WEBVTT - Consumer Talk: Cancelling a cell phone contract 0:00:00.920 --> 0:00:06.920 Lunch with Pippa Hudson and now Consumer Talk featuring Wendy Nolla. 0:00:09.119 --> 0:00:11.520 Wendy's back in the studio with us today. Always good 0:00:11.520 --> 0:00:13.440 to have you on the show. Wendy, welcome, thanks so. 0:00:13.480 --> 0:00:15.840 Much, Papa, good to be back in person, and yeah, 0:00:15.960 --> 0:00:16.600 nice to have you here. 0:00:16.640 --> 0:00:19.360 We are talking, as I've mentioned, about cell phone contracts 0:00:19.360 --> 0:00:21.200 and getting out of them when you want to cancel. 0:00:21.280 --> 0:00:23.439 I'm also happy to make some space for open line 0:00:23.440 --> 0:00:25.959 calls towards the end of the hour, So do you 0:00:26.000 --> 0:00:29.240 send your question on seven two five six seven one 0:00:29.400 --> 0:00:32.640 five six seven. I hope everybody has taken their blood 0:00:32.640 --> 0:00:35.160 pressure medication, is what I want to say first, because 0:00:35.200 --> 0:00:38.680 this is a talking point. Wendy, the cell phone contract issue, 0:00:38.800 --> 0:00:40.760 You and I collectively could write a book with all 0:00:40.800 --> 0:00:43.920 of the case studies plus our personal experiences over the years. 0:00:44.280 --> 0:00:47.040 It goes wrong so often. But won't you just set 0:00:47.040 --> 0:00:49.479 the scene for us before we introduce this week's case studies. 0:00:49.600 --> 0:00:53.480 Okay, So, anyone who's ever tried to cancel a fixed 0:00:53.560 --> 0:00:56.280 term contractor it's not just cell phones, it's also vehicle 0:00:56.360 --> 0:00:59.840 tracking that's happened to me. Jim, whatever the chances are 0:00:59.840 --> 0:01:02.680 you ahead with a very hard cell pitch and an 0:01:02.680 --> 0:01:06.080 attempt to keep you tied to the company, to get 0:01:06.120 --> 0:01:09.480 you to contract further, so you want to say goodbye, 0:01:09.880 --> 0:01:12.120 and they keep trying to make you stay with all 0:01:12.200 --> 0:01:16.280 kinds of sweet promises. Now, whenever I'm confronted with one 0:01:16.280 --> 0:01:19.280 of these cases, which is often, it thinks makes me 0:01:19.280 --> 0:01:22.320 think of my son, John's favorite game to play with 0:01:22.360 --> 0:01:24.360 me when he was a little boy. He's now twenty six, 0:01:25.080 --> 0:01:27.399 but he called this was his name, never letting Go. 0:01:27.640 --> 0:01:29.559 So he said, get on the carpet on the floor, 0:01:29.959 --> 0:01:33.320 and he'd entwine his little limbs with mine, and then 0:01:33.440 --> 0:01:36.679 I had to try and extricate myself from his grip, 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:40.480 which was quite considerable. Sweets, yes, very sweet, and he 0:01:40.760 --> 0:01:42.640 would literally say, come on, let's play. 0:01:42.720 --> 0:01:43.640 Let never let him go. 0:01:44.280 --> 0:01:47.800 And I think of that every time I get one 0:01:47.840 --> 0:01:50.960 of these complaints, because it's a game which the cel 0:01:50.960 --> 0:01:53.919 phone companies in particular like to play with their subscribers 0:01:53.920 --> 0:01:56.520 who want to cancel the contracts. But it's not nearly 0:01:56.560 --> 0:01:59.559 as much fun, at least not for the subscribers. 0:02:00.160 --> 0:02:02.680 So having taken up to such. 0:02:02.480 --> 0:02:05.080 And never letting go cases recently, sort of at the 0:02:05.120 --> 0:02:07.520 same time, I thought it was a good time for 0:02:07.600 --> 0:02:10.679 us to revisit this issue, tell these stories and maybe 0:02:10.680 --> 0:02:13.320 because or not, maybe definitely give some solid advice on 0:02:14.000 --> 0:02:17.400 what you should do, what your rights are, the kinds 0:02:17.400 --> 0:02:20.760 of blocking mechanisms that the companies use, and to be 0:02:20.840 --> 0:02:23.600 they valid or not. Spoiler alert, they're not valid. 0:02:24.400 --> 0:02:28.840 Thank you for that. Okay, So I mean you, as 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:31.400 you point out, Wendy, if you're an Emptyn customer, the 0:02:31.400 --> 0:02:33.760 first clue that it's not going to be easy to 0:02:33.760 --> 0:02:35.960 get out of a contract is the email address that 0:02:36.000 --> 0:02:37.360 you're obliged to you. 0:02:37.360 --> 0:02:38.960 You know, you have to get a hold of retentions. 0:02:39.240 --> 0:02:41.440 Retentions department handles cancelations. 0:02:41.480 --> 0:02:44.520 Yes, I've never had anybody say to me how ridiculous 0:02:44.520 --> 0:02:45.280 that it's retention. 0:02:45.360 --> 0:02:46.560 There should be cancelations. 0:02:46.600 --> 0:02:49.359 But it just becomes sort of normal, Like you upgrade 0:02:49.400 --> 0:02:49.960 your contract. 0:02:49.960 --> 0:02:52.480 You're not upgrading. That sounds like you caught a luck. 0:02:52.320 --> 0:02:56.359 On a plane, you know, being upgraded to business class 0:02:56.440 --> 0:03:02.680 or seat. You're choosing to get yourself committed to a 0:03:02.800 --> 0:03:06.919 completely new contract with possibly in probably different terms. It's 0:03:06.919 --> 0:03:09.799 sort of upgrading they want, but it sounds so much, 0:03:09.840 --> 0:03:13.120 but it sounds almost obligatory and sort of lovely, like 0:03:13.200 --> 0:03:15.360 a favor that you're going to upgrade. 0:03:15.680 --> 0:03:16.040 It's not. 0:03:16.680 --> 0:03:22.400 You know, we get so sort of bamboozled by the marketmology. 0:03:22.680 --> 0:03:25.400 Yes, so we start using it ourselves, Like people write 0:03:25.400 --> 0:03:27.440 to me about their one seater that went wrong. 0:03:27.480 --> 0:03:32.200 It's a chair, but the industry fair the three seat 0:03:32.200 --> 0:03:34.120 of the two seaters and the ones that chair. 0:03:34.560 --> 0:03:38.840 Yeah, okay, So our first case study today is from 0:03:38.960 --> 0:03:42.320 Nicky and Claremont, and I mean this is this just 0:03:42.360 --> 0:03:44.280 says it all, Wendy, Because if ever there was a 0:03:44.320 --> 0:03:47.960 case where a cancelation was obviously needed and there was 0:03:48.080 --> 0:03:50.240 never going to be a renewal of this contract, and 0:03:50.280 --> 0:03:52.360 that should have been obvious from the very very start. 0:03:52.440 --> 0:03:54.800 It should have been a simple case of please cancel 0:03:54.880 --> 0:03:57.640 this contract, yes, thank you very much, we will, and 0:03:57.720 --> 0:04:00.440 with a great deal more empathy than was shown. Won't 0:04:00.440 --> 0:04:02.480 you just tell us what happened when Nicky tried to 0:04:02.480 --> 0:04:05.880 cancel her father's long standing contract with Empty. 0:04:05.680 --> 0:04:08.160 Okay, it had moved on to a month two month basis, 0:04:08.200 --> 0:04:10.760 so he wasn't locked into a fixed term contract, meaning 0:04:10.800 --> 0:04:13.800 he could cancel at any time with a month's notice. 0:04:13.840 --> 0:04:17.080 So important thing to say right up front. Still, after 0:04:17.080 --> 0:04:20.000 all these years. Many people think, especially with their gym 0:04:20.040 --> 0:04:23.039 contracts and with their cell phone contracts and the tracker contracts, 0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:25.920 that if the end date is the fieth of November, 0:04:26.040 --> 0:04:29.119 then it's just going to automatically stop fall away along 0:04:29.160 --> 0:04:30.320 with your obligations. 0:04:30.360 --> 0:04:31.880 But it doesn't. It rolls over. 0:04:32.360 --> 0:04:36.520 The industries talked the Consumer Protection Bill back in the day, 0:04:36.680 --> 0:04:39.560 they saying, you know, it will prejudice consumers if it 0:04:39.680 --> 0:04:43.040 just automatically expired, because they could find themselves in an 0:04:43.040 --> 0:04:46.520 emergency situation, not realize their cel phone contract had expired, 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:48.800 and not be ultimate an emergency call that kind of thing. 0:04:49.279 --> 0:04:52.760 So it rolls over onto a month to month basis, 0:04:53.240 --> 0:04:56.240 meaning it will carry on doing that until you give 0:04:56.320 --> 0:04:58.600 them a month's notice. So you suddenly wake up at 0:04:58.600 --> 0:05:01.040 the end of November, give them a month's notice, You've 0:05:01.040 --> 0:05:03.680 still got to pay for December in this case. So 0:05:03.760 --> 0:05:06.480 that's all that was required in terms of Nicki's dad's contract. 0:05:06.520 --> 0:05:11.400 But he has Alzheimer's. Unfortunately, he hasn't been able to 0:05:11.440 --> 0:05:13.920 speak for a number of years, so and he doesn't 0:05:13.920 --> 0:05:17.080 even have a phone anymore, so he needs this contract 0:05:17.200 --> 0:05:17.800 to end. 0:05:17.839 --> 0:05:19.960 And as you said, I mean, there's just no way 0:05:20.000 --> 0:05:23.760 there are no circumstances and no contracts going to be renewed. 0:05:23.960 --> 0:05:26.120 Even if they said we will give you a fifteen 0:05:26.160 --> 0:05:29.640 thousand round iPhone for free, there was no point very 0:05:29.720 --> 0:05:32.320 much just cancel it, okay. So you would have thought 0:05:32.360 --> 0:05:35.520 that even the most bulldoggish of agents would see that 0:05:35.640 --> 0:05:38.640 and would also have some compassion for the circumstances Wendy 0:05:39.000 --> 0:05:41.760 to say, we've received your notification and we'll action it 0:05:41.839 --> 0:05:43.320 right away. So that is not what happened. 0:05:43.360 --> 0:05:45.760 This isn't a case of them trying to build oze 0:05:45.839 --> 0:05:49.400 Nicki into taking out something else in her father's contracts place. 0:05:49.480 --> 0:05:51.919 It was just that she didn't get anywhere for weeks 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:52.560 and weeks. 0:05:52.640 --> 0:05:53.360 It just stoled. 0:05:53.640 --> 0:05:55.360 Nicky's with us on the line. So let's bring her 0:05:55.360 --> 0:05:57.080 in at this point. And Nikki, I'm so sorry to 0:05:57.160 --> 0:05:58.960 hear about your dad, And I'm sure with all that 0:05:59.000 --> 0:06:01.240 you must be dealing with in that situation, I'm sure 0:06:01.240 --> 0:06:03.760 the very last thing you needed was grief over a 0:06:03.800 --> 0:06:06.760 cell phone contract. That's not needed. But thank you so 0:06:06.839 --> 0:06:08.560 much for joining us and being willing to share your 0:06:08.600 --> 0:06:09.680 experience with us today. 0:06:10.680 --> 0:06:12.680 Thank you, and hello, nice to be with you. 0:06:12.800 --> 0:06:14.799 Nice to have you on the show Nikky. I understand 0:06:14.839 --> 0:06:18.200 that when you first attempted to cancel this contract, it 0:06:18.240 --> 0:06:20.839 actually started quite well. Tell us what happened when you 0:06:20.880 --> 0:06:23.040 made that first call to empty and on the eleventh 0:06:23.080 --> 0:06:23.720 of September. 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:27.839 So when I furned through, I was put through to 0:06:27.880 --> 0:06:32.159 an agent and she very quickly said, I can't do 0:06:32.320 --> 0:06:34.839 this because it's a third party. She wanted to speak 0:06:34.839 --> 0:06:38.039 to my dad. My dad has no language, you know, 0:06:38.120 --> 0:06:41.000 he has a phasire, so he can't speak at all, 0:06:41.440 --> 0:06:44.400 and even if he could, I don't think he would 0:06:44.400 --> 0:06:46.000 be able to know, you know, he wouldn't be able 0:06:46.040 --> 0:06:49.880 to answer any questions. So I explained the situation and 0:06:49.960 --> 0:06:52.440 she said, you know, she doesn't. 0:06:52.200 --> 0:06:52.800 Know what to do. 0:06:52.960 --> 0:06:54.960 So I asked if she could put me through to 0:06:55.000 --> 0:06:59.080 someone who could. So that was in a way of 0:06:59.120 --> 0:07:02.039 first surprise for me, because I would have expected that 0:07:02.120 --> 0:07:06.920 there must be many circumstances where an individual can't cancel 0:07:06.960 --> 0:07:10.200 their own contract and so somebody would need to do 0:07:10.240 --> 0:07:12.600 it on their behalf. But anyway, I got put through 0:07:12.640 --> 0:07:15.640 to someone and he was very helpful. He told me 0:07:15.680 --> 0:07:18.760 I had to either get a letter from my dad's 0:07:18.760 --> 0:07:22.200 GP or doctor saying that he was ill and sent 0:07:22.400 --> 0:07:25.560 me my ID and his ID and or I could 0:07:25.600 --> 0:07:27.440 go to the police and get an affidavit. So I 0:07:27.480 --> 0:07:30.360 got given these options, and he even gave me his 0:07:30.440 --> 0:07:33.520 name and email like his, you know, so I didn't 0:07:33.560 --> 0:07:36.000 have to go through the whole system. I could go 0:07:36.120 --> 0:07:39.280 directly to him. And so I went and got all 0:07:39.280 --> 0:07:41.920 that stuff, sent it through to him, and got sort 0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:45.120 of this response saying I'm afraid I can't help you. 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:49.080 This is that you must go back to retentions. I 0:07:49.120 --> 0:07:51.640 wrote back, and I said, but I started with retentions 0:07:51.680 --> 0:07:55.280 and I was put through to you because they couldn't 0:07:55.320 --> 0:07:58.119 help me, and please, can you tell me who can 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:01.320 you know? Just let me know? And that started this 0:08:02.280 --> 0:08:06.560 endless and they cannot believe how many emails are sent 0:08:06.760 --> 0:08:10.520 to him personally saying just give me a name, just 0:08:10.560 --> 0:08:13.160 give me a number, just give me somebody, And in 0:08:13.240 --> 0:08:16.200 fact he just didn't respond at all. And then I 0:08:16.240 --> 0:08:19.400 started sending to every I was sent to retentions with 0:08:19.480 --> 0:08:22.800 all the information again to complaints that at empty n 0:08:23.000 --> 0:08:25.440 I even sent to the legal at empty and you know, 0:08:25.480 --> 0:08:28.960 I just found every email address I could, but I 0:08:29.040 --> 0:08:33.040 got only one response from another person saying something like, 0:08:33.360 --> 0:08:36.520 please can you help this customer or can you please help? 0:08:36.760 --> 0:08:40.079 Can someone help this person? But I still didn't get 0:08:40.200 --> 0:08:44.320 any other response, and so eventually I actually went to 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:48.920 Akaca in desperation saying, you know, like help what I do. 0:08:49.600 --> 0:08:52.720 And I got a very formal business kind of response saying, 0:08:52.920 --> 0:08:55.720 this isn't something they deal with. It's not their area, 0:08:56.040 --> 0:08:59.400 you know that they're responsible for. And then I thought, 0:08:59.480 --> 0:09:02.080 let me write to Wendy and they see whether she 0:09:02.160 --> 0:09:04.720 could help me. And I honestly thought it was too 0:09:04.760 --> 0:09:07.679 small an issue, you know, to get a response. And 0:09:07.720 --> 0:09:12.800 I was her relieved that she sat in Yeah, and 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:14.280 care saved the day for me. 0:09:14.880 --> 0:09:17.400 I am too. I'm so glad you got somewhere, Wendy, 0:09:17.440 --> 0:09:19.720 and tell us what you what steps you took. 0:09:20.080 --> 0:09:22.360 I first want to just backtrack a bit, because NICKI 0:09:22.600 --> 0:09:26.240 did warm them all those departments, and that original agent 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:28.040 that she was going to do that she currently I 0:09:28.080 --> 0:09:30.800 think you emailed them on a Thursday, Nikki, and you 0:09:30.840 --> 0:09:32.360 said if you haven't if I haven't heard, and it 0:09:32.400 --> 0:09:33.479 wasn't in bold. 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:36.080 Capital letters or aggressively, no. 0:09:36.000 --> 0:09:36.760 Nothing like that. 0:09:36.800 --> 0:09:39.240 She just said, if I haven't heard from you by Monday, 0:09:39.320 --> 0:09:41.960 then I'm going to contact Wendy Nola, and whoever read 0:09:41.960 --> 0:09:44.720 it or didn't read it, they didn't get back to it. 0:09:45.360 --> 0:09:46.800 So she didn't get hold of you, and you got 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:49.080 hold of me, and you've got a response much more 0:09:49.160 --> 0:09:50.800 quickly than Nicky did I did. 0:09:50.920 --> 0:09:55.160 I've got a very swift response, which is gratifying but annoying. 0:09:55.360 --> 0:09:56.400 I'm not the customers. 0:09:56.520 --> 0:09:58.720 Yeah, there needs to be a system and place where 0:09:59.200 --> 0:10:03.520 Nicki could get hold someone internally. That's the troubleshooter to say, like, I've. 0:10:03.280 --> 0:10:05.640 Been with us for weeks, they doesn't. They don't seem 0:10:05.679 --> 0:10:06.679 to have us kick up. 0:10:07.280 --> 0:10:12.680 They have escalations to the CEO's office. And then there's 0:10:12.720 --> 0:10:15.880 the media handling division for people like me, and they 0:10:15.920 --> 0:10:16.800 are super. 0:10:16.480 --> 0:10:19.400 Efficient media the media in all. 0:10:19.280 --> 0:10:22.520 The telecoms companies, most of them are big ones. They 0:10:23.120 --> 0:10:26.719 very responsive, but so at least. 0:10:26.960 --> 0:10:29.160 You know, if I may just say, they're very responsive 0:10:29.160 --> 0:10:31.120 to the media because they know how often they're going 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:34.960 to be in the media because of the education. Yes, okay, 0:10:35.000 --> 0:10:37.480 so what person say to you? 0:10:37.559 --> 0:10:41.120 So there was a big apology. First, I was told 0:10:41.160 --> 0:10:46.720 that Nicki's dad's contract had been canceled with no penalties. 0:10:47.440 --> 0:10:51.360 Penalty exactly, and the reason I asked quite a lot 0:10:51.360 --> 0:10:55.520 of questions. Obviously, they had a comprehensive investigation to why 0:10:55.559 --> 0:10:56.520 Nicki was ghosted. 0:10:56.920 --> 0:11:00.480 It revealed that she did follow the correct process. 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:04.160 In calling EMPTN and emailing retentions, and she was correctly 0:11:04.160 --> 0:11:07.480 advised on the documentation that she was required to supply. 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:12.880 Four interactions were misrouted or incorrectly escalated, for example, mails 0:11:12.920 --> 0:11:15.840 sent to collections and legal which she was desperate alone. 0:11:16.080 --> 0:11:19.160 She wasn't getting responses from the other Unfortunately, these were 0:11:19.200 --> 0:11:23.079 not redirected or acknowledged, which is not acceptable. No customer 0:11:23.160 --> 0:11:26.160 contact should ever go unnoted or resolved. Tell that to 0:11:26.200 --> 0:11:29.160 the people at the cold face. There was no word 0:11:29.240 --> 0:11:33.200 on why the right people that Retentions Lot ignored. 0:11:32.880 --> 0:11:34.960 Multiple emails from Niki as well. 0:11:35.160 --> 0:11:37.240 Yeah yeah, just because I mean it's their job to 0:11:37.320 --> 0:11:39.839 process instructions, so widely they do it. 0:11:39.960 --> 0:11:42.200 I think you said it was about five times, Nikia, right, 0:11:42.280 --> 0:11:44.839 five separate roundhouts lost count. 0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:50.040 I think there were more. Five was just desperate. I'm 0:11:50.040 --> 0:11:56.440 repeating myself here. I haven't heard from you anybody. Yeah yeah, yeah. 0:11:56.760 --> 0:11:59.839 So MTN says this case has highlighted a gap and 0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:04.440 internal handling of vulnerable customer scenarios. And one we deeply regret. 0:12:04.480 --> 0:12:06.760 I think they're referring to your father being vulnerable, but 0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:10.239 I think you felt pretty vulnerable to Nikki in the situation. 0:12:11.040 --> 0:12:14.040 I was told that immediate steps are being taken to 0:12:14.120 --> 0:12:18.439 make the necessary fixes. That's my summary of quite a 0:12:18.480 --> 0:12:21.080 long paragraph empty and claims to understand. 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:23.040 Because sorry, I've got a problem with. 0:12:23.120 --> 0:12:25.800 You making people write to Retentions when they want to cancel, 0:12:25.880 --> 0:12:28.439 because that tells me and them that it's not going 0:12:28.440 --> 0:12:30.960 to be as simple sorry to see you go, thank 0:12:30.960 --> 0:12:34.240 you for your custom process, which would be the appropriately 0:12:34.760 --> 0:12:38.320 graceful way to let yourself describer go, but that it 0:12:38.400 --> 0:12:40.559 was going you were going to be bombarded with please 0:12:40.600 --> 0:12:42.600 stays in the form of this offer and that offer 0:12:42.640 --> 0:12:47.199 and all the rest. So they took my point and said, 0:12:47.880 --> 0:12:51.640 we understand your concern about the having to deal with 0:12:51.679 --> 0:12:55.600 a so called retentions team. Cancelation is indeed more intuitive 0:12:55.640 --> 0:12:59.720 and customer centric, and we are actively exploring how best 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:04.680 evolve this naming. I mean, I would say just change 0:13:04.679 --> 0:13:05.400 it to cancelation. 0:13:05.520 --> 0:13:08.480 Yeah, if you have to think about that one, you've 0:13:08.480 --> 0:13:09.120 already missed the. 0:13:09.760 --> 0:13:11.960 Has cancelations and I'm pretty sure at one point they 0:13:12.000 --> 0:13:15.560 also used to have retentions, so I'm not convinced that 0:13:15.559 --> 0:13:17.800 there will be much of a naming evolution because the 0:13:17.840 --> 0:13:19.920 company went on to say this is empty end that 0:13:20.040 --> 0:13:23.400 many customers who expressed the desire to cancel actually trying 0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:26.360 to resolve service issues, and when those are addressed, they 0:13:26.440 --> 0:13:27.360 choose to stay. 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:29.319 But the retentions team. 0:13:29.200 --> 0:13:31.800 I was assured, is there to ensure that customers are 0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:36.160 fully informed and supported but not obstructed. I'm sure Litten 0:13:36.520 --> 0:13:38.480 is going to have something to say about that. The 0:13:38.559 --> 0:13:41.560 email box. This is something at least is managed. This 0:13:41.679 --> 0:13:45.960 is retentions directly by Empty n not third party sales teams, 0:13:45.960 --> 0:13:50.040 and we have strict quality controls to prevent undue pressure. 0:13:50.920 --> 0:13:54.760 Okay, so Nikki, they've responded to Wendy, Have they got 0:13:54.800 --> 0:13:57.360 back to you. Has the contract actually now been canceled? 0:13:57.360 --> 0:13:58.720 Has that been communicated to you? 0:13:59.840 --> 0:14:03.360 No, No, one's actually communicated from Empty and directly with me. 0:14:04.559 --> 0:14:08.719 I'm checking my dad's bank statement. Yeah, so I will 0:14:08.760 --> 0:14:11.280 check it this month to make sure that I didn't 0:14:11.280 --> 0:14:14.200 actually know that they weren't going to impose the extra 0:14:14.280 --> 0:14:18.760 month penalty. So I've been yeah, I will check his 0:14:18.920 --> 0:14:21.080 bank statement, but I haven't had any response. 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:24.000 It's not it's not a penalty. Sorry to jump, it's 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:25.680 not a penalty. It's the notice period. 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:31.400 They indicated they go to Rembicki for the exto months. 0:14:30.960 --> 0:14:32.800 They know they see. 0:14:34.080 --> 0:14:36.360 It's quite interesting, Nikki that everything you know has been 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:37.760 is what you've heard Viro you. 0:14:38.200 --> 0:14:39.080 I didn't realize that. 0:14:39.080 --> 0:14:42.040 I thought you'd been contacted directly, so that's not shocking. 0:14:42.160 --> 0:14:45.720 So even after so they've agreed to cancel it to you, Wendy, 0:14:45.760 --> 0:14:48.080 but they haven't actually come back to Niki to say 0:14:48.560 --> 0:14:51.680 we apologize firstly for what you've been through and you 0:14:51.840 --> 0:14:54.320 confirming we are going to cancel the contract. It actually 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:58.560 hasn't happened in person to their customers still, which is 0:14:58.600 --> 0:15:00.520 just I'm sorry, that's sounds give me. 0:15:01.360 --> 0:15:04.000 I must say, there's a part of me that is 0:15:04.080 --> 0:15:07.200 wondering whether I'll be writing to Wendy to say, just 0:15:07.400 --> 0:15:11.600 come off my father's accounts again, because I haven't received anything. 0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:15.800 I should have interrogated that with no penalties. I think 0:15:15.840 --> 0:15:17.920 what it means though, is often there is a penalty 0:15:17.960 --> 0:15:19.840 to pay if you're in a contract and now you 0:15:19.840 --> 0:15:22.640 want to cancel early. But I think the notice period 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:27.240 will apply so that don't be surprised if there's a 0:15:27.480 --> 0:15:29.920 last debit order of what was it two fifty eight 0:15:30.080 --> 0:15:32.520 or something in that region at the end of this month, 0:15:32.560 --> 0:15:34.200 that will be the last. And if it's not the last, 0:15:34.200 --> 0:15:35.160 and please let us know. 0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:39.400 Thank you just before we let you go. Nikki, I mean, 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:41.400 how do you feel about I mean, how has this 0:15:41.480 --> 0:15:43.520 process made you feel about the experience at the MPTN. 0:15:43.560 --> 0:15:45.320 Because it's one thing to get a resolution in the 0:15:45.400 --> 0:15:47.360 end and have Wendy be able to tell you the 0:15:47.400 --> 0:15:49.760 contract is going to be canceled, But I mean the 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:52.200 frustration that you've gone through, the amount of time you 0:15:52.240 --> 0:15:55.920 have wasted chasing all that. How you know, how are 0:15:55.960 --> 0:15:57.400 you feeling at this point? 0:15:58.360 --> 0:16:02.840 So I'm an I'm grateful that they've given Wendy this response, 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:07.080 it's it hasn't left me with a good feeling. I haven't. 0:16:07.120 --> 0:16:09.440 I don't feel positive. I certainly won't take art and 0:16:09.640 --> 0:16:15.640 MT and contract myself right now, you know, just because 0:16:16.000 --> 0:16:19.920 I feel like the whole situation, I don't feel like 0:16:20.080 --> 0:16:23.520 I think it was a complete lack of response. I 0:16:23.600 --> 0:16:26.480 really do understand that people don't want to just cancel 0:16:26.520 --> 0:16:29.600 a contract with a third you know, party, person. But 0:16:30.080 --> 0:16:32.200 you know, I was willing to do whatever they needed 0:16:32.240 --> 0:16:35.480 to give the proof that I'm my dad's daughter, and 0:16:35.600 --> 0:16:39.440 you know that he's ill and unable, and I think, 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:44.960 you know the silence after that, really it left me 0:16:45.080 --> 0:16:49.480 so unbelievably frustrated. I didn't know what to do. I thought, 0:16:49.520 --> 0:16:51.320 I'm going to be paying this until I can supply 0:16:51.400 --> 0:16:55.320 a death certificate, obviously, which I'm terrible, but it just 0:16:55.640 --> 0:17:00.320 it was just I felt so I thought, I she's 0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:02.600 vulnerable as the word. I felt like this is a 0:17:02.640 --> 0:17:05.320 big company. They should have a system in place. I'm 0:17:05.320 --> 0:17:07.879 sure I'm not the first person who's got a father 0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:11.520 who's got Alzheimers can't actually act on his own path. 0:17:12.000 --> 0:17:14.720 You know, if someone is ill with another illness, surely 0:17:14.720 --> 0:17:19.920 they have some system in place. So I'm I'm I'm 0:17:20.040 --> 0:17:20.960 the gobsmacked. 0:17:21.040 --> 0:17:24.240 To be honest, Nicky, I'm so sorry you've had this 0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:26.359 terrible run around, but thank you so much for being 0:17:26.359 --> 0:17:28.680 willing to join us on air to share the experience 0:17:28.720 --> 0:17:31.119 with us today and really, fingers crossed, toes crossed and 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:34.720 everything else that I canceled cross hoping that it is resolved. 0:17:35.000 --> 0:17:37.600 You're not alone. Interestingly, Jay's written in saying I had 0:17:37.600 --> 0:17:41.280 a very similar situation a few years ago. After weeks 0:17:41.320 --> 0:17:43.600 of the same kind of red tape that NICKI has had, 0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:46.560 I eventually rang back and just said I was the 0:17:46.640 --> 0:17:49.240 other person and they canceled the contract for me. And 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:52.960 I mean that, I mean that's at impersonating somebody else 0:17:53.000 --> 0:17:55.040 on lying, which is you know, obviously not something that 0:17:55.080 --> 0:17:58.560 we endorse or condone, but you can understand how how 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:01.600 you got there. Elsan's saying, my husband has been trying 0:18:01.640 --> 0:18:04.240 to kind of cancel his empty and contract for six 0:18:04.280 --> 0:18:05.520 months and has now given up. 0:18:06.240 --> 0:18:07.200 I'm shocking. 0:18:07.359 --> 0:18:11.119 It's so let me just share with our listeners for 0:18:11.200 --> 0:18:14.040 the record. According to empty in, this is how you 0:18:14.080 --> 0:18:16.640 go about canceling contract for somebody who is, as they 0:18:16.680 --> 0:18:20.920 put it, incapacitated. So you've got to email went further 0:18:20.960 --> 0:18:27.480 notice retentions at emptn dot com. You've got to include 0:18:27.680 --> 0:18:31.920 a certified copy of the account holder's ID, medical proof 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:36.080 of their incapacity, proof of your relationship and AFFIDAVID or 0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:43.439 birth certificate in the case of children of the account holder, 0:18:43.640 --> 0:18:45.240 and then your contact details. 0:18:45.560 --> 0:18:49.200 Okay, and it's still as skillful now to retentions at 0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:52.280 empty dot com. Well, we have a bother comcase to 0:18:52.320 --> 0:18:55.600 share after the eyewitness news and some more listener feedback 0:18:55.680 --> 0:19:00.840 as well. Join the conversation. Join the conversation with Kep 0:19:00.960 --> 0:19:07.119 talk well before we go onto the Vodicom case. Another 0:19:07.200 --> 0:19:10.720 unhappy MPTN customer. Listen to this. Jeremy writes, I contacted 0:19:10.800 --> 0:19:13.600 MTN on the thirty first of October twenty twenty two 0:19:13.960 --> 0:19:16.560 to request that my contract be canceled on the thirtieth 0:19:16.560 --> 0:19:19.160 of November, in other words, giving them the required notice 0:19:19.200 --> 0:19:21.879 of a calendar months. They told me I could only 0:19:21.960 --> 0:19:25.320 cancel after the expiry date, so effectively charged me for 0:19:25.359 --> 0:19:28.760 another month. This is an unethical business practice. I will 0:19:28.760 --> 0:19:30.560 never support the company again, says Jeremy. 0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:33.280 I've had a case like that before, one or two 0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:35.040 and I take it up and they go, no, it's nonsense, 0:19:35.119 --> 0:19:38.119 we'll we'll deal with the call center agent. 0:19:38.960 --> 0:19:42.040 I mean, what nonsense is that? 0:19:42.119 --> 0:19:44.000 And the other thing I want to talk about is 0:19:44.359 --> 0:19:49.200 that I've had cases where the self phone company has 0:19:49.320 --> 0:19:53.560 prescribed to the person on the way that they should cancel. 0:19:53.640 --> 0:19:56.080 So they've said, no, we only accept cancelations on the phone, 0:19:56.200 --> 0:20:00.840 or no you can't, you can't phone as send us 0:20:00.840 --> 0:20:04.480 an email. The Consumer Protection Access only that you must 0:20:04.480 --> 0:20:08.160 give a month's notice in some recordable form. So as 0:20:08.200 --> 0:20:10.560 long as the call centered was their call center, and 0:20:10.560 --> 0:20:13.639 as long as that email address was valid email address 0:20:13.680 --> 0:20:19.200