Neroli Brennan: This is Seeds for Success, a show where we have
Neroli Brennan: a good yarn about ag life with producers who are
Neroli Brennan: having a go. On the show you'll hear from farmers
Neroli Brennan: in New South Wales who are out there battling the
Neroli Brennan: elements, making tough calls, and getting the job done. You'll
Neroli Brennan: get a laugh out of some of their stories and
Neroli Brennan: also pick up some know- how along the way. I'm
Neroli Brennan: your host, Neroli Brennan. Today we're continuing our chat with
Neroli Brennan: Hamish Wald. In our last episode, Hamish gave us the
Neroli Brennan: rich history of his family farm business and all the
Neroli Brennan: help, support and luck he's utilized to get where he
Neroli Brennan: is today. In today's episode, Hamish delves into their experiences
Neroli Brennan: of shifting their dual- purpose sheep enterprise to White Dorpers,
Neroli Brennan: explaining how well- suited they are to their farm and
Neroli Brennan: business goals. Hamish also shares with us how important it
Neroli Brennan: is to surround yourself with great people, and he explains
Neroli Brennan: how proud he is to have his children returning to the
Neroli Brennan: business and building skills and knowledge that will allow them
Neroli Brennan: to grow beyond the family business. You'll also hear Hamish
Neroli Brennan: talking about the steps they are taking to build their
Neroli Brennan: Dorper stud, and how they're using EID to really refine their
Neroli Brennan: stock flock with a focus on optimizing length, depth, and
Neroli Brennan: width, to meet their meat carcass quality goals and to
Neroli Brennan: match their environmental growing conditions. Today, Local Land Services natural
Neroli Brennan: resource officer, Jasmine Wells, brings you this second part of
Neroli Brennan: her great two- part chat with Hamish.
Jasmine Wells: So Alex and Callum are both on the farm?
Hamish Wald: They are. They've fallen into it. Alex, she was a
Hamish Wald: bit unlucky. Her gap year fell into the first year
Hamish Wald: of COVID, so she'd worked really hard right through school,
Hamish Wald: through everything. Her extracurricular, she had an off the track
Hamish Wald: thoroughbred with a heart of a lion, jumping really well,
Hamish Wald: and she was unlucky. In year 12 at school, he got
Hamish Wald: lame a couple of crucial times. So he got lame at Willinga
Hamish Wald: about a month before the Aus Champs down at Boneo,
Hamish Wald: and so he was lame going to that till about
Hamish Wald: a week before he was sound. So she was able
Hamish Wald: to final and got to 20th, and then she placed at
Hamish Wald: Summer Classic in the end of December and she was
Hamish Wald: looking forward to that next year where she could have
Hamish Wald: 12 months where she was just going to be working
Hamish Wald: at home, but she'd go to every show she could
Hamish Wald: do. She'd go up and do the Queensland run in the
Hamish Wald: winter, she'd do the spring run down through here, she'd
Hamish Wald: do state champs and no distractions, but COVID happened and
Hamish Wald: like so many kids it got disrupted. And then when it
Hamish Wald: got to the end of the second year, she was
Hamish Wald: tossing up whether to try and have another gap year
Hamish Wald: or start uni. And she made the decision that second
Hamish Wald: year of COVID it was going to be no different. And so she put
Hamish Wald: herself in to do Ag Economics up at UNE, went
Hamish Wald: up there, loved her time up there, but she's got
Hamish Wald: herself through and she's got one year to go. And
Hamish Wald: so she's come home to do her last year. It's
Hamish Wald: been fantastic having her home. She's got 12 months at
Hamish Wald: home. She's got into a really good job while she
Hamish Wald: was up there for her working for a software crowd
Hamish Wald: based in agriculture. And so she's still doing that three
Hamish Wald: days a week at home. And then she works here
Hamish Wald: Thursday, Friday and she manages to get her uni done
Hamish Wald: at sometime in the middle, as most people seem to
Hamish Wald: be doing that now. This younger generation does so much
Hamish Wald: more work than we ever did.
Jasmine Wells: I didn't actually know her. I met her briefly at
Jasmine Wells: the draft, but I didn't know it was her. My
Jasmine Wells: mother actually commented. She said, " Oh, look at this young
Jasmine Wells: girl here. The time that she took to stop and
Jasmine Wells: talk to some of the young girls drafting." Just really kind. And there was a
Jasmine Wells: couple of little kids that came up and talked to her.
Hamish Wald: Oh no. Yeah, no, we're very lucky, Penny and I. And
Hamish Wald: it's nothing to do with us. We spent the first
Hamish Wald: year worried they'd break. By the second year we realized,
Hamish Wald: you can't really break them, and they're just the same children
Hamish Wald: they've been since they were tiny. Callum and Alex, I
Hamish Wald: think they're born with their personality and we're just lucky.
Hamish Wald: COVID was very cruel, but it meant we've had them
Hamish Wald: for an extra couple of years that we wouldn't have had.
Jasmine Wells: So Callum's on the farm as well.
Hamish Wald: He is. Callum, when he left school, it was a
Hamish Wald: battle to keep him through year 11 and 12 because it's not
Hamish Wald: his thing. He is very lucky. There was a careers
Hamish Wald: day and basically they let him know that if he
Hamish Wald: left school at 16, he still wouldn't have his licence. And
Hamish Wald: if he then decided later on he did want to
Hamish Wald: study, it didn't matter how well he did in year 11 and 12,
Hamish Wald: but anything he did then would make it easier for
Hamish Wald: him later on. And he had a terrific mentor at
Hamish Wald: the school who went with them from year 7 right
Hamish Wald: through. And he had an incredible group of peers. And
Hamish Wald: once he made the decision he was going to do
Hamish Wald: year 11 and 12, he had a terrific work placement English teacher
Hamish Wald: who was from a rural background. She understood those bush
Hamish Wald: kids. So he put his head down and worked really
Hamish Wald: hard through year 11, got himself early entry to uni.
Hamish Wald: Callum's a pretty straight thinker, then figured his work was
Hamish Wald: done, parents were off his back. So I don't think
Hamish Wald: there's a lot of work done for year 12, but
Hamish Wald: then he left school and a week after he left school he'd organized
Hamish Wald: a job for himself at Burrawang, which, we're lucky, is the Dorper stud at Ootha.
Jasmine Wells: Good grounding.
Hamish Wald: Incredible team. Graham Pickles, who was a major shareholder, was an entrepreneur from
Hamish Wald: Sydney and had a terrific clear thinking business brain. Mal
Hamish Wald: Brady who was the stud manager from the school of
Hamish Wald: hard knocks. He'd learnt everything the hard way, incredibly hard
Hamish Wald: worker, but incredibly positive. And then Wicus Cronje, who was the
Hamish Wald: stud master from South Africa, Barend's dad. Look, there's been
Hamish Wald: a lot of really important foundation people in the breed,
Hamish Wald: but the work he did there, it's just carried the breed forward. He's
Hamish Wald: just taught everyone. He's very generous with his time and
Hamish Wald: he's passionate about the breed and God, the whole breed
Hamish Wald: has been very lucky to have him. And well, his
Hamish Wald: work and his work in the Dorper breed will actually spread out
Hamish Wald: through the rest of the sheep industry because it's just
Hamish Wald: based on sound principles, and a lot of it goes
Hamish Wald: back to what our grandfathers used to say, to be quite honest, a
Hamish Wald: fair bit of it. So Callum is very lucky. Went
Hamish Wald: into that environment and he had six months there. It
Hamish Wald: was just very good for him. He was surrounded by
Hamish Wald: those people who were very generous and gave him a
Hamish Wald: lot of time because he was just an 18- year-
Hamish Wald: old boy with too many questions. And so yeah, he
Hamish Wald: loved it. He had a really good six months there. Then it
Hamish Wald: was sold to a corporate because there was no real succession for
Hamish Wald: that group of people. They were all looking to move on
Hamish Wald: I think, and then it was sold to a corporate.
Hamish Wald: He actually decided to come home at the end of
Hamish Wald: that, and he deserved to go away. The same as
Hamish Wald: Alex. There's been so much change with the stud and so much work and they've just taken on
Hamish Wald: the physical side. Alex has taken on all the technical
Hamish Wald: side of it, and the work she's done with our
Hamish Wald: cross systems has been able to come across into it.
Hamish Wald: And they've done work that we couldn't possibly have done.
Hamish Wald: And then with Barend, we were very lucky. Barend, he
Hamish Wald: was already well known in Condo. His wife, Stevie, she's
Hamish Wald: always been a fantastic girl in Condo. Fortunately he married her,
Hamish Wald: which has anchored him here a bit. Scanning and lamb-
Hamish Wald: marking, working in the sheep industry, he already had an
Hamish Wald: incredible reputation. He's just well known. He's just a thoroughly
Hamish Wald: decent, reliable, hardworking, kind man. He'd already been working with
Hamish Wald: the stud for Robin and Anne, who we bought it
Hamish Wald: off, for four years. So he was doing all the
Hamish Wald: classing and stud work anyway. But we were so lucky when we approached him
Hamish Wald: to come and help us, because we needed him and
Hamish Wald: he took it on. Like most relationships, you think you
Hamish Wald: know what you're getting into, but you don't know. And
Hamish Wald: he's just an incredibly intelligent guy, thoughtful guy. He's helped
Hamish Wald: create this terrific culture on the place with Alex and
Hamish Wald: Callum and other people we've had come and work. Yeah,
Hamish Wald: he's got a huge future in the industry. I think,
Hamish Wald: a bit like both of our kids, they're going to
Hamish Wald: outgrow the farm. The world's changing very quickly and they've got
Hamish Wald: these other outside skills. They bring great skills to the
Hamish Wald: farm, Alex does, but Alex is quiet in the background.
Hamish Wald: She's going to have a bigger future than just the
Hamish Wald: farm. The same with Callum. His ability to get on
Hamish Wald: with people and even get through difficult situations, which his
Hamish Wald: mother's got and she deals with every day in her
Hamish Wald: work. She's got a team of 25 with her and
Hamish Wald: somehow she keeps them all getting on, which I haven't
Hamish Wald: got those skills. Callum, so he's the same. I think
Hamish Wald: he's got more than just the farm. We're just very, very
Hamish Wald: lucky to have him at the moment. And then Barend's the same.
Hamish Wald: He's grown up in South Africa and that family has
Hamish Wald: developed with the breed in South Africa. So they've tried
Hamish Wald: all the things that people are trying now with shedding
Hamish Wald: breeds. They've seen the dead ends, they go up. They've
Hamish Wald: seen some of them do work, some don't. And I don't think Barend
Hamish Wald: ever thought he'd end up doing what he's doing, but
Hamish Wald: a mix of his personality and what he's grown up
Hamish Wald: in, he's got an enormous future here in Australia.
Jasmine Wells: Even as a teacher. I've been in the yards with him
Jasmine Wells: and I'm one of those people that asks too many
Jasmine Wells: questions and he'll stop and explain exactly what he's doing,
Jasmine Wells: what he's looking for, and you know he's got a pile of work in
Jasmine Wells: front of him, but he still takes the time.
Hamish Wald: He does. And so he's going to be bigger than our stud. He'll move
Hamish Wald: around, but anytime we can pinch off him, we're just
Hamish Wald: very grateful for, and we've just got to keep telling ourselves
Hamish Wald: that you're better off having someone like that, that you know
Hamish Wald: will one day outgrow us, than having someone that hasn't
Hamish Wald: got his ability. Because Robin and Anne, the foundation, and Barend
Hamish Wald: helped them, that they put into that stud using those
Hamish Wald: sires from Burrawang what Wicus and Mal Brady and Graham Pickles,
Hamish Wald: and they had this incredible staff there on farm as well,
Hamish Wald: like Amy Strudwick doing the marketing, and Anthony, her husband.
Hamish Wald: We were able to basically piggyback off the back of
Hamish Wald: them, that genetic work they did and it just carried us forward. And then
Hamish Wald: to have Alex doing that side, which they're all complementing
Hamish Wald: each other at the moment. Barend can see everything that's
Hamish Wald: there. Alex is able to unfold what's underneath the skin
Hamish Wald: of all those animals. Her data means that it is
Hamish Wald: all there.
Jasmine Wells: So you're using EIDs?
Hamish Wald: Absolutely, EIDs. We're using genomics, we're using every tool we
Hamish Wald: can at the moment. It's super expensive. It does not
Hamish Wald: help us selling a ram. At the moment, we're in that
Hamish Wald: foundation phase of the stud where every cent that we
Hamish Wald: make is being spent just building this base, trying to
Hamish Wald: create a ewe base going forward. We're using a team
Hamish Wald: from OverTech to do all our embryo transfer work. So
Hamish Wald: we're using a crowd, Lynn and Francois Marais, reproduction vets
Hamish Wald: from Dubbo. They come across and they do two embryo
Hamish Wald: programs. Burrawang is still letting us use some of their genetics, which
Hamish Wald: has been very good, and we've put a lot of
Hamish Wald: resources into trying to create this really good ewe base.
Jasmine Wells: And what are you looking for in that ewe base?
Jasmine Wells: What are you aiming for there?
Hamish Wald: We're keeping it very, very simple. Fertility is number one, so that's
Hamish Wald: where Alex's work in the EIDs is so important. And that
Hamish Wald: database, every time a ewe's been joined, who she's been joined
Hamish Wald: to, how she's raised those lambs. And we've got history
Hamish Wald: and what's fascinating, which anyone that does that, we've got
Hamish Wald: some five- year- old ewes that have had 16- year
Hamish Wald: lambs naturally in their life, that's in an accelerated joining and
Hamish Wald: you've got some ewe's that are only having four, five- year
Hamish Wald: period. So fertility is number one. Structure is important as
Hamish Wald: well. And then no different to any other sheep developed
Hamish Wald: in Australia. We're looking for length, width and depth. We're
Hamish Wald: not constraining or looking for a moderate body size in
Hamish Wald: the Dorper. We're looking for length, width and depth because
Hamish Wald: even though there's a perception that they've been developed for
Hamish Wald: that 20 to 22 kilogram carcass, the genetics are already in there
Hamish Wald: for them to go bigger, and we're trying not to
Hamish Wald: constrain the body that the animal's in because we think
Hamish Wald: the environment does that for you. Genetics are only part
Hamish Wald: of it, so we're trying to go for length, width and depth
Hamish Wald: to get you that good fast early growth. The meat
Hamish Wald: sector want them to go out to 28 to 34 kilos carcass. There's a
Hamish Wald: portion that's still very marketable at 18 to 20. So if the season's
Hamish Wald: tough, they can come off. If the season extends, you
Hamish Wald: can take them into that trade range but keep them growing out.
Hamish Wald: And so what we're aiming for is a 28 kilogram
Hamish Wald: carcass at 28 weeks of age, and that's what the
Hamish Wald: processes are telling us they want. They don't get fat in that
Hamish Wald: age. They keep growing out. They've got terrific eye muscles,
Hamish Wald: length and width and depth. By doing that, you end
Hamish Wald: up with good eye muscles, you end up with depth
Hamish Wald: down the leg, it'll go to a range of environments.
Hamish Wald: And then what happens is people in that environment, the
Hamish Wald: sheep adapt to what that environment is. If they've got
Hamish Wald: too short a growing season, they won't be growing those sheep out to
Hamish Wald: a 28 kilogram carcass. They'll be growing it out to 18
Hamish Wald: to 22 kilos. If it's a tight year, they go at 16 to 18 kilos
Hamish Wald: to a bag lamb if it's very tight or if
Hamish Wald: you can get their 18 to 20, I guess what they've done, they've
Hamish Wald: got rid of that store lamb part of the industry
Hamish Wald: because of its nature, is you're selling into the processor
Hamish Wald: market the whole time. And depending on where you are
Hamish Wald: and how your season's going, we're trying to keep the
Hamish Wald: target market open by having that bigger animal.
Jasmine Wells: You've allowed them to have the potential.
Hamish Wald: To do a mix of what their country does and
Hamish Wald: what the season does, and then you try and line
Hamish Wald: that up with the processor, rather than having a particular
Hamish Wald: set market for it to go into. And a lot
Hamish Wald: of blood and treasure can go into doing that. And
Hamish Wald: the reason I know that is we're doing that with
Hamish Wald: our cattle herd at the moment. We're tied up with the
Hamish Wald: Teys Grassland for our Herefords. You get the same rate
Hamish Wald: or better than the grain fed Angus rate, but to
Hamish Wald: get that you've got to grow them out to a 600 kilogram
Hamish Wald: carcass. Some years we get them there in 20 months.
Hamish Wald: Some year it takes 26 and the 26- month one, it's a
Hamish Wald: lot of blood and treasure to get them there and
Hamish Wald: your cost base has probably eaten up all that reward.
Hamish Wald: So I guess our sheep at the moment, our sheep program
Hamish Wald: is so much better suited financially and even agronomically on
Hamish Wald: the farm to where we live in the environment we're
Hamish Wald: in at the moment. That's part of what we're doing with
Hamish Wald: the sheep breed. We're trying to set it up so
Hamish Wald: it suits the country we're on and you can keep
Hamish Wald: your cost base low that you don't have to feed them.
Hamish Wald: You can choose to grain feed them if you want
Hamish Wald: to, but you don't have to. If you want to
Hamish Wald: opt out anywhere along the way, you can match your
Hamish Wald: stock to the season.
Jasmine Wells: And you've got both White Dorper and Dorper. Why is that? Can you
Jasmine Wells: explain that to someone who doesn't know a lot about Dorpers?
Hamish Wald: You see, so far we bought the stud because I went
Hamish Wald: to buy bread and milk at Chamens and ran into
Hamish Wald: Robin Sanderson. Well, it's even worse. The Black Dorpers were,
Hamish Wald: we'd just finished scanning up the Dohne ewes, the first half of the
Hamish Wald: dispersal to sell. Callum was working at Burrawang. We'd done
Hamish Wald: a very particularly short joining. We'd joined 1, 800 ewes
Hamish Wald: for only four and a half weeks in the Dohnes, and
Hamish Wald: so we thought we'd have about 15, 20% empties because you're lucky to only get 60%
Hamish Wald: in on each cycle just doing the maths. The one
Hamish Wald: thing I did remember from ag college. We had about
Hamish Wald: 300 empties and they'd just been scanned, and Callum rang
Hamish Wald: because he was at Burrawang and they're doing their embryo transfer program
Hamish Wald: and all their recipient ewes were pregnant, which happens. They're
Hamish Wald: highly fertile. And so they were synchronizing their recipes for
Hamish Wald: the program and he spoke to Mal Brady who was
Hamish Wald: the manager at the time, and he said, " Oh look,
Hamish Wald: dad's scanning at the moment. They might have enough empties."
Hamish Wald: And so we had 300 empties or whatever. Then he said, "
Hamish Wald: Yes, can we have them?" He asked what money we
Hamish Wald: wanted for them, and that was early 2020-21, must've been
Hamish Wald: about the March, and sheep prices had been quite hot.
Hamish Wald: At the heart, you like to think they'll stay the same, but
Hamish Wald: in reflection, they were very, very dear and he asked what
Hamish Wald: we wanted for them and I said " Look, I don't really care
Hamish Wald: about money, but if they've got spare embryos over in
Hamish Wald: the program, if we can have some embryos." Because that
Hamish Wald: was going to give us genetics that you don't normally
Hamish Wald: get. There's genetics that those studs at Burrawang now, it's got a very strong commercial focus
Hamish Wald: being corporate owned. They won't release any of those genetics
Hamish Wald: now because financially it's not in their interest and business
Hamish Wald: is business. We've got a very good relationship with them
Hamish Wald: and they're very good, but business is business. There was an
Hamish Wald: incredible opportunity then. I offered them, I said rather than
Hamish Wald: money for the sheep, I'd prefer embryos. And so we
Hamish Wald: ended up synchronizing those. It's a long answer to it.
Hamish Wald: So what ended up happening, we wanted all white embryos
Hamish Wald: because that's all we had. When they did the flush, I
Hamish Wald: got a phone call about three weeks later from Mal said, "
Hamish Wald: The flush hasn't gone as well as we wanted, so all
Hamish Wald: your embryos are going to be black or Dorpers." I went, "
Hamish Wald: God Mal, what are we going to do with those?" And then he said, "Oh, I'll see what I
Hamish Wald: can do. I'll see what I can do." And then
Hamish Wald: we ended up, he rang back and said, " Look, we'll
Hamish Wald: give you a 50/50." So we got half white embryos,
Hamish Wald: half Dorper embryos, and then he said, " Mate, look, this
Hamish Wald: thing's growing that quickly. I've seen it happen in the
Hamish Wald: western division. It's about to hit the central wheat belt.
Hamish Wald: You're going to need them anyway." And he laughed, and so we ended up with those Dorpers.
Hamish Wald: It sort of opened the door for us a bit
Hamish Wald: and then they were coming up to selling it and
Hamish Wald: they offered us a second lot of embryos and they were very dear,
Hamish Wald: but it was the same thing and we couldn't afford them.
Hamish Wald: But it's that you don't get those opportunities come along
Hamish Wald: and you've just got to grab them. What's that saying?
Hamish Wald: The right farm never comes up for sale at the
Hamish Wald: right time. And it's the same with that. Those opportunities never come up
Hamish Wald: when you're ready for them. And so we bought another
Hamish Wald: lot of embryos and they were half Dorper and half White, but he's a very good
Hamish Wald: businessman, Mal Brady, and he was thinking ahead. That meant
Hamish Wald: we had those terrific Dorper reams for sale, which we had in last
Hamish Wald: year's sale. They were as good as the lead of
Hamish Wald: Burrawangs who have got extraordinarily as good as anybody's, but
Hamish Wald: then we had none for the next sale. So we
Hamish Wald: were looking at the place where we had those ewes
Hamish Wald: from that flush, which were what we were after. We
Hamish Wald: had rams in last year's sale and then we're going
Hamish Wald: to have nothing in this year's sale. So then I had
Hamish Wald: to go and buy some Dorper ewes off him to flush, because otherwise
Hamish Wald: we're going to have rams in last year's sale, rams
Hamish Wald: in next year's sale, nothing in this year's sale. So he had me
Hamish Wald: over a barrel then and so yeah, he fleeced me.
Hamish Wald: We were able to buy 15 and we were able
Hamish Wald: to pick them out of their flock, 15 best ewes.
Hamish Wald: And Wicus was there helping Callum and they did it together.
Hamish Wald: The two of them were able to get 15 ewes
Hamish Wald: from 15 different families. So it was terrific for us to
Hamish Wald: create a base for our Dorper flock. We're no threat to anyone.
Hamish Wald: We're still tiny. It'll be five or six years time
Hamish Wald: before we've got enough numbers that we can show people
Hamish Wald: some really good rams. We're not at the stage where
Hamish Wald: we can show them lines of really good Dorper rams.
Hamish Wald: That's going to take work as it's taken every other
Hamish Wald: major stud in Australia. But Barend is very passionate about Dorper sheep
Hamish Wald: because that's what he grew up with. So it's going
Hamish Wald: to be an important part of our program, our White Dorpers.
Hamish Wald: We're very lucky, because Robin had such a good base
Hamish Wald: already, we've got really good White Dorper sheep. And I can say
Hamish Wald: that because it's had nothing to do with me. It's been to do with Robin and
Hamish Wald: Anne's base and then what Barend's been able to do
Hamish Wald: and then Alex behind the scenes and Callum as well.
Hamish Wald: Yeah, they put together a really good white base of
Hamish Wald: sheep and we're hoping the next five or six years
Hamish Wald: time, our Dorpers will be just as good. As I said,
Hamish Wald: it's that same thing. We were very lucky that the
Hamish Wald: base of those sheep were better than I realized from
Hamish Wald: Robin and Anne, and then we were able to get those breed leading genetics early. It
Hamish Wald: was a once off opportunity and we grabbed it and
Hamish Wald: it's worked. We've been very lucky. Now hopefully at some
Hamish Wald: point we sell some rams and start to-
Jasmine Wells: Yeah. So how many rams are you selling a year,
Jasmine Wells: at the moment?
Hamish Wald: We've been selling about 300, so it's gone up very
Hamish Wald: quickly. We kicked off with 350 stud ewes initially, from
Hamish Wald: Robin and Anne, but we've done six ET programs now,
Hamish Wald: so we've had 700 ET lambs on the ground. We
Hamish Wald: were able to buy with Matchless, which was one of
Hamish Wald: the very good foundation, White Dorper studs. We were able
Hamish Wald: to buy 150 of their stud ewes when they dispersed
Hamish Wald: last year. And then through natural progression, we're up now to 1, 200
Hamish Wald: ewes in the stud, and from that we cull about
Hamish Wald: 50% still. Even though it was founded in 2005 because
Hamish Wald: of that rate, we've still got classing rates are very high
Hamish Wald: because we just can't be seen to be selling a
Hamish Wald: ram that's not quite there. So we're still culling. 50% of our
Hamish Wald: rams go and then at the moment, we've just sold 130
Hamish Wald: rams this autumn and we sold 200 rams last spring,
Hamish Wald: and so we'll probably try and stay around that for
Hamish Wald: a couple of years while we consolidate. And then if
Hamish Wald: the demand's there, we'll increase.
Jasmine Wells: And still running your commercial flock as well.
Hamish Wald: It's been hard because we've increased our cattle numbers at
Hamish Wald: the same time. Like everyone, we've been looking for this
Hamish Wald: US herd rebuild, which I think it's obvious because it
Hamish Wald: hasn't happened yet, it's not going to look like what
Hamish Wald: we thought it was going to look like initially. It's
Hamish Wald: going to be a slower burn, a slower move up,
Hamish Wald: it won't be a quick jump. And we've got 1, 500
Hamish Wald: commercial Dorper ewes as well, White Dorpers, and they're run
Hamish Wald: the same as the stud in accelerated joining. They're split into
Hamish Wald: two halves, so they lamb February the first, June the
Hamish Wald: first and October the first. So we've got half the
Hamish Wald: flock lambing every four months. The idea being that before
Hamish Wald: those ewes lamb again, their previous lamb's already gone
Jasmine Wells: And being a stud, your biosecurity is obviously on point.
Jasmine Wells: You're in here today to pick up some baits actually.
Jasmine Wells: So how are you managing that? That's one of the
Jasmine Wells: biggest threats.
Hamish Wald: We're very lucky, we've got good neighbors. When we changed
Hamish Wald: from Merinos into Dorpers, classic Merino farm, we had a
Hamish Wald: lot of those fences done in the 50s with the wooden
Hamish Wald: posts, some that were done in the 70s where they
Hamish Wald: split the wooden posts and put a steel post in. They
Hamish Wald: were netting fences that the bottom had let go. They
Hamish Wald: were fine for Merinos because they don't go through a fence.
Hamish Wald: When we changed to Dohnes, they put pressure on fences
Hamish Wald: like as soon as you've got an open face on a sheep, whether
Hamish Wald: it's a Dorset, a Border Leicester, a Dohne, they do
Hamish Wald: that. So we'd done a lot of fencing as we'd
Hamish Wald: transitioned into the Dohnes. The Dorpers, I think because they're a stronger animal, they're
Hamish Wald: no more naughty than a Dohne, but they're stronger, so they were the same.
Hamish Wald: The only difference is we've gone from a plain wire
Hamish Wald: as a salvage wire on the bottom of our hinge
Hamish Wald: joint fences to putting a barb salvage wire, and most
Hamish Wald: of that's to do is we have a lot of
Hamish Wald: trouble with pigs. The pigs lift the fence and open the
Hamish Wald: hole and then the Dorper tries to follow it. I
Hamish Wald: don't know that we're any better off putting the bottom
Hamish Wald: barb on it. I think the plain salvage wire is
Hamish Wald: just as good and our fences are good. Our neighbors
Hamish Wald: were good and they helped us fencing. There was no problem, which
Hamish Wald: is lucky because not everyone can always help you.
Jasmine Wells: Yeah. And being a big Merino area, those meat sheep
Jasmine Wells: could be met with some contention.
Hamish Wald: They could, but they're terrific people. Well, the classic of Banar,
Hamish Wald: all the families that my great- great- grandfather that settled
Hamish Wald: at Banar, the Crouchs on our western boundary, who are the best
Hamish Wald: sheep people in Condo, they were all related back there.
Hamish Wald: When I rang them, they're tough phone calls. I rang
Hamish Wald: when I changed to the Dohnes and they saw that
Hamish Wald: as a hell of a change because it wasn't your
Hamish Wald: traditional Merino. I rang them with the Dorpers and this is how the disruption that's happening
Hamish Wald: through here. When they were in partnership, they won eight
Hamish Wald: Don Browns and I think since they split up, they've
Hamish Wald: won another four. We're lucky to have them as neighbors. They're just fantastic sheep men.
Hamish Wald: I rang them up and said, " Look, we're making a change.
Hamish Wald: We're transitioning to Dorpers. If there's anything you want done,
Hamish Wald: fence or whatever, we're happy to do it before they get here."
Hamish Wald: We had a six- month period before they came and I was
Hamish Wald: talking to Barry who I respect greatly, and there was this silence, because Barry
Hamish Wald: will tell you when he is not happy, and he's always
Hamish Wald: polite and there was a silence. He said, " Oh, Hamish, we're going
Hamish Wald: out of Merinos anyway. We're changing to cattle." And I
Hamish Wald: nearly fell off my chair because there's no sign of that.
Hamish Wald: And then I rang the eastern neighbor, Yarnel, who Don
Hamish Wald: Brown worked there, so it was out of respect for Don,
Hamish Wald: that they kicked off the Don Brown flock ewe competition,
Hamish Wald: and they're extraordinary Merino people as well. Because of the
Hamish Wald: nature of our country, they've got a different type of sheep to
Hamish Wald: Crouchs because Crouchs are on red country, they're on that heavy
Hamish Wald: black country. We're on that transition in the middle. Rang Wal,
Hamish Wald: and he wished me all the best and he said
Hamish Wald: they'd be interested in watching how it developed, and that's
Hamish Wald: a type of people they are. They're passionate about their Merinos,
Hamish Wald: but they're just fundamentally thoroughly decent people. And they've turned
Hamish Wald: up to all our ram sales. We're lucky, we've got a
Hamish Wald: really good community. So I know that hasn't been the
Hamish Wald: journey for everyone, but generally it comes down to it
Hamish Wald: doesn't matter what it is, everyone's got an incredible amount
Hamish Wald: of pressure on them. Change is always hard and you've
Hamish Wald: just got to be respectful because it's important I don't
Hamish Wald: impact their businesses. They've got good wool growing enterprises. I don't want our sheep
Hamish Wald: disturbing their business and exactly the same, we've got a stud.
Hamish Wald: Brucellosis is rife through the entire sheep industry. Doesn't matter
Hamish Wald: whether it's a Dorper, a Merino, a Dorset, and it improves fertility.
Hamish Wald: I know how important fertility is in our cattle herd.
Hamish Wald: It's the number one factor. No different in sheep and
Hamish Wald: if you're a stud, yeah, it makes or breaks you, biosecurity.
Hamish Wald: So it was in our interest for those fences to
Hamish Wald: be exceptional, on our sheep not getting mixed with anyone
Hamish Wald: else's either. We blood test every ram before we sell
Hamish Wald: it to make sure it's got a negative test. There's
Hamish Wald: no point doing that if you've got porous boundaries. So
Hamish Wald: we spend a lot of time on fences and we
Hamish Wald: spend a lot of time on pest control. We don't
Hamish Wald: allow pigs to transition through our farm. Pigs on our
Hamish Wald: farm we don't think are our neighbors. If there's a
Hamish Wald: pig on our farm, we treat it as it's our
Hamish Wald: pig and it's our job to get rid of it, even
Hamish Wald: though they do move through the landscape. So there's never
Hamish Wald: going to be a solution to pigs. They're just something
Hamish Wald: we're continually managing. Don't think that'll ever be any different.
Jasmine Wells: No, I think it's brilliant. I look forward to going to the next sale, actually. I'm going to-
Hamish Wald: No, it'll be great, Jas. What it is for us,
Hamish Wald: it's a great chance to catch up with a lot
Hamish Wald: of people. As I said, last year's sale, it was our second sale. It was
Hamish Wald: in tough conditions. There'd been a couple of terrible sales
Hamish Wald: of very good studs the week before. We'd gone from
Hamish Wald: 60 to 100 rams because we feel we need to put up
Hamish Wald: 100 rams so that everyone that comes, we want to
Hamish Wald: go home with a ram. The price of the sale
Hamish Wald: is not important. We just want everyone that comes, goes
Hamish Wald: home with one. We had a hundred people at our
Hamish Wald: sale, 55 of them were neighbors and friends that had
Hamish Wald: no interest of buying a ram, but it was just lovely
Hamish Wald: to see dust coming up that driveway and they all
Hamish Wald: stayed and they created this atmosphere that we were able to
Hamish Wald: sell all the rams and we're just so grateful.
Jasmine Wells: Give it a plug. When is your next sale?
Hamish Wald: September 11th. That's Wednesday. It starts at 10 o'clock, finishes
Hamish Wald: at 12. I think we're muscle scanning in the middle
Hamish Wald: of August and then we class a couple of days
Hamish Wald: after that. The farm's always open, anyone that wants to
Hamish Wald: come and see. Quite often it's daunting turning up on
Hamish Wald: a sale day or whatever. A really good chance to
Hamish Wald: see the sheep and what we do, for anyone that's interested. Even
Hamish Wald: if you're not interested in Dorpers, if you're in the
Hamish Wald: wool, come along and have a look. They're going to
Hamish Wald: be very important for the meat sheep industry going forward.
Hamish Wald: Come along and have a look and you'll see what
Hamish Wald: we throw out. It's hard work. It's only half the
Hamish Wald: rams that make it to the sale. The other half
Hamish Wald: don't. To me, Barend and Callum are pulling out a lot
Hamish Wald: of rams that I still think look fine, but they're
Hamish Wald: further down that track than me. They're pulling out rams
Hamish Wald: that they don't want to have a problem in two
Hamish Wald: years time. That's the time often when you learn so
Hamish Wald: much. If anyone wants to come on farm, we've got
Hamish Wald: an open door. You can come anytime because we're always
Hamish Wald: working sheep.
Jasmine Wells: Thanks, Hamish. That was great.
Hamish Wald: Thanks, Jas.
Neroli Brennan: Thanks for listening. This podcast was brought to you by
Neroli Brennan: Central West Local Land Services. Local Land Services delivers advice
Neroli Brennan: and support to farmers, landholders and the community across New
Neroli Brennan: South Wales. To learn more, you can find us online
Neroli Brennan: by searching for Central West Local Land Services. If you'd
Neroli Brennan: like more information about the topics we discussed today, as
Neroli Brennan: well as links to relevant articles, fact sheets, events and
Neroli Brennan: other helpful resources, we've added those into the show notes
Neroli Brennan: for this episode. You can find them by tapping or
Neroli Brennan: swiping over the cover art in your podcast player now.
Neroli Brennan: Hey, and while you're there, please leave us a five-
Neroli Brennan: star review. It really helps other farmers find the show.
Neroli Brennan: I'm your host, Neroli Brennan, and I'll chat to you next time.