1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:03,440 Speaker 1: He's editor in chief of Breitbart News and a New 2 00:00:03,560 --> 00:00:07,000 Speaker 1: York Times best selling author, and on this podcast he 3 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 1: brings deep research, prescient analysis, and. 4 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:14,880 Speaker 2: World class guests. He's Alex Marlow, and this is the 5 00:00:14,920 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 2: Alex Marlow Show. 6 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:17,279 Speaker 3: All right. 7 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:19,239 Speaker 1: Very pleased to be joined by my London bureau chief, 8 00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:22,480 Speaker 1: the wonder for Oliver JJJ Lane, who is working for 9 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:25,119 Speaker 1: very long time and incredible work for us at breit Bart. 10 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:27,480 Speaker 1: And Oliver, I want to start talking Epstein Royal family 11 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:31,760 Speaker 1: with you implications, but hopefully, god willing, we will have 12 00:00:31,800 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 1: some time to talk also about perhaps a new populist 13 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 1: anti establishment government in the UK. 14 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:40,520 Speaker 4: It could be on the horizon, who knows. 15 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:43,920 Speaker 1: It's not inconceivable, which is crazy to say, but possible. 16 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:45,879 Speaker 1: So we'll get to that a little bit. But let's 17 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:49,160 Speaker 1: start with the big stuff. The royal family completely rocked. 18 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:52,240 Speaker 1: There's been so much smoke around Princey Andrew and for 19 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 1: so long King Charles's brother. But I have to admit, 20 00:00:56,360 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 1: when I woke up this morning and saw that he'd 21 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:01,480 Speaker 1: been literally arrested, I didn't think this happened to people 22 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:05,640 Speaker 1: like this. In historically speaking, it doesn't, so tell us 23 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:07,600 Speaker 1: what happened in. 24 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:10,039 Speaker 4: Were usually shocked as well. 25 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:14,640 Speaker 3: Well, not shocks as such, because I think this has 26 00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:16,280 Speaker 3: been coming for a long time. But I think if 27 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:19,240 Speaker 3: we were surprised, then we were probably just about as 28 00:01:19,240 --> 00:01:22,959 Speaker 3: surprised as the King was. As we learn from British 29 00:01:23,040 --> 00:01:26,200 Speaker 3: state media, who of course have all their fingers in 30 00:01:26,240 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 3: all the government pies, shall we say, they're on the inside, 31 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 3: they're reporting that the King had not been told in 32 00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:35,240 Speaker 3: advance this arrest was going to happen today, so as 33 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:39,800 Speaker 3: long time watchers of bright bart News will know, the 34 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:42,600 Speaker 3: company's sometimes royal correspondence. I'm a great fan of the 35 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:45,280 Speaker 3: royal family, of the King, of his late mother, of 36 00:01:45,280 --> 00:01:48,720 Speaker 3: the Queen, and you might therefore suppose that for me, 37 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:51,600 Speaker 3: today's like a dark day, like to see a senior 38 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:53,000 Speaker 3: member of the royal family arrested. 39 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:55,720 Speaker 2: But actually I'm feeling pretty upbeat about it. 40 00:01:56,320 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 3: The fact that I live in a country where the 41 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 3: police kind of rest the brother of the king, and 42 00:02:02,480 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 3: the fact the King didn't know in advance is not 43 00:02:05,080 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 3: a scandal, and everybody says, actually that's good, that's the. 44 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 2: Law working the way it should. I feeling good about that. 45 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 1: So I totally agree it's kind of an amazing flex 46 00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 1: for you guys to be able to have actual justice, 47 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:22,200 Speaker 1: perhaps getting served, even for literal monarchs, is pretty great. 48 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:23,359 Speaker 4: It's very impressive. 49 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:28,080 Speaker 1: But let's talk about Prince Andrew's history. He's not really 50 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:29,920 Speaker 1: thought of as a good guy and hasn't been for 51 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: a very long time. Can you give US Americans some 52 00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 1: of the background? Today's show sponsored by Lear Capital, the 53 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:40,320 Speaker 1: precious metals leader since nineteen ninety seven and only company 54 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 1: I trust and recommend to my family, friends and viewers. 55 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:46,920 Speaker 1: Visit Lear alex dot com. 56 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:49,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's kind of a sad thing to say that 57 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:52,720 Speaker 3: in a way. Obviously, no sympathy if any of these 58 00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 3: things are proven true, which I hasten to mad nothing 59 00:02:55,360 --> 00:03:00,720 Speaker 3: has yet. It's all claims and counterclaims. But once Prince Andrew, 60 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:03,440 Speaker 3: as he was then is no longer was something of 61 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 3: a hero in this country. He was a proper serving 62 00:03:07,840 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 3: naval pilot. He flew helicopters in the Falklands War, and 63 00:03:12,400 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 3: not in a sort of rear echolon sort of way. 64 00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 2: He was on the front line. 65 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:19,440 Speaker 3: He was a real combat pilot, commanded a real warship 66 00:03:19,600 --> 00:03:22,960 Speaker 3: after that in the Royal Navy. Left the Navy in 67 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:25,799 Speaker 3: two thousand and one as a commander, and he had 68 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:30,800 Speaker 3: this kind of like action man kind of figure, you know, 69 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 3: impression in the. 70 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 2: UK, and that's the way. 71 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:35,200 Speaker 3: People thought about him, and it seems to have basically 72 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:37,680 Speaker 3: have all gone downhill at that point. I think possibly 73 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:39,680 Speaker 3: him being in the military was the best place for him. 74 00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 2: Gave him an outlet for his. 75 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 3: You know, whatever energy he has he needs to deal with. 76 00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:47,320 Speaker 3: And it's at that point, in two thousand and one 77 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:50,560 Speaker 3: that he was appointed a trade envoy for the UK government. 78 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:51,480 Speaker 2: We had a left wing. 79 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 3: Labor government back then, and I guess that was their 80 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:57,440 Speaker 3: way of doing something for the monarchy and giving him 81 00:03:57,440 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 3: a job, using him in a way that was used 82 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:03,480 Speaker 3: to the government because clearly they thought he it wasn't 83 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:07,640 Speaker 3: gonna be very good at the cutting ribbons business opening churches. 84 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 3: Rather get him out, get him abroad, get him selling 85 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:14,760 Speaker 3: British industry abroad, and that you know that clearly hasn't 86 00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:16,320 Speaker 3: worked out that well. I mean, he was known as 87 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,400 Speaker 3: air Miles Andy back then because he was just putting 88 00:04:19,440 --> 00:04:22,039 Speaker 3: so much on the government credit card paying for all 89 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:24,760 Speaker 3: those flights, is all those trade missions. And it's during 90 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:29,640 Speaker 3: that time we now believe so these allegations claim that 91 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 3: he became friends with Jeffrey Epstein and it was information 92 00:04:33,720 --> 00:04:37,480 Speaker 3: that he then Prince Andrew was getting from these trade 93 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:40,920 Speaker 3: missions that he was then allegedly passing on to Epstein. 94 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 3: Because there's always been this question mark over Jeffrey Epstein 95 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 3: hasn't there, which is, Okay, he's this billionaire financier and 96 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:51,599 Speaker 3: he's using this money, his enormous wealth, to buy these 97 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:55,560 Speaker 3: incredible properties which are then used to law powerful people 98 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:59,920 Speaker 3: and beautiful women allegedly. I mean, I guess we know that, 99 00:05:00,200 --> 00:05:02,520 Speaker 3: I'd have to say allegedly on that one, you know, 100 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:04,920 Speaker 3: to bring them together, and that's where the comprom as 101 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 3: is made. The question was always where did Epstein's money 102 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 3: come from? And assuming any of this is true, we 103 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:12,560 Speaker 3: don't know yet. It may be that some of this 104 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:15,840 Speaker 3: money came from the fact that he had advanced information 105 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 3: about global affairs that he was getting from these people 106 00:05:18,320 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 3: in his network, and one of these people may have 107 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:23,080 Speaker 3: been Prince Andrew because he was going around the world 108 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:27,239 Speaker 3: on these trade missions and he was sending reports about 109 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:29,560 Speaker 3: what he was up to to Epstein, and Epstein would 110 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:32,360 Speaker 3: have information about this stuff before anybody else, and that's 111 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:35,599 Speaker 3: a great place to be if you're a trader, if 112 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:39,960 Speaker 3: you're in the market, So that is yes. 113 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:42,120 Speaker 1: Ikes, yeah, So this is where I want to go 114 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:45,280 Speaker 1: into a little bit of the tail into his history, 115 00:05:45,560 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 1: which you've been kind of have to furnish me with 116 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 1: some of this stuff. But he allegedly passed confidential information 117 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:56,280 Speaker 1: on his visits to Singapore, Vietnam, Hong Kong and change then. 118 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:59,040 Speaker 4: Which is in China. So what do we know? 119 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 1: What is speggi and where do you get this information? 120 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 1: What is he passing? All was very dirty stuff and 121 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 1: reputationally very deleterious. 122 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,800 Speaker 3: Very indeed, I mean, where this has all come from 123 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:12,680 Speaker 3: is the latest tranch of Epstein emails, because of course 124 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:15,599 Speaker 3: Prince Andrew and Epstein have been linked publicly for a 125 00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:19,040 Speaker 3: very long time. In fact, Prince at the then Prince 126 00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:22,719 Speaker 3: Andrew left his trade role back in twenty eleven because 127 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 3: he'd been photographed in i think December twenty ten, walking 128 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:29,760 Speaker 3: in public in Central Park in New York with Jeffrey Epstein, 129 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:31,800 Speaker 3: very shortly after he was released from prison for the 130 00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 3: first time for those child sex offenses. 131 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:35,680 Speaker 2: And obviously this was. 132 00:06:36,160 --> 00:06:39,200 Speaker 3: Like a catastrophically stupid thing to do, to be seen 133 00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:41,440 Speaker 3: in public with somebody with that kind of record as 134 00:06:41,480 --> 00:06:45,159 Speaker 3: a high profile member of the royal family and clearly 135 00:06:45,160 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 3: being buddy buddy with him. So that was the point 136 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:50,479 Speaker 3: at which I think we first get this idea that 137 00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 3: these two are linked. The photographs come out, This is 138 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:56,360 Speaker 3: twenty eleven, this is fifteen years ago now. But now, 139 00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:58,920 Speaker 3: as I say, we have this latest trunch of emails 140 00:06:58,960 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 3: came out of the past couple of weeks, and we 141 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 3: see the correspondence as it happened in real time back 142 00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:08,000 Speaker 3: then between Epstein and Prince Andrew as he was, and 143 00:07:08,040 --> 00:07:10,760 Speaker 3: that is where we see. It's the it's the attachments 144 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:13,400 Speaker 3: in the emails and the sort of interesting sort of 145 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 3: thing from that. These aren't reports that Andrew wrote himself. 146 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 3: There were reports about what he was doing. They were 147 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 3: written for him by one of his staffers. He would 148 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:24,880 Speaker 3: then be emailed the report Prince Andrew, and he would 149 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:27,560 Speaker 3: then be forwarding it to Epstein within minutes of it 150 00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:30,360 Speaker 3: being generated. It was just like a reflexive, instant thing. 151 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 3: This is what the emails purport to show. Like I say, 152 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:35,400 Speaker 3: none of this has been proven in court, and just 153 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 3: you know, a quick note, like an admin note here 154 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 3: obviously Prince Andrew for Prince Andrew Andrew Manbatten Windsor is 155 00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:44,320 Speaker 3: now called, has been arrested in the UK. The police 156 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:47,800 Speaker 3: investigation is active, as they say, which means that I 157 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:51,200 Speaker 3: am now bound by contempt of court rules. So yeah, 158 00:07:51,240 --> 00:07:53,160 Speaker 3: I'm limited in what I can what I can say 159 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:54,760 Speaker 3: because I don't want to go to jail, because that's 160 00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:55,920 Speaker 3: the way the law works in the UK. 161 00:07:56,040 --> 00:07:58,160 Speaker 4: So yeah, yeah, put some more. 162 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:01,520 Speaker 1: I don't think people are completely familiar with that. And 163 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:03,680 Speaker 1: that's important to note that it's the now that this 164 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:06,920 Speaker 1: is happening. It actually means there's going to be this 165 00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 1: huge haze around everything because people aren't allowed to say things. 166 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 4: What are the things? Were? Types of things? Can't you say? 167 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 3: Well, so stuff that's already in the public domain. I 168 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:19,720 Speaker 3: can discuss the fact that things have happened or things 169 00:08:19,760 --> 00:08:23,280 Speaker 3: are claimed, but I couldn't as I've been I'm sure 170 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 3: you've noticed so careful to say. So far, everything is alleged. 171 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:29,240 Speaker 3: Everything is claimed. The emails purport to show, because of 172 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:31,200 Speaker 3: course it's not been proven in court that these emails 173 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:33,200 Speaker 3: are real, that it was the actual Prince Andrew who 174 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:36,880 Speaker 3: sent those emails. And that's that's what's going to be coming, 175 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:39,560 Speaker 3: I'm sure in the coming weeks and months. So the 176 00:08:39,559 --> 00:08:42,520 Speaker 3: position where we are now right this instant is that 177 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 3: Prince Andrew was arrested. I keep on calling Prince Andrew, 178 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 3: but was going to stick with it because it's everybody 179 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:48,679 Speaker 3: knows them by that name. It was arrested earlier this 180 00:08:48,720 --> 00:08:51,640 Speaker 3: morning at his home in Norfolk on the there's a 181 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 3: royal estate up there called Sandringham. The British police have 182 00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:58,280 Speaker 3: twenty four hours to question him. At that point, they've 183 00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 3: got to make a decision. Are they going to charte 184 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:03,240 Speaker 3: or they're going to cut him loose. It's quite possible 185 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:05,360 Speaker 3: that he'll be released this evening so he's not forced 186 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:08,200 Speaker 3: to sleep overnight in a police cell. But then again, 187 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:10,160 Speaker 3: they could keep him until tomorrow morning if they feel 188 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 3: like they need to hold him for questioning that long. 189 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:16,200 Speaker 2: My instinct is that they may not charge now. 190 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:20,920 Speaker 3: It could be released pending further inquiries. But the important 191 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:23,400 Speaker 3: thing for the police and for the investigation now is 192 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 3: that they've made the arrest. I believe they have seized 193 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 3: Prince Andrew's digital devices, so they're going to be able 194 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:32,880 Speaker 3: to pry into these now. Look at that digital paper 195 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 3: trail and sort of get the other side because of 196 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 3: course we have the server from Epstein which has been 197 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 3: released in the US, which is what got all this going. 198 00:09:42,200 --> 00:09:44,559 Speaker 3: But there's always the other side of what's going on. 199 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:47,719 Speaker 3: What else Prince Andrew's discussing at the time, and it's 200 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:49,240 Speaker 3: you know, we just don't know what else is going 201 00:09:49,280 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 3: to come out, what's going to come out in court. 202 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 3: We've got to wait and see. 203 00:09:52,240 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 1: Okay, so do he's one of the guys over and 204 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:59,240 Speaker 1: this is what's so important that actually is sort of 205 00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:01,679 Speaker 1: accues of p to feel you, which is funny because 206 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 1: it's not really what it is. He's actually because I 207 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:06,920 Speaker 1: know the age consent in the UK is sixteen, and 208 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:09,080 Speaker 1: I want to be crystal clear for legal purposes, we're 209 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:13,880 Speaker 1: talking about him perhaps praying on some of older miners 210 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 1: or do we way we define them as miners in 211 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:19,360 Speaker 1: the US. But it's interesting because as we track the 212 00:10:19,400 --> 00:10:27,000 Speaker 1: Epstein stuff obsessively in America, we are not. We're it's 213 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 1: very rare anyone has any is getting accused of being pedophiles. 214 00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:33,280 Speaker 1: We've been wrapped. We even round up a single pedophile 215 00:10:33,320 --> 00:10:35,679 Speaker 1: as far as I can tell. As revenue conversation from 216 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:38,800 Speaker 1: all the latest drops, which is kind of surprising even 217 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:42,080 Speaker 1: to me, who runs skeptical about everything the government releases. 218 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 1: But he's one of the guys who actually is a 219 00:10:44,440 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 1: cue of praying on the women, what is what do 220 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:49,760 Speaker 1: we know or what is being alleged? 221 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:52,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, actually because in 222 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:54,800 Speaker 3: terms again going back to what we could talk about 223 00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:56,520 Speaker 3: and can't talk about something that's been in the air 224 00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:59,679 Speaker 3: for a very long time, going back to the last 225 00:10:59,760 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 3: day following that those photographs that were taken of Epstein 226 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 3: Prince Andrew together in New York in twenty ten, was 227 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:12,880 Speaker 3: these allegations by a woman called Virginia Jeffrey that she 228 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:17,240 Speaker 3: had been sexually trafficked by Epstein to Prince Andrew, for 229 00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 3: Prince Andrew to use rape whatever word you want to 230 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:24,000 Speaker 3: use for that, and that again has never been proven 231 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 3: in court. Now, obviously he hasn't been arrested on anything 232 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:30,680 Speaker 3: to do with that. The arrests are over misuse of 233 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:34,080 Speaker 3: public office, over the corruption allegations. 234 00:11:34,440 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 2: But it's the police. 235 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 3: Have his computers, can I presume go through his files 236 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:42,400 Speaker 3: figure out what exactly been going on. This is the 237 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:44,360 Speaker 3: kind of thing I'm talking about when it's like possibly 238 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:48,040 Speaker 3: other things will follow. I cannot even begin to imagine 239 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:51,200 Speaker 3: or say that they will, but anything is possible at 240 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:51,640 Speaker 3: this stage. 241 00:11:51,679 --> 00:11:54,720 Speaker 2: But yeah, the Virginia Jeffrey thing. 242 00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 3: Has been it's been in the air a long time, 243 00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,200 Speaker 3: and there have been claims and claims and nothing has 244 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:02,080 Speaker 3: ever been proven. But that we believe is the reason 245 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:04,880 Speaker 3: that the King cut Prince Andrew out of the royal 246 00:12:04,920 --> 00:12:07,920 Speaker 3: family progressively and his mother before him, for that matter, 247 00:12:07,960 --> 00:12:10,959 Speaker 3: progressively over the past five or so years, to the 248 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 3: sort of the final conclusion of that last year where 249 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 3: he lost his actual royal title, he ceased to be 250 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 3: a prince at all and became plain old Andrew Manbattan 251 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:23,320 Speaker 3: windsor sermons of his grandfather's. 252 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:27,559 Speaker 2: All right, so the royal family Yes. 253 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:30,000 Speaker 4: No, no, nine, I'm sorry interrupt. 254 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:30,800 Speaker 2: No, not at all. 255 00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:34,720 Speaker 3: I think the royal family have been a pretty proactive 256 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:38,000 Speaker 3: in this, getting well ahead of it. And I don't 257 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:40,359 Speaker 3: think there's any indication that they knew that this specifically 258 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:42,280 Speaker 3: was coming. Like I say, they didn't know this rest 259 00:12:42,320 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 3: was coming. I don't think there's any indication that they 260 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:49,000 Speaker 3: knew there'd been malpractice in public office before those emails 261 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:51,080 Speaker 3: came out. I think that quite possible, was a surprise 262 00:12:51,120 --> 00:12:54,439 Speaker 3: to everyone. But like I say, there's been these claims, 263 00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:57,560 Speaker 3: these rumors swelling for a long time. And just to 264 00:12:57,559 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 3: go back to what you were saying about, like the 265 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 3: child sex abuse angle in terms of British law, I 266 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 3: don't think there's any suggestion that there's been any sex 267 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 3: abuse of children, but that the person that allegedly he 268 00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:16,400 Speaker 3: had sex with had been trafficked for the purpose of 269 00:13:17,280 --> 00:13:20,960 Speaker 3: So that's the problem now. I think there's also a 270 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:23,480 Speaker 3: suggestion that he might have also had sex with this 271 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 3: woman in the United States, and it might have been 272 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,600 Speaker 3: in a state where she wasn't legally of age. It's 273 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:32,719 Speaker 3: very borderline stuff. I don't want to like, you know this, 274 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:36,240 Speaker 3: it's been proven in court. 275 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 4: Does this guy do anything good? 276 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:42,000 Speaker 1: Does he make any meaningful contributions to humanity as far 277 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:42,920 Speaker 1: as we can tell. 278 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:45,200 Speaker 3: Well, you know, like we started out, you know, he 279 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:47,679 Speaker 3: was this it was a bona farde war hero once 280 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:52,080 Speaker 3: upon a time and did this trade and industry thing. 281 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,480 Speaker 3: But as it turns out, he may have been using 282 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 3: that role to feather the nests of himself and friends, 283 00:13:58,600 --> 00:13:59,559 Speaker 3: possibly allegedly. 284 00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:02,360 Speaker 2: So some of you win, some of your lose. 285 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 4: So who could get dragon to this? What are the implications? 286 00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 1: Who are let's talk I want to take on the 287 00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:14,200 Speaker 1: royal family and then I want to talk about the 288 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:19,040 Speaker 1: labor government, any perhaps figures in there who could get 289 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 1: wrapped up on this. 290 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:21,080 Speaker 4: But let's talk about what does it mean for the 291 00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 4: royal family. 292 00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, let's do the royal family first. So, like I 293 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:27,040 Speaker 3: was just touching on, I think they've been pretty proactive 294 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 3: in dealing with this and getting like ahead of what's happening. 295 00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:33,280 Speaker 2: So what has. 296 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:37,040 Speaker 3: Happened today is thoroughly extraordinary and there is no president 297 00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:39,560 Speaker 3: for it in modern times. And this is a bit 298 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:43,000 Speaker 3: of a gripe of mine because we've had some royal 299 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 3: commentators in the UK today saying there is no president 300 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:49,160 Speaker 3: for this at all, which is quite obviously patently false. 301 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 2: We've had a relatively stable run. 302 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,000 Speaker 3: Of decades in the UK with our royal family, especially 303 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 3: compared to Europe, where most of their royles have been murdered. 304 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:01,200 Speaker 3: But if you look at the longs stretch of history 305 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 3: on the British Isles where there have been several royal families, 306 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 3: several monarchies, kings having to deal with their troublesome brothers 307 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:10,280 Speaker 3: has been the norm, it has not. 308 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 2: Been the exception. 309 00:15:12,120 --> 00:15:15,960 Speaker 3: And in fact, I was amused to note the police 310 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 3: arrested Andrew today, which is bad luck for him because 311 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:21,640 Speaker 3: it's his sixty sixth birthday, and I thought, well, yeah, 312 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 3: they could have arrested him yesterday or tomorrow, to not 313 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:26,040 Speaker 3: arrested on his birthday. 314 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 2: Not but of course justice works that way. 315 00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:32,320 Speaker 3: But there's an even crazier anniversary yesterday, which is that 316 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:35,320 Speaker 3: in fourteen seventy eight, the Duke of Clarence was. 317 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:39,000 Speaker 2: Executed. This is the brother of the king. 318 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:42,320 Speaker 3: So in terms of inauspicious dates, I think arresting the 319 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:46,240 Speaker 3: Prince yesterday would have been even worse. Anyway, I'm getting 320 00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 3: lost down a one way track here. The point is, 321 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 3: how does this touch the Royal family? This is extraordinary, 322 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:54,120 Speaker 3: This is without president in modern times. But I'm not 323 00:15:54,160 --> 00:15:57,400 Speaker 3: feeling like there's this sense of like genuine crisis surrounding 324 00:15:57,440 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 3: the Royal family because they air gapped themselves from Prince 325 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:03,760 Speaker 3: Andrew last year, and so this guys no longer a 326 00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:06,920 Speaker 3: royal prince. This guy is no longer working with the firm. 327 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:09,800 Speaker 3: We've ostracized him. I think they've been seen to have 328 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 3: done the right thing. Now, who knows what follows. Like 329 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:15,280 Speaker 3: I say, the police are going to be doing their investigation. 330 00:16:15,400 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 3: Charges may follow, and it may get worse from here, 331 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 3: but right now it doesn't seem that bad for the Royals. 332 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:21,920 Speaker 2: In terms of politics. 333 00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 3: If I were Peter Mandelson, I would probably be pretty 334 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 3: well panicking right now. Peter Mandlson, of course, the former 335 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 3: ambassador from the United Kingdom to the United States, a 336 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:37,120 Speaker 3: former European Commissioner, a very big, very influential figure in 337 00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 3: the Labor Party. This guy has been running the Labor 338 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 3: Party from the shadows on and off basically as long 339 00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:45,800 Speaker 3: as I've been alive. A very powerful and consequential person 340 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:49,920 Speaker 3: who also has been revealed to have and again allegedly 341 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 3: in the emails in the Epstein emails release over the 342 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 3: past few weeks, allegedly revealed to have been sending confidential 343 00:16:57,360 --> 00:17:02,560 Speaker 3: information to friend Jeff Free to get him give him that. Yea, 344 00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:04,639 Speaker 3: that scoop on what's happening in the world, what the 345 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:06,840 Speaker 3: British government's going to be doing tomorrow, which is a 346 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:08,439 Speaker 3: great way to make money if you know that. 347 00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:12,680 Speaker 1: All right, So, people who listen to my show. Please, Yeah, yeah, 348 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:15,679 Speaker 1: people listen my show or no. Peter Mandelsson's name. I've 349 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:17,199 Speaker 1: brought him up a number of times. All right, So 350 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 1: Peter Mandelson, British strategist, Labor Party stalwart for a very 351 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,480 Speaker 1: long time. He is someone who's been wrapped up in this, 352 00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 1: and he's someone who you know for decades has just 353 00:17:27,440 --> 00:17:32,320 Speaker 1: been a stalwart in British politics. Remind people of his background. 354 00:17:32,600 --> 00:17:35,560 Speaker 1: And he had a close friendship with Epstein that I 355 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:38,480 Speaker 1: think we've known about, but it continued even well after 356 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:41,680 Speaker 1: his conviction. He's wrapped up in this as well. 357 00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:43,120 Speaker 4: Give me his role. Break that down. 358 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 1: If a red light therapy device is cheap, there's a reason, 359 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:49,440 Speaker 1: and it's not a good one. Most red light devices 360 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:51,560 Speaker 1: on the market are built to hit a low price point, 361 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 1: not to deliver real results. 362 00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:55,200 Speaker 4: They use weaker. 363 00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 1: Components, inconsistent light output, and non medical grade standards. That's 364 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,320 Speaker 1: so many of them feel underwhelming or stop working altogether. 365 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:07,760 Speaker 1: Flashy ads and big promises can't make up for poor performance. 366 00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 1: The super Palm is medical grade built for consistent, deep 367 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 1: penetrating light that professionals trust. That means stronger results, better reliability, 368 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: and real relief. You can feel, not guesswork. It's also 369 00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 1: easy to use handheld and comfortable, making it simple to 370 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:28,600 Speaker 1: add your daily routine as I have. I try cheaper 371 00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 1: devices made in China and didn't feel anything with the 372 00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 1: super Palm. The pain in my knee and back finally 373 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:38,159 Speaker 1: eased after just a few weeks. 374 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:40,719 Speaker 4: It's the first one that actually worked. 375 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:44,520 Speaker 1: SunPower led backs it with a money back guarantee and 376 00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:47,800 Speaker 1: a two year warranty, something most competitors just can't offer. 377 00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:52,120 Speaker 1: And it's made in America. Use code Marlowe for ten 378 00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 1: percent off today. Stop settling for low quality devices and 379 00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:59,360 Speaker 1: upgrade to real medical grade relief. 380 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:02,280 Speaker 3: So Mandelson is like one of these grand old men 381 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:05,439 Speaker 3: of the Labor Party. He created New Labor basically one 382 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:07,359 Speaker 3: of the very key figures in that back in the 383 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:11,439 Speaker 3: nineteen nineties, which pulled Labor away from its working class roots, 384 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:17,040 Speaker 3: reinvented it as a metropolitan elite party, something for university 385 00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:20,040 Speaker 3: educated people rather than people who you know, work for 386 00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:20,440 Speaker 3: a living. 387 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:22,160 Speaker 2: But frankly, and it. 388 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:26,440 Speaker 3: Was through that mechanism that he created that Labour won 389 00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:29,159 Speaker 3: that enormous election victory in ninety seven and carried on 390 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:31,359 Speaker 3: all the way through to twenty ten, huge run of 391 00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:33,880 Speaker 3: power for them and very unusual for Labor which don't 392 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,640 Speaker 3: normally do that well of elections in this country. So 393 00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:41,679 Speaker 3: a very consequential, a very important person. And just like 394 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:47,600 Speaker 3: again we allegedly believe Prince Andrew, he had this friendship 395 00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:48,520 Speaker 3: with Jeffrey Epstein. 396 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:49,360 Speaker 2: It was drawn to this. 397 00:19:49,400 --> 00:19:53,159 Speaker 3: Year, this powerful man, and that meant that he was 398 00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:57,719 Speaker 3: still in contact with him after Epstein's release from prison 399 00:19:58,640 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 3: for the first time for. 400 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:03,159 Speaker 2: Child sex abuse crimes or whatever it was. 401 00:20:03,960 --> 00:20:07,679 Speaker 3: So we have that same very similar sort of story 402 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:12,880 Speaker 3: allegedly where after Epstein's release from prison, Mandelsson is emailing 403 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:14,680 Speaker 3: him saying I much you're looking forward to seeing him 404 00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:18,320 Speaker 3: meeting up And again it's something that we've known about 405 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 3: for a long time. 406 00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:21,280 Speaker 2: And this is the big scandal that's hit the British. 407 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,280 Speaker 3: Government over the past couple of weeks, which is that 408 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 3: they had no excuse whatsoever to say when we appoint 409 00:20:27,119 --> 00:20:30,600 Speaker 3: reappointed Mandelsson to this big job for him being the 410 00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:34,720 Speaker 3: ambassador to the US, one of the most consequential diplomatic postings. 411 00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:37,840 Speaker 3: And by the way, also because he's this incredibly important 412 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:42,400 Speaker 3: person inside the Labor Party, he was helping Starmer run 413 00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:45,240 Speaker 3: the government allegedly during this time while he was ambassador. 414 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 3: They knew beforehand because everybody knew it was in the newspapers. 415 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:53,200 Speaker 3: It was a single Google search away that he had 416 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:56,199 Speaker 3: this close relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. And then when all 417 00:20:56,240 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 3: these latest emails came out, it made everybody look at 418 00:20:59,080 --> 00:21:02,640 Speaker 3: it again and go, yeah, why is this guy? Why 419 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:05,400 Speaker 3: is this guy so powerful in the Labor Party? Why 420 00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:07,479 Speaker 3: do you keep on letting him get away with this? 421 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:10,800 Speaker 3: So in terms of like people who should be watching 422 00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:14,280 Speaker 3: their backs at this stage, you have Beata Mandleton, because 423 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:19,200 Speaker 3: the police began their investigation into Mandelssohn and Prince Andrew 424 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:20,640 Speaker 3: at about the same time, within. 425 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:21,400 Speaker 2: A few hours of each other. 426 00:21:21,920 --> 00:21:25,600 Speaker 3: So if assuming any of this is true, assuming the 427 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,240 Speaker 3: police have been looking at this evidence and making their decisions, 428 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:31,359 Speaker 3: could we assume that Mandleson will getting a knock on 429 00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:34,080 Speaker 3: the door shortly. I think it's possible he certainly the 430 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 3: police have certainly already raided his house, taken away cartons 431 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:39,760 Speaker 3: of documents, they have been considering those. And then you 432 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,360 Speaker 3: have the political implications for the broader Labor Party and 433 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:47,359 Speaker 3: the new attack line just today from Nigel Farage as 434 00:21:47,359 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 3: he's launched a new whole new website, and I think 435 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:52,720 Speaker 3: that the uilist thing like labour has a problem dot 436 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 3: org and you. 437 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:54,040 Speaker 2: Go through to that. 438 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:57,960 Speaker 3: The new tagline that Farage is pushing is that labor 439 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:01,520 Speaker 3: has a pedophile problem. And this is not just with 440 00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:05,959 Speaker 3: the Mandelson issue and his closeness to Jeffrey Epstein, although 441 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 3: to be perfectly clear, at this stage there's no suggestion 442 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:12,120 Speaker 3: that Mandelson was involved in the sexual side of things. 443 00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:15,000 Speaker 3: It was a purely business and social relation as far 444 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:18,680 Speaker 3: as we know, so the claims go. But there's layer 445 00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:23,600 Speaker 3: upon within labor of very senior labor people who are 446 00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 3: alleged to have been close to child sex offenders, have defended. 447 00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 2: Child sex offenders. 448 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:32,000 Speaker 3: And then you have like the broader problem that's facing 449 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:33,560 Speaker 3: the UK that you know, you and I Alex have 450 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:35,920 Speaker 3: been talking about for as long as we've known each other, 451 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:39,520 Speaker 3: which is that in labor controlled areas of the UK, 452 00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:42,800 Speaker 3: these former mining towns that are stray trinally labor where 453 00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:45,200 Speaker 3: they've had a great deal of mass migration, where young 454 00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:51,080 Speaker 3: children have been gone through war crime level horrors at 455 00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 3: the hands of what they call predominantly Pakistani rape gangs 456 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,720 Speaker 3: and Labor appears to have covered that up in these areas. 457 00:22:57,760 --> 00:23:00,240 Speaker 3: So this is what reformers saying. Now Labor has a 458 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:01,200 Speaker 3: creedophile problem. 459 00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:04,199 Speaker 1: So but is it a pedophile problem or is it 460 00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:06,439 Speaker 1: a doing business with a bad guy problem? And this 461 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:08,480 Speaker 1: is the whole trick with the Epstein staff where people 462 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:11,040 Speaker 1: who are not obsessed with it can get lost. Is 463 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:15,320 Speaker 1: that because we're not really arresting any pedophiles. It seems like, 464 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:18,640 Speaker 1: so what are the business connections that these guys could 465 00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:21,359 Speaker 1: have with Epstein that are illegal? We know Epstein was 466 00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 1: a bad guy, an evil guy, even but I just 467 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:28,120 Speaker 1: don't It's very hard to say what are. 468 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 4: The takeaways that we know to this point of or 469 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:30,440 Speaker 4: are there any. 470 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:34,560 Speaker 3: Well not yes, because as I say so little has 471 00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:38,080 Speaker 3: been proven. But in terms of the broader situation we're in, 472 00:23:38,119 --> 00:23:40,440 Speaker 3: like I say, this is a moment of political peril 473 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:44,800 Speaker 3: in the UK for the broader political ecosystem around Peter Mandelsson. 474 00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:47,080 Speaker 2: This is a moment of perl for the royal family. 475 00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:50,440 Speaker 3: Although as I say, they haven't made the same mistakes 476 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:54,120 Speaker 3: say that Labor have, because even while people knew that 477 00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:58,480 Speaker 3: Peter Mandelson had been friends with Epstein, even after it 478 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,960 Speaker 3: became publicly inappropriate do so Labour still stuck with him 479 00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:03,760 Speaker 3: and made him important and kept him at the top 480 00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,160 Speaker 3: and gave him a top job. When it became apparent 481 00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:09,560 Speaker 3: that Prince Andrew had continued to be friends with Jeffrey 482 00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:12,119 Speaker 3: Epstein after it had been appropriate to do so, the 483 00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:15,440 Speaker 3: Royal family cut him loose and said, you know you're 484 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 3: a danger, off you go. So I think that the 485 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:20,679 Speaker 3: political danger is to Labor is greater than it is 486 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:25,159 Speaker 3: to the royal family. But you talk about the business relationship, Like, 487 00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:28,479 Speaker 3: because both of these, as far as we know from 488 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:31,399 Speaker 3: the evidence we've seen the alleged evidence, it appears to 489 00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:34,760 Speaker 3: be more about money than it does about sex, although 490 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 3: there does appear to be a sexual element in the 491 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,120 Speaker 3: Prince Andrew one as well. And like, what's the what's 492 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:42,120 Speaker 3: the reciprocal relationship here? Like what are these guys getting 493 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:43,920 Speaker 3: out of it? Because we can see what Epstein's getting 494 00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 3: out of it, which is he's getting this privileged allegedly 495 00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:51,359 Speaker 3: getting this privileged confidential information from very highly placed, knowledgeable 496 00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:55,520 Speaker 3: people in the UK. What are they then getting in response? Well, 497 00:24:55,600 --> 00:25:01,040 Speaker 3: in some in some cases it's money. Allegedly with Peter Mandelson, 498 00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:03,919 Speaker 3: the claims from the emails are that he and his 499 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,679 Speaker 3: husband that is in a same sex marriage, he and 500 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:12,159 Speaker 3: his husband received for the UK considerable amounts of money. 501 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:15,240 Speaker 3: I mean it's tens of thousands of dollars, which to 502 00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:18,040 Speaker 3: an American I think would probably make you laugh. British 503 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:22,119 Speaker 3: politics is so cheap. People have really bought very cheaply. Indeeds, 504 00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:25,240 Speaker 3: there's so little money in British politics. You know, the 505 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 3: price of entry for corruption is very low, alleged corruption, 506 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,200 Speaker 3: I should say, so, there's definitely a money element there 507 00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 3: for Prince Andrew. I think again it's shocking to think 508 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:36,879 Speaker 3: because the Royal family is fabulously wealthy, but he's clearly 509 00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:40,200 Speaker 3: a man who's always been unlucky with money. I don't 510 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,160 Speaker 3: particularly want to talk about his wife, Fergie, because it's 511 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 3: just not something I've delved into very deeply, and she's 512 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 3: not a character I find particularly interesting or engaging when 513 00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:49,960 Speaker 3: we put it that way. But she is somebody who 514 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:54,040 Speaker 3: has always had money troubles and my belief is that 515 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:56,399 Speaker 3: she has received money from Epstein in the past as 516 00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 3: well to help clear debts. So you know, that's the 517 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:01,400 Speaker 3: way the relationship goes. You know, information flows one way. 518 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:02,080 Speaker 3: And money or the other. 519 00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,000 Speaker 1: So let's use this as an opportunity to talk about 520 00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:09,560 Speaker 1: Nigel Farage you mentioned is seizing on the moment politically 521 00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:10,320 Speaker 1: as he should. 522 00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 4: It is. 523 00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:17,120 Speaker 1: Reading the headlines from across the pond, Oliver, it does 524 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:20,000 Speaker 1: look like there is a chance that Nigel Farage could 525 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:23,840 Speaker 1: complete his revolution of his now Reform Party, but really 526 00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:26,480 Speaker 1: the original Brexit movement just fighting the globalist and the 527 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:30,120 Speaker 1: establishment in the UK. It does seem like it's not 528 00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:33,720 Speaker 1: that he is particularly strong right now, which he is. 529 00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 1: He does seem particularly strong, but it seems like there's 530 00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:38,959 Speaker 1: so much weakness in the establishment parties now that this 531 00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:41,920 Speaker 1: really could be a moment where he could a catabult 532 00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:44,080 Speaker 1: himself for all the way the prime ministership is that 533 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:45,840 Speaker 1: possible handicap things? 534 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:46,520 Speaker 4: Where are we now? 535 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:50,439 Speaker 3: Okay, so first of all, let's let's give the big 536 00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:51,160 Speaker 3: question out of the way. 537 00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:51,960 Speaker 2: Is it possible? 538 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:52,320 Speaker 4: Yes? 539 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,439 Speaker 3: I have always been a real realist on this stuff, 540 00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:58,640 Speaker 3: and I think you and I have had this conversation 541 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:01,600 Speaker 3: before about people saying Nigel Faraj is going to be 542 00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:02,480 Speaker 3: the next Prime Minister of. 543 00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:04,879 Speaker 2: The UK, and I've always said, no, he's not. I 544 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:05,600 Speaker 2: love Nigel. 545 00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,240 Speaker 3: I think he's a very highly intelligent, skilled person, but 546 00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:11,320 Speaker 3: that's not the way the British constitution works, and it's 547 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:13,840 Speaker 3: still the case now. Nigel is riding high in the 548 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:16,159 Speaker 3: polls and the most likely thing is he is not 549 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:17,400 Speaker 3: the next primis for the UK. 550 00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:19,400 Speaker 2: My hope is that he's the. 551 00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 3: Next prime minister, but one because we have a parliamentary system. 552 00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:25,959 Speaker 2: When Starmer falls, which he inevitably. 553 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:29,720 Speaker 3: Will be it over this this Epstein Peter Mandelson thing, 554 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:32,680 Speaker 3: or over one of the thousands of other things about 555 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 3: which he is completely politically clueless, ruddleus and incapable, something 556 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:39,440 Speaker 3: will get him sooner or later, and probably early this year, 557 00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:42,879 Speaker 3: I should think. Just because he falls, there isn't then 558 00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,760 Speaker 3: a snap election in the UK. The Labor Party, which 559 00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:49,720 Speaker 3: commands Parliament will select from inside their group a new leader. 560 00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:51,240 Speaker 2: They will become the Prime Minister. 561 00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 3: That person will then have the thankless task of trying 562 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:58,240 Speaker 3: to lead this ungovernable country according to their own whims, 563 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:00,919 Speaker 3: until it's time for an election, and that maybe sooner 564 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 3: or rather than later. Of course, according to British law 565 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:07,280 Speaker 3: our constitution, the next election has to happen by twenty 566 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,440 Speaker 3: twenty nine, and all things told, that's probably the most 567 00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:12,679 Speaker 3: likely time there will be an election. But Forarag has 568 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:16,800 Speaker 3: this theory that labor is running our economy so badly, 569 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,840 Speaker 3: it's running the country into the ground so shamelessly that 570 00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:23,399 Speaker 3: there will be a mother of all financial crises and 571 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,360 Speaker 3: it will be so bad it will force the government, 572 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:29,440 Speaker 3: the government itself to collapse and Parliament will be dissolved 573 00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:31,680 Speaker 3: and they'll have to be fresh elections, which he then 574 00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:32,760 Speaker 3: presumably would win. 575 00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:35,200 Speaker 2: That's his vision, and. 576 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:38,320 Speaker 3: He's saying there's a slight chance there'll be an election 577 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,480 Speaker 3: as early as twenty twenty seven, so putting his money 578 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:43,680 Speaker 3: where his mouth is. Farage has said that he's going 579 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,600 Speaker 3: to put his party, Reform UK, on a war footing. 580 00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:49,400 Speaker 3: They're selecting their election candidates so if there is a 581 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 3: snap election, they're ready to go, because that's what got 582 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:56,120 Speaker 3: them last time. Richie Sudak, former Prime minister, called an 583 00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 3: early election which surprised people. Reforms simply wasn't ready. They 584 00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 3: were campaigning from a standing start, which really harmed them. 585 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:05,440 Speaker 3: And he doesn't want to be caught flat footed twice. 586 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:08,560 Speaker 4: Okay, so two big quo takeaways from this. 587 00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:16,440 Speaker 1: What do you think is the appropriate move for Reform 588 00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:22,000 Speaker 1: Party Nigel to capitalize on the Moment's number one in 589 00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,320 Speaker 1: what do you think is the best move from the 590 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 1: labor government to try to defend themselves. 591 00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:30,720 Speaker 3: I like a bit of steel manning. That'll be fun. 592 00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,440 Speaker 3: So for Forage, what he needs to do is keep. 593 00:29:33,280 --> 00:29:34,360 Speaker 2: Doing what he's doing now. 594 00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,120 Speaker 3: And it's an interesting position he's in now because I 595 00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 3: think Forage has become. 596 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,600 Speaker 2: Sufficiently baked into the equation. 597 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:43,840 Speaker 3: He's definitely part of the political furniture now and I 598 00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 3: think people are already accepting that he's going to be 599 00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:47,600 Speaker 3: the future government. 600 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 2: And because of. 601 00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:53,520 Speaker 3: That and the speed with which the Overton window is 602 00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:57,040 Speaker 3: shifting around him, I think it's instructive to note there 603 00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:00,640 Speaker 3: is now a like as Forage had long been the 604 00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:04,520 Speaker 3: devil sitting on the shoulder with the Conservative Party going 605 00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:06,719 Speaker 3: you can't do that, that's not right wing enough, like 606 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 3: come please get Brittin out to the European Union, please 607 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:10,600 Speaker 3: do something about mass migration. 608 00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 2: And that was kind of his role for a long time. 609 00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:16,120 Speaker 3: And as he becomes the main stream, like Farrage has 610 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,240 Speaker 3: always called himself center right, like a centrist. He's never 611 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,240 Speaker 3: thought of himself as extreme, and he's always aligned himself 612 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:25,600 Speaker 3: with the basically the British people, which is actually the 613 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:27,960 Speaker 3: things that I say most British people agree with. It's 614 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,040 Speaker 3: just the political hacks, the Westminster people who say that 615 00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 3: I'm really on the right, actually that this is the center. 616 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 2: You just can't see it. 617 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:36,880 Speaker 3: So the fact that I think that this is now 618 00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:39,280 Speaker 3: being so baked and is fascinating because there's now a 619 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:43,440 Speaker 3: right wing party to the right of Frage that's launched 620 00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:46,400 Speaker 3: this week called True Restore, led by a Chapman called 621 00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:49,400 Speaker 3: Rupert Low. So the fact that then there's somebody now 622 00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,600 Speaker 3: pulling Nigel Farage to the right, possibly because they're now 623 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:55,040 Speaker 3: sitting on his shoulder and going you're not being strive enough, 624 00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:57,160 Speaker 3: or mass migration, like we really do have to deport 625 00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 3: people who shouldn't be here. I find that fascinating. My 626 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 3: message to Frag is keep through to the message, keep 627 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:07,440 Speaker 3: doing what you're doing, because by not being a creature 628 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,800 Speaker 3: of the swamp, by not being part of the Westminster establishment, 629 00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:14,239 Speaker 3: that's your best hope of getting in. Because everybody is 630 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:17,040 Speaker 3: sick to death of the two party consensus that we've 631 00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:19,200 Speaker 3: had in this country for a century now. It has 632 00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:22,840 Speaker 3: not worked and the country is suffering terribly for it. Now, 633 00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:25,239 Speaker 3: let's think about what labor can do. And I've been 634 00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:26,560 Speaker 3: turning this over in the back of my head while 635 00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:28,520 Speaker 3: I've been talking about Farage, and they're in a bit 636 00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,440 Speaker 3: of a sticky wicket because they are in the same 637 00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:32,960 Speaker 3: position the Conservatives were a couple of years ago, which 638 00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:37,640 Speaker 3: is that everybody knows that they are venal and corrupt 639 00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:42,440 Speaker 3: and inefficient and low iq and ineffective. And the best 640 00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:44,720 Speaker 3: thing that they should do is apologize to the country, 641 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:48,040 Speaker 3: resign their seats from Westminster and never darken the doors 642 00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:51,040 Speaker 3: of politics again. Is exactly what the Conservative should have done. 643 00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,840 Speaker 3: And in fairness, some of them are getting there. They've 644 00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:56,280 Speaker 3: kind of figured out that they were the problem and 645 00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:59,040 Speaker 3: labor is the problem. But what can they do to 646 00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:02,200 Speaker 3: save themselves? They can save their souls by resigning. Let 647 00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:03,640 Speaker 3: me put it that way, go to church. 648 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:07,760 Speaker 4: What do you last one? And this is just sort 649 00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:08,440 Speaker 4: of a general one. 650 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:10,920 Speaker 1: What is it with the UK your culture of just 651 00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 1: resigning whenever you've won defeat. I mean it's always striking 652 00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:16,040 Speaker 1: to be a very watcher, you know UK television and 653 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,760 Speaker 1: stuff like that. It's we's you know, someone's resigning, Like 654 00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:19,880 Speaker 1: why you said this? 655 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:21,080 Speaker 4: Great victory three weeks ago. 656 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, but we lost this latest foot and so I 657 00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:26,480 Speaker 1: have to quit politics for life. It feels like we 658 00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:28,959 Speaker 1: don't have any sort of there's a deep sense of 659 00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:31,560 Speaker 1: pride and de quorum to have that sort of culture 660 00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 1: and it's really endured. 661 00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:36,560 Speaker 2: Well. So that's an interesting point. 662 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:38,400 Speaker 3: So that one of the big discussions we're having in 663 00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:40,880 Speaker 3: the UK at the moment, which is one of those 664 00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 3: things I think ordinary people would have been thinking about 665 00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:46,880 Speaker 3: for like a century, but it's just being permitted to 666 00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:49,400 Speaker 3: be talked about in public now, which is what is 667 00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 3: a British person who is British? And the government position 668 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:56,440 Speaker 3: on this is that whether you're British or not is 669 00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:59,000 Speaker 3: a purely cultural question. If you can sort of do 670 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,080 Speaker 3: this tickbox of like, you know, you speak English and 671 00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:06,360 Speaker 3: you drink tea and you believe in diversity and all 672 00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:08,440 Speaker 3: that sort of thing, like for the government, that's good enough. 673 00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:13,080 Speaker 3: And actually there is a even assuming you went with 674 00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:15,920 Speaker 3: this culturist idea of what it means to belong to Britain, 675 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:20,440 Speaker 3: there is actually a real, like not made up in 676 00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:25,520 Speaker 3: Westminster in a focus group, there is a real, long standing, 677 00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:30,800 Speaker 3: persistent British culture which you have just identified a part 678 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 3: of there, which is that it prizes very highly humility 679 00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,280 Speaker 3: and the ability to fall on one sword or to 680 00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:42,240 Speaker 3: withdraw to the drawing room with a glass of whiskey 681 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:44,440 Speaker 3: and a revolver when things have gone just a tiny 682 00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:48,040 Speaker 3: bit wrong, and to own up and to resign. And 683 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:50,680 Speaker 3: it's something that I think we do in our heart 684 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:54,000 Speaker 3: of hearts, really truly admire, which is somebody who's not 685 00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:57,800 Speaker 3: a grifter, not in politics for life, and can go 686 00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:00,280 Speaker 3: back to the farm if they've made a small state, 687 00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:03,560 Speaker 3: and long may it be the case. I thoroughly support it. Yeah. 688 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:05,800 Speaker 1: Amen, we could use a lot more of that here 689 00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:08,440 Speaker 1: in the United States. All right, Oliver, incredible information, and 690 00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:09,920 Speaker 1: thank you so much. You do an amazing job on 691 00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:10,520 Speaker 1: all subjects. 692 00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:12,080 Speaker 4: But it was really nice to get your take on 693 00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:13,640 Speaker 4: these two in particular. 694 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:15,640 Speaker 1: And we'll talk to you next time thanks to Mistin 695 00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:17,040 Speaker 1: and I'll be in the audience see us say