Speaker 1: From Kurt Coe media there's no place like.
Speaker 2: Welcome to another special episode of Hollywood unscripted stuck at home.
Speaker 2: I'm Jenny Curtis and today I'm virtually sitting down with
Speaker 2: playwright screenwriter and showrunner Mary laws. She's written on AMC
Speaker 2: is Preacher. HBO succession and created a new anthology series
Speaker 2: on Hulu called Monster land.
Speaker 3: Mary thank you so much for joining me. Hi. I
Speaker 3: want to start at the beginning. So you grew up
Speaker 3: in suburban Texas. Your parents were ministers. How did you
Speaker 3: find your way to the arts.
Speaker 4: Doesn't that answer your question. I grew up in Texas
Speaker 4: and my parents are suburban Minister.
Speaker 5: I grew up in a household where my mother read
Speaker 5: to me all the time and there was a great
Speaker 5: love of literature. And so from an early age she
Speaker 5: took me to a lot of dance tons of ballet
Speaker 5: when I was a kid. A lot of theater and
Speaker 5: I just fell in love. I didn't fall in love
Speaker 5: with movies. I fell in love with the theater I
Speaker 5: fell in love with the live performance aspect of things
Speaker 5: and so started doing theater as a kid. I just
Speaker 5: watched 10 15 and there's a couple of episodes about
Speaker 5: middle school theater that just made me absolutely weep because
Speaker 5: those were my formative years. I couldn't make it in
Speaker 5: my hometown theater troupe. I never got cast in anything.
Speaker 5: I think partly because sometimes a lot of kids who
Speaker 5: got like the lead roles and stuff their parents were
Speaker 5: like doing a lot of stuff behind the scenes and
Speaker 5: giving money. My parents were like We're not doing that
Speaker 5: for you. You will work your way there which I
Speaker 5: have growing up with ministers for parents. We grew up
Speaker 5: without a lot. And so they really kind of taught
Speaker 5: me work hard at an early age. And so because
Speaker 5: I couldn't work with the cool like community theater in
Speaker 5: my hometown I like went to the neighboring town where
Speaker 5: the community theater was full of all these old hippies
Speaker 5: who like worked at the Texas Renaissance Festival and they
Speaker 5: like Smoked blunts backstage on their break and they like
Speaker 5: wore face paint just to wear it. I was just
Speaker 5: like this is my family I'm home.
Speaker 4: The rest is history I guess. Then you went to
Speaker 4: school as an actor didn't you. I went to undergrad
Speaker 4: and studied performance.
Speaker 5: Definitely there are some youtube videos of me like singing
Speaker 5: dancing that I'm not proud of. I just really was
Speaker 5: looking for my way and I think to storytelling and
Speaker 5: I thought to myself well I can probably do this
Speaker 5: that or the other I could be a dramaturg or
Speaker 5: I could make costumes or I could be an actor
Speaker 5: or something. I never thought I could be a writer
Speaker 5: which I really wanted to do. I just admired them
Speaker 5: so much and I thought they were so smart. It
Speaker 5: was hard to finally admit to myself well that's the
Speaker 5: thing that I've always wanted to do and all these
Speaker 5: other avenues have just been me getting to that place
Speaker 5: of telling stories my own stories in my own words.
Speaker 5: I had a teacher when I was an undergrad who
Speaker 5: pulled me aside one day and was like you would
Speaker 5: be a half rate actor but you might be a
Speaker 5: really good writer. But I needed to hear it and
Speaker 5: really truly from not weave forward. I was like This
Speaker 5: is it. This is what I want to do as
Speaker 5: an actor.
Speaker 6: Was it heartbreaking to hear. Or was it like oh
Speaker 6: no way. You're right. I mean if I was that
Speaker 6: teacher I wouldn't maybe phrase it exactly like that but
Speaker 6: no it wasn't.
Speaker 7: It was like someone giving me permission to stop trying
Speaker 7: to fit in with all of my other classmates who
Speaker 7: wanted to be actors because that's kind of your way
Speaker 7: into theater right.
Speaker 1: You're either like an actor or you're a techie. Those
Speaker 1: are the two avenues. But being a writer it just
Speaker 1: felt like he was giving me permission to say yes
Speaker 1: to myself. And so I took a playwriting class and
Speaker 1: the same teacher helped me get a playwriting Grant and
Speaker 1: I went to New York and I wrote some terrible
Speaker 1: plays and had some staged readings of them. I just
Speaker 1: never stopped after that. So it was really more permission
Speaker 1: than anything else.
Speaker 3: What was the first play you wrote on.
Speaker 5: What was the first play I wrote. Oh God. It
Speaker 5: was called Singles cave which is like a cave off
Speaker 5: of the shores of Scotland. Great composers have written classical
Speaker 5: pieces about it. And I wrote a story about three
Speaker 5: people who I don't fucking remember kayakers and only three
Speaker 5: people ended up in this cave and they were all
Speaker 5: grappling with problems in their personal lives. One kid was
Speaker 5: blind and I don't know it was very sappy and sappy.
Speaker 5: It was a short play I hadn't read in a
Speaker 5: festival for the great playwright Tina Howe who is sort
Speaker 5: of like the moderate or the judge of a festival.
Speaker 5: And it was the most nervous I've maybe ever been
Speaker 5: to date even probably more than having a television show
Speaker 5: released out into the world at large. I think I
Speaker 5: was just horrified and she was so warm and so
Speaker 5: receptive and she told me I'll never forget. She said
Speaker 5: oh my aren't you a little girl with a great
Speaker 5: big cathedral inside of you. And I was just like
Speaker 5: Oh my God. Those formative years when you're just starting
Speaker 5: out it's so important. It's the most important thing to
Speaker 5: have someone to say you can do it. I feel
Speaker 5: for my friends and fellow artists who didn't have that
Speaker 5: because I think it makes it harder. I certainly didn't
Speaker 5: have a ton of people just telling me all the
Speaker 5: time how wonderful I was. But like those few that
Speaker 5: you really remember and you hold on to still I'm
Speaker 5: a 34 year old woman. This was more than 10
Speaker 5: years ago.
Speaker 3: And then you went to Yale School of Drama.
Speaker 5: I went to New York for a couple of years
Speaker 5: after undergrad and I was so starving so poor I
Speaker 5: worked as an intern at a theater called a battle
Speaker 5: stick Playwrights Theater which is in the village. It's an
Speaker 5: amazing place. I went there because I was obsessed with
Speaker 5: this one play called The Pavilion which Craig Wright who
Speaker 5: is also a television showrunner. He had written and I
Speaker 5: was in New York and like the sea of like
Speaker 5: endless possibilities and I was like What do I do.
Speaker 5: And I looked up where that play was originally produced
Speaker 5: and it was at this bitter battle stick and I
Speaker 5: was like Hey are you guys hiring interns. And they
Speaker 5: were like not really. And I was like Well I'll
Speaker 5: work for free. So I did. I like work for
Speaker 5: free and I would like work a job at like
Speaker 5: hedge funds and I would save up a bunch of
Speaker 5: money and then quit and then go back to the
Speaker 5: theater and I would like writing plays and trying to
Speaker 5: get into graduate school because it felt like the thing
Speaker 5: that would open some doors for me helped me find
Speaker 5: an agent or just get to practice meet other people
Speaker 5: who are impressive artists were young like me. So yeah
Speaker 5: that's what I did. How to apply three times before
Speaker 5: I got in. Which I always love to tell people
Speaker 5: don't give up. They only take a couple of people
Speaker 5: a year so if you're looking for a graduate program
Speaker 5: just keep applying until they get so sick of you
Speaker 5: that they only let you in.
Speaker 3: What was that like the place it was Yale or
Speaker 3: bust it was Yale or bust.
Speaker 5: Yeah I applied deal all three years and only applied
Speaker 5: to Yale the first two years. My third year I
Speaker 5: thought about the encouragement of my friends and parents who
Speaker 5: were like Maybe third time's not always a charm. So
Speaker 5: I applied a bunch of other places there incredible drama schools.
Speaker 5: I was really excited about UTI. Orson has an amazing
Speaker 5: program Mr. center and there are so many. But for
Speaker 5: me I like to think about the thing that I
Speaker 5: feel like I could never actually do and then try
Speaker 5: to do it. I think that's how I just live
Speaker 5: my whole life. It's like what is something that seems
Speaker 5: so impossibly out of reach and for me as like
Speaker 5: I said my poor kid who grew up in Texas
Speaker 5: who was again like top of my parents go work
Speaker 5: your way into whatever you want to have. I was
Speaker 5: like Well Yale seems like something that I'll never have.
Speaker 5: So I just was determined and I was so privileged
Speaker 5: to go there and I got to study with some
Speaker 5: amazing people.
Speaker 7: Paul a vocal was one of my primary mentors while
Speaker 7: I was there. He was unbelievable playwright and person who
Speaker 7: really truly has taught me some stuff about being in
Speaker 7: an artistic community and being in a rehearsal room that
Speaker 7: I've gotten to take with me into television about what
Speaker 7: it means to be an artist. I was telling someone
Speaker 7: the other day how we ran out on monster land
Speaker 7: because I think by and large we had a pretty
Speaker 7: happy sight set where everyone had a voice which was
Speaker 7: really important to me was really important to the whole team.
Speaker 7: And Paula at Yale I remember seeing the biggest deal
Speaker 7: in the room should always be the play and I
Speaker 7: thought that that was really an amazing way to think
Speaker 7: about like how to bring people together who all have
Speaker 7: big egos because you kind of have to have an
Speaker 7: ego if you're like look at me listen to my story.
Speaker 7: You have to have a little bit of that if
Speaker 7: you're going to survive but thinking about that in terms
Speaker 7: of the play but also in terms of television the
Speaker 7: episode and the story that we were telling always got
Speaker 7: to be the loudest and the most needy and the
Speaker 7: most vocal thing rather than any of us who were
Speaker 7: creating it. She was just a wonderful wonderful teacher at
Speaker 7: Yale and so many gems of wisdom I hold on to.
Speaker 3: What brought you to L.A. and how did you end
Speaker 3: up on preacher.
Speaker 5: So when I was at Yale I had a playwriting
Speaker 5: agent who was like hey have you ever heard of
Speaker 5: this guy Nick Ruffin. He is a film director and
Speaker 5: he's looking for someone to write a horror movie with him.
Speaker 5: And I threw your name in the pot and he
Speaker 5: liked your play and he wants to meet with you.
Speaker 5: And I was just like what is a film.
Speaker 8: You know I like I'd never ever thought about it.
Speaker 8: I don't even have final draft which is the program
Speaker 8: you write a film.
Speaker 5: I was like I don't know my ass from my
Speaker 5: elbow but I met with Nick. I'm not a cinephile
Speaker 5: at all but he directed this movie that I really
Speaker 5: loved called Bronson which is so innovative in terms of
Speaker 5: its production design the whole thing is shot in one
Speaker 5: house and it looks like you're going all over the
Speaker 5: country all over the world. It's really fantastic. But it
Speaker 5: is also so visceral. It felt like it was jumping
Speaker 5: out of the screen at me in this way that
Speaker 5: I had only ever experienced that kind of feeling in theater.
Speaker 5: I was like Sure I'll talk to him and I
Speaker 5: talked to him I had a conversation with him for
Speaker 5: an hour and a half one day and he was
Speaker 5: like Hey do you want to write this movie with me.
Speaker 5: And I was like yeah sure you seem really cool.
Speaker 5: It was such an unusual Hollywood experience. It feels almost
Speaker 5: unfair because it doesn't happen that easily for a lot
Speaker 5: of people. But you know I wanted to be a
Speaker 5: playwright like it wasn't what I wanted at all. It
Speaker 5: just felt like a really interesting upper. And so I
Speaker 5: said yes and came out to L.A. and I worked
Speaker 5: for like a year with him. It was like one
Speaker 5: year and we wrote a script together. And then the
Speaker 5: movie went into production and was released like a year
Speaker 5: later was very fast and it was really exciting because
Speaker 5: he was just like I want to make a movie
Speaker 5: that's not like any other movie and I was like
Speaker 5: well that's great. I don't know how to write. I
Speaker 5: was like aren't movies supposed to have like three acts.
Speaker 5: I think I heard that one that seems boring hours
Speaker 5: should have four you know. And he was so game
Speaker 5: and I think really wanted someone to partner with him
Speaker 5: on the film that didn't know how to do things right.
Speaker 7: Our movie was called the neon demon and it was
Speaker 7: a wonderful opportunity to like explore the horror genre for
Speaker 7: the first time. And I just sort of fell in
Speaker 7: love because the movie is about femininity and the male
Speaker 7: gaze and about what women then do to each other
Speaker 7: as a result of being subjected to the male gaze
Speaker 7: for so long. It's about models in L.A. who eat
Speaker 7: themselves alive literally but like I just thought wow what
Speaker 7: a great opportunity for me who is not a model
Speaker 7: but who is a woman to talk about what it
Speaker 7: feels like to be objectified and hurt by men in
Speaker 7: the world and by the patriarchy and by the way
Speaker 7: that people talk and look at my body and I
Speaker 7: sort of just fell in love with the horror genre.
Speaker 4: But that's why I came to L.A. and I have
Speaker 4: such a good experience working on that that I was
Speaker 4: like Maybe I'll just stay here. I watched it last
Speaker 4: night actually it's a very upsetting movie. It's not nice.
Speaker 7: I think it's a really great marriage of Nick and
Speaker 7: me like my outlook as a woman and then Nick
Speaker 7: as a man. It's a movie where two contradictions sort
Speaker 7: of bump up against each other a lot.
Speaker 3: Had you co-written before.
Speaker 7: No I never had. I never even thought about it
Speaker 7: but I love it. I love writing with other people.
Speaker 7: If it's a really good fit I think it's maybe
Speaker 7: even more magical than writing by yourself sometimes. It was
Speaker 7: so wonderful working on Preacher and then I worked on
Speaker 7: succession for a season and now this show my show.
Speaker 7: You know I love getting to hear other voices sort
Speaker 7: of bounce up against mine.
Speaker 5: It's like laughing What's the thing about marriage where it's
Speaker 5: like marriage should be like two rocks in a tumbler
Speaker 5: like shaking around making each other smooth. Which I think
Speaker 5: is so wonderful and I think it's the same thing
Speaker 5: about co writing it's just like you put like two
Speaker 5: people in a jar and shake them around you end
Speaker 5: up working out the kinks and the bumps in each other.
Speaker 5: And I don't know you make a baby together.
Speaker 8: I don't there's a lot of mixed metaphors.
Speaker 3: So when the baby was a TV show for preacher
Speaker 3: and succession which swept the Emmys. So congratulations on that.
Speaker 3: Moving from theater to film to TV. What was the
Speaker 3: experience like. How did it change the way you approach
Speaker 3: your writing.
Speaker 7: Well I think that there was something inside of me
Speaker 7: that I was more able to tap into in television
Speaker 7: writing and in cinematic writing which is like a visual
Speaker 7: kind of storytelling that you can get in the theater
Speaker 7: world but not with such frequency. Television is a visual
Speaker 7: medium period film is a visual medium period. The best
Speaker 7: films you can watch them with the sound off and
Speaker 7: you still know what's happening. And that allowed me to
Speaker 7: flex a different kind of muscle. I'm certainly not by
Speaker 7: any stretch a visual artist. I can't draw a doodle
Speaker 7: to save my life but I have something in my
Speaker 7: head and I think being able to put that down
Speaker 7: on paper and then have collaborators bring that to life
Speaker 7: is so exciting to me.
Speaker 9: And so I think the switch from playwriting to television
Speaker 9: because I really rarely write plays anymore and for a
Speaker 9: while guilt in myself about that and don't anymore I
Speaker 9: think this is a medium that is much more suited
Speaker 9: for me. And I think a lot of it was
Speaker 9: about being able to hone and use the skills of
Speaker 9: structure and character development and dialogue that I really got
Speaker 9: from my theater background. In addition to this visual language
Speaker 9: that is just so thrilling for Monster land I was
Speaker 9: really obsessed with the photography of Gregory Crewson and Todd
Speaker 9: Ito and so a lot of the images that are
Speaker 9: in the series were inspired by that kind of visual
Speaker 9: art and that just feels like something that again you
Speaker 9: can certainly have an interesting visual landscape in theater because
Speaker 9: you're dealing with real time space. But I find that
Speaker 9: it's such an exciting space to play with visual language
Speaker 9: and in film and television.
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Speaker 12: So monster land your first time as a show runner.
Speaker 12: It's interesting that you say like this is a better
Speaker 12: landscape for you because it feels to me like an
Speaker 12: anthology series like this is just a series of one
Speaker 12: act plays. Kind of yeah. What was the experience creating
Speaker 12: your first show.
Speaker 7: Oh it was stressful. I came to L.A. and sort
Speaker 7: of fell in love with the film and television industry
Speaker 7: and it was again that thing like I'm going to
Speaker 7: get into Yale no matter what. I was just sort
Speaker 7: of like I want to run a show that seems
Speaker 7: really hard and like something that they wouldn't let a
Speaker 7: young female 30 year old lesbian do. So I was
Speaker 7: like I want to do this and it's been possibly
Speaker 7: the biggest experience of my life. It has stretched me
Speaker 7: in ways that are unimaginable because as a showrunner you're
Speaker 7: not just a creative voice You're not just a writer
Speaker 7: but you're a producer and you're a champion of others
Speaker 7: you paved roads for other people. You have to be
Speaker 7: a maternal figure paternal figure at different points you wearing
Speaker 7: so many different hats. And I think navigating that and
Speaker 7: having to make excruciatingly hard decisions that affected other people's
Speaker 7: performance and experience on the show and income livelihoods especially
Speaker 7: during a pandemic I never thought I'd run my first
Speaker 7: show during a pandemic.
Speaker 5: It's been the hardest and the most rewarding thing I've
Speaker 5: possibly ever done.
Speaker 3: The series is based off of Nathan Ballon Grubbs North
Speaker 3: American Lake Monsters which is a series of short stories.
Speaker 3: It seems that you really were influenced by it but
Speaker 3: a lot of the stories were very much your own.
Speaker 3: What was the creative process there.
Speaker 13: Nathan's book North American Lake Monsters is absolutely beautiful and
Speaker 13: apart from this series which I hope everyone will watch
Speaker 13: I hope they'll read his book too because there are
Speaker 13: several stories from which episodes are directly adopted and then
Speaker 13: there are many that we did not adopt that are
Speaker 13: well worth a read. They're absolutely beautiful. I read the
Speaker 13: first story in Nathan's book and thought This is what
Speaker 13: I have to do. It was a really interesting and
Speaker 13: different kind of horror that I had seen in a while.
Speaker 13: And it was again doing some of those things that
Speaker 13: we talked about like really able to tap into character
Speaker 13: and real issues while also holding space within the genre.
Speaker 13: I was really excited about telling stories about complicated people
Speaker 13: who make terrible or difficult decisions but aren't necessarily monsters.
Speaker 13: They're just human. I think that's the way that I
Speaker 13: have experienced my own choices in my own world and
Speaker 13: also different traumas in my life. So it was just
Speaker 13: very inspirational. And there were some of his stories that
Speaker 13: we felt as a writers room were more relevant and
Speaker 13: more timely than others.
Speaker 14: And so those were the stories that we really felt
Speaker 14: as a community of five. We had four writers working
Speaker 14: on the show with me. We felt these feel like
Speaker 14: stories we really need to put out in the world
Speaker 14: right now because they're saying something about her current moment
Speaker 14: or current climate. And so we ended up adopting three
Speaker 14: from the book and then the rest are as you
Speaker 14: say inspired by. But we had these and come into
Speaker 14: the room with us for the first two weeks the
Speaker 14: first two weeks were sort of dedicated to deciding what
Speaker 14: stories we wanted to tell and coming up with new
Speaker 14: stories or jumping off of stories from Nathan's book to
Speaker 14: then create as sort of the genesis of an idea
Speaker 14: for a new story. And Nathan was really instrumental in
Speaker 14: those two weeks. I remember him bringing forward ideas for
Speaker 14: some of the stories that did end up in the
Speaker 14: season of 8. So it was really about having a
Speaker 14: diverse array of characters and also finding stories that felt
Speaker 14: like they were tapping into. I don't want to say
Speaker 14: issues because I'm not very interested in writing about issues
Speaker 14: but they were tapping into the current worlds and what
Speaker 14: people in our lives and in the world were grappling
Speaker 14: with in the moment that we were writing. We really
Speaker 14: wanted the series to be reflective of the United States
Speaker 14: and the turmoil that the US was going through and
Speaker 14: the different people that it affected. And as a result
Speaker 14: how these people were grappling with their own day to
Speaker 14: day lives.
Speaker 3: I mean it is reflective of the United States especially
Speaker 3: because you have named each episode after the location. What
Speaker 3: was the thought process behind that.
Speaker 13: Well what I loved about Ethan's book also many things
Speaker 13: I love about his book but what I also loved
Speaker 13: about his book was that his protagonists were not your
Speaker 13: typical protagonists. They were blue collar workers in the Gulf
Speaker 13: Coast or single down on their luck moms who don't
Speaker 13: get written about and those are people like that's what
Speaker 13: the country is made up of.
Speaker 14: You know we're not a country made up of politicians
Speaker 14: and billionaires we're a country of real people dealing with
Speaker 14: a lot of day to day stuff that doesn't make
Speaker 14: the news. And that doesn't make the next episode of
Speaker 14: whatever show you're watching. And so I think that naming
Speaker 14: each episode after a particular city was our way of
Speaker 14: highlighting sometimes issues and sometimes problems like Eugene Oregon deals
Speaker 14: with some systemic racism and I think our episode entitled
Speaker 14: Eugene Oregon deals with some of the same stuff but
Speaker 14: also just remembering that we are a massive country with
Speaker 14: pockets of people who are affected deeply by the decisions
Speaker 14: being made by the 1 percent by the people at
Speaker 14: the top by the politicians. We're not just a city
Speaker 14: of Los Angeles Chicago New York. There are smaller places
Speaker 14: that I think deserve investigation. So that was what was
Speaker 14: behind naming each episode after particular city it felt like
Speaker 14: we were giving a broader outlook on the United States.
Speaker 3: The writers room you compiled had some more veterans and
Speaker 3: some playwrights such as yourself and Emily Kazmierczak. How did
Speaker 3: you staff your room I mean kind of exactly like that.
Speaker 5: I. I was like Well I want to have a
Speaker 5: room that's again like a diverse group of people with
Speaker 5: different kinds of backgrounds from different age brackets who come
Speaker 5: from different parts of the world and different experiences and
Speaker 5: so that's kind of what I did. One of our
Speaker 5: staff writers Oliver Brown have lived all over the world
Speaker 5: and came to the book with such a unique perspective.
Speaker 5: Emily comes from playwriting as you mentioned and then two
Speaker 5: of our other writers Scott COSAT and Wesley Strick both
Speaker 5: had their roots in film writing but had very different
Speaker 5: backgrounds and growing up experiences. But everyone had a real
Speaker 5: grounded ness to them. No one was to quote unquote
Speaker 5: Hollywood and I thought that that was really important in
Speaker 5: the creation of the series that again if we're going
Speaker 5: to tell stories about real people we needed to be
Speaker 5: able to tell them in real ways and in everyone's
Speaker 5: interview I was also really open I was like We're
Speaker 5: gonna talk about stuff in the room I talk about
Speaker 5: my traumas very openly I talk about my personal experiences
Speaker 5: growing up in a really conservative area very openly and
Speaker 5: my struggle with coming out as a gay person very
Speaker 5: openly and so I wanted to open the door to
Speaker 5: people who had experiences and were willing to also talk
Speaker 5: about them and go to some really like vulnerable and
Speaker 5: dark places with me because I think as long as
Speaker 5: you're doing that and really safe and healthy way which
Speaker 5: you think the writers room it's very important to have
Speaker 5: a really safe and healthy writers room I think that's
Speaker 5: where the really good good stories come from.
Speaker 3: How do you create an environment where people are being
Speaker 3: so open that is safe and healthy.
Speaker 9: You check in with people you don't offer judgment on
Speaker 9: other people's stories you listen you make sure everyone has
Speaker 9: a voice and that if people disagree they're allowed to
Speaker 9: say that they disagree. And I think it's really important
Speaker 9: for the showrunner to do this. I've worked in places
Speaker 9: with groups of people where the person at the top
Speaker 9: is not accepting or has a judgment and that they
Speaker 9: bring to the room or point of view that's sort
Speaker 9: of toxic that they bring to the room and while
Speaker 9: I certainly didn't do everything right there's no way I
Speaker 9: did everything right. I do feel like I used that
Speaker 9: experience of like that kind of more negative type of
Speaker 9: environment and said day one like we're not going to
Speaker 9: have that. We didn't talk a lot about politics we
Speaker 9: did from time to time but I feel like politics
Speaker 9: can be kind of messy in the workplace and I
Speaker 9: think co-workers should be able to talk about that on
Speaker 9: their own time. But we didn't start every day like
Speaker 9: talking about what was in the news what happened the
Speaker 9: day before. I just think it's important that everyone feels
Speaker 9: heard and seen. I don't really believe in hierarchy within
Speaker 9: a room other than the hierarchy that I'm the one
Speaker 9: that starts and stops the show. I'm the one that
Speaker 9: can shut down a conversation and I'm the one that
Speaker 9: makes the final decisions on things. But as long as
Speaker 9: that much is clear then I think everyone should be
Speaker 9: able to have a voice and feel seen and heard
Speaker 9: and and that their stories are going to be protected.
Speaker 9: Do you share something vulnerable it's going to stay right
Speaker 9: there in the room and we're gonna take care of
Speaker 9: it and we're not going to judge you for it.
Speaker 9: We're really grateful that you shared that and that that
Speaker 9: could become a part of one of our stories. If
Speaker 9: you allow it to be and it's definitely challenging I
Speaker 9: think to be in a room not vulnerable but I
Speaker 9: think as long as you're approaching everything with kindness I
Speaker 9: don't know.
Speaker 3: So day one on set. What was the first scene
Speaker 3: you shot and what was it like being on set.
Speaker 14: Day one like God. Do you remember. I think the
Speaker 14: very first thing we shot was a scene with Caitlin.
Speaker 14: It's sort of on the docks and she's running late
Speaker 14: to work and she has to drop her care for
Speaker 14: the baby sitter. Denise the whole series we shot in
Speaker 14: New York.
Speaker 15: We shot all over the place and so we were
Speaker 15: shooting New York for Louisiana. And so we were out
Speaker 15: in Timbuktu shooting on these docks and it was so
Speaker 15: windy and I was incredibly worried about sound that day.
Speaker 15: I think I was just incredibly anxious in general it
Speaker 15: was the first pilot I've ever shot and kept running
Speaker 15: up to the sound booth and being like oh do
Speaker 15: we get it. What words did we get. What do
Speaker 15: we need. I think the whole day just sort of
Speaker 15: went by in a blur. Actually I think other shooting
Speaker 15: days feel much clearer in my mind. But it was
Speaker 15: great we had an amazing production designer Ola Malik who
Speaker 15: was able to make New York look like a different places.
Speaker 15: It was truly spectacular.
Speaker 3: So Caitlin's character comes back a few times throughout the series.
Speaker 3: Was that in the book or was that a tool
Speaker 3: that you implemented to kind of give it a through line.
Speaker 14: Yeah. No that was just us. You know Nathan's book
Speaker 14: felt very much like one world. And since we wanted
Speaker 14: to tell a story about our current world we were
Speaker 14: like Oh what are ways in which we could tie
Speaker 14: these episodes together. And some of those original ideas sort
Speaker 14: of fell out the window. But there are definitely some
Speaker 14: Easter eggs within all of the stories. You know there
Speaker 14: are a couple of politicians running for office and there's
Speaker 14: this disastrous oil spill that's covered in a couple of
Speaker 14: the episodes. So there are things that pull the series together.
Speaker 14: Caitlin I think being the largest you know after she
Speaker 14: disappears in the first episode we get to see her
Speaker 14: again in the middle of the series. And then again
Speaker 14: in the finale and kind of catch up with her
Speaker 14: as an organizing principle but also seeing what happens after
Speaker 14: her sort of disastrous choice that she has to make
Speaker 14: in the pilot. Do you have a favorite monster. Oh
Speaker 14: gosh no I love them all. I think maybe the
Speaker 14: monster I'm the most proud of is the mermaid. Coming
Speaker 14: from the theater world I didn't want to use a
Speaker 14: lot of visual effects. I wanted to use as few
Speaker 14: as I could because I love practical theatricality and I
Speaker 14: feel like as a viewer I can tell when something
Speaker 14: is a visual effect. We're all so used to watching
Speaker 14: so much that I feel like anyone can tell. And
Speaker 14: so I was like How can we make a mermaid
Speaker 14: that doesn't feel like that. It doesn't. Whenever you see
Speaker 14: her take you completely out.
Speaker 15: So we made her totally practically and Adria who played
Speaker 15: the mermaid was so game to put on that suit.
Speaker 5: We had two wheeler around in a wheelchair and have
Speaker 5: like 10 men lift her into the water and she
Speaker 5: was so awesome and would just hang out in this
Speaker 5: like tank of water while we were shooting other angles
Speaker 5: because it took so much time to get her in
Speaker 5: and out so she would just sit there and with
Speaker 5: her head on the lip of the tank and like
Speaker 5: watch the scene that another actor was shooting. But I
Speaker 5: feel very very proud and I think it turned out
Speaker 5: really beautifully and we shot that episode in like eight
Speaker 5: days or something like that.
Speaker 14: Talking about the monsters we worked with Greg like a
Speaker 14: terrorist company can be. Who does the walking dead and
Speaker 14: they're just unbelievable monster makers and so they came up
Speaker 14: with some pretty cool constructions for us for our actual
Speaker 14: monsters the people are monsters too. But for our actual
Speaker 14: monsters we shot all of these like it was like
Speaker 14: lightning speed our pilot we ended up having most days
Speaker 14: which I think was like 11 but then by the
Speaker 14: time we got to some of the other ones we
Speaker 14: were shooting them in six or seven days which for
Speaker 14: a monster show is not enough to give us more
Speaker 14: days next time.
Speaker 16: A moment of your time a new podcast from Kirk
Speaker 16: tell media currently 21 years old and today like magic
Speaker 16: Reed extended from her fingertips down to the blood to
Speaker 16: take care of yourself because the world needs you and
Speaker 16: just me every do gooder that asked about me was
Speaker 16: ready to spit on my dream fingers her face.
Speaker 17: Do you feel like your purpose in your work is
Speaker 17: really being kind of to stop me from playing the piano.
Speaker 16: She buys walkie talkies wonders to whom she should give
Speaker 16: the second. I don't love humans. We never did. We
Speaker 16: never will. We just find what you do.
Speaker 18: Rock climbing is that you can only focus on what's right.
Speaker 12: And so are American life begins.
Speaker 19: We may need to stay apart but let's create together
Speaker 19: available on all podcast platforms. Submit your piece at Kirk
Speaker 19: dot.com slash a moment of your time.
Speaker 12: Because it was your first show running experience. What was
Speaker 12: the feeling of calling rap on the last day.
Speaker 20: Oh my God it was like a blur of emotions.
Speaker 20: I did this thing which I'm really glad that I
Speaker 20: did where I had someone take a photo of me
Speaker 20: on like kind of the first major milestone day.
Speaker 14: And on that rap day I was like wow I
Speaker 14: have changed so much because I think it was like
Speaker 14: the biggest experience and personally it felt like Wow I
Speaker 14: had run not just a marathon but like eight marathons.
Speaker 14: And how much that had taken from me and how
Speaker 14: much that had given to me. I felt the unbelievable
Speaker 14: privilege of getting to work with such amazing talent the
Speaker 14: production team especially. I mean we had the most amazing
Speaker 14: actors but I think the production team I thought these
Speaker 14: people had just pushed a boulder up a mountain with
Speaker 14: me and like how lucky I was. Everyone said it
Speaker 14: was one of the hardest shows that they had ever
Speaker 14: worked on.
Speaker 15: I think by nature of the anthology where you're basically
Speaker 15: doing a total reset every single episode you're not using
Speaker 15: any of your same sets. Any of your same costumes
Speaker 15: and none of your same actors even you know everything
Speaker 15: is new and starting over is really really hard because
Speaker 15: you have to redesign re scout. I mean there are
Speaker 15: like eight many movies basically. And so doing that and
Speaker 15: the amount of time that we had which was very
Speaker 15: compressed our shooting schedule was just rapid fire and we
Speaker 15: had no breaks in between episodes I know like Black
Speaker 15: Mirror is even able to take some breaks in between
Speaker 15: there we have no breaks.
Speaker 14: So it was a very very very ambitious project and
Speaker 14: I was just looking around that the sea of faces
Speaker 14: of people who were willing to ride that ride with
Speaker 14: me and do it with so much heart and so
Speaker 14: much positivity. It just it was a very overwhelming day.
Speaker 14: It was a very overwhelming time ending production on the
Speaker 14: series because again it it just felt like we'd all
Speaker 14: run an ultra marathon together and everyone had had at
Speaker 14: least sort of like one little break down and we'd
Speaker 14: gotten up gotten back on the horse and we're all
Speaker 14: still quite friendly with each other too which I think
Speaker 14: you know everyone would love to come back and do
Speaker 14: another season and I think that's really saying something about
Speaker 14: the kinds of people who worked on the show and
Speaker 14: the kind of like grit. Also that you have to
Speaker 14: have to shoot in New York. We shot in the winter.
Speaker 14: I mean just everything hard we did it. And I'm
Speaker 14: just completely blown away by the team and we'll never
Speaker 14: be able to say thank you enough.
Speaker 4: So yeah I guess those are some of the feelings
Speaker 4: on wrap day.
Speaker 6: Also just like where's my martini. Can I sleep now.
Speaker 6: Those things too.
Speaker 3: What have you taken away from this experience is this
Speaker 3: finding who you are or is this another step along
Speaker 3: your path.
Speaker 14: Well my joke is always like I want to be
Speaker 14: Shonda Rhimes. I would love to have like multiple shows
Speaker 14: going on at once but I don't even know if
Speaker 14: that's true. I'm not sure what's next. To be totally
Speaker 14: honest this was a huge goal and a huge achievement
Speaker 14: and a big milestone. And I think that I want
Speaker 14: to do it again. It again it feels like one
Speaker 14: of those things that felt impossible and yet I did it.
Speaker 14: And our whole team did it. We did it together
Speaker 14: and whether this show another season or it or another
Speaker 14: show I want to do it again because I know
Speaker 14: I can do it better. What's so exciting to me
Speaker 14: about television is that you're able to tell stories on
Speaker 14: such a large scale. I mean theater it's like there's
Speaker 14: nothing like it when you see a really good play
Speaker 14: it changes your whole life. It changes your DNA. But
Speaker 14: what I like about television is that you can do
Speaker 14: that to such a wide wide audience and that's really
Speaker 14: exciting to me because as a gay person like I
Speaker 14: have this opportunity now to put more gay people on
Speaker 14: the screen and to see characters or women grappling with
Speaker 14: things on screen that I've grappled with in my own
Speaker 14: life that I never got to see growing up you
Speaker 14: know growing up we were Huck Finn you know or
Speaker 14: we were Peter Pan and we had to be these
Speaker 14: male protagonists and it's such a privilege and an opportunity
Speaker 14: to tell stories about people that don't always make it
Speaker 14: to screen and also not just people on screen but
Speaker 14: behind the screens you know like as much as there
Speaker 14: has been like quote unquote progress in Hollywood. It's just
Speaker 14: fucking not enough. And if I can do it again
Speaker 14: and paved roads for other people to then do it
Speaker 14: again and bring different kinds of people to the forefront
Speaker 14: of our minds and imaginations. I don't know maybe I'm
Speaker 14: really optimistic but I think that's world changing. I really
Speaker 14: really do because the kinds of things that you see
Speaker 14: coming out of Hollywood is how you think about the
Speaker 14: world that is absolutely how you think about the world.
Speaker 14: I was talking to a friend the other day about
Speaker 14: rom coms just generally speaking rom coms are always about
Speaker 14: the straight white girl and the straight white guy and
Speaker 14: that's not how I experienced my romantic life growing up
Speaker 14: at all. But that's what we're taught and that's what
Speaker 14: we see and that's what comes into our homes. And
Speaker 14: I think that if you're able to change people's minds
Speaker 14: on screen and open up people's minds on screen I
Speaker 14: think that's world changing. I really do. So. To fucking
Speaker 14: do it again. I want all of my writers to
Speaker 14: be able to do it. Then you know like I
Speaker 14: think part of being a really good leader and a
Speaker 14: good show writer is passing tools down to the people
Speaker 14: that you're working with that they have a roadmap and
Speaker 14: they have the knowledge to know like I can do
Speaker 14: this too if like this like for preacher's daughter from
Speaker 14: Texas can do it I can fucking do it too.
Speaker 14: And here's how. And here are the pitfalls and here's
Speaker 14: the support that I need. And then I can get
Speaker 14: my unique an untold story told. Yeah I'm going to
Speaker 14: do it again and I'll know what's going on out
Speaker 14: there but somethin.
Speaker 3: So my final question is always what does it mean
Speaker 3: to you to have a life and storytelling. But I
Speaker 3: think you just answered.
Speaker 14: Think about that. I think that's a I'll say another
Speaker 14: thing too. This is a more personal reason I guess.
Speaker 20: I've had a good and privileged life in these 34
Speaker 20: years that I've walked on the earth but I've had
Speaker 20: some really hard stuff too. I've dealt with my fair
Speaker 20: share of trauma. I've dealt with my fair share of
Speaker 20: not feeling like I am the norm because of my
Speaker 20: femininity or my sexuality and I think that the thing
Speaker 20: that has personally saved my life over and over again
Speaker 20: has been writing about it that anytime I can put
Speaker 20: pen to paper and walk myself through my own story
Speaker 20: I'm able to see myself a little bit better more clearly.
Speaker 20: I'm able to sort of put those ghosts to bed.
Speaker 20: I'm able to in a healthy and productive and creative
Speaker 20: way work through my shit and I truly think that
Speaker 20: that has kept my heart beating. I think that has
Speaker 20: given me a positive outlook on the effects and the
Speaker 20: burdens of trauma or abuse that you can actually turn
Speaker 20: it into something that helps you saves your life. Even
Speaker 20: turn it into something good. So I guess personally that
Speaker 20: is why I will keep writing. I always say it's
Speaker 20: like the one thing no one can take from me.
Speaker 20: I can be unemployed and I can still as long
Speaker 20: as I have a napkin and a pen. I can
Speaker 20: write my story down I can write any story down
Speaker 20: and I just think that thought is like the greatest
Speaker 20: gift in the world. It makes every other thing I've
Speaker 20: ever been able to do in my life possible because
Speaker 20: I've been able to write.
Speaker 3: Mary thank you so much for joining me. Monster land
Speaker 3: is available on Hulu. It is a great show. Very
Speaker 3: well done.
Speaker 16: Thank think. Fan so happy and fun and I have
Speaker 16: so much anxiety usually when I do these and it's
Speaker 16: been such a very easy pleasure to talk to you.
Speaker 16: Thank you ma'am. Hollywood unscripted was created by Kurt Commedia.
Speaker 16: This special episode of the stuck at home series was
Speaker 16: hosted and produced by me Jenny Curtis. With guest. Mary laws.
Speaker 16: Co-produced and edited by Jay Whiting. The executive producer of
Speaker 16: Hollywood unscripted is Stuart Halperin. The Hollywood unscripted theme song
Speaker 16: is by Celeste and Eric dick.
Speaker 2: Make sure to subscribe so you don't miss any special
Speaker 2: episodes of Hollywood unscripted stuck at home stay safe and
Speaker 2: healthy and thanks for listening. Kurt Carr media. Media.
Speaker 21: For your mind.