1 00:00:01,240 --> 00:00:03,840 Speaker 1: Let's widen the lens now and look at what's happening 2 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:05,040 Speaker 1: beyond our borders. 3 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:06,000 Speaker 2: It's Thursday morning. 4 00:00:06,200 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: Time to head over to our colleagues at Deutschevella in Germany. 5 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:12,680 Speaker 1: Joining me on Zoom is Kai neb in Bond. Welcome 6 00:00:12,840 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: and good morning. 7 00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 2: Good morning Saska. It's great to be on the show again. Now. 8 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:21,640 Speaker 1: It's a pervotal election that's coming up in Hungary this weekend. 9 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:26,200 Speaker 1: They're not the biggest nation nor the largest economy in 10 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: the European Leader Union, but the leader, Victor Auburn, has 11 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 1: been in power for sixteen years and this election is 12 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:37,400 Speaker 1: been closely watched by the EU, the United States and Russia. 13 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:38,159 Speaker 2: Kai. 14 00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:41,199 Speaker 1: Why is this election getting so much. 15 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:43,400 Speaker 2: Attention, Yeah, Saskia. 16 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:46,839 Speaker 3: As you point out, it's Hungary is not really a 17 00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:49,839 Speaker 3: very big country in Europe, but just for perspective, its 18 00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 3: population is around nine million people, whereas Germany has a 19 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 3: population of eighty million, just to give some perspective, and 20 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 3: its economy is far smaller. However, the election is very 21 00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 3: is being very watched by the European Union and actually 22 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 3: quite a lot of the world powers. For the fact 23 00:01:06,319 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 3: that we are seeing the president Victor Auban, who has 24 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:13,240 Speaker 3: led the country for sixteen years. He is pacing up 25 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:17,280 Speaker 3: his stiffest challenge to power for the last sixteen years. 26 00:01:17,280 --> 00:01:19,920 Speaker 3: There's a genuine chance he could lose the president, he 27 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:24,240 Speaker 3: could lose the leadership of Hungary. And his opponent is a. 28 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 2: Guy called Peter Magia of the Teaser Party. 29 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:30,720 Speaker 3: Now this, now, this, this is a It's an interesting 30 00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:34,760 Speaker 3: one basically because of the geopolitics of it. And that 31 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 3: basically is because you have for the very strange situation 32 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:41,679 Speaker 3: where the United States and Russia are both sort of 33 00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 3: hoping that Victor Auban wins for very different reasons on 34 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:51,400 Speaker 3: this case. And basically, Victor Auban, just for our listeners 35 00:01:51,440 --> 00:01:55,080 Speaker 3: who maybe not too familiar with Hungarian politics, describes himself 36 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:59,200 Speaker 3: as sort of a leader of a He he's the 37 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 3: leader of a crew in illiberal democracy, fighting as multiculturalism 38 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:09,120 Speaker 3: and sort of defending Hungary against the against the bureaucrats 39 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 3: from Brussels and the European Union, even though Hungary is 40 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:17,320 Speaker 3: a EU member and his opponent, Peter Magia is he's 41 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:19,840 Speaker 3: he used to be part of the same party of 42 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:23,200 Speaker 3: Victor Auburn, but he is sort of seen as what 43 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:26,639 Speaker 3: the one guy who can who's now fighting against Auburn 44 00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:28,840 Speaker 3: for this election and is one of the only guys 45 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:31,639 Speaker 3: who can actually he is like an insider who could win, 46 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:34,680 Speaker 3: and that's why this is seen as like a very 47 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:35,360 Speaker 3: tight race. 48 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 1: But in what way if he does potentially lose power, 49 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 1: in what way does that affect the power dynamics in Europe. 50 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:47,640 Speaker 1: I'm keen to know why? Why the US and you 51 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:52,720 Speaker 1: know you wanting him to to actually wins a. 52 00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:56,840 Speaker 3: Gen Well, no, So it's an interesting one. And because 53 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:01,359 Speaker 3: basically the United State, and when I say United States, 54 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:04,720 Speaker 3: the current party in power, the Republican Party in US 55 00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:08,160 Speaker 3: Conservatives have for years admired Victor Auban as the leader 56 00:03:08,200 --> 00:03:13,040 Speaker 3: of sort of a Christian nationalist state that is anti immigration, 57 00:03:13,200 --> 00:03:18,240 Speaker 3: anti multiculturalism, and that we've seen very clearly at the 58 00:03:18,280 --> 00:03:21,120 Speaker 3: moment because JD. Vance, the Vice President of the United States, 59 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:26,920 Speaker 3: is actively touring around Hungary and campaigning for him. Earlier 60 00:03:26,919 --> 00:03:30,639 Speaker 3: this year, Marco Rubio, Foreign President, Foreign Minister of the 61 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:36,480 Speaker 3: United States or the he also said that Auban's success 62 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:39,520 Speaker 3: is our success in the United States. As for Russia, 63 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 3: that's an interesting one because Russia has had a long 64 00:03:43,520 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 3: history with Hungary and Hungary is sort of in some 65 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:51,680 Speaker 3: circles seen as a pro Russian voice within the EU 66 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 3: and within NATO. So there are strategic reasons for Russia 67 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 3: to support Victor Auban, whereas there are ideological reasons past 68 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:04,200 Speaker 3: the current US administration to support Victor Auban. 69 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:05,000 Speaker 2: They're very different. 70 00:04:05,080 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 3: And as for the EU, their biggest concern, and I 71 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:10,360 Speaker 3: guess is sort of the erosion of democracy and the 72 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:15,280 Speaker 3: rule of law within Hungary that may continue if if 73 00:04:15,320 --> 00:04:16,400 Speaker 3: Auban remains in power. 74 00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:18,040 Speaker 2: However, this dynamic changes. 75 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:22,360 Speaker 3: We don't know, because TiSER the the challenge of Magia 76 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 3: and is Tisa party have never been in power. They 77 00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:28,440 Speaker 3: sort of come from a similar stock as FIDES, and 78 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 3: it's they've also sort of styled themselves as a party 79 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 3: that's like FIDES, like the current party in power, but 80 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:40,600 Speaker 3: without the baggage, without the corruption, without the bad vibes 81 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:41,640 Speaker 3: that go with them. 82 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:47,720 Speaker 1: We're chatting to Kinnibe from bonn Our d w Deutscher Vella, colleague, 83 00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:50,599 Speaker 1: just one more question on that, because what strikes me 84 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:54,039 Speaker 1: is so interesting, Uh, the US and Russia being on 85 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:54,800 Speaker 1: the same page. 86 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 4: We're going to see a lot more of this going forward, 87 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:00,799 Speaker 4: So I wouldn't say that they're on this same page 88 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:04,359 Speaker 4: as such. There are obviously very big differences between the 89 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:09,360 Speaker 4: reasons zation. But on the case of Victor Auburn, they 90 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 4: have very different reasons for supporting him or at least 91 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:16,280 Speaker 4: backing him in this regard, and it's it's going to 92 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:19,720 Speaker 4: be very fascinating. That's why this is a very closely 93 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:21,560 Speaker 4: watched election, and we will know. 94 00:05:21,480 --> 00:05:25,120 Speaker 3: The results, hopefully by the election happens on Sunday. 95 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,400 Speaker 2: Hopefully by Monday we will know the results. 96 00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 1: We're moving on now to a story still making the 97 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:33,160 Speaker 1: arms in Germany, where part of the country's new military 98 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:37,520 Speaker 1: service law suggests that young men will need permission to 99 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:40,040 Speaker 1: stay abroad for more than three months. 100 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:40,360 Speaker 2: Kai. 101 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:45,560 Speaker 1: This seems really alarming. How's the reaction been in one 102 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:47,719 Speaker 1: and in other German cities? 103 00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:50,599 Speaker 2: Well, sask you put the nail on the head. 104 00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 3: It is. 105 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 2: It's quite alarming. 106 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 3: And it was actually a very bizarre story because the 107 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 3: law had actually passed well. 108 00:05:57,200 --> 00:05:58,520 Speaker 2: What is known as the. 109 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:04,159 Speaker 3: Military Modernized Military Service Modernization Bill actually came into effect 110 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:06,839 Speaker 3: already in January, but it was only picked up. This 111 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:10,280 Speaker 3: fact that you're describing was only picked up last week 112 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 3: and it cased such an uproar across Germany when there 113 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:17,880 Speaker 3: was actual concern that now every single German Man in 114 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 3: that age group between the ages of eighteen to forty 115 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 3: five would actually have to seek permission from military authorities 116 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:27,760 Speaker 3: to leave the country if it were for longer than 117 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 3: three months, which for Germany as a country that has 118 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 3: got a lot of travelers and has a big feeling 119 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 3: of freedom and doesn't really like the idea of being 120 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 3: allowed or told not to do that kind of thing. 121 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:42,920 Speaker 3: I mean, it's been the discussion for many young men 122 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:47,480 Speaker 3: across German cities. They were even demonstrations against this on 123 00:06:47,520 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 3: the weekend in Berlin. And actually the story has become 124 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:56,480 Speaker 3: even more interesting because just yesterday the German Defense Minister 125 00:06:56,600 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 3: said that this rule would not apply as long as 126 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 3: Germany would not be in a state of war, in 127 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:04,480 Speaker 3: a state of conflict, and that this regulation is more 128 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:07,280 Speaker 3: about tracking and trying to figure out just how many 129 00:07:07,279 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 3: conscriptions or how many military age men would be available. 130 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:14,120 Speaker 3: But Saska, it's a very it's it's also sort of 131 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 3: it's an interesting topic because we just it's also making Germans, 132 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:22,000 Speaker 3: I guess, face up to the fact that there are members. 133 00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 3: There is a belief among some politicians that Germany does 134 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 3: you know, in years to come, may face potential threats, 135 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 3: and there are sacrifices that need to be made, and 136 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 3: there are military mentasked with creating essentially Germany Europe's strongest 137 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:40,040 Speaker 3: conventional army within the next few years. It's a very 138 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 3: hot topic at the moment. 139 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:45,440 Speaker 1: And I'm sure you will keep us posted on this 140 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:48,680 Speaker 1: as as it develops. But for me, it just seems 141 00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:51,560 Speaker 1: like the culture of Germany is such since World War 142 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:55,000 Speaker 1: Two that I think you guys have become very peace 143 00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 1: loving people. So I would imagine this is really going 144 00:07:57,640 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 1: to be a hot topic with Germans at home. 145 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 3: Well certainly, I mean that's the thing for since World 146 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 3: War Two, Germany has sort of been known as a 147 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 3: country of peace, at least inwardly seen in itself as 148 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 3: a country that is not warlike. That said, Germany did 149 00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:19,720 Speaker 3: have a very large military during the Cold War era 150 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 3: in a sense it was there was conscription, there was 151 00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 3: military service. For two years, it had about almost half 152 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:32,200 Speaker 3: a million active so active military personnel. That number reduced 153 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:37,880 Speaker 3: significantly after the Cold War period. But currently, the geopolitics 154 00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 3: of the situation is are changing, and I think German 155 00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 3: leaders are trying to prepare for that eventuality. 156 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 1: Can I thank you so much for joining us today. 157 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:51,719 Speaker 1: Of course that is our colleague in Germany at Deutschevella 158 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 1: kainebe in Bonn, and of course we do this every 159 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 1: single day on views and news