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Speaker 1: You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast.

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Speaker 2: Mama Maya acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on. The first time I

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Speaker 2: spoke with Ellie Sedgwick, otherwise known as the Volver Photographer,

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Speaker 2: was in twenty twenty two, and this is such an

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Speaker 2: interesting conversation that I know you'll want to listen to,

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Speaker 2: and we're bringing it back to you because there is

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Speaker 2: a new chapter to this story. I asked Ellie for

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Speaker 2: an update on how her project is going since the

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Speaker 2: last time we spoke, and this is the voice note

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Speaker 2: that she sent me.

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Speaker 1: Hey, Mia, it's Ellie. I just wanted to send you

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Speaker 1: a little update as a lot has happened since we

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Speaker 1: last recorded this podcast. I'm super excited to announce that

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Speaker 1: my coffee table book, Flip Through My Flaps, an Exploration

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Speaker 1: of the Volver, is finally, after seven years in the making,

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Speaker 1: available for purchase and next week I will personally be

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Speaker 1: packing each and every order from where it's printed in Melbourne, Australia.

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Speaker 1: It's something that I'm so proud to be able to

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Speaker 1: put out into this world. The book aims to raise

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Speaker 1: awareness of vulver diversity and it really breaks down the

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Speaker 1: stigma surrounding women's health. It features the photographs and stories

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Speaker 1: of over five hundred women, and it really dives into

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Speaker 1: a range of readily important topics, from the complexities of

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Speaker 1: our vulver anatomy to open conversations around sexual health, pleasure, motherhood, miscarriages.

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Speaker 1: This book is something that I wish existed when I

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Speaker 1: was younger. So it was only two weeks before the

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Speaker 1: book went to print that I ended up finding the

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Speaker 1: confidence to do my own vulver photo shoot, and I

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Speaker 1: was feeling self conscious throughout the shoot, and my friend

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Speaker 1: who shot me used the trial print copy of Flip

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Speaker 1: Through My Flaps that we had on us to bring

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Speaker 1: to me and show me that what I was worried

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Speaker 1: about was really normal. So it was really cool seen

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Speaker 1: it out in the world in action and I used

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Speaker 1: it on myself, which is just amazing. I think that

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Speaker 1: the statistics of people who have genital anxieties now are

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Speaker 1: so large, so I really hope that this book can

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Speaker 1: be used as a resource and a tool to show

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Speaker 1: that we're all unique and that's what makes us beautiful.

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Speaker 1: So yes, I'm very excited to be an author and

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Speaker 1: for this book to be out on the shelves for

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Speaker 1: the world to see. Big love for mom and me.

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Speaker 2: You're listening to No Filter, the podcast where people speak

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Speaker 2: candidly about their lives and aren't afraid to be vulnerable.

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Speaker 2: I'm me a Friedman and I don't like the word vulver.

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Speaker 2: It's not to say I don't love my actual volver.

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Speaker 1: I obviously do.

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Speaker 2: I mean I guess I do. Let's start some cool stuff.

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Speaker 2: I don't think about it that much, to be honest,

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Speaker 2: and that is part of the problem. If you have

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Speaker 2: a volver, for example, did you even grow up calling

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Speaker 2: it that? I didn't. My mum, a feminist, taught me

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Speaker 2: to call it a vagina, and that's the word I

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Speaker 2: taught my own kids their penises and vaginas. Today, you're

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Speaker 2: going to meet a woman who's mad about wolvers. She

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Speaker 2: loves them, and she uses the word at every opportunity.

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Speaker 2: She's even turned wolvers into a well paid job, and

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Speaker 2: wolvers have made her a little bit famous. So if

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Speaker 2: you've ever thought to yourself, is my vulver normal or

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Speaker 2: what the hell is an out yet, Ellie Sedgwick is

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Speaker 2: here to set you straight. Ellie is a body positive

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Speaker 2: photographer and entrepreneur who found it Comfortable in My Skin,

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Speaker 2: a movement empowering people to love the skin they're in.

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Speaker 2: But Ellie hasn't always felt comfortable with her own volver.

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Speaker 2: She's gone from being scared to wear swimmers to even

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Speaker 2: considering labiaplasty, and now she drives around the country photographing

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Speaker 2: other women's volvers for her upcoming book, which is going

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Speaker 2: to be called Slipped through My Flaps. I'm not even kidding.

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Speaker 2: Here's Ellie.

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Speaker 1: Ellie. What did you.

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Speaker 2: Call your genitals when you were a little girl?

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Speaker 1: Vagina always called vagina.

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Speaker 2: So you weren't in one of those families that had

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Speaker 2: cute little nicknames. What did your mama teach you about

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Speaker 2: your vagina?

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Speaker 1: This makes me feel a little bit sad, but my

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Speaker 1: mom wrote me a message about a year inter comfortable

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Speaker 1: with my skin, and she actually apologized. She said, I'm

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Speaker 1: so sorry that I didn't teach you the correct terminology folver,

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Speaker 1: because I obviously speak about that so much about how

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Speaker 1: we should call it the right thing, and I had

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Speaker 1: just done a post about what do you wish your

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Speaker 1: parents in school taught you when you were fourteen? Then

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Speaker 1: my mum read her all, and she felt really bad

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Speaker 1: because she's very sensitive, loving lady, and she was like,

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Speaker 1: I'm so sorry that I didn't teach you what all

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Speaker 1: volvers look like and wrote me this big message about it.

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Speaker 1: So she was always very lovely, but I mean, she

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Speaker 1: just didn't call it a volver herself.

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Speaker 2: Do you remember when you first became aware of it

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Speaker 2: even having one, or that girls and boys had different bits.

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Speaker 1: I remember the first time I was insecure about it,

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Speaker 1: definitely was in high school and I got a note

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Speaker 1: from someone saying, do you have an Innie or an Audi?

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Speaker 1: After I realized it was Evolver that they were talking about,

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Speaker 1: I realized that mine was maybe different.

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Speaker 2: Was that note based on anything like It's not like

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Speaker 2: in with no pants?

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Speaker 1: No, No, It was just this little boy behind me

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Speaker 1: in class and he just scribbled it with pen and

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Speaker 1: tapped me on the shold and gave it to me.

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Speaker 1: And I don't think I was even sexually active then,

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Speaker 1: so it was definitely not aimed at me on purpose.

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Speaker 1: It just was the start of my insecurities.

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Speaker 2: And I'd never heard that terminology, certainly when I was

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Speaker 2: a kid about the idea of innies and auties.

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Speaker 1: I grew up on the Northern beaches, and it's very

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Speaker 1: much beach culture. And I served my whole life, and

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Speaker 1: so I was always hanging out with big groups of boys,

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Speaker 1: and I was out the back and were to often

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Speaker 1: hear the chat about the girl's it's like the night before.

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Speaker 1: And I do speak about this a lot. But two

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Speaker 1: of my best friends growing up have had labiaplasty, one

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Speaker 1: when she was sixteen and then again when she was eighteen,

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Speaker 1: and then another one had it when she was eighteen.

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Speaker 1: And so I think that there was something about the

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Speaker 1: boys we hung out with maybe and the girls that

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Speaker 1: there was like this ideal way that your wolver should look,

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Speaker 1: I mean mine. You can see it when I wear

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Speaker 1: a bikini. And I photographed like, you know, four hundred

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Speaker 1: people now, so I do know I have quite distinct

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Speaker 1: laber and you can see it when I wear a bikini.

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Speaker 1: And there was just like joke said that made me

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Speaker 1: feel really sad growing up.

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Speaker 2: You said that your friend had a labioplastin when she

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Speaker 2: was sixteen. Was this the nineties or the two thousands?

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Speaker 2: How old are you really?

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Speaker 1: I'm thirty two, so this was the early two thousands. Yes,

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Speaker 1: So I finished school O seven, so it would have

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Speaker 1: just been a few years before that. She came and

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Speaker 1: showed her mum and said like, why do I look

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Speaker 1: like this? And her mum said, oh, I did as well,

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Speaker 1: and I don't want you to go through what I did,

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Speaker 1: feeling like it was not sexy, blah blah blah, and

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Speaker 1: took her and gave her permission. And she doesn't regret

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Speaker 1: it at all. She's actually happy with her laby a plasty.

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Speaker 1: But we always laugh and say, imagine if we all

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Speaker 1: had spoken and they only came forward and told me

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Speaker 1: because of comfortable in my skin or else. No one

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Speaker 1: else knows.

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Speaker 2: Because it's not something that girls spoke about as teenagers.

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Speaker 1: Not really. I mean, it's definitely changed now. You can

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Speaker 1: look on social media and find so much cool Volver

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Speaker 1: diversity awareness. Yeah, but I think when we were growing up,

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Speaker 1: and probably the same as you, a lot of my friends'

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Speaker 1: mums when I started comfortable with my skin were like,

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Speaker 1: what they all look the same? What are you doing?

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Speaker 1: What do you mean? They all had that kind of response,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, no, they don't.

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Speaker 2: The first time I became aware of the whole beauty

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Speaker 2: standard around Volvers was and I worked in magazines and

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Speaker 2: I was the editor of Cosmo, and I remember talking

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Speaker 2: to one of the editors of one of the men's

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Speaker 2: magazines in our same company, and he was telling me

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Speaker 2: how they had to always battle with the senses because

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Speaker 2: they were legally required to. And the wording was extraordinary

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Speaker 2: from the Bureau of Censorship seal the opening to a

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Speaker 2: single slit, a single crease, a single crease, so they

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Speaker 2: had to airbrush any protruding labbya from any image of

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Speaker 2: a naked woman that they showed, and then they didn't

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Speaker 2: disclose this. So my generation didn't grow up looking at

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Speaker 2: poorn necessarily, But we saw naked girls.

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Speaker 1: In men's magazine except Playboy.

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Speaker 2: And People and Picture and those kinds of things, And

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Speaker 2: what we never realized was that what we were looking

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Speaker 2: at were not real human vaginas they were in most cases. Rush, Bob,

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Speaker 2: we're going to have to do this a lot. Let's

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Speaker 2: go straight to that.

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Speaker 1: What I was going to say just quickly about that

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Speaker 1: is that a lot of sexologists, and you see a

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Speaker 1: lot of people talking about this currently saying that porn

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Speaker 1: is the reason why so many people are insecure. But

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Speaker 1: I personally, and this is just speaking from my personal opinion.

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Speaker 1: I'm the same as you. I had never watched porn

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Speaker 1: growing up, and so I don't blame the porn industry.

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Speaker 1: And I think that now especially, there's so much amateur porn.

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Speaker 1: You can find anything online, and so I don't actually

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Speaker 1: think that that's where a lot of the insecurities are

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Speaker 1: coming from.

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Speaker 2: Where do you think they're coming from?

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Speaker 1: Well, I think for me it was like not seeing

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Speaker 1: other ones, and then, like you said, the ones that

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Speaker 1: I did in Playboy or anything had been edited and photoshopped.

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Speaker 1: And then maybe the few because I'm very bisexual, I've

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Speaker 1: never been straight. Maybe the few girls that I was

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Speaker 1: sleeping with when I was starting to explore had that

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Speaker 1: kind of design of vagina, so they'd call it Barbie.

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Speaker 1: That's how my journey went. That was the kind of

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Speaker 1: wolvers that I first saw.

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Speaker 2: Tell me about the word ellie, I can't say it.

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Speaker 2: I just don't like it.

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Speaker 1: Volva, you don't like it.

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Speaker 2: And I've been pulled up on this for so many

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Speaker 2: years now, and I call them the Vulva police police,

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Speaker 2: the Vulvar police of which you are a proud card

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Speaker 2: can remember. Tell me why I don't like the word elie.

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Speaker 1: I don't know why you personally don't like it, but

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Speaker 1: it took me. I've been capturingvolvers for four years now

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Speaker 1: and it took me about three is to start saying it.

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Speaker 1: And then now I can't not pick up on it,

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Speaker 1: Like if I hear anyone say it's just I think

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Speaker 1: because my whole world is pussy, just like vulva, vulva, vulva,

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Speaker 1: and so I'm so in tune with it. As soon

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Speaker 1: as someone says, for Janah, it just tingles me. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: it's vulva. It makes me angry because there's such a

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Speaker 1: big lack of education.

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Speaker 2: Well, yes, I know how I thought that volver was

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Speaker 2: the name for labbia or for your slushy bits, like

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Speaker 2: to me, it's a very fleshy word. Yeah, but can

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Speaker 2: you explain the difference between a vagina and revolver for

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Speaker 2: those who are playing at home?

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Speaker 1: While the vaginas the canal, so it's you know, where

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Speaker 1: the inside the inside, yes, can't see it from the outside.

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Speaker 1: Hampon goes in, babies come out, toy baby comes out, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and then the volvers everything on the outside. And so

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Speaker 1: so many people are using the wrong terms, having no

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Speaker 1: idea and that's because we're not educated on our bodies,

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Speaker 1: that part of our body, Like we just missed out

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Speaker 1: on that. There's so much information on penises and everything else,

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Speaker 1: but just not volvers.

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Speaker 2: So it's like as if we were calling a penis

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Speaker 2: a scrotum, yeah, or testical.

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Speaker 1: Exactly why is.

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Speaker 2: That misinformation there? Because that's a bigger question, isn't it.

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Speaker 2: Why did I grow up with a feminist mother who

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Speaker 2: was very much about his the name that we call

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Speaker 2: it because that's what it's called. And I had an

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Speaker 2: argument with one of my best friends. We both had daughters,

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Speaker 2: and we were in a shop trying clothes and I

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Speaker 2: had a really short skirt and I said, oh goodness,

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Speaker 2: you can almost see my vagina, which you would have

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Speaker 2: corrected me on. But she got angry at me because

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Speaker 2: her daughters in their family, they called it a wink.

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Speaker 2: And so her little girl, who was I can't remember

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Speaker 2: five as the time, was skipping down the street going

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Speaker 2: vagina vagina, and she's like, thanks so much for that,

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Speaker 2: and she was really angry at me, and I'm like,

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Speaker 2: it's important that she learns what it's actually called.

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Speaker 1: It's a body part, and also talking about it normally.

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Speaker 1: Like my dad said this when I started comfortable in

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Speaker 1: my skin. He was like, talk about it like it's

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Speaker 1: a body part, because that's what it is. And when

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Speaker 1: you make things weird and nickname me, then it feels

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Speaker 1: like you're being naughty talking about it, when actually it's

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Speaker 1: just a beautiful part of our bodies, like our breast,

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Speaker 1: and it's something that we should treasure and love and

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Speaker 1: feel connected to, so we should be allowed to talk

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Speaker 1: about it in the right way.

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Speaker 2: He used to be a preschool teacher.

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Speaker 1: I did.

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Speaker 2: It's quite the career trajectory you cash to becoming evolver photographer.

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Speaker 1: Oh, speak to me about Everyone's always like what did

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Speaker 1: the moms say? And what does your boss say? And

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Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm very open with everything I do. And

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Speaker 1: it's so hilarious because all the mums would pull me

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Speaker 1: aside one by one to be like, I want to

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Speaker 1: be photographed, but don't tell the other mums, so you

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Speaker 1: do both. I don't so much. I mean, I do

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Speaker 1: steal nanny a lot of travel nanny, so I sometimes

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Speaker 1: go back and drop into it because I do genuinely

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Speaker 1: love hanging out with kids. It's so much fun. But

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Speaker 1: I do prefer hanging with the vulgar naked people capturing

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Speaker 1: the volvers.

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Speaker 2: Who was the first volver that you saw other than

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Speaker 2: your own?

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Speaker 1: The first volver I ever saw was Ella, my best friend,

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Speaker 1: and we were quite best friend with benefits, with benefits, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and so yeah, i'd say hers is the first I saw.

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Speaker 1: We had a lot of fun, and what did you think?

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Speaker 1: I remember thinking like, why does mine not look like hers?

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Speaker 1: That's what I remember thinking. And then hers looked like

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Speaker 1: a Barbie doll that I'd always played with when I

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Speaker 1: was younger, and I was like, oh my gosh, I've

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Speaker 1: got too much skin down there. Yeah, let's say that's

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Speaker 1: where a lot of the insecurity start.

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Speaker 2: Thanks Ella, But you didn't say anything to Ellen. Was

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Speaker 2: Ella the one that got the surgery?

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Speaker 1: No?

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Speaker 2: No, no, okay, So you didn't say anything to Ella

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Speaker 2: and she didn't say anything to you. No.

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Speaker 1: Well, this is the problem with volvers is because it's

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Speaker 1: such a taboo topic. I never told anyone except for

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Speaker 1: my sister. And then I went traveling around in my

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Speaker 1: early twenties around Europe, and I came back and I

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Speaker 1: remember sitting in the park with Nicki and I was

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Speaker 1: crying and sister. Yeah, because I just slept with someone

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Speaker 1: and I was like, what if they tell what I

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Speaker 1: look like? And I was like really upset. I used

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Speaker 1: to do this thing, but I would honestly cry with

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Speaker 1: people when I was sleeping with them, so sad for

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Speaker 1: the person I was sleeping with, because I'd be like,

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Speaker 1: what's wrong with it? It's so sad for you because

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Speaker 1: you were self conscious. I was so self conscious of

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Speaker 1: my volver. And so then NICKI said to me, there's

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Speaker 1: this thing called Laba plusty, and I think you should

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Speaker 1: get it because it's been so long now of you

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Speaker 1: being worried about this part of your body. And so

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Speaker 1: that's when my road led down to going to cosmetic

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Speaker 1: sessions in Sydney and it's so concerning. They don't even

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Speaker 1: look at your body. They were just like, when can

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Speaker 1: we book you in? And yeah, this is the price.

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Speaker 1: Because I was young, they were like, maybe you can

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Speaker 1: get under medicare. It's eight centimeters long. We can help

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Speaker 1: you get it cheaper.

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Speaker 2: How old were you I must have.

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Speaker 1: Been early early twenties. And then when I went to

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Speaker 1: finally have the surgery done, I went to India because

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Speaker 1: I used to babysit in India on and off for

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Speaker 1: six years, and the doctor I couldn't talk properly. I

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Speaker 1: was just calling it like liposuction and pointing down like.

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Speaker 2: You were calling it liposuction. Yeah, when your sister Nicki,

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Speaker 2: First of all, I don't have a sister. Do sisters

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Speaker 2: look at each other's volvers?

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Speaker 1: Nicki was the best best big sister you could ever

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Speaker 1: ever have. She was so beautiful. She just always showed

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Speaker 1: me hers and as looked exactly the same, and she

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Speaker 1: was like, who cares? Like who cares what the people think?

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Speaker 1: And she did surf boat rowing, and she was like,

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Speaker 1: you can see my outline when I'm in a bikini.

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Speaker 1: She just said she never cared all the time.

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Speaker 2: And what about your mum.

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Speaker 1: Mom's not a newdicist as such, so she was never

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Speaker 1: walking around the house nage. She talked to her about

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Speaker 1: it though, No, which is weird because as soon as

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Speaker 1: I lost my Virginia, I told her. I told her everything,

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Speaker 1: But for some reason, I never told he about my insecurities.

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Speaker 2: So your sister didn't want to get labiaplasty herself. No,

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Speaker 2: Nicky obviously knew that it existed, yes, and suggested it

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Speaker 2: to you little did you know one of your friends

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Speaker 2: had or two of you. I had it by that stage.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And so then I ended up in this horrible

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Speaker 1: situation with a cosmetic surgeon in India and he was like,

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Speaker 1: with a yellow highlighter drawing on my legs because he

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Speaker 1: thought I wanted my legs like it's actually I was

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Speaker 1: going to.

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Speaker 2: Say, I don't think I'm learning a lot already about

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00:16:39,845 --> 00:16:42,165
Speaker 2: well my bolvaries, but I don't think it involves my legs.

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Speaker 1: And then he said after a while, I was very awkward,

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Speaker 1: and I said, I mean, like here, not my legs

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Speaker 1: at all. And so that's when like this hilarious moment

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00:16:51,405 --> 00:16:53,525
Speaker 1: happened that I speak about all the time. He went

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Speaker 1: and got a mirror that's a circle, and he brought

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Speaker 1: over to my face and made me put my teeth

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Speaker 1: forward and showed me that for the same price as

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Speaker 1: lavio plasty, I could have my jaw line fixed with

347
00:17:06,045 --> 00:17:09,085
Speaker 1: a chin extension. And he was like, everybody sees your

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Speaker 1: face and only people you love seeing your vulva. And

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Speaker 1: I was like, ugh, but yeah, I went in with

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Speaker 1: one insecurity, came out with two.

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Speaker 2: Did you leave?

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Speaker 1: And I got yellow post its with all the prices,

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Speaker 1: like of what a chin extension would cost, and what

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00:17:24,205 --> 00:17:26,685
Speaker 1: laby PLASTI would cost, and how long the bruising would

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Speaker 1: be if I had to go back to work for

356
00:17:28,325 --> 00:17:31,285
Speaker 1: a chin extension, all this weird stuff. And like me

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00:17:31,365 --> 00:17:33,525
Speaker 1: and my best friends we always send each other double

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Speaker 1: chin self. These were like constantly doing that. So I

359
00:17:36,765 --> 00:17:38,965
Speaker 1: remember later telling them like, oh my god, I almost

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Speaker 1: got a chin extension. They're like, why would you change

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Speaker 1: your face?

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Speaker 2: You know?

363
00:17:43,765 --> 00:17:45,365
Speaker 1: So it's kind of like, why would I change this?

364
00:17:45,405 --> 00:17:46,965
Speaker 1: Why would I change this? It's just me.

365
00:17:47,525 --> 00:17:50,925
Speaker 2: So you walked out of there with some post it notes, yes,

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Speaker 2: but nobody alteration.

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00:17:53,725 --> 00:17:57,125
Speaker 1: Nobody alterations, which it is make you think again? Made

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00:17:57,165 --> 00:17:59,365
Speaker 1: me think again? He said to me, have you seen

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Speaker 1: other volvers? Because I don't think you need this surgery.

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Speaker 1: And I think I'm quite a natural, earthy girl, you know,

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Speaker 1: I love I see beauty in everyone. And I think

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Speaker 1: I was quite shocked that I would had even considered

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Speaker 1: doing my face. I don't know. I just think it

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Speaker 1: was lucky that he put so much pressure on, like

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Speaker 1: fixing everything.

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Speaker 2: Wow. So it's like what he restored to you and

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00:18:19,405 --> 00:18:22,645
Speaker 2: your self esteem about your volver. He tried to take

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Speaker 2: away with your face, but you just didn't pick up

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Speaker 2: what he was putting down.

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00:18:26,645 --> 00:18:28,725
Speaker 1: Yeah, I did not at all. And I also picked

381
00:18:28,765 --> 00:18:29,925
Speaker 1: up where he was like you need to go and

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Speaker 1: see others, and.

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00:18:31,245 --> 00:18:33,445
Speaker 2: So then like you need to go and see other volvervolvers.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this idea started where I should photograph heaps and like,

385
00:18:37,485 --> 00:18:40,925
Speaker 1: it's really interesting because a lot of my girlfriends remember

386
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Speaker 1: me one night at pizza and manly being like, oh,

387
00:18:43,805 --> 00:18:45,765
Speaker 1: you know, like how cool would a book like this be?

388
00:18:45,965 --> 00:18:48,805
Speaker 1: And this was like years before I started, but they

389
00:18:48,845 --> 00:18:51,405
Speaker 1: didn't know about my insecurities. And then when I actually

390
00:18:51,565 --> 00:18:54,245
Speaker 1: did this Facebook post in twenty eighteen saying I'm going

391
00:18:54,285 --> 00:18:57,205
Speaker 1: to create a coffee table book flip through my flats

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Speaker 1: and I'm going to photograph five hundred volvers, and they

393
00:18:59,925 --> 00:19:02,845
Speaker 1: were like, I remember you talking about this for years,

394
00:19:02,925 --> 00:19:04,885
Speaker 1: but I never made it about me. I was just like,

395
00:19:04,925 --> 00:19:07,165
Speaker 1: how cool would that be? Just to see real you

396
00:19:07,205 --> 00:19:10,285
Speaker 1: was still uncomfortable. I was still very uncomfortable, and is

397
00:19:10,285 --> 00:19:14,325
Speaker 1: that when people started to go, oh, actually, yeah, that

398
00:19:14,365 --> 00:19:16,245
Speaker 1: would be really cool. I'd love to see what other

399
00:19:16,285 --> 00:19:17,925
Speaker 1: ones look like. But then you heard like also the

400
00:19:18,045 --> 00:19:20,645
Speaker 1: jokes as well that were quite nasty.

401
00:19:20,925 --> 00:19:23,965
Speaker 2: Do you think that the word flaps? Can we reclaim that.

402
00:19:24,805 --> 00:19:28,965
Speaker 1: I have actually made jokes on my social media and

403
00:19:29,005 --> 00:19:31,805
Speaker 1: gotten messages from people that I photographed being like, I

404
00:19:31,805 --> 00:19:33,805
Speaker 1: don't find this funny. And if I'm a part of

405
00:19:33,885 --> 00:19:37,045
Speaker 1: your work trying to change the narrative of how we

406
00:19:37,205 --> 00:19:40,085
Speaker 1: joke about volvers, then I don't want my photos in

407
00:19:40,125 --> 00:19:43,205
Speaker 1: it if you're going to do that. Social media is

408
00:19:43,285 --> 00:19:46,805
Speaker 1: a very tough world. There's a lot of opinions.

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00:19:47,165 --> 00:19:48,245
Speaker 2: Where did you stand on that?

410
00:19:48,365 --> 00:19:50,965
Speaker 1: Where did you I took the post down that i'd done,

411
00:19:51,045 --> 00:19:53,125
Speaker 1: and I apologize, you know, I mean I photographed this

412
00:19:53,165 --> 00:19:55,445
Speaker 1: person's well where she was so open to me, and

413
00:19:55,525 --> 00:19:57,685
Speaker 1: I was like, if this has personally offended you, I

414
00:19:57,685 --> 00:20:00,725
Speaker 1: will take it down immediately. But I do push the

415
00:20:00,765 --> 00:20:03,685
Speaker 1: boundaries a little bit, I think because I find humor

416
00:20:03,725 --> 00:20:06,965
Speaker 1: helps for me, and I think it's like you can

417
00:20:07,045 --> 00:20:09,725
Speaker 1: say funny things as long as you just talk it.

418
00:20:10,005 --> 00:20:12,125
Speaker 1: I talked about all taboo topics and I drop a

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00:20:12,125 --> 00:20:14,645
Speaker 1: bit of humor in so that it's comfortable for everyone.

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Speaker 2: Do you remember the first man who saw your FOLV?

421
00:20:19,365 --> 00:20:23,605
Speaker 1: I do, so this guy wasn't the first, but this

422
00:20:23,645 --> 00:20:25,765
Speaker 1: is so long ago that it was on MSN, but

423
00:20:25,885 --> 00:20:31,325
Speaker 1: his brother messaged me saying that his brother said my

424
00:20:31,685 --> 00:20:34,285
Speaker 1: vagina looked like a track had run over it. I

425
00:20:34,365 --> 00:20:38,205
Speaker 1: was really young, and so I think that plays a huge.

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00:20:38,045 --> 00:20:40,045
Speaker 2: That would have been devastating.

427
00:20:40,165 --> 00:20:42,805
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was devastating, and I just remember sitting there

428
00:20:42,845 --> 00:20:47,165
Speaker 1: being so insecure, and I held onto that comment forever

429
00:20:47,485 --> 00:20:47,885
Speaker 1: for sure.

430
00:20:48,765 --> 00:20:51,685
Speaker 2: When did you finally let go of the idea of

431
00:20:51,685 --> 00:20:52,725
Speaker 2: getting labiaplasty.

432
00:20:52,925 --> 00:20:57,405
Speaker 1: Actually, I'm very anaphylactic to seafood and I had a

433
00:20:57,485 --> 00:20:59,325
Speaker 1: very bad reaction not long ago, and I went in

434
00:20:59,365 --> 00:21:02,845
Speaker 1: to see a doctor in Bondi and the guy was

435
00:21:02,965 --> 00:21:05,685
Speaker 1: telling me about all the things he can do. He

436
00:21:05,765 --> 00:21:09,485
Speaker 1: was like, I do botox, I do laba plastic and

437
00:21:09,525 --> 00:21:11,725
Speaker 1: I was like, I just need medicine to make my

438
00:21:11,765 --> 00:21:14,965
Speaker 1: eyes not so swollen. I said, I can't get other things.

439
00:21:15,005 --> 00:21:17,325
Speaker 1: I have this single comfortable in my skin. And he

440
00:21:17,405 --> 00:21:19,485
Speaker 1: said to me, I'd do laby a plasty for you,

441
00:21:19,725 --> 00:21:22,765
Speaker 1: because he wasn't listening, and I was like, no, Like,

442
00:21:22,925 --> 00:21:25,965
Speaker 1: I can't get labyo plasty. And now even if someone

443
00:21:26,005 --> 00:21:28,565
Speaker 1: paid me, I would never get it because I've worked

444
00:21:28,605 --> 00:21:30,645
Speaker 1: so hard to have the relationship I have now with

445
00:21:30,685 --> 00:21:34,245
Speaker 1: my volver and like, I masturbate constantly, and I realized

446
00:21:34,285 --> 00:21:36,045
Speaker 1: how many nerve endings are in there, and it's such

447
00:21:36,045 --> 00:21:39,125
Speaker 1: a great pleasure too for yourself to feel good, and

448
00:21:39,205 --> 00:21:40,645
Speaker 1: I would just never change it now.

449
00:21:40,925 --> 00:21:42,805
Speaker 2: Never are there nerve endings in there?

450
00:21:42,845 --> 00:21:43,885
Speaker 1: Tell me in your laby er?

451
00:21:44,245 --> 00:21:46,285
Speaker 2: Yeah, what does our laby you do? Well?

452
00:21:46,285 --> 00:21:48,845
Speaker 1: There's all sorts of funny memes, like obviously I'm a

453
00:21:48,845 --> 00:21:52,005
Speaker 1: meme queen, and there's always the ones that say, like

454
00:21:52,045 --> 00:21:54,245
Speaker 1: we've got eight thousand nerve endings. If you're going to

455
00:21:54,325 --> 00:21:55,765
Speaker 1: get on a woman's nerves, get on them.

456
00:21:56,165 --> 00:21:56,365
Speaker 2: You know.

457
00:21:56,445 --> 00:21:59,485
Speaker 1: There's all these like hilarious ones. But there's so much

458
00:21:59,525 --> 00:22:01,245
Speaker 1: pleasure down there. And if you go and see a

459
00:22:01,245 --> 00:22:03,885
Speaker 1: sex sologist, for example, if you're feeling insecure of your LaBier,

460
00:22:04,165 --> 00:22:06,765
Speaker 1: they might teach you how to massage you're inner labyer

461
00:22:06,845 --> 00:22:09,445
Speaker 1: a certain way so that it feels really good, and

462
00:22:09,445 --> 00:22:11,325
Speaker 1: to try and connect with it that way instead of

463
00:22:11,365 --> 00:22:13,605
Speaker 1: like chopping it off to fit society's idea of what

464
00:22:13,645 --> 00:22:16,285
Speaker 1: a beautiful volver should look like. So there's all these

465
00:22:16,605 --> 00:22:19,285
Speaker 1: great masturbation techniques and tools that I talk about in

466
00:22:19,285 --> 00:22:22,045
Speaker 1: photo shoots and workshops with people to try and help

467
00:22:22,085 --> 00:22:25,805
Speaker 1: them connect with their bodies rather than hate them. Because

468
00:22:25,805 --> 00:22:28,045
Speaker 1: my body still looks exactly the same as it did

469
00:22:28,565 --> 00:22:31,205
Speaker 1: when I had my big insecurities, and all that I've

470
00:22:31,285 --> 00:22:34,165
Speaker 1: changed is my mind, the way I think and connect

471
00:22:34,245 --> 00:22:36,645
Speaker 1: with my body. So it's like I am a living

472
00:22:36,685 --> 00:22:39,285
Speaker 1: example that you can change the way you feel without

473
00:22:39,365 --> 00:22:40,925
Speaker 1: changing it under the knife.

474
00:22:41,125 --> 00:22:44,285
Speaker 2: That's incredibly profound and applies not just to our volvers,

475
00:22:44,285 --> 00:22:47,125
Speaker 2: but to all aspects of ours, doesn't it physically all

476
00:22:47,125 --> 00:22:50,405
Speaker 2: the things that we focus on what's wrong with ourselves

477
00:22:50,405 --> 00:22:52,965
Speaker 2: instead of seeing what's right, I mean thinking about it.

478
00:22:53,045 --> 00:22:56,565
Speaker 1: I need to photograph so many people a week, and

479
00:22:56,685 --> 00:22:58,885
Speaker 1: every single time they have a different story, there is

480
00:22:59,045 --> 00:23:01,885
Speaker 1: always something I hate this. I hate this, I hate this,

481
00:23:02,125 --> 00:23:05,325
Speaker 1: like people find so many things on their bodies to hate.

482
00:23:05,805 --> 00:23:07,765
Speaker 2: How did you start photographingvolvers?

483
00:23:08,525 --> 00:23:11,205
Speaker 1: So the first I ever photographed, I put up that

484
00:23:11,245 --> 00:23:14,685
Speaker 1: post on Facebook. She was a midwife and she said

485
00:23:14,685 --> 00:23:17,725
Speaker 1: to me, this is so crazy. I watched these mother's

486
00:23:17,765 --> 00:23:21,125
Speaker 1: birth babies and they're not letting their partners stand at

487
00:23:21,125 --> 00:23:22,725
Speaker 1: that end of the bed because they don't want to

488
00:23:22,765 --> 00:23:25,765
Speaker 1: see their volvers or their vaginas, and they make them

489
00:23:25,765 --> 00:23:27,765
Speaker 1: stand up here and She's like, this is something I'm

490
00:23:27,885 --> 00:23:29,725
Speaker 1: so passionate about. So it was really cool that the

491
00:23:29,765 --> 00:23:33,645
Speaker 1: first person who came forward, I was so awkward photographing her.

492
00:23:33,765 --> 00:23:36,245
Speaker 1: I was like, got her to stand still and just

493
00:23:36,245 --> 00:23:38,485
Speaker 1: photograph her and then she was like, no, baby, you

494
00:23:38,525 --> 00:23:40,445
Speaker 1: need me laying down with my legs bread like you

495
00:23:40,445 --> 00:23:41,565
Speaker 1: need to get right in there.

496
00:23:42,405 --> 00:23:42,725
Speaker 2: Wow.

497
00:23:43,405 --> 00:23:45,005
Speaker 1: She's like, this is the part that people are self

498
00:23:45,005 --> 00:23:48,205
Speaker 1: conscious of. For me, I was more self conscious standing

499
00:23:48,245 --> 00:23:51,365
Speaker 1: up because my labya goes down and so that was

500
00:23:51,405 --> 00:23:53,645
Speaker 1: like my personal thing that I wanted to see. But

501
00:23:53,845 --> 00:23:55,645
Speaker 1: she was like, this is what most people are self

502
00:23:55,645 --> 00:23:56,165
Speaker 1: conscious of.

503
00:23:56,605 --> 00:23:58,365
Speaker 2: Did you just do it with an iPhone?

504
00:23:58,605 --> 00:24:03,525
Speaker 1: My dad actually showed me a camera. My dad's a photographer, teacher,

505
00:24:03,805 --> 00:24:06,405
Speaker 1: and a photographer helps a lot. And he was really

506
00:24:06,445 --> 00:24:08,765
Speaker 1: funny because he has a stall at the local shops

507
00:24:08,765 --> 00:24:10,925
Speaker 1: on the Northern Beach. It's a pop up store, and

508
00:24:10,965 --> 00:24:13,885
Speaker 1: he said like people were coming in constantly being like, oh,

509
00:24:13,925 --> 00:24:15,805
Speaker 1: love what Ellie's doing. Love what Ellie's doing. Love what

510
00:24:15,845 --> 00:24:20,445
Speaker 1: Ellie's doing. And so he ended up actually understanding why

511
00:24:20,525 --> 00:24:22,925
Speaker 1: I was doing it, and then he felt quite sad

512
00:24:22,965 --> 00:24:26,525
Speaker 1: because he was like, we nurtured you with so much love.

513
00:24:26,565 --> 00:24:29,565
Speaker 1: We were constantly like you're so beautiful, you know, and

514
00:24:29,605 --> 00:24:31,405
Speaker 1: he was like, I just can't get my head around

515
00:24:31,445 --> 00:24:35,125
Speaker 1: how you felt so insecure. And he was like, I

516
00:24:35,165 --> 00:24:36,765
Speaker 1: want to take you out for breakfast. So we went

517
00:24:36,765 --> 00:24:38,845
Speaker 1: out for a beautiful meal, and he was like, if

518
00:24:38,845 --> 00:24:40,685
Speaker 1: you explain to me from the start to the end

519
00:24:40,685 --> 00:24:43,205
Speaker 1: of why you're doing this, I will give you like

520
00:24:43,325 --> 00:24:46,165
Speaker 1: five photography lessons for twenty minutes a day a week.

521
00:24:46,645 --> 00:24:48,205
Speaker 1: But I want you to get like a lawyer to

522
00:24:48,245 --> 00:24:51,245
Speaker 1: protect yourself so that no one can ever you know,

523
00:24:51,285 --> 00:24:53,725
Speaker 1: it's like risky business what I'm doing. I've got so

524
00:24:53,885 --> 00:24:57,605
Speaker 1: many private photos of so many people. And so Dad

525
00:24:57,645 --> 00:25:00,045
Speaker 1: just got down to logistics and was like, I'll help you.

526
00:25:00,245 --> 00:25:01,605
Speaker 1: And then he said, but I want you to become

527
00:25:01,645 --> 00:25:05,165
Speaker 1: a good photographer. Don't want you to be an amateurer.

528
00:25:05,845 --> 00:25:07,725
Speaker 1: He's like, I want people to love the photos that

529
00:25:07,765 --> 00:25:08,405
Speaker 1: you take of them.

530
00:25:09,325 --> 00:25:14,405
Speaker 2: Interesting what your parents said, because it's something that a

531
00:25:14,525 --> 00:25:18,125
Speaker 2: parent can't really reassure you about. Like your dad telling

532
00:25:18,165 --> 00:25:20,245
Speaker 2: you you have a beautiful volver and you're a little

533
00:25:20,325 --> 00:25:22,245
Speaker 2: girl is just not.

534
00:25:22,205 --> 00:25:26,325
Speaker 1: I think, because he's so earthy and canoes and ab

535
00:25:26,445 --> 00:25:29,325
Speaker 1: sales and you know, hates makeup and that kind of stuff,

536
00:25:29,325 --> 00:25:31,605
Speaker 1: and he's just thinks every single person on this earth

537
00:25:31,645 --> 00:25:34,445
Speaker 1: is beautiful. Like every time I have a friend over,

538
00:25:34,605 --> 00:25:36,805
Speaker 1: he's like, oh, you guys, looks so beautiful, even if

539
00:25:36,805 --> 00:25:39,125
Speaker 1: we're in our pajamas, Like he does not see ugly

540
00:25:39,165 --> 00:25:39,645
Speaker 1: in the world.

541
00:25:40,085 --> 00:25:44,685
Speaker 2: For women, we learn about our bodies, unfortunately by comparing

542
00:25:44,685 --> 00:25:47,245
Speaker 2: them to other women's bodies, or by watching how other

543
00:25:47,285 --> 00:25:49,925
Speaker 2: people react yes to our bodies.

544
00:25:50,325 --> 00:25:53,165
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then of course, like you and I have said,

545
00:25:53,485 --> 00:25:56,365
Speaker 1: women so many times, but there's just people with wolvers.

546
00:25:56,725 --> 00:25:59,365
Speaker 1: It's a whole big world. We've got to Chinese the

547
00:25:59,445 --> 00:26:00,525
Speaker 1: right names for everything.

548
00:26:00,565 --> 00:26:05,525
Speaker 2: And well that's a very conversation because there are women

549
00:26:05,645 --> 00:26:09,085
Speaker 2: who have evolvers, and then there are non binary people

550
00:26:09,085 --> 00:26:09,925
Speaker 2: who volvers.

551
00:26:10,125 --> 00:26:11,725
Speaker 1: So I'm trying to include all of them in the

552
00:26:11,765 --> 00:26:17,205
Speaker 1: project as well. Photographed two transgender women and it's incredible

553
00:26:17,245 --> 00:26:19,925
Speaker 1: hearing their story. So the first transfer one a ever

554
00:26:19,925 --> 00:26:22,965
Speaker 1: photographed came over at nine am and I told her

555
00:26:23,005 --> 00:26:24,685
Speaker 1: that the photo shoot was going to finish it too,

556
00:26:25,125 --> 00:26:27,245
Speaker 1: and she was having the best day of her whole life,

557
00:26:27,285 --> 00:26:29,165
Speaker 1: like she could not leave my house. She was like

558
00:26:29,285 --> 00:26:31,325
Speaker 1: just one more minute, like one more shoot, one more

559
00:26:31,325 --> 00:26:34,365
Speaker 1: shoot because she was so proud of her vulver and

560
00:26:34,405 --> 00:26:37,405
Speaker 1: she just had the surgery. And most time when I

561
00:26:37,445 --> 00:26:40,045
Speaker 1: photographed people, they apologize. They're like, oh, I'm sorry if

562
00:26:40,085 --> 00:26:43,085
Speaker 1: I smell or I'm sorry if I'm sweaty. And she

563
00:26:43,205 --> 00:26:45,525
Speaker 1: was just standing there pointing to me and like, how

564
00:26:45,765 --> 00:26:48,005
Speaker 1: beautiful is it? How beautiful is it? How good does

565
00:26:48,045 --> 00:26:48,405
Speaker 1: it look?

566
00:26:48,485 --> 00:26:48,565
Speaker 2: Like?

567
00:26:48,965 --> 00:26:50,565
Speaker 1: Capture me l like this? Capture me like this? She

568
00:26:50,645 --> 00:26:52,285
Speaker 1: was so proud of her vulver.

569
00:26:54,685 --> 00:26:57,005
Speaker 2: I'm mea Friedman and you're listening to No Filter with

570
00:26:57,125 --> 00:27:04,725
Speaker 2: Ellie's Sedgwick. When people come and book in to have

571
00:27:04,805 --> 00:27:09,445
Speaker 2: their vulver photographed, is there a commonality in why they come.

572
00:27:10,845 --> 00:27:12,565
Speaker 1: There? Is there usually?

573
00:27:12,725 --> 00:27:12,925
Speaker 2: Is?

574
00:27:13,285 --> 00:27:16,485
Speaker 1: It's very often a comment that's been said in high school.

575
00:27:16,485 --> 00:27:19,085
Speaker 1: That's why eventually, once I bring out the book and everything,

576
00:27:19,085 --> 00:27:21,605
Speaker 1: I want it in high schools. And I would love

577
00:27:21,645 --> 00:27:23,885
Speaker 1: to personally go and speak to high school students because

578
00:27:23,965 --> 00:27:27,005
Speaker 1: I'm like, you don't know the damage you're doing to people,

579
00:27:27,165 --> 00:27:29,085
Speaker 1: Like it doesn't have to even be about the volvers,

580
00:27:29,125 --> 00:27:30,965
Speaker 1: but I just want to get in there and be like,

581
00:27:31,125 --> 00:27:34,645
Speaker 1: be kind, because one comment that's a throwaway in the

582
00:27:34,645 --> 00:27:38,525
Speaker 1: bedroom can ruin someone's life forever and their sex life,

583
00:27:38,725 --> 00:27:40,605
Speaker 1: which is so important and it should be something that

584
00:27:40,605 --> 00:27:43,765
Speaker 1: should be celebrated. So yeah, it's often a comment. And

585
00:27:43,805 --> 00:27:46,885
Speaker 1: then there's about ten topics that people come forward for.

586
00:27:46,925 --> 00:27:49,485
Speaker 1: So there's obviously, like I mean, I say obviously because

587
00:27:49,485 --> 00:27:50,765
Speaker 1: I'm so used to it, But do you know what

588
00:27:50,845 --> 00:27:51,765
Speaker 1: vaginismus is?

589
00:27:52,085 --> 00:27:54,205
Speaker 2: Very well, I don't have it, but there are many

590
00:27:54,245 --> 00:27:56,365
Speaker 2: women that I work with who have vaginismus.

591
00:27:56,445 --> 00:27:58,725
Speaker 1: Yes, So the first time I ever photographed someone with

592
00:27:58,805 --> 00:28:02,965
Speaker 1: vaginismus was actually my pa Jasmine. And it's often got

593
00:28:03,005 --> 00:28:05,805
Speaker 1: a lot to do with a religious background or religious upbringings,

594
00:28:05,925 --> 00:28:09,165
Speaker 1: or shame around sex or trauma. So her in particular

595
00:28:09,525 --> 00:28:12,445
Speaker 1: was a religious upbringing, and so then the night of

596
00:28:12,565 --> 00:28:15,485
Speaker 1: her wedding when she went to have penetrate sex with

597
00:28:15,565 --> 00:28:19,285
Speaker 1: her husband, she couldn't get it in and just called

598
00:28:19,285 --> 00:28:21,925
Speaker 1: them muscles. It was just closed. So you can't put

599
00:28:21,965 --> 00:28:25,165
Speaker 1: in a tampon, cu gumba, whatever you want to put in.

600
00:28:25,165 --> 00:28:27,445
Speaker 1: Their hurts so much. They often say it feels like burning.

601
00:28:28,085 --> 00:28:31,285
Speaker 1: But the thing is she'd heard that sex was painful,

602
00:28:31,525 --> 00:28:33,845
Speaker 1: and so they kept trying and trying to trying, and

603
00:28:33,925 --> 00:28:37,285
Speaker 1: because there's no education about vaginismus or hardly any education

604
00:28:37,325 --> 00:28:40,725
Speaker 1: about what sex should be like at schools. No, it's changing,

605
00:28:40,925 --> 00:28:43,765
Speaker 1: for sure. It used to just be like, don't do it.

606
00:28:44,165 --> 00:28:47,605
Speaker 1: And so she tried for ages and then went to

607
00:28:47,605 --> 00:28:51,645
Speaker 1: see a pelvic floor therapist, which if you're having painful sex,

608
00:28:51,685 --> 00:28:54,005
Speaker 1: go and see someone because they can help you so much.

609
00:28:54,085 --> 00:28:56,565
Speaker 2: They use little dilators to put.

610
00:28:56,485 --> 00:28:58,605
Speaker 1: Tiny ones in and then teach you how to relax

611
00:28:58,845 --> 00:29:00,245
Speaker 1: the muscles in your vagina.

612
00:29:00,365 --> 00:29:01,605
Speaker 2: How would you find one of those?

613
00:29:01,765 --> 00:29:03,405
Speaker 1: You can reach out to me and I can connect

614
00:29:03,445 --> 00:29:05,925
Speaker 1: you to people, for sure, But go see your local

615
00:29:05,965 --> 00:29:08,325
Speaker 1: GP and they'll connect you.

616
00:29:08,485 --> 00:29:10,685
Speaker 2: Women come to you because they've got vaginismas.

617
00:29:10,685 --> 00:29:13,485
Speaker 1: And the chat too, well, every single photo shoot, I

618
00:29:13,565 --> 00:29:16,605
Speaker 1: say like why are you here? And then after a while,

619
00:29:16,725 --> 00:29:18,565
Speaker 1: because I've been doing it for so many years now,

620
00:29:19,045 --> 00:29:21,925
Speaker 1: I have found out how many different topics there are.

621
00:29:22,045 --> 00:29:24,205
Speaker 1: And then what I do is I create a support

622
00:29:24,525 --> 00:29:28,085
Speaker 1: network group on Instagram for all these topics. So, like

623
00:29:28,205 --> 00:29:33,245
Speaker 1: lynchin'sclerocious back to your vaginosis reoccurring thrush herpes, I just

624
00:29:33,325 --> 00:29:36,965
Speaker 1: created my fortieth herpees group chat. I have a group

625
00:29:37,045 --> 00:29:38,245
Speaker 1: chat for literally everything.

626
00:29:38,645 --> 00:29:39,445
Speaker 2: What do you mean?

627
00:29:40,445 --> 00:29:42,445
Speaker 1: So if someone comes to me in a photoshoot and

628
00:29:42,485 --> 00:29:45,805
Speaker 1: says like, I have reoccurring thrush. I just cannot get

629
00:29:45,885 --> 00:29:48,045
Speaker 1: rid of it. I'm like, okay, great, I've got like

630
00:29:48,205 --> 00:29:50,405
Speaker 1: five groups on Instagram of people that have the exact

631
00:29:50,405 --> 00:29:51,965
Speaker 1: same problem. So I can put you in there and

632
00:29:52,005 --> 00:29:54,765
Speaker 1: you can talk about what helped, maybe natural remedies.

633
00:29:55,605 --> 00:29:58,565
Speaker 2: So you're like the Volver whisperer or the Vulva matchmaker,

634
00:29:58,645 --> 00:30:01,685
Speaker 2: like the match on the roof, but with volvers. Yeah.

635
00:30:01,765 --> 00:30:05,165
Speaker 1: Well, I have the most engaging Instagram you've ever met

636
00:30:05,165 --> 00:30:07,445
Speaker 1: in your life, Like it just never ever, ever stops.

637
00:30:07,805 --> 00:30:10,245
Speaker 1: And so I have so many people that feel comfortable

638
00:30:10,285 --> 00:30:12,965
Speaker 1: in that space. And every day I get a message

639
00:30:13,005 --> 00:30:15,405
Speaker 1: being like I've just been diagnosed with general or herb

640
00:30:15,485 --> 00:30:18,165
Speaker 1: is is a very common one, but whatever it is,

641
00:30:18,205 --> 00:30:20,245
Speaker 1: they know that. I'll be like, oh, no worries, I've

642
00:30:20,245 --> 00:30:21,845
Speaker 1: got a group for that. It's like a joke on

643
00:30:21,885 --> 00:30:22,485
Speaker 1: my Instagram.

644
00:30:22,645 --> 00:30:24,925
Speaker 2: So we could have come to you to be photographed,

645
00:30:25,165 --> 00:30:28,445
Speaker 2: like because they've got a recurring thrush or yeah I

646
00:30:28,485 --> 00:30:30,125
Speaker 2: hope he's diagnosis.

647
00:30:29,605 --> 00:30:31,925
Speaker 1: And they might just want someone to talk to about it.

648
00:30:32,005 --> 00:30:33,845
Speaker 1: And so when I do a photoshoot, I have six

649
00:30:33,925 --> 00:30:37,045
Speaker 1: people in every group, and so they it's.

650
00:30:36,925 --> 00:30:37,925
Speaker 2: A group experience.

651
00:30:37,925 --> 00:30:39,325
Speaker 1: It's a group experience.

652
00:30:39,805 --> 00:30:42,085
Speaker 2: How did that come about? Because I imagine at first

653
00:30:42,125 --> 00:30:43,445
Speaker 2: you only did one volver at.

654
00:30:43,325 --> 00:30:45,925
Speaker 1: A time, and then I was trying to teach at

655
00:30:45,925 --> 00:30:47,925
Speaker 1: the same time, and I'd have one day off a week,

656
00:30:48,005 --> 00:30:50,125
Speaker 1: and so then I was like, would have so many

657
00:30:50,125 --> 00:30:53,045
Speaker 1: people wanting to book in? It's high demand. You would

658
00:30:53,085 --> 00:30:55,205
Speaker 1: never expect it, but I have so many people try

659
00:30:55,245 --> 00:30:57,845
Speaker 1: to book in. And then I started realizing that when

660
00:30:57,885 --> 00:31:01,605
Speaker 1: I was putting in two or three girls or people together,

661
00:31:02,085 --> 00:31:04,365
Speaker 1: they would be like, oh, yeah, this has happened to me,

662
00:31:04,645 --> 00:31:06,125
Speaker 1: and then this has happened to me, and then they'd

663
00:31:06,125 --> 00:31:08,365
Speaker 1: be like, I did this to solve that. And so

664
00:31:08,445 --> 00:31:12,045
Speaker 1: I was like, this is so beautiful watching people connect

665
00:31:12,285 --> 00:31:15,365
Speaker 1: and share their stories and what healed them. And so

666
00:31:15,405 --> 00:31:17,525
Speaker 1: I started being like, it's actually better when there's a

667
00:31:17,565 --> 00:31:18,125
Speaker 1: bigger group.

668
00:31:18,325 --> 00:31:21,205
Speaker 2: And when they get to the photoshoot, are people naked

669
00:31:21,245 --> 00:31:23,805
Speaker 2: in front of each other? Some people more shy, Like

670
00:31:23,845 --> 00:31:27,005
Speaker 2: you must have noticed the way things tend to go,

671
00:31:27,165 --> 00:31:29,405
Speaker 2: like do people start off shy and then walking around

672
00:31:29,405 --> 00:31:30,165
Speaker 2: with my pants?

673
00:31:30,365 --> 00:31:34,965
Speaker 1: So I can, pretty much without exaggerating, tell you that

674
00:31:35,245 --> 00:31:39,005
Speaker 1: every single photoshoot I've ever done. Someone has messaged me

675
00:31:39,085 --> 00:31:40,685
Speaker 1: being like, I don't want to be naked in front

676
00:31:40,725 --> 00:31:42,725
Speaker 1: of someone else. Can I go into another en to

677
00:31:42,805 --> 00:31:45,285
Speaker 1: do my shoot? And I always say yes. And then

678
00:31:45,325 --> 00:31:47,205
Speaker 1: it's not just like they come in and they get naked,

679
00:31:47,245 --> 00:31:51,125
Speaker 1: like we usually do two hours worth of workshop activities

680
00:31:51,685 --> 00:31:55,565
Speaker 1: and then after that, I say, okay, who wants to

681
00:31:55,605 --> 00:31:59,645
Speaker 1: be photographed first? And then that person has never kept

682
00:31:59,885 --> 00:32:02,645
Speaker 1: their clothes often put them back on, like and so

683
00:32:03,005 --> 00:32:05,765
Speaker 1: it's every single photo shoot they come back naked and

684
00:32:05,845 --> 00:32:09,405
Speaker 1: they all stay naked. And I can't explain how I

685
00:32:09,445 --> 00:32:12,245
Speaker 1: do it, but I create a very safe space and

686
00:32:12,285 --> 00:32:15,085
Speaker 1: it's a slow process, and no one has ever put

687
00:32:15,125 --> 00:32:16,885
Speaker 1: their clothes back on for the end of the workshop.

688
00:32:16,925 --> 00:32:20,245
Speaker 1: They love being naked. They storm around my house, little venue,

689
00:32:20,245 --> 00:32:21,725
Speaker 1: whatever I've rented, and.

690
00:32:21,645 --> 00:32:23,365
Speaker 2: They just love my parts.

691
00:32:23,445 --> 00:32:25,685
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they're showing each other like, look at this

692
00:32:25,765 --> 00:32:27,365
Speaker 1: mole on my lady, are this is what I'm self

693
00:32:27,405 --> 00:32:30,285
Speaker 1: conscious for. Last week we had a girl showing us

694
00:32:30,325 --> 00:32:32,605
Speaker 1: her buttthole because she had a skin tag and everyone

695
00:32:32,685 --> 00:32:33,525
Speaker 1: was right in there.

696
00:32:34,565 --> 00:32:39,525
Speaker 2: Wow, how interesting, Because I guess men see other penises

697
00:32:39,565 --> 00:32:42,485
Speaker 2: from when they're young, like you know, I mean, boys

698
00:32:42,485 --> 00:32:45,125
Speaker 2: are always pulling them out when they're little and then

699
00:32:45,765 --> 00:32:49,725
Speaker 2: you know, wing outdoors or in a urinal or in

700
00:32:49,765 --> 00:32:53,565
Speaker 2: a you know, group shower whatever after sport. But for women,

701
00:32:54,965 --> 00:32:59,205
Speaker 2: I haven't ever seen a real life volver up close.

702
00:32:59,565 --> 00:33:02,365
Speaker 1: Yeah, they love looking at each other's after the photo shoots.

703
00:33:02,365 --> 00:33:05,925
Speaker 1: They're always very happy to do that, which is so beautiful.

704
00:33:06,405 --> 00:33:08,925
Speaker 1: Sometimes I let boys come. Sometimes people are like, my

705
00:33:08,965 --> 00:33:11,725
Speaker 1: partner wants to come, is that okay? And I'll check

706
00:33:11,725 --> 00:33:13,925
Speaker 1: with the group and if it's okay, then a partner

707
00:33:14,325 --> 00:33:17,965
Speaker 1: group would say it's okay for it's group, or if

708
00:33:17,965 --> 00:33:20,245
Speaker 1: it's like people that know each other, and then they're like,

709
00:33:20,325 --> 00:33:21,365
Speaker 1: can I bring my partner?

710
00:33:21,365 --> 00:33:23,325
Speaker 2: I wish people could see my face. My face is

711
00:33:23,405 --> 00:33:26,565
Speaker 2: just like okay, So I'm getting my volve of photographed

712
00:33:26,685 --> 00:33:29,005
Speaker 2: and then there's gonna be other people there that I

713
00:33:29,045 --> 00:33:31,045
Speaker 2: don't know, and I don't know the photographer, and also

714
00:33:31,125 --> 00:33:33,685
Speaker 2: someone's bringing their partner, no problem.

715
00:33:34,085 --> 00:33:37,165
Speaker 1: It hasn't happened for maybe two years that a partner's come,

716
00:33:37,245 --> 00:33:38,805
Speaker 1: but there was a while there where people were like,

717
00:33:38,885 --> 00:33:41,685
Speaker 1: can I bring? But also some men are just beautiful

718
00:33:41,685 --> 00:33:43,645
Speaker 1: and want to learn anat of me, and they I

719
00:33:43,725 --> 00:33:45,925
Speaker 1: have men reach out to me being like, I love

720
00:33:45,965 --> 00:33:47,725
Speaker 1: what you do and if I can be part of

721
00:33:47,725 --> 00:33:49,885
Speaker 1: it in any way, shape or form, I absolutely will.

722
00:33:50,365 --> 00:33:52,845
Speaker 1: So I think it's really natural for us to lead

723
00:33:52,925 --> 00:33:54,805
Speaker 1: down this path where we're like, oh, they just want

724
00:33:54,805 --> 00:33:57,005
Speaker 1: to see, but sometimes boys do just want to learn,

725
00:33:57,525 --> 00:33:59,765
Speaker 1: and like a lot of the stuff I teach is like,

726
00:33:59,925 --> 00:34:01,885
Speaker 1: you know, connecting with your pussy and having good sex

727
00:34:01,965 --> 00:34:05,085
Speaker 1: isn't about technique. It's about being comfortable. It's why it's

728
00:34:05,125 --> 00:34:08,045
Speaker 1: called comfortable in my skin. And so many guys are like,

729
00:34:08,165 --> 00:34:10,205
Speaker 1: I want to learn to be a better Ellie, and

730
00:34:10,285 --> 00:34:13,005
Speaker 1: I'm so happy to spend time with them and teach

731
00:34:13,005 --> 00:34:15,725
Speaker 1: them what I know, because you know, I feel like

732
00:34:15,725 --> 00:34:17,365
Speaker 1: I do have a world of knowledge and I want

733
00:34:17,405 --> 00:34:19,725
Speaker 1: to share it. So men shouldn't be able to miss

734
00:34:19,765 --> 00:34:20,445
Speaker 1: out on that too.

735
00:34:20,885 --> 00:34:22,645
Speaker 2: That's so true. And you know, I think that your

736
00:34:22,645 --> 00:34:25,485
Speaker 2: book is going to be so brilliant because I was

737
00:34:25,525 --> 00:34:29,005
Speaker 2: going to say, as mothers, how do we teach our

738
00:34:29,045 --> 00:34:33,005
Speaker 2: sons and our daughters, Yeah, that the volvers that they

739
00:34:33,045 --> 00:34:36,165
Speaker 2: see in porn, which they're going to see a lot of, yeah,

740
00:34:36,325 --> 00:34:41,285
Speaker 2: are not necessarily natural. They've often been surgically enhanced or else.

741
00:34:41,605 --> 00:34:44,565
Speaker 2: The women who go into porn are more comfortable because

742
00:34:44,565 --> 00:34:47,165
Speaker 2: they look a certain way. How do we teach our

743
00:34:47,245 --> 00:34:50,365
Speaker 2: kids about the diversity of exposure, like.

744
00:34:50,325 --> 00:34:52,485
Speaker 1: What you said in a safe way. So when I

745
00:34:52,605 --> 00:34:55,565
Speaker 1: lived in Manly, I had all the photos printed out

746
00:34:55,605 --> 00:34:57,965
Speaker 1: on polaroids and they were along every single bit of

747
00:34:58,005 --> 00:35:01,525
Speaker 1: my wall, like there was just volvers everywhere. And obviously,

748
00:35:01,685 --> 00:35:03,525
Speaker 1: because I had said to you before, I'm a preschool

749
00:35:03,525 --> 00:35:06,005
Speaker 1: teacher and I would nanny all the time, and I

750
00:35:06,045 --> 00:35:08,245
Speaker 1: would always speak to the mums and be like, you

751
00:35:08,365 --> 00:35:10,045
Speaker 1: just have to know that if your child comes to

752
00:35:10,045 --> 00:35:12,005
Speaker 1: my house, they're going to see a whole lot of volvers.

753
00:35:12,405 --> 00:35:15,005
Speaker 1: And I've had so many beautiful experiences with kids that

754
00:35:15,045 --> 00:35:17,725
Speaker 1: are like eight, being like, look, this one's hairy, Like

755
00:35:17,845 --> 00:35:20,605
Speaker 1: what color pubes do you think you'll have? And they

756
00:35:20,765 --> 00:35:23,005
Speaker 1: love it. They giggle and they're like, oh my gosh,

757
00:35:23,045 --> 00:35:25,045
Speaker 1: like I've got red hair. I've got this beautiful video

758
00:35:25,085 --> 00:35:28,165
Speaker 1: of this girl and she has red hair and her

759
00:35:28,245 --> 00:35:29,805
Speaker 1: mum has red hair, and she says, I think I'm

760
00:35:29,845 --> 00:35:32,565
Speaker 1: going to have red pubes like my mom, and her

761
00:35:32,605 --> 00:35:34,525
Speaker 1: mom was like cuddling her, I should show you the video.

762
00:35:34,525 --> 00:35:37,085
Speaker 1: It's so gorgeous, goodhou And so I just think it's

763
00:35:37,125 --> 00:35:40,245
Speaker 1: like normalizing it in a really safe space. Yeah, and

764
00:35:40,365 --> 00:35:42,765
Speaker 1: just like leaving flips through my flaps on the coffee

765
00:35:42,765 --> 00:35:44,525
Speaker 1: table for them to look at when they're ready, and

766
00:35:44,805 --> 00:35:46,965
Speaker 1: maybe when they're alone and they feel comfortable and they

767
00:35:46,965 --> 00:35:49,685
Speaker 1: want to just flip through it. That's what I needed

768
00:35:49,685 --> 00:35:52,045
Speaker 1: when I was younger. I'm just creating what I think

769
00:35:52,085 --> 00:35:52,805
Speaker 1: would have helped me.

770
00:35:54,125 --> 00:35:57,165
Speaker 2: When you talk to straight men about volvers, what do

771
00:35:57,245 --> 00:36:00,525
Speaker 2: they tell you? It depends if they're alone or in

772
00:36:00,565 --> 00:36:03,445
Speaker 2: a group, or it depends on life speak about that.

773
00:36:04,045 --> 00:36:07,245
Speaker 1: I think that when they're one on one, they're often like,

774
00:36:08,125 --> 00:36:12,245
Speaker 1: wear's the G spot was all the pleasure points? Like,

775
00:36:12,365 --> 00:36:14,365
Speaker 1: so they want to know. They want to know better

776
00:36:14,605 --> 00:36:18,045
Speaker 1: how they can pleasure a girl more. Definitely, they're very inquisitive,

777
00:36:18,805 --> 00:36:20,645
Speaker 1: and so that's when I'm sort of like, well, it's

778
00:36:20,685 --> 00:36:22,965
Speaker 1: all about communicating because I can speak for what feels

779
00:36:22,965 --> 00:36:24,245
Speaker 1: good for me, but I'm not going to be able

780
00:36:24,245 --> 00:36:25,925
Speaker 1: to speak for what feels good for the next person

781
00:36:25,965 --> 00:36:28,005
Speaker 1: you sleep with. So I love having these kind of

782
00:36:28,005 --> 00:36:30,845
Speaker 1: conversation with my male friends just to be like it's

783
00:36:30,885 --> 00:36:33,805
Speaker 1: okay to ask, but you know, sometimes they don't even

784
00:36:33,925 --> 00:36:37,245
Speaker 1: know what to ask for. So are you by it

785
00:36:37,365 --> 00:36:38,685
Speaker 1: all or am I yeah?

786
00:36:38,885 --> 00:36:40,885
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, it's not yet.

787
00:36:41,645 --> 00:36:44,005
Speaker 1: I noticed when I have sex with a woman compared

788
00:36:44,005 --> 00:36:46,965
Speaker 1: to when I have sex with a man, it's so different.

789
00:36:47,565 --> 00:36:48,965
Speaker 2: In what way is it different?

790
00:36:49,365 --> 00:36:52,565
Speaker 1: For example, my ex and I, when we had sex,

791
00:36:52,885 --> 00:36:56,765
Speaker 1: it would be like a four hour magic thing of

792
00:36:56,845 --> 00:36:58,845
Speaker 1: like you know, it wasn't even four play four play

793
00:36:58,965 --> 00:37:00,165
Speaker 1: was the sex like we would.

794
00:36:59,965 --> 00:37:02,285
Speaker 2: Have sounds very tiring, Alli, No, no, but.

795
00:37:02,205 --> 00:37:05,205
Speaker 1: We'd have oils. We'd be blindfolded, for example, and we'd

796
00:37:05,245 --> 00:37:07,925
Speaker 1: have oils just smelling them and like putting them behind

797
00:37:07,965 --> 00:37:11,085
Speaker 1: our ears and have amazing zick plane and like starting

798
00:37:11,085 --> 00:37:14,525
Speaker 1: with the body massage. And it was a huge like tease.

799
00:37:15,285 --> 00:37:17,245
Speaker 1: And then I find when I have sex with men,

800
00:37:17,365 --> 00:37:20,165
Speaker 1: not all men, they're on top. I'm bam, thank you,

801
00:37:20,205 --> 00:37:23,085
Speaker 1: Ma'm roll over, go to sleep, not after care. Whereas

802
00:37:23,125 --> 00:37:27,205
Speaker 1: with a woman. Hate to generalize, but we're lay in

803
00:37:27,245 --> 00:37:30,205
Speaker 1: bed kissing for so long after either of us has orgasm,

804
00:37:30,365 --> 00:37:33,045
Speaker 1: be like, you know, debrief, how is that for? You

805
00:37:33,205 --> 00:37:34,845
Speaker 1: did that feel good? I loved it when you did that.

806
00:37:34,885 --> 00:37:37,205
Speaker 1: And then the next day, oh my gosh, remember when

807
00:37:37,245 --> 00:37:40,045
Speaker 1: you did that? It felt amazing And the communication just

808
00:37:40,045 --> 00:37:43,005
Speaker 1: feels so much better. So I love explaining this to

809
00:37:43,085 --> 00:37:46,165
Speaker 1: my straight male friends, being like, talk more, ask what

810
00:37:46,205 --> 00:37:47,325
Speaker 1: they want, Like, You're.

811
00:37:47,245 --> 00:37:51,805
Speaker 2: Right, because I was gonna ask. In straight sex, the

812
00:37:51,885 --> 00:37:57,605
Speaker 2: male orgasm is kind of like the definitive end point usually,

813
00:37:57,765 --> 00:38:01,045
Speaker 2: or that certainly was often we've been led to believe,

814
00:38:01,605 --> 00:38:04,725
Speaker 2: you know, in everything that we've always seen in popular culture.

815
00:38:05,285 --> 00:38:08,325
Speaker 2: But in sex between two women, it's not that.

816
00:38:08,605 --> 00:38:12,485
Speaker 1: Absolutely, it's no endpoint, and once you've orgasmed, you can

817
00:38:12,525 --> 00:38:14,645
Speaker 1: still I don't know why, but when I have sex

818
00:38:14,685 --> 00:38:16,885
Speaker 1: with the guy again, I'm just speaking from me personally,

819
00:38:17,285 --> 00:38:21,005
Speaker 1: they so often just finish and they're done, and I'm

820
00:38:21,085 --> 00:38:24,205
Speaker 1: not even close to done, because as a volver owner

821
00:38:24,285 --> 00:38:28,165
Speaker 1: often we take out way longer time to climax and

822
00:38:28,205 --> 00:38:30,525
Speaker 1: it's like they just don't even care about your pleasure,

823
00:38:31,165 --> 00:38:35,085
Speaker 1: and I'm like, hey, I'm not at all finished, you know.

824
00:38:35,245 --> 00:38:37,525
Speaker 1: And so so many people think that they can't orgasm.

825
00:38:37,765 --> 00:38:40,085
Speaker 1: I have groups for that as well. They tell me

826
00:38:40,125 --> 00:38:42,965
Speaker 1: all the time like I've never had an orgasm, and

827
00:38:43,365 --> 00:38:46,885
Speaker 1: I'm like, well, that's sad, that's sad, and you can.

828
00:38:46,965 --> 00:38:50,085
Speaker 1: There's nothing wrong with you. Sometimes people do find it

829
00:38:50,125 --> 00:38:52,725
Speaker 1: really hard, but I truly believe that we can all

830
00:38:52,765 --> 00:38:56,045
Speaker 1: have really great, pleasurable sex. And sometimes it's not done

831
00:38:56,045 --> 00:38:58,285
Speaker 1: in the way that you see in porn. It's done

832
00:38:58,325 --> 00:39:01,685
Speaker 1: in like really slow, gentle activating all the senses or

833
00:39:02,885 --> 00:39:06,645
Speaker 1: you know, whatever's your blue erotic print, like maybe kinks

834
00:39:06,725 --> 00:39:10,005
Speaker 1: what works for you or senses. You know. It's just

835
00:39:10,085 --> 00:39:12,405
Speaker 1: everyone has a different way to get off and you

836
00:39:12,485 --> 00:39:13,445
Speaker 1: just need to find what it is.

837
00:39:13,525 --> 00:39:15,885
Speaker 2: I wanted to ask you how if there's a difference

838
00:39:15,965 --> 00:39:19,365
Speaker 2: in the way queer women and straight women feel about

839
00:39:19,365 --> 00:39:23,645
Speaker 2: their volvers, because I interviewed Sophicacia and she had a labiaplasty.

840
00:39:23,765 --> 00:39:27,725
Speaker 2: She was always very conscious of her labia. She hadn't

841
00:39:27,725 --> 00:39:30,125
Speaker 2: seen any other labia except her sisters because she'd have

842
00:39:30,165 --> 00:39:34,085
Speaker 2: bards and she had three sisters and they didn't have outias,

843
00:39:34,085 --> 00:39:37,125
Speaker 2: and she did, and she was always self conscious and

844
00:39:37,405 --> 00:39:39,685
Speaker 2: it was uncomfortable when she was wearing clothes or riding

845
00:39:39,725 --> 00:39:43,245
Speaker 2: a bike. And she said, now that she's queer and

846
00:39:43,325 --> 00:39:46,685
Speaker 2: she's seen a lot more volvers, yeah, she wishes she

847
00:39:46,725 --> 00:39:50,165
Speaker 2: hadn't done it because she realizes that she wasn't as

848
00:39:51,085 --> 00:39:53,285
Speaker 2: quote mark abnormal as she thought.

849
00:39:53,525 --> 00:39:55,565
Speaker 1: This is exactly what I said to you. It's just

850
00:39:55,645 --> 00:39:58,525
Speaker 1: a lack of seeing them. Like it's not even if

851
00:39:58,565 --> 00:40:01,485
Speaker 1: you're queer or straight. It's like how many you've seen

852
00:40:01,565 --> 00:40:04,525
Speaker 1: in my opinion, Like that's why I just plus this everywhere,

853
00:40:04,565 --> 00:40:07,805
Speaker 1: like go on my website, look at it. I don't know.

854
00:40:07,885 --> 00:40:11,165
Speaker 1: I had someone do something credible for me once. They

855
00:40:11,205 --> 00:40:13,565
Speaker 1: said to me after the third time we'd had sex,

856
00:40:13,645 --> 00:40:15,765
Speaker 1: like why are you so self conscious of your vulva

857
00:40:15,965 --> 00:40:18,605
Speaker 1: or I think he said pussy and I was like,

858
00:40:18,805 --> 00:40:20,925
Speaker 1: I'm not and he was like, no, you are, Like

859
00:40:21,125 --> 00:40:24,405
Speaker 1: you stand with your hands like covering your pussy in

860
00:40:24,485 --> 00:40:28,885
Speaker 1: the shower, and you walked backwards to the bedroom and

861
00:40:28,965 --> 00:40:31,245
Speaker 1: dropped your towel like you've put yourself in so many

862
00:40:31,245 --> 00:40:34,565
Speaker 1: positions so I can't see you. It didn't matter if

863
00:40:34,565 --> 00:40:36,085
Speaker 1: it was a boy or a girl that did this

864
00:40:36,125 --> 00:40:39,125
Speaker 1: to me. It's just someone that's like self aware.

865
00:40:39,285 --> 00:40:41,205
Speaker 2: I was going to say, very self aware that he's.

866
00:40:41,085 --> 00:40:42,765
Speaker 1: And aware of like the person that he was sleeping with.

867
00:40:42,845 --> 00:40:44,845
Speaker 1: And I just like cried more than I've ever cried

868
00:40:44,885 --> 00:40:46,045
Speaker 1: in my life, and he was like, let me just

869
00:40:46,085 --> 00:40:48,885
Speaker 1: see what you look like. And for me, that was

870
00:40:48,925 --> 00:40:51,685
Speaker 1: so healing. And so I think it's kind of like

871
00:40:51,765 --> 00:40:54,845
Speaker 1: if you're lucky enough to sleep with someone that's having conscious,

872
00:40:55,285 --> 00:40:57,645
Speaker 1: lovely sex and that wants to be there and wants

873
00:40:57,645 --> 00:40:59,885
Speaker 1: to make you feel good. And then he went to

874
00:40:59,885 --> 00:41:02,445
Speaker 1: so much effort to make me feel like beautiful because

875
00:41:02,445 --> 00:41:05,365
Speaker 1: he could realize I was self conscious. And then following that,

876
00:41:05,445 --> 00:41:09,005
Speaker 1: I have had really nice partners that are women that

877
00:41:09,085 --> 00:41:12,205
Speaker 1: do similar things. And so I just think it doesn't

878
00:41:12,205 --> 00:41:15,045
Speaker 1: matter if you're straight or gay, it's just whoever you're

879
00:41:15,085 --> 00:41:17,965
Speaker 1: sleeping with, trying and sleep with people that are lovely

880
00:41:18,405 --> 00:41:19,005
Speaker 1: if you can.

881
00:41:19,485 --> 00:41:23,405
Speaker 2: The people you know who've had labiaplastis, have you photographed them?

882
00:41:24,045 --> 00:41:26,925
Speaker 1: One I have, but she doesn't want it to go

883
00:41:27,045 --> 00:41:29,005
Speaker 1: in the book. She was like, this is purely a

884
00:41:29,085 --> 00:41:32,245
Speaker 1: thing for you and me, and that's fine. Like often

885
00:41:32,285 --> 00:41:33,845
Speaker 1: I photograph people and they're like, I don't want this

886
00:41:33,885 --> 00:41:36,285
Speaker 1: to go anywhere. This is like a pure healing process

887
00:41:36,285 --> 00:41:39,725
Speaker 1: for me. That's almost like delete the photos. It's the

888
00:41:39,765 --> 00:41:43,765
Speaker 1: process of having them taken that is the healing for them. Yeah, exactly.

889
00:41:44,405 --> 00:41:47,845
Speaker 1: And then the other one, she's very keen to be photographed,

890
00:41:47,845 --> 00:41:50,485
Speaker 1: but I just have not got round to it. But

891
00:41:50,965 --> 00:41:53,805
Speaker 1: she's still very very self conscious, even though she's had

892
00:41:53,805 --> 00:41:57,445
Speaker 1: the surgery, still hasn't had an orgasm at thirty two

893
00:41:57,685 --> 00:42:01,685
Speaker 1: and thinks it's because of cutting off the nerve endings.

894
00:42:01,685 --> 00:42:04,805
Speaker 1: But I've told her I as my own opinion, I

895
00:42:04,845 --> 00:42:06,605
Speaker 1: don't think it's that because I know people that have

896
00:42:06,645 --> 00:42:09,205
Speaker 1: had labiaplasty that can still orgasm. I just think that

897
00:42:09,445 --> 00:42:12,405
Speaker 1: she is in like fight or flight motes still and

898
00:42:12,445 --> 00:42:15,125
Speaker 1: she can't let go, and an orgasms all about letting go.

899
00:42:15,965 --> 00:42:17,765
Speaker 2: I should have asked you what people want to do

900
00:42:17,805 --> 00:42:18,565
Speaker 2: with the photos.

901
00:42:19,205 --> 00:42:20,765
Speaker 1: A lot of them are proud to be part of

902
00:42:20,805 --> 00:42:24,725
Speaker 1: the change that I'm creating, and everyone's got a different thing.

903
00:42:24,845 --> 00:42:27,085
Speaker 1: Like so I give a poloid at each photo. Shit,

904
00:42:27,165 --> 00:42:28,885
Speaker 1: So so many times people send it to me and

905
00:42:28,885 --> 00:42:30,885
Speaker 1: they're like, it's next to my bed, or they keep

906
00:42:30,885 --> 00:42:33,685
Speaker 1: it in their wallet as like a self empowered they

907
00:42:33,685 --> 00:42:37,325
Speaker 1: give it to a lover, they frame it. It's pretty cool. Actually,

908
00:42:37,405 --> 00:42:40,805
Speaker 1: I have got come from my skin tattooed on me. See,

909
00:42:42,525 --> 00:42:44,725
Speaker 1: and there's six people in the world now that have

910
00:42:45,085 --> 00:42:47,765
Speaker 1: come to my skin tattooed on them, and so they're

911
00:42:47,805 --> 00:42:50,405
Speaker 1: just like comfortable. My skin just represents like confidence and

912
00:42:50,605 --> 00:42:52,525
Speaker 1: love for yourself. So I think it's the same with

913
00:42:52,525 --> 00:42:55,005
Speaker 1: the vulb or they like carry it around the vulb

914
00:42:55,045 --> 00:42:57,525
Speaker 1: of photo and they're like, whenever I feel like I'm

915
00:42:57,565 --> 00:43:00,645
Speaker 1: not good enough or I'm ugly or different, I can

916
00:43:00,685 --> 00:43:02,725
Speaker 1: look at this and be like, no, I'm beautiful.

917
00:43:04,565 --> 00:43:09,125
Speaker 2: Just finally, if someone's listening to this and they might

918
00:43:09,165 --> 00:43:12,765
Speaker 2: be feeling very emotional because maybe they feel really self

919
00:43:12,805 --> 00:43:15,645
Speaker 2: conscious about their volver and maybe they didn't even realize

920
00:43:15,645 --> 00:43:18,605
Speaker 2: how it was impacting their sex life or how they

921
00:43:18,605 --> 00:43:22,085
Speaker 2: felt about themselves, what should they do? What are some

922
00:43:22,165 --> 00:43:25,405
Speaker 2: of the tangible things that they can do? I think

923
00:43:25,605 --> 00:43:29,245
Speaker 2: talk about it. I'm a huge to who audy.

924
00:43:29,285 --> 00:43:30,725
Speaker 1: You can come to me. I put you in one

925
00:43:30,725 --> 00:43:33,765
Speaker 1: of the groups message me. I mean I do this constantly.

926
00:43:33,805 --> 00:43:36,485
Speaker 1: Every single day. Someone reaches out and says like I've

927
00:43:36,485 --> 00:43:39,005
Speaker 1: just found you through this, like I've spent a whole

928
00:43:39,045 --> 00:43:41,965
Speaker 1: life in hiding. I can't not even my husband of

929
00:43:42,005 --> 00:43:45,165
Speaker 1: blah blah blah like seeming naked like, and I always

930
00:43:45,245 --> 00:43:48,405
Speaker 1: try and then help them. It is getting harder because

931
00:43:48,405 --> 00:43:49,725
Speaker 1: it's corresting like.

932
00:43:49,685 --> 00:43:52,045
Speaker 2: An angel on Earth, because that's a lot of unpaid

933
00:43:52,045 --> 00:43:52,645
Speaker 2: work for you.

934
00:43:52,725 --> 00:43:54,925
Speaker 1: It's a lot of unpaid work, which is something that

935
00:43:55,085 --> 00:43:58,965
Speaker 1: I'm navigating right now is that there's not enough of

936
00:43:59,005 --> 00:44:01,885
Speaker 1: me to do the work I'm doing. But I do

937
00:44:02,405 --> 00:44:04,245
Speaker 1: have a lot of groups where it's like these people

938
00:44:04,285 --> 00:44:06,045
Speaker 1: are all self conscious of their volver and so I

939
00:44:06,045 --> 00:44:07,645
Speaker 1: pop them in there and then I try and give

940
00:44:07,685 --> 00:44:10,445
Speaker 1: like group advice and say this is what helped me,

941
00:44:10,645 --> 00:44:11,565
Speaker 1: this is what you can do.

942
00:44:11,645 --> 00:44:13,765
Speaker 2: And if someone wanted to get their volve a photographed,

943
00:44:13,805 --> 00:44:15,165
Speaker 2: You're probably are booked out, aren't you.

944
00:44:15,285 --> 00:44:19,005
Speaker 1: I'm onto us, so you can message me again and

945
00:44:19,165 --> 00:44:21,765
Speaker 1: just see where I'm at right now. I'm in Tasmania.

946
00:44:21,805 --> 00:44:24,205
Speaker 1: I flew in today straight off the playing to you

947
00:44:24,285 --> 00:44:29,085
Speaker 1: maya very honored and then I head to I'm going

948
00:44:29,205 --> 00:44:33,125
Speaker 1: all around Australia, so wherever you are. I do small towns,

949
00:44:33,125 --> 00:44:38,085
Speaker 1: big towns do so many events events, yes, so each town.

950
00:44:38,125 --> 00:44:40,485
Speaker 1: I mean I usually do like a dominate Trix event.

951
00:44:40,965 --> 00:44:44,965
Speaker 1: What's that, Well, it's when everyone comes dressed in leather

952
00:44:45,245 --> 00:44:47,165
Speaker 1: or as a dom but you can wear just all

953
00:44:47,205 --> 00:44:49,725
Speaker 1: black if you want. And then I bring in dominate

954
00:44:49,765 --> 00:44:52,325
Speaker 1: tricks who teach different kinds of play because maybe you

955
00:44:52,365 --> 00:44:55,045
Speaker 1: didn't even know you were into kink. You just haven't

956
00:44:55,085 --> 00:44:57,645
Speaker 1: been opened up to the world. So we all have

957
00:44:57,685 --> 00:44:59,685
Speaker 1: different levels of what's like kinky for us. It doesn't

958
00:44:59,725 --> 00:45:02,645
Speaker 1: mean it's like has to be like painful play. It

959
00:45:02,645 --> 00:45:05,045
Speaker 1: can be something in your mind that you find naughty.

960
00:45:05,245 --> 00:45:07,645
Speaker 1: So I love teaching people different ways that they can

961
00:45:07,685 --> 00:45:11,685
Speaker 1: have kink play. So I do that through hiring dominatrix,

962
00:45:12,085 --> 00:45:14,325
Speaker 1: and then we might have someone come in and teach

963
00:45:14,485 --> 00:45:17,805
Speaker 1: the art of seduction. Everywhere I go, I fly in

964
00:45:17,885 --> 00:45:21,045
Speaker 1: different people to teach someone something that's maybe a little

965
00:45:21,045 --> 00:45:22,965
Speaker 1: bit taboo but could help their sex life or their

966
00:45:23,005 --> 00:45:24,565
Speaker 1: sexuality a lot.

967
00:45:25,165 --> 00:45:28,965
Speaker 2: You're amazing, You're amazing. When's the book going to be out?

968
00:45:29,005 --> 00:45:31,525
Speaker 2: And how can we support your work from the outside

969
00:45:31,565 --> 00:45:35,005
Speaker 2: if perhaps we don't want to have our own volvers photograph,

970
00:45:35,085 --> 00:45:36,925
Speaker 2: but we want to help support what you do.

971
00:45:37,805 --> 00:45:41,325
Speaker 1: So the book I have actually got enough folvers to

972
00:45:41,325 --> 00:45:43,685
Speaker 1: bring out a book right now. But there is no

973
00:45:44,325 --> 00:45:47,645
Speaker 1: diversity in this book. I do not know why I

974
00:45:47,645 --> 00:45:51,605
Speaker 1: am struggling so much to get women of color, bigger women,

975
00:45:52,285 --> 00:45:58,085
Speaker 1: elder women. I'm just seem to be photographing white bossie

976
00:45:58,085 --> 00:46:01,565
Speaker 1: gal and so I do so many call outs. And

977
00:46:02,045 --> 00:46:03,805
Speaker 1: not long ago, I went up to someone on the beach,

978
00:46:03,845 --> 00:46:05,845
Speaker 1: this beautiful black woman, and I tried to explain her

979
00:46:05,885 --> 00:46:08,085
Speaker 1: in a really nice way, and then I never heard

980
00:46:08,125 --> 00:46:12,205
Speaker 1: back from her. She didn't check kindly to that, and

981
00:46:12,245 --> 00:46:14,645
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm never doing that again. I'm just

982
00:46:14,725 --> 00:46:18,245
Speaker 1: like I I was so so innocent. I was just like,

983
00:46:18,285 --> 00:46:19,685
Speaker 1: you know, if you want to just come and have

984
00:46:19,725 --> 00:46:22,725
Speaker 1: your breast photograph or just like even do an interview

985
00:46:22,885 --> 00:46:25,205
Speaker 1: on your sex like on my page, I'm just trying

986
00:46:25,405 --> 00:46:29,525
Speaker 1: so hard and I'm not getting any diversity, all right.

987
00:46:29,525 --> 00:46:33,885
Speaker 2: So anyone who is perhaps a woman of color.

988
00:46:33,845 --> 00:46:36,005
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would love to do. Someone who has had

989
00:46:36,165 --> 00:46:40,245
Speaker 1: female jes FGMFGM genital mutilation. I would love to meet

990
00:46:40,285 --> 00:46:42,285
Speaker 1: someone like that to share that kind of story. Or

991
00:46:42,405 --> 00:46:44,365
Speaker 1: you know in countries where they pull the LaBier, they

992
00:46:44,365 --> 00:46:48,165
Speaker 1: want it longer, you know, just a different kind of story.

993
00:46:48,965 --> 00:46:53,005
Speaker 1: And until there is a representation of every single person

994
00:46:53,045 --> 00:46:55,125
Speaker 1: in this world in my book, I will not bring

995
00:46:55,125 --> 00:46:55,605
Speaker 1: my work out.

996
00:46:56,005 --> 00:46:58,965
Speaker 2: Ellie was such a joy to chat with, and I

997
00:46:59,045 --> 00:47:01,245
Speaker 2: really want to try and help her finish the book.

998
00:47:01,765 --> 00:47:05,885
Speaker 2: So if you are interested in being photographed, especially if

999
00:47:05,885 --> 00:47:08,685
Speaker 2: you have one of the folvers that she hasn't yet

1000
00:47:08,685 --> 00:47:12,005
Speaker 2: photographed for inclusion in her book, or if you just

1001
00:47:12,005 --> 00:47:14,285
Speaker 2: want to support her work more broadly. There's a link

1002
00:47:14,565 --> 00:47:16,925
Speaker 2: in the show notes, and there's more of my conversation

1003
00:47:17,045 --> 00:47:20,045
Speaker 2: with Ellie for Mum and Maya subscribers. We've kind of

1004
00:47:20,085 --> 00:47:22,805
Speaker 2: done a bit of like a sealed section version of

1005
00:47:22,845 --> 00:47:26,365
Speaker 2: this conversation if you're old enough to remember magazine sealed sections.

1006
00:47:26,805 --> 00:47:31,005
Speaker 2: We talked about a fairly detailed explanation of how Ellie

1007
00:47:31,005 --> 00:47:34,685
Speaker 2: achieved the best orgasm of her life. We talked about vibrators,

1008
00:47:34,765 --> 00:47:37,925
Speaker 2: about sex. Take a listen, here's a little bit.

1009
00:47:38,405 --> 00:47:41,045
Speaker 1: This one night, I was watching my reflection and I

1010
00:47:41,125 --> 00:47:44,325
Speaker 1: was dat sing and I was like touching myself. I

1011
00:47:44,405 --> 00:47:47,565
Speaker 1: wasn't intentionally trying to have an orgasm, but I ended

1012
00:47:47,605 --> 00:47:53,525
Speaker 1: up having the most transformative, back arching, like couch grabbing

1013
00:47:53,765 --> 00:47:57,885
Speaker 1: orgasm of my probably my life. And it was because

1014
00:47:58,205 --> 00:48:00,445
Speaker 1: I had been doing the mirror work.

1015
00:48:00,605 --> 00:48:02,285
Speaker 2: And there's a link in the show notes to hear

1016
00:48:02,325 --> 00:48:05,725
Speaker 2: the rest of that bonus episode right now. This episode

1017
00:48:05,725 --> 00:48:08,005
Speaker 2: of No Filter was produced by GM moylan and the

1018
00:48:08,045 --> 00:48:19,485
Speaker 2: executive producer he lies Ratliffe. See you next week, Hm,