1 00:00:10,888 --> 00:00:15,408 Speaker 1: You're listening to Amma Mer podcast Muma Me your acknowledges 2 00:00:15,448 --> 00:00:18,608 Speaker 1: the traditional owners of the land and waters. This podcast 3 00:00:18,688 --> 00:00:28,568 Speaker 1: is recorded on matchmaking. We've all attempted it, and we've 4 00:00:28,608 --> 00:00:31,488 Speaker 1: probably all been set up before. But when you enlist 5 00:00:31,488 --> 00:00:34,888 Speaker 1: the help of professionals, they just might deliver exactly what 6 00:00:34,968 --> 00:00:37,408 Speaker 1: you've been looking for. At least that's what happened for 7 00:00:37,488 --> 00:00:38,248 Speaker 1: Live and Ali. 8 00:00:38,928 --> 00:00:42,568 Speaker 2: I was kind of hooked from the first date. I 9 00:00:42,648 --> 00:00:46,087 Speaker 2: felt really safe with him, I felt really excited by 10 00:00:46,128 --> 00:00:49,728 Speaker 2: him and the prospect of dating him, and yeah, from 11 00:00:49,728 --> 00:00:52,368 Speaker 2: that night, I didn't really want to meet anyone else. 12 00:00:52,528 --> 00:00:54,008 Speaker 2: I was quite satisfied. 13 00:00:54,888 --> 00:00:58,008 Speaker 1: But dear listener, matchmaking is a game of two halves. 14 00:00:58,328 --> 00:01:01,248 Speaker 1: How you look on paper is only surface level, and 15 00:01:01,288 --> 00:01:04,968 Speaker 1: when you scratch that surface, surprises can await. Some are good, 16 00:01:05,128 --> 00:01:08,288 Speaker 1: some are indifferent, Some you could never see coming. 17 00:01:08,527 --> 00:01:10,968 Speaker 2: My stomach fell through the four or. I can't describe 18 00:01:10,968 --> 00:01:13,648 Speaker 2: the feeling because it was the only time I can 19 00:01:13,688 --> 00:01:17,167 Speaker 2: remember where a piece of information had really thrown me 20 00:01:17,248 --> 00:01:21,768 Speaker 2: for sex, like rug pulled under the feet type of moment. Yeah, 21 00:01:21,808 --> 00:01:27,888 Speaker 2: the shock was immediate, and I asked him to clarify that, 22 00:01:28,768 --> 00:01:33,248 Speaker 2: and I said, who hang on we're dating. I'm not Muslim, 23 00:01:33,888 --> 00:01:36,768 Speaker 2: I'm not Egyptian, so what are we doing? 24 00:01:46,448 --> 00:01:48,928 Speaker 1: I'm Georgia love and this is everyone has an ex 25 00:01:49,208 --> 00:01:51,408 Speaker 1: Come with me as we dive into a collection of 26 00:01:51,568 --> 00:01:55,888 Speaker 1: unconventional stories about relationships past through the eyes and the 27 00:01:55,928 --> 00:01:59,448 Speaker 1: hearts of the very people who lived them. Leif thought 28 00:01:59,448 --> 00:02:01,888 Speaker 1: she had life all figured out at twenty seven. She 29 00:02:01,928 --> 00:02:04,368 Speaker 1: had a fulfilling career, had just bought her own home, 30 00:02:04,608 --> 00:02:08,407 Speaker 1: and was relishing her newfound freedom. Despite her many successes, 31 00:02:08,448 --> 00:02:11,648 Speaker 1: though she couldn't shake the feeling that something was still missing. 32 00:02:12,007 --> 00:02:18,088 Speaker 2: I'd been single for about two years, and during that 33 00:02:18,168 --> 00:02:23,328 Speaker 2: two years was just a string of different guys. So 34 00:02:23,728 --> 00:02:27,768 Speaker 2: I downloaded every single app you could possibly think of. 35 00:02:28,048 --> 00:02:31,168 Speaker 2: I had Tinder, I had Hinge, I had Bumble. I 36 00:02:31,288 --> 00:02:35,008 Speaker 2: had all of them, and to be fair, I had 37 00:02:35,088 --> 00:02:39,248 Speaker 2: met a few really fun people, but nothing really turned 38 00:02:39,368 --> 00:02:43,488 Speaker 2: into anything substantial. And I had thought in my mind 39 00:02:43,648 --> 00:02:46,568 Speaker 2: that when I moved out of home, okay, i'll find 40 00:02:46,608 --> 00:02:48,968 Speaker 2: my own place, I'll meet someone that'll be the love 41 00:02:49,008 --> 00:02:52,648 Speaker 2: of my life, and I'll settle down. It wasn't to be. 42 00:02:53,488 --> 00:03:00,568 Speaker 2: So dating on the apps is like a full time job. 43 00:03:01,368 --> 00:03:04,768 Speaker 2: It takes up all of your time. When I first 44 00:03:04,848 --> 00:03:08,568 Speaker 2: started on the apps, I really didn't know what to 45 00:03:08,768 --> 00:03:14,048 Speaker 2: put in my profile. I obviously had a photo shoot 46 00:03:14,407 --> 00:03:19,248 Speaker 2: with all of my friends. I decided on the prettiest photos, 47 00:03:19,848 --> 00:03:22,528 Speaker 2: but it was so weird to try and think of 48 00:03:22,648 --> 00:03:26,448 Speaker 2: things that promoted me. It's not my personality to be 49 00:03:26,888 --> 00:03:31,608 Speaker 2: self promoting at all. So I projected an image of 50 00:03:31,688 --> 00:03:35,688 Speaker 2: myself that I don't think was truly me and attracted 51 00:03:36,728 --> 00:03:38,728 Speaker 2: a whole bunch of people who I don't think were 52 00:03:38,768 --> 00:03:44,608 Speaker 2: particularly great. Definitely a massive learning experience, but it was 53 00:03:45,248 --> 00:03:48,008 Speaker 2: most of my weekends, a few nights a week where 54 00:03:48,048 --> 00:03:52,008 Speaker 2: I was going and meeting people, and at the end 55 00:03:52,088 --> 00:03:58,008 Speaker 2: of it all, I just felt really empty. Dating is 56 00:03:58,128 --> 00:04:01,728 Speaker 2: always very surface level, and I felt like I was 57 00:04:01,768 --> 00:04:05,768 Speaker 2: having the same conversations over and over again and meeting 58 00:04:05,808 --> 00:04:10,328 Speaker 2: the same sort of people and even swipe in past 59 00:04:10,368 --> 00:04:15,488 Speaker 2: people that I dated already. And I thought, something's got 60 00:04:15,568 --> 00:04:20,448 Speaker 2: to give. I really want to have a relationship, a 61 00:04:20,488 --> 00:04:27,247 Speaker 2: serious relationship, potentially marriage, definitely children, And I decided, Okay, 62 00:04:27,368 --> 00:04:32,128 Speaker 2: I've got to take things seriously now. And I decided 63 00:04:32,168 --> 00:04:35,167 Speaker 2: to see whether matchmaking was a thing, and sure enough 64 00:04:35,168 --> 00:04:39,487 Speaker 2: it was. I found a matchmaking agency in the city 65 00:04:39,528 --> 00:04:42,728 Speaker 2: that I live in and decided to give it a go. 66 00:04:43,808 --> 00:04:47,448 Speaker 2: I applied to go and be part of the agency 67 00:04:48,048 --> 00:04:50,807 Speaker 2: and they called me in for a what they called 68 00:04:50,808 --> 00:04:54,128 Speaker 2: a meeting, which really was an interview. Part of their 69 00:04:54,168 --> 00:04:58,568 Speaker 2: service was to design your profile for you, so they 70 00:04:58,607 --> 00:05:03,008 Speaker 2: had a really long questionnaire and I had an agent 71 00:05:03,327 --> 00:05:06,808 Speaker 2: who would work on my behalf. So I spent about 72 00:05:06,808 --> 00:05:10,128 Speaker 2: an hour with her creating my profile and it was very, 73 00:05:10,248 --> 00:05:13,848 Speaker 2: very detailed. It was all about my hopes and dreams 74 00:05:13,847 --> 00:05:18,887 Speaker 2: for the future, my hobbies, my values, a bit about 75 00:05:18,928 --> 00:05:23,008 Speaker 2: my family and who was in my life, my financial situation, 76 00:05:23,327 --> 00:05:29,328 Speaker 2: my career. It was very thorough and yeah, after an hour, 77 00:05:29,648 --> 00:05:34,448 Speaker 2: she took pictures of me and said, I've got some 78 00:05:34,528 --> 00:05:36,488 Speaker 2: people on the book, so I think would be very 79 00:05:36,488 --> 00:05:42,528 Speaker 2: interested in meeting you. And that was so exciting. Another 80 00:05:42,568 --> 00:05:46,088 Speaker 2: part of the interview was about what I was looking for, 81 00:05:47,248 --> 00:05:51,408 Speaker 2: so again a very long questionnaire. What's your age range, 82 00:05:51,847 --> 00:05:56,448 Speaker 2: what physical features are you attracted to, what jobs would 83 00:05:56,488 --> 00:06:00,408 Speaker 2: you lack your potential partner to have, what future goals 84 00:06:00,648 --> 00:06:03,568 Speaker 2: for your partner are really important to you. It was 85 00:06:03,727 --> 00:06:08,808 Speaker 2: really really detailed, and it felt like I could design 86 00:06:09,168 --> 00:06:13,647 Speaker 2: my dream man and that was really fun. It was 87 00:06:13,688 --> 00:06:18,128 Speaker 2: a really fun experience, and I felt really trusting of 88 00:06:18,288 --> 00:06:21,608 Speaker 2: the agent that I was working with. She promised to 89 00:06:21,648 --> 00:06:25,527 Speaker 2: find me somebody who would match my criteria. Sure enough, 90 00:06:25,607 --> 00:06:30,168 Speaker 2: like the next day, they sent me Ali's profile and 91 00:06:30,648 --> 00:06:33,168 Speaker 2: said that he had seen mine and was really interested 92 00:06:33,207 --> 00:06:38,248 Speaker 2: in meeting. And on his profile it said everything that 93 00:06:38,368 --> 00:06:42,168 Speaker 2: I had said. He was looking for a life partner, 94 00:06:42,528 --> 00:06:47,647 Speaker 2: was looking for a serious relationship. Yeah, so I thought, Okay, 95 00:06:47,688 --> 00:06:48,967 Speaker 2: great beginner's luck. 96 00:06:49,248 --> 00:06:51,888 Speaker 1: The dating agency was coming through with the goods. And 97 00:06:51,928 --> 00:06:55,407 Speaker 1: when Live received the profile of Ali, an Egyptian diplomat, 98 00:06:55,607 --> 00:06:57,488 Speaker 1: it's fair to say she liked what she saw. 99 00:06:57,768 --> 00:06:59,967 Speaker 2: I remember sitting there and reading it and feeling really 100 00:07:00,008 --> 00:07:04,728 Speaker 2: really excited. It said you know, his age, his background, 101 00:07:05,087 --> 00:07:07,608 Speaker 2: and it said what he did for a job, and 102 00:07:07,928 --> 00:07:12,088 Speaker 2: the job was diplomat, and I felt really excited by that. 103 00:07:12,488 --> 00:07:15,608 Speaker 2: I thought, whoa a diplomat? It was imagining like James 104 00:07:15,648 --> 00:07:19,448 Speaker 2: Bond's Buys in my mind, the concept of dating a 105 00:07:19,488 --> 00:07:23,848 Speaker 2: diplomat was really fun to me. And immediately in my 106 00:07:23,968 --> 00:07:27,047 Speaker 2: mind I went to, Wow, that's traveling the world. That's 107 00:07:27,528 --> 00:07:30,448 Speaker 2: a really important job. This person's going to be so interesting. 108 00:07:31,088 --> 00:07:34,128 Speaker 2: It had his interests on the profile too, so we 109 00:07:34,208 --> 00:07:36,608 Speaker 2: had very similar ideas of what we love to do. 110 00:07:37,128 --> 00:07:40,088 Speaker 2: So he said that he loved bushwalking and hiking and 111 00:07:40,128 --> 00:07:42,968 Speaker 2: going out for dinners and I thought, okay, well that 112 00:07:43,088 --> 00:07:45,408 Speaker 2: sounds good. That sounds nice things I like to do 113 00:07:45,448 --> 00:07:47,727 Speaker 2: as well. And it also had his phone number at 114 00:07:47,727 --> 00:07:52,368 Speaker 2: the bottom of the profile. So the matchmaker really encouraged 115 00:07:52,448 --> 00:07:55,808 Speaker 2: people to have a phone call before they meet. So 116 00:07:56,088 --> 00:07:59,448 Speaker 2: I decided to call him. So I rang him and 117 00:08:00,008 --> 00:08:03,688 Speaker 2: he sounded beautiful on the phone. He was very friendly, 118 00:08:04,288 --> 00:08:08,088 Speaker 2: he had a really gorgeous voice, and he asked me 119 00:08:08,168 --> 00:08:10,728 Speaker 2: at the end of that conversation where we talked about 120 00:08:10,727 --> 00:08:14,648 Speaker 2: our family and our interests and typical things you would do, 121 00:08:15,328 --> 00:08:16,648 Speaker 2: he asked me at the end of that if he 122 00:08:16,648 --> 00:08:19,248 Speaker 2: could take me out for dinner. I said, certainly, let's go. 123 00:08:20,008 --> 00:08:23,688 Speaker 2: So that weekend we met each other for dinner at 124 00:08:23,688 --> 00:08:27,768 Speaker 2: a seafood restaurant and I looked beautiful. I made myself 125 00:08:27,808 --> 00:08:30,568 Speaker 2: look gorgeous, a full face of makeup, which is very 126 00:08:30,648 --> 00:08:34,048 Speaker 2: unusual for me, and I can remember walking around the 127 00:08:34,088 --> 00:08:38,248 Speaker 2: corner to the restaurant and seeing him sitting there and 128 00:08:38,288 --> 00:08:40,528 Speaker 2: I sort of stopped on my tracks because he looked 129 00:08:40,727 --> 00:08:44,408 Speaker 2: very similar to one of my ex boyfriends. I thought, look, 130 00:08:44,728 --> 00:08:47,288 Speaker 2: I'm going to push through and give this person a chance, 131 00:08:47,768 --> 00:08:50,088 Speaker 2: try and look past the exterior and get to know 132 00:08:50,168 --> 00:08:54,608 Speaker 2: them as a person. So sat down opposite him, and 133 00:08:55,568 --> 00:08:59,488 Speaker 2: his eyes just went very wide. He was stunned, I think, 134 00:08:59,728 --> 00:09:04,487 Speaker 2: and he said, wow, you look so beautiful, and I 135 00:09:04,528 --> 00:09:09,928 Speaker 2: remember feeling just seen by him and really flattered, which 136 00:09:09,928 --> 00:09:13,568 Speaker 2: is a really nice feeling on a first date. I 137 00:09:13,728 --> 00:09:18,568 Speaker 2: felt when I met him a real intellectual connection, and 138 00:09:18,688 --> 00:09:23,408 Speaker 2: for me, that's an immediate yes, because I need to 139 00:09:23,448 --> 00:09:28,408 Speaker 2: be connecting with someone through my mind first. And although 140 00:09:28,448 --> 00:09:32,768 Speaker 2: there wasn't necessarily the physical connection, I felt very attracted 141 00:09:32,848 --> 00:09:36,608 Speaker 2: to his mind and to his conversation and to the 142 00:09:36,608 --> 00:09:39,088 Speaker 2: way that he saw the world. And I was very 143 00:09:39,088 --> 00:09:41,408 Speaker 2: attracted to the way that he was different to me. 144 00:09:42,128 --> 00:09:46,247 Speaker 2: I was very curious about his life and his beliefs 145 00:09:46,448 --> 00:09:49,408 Speaker 2: and the way that he grew up. I think that 146 00:09:49,488 --> 00:09:52,128 Speaker 2: was the biggest draw card for me, is that curiosity 147 00:09:52,568 --> 00:09:55,968 Speaker 2: and wanting to know more about him and about his culture. 148 00:09:56,808 --> 00:10:01,928 Speaker 2: He was a diplomat, which was really really interesting to me. Obviously, 149 00:10:02,048 --> 00:10:04,848 Speaker 2: someone whose work takes them around the world was something 150 00:10:04,848 --> 00:10:07,528 Speaker 2: that really appealed to me, and I'd put on my 151 00:10:07,648 --> 00:10:10,448 Speaker 2: profile that I really wanted someone who travels. I was 152 00:10:10,648 --> 00:10:12,888 Speaker 2: very adventurous at the time and was hoping to work 153 00:10:12,928 --> 00:10:15,648 Speaker 2: overseas myself, and I thought, okay, great, if I could 154 00:10:15,688 --> 00:10:18,208 Speaker 2: get to know this person, then if it all turns 155 00:10:18,208 --> 00:10:20,088 Speaker 2: out well, then maybe I'll get to go with him 156 00:10:20,368 --> 00:10:23,168 Speaker 2: as he works around the world. So we were able 157 00:10:23,208 --> 00:10:25,808 Speaker 2: to talk a lot about that and where we hoped 158 00:10:25,808 --> 00:10:28,368 Speaker 2: to go and where we had been, and yeah, I 159 00:10:28,488 --> 00:10:32,448 Speaker 2: was kind of hooked. From the first date. I felt 160 00:10:32,488 --> 00:10:35,848 Speaker 2: really safe with him, I felt really excited by him 161 00:10:35,888 --> 00:10:39,528 Speaker 2: and the prospect of dating him, and yeah, from that night, 162 00:10:39,568 --> 00:10:42,208 Speaker 2: I didn't really want to meet anyone else. I was 163 00:10:42,368 --> 00:10:43,368 Speaker 2: quite satisfied. 164 00:10:44,048 --> 00:10:48,048 Speaker 1: Naturally, the matchmaker was pretty curious about her handiwork was 165 00:10:48,088 --> 00:10:50,368 Speaker 1: more than happy to give credit where it was due. 166 00:10:50,448 --> 00:10:53,688 Speaker 2: She called me after our first date. That was part 167 00:10:53,728 --> 00:10:56,408 Speaker 2: of the service was that the agent would call and 168 00:10:56,528 --> 00:11:00,768 Speaker 2: check in and see whether their match had been a 169 00:11:00,768 --> 00:11:04,488 Speaker 2: good one. And she called and said, well, yep, I 170 00:11:04,528 --> 00:11:07,648 Speaker 2: thought of Ali the minute that we finished your profile, 171 00:11:07,968 --> 00:11:10,048 Speaker 2: and I said, well, you've done an amazing job. We 172 00:11:10,048 --> 00:11:12,728 Speaker 2: have a lot in common and you can stop looking 173 00:11:12,768 --> 00:11:16,288 Speaker 2: because I'm happy to keep seeing him. So in my mind, 174 00:11:16,448 --> 00:11:21,008 Speaker 2: after that first date, I felt really calm and really 175 00:11:21,048 --> 00:11:25,688 Speaker 2: relieved because I had been through a year of crazy dating, 176 00:11:25,808 --> 00:11:29,568 Speaker 2: crazy appdating, and had decided to take this quite serious 177 00:11:29,608 --> 00:11:34,487 Speaker 2: step and invest fair bit of money into using a matchmaker, 178 00:11:34,888 --> 00:11:37,768 Speaker 2: and in my mind it had worked perfectly. I spent 179 00:11:37,808 --> 00:11:43,728 Speaker 2: three thousand dollars on the matchmaking service, which goes to 180 00:11:43,848 --> 00:11:47,488 Speaker 2: show how serious I was about finding a life partner. 181 00:11:48,768 --> 00:11:51,648 Speaker 2: In my mind, it also reassured me that other people 182 00:11:51,688 --> 00:11:54,448 Speaker 2: who were using the service and spending that amount of 183 00:11:54,488 --> 00:11:58,248 Speaker 2: money were also serious about finding their life partner. So 184 00:11:59,168 --> 00:12:02,568 Speaker 2: I felt that it was a really reasonable amount of 185 00:12:02,608 --> 00:12:07,928 Speaker 2: money to fulfill this big desire to have that type 186 00:12:07,968 --> 00:12:12,008 Speaker 2: of relationship. So to me, that was a really big 187 00:12:12,048 --> 00:12:14,368 Speaker 2: win for the matchmaking agency because I thought, oh, you 188 00:12:14,408 --> 00:12:16,328 Speaker 2: guys are great. You've sent me this person on the 189 00:12:16,408 --> 00:12:19,208 Speaker 2: very first go so from then on we really hit 190 00:12:19,248 --> 00:12:22,848 Speaker 2: it off. We went on a few more dates and 191 00:12:22,928 --> 00:12:27,048 Speaker 2: then it was the second Sydney lockdown in COVID and 192 00:12:27,168 --> 00:12:30,008 Speaker 2: at the time I was living on my own with 193 00:12:30,088 --> 00:12:34,608 Speaker 2: my little cat, and he also lived alone, obviously because 194 00:12:34,648 --> 00:12:38,408 Speaker 2: he was away from his family. He was from Egypt, 195 00:12:38,568 --> 00:12:42,248 Speaker 2: so all of his family were overseas so we became 196 00:12:42,528 --> 00:12:47,128 Speaker 2: our contact bubble because at the time, my family that 197 00:12:47,168 --> 00:12:49,928 Speaker 2: were living in Sydney were in a different local government area, 198 00:12:50,168 --> 00:12:52,928 Speaker 2: so I couldn't even see my people. I couldn't see 199 00:12:52,928 --> 00:12:54,688 Speaker 2: my sister, I couldn't see any of my friends, I 200 00:12:54,688 --> 00:12:57,648 Speaker 2: couldn't see my parents, any of my normal people that 201 00:12:57,648 --> 00:13:01,248 Speaker 2: I would find comfort from. And yet the government was 202 00:13:01,248 --> 00:13:03,688 Speaker 2: saying you can be with your intimate partner or my 203 00:13:03,728 --> 00:13:06,928 Speaker 2: intimate partner i'd met like the month before, so we 204 00:13:07,008 --> 00:13:09,688 Speaker 2: had to make that work and support each other through lockdown. 205 00:13:09,888 --> 00:13:12,768 Speaker 2: So we became very very close, very quickly. Because of 206 00:13:12,808 --> 00:13:17,727 Speaker 2: those circumstances. We ended up spending a few days at 207 00:13:17,728 --> 00:13:21,968 Speaker 2: each other's houses each week, and it was a real 208 00:13:22,048 --> 00:13:24,008 Speaker 2: comfort to know that I had him to rely on. 209 00:13:24,088 --> 00:13:27,888 Speaker 2: I can remember his apartment was right in the CBD, 210 00:13:28,368 --> 00:13:31,528 Speaker 2: so I was quite impressed by his apartment. It had 211 00:13:31,648 --> 00:13:33,808 Speaker 2: views of the Opera House, so we could sit and 212 00:13:33,888 --> 00:13:36,648 Speaker 2: just look at the Opera House and the Harbor Bridge, 213 00:13:36,728 --> 00:13:40,328 Speaker 2: and I was definitely like dazzled by his job and 214 00:13:40,368 --> 00:13:42,888 Speaker 2: what he earned and the lifestyle that he could afford, 215 00:13:43,368 --> 00:13:45,888 Speaker 2: and that was really exciting to me. But during lockdown, 216 00:13:45,928 --> 00:13:49,208 Speaker 2: I can remember the city being absolutely empty, and we 217 00:13:49,208 --> 00:13:53,088 Speaker 2: would just go on these long walks every weekend along 218 00:13:53,208 --> 00:13:56,168 Speaker 2: the waterfront and through the park and just talk and 219 00:13:56,208 --> 00:13:58,928 Speaker 2: get to know each other more and grab a coffee 220 00:13:59,048 --> 00:14:01,448 Speaker 2: and then just sit in his apartment looking at the 221 00:14:01,448 --> 00:14:05,648 Speaker 2: beautiful view and relaxing and reading and watching TV. It 222 00:14:05,728 --> 00:14:09,648 Speaker 2: was a very different start and progression of a relationship 223 00:14:09,648 --> 00:14:12,608 Speaker 2: that I'd ever experienced before, just because of the circumstances. 224 00:14:12,648 --> 00:14:15,128 Speaker 2: So we had to find a lot of really low 225 00:14:15,208 --> 00:14:18,128 Speaker 2: key ways to get to know each other, which usually 226 00:14:18,168 --> 00:14:20,848 Speaker 2: just meant a lot of time spent on the couch, 227 00:14:21,288 --> 00:14:26,088 Speaker 2: binging shit's creek and enjoying each other's company. Covid put 228 00:14:26,208 --> 00:14:31,968 Speaker 2: us straight into the settling down home body stage, and 229 00:14:32,248 --> 00:14:34,848 Speaker 2: that meant that we did a lot of baking and 230 00:14:34,928 --> 00:14:39,048 Speaker 2: cooking and reading on the couch and walking to go 231 00:14:39,088 --> 00:14:44,768 Speaker 2: and get a coffee, binge watching shows. And to be honest, 232 00:14:44,928 --> 00:14:48,888 Speaker 2: I couldn't imagine anything better at that time, because that's 233 00:14:48,928 --> 00:14:51,288 Speaker 2: the type of relationship I had been missing, was the 234 00:14:51,328 --> 00:14:53,488 Speaker 2: type where you could just do the simple things at 235 00:14:53,488 --> 00:14:57,448 Speaker 2: home and have a quiet life and have a cup 236 00:14:57,488 --> 00:14:59,328 Speaker 2: of tea on the couch. Those were the types of 237 00:14:59,368 --> 00:15:02,168 Speaker 2: things that I was really craving at the time, so 238 00:15:02,928 --> 00:15:05,848 Speaker 2: even though we were still in that honeymoon phase of 239 00:15:05,888 --> 00:15:10,768 Speaker 2: our relationship, it thrust us into that quite serious, settled 240 00:15:10,808 --> 00:15:14,128 Speaker 2: down type of relationship really quickly. But I was really 241 00:15:14,168 --> 00:15:18,248 Speaker 2: loving it because I felt very calm and I felt 242 00:15:18,288 --> 00:15:21,688 Speaker 2: like we were just living our regular life together, and 243 00:15:22,328 --> 00:15:25,728 Speaker 2: whether it was hanging out at his apartment or hanging 244 00:15:25,768 --> 00:15:30,608 Speaker 2: out at mine, the simplicity of it was actually really enjoyable. 245 00:15:31,008 --> 00:15:32,928 Speaker 2: I didn't feel like I wanted to go on big, 246 00:15:32,968 --> 00:15:36,848 Speaker 2: fancy dates or do anything exciting, and we couldn't because 247 00:15:36,888 --> 00:15:39,888 Speaker 2: of lockdown, but it was a really nice space to 248 00:15:39,888 --> 00:15:40,128 Speaker 2: be in. 249 00:15:41,208 --> 00:15:44,808 Speaker 1: Apart from this pesky pandemic, things were going great. There 250 00:15:44,888 --> 00:15:47,968 Speaker 1: was talk about the future, traveling the world, even talks 251 00:15:47,968 --> 00:15:50,688 Speaker 1: of marriage. So for leave, the obvious next step was 252 00:15:50,728 --> 00:15:53,528 Speaker 1: for Ali to meet her friends and family virtually. 253 00:15:53,608 --> 00:15:56,728 Speaker 2: Of course, I really did like him, and even to 254 00:15:56,768 --> 00:15:59,688 Speaker 2: the point where my parents were living overseas at the 255 00:15:59,688 --> 00:16:03,568 Speaker 2: time and I introduced him to them on video chart 256 00:16:04,408 --> 00:16:08,528 Speaker 2: My family friends would put on these online trivia nights 257 00:16:08,688 --> 00:16:12,568 Speaker 2: and he would join in, and my friends and family 258 00:16:12,688 --> 00:16:15,848 Speaker 2: really tried to make an effort to include him, and 259 00:16:15,888 --> 00:16:17,848 Speaker 2: I really liked that because I could see that they 260 00:16:18,008 --> 00:16:21,928 Speaker 2: liked him, so, for instance, in the trivia nights, they 261 00:16:21,968 --> 00:16:24,568 Speaker 2: would try and put a question about Egypt in there 262 00:16:24,648 --> 00:16:27,408 Speaker 2: so he could have a point, you know. So everyone 263 00:16:27,448 --> 00:16:30,648 Speaker 2: around me really made him feel really welcome because he 264 00:16:30,848 --> 00:16:32,968 Speaker 2: was a visitor in our country and didn't have his 265 00:16:32,968 --> 00:16:37,968 Speaker 2: family around. So our relationship and our people, at least 266 00:16:38,048 --> 00:16:40,568 Speaker 2: from my side, really were starting to get to know 267 00:16:40,688 --> 00:16:44,088 Speaker 2: us as a couple. And yeah, I felt like it 268 00:16:44,168 --> 00:16:47,248 Speaker 2: was moving in that direction, that we were moving into 269 00:16:47,248 --> 00:16:50,608 Speaker 2: something very serious and that was going to grow. My 270 00:16:50,728 --> 00:16:54,888 Speaker 2: family thought he was a great match for me. I 271 00:16:54,928 --> 00:16:57,808 Speaker 2: felt like I was falling in love very fast. I 272 00:16:57,848 --> 00:17:02,808 Speaker 2: really did, because it was exactly what I've been craving. 273 00:17:03,048 --> 00:17:06,767 Speaker 2: It was waking up with him, spending all day together. 274 00:17:07,328 --> 00:17:10,807 Speaker 2: It was making each other cups of tea. It was 275 00:17:11,128 --> 00:17:15,167 Speaker 2: going to get groceries. It was cooking together, it was 276 00:17:15,208 --> 00:17:18,608 Speaker 2: watching TV together. It was all of the very simple 277 00:17:18,648 --> 00:17:25,128 Speaker 2: things that make relationships intimate. And I felt that I 278 00:17:25,248 --> 00:17:28,728 Speaker 2: was really growing really close to him because of the 279 00:17:28,768 --> 00:17:33,808 Speaker 2: circumstances that we were in. So even though we had 280 00:17:33,808 --> 00:17:36,407 Speaker 2: only known each other a couple of months, I felt 281 00:17:37,288 --> 00:17:42,128 Speaker 2: very very strongly for him very quickly. He became pretty 282 00:17:42,208 --> 00:17:47,168 Speaker 2: much everything my support person the person I could laugh with, 283 00:17:47,368 --> 00:17:51,088 Speaker 2: the person I could tell my day to, the person 284 00:17:51,608 --> 00:17:54,648 Speaker 2: who I would work from home with on opposite ends 285 00:17:54,728 --> 00:17:58,328 Speaker 2: of the dining table. Yeah, he became the first person 286 00:17:58,368 --> 00:17:59,808 Speaker 2: I saw in the morning in the last person I 287 00:17:59,848 --> 00:18:04,008 Speaker 2: saw at night. And not only had I not experienced 288 00:18:04,008 --> 00:18:09,288 Speaker 2: that before in any other relationship, but he replaced everyone 289 00:18:09,288 --> 00:18:12,248 Speaker 2: else that I could otherwise have relied upon in that time. 290 00:18:12,688 --> 00:18:17,888 Speaker 2: So I was enjoying that. I really enjoyed having him around. 291 00:18:18,368 --> 00:18:21,768 Speaker 1: So three months after that first date, live had officially 292 00:18:21,928 --> 00:18:22,808 Speaker 1: caught the fields. 293 00:18:25,888 --> 00:18:30,968 Speaker 2: We'd been spending practically every waking moment together in lockdown, 294 00:18:31,088 --> 00:18:35,407 Speaker 2: doing those normal daily things at home, and I just 295 00:18:35,688 --> 00:18:39,487 Speaker 2: felt like he was my person. I really did. He 296 00:18:40,488 --> 00:18:44,488 Speaker 2: was everything to me. He was the only person I 297 00:18:44,528 --> 00:18:46,728 Speaker 2: could be around. He was the only person that I 298 00:18:46,728 --> 00:18:50,808 Speaker 2: could talk to in person. He knew everything that was 299 00:18:50,848 --> 00:18:52,768 Speaker 2: going on in my life because he was there with 300 00:18:52,808 --> 00:18:56,488 Speaker 2: me living it, and I felt like I had fallen 301 00:18:56,528 --> 00:19:00,408 Speaker 2: in love with him, and I wanted to tell him. 302 00:19:00,928 --> 00:19:04,728 Speaker 2: I did feel really nervous to tell him, And the 303 00:19:04,768 --> 00:19:07,288 Speaker 2: moment that I decided to do it was when I 304 00:19:07,368 --> 00:19:09,648 Speaker 2: first woke up in the morning and I rolled over 305 00:19:10,008 --> 00:19:13,687 Speaker 2: and I nudged him awake and with my eyeshut. I 306 00:19:13,848 --> 00:19:17,368 Speaker 2: just said I think I'm in love with you, and 307 00:19:18,048 --> 00:19:26,048 Speaker 2: he said, oh, thank you and hugged me. And internally 308 00:19:26,088 --> 00:19:29,688 Speaker 2: I was dying a little inside because he didn't say 309 00:19:29,688 --> 00:19:30,128 Speaker 2: it back. 310 00:19:30,488 --> 00:19:33,728 Speaker 1: This was not the response live and hoped for or expected, 311 00:19:34,128 --> 00:19:36,207 Speaker 1: but they were happy. She figured he would say it 312 00:19:36,208 --> 00:19:38,968 Speaker 1: back in his own time. Surely, after all, they came 313 00:19:39,008 --> 00:19:41,888 Speaker 1: from very different backgrounds, so maybe that was a factor. 314 00:19:42,248 --> 00:19:46,248 Speaker 2: From day one, I knew that he was Muslim. Egypt 315 00:19:46,328 --> 00:19:50,208 Speaker 2: is a Muslim country, but in fact, on his profile 316 00:19:50,248 --> 00:19:53,167 Speaker 2: for the matchmaker, he'd put that he was non religious, 317 00:19:53,968 --> 00:19:59,248 Speaker 2: so I had taken that as being spiritual or agnostic 318 00:19:59,488 --> 00:20:02,447 Speaker 2: or not really having a faith. And I think the 319 00:20:02,568 --> 00:20:07,167 Speaker 2: mis understanding there was that being an Egyptian person, you 320 00:20:07,248 --> 00:20:09,968 Speaker 2: are Muslim by nature. It's the way that you grow up, 321 00:20:10,008 --> 00:20:13,768 Speaker 2: it's the way the culture is. And I think he 322 00:20:13,848 --> 00:20:16,728 Speaker 2: felt that because he didn't go to mosque or he 323 00:20:16,768 --> 00:20:20,167 Speaker 2: didn't pray five times a day, that he was non religious. 324 00:20:20,648 --> 00:20:25,687 Speaker 2: That certainly his understanding of the world and particularly the 325 00:20:25,728 --> 00:20:28,808 Speaker 2: way that he did his job, was very associated with 326 00:20:29,248 --> 00:20:32,808 Speaker 2: Islam and how he understood the world and saw the world. 327 00:20:33,248 --> 00:20:37,368 Speaker 2: So I knew from the get go, but understanding how 328 00:20:37,448 --> 00:20:41,528 Speaker 2: important it was to him came along the way. That's 329 00:20:41,728 --> 00:20:46,048 Speaker 2: why it felt so confusing, because to say that he 330 00:20:46,248 --> 00:20:49,728 Speaker 2: was non religious and then to be in a job 331 00:20:49,848 --> 00:20:53,328 Speaker 2: that was so connected to the Muslim faith and upholding 332 00:20:53,688 --> 00:20:57,568 Speaker 2: the national identities and Egyptian it was less that I 333 00:20:57,928 --> 00:21:00,688 Speaker 2: wasn't Muslim and more that it would threaten his job. 334 00:21:01,168 --> 00:21:04,248 Speaker 2: That was the issue. He did Ramadan that year and 335 00:21:04,368 --> 00:21:07,407 Speaker 2: I supported him through that. We went to ead and 336 00:21:07,448 --> 00:21:10,167 Speaker 2: eat feasts together and that was a really cool experiencerience. 337 00:21:10,968 --> 00:21:15,088 Speaker 2: But I suppose he practiced his faith in like a 338 00:21:15,208 --> 00:21:19,528 Speaker 2: very surface level way and pick and chose which parts 339 00:21:19,528 --> 00:21:22,488 Speaker 2: of his faith that he was willing to engage in. 340 00:21:23,368 --> 00:21:28,448 Speaker 2: He went to Egypt during our relationship to visit his family, 341 00:21:29,128 --> 00:21:32,248 Speaker 2: and I can remember a time I wanted a video 342 00:21:32,328 --> 00:21:35,328 Speaker 2: call him to see you know, obviously we were dating, 343 00:21:35,368 --> 00:21:37,328 Speaker 2: so I wanted to see how his day had been 344 00:21:37,368 --> 00:21:40,928 Speaker 2: and just to catch up. And he answered the phone 345 00:21:40,968 --> 00:21:42,408 Speaker 2: and said, I'm going to have to call you back. 346 00:21:42,768 --> 00:21:45,608 Speaker 2: I said, okay, no problem, no problem. But he never 347 00:21:45,648 --> 00:21:48,608 Speaker 2: turned his camera on, and when he called me back, 348 00:21:48,688 --> 00:21:51,888 Speaker 2: he was like in a tiny room with the light off, 349 00:21:52,088 --> 00:21:54,088 Speaker 2: like hiding in a room. I'm like, what are you 350 00:21:54,168 --> 00:21:57,088 Speaker 2: doing and he said, oh, I'm just at a family lunch. 351 00:21:57,168 --> 00:21:59,848 Speaker 2: I'm just with my family. I said, okay, well, can 352 00:21:59,848 --> 00:22:01,648 Speaker 2: I say how to your mum? And he goes, oh, no, no, no, 353 00:22:01,688 --> 00:22:04,168 Speaker 2: she's busy. He said, what about your brother and he goes, 354 00:22:04,168 --> 00:22:06,208 Speaker 2: oh no, no, no, don't worry about that. He's busy 355 00:22:06,208 --> 00:22:08,768 Speaker 2: as well. And he was really really dismissive of me 356 00:22:08,888 --> 00:22:12,968 Speaker 2: trying to interact interact with him and also with his family, 357 00:22:13,008 --> 00:22:14,968 Speaker 2: and he was giving me a lot of one word answers, So, 358 00:22:15,128 --> 00:22:16,248 Speaker 2: how's your day been going? 359 00:22:16,288 --> 00:22:16,448 Speaker 3: Oh? 360 00:22:16,488 --> 00:22:19,368 Speaker 2: Good, how's your family? They're fine. Didn't really ask me 361 00:22:19,408 --> 00:22:23,088 Speaker 2: anything in return, and he was away for about a 362 00:22:23,128 --> 00:22:27,488 Speaker 2: week and we called maybe twice during that week, and 363 00:22:27,808 --> 00:22:31,048 Speaker 2: that was one of the worst weeks for me because 364 00:22:31,208 --> 00:22:34,768 Speaker 2: I felt so lonely because I didn't have him to 365 00:22:34,968 --> 00:22:39,888 Speaker 2: text or call or him with me, and I felt abandoned. 366 00:22:39,888 --> 00:22:43,048 Speaker 2: It's the only word I can think of. And whenever 367 00:22:43,088 --> 00:22:46,368 Speaker 2: he would call me, he would always be hiding away 368 00:22:46,488 --> 00:22:51,207 Speaker 2: somewhere he'd never be with other people. And I didn't 369 00:22:51,288 --> 00:22:54,768 Speaker 2: let myself think it, but I started to suspect that 370 00:22:54,888 --> 00:22:58,488 Speaker 2: they didn't know that I existed, and it was always 371 00:22:58,568 --> 00:23:01,008 Speaker 2: really hard for me to know what other people knew 372 00:23:01,048 --> 00:23:03,927 Speaker 2: because he would talk to his family in Arabic, so 373 00:23:04,128 --> 00:23:06,168 Speaker 2: if he was on the phone with his family when 374 00:23:06,208 --> 00:23:08,207 Speaker 2: I was around, he would be speaking to them in 375 00:23:08,208 --> 00:23:11,608 Speaker 2: the language I didn't understand. And I can remember taking him, 376 00:23:12,008 --> 00:23:15,008 Speaker 2: you know, on the bond Die to Bronte Walk and 377 00:23:15,728 --> 00:23:18,888 Speaker 2: he was taking all of these photos for his social media, 378 00:23:19,208 --> 00:23:23,407 Speaker 2: little videos, little snippets, and he took pictures with me 379 00:23:23,728 --> 00:23:25,568 Speaker 2: and no, it was really cute. It was one of 380 00:23:25,608 --> 00:23:29,928 Speaker 2: our first outings together. And when I got home that night, 381 00:23:30,008 --> 00:23:33,248 Speaker 2: we weren't together. That night. For whatever reason, he had 382 00:23:33,288 --> 00:23:38,207 Speaker 2: posted this video, this reel of his day, and no 383 00:23:38,368 --> 00:23:40,967 Speaker 2: photos of me were in there. He hadn't tagged me 384 00:23:41,008 --> 00:23:44,528 Speaker 2: in it, he hadn't mentioned me at all. And I 385 00:23:44,568 --> 00:23:48,368 Speaker 2: remember talking to him about it and he said, oh, 386 00:23:48,408 --> 00:23:51,288 Speaker 2: it's because I'm really private. For my job, I can't 387 00:23:51,448 --> 00:23:54,808 Speaker 2: be seen with other people. I just prefer to keep 388 00:23:54,888 --> 00:23:58,728 Speaker 2: my social media about myself. And I thought, okay, well 389 00:23:58,768 --> 00:24:02,207 Speaker 2: that's reasonable. Maybe he's just a really private person. And 390 00:24:02,288 --> 00:24:05,208 Speaker 2: I remember telling him that it was important to me 391 00:24:05,288 --> 00:24:07,207 Speaker 2: that he was proud of me and spoke about me, 392 00:24:07,528 --> 00:24:11,488 Speaker 2: and that our relationship was something that he shared with people, 393 00:24:11,968 --> 00:24:14,528 Speaker 2: and he goes, okay, well maybe I will you know 394 00:24:14,848 --> 00:24:16,888 Speaker 2: next time we go on a date. There was never 395 00:24:17,008 --> 00:24:19,488 Speaker 2: any post about me or with me in any of 396 00:24:19,528 --> 00:24:23,888 Speaker 2: his social media, and again I made an excuse for it. 397 00:24:24,248 --> 00:24:28,007 Speaker 2: I thought, Okay, well, he's just keeping his privacy and 398 00:24:28,048 --> 00:24:30,848 Speaker 2: he's keeping me protected. I didn't know what the risks 399 00:24:30,848 --> 00:24:34,128 Speaker 2: of being a diplomat were. Maybe he couldn't put any 400 00:24:34,128 --> 00:24:37,328 Speaker 2: of his associates out on Instagram or whatever he was using. 401 00:24:37,728 --> 00:24:40,128 Speaker 2: Maybe it was like a genuine security risk. So I 402 00:24:40,328 --> 00:24:45,608 Speaker 2: just had faith in him and trusted him that. That's 403 00:24:45,648 --> 00:24:46,328 Speaker 2: the reason. 404 00:24:46,088 --> 00:24:49,648 Speaker 1: Why, while Live was learning so much about Ali's life 405 00:24:49,648 --> 00:24:52,968 Speaker 1: as a diplomat and his culture, naturally, she also wanted 406 00:24:53,008 --> 00:24:54,248 Speaker 1: to expose him to hers. 407 00:24:56,288 --> 00:25:00,968 Speaker 2: Ali had never experienced Christmas before, and well, my family 408 00:25:01,048 --> 00:25:04,888 Speaker 2: decided to invite him around for our typical family Christmas. 409 00:25:04,928 --> 00:25:07,728 Speaker 2: So there were gifts under the Christmas tree for him. 410 00:25:08,128 --> 00:25:10,848 Speaker 2: There were Santa hats for a all to where my 411 00:25:11,048 --> 00:25:14,288 Speaker 2: mum had done a full ros, the turkey, the ham 412 00:25:14,368 --> 00:25:18,927 Speaker 2: that everything and had presented it on the dining table 413 00:25:18,968 --> 00:25:21,648 Speaker 2: when we're all sitting around having a nice time and 414 00:25:21,688 --> 00:25:24,688 Speaker 2: doing the Christmas crackers. It was Christmas carols were going. 415 00:25:24,728 --> 00:25:27,928 Speaker 2: It's like the quintessential Christmas. They put more into Christmas 416 00:25:27,928 --> 00:25:30,167 Speaker 2: that year than they would usually because they knew that 417 00:25:30,208 --> 00:25:34,568 Speaker 2: he was coming. And it was before dessert. We just 418 00:25:34,608 --> 00:25:37,968 Speaker 2: finished our meal and he said, when are we leaving? 419 00:25:38,608 --> 00:25:41,328 Speaker 2: And he said that in front of my entire family, 420 00:25:41,968 --> 00:25:45,368 Speaker 2: and I said, I'm with my family, like, we're going 421 00:25:45,448 --> 00:25:47,648 Speaker 2: to stay for dessert and then we can go if 422 00:25:47,728 --> 00:25:51,568 Speaker 2: you want. And he just sat there with this look 423 00:25:51,608 --> 00:25:53,488 Speaker 2: on his face like he didn't want to be there 424 00:25:53,648 --> 00:25:57,328 Speaker 2: at all, like leaning back in his chair, folding his arms. 425 00:25:57,528 --> 00:26:01,528 Speaker 2: And I can remember just looking at my parents really apologetically, 426 00:26:01,768 --> 00:26:06,207 Speaker 2: like trying to communicate through my eyes how sorry I was. 427 00:26:06,928 --> 00:26:10,608 Speaker 2: And that was pretty much like the pattern of our 428 00:26:10,648 --> 00:26:14,447 Speaker 2: relationship is that he would behave in a way that 429 00:26:14,528 --> 00:26:17,648 Speaker 2: I felt I was responsible for, and there was no 430 00:26:17,688 --> 00:26:22,528 Speaker 2: separation between his behavior and how responsible I felt. And 431 00:26:23,368 --> 00:26:26,848 Speaker 2: when we did eventually leave, and we left earlier before 432 00:26:26,848 --> 00:26:30,687 Speaker 2: the rest of my family, he asked to be dropped 433 00:26:30,688 --> 00:26:33,488 Speaker 2: off at his place and said, oh, I've got to 434 00:26:33,488 --> 00:26:37,447 Speaker 2: go to work. And I went home and spent the 435 00:26:37,488 --> 00:26:41,167 Speaker 2: rest of Christmas Day by myself watching I think I 436 00:26:41,248 --> 00:26:44,768 Speaker 2: watched Harry Potter for the afternoon on my own on 437 00:26:44,848 --> 00:26:47,167 Speaker 2: Christmas Day and he went home. 438 00:26:47,368 --> 00:26:50,488 Speaker 1: This was incredibly out of character for ally. At this point, 439 00:26:50,528 --> 00:26:52,687 Speaker 1: they'd been dating for a year and he was always 440 00:26:52,728 --> 00:26:56,248 Speaker 1: so kind and respectful to live his family. Something felt wrong, 441 00:26:56,608 --> 00:26:58,407 Speaker 1: but the next time they saw each other it felt 442 00:26:58,448 --> 00:27:01,488 Speaker 1: like things were back to normal, until it didn't. 443 00:27:01,648 --> 00:27:04,128 Speaker 2: It was the end of December that we went on 444 00:27:04,888 --> 00:27:08,927 Speaker 2: a regular date and we got back to his apartment. 445 00:27:09,768 --> 00:27:11,848 Speaker 2: I was planning on staying like I would usually do, 446 00:27:12,248 --> 00:27:16,727 Speaker 2: and I started talking to him about how excited I 447 00:27:16,848 --> 00:27:19,688 Speaker 2: was to meet his family and reflecting on how nice 448 00:27:19,728 --> 00:27:22,528 Speaker 2: it had been to have him at my family Christmas. 449 00:27:23,448 --> 00:27:26,048 Speaker 2: And I said, how do you think your family would 450 00:27:26,088 --> 00:27:29,048 Speaker 2: feel about me coming to visit next time you go 451 00:27:29,128 --> 00:27:32,848 Speaker 2: to Egypt? And he said to me, oh, they'll be polite, 452 00:27:32,848 --> 00:27:36,568 Speaker 2: but they'll be worried about my job. And I said, 453 00:27:36,688 --> 00:27:40,448 Speaker 2: what do you mean by that? And he said, well, 454 00:27:41,088 --> 00:27:44,207 Speaker 2: with my job, I'm not supposed to be married to 455 00:27:44,768 --> 00:27:49,768 Speaker 2: or even dating someone who's not a Muslim, and my 456 00:27:49,808 --> 00:27:52,688 Speaker 2: stomach fell through the floor. I can't describe the feeling, 457 00:27:52,928 --> 00:27:55,528 Speaker 2: because it was the only time I can remember where 458 00:27:55,848 --> 00:27:58,848 Speaker 2: a piece of information had really thrown me for six 459 00:27:58,968 --> 00:28:02,928 Speaker 2: like rug pulled under the feet type of moment. Yeah, 460 00:28:02,968 --> 00:28:09,048 Speaker 2: the shock was immediate, and I asked him to clarify that, 461 00:28:09,968 --> 00:28:14,408 Speaker 2: and I said, well, hang on, we're dating. I'm not Muslim, 462 00:28:15,088 --> 00:28:19,288 Speaker 2: I'm not Egyptian, so what are we doing? And he said, oh, 463 00:28:19,288 --> 00:28:22,208 Speaker 2: it's too early to think about that. And I said, 464 00:28:22,968 --> 00:28:25,447 Speaker 2: a year in is a fair amount of time to 465 00:28:25,488 --> 00:28:28,247 Speaker 2: be thinking about it, and ideally I would have known 466 00:28:28,328 --> 00:28:32,328 Speaker 2: this from the first date. He disagreed, and he said, oh, 467 00:28:32,368 --> 00:28:34,648 Speaker 2: it doesn't matter, we can just keep dating. And I said, well, 468 00:28:34,648 --> 00:28:37,048 Speaker 2: when you leave the country, then what do we do? 469 00:28:37,368 --> 00:28:39,368 Speaker 2: And he goes, oh, he could didn't have an answer 470 00:28:39,368 --> 00:28:42,728 Speaker 2: for that, And that's when all the red flags started 471 00:28:42,728 --> 00:28:45,648 Speaker 2: popping up, because it reminded me of times where I 472 00:28:45,688 --> 00:28:48,448 Speaker 2: would want to talk about moving overseas with him and 473 00:28:48,448 --> 00:28:52,288 Speaker 2: he would shut the conversation down, or I would ask 474 00:28:52,368 --> 00:28:54,328 Speaker 2: him how his family was going, and he'd give me 475 00:28:54,368 --> 00:28:57,768 Speaker 2: one word answers. So it turned out that he had 476 00:28:57,848 --> 00:29:01,008 Speaker 2: told no one about me, he'd even been home to 477 00:29:01,088 --> 00:29:04,448 Speaker 2: Egypt during the time that we were together, and had 478 00:29:04,488 --> 00:29:08,848 Speaker 2: kept me a secret the entire time. And I really 479 00:29:08,928 --> 00:29:12,288 Speaker 2: tried during that conversation to try and work it out. 480 00:29:13,008 --> 00:29:16,448 Speaker 2: I said how important is your job to you? Is 481 00:29:16,488 --> 00:29:18,448 Speaker 2: it something you can always see yourself doing? And he 482 00:29:18,488 --> 00:29:22,968 Speaker 2: says yes, Like okay, well that's the biggest problem. We 483 00:29:23,328 --> 00:29:26,888 Speaker 2: can't be together. If you're going to be an Egyptian diplomat, 484 00:29:27,168 --> 00:29:30,528 Speaker 2: it's in your contract. And I said, look, I don't 485 00:29:30,568 --> 00:29:32,808 Speaker 2: see a way that we can still be together. And 486 00:29:33,848 --> 00:29:36,968 Speaker 2: on the car ride home, he dropped me home because 487 00:29:36,968 --> 00:29:39,368 Speaker 2: I didn't have my car, and that's when he decided 488 00:29:39,408 --> 00:29:41,608 Speaker 2: to tell me that he loved me. Was the moment 489 00:29:41,728 --> 00:29:44,728 Speaker 2: that I said that we couldn't be together anymore. It 490 00:29:44,768 --> 00:29:47,568 Speaker 2: was like his last ditch effort to try and keep 491 00:29:47,608 --> 00:29:50,768 Speaker 2: me around. In the shock, I was still trying to 492 00:29:50,768 --> 00:29:53,448 Speaker 2: find ways to reconnect with him, so I tried to 493 00:29:53,448 --> 00:29:56,528 Speaker 2: come up with all sorts of different solutions. I was like, well, 494 00:29:57,008 --> 00:29:59,008 Speaker 2: what if we don't tell your work, what if we 495 00:29:59,048 --> 00:30:03,208 Speaker 2: don't get married, what if I convert to Islam? What 496 00:30:03,288 --> 00:30:06,728 Speaker 2: if I become an Egyptian citizen. I was really throwing 497 00:30:06,808 --> 00:30:11,248 Speaker 2: crazy things out there, and then it hit me. I thought, no, 498 00:30:11,488 --> 00:30:15,968 Speaker 2: I can't do that. I don't want that. I was 499 00:30:16,168 --> 00:30:18,928 Speaker 2: under the impression that the way that I was was 500 00:30:19,088 --> 00:30:24,848 Speaker 2: enough for him, when fundamentally it wasn't He said to me, 501 00:30:25,528 --> 00:30:28,528 Speaker 2: I do want to get married. And I said, but 502 00:30:28,648 --> 00:30:31,048 Speaker 2: you just told me you can't marry a non Muslim, 503 00:30:31,288 --> 00:30:34,248 Speaker 2: and he goes yeah. And I said, well, does that 504 00:30:34,368 --> 00:30:36,168 Speaker 2: mean you want to get married just not to me? 505 00:30:37,008 --> 00:30:40,048 Speaker 2: And he goes, well, it's too early to think about that. 506 00:30:40,288 --> 00:30:43,368 Speaker 2: His repeated phrase was it's too early to think about that. 507 00:30:44,488 --> 00:30:49,248 Speaker 2: So what I took from that was he had been 508 00:30:49,728 --> 00:30:54,728 Speaker 2: enjoying having an Australian girl while he was here in 509 00:30:54,768 --> 00:30:59,808 Speaker 2: Sydney and getting the benefit of seeing more of the city, 510 00:31:00,448 --> 00:31:03,568 Speaker 2: seeing a different side of life, and then he was 511 00:31:03,648 --> 00:31:08,208 Speaker 2: going to leave me behind and date someone else in 512 00:31:08,368 --> 00:31:11,928 Speaker 2: Spain or Portugal or wherever else he was going to 513 00:31:11,968 --> 00:31:14,968 Speaker 2: go in the world and just keep doing that as 514 00:31:15,048 --> 00:31:18,408 Speaker 2: part of his traveling the world experience as a diplomat, 515 00:31:18,528 --> 00:31:23,128 Speaker 2: and eventually marry an Egyptian girl who his family would 516 00:31:23,128 --> 00:31:28,008 Speaker 2: approve of, who his workplace would approve of. And perhaps 517 00:31:28,128 --> 00:31:30,048 Speaker 2: that's what he was imagining when he said that he 518 00:31:30,088 --> 00:31:31,248 Speaker 2: wanted to get married one day. 519 00:31:31,688 --> 00:31:34,528 Speaker 1: So live made the call right then and there she 520 00:31:34,608 --> 00:31:35,408 Speaker 1: broke up with him. 521 00:31:35,848 --> 00:31:40,288 Speaker 2: He burst into tears, stood up and went into the bathroom. 522 00:31:41,288 --> 00:31:46,568 Speaker 2: And I honestly think the penny dropped for him, that 523 00:31:46,888 --> 00:31:49,688 Speaker 2: he did care for me a lot, and that the 524 00:31:50,288 --> 00:31:53,288 Speaker 2: understanding that he was losing me and that there wasn't 525 00:31:53,408 --> 00:31:57,968 Speaker 2: a solution that either of us were comfortable with hit 526 00:31:58,048 --> 00:32:03,008 Speaker 2: him and hard, and then I love you started. Then 527 00:32:03,088 --> 00:32:07,848 Speaker 2: the begging started, and I don't know what came over me, 528 00:32:08,048 --> 00:32:10,808 Speaker 2: but I felt very certain and that I needed to 529 00:32:10,848 --> 00:32:15,928 Speaker 2: stand up for myself in that situation, and that negotiating 530 00:32:16,648 --> 00:32:19,208 Speaker 2: who I was and what I wanted was something I 531 00:32:19,248 --> 00:32:22,128 Speaker 2: couldn't keep doing because I felt that I had been 532 00:32:22,808 --> 00:32:26,248 Speaker 2: a chameleon the entire year, trying to make him feel 533 00:32:26,288 --> 00:32:30,968 Speaker 2: comfortable and trying to make him feel loved, and I 534 00:32:31,048 --> 00:32:34,648 Speaker 2: realized I hadn't had any of that in return, and 535 00:32:34,688 --> 00:32:36,568 Speaker 2: that was where the buck stopped. 536 00:32:36,568 --> 00:32:36,768 Speaker 3: There. 537 00:32:37,648 --> 00:32:40,128 Speaker 2: I needed to say no, and I needed to walk away. 538 00:32:40,568 --> 00:32:41,928 Speaker 1: And that's exactly what she did. 539 00:32:42,088 --> 00:32:45,128 Speaker 2: When I walked through the door of my apartment, I 540 00:32:45,208 --> 00:32:47,768 Speaker 2: cried and called my best friend and I told her 541 00:32:47,808 --> 00:32:52,648 Speaker 2: what happened, and she was in shock. She had so 542 00:32:52,768 --> 00:32:56,328 Speaker 2: much disbelief. She goes, what do you mean? What do 543 00:32:56,368 --> 00:32:59,688 Speaker 2: you mean that he has been dating you this entire 544 00:32:59,888 --> 00:33:05,448 Speaker 2: year knowing that you're not Muslim, You're not Egyptian and 545 00:33:05,488 --> 00:33:08,168 Speaker 2: he's so committed to his job that you can't be 546 00:33:08,328 --> 00:33:11,848 Speaker 2: together long term. I'm like, oh yeah. It took someone 547 00:33:11,928 --> 00:33:16,808 Speaker 2: else telling it back to me to understand the betrayal 548 00:33:17,008 --> 00:33:20,408 Speaker 2: that he'd put me through, and that he'd been lying 549 00:33:20,488 --> 00:33:23,928 Speaker 2: by a mission to me the entire year. Even though 550 00:33:24,248 --> 00:33:27,288 Speaker 2: we texted for the next couple of days. I called 551 00:33:27,328 --> 00:33:30,648 Speaker 2: him and said, we can't be friends. I'm not okay 552 00:33:30,648 --> 00:33:33,648 Speaker 2: with that. We've broken up and that's it. I don't 553 00:33:33,688 --> 00:33:36,848 Speaker 2: want to know you. I don't want to stay in 554 00:33:36,888 --> 00:33:45,928 Speaker 2: contact with you anymore. I felt really betrayed, and after 555 00:33:45,968 --> 00:33:48,728 Speaker 2: we broke up, it was really the straw that broke 556 00:33:48,768 --> 00:33:51,168 Speaker 2: the camel's back from my mental health. If I'm honest, 557 00:33:51,768 --> 00:33:56,168 Speaker 2: I had already been experiencing quite a lot of loneliness 558 00:33:56,368 --> 00:34:00,528 Speaker 2: and isolation, obviously through the COVID pandemic. I'd had a 559 00:34:00,568 --> 00:34:05,768 Speaker 2: string of very bad dating experiences and relationships. I had 560 00:34:06,048 --> 00:34:10,687 Speaker 2: literally spent thousands on going to a matchmaker and in 561 00:34:10,728 --> 00:34:14,448 Speaker 2: good faith, meeting this person who on paper matched all 562 00:34:14,488 --> 00:34:22,648 Speaker 2: of my criteria, and I felt just helpless and directionless, 563 00:34:22,728 --> 00:34:25,567 Speaker 2: like I didn't know what to do next, and my 564 00:34:25,608 --> 00:34:29,328 Speaker 2: biggest desire was to find someone that I could start 565 00:34:29,368 --> 00:34:32,087 Speaker 2: a family with, and all around me, all of my 566 00:34:32,168 --> 00:34:35,288 Speaker 2: friends were starting their families. My sister had been with 567 00:34:35,368 --> 00:34:37,768 Speaker 2: her partner for over a decade. I felt like the 568 00:34:37,808 --> 00:34:41,288 Speaker 2: real odd one out, and it really set me into 569 00:34:41,288 --> 00:34:46,288 Speaker 2: a big hole mentally that took a lot of intervention 570 00:34:46,728 --> 00:34:51,607 Speaker 2: and therapy to bring myself out of. I ended up 571 00:34:51,648 --> 00:34:55,088 Speaker 2: hospitalized from a mental health at one point I needed 572 00:34:55,128 --> 00:34:57,288 Speaker 2: to move back in with my parents for them to 573 00:34:57,328 --> 00:35:01,568 Speaker 2: take care of me. I spent nine months in weekly 574 00:35:01,648 --> 00:35:05,408 Speaker 2: group therapy to learn more about how to manage my 575 00:35:05,488 --> 00:35:10,607 Speaker 2: emotions and to listen to myself. I don't think up 576 00:35:10,688 --> 00:35:15,408 Speaker 2: unto that point, I had ever truly asked what I wanted. 577 00:35:16,248 --> 00:35:19,728 Speaker 2: Even reflecting back on the relationship I had with Ali, 578 00:35:20,328 --> 00:35:22,448 Speaker 2: I spent a lot of my time trying to take 579 00:35:22,488 --> 00:35:25,088 Speaker 2: care of him as the person who was here without 580 00:35:25,088 --> 00:35:28,048 Speaker 2: his family. So I would cook and clean his apartment 581 00:35:28,328 --> 00:35:31,848 Speaker 2: and make sure the fridge was stocked, and I really 582 00:35:31,888 --> 00:35:34,448 Speaker 2: put a lot of effort into making his life easy. 583 00:35:35,128 --> 00:35:39,888 Speaker 2: And I had never turned that love and care on myself, 584 00:35:40,568 --> 00:35:45,048 Speaker 2: So it took learning those skills for me to find 585 00:35:45,248 --> 00:35:49,048 Speaker 2: my way back to myself. And during about six months 586 00:35:49,088 --> 00:35:53,728 Speaker 2: into that process, I met my now husband. So he 587 00:35:53,808 --> 00:35:56,488 Speaker 2: met me at a point in time where I felt 588 00:35:56,568 --> 00:35:59,808 Speaker 2: like I was truly me, and I don't think if 589 00:35:59,848 --> 00:36:02,087 Speaker 2: I had met him at any other point in my 590 00:36:02,128 --> 00:36:04,047 Speaker 2: life prior to that, I don't think I would have 591 00:36:04,088 --> 00:36:06,368 Speaker 2: been able to make it work because I didn't know 592 00:36:06,408 --> 00:36:09,208 Speaker 2: myself well enough and I didn't know how to express 593 00:36:09,208 --> 00:36:15,448 Speaker 2: my emotion healthily. So it's the biggest silver lining to 594 00:36:15,568 --> 00:36:20,288 Speaker 2: a massive storm cloud that was that year, and I'm 595 00:36:20,328 --> 00:36:24,288 Speaker 2: truly healthier than I've ever been thanks to that experience. 596 00:36:24,768 --> 00:36:28,608 Speaker 2: And as for Ali, I heard from him maybe a 597 00:36:28,728 --> 00:36:32,768 Speaker 2: year later and he sent me an Instagram message. I 598 00:36:32,888 --> 00:36:36,288 Speaker 2: was with my now husband at the time, and he 599 00:36:36,688 --> 00:36:39,528 Speaker 2: said to me, I now realize what a big mistake 600 00:36:39,608 --> 00:36:42,608 Speaker 2: I made. I treated you very badly. I hope in 601 00:36:42,648 --> 00:36:47,368 Speaker 2: your heart you can forgive me. And I said to him, 602 00:36:47,728 --> 00:36:50,527 Speaker 2: I actually have no need to forgive you. You need 603 00:36:50,568 --> 00:36:54,408 Speaker 2: to forgive yourself. But I'm now in a very, very 604 00:36:54,488 --> 00:36:58,127 Speaker 2: healthy relationship where my feelings are reciprocated and I'm very 605 00:36:58,168 --> 00:37:02,448 Speaker 2: comfortable and you don't cross my mind at all. And 606 00:37:02,488 --> 00:37:08,048 Speaker 2: then he blocked me. So that was it. My husband 607 00:37:08,128 --> 00:37:11,607 Speaker 2: and I have been married for six months. We got 608 00:37:11,688 --> 00:37:16,968 Speaker 2: married in January, and he is such a gift. I 609 00:37:17,048 --> 00:37:20,808 Speaker 2: could not have imagined anyone like him. Particularly in the 610 00:37:20,848 --> 00:37:26,647 Speaker 2: aftermath of that breakup. I felt hopeless I would never 611 00:37:26,688 --> 00:37:29,768 Speaker 2: find anybody, and that I would be lonely, and I 612 00:37:29,888 --> 00:37:34,728 Speaker 2: needed to, with some help train myself to imagine a 613 00:37:34,808 --> 00:37:38,008 Speaker 2: life where I was on my own and be very 614 00:37:38,048 --> 00:37:40,768 Speaker 2: happy with what that might look like. So I could 615 00:37:40,848 --> 00:37:44,688 Speaker 2: visualize that. And it was within that sense of myself 616 00:37:44,808 --> 00:37:47,888 Speaker 2: and within that rebuilding a life that was just mine 617 00:37:47,928 --> 00:37:50,528 Speaker 2: that I met him, and we did meet through the apps. 618 00:37:50,648 --> 00:37:56,808 Speaker 2: They do work eventually, and I had written on my 619 00:37:56,968 --> 00:38:01,448 Speaker 2: profile that I wanted a house with a wrap around 620 00:38:01,528 --> 00:38:04,328 Speaker 2: veranda and a really big backyard that was big enough 621 00:38:04,328 --> 00:38:07,288 Speaker 2: for a dog and children to run around on, and 622 00:38:07,328 --> 00:38:09,647 Speaker 2: that I was imagining sitting with a cup of tea 623 00:38:10,288 --> 00:38:14,408 Speaker 2: in the evening watching the children play. And that is 624 00:38:14,528 --> 00:38:18,328 Speaker 2: the prompt on my profile that he responded to, and 625 00:38:18,368 --> 00:38:20,728 Speaker 2: he said, that sounds perfect. That's what I'm looking for 626 00:38:20,808 --> 00:38:25,608 Speaker 2: as well, and we messaged. We called each other on 627 00:38:25,648 --> 00:38:28,288 Speaker 2: the phone before we went on our first date and 628 00:38:29,728 --> 00:38:34,728 Speaker 2: spoke for hours, and when I met him, we went 629 00:38:34,848 --> 00:38:38,928 Speaker 2: for dinner and he sat down opposite me, and he's gorgeous, 630 00:38:39,208 --> 00:38:42,047 Speaker 2: and I was just in awe of him, and we 631 00:38:42,128 --> 00:38:46,647 Speaker 2: spoke about ironically, we spoke about our religions, and I 632 00:38:46,728 --> 00:38:52,047 Speaker 2: was describing my spirituality, he was describing his. And even 633 00:38:52,088 --> 00:38:54,888 Speaker 2: though he is from a different faith background to me, 634 00:38:55,128 --> 00:38:59,848 Speaker 2: he's Hindu. We understand the universe and the world in 635 00:38:59,888 --> 00:39:02,808 Speaker 2: such a similar way. And it's through our shared values 636 00:39:02,848 --> 00:39:05,448 Speaker 2: You've been able to build our life together. And I 637 00:39:05,608 --> 00:39:09,008 Speaker 2: really I respect him. I look up to him. He's 638 00:39:09,128 --> 00:39:12,768 Speaker 2: the gentle, kindest, most loving person in the whole planet. 639 00:39:13,048 --> 00:39:15,408 Speaker 2: And I know everyone says that about their husbands, but honestly, 640 00:39:16,008 --> 00:39:22,888 Speaker 2: and our life now is so settled and reciprocal, and 641 00:39:23,448 --> 00:39:27,848 Speaker 2: we make such a fantastic team. My sister did ask 642 00:39:28,048 --> 00:39:31,848 Speaker 2: when we first started dating. She goes, Okay, he's Hindu. 643 00:39:32,008 --> 00:39:35,128 Speaker 2: Is there any reason at all that you cannot be together? 644 00:39:35,768 --> 00:39:39,488 Speaker 2: And I messaged him and I said, Okay, don't take 645 00:39:39,528 --> 00:39:41,688 Speaker 2: this the wrong way, but you're Hindu and I'm not. 646 00:39:41,848 --> 00:39:44,888 Speaker 2: Is that going to be a problem? And he goes, nah, 647 00:39:45,128 --> 00:39:47,888 Speaker 2: my sister married a white guy. She's fine, It's all 648 00:39:47,928 --> 00:39:51,608 Speaker 2: going to be fine. And it was our wedding. We 649 00:39:51,648 --> 00:39:55,168 Speaker 2: had a beautiful Hindu ceremony and his family and my 650 00:39:55,328 --> 00:39:59,688 Speaker 2: family get along beautifully. So it just goes to show 651 00:39:59,768 --> 00:40:03,168 Speaker 2: that there can be differences in faith and culture, but 652 00:40:03,288 --> 00:40:06,328 Speaker 2: it's the shared values and the love that can bind 653 00:40:06,408 --> 00:40:09,688 Speaker 2: people together. If I were to have my time again, 654 00:40:10,848 --> 00:40:14,728 Speaker 2: I would tell myself to slow down and really listen 655 00:40:14,928 --> 00:40:19,768 Speaker 2: to myself and to ask myself the question what do 656 00:40:19,808 --> 00:40:22,688 Speaker 2: you need and what do you want? Rather than trying 657 00:40:22,768 --> 00:40:27,247 Speaker 2: to think about what others need and yeah, I would 658 00:40:27,288 --> 00:40:30,288 Speaker 2: go more internal and really try to understand what I 659 00:40:30,408 --> 00:40:35,968 Speaker 2: want and find comfort on my own before trying to 660 00:40:36,128 --> 00:40:38,127 Speaker 2: connect with someone else. That's the key. 661 00:40:38,168 --> 00:41:03,768 Speaker 3: I think. 662 00:40:54,568 --> 00:40:57,047 Speaker 1: Everyone has an eggs. It's a Minti Media production and 663 00:40:57,088 --> 00:40:59,928 Speaker 1: proudly part of the Mum and Mean Network. This episode 664 00:40:59,968 --> 00:41:03,368 Speaker 1: is written and produced by Linda Scott. Interview conducted by 665 00:41:03,488 --> 00:41:06,928 Speaker 1: Katie Powers and narrated by me Georgia Love. If you 666 00:41:06,968 --> 00:41:08,928 Speaker 1: have a story you'd like to share, email us at 667 00:41:09,048 --> 00:41:12,527 Speaker 1: podcast Momama dot com dot au. You can support us 668 00:41:12,568 --> 00:41:14,888 Speaker 1: by following the show in your favorite podcast app and 669 00:41:14,968 --> 00:41:17,168 Speaker 1: leaving a five star review. We'll see you for the 670 00:41:17,168 --> 00:41:18,127 Speaker 1: next episode.