WEBVTT - Consumer Talk: Avoiding the Black Friday scams 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:06.040 Around the world on twenty one Spectacular Lunch for Pilper Hudson. 0:00:06.000 --> 0:00:09.600 And now Consumer Talk featuring Wendy Nola. 0:00:11.800 --> 0:00:14.440 Right, Wendy is with us in studio today for the 0:00:14.480 --> 0:00:17.759 Big Black Friday Show. Just one thing on our mind, 0:00:17.760 --> 0:00:19.759 and that is that one of the biggest shopping days 0:00:19.800 --> 0:00:22.239 of the year is looming at the end of this week, 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:25.360 and the fraudsters of the cyber criminals are rubbing their 0:00:25.400 --> 0:00:28.720 hands together in glee, I guarantee it as they wait 0:00:28.760 --> 0:00:29.880 for the chance to fleece you. 0:00:30.400 --> 0:00:31.760 We are going to do our best to put it 0:00:31.800 --> 0:00:32.040 all in. 0:00:32.080 --> 0:00:34.519 Perspective, to remind you of some of the red flags, 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:36.760 but also just to talk a little bit about spending 0:00:36.800 --> 0:00:40.520 habits and psychology as well. So perhaps before I get started, 0:00:40.600 --> 0:00:44.199 let me ask you whether you even participate in Black Friday. 0:00:44.240 --> 0:00:46.600 Do you feel like you have scored good deals in 0:00:46.640 --> 0:00:50.040 the past. Have you bought something a particular product that 0:00:50.080 --> 0:00:53.159 you specifically waited for Black Friday and felt like you've 0:00:53.200 --> 0:00:55.880 got a great deal, Or on the other hand, are 0:00:55.920 --> 0:00:57.720 you one of those who said I'm not spending a 0:00:57.760 --> 0:01:00.640 penny between now and the end of November will utterly 0:01:00.680 --> 0:01:03.960 reject the whole concept of Black Friday. It's a hoax 0:01:04.240 --> 0:01:08.440 and it's a perfect symbol for overhyped consumers, consumerism and commercialism. 0:01:08.720 --> 0:01:12.280 Love to know where listeners fall in between on that spectrum, 0:01:12.400 --> 0:01:14.160 and if you would like to ask a question or 0:01:14.160 --> 0:01:16.440 share a comment, you are welcome to call in on 0:01:16.720 --> 0:01:19.160 two to one four four six oh five sixty seven 0:01:19.560 --> 0:01:21.720 or send a WhatsApp to seven two. 0:01:21.560 --> 0:01:24.320 Five six seven one five six seven. Always good to 0:01:24.360 --> 0:01:26.240 have you with us, Wendy, Thanks so much, Papa. 0:01:26.680 --> 0:01:29.080 A lot to talk about today. Let's just talk about 0:01:29.120 --> 0:01:31.840 the origins first. I mean Black Friday started in America, 0:01:32.120 --> 0:01:35.520 became a tradition to offer massive sales on the day 0:01:35.600 --> 0:01:38.640 after their Thanksgiving holiday, which is always the fourth Thursday 0:01:38.680 --> 0:01:41.399 in November. So it's the fourth Friday of November that 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:44.720 Black Friday began, and it's kind of their official start 0:01:44.800 --> 0:01:46.680 of the retail festive season. 0:01:47.160 --> 0:01:49.680 And you know it's origin, it's origins. You ask anybody 0:01:49.720 --> 0:01:50.160 who's been in. 0:01:50.160 --> 0:01:52.640 America for Black Friday, or certainly in the early days, Wendy, 0:01:52.680 --> 0:01:55.760 they will tell you they scored massive deals on big, 0:01:55.800 --> 0:01:58.720 big ticket items. But we've moved quite a far way 0:01:58.720 --> 0:02:01.760 away from all of that. Maybe let's start with Keith's question, 0:02:01.880 --> 0:02:04.000 which came in when he heard we were discussing this today, 0:02:04.000 --> 0:02:05.920 why is it even called black Friday? 0:02:06.040 --> 0:02:08.480 Okay, so it's an old accounting firm being in the 0:02:08.520 --> 0:02:10.760 black rather than in the red. In other words, so 0:02:10.840 --> 0:02:14.720 the chance for the retailers to turn a profit, the 0:02:14.760 --> 0:02:18.240 irony being that a lot of consumers who don't mindfully 0:02:18.400 --> 0:02:21.680 partake in Black Friday end up in the red as 0:02:21.720 --> 0:02:24.959 a result. But that's why it's called black Friday. And 0:02:25.120 --> 0:02:27.520 my sisters lived in the States for thirty years, so 0:02:28.200 --> 0:02:31.800 I've I experienced one memorable one with her back in 0:02:32.040 --> 0:02:34.960 two thousand and eight. We literally arrived at this huge 0:02:35.000 --> 0:02:38.320 malland Colorado in the dark, early in the morning, and 0:02:38.360 --> 0:02:42.080 we left in the darkened strow. And I can vouch 0:02:42.120 --> 0:02:46.520 for the fact that back then, certainly it was there 0:02:46.520 --> 0:02:51.359 were some really really massive, authentic bargains to be had, 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:55.320 and I think the same store applies now in between 0:02:56.160 --> 0:02:59.480 the fake bargains. In other words, the manipulating the percentage 0:02:59.480 --> 0:03:03.880 of a reduction that that the price advertised with Black 0:03:03.880 --> 0:03:06.720 Friday is but if you use it wisely, and I 0:03:06.840 --> 0:03:09.480 like to think I didn't, there'd be something wrong with me. 0:03:09.600 --> 0:03:11.800 But you know, I will I know the price of 0:03:12.040 --> 0:03:14.960 cosmetics that I use, for example, so when I wait 0:03:15.720 --> 0:03:18.440 to stock up, I will wait till now and I'll 0:03:18.480 --> 0:03:20.880 know without having to do any research that yes, that. 0:03:20.919 --> 0:03:22.280 Is a good deal. 0:03:22.880 --> 0:03:27.080 Yes. And I've bought some luggage that I've bought pressure cocker, 0:03:27.720 --> 0:03:32.000 things that you know, black, black Christmas, Black Fridays past 0:03:32.120 --> 0:03:36.000 that that I needed at the time and still use 0:03:36.040 --> 0:03:38.800 and get value from so and save up for it. 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:40.560 I have a budget for it. That's a thing I 0:03:40.600 --> 0:03:42.920 think because if you're going to use your credit card, 0:03:44.120 --> 0:03:46.840 there is that buy now, pay later option where you 0:03:46.880 --> 0:03:49.280 don't pay any interests and you don't and it's sort 0:03:49.280 --> 0:03:50.920 of free quidit as long as you pay when you're 0:03:50.920 --> 0:03:53.640 supposed to. But if you want to, you know, if 0:03:53.720 --> 0:03:55.440 if you're buying everything on your credit card and you're 0:03:55.440 --> 0:03:59.240 not paying it all off immediately, is the interest you know, 0:03:59.520 --> 0:04:03.240 maybe the interestable offset any savings that you might have. 0:04:03.320 --> 0:04:05.800 And then you throw in fomo with it as well, 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:08.920 and you know, are you really saving? Because the whole 0:04:08.960 --> 0:04:12.240 idea is to is to get us to move into 0:04:12.240 --> 0:04:14.800 and that's why it's no longer Black Friday, it's Black November. 0:04:15.120 --> 0:04:18.080 To get us to move into this ultra spend mode. 0:04:18.360 --> 0:04:21.720 Yeah, earlier and earlier, and it's very noticeable. 0:04:21.760 --> 0:04:23.640 As you said, used to be a one day and 0:04:23.680 --> 0:04:26.200 then it became the Friday plus the weekend, and then 0:04:26.320 --> 0:04:27.440 Cyber Monday. 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:30.119 On the morning afterwards, and it's not nice a whole month. Yeah. 0:04:30.160 --> 0:04:32.320 I was in Germany last year or the year before 0:04:32.400 --> 0:04:34.680 at this time, and yeah, there were there were Black 0:04:34.760 --> 0:04:39.119 November signs everywhere New Nurk. Yeah, it's a global song. 0:04:39.360 --> 0:04:42.360 Our first listener comment in from Jill saying, I absolutely 0:04:42.400 --> 0:04:44.800 reject the whole concept. I wish we did not feel 0:04:44.839 --> 0:04:47.400 it necessary to adapt American customs. 0:04:47.600 --> 0:04:50.000 So there's one shopper who will not be partaking. 0:04:50.600 --> 0:04:52.440 I'd be interested to you from anybody else who's made 0:04:52.440 --> 0:04:56.400 a similar decision, or perhaps you are somebody who genuinely 0:04:56.440 --> 0:04:59.320 needs to buy a new fridge, a new television, a 0:04:59.360 --> 0:05:01.799 new self. For me last year was running shoes Wendy, 0:05:01.839 --> 0:05:06.200 and I got an absolutely fantastic, massive discount on genuinely 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:08.839 a massive discount because I had been tracking the price. 0:05:08.760 --> 0:05:09.520 In the whole year. 0:05:09.640 --> 0:05:10.400 That's the way to do it. 0:05:10.440 --> 0:05:10.920 I don't think. 0:05:11.279 --> 0:05:14.080 I think to say denounce the whole thing is short sighted. 0:05:14.920 --> 0:05:17.839 Because like anything like your use of social media, there's 0:05:17.839 --> 0:05:19.080 the right way and. 0:05:19.040 --> 0:05:20.760 A roll way. 0:05:21.480 --> 0:05:24.520 So just the first bit of advice would be we're 0:05:24.520 --> 0:05:26.880 going to get more detail just now, is that on 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:30.640 the on the claimed savings first of all two factors. One, 0:05:31.680 --> 0:05:34.000 I've challenged a lot of these over over the years, 0:05:34.120 --> 0:05:38.920 and they'll be quoting the saving on the recommended retail price, 0:05:38.960 --> 0:05:39.799 which they've never. 0:05:39.640 --> 0:05:42.040 Actually used, oh gosh, okay, okay. 0:05:42.440 --> 0:05:44.800 And then the second one is, in order to be 0:05:44.839 --> 0:05:48.200 able to claim that it's this reduction, the prices get 0:05:48.360 --> 0:05:51.159 pushed up a little bit in September of October and 0:05:51.200 --> 0:05:53.800 then they can say, yes, it is a which strikes 0:05:53.800 --> 0:05:55.160 me and it's only occurred to me when I was 0:05:55.240 --> 0:05:58.440 preparing for today's show, Pepa that the advice should probably 0:05:58.440 --> 0:05:59.160 be don't. 0:05:58.880 --> 0:06:01.600 Buy a big in October. 0:06:02.120 --> 0:06:03.800 In September October. 0:06:03.520 --> 0:06:06.680 Because unless you're doing your homework on the price was 0:06:06.680 --> 0:06:08.000 in preparatory. 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:09.919 Okay, We're going to talk in more detail about that 0:06:09.960 --> 0:06:13.200 because they're actually really interesting legal ramifications to that kind 0:06:13.240 --> 0:06:16.400 of practice as well. But firstly, Wendy, I mean, one 0:06:16.440 --> 0:06:19.600 big red flag. We know the number of fraudulent websites 0:06:19.640 --> 0:06:23.680 has increased dramatically. We've spoken about several cases on the show, 0:06:24.560 --> 0:06:27.800 so that's the one thing that's definitely on the uptick. Interestingly, though, 0:06:27.839 --> 0:06:30.480 as you point out, the number of it wobbles associated 0:06:30.480 --> 0:06:31.840 with Black Friday is on the decrease. 0:06:31.880 --> 0:06:34.720 Yeah, that used to be my big story. Yeah, when 0:06:34.760 --> 0:06:38.560 we first adopted it here, I remember several years take 0:06:38.600 --> 0:06:43.880 a lot sute collapsed completely. They would gear up anticipate 0:06:44.200 --> 0:06:46.480 the number of sales they're going to have and then 0:06:46.520 --> 0:06:49.640 it would be super and so that I was always 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:53.080 on the lookout for that. But clearly that's been sorted out. 0:06:53.160 --> 0:06:55.279 I don't can't remember the last time I got a 0:06:55.320 --> 0:06:59.919 complaint about all there was any reports about major retail 0:07:00.240 --> 0:07:04.559 sits crumbling under the strain of increased Black Friday cells. 0:07:04.720 --> 0:07:05.960 They're on top of that now properly. 0:07:06.000 --> 0:07:07.919 Okay, so that's a positive. 0:07:07.960 --> 0:07:09.880 We're going to talk about the right of return and 0:07:09.960 --> 0:07:14.240 a lot of people's misunderstandings around what they're allowed to do. Okay, 0:07:14.240 --> 0:07:16.200 So let's get stuck in. Should we call it Survive 0:07:16.280 --> 0:07:19.360 and Thrive on Black Friday? You can here Linda's saying, 0:07:19.440 --> 0:07:21.880 let me introduce you to Buy Nothing Day, the antidote 0:07:21.920 --> 0:07:23.680 to Black Friday. You and I have heard of that, 0:07:23.880 --> 0:07:27.040 and we also have on the Tuesday, Giving Tuesday, which 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:30.240 is about giving away rather than or donating of your 0:07:30.240 --> 0:07:31.160 time and expertise. 0:07:31.200 --> 0:07:31.840 So there are. 0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:34.800 Actual formal resistance campaigns in place, if I can put 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:36.600 it that way. What we want to do today though, 0:07:36.680 --> 0:07:39.840 is really delve a little bit deeper in granular detail 0:07:39.920 --> 0:07:43.320 into some of the risks involved and just ways to 0:07:43.720 --> 0:07:46.200 avoid those risks. Now, Wendy, the first thing, and I 0:07:46.200 --> 0:07:49.840 think this has got to be said upfront, a bargain 0:07:49.880 --> 0:07:51.920 is only a bargain if you could afford it in 0:07:51.960 --> 0:07:55.480 the first place, and if you are sacrificing spent from 0:07:55.480 --> 0:07:59.320 somewhere else to take advantage of the fantastic deal on 0:07:59.360 --> 0:08:01.880 a fridge or a phone that you didn't actually really 0:08:01.920 --> 0:08:04.720 need or hadn't budgeted for. It's a short term when 0:08:05.040 --> 0:08:07.760 with very potentially serious long term consequences. 0:08:08.320 --> 0:08:09.520 And as you said, some people have. 0:08:09.520 --> 0:08:11.800 Been smart about this, They've been saving all year because 0:08:11.840 --> 0:08:14.240 they know there'll be an opportunity for a deal. But 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:16.400 what about those who haven't been saving that way. 0:08:16.280 --> 0:08:20.240 Now, So the advice is, with all this hap going on, 0:08:20.280 --> 0:08:22.480 and there's a little FOMO as well, it's become an event. 0:08:22.560 --> 0:08:25.560 It's become a sort of a retail celebration for people 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:29.880 is to not just think about I mean, obviously think 0:08:29.880 --> 0:08:35.560 about the what's coming in long, cold, hard January, school 0:08:35.600 --> 0:08:40.000 fees and all the rest and whatever, TV lasses or whatever, 0:08:40.440 --> 0:08:43.920 all those extras, but think beyond that, think about the 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:48.319 unexpected emergency spent a vetbul. I've just spoken to someone 0:08:48.360 --> 0:08:52.800 fellow journalists to have ten thousand ruand vetbul before payday, 0:08:53.880 --> 0:08:56.800 or you need new tires urgently, or you know these 0:08:56.840 --> 0:08:59.920 things that happen and you haven't dentist ball. That's another thing, 0:09:00.040 --> 0:09:03.640 the dentist, because you know, you left with this huge 0:09:04.160 --> 0:09:06.040 short for all, even if you do have medical ad 0:09:06.320 --> 0:09:10.120 so you must be able to know that if that happens, 0:09:10.520 --> 0:09:13.040 you haven't blown so much money on Black Friday, you 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:15.960 haven't got your credit limit or whatever, used your overdraft, 0:09:16.200 --> 0:09:19.400 and that you will be able to handle that. Because 0:09:19.679 --> 0:09:22.320 and those warnings came through from several sectors, and I thought, 0:09:22.320 --> 0:09:23.319 there's obviously a thing. 0:09:23.520 --> 0:09:26.600 Yeah, that they're seeing the rapplications people getting into January. 0:09:26.360 --> 0:09:28.160 Ninth, things happening in January day to. 0:09:28.240 --> 0:09:31.319 Day expenses because of the spending that happened at Black Friday. Okay, 0:09:31.320 --> 0:09:33.400 so keep that in mind as a matter of interest 0:09:33.440 --> 0:09:35.520 whilere we talking about spending on Black Friday, do we 0:09:35.600 --> 0:09:37.480 have sort of figures on just how big it is? 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:39.240 Yes, So this is the time of you when we 0:09:39.360 --> 0:09:43.080 journalists gets loads of Black Friday press releases that have 0:09:43.120 --> 0:09:46.679 sort of been saving them. So on Black Friday last year, 0:09:46.760 --> 0:09:50.800 if it be revealed recently that they processed twenty million 0:09:50.920 --> 0:09:55.719 card transactions, six hundred and ninety transactions per second, this 0:09:55.760 --> 0:09:58.839 is one bank, remember, and the banks is it's seen 0:09:59.240 --> 0:10:02.120 fifty nine cent you and your increase in consumer spend 0:10:02.240 --> 0:10:08.040 on Black Frisurely, just Jux, suppose that with the big 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:10.480 other story that we've been hearing in recent months and 0:10:10.480 --> 0:10:12.960 that I'm certainly involved with in that is gambling spend 0:10:12.960 --> 0:10:17.000 taking away and you know, somehow it'll be interesting for me, 0:10:17.080 --> 0:10:20.040 I think, because it's really that addiction for many people 0:10:20.040 --> 0:10:22.920 has really taken hold in the last i'd say twenty 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:26.600 four months. I'll be interested to see whether that gambling 0:10:26.640 --> 0:10:29.160 spent that's taking more and more of people's disposal income 0:10:29.240 --> 0:10:31.000 is going to have an impact on Black Friday self. 0:10:31.080 --> 0:10:33.079 That's an interesting conation if you're going to track that. 0:10:33.240 --> 0:10:35.360 Okay, yeah, so that's one to watch, but that gives 0:10:35.400 --> 0:10:38.160 you a sense of it's a twenty million card transactions 0:10:38.200 --> 0:10:39.360 processed by one bait. 0:10:39.440 --> 0:10:41.400 That's just one back on one day. 0:10:41.320 --> 0:10:44.000 Fast away couriers, because of course it becomes their job 0:10:44.120 --> 0:10:48.000 after the sale to deliver everything, to deliver obviously we're 0:10:48.000 --> 0:10:51.480 talking online here, and they reported at thirty three percent 0:10:51.559 --> 0:10:54.400 the third year, and your surgeon parcel volumes listened to 0:10:54.480 --> 0:10:57.800 this between August and October, a clear signal that twenty 0:10:57.840 --> 0:11:00.840 twenty five is peak trading season will strain national delivery 0:11:00.840 --> 0:11:03.959 capacity like never before. So this is people getting in earlier. 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:07.480 I don't know, I'm answering my question about gambling spend. 0:11:07.600 --> 0:11:11.200 Maybe overall we're still seeing the people just I mean, 0:11:11.440 --> 0:11:14.280 I challenged a retailer that had a Black Friday sale 0:11:14.320 --> 0:11:18.120 in July, footwear retailer Love, and I said, come on, 0:11:18.679 --> 0:11:22.600 and she said, it works. It's like a trigger for people. 0:11:22.640 --> 0:11:26.520 We call it Black Friday, and the sale, we get 0:11:26.559 --> 0:11:29.000 people's attention and they buy interesting. 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:31.000 It's I mean the psychology and theology. 0:11:31.080 --> 0:11:34.719 More about pology later on, but okay, so definitely a 0:11:34.880 --> 0:11:38.520 surge in in a number of transactions, a surgeon number 0:11:38.559 --> 0:11:42.240 of deliveries. As you've mentioned, Wendy, a lot of the 0:11:42.240 --> 0:11:47.360 financial institutions flagging the issue of indebtedness that comes with that. 0:11:47.520 --> 0:11:50.320 So I think we've covered that, you know. But an 0:11:50.360 --> 0:11:52.440 interesting point, just to just to put this in some 0:11:52.480 --> 0:11:55.720 extra perspective, it's not just about meeting the January bills. 0:11:56.240 --> 0:11:59.360 The National Debt Counseling Association pointing out if you were 0:11:59.360 --> 0:12:01.599 taking that money that you're spending on Black Friday and 0:12:01.720 --> 0:12:04.360 rather investing in your time at saving every year, what 0:12:04.400 --> 0:12:07.240 do you get at the end of that process? Exactly. 0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:09.720 It's a pending how on how much you put away 0:12:09.760 --> 0:12:12.320 over how many years, But she said you will have 0:12:12.400 --> 0:12:19.280 a fantastic growing retirement savings instead of cupboards full of 0:12:19.320 --> 0:12:22.480 forgotten gadgets which you didn't closed that. Yes, you just 0:12:22.600 --> 0:12:25.120 sort of of course, the best bargain is that saving 0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:26.239 is one hundred percent. 0:12:26.040 --> 0:12:27.800 Saving on the thing you didn't buy, exactly. 0:12:27.920 --> 0:12:31.480 But so they there was pages of press releases on 0:12:31.520 --> 0:12:33.360 this with the numbers and everything else. We don't have 0:12:33.400 --> 0:12:35.720 time to go into. But I think as a valid point, 0:12:35.760 --> 0:12:38.720 it's just not as sexy as getting stuck into, you know, 0:12:38.760 --> 0:12:42.360 black Friday and buying consumable things you know, we pull 0:12:42.440 --> 0:12:44.480 don't find it. We don't have a savings culture in 0:12:44.480 --> 0:12:45.839 this country at all, sadly, but. 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:48.600 As Sarah says, we have got to stop buying stuff 0:12:48.640 --> 0:12:52.040 and more stuff that we just don't need now, Gareth 0:12:52.080 --> 0:12:54.920 saying South Africa shouldn't really call it Black Friday. The 0:12:54.960 --> 0:12:58.439 deals we get are marginal at best. The USA has 0:12:58.520 --> 0:13:01.079 volume and is a hyper concus market. They can get 0:13:01.120 --> 0:13:03.560 away with low prices and high volumes once a year. 0:13:03.880 --> 0:13:04.599 We don't have that. 0:13:05.280 --> 0:13:08.040 Sally's comment though, is if you avoid the big ticket items, 0:13:08.040 --> 0:13:12.640 there are often excellent specials, she says sites household essentials 0:13:12.640 --> 0:13:14.800 for example, she says, I have stopped up my cleaning 0:13:14.800 --> 0:13:18.320 cupboard this week already with products at considerably lower than 0:13:18.400 --> 0:13:21.600 usual prices, A great saving when you're on a tight budget. 0:13:21.960 --> 0:13:24.400 So if you can, you know, if you've got storage 0:13:24.400 --> 0:13:28.760 space to store cosmetics, bottles of handy andy bought on special, 0:13:28.800 --> 0:13:29.319 that's great. 0:13:29.480 --> 0:13:33.040 Yes, So I've been looking at all the sites. Amazon 0:13:33.120 --> 0:13:35.400 is going for a big play, saying you t rand 0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:39.760 for next day delivery in the big capita and that 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:42.240 they've they've beefed up their stock, which they have. I've 0:13:42.240 --> 0:13:43.800 been looking at Amazon. I'm looking at take it. Look, 0:13:43.800 --> 0:13:45.880 I'll be looking on one day only all of them. 0:13:46.200 --> 0:13:48.760 And you see among the big tickets, you know, the 0:13:48.840 --> 0:13:53.280 TVs and the and and all the rest, laptops or whatever. 0:13:53.440 --> 0:13:57.320 You see loads of coffee, a luxury for many people, 0:13:57.440 --> 0:14:04.360 but real coffee. You see nappies, you see household cleaning materials, 0:14:04.400 --> 0:14:07.000 as our listeners just said there, so let's not forget that. 0:14:07.120 --> 0:14:10.960 And for many people in the lower LSMs, they know 0:14:11.200 --> 0:14:14.520 what things cost down to the scent. Yeah, and they 0:14:14.760 --> 0:14:18.280 go into the stores and we've seen those photos and 0:14:18.320 --> 0:14:21.680 they are getting essentials. They are getting basic goods. They're 0:14:21.680 --> 0:14:24.640 getting maze meal, they're getting rice, they're getting you know. 0:14:24.800 --> 0:14:29.200 So it's it's it's important to realize that it's at 0:14:29.240 --> 0:14:30.680 every level of consumericm. 0:14:30.720 --> 0:14:32.040 Yeah, it's not just the high end luck. 0:14:32.800 --> 0:14:36.240 And they are definitely getting themselves bargains on shelf stable 0:14:36.280 --> 0:14:40.640 foods and they're not easily doing in terms of price. 0:14:40.720 --> 0:14:42.240 That's it, and we should all be that way with 0:14:42.440 --> 0:14:43.840 exactly we should all be that way. 0:14:43.880 --> 0:14:45.520 But thank you for that. Okay, we're going to take 0:14:45.520 --> 0:14:46.320 a very short break. 0:14:46.320 --> 0:14:48.920 Our conversation are diving into some of the cyber fraud 0:14:49.040 --> 0:14:53.160 issues and some quite sobering stats as well as practical advice. 0:14:53.720 --> 0:14:56.280 As we continue this conversation to three o'clock, you can 0:14:56.320 --> 0:14:59.320 continue to join it on what'sapp seven two five six 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:06.920 seven one five six seven Talk Talk WhatsApp on seven 0:15:07.000 --> 0:15:13.280 two five six seven one five six seven. Okay, back 0:15:13.320 --> 0:15:17.240 to Black Friday and red flags and scams and when 0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:18.880 you look. The next thing we want to talk about 0:15:19.040 --> 0:15:22.560 is is the fraudulent sites. And we've spoken about this 0:15:22.640 --> 0:15:25.600 many times before because we've handled many cases of people 0:15:25.600 --> 0:15:28.640 who ordered. You know, I cited the example of the 0:15:28.680 --> 0:15:31.640 fake Sketches store, which was Sketches with the T added 0:15:31.680 --> 0:15:34.360 to the name, that was so easy to fall four 0:15:34.400 --> 0:15:36.520 and I so so nearly fell for it, and you 0:15:36.560 --> 0:15:39.200 know it happens so easily. But we do need to 0:15:39.240 --> 0:15:42.680 remind I think continuously on this one that the scammers 0:15:42.720 --> 0:15:46.080 are becoming more and more sophisticated in response to the 0:15:46.120 --> 0:15:49.760 different sort of ways of spending online. And I know 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:52.480 you had some engagement with consumer attorney Trudy Brookman on 0:15:52.520 --> 0:15:55.480 this issue, and she also flagged this as the sort 0:15:55.480 --> 0:15:57.880 of increase in the sophistication of the kinds of scams 0:15:57.920 --> 0:15:58.200 going on. 0:15:58.280 --> 0:16:02.600 So, as you mentioned there with sketches replica websites, which 0:16:02.600 --> 0:16:06.760 you must really really look out for because it's hard 0:16:06.800 --> 0:16:09.800 to it's very easy to miss an extra letter at 0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:15.080 transposed to transposed letters, etcetera. Everything looks the same. They've 0:16:15.120 --> 0:16:19.120 literally cloned the genuine website, and then you're just not 0:16:19.160 --> 0:16:24.480 going to get what you ordered. Remember that if unless 0:16:24.520 --> 0:16:28.479 they start getting cleverer about this and really mimicking reality. 0:16:28.880 --> 0:16:32.720 But usually at tellers, if all the sizes and colors 0:16:32.760 --> 0:16:36.200 and whatever are available so that I don't want to put 0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:37.240 you off a purchase. 0:16:38.080 --> 0:16:40.840 But that's normally a tel and it very seldom happens, 0:16:41.160 --> 0:16:42.479 especially on Black Friday. 0:16:42.640 --> 0:16:45.920 Yeah, I've been looking at something you know, sizes and 0:16:45.920 --> 0:16:46.720 massive size, and. 0:16:46.640 --> 0:16:48.480 I just want to repeat what you said about the lettering. 0:16:48.560 --> 0:16:50.560 So the way they catch you is you type, and 0:16:51.200 --> 0:16:53.320 you type into Google. So you decide I want to 0:16:53.320 --> 0:16:55.320 I'm going to carry on using sketches as the example. 0:16:55.680 --> 0:16:57.080 I want to buy a pair of sketches. Let me 0:16:57.080 --> 0:16:59.640 see if they've got a Black Friday special one and 0:16:59.680 --> 0:17:02.000 you in sketches and what pops up in the Google 0:17:02.040 --> 0:17:05.480 search is the actual sketches website or it appears to be, 0:17:05.960 --> 0:17:07.919 but when you click on that link, it takes you 0:17:07.960 --> 0:17:08.879 to a fake site. 0:17:08.880 --> 0:17:12.040 And if you then look up at the URL carefully, 0:17:12.119 --> 0:17:14.200 you will see it's. 0:17:13.520 --> 0:17:16.560 Spelt the wrong way, or they've added a letter, or 0:17:16.560 --> 0:17:18.399 it's the dot com instead of as dot said a, 0:17:18.600 --> 0:17:21.120 et cetera at the end. So it's it's even if 0:17:21.160 --> 0:17:23.440 the first even if you looked at that first link 0:17:23.520 --> 0:17:26.679 and said to yourself, oh, this is genuine, keep on 0:17:26.800 --> 0:17:29.720 checking throughout the transaction, especially when you're at the point 0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:32.639 of pay, Go back and check, am I still on 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:33.840 the genuine website? 0:17:33.880 --> 0:17:36.680 And the pop up Facebook ads and yes that come 0:17:36.760 --> 0:17:39.440 your way when you on Facebook, be ultra ultra wary 0:17:39.480 --> 0:17:43.160 of those and the one remember sorry, the scammers are 0:17:43.280 --> 0:17:47.040 using stolen credit card numbers or numbers that they've got 0:17:47.080 --> 0:17:49.040 in the dark way because there've been so many breaches. 0:17:49.080 --> 0:17:51.400 We're going to get to that to buy those ads. 0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:53.320 They don't even want to pay for their own. 0:17:53.280 --> 0:17:59.040 Advertising, so really, I know. Trudy's advice here is, firstly, 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:02.600 go on to social media. Look for the actual social 0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:05.920 media of the brands and check which websites they are 0:18:06.040 --> 0:18:09.560 using and advertising, and make sure you only go to 0:18:09.640 --> 0:18:11.560 that site because it's very you know, especially if you're 0:18:11.560 --> 0:18:13.320 shopping for the first time, Wendy, with a brand you've 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:14.280 not supported before. 0:18:14.680 --> 0:18:17.680 You don't know exactly whether it's easy for you to 0:18:17.680 --> 0:18:20.120 get caught. Yeah, but no I thing to compare. 0:18:19.840 --> 0:18:22.320 With, So go to their own social media And as 0:18:22.359 --> 0:18:23.920 two D pointed out to us, a lot of those 0:18:23.920 --> 0:18:26.119 brands have got a they're blue ticked ones, they've paid 0:18:26.119 --> 0:18:27.440 for verification on. 0:18:27.640 --> 0:18:30.160 Twitter and the like. So start there. 0:18:30.560 --> 0:18:33.240 As I mentioned, check, double check, triple check that you 0:18:33.359 --> 0:18:35.639 are l especially at the point of payment, to make 0:18:35.680 --> 0:18:39.800 sure you are still on the legitimate site. And then, Wendy, 0:18:39.840 --> 0:18:42.280 you've mentioned this already, but I know truly also flagged 0:18:42.280 --> 0:18:45.240 this issue of deals that aren't really deals at all. 0:18:45.880 --> 0:18:48.760 So she says, use sites like price check, which is 0:18:48.760 --> 0:18:50.679 adviced I've given in the past. You find out the 0:18:50.720 --> 0:18:54.000 real market price for an item that you wanting to buy. 0:18:54.640 --> 0:18:58.639 And there's also a site which specifically tracks take a 0:18:58.680 --> 0:19:03.600 lot's prices. It's called serviltracker dot com servile spelt seer 0:19:03.840 --> 0:19:05.720 va l tracker one word. 0:19:06.040 --> 0:19:08.920 Alice has just recommended it as well, interestingly enough, saying 0:19:08.920 --> 0:19:11.280 it it lists take a lot's price history so you 0:19:11.280 --> 0:19:15.280 can see interesting that this bargain price of two thousand 0:19:15.359 --> 0:19:17.320 rand when the item was actually on sale at two 0:19:17.359 --> 0:19:18.560 thousand and six months ago. 0:19:18.720 --> 0:19:19.360 All you do is. 0:19:19.320 --> 0:19:22.040 Click on the URL, you click on the product description 0:19:22.960 --> 0:19:29.040 copy and drop it into server servitracker dot com and 0:19:30.640 --> 0:19:31.800 you you will go down. 0:19:31.720 --> 0:19:33.760 Quite a ravage. You actually put this to the test. 0:19:33.720 --> 0:19:36.760 Die I did so. I went to their Black Friday 0:19:36.920 --> 0:19:41.520 section Black Friday Deals, and there's a Smeg whistling kettle 0:19:41.560 --> 0:19:45.080