WEBVTT - The Debate, Eating Pets & Taylor’s Cat

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<v Speaker 1>You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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<v Speaker 2>that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to

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<v Speaker 2>Mama Mia out Loud. It's what women are actually talking

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<v Speaker 2>about on Wednesday, the eleventh of September. I'm Holly Wainwright.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Mea Friedman, and I'm recording remotely today in case

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<v Speaker 1>I sound a little bit different to normal, because I'm

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<v Speaker 1>on the road doing our and your upfronts where we

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<v Speaker 1>talk about all the exciting things we've got coming up

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<v Speaker 1>at Mamma Mia next year to all out advertisers. But

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<v Speaker 1>there was no way I was going to miss weighing

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<v Speaker 1>in on this episode. Between the Kate Middleton video and

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<v Speaker 1>the debate, I'm all in.

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<v Speaker 3>That's one of the biggest episodes of the year.

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<v Speaker 1>I think.

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<v Speaker 3>I am Jesse Stevens.

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<v Speaker 2>And on the show today, as Maya has alluded to Trump, Paris,

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<v Speaker 2>Dogs and Cats and Taylor, we watched the first and

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<v Speaker 2>probably only US presidential debate so that you don't have to. Also,

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<v Speaker 2>the very happy announcement sees William and Kate take a

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<v Speaker 2>pr pivot straight out of the Harry and Meghan playbook,

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<v Speaker 2>and it looks like the social media band that kids

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<v Speaker 2>is actually going to happen. Should we be celebrating or panicking?

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<v Speaker 2>But first, Jesse Stevens.

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<v Speaker 3>In case you missed it, there is a photo circulating

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<v Speaker 3>of Matt Damon and Jennifer Lopez that I will argue

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<v Speaker 3>is one of the most iconic images of our lifetime.

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<v Speaker 2>I agree with you, Jesse, I agree with you. I

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<v Speaker 2>was so excited when I saw that. Our group chat immediately,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm like, look at this.

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<v Speaker 3>This week, Damon and Lopez appeared on the red carpet

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<v Speaker 3>for the premiere of Unstoppable at the Toronto International Film.

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<v Speaker 1>First, can we talk about what she was wearing?

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, Mea, obviously, that is the first point on the agenda.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, thank you.

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<v Speaker 3>We should say that the film was made by Damon

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<v Speaker 3>as production company, it stars Lopez.

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<v Speaker 1>I want to that's why he was there.

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<v Speaker 2>Maya. You have to let the woman give some context

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<v Speaker 2>to wear this image.

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<v Speaker 3>Of all time unpacked the dress.

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<v Speaker 1>Please, it is the best revenge dress since Diana's dress

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<v Speaker 1>that she wore On the night that Charles's interview went

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<v Speaker 1>to air, where he talked about his relationship with Camille.

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<v Speaker 1>I remember she wore that navy blue dress. We just

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<v Speaker 1>saw it replicated on the crown with Elizabeth Tickie anyway,

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<v Speaker 1>on the red carpet. I just could talk about this

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<v Speaker 1>for a long time. She was wearing this dress. It

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<v Speaker 1>was clear she was naked underneath because it had like

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<v Speaker 1>these bows all the way down. It'll become one of

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<v Speaker 1>the most iconic dresses, I think. But what's really interesting

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<v Speaker 1>about it that only real experts will have noticed, is

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<v Speaker 1>that it very clearly showed the place on her body

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<v Speaker 1>under her left breast where she had matching tattoos with Ben.

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<v Speaker 1>She's had it removed.

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<v Speaker 3>I wouldn't correct you, but it's her right breast.

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<v Speaker 1>No, I think it's her left.

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<v Speaker 3>It is her right breast. Now, do you want to describe.

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<v Speaker 1>The tattoo anyway? I can't remember what it was. It

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<v Speaker 1>was some symbol and it's not there anymore. Is the

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<v Speaker 1>most important thing to take away from this whole conversation? Anyway,

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<v Speaker 1>continue he covered it up with makeup.

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<v Speaker 3>She did, and it was an infinity symbol with Jennifer

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<v Speaker 3>and Ben written and it was covered up. And it

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<v Speaker 3>appears that she did wear that dress so that she

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<v Speaker 3>could cover up her tattoo. Now to the photo.

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<v Speaker 4>I love that.

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<v Speaker 3>At the after party, Damon and Lopez were photographed deep

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<v Speaker 3>in conversation. They are holding hands, Lopez appears to be talking,

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<v Speaker 3>and Damon has his head bowed as though to say,

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<v Speaker 3>I've been talking about this fucking relationship for twenty years

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<v Speaker 3>and I have had enough.

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<v Speaker 1>I think we've all been Matt Damon in that photo.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes we have.

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<v Speaker 2>I want I've been both the people in that photo.

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<v Speaker 3>I want Holly to lip read this still image. Holly,

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<v Speaker 3>what are they saying? Because some are saying that they're

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<v Speaker 3>praying together because they have their heads. That is obviously incorrect.

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<v Speaker 1>I'll come on.

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<v Speaker 2>You know sometimes you have to do penance for your

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<v Speaker 2>bad friends. Yeah, yeah, right, And he is in this photo.

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<v Speaker 2>My lipreading take is he's like, I know, I'm sorry,

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<v Speaker 2>he's a dick. What can I say? And she's like

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<v Speaker 2>and another thing. He's like, I know, I'm sorry, I

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<v Speaker 2>love him, but he's a dick. What can I say?

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<v Speaker 2>And she just keeps going because she's had a champagne

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<v Speaker 2>and she's like, I just there's another and he's like,

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<v Speaker 2>I know, I'm sorry, he's a dick. What could I say?

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<v Speaker 2>That's what I think.

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<v Speaker 3>Is happening may or what do you think they're saying

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<v Speaker 3>to each other.

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<v Speaker 1>I think they're both someone who really loved Benefwick, and

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<v Speaker 1>I think that you know when you love someone, but

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<v Speaker 1>you also just watch them get in their own way.

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<v Speaker 1>And he's obviously done something and behaved in a way

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<v Speaker 1>that they're both really familiar with. And I think what's

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<v Speaker 1>really important in all the sort of leaks, because of

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<v Speaker 1>course she's caught so much heat for this breakup, including

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<v Speaker 1>on this podcast about.

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<v Speaker 2>From you, I'd say Jesse and I have been defending her.

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<v Speaker 1>I was hoping we could gloss over that, but she

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<v Speaker 1>has copped a lot of heat about and particularly on

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<v Speaker 1>the internet also here, but about that she's too much,

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<v Speaker 1>she was too hungry for attention, she suppose their life,

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<v Speaker 1>And I think what's really clear is that that was

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<v Speaker 1>obviously put out by his camp preemptively or maybe the

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<v Speaker 1>just that's what we all thought because it's the way

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<v Speaker 1>that everyone defaults to blaming the woman. But what's really

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<v Speaker 1>interesting about after this breakup, she has been seen with

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<v Speaker 1>his kids. She clearly remains close and has a quarterial

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<v Speaker 1>relationship with his ex wife because she's attended Jennifer Garner

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<v Speaker 1>and Ben Affleck's kids events, which if they weren't close,

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<v Speaker 1>it wouldn't happen. And now here she is holding hands

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<v Speaker 1>almost in prayer with his best friend of his whole life.

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<v Speaker 1>So clearly she's not the one that fault here.

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<v Speaker 3>I completely agree. I think he is definitely being a.

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<v Speaker 1>Part I think he's cheated, and he's back on the

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<v Speaker 1>gear like that's what I think.

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<v Speaker 2>Please? Can I make it really clear that this is

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<v Speaker 2>wild speculation and that none of us have any eye

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<v Speaker 2>can I that's true?

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<v Speaker 3>The other thing I've been thinking when I'm seeing these

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<v Speaker 3>images is I'm imagining text exchange between Ben and Matt,

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<v Speaker 3>because now Ben's going, Matt, I have seen the photos

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<v Speaker 3>and I need to know what you've discussed. And Matt said,

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<v Speaker 3>you put me in that situation. I didn't want to

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<v Speaker 3>be at the after party talking to a crying jin

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<v Speaker 3>but you didn't come, and he's like, what did you say?

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<v Speaker 3>And then they're going back and forth, back and forth.

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<v Speaker 3>I think it's very uncomfortable between the two men right now.

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<v Speaker 1>It's great.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry it's great, but it's great.

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<v Speaker 4>It is very well known that Donald Trump is weak

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<v Speaker 4>and wrong. Nowhere in America is a woman carrying a

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<v Speaker 4>pregnancy to term and asking for an abortion that is

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<v Speaker 4>not happening. It's insulting to the women of America.

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<v Speaker 5>She was big on defund the police in Minnesota. She

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<v Speaker 5>went out, I'm talking now, if you don't mind, please,

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<v Speaker 5>does that sound familiar? I would say we would both

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<v Speaker 5>leave this debate right now. I'd like to see her

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<v Speaker 5>go down to Washington, DC during this debate because we're

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<v Speaker 5>wasting a lot of time because it's been so bad,

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<v Speaker 5>it's so ridiculous. And you know what, I give you

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<v Speaker 5>a little secret. He hates her. He can't stand her.

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<v Speaker 5>In Springfield, they're eating the dogs, the people that came in,

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<v Speaker 5>they're eating the cats, they're eating the pets of the

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<v Speaker 5>people that live there. And this is what's happening in

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<v Speaker 5>our country and it's a shame.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm going to invite you to attend one of Donald

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<v Speaker 4>Trump's rallies because it's a really interesting thing to watch.

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<v Speaker 4>You will see during the course of his rallies he

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<v Speaker 4>talks about fictional characters like Hannibal Lecter. He will talk

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<v Speaker 4>about win Mills cause cancer. And what you will also

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<v Speaker 4>notice is that people start leaving his rallies early out

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<v Speaker 4>of exhaustion and boredom.

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<v Speaker 1>We're eating pets, we're executing babies, and Taylor Swift has

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<v Speaker 1>entered the chat. Welcome to the presidential debate twenty four,

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<v Speaker 1>the second this year, but with two well with one

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<v Speaker 1>different candidate. We just walked into the studio. We haven't

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<v Speaker 1>even had time to talk amongst ourselves. Jesse, how feeling.

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<v Speaker 3>I really enjoyed that debate. I felt as though at

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<v Speaker 3>times I was watching a courtroom drama, and what we

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<v Speaker 3>saw was Harris the prosecutor. I think her greatest strength,

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<v Speaker 3>which I noticed within the first few minutes, was actually

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<v Speaker 3>in her rebuttals, like she knew how to refute him,

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<v Speaker 3>and it felt like there was a custodian of democracy,

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<v Speaker 3>like there was a grown up in the room, like

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<v Speaker 3>there was someone that you could trust. Obviously, that's a

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<v Speaker 3>completely biased view because I align with most of Harris's policies.

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<v Speaker 3>I think it's notable that Trump didn't ever look in

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<v Speaker 3>her direction. He was looking down kind of the camera

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<v Speaker 3>and straight on, whereas when he was speaking, she was

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<v Speaker 3>looking at him. And I think her facial expressions, I

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<v Speaker 3>kept thinking about how much she would have practiced them

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<v Speaker 3>and decided how she would respond. So there wasn't eye rolling,

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<v Speaker 3>there was anything that I thought was particularly denigrating. But

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<v Speaker 3>there were moments where she laughed, which said a lot.

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<v Speaker 3>And there was a lot of strategy in the way

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<v Speaker 3>that she knew how to rile him up. She knew

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<v Speaker 3>what buttons to press and where he might have had

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<v Speaker 3>something strong to say. She knew that if he suggested

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<v Speaker 3>that other world leaders were laughing at him, or people

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<v Speaker 3>were leaving his rallies early, then he would get so

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<v Speaker 3>stuck on that point that he would become undone. So

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<v Speaker 3>I thought it was masterful by her. And the analysis

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<v Speaker 3>I heard before this debate was if we come out

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<v Speaker 3>of this debate talking about Harris, then Trump won, and

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<v Speaker 3>if we come out talking about Trump than Harris one.

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<v Speaker 3>I actually disagree with that analysis. I think that people

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<v Speaker 3>will be coming out of this talking about what Harris said,

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<v Speaker 3>how she held herself. There are viral moments of her strengths,

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<v Speaker 3>but also Trump's weakness.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, I don't know about that, because I think

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<v Speaker 2>the most obvious easy headline is the eating cats and dogs.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah right, So the first thing that everybody on social

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<v Speaker 2>media globbed onto was him saying that the thing that

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<v Speaker 2>everybody needs to understand about that line, because it sounded

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<v Speaker 2>like she'd provoked him and he'd gone off his head. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>but they'd already said that. The Republicans have already been

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<v Speaker 2>talking about this, this untrue story that illegal aliens are

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<v Speaker 2>stealing people's pets from backyards in Ohio and eating them. JD.

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<v Speaker 2>Vance has tweeted about it, so they've tested that line.

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<v Speaker 2>We need to remember this. This is one of the

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<v Speaker 2>things I think it's so important with Trump is it's

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<v Speaker 2>so easy to laugh at him, which he hates, so

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<v Speaker 2>it's great to do that too. But in the first

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<v Speaker 2>two minutes of that debate, I was nervous because you

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<v Speaker 2>want to look at him, right, he looks weird. We

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<v Speaker 2>all know that, his orange face. It's got to be deliberate.

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<v Speaker 2>He looks like somebody you want to look at. He

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<v Speaker 2>says stupid things, he shouts him, and that actually makes

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<v Speaker 2>him a formidable opponent because who you're looking at is

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<v Speaker 2>who's got your attention, obviously. And I was worried at

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<v Speaker 2>first because I thought she sounded a little unsure footed,

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<v Speaker 2>but then she was just so good. But I think

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<v Speaker 2>the things remember, while we're all lolling about cats and

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<v Speaker 2>dogs and stuff. Is they've chosen that for a reason,

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<v Speaker 2>and they know that people, certain people will like that

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<v Speaker 2>and hang on to it and roll with it.

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<v Speaker 3>And JD. Vance was on Twitter and even he has said,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, this will probably end up being false, like

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<v Speaker 3>he's acknowledged that it's probably false, and that is an

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<v Speaker 3>old trope, really damaging racist trope about immigrants who eat animals,

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<v Speaker 3>like it is so so racist. There is no factual findings,

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<v Speaker 3>but the moment itself will be seen as a funny

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<v Speaker 3>social media grab, which is when most people will probably

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<v Speaker 3>be watching it. MAYA, what did you think?

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<v Speaker 1>I was worried at first. I thought that he looked composed.

0:11:59.327 --> 0:12:02.167
<v Speaker 1>I thought he'd actually been sedated. I thought he looked

0:12:02.767 --> 0:12:06.167
<v Speaker 1>healthy and composed. And I thought she looked worried, and

0:12:06.207 --> 0:12:10.647
<v Speaker 1>she was nervous in the beginning. And I'm so annoyed

0:12:10.767 --> 0:12:13.687
<v Speaker 1>that the abortion question was so early because she hadn't

0:12:13.767 --> 0:12:15.047
<v Speaker 1>hit her stride yet, and I.

0:12:15.407 --> 0:12:16.487
<v Speaker 3>Thought she was brilliant.

0:12:17.727 --> 0:12:18.527
<v Speaker 2>I disagree.

0:12:18.887 --> 0:12:22.647
<v Speaker 1>I didn't because I thought she was fine, Like I meant, God,

0:12:22.687 --> 0:12:26.327
<v Speaker 1>he's insane. But what I wanted her to say, because

0:12:26.367 --> 0:12:30.087
<v Speaker 1>he always does this right, he talks about aborting babies,

0:12:30.247 --> 0:12:33.007
<v Speaker 1>killing them after they're born. He talks about that, that's

0:12:33.007 --> 0:12:36.607
<v Speaker 1>what the Democrats do, that's what Kamala does, and no

0:12:36.647 --> 0:12:40.487
<v Speaker 1>one's ever really challenged him properly on that, and I

0:12:40.527 --> 0:12:42.887
<v Speaker 1>think that. I mean, the little fact check by ther

0:12:43.367 --> 0:12:46.367
<v Speaker 1>moderators was almost funny, where they were like.

0:12:46.447 --> 0:12:48.447
<v Speaker 4>There is no state in this country where it is

0:12:48.527 --> 0:12:50.567
<v Speaker 4>legal to kill a baby after it's born.

0:12:50.727 --> 0:12:55.407
<v Speaker 1>But what I really wanted her to say was, mister Trump,

0:12:55.407 --> 0:12:59.247
<v Speaker 1>are you okay? Are you unwell? Because you keep talking

0:12:59.287 --> 0:13:04.567
<v Speaker 1>about executing babies like you are imagining this stuff. This

0:13:04.727 --> 0:13:08.687
<v Speaker 1>is the stuff of terrible nightmares and delusions. I wanted

0:13:08.687 --> 0:13:11.607
<v Speaker 1>her to go what I wanted through this whole thing

0:13:11.767 --> 0:13:15.607
<v Speaker 1>about the dog eating and the babies and the all

0:13:15.647 --> 0:13:18.047
<v Speaker 1>the crazy, because she needed to draw out the crazy

0:13:18.047 --> 0:13:20.687
<v Speaker 1>in him, and I did. She did, but it was

0:13:20.727 --> 0:13:23.287
<v Speaker 1>sort of drip fed. So it's clear she knew that

0:13:23.287 --> 0:13:25.527
<v Speaker 1>there were about six or seven things that she needed

0:13:25.567 --> 0:13:27.487
<v Speaker 1>to say that would make him crazy, and every single

0:13:27.527 --> 0:13:30.367
<v Speaker 1>one of them did, from crowd size to you know,

0:13:30.447 --> 0:13:34.487
<v Speaker 1>his rallies, to saying that other leaders were disgusted. So

0:13:34.487 --> 0:13:36.327
<v Speaker 1>she knew all of those things and she dropped them

0:13:36.367 --> 0:13:38.607
<v Speaker 1>but what I wanted her to do was to build them.

0:13:39.007 --> 0:13:40.847
<v Speaker 1>I wanted her to build them so that he would

0:13:40.847 --> 0:13:44.687
<v Speaker 1>get more and more crazy, because I wanted her to

0:13:44.767 --> 0:13:48.407
<v Speaker 1>really go to his cognitive decline. He's marked by such

0:13:48.447 --> 0:13:51.247
<v Speaker 1>a different yardstick than anyone else. I mean, we talked

0:13:51.247 --> 0:13:54.087
<v Speaker 1>about Biden's cognitive decline, but the stuff that Donald's Trump

0:13:54.167 --> 0:13:56.527
<v Speaker 1>says and has always said is actually nuts, like it's

0:13:56.567 --> 0:13:59.727
<v Speaker 1>completely nuts, but it's just like, oh, yeah, that's just him.

0:14:00.127 --> 0:14:03.127
<v Speaker 1>And I wanted her to really draw that line and

0:14:03.207 --> 0:14:05.127
<v Speaker 1>to start because he will be that. He is already

0:14:05.127 --> 0:14:08.807
<v Speaker 1>the oldest ever candidate running for president, and I wanted

0:14:08.807 --> 0:14:12.247
<v Speaker 1>her to start making that the story, his cognitive decline

0:14:12.247 --> 0:14:14.727
<v Speaker 1>and he's crazy, so everyone people start questioning that.

0:14:15.087 --> 0:14:18.407
<v Speaker 2>I was deeply impressed because the context that we go

0:14:18.447 --> 0:14:22.367
<v Speaker 2>into this debate with every headline, every US politics pod,

0:14:22.487 --> 0:14:26.047
<v Speaker 2>every poll is like her honeymoon is over. She is shaky,

0:14:26.527 --> 0:14:29.687
<v Speaker 2>she is on the back foot. People were really nervous

0:14:29.727 --> 0:14:32.567
<v Speaker 2>about how she's going to perform because she's underestimated at

0:14:32.567 --> 0:14:36.087
<v Speaker 2>every turn, that woman, And there's all this muttering all

0:14:36.127 --> 0:14:39.887
<v Speaker 2>the time about how she's terrible off tellyprompter, she's not

0:14:39.967 --> 0:14:42.567
<v Speaker 2>good on her feet. I actually thought she was great.

0:14:42.647 --> 0:14:44.527
<v Speaker 2>I agree with you Mia that in the very beginning,

0:14:44.527 --> 0:14:46.807
<v Speaker 2>I was nervous. But for me, she hit her stride

0:14:46.847 --> 0:14:48.527
<v Speaker 2>in that abortion discussion.

0:14:48.647 --> 0:14:51.727
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, the way that she basically said, women don't want this,

0:14:51.847 --> 0:14:54.727
<v Speaker 3>women who you know have been raped or their baby

0:14:54.807 --> 0:14:56.727
<v Speaker 3>is a product of Like, women do not want this.

0:14:56.847 --> 0:14:59.127
<v Speaker 3>And she made a great point, which was that this

0:14:59.167 --> 0:15:01.567
<v Speaker 3>is offensive to all women that you think we're walking

0:15:01.647 --> 0:15:05.087
<v Speaker 3>around wanting abortions at nine months. I think her party

0:15:05.207 --> 0:15:09.087
<v Speaker 3>line instead of going the crazy route, the thing that

0:15:09.127 --> 0:15:11.967
<v Speaker 3>was repeated over and over again was he tells lies,

0:15:12.047 --> 0:15:14.007
<v Speaker 3>he tells lies. So then when there was another one,

0:15:14.047 --> 0:15:16.127
<v Speaker 3>she just went kind of shrugged her shoulders. And when

0:15:16.167 --> 0:15:17.487
<v Speaker 3>I told you he was going to lie, I told

0:15:17.527 --> 0:15:19.567
<v Speaker 3>you he was going to lie. That seemed like the

0:15:19.607 --> 0:15:22.407
<v Speaker 3>party line for me. But I want to go back

0:15:22.407 --> 0:15:24.967
<v Speaker 3>to the very beginning and the significance of the hands

0:15:25.167 --> 0:15:28.727
<v Speaker 3>Yes go com because they'd never met, that was going

0:15:28.767 --> 0:15:30.047
<v Speaker 3>to be an important moment.

0:15:30.287 --> 0:15:34.287
<v Speaker 2>Also, the important context is in the Biden Trump debate,

0:15:34.447 --> 0:15:37.687
<v Speaker 2>they didn't shake hands, they didn't acknowledge each other's existence,

0:15:38.047 --> 0:15:39.967
<v Speaker 2>and we talked about it at the time. Actually, I

0:15:40.007 --> 0:15:44.767
<v Speaker 2>hate that You've got to at least have the facade

0:15:44.807 --> 0:15:49.127
<v Speaker 2>of some kind of civilized debate, and he didn't come out,

0:15:49.207 --> 0:15:50.767
<v Speaker 2>but she made him do it.

0:15:50.887 --> 0:15:52.887
<v Speaker 3>She made him do it, which made her look strong.

0:15:53.607 --> 0:15:58.087
<v Speaker 3>She initiated, he sort of didn't have a choice. I

0:15:58.127 --> 0:16:02.167
<v Speaker 3>think it established a power dynamic within the debate. And

0:16:02.207 --> 0:16:03.927
<v Speaker 3>there's you know, people who say that Trump's a bit

0:16:03.927 --> 0:16:05.927
<v Speaker 3>of a germophobe and that he doesn't like handshakes have

0:16:05.927 --> 0:16:08.687
<v Speaker 3>been a big thing to Trump throughout his presidency and

0:16:08.807 --> 0:16:12.567
<v Speaker 3>you know, even this campaign period. So that to me

0:16:13.087 --> 0:16:16.087
<v Speaker 3>was a very significant moment, and it just showed she

0:16:16.207 --> 0:16:19.807
<v Speaker 3>was presidential. I thought she was incredibly presidential from that

0:16:19.927 --> 0:16:20.647
<v Speaker 3>moment onwards.

0:16:20.847 --> 0:16:22.447
<v Speaker 1>What did you think of the split screen? Who do

0:16:22.447 --> 0:16:23.607
<v Speaker 1>you think won the split screen?

0:16:24.007 --> 0:16:24.767
<v Speaker 2>I think she did.

0:16:24.847 --> 0:16:25.207
<v Speaker 3>She did.

0:16:25.447 --> 0:16:28.727
<v Speaker 2>Every single meme that I've seen flying around is because

0:16:28.727 --> 0:16:30.887
<v Speaker 2>you were talking about her facial expressions, Jesse, and that

0:16:30.927 --> 0:16:35.287
<v Speaker 2>she was restrained. She was restrained. But that face that

0:16:35.607 --> 0:16:37.967
<v Speaker 2>you're out of because you're right, mere, she didn't say it,

0:16:38.407 --> 0:16:40.727
<v Speaker 2>but her face said it all the time. You're out

0:16:40.767 --> 0:16:43.807
<v Speaker 2>of your mind. What are you talking about? You're crazy?

0:16:43.887 --> 0:16:46.767
<v Speaker 2>That's what that face was, and that's what's going around

0:16:46.807 --> 0:16:48.687
<v Speaker 2>the world at top speed, right now is like, this

0:16:48.807 --> 0:16:51.487
<v Speaker 2>is the face I use when my ex partner says blah.

0:16:51.527 --> 0:16:53.927
<v Speaker 2>This is the face I use when my boss does blah.

0:16:54.007 --> 0:16:56.487
<v Speaker 2>Like I think that's probably the best reaction she could

0:16:56.487 --> 0:17:00.647
<v Speaker 2>have had, smiling looking at him like he's ridiculous, but

0:17:00.767 --> 0:17:04.607
<v Speaker 2>without school yard kind of level. She's very sparkly, right,

0:17:04.687 --> 0:17:06.367
<v Speaker 2>you know how I said before one of the problems

0:17:06.367 --> 0:17:08.607
<v Speaker 2>with Trump is even if you hate him, which you

0:17:08.647 --> 0:17:11.567
<v Speaker 2>know clearly we all do and our allegiances are clear,

0:17:11.607 --> 0:17:14.047
<v Speaker 2>and I apologize for that if anybody loves him out there,

0:17:14.367 --> 0:17:16.927
<v Speaker 2>But even if you think he's a dangerous death pot,

0:17:17.047 --> 0:17:19.367
<v Speaker 2>as I say, you can't really help but look at him.

0:17:19.567 --> 0:17:22.487
<v Speaker 2>But there's something about her. When she's in her comfortable strides,

0:17:22.567 --> 0:17:25.767
<v Speaker 2>she's very sparkly. Her eyes are twinkly, her smile is amazing.

0:17:26.007 --> 0:17:28.447
<v Speaker 2>My eye became more and more drawn to her as

0:17:28.487 --> 0:17:28.887
<v Speaker 2>we went on.

0:17:29.087 --> 0:17:32.127
<v Speaker 3>She just came across as very very smart and like

0:17:32.887 --> 0:17:34.847
<v Speaker 3>well qualified and all of the things that we knew

0:17:34.847 --> 0:17:37.407
<v Speaker 3>she was. But I saw a prosecutor, which is what

0:17:37.567 --> 0:17:40.167
<v Speaker 3>I think would have been the aim. I want to

0:17:40.167 --> 0:17:43.367
<v Speaker 3>talk about a comment he made about the assassination, because

0:17:43.407 --> 0:17:46.047
<v Speaker 3>he got one in there. He got one which was

0:17:46.167 --> 0:17:49.887
<v Speaker 3>basically a jab at the Democrats, suggesting what was their

0:17:50.007 --> 0:17:52.727
<v Speaker 3>fault they had something to answer for when it came

0:17:52.767 --> 0:17:55.687
<v Speaker 3>to him getting shot in I think he said in

0:17:55.727 --> 0:17:56.287
<v Speaker 3>the face, it was.

0:17:56.327 --> 0:17:58.527
<v Speaker 2>In the head, and I took a bullet to the head.

0:17:58.727 --> 0:17:59.287
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:17:59.447 --> 0:18:02.727
<v Speaker 3>Now, Millennia Trump has released a video just in the

0:18:02.807 --> 0:18:06.207
<v Speaker 3>last twenty four hours promoting a book that's about to

0:18:06.247 --> 0:18:09.407
<v Speaker 3>come out, where she has fueled this conspiracy theory. So

0:18:09.487 --> 0:18:12.607
<v Speaker 3>she's basically saying, there's more that you need to know.

0:18:13.047 --> 0:18:15.367
<v Speaker 3>Do we think the Republicans are about to go full

0:18:15.407 --> 0:18:19.407
<v Speaker 3>blown tinfoil hats? This was a Democrat job? Like, is that?

0:18:19.487 --> 0:18:20.207
<v Speaker 3>Is that where we're heading?

0:18:20.327 --> 0:18:20.527
<v Speaker 1>Yeah?

0:18:20.607 --> 0:18:24.807
<v Speaker 2>Yes, Trump's people they lean into the conspiracy theories because

0:18:24.807 --> 0:18:27.247
<v Speaker 2>they're very good for them, right, And I think that

0:18:28.167 --> 0:18:31.847
<v Speaker 2>there's no accident that he said that in what appeared

0:18:31.887 --> 0:18:34.407
<v Speaker 2>to be an offhand way, and it's twelve hours before

0:18:34.487 --> 0:18:38.087
<v Speaker 2>Milani's video had been released. This is a new strategy

0:18:38.127 --> 0:18:38.407
<v Speaker 2>for them.

0:18:38.847 --> 0:18:38.967
<v Speaker 5>HM.

0:18:39.527 --> 0:18:41.527
<v Speaker 3>Can we also talk about Taylor. I need to talk

0:18:41.527 --> 0:18:44.767
<v Speaker 3>about Taylor and her press release following the debate.

0:18:44.527 --> 0:18:47.087
<v Speaker 2>Maya, how are you feeling about Taylor? There's no accident

0:18:47.087 --> 0:18:49.287
<v Speaker 2>in the photos she chose to use in her endorsement,

0:18:49.327 --> 0:18:50.247
<v Speaker 2>tell the people about it.

0:18:50.447 --> 0:18:53.767
<v Speaker 1>I'm very excited. My phone blew up just before we

0:18:54.007 --> 0:18:57.327
<v Speaker 1>jumped on to record this. The timing of this is

0:18:57.447 --> 0:19:01.647
<v Speaker 1>just so fascinating to me. So she put out quite

0:19:01.647 --> 0:19:04.327
<v Speaker 1>a long statement at the end of the debate, and

0:19:04.367 --> 0:19:08.247
<v Speaker 1>she referenced the debate. So again, this didn't happen by accident.

0:19:08.247 --> 0:19:10.047
<v Speaker 1>Tree Pain would have been all over it, and also

0:19:10.287 --> 0:19:12.607
<v Speaker 1>Carmala's campaign would have been all over it, so they

0:19:12.647 --> 0:19:15.367
<v Speaker 1>would have liaised about when is the most useful time

0:19:15.527 --> 0:19:17.887
<v Speaker 1>if I'm going to endorse, when do you want that

0:19:18.007 --> 0:19:21.167
<v Speaker 1>endorsement to be because it could be argued why is

0:19:21.167 --> 0:19:23.807
<v Speaker 1>she pulling focus? And I think that this is what

0:19:23.887 --> 0:19:27.407
<v Speaker 1>Carmala's campaign obviously wanted because she wouldn't have done it

0:19:27.447 --> 0:19:30.247
<v Speaker 1>otherwise because she would have been accused of pulling focus?

0:19:30.527 --> 0:19:33.247
<v Speaker 3>Can I ask, though, Maya, do you think my first

0:19:33.287 --> 0:19:35.447
<v Speaker 3>instinct with this was did she wait till after the

0:19:35.487 --> 0:19:37.087
<v Speaker 3>debate to see how it unfolded?

0:19:37.127 --> 0:19:37.207
<v Speaker 1>Like?

0:19:37.327 --> 0:19:39.647
<v Speaker 3>Was it possible that she was going Are we going

0:19:39.687 --> 0:19:42.087
<v Speaker 3>to see how Harris fares in this? And then I

0:19:42.127 --> 0:19:44.847
<v Speaker 3>will decide whether I no.

0:19:44.207 --> 0:19:47.087
<v Speaker 1>No, because like I mean, I'll read you her statement

0:19:47.167 --> 0:19:49.367
<v Speaker 1>and then I mean, this has clearly been prepared and

0:19:49.527 --> 0:19:51.927
<v Speaker 1>been given a lot of thought. And also, what's she

0:19:51.967 --> 0:19:53.687
<v Speaker 1>going to do? Go, oh, she didn't do so well.

0:19:53.727 --> 0:19:55.807
<v Speaker 1>I don't want to back someone who might not win.

0:19:55.927 --> 0:19:58.367
<v Speaker 1>I mean, that's not what this is. So she posted

0:19:58.407 --> 0:20:01.287
<v Speaker 1>a picture of herself with one of her cats. She's

0:20:01.327 --> 0:20:04.727
<v Speaker 1>got a couple of cats, and she said, like many

0:20:04.767 --> 0:20:06.967
<v Speaker 1>of you, I watched the debate tonight. If you haven't already,

0:20:06.967 --> 0:20:08.527
<v Speaker 1>now it's a great time to do your research on

0:20:08.567 --> 0:20:11.567
<v Speaker 1>the issues at hand and the stances these candidates take

0:20:11.647 --> 0:20:14.247
<v Speaker 1>on the topics that matters to you the most. And

0:20:14.287 --> 0:20:17.367
<v Speaker 1>she then just talks about how she's informed herself and

0:20:17.407 --> 0:20:21.607
<v Speaker 1>how that's important and this bit's interesting. She then refers

0:20:21.647 --> 0:20:24.247
<v Speaker 1>to the AI that came out that we've mentioned on

0:20:24.287 --> 0:20:27.527
<v Speaker 1>the show of her and she says, I was recently

0:20:27.527 --> 0:20:30.207
<v Speaker 1>made aware of the AI of me in quote marks

0:20:30.447 --> 0:20:34.367
<v Speaker 1>falsely endorsing Donald Trump's presidential run, and that he'd posted it,

0:20:34.407 --> 0:20:36.847
<v Speaker 1>and it really conjured up my fears around AI and

0:20:36.887 --> 0:20:40.127
<v Speaker 1>the dangers of spreading misinformation. It brought me to the

0:20:40.167 --> 0:20:43.047
<v Speaker 1>conclusion that I need to be very transparent about my

0:20:43.167 --> 0:20:46.607
<v Speaker 1>actual plans for this election as a voter. The simplest

0:20:46.647 --> 0:20:49.167
<v Speaker 1>way to combat misinformation is with the truth. I will

0:20:49.167 --> 0:20:51.367
<v Speaker 1>be casting my vote for Kamala Harris and Tim Waltz

0:20:51.727 --> 0:20:54.287
<v Speaker 1>in the election. I'm voting for Kamala Harris because she

0:20:54.327 --> 0:20:56.567
<v Speaker 1>fights for the rights and causes I believe need a

0:20:56.607 --> 0:20:59.687
<v Speaker 1>warrior to champion them. I think she is a steady handed,

0:20:59.727 --> 0:21:02.087
<v Speaker 1>gifted leader, and I believe we can accomplish so much

0:21:02.127 --> 0:21:04.567
<v Speaker 1>more in this country if we are led by calm

0:21:04.687 --> 0:21:08.247
<v Speaker 1>and not chaos. She then talks about how heart and

0:21:08.367 --> 0:21:11.327
<v Speaker 1>she was her selection of Tim wals as her running

0:21:11.327 --> 0:21:15.367
<v Speaker 1>mate because she says he's been standing up for LGBTQ

0:21:15.527 --> 0:21:18.087
<v Speaker 1>plus rights, IVF and a woman's right to her own

0:21:18.087 --> 0:21:21.007
<v Speaker 1>body for decades. I've done my research, and I've made

0:21:21.047 --> 0:21:23.407
<v Speaker 1>my choice. Your research is all yours to do, and

0:21:23.447 --> 0:21:25.887
<v Speaker 1>the choice is yours to make. And then she says,

0:21:26.047 --> 0:21:28.967
<v Speaker 1>you know, she encourages first time voters to register, and

0:21:29.007 --> 0:21:31.287
<v Speaker 1>then she signs it off. I love this with love

0:21:31.327 --> 0:21:34.927
<v Speaker 1>and hope. Taylor Swift childless cat lady because she's the

0:21:34.967 --> 0:21:36.687
<v Speaker 1>most famous childless cat lady of the world.

0:21:36.807 --> 0:21:37.007
<v Speaker 2>Right.

0:21:37.047 --> 0:21:39.727
<v Speaker 1>I mean that's obviously in reference to Jadie Vance's jab

0:21:39.767 --> 0:21:42.287
<v Speaker 1>about childless cat ladies. He was referring to Kamala Harris,

0:21:42.607 --> 0:21:44.647
<v Speaker 1>and everyone was waiting for Taylor Swift to come out

0:21:44.687 --> 0:21:48.007
<v Speaker 1>and she didn't at the time. She's been waiting for

0:21:48.087 --> 0:21:50.207
<v Speaker 1>the moment where it's going to land in the best

0:21:50.247 --> 0:21:52.447
<v Speaker 1>way for Kamala Harris, and that's clearly now.

0:21:52.767 --> 0:21:55.407
<v Speaker 2>The other thing is is that voter registration in the

0:21:55.567 --> 0:21:58.367
<v Speaker 2>US and it changes in different states but closes soon,

0:21:59.127 --> 0:22:02.167
<v Speaker 2>so there's a ticking deadline on how useful it is

0:22:02.167 --> 0:22:04.207
<v Speaker 2>for Taylor to endorse to get people out to vote

0:22:04.207 --> 0:22:07.007
<v Speaker 2>for the first time. And also, I just realized I

0:22:07.087 --> 0:22:10.407
<v Speaker 2>thought that the cat picture was because of the dogs

0:22:10.407 --> 0:22:16.607
<v Speaker 2>and cats, and now I'm like, oh, no, it's the

0:22:16.647 --> 0:22:21.367
<v Speaker 2>cat lady. I thought, well, that was fast. She really

0:22:21.407 --> 0:22:24.527
<v Speaker 2>did move fast on that bit. She's like selecting the

0:22:24.567 --> 0:22:26.607
<v Speaker 2>dogs and cat picture at the last minute.

0:22:26.767 --> 0:22:29.087
<v Speaker 3>Read differently, it looks like she's protecting her cat from,

0:22:29.247 --> 0:22:31.207
<v Speaker 3>you know, possible violence.

0:22:31.327 --> 0:22:33.647
<v Speaker 2>I think it's interesting me your point about pulling focus

0:22:33.647 --> 0:22:36.567
<v Speaker 2>and timing, because that could definitely be seen as a criticism.

0:22:36.607 --> 0:22:39.047
<v Speaker 2>But I think, I mean, you're so right because I

0:22:39.087 --> 0:22:41.607
<v Speaker 2>spoke before about how the context going into this debate

0:22:41.687 --> 0:22:43.847
<v Speaker 2>is the honeymoon is over for Kamala and that since

0:22:43.887 --> 0:22:47.607
<v Speaker 2>the DNC since the convention, people haven't been talking about

0:22:47.647 --> 0:22:51.727
<v Speaker 2>her so much, and her campaign knows that today is

0:22:51.767 --> 0:22:55.207
<v Speaker 2>another one of those tent pole breakthrough. Everybody will be

0:22:55.247 --> 0:22:58.927
<v Speaker 2>talking about a the election B Kamala Harris today, so

0:22:59.007 --> 0:23:01.407
<v Speaker 2>maximize give them more things to talk about. It will

0:23:01.447 --> 0:23:02.047
<v Speaker 2>extend it.

0:23:02.167 --> 0:23:02.767
<v Speaker 1>You know what I mean.

0:23:03.567 --> 0:23:06.007
<v Speaker 2>If you are as obsessed as some of us are

0:23:06.087 --> 0:23:09.047
<v Speaker 2>indeed about the US election, then you'll be happy to

0:23:09.047 --> 0:23:12.527
<v Speaker 2>know that the brilliant Amelia Lester is going to join

0:23:12.647 --> 0:23:17.847
<v Speaker 2>us for a proper debrief and point by point unpacking

0:23:18.087 --> 0:23:21.327
<v Speaker 2>of the debate in a special subscriber episode that is

0:23:21.367 --> 0:23:23.847
<v Speaker 2>available tomorrow, So keep your eye up for that. We'll

0:23:23.847 --> 0:23:24.927
<v Speaker 2>put a link in the show notes.

0:23:36.807 --> 0:23:37.927
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's really the way.

0:23:38.007 --> 0:23:40.567
<v Speaker 6>As a summer comes to an end, I cannot tell

0:23:40.607 --> 0:23:43.247
<v Speaker 6>you what a relief it is to have finally completed

0:23:43.287 --> 0:23:48.687
<v Speaker 6>my chemotherapy treatment. The last nine months have been incredibly

0:23:48.727 --> 0:23:51.447
<v Speaker 6>tough for us as a family. Life As you know,

0:23:51.487 --> 0:23:54.407
<v Speaker 6>it can change in an instant, and we've had to

0:23:54.447 --> 0:23:59.487
<v Speaker 6>find a way to navigate the stormy waters and road unknown.

0:24:01.247 --> 0:24:05.967
<v Speaker 6>The cancer journey is complex, scary, and unpredictable for everyone,

0:24:06.887 --> 0:24:08.407
<v Speaker 6>especially those closest to you.

0:24:10.047 --> 0:24:13.167
<v Speaker 2>We're in a forest, we're on a wind swept English beach,

0:24:13.607 --> 0:24:17.087
<v Speaker 2>we're always in natural fibers, and we are in Princess

0:24:17.167 --> 0:24:22.087
<v Speaker 2>Catherine's health update video. Yesterday via official channels, the Royals

0:24:22.127 --> 0:24:25.727
<v Speaker 2>released a three minute film that's a very long film

0:24:25.767 --> 0:24:27.767
<v Speaker 2>in social media time, by the way, three minutes.

0:24:27.807 --> 0:24:28.727
<v Speaker 3>It's not a real it's.

0:24:28.647 --> 0:24:31.447
<v Speaker 1>Very long video. It was almost a mini series.

0:24:31.847 --> 0:24:34.927
<v Speaker 2>And Catherine narrates telling us, as you just heard, that

0:24:35.007 --> 0:24:37.967
<v Speaker 2>she is through her chemotherapy and on her way to recovery,

0:24:38.007 --> 0:24:39.167
<v Speaker 2>planning on coming.

0:24:38.927 --> 0:24:39.567
<v Speaker 1>Back to work.

0:24:40.327 --> 0:24:42.807
<v Speaker 2>Now, I'm sure I know that in this conversation we're

0:24:42.807 --> 0:24:45.047
<v Speaker 2>about to have, we're going to analyze this video and

0:24:45.087 --> 0:24:47.767
<v Speaker 2>the strategy behind it and the pr planning that went

0:24:47.807 --> 0:24:50.607
<v Speaker 2>into it. But in a moment of earnestness, I have

0:24:50.727 --> 0:24:55.047
<v Speaker 2>to say I bloody loved this video. Every single person

0:24:55.167 --> 0:24:58.127
<v Speaker 2>I know who has been through a version of what

0:24:58.287 --> 0:25:00.807
<v Speaker 2>Kate has just been through and is still going through,

0:25:00.967 --> 0:25:03.607
<v Speaker 2>says what she says in this that it has profoundly

0:25:03.807 --> 0:25:08.247
<v Speaker 2>changed them, that their perspective has shifted in surprising or

0:25:08.287 --> 0:25:12.487
<v Speaker 2>in unsurprising. And my view is that these people, William

0:25:12.527 --> 0:25:15.127
<v Speaker 2>and Catherine, they don't have the option of silence. They

0:25:15.167 --> 0:25:17.647
<v Speaker 2>have to say something. We've seen what happens when they

0:25:17.647 --> 0:25:20.967
<v Speaker 2>don't say anything earlier this year, and so choosing how

0:25:21.007 --> 0:25:22.807
<v Speaker 2>to share this news was always going to be a

0:25:22.807 --> 0:25:24.447
<v Speaker 2>big deal and it was always going to get a

0:25:24.447 --> 0:25:27.847
<v Speaker 2>lot of scrutiny. What they chose to do was turned

0:25:27.887 --> 0:25:30.167
<v Speaker 2>to a guy that they've worked with before, a filmmaker

0:25:30.207 --> 0:25:33.447
<v Speaker 2>called will war who makes ads for things like uber eats,

0:25:33.487 --> 0:25:36.167
<v Speaker 2>but he's also the person who made their very similar

0:25:36.207 --> 0:25:39.967
<v Speaker 2>stylistically ten year wedding anniversary video and some of the

0:25:40.047 --> 0:25:43.567
<v Speaker 2>King's coronation films. To me, it felt very Harry and

0:25:43.607 --> 0:25:47.127
<v Speaker 2>Meghan Netflix doco Vibes, and Marina Hyde has written in

0:25:47.167 --> 0:25:51.087
<v Speaker 2>fact saying that the Meganification I like this word. The

0:25:51.167 --> 0:25:55.367
<v Speaker 2>Meganification of the royal family is in full swing. So Jesse,

0:25:55.687 --> 0:25:58.967
<v Speaker 2>let the analysis begin. Thoughts on our three minute video

0:25:59.007 --> 0:25:59.967
<v Speaker 2>from Catherine and William.

0:26:00.087 --> 0:26:02.527
<v Speaker 3>Firstly, I agree, I am so glad. A lot of

0:26:02.527 --> 0:26:04.567
<v Speaker 3>people said that they cried in the first ten to

0:26:04.607 --> 0:26:06.527
<v Speaker 3>fifteen seconds when they heard that she was okay, because

0:26:06.527 --> 0:26:09.167
<v Speaker 3>we've been waiting for an update and to see her

0:26:09.447 --> 0:26:12.727
<v Speaker 3>with those three little kids. I think we have all

0:26:12.767 --> 0:26:16.367
<v Speaker 3>known women who have lost their lives with little kids,

0:26:16.407 --> 0:26:17.927
<v Speaker 3>and there is a tragedy. What that does to a

0:26:18.007 --> 0:26:21.807
<v Speaker 3>family is just awful, and so I am so glad

0:26:21.887 --> 0:26:26.727
<v Speaker 3>that she is okay. This video I like to imagine

0:26:26.727 --> 0:26:29.887
<v Speaker 3>the briefing document because this video was about saying I

0:26:29.927 --> 0:26:31.647
<v Speaker 3>am now cancer free, but it was about a lot

0:26:31.687 --> 0:26:34.607
<v Speaker 3>of other things as well, right, Like, this was a

0:26:34.647 --> 0:26:37.487
<v Speaker 3>branding exercise, and there was a reason why it was

0:26:37.887 --> 0:26:41.727
<v Speaker 3>not a written statement from the palace. In fact, there

0:26:41.927 --> 0:26:45.287
<v Speaker 3>was no reference to anything royal. There was no palace,

0:26:45.407 --> 0:26:47.687
<v Speaker 3>there was no King Charles. It was a departure from

0:26:47.767 --> 0:26:50.887
<v Speaker 3>what we've seen. So I would like to analyze this

0:26:50.967 --> 0:26:52.967
<v Speaker 3>as though we are in year seven English, and there

0:26:53.007 --> 0:26:55.127
<v Speaker 3>are a few points I would like to make. The

0:26:55.167 --> 0:26:57.967
<v Speaker 3>first is that Kate is in the driver's seat. You'll

0:26:58.007 --> 0:27:00.167
<v Speaker 3>notice it's one of the first shots. She's back in

0:27:00.167 --> 0:27:02.967
<v Speaker 3>control of her life. Oh she is driving it. Yep, yep,

0:27:03.047 --> 0:27:06.207
<v Speaker 3>that's the symbolism there. Did we notice that she released

0:27:06.207 --> 0:27:08.767
<v Speaker 3>a butterfly. That's a symbol of metamorphosis.

0:27:09.647 --> 0:27:11.487
<v Speaker 2>Now, I think that was in the briefing.

0:27:11.447 --> 0:27:13.927
<v Speaker 3>I do, I do, or maybe not specifically, but like,

0:27:13.967 --> 0:27:17.327
<v Speaker 3>we have symbolism for metamorphosis, and that I have changed,

0:27:17.647 --> 0:27:21.887
<v Speaker 3>my perspective has changed. I'm a changed woman also blue.

0:27:22.247 --> 0:27:26.407
<v Speaker 3>So blue is Kate Middleton's color. And you'll notice that everyone,

0:27:26.447 --> 0:27:29.007
<v Speaker 3>even the kids, her and William, are all wearing different

0:27:29.007 --> 0:27:33.607
<v Speaker 3>shades of blue throughout the video and apparently it signifies

0:27:33.887 --> 0:27:36.607
<v Speaker 3>trust and stability. It is also as a family, their color,

0:27:36.927 --> 0:27:39.447
<v Speaker 3>but it is a color that is thought to evoke

0:27:39.527 --> 0:27:40.967
<v Speaker 3>trust and stability with people.

0:27:41.927 --> 0:27:43.607
<v Speaker 2>Color royal blue exactly right.

0:27:44.407 --> 0:27:46.887
<v Speaker 3>Now, did anyone else think it look like Kate was

0:27:46.927 --> 0:27:51.047
<v Speaker 3>releasing a folk album? Yes, yeah, it was a bit

0:27:51.087 --> 0:27:51.847
<v Speaker 3>folk album and.

0:27:51.807 --> 0:27:53.927
<v Speaker 2>It was a bit it will double for a music video.

0:27:54.127 --> 0:27:56.927
<v Speaker 3>Yes, well, this is very serious subject matter, but it

0:27:56.967 --> 0:27:59.367
<v Speaker 3>has also gone beyond viral. And there was a version

0:27:59.407 --> 0:28:01.927
<v Speaker 3>on Twitter where they put the succession the music under it,

0:28:01.967 --> 0:28:04.727
<v Speaker 3>and it was very funny. When I watched the whole thing,

0:28:04.727 --> 0:28:05.967
<v Speaker 3>and then I watched the whole thing again, and then

0:28:06.007 --> 0:28:09.567
<v Speaker 3>I watched the whole thing again. It was a bit unusual, like.

0:28:09.527 --> 0:28:12.647
<v Speaker 1>I buy that folk album just sorry, I've just gone

0:28:12.647 --> 0:28:14.807
<v Speaker 1>a fok album. It's the kind of album that I

0:28:14.847 --> 0:28:15.447
<v Speaker 1>really like.

0:28:15.847 --> 0:28:17.887
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that makes you feel things.

0:28:18.207 --> 0:28:20.567
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, you know what. None of us have

0:28:20.687 --> 0:28:24.607
<v Speaker 1>been through this, so I think that what also was

0:28:24.687 --> 0:28:29.367
<v Speaker 1>being conveyed to me by all of those bits were

0:28:29.767 --> 0:28:33.087
<v Speaker 1>a renewal of their relationship. And I think that whether

0:28:33.687 --> 0:28:38.167
<v Speaker 1>the affair rooms were true, there's no denying that something

0:28:38.207 --> 0:28:41.487
<v Speaker 1>like this is incredibly difficult. And also what they've gone

0:28:41.527 --> 0:28:46.127
<v Speaker 1>through with losing the Queen and then Charles's diagnosis, and

0:28:46.127 --> 0:28:49.007
<v Speaker 1>then Harry and Meghan and then all the accusations about

0:28:49.087 --> 0:28:51.487
<v Speaker 1>Kate that have come from Meghan and Harry and the

0:28:51.527 --> 0:28:54.047
<v Speaker 1>things he said in his book. They've had a time,

0:28:54.287 --> 0:28:59.807
<v Speaker 1>they really really have. And because they are not going

0:28:59.847 --> 0:29:03.367
<v Speaker 1>down the Harry Meghan route of talking to Oprah and

0:29:03.767 --> 0:29:08.287
<v Speaker 1>writing memoirs, they have to convey messages in other ways,

0:29:08.567 --> 0:29:10.727
<v Speaker 1>and I think this was the way to do that.

0:29:10.847 --> 0:29:13.327
<v Speaker 1>I think it's so interesting to me how they stepped

0:29:13.407 --> 0:29:16.007
<v Speaker 1>up their entire strategy. To me, this is what the

0:29:16.087 --> 0:29:19.807
<v Speaker 1>Royal Family has to be into the future, and I

0:29:19.807 --> 0:29:23.407
<v Speaker 1>think they get that because people aren't interested so much.

0:29:23.527 --> 0:29:25.807
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I guess there's a place for ribbon cutting

0:29:25.887 --> 0:29:28.447
<v Speaker 1>and being on balconies, but the point of the Royal

0:29:28.527 --> 0:29:32.287
<v Speaker 1>family is really decorative, and I think when you drill

0:29:32.367 --> 0:29:35.567
<v Speaker 1>even further into that, and what the read was for

0:29:35.687 --> 0:29:39.047
<v Speaker 1>me in this Kate video, is that the point of Kate,

0:29:39.847 --> 0:29:42.447
<v Speaker 1>because she's not ever going to be, you know, on

0:29:42.487 --> 0:29:45.207
<v Speaker 1>the throne. She's not in the line of success. She's

0:29:45.247 --> 0:29:47.647
<v Speaker 1>going to be not herself, you know what I mean.

0:29:47.887 --> 0:29:49.967
<v Speaker 1>It's not about her, It's about Charles, and then it's

0:29:49.967 --> 0:29:51.487
<v Speaker 1>about William, and then it's going to be about their

0:29:51.487 --> 0:29:56.207
<v Speaker 1>son George. So she's literally an accouterment to whoever's on

0:29:56.247 --> 0:29:56.647
<v Speaker 1>the phone.

0:29:57.287 --> 0:29:58.167
<v Speaker 2>She is gone.

0:29:58.247 --> 0:30:02.407
<v Speaker 1>But the point is that the role of her and

0:30:02.527 --> 0:30:07.327
<v Speaker 1>princesses is to perform this idea of femininity. I thought

0:30:07.327 --> 0:30:09.207
<v Speaker 1>it was really interesting that she was in address because

0:30:09.487 --> 0:30:11.607
<v Speaker 1>Kate doesn't usually wear a dress except when she's at

0:30:11.607 --> 0:30:14.127
<v Speaker 1>like big royal things, like we usually see her in

0:30:14.647 --> 0:30:19.247
<v Speaker 1>skinny jeans or pants. She's pretty sensible. She's sort of

0:30:19.247 --> 0:30:24.927
<v Speaker 1>that sporty country English gal. And I think, you know, again,

0:30:24.967 --> 0:30:27.447
<v Speaker 1>this isn't personal, and everybody gets to do whatever they want.

0:30:27.447 --> 0:30:30.007
<v Speaker 1>This isn't about her. I'm talking about what she symbolizes,

0:30:30.687 --> 0:30:34.407
<v Speaker 1>this idea that no matter whether she's just been diagnosed

0:30:34.407 --> 0:30:36.487
<v Speaker 1>with cancer, whether she's in the middle of her treatment,

0:30:36.767 --> 0:30:39.567
<v Speaker 1>we have never seen her look anything other than immaculate

0:30:39.607 --> 0:30:42.567
<v Speaker 1>because that is her job. And I feel like, firstly,

0:30:42.607 --> 0:30:47.447
<v Speaker 1>the pressure on her and secondly that isn't a very

0:30:47.887 --> 0:30:51.287
<v Speaker 1>modern approach. It's a little bit more I guess. I

0:30:51.327 --> 0:30:53.047
<v Speaker 1>don't want to say it's in authentic, but it's more

0:30:53.087 --> 0:30:55.047
<v Speaker 1>pulling back the curtain. That's what we're more used to.

0:30:55.327 --> 0:30:58.847
<v Speaker 2>But the rhyme authentic to her, you know, I mean,

0:30:59.487 --> 0:31:01.447
<v Speaker 2>she is going to be the queen. She is one

0:31:01.447 --> 0:31:03.727
<v Speaker 2>of the most important people in that family. There is

0:31:03.767 --> 0:31:05.927
<v Speaker 2>an argument that she is the most important person in

0:31:05.927 --> 0:31:07.767
<v Speaker 2>that family because people are always going to be much

0:31:07.767 --> 0:31:09.647
<v Speaker 2>more interested in her than they are in him, because

0:31:09.647 --> 0:31:12.367
<v Speaker 2>she's a woman. That's the way it works. But the

0:31:12.447 --> 0:31:14.527
<v Speaker 2>thing that I take from this is that they have

0:31:14.607 --> 0:31:17.087
<v Speaker 2>stepped their game up enormously. As you've said me, although

0:31:17.127 --> 0:31:19.927
<v Speaker 2>it's interesting because I said that and I said, you know,

0:31:20.007 --> 0:31:22.047
<v Speaker 2>this is a departure in strategy, But then when I

0:31:22.127 --> 0:31:24.407
<v Speaker 2>realized that this same guy made their ten year anniversary

0:31:24.447 --> 0:31:25.687
<v Speaker 2>video and you go back and look at that, it's

0:31:25.767 --> 0:31:28.847
<v Speaker 2>much the same, right, But they've stepped up their strategy

0:31:29.447 --> 0:31:33.367
<v Speaker 2>significantly in comms of how to talk about this story,

0:31:33.767 --> 0:31:37.167
<v Speaker 2>because it feels almost insane now that we were all

0:31:37.407 --> 0:31:41.607
<v Speaker 2>so obsessed with the Where's Kate's story earlier this year,

0:31:41.927 --> 0:31:44.767
<v Speaker 2>and it feels a bit gruesome and macab but the

0:31:44.767 --> 0:31:47.847
<v Speaker 2>truth of it is that fascination is never going to

0:31:47.887 --> 0:31:50.127
<v Speaker 2>go away, so they have to work out how to

0:31:50.167 --> 0:31:52.767
<v Speaker 2>play it. And I've read some commentary like that Marina

0:31:52.847 --> 0:31:55.687
<v Speaker 2>Hyde piece that kind of says, oh, it's a bit tacky,

0:31:55.887 --> 0:31:58.847
<v Speaker 2>like do they really owe us this? Do they really

0:31:58.887 --> 0:32:01.527
<v Speaker 2>owe us this glimpse into their family? There's always going

0:32:01.607 --> 0:32:04.087
<v Speaker 2>to be this argument that really the royals should be

0:32:05.127 --> 0:32:08.687
<v Speaker 2>above this kind of stuff, But the truth of it is,

0:32:08.687 --> 0:32:12.327
<v Speaker 2>as you say, these days, they can't afford to be

0:32:12.367 --> 0:32:15.087
<v Speaker 2>above this kind of stuff because otherwise everybody else is

0:32:15.087 --> 0:32:17.887
<v Speaker 2>telling their story. And although everyone's going to tell their

0:32:17.927 --> 0:32:20.287
<v Speaker 2>story anyway, you know, they're going to read into as

0:32:20.287 --> 0:32:22.727
<v Speaker 2>we're doing right now, like are they really as happy

0:32:22.727 --> 0:32:23.647
<v Speaker 2>as they appear on the beach?

0:32:23.687 --> 0:32:24.567
<v Speaker 3>And da da da da da.

0:32:24.607 --> 0:32:27.167
<v Speaker 2>People are still going to do that, but they have

0:32:27.287 --> 0:32:31.047
<v Speaker 2>to control it. And it's interesting because when the terrible

0:32:31.047 --> 0:32:34.847
<v Speaker 2>pr disaster of how this whole announcement of Kate's health

0:32:34.887 --> 0:32:38.727
<v Speaker 2>issues rolled out, and with hindsight you can see what

0:32:38.767 --> 0:32:41.607
<v Speaker 2>a very difficult message that was to work out how

0:32:41.607 --> 0:32:44.327
<v Speaker 2>to tell, and probably the fuss about the photo and

0:32:44.367 --> 0:32:47.727
<v Speaker 2>all that was really overblown. But they are learning, they

0:32:47.727 --> 0:32:50.927
<v Speaker 2>are changing, They are playing Harry and Meghan's game. This

0:32:51.087 --> 0:32:53.967
<v Speaker 2>did look like a lot of the stock footage in

0:32:54.007 --> 0:32:57.847
<v Speaker 2>that documentary, and I hope that this is where they're going,

0:32:58.007 --> 0:33:01.087
<v Speaker 2>that they're going to start giving controlled glimpses, which they

0:33:01.127 --> 0:33:03.647
<v Speaker 2>always have to appoint. She's released images of the family

0:33:03.647 --> 0:33:06.207
<v Speaker 2>that she takes and all those things. But it's interesting.

0:33:06.367 --> 0:33:08.327
<v Speaker 2>They have a job right now if anyone's into it.

0:33:09.247 --> 0:33:12.487
<v Speaker 2>Communications officer for Wills and Kate is on LinkedIn right now.

0:33:12.647 --> 0:33:14.607
<v Speaker 2>It only got posted on September the third.

0:33:14.767 --> 0:33:15.687
<v Speaker 3>I think you could do that.

0:33:15.767 --> 0:33:17.607
<v Speaker 2>I would love it. Maybe I'm going to go back

0:33:17.607 --> 0:33:19.367
<v Speaker 2>to England and work at Kensington Palace.

0:33:19.527 --> 0:33:22.567
<v Speaker 3>I think the really smart move was that it was

0:33:22.727 --> 0:33:25.287
<v Speaker 3>just Kate's voice. We don't hear Kate's voice very often,

0:33:25.327 --> 0:33:28.007
<v Speaker 3>and this was her voice for three minutes. There was

0:33:28.087 --> 0:33:30.527
<v Speaker 3>nothing from William. I think if this was ten years ago,

0:33:30.567 --> 0:33:32.767
<v Speaker 3>it almost would have been William's statement to talk about

0:33:32.807 --> 0:33:35.607
<v Speaker 3>how the family is faring. And the other moment that

0:33:35.647 --> 0:33:37.887
<v Speaker 3>stood out to me was when the kids spoke to

0:33:37.927 --> 0:33:40.327
<v Speaker 3>the camera. That was kind of candid. It was the

0:33:40.407 --> 0:33:42.287
<v Speaker 3>kids kind of playing with the camera and we heard

0:33:42.287 --> 0:33:44.887
<v Speaker 3>their voices, which I don't think I had heard their

0:33:44.967 --> 0:33:50.367
<v Speaker 3>voices before. But there is something very aspirational and idealized

0:33:50.407 --> 0:33:54.287
<v Speaker 3>about this family, which, as a millennial who has grown

0:33:54.367 --> 0:33:57.887
<v Speaker 3>up on the grittiness of social media, does look a

0:33:57.927 --> 0:34:00.407
<v Speaker 3>little bit out of touch. It's very kind of the

0:34:00.487 --> 0:34:03.247
<v Speaker 3>early influences, with their perfect kitchens and their eye and

0:34:03.327 --> 0:34:05.327
<v Speaker 3>clothes and all of that that I kind of went,

0:34:05.567 --> 0:34:07.607
<v Speaker 3>this isn't what a family looks like, but it's not

0:34:07.647 --> 0:34:08.247
<v Speaker 3>their job.

0:34:08.447 --> 0:34:10.887
<v Speaker 2>And also authentic to them, right, So you know the

0:34:10.927 --> 0:34:13.607
<v Speaker 2>stuff of her wandering around in forests, She's written and

0:34:13.687 --> 0:34:15.847
<v Speaker 2>talked about that a lot. Forest bathing, how she thinks

0:34:15.887 --> 0:34:19.127
<v Speaker 2>it's really important, Like, this is what they do. They

0:34:19.167 --> 0:34:22.167
<v Speaker 2>walk around in woods, they roll around on beaches.

0:34:22.527 --> 0:34:23.647
<v Speaker 1>What's forest bathing?

0:34:23.967 --> 0:34:24.927
<v Speaker 2>Walking in the woods.

0:34:25.407 --> 0:34:28.487
<v Speaker 1>Oh, it's not actually bathing in a forest in a river,

0:34:28.927 --> 0:34:29.407
<v Speaker 1>it's just.

0:34:29.327 --> 0:34:30.647
<v Speaker 2>Walking in the worlds well bathe.

0:34:30.727 --> 0:34:33.327
<v Speaker 1>Oh god, no, I think what's interesting. And you're right,

0:34:33.367 --> 0:34:35.447
<v Speaker 1>I should clarify when I say not authentic, I don't

0:34:35.487 --> 0:34:39.767
<v Speaker 1>mean as you say authentic for them. It's not necessarily

0:34:39.807 --> 0:34:43.367
<v Speaker 1>reflective of what someone looks like when they've gone through cancer,

0:34:43.807 --> 0:34:47.567
<v Speaker 1>during treatment and after treatment. And I think that possibly

0:34:47.567 --> 0:34:50.687
<v Speaker 1>if I was a person who has experienced cancer, is

0:34:50.687 --> 0:34:54.567
<v Speaker 1>still going through it. I would feel a little unrepresented,

0:34:54.647 --> 0:34:57.167
<v Speaker 1>but that's not necessarily her job, although she does say

0:34:57.247 --> 0:35:00.007
<v Speaker 1>I want to be a voice for you, but the

0:35:00.127 --> 0:35:02.207
<v Speaker 1>rules of being royal and the rules of being a

0:35:02.287 --> 0:35:06.047
<v Speaker 1>royal woman will never allow her to look anything less

0:35:06.087 --> 0:35:08.887
<v Speaker 1>than perfect, never ever, ever. But I think that the

0:35:08.927 --> 0:35:11.487
<v Speaker 1>other side text in this whole thing is a real

0:35:11.807 --> 0:35:16.647
<v Speaker 1>message to Harry and Megan, because their whole narrative about

0:35:16.647 --> 0:35:19.367
<v Speaker 1>why they had to leave the royal family and move

0:35:19.407 --> 0:35:22.927
<v Speaker 1>to America is because of what they wanted for their children.

0:35:22.967 --> 0:35:25.567
<v Speaker 1>They wanted their children and their family to be able

0:35:25.647 --> 0:35:29.407
<v Speaker 1>to have loving relationship and affectionate and to be able

0:35:29.447 --> 0:35:32.447
<v Speaker 1>to do normal things and not be in the spotlight.

0:35:32.527 --> 0:35:35.367
<v Speaker 1>And they wanted you know that he really painted himself

0:35:35.407 --> 0:35:39.007
<v Speaker 1>as a very different person to his cold brother and

0:35:39.087 --> 0:35:42.247
<v Speaker 1>his cold father who did everything for the press, and

0:35:42.647 --> 0:35:45.647
<v Speaker 1>that married just a dutiful person who came along, who

0:35:45.727 --> 0:35:48.447
<v Speaker 1>ticked boxes, which we imagine how insulting that was to

0:35:48.447 --> 0:35:50.887
<v Speaker 1>both of them, but especially Kate, and I think that

0:35:50.927 --> 0:35:54.567
<v Speaker 1>what this video said very clearly was no, No, we

0:35:54.607 --> 0:35:56.807
<v Speaker 1>are still in the royal family. We're still in line

0:35:56.847 --> 0:35:59.087
<v Speaker 1>to the throne. Don't try to say that we don't

0:35:59.167 --> 0:36:02.687
<v Speaker 1>have a loving, beautiful family and that we're not affectionate,

0:36:02.807 --> 0:36:05.007
<v Speaker 1>or that this is all just for show, because we

0:36:05.087 --> 0:36:07.927
<v Speaker 1>are a very normal like it showed them as good parents,

0:36:08.047 --> 0:36:10.687
<v Speaker 1>showed William is a really good dad. That's the mantle

0:36:10.727 --> 0:36:13.647
<v Speaker 1>Harry and Megan are trying to have that we're the

0:36:13.687 --> 0:36:16.887
<v Speaker 1>ones that care about acudes. And Harry very explicitly wrote

0:36:16.887 --> 0:36:19.887
<v Speaker 1>in his book, I'm worried for my niece and my

0:36:19.927 --> 0:36:23.127
<v Speaker 1>nephews growing up in that system, and it was so

0:36:23.567 --> 0:36:28.607
<v Speaker 1>out of line and so controlling, you know, through overconcern

0:36:28.727 --> 0:36:31.847
<v Speaker 1>this idea of only I can give my children a

0:36:31.847 --> 0:36:34.927
<v Speaker 1>happy life away from the royal bubble. And I think

0:36:34.967 --> 0:36:37.087
<v Speaker 1>this was very much a message in response to that.

0:36:37.327 --> 0:36:39.407
<v Speaker 2>And he clearly is a good dad. He only had

0:36:39.407 --> 0:36:41.927
<v Speaker 2>to watch the Taylor Swift concert video to see that.

0:36:42.447 --> 0:36:45.327
<v Speaker 2>You know, that wasn't happening two generations ago. If you

0:36:45.367 --> 0:36:49.127
<v Speaker 2>want to hear more royal thoughts, particularly from me, listen

0:36:49.127 --> 0:36:51.687
<v Speaker 2>to today's quickie we talk about this. We also it's

0:36:51.687 --> 0:36:54.127
<v Speaker 2>going to be a big time in royals guys, because

0:36:54.167 --> 0:36:55.607
<v Speaker 2>it's Harry's fortieth on the weekend.

0:36:55.887 --> 0:36:56.127
<v Speaker 1>Yep.

0:36:56.247 --> 0:36:58.207
<v Speaker 2>Everybody wants to know is the King going to post

0:36:58.247 --> 0:37:00.167
<v Speaker 2>about it. How is the family going to handle that?

0:37:00.327 --> 0:37:04.327
<v Speaker 2>He's inheriting sixteen million dollars pounds on that day. Next

0:37:04.327 --> 0:37:07.047
<v Speaker 2>week the first of two films about Prince Andrew and

0:37:07.087 --> 0:37:10.167
<v Speaker 2>that disastrous newsnight in If Who comes out, it's going

0:37:10.207 --> 0:37:11.527
<v Speaker 2>to be a big deal. There's going to be lots

0:37:11.527 --> 0:37:13.487
<v Speaker 2>to talk about that. If you want to hear about

0:37:13.527 --> 0:37:16.567
<v Speaker 2>all the royal gossip news, we won't call it gossip,

0:37:16.647 --> 0:37:18.207
<v Speaker 2>We'll call it news. If you want to hear all

0:37:18.207 --> 0:37:20.327
<v Speaker 2>the royal news, go listen to the Quickie. There's a

0:37:20.367 --> 0:37:21.207
<v Speaker 2>link in the show notes.

0:37:26.567 --> 0:37:37.367
<v Speaker 3>Hell every Tuesday and Thursday we drop new segments of

0:37:37.407 --> 0:37:41.327
<v Speaker 3>Mummeya out Loud just for Mummeya subscribers. Follow the link

0:37:41.367 --> 0:37:43.407
<v Speaker 3>in the show notes to get your daily doseph out

0:37:43.447 --> 0:37:46.807
<v Speaker 3>Loud and a big thank you to all our current subscribers.

0:37:54.527 --> 0:37:59.047
<v Speaker 3>This week, Prime Minister Anthony Albanezi announced his government would

0:37:59.087 --> 0:38:02.167
<v Speaker 3>be banning kids from using social media. Here's what he

0:38:02.247 --> 0:38:03.527
<v Speaker 3>said on ABC News.

0:38:03.767 --> 0:38:07.007
<v Speaker 7>We're looking at the range between fourteen and sixteen. That's

0:38:07.047 --> 0:38:09.727
<v Speaker 7>one of the reasons why we're having a trial, and

0:38:09.767 --> 0:38:11.807
<v Speaker 7>what we're looking at is how you deliver it. This

0:38:12.007 --> 0:38:15.687
<v Speaker 7>is a global issue that governments around the globe are

0:38:15.727 --> 0:38:18.447
<v Speaker 7>trying to deal with and so we can look at

0:38:18.487 --> 0:38:22.047
<v Speaker 7>the experience, look at the response as well of social

0:38:22.127 --> 0:38:27.327
<v Speaker 7>media companies. Social media has a social responsibility in order

0:38:27.407 --> 0:38:31.207
<v Speaker 7>to have that social license that they require to operate

0:38:31.647 --> 0:38:36.047
<v Speaker 7>in a decent society. They're not above everyone else. They

0:38:36.087 --> 0:38:39.727
<v Speaker 7>can't just say we're a big multinational company, we can

0:38:39.767 --> 0:38:43.487
<v Speaker 7>do whatever we like, regardless of the harm that's being caused.

0:38:43.727 --> 0:38:46.327
<v Speaker 3>By the end of this year, the Albanesi government vows

0:38:46.367 --> 0:38:49.447
<v Speaker 3>to impose a minimum age to use platforms like Facebook

0:38:49.487 --> 0:38:53.367
<v Speaker 3>and Instagram, although what that age is, as Albanezi said,

0:38:53.487 --> 0:38:57.047
<v Speaker 3>has not been determined yet. The cutoff age won't be

0:38:57.127 --> 0:39:01.807
<v Speaker 3>revealed until the government's trial of age verification technology is completed,

0:39:02.207 --> 0:39:04.567
<v Speaker 3>so without getting too technical, there are a few different

0:39:04.567 --> 0:39:08.087
<v Speaker 3>ways you can determine the age of a user, from

0:39:08.287 --> 0:39:12.327
<v Speaker 3>parental concers vent to estimating the user's age based on

0:39:12.647 --> 0:39:18.487
<v Speaker 3>their appearance to systems with ID. The move has bipartisan support, However,

0:39:18.487 --> 0:39:21.927
<v Speaker 3>the Greens have opposed the legislation, saying they would prefer

0:39:22.247 --> 0:39:27.047
<v Speaker 3>harm education over a blunt ban. Many countries around the

0:39:27.047 --> 0:39:29.767
<v Speaker 3>world are working on age limits for social media apps,

0:39:29.807 --> 0:39:34.407
<v Speaker 3>although the enforcement varies, and as Alberanizi has said as

0:39:34.407 --> 0:39:37.847
<v Speaker 3>of yet, no country in the world has solved this problem.

0:39:38.527 --> 0:39:41.127
<v Speaker 3>While some are in total support of introducing the ban,

0:39:41.527 --> 0:39:45.567
<v Speaker 3>some advocacy groups say social media is critical for marginalized

0:39:45.567 --> 0:39:48.367
<v Speaker 3>teens to find a sense of community and belonging, and

0:39:48.407 --> 0:39:51.567
<v Speaker 3>it could also limit their access to news and current affairs.

0:39:52.207 --> 0:39:55.487
<v Speaker 3>Another problem is the ways in which teens might find

0:39:55.567 --> 0:39:58.847
<v Speaker 3>workarounds spreading into darker corners of the internet with even

0:39:59.047 --> 0:40:02.447
<v Speaker 3>less regulation. Maya what do you make of the ban?

0:40:02.807 --> 0:40:05.247
<v Speaker 1>I think it's great. I hope it's still they're sixteen.

0:40:05.367 --> 0:40:07.247
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I think that kids will work a way

0:40:07.287 --> 0:40:12.247
<v Speaker 1>around it. But I they am really disappointed at the

0:40:12.287 --> 0:40:14.927
<v Speaker 1>cynical nature of the Greens and the way that they're

0:40:14.927 --> 0:40:19.847
<v Speaker 1>opposing this because they know that their base are traditionally younger,

0:40:20.127 --> 0:40:23.607
<v Speaker 1>So Greens voters tend to skiw younger. They're probably less

0:40:23.767 --> 0:40:27.127
<v Speaker 1>likely to have kids because they are younger, or if

0:40:27.127 --> 0:40:29.327
<v Speaker 1>they do have kids, they won't be at the age

0:40:29.327 --> 0:40:33.167
<v Speaker 1>where they've seen the detrimental effects of social media on

0:40:33.207 --> 0:40:36.527
<v Speaker 1>their kids. So I think that the closer you are

0:40:37.367 --> 0:40:40.767
<v Speaker 1>to being a teenager, and the less experience you have

0:40:41.287 --> 0:40:44.567
<v Speaker 1>either as an educator or as a parent with the

0:40:44.607 --> 0:40:48.367
<v Speaker 1>harmful effects of social media, the less likely you are

0:40:48.407 --> 0:40:51.327
<v Speaker 1>to understand or support this band. The idea of harm

0:40:51.367 --> 0:40:54.807
<v Speaker 1>minimization is better. I mean, come on, you know you

0:40:54.887 --> 0:40:58.087
<v Speaker 1>tried telling a teenager, oh, this is not good for

0:40:58.167 --> 0:41:02.127
<v Speaker 1>your mental health. What parents are saying is that if

0:41:02.127 --> 0:41:05.247
<v Speaker 1>it's just us trying to make these bands and put

0:41:05.287 --> 0:41:08.487
<v Speaker 1>these restrictions on our kids ourselves, Firstly, we're not equipped

0:41:08.487 --> 0:41:10.727
<v Speaker 1>to do it because we know how literally we don't

0:41:10.727 --> 0:41:13.127
<v Speaker 1>know how to stop them from getting on the platforms.

0:41:13.487 --> 0:41:17.687
<v Speaker 1>And secondly, it stigmatizes you kid, because unless you join

0:41:17.767 --> 0:41:20.727
<v Speaker 1>forces with everybody in their class and everybody that they know,

0:41:21.607 --> 0:41:23.967
<v Speaker 1>it makes them an outlier and it can make things

0:41:24.007 --> 0:41:26.527
<v Speaker 1>really really hard and can just connect them socially. So

0:41:26.967 --> 0:41:31.047
<v Speaker 1>there are certain things that governments have to control, and

0:41:31.447 --> 0:41:33.967
<v Speaker 1>we've seen that the tech companies are incapable of doing

0:41:33.967 --> 0:41:36.047
<v Speaker 1>it themselves. So I'm all for it.

0:41:36.047 --> 0:41:38.767
<v Speaker 2>It's interesting because I agree with you Mia to a point,

0:41:39.127 --> 0:41:42.247
<v Speaker 2>But then I've read all the counter arguments and some

0:41:42.287 --> 0:41:44.727
<v Speaker 2>of them are really interesting. But the thing that always

0:41:44.767 --> 0:41:47.967
<v Speaker 2>falls apart on it for me is we're not talking

0:41:48.047 --> 0:41:50.607
<v Speaker 2>about banning children from the internet like I would have

0:41:50.647 --> 0:41:53.647
<v Speaker 2>more sympathy from that idea of it cuts them off

0:41:53.687 --> 0:41:56.527
<v Speaker 2>from news and current affairs, it stops them from community building.

0:41:57.127 --> 0:41:59.447
<v Speaker 2>You know, it's ridiculous to think that you can't have

0:41:59.567 --> 0:42:02.607
<v Speaker 2>children's Internet just like you have children's TV. No one

0:42:02.647 --> 0:42:05.687
<v Speaker 2>is suggesting that children shouldn't be allowed on the internet, right.

0:42:05.807 --> 0:42:09.087
<v Speaker 2>What they're talking about is these very specific platforms and

0:42:09.247 --> 0:42:14.207
<v Speaker 2>aimed so far at Instagram, TikTok, snapchat. Discord is about

0:42:14.287 --> 0:42:17.087
<v Speaker 2>those platforms, so kids will still have access to all

0:42:17.167 --> 0:42:19.487
<v Speaker 2>kinds of things, and that you know, no one's talking about.

0:42:19.887 --> 0:42:21.847
<v Speaker 2>They're not allowed on the Internet. They're not allowed to

0:42:21.887 --> 0:42:23.487
<v Speaker 2>talk to anybody, they're not allowed to gain, they're not

0:42:23.487 --> 0:42:25.487
<v Speaker 2>allowed to communicate. That's not what this is about. This

0:42:25.607 --> 0:42:28.047
<v Speaker 2>is about putting restrictions on those giant companies. And I

0:42:28.127 --> 0:42:31.767
<v Speaker 2>agree with Albo on that point that these social media

0:42:31.807 --> 0:42:35.767
<v Speaker 2>platforms do have a responsibility, and they are becoming the

0:42:35.807 --> 0:42:38.567
<v Speaker 2>world's richest and most powerful people and then putting their

0:42:38.567 --> 0:42:41.007
<v Speaker 2>hands up and going, it's got nothing to do with us.

0:42:41.207 --> 0:42:44.407
<v Speaker 2>These terrible issues that are occurring with kids' mental health

0:42:44.447 --> 0:42:46.647
<v Speaker 2>and suicidality and all this stuff nothing to do with us.

0:42:46.687 --> 0:42:49.407
<v Speaker 2>You know, that's definitely parents' responsibility. I agree with mea

0:42:49.487 --> 0:42:52.847
<v Speaker 2>a million percent about the idea that parents can't fight

0:42:52.927 --> 0:42:56.967
<v Speaker 2>that alone. The only thing is I find it fascinating

0:42:57.007 --> 0:42:59.527
<v Speaker 2>because it's a really big deal. If it happens, it

0:42:59.567 --> 0:43:03.127
<v Speaker 2>affects all kinds of things. Think about for example, and

0:43:03.327 --> 0:43:08.167
<v Speaker 2>a bubble like tween and teen skincare obsession, which has

0:43:08.207 --> 0:43:13.407
<v Speaker 2>been entirely fueled by TikTok. It literally changed economies because

0:43:13.407 --> 0:43:15.767
<v Speaker 2>you're not supposed to market directly to children products that

0:43:15.767 --> 0:43:18.807
<v Speaker 2>aren't for children. But these social media platforms have allowed

0:43:18.847 --> 0:43:22.527
<v Speaker 2>businesses and companies to get around that unregulated and unfettered

0:43:22.567 --> 0:43:24.327
<v Speaker 2>for a really long time by saying, well, that's not

0:43:24.367 --> 0:43:26.567
<v Speaker 2>really what we're doing. It's just that the kids really

0:43:26.607 --> 0:43:28.727
<v Speaker 2>like what we're putting out there. It's like, no, that's

0:43:28.767 --> 0:43:30.407
<v Speaker 2>not why my twelve year old is asking me for

0:43:30.407 --> 0:43:32.247
<v Speaker 2>a hundred dollars serum. You know what I mean. It's

0:43:32.287 --> 0:43:35.607
<v Speaker 2>not that. So this will have massive implications in lots

0:43:35.607 --> 0:43:38.887
<v Speaker 2>of ways, which is good. There's a bit of me

0:43:38.967 --> 0:43:41.767
<v Speaker 2>that's sad because I think, if and when it happens,

0:43:41.967 --> 0:43:44.407
<v Speaker 2>I know that my children will probably be the guinea

0:43:44.447 --> 0:43:47.487
<v Speaker 2>pig generation in that I'll probably look back in a

0:43:47.527 --> 0:43:49.327
<v Speaker 2>few years and go I cannot believe I let my

0:43:49.407 --> 0:43:51.807
<v Speaker 2>daughter on TikTok when she was thirteen, will feel like

0:43:51.887 --> 0:43:55.367
<v Speaker 2>I was handing her a cigarette or a bottle of brandy,

0:43:55.767 --> 0:43:57.207
<v Speaker 2>Like Aura, I don't think you.

0:43:57.687 --> 0:43:59.487
<v Speaker 3>I don't think parents have a whole lot of control

0:43:59.567 --> 0:44:03.047
<v Speaker 3>right now, and we don't the public data that's come

0:44:03.047 --> 0:44:05.887
<v Speaker 3>out this comes after this release that said there's been

0:44:06.127 --> 0:44:09.207
<v Speaker 3>you know, an increase in mental health hospitalizations and psychological

0:44:09.407 --> 0:44:14.047
<v Speaker 3>stress among young people. That is a statistical reality. And

0:44:14.407 --> 0:44:18.167
<v Speaker 3>the increase is worse among women and girls aged sixteen

0:44:18.327 --> 0:44:21.167
<v Speaker 3>to twenty four. And so this has come out. All

0:44:21.207 --> 0:44:23.327
<v Speaker 3>of these studies have come out, and some will say

0:44:24.047 --> 0:44:27.527
<v Speaker 3>just because mobile phones coexist at the same time as

0:44:28.007 --> 0:44:31.407
<v Speaker 3>young people's mental health is deteriorating, doesn't mean one causes

0:44:31.447 --> 0:44:35.247
<v Speaker 3>the other. They say, correlation not causation. To that, I say,

0:44:35.527 --> 0:44:39.207
<v Speaker 3>speak to any teacher or any parent and ask them

0:44:39.247 --> 0:44:43.047
<v Speaker 3>what they think, or specifically, any parent who has lost

0:44:43.127 --> 0:44:46.767
<v Speaker 3>a child to you know, mental health issues or is

0:44:46.767 --> 0:44:49.967
<v Speaker 3>currently experiencing severe mental health issues, and they will tell

0:44:50.047 --> 0:44:52.847
<v Speaker 3>you the same thing. There have been a lot of

0:44:52.887 --> 0:44:56.087
<v Speaker 3>advocates that have been interviewed. One I saw this was

0:44:56.127 --> 0:45:00.287
<v Speaker 3>in Australia and she lost her daughter to suicide, and

0:45:00.367 --> 0:45:02.927
<v Speaker 3>she went on her daughter's phone afterwards and had a

0:45:02.967 --> 0:45:06.007
<v Speaker 3>look at what she was being served on TikTok, and

0:45:06.127 --> 0:45:10.527
<v Speaker 3>it was so distressing what that our Go rhythm had done.

0:45:10.647 --> 0:45:13.447
<v Speaker 3>It was wall to wall girls who felt the same

0:45:13.487 --> 0:45:17.847
<v Speaker 3>as her, girls who were speaking very very candidly about dying.

0:45:18.287 --> 0:45:21.167
<v Speaker 3>Like any mental health expert would say, you can't look

0:45:21.167 --> 0:45:25.407
<v Speaker 3>at that. It's contagious. So the ban, I think is

0:45:25.447 --> 0:45:27.607
<v Speaker 3>one thing, and a lot of people then go the ban,

0:45:28.047 --> 0:45:30.207
<v Speaker 3>how about X, Y and Z. I don't think this

0:45:30.327 --> 0:45:34.007
<v Speaker 3>is in isolation. I also think that algorithms, that's a

0:45:34.007 --> 0:45:36.927
<v Speaker 3>big one. Algorithms for young people are really bad because

0:45:36.967 --> 0:45:39.847
<v Speaker 3>they radicalize them and they take them down into rabbit holes.

0:45:39.847 --> 0:45:43.447
<v Speaker 3>So that's another thing that could be addressed. But I

0:45:43.487 --> 0:45:46.807
<v Speaker 3>find this attitude of something has to be done, something

0:45:46.847 --> 0:45:49.047
<v Speaker 3>has to be done, and then they choose something. This

0:45:49.167 --> 0:45:52.407
<v Speaker 3>keeps happening. The e Safety commissioner or the government chooses

0:45:52.407 --> 0:45:56.567
<v Speaker 3>something and everyone yells not that, or I've even heard

0:45:56.687 --> 0:45:58.687
<v Speaker 3>people say, well, it's not gonna work.

0:45:58.727 --> 0:45:59.527
<v Speaker 2>It's not gonna work.

0:45:59.807 --> 0:46:03.087
<v Speaker 3>I think that's defeatist and a country has to be

0:46:03.407 --> 0:46:05.767
<v Speaker 3>the first country to work it out. There are big

0:46:05.807 --> 0:46:09.047
<v Speaker 3>problems facing the world. Look at what AI can do.

0:46:09.367 --> 0:46:10.927
<v Speaker 3>You can't tell me that there isn't a solution.

0:46:11.487 --> 0:46:13.807
<v Speaker 2>Per Countries all over the world are grappling with this.

0:46:14.127 --> 0:46:16.087
<v Speaker 2>So the tech companies are going to say that this

0:46:16.167 --> 0:46:19.007
<v Speaker 2>is extreme. In Australia's idea is extreme, but countries are

0:46:19.007 --> 0:46:21.407
<v Speaker 2>all over the world are trying to fix this. The

0:46:21.447 --> 0:46:24.287
<v Speaker 2>first thing that everybody says, and this including parents who

0:46:25.007 --> 0:46:28.407
<v Speaker 2>like myself a bullseye in this demo of our kids

0:46:28.487 --> 0:46:31.047
<v Speaker 2>living on social media to a point, and we do

0:46:31.127 --> 0:46:34.047
<v Speaker 2>our best with our earnest like not until you're this age.

0:46:34.247 --> 0:46:36.487
<v Speaker 2>And but you know, I'm going to put these filters

0:46:36.527 --> 0:46:38.487
<v Speaker 2>on your phone and all that. But ultimately, as me

0:46:38.527 --> 0:46:41.207
<v Speaker 2>has already expressed, you're kind of powerless in this because

0:46:41.207 --> 0:46:43.927
<v Speaker 2>it is their world. Like talking about the implications of

0:46:44.287 --> 0:46:48.367
<v Speaker 2>banning Snapchat is enormous. That is, my daughter probably cannot

0:46:48.407 --> 0:46:51.807
<v Speaker 2>imagine her life or her social life without Snapchat, which

0:46:51.847 --> 0:46:54.727
<v Speaker 2>is scary in itself. Right, So the first thing everyone

0:46:54.727 --> 0:46:56.887
<v Speaker 2>says is it can't be done. How would you do that? Oh,

0:46:56.927 --> 0:46:59.327
<v Speaker 2>they'll find a way around it. Yes, they will find

0:46:59.367 --> 0:47:01.487
<v Speaker 2>a way around it. Lots of kids, some kids will,

0:47:01.687 --> 0:47:05.127
<v Speaker 2>but kids find their way around buying booze before they're eighteen.

0:47:05.207 --> 0:47:07.127
<v Speaker 2>It doesn't mean we all go we should just make

0:47:07.287 --> 0:47:09.967
<v Speaker 2>alcohol legal from when you're ten. Yeah, I think it

0:47:10.047 --> 0:47:13.087
<v Speaker 2>is defeatist. It's going to be really interesting. I think

0:47:13.087 --> 0:47:14.927
<v Speaker 2>with these kind of debates you just have to strap

0:47:14.967 --> 0:47:16.207
<v Speaker 2>in and go. A lot of people are going to

0:47:16.247 --> 0:47:18.327
<v Speaker 2>say a lot of stuff, but there is no question

0:47:19.087 --> 0:47:21.647
<v Speaker 2>that this is one of the biggest issues that's facing kids.

0:47:21.727 --> 0:47:25.767
<v Speaker 3>And community can be found in places outside of social media,

0:47:25.847 --> 0:47:28.727
<v Speaker 3>and news and current affairs can and should be found

0:47:29.167 --> 0:47:31.367
<v Speaker 3>in places outside of social media. What I do think

0:47:31.487 --> 0:47:34.367
<v Speaker 3>is a little bit funny is like you hear as

0:47:34.367 --> 0:47:37.367
<v Speaker 3>you say, Maya, the closer they are to teenagers, it's like,

0:47:37.887 --> 0:47:41.567
<v Speaker 3>I need the Internet for my community, and it's like, mate,

0:47:41.607 --> 0:47:45.287
<v Speaker 3>you're not sitting there making friends on the Internet. You're

0:47:45.327 --> 0:47:46.567
<v Speaker 3>looking at pornography.

0:47:48.127 --> 0:47:51.967
<v Speaker 2>Ironic thing about them, Yeah, they are definitely Yeah, I

0:47:51.967 --> 0:47:53.847
<v Speaker 2>think they definitely are. And I but the thing is

0:47:53.847 --> 0:47:55.527
<v Speaker 2>that I think there will be still be ways to

0:47:55.567 --> 0:47:57.967
<v Speaker 2>do that. The thing that's slightly ironic about the Green's position,

0:47:58.007 --> 0:48:00.367
<v Speaker 2>which I do have sympathy for, I understand that point,

0:48:01.207 --> 0:48:05.407
<v Speaker 2>is that they're defending the business models of these massive

0:48:05.727 --> 0:48:08.847
<v Speaker 2>tech platforms that are just all about getting rich. You

0:48:08.887 --> 0:48:12.327
<v Speaker 2>know what you just explained, Jesse about the awfulness being

0:48:12.367 --> 0:48:14.807
<v Speaker 2>served in an algorithm to a young girl with mental

0:48:14.847 --> 0:48:19.167
<v Speaker 2>health issues. Generally speaking, the bosses of the tech platforms

0:48:19.167 --> 0:48:21.527
<v Speaker 2>will literally go, that's got nothing to do with us

0:48:21.607 --> 0:48:26.007
<v Speaker 2>while cashing checks. So it seems very ironic that the

0:48:26.047 --> 0:48:29.887
<v Speaker 2>Greens would be defended in a way that really usually

0:48:29.927 --> 0:48:33.047
<v Speaker 2>they would kind of think, there's got to be another way.

0:48:33.207 --> 0:48:35.247
<v Speaker 3>There was a piece of legislation I think passed in

0:48:35.287 --> 0:48:39.367
<v Speaker 3>the nineties or something that basically protects all tech giants

0:48:39.367 --> 0:48:42.127
<v Speaker 3>from anything that is put on their platforms. Like legally

0:48:42.207 --> 0:48:45.207
<v Speaker 3>they can just go, oh, well, we didn't mean them

0:48:45.207 --> 0:48:47.487
<v Speaker 3>to see that or whatever. This will hold them more

0:48:47.527 --> 0:48:51.727
<v Speaker 3>to account, and maybe it means that the market corrects

0:48:51.727 --> 0:48:54.167
<v Speaker 3>itself and we have better platforms for young people. It

0:48:54.167 --> 0:48:56.847
<v Speaker 3>doesn't mean there are no platforms, but maybe it's not

0:48:56.887 --> 0:48:59.247
<v Speaker 3>the wild West. And you know, this is a bit

0:48:59.287 --> 0:49:01.847
<v Speaker 3>of a kickup the bum. If this segment has brought

0:49:01.927 --> 0:49:04.607
<v Speaker 3>up anything for you or has made you think about

0:49:04.607 --> 0:49:07.407
<v Speaker 3>a young person in your life, then there are resources

0:49:07.407 --> 0:49:10.047
<v Speaker 3>available in the show notes to life Line and beyond

0:49:10.047 --> 0:49:12.287
<v Speaker 3>Blue out Louders.

0:49:12.367 --> 0:49:14.567
<v Speaker 2>That's all we've got time for on today's show. Thank

0:49:14.647 --> 0:49:16.607
<v Speaker 2>you as always for being with us, and thank you

0:49:16.647 --> 0:49:19.287
<v Speaker 2>to our brilliant team on a crazy debate day helping

0:49:19.327 --> 0:49:22.207
<v Speaker 2>us put all that together. We are going to play

0:49:22.247 --> 0:49:25.327
<v Speaker 2>you now a little bit of a episode that we

0:49:25.447 --> 0:49:28.687
<v Speaker 2>made just the subscribers this week with Emily Vernon, and

0:49:28.767 --> 0:49:33.087
<v Speaker 2>it's about wedding etiquette, which is complex and always gets

0:49:33.087 --> 0:49:37.087
<v Speaker 2>people excited and specifically about what bridesmaids should and shouldn't

0:49:37.127 --> 0:49:39.887
<v Speaker 2>be expected to do and pay for. Here's a little

0:49:39.887 --> 0:49:40.287
<v Speaker 2>bit of it.

0:49:40.807 --> 0:49:44.087
<v Speaker 3>I was invited to a wedding and they said absolutely

0:49:44.167 --> 0:49:45.287
<v Speaker 3>no gifts. That was on there.

0:49:46.407 --> 0:49:47.287
<v Speaker 2>Do you still bring a gift?

0:49:47.487 --> 0:49:48.767
<v Speaker 1>No? Not bring a gift?

0:49:48.847 --> 0:49:50.567
<v Speaker 2>Right we honor people's wishes.

0:49:50.847 --> 0:49:53.127
<v Speaker 3>They said absolutely no gift. Do you bring a card?

0:49:53.487 --> 0:49:53.567
<v Speaker 5>Like?

0:49:53.607 --> 0:49:54.287
<v Speaker 1>Do you bring card?

0:49:54.407 --> 0:49:57.607
<v Speaker 2>Is good card? I'd bring like an emergency card with

0:49:57.687 --> 0:49:59.687
<v Speaker 2>some money in it and then see what everyone else

0:49:59.767 --> 0:50:00.127
<v Speaker 2>is doing.

0:50:00.207 --> 0:50:00.887
<v Speaker 1>This is a thing.

0:50:01.287 --> 0:50:04.247
<v Speaker 2>No, if they say no gifts, it means no gifts,

0:50:04.287 --> 0:50:06.767
<v Speaker 2>just have trust issues. I don't call them on that.

0:50:06.807 --> 0:50:09.807
<v Speaker 2>Shites because also I feel like once I give a gift,

0:50:09.807 --> 0:50:11.727
<v Speaker 2>I've done my job. Like I've done it. I just

0:50:11.767 --> 0:50:12.487
<v Speaker 2>want to have a good time.

0:50:12.527 --> 0:50:13.247
<v Speaker 1>I just want to drink.

0:50:13.807 --> 0:50:14.247
<v Speaker 2>Know what it is.

0:50:14.287 --> 0:50:16.687
<v Speaker 3>You don't feel even you feel like you've got one up.

0:50:16.887 --> 0:50:18.927
<v Speaker 3>They're walking around the world thinking they've got one up

0:50:18.927 --> 0:50:20.607
<v Speaker 3>on me because they in the event, and I didn't

0:50:20.607 --> 0:50:22.567
<v Speaker 3>give you a gift, so you're like no.

0:50:22.807 --> 0:50:25.127
<v Speaker 2>So here's the thing that is to the rest of

0:50:25.167 --> 0:50:25.687
<v Speaker 2>the episode.

0:50:25.887 --> 0:50:27.847
<v Speaker 3>In the show notes, Bye.

0:50:28.447 --> 0:50:31.327
<v Speaker 2>Shout out to any Mamma Mia subscribers listening. If you

0:50:31.487 --> 0:50:34.367
<v Speaker 2>love the show and you want to support us, subscribing

0:50:34.367 --> 0:50:36.807
<v Speaker 2>to Mamma Mia is the very best way to do it.

0:50:37.007 --> 0:50:38.847
<v Speaker 2>There's a link in the episode description.