Speaker 1: From crypto media.
Speaker 2: The spiritual guide to all this is you talk about karma. Mr.
Speaker 2: K his signature autograph was always love cars love. People
Speaker 2: love my boy if I could take a little piece
Speaker 2: of that and apply that to my own life I
Speaker 2: would be so grateful. This is my. Stepmother.
Speaker 3: This is Robert Ross with another episode of cars that matter.
Speaker 3: I'm here today with Pete. Heaven. Greetings. I'm glad you
Speaker 3: could join us.
Speaker 4: Hello Pete is the author of Nissan's Z. Fifty years
Speaker 4: of exhilarating performance. It was just published this year by
Speaker 4: motor Books an imprint of cuarto press. I'm here to
Speaker 4: tell you I have the book in hand and among
Speaker 4: all of the recent automotive publications this one really stands apart.
Speaker 4: Congratulations on a great project.
Speaker 5: Pete thank you very much I really appreciate that. It
Speaker 5: was a labor of love. I put it together fairly
Speaker 5: quickly because it was something that Nissan jumped on board
Speaker 5: at a last minute decision. It was interesting. They really
Speaker 5: did make a big deal out of the 25th anniversary
Speaker 5: and I don't know why but it didn't really occur
Speaker 5: to them to do much about the fiftieth anniversary. Then
Speaker 5: all of a sudden somebody internally said we really have to.
Speaker 5: And that was Hiroshi Tamura. They got in touch with
Speaker 5: their licensing agency which is EMI and EMI contact and
Speaker 5: motor books and motor books contacted me because I had
Speaker 5: written an earlier version of thirty fifth anniversary. And so
Speaker 5: we put this book together really in a little less
Speaker 5: than a year.
Speaker 4: I noticed the foreword is by Hiroshi tomorrow. Obviously he
Speaker 4: had a hand in recognizing that 50 years of Zen
Speaker 4: is as you call it. Pete you've got kind of
Speaker 4: an interesting career. Obviously your Zen aficionado but you're also
Speaker 4: a professor in the Department of Communications at Cal State Fullerton.
Speaker 4: Probably as we talk about your book and about the
Speaker 4: history of the Zen cars we'll maybe get into a
Speaker 4: little bit of the market speak that would along with
Speaker 4: essentially introducing a Holden car and a whole new concept
Speaker 4: to a whole new audience that is the North American
Speaker 4: audience for whom a sports car from Japan was a
Speaker 4: brand new unthinkable concept back in 1970. I know this
Speaker 4: isn't your first Zipcar rodeo either because you published Zee
Speaker 4: 35 years of Nissan sports car in 2005. It's hard
Speaker 4: to imagine that the nameplate is as old as it
Speaker 4: is and for its thirty fifth anniversary there were some
Speaker 4: pretty exciting things happening too. But I guess really to
Speaker 4: start at the beginning let's go back and look at
Speaker 4: the Zee legacy from the start. You and I are
Speaker 4: old enough to remember that back in the 60s and
Speaker 4: early 70s Japanese cars were by and large disregarded. I'm
Speaker 4: being charitable I'd say a joke in some ways but
Speaker 4: they were no joke because of course Honda and Toyota
Speaker 4: essentially took over their respective markets and Dotson did the same.
Speaker 4: But really the only sports car we had back in
Speaker 4: the 60s was the Toyota 2000 and that was such
Speaker 4: a rare and esoteric piece of work that it almost
Speaker 4: doesn't count.
Speaker 5: Nissan did try. They had a sixteen hundred little sports
Speaker 5: car was a little convertible. It started as a sixteen hundred.
Speaker 5: They called it the fair Lady in Japan of course.
Speaker 5: And then they brought it over here to the US
Speaker 5: and then it became a slightly larger motor and they
Speaker 5: had it with the two leaders they called it the
Speaker 5: two thousand I remember that two thousand well a friend
Speaker 5: of mine had a canary yellow one.
Speaker 4: And I thought it was an amazing thing it was
Speaker 4: right up there with any of G.B. except that it
Speaker 4: was more reliable and a great little competitive car.
Speaker 6: And Peter Brock raised it so did Bob Sharp on
Speaker 6: the east coast and so that kind of really established
Speaker 6: a footprint if you will for Nissan at least from
Speaker 6: the motor sports standpoint and it gave them some credibility
Speaker 6: and it really provided the power I guess internally to
Speaker 6: look at a genuine sports car a hard top version
Speaker 6: and you can always thank Mr. Kay.
Speaker 7: You talk a kind of Yama who pushed that car
Speaker 7: the Z initially and he was here in America as
Speaker 7: the president of Nissan USA and he went back to
Speaker 7: Japan and said we really have to have a sports
Speaker 7: car that is affordable and is something that everyone can
Speaker 7: afford here in the United States. And so he basically
Speaker 7: brought the idea of democratizing a sports car. You mentioned
Speaker 7: the Toyota 2000 GTA. It was an incredible car. But
Speaker 7: it didn't really have the legs to expand they didn't
Speaker 7: really bring it over here in significant quantities and it
Speaker 7: was a very expensive car as opposed to a little
Speaker 7: roadster is a rumor.
Speaker 4: But Bob Bonner and use the little 2 thousands for
Speaker 4: his driving school. They were so good and reliable and
Speaker 4: relatively inexpensive that Toyota was essentially unaffordable. And it was
Speaker 4: fragile and even though it did a little bit of
Speaker 4: racing there just wasn't enough critical mass to really make
Speaker 4: it stick.
Speaker 7: Nissan really wanted to be the first to come in there.
Speaker 7: Honda was here but they made really small throwaway cars
Speaker 7: to begin with.
Speaker 5: Let's call them shoeboxes I think the only thing smaller
Speaker 5: was that Subaru 360 that looked like an egg with
Speaker 5: Finnish oils and Nissan was ahead of their time of
Speaker 5: course they were called Datsun them but they came out
Speaker 5: with their 240 Zi and late 69. But they also
Speaker 5: had a pickup truck. And so those were two key
Speaker 5: markets that they used to go after slightly different audiences
Speaker 5: but that's how they penetrated the U.S. market at least initially.
Speaker 4: So many times a great nameplate like the 240 Zi
Speaker 4: comes about because of the vision of a single person
Speaker 4: or a tight team and you talk about you talk
Speaker 4: a cutie Sharma or Mr. Kay Cottee Amazon was obviously
Speaker 4: an interesting guy and he must have been doing something right.
Speaker 4: So he lived to be one hundred five years old.
Speaker 4: That's a remarkable thing in and of itself. You speak
Speaker 4: very fondly of him in your book. Can you give
Speaker 4: us a little insight into what it took to get
Speaker 4: his own corporate colleagues and superiors to buy as crazy
Speaker 4: an idea as a sports car for America.
Speaker 7: I think he was just a force. He just had
Speaker 7: such an incredible passion I had the pleasure of meeting
Speaker 7: with him several times and interviewed him not only for
Speaker 7: my previous book but also speaking to him and several
Speaker 7: of the Z cons and car shows. I mean he
Speaker 7: was very passionate love people as they said in his
Speaker 7: slogan Love life love people you couldn't not like him
Speaker 7: I hate double negative. But the fact is is that
Speaker 7: I believe that his passion and his persuasive skills were
Speaker 7: partially enough to demonstrate that he could sell this car
Speaker 7: in United States. And I think that's what it took
Speaker 7: to convince his contemporaries his colleagues in Japan that if
Speaker 7: he could have the opportunity to bring the Z here
Speaker 7: in America he would show them that that was the
Speaker 7: right car at the right time and he would be
Speaker 7: successful with it. And they believed him. They were a
Speaker 7: little skeptical his colleagues in Japan but they obviously invested
Speaker 7: in the car and said OK now it's up to
Speaker 7: you and your colleagues to make sure that this happens
Speaker 7: and it did.
Speaker 4: Pete you're a marketing man so let's clear up the
Speaker 4: name change. Now again today we call it a rebranding
Speaker 4: but to me Nissan is always going to be dots.
Speaker 6: Can you explain how the name change came about by
Speaker 6: Nissan was always the corporate name always has been. Dotson
Speaker 6: has a history of its own was used originally in
Speaker 6: Japan and then eventually through mergers and acquisitions. Other companies
Speaker 6: the corporation became Nissan and that was the name that
Speaker 6: they utilized at least internationally Nissan wanted to brand their
Speaker 6: name Nissan around the world. They wanted to have one
Speaker 6: name one brand and that makes total sense.
Speaker 7: Why would you have three or four different brands around
Speaker 7: the world. So at some point in the late 70s
Speaker 7: early 80s they said OK we need to brand our
Speaker 7: companies name particularly in North America as Nissan. First it
Speaker 7: was Nissan by Datsun and then it was dotted by Nissan.
Speaker 7: Eventually the nameplate just became Nissan and Nissan assumed all
Speaker 7: the cost of replacing all the sage at the dealerships
Speaker 7: back to the business cards. I mean they invested many
Speaker 7: millions of dollars to do this a lot of dealers
Speaker 7: of course were very unhappy about this but for any
Speaker 7: sign it was important to have one name one symbol
Speaker 7: one identity. And from a marketing standpoint that make total sense.
Speaker 4: Funnily enough peop it's always going to be Dotson to
Speaker 4: me in the same way that till the day that
Speaker 4: died my dad called me Bobby and there's just no
Speaker 4: way around it. You grow up with a name and
Speaker 4: that's what it's going to be. So for me and
Speaker 4: you it's a Datsun to 40 see that car really
Speaker 4: change the game entirely both in terms of looks and
Speaker 4: power versus price launched here I guess in the U.S.
Speaker 4: and 1970 is that right. That's right. Plenty interesting things
Speaker 4: were happening back then. Ferrari Daytona was fresh on the
Speaker 4: ground Porsche 911 was just making its way in motorsport
Speaker 4: and in the public consciousness. And here we get the
Speaker 4: Datsun 240 Z. All of a sudden coming in at
Speaker 4: a fraction of the price of any of those what
Speaker 4: was about thirty five hundred bucks at the time a
Speaker 4: less than thirty five hundred dollars.
Speaker 7: I mean it was a wonderful time if you were
Speaker 7: a automotive enthusiast and I was a teenager at the
Speaker 7: time and it was just incredible for me to see
Speaker 7: all the cars out there I kept dragging my dad
Speaker 7: to dealerships Dad. We got to see this car in
Speaker 7: this car. I'd spent a lot of my childhood living overseas.
Speaker 7: My dad worked for the U.S. government and we had
Speaker 7: just come back believe it or not from Iran. And
Speaker 7: so we were in showrooms and looking at stuff. He
Speaker 7: bought a Pinto. Come on.
Speaker 4: I mean seriously pent up well you know at the
Speaker 4: time the Pinto or the Vega probably seemed like the
Speaker 4: right thing to do. But the two Ford easy was
Speaker 4: definitely a cut above Oh yeah it's looks obviously really
Speaker 4: defined as being a car that was something special it
Speaker 4: really looked like a European sports car. Whether you think
Speaker 4: of a Jaggi type or a Ferrari 275 it had
Speaker 4: all the proportions down. Who was the designer. Can you
Speaker 4: talk about the design of that automobile.
Speaker 8: You could start with you talk a cutie I'm a Mr. K..
Speaker 8: The other gentleman that you always have to say is
Speaker 8: so you see Collazo. He was the vice president on
Speaker 8: the East Coast. He was also very responsible for selling
Speaker 8: the cars on the East Coast. Takashi Ishihara was also
Speaker 8: involved with respect to selling the cars. Those gentlemen were
Speaker 8: really necessary for being instrumental in making sure that this
Speaker 8: car was brought to America. But with respect to the
Speaker 8: designers the two designers started in early 1965. Their names
Speaker 8: were Yoshiko Matsuo and his boss was teaching Hara. And
Speaker 8: those two gentlemen were basically responsible for the design they
Speaker 8: oversaw most of the development of passenger cars and trucks
Speaker 8: and vans. What was then Nissan in Japan. Mr. Matsuo
Speaker 8: really is credited with the design of the cars weren't
Speaker 8: just beautiful.
Speaker 4: They actually had a really great engine and it was
Speaker 4: an inline six that served them well in competition too.
Speaker 4: Can you talk about the race history of those cars
Speaker 4: early on the Ari was racing on the West Coast.
Speaker 7: They first ran the fairly lady the sixteen hundred and
Speaker 7: the 2000 the Roadster Brock and Katayama developed a very
Speaker 7: close relationship. Cody amo was a huge race and King
Speaker 7: goes many West Coast races as he could and so
Speaker 7: with driver John Morton who actually wrote the introduction to
Speaker 7: my first book. Both of those gentlemen. They formed a
Speaker 7: partnership between driver and owner that was just cemented together.
Speaker 7: They went and tore up the SPCA and scored countless
Speaker 7: victories and championships and really added an element of credibility
Speaker 7: to the car to show. Not only was it a
Speaker 7: great performer but a bullet proof engine that straight sex
Speaker 7: was a powerful motor and really was chewing up the
Speaker 7: competition on the racetrack. And that really translated to a
Speaker 7: lot of advertising showing that that was the same motor
Speaker 7: that you could purchase in the showroom on the East Coast.
Speaker 7: Bob Sharpe with Bob Sharp racing. He was racing himself
Speaker 7: first and then we started adding drivers like Paul Newman.
Speaker 7: Paul Newman never went by his name Paul Newman on
Speaker 7: the race card generally was Paul Newman. I had the
Speaker 7: pleasure of meeting him several times when he ran the
Speaker 7: Trans Am in the 1980s I worked for SPCA pro
Speaker 7: racing at the time based out of Denver Colorado. And
Speaker 7: one of my responsibilities was the trans am and Newman
Speaker 7: ran that horse racing effort of course was first class
Speaker 7: all the way big tractor trailer with Newman sharp racing
Speaker 7: and he'd roll out those turbo 300 Zee Xs and
Speaker 7: everybody was just always in Newman. He took his racing
Speaker 7: very seriously and those cars were incredible. Newman won a
Speaker 7: race his only pro race at his home track which
Speaker 7: was Lime Rock Park and you couldn't shut the man
Speaker 7: up normally he was very quiet kept a very low profile.
Speaker 8: The racetrack but that particular day when he won he
Speaker 8: was just itching to tell everybody his life story and
Speaker 8: everything about racing. How important it was but the credibility
Speaker 8: that he added as a racer that Bob Sharpe added
Speaker 8: both in the average ranks and then in the pro
Speaker 8: ranks and they brought in a lot of sponsorship Budweiser
Speaker 8: Coca-Cola Planters Peanuts that helped with advertising and helped exposure
Speaker 8: level for Nissan but that trickled down and then a
Speaker 8: lot of other competitors started running. Dotson do for disease
Speaker 8: to 60s to 80s through hundreds in all levels of
Speaker 8: racing Nissan's motorsports department I ended up working for them
Speaker 8: in the 90s first under Kastner who ran the program.
Speaker 8: He had worked with TR six years and really got
Speaker 8: involved with Nissan and then Frank consulates took over when
Speaker 8: Carson retired and Frank ran that department for twenty seven years.
Speaker 8: So motorsports was really instrumental and a big part of
Speaker 8: Nissan's legacy and in helping sell a lot of vehicles.
Speaker 4: It certainly was an enduring design because the 240 C
Speaker 4: lasted 73 73. It was quickly supplanted by a slightly
Speaker 4: larger displacement version called the 260 which only lasted for
Speaker 4: a year right. That's correct. And then onto the 280.
Speaker 7: There's some debate as to why the 260 was only
Speaker 7: one year. It really seems to be one that they
Speaker 7: kept in there just as a shoehorn before they went
Speaker 7: to the two 80 which was a larger displacement a
Speaker 7: little bit more refined. They also had to adhere to
Speaker 7: more emissions control so there were some decisions made in
Speaker 7: Japan to put a 260 in there. And again back
Speaker 7: to marketing I think that they designed that car or
Speaker 7: released that car with a different model number simply to
Speaker 7: create demand or the fact that hey this is a
Speaker 7: new car. It could be of interest to you but
Speaker 7: we're working very earnestly towards it 2 8 but the
Speaker 7: three hundred six that was a whole different car there
Speaker 7: was a previous three energy X which was still kind
Speaker 7: of shaped like the original to Ford that came out
Speaker 7: in the mid to late 80s. So that 306. It
Speaker 7: had slightly hidden headlights but when the new three energy
Speaker 7: X came out they kept the same nameplate which I
Speaker 7: thought that was kind of strange. They might have changed
Speaker 7: the nameplate because the car was completely changed such a
Speaker 7: sweeping difference to the look.
Speaker 4: I remember when that launched my buddy bought one in
Speaker 4: 1990 I bought a new Corera at the time and
Speaker 4: he bought a new Z X between the two cars
Speaker 4: we trade them off and I thought that 306 was
Speaker 4: really one hell of a car and an exquisite shape
Speaker 4: that actually as a design holds up today impeccably. That
Speaker 4: car is as refined to look now as it was
Speaker 4: when it was first introduced 30 years ago. Help us
Speaker 4: put it into context Pete Renault and Nissan started to
Speaker 4: get together. I guess there's a real close relationship between
Speaker 4: the French and the Japanese companies that allowed both of
Speaker 4: them to sort of join ranks and create a stronger
Speaker 4: brand for both companies right.
Speaker 7: I worked at least on at the time and Nissan
Speaker 7: was kind of going through kind of a downward spiral
Speaker 7: and I don't mean that in a negative way it
Speaker 7: was just that they were having some financial difficulties some problems.
Speaker 7: The frontier was the replacement truck for the old hard body.
Speaker 7: It did not take off as well as they had hoped.
Speaker 7: Keep in mind that the Zee had been discontinued. I
Speaker 7: was actually running the Z store for Nissan at the
Speaker 7: time the Zi store of course was the program where
Speaker 7: we were restoring original to 40 seats and I was
Speaker 7: running it kind of on a shoestring but bless Nissan
Speaker 7: they were at least funding that. But there wasn't a
Speaker 7: lot of marketing money because budgets were being cut. So
Speaker 7: my son was looking for a partner. And along came
Speaker 7: Renault and this was about 1998 when it happened and
Speaker 7: we got a message on everybody's desk when we came
Speaker 7: to work one day that said Nissan is going to
Speaker 7: partner with Renault we have a new automotive family and
Speaker 7: that's really when things got a little different. It didn't
Speaker 7: really affect any of us in terms of our positions
Speaker 7: but it was the partnership that they needed. Quite honestly
Speaker 7: the cash infusion that they needed maybe the stability that
Speaker 7: they needed but it really kept Nissan on the playing
Speaker 7: field if you will.
Speaker 4: That's an interesting history and proof that so many OEMs
Speaker 4: major brands really need to partner and have strength in
Speaker 4: numbers that allow them to really become families of cars
Speaker 4: as opposed to individual brands.
Speaker 3: Look at Volkswagen Group and the fact that they own
Speaker 3: everybody from Skoda to the gods. And similarly other affiliations
Speaker 3: that have made all of the products stronger by virtue
Speaker 3: of that. I agree we're going to take a quick
Speaker 3: break but we'll be right back Welcome to life.
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Speaker 11: We're back with Keith. Keith let's switch topics a little.
Speaker 11: I think it'll be impossible to talk about the Zee
Speaker 11: without talking about the GDR.
Speaker 7: Coincidentally I guess both cars are 50 years old in
Speaker 7: 2020 and both of those are managed by Hiroshi Tamura
Speaker 7: the gentleman we talked about at the beginning of our
Speaker 7: podcast tomorrow sun is kind of Mr. GDR and Mr.
Speaker 7: Zheng He is the caretaker if you will of both cars.
Speaker 7: His goal is to make sure that each one of
Speaker 7: those has a future long after he has retired from
Speaker 7: the company. Godzilla as we all refer to the GDR
Speaker 7: is a remarkable vehicle in terms of power in terms
Speaker 7: of its awesomeness and certainly it is the halo brand
Speaker 7: of Nissan. Whereas the Zee is the face of Nissan
Speaker 7: the GDR is this way up here Halo aspirational vehicle.
Speaker 4: It's an amazing car. I think I drove my first
Speaker 4: GTA in 2007 right when they came out and I've
Speaker 4: driven them successively and then every model upgrade and it's
Speaker 4: a car that has a distinct personality. Godzilla certainly one
Speaker 4: of them but it can also be a fairly tame Dr.
Speaker 4: Jekyll and not always a Mr. Hyde. I mean the
Speaker 4: car is actually a car you can drive at a
Speaker 4: remarkable achievement in terms of performance and all of that
Speaker 4: relative to its price which while not inexpensive is at
Speaker 4: least within the realm of consideration for mere mortals. The
Speaker 4: Zipcar of course much more so in recent years it's
Speaker 4: changed its look and its feel. I see recent. Really
Speaker 4: I'm thinking all the way back to 2002 which I
Speaker 4: guess doesn't make it that recent at all but that's
Speaker 4: when the 350 CE came out and that was a
Speaker 4: whole new look catapulted the Zee into the 21st century.
Speaker 4: How did that car take off and how successful was that.
Speaker 6: Do you remember the movie with Kevin Costner. Field of Dreams.
Speaker 6: There was this saying that if he builds it they
Speaker 6: will come here one day on our desks. When we
Speaker 6: came to work and this was always a big thing
Speaker 6: at any side is that there was always some kind
Speaker 6: of symbolism tied to a big announcement so on our
Speaker 6: desk in the morning was a baseball and the baseball
Speaker 6: said we will build it. And that was a sign
Speaker 6: that the new Z was kind of. And that was
Speaker 6: in 2000 when it finally showed up in 2002.
Speaker 7: The three goals that were inherent in building the doozy
Speaker 7: was that it would be powerful it would be unique
Speaker 7: and it would be affordable. One of the factors that
Speaker 7: led to the demise of the 300 X back in
Speaker 7: 1996 was that it had become unaffordable. It was a
Speaker 7: costly car sales and trickled down quite a bit. The
Speaker 7: New Jersey in 2002 had been calculated had been price
Speaker 7: had been built with a sales price or an MSR
Speaker 7: P that was within the realm of a new audience
Speaker 7: that really could afford it. And it was designed with
Speaker 7: enough power that it would be able to compete with
Speaker 7: whatever it was on the market at that time. It
Speaker 7: was a 911 tape bill but it was a great
Speaker 7: car with a very distinctive look. It was lighter shorter smaller.
Speaker 7: Those are the characteristics that we were trying to achieve.
Speaker 7: So it was built it was ready. It was launched
Speaker 7: and it was with great fanfare that the car came
Speaker 7: out and that car soldiered on for quite a while
Speaker 7: I guess.
Speaker 4: What 2009 it got replaced with the 370 DC and
Speaker 4: that's essentially the nameplate that we have today.
Speaker 7: The idea was to launch the car in 2002 with
Speaker 7: a new name but keep the same soul. And then
Speaker 7: that car lasted until 2009 when the 370 new name
Speaker 7: came out with more horsepower slightly modified in terms of
Speaker 7: the look but still retaining kind of the same stance
Speaker 7: the same silhouette but with new modifications new upgrades new technology.
Speaker 4: Well the fiftieth anniversary edition of the 370 Zee I
Speaker 4: guess is the cap on a half century of success
Speaker 4: for that model. But I know there's one call the
Speaker 4: new smo and that's been a name that's been attached
Speaker 4: to some of the super high performance names songs for
Speaker 4: a while.
Speaker 7: Can you explain to us what these mo means Miss
Speaker 7: Mo stands for Nissan motorsports. It's their high performance brand.
Speaker 7: It's their high performance parts division. They make a lot
Speaker 7: of money obviously selling high performance parts. So Nimmo itself
Speaker 7: the car is a compilation of their high performance parts
Speaker 7: integrated if you will into a special car.
Speaker 4: They look pretty remarkable I guess if you want to
Speaker 4: check all the boxes you order yourself a 3 7
Speaker 4: Daisy Nesmith and you've got the fiftieth anniversary edition that
Speaker 4: is going to be quite collectible going forward. Speaking of
Speaker 4: going forward what do you think Tim Morrison envisions for
Speaker 4: the future of the Zee nameplate.
Speaker 7: I spoke to him just a couple of days ago actually.
Speaker 7: He's very excited about the Z promo as they call it.
Speaker 7: It's going to take probably another two years before the
Speaker 7: car actually sees the showroom. Obviously the sooner the better.
Speaker 7: His goal is to have the car come out with
Speaker 7: a twin turbo 60 manual which will be wonderful. What
Speaker 7: are the only manuals left in the world by then
Speaker 7: it will come with an automatic as well it's an
Speaker 7: option but it's got so many components that bring a
Speaker 7: full circle between both the 240 and and then Alphonso
Speaker 7: the also who is the head of design. His first
Speaker 7: he was the 300 g x and it had such
Speaker 7: an impact on him that he wanted to incorporate a
Speaker 7: lot of the impact of that car. So that's why
Speaker 7: you see the tail lights from the 306 in the
Speaker 7: new Z prototype the hood and the edges of the car.
Speaker 7: It has a katana blade which goes back to the
Speaker 7: heritage of the Samurai soldier. But the thing that I
Speaker 7: always feel is so critical is that the three dials
Speaker 7: on the dash. And that's something that they have maintained
Speaker 7: all along. And to me that represents a big part
Speaker 7: of the heritage of 246.
Speaker 4: Well we'll talk about the future of the nameplate. That
Speaker 4: sounds like it's position for another 50 years if we're
Speaker 4: all driving by then. But let's look back on some
Speaker 4: of the older cars again and talk about the collector market.
Speaker 4: I know you were involved in the vintage Z project
Speaker 4: in Japanese cars across the board not just Dodson's Nissans
Speaker 4: Toyota's Hondas monsters. They're all very very collectible now those
Speaker 4: cars from the early era. They've really kind of taken
Speaker 4: off among younger collectors and maybe some older guys to
Speaker 4: it among these cars the 240 see is probably one
Speaker 4: of the linchpins of any Japanese car collection. Talk about
Speaker 4: some of the models the most desirable ones special additions.
Speaker 4: Can you explain what fair lady really is and covered
Speaker 4: the headlights versus the uncovered headlights and all the stuff
Speaker 4: that we see that I always wonder about.
Speaker 7: Fair Lady The name came from the fact that my
Speaker 7: fair lady was a great theatrical performance. It was a
Speaker 7: play and the president of Nissan in Japan at the time.
Speaker 7: Loved the play and he wanted to use that name
Speaker 7: for his upcoming line of cars. That's how it started.
Speaker 7: And instead of saying My Fair Lady they just used
Speaker 7: fairly always and that's something obviously they had to get
Speaker 7: the rights to use the name but that's how the
Speaker 7: car at least the sports car and it goes back
Speaker 7: in 1960 where they first started applying that to their
Speaker 7: original rag top although Mr. K. said that isn't going
Speaker 7: to work the United States. It's just not masculine enough
Speaker 7: for the American consumer. So he fought long and hard
Speaker 7: for the name 240 Z which was obviously reflective of
Speaker 7: the displacement of the. And then you mentioned covered lights
Speaker 7: versus open scoops. There's also the Geno's which is the
Speaker 7: covered nose again some of these are rare. Some of
Speaker 7: these are Japanese only the Geno's was really mostly a
Speaker 7: Japanese product. There are some that have a little spoiler
Speaker 7: on the back there some that have spoilers on the front.
Speaker 7: Most of those came from the parts been from the
Speaker 7: racing program and you could order some of these accessories.
Speaker 7: But honestly the cars started becoming more collectible in the
Speaker 7: last five to seven years up to that point disease
Speaker 7: really weren't generating a whole lot of return. Other Japanese
Speaker 7: cars were more desirable. You mentioned the two thousand GTD
Speaker 7: the Toyota that cars skyrocketed probably in some respect because
Speaker 7: they featured in the James Bond movie all cars that
Speaker 7: feature in James Bond movies for whatever reason seem to
Speaker 7: have a certain value ascribed to them except my Z3
Speaker 7: and the lotus. But that car seemed to have a
Speaker 7: certain value. Other cars that have really mushroomed in the
Speaker 7: last few years the supra the original. What is it
Speaker 7: land cruiser. That car has really increased in value. Those
Speaker 7: are the cars that I would see have value. But
Speaker 7: really all of a sudden the Zipcar and I'm proud
Speaker 7: to say the ones that we made a Disney star.
Speaker 7: These are now called the restoration zis have really increased
Speaker 7: in value because we only need 38 of them. And
Speaker 7: so they're all basically hand built Piers Z made a
Speaker 7: number of them here and author Mark Jones made a
Speaker 7: bunch of them in Signal Hill dot Sonali and we
Speaker 7: had two other less Kennedy made one or two and
Speaker 7: a couple of folks old car design made too. These
Speaker 7: cars were all hand built. We took all of these.
Speaker 7: I bought all of them all 240 zis locally paid
Speaker 7: two thousand three thousand for them and then we restored
Speaker 7: them all on a rotisserie all new body completely down
Speaker 7: to the metal dipped to some extent that we could
Speaker 7: we bought a new wiring I mean we did a
Speaker 7: complete restoration.
Speaker 4: I remember when that program came out I was really
Speaker 4: impressed that a manufacturer would actually undertake such a heartfelt
Speaker 4: project under their own wing and that they regarded their
Speaker 4: history as being so significant that they wanted to get
Speaker 4: these cars back to perfect condition and back on the road.
Speaker 7: You know Robert it was heartfelt but was also again
Speaker 7: a marketing decision. Keep in mind that the 306 had
Speaker 7: just been discontinued in 1996. We did the Z program
Speaker 7: for two reasons one. We keep the name Zee fresh
Speaker 7: in people's minds because we anticipated at some point that
Speaker 7: we would have a new Z. We didn't know when.
Speaker 7: So the idea was to keep the Z in the
Speaker 7: minds of people and we had an accompanying marketing program
Speaker 7: with heavy advertising and all the buzz books. We also
Speaker 7: did a lot of PR. We built a press car
Speaker 7: that saw a lot of miles being driven by a
Speaker 7: lot of journalists. And then the other thing was that
Speaker 7: we had to protect the trademark. I'll tell you right
Speaker 7: now that a certain manufacturer that makes another Z based
Speaker 7: car tried to pursue the trademark saying that the Z
Speaker 7: in America was no longer being used therefore they wanted
Speaker 7: to take control of the Z trademark. So was both
Speaker 7: a legal and a marketing decision to do this. It
Speaker 7: paid off for us in terms of keeping this bridge
Speaker 7: between the old Z and the new one which we
Speaker 7: announced obviously in 2000. That four year span was important
Speaker 7: for Nissan but it was very heartfelt because it was
Speaker 7: important for all of us to build the car. At
Speaker 7: one point in the employee parking lot I probably had
Speaker 7: 50 old uses. Of course they were all exposed and
Speaker 7: then somebody from H.R. said you need to cover those cars.
Speaker 7: So we nicely covered them all up and then eventually
Speaker 7: we had to move them.
Speaker 4: That's funny. Well Pete it sounds like it was a
Speaker 4: great project. Obviously you focused on two 4-D. So those
Speaker 4: first four years of production. Is that right. You didn't
Speaker 4: do later cars.
Speaker 7: We actually didn't build Sony 73 years because the 73
Speaker 7: I didn't really want to build. That was the first
Speaker 7: year of their mission changes so I really focused from
Speaker 7: 70 to 72.
Speaker 4: So from 70 71 and 72 that's the car that
Speaker 4: a collector would want to look for in terms of
Speaker 4: the emissions and in terms of the purity of the
Speaker 4: design of the bumpers and all that kind of good stuff.
Speaker 7: Those early zis in any UN restored original Z. Anything
Speaker 7: that Mr. Kay has kind of touched.
Speaker 11: Those cars have really escalated in the marketplace now and
Speaker 11: I suspect that the cars are not going to get
Speaker 11: any less desirable as time goes on. They are we're
Speaker 11: going to take a short break but we'll be right
Speaker 11: back in a moment of your time.
Speaker 12: A new podcast from critical media.
Speaker 9: Currently 21 years on and today like magic read a
Speaker 9: from her fingertips down to the blood to take care
Speaker 9: of yourself because the world needs you. And just like
Speaker 9: every do gooder that asked about me was ready to
Speaker 9: spit on my fingers her face you can feel like
Speaker 9: your purpose and your wife is really being cruel to
Speaker 9: stop me from playing the piano. She buys walkie talkies
Speaker 9: wonders to whom she should give the second dolls love humans.
Speaker 4: We never did. We never will.
Speaker 13: We just find the beauty of rock climbing is that
Speaker 13: he can only focus on what's right in life.
Speaker 6: And so our American life begins.
Speaker 12: We may need to stay apart but let's create together
Speaker 12: available on our podcast platforms. Submit your piece at Kirkham
Speaker 12: slash a moment of your time.
Speaker 14: Welcome back. Cars that matter what's in your garage. You
Speaker 14: have a zip in your garage.
Speaker 7: I don't right now. I've had three in the past.
Speaker 7: I've had a 240. I was in the publishing business
Speaker 7: out of grad school and had a company car in
Speaker 7: which was a 286 Turbo. I lived in Denver Colorado.
Speaker 7: It snows in Denver an incredible amount and I had
Speaker 7: to put kitty litter in the back because that car
Speaker 7: just went nuts in the snow. But that was my
Speaker 7: company car which was a wonderful car. I also had
Speaker 7: a 300. I worked for Steve Millen before I worked
Speaker 7: for Nissan. It was the fact that I work for Millen.
Speaker 7: That got me hired by Nissan. We built a tribute
Speaker 7: car for the 25th anniversary of Nissan Z which we
Speaker 7: called the SMG and had a different aerodynamic look and
Speaker 7: big brakes. You know common tires it really was a
Speaker 7: nice nice car. And I had a z then so
Speaker 7: I did three I don't have one now but I
Speaker 7: really would like to get one of the new disease
Speaker 7: that comes out. What's in my garage right now. I've
Speaker 7: got a 63 Corvair which is the one that was
Speaker 7: in a movie called Zodiac but that from the studio
Speaker 7: I've got a sixty five grand cherokee just pristine. I've
Speaker 7: got a 65 Thunderbird special Lando. I have a 66
Speaker 7: Mustang convertible and I have a 73 triumph TR 6
Speaker 7: and then I have a 2015 Camaro to SS and Audi.
Speaker 4: All right boy you've got quite a stable there and
Speaker 4: there's a lot of great American iron for a fellow
Speaker 4: who's an expert on Japanese cars. I think you're definitely
Speaker 4: waving the flag for General Motors and a little bit
Speaker 4: of Ford here and there. I know that's a nice
Speaker 4: collection of cars. And of course the Corvette is a
Speaker 4: bit of an outlier another car that doesn't get all
Speaker 4: the respect that's due for being such a forward thinking design.
Speaker 7: Yeah. I love the Corvette. My dad had a Corvette.
Speaker 7: So my dad loved rearranging cars. Had to Renault dolphins.
Speaker 4: Oh good heavens. Well you don't see those on the
Speaker 4: road anymore.
Speaker 7: And then he had a Corvair. So I don't know
Speaker 7: why you liked rearranging cars but then I ended up
Speaker 7: buying one too because they are fun to drive.
Speaker 4: That's why there's nothing more fun and sometimes surprising than
Speaker 4: the rear engine car. But when it comes to classic
Speaker 4: looks and style I think it's hard to beat the
Speaker 4: two Ford easy especially when you put it in the
Speaker 4: context of the early 70s and you see what was
Speaker 4: happening to automotive designs then you can put that car
Speaker 4: up side by side with any type or any Ferrari
Speaker 4: from the era. And stylistically it really does hold its own.
Speaker 4: I agree. A great testament to a company that took
Speaker 4: a hell of a chance with a market that had
Speaker 4: no idea they were coming. Oh I agree. It was
Speaker 4: a gamble but it really paid off. I want to
Speaker 4: talk about your book for a minute Pete because your
Speaker 4: book is really a cut above in the range of
Speaker 4: automotive books. It's beautifully designed by the way. It's not
Speaker 4: only well laid out but it's really an attractive design
Speaker 4: aesthetic when it comes to the information man. You drill
Speaker 4: deep for anyone who wants to know literally the nuts
Speaker 4: and bolts of the car history. Your book has it
Speaker 4: that really goes deep into the crevices and pulls out
Speaker 4: all the little goodies that would probably otherwise never be
Speaker 4: told it's someone who's been involved with Neeson for quite
Speaker 4: a while I appreciate that.
Speaker 7: I love cars. I have always loved cars since I
Speaker 7: was a kid. And to be able to be in
Speaker 7: the automotive business for as long as I have been
Speaker 7: was just a dream of mine. I started my automotive
Speaker 7: journey back in 1985 working for SPCA and then I
Speaker 7: had a stint working for Selene helping him market and
Speaker 7: selling his Mustangs and then I left after his Indy
Speaker 7: car program exploded and I went to work for Ford
Speaker 7: and did some work for them that got me at
Speaker 7: Bob bond Grant and I worked at his school performance
Speaker 7: driving in Phoenix right when he moved there and spent
Speaker 7: three years there then got hired on and Steve Mullens
Speaker 7: and that got me into Nissan and after that I
Speaker 7: worked in the advertising business and then became a teacher.
Speaker 7: So I've had a very diversified career but writing has
Speaker 7: been fundamental to all that I teach writing now I
Speaker 7: teach writing for advertising I teach copywriting I teach marketing
Speaker 7: but being able to follow my passion has been absolutely critical.
Speaker 4: That's a great career arc from SPCA motor sport to
Speaker 4: advertising really kind of covers the gamut when it comes
Speaker 4: to cars.
Speaker 2: You mentioned the fact that the spiritual guide to all
Speaker 2: this is you talk about karma. Mr. K we love
Speaker 2: to be honored five. So you did something right. His
Speaker 2: signature autograph was always love cars love people love my
Speaker 2: boy if I could take a little piece of that
Speaker 2: and apply that to my own life I would be
Speaker 2: so grateful. I'm so grateful to be able to have
Speaker 2: written this book and I thank the folks in motor
Speaker 2: books for giving me this opportunity and the folks at
Speaker 2: least for letting me put into words the passion that
Speaker 2: they have for this car and celebrate it. But that
Speaker 2: to me is important to a writer and to a person.
Speaker 2: Like I said it's passion about cars as I am
Speaker 2: I'm living the dream. Thanks to Peter Kavanagh author of
Speaker 2: this on Z 50 years of exhilarating experience for joining
Speaker 2: us today on cars that come back next time as
Speaker 2: we continue to talk about the passions that drivers and
Speaker 2: the passions we drive.
Speaker 3: This episode of cars that matter was hosted by Robert
Speaker 3: Ross produced by Chris border headed by Chris Porter sound
Speaker 3: engineering by Michael Kennedy theme song by Celeste and Eric
Speaker 3: Dix additional music and sound by Chris Porter. Please like
Speaker 3: subscribe and share this podcast. I'm Robert Ross. Thanks for listening.
Speaker 15: Kurt call media media for your mind.