Speaker 1: You're listening to a mom with mea podcast that's huge.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, but it's all me and Andy.
Speaker 1: You're talking about what are you going to do to
Speaker 1: keep it?
Speaker 3: What have you got coming up and tell.
Speaker 1: The people tell you we can't beat you at your game.
Speaker 1: I'll just keep refreshing it till we get back there. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well done.
Speaker 2: Who was that Jesse was so referring to Hamish?
Speaker 4: Blake has finally released a statement conceded.
Speaker 5: Regarding our victory in the podcast Ranker where we did
Speaker 5: beat Hamish Nandy. They are usually number one. We got
Speaker 5: number one. It's of course completely irrelevant that they are
Speaker 5: on holidays, but.
Speaker 2: They haven't really been releasing them.
Speaker 5: No, and that Hamish has probably been laying by a
Speaker 5: pool with a cocktail.
Speaker 3: Do you know what I heard when I heard that?
Speaker 3: I heard a scared man.
Speaker 5: I heard a scared man too. I mean it was
Speaker 5: it was diplomatic. He'd clearly prepared that statement and really
Speaker 5: thought about what he was going to say.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's clearly true that he and Andy spoke of
Speaker 2: nothing else.
Speaker 5: Yes, and it's clear that that certainly wasn't the.
Speaker 4: First he'd heard of the fact we beat him in
Speaker 4: the Red gun that maybe he's been a bit distracted.
Speaker 4: I would say he is a dignified loser.
Speaker 2: He's a dignified loser, and you're in our thoughts, Hamish.
Speaker 5: Yeah, better luck next month. Actually, I don't even think
Speaker 5: he's back next month. Better luck in July when you
Speaker 5: decide to come back for five minutes and you smash her.
Speaker 2: But anyway, out Loud as Welcome to Australia's number one podcast.
Speaker 5: We keep saying that until Hamish is our annual needs
Speaker 5: back to work.
Speaker 2: This is Mama Mire out Loud and it's what women
Speaker 2: are actually talking about. On Monday, the twenty third of February.
Speaker 4: I'm Holly Wayne Wright, I'm Jesse Stevens.
Speaker 1: And I'm Amelia Lester and here's.
Speaker 2: What's on our agenda for today. So Prince William was
Speaker 2: just at the bafter's right. Just happened just before we
Speaker 2: got on air, and someone asked him if it's in
Speaker 2: Hamnet and he gave a very understandable response to that.
Speaker 2: That suggests he's had maybe other things on his mind.
Speaker 4: He's not maybe in the mental yeah.
Speaker 2: Like I think perhaps the fact that his uncle may
Speaker 2: have just put him and his dad and everybody else
Speaker 2: out of a job, so we will be discussing the
Speaker 2: ongoing fallout from Andrew Mountbatten Windsor.
Speaker 5: Plus, we finally know what replaced the girl boss feminism
Speaker 5: of the twenty tens. It is the burnout feminism of
Speaker 5: the twenty twenties. But we want to know if that
Speaker 5: trend is actually really any better.
Speaker 3: And we all think we know what happened last week
Speaker 3: when Channel nine's Danika Mason went to air drunk from
Speaker 3: the Winter Olympics.
Speaker 1: But the truth is a little bit more complicated.
Speaker 2: But first, so as I say, Prince William, Princess Catherine,
Speaker 2: they're at the Baftis. They used to always go to
Speaker 2: the Baftis, but they haven't been for three years because
Speaker 2: of Catherine's health. Right, so this is a triumphant return
Speaker 2: to the red carpet, as the tablelats would say. She
Speaker 2: was wearing this gorgeous Gucci frog that she's born before
Speaker 2: I know she's recycling it, which is ace. But unlike
Speaker 2: previous years, when they step out of the car and
Speaker 2: onto the red carpet, they just get yelled at from
Speaker 2: all these paps, going is the monarchy in peril? Well
Speaker 2: you miss it all over William if you're don't about
Speaker 2: to resign and he's like, oh fuck. And then one
Speaker 2: of the journos asks him, have you seen Hamnet, which
Speaker 2: is a fair question. They knew it was going to
Speaker 2: win Big English movie, and he.
Speaker 1: Said, A famously sad movie.
Speaker 2: It's very sad emotional movie. I know lots of people
Speaker 2: who share Prince William's sentiment on this. He said, I
Speaker 2: need to be in quite a calm state. He said
Speaker 2: to watch it with um and I am not at
Speaker 2: the moment, so I will save it now. Fair lots
Speaker 2: of people feel that way about Hamnet. Kate was there,
Speaker 2: she was like, I've watched it, she said, cried. She
Speaker 2: had cried, mine is out my eyes when all puffy.
Speaker 2: I'm like me too, you too? Yeah? Anyway, why is
Speaker 2: William not calm? William is not calm because, as you
Speaker 2: would know if you listen to our special emergency episode
Speaker 2: on Friday, his uncle, formerly known as Prince Andrew, was
Speaker 2: arrested in the UK on Thursday, and the fallout for
Speaker 2: that has now led us to a place where people
Speaker 2: are saying, is this the end of the monarchy? Is
Speaker 2: King Charles about to abdicate? Jesse? Have you heard all
Speaker 2: this abdication chat.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I listened to an emergency episode of Mummy out loud
Speaker 5: on Friday. I had not seen anything. I had not
Speaker 5: seen pictures, and then I listened to you explain it
Speaker 5: all to me. And I must say that when I
Speaker 5: saw William use the word calm, I thought it was
Speaker 5: very revealing because the keep calm and carry on is
Speaker 5: the royal mantra, and he was basically saying, I am
Speaker 5: not calm right now. I am completely thrown by this.
Speaker 5: I think that they've been very strategic in what they
Speaker 5: have and haven't said, but I can't imagine the family
Speaker 5: fall out.
Speaker 3: If you look at Charles's statement that he released after
Speaker 3: the arrest, it was a real departure from royal protocol,
Speaker 3: which is normally all about W and R and the
Speaker 3: royal WI. And his statement began, I have learned with
Speaker 3: the deepest concern the news about Andrew Mountbatten Windsor. That
Speaker 3: is not how you rever to your brother. No, you
Speaker 3: don't rever to your brother by aseful name. To me,
Speaker 3: it was giving the Mariah Carey.
Speaker 1: I don't know her mean yes, yeah, yeaheah, I don't
Speaker 1: know her vibes.
Speaker 2: But good luck with that, Charles, because so a bit
Speaker 2: of a recap on what's happened since so Andrew Mountbatten
Speaker 2: Windsor was arrested early on Thursday morning and he was
Speaker 2: taken to a police station in Question for around twelve.
Speaker 4: Hours, which means I had a lot of questions.
Speaker 2: Yes, he was not charged and he has not been charged,
Speaker 2: and it's important to note, of course, no charge is
Speaker 2: laid and obviously he's innocent till proven guilty. He was
Speaker 2: not cautioned, he was not bailed, he was just released.
Speaker 2: So there's that. But the arrest itself has been one
Speaker 2: of the biggest stories in the world, but particularly shocking
Speaker 2: for the royal family. Apparently King Charles didn't know it
Speaker 2: was going to happen. Nobody in the family knew it
Speaker 2: was going to happen. Andrew didn't, and that's you can
Speaker 2: see why. Obviously, if Scotland Yard had tipped Charles off
Speaker 2: and then Andrew was suddenly not home when the cops
Speaker 2: came knocking on the door, that would have been problem enough.
Speaker 2: Everybody's waiting now for the other shoe to drop. So
Speaker 2: the ripple effect of this is enormous and where we've
Speaker 2: landed today, which is this sort of is this really
Speaker 2: good to be the end of the monarchy? And everybody
Speaker 2: shouting at Prince William about it because there's a lot
Speaker 2: of reporting out there that this scandal is so big
Speaker 2: and goes so far and so deep into the monarchy
Speaker 2: that Charles may have no choice really but to maybe abdicate.
Speaker 5: Can I ask you about that, because when I've seen
Speaker 5: whispers of that and reports saying that there's maybe a
Speaker 5: push for him to abdicate, or that it might be
Speaker 5: something he chooses to do on his own accord, why like,
Speaker 5: what does this have to do with Charles?
Speaker 2: So the reason is this didn't come from nowhere. This
Speaker 2: has obviously that Andrew business has been an open secret,
Speaker 2: like different levels of it. It's important to note that
Speaker 2: what he was arrested for misconduct in public office, and
Speaker 2: as we've talked about on Friday's emergency meeting, what he
Speaker 2: appears to have been arrested for are the allegations that
Speaker 2: came out in the latest drop of the Epstein files
Speaker 2: that while he was Special Trade Envoy for Great Britain,
Speaker 2: he was emailing Epstein and the allegedly sharing very sensitive
Speaker 2: information that was good for Epstein and his pals things
Speaker 2: that you should share. So that is what he was
Speaker 2: actually arrested for. In twenty twenty two, Andrew reached an
Speaker 2: out of court settlement with Virginia Giffrey in a US
Speaker 2: civil case which involved an undisclosed payout of a very
Speaker 2: large sum of money and no admission of guilt on
Speaker 2: his part. That money is widely believed to have come
Speaker 2: from the Queen, from King Charles, from his family. Basically,
Speaker 2: he didn't have twelve million pounds lying around, so there
Speaker 2: are a lot of lot of speculation that how much
Speaker 2: did everybody know and how much did they enable him.
Speaker 2: There is a journalist and an author called Andrew Lowney
Speaker 2: who wrote the book about Andrew and Fergie last year
Speaker 2: that became almost a bit of a catalyst for all
Speaker 2: of this. And he was interviewed by the Quickie this
Speaker 2: morning and this is what he said about the problem
Speaker 2: that Charles faces.
Speaker 6: I have counterless stories in my book entitled in My Research,
Speaker 6: of people going and complaining to the Palace, to the
Speaker 6: Queen's private secretary and being sent away with a flea
Speaker 6: in the ear. And these are intelligence officials, the heads
Speaker 6: of the Foreign Office, and others. So I do think
Speaker 6: this scandal is getting very close to the crown and
Speaker 6: it may well lead to a second abdication, depends what
Speaker 6: he knew and what he did. I think his position
Speaker 6: is very dangerous. You know, clearly they didn't expect this
Speaker 6: Epstein material to be released. They're kind of paddling furiously
Speaker 6: now to see what they can say. So no, I
Speaker 6: think he's you know, as more and more evidence comes out,
Speaker 6: and I suspect it will implicating other members of the
Speaker 6: royal household. I mean they will say perhaps that King
Speaker 6: Charles didn't see it. It went to private secretaries. The
Speaker 6: Queen dealt with it, but he was in effect co
Speaker 6: ruling with the Queen for the last few years of
Speaker 6: her reign. He's been the king for the last few years.
Speaker 6: This is a problem that goes way back. And Andrew
Speaker 6: was basically an accident waiting to happen. So I think
Speaker 6: it's going to be very difficult to keep his hands clean.
Speaker 6: I mean, the wagons are circling. I think it's looking
Speaker 6: very dangerous for him.
Speaker 3: Wow, the fact that he's saying that Andrew Lowney really
Speaker 3: I was pretty skeptical of this idea that Charles would
Speaker 3: step down, because since when has Charles ever wanted to
Speaker 3: take respond on stability for anything anyone at his family does.
Speaker 1: But that's a very credible source.
Speaker 2: It is, and it's also it's interesting because I don't
Speaker 2: think anyone suggesting this will happen tomorrow, next week, next month,
Speaker 2: But people are now saying that they think that that
Speaker 2: when Andrew was properly cast out by Charles last October,
Speaker 2: when he had his prince title revoked and he was
Speaker 2: kicked out of the family home and all those things,
Speaker 2: Charles didn't know that this exact arrest was coming, but
Speaker 2: they knew that the chickens were coming home to roost,
Speaker 2: and he by doing that level of stepping back, he
Speaker 2: was signaling I'm not going to stand in the way.
Speaker 2: The palace are not going to stand in the way
Speaker 2: anymore of whatever you're going to do. And that was
Speaker 2: one step in this. The problem that the royal family
Speaker 2: have if they want to survive, of course, is that
Speaker 2: there is an enormous public dissatisfaction with obviously Andrew's actions,
Speaker 2: but also the perception that there's just a completely different
Speaker 2: set of rules for royals, which there always has been.
Speaker 2: Let's be honest, But that's becoming increasingly unpopular, and the
Speaker 2: speculation is that William is a clean skin in this.
Speaker 2: No one can suggest that he was complicit. He has
Speaker 2: been very stern. He has said over and over again
Speaker 2: that he wants to modernize and slim land the monarchy.
Speaker 2: So there is speculation that Charles could sort of take
Speaker 2: the fall, as it were, for this and then at
Speaker 2: some point step down, maybe because of his health, maybe
Speaker 2: for other reasons. He's seventy seven and he's not very
Speaker 2: well and allow a different kind of monarchy to come through.
Speaker 3: But that slim down monarchy is going to have a
Speaker 3: direct implication on Harry and Magant very much, because he's
Speaker 3: not going to slim it down in one way and
Speaker 3: not the other way.
Speaker 2: Oh well, if you look at so they call them
Speaker 2: the pushbike royals, right, the royals of Scandinavia, so Norway, Denmark, Sweden.
Speaker 2: They have this model of monarchy where the only royals
Speaker 2: are actually the king for the monarch and their direct heir.
Speaker 2: So that means that the only if they were to
Speaker 2: follow a Nordic model, the only official royals who get
Speaker 2: any kind of public allowance as it were, and are
Speaker 2: working royals would be William, Catherine and their children and
Speaker 2: everyone else. Like, of course they're still posh and you
Speaker 2: still get to go to palaces and be involved in
Speaker 2: weddings and whatever, but they're not working members of the
Speaker 2: royal family on the public purse. And in Britain that
Speaker 2: used to be a sprawling group of royals, it's been
Speaker 2: slowly carved out.
Speaker 3: And it's the key that they don't get a title
Speaker 3: to presumab day which are part of what enabled Andrew
Speaker 3: to sort of work in these worlds was his HR
Speaker 3: eight and.
Speaker 2: Gave him status, and he gave those to his daughters
Speaker 2: and famously the Queen's daughter, and when she had her
Speaker 2: children she said, I don't want the titles she could
Speaker 2: have given her daughter and son prince and princess, she said.
Speaker 2: Nat Andrew is probably a surprise to no one as
Speaker 2: more and more of his character becomes apparent. Who's like, absolutely,
Speaker 2: my girls will be princess.
Speaker 1: He had it on his email signature, as we now know.
Speaker 2: So he wanted that one hundred percent. So that will
Speaker 2: be interesting.
Speaker 5: Because Harry and Meghan have just I'm really surprised at
Speaker 5: the restraint they've shown.
Speaker 4: I'm surprised I haven't said anything yet. Really, yeah, I am,
Speaker 4: because this is so.
Speaker 5: Much like I just keep imagining Meghan showing up to
Speaker 5: meet Harry's in laws at the table and being like, wait,
Speaker 5: your uncle, that guy who's just sitting across from me
Speaker 5: was accused of what probably had a lot more insight
Speaker 5: than any of us did. And as you say, it
Speaker 5: was mentioned in Passing and Spare in Harry's book. But
Speaker 5: do you think they will say anything.
Speaker 2: I don't think they'll say anything directly immediately, but I
Speaker 2: think that they would be quite happy sitting in Montecida
Speaker 2: right now. A because they've distanced themselves from an increasingly
Speaker 2: toxic brand. B Because all the reports are that Harry's
Speaker 2: going to go back to the UK in an official
Speaker 2: capacity this northern summer, and Megs might go too, and
Speaker 2: the kids might go too. For the first time. Whether
Speaker 2: or not William really is on the brink of becoming king,
Speaker 2: Harry has a kind of opportunity to set them up
Speaker 2: as sort of almost like more moral superior royals, you know,
Speaker 2: in a different way, and he might lose his title.
Speaker 2: I mean, he clearly wants to really hold onto that
Speaker 2: title too. He's given it to his children if William
Speaker 2: gets his way, but not for a while. There's still
Speaker 2: some time to make hay. I think they'll bide their
Speaker 2: time before they say anything.
Speaker 4: And here's my other question.
Speaker 5: Do we think this is what I think a lot
Speaker 5: of the outrage has been is that Andrew has not
Speaker 5: given official evidence. Do you think that this might.
Speaker 1: Force him to?
Speaker 5: Is there a future in which Andrew has to sit
Speaker 5: on trial and testify and actually reveal the details of
Speaker 5: his relationship with Jeffrey Epstein.
Speaker 2: Yes, But the thing is is the details of his
Speaker 2: relationship with Jeffrey Epstein are already revealed. You know, he
Speaker 2: and Sarah Ferguson and some of the people mentioned the most. Yeah,
Speaker 2: in those millions and millions of Epstein, Puss and their daughters,
Speaker 2: that relationship was clearly very close. And they've both been
Speaker 2: proved to have been lying when they said, oh, after
Speaker 2: his conviction, we barely had anything to do with him.
Speaker 2: The same year he was released from prison, Fergie and
Speaker 2: the girls were flown on Epstein's purse two Palm Beach
Speaker 2: to have lunch with him, like they were tight. And
Speaker 2: the Brits are quite smug this weekend about the fact
Speaker 2: that well, at least we're doing something about our Epstein villains.
Speaker 2: Important to note that obviously people said why was he
Speaker 2: arrested rather than just asked him for questioning. Usually in
Speaker 2: a high profile case, the first thing would be helping
Speaker 2: us with our inquiries, right, But the fact that he
Speaker 2: was brought in it meant that the police had power
Speaker 2: to then go and search his house and houses, which
Speaker 2: they did. Also, they could hold him whether he spoke
Speaker 2: or not. They could hold him, whereas if they just
Speaker 2: invited him in at his own discretion, he could just
Speaker 2: make excuses and go. And also it may suggest that
Speaker 2: they had tried to help us with our inquiries several
Speaker 2: times in world.
Speaker 1: Why do you think they did it on his birthday?
Speaker 2: Oh? I don't know, because the fact I was listening
Speaker 2: to reporting saying that to arrest him to question about
Speaker 2: the Epstein connection, they would have had to be cooperating
Speaker 2: with the DOJ in America, So that's an international issue.
Speaker 2: They have also come under criticism for maybe treating him
Speaker 2: and other roles with kid gloves for these past few years.
Speaker 2: Maybe Charles and the Queen and her time were pushing
Speaker 2: them back, just in terms of the ripple effect So
Speaker 2: the other big story this weekend that's come out. Everybody's
Speaker 2: been saying, where's Fergie, Where's Sarah Ferguson. She hasn't been
Speaker 2: seen in Britain since September last year. Some reporting from
Speaker 2: Tom Sykes, who's the Royalist, broke that she had been
Speaker 2: in a clinic in Switzerland over January. That she's obviously
Speaker 2: in a fragile state and she's trying to find where
Speaker 2: she can go. She's been sited in the Middle East.
Speaker 2: Her daughters sometimes work in the Middle East.
Speaker 3: By the way, the clinic that she went to in
Speaker 3: Switzerland is apparently the most expensive rehab clinic in the world.
Speaker 3: And the way she got in there is that she
Speaker 3: did a video on their social media talking about us.
Speaker 1: Of course she did.
Speaker 2: So this is the thing, right, is that one of
Speaker 2: the reasons why Sarah and Andrew have always been problems
Speaker 2: for the royal family is because they don't have enough money,
Speaker 2: in their opinion, to live the way they want to live.
Speaker 2: Tina Brown has always been on the record as saying
Speaker 2: that peripheral royals are a big problem because it's like
Speaker 2: they can't really earn enough to live by getting just
Speaker 2: a good job. You know what I mean, live in
Speaker 2: the way that they are accustomed to. So therefore that's
Speaker 2: why you're staying at your problematic billionaires friend's mansion in
Speaker 2: New York, or talking your way into a clinic in Switzerland,
Speaker 2: or getting a Saudi prince to bankroll your trip to
Speaker 2: the UA. So lots of talk about what Fergie is
Speaker 2: going to do. And of course the princess is Beatrice
Speaker 2: and Eugenie. There has been a lot of sympathy for
Speaker 2: them because they were named hundreds of times in the
Speaker 2: Epstein files, and mostly they were really young at the time.
Speaker 2: A lot of people are saying, if they want to
Speaker 2: show that they are of goodwill during this reckoning, that
Speaker 2: they would hand their titles back to because if their
Speaker 2: father isn't a prince, are the princess?
Speaker 3: Any can't get over how we've learned through these emails
Speaker 3: how their parents, which is so irresponsible in intertwining women
Speaker 3: in Epstein's world. For instance, Beatrice's eighteenth birthday a masked
Speaker 3: ball that apparently costs one hundred pounds. Harvey Weinstein, Julie Maxwell,
Speaker 3: and Jeffrey Epstein attended her eighteenth birthday party. Now that's
Speaker 3: not on her that's on her parents.
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, they probably helped pay for it.
Speaker 4: A fun fact to end on.
Speaker 5: Did you know that fourteen years ago a member of
Speaker 5: the royal family was convicted of.
Speaker 4: A criminal offense.
Speaker 2: Who was that? Jesse was Princess Anne.
Speaker 5: Princess Anne pled guilty after her dog, a three year
Speaker 5: old English bull Terrier called Dotty, bit two children as
Speaker 5: they walked in winds A great part and.
Speaker 4: Shew the book criminal offense.
Speaker 5: Fined five hundred pounds, which we all know was a
Speaker 5: lot of money, a lot that's more than.
Speaker 4: Any fine Andrew's gotten. But you know, Princess Anne did
Speaker 4: her time.
Speaker 2: As they say on dogs. One last thing, Yeah, Sarah
Speaker 2: ferguson Fergie. She famously got the Queen's corgies when the
Speaker 2: Queen did she and she likes to talk about it
Speaker 2: a lot, and she says things like, when the corgies
Speaker 2: come in in the morning and bark at me, I
Speaker 2: like to think it's the Queen.
Speaker 5: Like saying, I definitely put those dogs on like only
Speaker 5: famous to enjoy.
Speaker 1: The now come.
Speaker 2: And apparently it really annoys William and Catherine really.
Speaker 1: That they have the call, that.
Speaker 2: They have the corgies, and that she keeps talking about
Speaker 2: the Corgies because she keeps like insinuating herself closer and
Speaker 2: closer to the Queen. Because Charles is in a difficult situation.
Speaker 2: It's really for him to distance himself completely from Andrew,
Speaker 2: who has to blame his mum. And everybody still loves
Speaker 2: the Queen, even if her the fact that her favorite
Speaker 2: child apparently his nickname from his security detail was the
Speaker 2: C word. It does call a judgment into questions. Okay,
Speaker 2: we'll keep you up to date, friends, keep an eye
Speaker 2: on that teetering crown.
Speaker 5: After the break, a new brand of feminism has replaced
Speaker 5: the girl Boss era, But is it really any better?
Speaker 1: Hey out loud as it's Mia.
Speaker 7: I have got one of my favorite episodes of all
Speaker 7: time coming into your ear holes tomorrow. Amelia and I
Speaker 7: have downloaded all our obsessions about the new show loves
Speaker 7: story about JFK Jr.
Speaker 1: And Carol and Bassett.
Speaker 7: Whether you know who they are or not, you're going
Speaker 7: to love this episode. We certainly loved making it. Our
Speaker 7: subscriber apps drop twice a week Tuesdays and Thursdays, so
Speaker 7: if you're not already a subscriber, follow the link in
Speaker 7: the show notes and you can get out loud and
Speaker 7: me in your ears five days a week.
Speaker 5: There's an article in Bloomberg this week about how burnout
Speaker 5: feminism has come to replace the girl Boss lean in era,
Speaker 5: and author Alice Rob makes a very compelling case. So
Speaker 5: she begins by reminiscing about the twenty tens, when Yahoo
Speaker 5: chief executive officer Marissa Mayer insisted it was totally possible
Speaker 5: to work a one hundred and thirty hour a week
Speaker 5: as long as you timed your bathroom breaks perfectly, and
Speaker 5: media boss Joanna Coles, while walking at her treadmill desk,
Speaker 5: insisted that she was not at all interested in relaxing.
Speaker 5: So that gives you a snapshot of what the twenty
Speaker 5: tens vibe was.
Speaker 2: But this decade, it happened to all the trep It's true,
Speaker 2: I know recently, and she had one. I had a
Speaker 2: friend with one.
Speaker 3: I remember when people used to sit on bow sue balls.
Speaker 3: That one way too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if I had a treadmill desk, it would just
Speaker 2: be a very very heavily about clothes track.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but this decade, the twenty twenties, is all about
Speaker 5: the pleasure of giving up, and Rob cites a number
Speaker 5: of books throughout this article that really capture this sentiment.
Speaker 5: She talks about Emma Gannon, who is a writer we've
Speaker 5: spoken about before. She was a very accomplished journalist, podcaster,
Speaker 5: was doing everything, and she basically quit all the commitments
Speaker 5: to take walks and eat banana bread instead. She also
Speaker 5: wrote a very successful book and substack and all of that,
Speaker 5: but basically she was like, this burns me out and
Speaker 5: it makes me not happy, and she started this movement.
Speaker 5: There's even one book called Life After Ambition, which sums
Speaker 5: up a lot about this genre. For some women, having
Speaker 5: babies is the breaking point, and for others it was
Speaker 5: discovering that despite their one hundred and thirty hour work weeks,
Speaker 5: they were still getting paid less.
Speaker 4: Than the men they worked alongside. Amelia.
Speaker 5: There are definitely some parts of burnout feminism to be
Speaker 5: celebrated in terms of us all going this is too much,
Speaker 5: I can't do it. But should we be worried about
Speaker 5: this kind of shaming of female ambition. There's this idea
Speaker 5: that the new trend is that we've all got to
Speaker 5: pretend like work life balance, hobbies, not striving too much
Speaker 5: is what we really want, and I'm not seeing maybe
Speaker 5: men being pressured the same.
Speaker 1: Way use the problem.
Speaker 3: Men aren't leaning out, Men are still just at that
Speaker 3: table leaning in yes, And that tells me that there's
Speaker 3: something awry with this trend.
Speaker 1: If this article actually made me.
Speaker 3: Quite sad, the idea that it says that for all
Speaker 3: of human history women's ambition has been condemned except for
Speaker 3: this brief period between twenty thirteen and twenty twenty.
Speaker 1: That really hit home for me because.
Speaker 5: It's true, and there's so much hatred towards the women
Speaker 5: who led that girl bus.
Speaker 4: Here are like so much vitriol.
Speaker 3: True, And I just think that it's also a little
Speaker 3: disingenuous for all these authors that are cited in here
Speaker 3: to tell us how they're just so lazy now and
Speaker 3: they do nothing to eat banana bread.
Speaker 1: But I'm reading this in books they've written.
Speaker 3: Now. I've never written a book, but I think that
Speaker 3: they're quite time consuming, is what I've heard, and they're
Speaker 3: quite impressive achievements. So do tell me how lazy you
Speaker 3: are when I'm reading it in a book you.
Speaker 5: Wrote, Rebsolutely, nothing burns you out like writing a book.
Speaker 5: I'm not seeing these people disappear. It's like I see
Speaker 5: the reinvention. I mean, it's just rebranding, right, it's rebranding.
Speaker 5: And it's like, is there something unpopular now about going well,
Speaker 5: I want to be the boss?
Speaker 4: Like is that kind of Well?
Speaker 2: It's interesting, isn't it? Because maybe it's just splintering because
Speaker 2: there is still a lot of what you would call
Speaker 2: girl bossing on the internet. Look at Emma Greed. We
Speaker 2: talk about her all the time, right, she's boss lady
Speaker 2: at Skins. Look at all every Kardashian. Look that these
Speaker 2: are not lazy people. These are not that any of
Speaker 2: these women are lazy, but you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: they're not celebrating not working. They are work bitch, right,
Speaker 2: And I think that this is a pushback to that
Speaker 2: because it's an interesting question about the men. Are men
Speaker 2: allowed to burn out? I don't know that they are,
Speaker 2: do you know what I mean? Like, I think that
Speaker 2: the culture we expect men to work, work, work, work, work,
Speaker 2: and if they were to say I'm burnt out and
Speaker 2: I need to stop, we'd probably everyone would probably be
Speaker 2: quite mocking of them. Are we seeing like a splintering
Speaker 2: of different groups because the girl boss world doesn't suit everybody,
Speaker 2: doesn't make them happy, doesn't make them feel fulfilled. Nor
Speaker 2: does the soft life as they call it, suit everybody.
Speaker 2: So are we not just seeing a broader range?
Speaker 5: Because or was the issue though that we were being
Speaker 5: yelled at to lean in while our home lives mark
Speaker 5: in terms of who was looking after our children.
Speaker 2: We were all that's exactly the reaction to that, you know,
Speaker 2: which is the fact that, well, you can girl boss
Speaker 2: or you want, but when you get home, you're still
Speaker 2: mopping the floor and cooking the dinner and try.
Speaker 5: And a man can lean in if the woman is
Speaker 5: still doing the majority of the domestic load, which I
Speaker 5: think was that contributing to the burner.
Speaker 3: Look, I hate to be doing this, but I'm going
Speaker 3: to defend Cheryl Samberg.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, but I have to.
Speaker 3: I do think that the whole lean In idea got
Speaker 3: completely misunderstood by everyone. The whole idea was that you
Speaker 3: meant to instead of preemptively saying, well, I want to
Speaker 3: have kids, therefore I'm not going to work as hard
Speaker 3: just in preparation for that. She's like, no, just keep
Speaker 3: working hard until the point that you want to have kids,
Speaker 3: and then you can reassess. That was all she was
Speaker 3: saying with lean In she was saying, lean in until
Speaker 3: you can't lean in anymore.
Speaker 2: And you'll be in a good position take break now.
Speaker 1: It is not bad advice.
Speaker 3: And I recently went to speak at my high school,
Speaker 3: as I know you did, Jesse, and I was sent
Speaker 3: a list of sample questions by the high school students
Speaker 3: who invited me, and one of the questions was how
Speaker 3: do you achieve work life balance? And I just thought,
Speaker 3: how insane at seventeen to be worried about that about
Speaker 3: work life balance. I just don't think they need to
Speaker 3: worry about that, And that was Cheryl's point. So I
Speaker 3: kind of worry that by telling us all not to
Speaker 3: work so hard, not to worry so much, there's a
Speaker 3: bit of a nefarious conservative agenda underneath it, because it's
Speaker 3: basically saying like, you don't need money, and the fact
Speaker 3: is women need money. The pay gap is widening again
Speaker 3: for the first time in a while, and it's because
Speaker 3: women are being told that actually their financial future and
Speaker 3: security is not important.
Speaker 1: Okay, who benefits from that?
Speaker 2: But I agree with you entirely. But also, and I
Speaker 2: think I've told this story before, so throw something at
Speaker 2: my head. That's the case. But so I had a
Speaker 2: significant episode of burnout in the mid twenty teens when
Speaker 2: my kids were little, and I remember very clearly being
Speaker 2: at the doctor and like having it was very similar
Speaker 2: to the way that Emma Gannon explains it. And I
Speaker 2: was crying at the doctor and I was trying to
Speaker 2: explain to her what was wrong with me. And this doctor,
Speaker 2: who was much younger than me and very glamorous, she
Speaker 2: said to me, Oh, I see women like you all
Speaker 2: the time. She said, women trying to have it all.
Speaker 2: That's what she said to me.
Speaker 5: And the doctor said, doctor, and I diagnose you with
Speaker 5: trying to have it I.
Speaker 2: Diagnosed you with trying to have it all. And I
Speaker 2: was busy having my burnout meltdown, which apparently was right
Speaker 2: on schedule exactly what it was.
Speaker 3: Well, this doctor is obviously just slacking away. Didn't go
Speaker 3: through medical.
Speaker 2: Yes, I was like trying to have it all, like
Speaker 2: have a job and have a family like those.
Speaker 5: You were also trying to run a marathon, which you
Speaker 5: do talk about often.
Speaker 2: Well I did. That was possibly my mistake. But the
Speaker 2: thing is is I can't bear my view on this
Speaker 2: is that it is true that we absolutely fetishized busyness
Speaker 2: for a while there, and I think we're pulling back
Speaker 2: from that, that whole thing of like how are you
Speaker 2: and busy?
Speaker 1: How I'm going?
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, And I think that there is a sort
Speaker 2: of for a high achieving woman, but I'm sure it's
Speaker 2: probably true of a hygiene man. I don't know. If
Speaker 2: we're not completely stretched all the time and doing twenty
Speaker 2: five things all the time and we get a moment
Speaker 2: to breathe, we panic, we feel guilty, we feel lazy,
Speaker 2: we feel like we're panicking. I'm supposed to be constantly
Speaker 2: in a state of hustle, of hustle, of stress, of
Speaker 2: too many places to be, too many things to do,
Speaker 2: and if I'm not in that state, I'm doing life wrong.
Speaker 2: I think that's absolutely true that that became fetishized and
Speaker 2: normalized to a point. And so if you do say
Speaker 2: and people like how are you and you're like, I'm fine.
Speaker 2: I spent the weekend, you know, I don't know, watching
Speaker 2: TV in my garden baking a cake, people be like, oh,
Speaker 2: you're supposed to be constantly optimizing. So I think that
Speaker 2: if burnout feminism acknowledge is that everybody's nervous system isn't
Speaker 2: created for that, not everybody's preferences aren't created for that,
Speaker 2: then that's fine. But we are to your point, Emelia,
Speaker 2: about the young women asking you that question, It's like
Speaker 2: we're preloading them with this idea that you can't handle it.
Speaker 2: You cannot handle the life that will come at you
Speaker 2: if you want to work hard?
Speaker 3: Is that?
Speaker 1: Is that true? Though?
Speaker 2: I don't think it's true.
Speaker 1: Is it?
Speaker 2: Men have breakdowns? Just you know?
Speaker 5: Yeah, I wonder if the setup, though, was unsustainable. It's
Speaker 5: like the one hundred and thirty hours a week is
Speaker 5: completely unsustainable. And remember when Arianna Huffington discovered sleep and
Speaker 5: she was like, everyone, there's this thing that you should
Speaker 5: do for a few hours every night and it makes
Speaker 5: you feel great. And it was like that was a
Speaker 5: weird time, that was ripe for parody like that, there
Speaker 5: was something kind of ridiculous about that. But then at
Speaker 5: the same time to transition into this burnout feminism.
Speaker 4: And I hate to kind of use this word.
Speaker 5: All the time, but there is such an inherent privilege
Speaker 5: in it, right, because not everyone gets to fall in
Speaker 5: a heap, and not everyone gets to take a year
Speaker 5: off because you're tired. I think about my Nan who
Speaker 5: had she had seven kids. She had a husband who
Speaker 5: was a war veteran and was in a wheelchair, and
Speaker 5: she looked after the kids, and then she went overnight
Speaker 5: and cleaned offices.
Speaker 4: Right, she had to do that.
Speaker 5: If you told that woman that having a hobby and
Speaker 5: getting a good night sleep and work life balance was important,
Speaker 5: she would have spat in your face because that was
Speaker 5: not something that was possible.
Speaker 2: But equally, why are we telling women, and I know
Speaker 2: this is my particular favorite soapbox, that if you have
Speaker 2: a job that fulfills you, you will also do all
Speaker 2: the load at home and you just have to deal
Speaker 2: with it. That isn't actually true. You could actually set
Speaker 2: up a much more equal partnership if you're in whatever
Speaker 2: kind of relationship you're in, if you're in one same
Speaker 2: sex or straight relationship where you're not doing everything, it's
Speaker 2: just like we almost accept that as well. That's the diffault.
Speaker 2: So we're telling girls from the beginning, you'll be set
Speaker 2: up to fail because you'll have to do all the
Speaker 2: work at home, You'll have to do all the work
Speaker 2: at work. You'll burnen yourself out. And I think there
Speaker 2: are other options. I saw a mug I really wanted
Speaker 2: to buy on the Internet the other day that said
Speaker 2: earn your own money, marry someone funny.
Speaker 4: Yes, I like that a lot.
Speaker 3: After the break the Australian reporter who went viral for
Speaker 3: being drunk on air, it turns out there's something we
Speaker 3: all missed in this story. So we all think we
Speaker 3: know what happened last week when Channel nine reporter Danika
Speaker 3: Mason appeared drunk on air in a live cross to
Speaker 3: the Today Show from Milan.
Speaker 1: We've seen the clip. Everyone in the whole world saw
Speaker 1: the clip.
Speaker 3: Even Anthony Albanezi wait in he described himself as pro Danika.
Speaker 3: The general vibe online and around the world seemed to
Speaker 3: be onya. People thought it was funny. She gave a
Speaker 3: very fulsome and gracious apology afterwards. But when I started
Speaker 3: looking into it today, I realized that it's like so
Speaker 3: many Internet stories. You think you know what happened from
Speaker 3: the TikTok that you saw.
Speaker 1: But actually the real story of what happened is so
Speaker 1: much more interesting and it.
Speaker 3: Really sheds light on how internet stories get created.
Speaker 1: Let me explain. Okay, here's what I pitched.
Speaker 3: It happened before she went on air drunk last Wednesday.
Speaker 3: I think that she went out to a pub in Milan,
Speaker 3: or she had a lot of negronies while she was
Speaker 3: having great fun all evening and then all of a sudden,
Speaker 3: remember she had to be on air, was pulled back
Speaker 3: in front of the camera and was drunk. And that's
Speaker 3: very irresponsible, right, because who would do that. Well, what
Speaker 3: I didn't realize is that was her sixth appearance on
Speaker 3: air that evening.
Speaker 2: I thought you were going to say that was her
Speaker 2: sixth LAGRONI oh, it probably was that too.
Speaker 4: That needs a lot of negroments.
Speaker 2: Actually, she had been working.
Speaker 3: She had been working all night in minus six degree temperatures,
Speaker 3: so she had been doing these crosses to morning TV
Speaker 3: in Australia, but it was evening in Milan, and basically
Speaker 3: the first one she's absolutely fine, the second one she's
Speaker 3: absolutely fine. Again, it's very cold out there. She's had
Speaker 3: a very busy day at work. Third appearance starting to
Speaker 3: appear a little looser. Fourth appearance starts to slur her words.
Speaker 1: Oh my fifth.
Speaker 3: Appearance gets worse, and then there's the sixth appearance. And
Speaker 3: by the way, she was going to be on for
Speaker 3: a seventh appearance, it's speculated, but they pulled her from that.
Speaker 2: I think she's been hustling too hard. She needs to
Speaker 2: get into the burn out.
Speaker 3: So let's have a listen to the particular clip which
Speaker 3: went viral, because I'm going to tell you some more
Speaker 3: context about that that's going to change how you think
Speaker 3: about it.
Speaker 1: Like the price of coffee over here is actually fine.
Speaker 1: It's more the price of coffee in the US that
Speaker 1: we are going to have to get used to. I'm
Speaker 1: not sure that the IAS.
Speaker 3: I don't watch morning TV, and I came across this
Speaker 3: exact clip and I thought, oh no, why is she
Speaker 3: talking about the price of coffee in the US.
Speaker 1: Why is she talking about iguanas? And the reason is
Speaker 1: very sensible.
Speaker 3: In her previous five or six appearances on The Today Show,
Speaker 3: Karl Stefanovic had been talking to her about the fact
Speaker 3: that she's soon about to go to Vegas for the
Speaker 3: Annil's Games there, so she was referring back to their
Speaker 3: previous five conversations about her upcoming US trip, and then
Speaker 3: the iguana bit, which I think everyone around the world
Speaker 3: just thought was so surreal and off the wall, is
Speaker 3: because literally throwing to her, Carl compares her to an iguana,
Speaker 3: which by the way, makes no sense. He was by
Speaker 3: all accounts sober, but in his throwing to her on air,
Speaker 3: he compares her to an iguana, and she's live in
Speaker 3: really hot She's naturally very confused by the comparison.
Speaker 1: So it was just a reminder that nothing on the
Speaker 1: internet is as it seems.
Speaker 5: No, And I think as well when she made her apology,
Speaker 5: which I thought was incredibly can I.
Speaker 2: Just say just two sets back, did she say in
Speaker 2: her apology that she had been drinking?
Speaker 1: Yes, wasn't drunk.
Speaker 5: And I think that's part of the good will, is
Speaker 5: that she didn't try and make it like about anything else.
Speaker 4: She went, yeah, I had a drink.
Speaker 3: And Carl tried like when he first when this happened,
Speaker 3: his immediate reaction was to say, oh, it's very hold there.
Speaker 3: And when I was reporting from Washington, DC, my mouth
Speaker 3: didn't move properly because it was too cold. Carl, of course,
Speaker 3: has been drunk on their himself, and it was arguably
Speaker 3: the main him.
Speaker 5: If anyone is going to interview you drunk, you want
Speaker 5: it to be Carl because he's going to try and
Speaker 5: cover for you.
Speaker 4: That was Krlay's best.
Speaker 5: But she said altitude, She said I had a drink,
Speaker 5: on nepty's stomach. I mean throw in sleep deprivation if
Speaker 5: she's doing these night crosses. And I can't imagine the
Speaker 5: kind of hours that she's doing. We all know the
Speaker 5: experience of having one or two drinks and it hits
Speaker 5: you harder because of a myriad of factors. But what
Speaker 5: I have found so interesting about this story is that
Speaker 5: it seems to be the one thing that the Internet
Speaker 5: can agree on, which is like, all power to.
Speaker 2: Isn't that nice? And it's nice for it is a
Speaker 2: surprise because I thought the Internet would be outraged. No
Speaker 2: one is out right, lady at work, it's happening, and
Speaker 2: you can't trust the ladies with the alcohol.
Speaker 5: Everyone's like, oh well, we can't get drunk on television anymore.
Speaker 4: I really like it.
Speaker 2: There are probably some whales as who are like, we
Speaker 2: shouldn't be celebrating the drunk lady. Because what I wondered
Speaker 2: when I first saw it was I wonder what this
Speaker 2: does to your career ongoing, like as in it's good lolls,
Speaker 2: but will she always be known for this? And I
Speaker 2: bet that she is probably beating herself up about that
Speaker 2: a little bit. But also I didn't know who she
Speaker 2: was before this story came out. And now I'm really
Speaker 2: impressed with her because I know she had seven crosses
Speaker 2: too outpointed.
Speaker 5: People who have been watching religiously have said she's a
Speaker 5: brilliant reporter. So I think a lot of the good
Speaker 5: will has come from the fact she's actually really good
Speaker 5: at her job. She's been great at her job for
Speaker 5: this entire period. She had this one moment that she's gone, oh,
Speaker 5: I'm mortified, I'm actually really.
Speaker 3: Bad and that job is so much more demanding than
Speaker 3: I realized. I mean, seven or eight crosses in one evening,
Speaker 3: when I'm sure she does have to wake up very
Speaker 3: early the next morning to cover that. I just had
Speaker 3: no idea that morning TV was that.
Speaker 5: Brutal Can I ask you a question earlier because I
Speaker 5: wondered if this was a uniquely Australian cultural thing that
Speaker 5: was like we kind of loved when Karl was drunk
Speaker 5: on air.
Speaker 2: We do talk about it a lot, we do talk
Speaker 2: fifteen years ago it.
Speaker 1: Was, but arguably it was his making, right, It's.
Speaker 5: Kind of his making because it was like Alarican Australia's
Speaker 5: the authenticity. It's like seeing your friend have a few
Speaker 5: too many at a party or whatever. How would this
Speaker 5: go down in the States. I'm wondering about the cultural difference.
Speaker 5: If this was a US reporter, do you think that
Speaker 5: viewers would be as accepting and gracious or do you
Speaker 5: think they'd be like I.
Speaker 3: Think the reason why everyone in the world forgave her
Speaker 3: is because it does tap into what people, rightly or wrongly,
Speaker 3: for better or for worse, think of Australians, which is.
Speaker 1: That they travel the world, they have.
Speaker 3: A good time doing it, and they let loose and
Speaker 3: that is a national stereotype that has been exported. So
Speaker 3: when people saw that, they were relieved that Australians were
Speaker 3: exactly as they.
Speaker 1: Imagine them to be.
Speaker 2: And they're not wrong.
Speaker 1: They're not wrong.
Speaker 2: Lemonchella, that's what she would have been drinking, right, Milan,
Speaker 2: that would be surely.
Speaker 5: And we've all had We've done live shows or I've
Speaker 5: done live television where no, no, no, where people have
Speaker 5: been offered a drink before and someone's had a beer
Speaker 5: or a wine or whatever, and I've been like, that
Speaker 5: is dangerous.
Speaker 2: Oh Graham Norton show, they always have wine.
Speaker 5: I'm like, I would not put it on my tongue
Speaker 5: because I just know I would forget.
Speaker 2: I was on antibiotics or something.
Speaker 5: And then it would react and then I do something
Speaker 5: really weird.
Speaker 3: Bar soap is dying, and I, for one, I'm not
Speaker 3: happy about it. First of all, I need to know,
Speaker 3: are you a bar soap or a liquid soap user?
Speaker 4: Jesse, I love me a bar soap.
Speaker 1: Oh good, Okay, I do, Polly.
Speaker 2: I have very strong opinions about the divide bar soap
Speaker 2: for shower, hand soap for sink.
Speaker 1: Oh interesting. I want to hear more about that well.
Speaker 3: Over the coming decade, bar soap is projected to become
Speaker 3: near extinct, which.
Speaker 1: I feel very sad about.
Speaker 3: Body wash has come to dominate the personal hygiene market,
Speaker 3: and this is in part because bar soap uses skew
Speaker 3: Old people over fifty five love some bar soap, whereas
Speaker 3: eighteen to thirty four year olds think.
Speaker 1: That it's dirty and which it's not, which it's not.
Speaker 3: I need to play you a grab that I think
Speaker 3: is to blame for why young people think that soap
Speaker 3: is dirty and awful. And it comes from a show
Speaker 3: called Friends. You may have heard of it. And here
Speaker 3: is Joey spreading lies about bar soap to Chandler.
Speaker 7: Why can't we use the same toothbrush, but we can.
Speaker 3: Use the same soap.
Speaker 8: Because soap is soap, it's self cleaning.
Speaker 5: All right, Well, next time you take a shower, think
Speaker 5: about the last thing I wash, and the first thing
Speaker 5: you wash.
Speaker 1: Soap is soap. Chandler is exactly right.
Speaker 3: Some scientists with too much time on their hands put
Speaker 3: some e coli, some actual e coli, on soap to
Speaker 3: see whether it would get contaminated when people used it
Speaker 3: on their hands.
Speaker 1: Guess what, it didn't. Because soap is soap.
Speaker 4: It is self cleaning. It can't grow.
Speaker 1: It's like vaginas and ovens. It's self cleaning.
Speaker 4: Exactly exactly right. Isn't it funny?
Speaker 6: Though?
Speaker 5: Because I kind of agree with Holly. There in the shower.
Speaker 1: A bar of soap.
Speaker 5: That is, because I have a sense that it's the
Speaker 5: most efficient way to get clean. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't use the bar of soap on
Speaker 2: my body. I lather it up in my hands to
Speaker 2: get a really good lather going. And it's such an
Speaker 2: elegant des like it literally disappears when it's finished. Yes,
Speaker 2: be better. But when you're washing your hands, which you
Speaker 2: do more often generally speaking, at the sink was I
Speaker 2: don't want to be always reaching and it always goes
Speaker 2: a bit smaggy on the side of.
Speaker 1: The thing it does make.
Speaker 5: But then I was reading that if you have even
Speaker 5: like your fancy soap with your pump, apparently pump way
Speaker 5: dirtier than yourself cleaning soap because you've got your germs.
Speaker 3: On that don't tell all the people with very sop soapsp.
Speaker 2: Bottle with some gamart soap inside.
Speaker 5: But even like environmentally, the idea that we've all gone
Speaker 5: to these kind of plastic tubs.
Speaker 1: Petro chemicals slash, yes.
Speaker 4: We just except now are in the shower.
Speaker 5: This article that we read about it, which for some
Speaker 5: reason and was ten thousand words.
Speaker 2: I was like, this is the longest dissertation on bar
Speaker 2: so It went into.
Speaker 5: The history of bar soap, and I was like, look,
Speaker 5: I just have a feeling about it.
Speaker 1: I don't need the history. It was in sleeate if
Speaker 1: anyone wants to read it.
Speaker 5: But it was saying even at hotels they don't have
Speaker 5: it anymore.
Speaker 4: A lot of places just have it on the wall.
Speaker 3: Now hotels are apparently building in that kind of bolted
Speaker 3: on soap.
Speaker 1: That makes me feel like I'm in a prison.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and you don't know how it smells to you.
Speaker 1: Pump it?
Speaker 4: No, I like with a I can smell it before
Speaker 4: I run.
Speaker 2: Okay, but here's the obvious, the obvious pushback to soap
Speaker 2: in the shower right now, if you live with someone
Speaker 2: grubby or people who are grubby, it's the hair that
Speaker 2: is the thing that people get upset about. And there
Speaker 2: are people in the world, and I believe that most
Speaker 2: of them possibly called men. I don't want a stereotype
Speaker 2: who might well use the bar on their body, who
Speaker 2: get air or dirt in it, and then it feels icky, right,
Speaker 2: And if you're living with people you're not that intimate
Speaker 2: with to Joey's point, it does feel a bit like
Speaker 2: sharing a toothbrush, even though it isn't.
Speaker 5: That is why the secret is that you need your
Speaker 5: own bar of soap, even though it's not.
Speaker 2: With your name on it.
Speaker 5: Well, we have always used separate soap because I agree
Speaker 5: that the.
Speaker 4: Separate soap like a bar.
Speaker 3: Two separate bar soaps, or are you in a bar
Speaker 3: soap liquid soapole?
Speaker 5: We are in two separate bars. And when we buy it,
Speaker 5: it's like, here's your bar of soap, and this is
Speaker 5: it's not it just isn't covered in hair, so it's
Speaker 5: like mine will sit somewhere different. I know that that's mine,
Speaker 5: but I don't want to pick up like the little
Speaker 5: slither with like just.
Speaker 4: A little round hairs on it.
Speaker 2: That there's that guy like he will open the toothpaste tube.
Speaker 4: Mate, you can afford you.
Speaker 2: I do appreciate the free galley. It never goes astray.
Speaker 8: But things aren't actually that bad, and so I'm often
Speaker 8: going into the bathroom the tastes they got everywhere. The
Speaker 8: kids are like, why does that do that?
Speaker 2: I believe that is all we have time for on
Speaker 2: this Monday's when we are out loud on the number
Speaker 2: one podcast in the nation.
Speaker 1: Do you think.
Speaker 3: Hamish is a sparal liquid so so true?
Speaker 1: I mean he's always in his house, so they've got
Speaker 1: the fancy it's.
Speaker 2: Nice bar soap. It smells great, right.
Speaker 4: I think you can get like designer bars a state.
Speaker 3: Do you know that brand fancy? It's Australian and California.
Speaker 3: It's very fancy. And I went to his estate for
Speaker 3: a story and he started his very fancy brand making
Speaker 3: the most beautiful bar soaps from just herbs he'd gathered
Speaker 3: in the garden.
Speaker 5: That should be Maybe our treat for being number one
Speaker 5: now is that maybe we don't need the home brand generic.
Speaker 5: Maybe we should buy ourselves and really fancy bodies.
Speaker 1: What about like a branded Muma. You're out loud soap?
Speaker 2: Oh yes, bring it on, Haron.
Speaker 4: That can be my maternity leave project. Yes, yes, yes,
Speaker 4: I like that.
Speaker 1: You needed a project.
Speaker 2: We can call it don't want to get bored. We
Speaker 2: can call it number one. So anyway, thank you out
Speaker 2: louders for being here with us this Monday, and thank
Speaker 2: you to our amazing team for helping us put the
Speaker 2: show together. As you've heard from me and She and
Speaker 2: Amelia will be back in your ears tomorrow with a
Speaker 2: very special subscriber episode. Jesse and I, we'll see you
Speaker 2: on Wednesday.
Speaker 1: Bye bye.
Speaker 5: Mamma Mayer acknowledges the traditional owners of the land on
Speaker 5: which we have recorded this podcast.