WEBVTT - Consumer Talk: Aircon contractor fails to deliver 0:00:00.640 --> 0:00:06.680 Lunch with Pipper Hudson and now Consumer Talk featuring Wendy Nolar. 0:00:08.760 --> 0:00:11.119 It is time for Consumer Talk, and Wendy Nola is 0:00:11.119 --> 0:00:13.640 back with us this week here in studio, and we're 0:00:13.640 --> 0:00:16.640 going to be talking about a cluster of complaints about 0:00:16.640 --> 0:00:20.320 an air conditioning business which raises big questions around the 0:00:20.440 --> 0:00:24.560 risk of paying either in full or a substantial deposit 0:00:24.640 --> 0:00:27.680 upfront before you have received the promised goods or services. 0:00:28.080 --> 0:00:30.240 If you have had experience with this issue, if you'd 0:00:30.280 --> 0:00:32.680 like to ask a question or engage, you are welcome 0:00:32.720 --> 0:00:35.400 to call us on two one four four six five 0:00:35.520 --> 0:00:37.600 sixty seven, or you can send a voice note or 0:00:37.640 --> 0:00:41.760 WhatsApp text to seven two five six seven one five 0:00:41.840 --> 0:00:43.320 six seven. Great to have you back with us. We 0:00:43.320 --> 0:00:44.000 missed you last week. 0:00:44.280 --> 0:00:45.200 Thank you your pet too. 0:00:45.800 --> 0:00:47.560 This is a tough one because a lot of service 0:00:47.600 --> 0:00:51.159 providers do ask for substantial or sometimes even full payment upfront, 0:00:51.159 --> 0:00:53.960 and I know often as consumers we don't feel empowered 0:00:54.000 --> 0:00:56.920 to query that. But the case studies we're looking at today, Wendy, 0:00:56.960 --> 0:00:59.200 are a good example of how that situation can go wrong. 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:03.960 Absolutely so with any home or office installation or construction, 0:01:04.240 --> 0:01:07.240 there is risk to both parties. Right, So for the contractor, 0:01:07.240 --> 0:01:09.720 there's the risk that the client won't pay, and shamefully 0:01:09.920 --> 0:01:12.760 many doesn't. Yeah, they find some little niggle and then 0:01:12.880 --> 0:01:15.280 just dodge the payment. And for the custom of the 0:01:15.360 --> 0:01:17.400 risk is of course that the supplier will take your 0:01:17.400 --> 0:01:20.200 money and give you nothing in return. Nothing that is 0:01:20.440 --> 0:01:23.440 but a long, exhausting and mostly fruitless run around to 0:01:23.440 --> 0:01:27.120 get your money back. And that's why contractors require deposits 0:01:27.120 --> 0:01:30.720 on acceptance of their quote, and quite understandably as well. 0:01:31.360 --> 0:01:34.600 To my mind though it shouldn't be more than a 0:01:34.640 --> 0:01:38.119 fifty percent deposits, so that each party has equal skin 0:01:38.200 --> 0:01:41.640 in the game, equal risk. And when I started in 0:01:41.680 --> 0:01:46.039 consumer journalism twenty seven years ago, that was it was. 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:49.080 It was the norm, the norm, equal skin in the game. 0:01:49.200 --> 0:01:51.920 And that deposit that contractors are asking is going up 0:01:51.920 --> 0:01:54.200 and up and up. And I'm sure those who are 0:01:54.200 --> 0:01:56.280 listening driving along thing when I say cost so many 0:01:56.280 --> 0:02:00.280 customers don't pay whatever. That is the reality. But our 0:02:00.880 --> 0:02:04.840 the upshot is that is that the consumer has far 0:02:04.920 --> 0:02:07.960 more to lose if things go wrong than the contract 0:02:08.000 --> 0:02:12.520 the conduct they've got, you know, seventy percent is common 0:02:13.919 --> 0:02:16.760 eighty percent. I would say for me that would be 0:02:17.120 --> 0:02:20.040 a step two free except in extreme cases depending on 0:02:20.080 --> 0:02:22.960 what the woods being supplied are with risk. The contractor 0:02:23.080 --> 0:02:25.080 carries that kind of thing. But eighty percent you must 0:02:25.160 --> 0:02:28.520 know you are at quite great risk if something goes wrong. 0:02:28.639 --> 0:02:31.840 Okay, which then leads us to today's case study, or 0:02:31.880 --> 0:02:33.680 rather case studies plural with yes. 0:02:34.160 --> 0:02:37.800 So Cape based cool Tech Solutions asked for payment of 0:02:37.840 --> 0:02:41.000 eighty percent of the quote job as a deposit from 0:02:41.240 --> 0:02:43.760 its customers. But in the case of at least six people, 0:02:44.080 --> 0:02:46.440 and those are just the sex that we know of, 0:02:47.000 --> 0:02:49.600 the company, which is run by Jacques and Mandre Small, 0:02:50.200 --> 0:02:52.959 took their money the eighty percent deposits and then failed 0:02:53.000 --> 0:02:55.800 to install the air conditioning units, some in homes, two 0:02:55.840 --> 0:03:00.480 in business prisonerses, all in the Cape area. The date 0:03:00.560 --> 0:03:05.720 between August last year and May of this year. The 0:03:06.639 --> 0:03:10.000 areas that the company operated and ranged from Somerset West 0:03:10.000 --> 0:03:13.000 to Wellington, Paro, Mornsbury, Atlantis and Balville. 0:03:13.560 --> 0:03:15.440 Now did these clients ask for their money to be 0:03:15.480 --> 0:03:17.359 refunded after time had passed? 0:03:17.360 --> 0:03:21.560 Wendy, Yes, so that you know they they paid their deposit, 0:03:21.680 --> 0:03:25.239 waited for installation the dates came. There was various excuses. 0:03:26.080 --> 0:03:29.799 Bad weather, Bucky broke down, fell off a ladder, and 0:03:29.840 --> 0:03:33.239 then of course the client reaches the point where they say, okay, 0:03:33.280 --> 0:03:35.320 well I want my money back. Then they got letters 0:03:35.360 --> 0:03:40.840 saying or email saying semesters some form of communication saying 0:03:41.280 --> 0:03:42.960 we all pay you back within I think it was 0:03:43.000 --> 0:03:45.960 five to ten or ten to fifteen working days. I'll 0:03:46.320 --> 0:03:49.920 confirm that in a bit. And then just as that 0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:54.040 period was coming to close, that get in the case 0:03:54.080 --> 0:03:58.640 of three, they got letters saying we're going We've gone 0:03:58.640 --> 0:04:00.800 into liquidation. So sorry, sorry, you won't. 0:04:00.640 --> 0:04:03.160 Join the line of creditors. Yes, yeah, okay, now, Wendy. 0:04:03.280 --> 0:04:06.480 Obviously that does happen. It can happen. Businesses go into liquidation. 0:04:06.560 --> 0:04:08.720 Times are very tough out there, we know. But what 0:04:08.840 --> 0:04:12.360 is problematic here is the timeline around that going into 0:04:12.440 --> 0:04:15.680 liquidation letter versus new orders being taken. 0:04:15.800 --> 0:04:19.080 Okay, absolutely so. In the case of the sex which 0:04:19.080 --> 0:04:22.800 we'll call them, three of them got those we are 0:04:22.800 --> 0:04:27.719 liquidating notifications in March of this year. But in April 0:04:28.160 --> 0:04:32.240 and until fairly recently, mandre Smile was still placing adverts 0:04:32.240 --> 0:04:37.600 for Aircon specials on Facebook marketplace. In April, some weeks 0:04:37.720 --> 0:04:40.960 after those we are liquidating emails was sent to the 0:04:41.000 --> 0:04:44.440 three of the six who had been asking for a 0:04:44.480 --> 0:04:47.440 refund of their deposits. Call Tech Solutions quoted two more 0:04:47.480 --> 0:04:49.719 people for jobs, two more that we know of, and 0:04:49.800 --> 0:04:52.440 accepted payment of eighty percent deposits from them, and they 0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:56.800 didn't delivered the goods to them for the service. So 0:04:56.880 --> 0:05:00.559 that is problematic. And I think it's relevant to say 0:05:00.600 --> 0:05:03.839 that the losses of the six combined cases, so the 0:05:03.880 --> 0:05:07.520 total of their eighty percent deposit that they paid is 0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:10.000 around one hundred and forty six thousand grand, so. 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:14.680 It's substantial subti Now, Wendy, those six haven't just come 0:05:14.760 --> 0:05:18.160 to us at consumer consumer talk. They've also taken steps 0:05:18.200 --> 0:05:20.560 to pursue criminal action, haven't they. 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:25.240 Yeah, so they've opened cases a fraud at various police stations. 0:05:25.760 --> 0:05:31.120 Our information is that those cases are our being coordinated 0:05:31.200 --> 0:05:33.760 by steps, because if you go that's the only way 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:35.440 that you're really going to be able to build a case. 0:05:35.480 --> 0:05:39.239 If you've got one case one police station and another 0:05:39.279 --> 0:05:42.719 one and they and the operation signers, but the prosecutor, 0:05:43.160 --> 0:05:45.919 you know, the chances of prosecution are not great. But 0:05:46.000 --> 0:05:50.840 once you've got a pattern and several complainants all with 0:05:50.839 --> 0:05:55.159 the same moders operandi, then you know there is interest 0:05:55.400 --> 0:05:57.760 and the appetite to prosecute put up. 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:02.320 Okay, so six of these complaints planets have open cases 0:06:02.320 --> 0:06:04.880 of fraud, and we'll take a look at the individual 0:06:05.880 --> 0:06:08.480 ins and arts of those cases one by one, but 0:06:08.600 --> 0:06:11.919 just to say so police action has been taken and 0:06:12.000 --> 0:06:15.520 in one case a consumer a small claims court actually 0:06:15.520 --> 0:06:18.280 small court get to in a moment, but the bottom 0:06:18.279 --> 0:06:20.039 line is that these these are the six that we're 0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:23.080 aware of who paid their eighty percent deposits. And Wendy 0:06:23.120 --> 0:06:25.000 also important to say, and I think, in fairness to 0:06:25.000 --> 0:06:26.839 the company, important to say that some of them said 0:06:26.880 --> 0:06:29.840 to us, I did so because i had previously dealt 0:06:29.880 --> 0:06:32.240 with them, and I'd had good experiences with their service 0:06:32.279 --> 0:06:36.000 delivery when they were trading under a previous name as 0:06:36.080 --> 0:06:38.880 Efficient Air Conditioning and Ventilation. We knew it was the 0:06:38.920 --> 0:06:41.080 same people, so we thought we'd get the same kind 0:06:41.120 --> 0:06:41.560 of service. 0:06:41.720 --> 0:06:44.680 Actually, and that makes it really, say me and quite 0:06:44.720 --> 0:06:47.760 odd because you know, I mean, we've all done that, 0:06:47.880 --> 0:06:49.960 had good experience from a company, and then use them 0:06:49.960 --> 0:06:52.599 again with great faith that you know you're going to 0:06:52.600 --> 0:06:57.280 get the same good service. For most of the six well, certainly. Yeah. 0:06:57.400 --> 0:07:01.719 Many of them had had this good experience, good, good 0:07:01.839 --> 0:07:06.240 value for money, good service, efficient service from Efficient air 0:07:06.240 --> 0:07:10.080 Conditioning and ventilation, which is and by the same couple 0:07:10.800 --> 0:07:14.520 one of their names, So yeah, and then had a 0:07:14.560 --> 0:07:17.320 completely opposite experience working time around. Yeah. 0:07:17.440 --> 0:07:19.720 Okay, well, let's bring in one of the complaint's. Laura 0:07:19.800 --> 0:07:21.720 Ford is with us on the line and it was 0:07:21.760 --> 0:07:24.160 her husband David, who dealt with Shark about an aircon 0:07:24.280 --> 0:07:27.280 installation at their home at the end of last year. Laura, 0:07:27.280 --> 0:07:28.760 thank you so much for being willing to chat to 0:07:28.840 --> 0:07:30.200 us today and welcome to the show. 0:07:31.400 --> 0:07:33.440 Thank you very much, nice to be with you. 0:07:33.640 --> 0:07:36.200 Thank you. Won't you just tell us briefly what happened 0:07:36.680 --> 0:07:39.120 starting with your your earlier dealings with this endeavor. 0:07:40.200 --> 0:07:43.800 Yes, I think the whole sort of crux of this 0:07:44.280 --> 0:07:49.560 or the continuing line of province, or is the the 0:07:49.960 --> 0:07:53.640 modus apparandi. So our initial contact with them was in 0:07:53.720 --> 0:07:58.760 March twenty twenty with an installation. We subsequently used them 0:07:58.880 --> 0:08:04.000 over the following years seven times and never had issues. 0:08:04.360 --> 0:08:09.400 Fantastic service, attention to detail, no complaints, so it was 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:12.680 a complete no brainer. When we wanted to install two 0:08:12.720 --> 0:08:16.640 new units in December to make contact with them. They 0:08:16.680 --> 0:08:21.320 gave advice on what units pricing, and yeah, we paid 0:08:21.320 --> 0:08:26.360 the quote eighty percent deposit without a second thought. We 0:08:26.480 --> 0:08:29.960 truly never ever thought to just take five minutes and 0:08:30.640 --> 0:08:34.559 do a bit of social media research, which was a 0:08:34.640 --> 0:08:37.080 valuable lesson. It doesn't take long to just go and 0:08:37.080 --> 0:08:39.000 do a little bit of googling, a little bit of 0:08:39.000 --> 0:08:43.880 Google reviews, Facebook comments to get a quick picture. But 0:08:43.960 --> 0:08:46.880 we didn't. And then yes, and when he says, we 0:08:46.920 --> 0:08:52.680 started getting the excuses and kind of by us led 0:08:52.760 --> 0:08:58.000 March realize that things were going south. And then that's 0:08:58.000 --> 0:09:02.280 how I found the other a grief parties their complaints 0:09:02.280 --> 0:09:04.959 on Facebook and how we kind of got our little 0:09:04.960 --> 0:09:09.520 group together comparing notes and we basically all went through 0:09:09.520 --> 0:09:12.640 the same, the same process of receiving the letter of 0:09:12.679 --> 0:09:18.600 liquidation and yeah, initially refund I within twelve to with 0:09:18.679 --> 0:09:22.679 intention shifteen different they acted and materialized. Then it was 0:09:22.720 --> 0:09:26.520 after though were in liquidation. But you know liquidation, When 0:09:26.520 --> 0:09:30.120 you go into liquidation, you have to see trading. And then, 0:09:30.280 --> 0:09:34.200 as Wendy said, they have continued trading up until yeah, 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:39.720 last month with the last issue. We know, so yeah, 0:09:40.040 --> 0:09:40.840 that's the story. 0:09:41.880 --> 0:09:43.960 Laura as amount of interest. Can you say you received 0:09:43.960 --> 0:09:46.160 a list of excuses why the work wasn't being done? 0:09:46.200 --> 0:09:48.719 What were some of those excuses? What were you told me? 0:09:48.960 --> 0:09:52.319 We say there were Okay, So installation was supposed to 0:09:52.320 --> 0:09:56.040 be twenty three December. We then were told that he 0:09:56.440 --> 0:10:01.160 had an accident with a grinder and into his hand 0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:04.560 and he did an operation. So that kind of limade 0:10:04.679 --> 0:10:07.800 us back off until end of January because we realized 0:10:07.840 --> 0:10:12.960 he would need to get better. Then they told us 0:10:13.000 --> 0:10:17.079 they had Bucky problems. Then the lad the lad and 0:10:17.160 --> 0:10:20.000 they were actually on their way to us when the 0:10:20.040 --> 0:10:24.960 Bucky broke down and I mean, you just can't actually 0:10:24.960 --> 0:10:28.640 make this stuff up. And then the sun broke his arm, 0:10:29.600 --> 0:10:32.000 and then we kind of realized, okay, know we want 0:10:32.040 --> 0:10:32.600 to refund. 0:10:33.880 --> 0:10:37.000 How much had you paid Laura as an eighty percent depositive? 0:10:37.040 --> 0:10:39.600 We paid sixty five. 0:10:40.360 --> 0:10:46.079 Okay, substantial amount. And yeah, you naturally suspect you've spoken 0:10:46.120 --> 0:10:49.280 to sex, but you suspect that there could be others 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:54.920 If somebody, yeah, if somebody listening also paid a deposit 0:10:55.920 --> 0:11:00.600 to this operation and have nothing to show it, what 0:11:00.640 --> 0:11:01.920 would you advise them to do? 0:11:03.200 --> 0:11:05.280 Please get hold of us and will give you an 0:11:05.280 --> 0:11:08.079 email and address that we have for our group. But 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:11.040 the more people we can find, the more powerful our 0:11:11.120 --> 0:11:11.800 case is. 0:11:11.840 --> 0:11:14.400 With that, we. 0:11:14.280 --> 0:11:17.160 Realized, I think the biggest thing here is we realize 0:11:17.160 --> 0:11:18.800 we're not going to feed that money again. That money 0:11:18.920 --> 0:11:23.280 is gone, but we need to stop this happening to 0:11:23.400 --> 0:11:26.640 other piece. If said don't get stopped, they will just 0:11:26.679 --> 0:11:31.320 continue to do this, okay, and I mean at a 0:11:31.360 --> 0:11:35.200 point where they can't keep doing this' that's wrong. It's falled. 0:11:35.240 --> 0:11:37.440 I mean one hundred and fifty thousand rand and there's 0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:39.000 actually nothing to show for that. 0:11:39.960 --> 0:11:43.160 Did you ever intempt to engage with one of the 0:11:43.160 --> 0:11:46.959 couple to say you were so great, we loved the service. 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:52.480 What happened absolutely well, either they ignore your emails or 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:56.920 your WhatsApps, But I mean my husband really genuinely tried 0:11:56.920 --> 0:11:58.600 to reach out and tell them that they were going 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:02.280 down the wrong road. And yeah, come on, did you 0:12:02.440 --> 0:12:03.240 turn this around? 0:12:03.280 --> 0:12:05.120 Did you ever speak to them or was all your 0:12:05.120 --> 0:12:09.280 correspondence written about email or SMS or WhatsApp? 0:12:10.040 --> 0:12:16.680 Mm hmm, there was no actual conversation. Well, yeah was 0:12:16.720 --> 0:12:19.520 when I Jock was recommending what units to put in, 0:12:19.880 --> 0:12:23.120 But otherwise that is their one the one graft we 0:12:23.200 --> 0:12:25.480 have had with them in that entire period since we 0:12:25.520 --> 0:12:28.280 started using them, which they don't answer their phone, they 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:31.440 don't apply to email, but we kind of overlooked at 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:34.080 because their service was so good. 0:12:34.679 --> 0:12:36.200 Yeah, it's just kind. 0:12:36.040 --> 0:12:39.720 Of a yeah, okay, So Laura, look, I wanted to 0:12:39.720 --> 0:12:42.600 say again, I think it's it's fantastic the solidarity you've 0:12:42.600 --> 0:12:45.440 all shown in grouping together to try and make sure 0:12:45.480 --> 0:12:48.840 that other people don't fall victim to this murdus oper Randy, 0:12:49.040 --> 0:12:51.000 won't you just remind us again if somebody is listening 0:12:51.040 --> 0:12:53.719 to this, going, hey, hashtag me too. It happened to us. 0:12:53.800 --> 0:12:55.240 What's the best way to connect with. 0:12:55.240 --> 0:13:01.960 You, mat The email is air con forward at gmail dot. 0:13:01.840 --> 0:13:05.600 Com, airconfraud at gmail dot com, and you can then 0:13:05.640 --> 0:13:08.360 be connected with the other people who have brought cases 0:13:08.400 --> 0:13:10.360 to SAPs and make sure that you are contained under 0:13:10.360 --> 0:13:14.320 the same sort of separate, same group as it were 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:15.360 in how it's treated. 0:13:15.640 --> 0:13:15.720 Well. 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:18.040 Laura, I'm really sorry that this happened to you, but 0:13:18.080 --> 0:13:19.760 thank you for being willing to come on air and 0:13:19.800 --> 0:13:22.200 share the details with us so that others can avoid 0:13:22.200 --> 0:13:24.480 this happening to them. I think it is very valuable 0:13:24.520 --> 0:13:25.600 and we do appreciate it. 0:13:26.360 --> 0:13:28.400 Thanks, thank you, thank you so much. 0:13:28.400 --> 0:13:31.280 Laura Ford speaking to us. There so one of the 0:13:31.320 --> 0:13:35.240 six cases that we looked at, Wendy, shall we I'll 0:13:35.240 --> 0:13:37.000 tell you what we well less briefly look at one 0:13:37.040 --> 0:13:38.520 or two of the others. I'm keeping an eye on 0:13:38.559 --> 0:13:40.280 the clock and knowing that news is looming. But there 0:13:40.280 --> 0:13:43.079 are five others, all with very similar stories. So I 0:13:43.080 --> 0:13:45.240 think it does reinforce what we've just heard from Laura. 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:46.720 Do you want to tell us about what happened to Albert. 0:13:46.840 --> 0:13:50.160 I've spoken to all of them. In January Albert deforce 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:53.440 of Paropaid cool Tech a deposit of almost twenty five 0:13:53.440 --> 0:13:55.600 thousand Rand to an install an air con unit in 0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:57.960 his home. Installation was supposed to happen on the eighth 0:13:57.960 --> 0:14:01.200 of feb didn't happen. Excuse has included the broken down 0:14:01.240 --> 0:14:05.360 bucky he or his wife being ill, that's that's jock smell, 0:14:05.920 --> 0:14:08.199 and then a long string of next weekend, next weekend. 0:14:08.280 --> 0:14:10.040 He asked for a full refund at the end of Feb, 0:14:10.320 --> 0:14:11.880 got a letter saying he'd get it in ten to 0:14:11.920 --> 0:14:14.760 fifteen working days. The same EMMO two days before that 0:14:14.840 --> 0:14:19.360 was up he received notice of intention to liquidate. Albert 0:14:19.400 --> 0:14:22.440 opened a case of fraud in March, and he was 0:14:22.480 --> 0:14:24.920 one of several This is interesting, one of several of 0:14:24.960 --> 0:14:27.640 the complainants of the six who received an email from 0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:31.440 Jacquies yesterday ordering him to immediately cease and desist from 0:14:31.480 --> 0:14:34.200 making false to Pametory and harrissing statements against him and 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:35.760 his family yesterday. 0:14:36.160 --> 0:14:40.320 Obviously subsequent suit to your engage, and we have had 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:41.760 engagement in which we will share. 0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:44.600 Obviously Laura got part of Laura and David who has 0:14:44.600 --> 0:14:46.520 beand got the same the same letters. 0:14:46.520 --> 0:14:49.560 So three of them all yesterday, yep. Okay, So three 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:51.640 of the six have received that letter from his three 0:14:51.840 --> 0:14:54.920 other two or three will i'll confirminacy okay. So we'll 0:14:54.920 --> 0:14:56.560 pause it there for a second because we must just 0:14:56.600 --> 0:14:58.160 take an ad break and go to news. But we 0:14:58.200 --> 0:15:00.160 will be back after this with a couple of the 0:15:00.160 --> 0:15:03.360 case studies and obviously with the response from the company 0:15:03.400 --> 0:15:05.600 as is the writ and fair that Wendy did engage 0:15:05.640 --> 0:15:08.000 with them, and we'll tell you how that went. After 0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:12.000 the short break. Join the conversation. Join the conversation you're 0:15:12.080 --> 0:15:17.600 with Kate talk okay yo, as one of our listener says, 0:15:17.600 --> 0:15:20.280 the case studies are always fascinating, but let's what real world 0:15:20.320 --> 0:15:22.680 recourse do we have. I'm busy shopping for a kitchen, 0:15:22.720 --> 0:15:24.840 and the default I'm being asked for is sixty to 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:28.240 seventy percent. That's all with reputable companies. What am I 0:15:28.320 --> 0:15:29.200 supposed to say? 0:15:29.320 --> 0:15:31.880 I would say, choose one that's a member of the 0:15:31.960 --> 0:15:35.960 Kitchen Specialist Association the KSA, because they will mediate any disputes. 0:15:36.080 --> 0:15:37.760 Oh, that's helpful, and yes, okay. 0:15:37.800 --> 0:15:40.040 And it's not to say that that there's you know 0:15:40.880 --> 0:15:43.560 that if they're not a member, they're not perfectly reputable. 0:15:43.560 --> 0:15:45.320 I don't want to create that impression. But I do 0:15:45.440 --> 0:15:47.440 know from dealing with these cases for so long that 0:15:47.480 --> 0:15:50.960 the KSA is very hands on if you have a dispute, 0:15:51.000 --> 0:15:52.840 and it's so nice to not be fighting this on 0:15:52.880 --> 0:15:53.240 your own. 0:15:53.320 --> 0:15:55.840 Absolutely okay, So that's great advice. We've also got some 0:15:55.880 --> 0:15:57.800 advice from Angelou which will share with you on how 0:15:57.840 --> 0:15:59.760 to make what to giving advice on what to do 0:15:59.800 --> 0:16:02.880 when contractors do ask for large deposits. That hopeful we'll 0:16:02.920 --> 0:16:04.960 share that with you, and we'll also circle back to 0:16:05.040 --> 0:16:07.520 the other case studies in this current batch plus the 0:16:07.560 --> 0:16:09.320 owner of the business's response. 0:16:09.760 --> 0:16:15.080 Cap Talk Consumer Talk WhatsApp on seven to five six 0:16:15.200 --> 0:16:17.200 seven one five six seven. 0:16:18.560 --> 0:16:21.280 Right, we are circling back to the case of the 0:16:21.320 --> 0:16:24.880 air conditioning clients who paid substantial deposits and then never 0:16:24.960 --> 0:16:27.840 received their air conditioning systems. And just before the break, 0:16:27.880 --> 0:16:30.040 we had a listener asking what should we do then 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:33.080 when a contractor asks us for a large deposit, and 0:16:33.080 --> 0:16:35.840 Wendy gave case specific advice to that person on a 0:16:35.920 --> 0:16:38.280 kitchen contract. But I believe we've also received a voice 0:16:38.320 --> 0:16:41.960 note from our DIY contracting guy, Angelo, who'd like to 0:16:41.960 --> 0:16:45.560 share some advice around contractors and deposits. Thanks for sending 0:16:45.560 --> 0:16:47.119 this Angelo, Let's take a listen. 0:16:47.680 --> 0:16:49.120 Hi, Perba Angelo. 0:16:49.200 --> 0:16:54.320 Yeah, with regards to paying deposits, when we tackle projects, 0:16:54.400 --> 0:16:58.240 if a contractor is looking for a deposit, we require 0:16:58.400 --> 0:17:05.280 a the voice from the supplier, a tax invoice, as 0:17:05.320 --> 0:17:13.159 well as a transfer of ownership documentation stating that the material, 0:17:13.760 --> 0:17:19.520 once paid for, belongs to the client. There are other 0:17:19.520 --> 0:17:23.160 steps involved, but that's the way. That's the only way 0:17:23.200 --> 0:17:26.760 you can secure materials. 0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:29.520 I love that. 0:17:29.680 --> 0:17:31.920 I'm going to be using that, Thank you Angelo, going 0:17:31.960 --> 0:17:33.800 forward on all my platforms. 0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:37.000 Thank you for that. So just to recap, and we 0:17:37.480 --> 0:17:40.360 shared some of the case studies beforehand, I just want 0:17:40.359 --> 0:17:42.399 to go back to where we started this conversation. The 0:17:42.400 --> 0:17:45.880 company in question is currently operating as cool Tech Solutions, 0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:48.919 and these customers have paid up to eighty percent in 0:17:49.000 --> 0:17:52.879 deposits for various air conditioning jobs, both at home residences 0:17:52.920 --> 0:17:56.960 and in an industrial setting, many in the Sumrset West, Wellington, Malmsbury, 0:17:56.960 --> 0:17:59.680 Atlantis sort of area, as well as some cases in Belleville. 0:17:59.760 --> 0:18:03.720 And Wendy has engaged with the owner's Jacques Mandre smull 0:18:03.760 --> 0:18:05.399 and we'll get to that in just a moment. We 0:18:05.480 --> 0:18:09.440 heard from Laura, we heard about Albert's experience, Wendy, let's 0:18:09.480 --> 0:18:11.240 just quickly take a look at the others as well, 0:18:11.280 --> 0:18:13.080 because it does really help to build the picture of 0:18:13.080 --> 0:18:14.919 what's been happening. What are it to Domini. 0:18:14.800 --> 0:18:17.679 Dominic Hag of Somerset West paid cool Tech a deposit 0:18:17.720 --> 0:18:19.880 of forty two thousand round in January for an air 0:18:19.880 --> 0:18:23.760 con job excuses for London delivery the same broken down Bucky. 0:18:24.119 --> 0:18:27.800 Then came the promise to refund letter, then the liquidation email, 0:18:27.840 --> 0:18:30.520 then yesterday the cease and assist that was another one 0:18:30.520 --> 0:18:31.800 who got okay, and. 0:18:31.720 --> 0:18:34.200 That was Dominic and then we had Belinda in Belinda 0:18:34.240 --> 0:18:36.760 Dawson in Malmesbury. Now she was another one of those 0:18:36.760 --> 0:18:39.480 who said that she'd previously had a really positive experience 0:18:39.520 --> 0:18:41.320 with the Smiles when they were trading us Efficiently. 0:18:41.840 --> 0:18:47.080 Yes, the apparently very aptly named efficient Air. She was 0:18:47.680 --> 0:18:49.600 so on the base of that, she was a basis 0:18:49.600 --> 0:18:51.439 of that, she was happy to pay cool Tech thirteen 0:18:51.480 --> 0:18:53.359 and a half thousand round of the ninth of August 0:18:53.480 --> 0:18:55.960 last year. This is the oldest case of the six 0:18:56.640 --> 0:19:01.640 for an air con installation. Excuses included that he were 0:19:01.680 --> 0:19:04.160 not doing the installation, was that he'd fallen off. Jacques 0:19:04.200 --> 0:19:07.960 had fallen off a scaffolding and hurt his back. After 0:19:08.000 --> 0:19:10.120 she opened a case of fraud. This is interesting. Cool 0:19:10.160 --> 0:19:12.400 Tech made a positive two hundred rand into her account 0:19:13.800 --> 0:19:16.760 bank account without communicating with her about that, and as 0:19:16.800 --> 0:19:19.719 a result the case was closed. It's since been reopened. 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:22.120 No, so she'd paid thirteen and a half thousand rounds, 0:19:22.119 --> 0:19:25.720 she was refunded two hundred rounds and the police closed 0:19:25.760 --> 0:19:26.320 the case on that. 0:19:26.440 --> 0:19:29.280 Yeah, because the thing was that there's no pattern here. 0:19:29.359 --> 0:19:32.520 And she was the first remember there's no pattern, and 0:19:32.560 --> 0:19:34.359 he's obviously going to pay you back. This is just 0:19:34.400 --> 0:19:37.680 the first and that was also the last. So she's 0:19:37.720 --> 0:19:41.480 currently owed around thirteen thousand and three three hundred five. 0:19:42.080 --> 0:19:43.359 And then we have Craig Bauer. 0:19:43.400 --> 0:19:45.320 So just to say she took the matter to the 0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:48.439 small claims court, that's couple fell to a ps so 0:19:48.560 --> 0:19:51.560 she has a default judgment and she's had no further refund. 0:19:51.320 --> 0:19:53.199 Okay, So there is actually a small claims called judgment 0:19:53.240 --> 0:19:54.120 saying she is owed. 0:19:54.640 --> 0:19:55.959 They didn't appierre okay. 0:19:56.640 --> 0:19:59.960 Then Craig Bauer, it was the industrial one in his. 0:20:00.240 --> 0:20:02.959 Yes, he got cool Tech into quote for an industrial 0:20:03.040 --> 0:20:06.520 extraction system at his billiard and dart club in Bellville. 0:20:06.640 --> 0:20:10.040 He again as well, they all have had previously had 0:20:10.040 --> 0:20:13.679 a good service experience with the Smulls, and so he 0:20:13.720 --> 0:20:17.720 paid his thirteen thousand rand deposit on the twelfth of May, 0:20:18.240 --> 0:20:20.760 and the case then followed the same pattern as the others. 0:20:22.560 --> 0:20:25.879 Like the others, after the quotation stage, which was handled 0:20:25.880 --> 0:20:29.480 by Jacques all communications with his wife Andre he told 0:20:29.480 --> 0:20:32.920 me they still accepted my deposit payment. After sending liquidation 0:20:33.040 --> 0:20:36.320 letters to the others who they owed deposit refunds okay. 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:38.720 And then the final case that we are aware of 0:20:38.840 --> 0:20:41.440 is of Sculptretorius, who owns two factories in Atlantis. 0:20:41.560 --> 0:20:45.080 Yeah, two aluminium plants. He gave cool Tech the go 0:20:45.200 --> 0:20:47.439 ahead to install two air con units in one of 0:20:47.480 --> 0:20:51.000 them and paid a deposit of eighteen thousand Rand in 0:20:51.040 --> 0:20:53.720 April on the basis again of a good experience he'd 0:20:53.720 --> 0:20:57.480 had with efficient Air also operated by the Smulls. He 0:20:57.560 --> 0:20:59.959 got no installation. The blame was put on heavy ray 0:21:00.160 --> 0:21:04.639 and unavailability of technicians. When he got the liquidation notification 0:21:04.920 --> 0:21:09.679 in July, he asked for the liquidation attorney's details, but 0:21:09.840 --> 0:21:12.040