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Speaker 1: Delayed Plan B with senior Daily Maverick journalist Rebecca Davis

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Speaker 1: begins now with a cheery, good afternoon, Rebeccah.

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Speaker 2: Good afternoon, John. I just managed to swallow a large chip.

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Speaker 2: I was eating a large what cutting It's fine, a

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Speaker 2: large crisp. Perhaps you would call them.

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Speaker 1: Ah, yeah, I'd call them a chop.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: What's your preferred flavor.

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Speaker 2: Rebecca, creamy chedder has to be No, has to be no,

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Speaker 2: absolutely not. Well, it's delicious, John, if you take two

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Speaker 2: pieces of built on and you create a creamy headed

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Speaker 2: chip sandwich. So the chip is the sandwich, the filling,

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Speaker 2: and then the built on is the role to follow.

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Speaker 2: Not really need highly recommend.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I will try it after my eightieth birthday. I

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Speaker 1: want to really look forward to it, Rebecca. I said

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Speaker 1: on the radio that I I simply do not understand

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Speaker 1: what Sir Raman Pausa gains by keeping Sissi to last

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Speaker 1: share in the post of minister of one of the

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Speaker 1: more important portfolios in the cabinet, the Minister of Social Development.

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Speaker 1: Now you have been reporting on her for a while,

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Speaker 1: so you are perhaps better placed than I to argue

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Speaker 1: for her scorping.

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Speaker 2: Eight Yes, I think there is one potential reason why

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Speaker 2: President Ramaposa might not act against to last year, or

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Speaker 2: at least be reluctant to do so, and that has

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Speaker 2: less to do with her position as Minister of Social

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Speaker 2: Development and a lot to do with her position as

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Speaker 2: the head of the NC Women's League, which traditionally is

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Speaker 2: a fairly powerful constituency, particularly going into anc election season,

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Speaker 2: not necessarily a body to be trifled with. But the facts,

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Speaker 2: John are just as stomichhing. I mean the rap sheet

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Speaker 2: that this woman by now has developed. And I'll rend

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Speaker 2: of what somebody said to me about the Department of

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Speaker 2: Basic Education, which is that if you want to capture

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Speaker 2: a department, you capture h R because if you can

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Speaker 2: control hiring and firing decisions, then you shore up your

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Speaker 2: little feastom and you know, become bulletproof. So where does

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Speaker 2: she start. Cabinet gives up permission to appoint as Director

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Speaker 2: General Peter Nechipale for one year because he's sixty four.

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Speaker 2: Talasha proceeds to give him a five year contract, seemingly

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Speaker 2: defying Cabinet. Then tells Parliament he's on a five year

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Speaker 2: contract even though the Cabinet minister clearly states the one

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Speaker 2: year contract. We report on this contradiction. Minister Talasha tells

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Speaker 2: Parliament it was a clerical error. Both she and Netchipala

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Speaker 2: identified it. Now fixed, no harm, no file. A week later,

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Speaker 2: without saying anything to Parliament, she quietly goes ahead and

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Speaker 2: institutes discinary charges against Nepale, which she is not allowed

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Speaker 2: to do without the President's permission, which she does not have.

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Speaker 2: So she's now defying the President's She's defied Cabinet and

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Speaker 2: President keep up. She subsequently goes ahead and Minister tarashitas

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Speaker 2: and advertises the DG's position, which she is also not

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Speaker 2: legally permitted to do, and when she's warned against this,

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Speaker 2: she proceeds to double down, arguing that even though she

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Speaker 2: can't hire the new DG, she can advertise it also

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Speaker 2: not true. She employs a special advisor in Guapo Huttler,

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Speaker 2: who she takes with her from the Department of from

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Speaker 2: the Department of Women, Children and People's Disabilities where she

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Speaker 2: was previously Deputy. Kutler may have falsified job experience on

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Speaker 2: the CV. He certainly has no experience with social development,

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Speaker 2: social work, any of those matters at all, and he's

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Speaker 2: trailing disciplinary charges from the Department of Women due to

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Speaker 2: shaming double salary from the government. Will you report on

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Speaker 2: that she gets DG. Nechapale to write a quas high

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Speaker 2: legal letter Nechapala is not a lawyer, saying that they

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Speaker 2: can't do anything to take the disciplinary charges further because

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Speaker 2: it didn't happen in this department. Why is she so

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Speaker 2: intent on employing Guako Huttler Well, one possibility is that

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Speaker 2: she is in a romantic relationship with him, despite being

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Speaker 2: four decades his senior. No judgment happens all the time

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Speaker 2: when the genders are reversed, just noting for color and interest.

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Speaker 2: We reported this on the basis of extremely intimate text

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Speaker 2: messages between Talache and Hutler seen by Daily Maverick. She

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Speaker 2: also employs Hutler's niece as her chief of staff, one

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Speaker 2: of the most senior posts in government and with a

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Speaker 2: salary to match, despite the fact that this needless Eddi

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Speaker 2: Mableta is twenty one years old and also appears to

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Speaker 2: have falsified work experience on her CV. Tolaha is told

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Speaker 2: by Ata pretty explicitly, this young lady cannot be appointed

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Speaker 2: due to lack of qualifications, but she gets Nichepale to

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Speaker 2: sign her employment contract regardless we report on it. She

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Speaker 2: gets haled before Parliament, claims that her former Jesus staff

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Speaker 2: Vanellis Simmons, somehow inexplicably conspired to get my bletcher into

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Speaker 2: the department. No reason at all for why on earth

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Speaker 2: she would do this. Simmons, highly experienced and apparently very

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Speaker 2: able government official, is summarily fired. Mab Leta, however, is

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Speaker 2: suspended on full pay and then allowed to leave quietly

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Speaker 2: at the end of her very lucrative contract. The latest,

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Speaker 2: because John, as I reported last week, is that she

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Speaker 2: appears to have taken possession of two luxury for by

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Speaker 2: four vehicles from Chinese officials, which were supposed to go

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Speaker 2: to the AMC Women's League. She quietly registered them under

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Speaker 2: her kids name and gave them to the kids. She

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Speaker 2: then once again lied to Parliament and said that the

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Speaker 2: donations were given to the ANC Women's League. The AMC

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Speaker 2: Women's League know nothing about it. Of course, neither does

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Speaker 2: the NC, so that seems a very clear falsehood. And

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Speaker 2: what we're left with is a hot mess, John, I

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Speaker 2: mean the infighting, the she's you know, employing people from

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Speaker 2: Sassa and various roles because she's particularly close to the

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Speaker 2: SASSA squad. There aren't people in the positions that most

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Speaker 2: need to be in the positions they're currently now advertising

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Speaker 2: again for the Director General. And the point is there

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Speaker 2: is every sign that this minister has at the very

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Speaker 2: least contravened the rules of Parliament by not declaring cars

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Speaker 2: given as a gift that value almost a million rand,

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Speaker 2: President Ramaposa, what will it take? What? Let's take?

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Speaker 1: Clearly that long list Rebecca so articulately presented is not enough.

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Speaker 1: Happy birthday, by the way, thank you.

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Speaker 2: We're two weeks apart, I think, John, but you are

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Speaker 2: a place season I am in ares, which explains a

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Speaker 2: lot I believe in that sort of thing, which I

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Speaker 2: do not, John, I just tend forty four. This is

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Speaker 2: where you express disbelief.

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Speaker 1: I just you don't look a day over much less

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Speaker 1: than forty four.

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Speaker 2: Correct. But nonetheless, here I am defying the odds and

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Speaker 2: turning forty four. And I didn't actually have any particular

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Speaker 2: themes about turning forty four. It's a bit of a

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Speaker 2: random age. I think we would all agree. Until a

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Speaker 2: very malicious friend sent me an article regarding research that

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Speaker 2: has been done. The truths that.

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Speaker 3: At age sixty and at age forty four, you have

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Speaker 3: a sudden, terrific, dramatic spike in aging. Basically, you turn

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Speaker 3: forty four and your body just ages, musculo skeletal problems,

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Speaker 3: cardiovascular disease, it just all comes crashing down as you

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Speaker 3: transiated from forty three to forty four.

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Speaker 2: Did you find that when you turned sixty?

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Speaker 1: It's so long ago. I don't remember. No, I didn't

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Speaker 1: feel that. Have you felt it in the what just

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Speaker 1: more than a week since you turn forty four?

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Speaker 2: Or Oh, I've never felt all that, John. I have

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Speaker 2: the haggard appearance of a woman as it's been sailing

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Speaker 2: a yacht around the world for a year, and it's going.

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Speaker 1: To get worse since sixteen years time. Oh what a prospect.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know that when I turned forty four and sixty,

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Speaker 1: so I was able to absorb those two milestones in

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Speaker 1: my stride. Shame were you.

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Speaker 2: Well? The good news is John, that the next coming

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Speaker 2: for you is seventy eight. That's the next agent spike.

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Speaker 1: Okay, well, if I get there, I'll be ready for it,

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Speaker 1: and I will take steps now to counteract any spike.

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Speaker 1: I will dull the upcoming spike. There we go. Why

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Speaker 1: did you ask me, Rebecca, whether I can spell?

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Speaker 2: Well? I assumed I knew the answer, John, I mean

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Speaker 2: you're not You're not a sick oh are you? But

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Speaker 2: I was interested because I'm very happy to see in

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Speaker 2: day average afternoon at the South African Spelling b team

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Speaker 2: just took top honors at the African Spelling Bee, and

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Speaker 2: I thought I would put you to the test by

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Speaker 2: giving you a number of words to spell live on air.

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Speaker 3: Are you ready?

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Speaker 2: I'm also going to ask make it slightly more interesting

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Speaker 2: by asking you to use them in a sentence as well.

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Speaker 2: All right, let's go quickly. First one, it's what.

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Speaker 1: S what ty used to be called Swaziland e s

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Speaker 1: w a t i n I very good. Komborti is

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Speaker 1: a drink from a traditional households in the part of

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Speaker 1: the Eastern Cape where I grew up. U m b

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Speaker 1: o m q u i t I.

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Speaker 2: That's very absurdly wrong. Could you give me that again, you.

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Speaker 1: M qo m o t.

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Speaker 2: I U m q o m b o t h I.

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Speaker 1: John, No, No, no, no, no, no no, that's modern spelling.

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Speaker 2: Oh please, oh please? What are you giving me some

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Speaker 2: missionary purest John h b U c h U.

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Speaker 1: I don't believe that buhle water is a tonic for

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Speaker 1: abdominal problems.

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Speaker 2: Oh, that sounds like something I should be drinking at

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Speaker 2: twenty four.

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Speaker 1: Great John Grio please. One of my favorite albums at

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Speaker 1: the moment is by the American roots singer Eric Bibb

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Speaker 1: called Global Grio, and it reflects his fascination with the

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Speaker 1: boulevard dear poets and singers of West Africa known.

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Speaker 2: As Grio's spelling.

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Speaker 1: Oh sorry, g R I O T very good too.

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Speaker 1: I don't believe in the taco losh, but I do

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Speaker 1: mount my beds spread on four flat stones just in case.

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Speaker 1: T O K O l O s H s h

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Speaker 1: E excellent jembe I have you not seen the video

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Speaker 1: of John Matham beating a gembear drum on a recent

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Speaker 1: visit to zimbabwere d j E m b oh.

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Speaker 2: I was hoping I was going to get you there,

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Speaker 2: but there isn't e. At the end, did you mention

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Speaker 2: that I did?

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Speaker 1: Yes?

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Speaker 2: All right, got three more? I know the news is coming.

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Speaker 1: Well, sometimes there's a K and sometimes there's not. To

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Speaker 1: use it in a sentence, The government holds many lehotlas

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Speaker 1: and none of them lead to anything positive. So it

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Speaker 1: is either l E K g O t l A

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Speaker 1: or without the K, and some spellings.

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Speaker 2: Oh sliney pants, second line.

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Speaker 1: Shwe as as in the the Suitor.

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Speaker 2: Royal no as in the fabric.

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Speaker 1: Oh, I don't know that s h e s h

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Speaker 1: w e, but not a word I know.

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Speaker 2: That's correct s h w e s h w e.

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Speaker 2: And finally, John.

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Speaker 1: Hark Harkua used to be a homeland in Apartet, South Africa,

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Speaker 1: and it is sometimes and mostly small g a hyphen

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Speaker 1: uh hang g A r you r U n k

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Speaker 1: u w.

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Speaker 2: A r A n K. I'll give it to you, John,

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Speaker 2: I'll give it all to you. Do you are the

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Speaker 2: spelling b whiz of Cape Talk can I.

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Speaker 1: When I was monitoring the American Spelling Bee competition a

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Speaker 1: few years ago, I was very proud that I was new,

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Speaker 1: knew all of the words, knew what they meant and

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Speaker 1: how to spell them, except this one E limo siginary

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Speaker 1: over to you.

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Speaker 2: E l I m eliemo.

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Speaker 1: M e limo signary.

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Speaker 2: E l I m O s I n A R wife.

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Speaker 1: And it means you're wrong, But it means okay, it

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Speaker 1: means John, it means charitable, and it's spelled e l

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Speaker 1: w E m O s y n A r y

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Speaker 1: E limo siginery. I am in a Limo signory mood.

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Speaker 1: So I'm not going to comment on your inability to

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Speaker 1: spell that word, but thank you very much. Rebecca Davis,

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Speaker 1: senior Daily Maverick journalist, back with another Plan B next week.

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Speaker 1: Why did she set me these challenges? Did you know?

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Speaker 1: Sheeshwe no, there we go. Relief