08:19,679
Speaker 3: to the circumcision. It should be let's.

1084
01:08:19,440 --> 01:08:22,280
Speaker 2: Go to the covenant when we speak in English, because

1085
01:08:22,320 --> 01:08:27,080
Speaker 2: in Hebrew, Grit means covenant, Grit me law means covenant

1086
01:08:27,080 --> 01:08:32,160
Speaker 2: of the circumcision. That's the whole term there. But that's

1087
01:08:32,200 --> 01:08:34,639
Speaker 2: what it is, that's the convenant. That's why it's such

1088
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:39,799
Speaker 2: a big deal. Contradistinction to many later references to Britain,

1089
01:08:39,840 --> 01:08:42,920
Speaker 2: in which God's covenant with Israel has made dependent on

1090
01:08:43,120 --> 01:08:48,800
Speaker 2: Israel's continued faithfulness. The Bible here makes God's commitment unconditional.

1091
01:08:49,880 --> 01:08:53,160
Speaker 2: Not only has God created a physical universe, it's a

1092
01:08:53,200 --> 01:08:57,639
Speaker 2: beautiful point. Not only has God created a physical universe

1093
01:08:57,720 --> 01:09:03,280
Speaker 2: with immutable laws, non changeable laws, he has established conditions

1094
01:09:03,320 --> 01:09:09,000
Speaker 2: for an unchanging spiritual world as well.

1095
01:09:09,240 --> 01:09:10,320
Speaker 3: That's what's being said.

1096
01:09:10,360 --> 01:09:13,960
Speaker 2: I made a law with unchanging physical laws and unchanging

1097
01:09:14,040 --> 01:09:19,360
Speaker 2: spiritual laws, and I might add unchanging moral laws. He

1098
01:09:19,479 --> 01:09:23,479
Speaker 2: is a faithful God, faithful in his natural as well

1099
01:09:23,520 --> 01:09:29,479
Speaker 2: as trans natural manifestations, and unlike the pagan deities whose

1100
01:09:29,600 --> 01:09:34,960
Speaker 2: universes were unpredictable and erratic, God shows himself in the

1101
01:09:35,000 --> 01:09:37,640
Speaker 2: Covenant between the pieces to be an il nam On,

1102
01:09:38,479 --> 01:09:44,040
Speaker 2: a God who is both dependable and trustworthy. No such

1103
01:09:44,120 --> 01:09:50,439
Speaker 2: religious covenant is known outside of Israel. This is another unique,

1104
01:09:51,240 --> 01:09:57,360
Speaker 2: unique means Uno only it never happened outside this concept

1105
01:09:57,439 --> 01:10:01,080
Speaker 2: of the covenant. What the Jews obligations are we'll talk

1106
01:10:01,080 --> 01:10:02,040
Speaker 2: about next time.

1107
01:10:01,880 --> 01:10:02,479
Speaker 3: When we talk.

1108
01:10:03,000 --> 01:10:07,400
Speaker 2: When we will later talk about covenant, it'll be embellished,

1109
01:10:07,840 --> 01:10:08,200
Speaker 2: but I.

1110
01:10:08,160 --> 01:10:10,840
Speaker 3: Will explain that next time. We go to chapter sixteen.

1111
01:10:11,280 --> 01:10:13,120
Speaker 3: Thank you, Enjoy your summer.

1112
01:10:16,080 --> 01:10:20,400
Speaker 1: This has been timeless wisdom with Dennis Brager. Visit Dennisprager

1113
01:10:20,439 --> 01:10:24,000
Speaker 1: dot com for thousands of hours of Dennis's lectures, courses

1114
01:10:24,000 --> 01:10:28,640
Speaker 1: in classic radio programs, and to purchase Dennis Prager's Rational Bibles.