WEBVTT - A Very Cranky William & A Very Wicked Woman 0:00:02.960 --> 0:00:05.600 Hello, and welcome to Mama Mia out loud. It's what 0:00:05.640 --> 0:00:08.880 women actually talking about on Monday, the twenty second of June. 0:00:08.960 --> 0:00:11.920 And I am Holly Wayne right, I'm Claire Stevens. Welcome back. 0:00:12.240 --> 0:00:14.480 Sorry Amelia, but you were off a bit. 0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:17.520 Last week and I think somehow Loud has thought I'd 0:00:17.520 --> 0:00:21.360 had a baby and I was like, guys, like I 0:00:21.600 --> 0:00:25.040 honestly like I wish, but no, I was just sick 0:00:25.079 --> 0:00:27.280 and it was boring and I had to listen to 0:00:27.280 --> 0:00:30.080 you guys without fighting back. It was annoying. 0:00:30.480 --> 0:00:33.680 I'm Amelia Lessa And here's what's made our agenda for today. 0:00:34.159 --> 0:00:38.440 Olivia Wilde is finally talking about that cursed don't worry 0:00:38.520 --> 0:00:42.360 Darling pressed to her and why she inexplicably became one 0:00:42.400 --> 0:00:44.000 of the most hated women in the world. 0:00:44.960 --> 0:00:47.920 The shit skirt is casting around for a new British 0:00:47.920 --> 0:00:50.479 prime minister to wear it. What you need to know 0:00:50.640 --> 0:00:52.920 about the mess of UK politics right now and what 0:00:53.080 --> 0:00:55.520 it might say about ours. 0:00:55.120 --> 0:00:59.160 And I have a very simple, completely free way to 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:00.600 start your day better. 0:01:00.960 --> 0:01:04.040 But first, in case you missed it, So it seems 0:01:04.080 --> 0:01:07.280 that the Keith Urban Nicole Kidman divorce has taken a 0:01:07.319 --> 0:01:08.000 lovely turn. 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:09.520 Oh how nice? 0:01:09.600 --> 0:01:11.640 Who would have thought this? It was about nine months 0:01:11.680 --> 0:01:14.959 ago that that split came out of the blue, didn't it. 0:01:14.959 --> 0:01:17.640 At least I was in the Mumamea offices that day 0:01:17.680 --> 0:01:20.280 and that was just I think that was the biggest 0:01:20.360 --> 0:01:21.640 day in history. 0:01:22.600 --> 0:01:25.840 Everybody lost their minds. Now, they obviously knew it was 0:01:25.880 --> 0:01:27.720 coming because by the time we heard about it, their 0:01:27.760 --> 0:01:31.360 settlement was almost done. So as far as we know, 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:32.920 this could have been brewing for a while, but it 0:01:32.959 --> 0:01:35.720 certainly came out of nowhere for us. But it seems 0:01:35.760 --> 0:01:39.560 that things are amicable now because social media slutes know 0:01:39.680 --> 0:01:42.800 these things. First of all, it was Nicole Kidman's birthday 0:01:42.800 --> 0:01:46.400 on Saturday, and Keith Urban actually made a story and 0:01:46.440 --> 0:01:48.560 put it on his stories and it just had text 0:01:48.800 --> 0:01:53.080 lower case happy Birthday, Nicole Mary. 0:01:53.120 --> 0:01:56.600 Which makes her more relatable because I feel like every 0:01:56.640 --> 0:02:01.640 Australian woman their middle name is either Mary or Marie 0:02:02.040 --> 0:02:04.880 or Louise. Like I like that she's Nicole Mary. 0:02:05.480 --> 0:02:07.720 And I think maybe one of the daughters like showed 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:09.600 him how to do it. Yeah, like I'm not doing 0:02:09.639 --> 0:02:12.520 too much. Wasn't just a lowercase story. It wasn't a 0:02:12.560 --> 0:02:14.959 very good story, and their design it wasn't there was 0:02:15.000 --> 0:02:18.760 no design, and then the next day with design kidman 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.480 posts for father's sakes. It's just been Father's Day on 0:02:21.520 --> 0:02:23.240 the other side of the world, and she had a 0:02:23.240 --> 0:02:26.919 split screen photo of her late dad and then Keith 0:02:27.000 --> 0:02:29.920 with his girls and wished all the good dadsy So 0:02:30.040 --> 0:02:31.080 things have gone nice? 0:02:31.200 --> 0:02:33.200 Do I like this? That's interesting because I feel like 0:02:33.280 --> 0:02:37.040 it's very fraught about when and how you interact with 0:02:37.360 --> 0:02:40.280 X's on social media or in general, whether you reach 0:02:40.320 --> 0:02:41.560 out to them on their birthday. 0:02:41.639 --> 0:02:43.320 What do you think? Do you think would you? 0:02:43.560 --> 0:02:45.800 I don't believe it. I don't believe you can be 0:02:45.880 --> 0:02:48.760 amicable this quickly. I think there's tension, but I think 0:02:48.760 --> 0:02:51.760 it's very clever that they're pretending to be I think 0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:55.760 that's quite lovely. But it's like, don't pretend that there 0:02:55.760 --> 0:02:56.560 hasn't been any. 0:02:56.480 --> 0:02:58.600 Drama, but don't you think that it's possible that all 0:02:58.639 --> 0:03:02.920 the drama happened? Or because apparently, if reports are to 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:07.079 be believed, their settlement has been relatively stress free. They've 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:10.120 both agreed to not go for alimony, not go for 0:03:10.200 --> 0:03:12.440 any spousal support anything like that. She walks away with 0:03:12.440 --> 0:03:14.360 her money, he walks away with his They've got a 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:17.519 very straightforward custody agreement with the kids, which is joint, 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:21.919 but she's primary parent and if reports as to be believed, 0:03:22.000 --> 0:03:25.320 schorelous here she is dating again. Remember there was all 0:03:25.360 --> 0:03:29.800 the gossip about him. Maybe is she dating Simon Baker? 0:03:30.800 --> 0:03:32.919 I wish she was because that would be great. 0:03:33.000 --> 0:03:36.920 But although I don't know, you don't know about it. 0:03:38.200 --> 0:03:40.320 Apparently she's dating a businessman. 0:03:40.440 --> 0:03:43.080 Oh that's that's a big Hollywood move these days. Reese 0:03:43.120 --> 0:03:44.360 has got a businessman on. 0:03:44.400 --> 0:03:48.720 The Chairman of the Border MGM, and he's called Paul Salem. 0:03:48.800 --> 0:03:50.560 Allegedly he's divorced with four daughters. 0:03:50.560 --> 0:03:52.839 And again regardless vibe here. 0:03:53.000 --> 0:03:56.320 Yeah, yeah, so maybe things have just maybe Nichole's just 0:03:56.440 --> 0:03:58.560 like cool, let's get back to social media and I, 0:03:58.800 --> 0:03:58.960 you know. 0:03:59.080 --> 0:04:02.640 He's been hanging out at mar Lago, So I feel 0:04:02.640 --> 0:04:04.760 like they're diverging in many ways at this point. 0:04:04.880 --> 0:04:09.760 Oh wow, Well, Sunday, the daughter she unfollowed her dad 0:04:09.800 --> 0:04:12.560 on Instagram and April, so I think she might say 0:04:12.640 --> 0:04:14.800 that this Sunday. 0:04:14.880 --> 0:04:16.760 I thought you were talking about Father's Day on Sunday. 0:04:16.800 --> 0:04:20.440 She did that Sunday, Yes, sorry, Sunday, you don't. 0:04:20.279 --> 0:04:24.840 Miss the thing, Joe gest stating and checking out Sundays following. 0:04:24.600 --> 0:04:28.039 She followed him again, unfollowed and followed. But I just 0:04:28.080 --> 0:04:30.320 think you can say, oh you want about the legal process, 0:04:30.760 --> 0:04:31.799 That's what I care about. 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:36.919 I've got another little bit of social media news from celebs, 0:04:37.120 --> 0:04:40.919 which is that Anne Halfaway is joining the ranks of 0:04:40.960 --> 0:04:43.719 celebrities who are pregnant well into their forties. She posted 0:04:43.760 --> 0:04:45.680 over the weekend in what looked like a kind of 0:04:45.720 --> 0:04:51.280 like Lily Allen coated Brooklyn Brownstone vibe type backdrop. She 0:04:51.400 --> 0:04:55.159 was wearing this very sheet cheesecloth number and it showed off. 0:04:55.480 --> 0:04:58.040 Dare I say she was flaunting a baby bump. 0:04:58.279 --> 0:05:02.720 She is pregnant real estate agent over here with the 0:05:02.839 --> 0:05:03.400 brown style. 0:05:04.360 --> 0:05:08.599 Sorry, it was very yesteryear coded right, this cheesecloth number 0:05:08.640 --> 0:05:12.000 that she was in. And now there's a lot of 0:05:12.000 --> 0:05:14.240 other celebrities who are pregnant into their forties right now. 0:05:14.320 --> 0:05:17.760 Natalie Portman is pregnant, she's forty five. Giselle was forty 0:05:17.760 --> 0:05:19.760 four when she had her latest and Cianna Miller, of 0:05:19.800 --> 0:05:21.560 course we've talked about on the show, was forty three. 0:05:22.160 --> 0:05:25.120 So I was interested to see what the story was 0:05:25.160 --> 0:05:27.880 with Anne Hathaway's other children. I knew vaguely she had children, 0:05:27.880 --> 0:05:30.320 but she is very private about it, so I kind 0:05:30.360 --> 0:05:32.560 of had to dig a little. But it turns out 0:05:32.600 --> 0:05:34.520 her first child was born a full ten years ago. 0:05:34.720 --> 0:05:37.839 That's quite a spread, and then her second and twenty nineteen, 0:05:38.279 --> 0:05:40.960 and she's talked a lot about going through infertility and 0:05:41.000 --> 0:05:43.159 conception house, so it's very nice news. 0:05:43.200 --> 0:05:45.479 I don't even know who her partner is. Same guy 0:05:45.560 --> 0:05:47.640 with all the kids, same guy, same guy. That's very 0:05:47.680 --> 0:05:49.960 private and he so little. 0:05:49.960 --> 0:05:53.840 Fun story. I was in Positano, I'm going to say 0:05:53.880 --> 0:05:57.880 fifteen years ago, and I was standing at a bus 0:05:57.920 --> 0:05:58.680 stop and I. 0:05:59.200 --> 0:06:03.080 Sorry, Impositano, but you were saying it a bus john 0:06:04.120 --> 0:06:05.400 a lot about the quality of my. 0:06:05.360 --> 0:06:08.400 Holidays a few years ago, Yes, And I looked across 0:06:08.440 --> 0:06:11.039 the road and I went, that's Anne Hathaway and she 0:06:11.240 --> 0:06:13.599 was with the same guy that she's still with. 0:06:14.400 --> 0:06:21.240 I googled the Italian fraudsters that was a great. 0:06:17.480 --> 0:06:21.279 Before, same same guy, because I was like, I don't 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:24.520 recognize yeah, and then when I googled him, I was like, 0:06:24.560 --> 0:06:27.160 that's exactly who she was with. And I was so excited. 0:06:27.160 --> 0:06:30.479 But this was this was pre kids. Pre everything, but no, 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:32.479 I have been on holiday with Anne halfway you have. 0:06:32.600 --> 0:06:36.240 Definitely this all buys into my theory that we're living 0:06:36.279 --> 0:06:39.599 in an age of agelessness, that like the longevity tech 0:06:39.640 --> 0:06:42.960 bros are all about, you know, not eating food and 0:06:43.000 --> 0:06:45.080 doing all that stuff to live forever. But the female 0:06:45.120 --> 0:06:48.320 version of that is extension of fertility. And I don't 0:06:48.360 --> 0:06:50.720 know if it's now just because I'm old, but now 0:06:50.720 --> 0:06:53.840 I'm like forties so young, you have so much time. 0:06:54.240 --> 0:06:58.520 Yeah. One of the most bizarre realities of celebrity culture 0:06:58.880 --> 0:07:02.200 is that a story can completely take over the zeitgeist 0:07:02.320 --> 0:07:04.520 for weeks or months at a time, and then just 0:07:04.560 --> 0:07:07.920 as quickly as it appeared, it's entirely forgotten. And then 0:07:07.920 --> 0:07:10.680 when it comes up again, we're like, oh, yeah, that 0:07:10.920 --> 0:07:14.560 was bat sheet insane. So with the clarity of hindsight, 0:07:14.680 --> 0:07:17.840 often you can't work out why everyone lost their minds. 0:07:17.840 --> 0:07:23.360 And this is the case with the scandal of the 0:07:23.480 --> 0:07:26.720 Don't Worry Darling press tour with Olivia Wilds. 0:07:26.720 --> 0:07:29.440 This was one of my favorite moments and pop culture ever. 0:07:29.640 --> 0:07:32.600 I really enjoyed it. I saw a tweet that was like, 0:07:33.160 --> 0:07:36.720 it's q andon for highly online people. Yeah, and I'm 0:07:36.720 --> 0:07:38.720 like that's what it was for me. Like the closer 0:07:38.720 --> 0:07:39.720 you look, the more you found it. 0:07:39.720 --> 0:07:41.360 I think Q and on is also Q and on 0:07:41.400 --> 0:07:43.280 for I take a p. 0:07:43.560 --> 0:07:48.160 That's very true. So very luckily we got Olivia Wilde 0:07:48.240 --> 0:07:51.640 sitting down on Call Her Daddy last week to unpack 0:07:52.120 --> 0:07:54.880 all the details of the Gossip of the Press. Too 0:07:54.960 --> 0:07:56.680 are with Alex. 0:07:56.400 --> 0:07:58.520 Cooper because apparently her new movie is really good. 0:07:58.640 --> 0:08:01.280 Yeah, yeah, The Invitation and it's called with Sethrob. 0:08:01.480 --> 0:08:04.480 I believe it. Her first movie that she directed was brilliant. Yeah, 0:08:04.560 --> 0:08:06.440 the book smart and I've always given her a lit 0:08:06.520 --> 0:08:07.600 I know credit. 0:08:07.440 --> 0:08:10.800 And can we just acknowledge don't worry, Darling was an 0:08:10.840 --> 0:08:12.600 excellent film. I enjoyed it. 0:08:13.040 --> 0:08:14.160 I didn't watch it. 0:08:15.080 --> 0:08:15.640 That's the prob. 0:08:15.960 --> 0:08:19.120 I didn't watch it. The controversy I say too much. 0:08:19.280 --> 0:08:22.000 She's really smart, like on this. In this interview, she 0:08:22.040 --> 0:08:24.000 talks about how she's always wanted to direct her now 0:08:24.040 --> 0:08:26.920 she is a proper director. She's followed Greta Gerwick and 0:08:26.960 --> 0:08:28.800 all the rest of it. And one of the things 0:08:28.840 --> 0:08:30.720 that's really interesting that she says, though she says it's 0:08:30.760 --> 0:08:33.720 given her speaking of agelessness, she said she feels like 0:08:33.760 --> 0:08:36.520 she can relax. It's given her some longevity because otherwise 0:08:36.760 --> 0:08:38.720 you cast out at an early age. 0:08:38.760 --> 0:08:42.440 Anyway, she's very talented. So in twenty twenty two, for 0:08:42.520 --> 0:08:45.880 those who have forgotten the headlines about the Cursed, don't worry, 0:08:45.960 --> 0:08:49.360 Darling pressed who are were everywhere and the drama kicked 0:08:49.400 --> 0:08:53.520 off in April when Olivia Wilde, who directed the film, 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:57.280 was at CinemaCon and she's on stage talking about the 0:08:57.360 --> 0:09:03.480 movie and she is served custody that were from via 0:09:03.920 --> 0:09:06.560 her ex Jason sidekis ted Lasso. 0:09:06.880 --> 0:09:09.200 Yes, that's why I will never believe he did it 0:09:09.200 --> 0:09:10.800 on purpose, because he's Ted Lasso. 0:09:11.080 --> 0:09:14.000 Yeah, it really challenged a lot of what we thought 0:09:14.080 --> 0:09:17.800 about that man. But so she served these papers and 0:09:18.440 --> 0:09:21.560 in that moment she was seen as a bit of 0:09:21.559 --> 0:09:24.480 a victim. People went, that would be absolutely awful. 0:09:24.520 --> 0:09:28.680 It's unquestionably a shitty thing to do in front of 0:09:28.720 --> 0:09:32.960 all these people, just derail her whole professional moments. 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:35.160 So bad. But I think it really did put a 0:09:35.200 --> 0:09:38.520 spotlight on people being like, oh, she was with ted 0:09:38.640 --> 0:09:41.440 Lasso and now they're no longer together and they have 0:09:41.559 --> 0:09:43.840 kids together, so people kind of had that in their minds. 0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:49.200 Then later in the year don't worry, Darling comes out 0:09:49.720 --> 0:09:53.560 and it was largely overshadowed by a whole lot of 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:56.240 other drama. So Olivia Wilde was dating the lead actor, 0:09:56.480 --> 0:10:00.360 Harry Styles, who was ten years her junior and currently 0:10:00.720 --> 0:10:03.840 Florence Pugh, who was the lead actress, was pissed about it, 0:10:04.240 --> 0:10:07.640 and this there did actually seem to be legs to 0:10:07.679 --> 0:10:09.599 the fact that Florence Peugh was pitched. She made a 0:10:09.600 --> 0:10:12.640 few statements. She went to Venice Film Festival and didn't 0:10:12.840 --> 0:10:15.360 say anything, didn't give any interferee. 0:10:14.960 --> 0:10:17.440 She switched around with an apperl sprits in hand and 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:18.920 just refused to speak. 0:10:18.600 --> 0:10:22.600 Which is how I prefer to express my exactly exactly. 0:10:22.640 --> 0:10:26.319 So there definitely was some tension. And then of course 0:10:26.400 --> 0:10:32.120 we had uh the spitting incident, which was Harry Styles 0:10:32.120 --> 0:10:34.839 definitely looked like he spat on Chris. 0:10:34.640 --> 0:10:37.240 Pine and do you think that he did? 0:10:37.480 --> 0:10:41.560 Okay, there is no way that Harry Styles spits, I asked, 0:10:43.280 --> 0:10:45.240 if you look at that foot, it is the optical 0:10:45.280 --> 0:10:49.560 illusion of the century. He said, Remember, Jesse and I 0:10:49.600 --> 0:10:51.680 did a canceled episode on it, and we said, it's 0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:52.480 like ghosts. 0:10:52.840 --> 0:10:55.560 It's more fun to believe. It's more fun if you 0:10:55.679 --> 0:10:58.280 just believe that Harry Styles did spit on Chris Pine 0:10:58.559 --> 0:11:00.560 and then Harry Styles made joke about It's like, this 0:11:00.600 --> 0:11:02.160 isn't for you to joke about, this is for us 0:11:02.200 --> 0:11:07.120 to joke You shut up. But now four years later, 0:11:07.640 --> 0:11:11.640 Olivia Wilde has spilled everything she's did very quiet. 0:11:11.840 --> 0:11:14.000 But we're a good reason because she was hard. 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:17.680 You know who's not happy that she's choosing now to 0:11:17.679 --> 0:11:19.960 speak up. Yes, she has a movie coming out, but 0:11:20.080 --> 0:11:24.240 also Jason Zadekas has new season of ted Lars and 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:27.960 all of this is undercutting that every man, good guy 0:11:28.040 --> 0:11:30.480 image that he has worked so hard to present in 0:11:30.520 --> 0:11:33.840 ted Larso wow, I don't think so well. 0:11:34.920 --> 0:11:39.280 Olivia Wilde makes some very interesting points about the conversation 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:42.679 around her relationship with Harry Styles at the time. They 0:11:42.720 --> 0:11:45.600 went out for for a few years and then broke up. 0:11:45.600 --> 0:11:48.120 But this is what she says about the age gap. 0:11:48.559 --> 0:11:52.200 It's almost like the happiness made them mad. 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:53.760 Like I would like go to shows and dance and 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:58.439 people were like, oh, oh good gee, You're like, dare 0:11:58.559 --> 0:11:59.200 you dance? 0:12:00.440 --> 0:12:04.120 I think that it's we police women's morality to such 0:12:04.160 --> 0:12:07.920 a different degree than men that in especially mothers, the 0:12:07.960 --> 0:12:10.320 fact that you were kids, you're fuck oh yeah. So 0:12:10.679 --> 0:12:14.559 I think that there is a expectation, especially as a mother, 0:12:15.120 --> 0:12:17.280 that when you go through that public separation with the 0:12:17.360 --> 0:12:21.960 kids involved, you are supposed to be self sacrificing and 0:12:21.960 --> 0:12:22.920 you need to be sexless. 0:12:23.000 --> 0:12:25.240 Yeah, yeah, yeah, preach. Every word of that is true. 0:12:25.320 --> 0:12:27.880 But that was mostly call her daddy speaking. 0:12:27.960 --> 0:12:29.959 Yes, she was kind of putting it more into words 0:12:29.960 --> 0:12:35.800 because Alex Cooper asked Olivia Wilde why she thought there 0:12:36.000 --> 0:12:39.880 was so much anger about her relationship with Harry Styles, 0:12:39.920 --> 0:12:42.559 and Olivia Wilde said, it's sort of the parasocial relationship 0:12:42.559 --> 0:12:44.800 people have with him. But she also was like, I 0:12:44.800 --> 0:12:48.160 don't know, Like why do you think? And so I 0:12:48.280 --> 0:12:53.000 thought Cooper gave a really interesting analysis of that, Amelia, 0:12:53.679 --> 0:12:57.320 Why did we have such a visceral reaction to a 0:12:57.360 --> 0:13:00.800 relationship with a ten year age girl. I think Harry 0:13:00.840 --> 0:13:02.120 Styles is in his late twenties. 0:13:02.280 --> 0:13:03.920 He was twenty six, she was thirty six. 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:06.400 Yeah, yeah, I think it's. 0:13:06.480 --> 0:13:11.800 Just the mother thing. I think age gap relationships post 0:13:12.000 --> 0:13:14.880 Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky in the late nineties, I 0:13:14.920 --> 0:13:20.520 think we have developed this weird, very prudish morality around 0:13:20.520 --> 0:13:23.679 age gap relationships whether they be between an older man 0:13:23.720 --> 0:13:26.440 and a younger woman, or a younger woman, or an 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:28.520 older woman and a younger man. And the proof I 0:13:28.559 --> 0:13:30.720 have of this is that there's this new show on 0:13:30.800 --> 0:13:34.800 Disney Plus called Alice and Steve. It is a perfect, 0:13:35.160 --> 0:13:37.560 one of those like perfect little capsules of a show 0:13:37.600 --> 0:13:40.400 that only the Brits can do. It's only six episodes, 0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:44.040 and it's six perfect little half hour episodes, and it's 0:13:44.080 --> 0:13:48.679 about Jermaine from Flight of the Concords, who is embarking 0:13:48.679 --> 0:13:51.440 on a relationship with a twenty six year old woman 0:13:51.840 --> 0:13:52.280 who is. 0:13:52.480 --> 0:13:53.720 The daughter of his best friend. 0:13:53.840 --> 0:13:57.320 His friend, right, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 0:13:56.840 --> 0:14:00.800 I'll get to that. I think it's important on its 0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:04.040 so but yeah, and it's like sort of like it's 0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:07.280 been built as like a wrong colm, which I hadn't 0:14:07.320 --> 0:14:10.120 heard that phrase before, but it's very true for this show. 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:13.600 It's like that kind of awkward, cringey humor that you 0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:16.000 can't look away from. I just loved it. I ate 0:14:16.040 --> 0:14:18.080 it up over the course of like forty eight hours. 0:14:18.360 --> 0:14:20.680 But then I you know how you watch a show 0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:22.360 and then you want to see what the reviewers think. 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:24.240 So I saw googling around and the first thing that 0:14:24.280 --> 0:14:28.200 comes up is the Guardians review, and I'm sorry, but 0:14:28.320 --> 0:14:32.080 to me, it encapsulated our inability as a society to 0:14:32.160 --> 0:14:34.760 talk properly or rationally about this topic. It was a 0:14:34.800 --> 0:14:37.960 review written by Lucy Mangan, who is a great TV reviewer. 0:14:38.040 --> 0:14:41.960 I love her reviews generally, but she kind of just 0:14:42.200 --> 0:14:46.160 spins out about this premise, and she writes that the 0:14:46.280 --> 0:14:50.120 poor man we are led to understand is not a predator. 0:14:50.160 --> 0:14:53.320 He's just a bit weak and lonely, and never asks 0:14:53.360 --> 0:14:57.080 the question of whether inexperienced people are ever in command 0:14:57.160 --> 0:15:03.160 of a situation involving experienced people of any kind. So basically, 0:15:03.160 --> 0:15:06.640 as a society, we seem to have decided that inherently, 0:15:06.720 --> 0:15:09.280 if you have an age gap, regardless of whether it's 0:15:09.320 --> 0:15:12.720 a man, again, regardless of which gender is in which 0:15:13.040 --> 0:15:16.920 power position, it can never be a relationship that's anything 0:15:16.960 --> 0:15:20.240 other than wrong or perverted. And I just think that 0:15:20.240 --> 0:15:24.640 that's insane. Twenty six is a full grown adult who 0:15:24.760 --> 0:15:28.120 is perfectly capable of consenting to this relationship. Is it 0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:30.440 a good relationship? No? Are they compatible? Not in the 0:15:30.480 --> 0:15:32.520 slightest But the. 0:15:32.560 --> 0:15:35.480 Best friends started dating your daughter? Yes, Well, yeah, that's 0:15:35.520 --> 0:15:36.800 the premise of the show. 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:41.120 But to say that the concept in itself of someone 0:15:41.200 --> 0:15:43.880 being more experienced than someone means that there is an 0:15:43.880 --> 0:15:47.160 inherent and wrong power dynamic. I just think is like 0:15:47.840 --> 0:15:51.160 a very strange new morality emerging. 0:15:51.800 --> 0:15:55.480 I I think we've always been totally fine with age 0:15:55.480 --> 0:15:58.000 gap relationships when it's men and women. For a long time, 0:15:58.040 --> 0:16:00.680 older men younger women. That was the norm and every 0:16:00.680 --> 0:16:02.920 movie you've ever seen when you think about it, right, 0:16:03.560 --> 0:16:05.880 I think it's only recently post Me Too, we've started 0:16:05.920 --> 0:16:08.440 pushing back on them with any actual veracity. 0:16:08.720 --> 0:16:12.160 Like well, but the fact that Jason Sudeikis was dating 0:16:12.200 --> 0:16:14.080 somebody who was younger. 0:16:13.760 --> 0:16:14.960 And no one even meaned it. 0:16:15.040 --> 0:16:17.240 I didn't know that. That's the first I had heard 0:16:17.320 --> 0:16:19.720 when when Olivia Wilde said it in the Call a 0:16:19.760 --> 0:16:20.400 Daddy interview. 0:16:20.480 --> 0:16:24.000 I think that a lot of the kind of way 0:16:24.040 --> 0:16:27.200 you feel about age gut relationships, Like many things in life, 0:16:27.320 --> 0:16:30.320 it's often about your life stage and where you're at, 0:16:30.440 --> 0:16:33.800 because I think that I don't think that generally we 0:16:33.840 --> 0:16:37.320 think that age gat relationships full stop are wrong, But 0:16:37.400 --> 0:16:40.400 you can see the power dynamics so much more clearly 0:16:40.480 --> 0:16:42.120 from later in your life. 0:16:42.160 --> 0:16:45.040 But I want to keep the conversation around a twenty 0:16:45.120 --> 0:16:48.800 six year old is not apparently capable of deciding that 0:16:48.880 --> 0:16:51.000 she wants to have a fling with this guy as 0:16:51.080 --> 0:16:52.880 much older than her. And the thing is that all 0:16:52.920 --> 0:16:56.520 relationships have power differentials, like no one enters into a 0:16:56.560 --> 0:17:00.280 relationship entirely equal on every footing. For instance, I'm a 0:17:00.360 --> 0:17:02.760 very very bad driver because I learned in my thirties. 0:17:03.000 --> 0:17:06.080 I'm very inexperienced when it comes to driving. I'm married 0:17:06.080 --> 0:17:08.080 to someone who's a great driver, who's been driving like 0:17:08.119 --> 0:17:11.359 a normal person since his teens. That's okay. There's different 0:17:11.400 --> 0:17:13.080 power dynamics and relationships. 0:17:13.160 --> 0:17:15.679 Oh, I agree, once you're an adult, do what you 0:17:15.720 --> 0:17:18.359 want to do. But I think that as older women 0:17:18.359 --> 0:17:22.400 in particular often get a very cynical about the men 0:17:22.440 --> 0:17:25.680 in their lives who, strangely their girlfriends are always twenty five. 0:17:25.840 --> 0:17:28.400 It's like no one is suggesting that that twenty five 0:17:28.480 --> 0:17:31.879 year old doesn't have agency. It's more it says something 0:17:31.920 --> 0:17:34.199 about you if you're a man in your fifties and 0:17:34.240 --> 0:17:36.080 you only date twenty five year olds. I mean, look 0:17:36.080 --> 0:17:39.119 at how we all laugh at Leonardo DiCaprio, right, And 0:17:39.200 --> 0:17:43.720 so I think I do think it's true that Olivia Wilde, 0:17:43.760 --> 0:17:45.920 when you listen to this interview and they go through 0:17:45.920 --> 0:17:48.480 this crazy year, we burnt that woman. 0:17:48.280 --> 0:17:50.200 At the stage the public shame. 0:17:50.280 --> 0:17:52.720 It is one hundred percent true. She was dating our 0:17:52.760 --> 0:17:56.440 favorite internet son. You know, she was older than him. 0:17:56.440 --> 0:17:59.679 What a predator. She had young children. She makes a 0:17:59.720 --> 0:18:02.760 point that not long after the divorce, it was thanks 0:18:02.800 --> 0:18:06.040 and all the custody arrangements were fine, and it was 0:18:06.080 --> 0:18:08.760 Thanksgiving and she was home with the kids and Sedukis 0:18:08.880 --> 0:18:10.840 was in Costa Rica with his young girlfriend, and she 0:18:10.880 --> 0:18:13.000 said that was fine. I knew he was there. Everybody 0:18:13.200 --> 0:18:15.359 but the press had the pictures of him and his 0:18:15.400 --> 0:18:16.800 young girlfriend on the beach, and they were all like, 0:18:16.880 --> 0:18:19.639 how lovely for him, isn't that great? I would like 0:18:19.720 --> 0:18:22.120 to see what they would have said about me if 0:18:22.119 --> 0:18:24.520 it was a national holiday and I was not with 0:18:24.600 --> 0:18:29.040 my children frolicking on a beach with Harry Styles. I 0:18:29.040 --> 0:18:30.440 think we know what they would have not. 0:18:30.840 --> 0:18:33.080 And I agree with that she was burned at the stage. 0:18:33.160 --> 0:18:35.480 I guess I'm just saying that I think you're right 0:18:35.560 --> 0:18:40.320 that post me too. We're casting that judgment more on 0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:43.040 men than we're used to, and maybe that's a good thing, 0:18:43.160 --> 0:18:47.119 but I'm just observing that that's changed since say the nineties, 0:18:47.119 --> 0:18:51.600 when feminists everywhere stuck up for Bill Clinton because they 0:18:51.640 --> 0:18:54.959 said that Monica Lewinsky was perfectly capable of consenting as 0:18:55.000 --> 0:18:59.640 an intern to engaging in sexual acts with the president. 0:19:00.600 --> 0:19:04.439 I think what's interesting about the Olivia Wilde story is 0:19:04.520 --> 0:19:08.560 that now with the benefit of hindsight and kind of 0:19:08.600 --> 0:19:14.040 the sting coming out of whatever, we were so furious 0:19:14.040 --> 0:19:17.840 about at the time, which feels so ridiculous. Do you 0:19:17.880 --> 0:19:21.480 think it was I think we were angry. We were 0:19:21.520 --> 0:19:25.919 angry that she hired Harry Styles and that she they 0:19:25.960 --> 0:19:28.800 were spending a lot of time together in the trailer, Amelia, 0:19:29.280 --> 0:19:29.640 and that. 0:19:29.680 --> 0:19:34.840 Was probably making Florence uncomfortable. Like I get Florence's side 0:19:34.880 --> 0:19:38.959 in this. I think in a workplace dynamic, that's not easy. 0:19:39.200 --> 0:19:42.440 Yeah, so I think we were mad about that. We 0:19:42.440 --> 0:19:47.000 were mad, but we I think we were mad that 0:19:47.359 --> 0:19:52.440 he's just an innocent little boy and this woman who's 0:19:52.440 --> 0:19:55.879 a grown up, divorced woman. Yeah, divorced woman. Remember the 0:19:55.960 --> 0:20:01.880 story about about the salad He brought salad dressing Styles 0:20:02.720 --> 0:20:05.439 a salad over to her house. This came from the 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:09.040 nanny brought a salad over to her house, and Jason 0:20:09.080 --> 0:20:11.920 Sadaikis was so sad about it that he like laid 0:20:11.960 --> 0:20:15.440 in front of the car or something to like stop her. 0:20:15.560 --> 0:20:17.920 It was a messy split. It was a really really 0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:20.240 amating and then the salad dressing recipe went viral. It 0:20:20.320 --> 0:20:23.159 was the one from Harper Nora Refron's one from Hartburn. 0:20:23.240 --> 0:20:24.800 This is a deep cut. But then I think we 0:20:24.880 --> 0:20:27.720