1 00:00:11,280 --> 00:00:14,000 Speaker 1: You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast. 2 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:17,720 Speaker 2: Mamma May I acknowledges the traditional owners of the land 3 00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:20,759 Speaker 2: and waters that this podcast is recorded on. This is 4 00:00:20,759 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 2: my impression of my auntie after I've said, I reckon, 5 00:00:23,360 --> 00:00:26,360 Speaker 2: I've got ADHD, because I've been really struggling lately, especially 6 00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 2: with things like paying attention and like attention span. 7 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:28,680 Speaker 3: Right. 8 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 2: Oh, You've got to have something, don't you. You're a 9 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:32,560 Speaker 2: little bit different. You go to hd H. That's what 10 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:34,960 Speaker 2: people are supposed to do. You're supposed to want to 11 00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 2: do things. But this generation, if you don't want to 12 00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:39,919 Speaker 2: see in front of the TV, you go ADHD. Go TOHD. 13 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:42,480 Speaker 2: I'm a bit sad today. Well, I've got depression, don't I. 14 00:00:42,480 --> 00:00:46,040 Speaker 2: I've got depression generation generation. 15 00:00:48,560 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 1: For Mamma Mia. 16 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:53,160 Speaker 3: I'm your host, Ashannie Dante. Welcome to But are You Happy? 17 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:56,560 Speaker 3: The podcast that won't diagnose you, but will probably make 18 00:00:56,600 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 3: you say, Oh that sounds like me. 19 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 2: And I'm Doctor Anastaga hernis a clinical psychologist passionate about 20 00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:06,840 Speaker 2: happiness and mental health. Have you ever wondered if you 21 00:01:06,959 --> 00:01:10,679 Speaker 2: might have ADHD but feel nervous about saying it loud? 22 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:14,520 Speaker 2: Or maybe you've been diagnosed already, but all you hear 23 00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:16,119 Speaker 2: are confusing myths. 24 00:01:16,399 --> 00:01:20,079 Speaker 3: Yeah, it feels like ADHD gets boxed into one definition, 25 00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 3: but the reality is it's way more complex. 26 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 1: Right, everyone's experience is different. 27 00:01:25,759 --> 00:01:28,959 Speaker 2: Exactly today, I want to break down the many ways 28 00:01:29,039 --> 00:01:32,279 Speaker 2: ADHD can show up, clear up some of the biggest myths, 29 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:35,039 Speaker 2: and share what to do if you think you might 30 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:37,039 Speaker 2: need to go and get a diagnosis. 31 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:39,720 Speaker 3: I know a lot of listeners have been waiting to 32 00:01:39,759 --> 00:01:45,759 Speaker 3: hear about this one, so let's dive straight in. Okay, Anastasia, 33 00:01:45,839 --> 00:01:49,880 Speaker 3: The term ADHD is being thrown around a lot, but 34 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:52,440 Speaker 3: I'm keen to hear it from you as the expert. 35 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:54,919 Speaker 1: What actually is ADHD? 36 00:01:55,760 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 2: Good starting point, ADHD is a developmental disorder. So what 37 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:04,320 Speaker 2: that means is that it starts early on in childhood 38 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:08,839 Speaker 2: and it is with you throughout your life. Right. ADHD 39 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:13,600 Speaker 2: is a diagnosed ciner condition that affects the executive functioning 40 00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:16,880 Speaker 2: in our brain. So this very much relates to the 41 00:02:16,920 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 2: prefrontal cortex, that front part of our brain that is 42 00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:28,240 Speaker 2: responsible for higher order planning, decision making, problem solving, emotion regulation, 43 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:30,320 Speaker 2: things like that. It's the part of the brain from 44 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 2: an evolutionary perspective that develops later. It's what distinguishes us 45 00:02:33,640 --> 00:02:36,680 Speaker 2: from things like animals that don't have as well developed 46 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:41,120 Speaker 2: prefrontal cortext So it's this developmental condition that largely affects 47 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,600 Speaker 2: the front of the brain and impacts the way in 48 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:47,880 Speaker 2: which people are able to focus and pay attention and 49 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:49,600 Speaker 2: engage with certain parts of their life. 50 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:54,840 Speaker 3: Now, I know in our previous season episode one, we 51 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:57,760 Speaker 3: talked about anxiety, and I remember you talking about how 52 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 3: there's a spectrum, right, is that the same case for ADHD. 53 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:05,640 Speaker 2: So ADHD symptoms can exist on a spectrum. But there 54 00:03:05,640 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 2: are actually some well defined subtypes of ADHD. It used 55 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,440 Speaker 2: to actually be called ADD but now we refer to 56 00:03:13,480 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 2: it as ADHD. So attention deficit hyperactivity disorder is what 57 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 2: the full acronym actually stands for. So there's three different 58 00:03:22,640 --> 00:03:27,120 Speaker 2: subtypes that someone can be diagnosed with. The first one 59 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:32,440 Speaker 2: is the inattentive subtype. So this is where someone really 60 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:37,440 Speaker 2: struggles with distractability. It's hard for them to pay attention, 61 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 2: it's hard for them to focus, they become easily distracted 62 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:43,440 Speaker 2: with other things. You might have noticed this if you've 63 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 2: been in a conversation with someone who has ADHD inattentive subtype, 64 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:50,480 Speaker 2: and suddenly you're talking about one thing and then they're 65 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 2: off onto a different kind of conversation and topic. Right, 66 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 2: their brain gets easily distracted. Or it could be that 67 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 2: they notice something in their environment and they get distracted 68 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 2: by that. So this inattentive subtype is characterized by challenges 69 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:06,960 Speaker 2: with focus and paying attention. 70 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 3: When it comes to inattentive symptoms, is there the symptoms 71 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:12,080 Speaker 3: underneath that category? 72 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, So this could be other things like people might 73 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:18,479 Speaker 2: have a tendency to start projects and then not finish 74 00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:20,760 Speaker 2: them again because they get distracted or they find it 75 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 2: hard to finish. They might sort of put off some 76 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 2: tasks that require a lot of effort, so we see 77 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:31,120 Speaker 2: a lot of procrastination. Sometimes memory difficulties, trouble remembering things, 78 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:33,760 Speaker 2: and this is not necessarily a core memory problem itself. 79 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,799 Speaker 2: It's more so that perhaps if a person wasn't really 80 00:04:36,840 --> 00:04:40,040 Speaker 2: paying attention in the first place, that information doesn't get 81 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 2: properly encoded and stored in the brain. We might find 82 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:47,040 Speaker 2: that people lose things very easily. It's hard for them 83 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:50,000 Speaker 2: to kind of follow instructions. We see this with kids 84 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:51,880 Speaker 2: at school. It might be hard for them to follow 85 00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:54,920 Speaker 2: the instructions that the teacher gives and maybe sort of 86 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,599 Speaker 2: someone who makes a lot of mistakes that sort of 87 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:00,719 Speaker 2: seem careless, but they're not. It's just that as part 88 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:03,600 Speaker 2: of this inattentive ADHD, it is hard to focus and 89 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:04,599 Speaker 2: organize and plan. 90 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:07,720 Speaker 3: So what about Is there any other types of ADHD 91 00:05:07,840 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 3: or is it just that one? 92 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:14,800 Speaker 2: So there's the hyperactive subtype of ADHD, and this is 93 00:05:15,120 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 2: the sort of stereotypical presentation that people might have historically 94 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:22,440 Speaker 2: had in mind when they thought about ADHD. If you 95 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:25,640 Speaker 2: imagine kind of like that typical kid that doesn't sit still, 96 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 2: like they can't sit in their chair, they're constantly squirming 97 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:30,839 Speaker 2: and fidgeting more than any of the other kids. This 98 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:35,400 Speaker 2: is that kind of hyperactive subtype. So it's that restlessness, 99 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:39,920 Speaker 2: it's hard to sit still. It's characterized by impulsivity, so 100 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:43,760 Speaker 2: reacting very quickly to things, finding it hard to kind 101 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 2: of think through decisions before actually acting on them. People 102 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:50,960 Speaker 2: with this hyperactive subtype also might find that they get 103 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:54,160 Speaker 2: bored quite easily, so there's that sense of boredom that 104 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:58,000 Speaker 2: comes in. They might be thrill seekers, so there's a 105 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 2: lot of risk taking behavior or thrill seeking behavior that 106 00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:05,280 Speaker 2: might occur. So this is more of that hyperactive subtype 107 00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:08,960 Speaker 2: for ADHD. And then we can have the third type, 108 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:12,040 Speaker 2: which is essentially a combat nation of both a combination 109 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:15,080 Speaker 2: of the hyperactivity and the inattention as well. 110 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:18,040 Speaker 3: It's like it's a double whammy, a mix of the 111 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:21,200 Speaker 3: mix of both. Yeah, So does that mean people with 112 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:23,440 Speaker 3: ADHD can't focus at all? 113 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:25,320 Speaker 4: Not at all. 114 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 2: It doesn't mean that. It just means that there are 115 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:33,200 Speaker 2: sometimes some challenges and some difficulties with focusing, and particularly 116 00:06:33,280 --> 00:06:37,159 Speaker 2: we're talking about focusing for long periods of time. So 117 00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 2: when we actually think about attention and focus, there are 118 00:06:40,840 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 2: different types of attention. Right. We have sort of our 119 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 2: short term attention, we have our long term attention. We 120 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:51,200 Speaker 2: have our ability to focus on two things at once. Right, 121 00:06:51,240 --> 00:06:53,760 Speaker 2: So we're talking about lots of different types of attention here. 122 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:57,920 Speaker 2: But what we see is that it's sometimes that longer 123 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:02,280 Speaker 2: attention that people with ADHD might struggle with. But that said, 124 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:07,720 Speaker 2: there is actually something called hyper focusing in ADHD, which 125 00:07:07,960 --> 00:07:12,400 Speaker 2: is that ability to focus and get into that flow 126 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 2: in a really in depth way. When someone with ADHD 127 00:07:17,200 --> 00:07:20,080 Speaker 2: has the right conditions around them and they're interested in 128 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 2: what they're doing. They can actually double down and focus 129 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 2: really quite intensely and for long periods of time on 130 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 2: that specific task. So it's a myth to say that 131 00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:37,040 Speaker 2: people with ADHD can't focus. They absolutely can, but sometimes 132 00:07:37,080 --> 00:07:39,960 Speaker 2: it means that environmental conditions need to be tweaked in 133 00:07:40,040 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 2: order for them to get into that space of focus. 134 00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:45,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's really interesting, and I think that's why I'm 135 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:48,160 Speaker 3: also very excited about this episode because I feel like 136 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:50,320 Speaker 3: you are going to bust a lot of myths for 137 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:51,880 Speaker 3: us when it comes to ADHD. 138 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:55,000 Speaker 2: What I will add is that with the hyper focusing, 139 00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:57,680 Speaker 2: there can be pros and cons to that be with ADHD. 140 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 2: So while they can really get into that flow and 141 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:04,560 Speaker 2: get a lot done in a period of time, sometimes 142 00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:08,080 Speaker 2: what they find is that there's difficulty coming out of it. 143 00:08:08,680 --> 00:08:11,440 Speaker 2: So actually breaking the focus when they need to then 144 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:14,880 Speaker 2: actually stop because life requires them to do other things 145 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:18,040 Speaker 2: coming out of it and breaking that focus can feel 146 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 2: quite challenging, And people who have ADHD who get into 147 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:26,000 Speaker 2: these hyper focused states can say that it almost even 148 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 2: feels like time distorts, like when they're in that state, 149 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:33,120 Speaker 2: you know, it might have been five or six hours 150 00:08:33,160 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 2: that pass, but it only actually feels like one. So 151 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:39,040 Speaker 2: this is it's this whole sort of experience that's quite 152 00:08:39,160 --> 00:08:40,199 Speaker 2: unique to ADHD. 153 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:44,040 Speaker 3: It's interesting because as you've been going through a lot 154 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:46,680 Speaker 3: of the symptoms, like I mean, I'm sitting here like, 155 00:08:46,720 --> 00:08:48,720 Speaker 3: oh my gosh, I do that. I do that, And 156 00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:51,200 Speaker 3: I'm sure there's listeners tuning in where they're like, I'm 157 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:54,760 Speaker 3: ticking a lot of these boxes and I'm keen to know. 158 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:57,680 Speaker 3: How do you actually know if you have ADHD? Like 159 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:00,240 Speaker 3: what's involved with getting a real diagnosis. 160 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:02,959 Speaker 2: Yeah, one of the important things for us to think 161 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 2: about is how frequent our inner tention and these symptoms occur, 162 00:09:09,600 --> 00:09:13,559 Speaker 2: but also oh how much they occur across context. Right, 163 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 2: So we're all sometimes destractible, we all sometimes lose focus, 164 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 2: we all sometimes forget things, right, that's kind of just 165 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 2: normal human behavior. But what we're really looking for is 166 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:28,559 Speaker 2: patterns in someone's life, and patterns that are ultimately debilitating 167 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:31,720 Speaker 2: or cause dysfunction for them in some way. It's all 168 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:34,080 Speaker 2: well and good if we every now and again forget something, 169 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 2: but if we are forgetting so often that it means 170 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:39,240 Speaker 2: we're not attending doctor's appointments, we're not meeting deadlines for 171 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 2: work and we run the risk of getting fired, then 172 00:09:41,560 --> 00:09:45,600 Speaker 2: that's having some serious negative consequences in our life. We 173 00:09:45,800 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 2: also want to make sure that we are seeing these 174 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 2: symptoms across contexts. Now, when we look at diagnosing children, 175 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 2: this is really important because if a child struggles to 176 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 2: focus at school, but they can focus home, or they 177 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 2: can focus when they're with their friends, they can focus 178 00:10:01,640 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 2: in other contexts, this isn't typical of ADHD, and it's 179 00:10:05,760 --> 00:10:08,200 Speaker 2: more indicative that maybe there's something going on at school 180 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:12,240 Speaker 2: that's causing disruption for them. ADHD doesn't kind of discriminate 181 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 2: according to where you are or who you're with. That's 182 00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:18,760 Speaker 2: one of the key features of ADHD symptoms is that 183 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:22,080 Speaker 2: they go across contexts. So if someone's listening to this 184 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 2: and thinking, Okay, that still does sound like me, what 185 00:10:27,680 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 2: can they do well? Seeking a diagnosis from a medical 186 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:35,920 Speaker 2: professional is probably the next step. So usually this would 187 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 2: involve going to a GP as a first point of 188 00:10:38,920 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 2: contact to discuss the possibility of ADHD, and then perhaps 189 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:48,040 Speaker 2: getting a referral to either a psychiatrist or a psychologist 190 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 2: to get a more formal diagnosis, or in the case 191 00:10:50,280 --> 00:10:51,599 Speaker 2: of a child, a pediatrician. 192 00:10:52,560 --> 00:10:54,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, and I can imagine as well, people that are 193 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:56,880 Speaker 3: kind of on the fence and the dowding. I guess 194 00:10:56,920 --> 00:10:59,480 Speaker 3: it doesn't hurt to just go to a GP and 195 00:10:59,520 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 3: have the conversation. 196 00:11:00,560 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 2: Right, absolutely, absolutely, These are the people who are trained 197 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:07,440 Speaker 2: and equipped to be able to talk through your symptoms 198 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 2: with you in a way that's going to make sense 199 00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 2: for you and be able to provide you with some clarity. 200 00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 3: So with ADHD, and I know we kind of spoke 201 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 3: to it a little bit before around how we're hearing 202 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 3: it everywhere, like it's I know, for me, it's on 203 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:22,520 Speaker 3: my social media feed. I'm hearing in a lot of 204 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:25,240 Speaker 3: my circles of friends and people I know that are 205 00:11:25,280 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 3: getting diagnosed with ADHD, and it gets me wondering, why 206 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:33,200 Speaker 3: is there a sudden rise in the diagnosis. 207 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:37,920 Speaker 2: Yes, we've seen the rise of the adult ADHD diagnosis 208 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 2: in the last few years. And I think what this 209 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:45,439 Speaker 2: really speaks to is two things. One, perhaps reduced stigma. 210 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:49,720 Speaker 2: Maybe people feel like there's less stigma around ADHD and 211 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 2: that they can actually go to a doctor or a 212 00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:55,200 Speaker 2: health professional and get that diagnosis and be able to 213 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:59,240 Speaker 2: tell people that they have ADHD. But also that there's 214 00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 2: a greater awareness of it. And we're seeing this particularly 215 00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:07,640 Speaker 2: around adult women who fall into the inattentive subtype. So 216 00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:12,040 Speaker 2: these were typically the kids who went undiagnosed at school 217 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:15,320 Speaker 2: because they weren't disruptive. So if I can present you 218 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 2: with the stereotypical picture, it's the kid who sits at 219 00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 2: the back of the classroom daydreaming, not causing any problem, 220 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 2: not being disruptive, not being loud and noisy, like the 221 00:12:24,680 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 2: hyperactive kids might be the inattentive kids flight under the radar. 222 00:12:29,520 --> 00:12:32,000 Speaker 2: And so if we think back, you know, ten twenty 223 00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:35,439 Speaker 2: thirty years ago, where we perhaps didn't have the understanding 224 00:12:35,560 --> 00:12:39,600 Speaker 2: of ADHD that we do now, these are the adults 225 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:42,600 Speaker 2: who are now getting diagnosed, and as I said, particularly 226 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 2: those adult women who fall into that inattentive subtype. 227 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:49,320 Speaker 3: And do you find as well that social media can 228 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:52,960 Speaker 3: impact like the consumption of social media can impact people 229 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:57,600 Speaker 3: with ADHD because you know you're constantly getting those dopamine hits, right, Like, 230 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:00,240 Speaker 3: is there some correlation there or maybe not? 231 00:13:00,560 --> 00:13:03,040 Speaker 2: Yes? I love that you bring dopamine and the brain 232 00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:05,440 Speaker 2: into the conversation. I've been ninety well. 233 00:13:05,280 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 3: I've been reading a book called The Dopamine brain. I 234 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 3: don't know if anyone's heard of it before. 235 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:14,080 Speaker 2: So you're spot on here about dopamine. So when we 236 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,680 Speaker 2: actually look at what's happening in the brain for someone 237 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 2: with ADHD, as I said, it's related to that prefrontal 238 00:13:20,840 --> 00:13:23,080 Speaker 2: cortex part of the brain. And there are a few 239 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:26,679 Speaker 2: kind of theories that are still being debated in the literature, 240 00:13:27,080 --> 00:13:31,120 Speaker 2: but there is a theory around under activation of dopamine. 241 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:33,520 Speaker 2: So dopamine is not being activated enough or there is 242 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:37,840 Speaker 2: not enough dopamine in the brain right And this dope 243 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 2: meine is very much related to drive and motivation to 244 00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:44,840 Speaker 2: seek out rewards. And so what this might mean is 245 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:48,640 Speaker 2: that people with ADHD feel quite impulsive. They find it 246 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:51,720 Speaker 2: hard to sort of find the motivation to do things 247 00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 2: that might be challenging at time because of not of 248 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:56,760 Speaker 2: a lack of willingness, but because of the way in 249 00:13:56,760 --> 00:13:59,880 Speaker 2: which their brain is operating and dope mean is being activated. 250 00:14:00,520 --> 00:14:04,880 Speaker 2: The other theory is that dopamine is activated similarly in 251 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:09,320 Speaker 2: the brain to people without ADHD, but it is removed 252 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:12,040 Speaker 2: quicker so it doesn't sort of kind of hang around 253 00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 2: as long in the brain, which again might result in 254 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:19,240 Speaker 2: people being more impulsive or as you said, seeking out 255 00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:23,240 Speaker 2: those dopamine hits, whether that's from social media, whether it's 256 00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:26,680 Speaker 2: from video games or other things in people's lives. And 257 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:29,080 Speaker 2: what I see a lot of in the clinic, A 258 00:14:29,080 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 2: lot of my work is in addictions specifically, but actually 259 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:34,760 Speaker 2: what we see is that a lot of the people 260 00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:39,960 Speaker 2: who come with some sort of addiction actually have undiagnosed ADHD. 261 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:44,200 Speaker 2: Really yeah, And for many years they've been self medicating 262 00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 2: to manage the kind of ups and downs and highs 263 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:50,240 Speaker 2: and lows that they've been feeling, and substances have been 264 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:52,760 Speaker 2: a way for them to sort of quote unquote feel 265 00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:53,960 Speaker 2: normal in some way. 266 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:56,920 Speaker 3: And it really does come down to this is what 267 00:14:57,000 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 3: I'm gathering. It is the right education, right And it 268 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 3: gets me wondering, are there what are some of the 269 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 3: other biggest myths out there when it comes to ADHD. 270 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 2: I think the biggest one is like the whole laziness thing, 271 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:15,600 Speaker 2: Like if you have ADHD and then you can't focus 272 00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:17,800 Speaker 2: or get tuss done, it means that you're lazy, or 273 00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:20,800 Speaker 2: it means that you don't try hard enough, or you 274 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:23,480 Speaker 2: just don't have enough kind of willpower to get through it. 275 00:15:23,520 --> 00:15:26,640 Speaker 2: And it's just really not the case. It's fundamentally that 276 00:15:26,680 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 2: the brain is working differently to people who don't have 277 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 2: the ADHD diagnosis, and that can have both, as we said, 278 00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:36,040 Speaker 2: pros and cons to being able to get things done. 279 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 2: Another myth I think that we see is more so 280 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:44,000 Speaker 2: with children and parenting, that ADHD is the result of 281 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:49,040 Speaker 2: kind of bad parenting or parents not disciplining their children enough. 282 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 2: And again it's simply not the case. You can put 283 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:58,040 Speaker 2: all the rules and schedules and discipline in place for 284 00:15:58,160 --> 00:16:01,520 Speaker 2: children with ADHD and they will still present with ADHD behaviors. 285 00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 3: So what's the impact for people that are undiagnosed with ADHD. 286 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 2: What I see a lot of in the clinic is 287 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,760 Speaker 2: for people who've been under diagnosed through most of their 288 00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 2: childhood and early adult years, they internalize the struggles that 289 00:16:17,840 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 2: they've been having, And what I mean by that is 290 00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 2: that there's a lot of self blame that develops. They 291 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:27,960 Speaker 2: blame themselves for being forgetful, for not getting tasked done, 292 00:16:28,120 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 2: for not being able to focus, for maybe not being 293 00:16:30,480 --> 00:16:33,320 Speaker 2: able to achieve as much as they know they have 294 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:36,680 Speaker 2: the potential for. And they blame themselves as being lazy 295 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:40,440 Speaker 2: or undisciplined or not motivated enough they compare themselves to 296 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:42,840 Speaker 2: maybe their siblings or their friends who've been able to 297 00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:48,360 Speaker 2: achieve more. So they internalize the hardships that they've been 298 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 2: facing and kind of attribute it to some sort of 299 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:56,600 Speaker 2: character flaw as opposed to an actual diagnosis that exists 300 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:58,880 Speaker 2: in the way that their brain works. And so I 301 00:16:58,920 --> 00:17:02,600 Speaker 2: see a lot of depression and low self esteem as 302 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:05,399 Speaker 2: a result of it. On the flip side of that, 303 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:08,520 Speaker 2: when I see people who've been struggling for so long 304 00:17:08,639 --> 00:17:12,600 Speaker 2: and then finally do get it done diagnosis, it's often 305 00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:17,400 Speaker 2: this moment of relief for them, like suddenly their experience 306 00:17:17,560 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 2: makes sense to them. They're like, this is why I've 307 00:17:20,640 --> 00:17:23,200 Speaker 2: been struggling. It's not because I'm dumb. It's not because 308 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:25,680 Speaker 2: I'm lazy, it's not because I haven't been hard working. 309 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:27,879 Speaker 2: It's not all these things that maybe people in my 310 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:31,199 Speaker 2: life have told me I am. It's actually because I 311 00:17:31,280 --> 00:17:35,520 Speaker 2: have ADHD. And while it can be relieving, it can 312 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:37,960 Speaker 2: also be a little bit sad for people. I see 313 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:42,240 Speaker 2: the sadness come through because they think, Gosh, if only 314 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:44,840 Speaker 2: I had known this earlier in my life, you know, 315 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:48,480 Speaker 2: I potentially could have achieved more, or perhaps school wouldn't 316 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 2: have felt like such a struggle, or perhaps I wouldn't 317 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:55,640 Speaker 2: have had the negative impact maybe on friendships and relationships 318 00:17:55,640 --> 00:17:58,720 Speaker 2: that I've had in my life. So it's a bittersweet 319 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 2: moment often for people where there's a bit of that 320 00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:03,680 Speaker 2: sadness but also that relief for them. 321 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 3: And I really love that because I think sometimes we 322 00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:09,760 Speaker 3: can villainize labels, but if anything, it sounds quite liberating 323 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:13,120 Speaker 3: to sometimes to sometimes have a bit more language and 324 00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:15,160 Speaker 3: a label around what you're going through. 325 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:18,640 Speaker 2: Absolutely, it's how we use the label, right, Yeah. If 326 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:22,960 Speaker 2: the label ultimately helps us understand ourselves better and make 327 00:18:23,120 --> 00:18:26,600 Speaker 2: sense of our own experience, then that's a great thing. 328 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:30,720 Speaker 3: After the break, doctor Anastasia is going to tell you 329 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:32,439 Speaker 3: what to do if you think you might need to 330 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:38,400 Speaker 3: be diagnosed with ADHD. Okay, Anastasia, I feel like you've 331 00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:42,000 Speaker 3: really given us a thorough overview of what ADHD is. 332 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:44,719 Speaker 1: I've got two part question for you. 333 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:47,920 Speaker 3: First question is what do you do if you think 334 00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:52,160 Speaker 3: you might have ADHD? And the second one is if 335 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 3: you do have ADHD, how do you manage it day 336 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:57,200 Speaker 3: by day. Let's start with the first question. 337 00:18:57,359 --> 00:18:59,320 Speaker 2: Yes, okay, so what do you do if you're listening 338 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:01,840 Speaker 2: along and you think, hmm, that sounds like me. I 339 00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:05,840 Speaker 2: might have ADHD. So I'm going to talk about where 340 00:19:05,880 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 2: to seek out help and a diagnosis. So I always 341 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:14,960 Speaker 2: recommend GPS as a first point of contact GPS for adults, 342 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:19,200 Speaker 2: pediatricians for kids. And this is because they are a 343 00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 2: wealth of knowledge and they can point you in the 344 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 2: right direction after having that initial consultation with you. So 345 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:30,040 Speaker 2: a GP can be a great first place to start. Ultimately, 346 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 2: a psychologist or a psychiatrist can diagnose an adult with ADHD, 347 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:41,960 Speaker 2: or a pediatrician for a child. So psychologists and psychiatrists 348 00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:48,000 Speaker 2: often go about diagnosing ADHD differently. So psychiatrist will do 349 00:19:48,120 --> 00:19:51,480 Speaker 2: quite an in depth clinical interview with you and usually 350 00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:56,000 Speaker 2: administer some questionnaires. So we have some good quality questionnaires 351 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,440 Speaker 2: that can assist with the diagnosis of ADHD. Usually these 352 00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:02,200 Speaker 2: are filled out by the person who thinks they have ADHD, 353 00:20:02,359 --> 00:20:05,320 Speaker 2: but also often the parents as well, because it's asking 354 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:08,240 Speaker 2: parents to think back to when you were a child, 355 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,880 Speaker 2: did you know little Bobby do these things? And as 356 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:13,639 Speaker 2: we said before the reason for this is it's a 357 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:17,119 Speaker 2: developmental condition. It should start in childhood. If it's not 358 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:20,760 Speaker 2: present in childhood. If you suddenly have this onset of 359 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:24,880 Speaker 2: symptoms in adulthood that was not there in childhood, then 360 00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:27,959 Speaker 2: we would probably not be looking at ADHD and maybe 361 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:31,399 Speaker 2: some other sort of either mental health or even neurological 362 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:33,879 Speaker 2: condition that might be going on. Okay, so we really 363 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:36,679 Speaker 2: have to see that stability across time. That's what a 364 00:20:36,680 --> 00:20:40,760 Speaker 2: psychiatrist will do. A psychologist will also do this sort 365 00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:43,840 Speaker 2: of in depth clinical interview with someone, but they can 366 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:48,480 Speaker 2: also do psychological tests, neuropsychological tests, so they might do 367 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:52,360 Speaker 2: things like an IQ test, an academic test, and other 368 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:57,879 Speaker 2: sort of tests that assess for different types of attentional functioning. 369 00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:00,200 Speaker 2: And what you get at the end of this is 370 00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:03,440 Speaker 2: a big, long, comprehensive report that basically gives you your 371 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:08,920 Speaker 2: neuropsychological profile. So it'll explain your IQ, your working memory, 372 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:12,560 Speaker 2: how fast you can process information, all these different parts 373 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:15,360 Speaker 2: of what your brain and your executive function can do. 374 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:18,920 Speaker 2: Psychiatrists tend not to do that, so there's a point 375 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:21,159 Speaker 2: of difference there in terms of the process that we 376 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:25,800 Speaker 2: might go through to get diagnosed. Now, another difference is 377 00:21:25,840 --> 00:21:31,680 Speaker 2: that psychologists can't prescribe medication, So if someone does want 378 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:34,680 Speaker 2: to pursue a pathway or consider a pathway of medication, 379 00:21:35,120 --> 00:21:37,960 Speaker 2: then they would be looking at seeing a psychiatrist for that. 380 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:41,320 Speaker 3: With the process so far, because if you're not sure 381 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:44,680 Speaker 3: whether to see a psychiatrist or a psychologist, would that 382 00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:47,439 Speaker 3: discussion be had with your GP they'll be able to 383 00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:49,440 Speaker 3: point you to which person to go to next. 384 00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:52,840 Speaker 2: It absolutely can be. And if someone really is feeling 385 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:55,880 Speaker 2: like they have potentially severe ADHD and would be very 386 00:21:55,920 --> 00:21:59,960 Speaker 2: open to that pathway of attaining medication, if that was 387 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:02,760 Speaker 2: the right treatment for them, then sometimes it's best to 388 00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:05,720 Speaker 2: go to a psychiatrist from the start because these things 389 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:08,480 Speaker 2: are also expensive, right, let's not shy away from that fact. Ye, 390 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,399 Speaker 2: the costs add up, and so seeing a psychiatrist from 391 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,200 Speaker 2: the start can be useful. The reason people might want 392 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:17,439 Speaker 2: to see a psychologist first is because they get that 393 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:22,080 Speaker 2: profile of themselves, and for some people, that's really helpful 394 00:22:22,120 --> 00:22:26,040 Speaker 2: for them to understand, almost in small ways, how different 395 00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:29,760 Speaker 2: parts of their brain and brain functioning work. So that 396 00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 2: can be a really validating, validating and informative process for 397 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:34,080 Speaker 2: some people. 398 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:38,679 Speaker 3: Okay, so how about someone with ADHD? How can they 399 00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:40,640 Speaker 3: manage that in their day to day life? 400 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,639 Speaker 2: So, if you've been diagnosed with ADHD. You've got the 401 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:49,880 Speaker 2: diagnosis and you go now what Yes, Typically a combination 402 00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:55,800 Speaker 2: of medication and behavioral strategies is what's considered first line option. 403 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:58,680 Speaker 2: It's not to say that everyone needs to go on medication, 404 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,320 Speaker 2: but I will say that there is really good evidence 405 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:05,320 Speaker 2: for stimulant and non stimulant medication, and this is usually 406 00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:09,920 Speaker 2: an option that is discussed by psychiatrists or doctors or pediatricians. 407 00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:15,080 Speaker 2: Right in addition to medication, though, it's really looking at 408 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:18,639 Speaker 2: what behavioral strategies can we put in place to help 409 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:22,400 Speaker 2: with the areas that we're struggling. So, if it's struggling 410 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:27,040 Speaker 2: with organization and planning, can we have big colored planners 411 00:23:27,120 --> 00:23:29,919 Speaker 2: on the wall that outline every day what you need 412 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:32,119 Speaker 2: to be doing at different times. Is it that you 413 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,439 Speaker 2: need to set lots of alarms in your phone to 414 00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 2: be able to kind of send reminders for when you 415 00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:40,240 Speaker 2: need to leave the house buy because you run the 416 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:42,480 Speaker 2: risk of being late a lot of the time. Is 417 00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:46,480 Speaker 2: it that you get really overwhelmed by sensory things and 418 00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:48,800 Speaker 2: you get very distructed and you need to wear headphones 419 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:51,800 Speaker 2: around the office to help with the destructions, you know, 420 00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:55,520 Speaker 2: finding what some of those practical strategies are to help 421 00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 2: with that management of whatever the symptoms are that you 422 00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:00,400 Speaker 2: experience of ADHD. 423 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,919 Speaker 3: Is that where fidget toys come in, because I've noticed 424 00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:06,360 Speaker 3: there's this I don't know if it's a new trend thing, 425 00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:08,639 Speaker 3: but I'm seeing a lot more fidget toys around. 426 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:12,560 Speaker 2: Yes, the fidget spinners to toys. Absolutely. People with ADHD 427 00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:15,160 Speaker 2: find that if they have that kind of sensory touch 428 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:17,600 Speaker 2: and something to do with their hands, it can actually 429 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 2: help them focus on the task at hand. There's also 430 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 2: I don't know if you've heard about body doubling. 431 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:24,440 Speaker 1: No, what's that. 432 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,359 Speaker 2: Yeah, So a lot of people with ADHD find that 433 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:30,879 Speaker 2: if they need to do a task, sitting with someone 434 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,840 Speaker 2: else who's also doing a task and sort of like 435 00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:37,560 Speaker 2: doubling physically what they're doing can help them do it. 436 00:24:37,880 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 2: And there's actually websites online where you can like kind 437 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,160 Speaker 2: of find body doubles remotely. If you go, right, I've 438 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:44,800 Speaker 2: got half an hour of work to do and I 439 00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:46,480 Speaker 2: need to sit at my computer and do it, and 440 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:48,840 Speaker 2: you get someone else to do the same thing. It 441 00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 2: helps with that sort of accountability and focusing on the task. 442 00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:54,400 Speaker 1: I've never heard of that before. 443 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:58,280 Speaker 2: There's lots of like detailed ways and nuanced ways in 444 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:01,640 Speaker 2: which we can put strategies in place to help manage 445 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:05,680 Speaker 2: the attentional or hyperactive difficulties that people might face. 446 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:10,000 Speaker 3: So if the above strategies don't work or it's not 447 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:12,520 Speaker 3: an is that when you would look into medication. 448 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:16,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, you can look into medication if that doesn't feel 449 00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:19,359 Speaker 2: like it's enough or even from the starting point of 450 00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:22,439 Speaker 2: getting the diagnosis. And so this is where someone like 451 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:26,200 Speaker 2: a psychiatrist might discuss either stimulant or non stimulant medication. 452 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:31,040 Speaker 2: So stimulant medication things like ritulin. These medications are typically 453 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,840 Speaker 2: non addictive. Of course, like any medications, they can have 454 00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:37,920 Speaker 2: some side effects. They might interrupt sleep, or they might 455 00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:40,679 Speaker 2: result in like kind of lower appetite and things like this, 456 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,280 Speaker 2: so of course we always need to be monitoring for 457 00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:48,280 Speaker 2: side effects. But also, like with a lot of conditions, 458 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:51,840 Speaker 2: when it comes to either neurodivergence or mental health conditions, 459 00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:55,800 Speaker 2: these conditions exist on a spectrum right as we were 460 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:58,600 Speaker 2: saying before, So you can have perhaps a more mild 461 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:01,639 Speaker 2: diagnosis of ADHD, or you can have quite a severe 462 00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:05,880 Speaker 2: diagnosis of ADHD. And depending on what sort of category 463 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:09,359 Speaker 2: you fall into. You might need either different strengths of medication, 464 00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 2: different type of medication, or different combinations of behavioral strategies 465 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:14,879 Speaker 2: as well. 466 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:18,560 Speaker 3: Just when you were talking about like the different severities 467 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:21,919 Speaker 3: of ADHD, does that mean someone who has severe ADHD 468 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 3: would have, let's say that third type that you spoke 469 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:26,840 Speaker 3: about before, like a combination of both. 470 00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:32,280 Speaker 2: Not necessarily, OK. Someone can have a pure inattentive ADHD 471 00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:35,240 Speaker 2: and it still can fall into the severe category, so 472 00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:38,199 Speaker 2: that the categories are really dependent on how much of 473 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 2: a negative impact it's having on someone's day to day functioning. 474 00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:45,879 Speaker 3: After this shortbreak, we hear from a woman who's just 475 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:49,040 Speaker 3: been diagnosed with ADHD and isn't sure if she should 476 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:51,200 Speaker 3: tell her workplace stay with us. 477 00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:58,879 Speaker 2: Berb, Barb, Berb, I'm proving a serious Cristi Therb having 478 00:26:58,880 --> 00:26:59,720 Speaker 2: a crisis. 479 00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:02,840 Speaker 3: We've reached that time in our episode where we answer 480 00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 3: a question or dilemma from one of you our listeners. 481 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 1: This dilemma comes from Molly. 482 00:27:08,120 --> 00:27:11,399 Speaker 4: I've just been diagnosed with ADHD, and it explains a 483 00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:14,560 Speaker 4: lot about my struggles at work, like missing deadlines or 484 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,800 Speaker 4: zoning out meetings. But now I'm stuck wondering if I 485 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 4: should tell my boss and colleagues. Part of me wants 486 00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:23,000 Speaker 4: to be honest so that they understand where I'm coming from. 487 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:26,040 Speaker 4: But I'm also terrified that they might judge me or 488 00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 4: treat me differently. Will they see me as less capable? 489 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:34,280 Speaker 4: Could it hurt my chances for a promotion? I want support, 490 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,720 Speaker 4: but I don't want my diagnosis to become a label 491 00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:39,520 Speaker 4: that limits me professionally. What's the right move here? 492 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 2: Tricky scenario. 493 00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:44,560 Speaker 3: I feel like every single dilemma we always start off 494 00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:47,840 Speaker 3: it's hard. Yeah, it's always hard, MOLLI we feel for you. 495 00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:52,480 Speaker 2: And Molly. I really think this is a common question 496 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:57,120 Speaker 2: people who've been diagnosed with ADHD in adulthood or asking 497 00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:59,320 Speaker 2: right should I tell my workplace? Should I tell my friends? 498 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:01,399 Speaker 2: Should I tell the people around me? What are the 499 00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:04,399 Speaker 2: pros and cons? And I guess what I would suggest 500 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:06,840 Speaker 2: here is it really is a personal decision at the 501 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:08,520 Speaker 2: end of the day, and I don't think there's a 502 00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:12,240 Speaker 2: right or wrong. I unders stand the hesitation about wanting 503 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,040 Speaker 2: to share the diagnosis with work. As much as we 504 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:18,360 Speaker 2: would like to think that we're past stigma, it does 505 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,680 Speaker 2: still exist realistically. But if you did want to talk 506 00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 2: to work about it. Then one of the things I 507 00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:29,760 Speaker 2: would suggest to you is share the diagnosis with them, 508 00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:32,760 Speaker 2: but share what it is that you need so that 509 00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:35,880 Speaker 2: you're not presenting it as a limitation. As we said before, 510 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 2: ADHD can have some real positive strengths to it. You 511 00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:40,440 Speaker 2: can get into that hyper focus mode and you can 512 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 2: get a lot of work and tasks done right, So 513 00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:46,960 Speaker 2: have a plan as to what you're going to suggest 514 00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,800 Speaker 2: or propose to work if you do tell them about 515 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:53,920 Speaker 2: your diagnosis. So perhaps it might be about telling them, Look, 516 00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:57,760 Speaker 2: I've been recently diagnosed with ADHD. What that means is 517 00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 2: that at times I can become distracted, maybe a little 518 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 2: bit more easily than some other people. But here are 519 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,880 Speaker 2: some things that help me. One might be it's really 520 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:09,720 Speaker 2: helpful for me to wear headphones when I'm in the 521 00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 2: office and I'm not distracted by other people's conversations. So 522 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:15,800 Speaker 2: if you see me walking around the office with headphones on, 523 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,600 Speaker 2: it's because I'm focusing, not because I'm being rude and 524 00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:21,120 Speaker 2: not wanting to talk to anyone. It might be that 525 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:24,960 Speaker 2: I find it really helpful to have a clear task 526 00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 2: structured in my calendar and to block out times to 527 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:29,840 Speaker 2: do certain tasks. So you'll see that my calendar is 528 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:32,800 Speaker 2: organized in a particular way. This is really helpful for me. 529 00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:36,040 Speaker 2: So if you can talk to work about it but 530 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,880 Speaker 2: also present to them the strategies that are going to 531 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:43,960 Speaker 2: help you that they can get on board supporting, then 532 00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:48,280 Speaker 2: we're hopeful that the response from work won't be one 533 00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:51,600 Speaker 2: of stigma but one of understanding and for them to 534 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 2: have a willingness to get on board to support you 535 00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:55,280 Speaker 2: to do the best that you can at work. 536 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 3: And it's also really incredible because you having the courage 537 00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:00,960 Speaker 3: to have that conversation Molly with your boss could open 538 00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:03,840 Speaker 3: up possibilities for other people in the workplace, you know, 539 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,680 Speaker 3: like how common ADHD is. It's also an opportunity for 540 00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 3: the workplace culture to be educated on these things as 541 00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:10,840 Speaker 3: a whole. 542 00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 2: So absolutely, it starts somewhere, Start somewhere. 543 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 3: Good luck, Molly, Anastasia. Can you give us the main 544 00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:23,280 Speaker 3: takeaways from today's episode? 545 00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:27,640 Speaker 2: Yes, I can. First of all, ADHD is a condition 546 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:33,120 Speaker 2: that's rising in recognition. Second, there are different types of 547 00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:37,960 Speaker 2: ADHD which affect people differently. There's the inattentive subtype, which 548 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:42,840 Speaker 2: is characterized by a difficulty with focus, concentration and paying attention. 549 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:48,480 Speaker 2: There's the hyperactive subtype, which is characterized by difficulty with 550 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:51,560 Speaker 2: sitting still or feeling like you always want to be 551 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:55,120 Speaker 2: on the move. And then there's the combination where we 552 00:30:55,240 --> 00:31:01,240 Speaker 2: have a combination of inattention and hyperactivity. Third, don't be 553 00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:04,200 Speaker 2: fooled by myths that say that ADHD is a lack 554 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:07,840 Speaker 2: of discipline. It's not. And last of all, talk to 555 00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 2: your GP or a health professional if you think that 556 00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:14,920 Speaker 2: you might be struggling with ADHD. Explore behavioral therapy and 557 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:16,520 Speaker 2: medication treatment options. 558 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:18,960 Speaker 3: If you have a burnie question for us, there are 559 00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:20,520 Speaker 3: a few ways to get in touch with us. 560 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:21,920 Speaker 1: Links are in the show notes. 561 00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 2: And remember, while I am a psychologist, this podcast isn't 562 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:29,080 Speaker 2: a diagnostic tool, and the advice and ideas we present 563 00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:32,719 Speaker 2: here should always take into account your personal medical history. 564 00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:37,800 Speaker 2: The executive producer of But Are You Happy? Is Niama Brown. 565 00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:40,480 Speaker 1: Our senior producer is Tarlie Blackman. 566 00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:43,480 Speaker 2: Sound design and editing by Jacob Brown. 567 00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:45,680 Speaker 1: I'm a Shany Dante. 568 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:49,320 Speaker 2: And I'm doctor Anastasia heronus. The names and stories of 569 00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:53,320 Speaker 2: clients discussed have been changed for the purpose of maintaining anonymity. 570 00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:56,760 Speaker 2: If this conversation brought up any difficult feelings for you. 571 00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,720 Speaker 2: We have links for more resources in the show notes 572 00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:03,200 Speaker 2: around the topics we discussed today. You can also reach 573 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:06,720 Speaker 2: out to organizations like Beyond Blue or Lifeline if you're 574 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:08,640 Speaker 2: wanting more immediate support. 575 00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:12,280 Speaker 3: Tune in next week as we unpack adulthood, anxiety, and 576 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:15,880 Speaker 3: how to build real confidence and competence in everyday life. 577 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:19,280 Speaker 3: Mumma Bea studios are styled with furniture from Fenton and Fenton. 578 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:23,120 Speaker 3: Visit Fenton Andfenton dot com dot au. Thanks for listening, 579 00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 3: See you next time. 580 00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:27,160 Speaker 2: Thank you so much for listening to today's But Are 581 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:30,800 Speaker 2: You Happy? Episode. We're keen to understand how you're looking 582 00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:34,240 Speaker 2: after your mental health these days. There's a survey link 583 00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 2: in the show notes. It only takes a few minutes 584 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:38,880 Speaker 2: and you'll go in the drawer to win a one 585 00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 2: thousand dollars gift voucher. We'd love to hear from you.