Speaker 1: We acknowledged the traditional custodians of the land we're recording
Speaker 1: on today.
Speaker 2: I'm sure there were mothers in my group that were
Speaker 2: feeling the same things. I felt that I would just
Speaker 2: had the blinkers on because the mental chatter was so loud.
Speaker 3: Hello, and welcome back to eat, sleep, shit, repeat, the
Speaker 3: Wildly I'm hinted podcast all about the man as that
Speaker 3: is motherhood and every little thing in between. I'm Kiri
Speaker 3: Cels and I am full of bases about sillies.
Speaker 4: It's because you just had a banana, I do. I'm
Speaker 4: Kelly McCarron and we've got a ripper of an epp
Speaker 4: for you this week. So no, dilly darling, Shall I
Speaker 4: just kick things off with my peak and my pitch?
Speaker 1: Go on your little foxy more on over there.
Speaker 5: He just goes, oh, I thank good, as it's not
Speaker 5: moti to do peak and pit and I was like,
Speaker 5: oh shit, I've got so many pits but no peaks.
Speaker 4: Well fine, I'm the most miserable person, but I always
Speaker 4: winch about things with a sense of humor.
Speaker 1: Well, I would say that your peak is that your
Speaker 1: face is settled and your looking.
Speaker 5: I am looking not too shabby.
Speaker 4: So I decided to an at home die job, a
Speaker 4: box die if you will, many a hairdresser.
Speaker 1: I'm staring at the repercussions of that right now.
Speaker 5: It's not that bad.
Speaker 1: Look, it's not that bad.
Speaker 4: In your own words, it's not horrendous. It's not horrendous. Yes,
Speaker 4: I have a ginge tinge, a little bit overtoned, greenish
Speaker 4: at the back.
Speaker 5: It's fine, it's fine. It's just hair.
Speaker 1: Don't do the job.
Speaker 5: It's just hair. So the peak is I guess that
Speaker 5: I'm still hot. Here, you are hot.
Speaker 4: Let's just go into my pitz because they're quiet, they're
Speaker 4: all funny.
Speaker 1: So can I just say that your period of hotness
Speaker 1: is running alongside my period of being.
Speaker 4: She turned up in these very pregnant pants and I went,
Speaker 4: why do you let the pants to my house?
Speaker 1: I was like, Kelly, they're the only pants have fit
Speaker 1: me right now. Okay, just fucking the stretchy fit.
Speaker 4: Really currently leaning into the stereotype of black women having
Speaker 4: big asses.
Speaker 3: Because Charlie's like, oh, I think it's it is tripled in,
Speaker 3: but it looks great.
Speaker 5: There is nothing quite like a juicy a rump.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I reckon, that's why it's a boy anyway, This
Speaker 1: is not about me, This is about you.
Speaker 4: Bad roots. Number one in my pits. Number two in
Speaker 4: my pits is my child has started saying for fuck's sake?
Speaker 1: So when did this happen?
Speaker 5: The first time?
Speaker 4: No, no, the first time it happened was a couple
Speaker 4: of weeks ago. I messaged my father, who has a
Speaker 4: huge problem with children swearing, and said, your grandson has
Speaker 4: a potty mouth. And my dad's response was, Luke should
Speaker 4: be proud of himself.
Speaker 1: Does Luke have a body mouth?
Speaker 5: This was part of the lull.
Speaker 4: Lenny didn't learn it from Luke, who says, for fuck's
Speaker 4: sake all the time you do all the time for
Speaker 4: fox sake? This for sake that I hear and I'm like,
Speaker 4: oh no. So that was a few weeks ago. I
Speaker 4: told him that he wasn't supposed to say that. Then
Speaker 4: the other night, I'm getting cranky about something and I'm like,
Speaker 4: fux sake, and then he just starts giggling and repeating
Speaker 4: it and repeating it, repeating it. Luke can't help himself.
Speaker 4: He bursts out laughing, and Lenny then obviously thinks it's
Speaker 4: hilarious and keep saying it.
Speaker 1: Of course he does. He's getting that positive reinforcement.
Speaker 4: So I just, yeah, that's quite the pit because all
Speaker 4: I'm imagining now is him going to daycare, beautiful misreget
Speaker 4: being like, oh no, something's happened. And then I'm going
Speaker 4: for fact's sake, and oh dear me, and of course
Speaker 4: it's my.
Speaker 5: Fault, of course, of course, of course.
Speaker 1: Wait, so did we do your peek?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 4: Your peak is just that you're hot. No, so I'll
Speaker 4: just tell you another bitch, another pitch.
Speaker 1: Three pits. We're so lucky.
Speaker 4: This one's annoying. I've got to have another thing on
Speaker 4: my bloody brain. No, when I tell you that I
Speaker 4: hate medical stuff, yeah, more than the average person. I
Speaker 4: get proper panic attacks. People get it doesn't hurt. Oh no, shit,
Speaker 4: it doesn't hurt. I'm thinking about the pressure and feeling
Speaker 4: things like go into my veins and like all the anticipation.
Speaker 4: It's just knowing that it's happening. It's foul, it's disgusting,
Speaker 4: and it's all I can focus on, and it really
Speaker 4: creeps me out, and I get very anxious about it.
Speaker 4: Even just a blood test, it sends me into a spiral,
Speaker 4: a proper spiral. So anyway, I have to have an
Speaker 4: awake procedure.
Speaker 1: Yuck, what do you mean? What are they gonna do?
Speaker 4: I feel like someone that's okay with medical stuff would
Speaker 4: be like, that's foul.
Speaker 1: What can you have that you're awake? That's like a procedure.
Speaker 4: Well, it's not like operation or anything. But what they
Speaker 4: do is, I'm going to spell it out for you.
Speaker 1: I'm already getting kind of here bebies antists.
Speaker 5: Okay, well, you're gonna have to listen.
Speaker 4: They're going to insert a catheter into the vein on
Speaker 4: my hands.
Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, step one.
Speaker 4: Hey, catheters then inflate a balloon in my elbow so
Speaker 4: that then they can feed something up through to the
Speaker 4: corotid artery in my neck.
Speaker 1: Why why do you have a carotid artery in your neck?
Speaker 5: Sweety, you do too. It's probably one of your nodules.
Speaker 1: It's like, what are you see? Sorry?
Speaker 5: Did you pass science?
Speaker 1: I don't think so? Okay, got it?
Speaker 6: Got it.
Speaker 1: Crottid artery is a piece of our body that we need.
Speaker 4: God, everyone has one. It's very important. We also have
Speaker 4: one in our leg.
Speaker 5: Wow. Yeah, that's why. Like, if a shark bites you
Speaker 5: too high, you bleed out by the time you get
Speaker 5: to water.
Speaker 1: Understood, Okay, crottid artery, So then where are we going
Speaker 1: from there?
Speaker 4: So then the crottid artery, they inject like a die
Speaker 4: into my brain from the corodid diary, different dies, and
Speaker 4: this is why I need to be awake, because I
Speaker 4: need to do different things for them while they're having
Speaker 4: a look at my veins in my brain.
Speaker 5: And I literally was like, I can't do that.
Speaker 4: No, there's a one percent risk of stroke with this
Speaker 4: sort of a thing, and I'm like one percent, Like
Speaker 4: you know, that's fine. Yeah, Well there's a zero point
Speaker 4: five percent of the aneurysm bursting at the size that
Speaker 4: it is yea, so which is like I'm kind of like, ok,
Speaker 4: it's only.
Speaker 5: A little bit bigger.
Speaker 1: So yeah.
Speaker 4: And also there's a chance that this might show that
Speaker 4: it's just a really dodgy looking vein not even.
Speaker 1: Okay, So is that why they wanted to do it
Speaker 1: to rule yes out?
Speaker 4: So I'm like, the way that my brain works is surely,
Speaker 4: because I will be in such a state of panic
Speaker 4: and anxiety, my blood pressure is going to be higher.
Speaker 4: Surely that like then ups my risk of a stroke
Speaker 4: by tenfold. So I was like, I'm just not doing it.
Speaker 4: I told my family. I told Luke that I'm I'm like,
Speaker 4: I'm sorry, I'm just.
Speaker 5: Not doing it. I cannot do that.
Speaker 1: And there's not another way, Like there's something.
Speaker 5: This is it. I guess it's a peak.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 5: I found one.
Speaker 4: Talking to Sandy, my bestie friend of the pod we've
Speaker 4: had her on. She's a nurse, and she was like,
Speaker 4: I don't understand why no one has spelled this out
Speaker 4: for you. She's like, they told you that they would
Speaker 4: sedate you, correct, like not put you to sleep, but
Speaker 4: sedate you.
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, oh so they will sedate you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but not they'll give you like some valium or something.
Speaker 5: No, well that's what I thought.
Speaker 4: I was like, it'll just be stupid on valume, which
Speaker 4: is what I had with my laser eye surgery, doesn't
Speaker 4: do anything.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: She's like, no, the anetheist is there. She said, I've
Speaker 4: had this sedation every single time with my egg collection
Speaker 4: because I don't want to put you on because obviously
Speaker 4: that's like a thing. Yeah, she goes, I do not
Speaker 4: remember a single thing. You're so out of it, I swear,
Speaker 4: And she said, if at any point you are aware. Yeah,
Speaker 4: you're in so much a state of like whatevs because
Speaker 4: you're so drugged. You will be fine. So you'll just
Speaker 4: be like doing what they say. You probably won't even
Speaker 4: remember it.
Speaker 5: It will be fine.
Speaker 4: Oh Okayhames, you just really need to go friends. Thank you,
Speaker 4: Sandy Peaky Is I've got really good friends.
Speaker 1: Yes, we love it. So moving on to today's topic,
Speaker 1: It's something I'm very excited about given I have been
Speaker 1: a number two on the way post birth aftercare. Yes,
Speaker 1: something I've never really thought much about before, but something
Speaker 1: that definitely with this pregnancy has been top of mind.
Speaker 4: Oh yes, and you're really thinking about it this time around.
Speaker 4: So let's chat first about your aftercare experience with Rue
Speaker 4: and what you will be doing the same I guess
Speaker 4: post birth this time, and what you'll be doing differently
Speaker 4: with the big baby that's.
Speaker 1: Growing, big baby that we think maybe a boy, but
Speaker 1: we're not too sure. So with Rue, I went privately.
Speaker 1: I ended up having to get an emergency C section
Speaker 1: after a couple of days of laboring. Because I went privately,
Speaker 1: I was able to and also had a sea section.
Speaker 1: I was able to stay in the hospital for about
Speaker 1: a week, so at the end of that week, and
Speaker 1: while I was in hospital, I should say they were
Speaker 1: like breastfeeding classes. They were just like random classes that you.
Speaker 5: Could go to run one of the classes. Yes, friends,
Speaker 5: she did.
Speaker 1: She did, and I was like hey, yeah, And then
Speaker 1: when we interviewed her, I.
Speaker 5: Was like, yes, that's where I know.
Speaker 1: Who are you from?
Speaker 5: I got my titty out in front of you.
Speaker 1: At the time, like I didn't really think much. But
Speaker 1: we also put ruined nursery for like a few hours.
Speaker 1: I don't let you keep them in there for like
Speaker 1: nights on end, but we did like maybe a five
Speaker 1: hour stint where she was in the nursery on one
Speaker 1: of the nights so you could just get some get
Speaker 1: some sleep and get some rest. Then we were out
Speaker 1: on the Sunday, which was Mother's Day, and then on
Speaker 1: the Monday, Charlie's mum and dad arrived for a week.
Speaker 1: They didn't stay with us because we live in a
Speaker 1: little apartment, but they stayed in a hotel a couple
Speaker 1: of doors down and they would just come over in
Speaker 1: the morning, help us, just look after the baby, let
Speaker 1: me get some rest, cook for us, we go and
Speaker 1: have a drink.
Speaker 5: Were just like my god, that sounds so nice.
Speaker 1: It was really nice. And then after a week they
Speaker 1: left and it was just us. But I think a
Speaker 1: few weeks later I then joined my mother's group, and
Speaker 1: then that kind of became my support, my village, my
Speaker 1: people because I was very lucky with the Mother's group
Speaker 1: that I found, we were all very like minded.
Speaker 5: You really leaned into it as well.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but also I think it's just luck of being
Speaker 1: with people that are the same type of parent that
Speaker 1: you are, like non judge, going with the flow, not.
Speaker 5: Afraid to like be vulnerable, vulnerable.
Speaker 1: I think that was a big key, because you know,
Speaker 1: there were a couple of people who were like, everything's
Speaker 1: so great, and I was just like, is it you fuck?
Speaker 5: I mean, fuck, nothing's bad, nothing at all even hurt.
Speaker 1: Tell me, have you had sex yet?
Speaker 5: How's your vision?
Speaker 1: How is it good? So that was our first experience,
Speaker 1: which was really great. I think I actually realized probably
Speaker 1: how good that experience was with after we spoke to
Speaker 1: our upcoming person that we interviewed for this episode, Larissa.
Speaker 1: That was probably maybe the first time I really reflected
Speaker 1: on that whole journey and the help that we had
Speaker 1: this time around. Obviously things are going to be like
Speaker 1: quite different. We have a toddler, I am not working
Speaker 1: full time, like employed by a company full time. So
Speaker 1: and then in the way of family we have of
Speaker 1: course Charlie's brother and sisters shout out to Jim friend
Speaker 1: of the Pod, who are in Sydney. But obviously Charlie's
Speaker 1: mum passed away earlier this year. So I had been
Speaker 1: thinking about this for quite a few weeks, about the
Speaker 1: idea of like what's our aftercare gonna look, like, what
Speaker 1: support are we going to have? Of course, I know,
Speaker 1: given like recent events, like all of our friends have
Speaker 1: just you know, sent messages and said, hey, like we
Speaker 1: are here to support you during this time. But I
Speaker 1: also really worried just about like not having that maternal figure.
Speaker 1: And it's something I never worried about before because dev
Speaker 1: was like such a big part of.
Speaker 5: Very hands on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and like yeah, I always kind of had that
Speaker 1: in my back pocket, like, you know, she's the best
Speaker 1: resource that we could have. So I had done a
Speaker 1: little bit of reading and you know, duelers have been
Speaker 1: something that has been popping up quite a lot in
Speaker 1: recent years, and I kind of floated the idea to Charlie.
Speaker 1: I just and I was quite nervous because, look, it's
Speaker 1: not a cheap thing to do.
Speaker 4: It's also okay, I know that this isn't the right word,
Speaker 4: but it's a little bit woo woo when someone says, Duela,
Speaker 4: I think you automatically think free birthing, water birth at home.
Speaker 4: But it's like in a lake pushing your baby at yourself.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's not like that. It's also a luxury.
Speaker 6: It is a.
Speaker 1: Luxury, and I think free birthing and water birthing at
Speaker 1: home on one end of the scale.
Speaker 5: How too, if you want to do that, by the way,
Speaker 5: how to you.
Speaker 1: I still would like to be in a medical environment
Speaker 1: that just suits my personality. But I do really want
Speaker 1: like someone that's advocating for me, because in hindsight, when
Speaker 1: I'm looking back at my first berth, there are some
Speaker 1: things that I would have liked to have done in
Speaker 1: the moment, of course, to change it. It may not
Speaker 1: have had any effect on the outcome, but I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: I wonder if that did. But I wasn't like in
Speaker 1: a great state of mind to be advocating for myself.
Speaker 1: And Charlie it's the first time we're both doing it,
Speaker 1: you know. Like we did our best and we got
Speaker 1: a healthy baby out of it.
Speaker 5: You're literally just like learning as you go with the.
Speaker 1: First really, but as I said, like it is a
Speaker 1: bit of an investment. So we have already been paying
Speaker 1: for fucking private health for you know, since even before rue,
Speaker 1: So we've been paying for private health for like three
Speaker 1: and a half almost four years. It's not cheap monthly.
Speaker 1: It is in fact, robbery is what it is. Daylight hobbery,
Speaker 1: daylight robbery. And I was really nervous because, like, you know,
Speaker 1: just the way that everything is at the moment with
Speaker 1: cost of living crisis, like we are hanging on not flush. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I kind of said to him like, oh, baby, know,
Speaker 1: like we're gonna have a toddler this time around, We're
Speaker 1: not gonna have like the support that we necessarily had
Speaker 1: last time. Like, what would your thoughts be on getting Adula?
Speaker 1: Like we would use her for you know, we meet
Speaker 1: up with her maybe pre birth, she would be present
Speaker 1: at the birth, and then we can have as many
Speaker 1: check ins as we'd like post birth with her. And
Speaker 1: he I couldn't really even finish my sentence before he
Speaker 1: just said like, yeah, absolutely, I think that is a
Speaker 1: really good idea. He's just also like, we're all still
Speaker 1: really in.
Speaker 4: The depths of grief and you just don't know when
Speaker 4: those big swings are gonna come.
Speaker 1: So he was almost like, obviously, I'm gonna be there
Speaker 1: for you and be supportive, but I would love that
Speaker 1: if we had someone else as well in case I
Speaker 1: can't be there fully.
Speaker 5: And why are we both getting teary? You know, I'm
Speaker 5: not pregnant. What's my excuse? Ah?
Speaker 1: So that was wonderful, Like that was really good. We're
Speaker 1: both on the same page with that. So I was
Speaker 1: like very relieved, and then I just kind of put
Speaker 1: it out to my Sydney group of girlfriends like, hey,
Speaker 1: did anyone use a Duela? Would they recommend one? And
Speaker 1: one of my girlfriends Bellau wrote back, yep key, I'll
Speaker 1: message you privately and I was like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: I have just won the jackpot. Here a f the jackpot. Anyway,
Speaker 1: she was lovely. She actually told me about a service
Speaker 1: that exists called she Birth. So it's a website. They
Speaker 1: do a lot of stuff, but they have like a
Speaker 1: section that says what can I help you with? And
Speaker 1: it is dueller services. It's basically like a matchmaking service
Speaker 1: for you know, expecting parents and duellers. You can pay
Speaker 1: I think it's like five hundred dollars to use their service,
Speaker 1: and they'll go through what you're looking for, like what
Speaker 1: kind of support, because it is really bespoke what you
Speaker 1: need out of a dueler, and like what you're looking for.
Speaker 1: So for us, say we're really looking for someone who's
Speaker 1: quite maternal and who.
Speaker 4: I would be looking for like an overbearing mother in
Speaker 4: law type.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you want someone to take care of me? Yeah,
Speaker 1: And they can then narrow it down and they give
Speaker 1: you a couple of options. You can meet with them
Speaker 1: and then make your decision and if you're not happy,
Speaker 1: I think you can go back again. But really, luckily,
Speaker 1: she said, gave me the name of her So she
Speaker 1: gave me she birth's the name of her dollar that
Speaker 1: she used who she loved. But then she was like, also,
Speaker 1: my chiropractor is amazing. She has actually had a bit
Speaker 1: of time off because she's got young kids, but she
Speaker 1: was mentioning that she might want to come back, and
Speaker 1: she's like, if I had a second I would absolutely
Speaker 1: go to her because she's just so amazing. I went
Speaker 1: onto her website and she has like qualifications in like
Speaker 1: Chinese medicine, so that's like a big thing.
Speaker 4: So like, I think that's just like an added area
Speaker 4: that I'd like to explore for the second birth, like acupuncture,
Speaker 4: even just the way that Chinese.
Speaker 1: Culture approach post birth aftercare. Another girlfriend of mine who
Speaker 1: moved back from the States, she got a dollar and
Speaker 1: she did like the five five rules. So it's five
Speaker 1: days in the bed, five days on the bed, five
Speaker 1: days near the bed. This gives you a solid two
Speaker 1: weeks of focused, intentional rest. So basically post birth, you
Speaker 1: are letting your body move back to where it needs
Speaker 1: to be, like the organs are moving, You're actually resting
Speaker 1: your body rather than just trying to be up and about.
Speaker 1: And I say a lot of people are resting, but
Speaker 1: like conscious intentional rest where you're like, Okay, for five days,
Speaker 1: I'm inside the bed and it's a luxury. Like who
Speaker 1: knows if I'll actually be abut to do this, but
Speaker 1: I'm really interested in that though, different types of practices
Speaker 1: this time around because of what we've been through and
Speaker 1: I'm just really kind of aware of now more than ever.
Speaker 1: You know, post birth hormones, all of that stuff, having
Speaker 1: to deal with a toddler on top of that, Like,
Speaker 1: it's not going to be easy. So I think just
Speaker 1: having a bit more of a plan, someone to catch
Speaker 1: us if we fall that kind of.
Speaker 4: Thing, having guess summer baby, so you don't need to
Speaker 4: worry so much about what bugs rubrings home. I know
Speaker 4: that will be actually with this winter. Shout out to
Speaker 4: anyone that's had a baby over the past.
Speaker 5: You mins at home.
Speaker 4: So many of like my audience on an insta each week,
Speaker 4: right and we're picking pits and it's like, I've got
Speaker 4: a baby, I've got a newborn, and I've got a toddler.
Speaker 4: We are literally and you've got to take them to hospital.
Speaker 5: Like it's just sucks. It's awful. It is awful.
Speaker 1: Good thing is they have really good immune systems. By
Speaker 1: the time they get to you know, like daycare or whatever,
Speaker 1: they're tough as not. But that's kind of where we've
Speaker 1: landed at the moment, and I'm feeling really good about that.
Speaker 1: So instead of feeling like quite lost and maybe apprehensive
Speaker 1: about what that time is going to look like, just
Speaker 1: knowing that we're like have someone to help us and
Speaker 1: that we can call on as much as possible, like
Speaker 1: I think the fee will cover you know, a pre
Speaker 1: birth consult, the birth, and then maybe one or two
Speaker 1: after birth consults. But if you need more, you just say, hey,
Speaker 1: I need another consult, then that's just like an additional
Speaker 1: fee or whatever. So it's really how much you need.
Speaker 1: You can kind of tailor it to that, which I
Speaker 1: really like personally because it could be okay and that's
Speaker 1: all we need, or maybe I'm like, hey, I'm really
Speaker 1: struggling this week. Is there any way you could come
Speaker 1: over and help kind of thing. Yeah, So yeah, it's
Speaker 1: cool to be able to do it in a different
Speaker 1: way and also see what happens and plan, yeah, and
Speaker 1: really plan. I think, yeah, it's nice to have some
Speaker 1: control over a time that you have little to no
Speaker 1: control over.
Speaker 4: So because when you think about like, the public service
Speaker 4: is great, but you can't plan anything really like, no,
Speaker 4: you can't. You're not even generally guaranteed a midwife.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: So my midwife that I saw too through my pregnancy
Speaker 4: with regularity, but then the midwife that was on duty
Speaker 4: on the day was someone completely.
Speaker 5: Different and then I you know, their shift.
Speaker 4: Changed, so they got a new one and then different
Speaker 4: ones would come to my house.
Speaker 5: So yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's just you don't really have that sort of
Speaker 4: relationship building, I guess.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the continuity of care is like a really big
Speaker 1: yeah for sure, and just someone like in the birth
Speaker 1: just saying like knowing what to.
Speaker 4: Ask or for what you want to have a specific
Speaker 4: plan this time, yes, so hopefully we want to have the.
Speaker 5: Episode about back. Yeah you know that.
Speaker 4: I'm sometimes like so can't be bothered to it, mat
Speaker 4: it's boring. I could talk about beebacks till the cows
Speaker 4: come home.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, till the cows come home.
Speaker 4: Maybe because I'm like I would love to do it.
Speaker 4: I'm so jealousy you get chance to so proud of you.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm just going to try for the good thing
Speaker 1: about it is I have zero expectations, so if it
Speaker 1: ends with a seat and I'll be happy either way. Like,
Speaker 1: my recovery from my sea was fine. I didn't mind it.
Speaker 1: I actually like even though it was an emergency cesarean.
Speaker 5: It was still quite a nice experience, right, Yeah.
Speaker 1: Because Rue was fine, So I'm really fine with however
Speaker 1: it turns out. But I also know that during my
Speaker 1: birth with Rue, there were just a couple of things
Speaker 1: that I didn't try and I just I think, like,
Speaker 1: you're scared, right because you've never done it before. So
Speaker 1: I went never been in that much pain before, and
Speaker 1: you you cannot explain the pain exactly. And I went
Speaker 1: to the hospital three times, which is not good, like
Speaker 1: they tell you to not go as much and labor home.
Speaker 1: But because I went privately, it's like I called them
Speaker 1: and was like, hey, my waters are broken. They're like, okay,
Speaker 1: you need to come in. We need to like look
Speaker 1: at it. And I'm like okay, So I went in.
Speaker 1: Then I went home. Then I went back because I
Speaker 1: was like, I'm in so much pain. Surely I've dilated.
Speaker 1: This is after laboring all day. And then they're like, no,
Speaker 1: you've not dilated that much. And they're like you want
Speaker 1: to go home, and I was like, well yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: so but I couldn't even walk to the car.
Speaker 5: I don't know why you went home after that and.
Speaker 1: Then came back, you know, like five hours later, and
Speaker 1: then it was just like give me the drugs. But
Speaker 1: I feel like if I had been in one space
Speaker 1: with someone like just coaching me along or saying let's
Speaker 1: try this, let's try this, like Charlie was doing that.
Speaker 1: Of course but it was just we were also like
Speaker 1: he's knew it it too. We didn't know. Like I'm like,
Speaker 1: this is the most pain I've ever found in my life.
Speaker 1: Surely this is it, you know. And then they're like no,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, well, fuck.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So I think there's just like small things like that.
Speaker 1: I never got into the bath, which I've wondered if
Speaker 1: I would have liked some water. I think I just
Speaker 1: got there and I was like, give me the drugs, like,
Speaker 1: and they gave me morphine and then in the morning
Speaker 1: it was like, we're inducing you. So had I been
Speaker 1: a little bit more of a steady mind, like maybe
Speaker 1: before they induced me, I.
Speaker 4: Mean tried a few different things because you think about
Speaker 4: as soon as I don't know what the stats are,
Speaker 4: but induction increases chances of seeing indention.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, exactly. So it just kind of is like
Speaker 1: a trickle effect. Some people are fine. But in the
Speaker 1: end she was like flex her face was up. So
Speaker 1: I'm so happy with har everything turned out. I liked
Speaker 1: that I labored for ages because she was so awake
Speaker 1: when she was greater. She was like, oh, I've been
Speaker 1: bombing up and down for a couple of days, guys
Speaker 1: would never come.
Speaker 4: Thank god, someone decided to yank me out exactly.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I'm happy either way. I'm just keen to
Speaker 1: give it a shot, give it a go. Anyway, Enough
Speaker 1: about me. I know I'm not meant to say this,
Speaker 1: but when you do have your second, you're going to
Speaker 1: have I can only I can say that because we're
Speaker 1: very close friends. What would you do differently if you
Speaker 1: had another baby? When you have another baby?
Speaker 4: Everything, And I wanted to put my notes in even
Speaker 4: though I'm not having another baby. Maybe, but I wanted
Speaker 4: to give advice basically to anyone that's playing along at
Speaker 4: home and similar to me, maybe in personality or like,
Speaker 4: because this obviously wouldn't work for someone like Key. But yeah,
Speaker 4: so yeah, I would do everything differently. Oh, I actually
Speaker 4: don't think there is one thing I would do the same.
Speaker 1: Okay, talk me through these things.
Speaker 5: So my list.
Speaker 4: I would have maternityly, yes, of course, of course, of course,
Speaker 4: And even though then I start thinking, oh but maybe
Speaker 4: I could just do this or no, I would lean
Speaker 4: in to a proper maternity leave period where I do
Speaker 4: not have to think about anything. I would pre book
Speaker 4: this is like a personal Sydney thing. Sint John of God.
Speaker 4: So that is a private psychiatric hospital in Sydney with
Speaker 4: a mother and baby unit. Oh yeah, so that's the
Speaker 4: one that they wanted me to go to. That's the
Speaker 4: one that they suggested I attend. Yeah, which sounds so
Speaker 4: much more aggressive.
Speaker 5: You need to go to a sadboard, bitch, ma'am.
Speaker 1: We're going to admit you.
Speaker 5: We will be admitting you. I couldn't afford to be admitted.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was minimum thirty thousand dollars because my private
Speaker 4: health didn't cover it. I don't think I had private
Speaker 4: health at the time anyway. Now I have private health
Speaker 4: with psychiatric cover, so I would be able to go
Speaker 4: for like something like six hundred dollars for six weeks.
Speaker 4: They have art classes, you know how much I love
Speaker 4: my art. They have all of the help that you
Speaker 4: can get. Obviously you need to qualify, but I absolutely would. Yeah,
Speaker 4: of course I would have Ashley Friend of the Pod
Speaker 4: as my birth dueler.
Speaker 1: Oh she'd be great.
Speaker 5: She's so nurturing and caring. Yeah, she'd be such a
Speaker 5: good duela.
Speaker 4: And she has more time, like maybe when all the
Speaker 4: kids are at school and she's not building a huge
Speaker 4: house and doing a million different things. Maybe she actually
Speaker 4: because she would just be wonderful. Yeah, and I would
Speaker 4: make sure Luke knew what to do this time around,
Speaker 4: Like he just didn't know what to do. He didn't
Speaker 4: did you do the birth in class? We didn't do
Speaker 4: any class, He didn't do any reading nothing. Yeah, well,
Speaker 4: say I get him to know what to do. Also,
Speaker 4: I'd get him like I didn't want to be filmed,
Speaker 4: and he didn't know what to do because he was
Speaker 4: so shell shocked. I would still like, I'd just be like,
Speaker 4: just keep filming anyway.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know I can get any video either, but
Speaker 1: I quite like that though. I've got a lot of
Speaker 1: videos of rubing pulled out of my belly which are
Speaker 1: pretty funny.
Speaker 5: Yeah, they look so disgusting.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I've got that that the nek but like, and
Speaker 4: I've got weird photos of that Luke or the nurse
Speaker 4: took of me, like crawling and vomiting at the same time,
Speaker 4: or just in agony, like a great but I want, like, I.
Speaker 1: Just cannot imagine seeing that. What do you mean seeing
Speaker 1: you crawling in agony vomiting like I've.
Speaker 5: Shown you before, you can't see the vomit.
Speaker 1: I've never seen this, I just blocked it out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: maybe I.
Speaker 4: Will get it out and I would save enough money
Speaker 4: and not worry about, like as we talk about later
Speaker 4: with Laurissa in the episode, things that don't really matter,
Speaker 4: Like I know, I would save my money to put
Speaker 4: towards having a night nurse a couple of nights a week.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so I was guaranteed a bit of sleep.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. I remember Zolie Foster Blake did an interview
Speaker 1: I think she did it maybe like Australian Birth Stories
Speaker 1: or something, and she said like that she was not
Speaker 1: in a good way, and they and I think Hamish
Speaker 1: was like going and filming something overseas and he was like,
Speaker 1: I'm going to get you a night nurse to come
Speaker 1: a couple of nights a week, and she said it
Speaker 1: was like life changing.
Speaker 4: It's life. Even if your other night's awful, you know
Speaker 4: that you're going to have a few nights of sleep
Speaker 4: when you're in the depths of postpartum and you think,
Speaker 4: I genuinely don't know when I'm going to sleep again. Yeah,
Speaker 4: that's awful to be able to be like this night
Speaker 4: sucks balls, but I get to sleep on Thursday night.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: It just I think that that will well, yeah, that
Speaker 4: would just change the mentality. So yeah, those are some
Speaker 4: of the things that I would do differently, but overall everything.
Speaker 1: The thing is that to me says that you could
Speaker 1: do it again because you know what you need to
Speaker 1: do differently this time, which is everything.
Speaker 4: Which is everything. Let's get into the interview with a profresh.
Speaker 1: Yes please, I bloody love this interviews and I just
Speaker 1: love the idea of women being able to go somewhere.
Speaker 1: We're now going to talk to Larissa, who opened up
Speaker 1: home h o mb, a luxury postpartum facility to help
Speaker 1: support women. And although this is only availab in Melbourne
Speaker 1: at the moment, we think it starts a really important
Speaker 1: conversation about that postpartum period and we think it's something
Speaker 1: really lovely for ashit is listening to consider and to
Speaker 1: talk to their families and support people about if they're
Speaker 1: having another baby.
Speaker 4: Exactly and how for many of us it is just
Speaker 4: that time when we've just become a mum, but we've
Speaker 4: never needed mothering and nurturing ourselves more.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so welcome.
Speaker 6: Larissa, thank you.
Speaker 4: Can you start with your own postpartum period?
Speaker 2: How much time have you got up. My first postpartum
Speaker 2: period was not great. It was very sort of earth
Speaker 2: shattering for me. It wasn't everything that I had the
Speaker 2: impression of or what I expected.
Speaker 6: It was a really.
Speaker 2: Big change for someone like me, you know, a typical
Speaker 2: personality in control, knew all the things, had all my
Speaker 2: you know, all my ducks in a row, and then
Speaker 2: this baby came along and I was like, well, what's
Speaker 2: going on? Why is it not doing what the book said?
Speaker 4: The ducks were no longer in a row, The ducks
Speaker 4: are on drugs.
Speaker 2: They were yeap, they were very much having their own party.
Speaker 6: And then it was just.
Speaker 2: A cascade of you know, self judgment, self doubt. But
Speaker 2: I kept the veil very well, so no one really
Speaker 2: had an idea what was going on internally. And my
Speaker 2: daughter just didn't sleep for five and a half months.
Speaker 2: She wouldn't sleep past a forty five minute cycle. And
Speaker 2: then obviously, you know that that cascades into stress, which
Speaker 2: cascades into not being able to breastfeed, which you know,
Speaker 2: and my only safe space to sort of have a
Speaker 2: bit of a cry was in the shower, you know,
Speaker 2: that was where no one could see sort of what
Speaker 2: was going on.
Speaker 6: And then I just got to some.
Speaker 2: Very very deep, dark places, and I knew that the
Speaker 2: thoughts weren't normal. So I reached out to my husband
Speaker 2: and then interestingly, we you didn't get anyone for me.
Speaker 2: We got a mothercraft nurse for my daughter, Valentina, because
Speaker 2: we thought if we sought her then I'll be fine.
Speaker 5: What's a mother craft nurse?
Speaker 2: They do a bit of everything, So my particular one
Speaker 2: was I had a nursing background Midwiffrey and a few
Speaker 2: other specialist areas, but they sort of do the whole sleep, eat,
Speaker 2: play and kind of bring it all together. So it
Speaker 2: wasn't just sleep, you know, it wasn't click of the fingers.
Speaker 2: And she slept through first night. It still took, you know,
Speaker 2: many months. I had to learn how to sleep again
Speaker 2: because I had completely lost my rhythm, and that took
Speaker 2: longer than having Valentina.
Speaker 5: We don't often talk about that.
Speaker 4: Actually, when you go without consistent good sleep for so long,
Speaker 4: even when you first have a baby, and people say, oh,
Speaker 4: just sleep when the baby sleeps, you can't because you're
Speaker 4: so used to not sleeping by that point, and you
Speaker 4: can be lying there so tired, like your bones are tired,
Speaker 4: but you still can't force yourself to sleep.
Speaker 2: Yeah, all you want to do is sleep. And then
Speaker 2: I would find when I would sleep, I would almost
Speaker 2: wake up in that sleep paralysis. And I remember those
Speaker 2: stages and it was frightening because then I used to think,
Speaker 2: I'm holding the baby. Am I in a sleep paralysis?
Speaker 6: Am I like?
Speaker 2: And so it was actually horrible. It was a really,
Speaker 2: really horrible postpartum period for me. Twelve months later, we
Speaker 2: decided to have our second and I thought, oh, I
Speaker 2: don't want to I don't want to have that experience again.
Speaker 2: So I went to see a psychologist and through that
Speaker 2: process I was retrospectively diagnosed with postnatal depression and anxiety.
Speaker 4: Do you think, because as you said, you were someone
Speaker 4: very atypical, very measured, with everything that you almost internalized
Speaker 4: more a lot of those feelings that you were having postpartum.
Speaker 6: Yeah. Absolutely.
Speaker 2: For whatever reason, I had a judgment upon myself that
Speaker 2: I needed to continue that sense of what at the
Speaker 2: time I deemed was successful, what was well put together,
Speaker 2: what was you know, I had all of these self
Speaker 2: imposed barometers in my head of what I needed to
Speaker 2: look like, and I just wanted to continue that regardless,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: I feel like societal expectations of us as well as women,
Speaker 1: you know, like that's kind of the undercurrent of motherhood.
Speaker 1: It's like, absolutely, do get your soul this picture of
Speaker 1: like a newborn, it's going to be so great, You'll
Speaker 1: take walk, so sleep, And when it's not like that,
Speaker 1: you're like, what am I doing wrong? Like why can't
Speaker 1: I do this?
Speaker 6: Absolutely?
Speaker 2: And you know, even when I did eventually get to
Speaker 2: a mother's group, and you know, that adds a whole
Speaker 2: other layer of things that happened for you mentally, I'm
Speaker 2: sure there were mothers in my group that were feeling
Speaker 2: the same things I felt, But I just had the
Speaker 2: blinkers on.
Speaker 6: I didn't hear.
Speaker 2: I didn't hear a lot that was going around me
Speaker 2: because the mental chatter.
Speaker 6: Was so loud.
Speaker 4: Can you talk to us about then, what you did
Speaker 4: differently with your second postpartum period.
Speaker 2: It sounds so basic when I say it now, but
Speaker 2: I really just let go. I was just determined not
Speaker 2: to have a postpartum like I did, and I thought,
Speaker 2: I'm really just going to let this baby tell me
Speaker 2: what it needs and what it wants to do. And
Speaker 2: I know I'm going to be sleep deprived and I
Speaker 2: know I'm going to do these things, but I'm going
Speaker 2: to try and not eat chocolate biscuits all day and
Speaker 2: try and you know, feed myself differently this time.
Speaker 6: And I'm just going to try and relax.
Speaker 2: I'm not going to put any parameters on myself, you know, energetically.
Speaker 6: I was just very different.
Speaker 2: You know when Sebastian ended up sleeping through the night
Speaker 2: for the first time at like four weeks, and that
Speaker 2: was a bit of my permission slip to say, give
Speaker 2: myself a pat on the back, you know, to be like, oh, okay,
Speaker 2: maybe you're actually doing this okay, like you know, just
Speaker 2: putting one foot in front of the other. You know,
Speaker 2: we're seeing lots of women come through home that our
Speaker 2: first time moms are second time mom's a third time mums.
Speaker 2: We've got someone traveling from Wollongong in a couple of
Speaker 2: weeks and they're a fourth time mum.
Speaker 6: But they're acutely aware.
Speaker 2: Of how fragile we are as women after birth. And
Speaker 2: that's something that society just doesn't understand, but other cultures
Speaker 2: are hundred percent.
Speaker 4: They probably also know as a third, fourth, second time
Speaker 4: mom how important it is to put yourself first, and
Speaker 4: they also probably want to break from the other kids.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a really big theme we're seeing. While it's
Speaker 2: the men load of I've got another child or another
Speaker 2: two kids at home.
Speaker 6: There is that.
Speaker 2: But I'm here and I'm just going to be grateful
Speaker 2: that I'm here, and I'm really going to absorb all
Speaker 2: the care and nurturing that I'm getting while I'm here.
Speaker 6: But you know, the mental load is huge.
Speaker 2: Shifting a narrative is really hard. But yeah, that second
Speaker 2: time round, I really just I really just thought, I'm
Speaker 2: just I'm going to put my hands up a bit.
Speaker 2: I'm just going to be like, Okay, I need to
Speaker 2: just take what comes, because I just I think my
Speaker 2: driving force was I did not want to go back
Speaker 2: into that anxiety and depression that kept me a mile
Speaker 2: away and was my driving force. So you know, whether
Speaker 2: that's healthy or not, I'm not quite sure.
Speaker 5: But I got you there in the end, though.
Speaker 6: It did. It absolutely did.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So it was then that you decided to start
Speaker 4: working on the concert of Home.
Speaker 2: I was yearning for a place such as now that
Speaker 2: I've created at the time, and I would google it
Speaker 2: and be like, surely there's somewhere I can go where
Speaker 2: I can just stay for a week, someone can like
Speaker 2: help me and guide me and like show me how.
Speaker 6: To do this stuff.
Speaker 2: Because breastfeeding for me did not come naturally, and it
Speaker 2: doesn't come naturally for a lot of women. It is
Speaker 2: very much a learned skill.
Speaker 4: I didn't realize that until, like I knew that for
Speaker 4: some women it was really hard. But that was like
Speaker 4: I asked the audience like to talk about their own
Speaker 4: postpartum experiences and what they struggled with the most, and
Speaker 4: I'd say, like eighty percent it was breastfeeding that they
Speaker 4: wanted more help and more support with breastfeeding.
Speaker 6: Yeap, it's huge.
Speaker 2: In all the research that I did over you know,
Speaker 2: many years and then ended up surveying women all over
Speaker 2: Australia that sleep and breastfeeding were the two main actors
Speaker 2: of overwhelm self judgment, you know, and just real difficulty.
Speaker 2: So yeah, so end of twenty twenty one, I really
Speaker 2: started doing all the due diligence, so doing huge research,
Speaker 2: engaged a company out of Sydney to do that, and
Speaker 2: just kept speaking to a lot of women. We ended
Speaker 2: up surveying well over seventeen hundred women all over Australia
Speaker 2: and it was just phenomenal.
Speaker 6: And the people who conducted.
Speaker 2: The survey they said, look, we do some pretty big
Speaker 2: stuff and the level of engagement that you have is
Speaker 2: nothing that we have ever seen.
Speaker 6: And there were pages and pages of.
Speaker 2: Women telling their stories and their experiences and it took
Speaker 2: me three days to go through and read them all.
Speaker 2: And you know what it was interesting.
Speaker 6: It was women.
Speaker 2: So we surveyed women from the age of eighteen up
Speaker 2: to sixty because I knew that women would still be
Speaker 2: hanging on to a lot of things. And I cannot
Speaker 2: tell you the women in their fifties and sixties that
Speaker 2: could tell me in detail their experiences still from maybe
Speaker 2: thirty years ago.
Speaker 5: That's incredible.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So you know, it was quite evident that there
Speaker 2: needed to be something like this, and then you know,
Speaker 2: I started the Wheels in Motion. The name's Amazing Home
Speaker 2: but spelt as in the womb, right.
Speaker 5: I love it. It's so cute, it's so really clever.
Speaker 2: It felt very significant in amongst all the other names
Speaker 2: that were put to me, that one was just a
Speaker 2: full body response.
Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, so tell us about it.
Speaker 2: So it is look, for lack of a better term,
Speaker 2: it's a postpartum hotel that feels very transactional because there's
Speaker 2: so much depth to what we do. And essentially you
Speaker 2: come in, you check in like a hotel. We have
Speaker 2: a four night minimum stay or your meal are included,
Speaker 2: all your beverages, we do all your laundry, so all
Speaker 2: the things are done. You don't need to think or
Speaker 2: worry about any of that. And it's very bespoke the
Speaker 2: stay to each.
Speaker 6: Woman, So.
Speaker 2: Everything that you receive is not cookie cutter. It's very
Speaker 2: bespoke to what you need because women need different things
Speaker 2: through their postpartum. No one's the same, no baby is
Speaker 2: the same. And yeah, you have your own suite, you
Speaker 2: have your own private room, but then we also have
Speaker 2: communal areas, which I started this and thought women would
Speaker 2: want their own space. You know, some women may not
Speaker 2: want to share their experiences, they may not want to
Speaker 2: be around anyone. So I had this idea that people,
Speaker 2: you know, would just stay in their suites. But women
Speaker 2: have been eating dinner together even with their partners. Having
Speaker 2: the non birthing partner, there has been really fundamental as well,
Speaker 2: so that's included in the stay and a really important
Speaker 2: part it. So it's a very mother led experience. If
Speaker 2: you want your baby to stay in the room with
Speaker 2: you overnight, then that's what we'll do. We'll help you
Speaker 2: with feeding whatever you need. But also if you want
Speaker 2: bubbs to stay in the nursery.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, I'm like, is that at all?
Speaker 6: Yeah, in that way.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it can come in whatever form you want it
Speaker 2: to come in. But fundamentally, what we're trying to do
Speaker 2: is empower women back into that connection with themselves because
Speaker 2: I think the systems around us have very much unconsciously
Speaker 2: or consciously pulled.
Speaker 6: Us away from what we know.
Speaker 2: So we're constantly looking for these external things to solve everything.
Speaker 2: And no judgment on that, right, I did it, We
Speaker 2: all do it. But if we lean back into motherhood
Speaker 2: and people in society allow us to do that and
Speaker 2: not judge it, it feels a bit easier, it feels
Speaker 2: a bit calmer.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 4: And I saw that you actually you can nominate someone
Speaker 4: to have like a subsidized stay.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so part of the whole concept. It was really
Speaker 2: important for me for this to be accessible to every woman,
Speaker 2: not just people that could afford it.
Speaker 6: So we are not for profit.
Speaker 2: So I started a charity, so you know, we call
Speaker 2: for people to donate because it does go directly to
Speaker 2: women who can't afford it, that really need that help.
Speaker 2: And at the moment, ninety percent of the women that
Speaker 2: are staying with us are on either one hundred percent
Speaker 2: supported stays or fifty percent supported stays.
Speaker 4: Like, the better our postpartum period, the better the transition
Speaker 4: back to work will be overall, and the better the
Speaker 4: long term implications are on us.
Speaker 5: Absolutely, it's a benefit to everyone.
Speaker 2: Women are huge contributors to our economy. Right If we
Speaker 2: have women back in the worst workforce and contributing to
Speaker 2: the social and economic fabric of this country, we will
Speaker 2: be better off, you know. And the way that we
Speaker 2: do that is we support women through one of the
Speaker 2: biggest transitions. I was talking to doctor Edna Lacabe, who
Speaker 2: is an incredible perinatal and fertility psychologist, and she said
Speaker 2: the main parts of transition in women's lives are menstruation, birth, motherhood,
Speaker 2: and menopause. We recognize, you know, the two on either side,
Speaker 2: although you know, there's huge work being done with menopause,
Speaker 2: but there is nothing for postpartum, you know. So that's
Speaker 2: really what we're trying to up the ante on the
Speaker 2: accessibility but at this point, the only way that I
Speaker 2: could see doing that was to start a charity and
Speaker 2: knock on the doors of philanthropists big corporates. Right, there's
Speaker 2: a huge responsibility.
Speaker 6: That big corporates have.
Speaker 2: You know, they employ lots of women, and you know,
Speaker 2: we're really trying to encourage them at the moment to
Speaker 2: have it as part of their employee benefit schemes. And
Speaker 2: you know, we're having some really really great conversations, but
Speaker 2: you know, the system is hard to It's an old
Speaker 2: system that's been there for a while.
Speaker 5: They don't care about women.
Speaker 2: No, And I talk to men a lot because it's
Speaker 2: they're in these positions. You know, there's not a lot
Speaker 2: of women unfortunately, who can make these decisions. So it's
Speaker 2: a conversation I'm having with men about caring for women.
Speaker 2: It's so cliche, but we have to get back that village.
Speaker 2: We just have to and the village of like whatever goes.
Speaker 2: You know, my non Na has passed away, but you know,
Speaker 2: a good Italian family and she will talk to me
Speaker 2: about literally raising her children in the village, you know,
Speaker 2: and everyone helps. And there's still cultures that do this,
Speaker 2: Like the Asian culture is incredible in honoring this period
Speaker 2: that African culture is phenomenal. You know, doctor Edna was
Speaker 2: explaining her African culture and what they do and you.
Speaker 6: Know how they care for him and a woman is
Speaker 6: a queen after she gives birth.
Speaker 2: But you know, in Western society, we have this trophy
Speaker 2: culture of how good are you that you're pushing a
Speaker 2: pram on day three or you're back in the salon
Speaker 2: getting your hair done.
Speaker 1: Or you know you're back at work.
Speaker 6: You're back at work, right, I mean you're.
Speaker 5: On emails in the hospital. You just pushed out a baby.
Speaker 5: Good for you?
Speaker 2: And that was me right even second time round, although
Speaker 2: I let go and did all the things, I went
Speaker 2: back to work at seven weeks right because I still
Speaker 2: had those belief systems of like, oh, my clients will
Speaker 2: value the fact that I'm seven weeks postpartum and look
Speaker 2: at me, I'm.
Speaker 6: Back at work.
Speaker 4: We need to change things so that that isn't the
Speaker 4: automatic reaction. It's like, if that's what you want to
Speaker 4: be doing, great, amazing, You're doing.
Speaker 5: It because you feel like you have to.
Speaker 4: That's what we sort of need to change that cultural
Speaker 4: charrative about.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, the judgment needs to stop because in my opinion,
Speaker 2: we are just having mental health be a part of
Speaker 2: what happens when you give birth, like it's just part of.
Speaker 6: It, and that is dangerous.
Speaker 2: The statistics were one in ten for postnatal depression and
Speaker 2: anxiety when I had Valentine or eleven years ago. We're
Speaker 2: now one in five. And you know, there's many schools
Speaker 2: of thought on that. Are we talking about it more?
Speaker 2: Is it just more well known now, all these sorts
Speaker 2: of things. But I don't think that's an excuse for Like,
Speaker 2: I speak to incredible people in the hospital system and
Speaker 2: particularly mother baby units, and they're desperate for something like
Speaker 2: this because midwives and women who are running mother baby units,
Speaker 2: they know they're releasing women from medical care, but they
Speaker 2: know that they are releasing them on a path of
Speaker 2: not having a great experience, you know. So they're saying
Speaker 2: to me, we're carrying that burden of knowing that they're
Speaker 2: not ready, they still need help. We're not talking about,
Speaker 2: you know, weeks and months on end of care. We're
Speaker 2: just asking for recognition that the first month after birth
Speaker 2: is a really critical point. It is a really critical
Speaker 2: point in a woman's experience and mental health.
Speaker 1: Just letting the body heal even like that that time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and nourishing it from the inside out right. Nutrition
Speaker 2: plays such a huge role. We have an incredible naturopath
Speaker 2: and nutritionist vun Gary who works in our space, and
Speaker 2: I've learned so much about nourishing the body through food
Speaker 2: after postpardon. It is vital, It really really is, and
Speaker 2: it makes all the difference. You know, We've women who
Speaker 2: have come in with not great flow and then have
Speaker 2: had this abundance of good nutrient dense food and you know,
Speaker 2: have noticed really little changes in lots of different things
Speaker 2: just with their breastfeeding, let alone their mental clarity, their
Speaker 2: you know, digestive system. Like there's just so much. There's
Speaker 2: so many facets to it. It's not one particular thing.
Speaker 5: Thank you so much, Larisa. We really appreciate that.
Speaker 4: We'll make sure that we link to the amazing service
Speaker 4: that you've got in our show notes and yeah, we
Speaker 4: just appreciate that you're doing something that's such good work.
Speaker 6: Thank you so much.
Speaker 2: I really appreciate you giving home a voice and hopefully
Speaker 2: letting a lot more women know that this is accessible
Speaker 2: and available.
Speaker 4: That conversation with Larissa was so good and when I
Speaker 4: actually put it out to the shit is asking them
Speaker 4: a couple of questions about their own postpartum experience. Sixty
Speaker 4: four percent who responded to the questions, they said that
Speaker 4: they absolutely didn't enjoy that experience, Which is so.
Speaker 5: Funny that the language around.
Speaker 4: Postpartum is like the baby bubble, the chin master, blah
Speaker 4: blah blah. But it's like, universally people just need more support.
Speaker 4: People need partners, being given longer leave, food services, washing services,
Speaker 4: someone to take their toddler. And the biggest takeaway from
Speaker 4: the shit is in what support they really needed, As
Speaker 4: I mentioned with when we charted to Larisa, was that
Speaker 4: lactation support. So it's almost like we need several appointments
Speaker 4: booked in post berth and then you just cancel them
Speaker 4: if you don't need them. I don't know if there's
Speaker 4: maybe there's like a not enough lactation consultants available, but
Speaker 4: a lot of.
Speaker 1: People seek the help after and they will often seek
Speaker 1: it after they've been struggling.
Speaker 4: For a period and then it's like, oh, I can't
Speaker 4: get him for three more weeks.
Speaker 5: I have to feed this baby every three hours fait
Speaker 5: three weekly.
Speaker 1: It's like, I think I was so worried about what
Speaker 1: my vagina would look like. That was the one thing
Speaker 1: and I didn't even use it, but like that was
Speaker 1: the one appointment I had booked in for postber.
Speaker 4: My god, that's right, you're yes, my vagina need to
Speaker 4: z oh whatever appointments exactly, But I'm thinking, like, in hindsight,
Speaker 4: would have been lovely to have a lactation consult booked
Speaker 4: in for the week that we get home.
Speaker 1: Would have been lovely to have I don't know my
Speaker 1: psych appointment. I did have a psych appointment booked in actually,
Speaker 1: so that was good too.
Speaker 4: A planner, and you are smart, but you will be
Speaker 4: even smarter this time around, exactly.
Speaker 1: But you're so right having those appointments booked in just
Speaker 1: in case, in case, and hair appointments for.
Speaker 4: Them, so people don't You're not wasting someone's time or
Speaker 4: wasting your own time at night. But also, just go,
Speaker 4: I have some recommendations for this episode.
Speaker 1: Oh yes, go onkel so I'll run through them.
Speaker 4: I will pop everything in the show notes though, so
Speaker 4: you can access the information easily. So if you contact
Speaker 4: Panda on thirteen hundred seven two six three oh six,
Speaker 4: they are amazing. If you have postpartum depression, your experience
Speaker 4: anxiety or depression during pregnancy.
Speaker 5: So they were incredible with me.
Speaker 4: Panda helped me through my pregnancy and then postpartum I
Speaker 4: had access to a free psychiatrist and psychologist.
Speaker 1: That's so good. So is that a government funded thing? Yes?
Speaker 1: Oh wow, okay, I didn't even I didn't realize it
Speaker 1: was government funded.
Speaker 4: So you just need to contact them and they will
Speaker 4: help you. Parent Lines so googled that and then the
Speaker 4: appropriate number for your state should come up. So when
Speaker 4: I Google, it just comes up with parent Line New
Speaker 4: South Wales. The shit that my sister has called them about.
Speaker 4: I've never actually called them. My sister has called them
Speaker 4: multiple times, but just about stuff like Evelyn Ate, something
Speaker 4: really that she shouldn't have won. So my sister called
Speaker 4: parent line to find out what she should do.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they.
Speaker 5: Were like, actually, it just says that it's poisonous on
Speaker 5: the packet. It's not really, so don't worry.
Speaker 1: I called them because you know those little packets that
Speaker 1: you get in like shoe boxes.
Speaker 5: That was the same thing.
Speaker 3: Shut up, okay, yes, okay, okay, do you want to
Speaker 3: say what it was?
Speaker 4: Because I was like, if telling that story, it sounds
Speaker 4: like we should have called the ambulance, but she didn't
Speaker 4: know what to do, so she called parent Life.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well the thing was open, like it had been
Speaker 1: ripped open a little bit and I found it on
Speaker 1: the floor and was crawling and I was like did
Speaker 1: she didn't she? But when I called, she was like
Speaker 1: what type of beads are they? And I explained and
Speaker 1: they were the non toxic ones that are made out
Speaker 1: of most of.
Speaker 5: Them are non toxic, but they still have to put I.
Speaker 1: Don't think because of that reason, they're like, this is
Speaker 1: a real bick hazard to kids because they fall out.
Speaker 5: I find them all the time. I called parent You
Speaker 5: two did the exact same thing.
Speaker 4: And it's not just about safety stuff, Like you can
Speaker 4: call them about sleep stuff, literally anything to do with kids,
Speaker 4: and that's at all ages.
Speaker 5: Yeah, just call parent Line.
Speaker 1: So good.
Speaker 5: It's a free service as well.
Speaker 4: The Gidget Foundation they do village groups for expectant moms
Speaker 4: and dads, so it's facilitated by experienced preinatal mental health
Speaker 4: clinicians and they'll actually like just offer really beautiful services,
Speaker 4: which like building your own village, having that support.
Speaker 1: That's cool.
Speaker 4: Mom for Mom offers weekly in home emotional support during
Speaker 4: that last trimester of pregnancy and the first year of
Speaker 4: a baby's life.
Speaker 1: My friend in my mother's group did this. She had one,
Speaker 1: did you a lady. Yeah, she was just a grandma
Speaker 1: whose kids didn't have kids, and she just was like
Speaker 1: loved being a mom so much that she wanted to
Speaker 1: offer up her time and kind of like a mother's helpers.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, they want one, Yeah, you can get one.
Speaker 5: They had another one you can free.
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure it was free.
Speaker 5: Good dear me.
Speaker 4: So the support is given by trained volunteers who are
Speaker 4: mothers themselves. That one's Sydney based.
Speaker 5: But yes, okay, if you have a Google.
Speaker 4: The problem is because I'm in New South Wales. When
Speaker 4: I Google different things, it will only come up with
Speaker 4: New South Whales. Even when I put in Victoria, it
Speaker 4: will just direct me.
Speaker 5: It's really annoying. Yeah that, but I did find Peach Trade.
Speaker 4: That is a Queensland and Northern Territory community based mental
Speaker 4: health organization. They provide services for parents, partners and families
Speaker 4: who are impacted by mental health challenges in the period
Speaker 4: of pregnancy and early parents it There is the Sydney
Speaker 4: Concierge New Mum packages that you can buy new mums.
Speaker 1: I did not know this.
Speaker 2: I know.
Speaker 4: So you can buy so many things that would be
Speaker 4: so helpful to a new mum from the service. Christmas
Speaker 4: tree and decorations decorated for you. Imagine if you had
Speaker 4: a baby in December and someone came over like this
Speaker 4: is just the first thing that's come up, and I'm
Speaker 4: like that is so handy. Someone will organize all your
Speaker 4: travel for you moving home. Someone will do your packing
Speaker 4: for you. The new mum packages, so number of hours
Speaker 4: a trained professional will come over and just help you
Speaker 4: with whatever you.
Speaker 1: Need, washing, cooking, cooking after the.
Speaker 4: Baby, taking the baby for a walk, whatever you need
Speaker 4: you can purchase someone however many amount of hours you
Speaker 4: can afford or whatnot.
Speaker 1: That's what should be in your baby shower wishing well.
Speaker 4: So there's playgroup Australia, so there's there should be one
Speaker 4: in every single state. It is a not for profit
Speaker 4: making sure that every child and family has access to
Speaker 4: a quality plagu grond so for that support. So even
Speaker 4: if they're not in like daycare or you're not part
Speaker 4: of a mother's group, they'll sort of like facilitate that.
Speaker 4: For yes, there's a few in our area, just for
Speaker 4: mums for dads as well.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's so cool, like the stuff they have.
Speaker 1: They're like outdoor areas, play things that they set up like.
Speaker 1: They're actually awesome.
Speaker 5: There's Mumma Tribe. I hate the name so much.
Speaker 1: Come on, you love it.
Speaker 5: I hate it.
Speaker 1: I don't mind it. But what service they offer?
Speaker 4: So you find someone you join and then you can
Speaker 4: find someone that lives near you that you might want
Speaker 4: to go to the gym with, or you just want
Speaker 4: to like go for a walk and grab a coffee
Speaker 4: and talk about sleep.
Speaker 1: That's so nice for like a new parent that may
Speaker 1: have moved to a new area and they don't have
Speaker 1: any friends exactly, or if you're the first of her
Speaker 1: friends to have a kid and you don't have anyone else,
Speaker 1: have any like second friends.
Speaker 4: Eighty five thousand people across forty five locations Australia wide.
Speaker 4: That's so they and they help. So you just say hey,
Speaker 4: I live here. They'll help you find someone that lives
Speaker 4: really close to you.
Speaker 5: How good is that?
Speaker 4: And then there's mum Space, which is mental health support
Speaker 4: for mums.
Speaker 1: I've got one more to add, if that's okay, please do.
Speaker 4: This was my biggest resource throughout the newborn stage and
Speaker 4: even now it's like whenever I'm asking myself a question
Speaker 4: or always gone here Raising Children dot net.
Speaker 1: So this is Australia's parenting website. They cover from pregnancy, newborns, babies,
Speaker 1: toddler's preschool, school age, preteens, teens, grown ups, and they
Speaker 1: also go into autism and disability. They've just launched and
Speaker 1: launched an app raising healthy minds and it's so good.
Speaker 1: They're like this is where I read about. Like I
Speaker 1: was like, do I need to go to a different
Speaker 1: formula now Roou's older and I like went on to
Speaker 1: raising children and on there it was like there's no need.
Speaker 1: They're all the same, like.
Speaker 4: All like basic information that you need.
Speaker 1: Yeah, just basic information that you need from a reliable source.
Speaker 1: Like it's all been like moderated and it's all supported
Speaker 1: by the Australian Government and the Department of Social Services.
Speaker 1: So it's just really quick, easy, non like fluffy fluffy,
Speaker 1: straight to the point information love love. I loved using it.
Speaker 4: The government funded that also just reminded me there's Trisilian
Speaker 4: and Karatani which government funded and they help the amount
Speaker 4: of people I had a bad experience with Karatani, but
Speaker 4: that wasn't their fault. No, No, they help so much
Speaker 4: with things like sleep. So the amount of people that
Speaker 4: suggested Karatani or Trisilian to me saying it just gave
Speaker 4: me so much confidence with like how to get my
Speaker 4: baby to go to sleep, and how to manage different
Speaker 4: sleep cycles and that sort of thing. Breastfeeding if you're
Speaker 4: struggling toddler tantrums, yeah, wow, behavioral stuff with toddler's fussy eaters,
Speaker 4: like anything you can sort of think of that you're
Speaker 4: struggling with, you can go and stay there. They're in
Speaker 4: the hospitals generally. Yeah, and they've got like all the support.
Speaker 4: It's so good.
Speaker 5: It's so good.
Speaker 1: I can't believe how many good resources are actually out there,
Speaker 1: even just.
Speaker 4: Like if you're struggling mentally cope dot com, dot au.
Speaker 4: There's so many suggestions and resources there that you can
Speaker 4: just like there's always something, yeah, And I wish that
Speaker 4: I'd known that more so, I really wish I'd had
Speaker 4: this list of resources when pregnant and pay it forward.
Speaker 1: If you have a friend that might be expecting or
Speaker 1: in that newborn phase, you don't have to ask them
Speaker 1: any specific how are you going, Hey, I've just come
Speaker 1: across this amazing list of resources I wanted to share
Speaker 1: with you.
Speaker 5: Yes, and they make sure that they're listening to the.
Speaker 1: Well, I didn't want to lead with that, but yes,
Speaker 1: encourage them to.
Speaker 4: Listen to the pod also, and why not ask on
Speaker 4: our Facebook page as well if you have any sort
Speaker 4: of question or want suggestions or advice or something. There
Speaker 4: might be a shitter that lives close to you that
Speaker 4: wants to go grab a coffee.
Speaker 5: There might be a shitter.
Speaker 4: That's gone through the exact sort of same thing, or
Speaker 4: might have a really good suggestion. I myself have found
Speaker 4: that group so helpful.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is so helpful. And there's always someone out
Speaker 1: there with either an answer to your question or wondering
Speaker 1: the same thing. Yeah, you know exactly. You can work
Speaker 1: it out together.
Speaker 4: Well, thank you so much. We really appreciate everyone listening today.
Speaker 4: Please rate and review us. I know that thousands of
Speaker 4: people were listening per week, sometime even more.
Speaker 1: We see the numbers, and yet we don't.
Speaker 5: Have thousands of reviews.
Speaker 4: How the math Saint math to please go and write
Speaker 4: a beautiful review. It honestly means the world, and it
Speaker 4: means that we get to keep doing the content that
Speaker 4: you're loving exactly.
Speaker 1: You could just put best that's amazing, fab fab, say
Speaker 1: no more that would be said. This episode was produced
Speaker 1: by myself, Kirie Cells, and Kelley McCarran, with audio production
Speaker 1: by the Lovely Madeline Joanna. We will be back in
Speaker 1: your ears next week.
Speaker 5: She is bye bye