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Speaker 1: Seven o two The Africa Report Get stories from the continent,

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Speaker 1: the rest of the continent stories We think you need

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Speaker 1: to pay attention to. Starlink, the satellite internet service backed

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Speaker 1: by Elon Musk, has hit another snag on the continent.

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Speaker 1: Namibia's telecom regulator has rejected its licensed application to operate there,

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Speaker 1: saying the company doesn't meet key ownership and regulatory requirements,

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Speaker 1: including how much of the business must be locally owned

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Speaker 1: and controlled. Now, what will that mean for rural communities

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Speaker 1: in Namibia hoping for faster internet. Starlink has already started

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Speaker 1: services in other parts of the continent and says it

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Speaker 1: will appeal that decision. We've invited tech Central editor Duncan

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Speaker 1: MacLeod to join us dunk in a pleasure to have

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Speaker 1: you on our show. Thank you for your time, pleasure

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Speaker 1: to be here.

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Speaker 2: Thank you all right.

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Speaker 1: So Starlink sometimes gets a ya, but at times gets

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Speaker 1: a nay.

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Speaker 2: That's right. So most of the countries in Southern Africa

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Speaker 2: have actually licensed Stylink. Now all of our neighboring countries,

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Speaker 2: with the exception of Namibia, have licensed the service. So

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Speaker 2: it's available in Botswana, in Swaziland, or it Sutini in Zimbabwe,

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Speaker 2: the CITU and Mozambique, but an Omiba and South Africa

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Speaker 2: or the holdouts in our region.

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Speaker 1: What is the difference between the connectivity of countries And

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Speaker 1: maybe ours might not be the ideal example, but i'll

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Speaker 1: i'll throw us in the hat anyway, what's the difference

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Speaker 1: in terms of our connectivity versus countries that have allowed

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Speaker 1: starlink to operate.

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Speaker 2: We have a pretty well developed telecommunications infrastructure in South

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Speaker 2: Africa since the market was liberalized about fifteen years ago.

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Speaker 2: There's been tens of billions, it's not hundreds of billions

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Speaker 2: around poured into telecommunications infrastructure. So we've seen the deployment

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Speaker 2: of fiber mobile telecommunications across the country. So we're pretty

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Speaker 2: well connected, but there are still gaps. In fact, there

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Speaker 2: was a report issued by the DBSA just a couple

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Speaker 2: of days ago that showed that there are still big

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Speaker 2: gaps in parts of South African Crean cauisin An Hotel,

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Speaker 2: northwestern Popo and the Northern Cape where there is no

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Speaker 2: fiber infrastructure and where mobile infrastructure is also poorly developed.

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Speaker 2: And it's specifically in those areas. I think that satellite

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Speaker 2: communications provided life Styling and others would play a big role.

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Speaker 1: So so come in there, and I would imagine the

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Speaker 1: Eastern Cape is a part of that mix. That's why

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Speaker 1: I was reluctant to throw us in. All right, so

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Speaker 1: take us out of the equation. What does Namibia look

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Speaker 1: like versus say, Botswana or even Mozambique in terms of

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Speaker 1: connectivity without Starling.

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Speaker 2: Connectivity in the media is pretty good in the cities,

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Speaker 2: but the movie is a very sparsely populated country and

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Speaker 2: I don't know if you've been up there, Bongani. You

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Speaker 2: can drive for you can drive for hours and hours

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Speaker 2: and see another person, especially in the south of the country.

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Speaker 2: It's it's it's it's a very low, low populated country

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Speaker 2: and remote farming communities, remote villages. I think that would

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Speaker 2: benefit enormously from satellite bars dance services such as starlink.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it would make absolute sense to launch a

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Speaker 2: service like that in that market. But it makes sense

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Speaker 2: to launch starlink everywhere. I mean, there's applications for it

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Speaker 2: in mining, in schools, in remote areas, you know, wherever

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Speaker 2: there's no connectivity. Satellite is promising to fill that gap,

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Speaker 2: and licensing these sort of services makes absolute sense.

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Speaker 1: There have been some warnings around particularly the and what

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Speaker 1: you're saying, of course about connectivity, particularly in areas where

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Speaker 1: there is not much infrastructure. That argument makes sense, but

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Speaker 1: the person of Elon Musk becomes a factor when it

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Speaker 1: comes to starlink, and there have been some concerns about

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Speaker 1: giving access to someone of that persuasion, if you will.

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Speaker 1: In other words, Musk isn't just there as a tech player.

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Speaker 1: He's somebody who wants to influence the direction a country

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Speaker 1: might go, and that's part of the nervousness of allowing

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Speaker 1: him in.

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Speaker 2: Yes, you know, Musk is really a bit of a

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Speaker 2: toxic personality, and I think that's half the problem here.

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Speaker 2: And I think he's you know, he's probably causing himself

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Speaker 2: damage in a lot of these markets, and that you know,

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Speaker 2: he often appears on his social media platform x complaining

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Speaker 2: about why he can't get a license in South Africa

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Speaker 2: because he's not black, and I think that rubs up

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Speaker 2: a lot of people in this area, in this part

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Speaker 2: of the world the wrong way. And you know, I

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Speaker 2: don't think he's doing himself any favors by doing that.

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Speaker 2: He's certainly a toxic political personality in his association with

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Speaker 2: with Trump and the Republican Party in the US, I

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Speaker 2: think doesn't go down with well with many people, including

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Speaker 2: regulators and politicians in this part of the world. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: I think that is actually a large part of the

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Speaker 2: reason that he's finding it so difficult to get licensed

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Speaker 2: in this part of the world. It's unfortunate because I

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Speaker 2: think policy makers and regulators should look past that sort

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Speaker 2: of thing. I don't think I don't think that a

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Speaker 2: personality should influence, you know, a policy making decision for

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Speaker 2: a country, but certainly that is having an impact on

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Speaker 2: political views on this part of the world.

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Speaker 1: I like the question of evidence, Duncan, because in all

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Speaker 1: the countries that you've mentioned in Southern Africa, has his

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Speaker 1: impact been political or has he just provided the service

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Speaker 1: and gone about his business.

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Speaker 2: The evidence suggests that there's been no sort of political

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Speaker 2: interventions at all. Has been no efforts to cut off

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Speaker 2: services or threats to these countries or anything like that,

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Speaker 2: you know. I think I think the people behind Starling,

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Speaker 2: and I've engaged with them in some detail over the

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Speaker 2: last a few years, they just want to get onto

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Speaker 2: the business of rolling out infrastructure. You know, they're running

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Speaker 2: a business at the end of the day, and and

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Speaker 2: and providing providing a service, and you know, I think

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Speaker 2: that's what they want to do. But you know, you've

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Speaker 2: got this guy at the top who who's constantly aggravating

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Speaker 2: people with his tweets, and you know, I think that's

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Speaker 2: that's just making the situation worse.

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Speaker 1: What do these ownership rules, both for South Africa and

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Speaker 1: that context we understand well enough, but even say for Namibia,

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Speaker 1: which requires a certain percentage of local ownership, those seem

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Speaker 1: necessary from the perspective of Namibia, for example, But do

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Speaker 1: they harm or hurt the prospects of investment?

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Speaker 2: I think they hurt investments, you know, I think just

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Speaker 2: coming back to the South African context. You know, South

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Speaker 2: Africa's BEE Framework allows for the thing called Equity equivalent

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Speaker 2: Investment programs or eeips. It's supported by the Department of Trade,

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Speaker 2: Industry and Competition. So actually Communications Regulated ucassa's licensing rules,

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Speaker 2: which requires thirty percent of licensees to be in the

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Speaker 2: hands of historically disadvantaged individuals in terms of equity ownership,

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Speaker 2: is actually out of step with the country's BEE framework,

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Speaker 2: and the move by the Communications min Is to Soli

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Speaker 2: Malasi is actually really regulatory housekeeping to get the acast

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Speaker 2: of rules in line with the existing BEE framework. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 2: as this tends to happen in South Africa, I think

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Speaker 2: it's become a political hot potato with politicians fighting over

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Speaker 2: and seeing trying to score cheap political points. But I

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Speaker 2: think that Malatzie's move to trying to line the licensing

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Speaker 2: framework in South Africa with see broader the framework supported

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Speaker 2: by the d T I C and government is the

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Speaker 2: right one. You know, it's it's it's a fact that

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Speaker 2: he casted licensing rules the out of step of the

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Speaker 2: national framework.

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Speaker 1: What Thankan mcclart appreciate your time Tech Central editor with

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Speaker 1: this week's Africa Report