1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:03,640 Speaker 1: Stephen's on the Money Show six to eight pm with 2 00:00:03,720 --> 00:00:06,720 Speaker 1: a holding company Remgro reporting their headline earnings per share 3 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:09,680 Speaker 1: up on nearly forty percent. They've increased their interim dividend 4 00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:13,720 Speaker 1: by eighty percent. Strong earnings from their medic many clinic 5 00:00:13,840 --> 00:00:17,520 Speaker 1: business Rainbow Chicken, but they are worried about their mediclinic 6 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:20,760 Speaker 1: operations in the Middle East. Jani Duruant is the CEO 7 00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:23,279 Speaker 1: at Remgrow you any good evening and welcome back to 8 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:25,920 Speaker 1: the Money Show. Thanks for joining us. I mean Mediclinic. 9 00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:28,960 Speaker 1: They contributed four hundred and eighty five million Rand to 10 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 1: your bottom line. I mean the group's doing well and 11 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,880 Speaker 1: I presume there's a strong demand for its services. 12 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:38,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, thank thank you very much. In good evening, Stephen. 13 00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, Unfortunately, I mean a couple of weeks ago, I 14 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 3: wouldn't have said, we wouldn't have been worried about it 15 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:44,920 Speaker 3: all in the Middle East because we were such a 16 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:47,879 Speaker 3: performing operation of us. The demand was there with the 17 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:51,519 Speaker 3: best operated in the Middle East from a South African company. 18 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:54,280 Speaker 3: BE very proud of that. But unfortunately things have changed. 19 00:00:55,040 --> 00:00:57,639 Speaker 3: I must just give goodos to our management teams there. 20 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 3: They actually under difficult circumstances, things are going actually not 21 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 3: so bad. They're working closely with the government of the 22 00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:08,600 Speaker 3: UAE keeping the hospitals open. Our inpatient volumes seems to 23 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:11,000 Speaker 3: be fine. Just the outpatient volumes that is not so 24 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:14,320 Speaker 3: great at the moment, but people not traveling. But yeah, overall, 25 00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:18,440 Speaker 3: just congratulations to them, and really we salute them for 26 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:19,399 Speaker 3: what they're doing there. 27 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 1: How worried are you about the impact of what's happening 28 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 1: in the Middle East? I mean, you made the point 29 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 1: in your sense statement that most of your assets are 30 00:01:26,600 --> 00:01:29,280 Speaker 1: an emerging market. It's more likely to be hit hard 31 00:01:29,319 --> 00:01:33,319 Speaker 1: by higher fuel prices and higher inflation. Is it keeping 32 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:33,880 Speaker 1: you up at night? 33 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:37,920 Speaker 3: Yet at the moment he's starting to I mean, the 34 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:40,720 Speaker 3: war is getting on longer, and if thought it would, 35 00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 3: I think nobody knows when it's going to end, not 36 00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:45,280 Speaker 3: even probably the President of the United States, to be 37 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:48,280 Speaker 3: quite frank. So it's actually at a concerning thing. The 38 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:50,400 Speaker 3: longer it goes on, the bigger the impact would be. 39 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:52,800 Speaker 3: I think we can already see what is happening in 40 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:56,080 Speaker 3: South Africa. People are probably scrambling a bit, but we 41 00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 3: go to some field shortages. As you're probably aware, fifty 42 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:00,920 Speaker 3: percent of the film comes from that region that we 43 00:02:00,960 --> 00:02:03,800 Speaker 3: actually import fifty percent, so it's a significant amount and 44 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:04,400 Speaker 3: you can't just. 45 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:07,320 Speaker 2: Redirect that in two other areas. 46 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:09,960 Speaker 3: So we've only got one operating refinery on the ranch, 47 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:11,960 Speaker 3: so that that is a problem as well if you 48 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:13,920 Speaker 3: have to refine fuel products. 49 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:14,840 Speaker 2: So yeah, I do. 50 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:18,560 Speaker 3: It will have an impact not just on our companies 51 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:20,680 Speaker 3: but on South Africa Inc. And that's what I'm worried 52 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:23,360 Speaker 3: to on more about South African Inc. And ourselves because 53 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:26,600 Speaker 3: people are not in a great position of high inflation, 54 00:02:26,680 --> 00:02:28,920 Speaker 3: food prices, all of that thing. We can go back 55 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:31,000 Speaker 3: to some of the COVID days which will not be great. 56 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 1: Just your exposure to the healthcare sector in Southern Africa, 57 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:39,919 Speaker 1: and our health minister, I think is determined to introduce 58 00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:43,840 Speaker 1: the NHI. You have signed a sort of deal in 59 00:02:43,880 --> 00:02:46,360 Speaker 1: principle with the mESC group, so you'll own all of 60 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:50,639 Speaker 1: the Southern African operations of Mediclinic. You must still believe 61 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:53,400 Speaker 1: then that private healthcare is a strong future in South Africa. 62 00:02:54,760 --> 00:02:58,079 Speaker 3: Absolutely no, no, we convince about that. And from what 63 00:02:58,240 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 3: the NHI is are funding, although they've got certain things 64 00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:03,200 Speaker 3: on the medical aids of funding model is not a 65 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:06,840 Speaker 3: delivery model, and we think we can deliver the services 66 00:03:06,880 --> 00:03:08,839 Speaker 3: that will be required, and we think we can even 67 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:10,640 Speaker 3: deliver it at the lower cost place so that it 68 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:13,440 Speaker 3: can make it more affordable for people. But we need certainty, 69 00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:16,079 Speaker 3: we need to share actually how the policy frameworks work. 70 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:19,680 Speaker 3: But we confident that NHI won't affect our business too much. 71 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:21,959 Speaker 3: And to be quite frank with you, Stephen, I don't 72 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 3: think we can afford NHI at this point in time, 73 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:26,520 Speaker 3: especially what's happening now. I think it's going to take 74 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 3: a long time. It's going to be in the court. 75 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:30,800 Speaker 3: It's actually stalled at the moment as we speak. So 76 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:32,919 Speaker 3: that is definitely not keeping me up like at night. 77 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:36,360 Speaker 3: The middle eas situationally much more like it as we speak. 78 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 2: Absolutely sure. 79 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:39,840 Speaker 1: I mean I'm interested when you say you could reduce 80 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 1: costs in the medical sector because around the world healthcare 81 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: inflation is much higher than CPI. 82 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, as a lower cost model, what is things like 83 00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:52,800 Speaker 3: certain things The hospitals that you'll be or the clinics 84 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 3: that you'll build won't have private rooms, it will have 85 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 3: probably bigger holes, more people in the in the building, 86 00:03:57,880 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 3: and the food will probably not be of a lower 87 00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 3: court but. 88 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 2: Difficult to say. 89 00:04:02,520 --> 00:04:04,920 Speaker 3: So there is certain things and is right flying business 90 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 3: laws or your flying economy class. The people that can 91 00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 3: afford it can have a private room and be confident 92 00:04:09,880 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 3: about that. The biggest the biggest challenge that we have 93 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:14,360 Speaker 3: to find and we will be able if we can 94 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 3: employ our own doctors and we need to portray more doctors, 95 00:04:17,440 --> 00:04:20,080 Speaker 3: and then we think we can deliver like a Capy deca. 96 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:21,400 Speaker 2: So done so remarkably well. 97 00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:23,680 Speaker 3: In the banking and financial service sector, it is the 98 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:26,320 Speaker 3: is opportunity to deliver a lower cost of model model, 99 00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:28,680 Speaker 3: but then you need to have certainty and you have 100 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:31,119 Speaker 3: got that need to have a medical aid that people 101 00:04:31,160 --> 00:04:33,679 Speaker 3: can pay for that but at a lower price point. 102 00:04:34,800 --> 00:04:36,880 Speaker 1: You own a big stake in r CL Foods and 103 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 1: their battling because of the problems in our sugar industry, 104 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 1: and government's been asked to help the sugar industry, I 105 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: mean perhaps through tariffs. Even would you support that It 106 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:48,200 Speaker 1: would obviously help your business, It might make sugar slightly 107 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 1: more expensive for consumers. 108 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 3: Absolutely were very supportive of that, and I think it's 109 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 3: a it played out of what is happening in case 110 00:04:56,120 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 3: it enft on guard Unity is a competitor, but we 111 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:01,440 Speaker 3: it's not a good team that they will go into liquidation. 112 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:04,000 Speaker 3: I mean, so about two hundred thousand people depend on 113 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:06,200 Speaker 3: the sugar introduce case it and as we speak, at 114 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:08,600 Speaker 3: the current sugar prices, they're not making money. The mills 115 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 3: or not even running. The growers are struggling. So it's 116 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 3: actually it's at a tipping point at the moment. And 117 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:16,720 Speaker 3: the problem is not that we're not effective country in 118 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:19,800 Speaker 3: sugar is like the chicken industry with effective cost. We 119 00:05:19,839 --> 00:05:23,280 Speaker 3: convert sugar effectively and we one of the top five 120 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:25,719 Speaker 3: in the country, but we're getting flooded with cheap inputs 121 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:28,080 Speaker 3: out of Indian Brazil which are subsidized, and we don't 122 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,719 Speaker 3: get any subsidy from the government. So you're not competing 123 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 3: on a level playing field, and that is why we 124 00:05:32,600 --> 00:05:34,720 Speaker 3: need need the terrors to make sure that it's a 125 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 3: level playing field. 126 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:40,920 Speaker 1: You recently sold your steak or most of your steak, 127 00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:42,720 Speaker 1: A lot of your steak in first round I think 128 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:44,760 Speaker 1: was four point nine billion rounds worth, and you've been 129 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 1: setting down your steak in that group. Are you getting 130 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:49,359 Speaker 1: out of first round for some reason or do you 131 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:52,520 Speaker 1: believe you can just use the capital more effectively somewhere else. 132 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 3: I think if you just take you back even to 133 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 3: twenty eighteen, that's when we unbundled our big first round stake, 134 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,560 Speaker 3: when we were still the biggest shareholders. Since then, we 135 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 3: actually have said at that point in time on going back, 136 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 3: not to twenty eighteen. So I'm just recording correctly, but 137 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 3: I said, it's like a child, it leaves yourself. It's 138 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:11,680 Speaker 3: actually growth through university and then it need to go 139 00:06:11,760 --> 00:06:13,640 Speaker 3: and sprint. I mean, first of it was much bigger 140 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 3: than us. Our influence, our value add was very limited, 141 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:19,839 Speaker 3: so we kept the strategics takers cash or near cash, 142 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 3: and we thought at this point in time we could 143 00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:25,320 Speaker 3: apply the cash somewhere else. I think things have changed 144 00:06:25,400 --> 00:06:27,039 Speaker 3: a little bit since in the last couple of weeks 145 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 3: of what how we will apply that cash. But I 146 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 3: think it's quite critical to see that we actually solved 147 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 3: before some of the biggest portion of our state, just 148 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:36,360 Speaker 3: before the war in the Middle East. So we're still 149 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 3: sitting in a little bit of that. But so it's 150 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 3: been a long time coming. It's been coming since twenty eighteen. 151 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:44,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, I need Duran good to chat to you. Thank 152 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 1: you so much, really appreciated the CEO at remgrow