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Speaker 1: Welcome to Christian Parent Crazy World, the podcast that tackles

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Speaker 1: tough topics to help you be a godly parent in

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Speaker 1: an ungodly world. I am your host, Catherine Seekers, and

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Speaker 1: in today's episode, we will tackle this vitally important question.

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Speaker 1: What story is shaping your child's life and do they

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Speaker 1: know that they're living inside of God's story? Because here's

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Speaker 1: the reality. Our kids are surrounded by competing narratives. The

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Speaker 1: world tells them their identity is something they create, their

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Speaker 1: worth is something they can earn. Their purpose is something

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Speaker 1: they have to figure out on their own. And when

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Speaker 1: they believe that story, it can leave them anxious, untethered,

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Speaker 1: and searching for meaning in all the wrong places. But

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Speaker 1: scripture tells us a different story, a bigger story, a

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Speaker 1: story that begins with a God who created them on purpose,

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Speaker 1: who loves them deeply, and who invites them to be

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Speaker 1: a part of something eternal. The question is do we

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Speaker 1: as parents understand that story well enough to help our

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Speaker 1: kids live in it. Today I'm joined by Randy and

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Speaker 1: Roseanne Frasey, authors of Encountering God's Love from Genesis to Revelation.

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Speaker 1: They're going to help us see how the entire Bible

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Speaker 1: fits together as one beautiful love story and how our

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Speaker 1: kids can find their place in it. That's the plan

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Speaker 1: for this episode of Christian Parent Crazy World. You know,

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Speaker 1: if we're honest, many of us as parents grew up

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Speaker 1: knowing Bible stories, but not necessarily knowing the Bible's story.

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Speaker 1: We know about Noah in the Arc, David and Goliath,

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Speaker 1: Daniel in the lions Den, but they often feel like

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Speaker 1: disconnected lessons, moral stories about being brave, being obedient, being good.

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Speaker 1: And when faith becomes nothing more than a list of

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Speaker 1: stories or a set of rules, it's fragile because the

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Speaker 1: moment our kids face real suffering or real doubt, real

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Speaker 1: cultural pressure, a handful of disconnected stories isn't enough to

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Speaker 1: hold them steady. What they need, and what we need,

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Speaker 1: is to understand that Christianity is not primarily about rules.

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Speaker 1: It's about a reality. It's about a God who has

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Speaker 1: been writing one continuous story from the very beginning of time,

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Speaker 1: a story of creation and fall, of rescue and redemption

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Speaker 1: of love that refuses to give up. And here's why

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Speaker 1: this matters so much for us parents. When our kids

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Speaker 1: understand that story, they understand themselves. And that's exactly why

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Speaker 1: today's conversation matters. Our guests are Randy and Roseanne Phrasy.

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Speaker 1: They have spent decades helping people understand scripture not as

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Speaker 1: disconnected pieces, but as one unified, life changing story. Randy

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Speaker 1: is a pastor, an author, and visionary leader who has

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Speaker 1: helped countless churches engage scripture in deeper and more transformative ways.

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Speaker 1: Roseanne is an author and a speaker with a deep

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Speaker 1: passion for helping people, especially women, understand the depth of

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Speaker 1: God's love and their place in his story. Together, they

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Speaker 1: have written Encountering God's Love from Genesis to Revelation, which

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Speaker 1: is a powerful guide to help readers see the Bible

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Speaker 1: as it was meant to be seen, as one beautiful,

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Speaker 1: cohesive story about God's relife less love. Now, just a

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Speaker 1: special note here if you missed last week's episode with

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Speaker 1: Randy and Roseanne, be sure to check that one out.

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Speaker 1: That conversation about the ways are simple everyday actions and

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Speaker 1: parenting affect the faith of our kids, Well, all I

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Speaker 1: can say about it is wow. It challenged me more

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Speaker 1: than any conversation I've ever had on CPCW and it

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Speaker 1: was completely unplanned. That one was Holy spirit driven all

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Speaker 1: the way, So definitely check that out. But today's conversation,

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Speaker 1: it's going to challenge us in a different way. It's

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Speaker 1: going to challenge us to rise above the difficulties of

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Speaker 1: our everyday lives to see the story that God is

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Speaker 1: writing and how you and I and our children fit

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Speaker 1: in it. So with that said, let's jump right in.

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Speaker 1: Randy and Roseanne, welcome back to Christian parent Crazy World.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for having us again.

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Speaker 3: Yes, let's do it again.

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Speaker 1: Yes, we had such a rich and nourishing conversation last

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Speaker 1: last episode, very unexpected. We just took a holy spirit

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Speaker 1: turn into the idea of the spiritual disciplines, particularly focusing

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Speaker 1: around meal times and things that we can do to

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Speaker 1: really nourish our kid's spirits as well as their bodies.

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Speaker 1: And a lot of stuff came out in that, and

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Speaker 1: you had all of the great practical advice there, Roseanne

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Speaker 1: and Randy, you had a lot of that scientific advice

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Speaker 1: about what is actually happening and also unpacking spiritually what's happening.

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Speaker 1: The concept that I'm still like my mind is a

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Speaker 1: little blown about the concept that at every meal something

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Speaker 1: had to die so that we could live. That was

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Speaker 1: such a rich conversation thank you so much for it.

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Speaker 1: But today we want to turn our attention to your book.

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Speaker 1: You have an incredible new book out Encountering God's Love

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Speaker 1: from Genesis to Revelation. We're going to talk about that

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Speaker 1: for anyone who might have missed last week's episode, and

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Speaker 1: if you did.

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Speaker 4: Please go back and check it out.

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Speaker 1: Just briefly introduce yourself, tell us a little bit about yourself,

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Speaker 1: and we'll jump into talking about this incredible revelation you

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Speaker 1: have in this book.

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Speaker 2: Today we see, well, we have been married for forty

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Speaker 2: four years and we have four children and five grandchildren.

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Speaker 2: We live between San Antonio and Kansas City, and that's

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Speaker 2: because my husband is now become pastor. Emeredis at our church,

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Speaker 2: west Side Family Church in Lenexa, Kansas, and we travel

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Speaker 2: quite a bit, mostly for work and also to see

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Speaker 2: our grandkids who live in DC. So we're kind of busy.

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Speaker 3: But love and life resented. And I met at a

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Speaker 3: a church and we got married early, had the four children,

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Speaker 3: and my pickup line to her because at fifteen a

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Speaker 3: guy came in the church lobby. I didn't have parents

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Speaker 3: who went to church, and he said, Randy, you'd make

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Speaker 3: a good pastor and I just had never had anybody

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Speaker 3: speak into my life in that way, and so I'm like,

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Speaker 3: you think I can do that? Anyhow, I kind of

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Speaker 3: locked and loaded that that's what I'm going to do.

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Speaker 3: That's the vision that this man poured into me. So

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Speaker 3: when Rosanne's family came to the church six months later

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Speaker 3: and she's beautiful pick my pickup line to her was

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Speaker 3: I'm going to be a man of God. I'm going

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Speaker 3: to be a pastor. And she says, well, I don't.

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Speaker 3: I don't want to marry a pastor. I'm like, how

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Speaker 3: did this backfire? Her dad was at the previous church,

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Speaker 3: was on the board, and he was really sympathetic toward pastors.

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Speaker 3: And so Sunday afternoon, the pastor and his wife were over.

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Speaker 3: The church members were being ornery and picking on the

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Speaker 3: wife maybe she worked too much makeup, and Rosanne just

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Speaker 3: remembers her crying most of the time at her parents' house. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: I convinced her. I convinced her that it's going to

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Speaker 3: be okay. And so, you know, we have been in ministry.

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Speaker 3: You know, we went to undergraduate and seminary and became

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Speaker 3: I became a pastor at the age of twenty eight

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Speaker 3: and had been doing it for I did it for

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Speaker 3: thirty six years as a lead pastor in four churches

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Speaker 3: and now pastor Meredith and help some other churches and

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Speaker 3: consult it. That's kind of our life, including writing some

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Speaker 3: books every now and again.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, ah, great pickup line, backfired up.

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Speaker 3: It was so original, Cathy, and I mean everyone else

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Speaker 3: goes like, hey, you know the mindset, I'm going to

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Speaker 3: be a man of God and.

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Speaker 4: Good luck with that.

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Speaker 3: I thought, this is a dead ringer. It's in church

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Speaker 3: for ChRI and it's like I was at a bar,

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Speaker 3: were at church. This is what every girl in church

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Speaker 3: wants to hear.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I just wanted a Christian boyfriend. I didn't want

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Speaker 2: the pastor.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but you came around. You came around.

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Speaker 1: That I came That's awesome. Okay, So I'd like to

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Speaker 1: start here. What first stirred your passion for helping people

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Speaker 1: to see the Bible not not as a series of

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Speaker 1: disconnected stories, but as one unified story of God's love.

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Speaker 3: I'll start with them when if you was in and

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Speaker 3: then I'll let you. Yeah. I mean, because I really

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Speaker 3: remember distinctly, I was pastoring a church in the downaspt

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Speaker 3: Worth area. I was twenty eight years old. It was

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Speaker 3: a Bible church, Catherine, so in its name it signified

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Speaker 3: that we're going to teach you the Bible. But progressively

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Speaker 3: people did not know the story of the Bible. They

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Speaker 3: really just did not know the story of the Bible.

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Speaker 3: And it just seems to me, if you're going to

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Speaker 3: be in church for even a year, let alone twenty years,

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Speaker 3: you should be able to stand up and talk from

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Speaker 3: Genesis all the way to Revelation, not in great detail,

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Speaker 3: but then the fact it's one story. Many people thought

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Speaker 3: the Gospels began in the Gospel of Matthew. You like, no,

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Speaker 3: you're not, no idea. And then later on I talked

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Speaker 3: to a gentleman as a professor at LL Seminary where

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Speaker 3: I graduated from, who confessed that he was working on

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Speaker 3: his PhD program and they later became the president of

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Speaker 3: the seminary. He said, it wasn't until I took on

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Speaker 3: being a teacher for walk through the Bible. And I'm

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Speaker 3: a PhD student, but I actually walked through the chronology

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Speaker 3: of the Bible. I'm like, Okay, if this guy, with

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Speaker 3: all the hours he's put in can't do that, then

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Speaker 3: what's the chance that our people. And I remember trying

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Speaker 3: to get people through the scripture, and so one year

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Speaker 3: I would do, hey, we're all going to read through

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Speaker 3: the Bible together, but it's in, you know, just a

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Speaker 3: straight up Bible, Old Testament reading straight through or Old

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Speaker 3: Testament New Testaments all. And I realized that that was

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Speaker 3: like reading your favorite novelist, like mine's Robert Ludlam, the

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Speaker 3: Bourne Identity series. You know, they're five hundred pages and

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Speaker 3: it's like starting in page thirty four and then jump

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Speaker 3: into three forty five. I mean, it would be very

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Speaker 3: difficult to understand that. And so then I tried to an

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Speaker 3: abridge chronology of the Bible, and again a couple of

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Speaker 3: people that are green Berets got through it. But then

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Speaker 3: what ended up happening as my publisher, which is HarperCollins,

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Speaker 3: it was just Soondervan at the time, came and brought

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Speaker 3: a new tool that they developed called the Story. It's

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Speaker 3: an abridged chronology of the Bible. Not intended to be

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Speaker 3: a Bible, intended to be a gateway to the Bible

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Speaker 3: where people could actually see the one story of the Bible.

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Speaker 3: And I said, this is what I've been looking for

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Speaker 3: they took out all the chapters and verses and someone

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Speaker 3: listening because your people are super smart, you know, so

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Speaker 3: it says you can't take out the chapters and verses, Well, sweetheart,

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Speaker 3: they weren't actually there. We put them in. We put

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Speaker 3: those in. We put those in by the massoretics and

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Speaker 3: like twelve hundred and eighty, so it's okay, and we

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Speaker 3: just took them out. And you know, we just we

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Speaker 3: just created a flow in thirty one chapters. We call

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Speaker 3: like a novel experience. And so they created it. I said, hey, listen,

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Speaker 3: I can improve it, and I would like to build

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Speaker 3: community around it. I'd like this to be an entire

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Speaker 3: church campaign, and so that's what I did. I did

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Speaker 3: thirty one videos on it, thirty one sermons on it,

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Speaker 3: We did a student version with videos, we did three

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Speaker 3: children's versions on it with children's curriculum, and we launched

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Speaker 3: it and it's just been eye opening for people. So

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Speaker 3: you know, that's when I realized, so we published it.

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Speaker 3: So we did it.

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Speaker 2: I did.

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Speaker 3: I did it originally just for to serve the people

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Speaker 3: that I was serving. It just happened that I ended

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Speaker 3: up shifting churches and so I was just at a

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Speaker 3: conference yesterday in Dallas. Of the seventy churches that were

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Speaker 3: seventy seven churches that were represented, I think seventy of

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Speaker 3: them have gone through this as a Bible engagement campaign.

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Speaker 5: Wow.

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Speaker 3: It was really quite astounding. And so that's where it

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Speaker 3: really dawned on me that people don't. People think the

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Speaker 3: Bible is a story. They can't tell it. And if

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Speaker 3: they can't tell it, it's really hard for them to

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Speaker 3: see that there's still a character in it. So Razann Ghibbee,

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Speaker 3: you have your own insighted too.

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Speaker 2: That One of the things that I loved because it

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Speaker 2: was a churchwide campaign as a parent was my children

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Speaker 2: were talking about the same thing in their Sunday school

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Speaker 2: class that I was hearing in church. And my students,

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Speaker 2: no matter what age, we were all hearing the same thing,

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Speaker 2: and it enhanced when we got in the car. Normally

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Speaker 2: I would say, hey, what'd you learn on Sunday school?

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Speaker 2: And they say all about Jesus, you know, But all

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Speaker 2: of a sudden we were talking about well, we talked

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Speaker 2: about Joseph and we could have a conversation about what

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Speaker 2: we were studying together. It really gave me an invaluable

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Speaker 2: tool as a mom to be able to talk to

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Speaker 2: my kids about what they were learning and go a

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Speaker 2: step further with them, right. Does that makes sense?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, oh totally. You're all on the same page. And

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Speaker 1: that's part of something that we do in classical learning

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Speaker 1: a lot is that you'll have kids of different levels,

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Speaker 1: different age groups. You might be digging into it a

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Speaker 1: lot deeper, obviously as an adult than you would as

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Speaker 1: a child. You know what this reminds me of, though,

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Speaker 1: Our favorite Bible to this day, even though my kids

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Speaker 1: are a good bit older, is the Jesus Storybook Bible,

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Speaker 1: which it's probably written to where a four or five

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Speaker 1: year old can receive it. And my youngest kid right

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Speaker 1: now is nine, just turned nine a couple days go.

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Speaker 1: And then I've got an eleven year old and a

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Speaker 1: sixteen year old and soon to be eighteen and twenty one.

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Speaker 1: But those younger kids, you know, we have our Bible

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Speaker 1: time in the morning and we still.

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Speaker 4: We tore that Bible up.

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Speaker 1: So we didn't mean to tear it up, we just

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Speaker 1: used it so much that we had to replace it

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Speaker 1: last year and we're still reading it. They still bring

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Speaker 1: it to me to read it, even though it's written

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Speaker 1: to where a four or five year old could understand it.

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Speaker 1: The reason why I bring it up is if any

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Speaker 1: of my listeners haven't used that with their kids. That is,

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Speaker 1: it's one unified story from in the beginning, exactly in

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Speaker 1: the beginning, God created, and you see in each and

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Speaker 1: every story, and they do she does it masterfully. You

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Speaker 1: see it pointing towards Christ. It's all about that redemption

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Speaker 1: in Christ. And so I'm guessing that what you're doing

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Speaker 1: is just unpacking that a good bit more.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, for a whole year.

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Speaker 3: I recommend to people that don't know the Bible to

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Speaker 3: pick up the same Jesustur book Bible. If you have kids,

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Speaker 3: read it to your kids, and that'll be you. That'll

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Speaker 3: be your primer to getting into the chronology of the Bible.

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Speaker 3: So that's really step one. Now, if you want to

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Speaker 3: take it to another level but still make it accessible.

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Speaker 3: You know, there's a statistic because what was aanswying we

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Speaker 3: have three two degrees of integration and you know, very

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Speaker 3: soldom to speak to an audience that gets education as

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Speaker 3: much as you're listener, So so this will be like duh.

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Speaker 3: But for most people I talk to, it's like in

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Speaker 3: this program, you know, usually at churches they're all doing

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Speaker 3: something different, everybody's doing something different. But in this thirty

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Speaker 3: one weeks, the church commits we're going to go through

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Speaker 3: the Bible together in chronological order, and for everybody, there's

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Speaker 3: going to be a monologue experience, you know, that's the

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Speaker 3: sermon or the children's Also there's going to be a

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Speaker 3: dialogue experience that's this small group experience or the family experience.

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Speaker 3: And then there's going to be a personal time of

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Speaker 3: studying and reading. Okay, and then and then in addition,

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Speaker 3: we're going to have all of the adults, all the students,

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Speaker 3: and all the children of all ages going. So thirty

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Speaker 3: one weeks with this sort of double in integration at

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Speaker 3: three levels, it's just magnificent. So one of the things

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Speaker 3: that motivated me to really turn this book, which, by

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Speaker 3: the way, Catherine, when it first came out and Zonderman

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Speaker 3: had this huge high hope for this book, I mean

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Speaker 3: they put they threw everything at it, and it just

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Speaker 3: didn't sell very well. But then when we came along

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Speaker 3: and added this communal element, it changed everything. In this

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Speaker 3: multiple levels of integration, and just real quick, you know,

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Speaker 3: there's a stat I read years ago long time ago

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Speaker 3: now about creating good habits or breaking bad habits. And

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Speaker 3: so in terms of breaking bad habits, if you want

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Speaker 3: to quit smoking and you try to do it on

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Speaker 3: your own, your statistical chances of success are zero. If

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Speaker 3: you add a tool like a nicotine patch, your chances

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Speaker 3: inch up to five percent. But if with that tool

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Speaker 3: you add community, your chances skyrocket to forty percent. And

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Speaker 3: the same thing is true with people understanding the one

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Speaker 3: love story of God. It's overwhelming to most people. Research

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Speaker 3: shows that most people have reading through the Bible on

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Speaker 3: their bucket list, right up there with climbing Mount Everest

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Speaker 3: or dropping out of an airplane. They find those two

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Speaker 3: more accessible than reading through the Bible. So this communal experience,

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Speaker 3: which I think again is really good in homeschool and

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Speaker 3: classical education. The idea that you take a subject and

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Speaker 3: people are doing it at different stages, but you're on

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Speaker 3: the same subject. There's a real amazing dynamic to that.

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Speaker 3: And by the way, the sales of all of the products,

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Speaker 3: including the stories, I think past ten million now. It

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Speaker 3: was five thousand and it's now past ten million. So

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Speaker 3: anybody out there is into publishing, you know that that's

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Speaker 3: a big number.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that is a very big number.

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Speaker 4: Wow, congratulations on that.

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Speaker 1: And to tie that back into what we were talking

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Speaker 1: about in the last episode, it's perfect conversation to break

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Speaker 1: down some of that stuff and our meal times, right,

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Speaker 1: we could actually have those conversations about some of the

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Speaker 1: things that we're reading in the Bible.

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Speaker 4: Because you said one of the things we do is

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Speaker 4: what did you do today?

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Speaker 1: Well, I was reading this in the Bible, So it

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Speaker 1: would be really incredible way to subject matter for our

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Speaker 1: meal times.

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Speaker 4: But I love this, I absolutely love this. And also

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Speaker 4: one other thing that.

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Speaker 1: I loved about the Jesus Storybook Bible. You guys probably

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Speaker 1: don't know this, but I have my MA and communications

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Speaker 1: in theater. I love how three theatrical that is written.

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Speaker 1: And so we sit down and it just takes a

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Speaker 1: few minutes, but I am I am really excited about

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Speaker 1: the idea of sitting down and doing this that's much

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Speaker 1: deeper because it does only go so deep there, and

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Speaker 1: this gives you the time to really unpack it and

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Speaker 1: really have a thorough understanding and knowledge of scripture in

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Speaker 1: a way that has that through line all the way throughout.

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Speaker 1: So we've talked about the what it is, and a

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Speaker 1: little bit of the why.

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Speaker 4: But let's unpack that just a little bit more.

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Speaker 1: Why, then, is it so important for us to understand

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Speaker 1: the Bible is one cohesive story and not just as

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Speaker 1: these individual lessons or characters.

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Speaker 4: What's the deep why behind that?

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Speaker 2: There is a huge why behind that. I grew up

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Speaker 2: in the church, so I heard the Bible stories one

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Speaker 2: at a time each week, and know that they were

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Speaker 2: probably teaching them progressively. But I was probably a teenager

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Speaker 2: before I realized that Joseph, like the Coat of many Colors,

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Speaker 2: was the Joseph in Egypt that saved them from the famine.

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Speaker 2: And somewhere along the road in Randy's teaching of the story,

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Speaker 2: the first time he went through, he uncovered through the

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Speaker 2: through that story of Joseph, that there is something more

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Speaker 2: going on than just what's happening in Joseph's what we

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Speaker 2: call the lower story life. It's like our glory story

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Speaker 2: life is taking the making the kids lunch, getting them

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Speaker 2: to school, cooking dinner, going to the store, going to work.

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Speaker 2: But there's more going on that Joseph actually captured. There

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Speaker 2: was an upper story, or God's story going on, an

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Speaker 2: overarching story that was happening. And we know that this

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Speaker 2: that he somehow captured this because at the end of

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Speaker 2: his life, through all the ups and downs he went through,

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Speaker 2: he says, what you meant for evil, God meant for good.

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Speaker 2: That's one of the times he says it. And he

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Speaker 2: understood that while his brothers treated him horribly, God was

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Speaker 2: working in his grand story to protect Israel and the

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Speaker 2: future plan that God had to use Israel to bring

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Speaker 2: us Jesus the Savior.

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Speaker 4: Yes, I love that verse.

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Speaker 1: I think it's Genesis fifty, verse twenty, isn't it? I

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Speaker 1: believe what the enemy is not yet?

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Speaker 5: I guess.

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Speaker 4: I think that's where it is.

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Speaker 1: And I think understanding that upper versus lower story, Man,

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Speaker 1: do I need that sometimes, especially right now, because the

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Speaker 1: lower story is pretty messy and very confusing and extremely painful,

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Speaker 1: And somehow we can get a glimpse of the upper story,

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Speaker 1: the upper story of what God is writing in our lives,

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Speaker 1: but not just in our lives, because what we have

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Speaker 1: to come to understand is we're part of his story exactly.

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Speaker 1: He's not a part of our story. We're a part

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Speaker 1: of his story if we choose to be. We don't

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Speaker 1: have to be, you know, a lot of people choose

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Speaker 1: not to be a part of his story, but we can.

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Speaker 1: We get the great privilege when we accept what Christ

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Speaker 1: did for us on the cross, we enter into his story.

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Speaker 1: So many believers, though, never really enter into his story

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Speaker 1: because they never really see what his story is. And

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Speaker 1: that's a large part of why we need to connect

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Speaker 1: his story together and enter into his story. I'm preaching

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Speaker 1: to myself right now because we are going through so

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Speaker 1: much stuff right now, just a lot of trauma and

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Speaker 1: tragedy involving some of the friendship circles in my kids' lives,

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Speaker 1: just a lot of things going on that are just

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Speaker 1: excruciatingly painful and extremely stressful. And I'm trying personally to

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Speaker 1: get to this place where I'm like, God, all of

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Speaker 1: this tragedy down here, help me to see a bigger

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Speaker 1: story in it, because right now this is really really painful,

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Speaker 1: and I think my listeners probably I'm sure, can point

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Speaker 1: to multiple things in their lives in this lower story

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Speaker 1: of all of the painful things that they're going through. Really,

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Speaker 1: what our faith is is coming to that place where

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Speaker 1: we can trust that God is working out something good overarching,

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Speaker 1: not just in our lives, but certainly in our lives,

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Speaker 1: but we are a part of that higher story. So

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Speaker 1: speaking to that, why don't you to Randy the higher

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Speaker 1: versus the lower stories that we're all a part of.

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Speaker 1: But too often I think we just get so sucked

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Speaker 1: into the pain and the heartache that's going on in

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Speaker 1: the lower story. And by the way, this answer is

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Speaker 1: one of the big questions of life of like, you know,

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Speaker 1: why does evil and suffering happen in the world, and

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Speaker 1: what's the meaning out of it? And I think our

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Speaker 1: faith is the only worldview that really offers purpose in it.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't offer all the answers, but it does offer

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Speaker 1: purpose in that God is doing something greater in the

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Speaker 1: higher story that he's writing in history.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think this idea of the upper and lower

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Speaker 3: story at least, you know, we've chosen the languages. May

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Speaker 3: be other ways to describe it, so you know, there's

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Speaker 3: nothing new under the sun. We've just found this way

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Speaker 3: to describe it is in the encounter in God's Love

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Speaker 3: fifty two devotionals, which it really comes as a as

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Speaker 3: a second generation to the story that we originally wrote.

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Speaker 3: We're going to walk you through fifty two weeks. We're

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Speaker 3: going to walk you through in chronological order and all

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Speaker 3: these encounters of these characters, and in every single devotion

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Speaker 3: of each week, we're going to talk about the lower story,

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Speaker 3: and then we're going to give you the insight into

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Speaker 3: the upper story. And then we're going to invite you

434
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,480
Speaker 3: to think about your story in that and to put

435
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:47,679
Speaker 3: yourself as a character in it. And we want you

436
00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:51,639
Speaker 3: to see it in chronological order, because you're going to

437
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,639
Speaker 3: see Jesus just as we talked about in the Jesus

438
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,280
Speaker 3: Deurbic Bible. You know, all the clues and Roseanne and

439
00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:00,119
Speaker 3: I write about this, all the clues come from the

440
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:04,800
Speaker 3: very first pages. You know, when Adam and Eve sin

441
00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:09,960
Speaker 3: and they're hiding, and the very first thing act that

442
00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:13,280
Speaker 3: God does, the first act that God does is he

443
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:19,399
Speaker 3: replaces their fig leaves with animal skins. And you already

444
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:21,480
Speaker 3: know the reason for that, Catherine, but a lot of

445
00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:24,800
Speaker 3: people don't know the reason for that. Yeah, animal skins

446
00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:27,840
Speaker 3: is much more durable than greenery. That would be one,

447
00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:31,920
Speaker 3: but it's more significant than that. It's sending a signal

448
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:35,679
Speaker 3: that it's going to require the shedding of another's blood

449
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:40,119
Speaker 3: to cover our sin. And you know, you see this

450
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 3: throughout the scriptures, and we really bring this out and

451
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:46,280
Speaker 3: it's going to deepen people's faith. But I'll finish with this.

452
00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 3: This is what takes a passage of scripture that is

453
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:55,520
Speaker 3: overused and gives it really amazing meaning. It's got to

454
00:24:55,560 --> 00:24:59,720
Speaker 3: be my favorite single passage of scripture. Romans twenty eight.

455
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,440
Speaker 3: All things work together for the good to those who

456
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:05,439
Speaker 3: love God and are called to coding to his purpose.

457
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:08,359
Speaker 3: So we say, first of all, all things work together

458
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:12,119
Speaker 3: for the good. It doesn't mean that you're good, you know.

459
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:16,320
Speaker 3: I think of when we cover Oh that's good. But

460
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 3: are you going to be okay that your life produced good?

461
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:23,080
Speaker 3: And I think of the life of Stephen. I'm giving

462
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 3: a message on that this Sunday at our church in

463
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:28,439
Speaker 3: Kansas City, and are you comfortable with that? I just

464
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,840
Speaker 3: heard an illustration of a guy. He's a carpenter, and

465
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 3: he was walking through the woods with the sun and

466
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:38,160
Speaker 3: he picked up an acorn and he said to his son,

467
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:41,440
Speaker 3: see this acorn. I could do the best work I've

468
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 3: ever done and never be able to reproduce the intricacy

469
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 3: of this acorn. Am I saying that right? Acorn? Yeah?

470
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:51,679
Speaker 3: I mean no, I'm sorry pine Combe. I mean a

471
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,200
Speaker 3: man to say, pinecombe, he picks up this pine cone,

472
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 3: and you know the intricacy of a pine combe. Yes,

473
00:25:57,000 --> 00:25:59,439
Speaker 3: and he picked up and he said, Yet, in all

474
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:02,880
Speaker 3: of its its number one purpose was to fall off

475
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,399
Speaker 3: the tree and die to product provide seed. And you're

476
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 3: okay with that. In the case of Stephen, you know,

477
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 3: his life was snuffed out, but it created it created

478
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:16,360
Speaker 3: the spread of Christianity to Judea and Samaria. I think

479
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:18,439
Speaker 3: for the most part, though, you can even see the

480
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 3: good in your own life. But it says all things

481
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:24,359
Speaker 3: work together. So all the lower stories are working together

482
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 3: to write a good story with your life. But there's

483
00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 3: two conditions. You have to love God, which means you

484
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:33,800
Speaker 3: have to take them seriously. And number two, you need

485
00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:38,159
Speaker 3: to align. You need to align your life to his

486
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:41,160
Speaker 3: upper story purpose. And so I don't know what that is. Well,

487
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:43,159
Speaker 3: that's what this book is about. It's to help you

488
00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:47,919
Speaker 3: understand that God's story is it is on a destination

489
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 3: and nothing can thwart it. And that's where Roseanne was

490
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 3: talking about Joseph. You know, he first discovered it. You know,

491
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 3: so he's fourteen, so he's twenty two years of up

492
00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:01,080
Speaker 3: and down. You talk about being in prison and being

493
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:03,159
Speaker 3: this and that. I mean twenty two years, which is

494
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:05,680
Speaker 3: where you're at right now, Catherine. You're in the down

495
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 3: cycle of Joseph. You know you're in prison, you know

496
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:08,960
Speaker 3: right now.

497
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:10,520
Speaker 4: But I love that.

498
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:14,440
Speaker 3: But in the story, the only time in Joseph's story

499
00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:18,360
Speaker 3: that the phrase God was with him appears is when

500
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:21,000
Speaker 3: he's in the pit. It's only it's like God was

501
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,480
Speaker 3: with him in the pit, reminding God's with you in

502
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,679
Speaker 3: the pit. And he's building character that twenty two years,

503
00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:29,560
Speaker 3: was building the character so that Joseph would be the

504
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,520
Speaker 3: kind of leader that could be trusted for the assignment

505
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,000
Speaker 3: he didn't know about, and that could be where all

506
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:37,000
Speaker 3: of the listeners are at right now, when you're in

507
00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:39,440
Speaker 3: a pit. And so when his brothers come to him,

508
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:42,480
Speaker 3: he has at this moment in time, he was able

509
00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 3: to forgive them because he saw the upper story. What

510
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 3: you meant for evil, God meant for good to save Israel.

511
00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,000
Speaker 3: And the good part of Joseph's story is that you

512
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:55,240
Speaker 3: know his being there in advance saved all of Israel,

513
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:58,720
Speaker 3: so we could have Jesus. That's a good story. But

514
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,959
Speaker 3: he had twenty two years. But the story tells us,

515
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:06,119
Speaker 3: he had seventy two more years and his grandparents. We

516
00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:09,920
Speaker 3: can get this appearance. The story of Genesis ends by

517
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:13,639
Speaker 3: simply saying that Joseph lived a good life and he

518
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:18,160
Speaker 3: had his children and his grandchildren to the third generation

519
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 3: on his lap. That's how the whole book of Genesis ends.

520
00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:24,639
Speaker 3: And so anybody who's in a pit right now, the

521
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:27,119
Speaker 3: Lord is with you, and he promises that if you

522
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:30,479
Speaker 3: align your life to his upper story, he is writing

523
00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:33,480
Speaker 3: a good story. Most likely it'll be a good story

524
00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,200
Speaker 3: for you, but at the very least it'll be good

525
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 3: for the overall thing that God has created. And that's

526
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 3: the power of this. So while this is educational, you're

527
00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:46,320
Speaker 3: going to learn the chronology and you're going to be

528
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:48,680
Speaker 3: able to in the book, we teach you how to

529
00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 3: share the five movements of the story. The real big

530
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 3: deal is to get you through the tough seasons of

531
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:56,040
Speaker 3: life knowing that God loves you.

532
00:28:57,760 --> 00:28:58,840
Speaker 4: That is so good.

533
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,280
Speaker 1: An English teacher. So when you and I, particularly, I'm

534
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:05,320
Speaker 1: a grammar NERD I love grammar.

535
00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 4: I don't know why, but my.

536
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:09,719
Speaker 1: Family would like it if I loved cooking more. Hearkening

537
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:12,200
Speaker 1: back to our last conversations. But I love grammar for

538
00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:15,160
Speaker 1: whatever reason. So when you talked about Roman date twenty

539
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:18,120
Speaker 1: eight a verse that many of us are very familiar with,

540
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:23,400
Speaker 1: all things work together for the good, not your good.

541
00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:28,640
Speaker 1: Those are different adjectives. The is an article adjective. I

542
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 1: was treating my nine year old the three article adjectives,

543
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:36,760
Speaker 1: and so that's referring to the overarching good, the upper story,

544
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 1: not the lower story.

545
00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:40,680
Speaker 4: And seeing that the way you put that.

546
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:44,280
Speaker 1: In emphasizing the of course, we know it doesn't say

547
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:46,520
Speaker 1: your but I think we treat that verse too often

548
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,920
Speaker 1: in the church as if it said your God causes

549
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:52,840
Speaker 1: all things to work together for your good.

550
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:55,600
Speaker 4: But it's the good, it's the good.

551
00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:57,680
Speaker 1: And I love the two conditions that you bring out

552
00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:00,760
Speaker 1: for those who love God first of all God and

553
00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:04,400
Speaker 1: are called according to His purpose. So that is, those

554
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 1: are the lives that God is going to work out

555
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:08,200
Speaker 1: for the good.

556
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 4: And you mentioned Stephen. He was the.

557
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 1: First martyr, and that didn't look very good to all

558
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:19,040
Speaker 1: of the to the early church. And he was brilliant.

559
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 1: He was brilliant, this young man. And when you read

560
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 1: about him in scripture, I was really moved. I went

561
00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 1: to read about him recently, and I was like.

562
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 4: This guy was so smart.

563
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:34,120
Speaker 1: He was such an incredible young talent, Like just his articulation,

564
00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:37,720
Speaker 1: he was so brilliant, and it's hard to imagine how

565
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:41,400
Speaker 1: that could have been for obviously his good, I mean,

566
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:45,000
Speaker 1: he didn't live very long, he died young. That doesn't

567
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:49,080
Speaker 1: seem good, but how it was for the good that

568
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 1: persecution spread the gospel, and it ultimately was for the good.

569
00:30:56,200 --> 00:30:59,840
Speaker 1: And ultimately it's for Steven's good as well, because not

570
00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:03,320
Speaker 1: everyone will get one of those crowns in heavens, the

571
00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:06,320
Speaker 1: martyr's crown, which is eternal, and he can lay at

572
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:09,600
Speaker 1: the feet of Jesus, so that that is really powerful.

573
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:11,840
Speaker 1: I appreciate you bringing that out. I'm going to be

574
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:15,400
Speaker 1: circling the in my Romans twenty eight and all of

575
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:19,000
Speaker 1: my Bibles right now and pointing out the meaning of that,

576
00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:22,120
Speaker 1: because that's really pointing to the upper story, not the

577
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:24,040
Speaker 1: lower story. Not that the lower story isn't going to

578
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 1: work out, that God isn't going to do good there.

579
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:29,080
Speaker 1: I was reading just yesterday, I would have fainted had

580
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 1: I not believed that God would do something good in

581
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:33,320
Speaker 1: the Land of the living.

582
00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:36,360
Speaker 4: I'm not quoting that quite right. It's out of the Psalms.

583
00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 4: But that is a verse that we have as well.

584
00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:41,520
Speaker 1: There's many promises that God is with us and does

585
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:45,600
Speaker 1: good in the lower story, I believe quite often as well.

586
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 1: But that's pointing at that upper story, and that can

587
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:53,000
Speaker 1: help us understand why hard things happen, why the world

588
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:56,080
Speaker 1: is broken, why we need Jesus. It can really help

589
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 1: us unpack those questions for our kids as well, can it.

590
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,520
Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, I mean if we give maybe us a

591
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:06,520
Speaker 3: chance to give like then a personal story, because what

592
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:09,200
Speaker 3: we what we want to do is help people see,

593
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 3: you know, not only learn the chronology of the Bible.

594
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:12,959
Speaker 3: And when you learn the chronology of the Bible, by

595
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:15,200
Speaker 3: the way, you now have access to the Bible for yourself.

596
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:16,960
Speaker 3: This is one of the big mishaps in the church

597
00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:19,920
Speaker 3: today is that people are having to still be spoon fed.

598
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,040
Speaker 3: I want you to think of a grown up in

599
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 3: a high chair, just how ridiculous it is that you know,

600
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:28,720
Speaker 3: you still need a person to spoon feed you. Pablem

601
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:30,800
Speaker 3: you know. But when people know the chronology of the Bible,

602
00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 3: they can drop into any one of them like a

603
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:35,840
Speaker 3: bacchuk and all of that. And I would say that

604
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:37,880
Speaker 3: you have to learn the story and then you know,

605
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 3: I'm sure you're familiar with the Bible Project, Hey, go

606
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 3: to the Bible Project and watch the summary of this

607
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 3: book and get access to the scripture for yourself. Not

608
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 3: that Bible reading was intended to be a solo sport.

609
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:49,120
Speaker 3: It really wasn't. As a matter of fact, in the

610
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:51,600
Speaker 3: first century, it was public reading a scripture. But I

611
00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:54,360
Speaker 3: think it's really important too. Then once you learn about

612
00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 3: the lower story and then the upper story, and you

613
00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 3: see that connection to Jesus and what God's doing, then

614
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:02,040
Speaker 3: we invite you to interact with your story. And I'll

615
00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:06,840
Speaker 3: give you an example and may have an example as well.

616
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:09,920
Speaker 3: You can pick anyone that you want, Roseanne, I was

617
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:13,480
Speaker 3: thinking of of, like even how I became a pastor.

618
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 3: You know of a church. That's a good that's a

619
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:17,760
Speaker 3: good one. But I'll tell you really if we have

620
00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 3: just a really sure okay, Okay, So I'm gonna tell

621
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,440
Speaker 3: more of an emotional one for me. You know, I

622
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 3: grew up in an unchurched home and my mom and

623
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,080
Speaker 3: dad did not have a great marriage when I was

624
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 3: I came to Christ at fourteen and a half.

625
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: And that was an inside joke for listeners from the

626
00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:41,480
Speaker 1: last episode back and at.

627
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 3: The age at the age of seventeen, I'd come home

628
00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:45,680
Speaker 3: from school. My mom was always there, but she wasn't

629
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 3: home that day, and so I lay down to watch

630
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:50,600
Speaker 3: with my mom. Usually sat with my mom and watching

631
00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:53,719
Speaker 3: One Life to Live, which was a soap opera. I

632
00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:57,200
Speaker 3: remember that more detail. And I was laying on the

633
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 3: couch and she came in. I was like, where the

634
00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 3: heck were you? And she said, while I went to

635
00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 3: see your youth pastory today. I go, yeah, you as

636
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 3: well as you know. You know, your dad and I

637
00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:08,319
Speaker 3: are having trouble, like, well, everybody in the house knows

638
00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:11,879
Speaker 3: that'sre having trouble. And he said, I said that he help.

639
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,040
Speaker 3: He says he can't really help me much with the marriage,

640
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,880
Speaker 3: but he did leave me to Jesus today. Oh, I'm like,

641
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:18,320
Speaker 3: oh my gosh, this is amazing.

642
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:27,239
Speaker 1: Hey, friends, it's Catherine here. If you're trying to be

643
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:30,880
Speaker 1: a godly parent in this wild and wacky world, you

644
00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 1: need all the help you can get, and I've got

645
00:34:33,640 --> 00:34:36,560
Speaker 1: you covered. When you subscribe to my website, you'll get

646
00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:40,799
Speaker 1: instant access to tons of free resources made just for

647
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,160
Speaker 1: Christian parents. You'll get my Prodigal Bundle, which is packed

648
00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:47,480
Speaker 1: with every podcast, article and scripture list I've created for

649
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:49,200
Speaker 1: parents walking that.

650
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:50,439
Speaker 4: Tough prodigal road.

651
00:34:50,640 --> 00:34:53,880
Speaker 1: You'll also get my free eat book Beyond the Lies

652
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:57,399
Speaker 1: and covering five myths the culture spreads to mothers, plus

653
00:34:57,560 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 1: powerful scripture list Pray over your kids, and even scripture

654
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:03,279
Speaker 1: songs to help your family hide God's.

655
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:05,360
Speaker 4: Word in your hearts without even trying.

656
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 1: And of course I'll keep you encouraged with my weekly

657
00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:12,520
Speaker 1: newsletter full of faith filled PEP talks and outlines of

658
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:14,799
Speaker 1: what we're tackling each week on the show.

659
00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:15,640
Speaker 4: So don't miss out.

660
00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 1: Head over to Catherine Scars dot com. That's Catherine Scars

661
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:23,080
Speaker 1: dot com and subscribe today. Because Christian parenting may be crazy,

662
00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:25,520
Speaker 1: but you don't have to do it alone.

663
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,640
Speaker 3: And so, you know, my dad was an ordinary guy,

664
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,040
Speaker 3: really was, and I got to understand it a little

665
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:36,239
Speaker 3: bit later. But he didn't allow my mom to attend church,

666
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:39,920
Speaker 3: and so she really tried to nurture her own faith

667
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,239
Speaker 3: on her own. And I went away to college and

668
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 3: then seminary and then became a pastor, and so I

669
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 3: wasn't there around her. But at the age of sixty two,

670
00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 3: my mom got advanced pancreatic cancer, and within a couple

671
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 3: of months she died. And so I remember when she

672
00:35:57,080 --> 00:35:59,279
Speaker 3: got to cancer. I was in I was getting ready

673
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:02,120
Speaker 3: to take my mom and dad on an all expense

674
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:04,319
Speaker 3: paid for a trip to Niagara Falls. And this first

675
00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:05,800
Speaker 3: time in my life, I was able to do something

676
00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:08,440
Speaker 3: for my mom that sacrificed so much. And I just

677
00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:10,360
Speaker 3: went into the chapel, you know, I said, God is

678
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:13,279
Speaker 3: so understand, you know. And sure enough she died three

679
00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 3: days before we were to leave for that trip, and

680
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 3: it was just devastated. And I remember saying, God, you know,

681
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 3: you know, please hear my prayer. You know, I'll become

682
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:23,239
Speaker 3: a pastor. Oh no, I'm already a pastor. I'll become

683
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:25,360
Speaker 3: a missionary. You know, I'll do whatever you need me

684
00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:28,320
Speaker 3: to do. I'm like doing that, you know, Abraham bargaining

685
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 3: with God kind of thing. And so he said, it's

686
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:33,680
Speaker 3: been of the general whisper. It's like, how many more

687
00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:36,799
Speaker 3: years do you want, Randy, I mean, how many more

688
00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 3: do you do? You think it's going to be a

689
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:41,560
Speaker 3: good deal? I said, well, probably, I'm not ever going

690
00:36:41,560 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 3: to feel it's a good deal. It's going to be painful.

691
00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:47,200
Speaker 3: In the matter when it happens, says precisive. So do

692
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:51,120
Speaker 3: you think I'm doing something at all? You know, like, no,

693
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:52,799
Speaker 3: not really right now, I just want you to heal

694
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,040
Speaker 3: my mother so I could take her Nigara falls. So

695
00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:58,960
Speaker 3: she passed away, and my dad and I had never

696
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:00,520
Speaker 3: we had tried. I tried so couple of times to

697
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:03,239
Speaker 3: talk to my dad, very awkward, and so now I've

698
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 3: got a fire in my belly. And I told my

699
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 3: wife Roseanne. I said, hey, we had to fly back

700
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:11,040
Speaker 3: to Texas. I said, take the kids to get something

701
00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:13,080
Speaker 3: to eat. I need to talk to my dad one

702
00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:17,000
Speaker 3: more time. And I locked all the doors. My dad

703
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:19,960
Speaker 3: did not like these emotional conversations, but I wasn't going tolone.

704
00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 3: And I literally straddled his lazy boar chair and I said, Dad,

705
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:26,080
Speaker 3: we're going to have one more conversation. We just lost Mom.

706
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 3: But she knew Jesus, and I have great confidence, with

707
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:31,600
Speaker 3: the grace of Jesus that she's going to be in

708
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:34,319
Speaker 3: the eternal Kingdom of God. And I said, but you've

709
00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:36,960
Speaker 3: always rejected this conversation. We're going to have it. This

710
00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:39,080
Speaker 3: is the last time we're going to have it. And

711
00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:41,000
Speaker 3: I said, I know it's uncomfortable for you. So I've

712
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:43,719
Speaker 3: written it all out for you on one page. I'm

713
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:46,000
Speaker 3: going to walk away for a little bit and I'm

714
00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:47,680
Speaker 3: going to let you read it, and then you come

715
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:50,680
Speaker 3: back and you just simply say yes or no. And

716
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 3: if you say no, then I'll leave you alone forever.

717
00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:56,280
Speaker 3: And I came back into the room and my dad

718
00:37:56,800 --> 00:38:00,920
Speaker 3: was weeping, I mean weeping, and he goes, I'm in

719
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:06,160
Speaker 3: And so my dad came to Christ and in that moment,

720
00:38:07,120 --> 00:38:11,080
Speaker 3: in that moment, God was saying, see, Randy, I didn't

721
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 3: give your mom pancreatic cancer. By the way, you know,

722
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:16,880
Speaker 3: this is a sinful, broken world. She got pancreatic cancer.

723
00:38:16,920 --> 00:38:20,399
Speaker 3: That was her story. Yes, I could have intervened, but

724
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:24,080
Speaker 3: now do you understand that for all eternity, you're not

725
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 3: going to be with your mother, but you're going to

726
00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:29,040
Speaker 3: be with your father. Would you now, for the rest

727
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:32,799
Speaker 3: of your life, trust me that I am working it

728
00:38:32,840 --> 00:38:35,120
Speaker 3: out for the good. It didn't look like it was

729
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:38,040
Speaker 3: for the good of your mother, but as it turns out,

730
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:40,479
Speaker 3: it's actually for her good, but for a greater good

731
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:44,080
Speaker 3: for your family. And that's what this journey of understanding

732
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 3: the upper and lower story would be not just understanding

733
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,560
Speaker 3: the characters of the Bible, but to know that God

734
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:50,800
Speaker 3: is doing that in your life as well.

735
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:57,839
Speaker 1: Wow. Sorry, I should have brought some kleeneges for this one.

736
00:38:57,880 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 1: I needed that.

737
00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:01,120
Speaker 3: I'm good I needed that.

738
00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:05,080
Speaker 1: I'm sure my listeners needed that. But I kind of

739
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:10,719
Speaker 1: alluded to our family going through some tragedies recently and

740
00:39:10,760 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 1: I've been praying kind of like you did about your mom.

741
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,759
Speaker 1: God please answer this.

742
00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:21,520
Speaker 4: Prayer this way, and he did not.

743
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:25,520
Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, it kind of took a

744
00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:30,400
Speaker 1: traumatic turn where it literally ended up as roadkill. And

745
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:34,880
Speaker 1: I'm like, really bad it was. I mean, I'll just

746
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:38,160
Speaker 1: share a little bit. My daughter is in a friendship circles.

747
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 1: This is the one who struggled in her faith, and

748
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:45,320
Speaker 1: she has a friend whose mother is just abusive, bipolar

749
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:49,279
Speaker 1: and just really messed up. The only thing this young

750
00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:53,040
Speaker 1: girl had were her pets. She had three little pets.

751
00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:54,839
Speaker 4: The two of them that my daughter and.

752
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:58,160
Speaker 1: She had rescued, and this mother just took him, dropped

753
00:39:58,239 --> 00:40:03,440
Speaker 1: them off somewhere, and then a few weeks ago and

754
00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:06,000
Speaker 1: I kept one of them, and one of them was disabled.

755
00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 1: He didn't have an eye. They named him Derek, and

756
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:17,520
Speaker 1: these girls have struggled in their faith. And the young

757
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:19,520
Speaker 1: girl had come over to my house and I was

758
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:22,480
Speaker 1: letting her stay here because she was bribing her mom.

759
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:24,799
Speaker 1: She was doing everything. All she had in life were

760
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:27,160
Speaker 1: these little creatures who loved her, who she had rescued.

761
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:29,680
Speaker 1: She has a huge heart. And I was just like, God,

762
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 1: just protect them, God, and I prayed out loud, just.

763
00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:36,759
Speaker 4: Protect them, just keep them safe, keep them well.

764
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 1: When we found out where they were the next morning,

765
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:44,360
Speaker 1: and Derek, the disabled cat, was already roadkill and the

766
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,359
Speaker 1: other one, one of them, is pregnant. That happened accidentally,

767
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:51,160
Speaker 1: well not accidentally. The mother let them get together. She

768
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:52,880
Speaker 1: was trying to get them to get fixed, and so

769
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:58,239
Speaker 1: it's just this really big, traumatic, horrible story. The other

770
00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:01,719
Speaker 1: cat named Josie, who's pregnant, is still missing. And I've

771
00:41:01,719 --> 00:41:02,280
Speaker 1: been praying.

772
00:41:02,360 --> 00:41:03,040
Speaker 4: I've been praying.

773
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:05,879
Speaker 1: I've been praying, praying, praying, help us to fine or

774
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:09,640
Speaker 1: help this to be a story where my daughter and.

775
00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 4: A friend can see you move. And I want him

776
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:14,719
Speaker 4: to move this way like you did.

777
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:17,880
Speaker 1: I want him to move in the way that I

778
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:25,200
Speaker 1: feel in the lower story makes the most sense, which

779
00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 1: in your lower story What made the most sense was

780
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:29,520
Speaker 1: your mom being healed and you getting to go to

781
00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 1: Niagara Falls. You've never done this before. But in the

782
00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:38,479
Speaker 1: upper story, your father came to Christ and I'm going

783
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:43,360
Speaker 1: to venture a guest that thousands of years from now

784
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 1: in eternity, you're not going to remember the Niagara Falls

785
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:47,960
Speaker 1: trip that you missed, are you.

786
00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:50,400
Speaker 3: Well, here's yeah, yeah, yeah, go ahead.

787
00:41:50,560 --> 00:41:52,760
Speaker 4: No, well no, it's just go ahead.

788
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 3: Well yeah, no. Here's the thing that really captured me,

789
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:57,799
Speaker 3: if you don't mind me interrupting you, is that when

790
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:01,840
Speaker 3: you read Revelation chapter only one in twenty two, it

791
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:06,040
Speaker 3: talks about this river of life flowing from the Throne

792
00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:09,440
Speaker 3: of God, you know, filled with this living water. On

793
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:11,600
Speaker 3: both sides of it are the two trees of life

794
00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:16,560
Speaker 3: that produce fruit every month. And so I basically heard

795
00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:21,040
Speaker 3: God say, your trip hasn't been canceled, Randy, it's just

796
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 3: been postponed you. But you're not going to have to

797
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:28,080
Speaker 3: pay for this trip, Randy, the Son of God has

798
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 3: already paid for this trip. And it's not going to

799
00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:33,120
Speaker 3: just be for three little, measly days in your budget.

800
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:37,279
Speaker 3: It's going to be forever in a residence that will

801
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:40,080
Speaker 3: be much more opulent than you wanted to embarrass your

802
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:41,880
Speaker 3: mom with. It's going to be much more than the

803
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:44,960
Speaker 3: beauty of the story has come along around and you know,

804
00:42:45,080 --> 00:42:49,160
Speaker 3: and the reality is not everybody gets the privilege of

805
00:42:49,239 --> 00:42:54,080
Speaker 3: seeing the upper story as quickly as I did. And

806
00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:56,600
Speaker 3: so then and that's where the trust comes comes in.

807
00:42:56,640 --> 00:43:00,160
Speaker 3: Maybe it resin. Just make a comment about our our

808
00:43:00,160 --> 00:43:00,839
Speaker 3: good friend job.

809
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:06,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, job. We very clearly, from reading the scriptures, know

810
00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:08,439
Speaker 2: that there was something going on in the heavenly realm.

811
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 2: Satan was challenging God about his followers and saying, they

812
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:14,000
Speaker 2: just follow you because you're good to them and you

813
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:19,080
Speaker 2: give them everything. And God says, take my certain servant

814
00:43:19,160 --> 00:43:22,479
Speaker 2: job for example, and he says, well, he's you've given

815
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:25,440
Speaker 2: him everything, take it away, and he won't worship you anymore.

816
00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:29,560
Speaker 2: And we know that that's going that conversation's happening. But

817
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:33,320
Speaker 2: Joe never knew. He never knew in his lower story

818
00:43:33,440 --> 00:43:37,279
Speaker 2: why all this tragedy happened, and we lost his kids

819
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:42,280
Speaker 2: and his house and his businesses and everything was gone,

820
00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:46,279
Speaker 2: and he didn't know why that had happened to him.

821
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 2: And yet in the upper story, it's very clear to

822
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:53,640
Speaker 2: us that God Satan has this challenge with God going on,

823
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:58,440
Speaker 2: and while he questioned God, he never cursed God, and

824
00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:02,920
Speaker 2: he never he didn't do anything that was against God.

825
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:06,319
Speaker 2: He stood with him and still worshiped him. And God

826
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:08,880
Speaker 2: got the glory for that in the upper story.

827
00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:10,719
Speaker 4: When that's really our.

828
00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:15,120
Speaker 2: Ultimate goal is for God to be glorified through our lives.

829
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:17,960
Speaker 3: Well and for Job, you know, I mean there's three characters.

830
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:21,000
Speaker 3: One is imaginary. One says when bad things happen to

831
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:24,000
Speaker 3: good people. You know, Job was a good guy because

832
00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:26,080
Speaker 3: that's why he was selected. And I thought, I wonder

833
00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:30,200
Speaker 3: if God were to redo that conversation with Satan, would

834
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:34,160
Speaker 3: he pick me to be the person that he entrusted

835
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:40,280
Speaker 3: that with. Well, so Job's wife responded like most people

836
00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:42,880
Speaker 3: do when bad things happen to good people, which is

837
00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:44,880
Speaker 3: a bad question because there's no such thing as good people,

838
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:48,120
Speaker 3: and that she says, curse God and die. You know,

839
00:44:48,239 --> 00:44:50,239
Speaker 3: God's done this to you. He's a mean guy and

840
00:44:50,280 --> 00:44:52,560
Speaker 3: you just need to curson. Then his friends, you know,

841
00:44:52,640 --> 00:44:55,480
Speaker 3: came along and said this is all on you, Job.

842
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:57,480
Speaker 3: You know, God's doing this to you because you're the

843
00:44:57,520 --> 00:45:00,120
Speaker 3: bad guy here. And then the atheist who does and

844
00:45:00,160 --> 00:45:01,800
Speaker 3: exists in the story. He says, Oh, this is just

845
00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:05,640
Speaker 3: proof that there is no God. This just happened by coincidence,

846
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:08,920
Speaker 3: and you need to like figure this out because there

847
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:11,959
Speaker 3: is no God. But you know, Job, like Razanne said,

848
00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:15,879
Speaker 3: he questioned God, which God didn't like him doing that either,

849
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:17,759
Speaker 3: because he spends quite a few chapters at the end

850
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:21,239
Speaker 3: of the book challenging him on asking the questions. Job says, Okay,

851
00:45:21,239 --> 00:45:22,600
Speaker 3: I'm going to cover my mouth and it's not say

852
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 3: anything anymore. But he never cursed God, and at the

853
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:28,880
Speaker 3: end of the story he was blessed beyond belief. And

854
00:45:29,120 --> 00:45:31,560
Speaker 3: the whole story, just like the story with Joseph, it

855
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:36,759
Speaker 3: ends with this insane blessing that Job experience at the

856
00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:38,400
Speaker 3: end of the story.

857
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:43,360
Speaker 5: And so the good was the good was a God

858
00:45:43,719 --> 00:45:51,040
Speaker 5: in the heavenlies used Job's life to put Satan down.

859
00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:54,759
Speaker 3: That's a pretty good story, you know, you know when

860
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:57,319
Speaker 3: you get into the Eternal Kingdom and you'd say, I'm

861
00:45:57,320 --> 00:45:59,279
Speaker 3: going to be Job, like, what was it like when

862
00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:02,600
Speaker 3: you discover what the upper story was? Because now he

863
00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:05,680
Speaker 3: knows and he's like, man, I can't believe it. You know,

864
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:09,040
Speaker 3: I was used to put to defeat Satan. In front

865
00:46:09,080 --> 00:46:11,120
Speaker 3: of God, I can't even believe it. Well, I got

866
00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:15,800
Speaker 3: really close, but I didn't do it. And yet anyhow

867
00:46:15,840 --> 00:46:18,719
Speaker 3: So I just think, for you know, one of our

868
00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:22,360
Speaker 3: desires in this fifty two week study is that people

869
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:26,479
Speaker 3: would just really get into these characters and weep over

870
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:29,359
Speaker 3: what happened and relate to him, so that you might

871
00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:31,480
Speaker 3: trust God in this sort of way that he's writing

872
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:35,840
Speaker 3: a good story, and will you trust him even if

873
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:38,680
Speaker 3: you never really understand what it is. But I think

874
00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:40,520
Speaker 3: for the most part, if you're willing to look up

875
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:43,080
Speaker 3: and you understand where the story's going, which is why

876
00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:45,520
Speaker 3: you need to understand the story in chronological order, it's

877
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:48,879
Speaker 3: going toward a destination and there's a purpose in it.

878
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:51,120
Speaker 3: And if you can go toward, if you can just

879
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:54,160
Speaker 3: make sure you align your life it's anything that's moving

880
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:56,319
Speaker 3: in that direction. That's what it means to align your

881
00:46:56,360 --> 00:46:58,439
Speaker 3: life to God's upper story. And if you do that,

882
00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:01,560
Speaker 3: He's going to do something really really good, even though

883
00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:03,719
Speaker 3: like Joseph, you might be in a pit right now.

884
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:07,360
Speaker 1: I think what we need to come to count on

885
00:47:07,960 --> 00:47:09,960
Speaker 1: and teach our kids to even count on, is that

886
00:47:10,040 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 1: these these two stories that they don't look like they're

887
00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:15,320
Speaker 1: going hand in hand all the time. They're like, because

888
00:47:15,520 --> 00:47:19,480
Speaker 1: sometimes the worst our lower story gets, the better his

889
00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:21,120
Speaker 1: upper story must be.

890
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:22,719
Speaker 4: And like you said, we don't always get to see it.

891
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:23,360
Speaker 1: Sometimes we do.

892
00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:25,040
Speaker 4: I've I've had.

893
00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:28,239
Speaker 1: Instances in my life where the lower story got really bad,

894
00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:30,439
Speaker 1: but then I got to see what God was doing

895
00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:32,320
Speaker 1: in the upper story, and he did something really great.

896
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:36,520
Speaker 1: My listeners, regular listeners know the story of our miscarriage

897
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 1: when I was forty four that ended in this prayer

898
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:43,480
Speaker 1: vigil that really built so many spiritual muscles, and we

899
00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:46,799
Speaker 1: did get the promised child, our evangeline faith that we

900
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:49,640
Speaker 1: found out about the day that the child we lost

901
00:47:49,719 --> 00:47:50,080
Speaker 1: was due.

902
00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:52,200
Speaker 4: Her name was Hope, And so I got.

903
00:47:52,120 --> 00:47:55,560
Speaker 1: To see that within the course of a less than

904
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:59,680
Speaker 1: a year, I got to see the upper story versus

905
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:03,000
Speaker 1: the lower story. But like you said, Joe didn't necessarily

906
00:48:03,080 --> 00:48:06,799
Speaker 1: he did have the redemption here on earth. He was

907
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:09,239
Speaker 1: blessed after all of that happened, but he didn't really

908
00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:12,040
Speaker 1: get to see behind the scenes. As Paul Harvey used

909
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:16,120
Speaker 1: to say, the rest of the story was such a

910
00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:18,640
Speaker 1: great line. We only have a few minutes left, but

911
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:21,560
Speaker 1: why don't we in our closing moments, would you speak

912
00:48:21,600 --> 00:48:25,279
Speaker 1: to this upper story, God's perspective in order to give

913
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:29,760
Speaker 1: parents hope who maybe the lower story that's going awry

914
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:32,680
Speaker 1: has to do with their kids, has to do with

915
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:36,239
Speaker 1: maybe a prodigal journey there on, or choices that they're

916
00:48:36,239 --> 00:48:40,239
Speaker 1: making and their story and this is not going the

917
00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:43,359
Speaker 1: way they hoped. I have a lot of listeners who

918
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 1: are going through that. I've explained that we've had that

919
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:47,160
Speaker 1: season ourselves.

920
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 4: We have five kids. Some of those stories seem to

921
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:50,320
Speaker 4: be going really, really great.

922
00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 1: And I was explaining to you earlier I often have

923
00:48:52,719 --> 00:48:55,360
Speaker 1: people come up to me in church and compliment me

924
00:48:55,440 --> 00:48:57,560
Speaker 1: and praise me about these kids that are so amazing.

925
00:48:57,560 --> 00:48:59,720
Speaker 1: You must be incredible parents. And I'm like, nope, nope,

926
00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:01,839
Speaker 1: not to take that credit. I'm going to give that

927
00:49:01,880 --> 00:49:06,120
Speaker 1: over to God because that hasn't always been the story

928
00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:09,040
Speaker 1: in our lives. And we have watched that prodigal road.

929
00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:12,279
Speaker 1: My daughter is believing again, but you know it's He's

930
00:49:12,320 --> 00:49:16,000
Speaker 1: the one who causes the growth, and he's doing something

931
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:20,840
Speaker 1: even I'm going to speak in faith that even with roadkill,

932
00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 1: even with a lost pregnant cat, even with a bipolar

933
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:29,359
Speaker 1: mother that has just done the sort of things that

934
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:32,880
Speaker 1: just seem almost unforgivable to a child, just to be

935
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:34,920
Speaker 1: that cruel to take the only things that love her

936
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:38,000
Speaker 1: in life and treat her well and just dump them

937
00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:41,440
Speaker 1: out miles away from her home. That even in all

938
00:49:41,480 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 1: of this, God can write a great story in all

939
00:49:45,160 --> 00:49:45,399
Speaker 1: of it.

940
00:49:45,520 --> 00:49:46,520
Speaker 4: But speak to those.

941
00:49:46,360 --> 00:49:50,400
Speaker 1: Parents in particular who's struggling with their children going down

942
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:53,640
Speaker 1: roads that they they may have never imagined. But how

943
00:49:53,680 --> 00:49:58,360
Speaker 1: God's upper story can especially through our prayers as we're faithful,

944
00:49:58,400 --> 00:49:59,719
Speaker 1: sometimes we don't feel like we have a lot of

945
00:49:59,719 --> 00:50:02,600
Speaker 1: them fluence left. Once they become older and are out

946
00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:04,719
Speaker 1: of the house, we can still pray. We can still pray,

947
00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:07,920
Speaker 1: and all of the seeds that we planted throughout their

948
00:50:07,960 --> 00:50:11,759
Speaker 1: life can still bring forth fruit and grow into something beautiful.

949
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:13,840
Speaker 1: So speak into that in our final moments.

950
00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:25,120
Speaker 3: I would like to Rozan can actually tell the story,

951
00:50:25,120 --> 00:50:26,799
Speaker 3: but I'll kind of tee it up a little bit.

952
00:50:27,160 --> 00:50:30,280
Speaker 3: We have four children and we have a great upper

953
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:34,480
Speaker 3: story experience with our son, but it wasn't through a

954
00:50:34,520 --> 00:50:37,440
Speaker 3: prodigal experience. He was born without a left hand, and

955
00:50:38,520 --> 00:50:43,120
Speaker 3: just the overall journey that I went on and just

956
00:50:43,239 --> 00:50:45,960
Speaker 3: where he is at today, he's the one that's in

957
00:50:47,280 --> 00:50:50,640
Speaker 3: a litigator in DC, you know, with a married to

958
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:54,640
Speaker 3: a beautiful Christian journalist and they've adopted three kids from Bulgaria.

959
00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:59,040
Speaker 3: He loves God deeply and actually he sees well one

960
00:50:59,040 --> 00:51:02,000
Speaker 3: in the courtroom, all the juries take pity on him

961
00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:04,120
Speaker 3: because he's missing the hand, and.

962
00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:12,440
Speaker 6: Him the opposing side underestimates our son's capacity because he's

963
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:14,640
Speaker 6: missing a hand, and the jury falls in love with him,

964
00:51:14,640 --> 00:51:15,880
Speaker 6: so he wins most of his cases.

965
00:51:15,920 --> 00:51:18,520
Speaker 1: So how in the world would that have anything to

966
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:20,400
Speaker 1: do with this intellectual capacity.

967
00:51:20,520 --> 00:51:21,200
Speaker 4: I do not know.

968
00:51:21,440 --> 00:51:23,440
Speaker 3: People are weird in that way, but they do. They are,

969
00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:26,880
Speaker 3: they are they are that way. But ours is Our

970
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:29,960
Speaker 3: daughter was the prodigal in our situation. She's the oldest.

971
00:51:30,239 --> 00:51:32,920
Speaker 3: And as Razi maybe said, it was either this podcast

972
00:51:33,080 --> 00:51:34,960
Speaker 3: or the one prior in the Christian school. It was

973
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:37,279
Speaker 3: the one in the private one. So listener's got to

974
00:51:37,280 --> 00:51:39,440
Speaker 3: go back to the prior one. Our daughter went to

975
00:51:39,480 --> 00:51:41,080
Speaker 3: a Christian school of which I was the pastor of

976
00:51:41,120 --> 00:51:43,400
Speaker 3: the church that ran it, and so there was just

977
00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:45,800
Speaker 3: a lot of a lot of times in Christian schools

978
00:51:46,120 --> 00:51:49,080
Speaker 3: we have experienced if you're not careful, there could be

979
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:51,840
Speaker 3: a complacency to your faith because you're going to chapel

980
00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:54,960
Speaker 3: every day and and the you know, just there's a complacency.

981
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:56,560
Speaker 3: You're never having to fight for anything because you're in

982
00:51:56,600 --> 00:51:58,840
Speaker 3: this bubble. And so there was just a lot of

983
00:51:59,440 --> 00:52:02,839
Speaker 3: hypocrisy that our daughter chose to interpret a certain way,

984
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:04,960
Speaker 3: and she just walked away from her faith and it

985
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:08,319
Speaker 3: led her down. It led her down a pathway that

986
00:52:08,360 --> 00:52:10,120
Speaker 3: I don't think she would mind saying. She just made

987
00:52:10,160 --> 00:52:13,600
Speaker 3: a lot of really bad choices in her life, and

988
00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:17,600
Speaker 3: as it relates to boys in her life. And so

989
00:52:18,160 --> 00:52:20,640
Speaker 3: we finally had we were living in Chicago at the time,

990
00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:24,719
Speaker 3: and we finally had someone from the Dallas Fort Worth

991
00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:26,880
Speaker 3: area call us because I was a pastor of a

992
00:52:26,960 --> 00:52:31,120
Speaker 3: large church and our daughter was forgot that she lives

993
00:52:31,160 --> 00:52:33,360
Speaker 3: in a glass bowl when your dad is the pastor

994
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:35,839
Speaker 3: of a large church. She didn't think anybody was seeing

995
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:37,680
Speaker 3: or watching. Were there are people that were in her

996
00:52:37,960 --> 00:52:41,520
Speaker 3: apartment community that called us and said, Hey, I'm a

997
00:52:41,600 --> 00:52:44,520
Speaker 3: dad and my daughter called and this is what's happening

998
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:47,400
Speaker 3: to your daughter. So my daughter and I had a

999
00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:50,480
Speaker 3: phone conversation. I'd said in the last episode, I never

1000
00:52:50,760 --> 00:52:53,400
Speaker 3: I hardly ever raised my voice. This is one of

1001
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:56,760
Speaker 3: them where I laid it on her really really thick,

1002
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:59,840
Speaker 3: and she was mad as a hornet at me. But Rosanna,

1003
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,600
Speaker 3: tell you the redemption story. And I think our biggest,

1004
00:53:02,920 --> 00:53:05,920
Speaker 3: our biggest thing for your listeners is one of the

1005
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:08,600
Speaker 3: things that one of the mentor couples in our life

1006
00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:13,120
Speaker 3: said to us, don't give up on the relationship because

1007
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:15,719
Speaker 3: the story is not over yet. The story is not

1008
00:53:15,880 --> 00:53:19,440
Speaker 3: over yet. And so that was our strategy, that was

1009
00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:22,960
Speaker 3: our path that we chose. We did not give credence

1010
00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:24,920
Speaker 3: to what she did. We didn't even know what she

1011
00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:28,000
Speaker 3: was doing, but we chose to stay in a relationship

1012
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:30,960
Speaker 3: without ever giving advocacy to what she was doing. And

1013
00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:33,719
Speaker 3: I laid into her that at one time, and well

1014
00:53:33,719 --> 00:53:36,520
Speaker 3: then the wheels came off and she called her mother.

1015
00:53:36,719 --> 00:53:38,520
Speaker 3: I'll let you take it from there, Rosanna, if you

1016
00:53:38,680 --> 00:53:39,359
Speaker 3: know where I'm at.

1017
00:53:40,040 --> 00:53:42,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, I got to a point where I was praying,

1018
00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:44,839
Speaker 2: and I was praying crazy stuff like God, I don't

1019
00:53:44,840 --> 00:53:47,720
Speaker 2: want to be in your kingdom forever without my daughter.

1020
00:53:48,040 --> 00:53:51,040
Speaker 4: I mean, yeah, I know, you just get there.

1021
00:53:51,280 --> 00:53:55,680
Speaker 2: And fortunately the home spirit can interterpret our prayers and

1022
00:53:55,800 --> 00:53:59,319
Speaker 2: make sense of them, and I think he did that

1023
00:53:59,640 --> 00:54:02,320
Speaker 2: but yeah, we went a couple of days. I couldn't

1024
00:54:02,320 --> 00:54:05,440
Speaker 2: get a hold of her after this conversation, and I

1025
00:54:05,520 --> 00:54:07,640
Speaker 2: was very worried about her. And I called the guy

1026
00:54:07,760 --> 00:54:10,280
Speaker 2: she was dating, and he said, she's really really ticked

1027
00:54:10,280 --> 00:54:11,880
Speaker 2: at you guys right now. She doesn't want to talk

1028
00:54:11,920 --> 00:54:14,280
Speaker 2: to you. I said, I need to hear her voice.

1029
00:54:14,560 --> 00:54:17,560
Speaker 2: Just tell her to call me. And so she did

1030
00:54:18,239 --> 00:54:22,120
Speaker 2: and we connected and she was really really angry. But

1031
00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:26,120
Speaker 2: fast forward about six months. I can't remember six months

1032
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:29,080
Speaker 2: or a year, and she called me one day, knowing

1033
00:54:29,160 --> 00:54:34,279
Speaker 2: that the relationship was strained, and she said, Mom, do

1034
00:54:34,320 --> 00:54:37,880
Speaker 2: you I would like to come back to Chicago and

1035
00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:40,560
Speaker 2: live with you guys for a while. Do you think

1036
00:54:40,680 --> 00:54:44,160
Speaker 2: Dad would be open to that? I said, let me

1037
00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:46,440
Speaker 2: talk to him, but I'm pretty sure the answer is yes,

1038
00:54:46,760 --> 00:54:49,560
Speaker 2: because one of the things we had done was we

1039
00:54:50,160 --> 00:54:54,120
Speaker 2: prepared our hearts, or God prepared our hearts to not

1040
00:54:54,320 --> 00:54:58,719
Speaker 2: give up on this child, and knowing, like the dad

1041
00:54:58,760 --> 00:55:01,560
Speaker 2: of the prodigal son, to be ready and waiting and

1042
00:55:01,640 --> 00:55:03,840
Speaker 2: watching for her to come home.

1043
00:55:05,280 --> 00:55:10,680
Speaker 1: Sorry, don't apologize. We've all been there in some way,

1044
00:55:10,880 --> 00:55:13,239
Speaker 1: shape or form, probably with each of our kids, even

1045
00:55:13,239 --> 00:55:15,440
Speaker 1: the ones that aren't on prodigal journeys, the things that

1046
00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:17,120
Speaker 1: they have to go through. But man, you do not

1047
00:55:17,239 --> 00:55:20,000
Speaker 1: have to apologize for that. I've cried, well, I cried.

1048
00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:23,160
Speaker 2: Well, we were we were upset with her, and we

1049
00:55:23,160 --> 00:55:26,600
Speaker 2: were angry, and you know, we talked about should we

1050
00:55:26,680 --> 00:55:29,560
Speaker 2: cut her off or should we So we decided we

1051
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,160
Speaker 2: wanted to stay in a relationship with her and not

1052
00:55:32,280 --> 00:55:35,160
Speaker 2: give up, with the hope that she would one day

1053
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:37,320
Speaker 2: come home and that we would be ready with open

1054
00:55:37,440 --> 00:55:41,120
Speaker 2: arms to forgive her for whatever had happened. And so

1055
00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:44,799
Speaker 2: we had this conversation, and she came came back and

1056
00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:48,720
Speaker 2: lived with us for about a year. And I didn't

1057
00:55:48,920 --> 00:55:51,759
Speaker 2: ever really have the courage to ask her what had

1058
00:55:51,880 --> 00:55:55,319
Speaker 2: changed or what had caused her to make that phone call,

1059
00:55:55,400 --> 00:55:57,440
Speaker 2: But she did allude to the fact that she was

1060
00:55:57,440 --> 00:55:59,839
Speaker 2: in a relationship she did not know how to get

1061
00:55:59,920 --> 00:56:03,600
Speaker 2: up out of the only way she could think of, well,

1062
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:06,960
Speaker 2: we're pretty sure it was abuse of in some way,

1063
00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:08,839
Speaker 2: and the only way she could think of to get

1064
00:56:08,880 --> 00:56:11,840
Speaker 2: out of it was to flee and come back to us.

1065
00:56:11,920 --> 00:56:16,720
Speaker 2: And we were so grateful, so very grateful. So, like said,

1066
00:56:16,760 --> 00:56:19,960
Speaker 2: the story's not over until it's over. But I've seen

1067
00:56:20,040 --> 00:56:22,600
Speaker 2: parents where they've cut their children off and they just

1068
00:56:22,640 --> 00:56:25,960
Speaker 2: will have nothing to do with them, and that's not

1069
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:27,480
Speaker 2: a great place to be.

1070
00:56:27,960 --> 00:56:29,640
Speaker 3: It's yeah, now I'm want to I'm going to interrupt.

1071
00:56:29,640 --> 00:56:31,839
Speaker 3: There was in because I do think it's appropriate not

1072
00:56:31,880 --> 00:56:34,640
Speaker 3: to not to no, no, not to fund their disobedience.

1073
00:56:34,840 --> 00:56:35,960
Speaker 3: We didn't oh no, no, no.

1074
00:56:36,239 --> 00:56:38,040
Speaker 2: I meant to say that. I meant to say that.

1075
00:56:38,080 --> 00:56:40,160
Speaker 2: We had this discussion about should we cut her off

1076
00:56:40,280 --> 00:56:42,440
Speaker 2: or should we stay in a relationship with her, and

1077
00:56:42,440 --> 00:56:45,040
Speaker 2: we decided we would stay in the relationship, but we

1078
00:56:45,080 --> 00:56:48,080
Speaker 2: would not fund her disobedience right at all. And then

1079
00:56:48,120 --> 00:56:50,840
Speaker 2: so she was totally on her own, but we talked.

1080
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:54,359
Speaker 3: Yeah, just like the prodigal son, the pronicle daughter. I mean,

1081
00:56:54,480 --> 00:56:57,200
Speaker 3: she got to the place where she was eating pig slop,

1082
00:56:57,600 --> 00:57:00,520
Speaker 3: you know, and we know that that the the beauty

1083
00:57:00,560 --> 00:57:02,640
Speaker 3: of the scriptures is not to keep you from something,

1084
00:57:02,680 --> 00:57:05,880
Speaker 3: it's to save you to something. And she didn't trust that,

1085
00:57:06,040 --> 00:57:08,719
Speaker 3: and she got herself into a pig slop and she

1086
00:57:08,800 --> 00:57:10,200
Speaker 3: just said, I wonder if I could come home as

1087
00:57:10,239 --> 00:57:13,120
Speaker 3: a servant. You know what. She didn't know what she

1088
00:57:13,160 --> 00:57:15,040
Speaker 3: didn't know Just like you, Catherine, you go to the

1089
00:57:15,120 --> 00:57:17,200
Speaker 3: edge of your property every day to see it. Today

1090
00:57:17,360 --> 00:57:21,280
Speaker 3: she might, she might come home. And so now today

1091
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:25,360
Speaker 3: our daughter's forty one, she's married, we have two beautiful granddaughters,

1092
00:57:25,480 --> 00:57:29,240
Speaker 3: and this girl loves Jesus like you would not believe.

1093
00:57:29,440 --> 00:57:32,840
Speaker 3: I never anticipated her being at this level. And I'm

1094
00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:37,080
Speaker 3: watching how now she's got, particularly our daughter who's seventeen,

1095
00:57:37,800 --> 00:57:41,160
Speaker 3: our granddaughter who loves Jesus, and she's getting that from

1096
00:57:41,200 --> 00:57:44,680
Speaker 3: her from her mother. And you know, a couple of

1097
00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:47,000
Speaker 3: times I've wanted to say to my daughter. I have

1098
00:57:47,120 --> 00:57:49,840
Speaker 3: never done it, but I want to say, would you

1099
00:57:50,040 --> 00:57:52,280
Speaker 3: like for your daughter Ava to do what you did

1100
00:57:52,280 --> 00:57:56,560
Speaker 3: to us.

1101
00:57:55,720 --> 00:57:56,600
Speaker 1: In this episode?

1102
00:57:57,120 --> 00:58:00,840
Speaker 3: She would be mortivide.

1103
00:57:59,640 --> 00:58:05,080
Speaker 7: I think we all kind of have those moments, whether

1104
00:58:05,160 --> 00:58:07,520
Speaker 7: it's whether it's with a kid who's on a prodigal

1105
00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:09,760
Speaker 7: journey or some other frustrating thing that they do.

1106
00:58:09,840 --> 00:58:11,200
Speaker 1: Would you want your kids to do this?

1107
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:12,320
Speaker 2: No?

1108
00:58:12,440 --> 00:58:17,200
Speaker 1: But I wholeheartedly encourage my parents. Yeah, stay in relationship

1109
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:20,760
Speaker 1: with your kids, but do not do not fund a

1110
00:58:20,840 --> 00:58:24,360
Speaker 1: prodigal journey. Although hey, in scripture, he kind of did

1111
00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:26,760
Speaker 1: you know, he asked for the inheritance and he handed

1112
00:58:26,800 --> 00:58:29,120
Speaker 1: it to him and pretty much knowing we know that

1113
00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:32,680
Speaker 1: this is representative God that the father there, he knew

1114
00:58:32,720 --> 00:58:35,400
Speaker 1: what he was going to do, and so he took that.

1115
00:58:35,440 --> 00:58:38,640
Speaker 4: Money and went on, you know.

1116
00:58:38,600 --> 00:58:43,040
Speaker 1: A spree of rebellion and only came to his senses

1117
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:44,880
Speaker 1: when there was nothing left. And like you said, he

1118
00:58:44,920 --> 00:58:47,880
Speaker 1: wanted to come back as a slave. And no, that's

1119
00:58:47,880 --> 00:58:51,200
Speaker 1: not good enough for God, and that's not good enough

1120
00:58:51,200 --> 00:58:53,080
Speaker 1: for us as parents. We want our kids to come

1121
00:58:53,120 --> 00:58:56,240
Speaker 1: back home and be full fledged members of the house.

1122
00:58:56,280 --> 00:58:59,120
Speaker 1: And I think of the household of the and then

1123
00:58:59,320 --> 00:59:02,440
Speaker 1: the body of and I think that children who have

1124
00:59:02,720 --> 00:59:05,800
Speaker 1: gone that journey. Obviously we don't want our kids to

1125
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:09,080
Speaker 1: go that journey, but they have an appreciation, just like

1126
00:59:09,160 --> 00:59:12,480
Speaker 1: the woman who broke the jar of oil and put

1127
00:59:12,520 --> 00:59:15,320
Speaker 1: it over Christ, they have an appreciation for their salvation

1128
00:59:16,280 --> 00:59:17,080
Speaker 1: that those of us.

1129
00:59:17,200 --> 00:59:19,320
Speaker 4: You know, I never really had that journey.

1130
00:59:19,960 --> 00:59:20,120
Speaker 7: You know.

1131
00:59:20,160 --> 00:59:23,000
Speaker 1: I've wandered a little bit in my theology and my

1132
00:59:23,080 --> 00:59:25,160
Speaker 1: faith a little bit to things where I've like, well,

1133
00:59:25,200 --> 00:59:28,680
Speaker 1: I've had to repent of maybe some errant theology or

1134
00:59:28,880 --> 00:59:31,760
Speaker 1: arrant beliefs or some arrant practices. But I haven't had

1135
00:59:31,760 --> 00:59:34,920
Speaker 1: a full fledged prodigal journey. And I think that our

1136
00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:37,880
Speaker 1: children who go through that God has a special purpose

1137
00:59:37,920 --> 00:59:40,600
Speaker 1: for them in His kingdom, and the people that they

1138
00:59:40,640 --> 00:59:43,600
Speaker 1: will be able to reach in their lives with their

1139
00:59:43,680 --> 00:59:45,880
Speaker 1: story might be different than the ones that we can

1140
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:50,040
Speaker 1: reach with our stories. So I'm I'm grateful that you

1141
00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:52,640
Speaker 1: shared that with us today because I know it's going

1142
00:59:52,720 --> 00:59:54,880
Speaker 1: to encourage a lot of parents because they might not

1143
00:59:55,000 --> 00:59:55,560
Speaker 1: be at that.

1144
00:59:55,560 --> 01:00:00,280
Speaker 4: Part of the story yet. But the story isn't over.

1145
01:00:00,320 --> 01:00:02,280
Speaker 4: God is still think yes.

1146
01:00:02,880 --> 01:00:05,160
Speaker 2: We know for revelation the story is not over yet,

1147
01:00:05,240 --> 01:00:08,200
Speaker 2: and we all have a choice to make, including our children.

1148
01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:11,160
Speaker 2: We can be a protagonist or we can be an

1149
01:00:11,240 --> 01:00:15,760
Speaker 2: antagonist in God's story, but we will be used in

1150
01:00:15,840 --> 01:00:18,880
Speaker 2: his story one way or another. And so it's important

1151
01:00:18,880 --> 01:00:21,880
Speaker 2: to surrender and align your life with what God is doing.

1152
01:00:22,520 --> 01:00:25,439
Speaker 2: And so when we do that, it's really the best

1153
01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:27,760
Speaker 2: way to live. And I think that's encountering God's love

1154
01:00:27,920 --> 01:00:31,280
Speaker 2: is an exercise in taking you through these stories and

1155
01:00:31,320 --> 01:00:34,240
Speaker 2: seeing their lower story and then what God's doing in

1156
01:00:34,280 --> 01:00:36,760
Speaker 2: the upper story. And then we tie it in and

1157
01:00:36,800 --> 01:00:40,080
Speaker 2: ask you to consider your story and what God's doing

1158
01:00:40,680 --> 01:00:43,560
Speaker 2: in each day or each week.

1159
01:00:43,800 --> 01:00:47,000
Speaker 1: Sorry, yes, yes, what you're saying just totally reminds me

1160
01:00:47,120 --> 01:00:51,479
Speaker 1: of this scripture. It's found in it's First Corinthians, chapter three,

1161
01:00:51,800 --> 01:00:55,200
Speaker 1: it's verse six. And this is a freedom that I've

1162
01:00:56,080 --> 01:01:00,000
Speaker 1: I've come to really appreciate in Scripture as a parent,

1163
01:01:00,080 --> 01:01:04,000
Speaker 1: and I love that your story coincides with what so

1164
01:01:04,040 --> 01:01:07,400
Speaker 1: many of us go through as parents, because there's there's

1165
01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:09,760
Speaker 1: a pressure in the church. There's a big pressure in

1166
01:01:09,800 --> 01:01:12,840
Speaker 1: the church that, well, if I have my kids in

1167
01:01:12,880 --> 01:01:15,200
Speaker 1: a Christian school, or if I have them in church

1168
01:01:15,240 --> 01:01:17,120
Speaker 1: and youth group, and they see this example in me,

1169
01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:20,240
Speaker 1: and we actually answer all the right questions and we

1170
01:01:20,280 --> 01:01:23,360
Speaker 1: train them the right way, and we are very intentional

1171
01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,360
Speaker 1: about their spiritual formation that we're going to raise a Daniel,

1172
01:01:26,400 --> 01:01:28,160
Speaker 1: Praise God. They're not going to bow, They're not going

1173
01:01:28,200 --> 01:01:30,160
Speaker 1: to have this prodigal season. And that's not what we

1174
01:01:30,200 --> 01:01:33,600
Speaker 1: are promised in scripture. What we are told in one

1175
01:01:33,680 --> 01:01:37,080
Speaker 1: Corinthians three, verse six is this is paul speaking. He says,

1176
01:01:37,080 --> 01:01:41,600
Speaker 1: I planted the seed, a Paulus watered the seed, but

1177
01:01:41,800 --> 01:01:46,040
Speaker 1: God has been making it grow. And I love that

1178
01:01:46,160 --> 01:01:50,160
Speaker 1: because God is the one who produces growth. We aren't

1179
01:01:50,200 --> 01:01:52,760
Speaker 1: responsible for the growth. It goes on to say in

1180
01:01:52,760 --> 01:01:54,760
Speaker 1: the very next verse, verse seven. So neither the one

1181
01:01:54,760 --> 01:01:57,880
Speaker 1: who planned, nor the one who waters is anything. I

1182
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:02,040
Speaker 1: think we have a responsibility. But it's only God, it says,

1183
01:02:02,040 --> 01:02:05,240
Speaker 1: but only God who makes things grow. And that is

1184
01:02:05,280 --> 01:02:08,560
Speaker 1: so liberating as a parent. I mentioned earlier that I

1185
01:02:08,560 --> 01:02:11,919
Speaker 1: don't take the credit with my kids, who everybody comes

1186
01:02:11,920 --> 01:02:14,920
Speaker 1: and praises me, because they're on the mission stream and they're,

1187
01:02:15,240 --> 01:02:19,080
Speaker 1: you know, traveling to Asia and they're preaching internationally, and

1188
01:02:19,160 --> 01:02:21,880
Speaker 1: they're looking to go into missions and they love having

1189
01:02:21,880 --> 01:02:23,760
Speaker 1: them on the children's team. And I could take all

1190
01:02:23,760 --> 01:02:26,400
Speaker 1: that credit, but it's not me. I didn't cause that growth.

1191
01:02:26,880 --> 01:02:29,360
Speaker 1: I was just faithful to plant the seeds. And regardless

1192
01:02:29,400 --> 01:02:32,480
Speaker 1: of what outcome you get from those seeds, whether it's

1193
01:02:32,520 --> 01:02:38,240
Speaker 1: a season that may last for months, years, decades of

1194
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:42,040
Speaker 1: a child in the pig slop, was I faithful to

1195
01:02:42,080 --> 01:02:42,760
Speaker 1: plant the seeds.

1196
01:02:42,800 --> 01:02:44,600
Speaker 4: And there may be some in my audience who.

1197
01:02:44,440 --> 01:02:46,960
Speaker 1: Say, well, you know, I wasn't walking with the Lord

1198
01:02:47,040 --> 01:02:48,280
Speaker 1: as closely as I should have been.

1199
01:02:48,320 --> 01:02:50,400
Speaker 4: That's okay. God can redeem it.

1200
01:02:51,160 --> 01:02:53,560
Speaker 1: All. All we have to do is be faithful to

1201
01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:55,920
Speaker 1: plant the seeds, continue to nurture the seeds.

1202
01:02:56,240 --> 01:02:58,320
Speaker 4: Today we can go this day forward.

1203
01:02:58,800 --> 01:03:01,720
Speaker 1: And that's why my tagline for my show, you Guys

1204
01:03:01,760 --> 01:03:03,800
Speaker 1: wouldn't know this, but early on my tagline for my

1205
01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:07,960
Speaker 1: show was this was a podcast about raising godly kids

1206
01:03:08,040 --> 01:03:11,120
Speaker 1: in an ungodly world, which is a great thing to do.

1207
01:03:11,280 --> 01:03:12,160
Speaker 4: We all want to do that.

1208
01:03:12,720 --> 01:03:14,800
Speaker 1: But at some point a couple years into the show,

1209
01:03:14,840 --> 01:03:18,640
Speaker 1: I realized I don't have any control over whether they choose.

1210
01:03:18,400 --> 01:03:18,960
Speaker 4: To be godly.

1211
01:03:19,600 --> 01:03:21,520
Speaker 1: They may choose to be godly and they may not.

1212
01:03:21,680 --> 01:03:24,600
Speaker 1: All I have control over is being a godly parent.

1213
01:03:24,640 --> 01:03:27,160
Speaker 1: So I changed my tagline to this is a podcast

1214
01:03:27,160 --> 01:03:30,560
Speaker 1: about being a godly parent. That's all I have control over.

1215
01:03:31,080 --> 01:03:32,880
Speaker 1: So I'm going to plant the seeds. I'm going to

1216
01:03:33,040 --> 01:03:36,200
Speaker 1: nourish the seeds. But God is the one who is

1217
01:03:36,320 --> 01:03:40,240
Speaker 1: responsible for bringing the growth. And if we have to

1218
01:03:40,280 --> 01:03:42,680
Speaker 1: go through one of those seasons, I pray to God

1219
01:03:42,720 --> 01:03:44,280
Speaker 1: I don't have to anymore.

1220
01:03:44,320 --> 01:03:47,160
Speaker 4: But I'm just going to keep planting. I'm going to

1221
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:48,160
Speaker 4: keep nourishing.

1222
01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:51,560
Speaker 1: I'm going to keep that relationship open with my child

1223
01:03:52,080 --> 01:03:54,520
Speaker 1: so they always have that open door to come back.

1224
01:03:54,560 --> 01:03:55,960
Speaker 4: And sometimes, like you.

1225
01:03:55,920 --> 01:03:57,640
Speaker 1: Said, there may be a moment where you have to

1226
01:03:57,640 --> 01:04:00,480
Speaker 1: speak a hard word where it's it gets a little

1227
01:04:00,560 --> 01:04:03,880
Speaker 1: uncomfortable when you're speaking the truth into that situation. But

1228
01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:07,440
Speaker 1: it's the truth that sets our children free, and ultimately,

1229
01:04:07,480 --> 01:04:10,240
Speaker 1: I'm praying that all of my children embrace the truth.

1230
01:04:10,600 --> 01:04:13,240
Speaker 1: And I know that a resource like this, I am

1231
01:04:13,320 --> 01:04:14,800
Speaker 1: really excited.

1232
01:04:14,760 --> 01:04:15,360
Speaker 4: To check it out.

1233
01:04:15,400 --> 01:04:18,520
Speaker 1: Even further, I am really excited because I would love

1234
01:04:18,600 --> 01:04:23,120
Speaker 1: to learn to take the Jesus Storybook Bible to the

1235
01:04:23,160 --> 01:04:26,400
Speaker 1: next level and really dig deeper to see how cohesive

1236
01:04:26,440 --> 01:04:30,120
Speaker 1: this story is from Genesis to Revelation. So why don't

1237
01:04:30,120 --> 01:04:32,440
Speaker 1: you tell our listeners where they can learn more about

1238
01:04:32,640 --> 01:04:36,000
Speaker 1: Encountering God's Love from Genesis to Revelation and perhaps get

1239
01:04:36,000 --> 01:04:37,240
Speaker 1: a copy for themselves.

1240
01:04:37,600 --> 01:04:41,320
Speaker 3: Yes, you can go to Randyfrasey dot com is our

1241
01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:43,600
Speaker 3: landing page for all of the stuff that Rosanna and

1242
01:04:43,640 --> 01:04:46,720
Speaker 3: I have written and just other different journeys that we're

1243
01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:49,720
Speaker 3: on in terms of travel and all of that. Or

1244
01:04:49,760 --> 01:04:52,160
Speaker 3: you can go to Amazon or wherever you want to

1245
01:04:52,160 --> 01:04:56,240
Speaker 3: get Encountering God's Love and encourage you to pick it up. Also,

1246
01:04:56,520 --> 01:04:59,640
Speaker 3: you know, particularly for your homeschoolers, Encounter God's Love is

1247
01:04:59,640 --> 01:05:01,920
Speaker 3: a great fifty two week study that you can do

1248
01:05:02,360 --> 01:05:05,560
Speaker 3: by yourself, with a couple of friends, even with your

1249
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:08,800
Speaker 3: older kids probably. But then there's also the story Bible

1250
01:05:08,880 --> 01:05:12,800
Speaker 3: engagement campaign, which is a thirty one week fully integrated

1251
01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:16,280
Speaker 3: experience that you can do as a curriculum in your

1252
01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:20,520
Speaker 3: homeschool structure. That could be pretty helpful. And go to

1253
01:05:20,600 --> 01:05:23,000
Speaker 3: Randy Frasy dot com and you'll find all of.

1254
01:05:22,960 --> 01:05:26,200
Speaker 4: That, all of that there. That is awesome.

1255
01:05:26,240 --> 01:05:30,080
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for sharing your life, your stories,

1256
01:05:30,560 --> 01:05:34,160
Speaker 1: your incredible resources with our audience today. I am so

1257
01:05:34,320 --> 01:05:37,880
Speaker 1: moved and so blessed to really see a new God's

1258
01:05:38,200 --> 01:05:42,200
Speaker 1: upper story. Really, the life of faith is trusting that

1259
01:05:42,240 --> 01:05:45,840
Speaker 1: God is doing something good in that upper story even

1260
01:05:45,840 --> 01:05:49,080
Speaker 1: when our lower story is pretty messed up. Any final

1261
01:05:49,120 --> 01:05:52,800
Speaker 1: thoughts you have before we sign off here, I.

1262
01:05:52,800 --> 01:05:55,040
Speaker 3: Would say just that we're super grateful for what you're doing.

1263
01:05:55,080 --> 01:05:57,880
Speaker 3: We think it matters, and we just want to root

1264
01:05:57,960 --> 01:06:01,640
Speaker 3: you on as well as is to pray for you

1265
01:06:02,720 --> 01:06:05,080
Speaker 3: in where you're atting your lower story right now, that

1266
01:06:05,160 --> 01:06:09,000
Speaker 3: God would reveal himself to you and do what he's

1267
01:06:09,040 --> 01:06:11,800
Speaker 3: done faithful through all the characters of the scripture.

1268
01:06:13,600 --> 01:06:17,160
Speaker 1: Thank you, Thank you so much, Randy and Roseanne. It

1269
01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:20,840
Speaker 1: was great. It's been an honor to have you here

1270
01:06:21,000 --> 01:06:22,560
Speaker 1: and parents listening. I just want to leave you with

1271
01:06:22,600 --> 01:06:24,800
Speaker 1: this thought. Your kids don't need you to be a

1272
01:06:24,800 --> 01:06:27,800
Speaker 1: perfect Bible teacher, because you're not going to be. They

1273
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:29,440
Speaker 1: don't need you to be a perfect parent. You're not

1274
01:06:29,440 --> 01:06:30,960
Speaker 1: going to be done either. They don't need you to

1275
01:06:30,960 --> 01:06:33,440
Speaker 1: have every answer to get it right every time. What

1276
01:06:33,520 --> 01:06:36,640
Speaker 1: they need the most is a parent who is walking

1277
01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:39,800
Speaker 1: with God, who's growing in his word, who's wrestling out

1278
01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:42,920
Speaker 1: these tough seasons when the lower story in the upper

1279
01:06:42,920 --> 01:06:45,560
Speaker 1: story seem to be conflicting with each other, and you're

1280
01:06:45,600 --> 01:06:47,200
Speaker 1: trying to figure out how in the world can this

1281
01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:49,720
Speaker 1: lower story for do something good in God's upper story.

1282
01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:52,440
Speaker 4: Well, that's why he's God. He can do that.

1283
01:06:52,960 --> 01:06:57,080
Speaker 1: Just as Joseph said in Genesis fifty, verse twenty, what

1284
01:06:57,160 --> 01:06:59,840
Speaker 1: the enemy meant for harm, God can use for good,

1285
01:06:59,840 --> 01:07:02,200
Speaker 1: and you will use it for good no matter what

1286
01:07:02,360 --> 01:07:03,960
Speaker 1: is happening in your lower stories.

1287
01:07:04,040 --> 01:07:05,160
Speaker 4: So determine that.

1288
01:07:05,080 --> 01:07:07,600
Speaker 1: You're going to be a part of the big story

1289
01:07:07,640 --> 01:07:11,800
Speaker 1: that God is writing in human history, and encourage your

1290
01:07:11,920 --> 01:07:16,640
Speaker 1: children to do the same. And always remember God gave

1291
01:07:16,720 --> 01:07:21,200
Speaker 1: you your kids, your specific kids for a reason. That's

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01:07:21,240 --> 01:07:25,800
Speaker 1: because you hold the key to unlocking God created them

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Speaker 1: to be. We'll see you next.

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Speaker 8: Time, Christian parent. Crazy World is a production of life,

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Speaker 8: audio and Salem Media. If you liked what you heard today,

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Speaker 8: please take a second to rate and review this podcast

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Speaker 8: in your favorite podcast app so that more listeners like

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Speaker 8: you can find the show. For more faith filled, inspirational podcasts,

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Speaker 8: visit us at lifeaudio dot com.