1 00:00:00,920 --> 00:00:05,280 Speaker 1: Good morning, Cape Town, Lester Gibbett, starting your day on 2 00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:09,240 Speaker 1: Cave Talk. What are you getting on your bike to 3 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:11,920 Speaker 1: get to work? Are you making plans to deal with 4 00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 1: a steep increase in fuel? Since last Wednesday, fuel prices 5 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:19,800 Speaker 1: have gone up around the world as a result of 6 00:00:19,840 --> 00:00:26,479 Speaker 1: the Middle Easter conflicted prompted governments around, particularly in Southeast Asia, 7 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:30,160 Speaker 1: to try and work out some plans, whether it is 8 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: directives to work from home, whether it is governments like 9 00:00:35,440 --> 00:00:42,279 Speaker 1: the Malaysian government spending money on monthly subsidies, if it's 10 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 1: the Sri Lankan government who has declared every Wednesday public 11 00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:51,280 Speaker 1: holiday for government institutions, schools and universities. What is South 12 00:00:51,320 --> 00:00:55,800 Speaker 1: Africa doing? What is your workplace doing to mitigate against 13 00:00:55,800 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 1: the increase in fuel costs? Joining me on the line 14 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:03,600 Speaker 1: is are in low director of the four day Week? 15 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:07,319 Speaker 1: Think you'd think that we'd have this conversation down battleready 16 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:10,720 Speaker 1: after the COVID break and how the world has changed 17 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:14,039 Speaker 1: when it comes to the relationship of working from home 18 00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:17,080 Speaker 1: and working from the office. But again it's another opportunity 19 00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:22,120 Speaker 1: to have this conversation of how businesses, companies, institutions are 20 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 1: having to adapt to a bold New World Car and 21 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:25,319 Speaker 1: good morning. 22 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 2: Good morning Lester. Yes, you would think we've had it 23 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:31,960 Speaker 2: on PAT. We've had a few conversations about the four 24 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:35,720 Speaker 2: day week. I think this time, though, we're heading into 25 00:01:35,800 --> 00:01:39,639 Speaker 2: a collision between an economic reality and traditional management thinking. 26 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:42,559 Speaker 2: You know, the first wave of remote work was driven 27 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:46,080 Speaker 2: by COVID because of health. This second wave with the 28 00:01:46,080 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 2: fuel crisis is driven by economics, which for me, companies 29 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:53,160 Speaker 2: can't treat as temporary. We have no idea how long 30 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 2: this crisis is going to continue. For we have to 31 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 2: design work properly this time, and reducing the work commute 32 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 2: can be a real cost of living intervention. But I 33 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:07,560 Speaker 2: would caution against a broad conversation around a four day 34 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:10,239 Speaker 2: work week and just reducing one day a week. Sure 35 00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:14,400 Speaker 2: it will impact financially and help consumers or employees in 36 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 2: their daily commute, but I think this is a much 37 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:21,800 Speaker 2: broader conversation around how we redesign work because we can't 38 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:23,839 Speaker 2: just go back to the old ways that we had 39 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:29,720 Speaker 2: in COVID. We saw, you know, officers, businesses really struggling 40 00:02:29,760 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 2: with productivity with a drop and engagement with mental health 41 00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:37,480 Speaker 2: crisis when when employees were working from home. We cannot 42 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 2: just go blindly in like we did in COVID. We 43 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 2: really really need to plan how we design work in 44 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:45,519 Speaker 2: The four day work week is a time. You know, 45 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 2: unless we've spoken about this before, but time is a 46 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 2: is a forcing function. It's a constraint, and when we 47 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:54,760 Speaker 2: put a constraint in place, you can look up opportunities 48 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:58,280 Speaker 2: that exist around behavior change and fuel isn't just a cost. 49 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:02,720 Speaker 2: It changes our behavior. It's and when behavior changes, work 50 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:03,920 Speaker 2: has to change with it. 51 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:07,800 Speaker 1: Have you seen an increase in the number of requests 52 00:03:07,919 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 1: or at least companies and businesses asking for some advice 53 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:16,080 Speaker 1: and how they they deal how they handle with requests 54 00:03:16,120 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: from staff saying, look, it's becoming more expensive for me 55 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:22,040 Speaker 1: to travel in and out. What will be after we've 56 00:03:22,440 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 1: now over the next few weeks feel the pinch of 57 00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:29,079 Speaker 1: last week's fuel price. Having the conversation, okay, let us 58 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:32,080 Speaker 1: try and work out or work around some of our 59 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:32,800 Speaker 1: work streams. 60 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 2: Absolutely, Lester. I think again, that's driven by your smmes. 61 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:42,040 Speaker 2: You know, your small medium enterprises that are typically more 62 00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:46,480 Speaker 2: flexible and adaptable to these sort of knocks and shocks. 63 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:49,440 Speaker 2: But you know there are certain industries that are not 64 00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 2: able to consider it and I think I think that's 65 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:54,600 Speaker 2: always going to be the case when you look at 66 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 2: reduced hours working. Some environments are more able to adapt 67 00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 2: and allow their employees to work from home and even 68 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:05,840 Speaker 2: not enforce it, but strongly encourage it so that there 69 00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:07,600 Speaker 2: is a financial saving at the end of the day 70 00:04:07,600 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 2: for the employee. But the questions and the meetings that 71 00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 2: we're currently having behind closed door doors are how do 72 00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:19,520 Speaker 2: we use this fuel pricess or fuel price shock to 73 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:23,719 Speaker 2: redesign how we are working so that it's a dual effect. 74 00:04:23,800 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 2: We're not just looking at work or reducing the commute, 75 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:30,200 Speaker 2: We're actually going what do we do this time to 76 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:33,240 Speaker 2: ensure productivity remains the same and at the same time 77 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,480 Speaker 2: improve what's left at the end of the month in 78 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:40,840 Speaker 2: the employees' pockets. So early adopters as usual, but it 79 00:04:40,920 --> 00:04:44,320 Speaker 2: really is a work redesigned business process. Re engineering conversation 80 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,120 Speaker 2: is less about reduced working hours and more about how 81 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 2: reduced working hours by forcing a time where you don't 82 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 2: have to come to work maybe two days a week 83 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:56,039 Speaker 2: you only come in, or three days a week you 84 00:04:56,080 --> 00:04:58,560 Speaker 2: only come in. What does that do to the way 85 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:00,360 Speaker 2: we work and the way we show up? Where can 86 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:01,839 Speaker 2: pull through productivity happens. 87 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: Lookly, maybe a ceasefire declared sometime this week, it may 88 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:11,719 Speaker 1: carry on indefinitely. In South Africa, We'll only be buffered 89 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:16,600 Speaker 1: by the lowering of the petrol price levy at least 90 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:21,680 Speaker 1: for April, maybe May. Treasury says definitely not into June. 91 00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:26,200 Speaker 1: So if this war fuel prices continue to skyrocket, we 92 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:29,320 Speaker 1: only being protected, yeah, in South Africa at least for 93 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:33,000 Speaker 1: the next two months. So sooner rather than later, we're 94 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:35,600 Speaker 1: going to have to start developing some sort of plan 95 00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:38,080 Speaker 1: on how we work and how we get to work, 96 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:41,080 Speaker 1: and how we gather and move things in this country. 97 00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:45,400 Speaker 2: Lest I think that's the biggest opportunity. You know, COVID 98 00:05:45,480 --> 00:05:49,120 Speaker 2: was an immediate lockdown. No one really knew what was happening. Here, 99 00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:51,840 Speaker 2: we have an opportunity to get ahead, you know. I 100 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:55,160 Speaker 2: think this crisis is going to stay with us for 101 00:05:55,240 --> 00:05:57,280 Speaker 2: quite some time. And it's not so much just the 102 00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:01,600 Speaker 2: fuel shortage or the shocks with the price increases. What 103 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:04,600 Speaker 2: are the longer term ramifications of this energy is going 104 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 2: to be more expensive in the long run. So I 105 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:11,120 Speaker 2: think there are opportunities for multiple businesses to rethink ways 106 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:13,799 Speaker 2: of ways of working. And we've got this wonderful gap 107 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 2: now where organizations can get ahead and also discuss this 108 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 2: with employees. Leicester. You know, we always forget to say, well, 109 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 2: how are we going to sustain the way we are 110 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 2: currently living? When we were already teetering on the edge, 111 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:34,360 Speaker 2: we're looking at a very serious economic crisis here. I 112 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:36,919 Speaker 2: don't know about you, but you know, filling up my 113 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 2: old Fortuner is she's a very thirsty lady, and she's 114 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:43,320 Speaker 2: very expensive. And I've got kids, lifts, and I've got 115 00:06:43,880 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 2: work runs and I need to go to capes on 116 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:47,800 Speaker 2: every now and again on that end too, and I 117 00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:52,240 Speaker 2: am honestly rethinking every meeting is this necessary? Is there 118 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:55,640 Speaker 2: an alternative? And I think businesses have this wonderful opportunity 119 00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:58,320 Speaker 2: to discuss that with employees. How do we keep work 120 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 2: working and how do we redesign it for remote work 121 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 2: for example, but also how do we ensure that employees 122 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:10,080 Speaker 2: are not feeling this absolute sense of dread that at 123 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:11,360 Speaker 2: the end of the month they're not going to be 124 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 2: able to pay their bills, because it's going to have 125 00:07:12,960 --> 00:07:16,560 Speaker 2: a knock on effect on every single thing that we consume. 126 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,160 Speaker 1: Corn Low, director of the Four Day we have to 127 00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:22,400 Speaker 1: leave it there, but thanks so much for chatting to 128 00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 1: us this morning.