Speaker 1: Welcome to Mummy, are out loud? What women are actually
Speaker 1: talking about on Friday, the twelfth of June. I'm Clare Stevens,
Speaker 1: I'm Amelia Leicester and I'm m ven M Holly Is.
Speaker 2: Guys.
Speaker 1: You may notice I'm driving and I'm pretending. I am
Speaker 1: pretending to be Hollywayne right right now. But there will
Speaker 1: be errors. I can assure you that I quite miss
Speaker 1: Holly today.
Speaker 3: Ye else, I'm missing her presence. I mean, so far,
Speaker 3: so good. You didn't stop up the day, you know.
Speaker 4: Honestly, I'm really happy she's away because this is my
Speaker 4: chance to like break into the Friday Show.
Speaker 2: We get to talk about fun things I've had recom recommend.
Speaker 2: Here's what's on our agenda for today.
Speaker 3: There's a new type of influencer that's making money by
Speaker 3: simply having no friends.
Speaker 4: In Friday Rex, there's a word of mouth hit TV
Speaker 4: show which is unlike anything else you have ever seen.
Speaker 1: Plus is you look good for your age? Actually the
Speaker 1: ultimate backhanded compliment.
Speaker 4: But first, did you have to battle for space this
Speaker 4: morning to brush your teeth and to do your morning
Speaker 4: ablutions with other people?
Speaker 2: It's so you were like me? You did Claire?
Speaker 3: Well, I live alone, So that would have been quite traumatizing.
Speaker 2: If you like, hello, someone in here.
Speaker 4: Well, Claire, you and I are just like celebrities, or
Speaker 4: at least some celebrities. Tom Hanks and Rita Wilson, who
Speaker 4: have been married for thirty eight years.
Speaker 2: They look like a very happy couple.
Speaker 4: People are always asking them the secret to why they've
Speaker 4: been married for so long, and Rita recently gave a
Speaker 4: very unexpected answer, and that is a shared bathroom. Sounds
Speaker 4: kind of counterintuitive, but she explains that it's where you
Speaker 4: laugh about what you're doing in the mornings, you're thinking
Speaker 4: about what you're doing that day, maybe you make some
Speaker 4: plans to meet up later. It kind of makes sense
Speaker 4: when she explains it. Now, this is a controversial perspective
Speaker 4: because other celebrities disagree. Take Michelle Obama. She and Ack
Speaker 4: Obama have been married for thirty three years, and here
Speaker 4: she is on the Today Show talking about the secret
Speaker 4: to their long marriage.
Speaker 3: Now, one of the keys to a successful marriage is
Speaker 3: separate bathroom.
Speaker 2: So it's a lot when he enters my bathroom. Sometimes
Speaker 2: I'm like, why.
Speaker 3: Are you in here? What are you doing?
Speaker 4: And he's like, I live here, Can I enjoy my
Speaker 4: bathroom too. One celebrity who I guess kind of splits
Speaker 4: the difference on this very important topic that I've been
Speaker 4: dying to talk about on a Friday show for a
Speaker 4: long time is Megan Trainer. All about that base. She
Speaker 4: and her husband, Darryl Sabara have been married for eight years.
Speaker 4: I learned today that he is the little kid in
Speaker 4: the express.
Speaker 3: Oh he does buy kids as well.
Speaker 2: Oh, okay, there you go. I knew it was someone
Speaker 2: I just never bothered to look it up.
Speaker 4: And she, of course is in the infamous mothers group
Speaker 4: that yeah yeah, created a lot of headlines earlier this
Speaker 4: year for being mean girls. Anyway, they got two toilets
Speaker 4: installed side by side after their first child. In the
Speaker 4: same interview with Kiss La Fa, she mentioned that her
Speaker 4: husband sits when he urinates, which I did not know
Speaker 4: men did that, and that they often pee at the
Speaker 4: same time. But Megan assures us, and this is a
Speaker 4: direct quote, we don't poop together. I am so glad
Speaker 4: she clarified that. And also do men often sit to pee?
Speaker 2: No, I thought that was the weird ones. I did
Speaker 2: want to say that I'm confused by that. It's like
Speaker 2: he's not paying honey, he scrolling on his But how
Speaker 2: is it going for you? And Rory?
Speaker 4: Do you think you'll get a second toilet installed after
Speaker 4: this baby comes, like next year the first one?
Speaker 2: That's a great question.
Speaker 1: The layout of our bathroom is such that there is
Speaker 1: not room to move, let alone put another toilet, as
Speaker 1: much as I would love one. So we share our
Speaker 1: one bathroom between the two of us and a toddler,
Speaker 1: and there's going to be so we're going to be
Speaker 1: a fan family of four with one bathroom.
Speaker 2: And it hadn't always been that way.
Speaker 1: So when I first moved out of home, I lived
Speaker 1: with me Jesse and Rory. And Jesse and I shared
Speaker 1: a bathroom and Rory had one to hear because I
Speaker 1: liked stealing her beauty products and she had nice things
Speaker 1: from the shower.
Speaker 2: And so on.
Speaker 1: And sometimes she would yell at me and be like,
Speaker 1: can you share with your like very long term partner,
Speaker 1: like that would.
Speaker 2: Be the more conventional a region.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I'm go, I guess beard hair everywhere and
Speaker 1: he's like and he's soap caked on to the side.
Speaker 1: But I do think that there is such a luxury
Speaker 1: in not sharing. However, the more I read about this,
Speaker 1: the more I thought, there's something quite beautiful about what
Speaker 1: happens when you share a bathroom with someone, and that
Speaker 1: is that you really see who they are.
Speaker 2: You see the essence of who they are.
Speaker 1: I think that there's something that brings you closer in
Speaker 1: a way. You may not want to be that close,
Speaker 1: but I think it pays off.
Speaker 2: I really do.
Speaker 3: No one needs to see me in a bathroom. I
Speaker 3: promise you you don't need. What really annoyed me is
Speaker 3: that Tom Hanks and Rita Wilson can afford at least
Speaker 3: two bathrooms.
Speaker 2: Why it's adorable.
Speaker 3: It's not adorable.
Speaker 2: I was like, what too?
Speaker 4: Like?
Speaker 3: I know they could have a bathroom each and then
Speaker 3: an extra bathroom just in case. I like living with someone,
Speaker 3: my biggest fears having to share a bathroom with them,
Speaker 3: And because of Sydney prices, I know that the rest
Speaker 3: of my life I will probably be sharing a bathroom
Speaker 3: with someone else. And I love my own like solutude
Speaker 3: time in a bathroom. I like doing my toilet stuff
Speaker 3: in there by myself. I also live in a studio,
Speaker 3: so my bathroom door is the only door I have
Speaker 3: in my whole place. I love being at my sink
Speaker 3: by myself. I love showering, I love doing my skincare,
Speaker 3: and then when I come I'm a different person when
Speaker 3: I leave the bathroom, and I don't need someone else
Speaker 3: to witness that.
Speaker 2: I've got bad news for you.
Speaker 4: And because Catherine Jesus Morton, who writes the fabulous Brooding
Speaker 4: column in The Cut, she just this week wrote a
Speaker 4: defense of the shared bathroom, and in it she argues
Speaker 4: that in order to have healthy adult relationships, you have
Speaker 4: to eventually learn how to deal with each other's gross
Speaker 4: physical body stuff in bathrooms.
Speaker 2: No, she says, even.
Speaker 4: Those of us who are most committed to the bit
Speaker 4: that our partners don't shit eventually have to accept the truth.
Speaker 4: This is basically what it means to acquire maturity, to
Speaker 4: accept that we can't control everything and that everyone has
Speaker 4: a private body made of the same materials.
Speaker 3: Okay, what happens if you both get gastro.
Speaker 2: It's actually really bonding.
Speaker 1: It's actually really profound how close you become. I honestly
Speaker 1: reckon Rory and I still talk about it. One of
Speaker 1: the most like we've been together for so long and
Speaker 1: yet one of the most bonding experiences that we have
Speaker 1: had was after I gave birth to Matilda and Amelia,
Speaker 1: you would know a lot happen. You see a lot,
Speaker 1: you're just there's a lot of smell. It's a lot,
Speaker 1: and there's one bathroom. And because I was scared of
Speaker 1: going to the toilet, I said, I'm gonna keep this,
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna keep this open because I'm scared and
Speaker 1: I need to talk to you while I go to
Speaker 1: the toilet. And we came out.
Speaker 2: Of that being like this we unlocked a new level.
Speaker 1: We unlocked a new level of love, and I reckon
Speaker 1: Otherwise you get to what illness, you get to old
Speaker 1: age and you're like, ooh, I don't want to smell
Speaker 1: your incontinence, and it's like, well, you're gonna.
Speaker 2: Have to, because we're all headed that way.
Speaker 1: It's broadly understood as a compliment that everyone over a
Speaker 1: certain age wants to hear you look so good for
Speaker 1: your age, or you don't look your age, or if
Speaker 1: you're a psychopath, you play a game with someone where
Speaker 1: you say how old do I look? And I say
Speaker 1: twenty five and you say what, I'm actually seventy, And
Speaker 1: it's like happens all the time, And in a culture
Speaker 1: obsessed with aging, it's no surprise that so many of
Speaker 1: us like to hear that we look younger than we
Speaker 1: actually are. Like, if you're looking at beauty products so
Speaker 1: often you're looking at anti aging stuff. So it's like,
Speaker 1: why wouldn't I want to hear that. I guess it's working.
Speaker 1: I always think with the amount of anti aging products
Speaker 1: there are, you know how every anti aging product you buy,
Speaker 1: it's like, this makes you look like X years younger
Speaker 1: in a week. I'm like, I should be a newborn
Speaker 1: at the point from how much I've spent on this stuff.
Speaker 2: Anyway.
Speaker 1: A recent article in Vogue by Poona Bell titled stop
Speaker 1: telling Me I look good for my age shared a
Speaker 1: very different perspective on this. She said that she was
Speaker 1: at a bar with a group of friends that were
Speaker 1: all in their thirties and forties, and she was actively
Speaker 1: trying to flirt, and then she clocked that everyone around
Speaker 1: them was fifteen to twenty years younger than her. She
Speaker 1: acknowledged that everyone was too young for her own interests,
Speaker 1: and another woman at the table, who was younger than
Speaker 1: Belle said, you don't look your age, though, and the
Speaker 1: others chimed in to agree, and it became a whole
Speaker 1: group conversation and respect to our friend Porner, she was like,
Speaker 1: why am I pissed off? I'm going to prosecute why
Speaker 1: I'm pissed off by that comment, which is my favorite
Speaker 1: when somebody when somebody you're out to drinks and someone's like,
Speaker 1: I'm annoyed, I'm annoyed.
Speaker 2: Let me explain, let me break it down.
Speaker 1: So she was like, I wasn't being self deprecating. I'm
Speaker 1: genuinely not interested in dating or hooking up with younger people.
Speaker 1: And the reassurance that I don't look my age is
Speaker 1: seeped in ageism and the fact that why on earth
Speaker 1: would I want to even though I'm very happy with
Speaker 1: where I am in life, And she said, I don't
Speaker 1: want to cosplay as a younger person.
Speaker 2: I'm more confident I like myself.
Speaker 1: And I thought it was a really fascinating insight into
Speaker 1: the fact that not everybody is walking around wanting to
Speaker 1: be told they look twenty five when they're not. Amelia,
Speaker 1: I have absolutely no idea how old you are, but
Speaker 1: you look beautiful for your age.
Speaker 4: First of all, being told you have absolutely no idea
Speaker 4: how old I am. I'm just going to take that
Speaker 4: as a great compliment, Like, for some reason, it just
Speaker 4: really makes me feel good to be enigmatic and the serious.
Speaker 2: So you are as serious.
Speaker 4: Second of all, I am also glad that she unpacked.
Speaker 4: Why this made her feel weird because a colleague said
Speaker 4: to me just recently, I got a haircut and this
Speaker 4: colleague said to me, oh, it's taken ten years off you,
Speaker 4: and that.
Speaker 2: Made me feel weird. Yeah, why why did that make
Speaker 2: me feel weird?
Speaker 1: It could because you're like, take ten years off me,
Speaker 1: that would make me fine.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was part of that's for sure.
Speaker 4: And then I got thinking about how when when I
Speaker 4: remember that when I was in my teens and twenties,
Speaker 4: I didn't want to be told I looked young.
Speaker 2: But then at what point.
Speaker 4: Do you switch over to actually seeking out the comments
Speaker 4: about looking young? And you you famously just turned thirty.
Speaker 3: I famously just turned thirty, And I.
Speaker 2: Feel like, where are you on that divide now?
Speaker 3: It was probably the last few years where I've been
Speaker 3: so aware of my age and getting older, and I
Speaker 3: can pinpoint the exact instance. It was last year I
Speaker 3: was twenty nine and I was hosting a trivia night
Speaker 3: for some people, kind of my side gig.
Speaker 2: I expected that an don't just start.
Speaker 3: It's not a side gig. I think someone just thought
Speaker 3: I was fine and was like, you might hosting the
Speaker 3: trivia night, and I was like, yeah, you know what,
Speaker 3: I'll do it. So we did the trivia night. It
Speaker 3: was with a lot of the people playing were like
Speaker 3: younger men, and it got to a point where there
Speaker 3: were two teams who both had like the same amount
Speaker 3: of points, and the person who was organizing the trivia
Speaker 3: night didn't really have a plan for what to do,
Speaker 3: so they were like, okay, breaking point, guess Emily's age,
Speaker 3: and whichever team is the closest.
Speaker 2: W oh god. You were doing this as a.
Speaker 3: And that was the first time. I feel like if
Speaker 3: this had happened even three years earlier, I would have
Speaker 3: been like, yeah, that's a fun, fun thing they've not
Speaker 3: heard of.
Speaker 4: Asking how many people survived the Titanic.
Speaker 3: And I was just sitting there and I was watching.
Speaker 3: I was watching these guys kind of like look at me,
Speaker 3: and I'm sitting there in the host chair like analyzing
Speaker 3: my face. And I walked past the table of these
Speaker 3: group of boys and they were like, oh, she's got
Speaker 3: to be somewhere in her thirties a lah, and then
Speaker 3: no one guessed my age. Everyone gets older, and I
Speaker 3: had got a full complex about it.
Speaker 2: I never host trivia again.
Speaker 3: Never hosting again. I've lost that friendship. Not but it
Speaker 3: fully gave me a complex. And I think it was
Speaker 3: also because it was men, mostly men, getting my age.
Speaker 3: The ones that were closer to twenty nine were the
Speaker 3: ones who had girls on their team, and it fully
Speaker 3: made me smile. But that was the first time where
Speaker 3: I was like, oh my god, I'm so aware of
Speaker 3: how old I am.
Speaker 4: I have read, No, I don't know if this is true,
Speaker 4: but I have read that you can with a lot
Speaker 4: of accuracy tell what age someone is if they are
Speaker 4: younger than you, but if it's someone who is older
Speaker 4: than you, you got no idea, Like you lack the
Speaker 4: sort of coordinates to tell.
Speaker 2: Do you think that's true?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Like I can always like vibe wise, I
Speaker 1: always know when someone's younger than me, although I don't
Speaker 1: know if they're twenty one or twenty two.
Speaker 4: Here's the other thing about it, Like whatever age is
Speaker 4: older than yours, it's really just a big mass. So
Speaker 4: right now I'm around forty and everyone who's like say,
Speaker 4: fifty on, I'm just like, I have no idea, yeah yeah,
Speaker 4: but whereas below forty, I feel each one of those
Speaker 4: ages acutely.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because you went through it, you know, and I
Speaker 3: feel the same. I feel like similar to you, Claire.
Speaker 3: Right now, anyone in their twenties are just in their twenties,
Speaker 3: like I can't actually see the difference between twenty one,
Speaker 3: twenty five, twenty seven. But when I was in my twenties,
Speaker 3: I was so aware of the early twenties, mid twenties,
Speaker 3: late twenties because I felt like complete different eras of
Speaker 3: my time. And now it's that age where when I'm
Speaker 3: thirty and I tell people I'm thirty, the first thing
Speaker 3: they go is, you're so young. You're so young. It's
Speaker 3: more of like a dim worry.
Speaker 2: I said that to you.
Speaker 4: I'm so sorry to They also tell you look for
Speaker 4: your age.
Speaker 3: I think, but it's coming back to your haircut thing. Yes,
Speaker 3: I have a feeling that you felt when someone told
Speaker 3: you you look what you look so much younger.
Speaker 4: She said, it's taken ten years and by the way
Speaker 4: she meant, well, it just.
Speaker 2: Did not hit right with me.
Speaker 3: But I think it comes to when someone makes an
Speaker 3: alteration to their appearance is done so because you want
Speaker 3: to look younger, and sometimes you just want a haircut.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, it is that. That's exactly what Belle said
Speaker 1: in her article. But basically, when when her friends were
Speaker 1: saying you don't look your age, she felt like her
Speaker 1: she felt very observed, which is I think how you
Speaker 1: felt that people are looking at you and analyzing like
Speaker 1: does her face move?
Speaker 4: Does like I'm using some objective yardstick of what that
Speaker 4: age should look.
Speaker 1: Like exactly, and that the arbitrary standard of beauty is youth,
Speaker 1: and I don't fully subscribe to that. Like I have
Speaker 1: a lot of conversations with friends where we sit around
Speaker 1: and we will we'll sometimes look at photos of ourselves
Speaker 1: in like you know, when we were twenty and in
Speaker 1: Europe and that kind of thing and be like lol,
Speaker 1: but we all are like no, no, no, no, we are.
Speaker 1: The thing about being young is that you haven't figured
Speaker 1: out how to style yourself or anything like that. So
Speaker 1: we all say to each other like, we actually look
Speaker 1: our best now because we figured out like not to
Speaker 1: take risks with the hair, and to like how to
Speaker 1: dress and just how to be less weird and figured
Speaker 1: out a lot of our neuroses, and so it is
Speaker 1: when somebody implies that basically you don't look your age,
Speaker 1: that they think you look younger.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I don't want to be any younger.
Speaker 1: I don't want to be any younger because I wasn't
Speaker 1: I wasn't me, and I wasn't confident, and I don't
Speaker 1: consider myself.
Speaker 4: That said, I want to gauge whether you guys think
Speaker 4: it's okay to ask someone how old they are, because yes,
Speaker 4: I agree Claire that it's not like everything that you
Speaker 4: do after a certain age is about trying to look young.
Speaker 4: But I think that the problem with asking someone how
Speaker 4: old they are is that there is no right way
Speaker 4: to respond, because if you want to avoid this, you
Speaker 4: look with your age. What are you meant to do?
Speaker 4: Like it's an age? What are you meant to say?
Speaker 4: And that's why I don't think you should ask that question.
Speaker 3: I don't think you should ask the question. But I
Speaker 3: really want to know. Yes, I want to know how
Speaker 3: everyone is. And I think that's a fully like self
Speaker 3: indulgent wanting to know because I just want to compare
Speaker 3: my life to your life and see what you've achieved
Speaker 3: up until that age. Compared to what I'm achieving up
Speaker 3: until that age. I do this all the time during
Speaker 3: the Olympics. The last Olympics of the twenty twenty four
Speaker 3: Paris Olympics was the first Olympics where most of the
Speaker 3: athletes were youngnger than me.
Speaker 2: And I think that's a turning point.
Speaker 3: It's a turning point because you grow up as a
Speaker 3: kid and you're like, I could be that, I could
Speaker 3: do that, and then you're suddenly thirty and you're like, oh,
Speaker 3: I guess I'm not going to be an Olympian. That
Speaker 3: ship set, it's not going to happen. I also remember,
Speaker 3: so specifically the first celebrity I knew that was younger
Speaker 3: than me, and it was Lord Oh and we were
Speaker 3: born in the same year, but she was I think
Speaker 3: six months younger than me. And I was sixteen and
Speaker 3: she was fifteen, and I just saw this girl going.
Speaker 3: And up until then, all my favorite celebrities, all the
Speaker 3: pop stars, were all older than me. And I was like, oh,
Speaker 3: I have time. I have time to be a pop star.
Speaker 3: And then Lord was out with Taylor Swift, she was
Speaker 3: making Royals, she was doing these big stadium tours. Looked
Speaker 3: up her age fifteen years old, and I my whole
Speaker 3: world had crashed down.
Speaker 4: Good barometer. I remember the celebrity for me was Nicki Webster.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, yeah, Strawberry Kiss is famous and younger than me.
Speaker 2: How is this possibly?
Speaker 4: Say?
Speaker 1: Mine? Mine is is Emma Watson. Oh so her being hermione?
Speaker 1: I was like, how she got her Hollywood career already
Speaker 1: and I'm just here. And then every time she does
Speaker 1: something really impressive, like gives a speech at the un
Speaker 1: I'm like, you're still still going strong vibe.
Speaker 2: I still go on strong.
Speaker 3: It's like I feel like that's when you as a kid,
Speaker 3: You're just like, oh no, I have to lock in,
Speaker 3: like it's no more a dream, like people are actually
Speaker 3: doing this.
Speaker 1: But the one thing I will say about this article,
Speaker 1: and I am finding it more and more. And it's
Speaker 1: because I spend too much time on the internet. I
Speaker 1: get a bit uncomfortable with policing little offhanded comments and
Speaker 1: like headlines slash articles that are about don't say this
Speaker 1: because I find myself in social situation. I think it
Speaker 1: contributes to social anxiety massively. And you could simply say
Speaker 1: something like that, it comes out and then you're left
Speaker 1: questioning it for days and days and days when most
Speaker 1: people you ask about their age or say oh you
Speaker 1: look really good or whatever, aren't going to think about it.
Speaker 2: But I don't think that there is anything objectively rude
Speaker 2: about asking people how old they are.
Speaker 4: It's just a fun Really, do you mind when someone
Speaker 4: asks you.
Speaker 1: No, no, I'm like, oh, yes, this will contextually place
Speaker 1: me in the world as a.
Speaker 3: Person, And how do you expect them to reply?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not that it's rude.
Speaker 4: It's more that response like what do you What do
Speaker 4: you say when someone says I'm thirty eight?
Speaker 2: Oh cool, that's great for you, Like, there's no response. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I know.
Speaker 1: It is a bit of a conversation dead end. That's very,
Speaker 1: very true. I often ask it in the context of
Speaker 1: like maybe we're in similar circles or no similar people,
Speaker 1: and so I'm like, how old are you?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 1: Okay, you might know my cousin like that kind of thing,
Speaker 1: but I I know what you mean. Otherwise it is
Speaker 1: a bit of a dead end. And I have every
Speaker 1: now and then had like a young person asks you
Speaker 1: how old you are, and you're like, don't patronize.
Speaker 3: Me older than you out louders in a moment the
Speaker 3: new type of influencer that has no friends, live alone,
Speaker 3: is single, and I'm a little bit jealous of.
Speaker 5: Hey, out louders, it's mea here. On our Thursday subscriber episode,
Speaker 5: we got a little bit racy.
Speaker 2: It was Claire, it was m it was me.
Speaker 5: We were talking about Off Campus, the show that is
Speaker 5: a bit sexy, quite talkie and that everybody's talking about.
Speaker 5: We covered everything there is to know about this show.
Speaker 5: No spoilers, but god, you're gonna love it if you
Speaker 5: want to listen right now. If you love Off Campus,
Speaker 5: and even if you don't, you just will know what
Speaker 5: all the fuss is about. There's a link in the
Speaker 5: show notes you can listen right now.
Speaker 3: So social media influencers, I want to speak historically about them.
Speaker 3: Their job before they became very very big post COVID
Speaker 3: was to basically influence us into buying things. So whether
Speaker 3: it's hand cars, make our products. They had a very
Speaker 3: very simple job and we understood it as a consumer.
Speaker 3: Now influencers have changed into something completely different and they're
Speaker 3: much much bigger. We have trad wives who are influencing
Speaker 3: a way of life. We have people who live on
Speaker 3: farms who are influencing farm life. We have people who
Speaker 3: are working in finance who are influencing the nine to
Speaker 3: five corporate job, and we also now have loneliness influences.
Speaker 3: So the loneliness influences are people usually a young woman
Speaker 3: who lives alone and vlogs her nighttime routine, and her
Speaker 3: routine will include a title card that says, POV, you
Speaker 3: have no friends and live alone and this is how
Speaker 3: you spend your evenings.
Speaker 1: And we would just like to signposts. That is the
Speaker 1: wrong use of I'm sorry, it's not point of view.
Speaker 3: Well, as I was watching these videos, I was just
Speaker 3: thinking of you, Immelia.
Speaker 2: This is you Also, didn't think they look really esthetic.
Speaker 3: It's not technically their POV. It's our POV watching.
Speaker 2: Them, Yes, that's the one.
Speaker 3: And they're basically vlogging their evenings, which all include them
Speaker 3: coming home, doing their dishes, cleaning up their apartment, making
Speaker 3: themselves a dinner, watching TV, doing their skin carotene. Stuff
Speaker 3: that we do but like not including the going out
Speaker 3: to drinks with friends, not returning a book to the library,
Speaker 3: not saying hi to your mum and dad. Just kind
Speaker 3: of them by themselves, and they've kind of marketed this
Speaker 3: as something that you should be really looking forward to
Speaker 3: as someone who has no friends, no partner and lives alone.
Speaker 3: Have you guys seen these videos and what are your thoughts?
Speaker 1: I get these pop up in my feed so much,
Speaker 1: and it's like.
Speaker 3: You want this class?
Speaker 1: Yeah. I think part of it is rage baby, like
Speaker 1: a part of it is like pov, I'm someone with
Speaker 1: no friends. Like it's there's no nuance to it. It's
Speaker 1: like I haven't no friends and you're like, I'm sure
Speaker 1: you have one friends. I'm sure you have literally, which
Speaker 1: is actually kind of impressed. You tried really hard to
Speaker 1: have no friends. So I feel like there is a
Speaker 1: rage baby element where it is asking you to be
Speaker 1: annoyed at gen Z for not having social relationships. But
Speaker 1: the reason I cannot look away is because there is
Speaker 1: also something deeply, deeply aspirational about it. The idea of
Speaker 1: coming home from work, your space is your, no one
Speaker 1: else has been there, You're not cleaning up after anybody else.
Speaker 1: You're walking in, You're eating exactly what you want to eat,
Speaker 1: when you want to eat it. For me, it's the
Speaker 1: wine glass, it's the goblet, It's the goblet with ice
Speaker 1: and diet coke. Yeah, I'm like that's all I ever
Speaker 1: want is diet coke with ice, and I don't have
Speaker 1: time to pour it in a wine glass, and that
Speaker 1: seems lovely. And then they sit in front of their
Speaker 1: television and their lighting is how they and everything's.
Speaker 3: So slow and quiet and quiet, and they're not rushed.
Speaker 1: And I think it really is probably a lot of people,
Speaker 1: and probably women who are in a very different life stage,
Speaker 1: who are looking at that thinking, oh, that would be heaven.
Speaker 1: But I think most of us have also lived through
Speaker 1: that life stage like a time that felt it was
Speaker 1: and I don't even associate it with loneliness. It just
Speaker 1: was somewhat indulgent and you could and quiet, and you
Speaker 1: could live life how you wanted to, and God, I
Speaker 1: miss it.
Speaker 4: I think there were elements of loneliness to it. I mean,
Speaker 4: your twenties can be a weird time because for most
Speaker 4: people it's their first time living outside of their family unit,
Speaker 4: and it's a point in time when friendships start to
Speaker 4: get a bit more fraught in various ways. Money enters
Speaker 4: the pictures. Some people have a lot of money, some
Speaker 4: people have very little money. Some people are working all
Speaker 4: the time, some people are struggling to find their footing,
Speaker 4: and there are times, I think where when you were
Speaker 4: in that life stage, you do feel lonely, and yet
Speaker 4: you feel like you're not allowed to admit it, or
Speaker 4: at least I felt I wasn't allowed to admit it
Speaker 4: because it's meant to be. Everyone says to you, it's
Speaker 4: the prime of your life. You're meant to be always
Speaker 4: doing exciting things. I remember one time. It was in
Speaker 4: my late twenties, I guess, and I lived alone, and
Speaker 4: weekends were in particular quite challenging for me. I guess
Speaker 4: in part because I'm an extrovert and I felt like
Speaker 4: I needed to always line up plans. And one Sunday,
Speaker 4: the only plan I had was dinner with a friend,
Speaker 4: and that was actually not very many plans for me.
Speaker 4: And then the friend canceled on me that afternoon. She
Speaker 4: lived with her boyfriend. I remember that little detail. So
Speaker 4: I was like, so, you've been with your boyfriend on
Speaker 4: weekend and then she canceled on me, And of course
Speaker 4: she's allowed to cancel, But like, I just saw this
Speaker 4: expanse of time stretching out ahead of me, and it
Speaker 4: was really kind of confronting. So when I watched these videos,
Speaker 4: it took me back to that time. And it's interesting.
Speaker 1: Some of the criticism around this is that they're romanticizing
Speaker 1: loneliness and normalizing normalizing that. And I'm on the one hand,
Speaker 1: as you say, a lot of people have just lived
Speaker 1: that because that's just a phase of life for some people.
Speaker 1: It also might not be a choice, like you might
Speaker 1: just have to live in a different city for work
Speaker 1: or whatever, work remotely and you don't have that kind
Speaker 1: of day to day interaction with the community. But I
Speaker 1: saw some commentary that I thought was really interesting that
Speaker 1: it's like, so this content is romanticizing loneliness apparently, and
Speaker 1: it's like, is it not sadder to be the person
Speaker 1: who's sitting alone watching it?
Speaker 2: Which is it's like I'm alone in my or I'm
Speaker 2: not alone.
Speaker 1: I have I have a child in front of me
Speaker 1: and a partner in the next room, and I'm watching
Speaker 1: loneliness content.
Speaker 3: You're on the toilet and your shared bathroom.
Speaker 2: And I'm just staring at it.
Speaker 3: It's yeah. I Well. I want to say that I
Speaker 3: was actually the og Lonely influencer because I had a
Speaker 3: newsletter when I was twenty four to twenty five called
Speaker 3: The Lonely Girl's Guide, such a good name, Oh my god,
Speaker 3: and I just like wrote whatever I wanted.
Speaker 4: I think.
Speaker 3: I think I pitched it to Mama Mia and they
Speaker 3: were like, yeah, that sounds great, and then I just
Speaker 3: did whatever I wanted with it. But I remember wanting
Speaker 3: to do something like this because it was a time
Speaker 3: where my friendships were kind of splintering. Like we were
Speaker 3: in that era where a lot of my friends were
Speaker 3: finding their long term partners and were living outside of
Speaker 3: home and they had roommates or they had a partner
Speaker 3: they were living with, and I just felt like I
Speaker 3: was in a completely different phase of life, and I
Speaker 3: wanted that phase of life to be my brand. And
Speaker 3: I think what was so different, what was so different
Speaker 3: about then versus now, is that with the younger women
Speaker 3: that I'm seeing on TikTok being lonely influences, but a
Speaker 3: lot of them, it's not really a phase. It kind
Speaker 3: of is just their life. And it's very similar to
Speaker 3: to my sister, who's also in an early twenties, where
Speaker 3: a lot of them went through COVID during their early
Speaker 3: twenties when they went to college or university, so they
Speaker 3: had all their friends in high school and then they
Speaker 3: all had to do university online and not really make
Speaker 3: any friendships or any connections during that time, and then
Speaker 3: a lot of them then went straight into the workforce,
Speaker 3: working fully remotely. So for them, that's kind of all
Speaker 3: they've known. They haven't actually known that this could be
Speaker 3: a face because they actually haven't learned those skills on
Speaker 3: how to make friends outside of high school where they're
Speaker 3: not just forced to be with each other every single day.
Speaker 3: And I think that's what's so different about young people
Speaker 3: in their early twenties versus people in the later twenties
Speaker 3: and above. It's because they actually haven't had the chance
Speaker 3: or the opportunity to find friendships and.
Speaker 2: Don't necessarily know.
Speaker 1: That it requires a level of risk taking, a level
Speaker 1: of discomfort. The other thing is looking at these and
Speaker 1: you see how you can basically organ your day exactly
Speaker 1: how you want to because it's just on your terms
Speaker 1: and you don't have any friends and don't speak to
Speaker 1: your family or whatever. And it sort of reminds me
Speaker 1: of a theme that's come up a bit in the
Speaker 1: last few years about how inconvenience is the cost of community.
Speaker 2: That we have to be prepared.
Speaker 1: That people can be annoying, and they can change our
Speaker 1: plans and they can barge in and if you have
Speaker 1: people over, they're going to make your house messy and
Speaker 1: they're going to be loud, and that is kind of
Speaker 1: that's that's the price that you pay. And I think
Speaker 1: the more we get used to that kind of isolation,
Speaker 1: the more jarring we then find what people are actually.
Speaker 4: Lying, which is why I like M's point that this
Speaker 4: is I think that's so interesting what you point out
Speaker 4: about how for many young people of a particular age group,
Speaker 4: this is actually comforting to them because it's all they've
Speaker 4: really ever known. So it's one thing for you, Claire,
Speaker 4: or for another millennial to say you've got to go
Speaker 4: and make the effort to make friends. But it seems
Speaker 4: like they maybe didn't have those experiences at the most
Speaker 4: formative time. The only thing I worry about for them
Speaker 4: is that they may be creating a bit of a
Speaker 4: self fulfilling prophecy because Lana's solo life, who I think
Speaker 4: is broadly credited as starting the lonely influencer trend.
Speaker 2: Excluding M of course, she has close to her two.
Speaker 3: Hundred thousand followers.
Speaker 2: Wow, she got big here.
Speaker 4: She lives in Toronto, and she really has mastered the genre.
Speaker 4: She kind of just makes heating up a frozen pizza
Speaker 4: look really serene and tranquil. But she says, if you
Speaker 4: are on this journey of being alone, I'm so excited
Speaker 4: to be a part of it with you and to
Speaker 4: show how amazing it can be and how fulfilling it
Speaker 4: can be to make yourself happy and not rely on
Speaker 4: other people. She did this during a Christmas video of
Speaker 4: all things. Lena is twenty four. Her journey is just beginning.
Speaker 4: And what I worry about this is, yeah, she's making
Speaker 4: off this. She's obviously very successful to your point, and
Speaker 4: but I don't want her to decide that this is
Speaker 4: the way it has to be forever, even when there's
Speaker 4: a financial incentive for her to continue doing it.
Speaker 1: And once you make it your brand and you are
Speaker 1: earning an income, how do you then shift to like, oh,
Speaker 1: by the way, I actually really want to make some
Speaker 1: friends and join a social netball team.
Speaker 2: The other thing is.
Speaker 1: That obviously, by creating the content in the first place,
Speaker 1: it is clearly a bid for connection, but a different
Speaker 1: kind of connection, Like I don't think you'd feel like
Speaker 1: the impulse to share that and have other people say
Speaker 1: me to me, to me too. That is the antidote
Speaker 1: to loneliness, but it's not it's obviously not as rich
Speaker 1: as real life social experiences. The other thing I thought,
Speaker 1: and I've thought about this a lot. A few years
Speaker 1: ago I interviewed the comedian Josh Thomas and he and
Speaker 1: he's neurodivergent, and he told me that he thinks the
Speaker 1: fact that he is famous and people know him from
Speaker 1: his stand up comedy and his television and they might
Speaker 1: know him from social media, that it makes it easier
Speaker 1: for him in the real world because people have a shortcut,
Speaker 1: so he doesn't have to explain his weird sense of
Speaker 1: like people straight away know what they're getting. You know,
Speaker 1: he's got this quirky sense of humor, very very dry.
Speaker 1: He's got what he refers to as kind of a
Speaker 1: changing accent.
Speaker 2: And I wonder if social media does that.
Speaker 1: For people that it's like so with you know, Lana,
Speaker 1: that she would go out into the real world and
Speaker 1: people would say, oh, you're the girl he does the
Speaker 1: loneliness stuff, and then it's kind of this quick way
Speaker 1: to form a connection and you've done some of the
Speaker 1: groundwork already, just.
Speaker 2: Lana want to make that connection.
Speaker 3: I'm not sure you're the.
Speaker 2: Girl who has not even one, not.
Speaker 4: Even There's another just fascinating little quirk here which I'd
Speaker 4: love your take on. In particular, EM, is that Paulina
Speaker 4: C who is one of the other very famous Loneliness influencers.
Speaker 4: She lives in New York City. She's mentioned Lana, who
Speaker 4: we talked about previously, as her inspiration. There's some speculation
Speaker 4: that she is not real or maybe a very elaborate
Speaker 4: marketing campaign for infrared yoga mats. Oh my god, there's
Speaker 4: something a bit uncanny about her. On every video, she
Speaker 4: comes home and sanitizes the soles of her shoes. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and just seems to never have anything to do outside
Speaker 4: of coming home and sanitizing her shoes and hitting up
Speaker 4: a frozen pizza and pouring diet coke into a wineglass.
Speaker 2: Do you think there's some some.
Speaker 4: Credibility to that idea that maybe she's not real or
Speaker 4: maybe she's a marketing campaign.
Speaker 3: It was really interesting when I was seeing those comments
Speaker 3: about her being like a marketing campaign, and I hope
Speaker 3: she's not, because what I think is happened is she
Speaker 3: is materialistically speaking, so beautiful like she looks like l
Speaker 3: from legally Blonde, she dresses like an all pins, she's
Speaker 3: always an actor ware and I think us as a
Speaker 3: society go she can't be living alone and single with
Speaker 3: no friends like that doesn't make sense in my heart,
Speaker 3: There's no reason for it. And I think we always treat,
Speaker 3: especially young women who are single, we always treat as
Speaker 3: them as it is a very temporary part of their life,
Speaker 3: and I think we forget that being single, you can
Speaker 3: be single and still live a full life, and they're
Speaker 3: just choosing kind of not to. And what worries me
Speaker 3: about the loneliness influencer stuff is that they are pushing
Speaker 3: away connections because they become that they made this their brand,
Speaker 3: and they're influencing other young people to also make it
Speaker 3: their brand and show that Whereas if I was twenty
Speaker 3: four twenty five and I had these influences in my life,
Speaker 3: I would feel really reassured and safe in that. And
Speaker 3: there is a possible there is a world where I
Speaker 3: just would have avoided connection because I'm seeing these men
Speaker 3: who are making money, who have so many followers, so
Speaker 3: many people who are living the same life style as them,
Speaker 3: be okay because that's what I'm seeing. I'm not seeing
Speaker 3: them being sad, I'm not seeing them looking alone. I'm
Speaker 3: seeing them being really content and happy. And now we know,
Speaker 3: we're old enough to know that whatever we see on
Speaker 3: cameras not necessarily what we see off camera. I would
Speaker 3: just probably be in the same boat where I would
Speaker 3: push connection away because I'd be like, oh, I'm fine
Speaker 3: right now on my own, and maybe.
Speaker 4: You'd start sanitizing the sols of issues.
Speaker 3: I can promise you I'd never do that.
Speaker 1: There's also a theory that it's kind of being pushed
Speaker 1: by certain industries and by tech and things like meal
Speaker 1: delivery services, like all of these. Basically there's a lot
Speaker 1: of industries that benefit from us valuing things rather than
Speaker 1: people and by living further and further a great isolation,
Speaker 1: and so there are some theories about whether that's that's
Speaker 1: also what's happening.
Speaker 2: Because yeah, I.
Speaker 1: Don't need an infrared yoga mat oh god, I want
Speaker 1: one after the break, two TV shows and a very
Speaker 1: unlikely beauty record to set you up for the weekend.
Speaker 3: Vibes ideas atmosphere, something casual, something fun. This is my
Speaker 3: best recommendation.
Speaker 1: It's Friday, so we want to help just make your
Speaker 1: weekend a little bit better with our best recommendations.
Speaker 2: Amelia, you have the floor this fear.
Speaker 4: I've been dying to tell you about this. So I
Speaker 4: have a show called Widow's Bay. It is on Apple TV.
Speaker 4: It actually premiered in April, but I would say that
Speaker 4: the word of mouth around this show has been gathering steam,
Speaker 4: and in the last week, I've just had so many
Speaker 4: people seize me by the shoulders and say, you have
Speaker 4: to watch this show. So I have, and I love it.
Speaker 4: It's again, It's called Widow's Bay. The genre is comedy horror,
Speaker 4: which makes no sense.
Speaker 3: I love that genre.
Speaker 4: But I read this amazing inter you with a horror director,
Speaker 4: or rather my friend did, and he sent me the
Speaker 4: best bit of it, which I'm about to recount for
Speaker 4: you now, which said that horror and comedy for a
Speaker 4: director are basically the same thing because basically both require
Speaker 4: this kind of buildup of tension, and it's often a
Speaker 4: kind of physical tension that you're holding in your body,
Speaker 4: and then you release the tension either through a laugh
Speaker 4: or through a jump skit like something that makes you jump,
Speaker 4: something that makes you jump or laugh.
Speaker 3: Sinners was horror comedy Sinners.
Speaker 4: Exactly, and so this is the first show I've seen
Speaker 4: that really blends the two of them on the small screen.
Speaker 4: And what I love about it is that you're laughing
Speaker 4: out loud in an episode and then you're afraid to
Speaker 4: turn the lights off afterwards. Like it's a really interesting mix.
Speaker 4: It's set in this fictional New England town. It's very gothic.
Speaker 4: It has a lot of supernatural goings on in the town.
Speaker 4: It stars Matthew Reese, who you would know from the Americans.
Speaker 4: He specializes in like looking sort of like paranoid and
Speaker 4: like nothing's quite going right for him. And then this
Speaker 4: made it clip for this is why it's such a
Speaker 4: good show. It is actually made by Kate Dippold, who
Speaker 4: created Pucks and Wrack.
Speaker 2: Oh wow.
Speaker 1: So that for me, yeah, because it's it's comedy, but
Speaker 1: it's not slapstick. No, it's it's really really clever and
Speaker 1: it's got that because I've seen the trailer the trailer
Speaker 1: for this and it is next on my list, but
Speaker 1: almost like establishing a very real, authentic world.
Speaker 2: It's world bleoding exactly. That is part I love about it.
Speaker 4: It's like every episode a different character in this community.
Speaker 4: We're kind of spending time with them and exactly that's
Speaker 4: what I love about it.
Speaker 3: And you guys TV show too, I've got a TV
Speaker 3: show as well. It's also kind of an ensemble cast.
Speaker 3: It's a comedy, the kind of sitcom level comedy created
Speaker 3: by Mindy Kayling. So I knew it is my birthright
Speaker 3: to watch it because I watch everything that she creates
Speaker 3: and reads everything she creates. She's been working on like
Speaker 3: her trilogy for a really long time, and this is
Speaker 3: our last iteration of it because she's been work doing
Speaker 3: shows that I were big in her formative years. So
Speaker 3: she started with Never Have I Ever about like high school,
Speaker 3: and then she did sex Lives of College Girls about college,
Speaker 3: and now she's got this new show called Not Suitable
Speaker 3: for Work, and it's those years straight out to college.
Speaker 3: I think this is a big thing for Americans, especially
Speaker 3: or straight out of college or UNI. You kind of
Speaker 3: don't know what to do and you think you want
Speaker 3: a career, but you also just have to make money,
Speaker 3: so you're working these odd jobs while working on your career.
Speaker 3: Maybe you're doing an internship. But it's similar to what
Speaker 3: we said before where it kind of those splinter years
Speaker 3: where everyone in your friendship group is kind of doing
Speaker 3: something different. So it's about these five friends who live
Speaker 3: in the same building in Manhattan, and they all have
Speaker 3: different careers. One is a med student wanting to be
Speaker 3: an actor, one's in fashion, to our in finance, and
Speaker 3: it's about not only their friendship. So it has that
Speaker 3: kind of like Girls kind of edit where it's so
Speaker 3: fun the girls edit where they're all like intertwined and
Speaker 3: their friendships are really really big, but their individual store
Speaker 3: lines are about them at work, kind of like the
Speaker 3: movie Horrible Bosses, such a good movie, so you also
Speaker 3: are seeing them as individuals interact with their bosses and
Speaker 3: how they're they're kind of change themselves when in the workplace.
Speaker 3: It is so bloody funny that Mindy Kaling humor just
Speaker 3: cuts through so perfectly. It's just one of those shows
Speaker 3: that you can go through really really fast. The pacing
Speaker 3: is really fast in it. It launched with the first
Speaker 3: three episodes last week and now I think it's a
Speaker 3: weekly drop and I've just been binging it. It's really fun.
Speaker 3: Not suitable for work on Disney, plus love it.
Speaker 1: I have a beauty recommendation.
Speaker 2: You kind of play.
Speaker 1: It may be the first time I've ever had a
Speaker 1: beauty recommendation. As Amelia pointed out this morning, I am
Speaker 1: supporting a small business to startup by shouting out, Hailey Beans,
Speaker 1: she needs it, she needs it, Yeah, yeah, she just
Speaker 1: she doesn't have enough people who know about it. So
Speaker 1: with moisturizes, I've been through a journey because for me,
Speaker 1: it's very much about like I feel like my skin
Speaker 1: feels tight when I don't use the right moisture. It's
Speaker 1: not even so much about how it. I don't even
Speaker 1: know if it looks any different, but it's just how
Speaker 1: it feels that I'm like.
Speaker 3: That's dehydrated skin.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that one.
Speaker 1: That one, and that is different to dry skin. So
Speaker 1: I can never find the right product. And I was
Speaker 1: I was cursed a few years ago because Mecha sent
Speaker 1: me a big box of amazing products and there was
Speaker 1: a Thatcher mush and I was like, this product's great,
Speaker 1: I'll just go buy it. And then the issue was
Speaker 1: it was one hundred and twenty two dollars for fifty meals.
Speaker 2: Which is like over two dollars a meal. Meal that
Speaker 2: doesn't do very much.
Speaker 1: It's just so t I was like, would you put
Speaker 1: it that way, Clark, I just I shan't never out.
Speaker 2: Of my one bathroom for four people.
Speaker 1: So then I have been on a big jet, like,
Speaker 1: tried cheap o stuff, tried more expensive stuff like, and
Speaker 1: I just cannot find something that just makes my skin
Speaker 1: feel juicy and nice. So I had heard a lot
Speaker 1: about Haley Beeber's glazing milk, and I'd seen it on
Speaker 1: TikTok and I'd seen a beauty tutorial of her using it.
Speaker 1: Because what it does is it makes your skin look
Speaker 1: really dewy before you put your foundation on, which I
Speaker 1: can never achieve. I just look wet. And so I
Speaker 1: went in and I was like, shall I do it?
Speaker 2: And it was only.
Speaker 1: Thirty five dollars for sixty five meals, so that's the
Speaker 1: smaller size.
Speaker 2: But I was like, we got it, we'll try, We'll
Speaker 2: give it a try. And is it a moisturizer? Okay,
Speaker 2: it's unclear, it's an essence.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I don't know that.
Speaker 3: I think it's kind of like an in between a
Speaker 3: ton of Sarah meting. So you can do moisturizer.
Speaker 2: Are you putting a moisturizer on after it?
Speaker 4: Yes?
Speaker 1: Okay, So it comes out like the texture of meal milk,
Speaker 1: and you like rub it together and then you like
Speaker 1: press it in and then I've been putting a moisturizer
Speaker 1: on top, which is I recommended it in the newsletter
Speaker 1: where Holly asked for our beauty record.
Speaker 2: What was it?
Speaker 1: It is the Drunk Elephant Electrolyte water facial hydration mask,
Speaker 1: which I thought was a daily moisturizer.
Speaker 2: It's not. It's a mask. It's in the name. You're
Speaker 2: only But then when I went to.
Speaker 1: Rebuy it, the lady was like, you're allowed to put
Speaker 1: it on in the morning, and I'm like, thank you
Speaker 1: for your.
Speaker 2: Specific am I allowed to put this on in the morning.
Speaker 1: Like I'd like to use this as just a normal moisturizer,
Speaker 1: and just that you can do that, And I'm like, okay.
Speaker 2: I love the validation from her, and you needed it.
Speaker 1: Which is only a little bit cheaper than the thatcher.
Speaker 1: It's like ninety something dollars for fifty mili. But anyway,
Speaker 1: so I do my glazing milk and then I do
Speaker 1: that and I feel lovely. I feel really thank you.
Speaker 1: That's for your age. I forced you into that compliment.
Speaker 1: But no, the glazing milk apparently makeup artist day. It's
Speaker 1: really nice to put on before you make up.
Speaker 4: Are you using it twice a day, like morning and
Speaker 4: night or just as a makeup base.
Speaker 2: A morning and night? Okay, just because I like how
Speaker 2: it feels nice. I love that.
Speaker 1: That's all we have time for on today's Friday episode.
Speaker 1: A big thank you to the out louders and to
Speaker 1: our team who make this show possible every week.
Speaker 2: Thank you Amelia for stepping in.
Speaker 4: Oh my pleasure. I hope I can come back. I
Speaker 4: told Holy to extend her vacation.
Speaker 2: You've got more recos where that came from.
Speaker 3: Also, before we go, because Holly's away, I am taking
Speaker 3: over her newsletter this week. My credentials are good vibes.
Speaker 2: Yes, Lonely Girl.
Speaker 3: Thenly Girl returns. Oh my god, it's like it's meant
Speaker 3: to be Holly.
Speaker 2: For you to be away, I feel like you have
Speaker 2: to go really rogue and do something really weird. Yeah
Speaker 2: I don't.
Speaker 3: I don't. I didn't want to like ruin her house
Speaker 3: that she's so lovely built. But I think I might.
Speaker 1: No, No, I think I might to the ground to
Speaker 1: be hilarious. That's what she gets taken leave exactly If.
Speaker 3: You haven't signed up for it already, please do. Holly
Speaker 3: is amazing. She writes every week and she also gives
Speaker 3: us a little treat sometimes. We'll put a link to
Speaker 3: that in our show notes.
Speaker 1: Bye Sea Mummy acknowledges the traditional owners of the land
Speaker 1: on which we have recorded this podcast.