1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:04,520 Speaker 1: I have seen since I returned from France. And during 2 00:00:04,559 --> 00:00:07,040 Speaker 1: the stay in France, I wasn't able to monitor what 3 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:10,239 Speaker 1: was happening with Artemis two as I would have if 4 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:12,960 Speaker 1: I had still been in South Africa. But since I've 5 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 1: come back, I've looked at some truly extraordinary photographs. I mean, 6 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:18,639 Speaker 1: I don't know whether they are more extraordinary than the 7 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:22,680 Speaker 1: photographs that were taken during the relatively brief period where 8 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:25,720 Speaker 1: humans were traveling to and landing on the Moon and 9 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:31,680 Speaker 1: traveling back from the Moon. Obviously, photographic techniques will have improved, 10 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:35,560 Speaker 1: but maybe things have been photographed now that we didn't 11 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:40,080 Speaker 1: know about. Then maybe the science is really exciting. What 12 00:00:40,120 --> 00:00:44,680 Speaker 1: do we as citizens know? We just go wow. For 13 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:51,040 Speaker 1: the first time in very nearly sixty years, human beings 14 00:00:51,159 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: have got into a spacecraft and flown around the Moon, 15 00:00:55,680 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 1: and soon they might well land again on the Moon. 16 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:03,600 Speaker 1: Eugene Avenant is chief engineer at SANSA Space Operations and 17 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 1: joins US now from Artebia Sportello. Eugene hi got often 18 00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:12,039 Speaker 1: and joined So how excited are you, as a professional 19 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:15,440 Speaker 1: in the field about what Artemis two has done versus 20 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:20,440 Speaker 1: what maybe it was expected to do? Are do you think, wow, 21 00:01:20,560 --> 00:01:21,440 Speaker 1: this has been amazing. 22 00:01:22,560 --> 00:01:25,600 Speaker 2: Yes. Of course, as an engineer myself, one always theres 23 00:01:25,640 --> 00:01:29,560 Speaker 2: a wonder at these complex systems performing as per specification. 24 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:34,520 Speaker 2: I think probably for engineers it's better that there's nothing 25 00:01:34,560 --> 00:01:38,119 Speaker 2: exciting happening because it is not exciting. It means it's 26 00:01:38,120 --> 00:01:43,200 Speaker 2: working as as supposed to, which in itself is a 27 00:01:43,240 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 2: great achievement. Sometimes excitement is not a good thing. And 28 00:01:46,080 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 2: a mission like this where you humilize our it stake. 29 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 1: It's not a particularly complicated process. Well, I mean it is, 30 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:55,360 Speaker 1: but it isn't given If we were able to do 31 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 1: it in nineteen sixty nine and go one step further 32 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:00,440 Speaker 1: and put a landing module on the Moon and get 33 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: the people onto the Moon and then off the Moon's surface, 34 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:06,000 Speaker 1: back into the command module and then back to Earth, 35 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:10,680 Speaker 1: this by comparison, was relative. Not got more difficult to 36 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:12,840 Speaker 1: fly humans around the Moon, has it? 37 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 2: No? 38 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:14,359 Speaker 1: No? 39 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:17,080 Speaker 2: I mean in terms of the science it's the same. 40 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:20,799 Speaker 2: So the orbital mechanics didn't change. The requirements to get 41 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:22,440 Speaker 2: there and back hasn't changed. But I think what I've 42 00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:26,280 Speaker 2: changed is our risk aversion. So when the first missions went, 43 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 2: it was a pioneering spirit that took them there. So 44 00:02:30,600 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 2: people always had at the back of their mind the 45 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:36,040 Speaker 2: possibility of failure and a certain tolerance for failure. But 46 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:38,560 Speaker 2: I think this time around this basically a zero tolerance 47 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:42,440 Speaker 2: for failure. So the engineering requires everything to be really, 48 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:46,519 Speaker 2: really really rock solid and there to be no hiccups 49 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:49,320 Speaker 2: and frightening moments, and there weren't. 50 00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:52,240 Speaker 1: They were as I say, it wasn't monitoring as closely 51 00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:54,720 Speaker 1: as I would have if I'd been at home and 52 00:02:55,360 --> 00:02:58,239 Speaker 1: on the radio, But there were no ops moments in 53 00:02:58,840 --> 00:02:59,360 Speaker 1: the whole. 54 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 2: Apart from the from the toilet that it seems to 55 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:06,680 Speaker 2: have overshadowed the news, but thankfully that's not a life 56 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 2: threatening situation. 57 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:13,720 Speaker 1: And as an engineer speaking to colleagues who are data 58 00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 1: scientists and so on, is there a similar sense of 59 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 1: excitement about the data that might have been gathered, You know, 60 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:23,079 Speaker 1: the observations of the far side of the Moon, which 61 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:27,560 Speaker 1: are as extensive, more extensive, considerably more extensive than have 62 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:28,520 Speaker 1: happened before. 63 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:32,359 Speaker 2: So there's a number of robotic missions that has gone 64 00:03:32,360 --> 00:03:34,639 Speaker 2: to the Moon and orbiters that's flying around the Moon, 65 00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:38,040 Speaker 2: that's taking the scientific measurements and mapping the Moon. I mean, 66 00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 2: you can actually even invoke the Moon on something like 67 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 2: Google Google Maps and just crewis around there. But that's 68 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 2: sort of like almost like sterile science. So the notion 69 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 2: here is that you have human beings behind the cameras 70 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 2: and they can go, oh, look at that. That's exciting 71 00:03:52,760 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 2: and then refocus the attention to that and photograph that 72 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:00,640 Speaker 2: or have an interpretation. So having a person that can 73 00:04:00,640 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 2: make decisions worth the censer in the hand immediately gives 74 00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:07,160 Speaker 2: us that sense of wonder. I mean, if we've all 75 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 2: seen the photographs, they're quite spectacular, both the ones looking 76 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:13,760 Speaker 2: back towards the Earth and for you and the one 77 00:04:13,760 --> 00:04:17,479 Speaker 2: that has the Moon eclipsing the Sun. Those are quite 78 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 2: exciting photographs. Even if the science the per se is 79 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:24,680 Speaker 2: not that useful, it does create that sense of wonder 80 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 2: and it does really motivate people to have those scientific pursuits. 81 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:35,880 Speaker 1: And now a human landing, another human landing on the Moon, 82 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:40,680 Speaker 1: the first in what fifty six years, it would be 83 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 1: about that. Yeah, that is now inevitable. The success of 84 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 1: this mission makes a lunar landing, a human landing on 85 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:53,159 Speaker 1: the Moon inevitable, does it, you, Gene. 86 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:56,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, we can use the word inevitable, but I think 87 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:58,200 Speaker 2: it's been always in the plan. It's always been the 88 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:00,800 Speaker 2: build up towards that. So there's changed the program a 89 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 2: little bit. They're going to take it a little bit easier, 90 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 2: so they first can approve some additional technologies with art inistry. 91 00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:09,640 Speaker 2: Where previously they were going to land with artemistry, now 92 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:12,200 Speaker 2: it's artemisphere before that's going to the lunar surface with 93 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:15,040 Speaker 2: human beings. There's a few things that still need to 94 00:05:15,080 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 2: happen between now and then. I think getting the landers 95 00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:21,680 Speaker 2: and the technology behind the landers sorted out, built and 96 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 2: proven needs to happen, and it needs to happen pretty quickly. 97 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,640 Speaker 2: But I think it's it's it's always been the focus 98 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:29,279 Speaker 2: of the program is to get boots back. 99 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:33,159 Speaker 1: On the Moon, Thank you very much. Indeed, Eugene Evenant, 100 00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 1: chief engineer at the South African National Space Agency's Space 101 00:05:37,640 --> 00:05:42,120 Speaker 1: Operations Division, something that we should be excited about.