Speaker 1: You're listening to I'MM with Me podcast.
Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to biz your work life Sorted. I'm
Speaker 2: m Venom and today we're diving into something that I
Speaker 2: am personally obsessed with. We're using AI to make our
Speaker 2: work lives easier, or as TikTok calls it, lazy girl jobs.
Speaker 2: So I'll be honest, I use AI for literally everything
Speaker 2: these days. I use it for therapy, although I'm not
Speaker 2: going to talk about that today, but I also use
Speaker 2: it to help me prep for interviews, to structure my thoughts,
Speaker 2: even just to give me a little confidence booster before
Speaker 2: big meetings. But I know a lot of people are
Speaker 2: either scared of it, or confused by it, or worry
Speaker 2: that it's going to.
Speaker 1: Take your job.
Speaker 2: So today, so sits down with AI expert Amantha Imba
Speaker 2: from INVENTINGM to break down exactly how to use AI
Speaker 2: tools properly. And when I say properly, I mean actually
Speaker 2: making them work for you, not just throwing random prompts
Speaker 2: at chat GBT and hoping for the best. Plus, they're
Speaker 2: sharing the exact prompts and frameworks that will help you
Speaker 2: use AI as your personal work assistant.
Speaker 3: First, when it comes to AI. I think there's a
Speaker 3: really big mix in terms of how people are using it.
Speaker 3: It's also changing so quickly. So in a work context,
Speaker 3: should we be just trying to use AI as the
Speaker 3: first point of call for everything or is there a
Speaker 3: better way?
Speaker 1: There's definitely a better way. Do not just default to AI.
Speaker 4: So there are three questions that we think about at
Speaker 4: Inventium when we're training people on how to use AI.
Speaker 1: So the first.
Speaker 4: Question is what is the risk if AI gets it wrong.
Speaker 4: If it's a low risk, great, go ahead and use AI.
Speaker 4: But if it's a higher risk, like if the life
Speaker 4: and death situation, maybe think twice. Secondly, and this is related,
Speaker 4: can you easily verify and correct the AI's output? So
Speaker 4: you know, if for example, you're getting it to help
Speaker 4: you write an article on something or social media post,
Speaker 4: it's probably going to be pretty easy to verify things.
Speaker 4: Maybe there's some research that it's referenced, you can go
Speaker 4: straight to the source and check that. But if you
Speaker 4: can't verify it, let's just say you're getting it to
Speaker 4: review a contract and you're not a lawyer and that
Speaker 4: contract is high stakes, maybe don't use the AI. And
Speaker 4: then finally, will the AI save you significant time or effort,
Speaker 4: because if it would be quicker to just write that
Speaker 4: quick little email back yourself rather than prompt the AI
Speaker 4: to do it for you, then there's really no point
Speaker 4: in using the AI.
Speaker 1: So there are the three questions that we ask.
Speaker 3: I've definitely made that mistake before where it's like, would
Speaker 3: you like AI to write this for you? And I'm
Speaker 3: like sure, and then you spend more time rewarding it. Okay,
Speaker 3: I really like those. So one assess the risk to
Speaker 3: can you verify the output? And then three is it
Speaker 3: actually going to save you time? Just one number two
Speaker 3: in terms of verifying the output? How do you actually
Speaker 3: do that? Then? So can you give such just a
Speaker 3: few more examples of how you would actually verify the output.
Speaker 4: So, for example, if you're using the AI to research
Speaker 4: something for you and it gives you all the sources,
Speaker 4: I think a lot of us now know that AI
Speaker 4: is not a fact engine. It's a prediction engine that
Speaker 4: is very important, So it doesn't produce facts and it
Speaker 4: is very prone to HA hallucination. So if for example,
Speaker 4: you've asked it to research I don't know some statistics
Speaker 4: around mobile phone use, and it's spitting out some data.
Speaker 4: You want to be clicking on those sources that it's
Speaker 4: giving you to verify those answers yourself.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's so true, I guess as well. Another build
Speaker 3: on that is if you're doing something for the first time,
Speaker 3: So say your boss is like, can you write this
Speaker 3: like twenty page strategy document. You've never done that before.
Speaker 3: Using AI to give you that output, you're not really
Speaker 3: going to know like is that output any good or not? Okay,
Speaker 3: So that's understanding when you should use it and doesn't
Speaker 3: necessarily mean you should be using it for every task.
Speaker 3: Let's talk about like this is kind of what we
Speaker 3: really want to get into today, which is like the
Speaker 3: detail around how you actually use it, you know, sort
Speaker 3: of challenging a lazy girl energy here. We want to
Speaker 3: be using it to save us time and to make
Speaker 3: our jobs easier. But I think the problem a lot
Speaker 3: of us get into is we just jump straight into
Speaker 3: like trying to write those prompts in chat GPT, and
Speaker 3: then we're not really happy with what we're getting out
Speaker 3: of it. So there's something really important that you need
Speaker 3: to understand first. So Amantha Savius, what do we need
Speaker 3: to know before we just start prompting.
Speaker 4: Well, what we need to do is we need to
Speaker 4: think about what role can AI actually play to help us,
Speaker 4: Because if you think about your work life, there are
Speaker 4: three categories of people that you have in your work life.
Speaker 4: There's people that you can delegate too that might be
Speaker 4: say an administrative assistant. There's people that are teammates, so
Speaker 4: our buddies that might give us feedback and you know,
Speaker 4: just help us think about ideas on problems that we're
Speaker 4: trying to solve. And then there's experts. So maybe your
Speaker 4: boss is an expert. Hopefully maybe you've got a mentor,
Speaker 4: or maybe there are other clever people that you draw on.
Speaker 4: And too often where we get it wrong with AI
Speaker 4: is we just think about the AI as something we
Speaker 4: can delegate our low level admin monotonous tasks too, right
Speaker 4: like can you take notes for this meeting and summarize
Speaker 4: the actions so I can email that round? Pretty low
Speaker 4: level kind of task. Can you write this email for me?
Speaker 4: Pretty low level? But where AI also really shines is
Speaker 4: as a buddy and also as an expert. So I
Speaker 4: don't know if you're anything like me, but I feel
Speaker 4: very guilty tapping teammates on the shoulder and going hey,
Speaker 4: can I get your feedback on this presentation I've put
Speaker 4: together or something like that, because you know, people's time
Speaker 4: is precious, but with the AI, it's always there for you.
Speaker 4: It doesn't care how many times you ask at things,
Speaker 4: what time of day or night you're asking it.
Speaker 1: So it is great as a buddy.
Speaker 4: Like you know, if I want to get a second
Speaker 4: set of eyes on, you know, like a post that I've.
Speaker 1: Written, I can just ask the AI to give me
Speaker 1: its views on that. And I can also use it
Speaker 1: as an expert.
Speaker 4: Like there are times I find where you might have
Speaker 4: a contract to review. There might be pretty low stakes,
Speaker 4: but you still need to look at it. Like let's
Speaker 4: say a contract to use a photographer for an event,
Speaker 4: and it's not worthwhile paying a lawyer to reve because
Speaker 4: it's low stakes. And I must say, lawyers are great
Speaker 4: and lawyers are important, but USEI as an expert. You
Speaker 4: can prompt it to be in the persona of a
Speaker 4: lawyer and just review the contracts so that you can
Speaker 4: understand the causes that you're signing.
Speaker 3: For example, Ah, this is so good, I've never thought
Speaker 3: about it. In those three levels. Before I know we're
Speaker 3: going to get into a live walkthrough of sort of
Speaker 3: how you craft are prompt in a moment, but just
Speaker 3: going back to because I just think like some of
Speaker 3: those use cases you shared are just so helpful and
Speaker 3: can be quite simple too. So back to it being
Speaker 3: like your buddy or your coworker who you don't want
Speaker 3: to bother if you like, can you just review this
Speaker 3: doc and tell me how to make it better? What
Speaker 3: would be just an example prompt that you would throw
Speaker 3: in there to get it to do that?
Speaker 4: I would firstly always talk about, well, what's my task,
Speaker 4: what's my goal that I need at the end of
Speaker 4: the day. Am I looking for a critique? Am I
Speaker 4: looking for a grammar and spelling check? Am I looking
Speaker 4: for someone to view it through the lens of one
Speaker 4: of my customers, for example? So be really clear and
Speaker 4: give it that context. I would also if something that
Speaker 4: you've done before, like let's just say it's a report
Speaker 4: that you have to produce every week for your manager,
Speaker 4: I would give it examples of previous reports that I've
Speaker 4: written that I know a really good quality, and I'd say,
Speaker 4: can you compare it against these previous reports and suggest
Speaker 4: how I might improve it? For example, or tell me
Speaker 4: what I might be missing.
Speaker 3: Now that you're talking about this. This is kind of
Speaker 3: how I use it a lot in terms of that
Speaker 3: sort of almost like thought partner or like peer. And
Speaker 3: so I'll even use things like can you tell me
Speaker 3: what the boring parts are of this and take them out?
Speaker 3: Or can you rewrite this like you're explaining it to
Speaker 3: a smart twelve year old. I find those really helpful
Speaker 3: as well. But just like that kind of thought partner's
Speaker 3: boring partner, I find really helpful too. So that's kind
Speaker 3: of like how to use it as a buddy or
Speaker 3: a peer. Let's talk about an expert. One talk me
Speaker 3: through how you use it as an expert.
Speaker 4: So when I'm using it as an expert, I will
Speaker 4: often go into what I refer to as voice mode
Speaker 4: and how I use it. I've got chat JPT as
Speaker 4: an app on my phone, and you can go into
Speaker 4: the app and there's a little symbol that looks like,
Speaker 4: I guess, an audio icon, and if you press on that,
Speaker 4: wait for it to connect to the internet and turn
Speaker 4: into a colorful bubble. The AI becomes a voice companion
Speaker 4: as opposed to a writing companion, and it will talk
Speaker 4: to you and you can have a conversation with it
Speaker 4: as if you are talking to a real person.
Speaker 1: So that is voice mode. I use that heaps.
Speaker 4: Where I find it's really useful is I will often
Speaker 4: try to think through problems when I'm out walking, when
Speaker 4: I'm out moving, and what I now do is, rather
Speaker 4: than just being with my own thoughts, than having to
Speaker 4: think through things on myself, I can now have an
Speaker 4: expert that I'm having a chat with while I go
Speaker 4: for a walk. Like the other morning, I went for
Speaker 4: a pretty early morning walk and I was trying to
Speaker 4: think through a pricing strategy for a new product that
Speaker 4: we're launching at Inventium, and so I prompted the AI
Speaker 4: to actors are pricing expert in my particular industry, which
Speaker 4: is consulting, and then I just started having a chat
Speaker 4: with it about, Hey, this is my context, this is
Speaker 4: the task that I want you to help me think through.
Speaker 4: And we basically had a thirty minute conversation where I
Speaker 4: had managed to channel an expert in pricing strategy, and
Speaker 4: by the end of that thirty minute walk, I had
Speaker 4: some really great advice that I could put into practice.
Speaker 3: I feel like, if you don't listen to the rest
Speaker 3: of the episode, don't worry, because this is the most
Speaker 3: important thing. This for me was completely game changing for
Speaker 3: anyone who is not using voice mode. You can use
Speaker 3: it on chat, GPT, you can use it on Gemini.
Speaker 3: I think probably most AI assistants have it. Now I
Speaker 3: want you to pause this episode. I want you to
Speaker 3: get your phone out, I want you to download the
Speaker 3: app for your AI have choice, and I want you
Speaker 3: to actually test out using voice mode. So as Amantha said,
Speaker 3: it's that little button on the right hand side, lower
Speaker 3: right hand side, and it looks like a little sound
Speaker 3: recorder it and just start talking. It's so conversational and natural. Yeah,
Speaker 3: this has been game changing for me. The way I
Speaker 3: use it that I really love is to help it
Speaker 3: organize my thoughts. So obviously I'm a content creator, but
Speaker 3: this could be for you. You know, you've got a
Speaker 3: LinkedIn post that you maybe you want to write at work,
Speaker 3: or you've got like a strategy document you're working on.
Speaker 3: You have to give a talk to your team and
Speaker 3: update in a team meeting. I just say to it,
Speaker 3: I want you to act as a marketing manager or
Speaker 3: a business leader, whatever it is. And I'm just going
Speaker 3: to share with you some of my thoughts. Then I'm
Speaker 3: going to get your help to craft that into something
Speaker 3: that has structure and blood, and then you just share
Speaker 3: your little thoughts with it, and then you just kind
Speaker 3: of keep going back and forth like that. So I
Speaker 3: use that all the time.
Speaker 1: I love that.
Speaker 3: I love that. I've also heard a lot of young
Speaker 3: people using it like a therapist or like an executive coach.
Speaker 3: For example, this is like putting me out of a
Speaker 3: job right now, but basically you say to it, like
Speaker 3: act as an executive coach at leading companies like Apple
Speaker 3: or Google, and I want you to coach me on
Speaker 3: this problem that I've got, and you literally just like
Speaker 3: share your problem with it. But therapy as well. Lots
Speaker 3: of gen z using chat jopt there a bit. Now
Speaker 3: we're going to get into the really practical stuff for everyone.
Speaker 3: So we're actually going to do a bit of a
Speaker 3: walkthrough of what makes a good prompt, because I think
Speaker 3: that's where a lot of us just kind of come undone.
Speaker 3: We'll just like chuck a prompt in there, we don't
Speaker 3: really get a good output, and we're like, that was
Speaker 3: waste of time. I'm not doing it again. But sometimes
Speaker 3: it's a you problem and we're going to fix our
Speaker 3: prompting the anatomy of a prompt. Okay, so let's talk
Speaker 3: about the use case amanth Of. Say you've got a
Speaker 3: presentation that you have to give an internal presentation in
Speaker 3: a just like normal weekly team meeting. Can you walk
Speaker 3: me through how you would approach creating a prompt for that.
Speaker 1: Yes.
Speaker 4: So at a higher level, what we talk about at
Speaker 4: Inventium in our training as we say that there's gun
Speaker 4: slinging and there's architecting when it comes to prompting. So
Speaker 4: gun slinging is where you just treat it as someone
Speaker 4: you were chatting to and you're like, hey, help me
Speaker 4: do this presentation, and then it does stuff and then
Speaker 4: you're like, ah, no, you got that completely wrong.
Speaker 1: Do more of this, do less of.
Speaker 4: That, and it turns into this really long, arduous prompt
Speaker 4: chain and at the end you're thinking, why did I
Speaker 4: even try using AI in the first place. So gunsling
Speaker 4: is very ad hoc, but we find that I would
Speaker 4: say ninety five percent of people that we work with
Speaker 4: and coach at invent Him use a gunslinging approach. What
Speaker 4: will get you a far better result, particularly the more
Speaker 4: complex project you're trying to work with AI. The more
Speaker 4: important this is is what we call architecting, where how
Speaker 4: we would do it. Let's take the example of a
Speaker 4: work presentation project update. Let's say is that first we're
Speaker 4: setting the task or the goal. So that might be
Speaker 4: I need you to help create a presentation from scratch,
Speaker 4: or it might be I need you to help you know,
Speaker 4: review this existing presentation. It's probably going to be one
Speaker 4: of those goals. Then we want to give it the context,
Speaker 4: so we need to tell it who is the audience
Speaker 4: and what are the outcomes that I am trying to
Speaker 4: achieve with this presentation.
Speaker 3: So that might be the audience is like my team
Speaker 3: of mid level marketing managers, and the outcome might be.
Speaker 4: The outcome might be just so they're feeling crystal clear
Speaker 4: on where this project is at, or so that they
Speaker 4: are going to approve a certain amount of funding for
Speaker 4: this idea that I have, or you know, whatever it
Speaker 4: might be. The more specific we can be, the better.
Speaker 4: So definitely the audience tell it the industry that you're in,
Speaker 4: what your job is. So the more context the better,
Speaker 4: because it is not psychic yet.
Speaker 1: Then instead of.
Speaker 4: Just going okay, so go create that presentation for me
Speaker 4: in which case you are going to end up with
Speaker 4: a very very messy prompt thread. Instead, work on an
Speaker 4: outline first, because something like a presentation has a lot
Speaker 4: of different components and there's a way to structure it.
Speaker 4: So if you think about it like a collaborative buddy,
Speaker 4: and you prompt it first to say, help work with
Speaker 4: me on an outline for this presentation, don't actually start
Speaker 4: writing the presentation yet, so.
Speaker 1: Be really clear with it.
Speaker 4: What you can also do, and this would be my
Speaker 4: favorite add on to any prompt is get it to
Speaker 4: ask you questions. So say something like, please ask me
Speaker 4: any questions you need to be ninety five percent confident
Speaker 4: in doing a great job because it's going to have gaps,
Speaker 4: and why not let it guide you in helping it
Speaker 4: fill in its gaps.
Speaker 3: I am going to pause you there because I agree
Speaker 3: if you are still listening to this podcast, even though
Speaker 3: I told you the most important point was before around
Speaker 3: voice mode, I actually lie because this is another important point,
Speaker 3: flipping it and saying you ask me the questions and
Speaker 3: I'll feed you more information. So that line you had
Speaker 3: ask me clarifying questions. Until you're ninety five percent confident,
Speaker 3: you can you know complete the task successfully. That is
Speaker 3: so important and that has helped me so much because
Speaker 3: a lot of time, it's not just that you want
Speaker 3: the AI to just produce this perfect thing for you.
Speaker 3: You sort of just need it to help you organize
Speaker 3: your thoughts and I think getting it to ask you
Speaker 3: question is a really good way to do that. So
Speaker 3: let me just replay this because this is I mean,
Speaker 3: I thought I was pretty good, but this has already
Speaker 3: helped me. So, you know, what is the goal of
Speaker 3: the task you're trying to do, give it the context
Speaker 3: who you're talking to, what you want them to know,
Speaker 3: you know what they're going to get out of it
Speaker 3: kind of thing. And would you even put in there
Speaker 3: amount the context around like the format or is that
Speaker 3: coming later, like in terms of the output, like I
Speaker 3: want it to be ten minutes long, or when does
Speaker 3: that come in?
Speaker 4: Yeah, So format is good to stay upfront because then
Speaker 4: if you're working with it to create a structure, it
Speaker 4: can know that like a ten minute update presentation is
Speaker 4: going to be very different from a sixty minute in
Speaker 4: depth educational presentation, for example.
Speaker 3: You'd almost put that in the goal then maybe like
Speaker 3: your goal is to presentation that's ten minutes long. Okay, cool, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 4: So once you've got to ask you questions and you
Speaker 4: feel in the gaps for it, it's got context, it
Speaker 4: knows the tasks that we're trying to achieve the goal.
Speaker 4: Then what you're going to ask it to do is
Speaker 4: essentially build out the structure so that you're happy with
Speaker 4: the structure you know, and it might be you know, introduction,
Speaker 4: and then it might be you know, point one point
Speaker 4: two point three and then some sort of closing, like
Speaker 4: a very basic structure. It probably won't be that, but
Speaker 4: let's use that as an example. So once you're happy
Speaker 4: and you've kind of got that scaffolding, if you like,
Speaker 4: for the overall structure of the output, then you want
Speaker 4: to prompt the AI to build out each section with you.
Speaker 4: So once you're happy with the scaffolding, I would then
Speaker 4: be saying, okay, let's work on the first section. Can
Speaker 4: you help me build out this introduction, And you're potentially
Speaker 4: feeding it with more details or more context around the
Speaker 4: introduction and what it needs to contain, and then basically
Speaker 4: repeating that for every section or every chunk of the task.
Speaker 1: It will stop you.
Speaker 4: Having to undo and redo and edit prompts and make
Speaker 4: a big mess of things. This is exactly the process
Speaker 4: that I use when I'm using THEAI to work on
Speaker 4: something quite long or complex.
Speaker 3: I love this, and for anyone listening, we're going to
Speaker 3: put all of these prompts in the newsletter, so just
Speaker 3: make sure you're signed up. Is in links in the
Speaker 3: show notes. But this is so good because what you're
Speaker 3: saying is to that gun slinger method that you mentioned earlier.
Speaker 3: I'm just thinking about today. I was prompting AI to
Speaker 3: help me. It was actually helping me prep a podcast episode,
Speaker 3: and I asked it to give me three examples based
Speaker 3: on these three points that I gave, and then I
Speaker 3: said make it funnier, and then I said, now make
Speaker 3: it shorter, and then I said, now give me an
Speaker 3: example for a manager. And it just progressively got worse
Speaker 3: and worse as I sort of went down. Not to
Speaker 3: say you can't do that, because I think refining it
Speaker 3: sometimes is helpful, so like, you know, rewrite this to
Speaker 3: make it more concise or whatever. But sometimes you know,
Speaker 3: in just messing with it, the output just gets worse
Speaker 3: and worse. I've noticed that, so I think taking a
Speaker 3: pause to really architect your prompt at the start is
Speaker 3: really helpful.
Speaker 4: You've brought up a really important point that I find
Speaker 4: most people don't know about. If you have felt that
Speaker 4: way like you felt today, where it just seemed like
Speaker 4: the AI was getting stupider, which is really weird because hey,
Speaker 4: it's software.
Speaker 1: Software doesn't get stupider. It actually does. So the AI
Speaker 1: can't learn.
Speaker 4: And if you think of its memory and why and
Speaker 4: when you need to start a new thread or like
Speaker 4: a new chat if you like, it's because the AI
Speaker 4: can only remember so much. If you think about, like
Speaker 4: if say you were reading a multi page document, Let's
Speaker 4: say it's a five page document, why the AI gets
Speaker 4: dumber is because it can remember about a page or two,
Speaker 4: but then it starts to forget. And so what's important there.
Speaker 4: If you were like having that experience where the AI
Speaker 4: seems to be getting dumber, you probably at the end
Speaker 4: of a very long thread, in which case what I
Speaker 4: recommend is prompting the AI to summarize this thread in
Speaker 4: terms of what's being covered, and then start a new
Speaker 4: thread with that summary, and you'll find that all of
Speaker 4: a sudden, the AI's gotten smarter again.
Speaker 3: That is an amazing tip. Oh, that's just one other
Speaker 3: point that I think is really important. Someone just showed
Speaker 3: me how to do this amount, which is you can
Speaker 3: actually see the memory that chat GPT has about you,
Speaker 3: and I think it can only save. This is when
Speaker 3: you know, if you're using it quite regularly, it's starting
Speaker 3: to learn where you work and all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 3: It can only remember about fifty lines about you or something,
Speaker 3: and you can actually go into the settings. We'll put
Speaker 3: the details of this in the newsletter, and you can
Speaker 3: actually see what it knows about you, and you can
Speaker 3: delete some stuff. So if something's not relevant anymore, you
Speaker 3: were getting it to help you on a certain task
Speaker 3: and that time has passed, you can delete that whole
Speaker 3: thing and then it can actually learn more about you.
Speaker 3: This is on the free version. It probably remembers stuff
Speaker 3: on the paid version. So the final kind of point
Speaker 3: that I want to talk about with your mouth there
Speaker 3: is making it stick. So I think with a lot
Speaker 3: of us it's something that we're kind of dabbling in.
Speaker 3: Maybe we're using it here and there, but it hasn't
Speaker 3: been so life changing. But then other people, you know,
Speaker 3: it literally is their go to for everything. How do
Speaker 3: you make that change? How do you make it a
Speaker 3: happit and how are we really going to channel that
Speaker 3: lazy girl energy and to get this to do our jobs?
Speaker 1: For us?
Speaker 4: I think the simplest thing is to have a constant reminder.
Speaker 4: So what we recommend to people that we are training
Speaker 4: at inventim is we say, grab a post it note
Speaker 4: and write on that post it note should I use
Speaker 4: AI for this task? Put that post it note on
Speaker 4: your computer monitor, and for the next few days, you
Speaker 4: will not be desensitized to that message.
Speaker 1: You will think about that.
Speaker 4: With every task that you do until it starts to
Speaker 4: become second nature. I mean, there's plenty of other things,
Speaker 4: but I think that's a really simple hack. Post it
Speaker 4: note on your computer should I use AI for this task?
Speaker 4: And you will start to think about that whenever you
Speaker 4: start a new task.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. And then yeah, once you've made that change,
Speaker 3: then it just starts to become second nature just very quickly.
Speaker 3: In terms of you know, we've talked a lot about
Speaker 3: sort of chat GPT, but there are other tools that
Speaker 3: are AI that are super helpful. Can you just give us,
Speaker 3: like your top three most favorite AI tools that aren't
Speaker 3: chat JPTO.
Speaker 4: I actually use claude more than chat GPT. I find
Speaker 4: that it's not as popular. But if you want an
Speaker 4: AI that sounds more human than more robot, Claude is
Speaker 4: your best friend. I have in the last few weeks
Speaker 4: become obsessed with Granola. Now, Granola is a great meeting
Speaker 4: note taker. It only works on a Mac and you
Speaker 4: need a Google Workspace address. It doesn't work with a
Speaker 4: Gmail address sadly, so that's going to be a smaller
Speaker 4: portion of listeners. But anyway, if that is you, Granola
Speaker 4: is gold. I use Perplexity for search. I'm sure a
Speaker 4: lot of listeners are doing that already, a couple of others.
Speaker 4: I love consensus. I do a lot of research for
Speaker 4: my work, a lot of academic research, and consensus it's
Speaker 4: been around for years, but the AI that they've put
Speaker 4: into it is amazing. It basically allows you to find
Speaker 4: research driven answers to your questions. It's basically got millions
Speaker 4: of academic papers eaten up.
Speaker 1: By the AI, so it draws on all that knowledge.
Speaker 4: And you know, if I have a question, like you
Speaker 4: know it does hybrid work lead to greater productivity? It
Speaker 4: will show me all the research that's been done on
Speaker 4: that topic, which is brilliant, amazing.
Speaker 3: Can confirm you actually got me onto granola last week,
Speaker 3: because like people have told me about meeting note takers
Speaker 3: and I'm like whatever, I'm kind of like a bit.
Speaker 3: I've tried different air tools and if they annoy me,
Speaker 3: I'm I'm sort of like against them. Granola is unbelievable.
Speaker 3: I just like, I wish I had this my whole life. Yes,
Speaker 3: can confirm the culture.
Speaker 5: Culture.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 5: So if I loved that conversation, there were so many
Speaker 5: nuggets of goals in that and little things that were
Speaker 5: said that just unlocked new ways of thinking about AI
Speaker 5: For me. I loved the point on verifying your answers.
Speaker 5: That is so important and something that I don't do.
Speaker 5: I am very trusting.
Speaker 3: It's gotten a lot better in terms of hallucination, but
Speaker 3: I still like the other day I asked Perplexity for
Speaker 3: some research and then I was like, Okay, can you
Speaker 3: give me the source of this? And it's like, oh, actually,
Speaker 3: I got that wrong. It literally said to me, I
Speaker 3: got that wrong. That research doesn't exist because it sort
Speaker 3: of wants to give you what you want to hear.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's such a good point. I think that's a
Speaker 5: really important one. To drill home and also just thinking
Speaker 5: about AI as a buddy. I think that's probably the
Speaker 5: bucket that I use it most in. And I actually
Speaker 5: said to my co founder the other day, like, I
Speaker 5: think chut jpit is my best friend.
Speaker 1: Like I just talk to it. That's really sad.
Speaker 5: I talk to it all day long, all the time,
Speaker 5: in a similar bucket to the buddy. The main way
Speaker 5: I use AI that I wanted to call out for
Speaker 5: other people that are maybe thinking about just giving it
Speaker 5: a go. I use it to build confidence in my
Speaker 5: own take on something, or if I've gotten a pinion
Speaker 5: that I think is fresh or unique, but I might
Speaker 5: feel a bit scared about saying that in front of
Speaker 5: a room of people just yet, or maybe I'm going
Speaker 5: to put it out in some content on social media.
Speaker 5: I use chat JBT as like a sense checker, Am
Speaker 5: I onto something here? Is this interesting? And it actually
Speaker 5: really builds my confidence. Like sometimes it'll say things back
Speaker 5: like that's a really sharp take, and I'm like, yes,
Speaker 5: you know, maybe this is a good one.
Speaker 3: I love that as an original thoughts thought partner. The
Speaker 3: thing I like about that is that so much of
Speaker 3: the time we think about AIS like doing the task
Speaker 3: for us. But actually it's about making you better at
Speaker 3: your own original thought, which I think is cool. On
Speaker 3: the thought partner thing, there's a little phrase you can
Speaker 3: use that I think really helps, where you can say, like,
Speaker 3: let's do a thought experiment works really well, or the
Speaker 3: one I've started using a lot is I'll share my
Speaker 3: opinion with it and then I'll say, okay, play Devil's
Speaker 3: advocate pick holes in this basically what's wrong with this argument?
Speaker 5: It was also enlightening to me. I think it was
Speaker 5: you who brought it up, like actually getting whatever AI
Speaker 5: tool you're using to ask you the questions to refine
Speaker 5: things before it just comes out with a response, because
Speaker 5: you do need to train it. Like initially I thought,
Speaker 5: if I start talking through a campaign I idea with AI,
Speaker 5: its ideas are going to be too basic, they're not
Speaker 5: going to be thoughtful enough, they're not going to be considerate,
Speaker 5: they're not going to be edgy. But it's actually like
Speaker 5: what feedback you're giving it as well, Like I'll say
Speaker 5: things like that's too basic, that's not cool enough, and
Speaker 5: like we'll kind of work on it.
Speaker 3: It's so true, Yeah, don't just take the first answer
Speaker 3: that it gives you. You know, it's so much like
Speaker 3: working with like a really smart intern or as a manager,
Speaker 3: if you brief someone on a task and you don't
Speaker 3: give a very good brief, you don't put much thought
Speaker 3: into it. When they bring that work back to you,
Speaker 3: you're kind of like, oh, that's not really what I thought.
Speaker 3: But it's kind of like you haven't put enough time
Speaker 3: into the brief. And the other thing that I thought
Speaker 3: it was like, have you ever Michelle worked with Say
Speaker 3: you're working with a freelancer or a creative and you're like,
Speaker 3: just like, make the logo bigger, and now make it blue,
Speaker 3: and now move it to the left. Like the more
Speaker 3: prescriptive you are sometimes trying to kind of give it
Speaker 3: this like the wrong kind of feedback, the worse it gets.
Speaker 3: And that happens sometimes if it gives you a result
Speaker 3: and then you're like, no, change this change that you'll
Speaker 3: often like make it worse. So I think it's about
Speaker 3: like from the beginning, trying to sort of have the
Speaker 3: ingredients that you need to give it a really good brief.
Speaker 3: But then it is like an ongoing conversation for sure.
Speaker 5: Also your point on younger people using it as a therapist.
Speaker 5: I have totally done that. Like I had a therapist
Speaker 5: that I was saying fortnightly, and therapy is quite expensive,
Speaker 5: and once I became a mum, I probably was probably
Speaker 5: the moment where I really needed to go back to
Speaker 5: my therapist, but I was just too busy, and so
Speaker 5: I just started chatting to chat GPT. And I haven't
Speaker 5: reached the point yet where it doesn't remember things. But
Speaker 5: I love it that I can kind of like pick
Speaker 5: up where I left off, Like, Hey, remember I was
Speaker 5: talking to you about this complex situation I've got at work,
Speaker 5: or I'll talk to it sometimes about the complexities of
Speaker 5: mother and like how society isn't really set up to
Speaker 5: support us, and like get into these deep conversations with it.
Speaker 5: And I honestly think it is on par with the
Speaker 5: therapy I've received from professionals.
Speaker 1: I hate to say it.
Speaker 3: Wow, Okay, that's really interesting on that point. In terms
Speaker 3: of memory, you can go in, say there's like something
Speaker 3: that happened in your life that's not relevant anymore. You
Speaker 3: can actually go in and delete that from the memory.
Speaker 3: So it's got more space to save new memories, which
Speaker 3: I think is really good. It's just in the settings.
Speaker 3: Maybe we'll share in the newsletter how to do that.
Speaker 3: But yeah, it's pretty easy. So I thought i'd give
Speaker 3: a really quick, rapid fire roundup of my most helpful
Speaker 3: prompts that I use, and then when I'm talking to
Speaker 3: people they tell me similar things quickly on the ingredients,
Speaker 3: because it's not about having a perfect prompt, right, there's
Speaker 3: no like one framework that's right, but just in terms
Speaker 3: of like the ingredients that make a good prompt, just
Speaker 3: to recap some of this upper cupboard. But it was task.
Speaker 3: So like, I'm trying to write a presentation that's about
Speaker 3: ten minutes long. What role you want it to play?
Speaker 3: Like do you want it to play a you know,
Speaker 3: world class copywriter, a expert strategy or you know, an
Speaker 3: executive coach? Like what is the role you want it
Speaker 3: to play? If that's relevant? Any kind of context you
Speaker 3: can give it, like who is the audience? What kind
Speaker 3: of tone do you want it to be? What kind
Speaker 3: of output do you want? Is it an outline that
Speaker 3: you're after or do you want like a complete thing,
Speaker 3: the one that is really helpful if you've done that
Speaker 3: thing before. So, say you want it to write a
Speaker 3: LinkedIn post for you give it three examples of other
Speaker 3: LinkedIn posts that you've written that are good, and just
Speaker 3: say these are good examples, like analyze these and like
Speaker 3: try to match that kind of thing. So that's really helpful. Now,
Speaker 3: just very quickly, my favorite prompts that I use so
Speaker 3: with writing, I use this every single day. Basically, here's
Speaker 3: the text, and you just drop your text in, improve clarity,
Speaker 3: fix the grammar, make it sound more conversational, human, assertive, professional,
Speaker 3: whatever inso your thing. I use that daily. The one
Speaker 3: that I also love using is summarize this and I'll
Speaker 3: upload like this giant pdf, like summarize this into one page,
Speaker 3: one paragraph, and one word, and then using that for
Speaker 3: your own stuff as well. It basically tests like how clear,
Speaker 3: how concise, like how punchy is the thing that I'm
Speaker 3: trying to write. And then the other one is, say
Speaker 3: you're doing a slide deck and you want like a
Speaker 3: really good headline or title for that slide that actually
Speaker 3: explains what's on the slide and isn't boring. I'll say, like,
Speaker 3: rewrite this headline in the style of And I've just
Speaker 3: got some of my favorite people that write really sharp copies,
Speaker 3: So like Malcolm Gladwell or Seth Godin, or whoever it
Speaker 3: is that you love their writing style. You can say,
Speaker 3: rewrite this in their style. Love okay, very quickly onto meetings,
Speaker 3: analyze this presentation and give me a topic or question.
Speaker 3: I can ask the room that will spark conversation that
Speaker 3: one is amazing, or give me the objections that people
Speaker 3: might have to this, so you can be prepared for
Speaker 3: the things that people are actually going to object to.
Speaker 3: I love that learning. I want to learn about insert topic,
Speaker 3: identify and explain the most crucial twenty percent of the
Speaker 3: concepts that will help me grasp eighty percent of the
Speaker 3: topic effectively. Use that all the time to teach me stuff. Oh,
Speaker 3: you're blowing my mind.
Speaker 5: I'm trying not to start madly typing.
Speaker 3: We'll put them all into the newsletter and then it
Speaker 3: just to close. This my favorite thing to do. Sometimes.
Speaker 1: This is just like wild card.
Speaker 3: I like it to help me be creative and get
Speaker 3: out of my own thought patterns sometimes. So this is
Speaker 3: the one I've been using so much lately, and I
Speaker 3: love it. I say, give me one truly deep novel
Speaker 3: out of distribution, mind blowing insight related to topic that
Speaker 3: only a few or none of us are aware of.
Speaker 3: It can't be generic, vague, flashy or slop corporate stuff.
Speaker 3: And it just gives you like things you would have
Speaker 3: never thought of.
Speaker 5: Really like, it's impressive what you're getting back.
Speaker 3: It's learned from all of human insight and intelligence. Yeah,
Speaker 3: you've just lived in your own brain for however many years,
Speaker 3: so like it just breaks you out of your own
Speaker 3: mind chamber.
Speaker 5: Oh okay, well I've got to go because I've got
Speaker 5: to get on chat JBT.
Speaker 3: With that, we will close out. I will just say,
Speaker 3: if you want to learn more about AIM, this company
Speaker 3: invent Him has a really good course. So she does
Speaker 3: both in person and also self paced, and so we'll
Speaker 3: put a link to that in the show notes. And
Speaker 3: also just her podcast is my favorite podcast. It is
Speaker 3: very worky, but obviously I'm obsessed with work. Her podcast
Speaker 3: is called how We Work and I've listened to every
Speaker 3: single episode. Love it.
Speaker 5: Well, thanks so much for leading that conversation.
Speaker 3: It was amazing. Oh thank you.
Speaker 2: So I thought I was someone who used AI a lot,
Speaker 2: but my mind is blown by how much I could
Speaker 2: actually be getting out of it. The key takeaway from
Speaker 2: today's episode is understanding AI's three distinct roles as a
Speaker 2: delegate for basic tasks, as a collaborative partner for brainstorming
Speaker 2: and feedback, and as an expert for specialized knowledge. Make
Speaker 2: sure you check out this week's bus newsletter, where we'll
Speaker 2: be sharing all those juicy prompts that Amantha mentioned, from
Speaker 2: therapy ones to those presentation helpers, and yes, I'll be
Speaker 2: trying that mind blowing insight prompt. And immediately after this,
Speaker 2: you can also head to our Instagram at biz by
Speaker 2: Mama Mia, where we'll be sharing more AI hacks and
Speaker 2: tools throughout the week. I will see you in Thursday's
Speaker 2: Inbox episode, where we'll be answering all of your career dilemmas. Bye,
Speaker 2: Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on