WEBVTT - EXTRA: Cath Mahoney & What Nobody Says About Getting Divorced 0:00:08.234 --> 0:00:15.994 You're listening to a mother and mea podcast. Hello, Unleashes, 0:00:16.274 --> 0:00:19.553 it's me a Freedman here, also known in this context 0:00:19.714 --> 0:00:24.154 as producer Mea. I know that you're obsessed with Kath Mahoney. 0:00:24.394 --> 0:00:25.914 Honestly I am as well. 0:00:25.994 --> 0:00:28.954 Isn't she like human sunshine? 0:00:29.074 --> 0:00:31.834 And I know that you love her because you're all 0:00:31.914 --> 0:00:34.074 up in our dms like I want to know more 0:00:34.193 --> 0:00:37.674 about kaf and about all the hosts, which is fair 0:00:37.833 --> 0:00:41.793 because they're pretty remarkable women. So I found this conversation 0:00:42.193 --> 0:00:45.473 that I had with Kath and I thought, you immediately 0:00:45.674 --> 0:00:47.793 need to hear it. You're gonna love it because what 0:00:47.873 --> 0:00:50.793 you might not know about this woman is the following. 0:00:51.273 --> 0:00:54.354 Before she was on Unleashed making us laugh about VADG, 0:00:54.434 --> 0:00:58.034 waxes and dating. She sat across from me when I 0:00:58.074 --> 0:01:01.313 hosted No Filter and told me one of the most honest, 0:01:01.914 --> 0:01:07.074 funny and genuinely gutting stories that I'd heard in years. 0:01:06.874 --> 0:01:08.874 She was married, as many of you know, to one 0:01:08.914 --> 0:01:12.234 of the most famous sportsmen in Australia, a big, well 0:01:12.274 --> 0:01:15.914 known footy player, and so when that marriage ended, as 0:01:15.994 --> 0:01:17.994 it did quite a few years ago, she wasn't just 0:01:18.074 --> 0:01:20.914 dealing with divorce and being a single mum, she was 0:01:20.994 --> 0:01:25.554 dealing with public scrutiny and that feeling of hang on, 0:01:26.154 --> 0:01:29.234 who am I now, which I think is really familiar 0:01:29.314 --> 0:01:31.953 to women who've been through divorce, even if their ex 0:01:32.394 --> 0:01:35.634 is not a famous Australian. I promise you though, this 0:01:35.714 --> 0:01:39.034 isn't a conversation about her ex husband. We are not 0:01:39.194 --> 0:01:42.074 doing that. It's about calf And if you love her 0:01:42.114 --> 0:01:44.674 on unleashed, which I know you do, you're gonna love 0:01:45.154 --> 0:01:47.994 getting to know her a little bit better one on one. 0:01:48.754 --> 0:01:51.114 So from deep in the Mamma Mera archives comes this 0:01:51.194 --> 0:01:53.154 classic episode of no filter. 0:01:53.714 --> 0:01:54.394 Here she is. 0:02:03.314 --> 0:02:06.434 The day that you strap yourself into the most expensive 0:02:06.554 --> 0:02:09.513 dress that you've ever owned and walk down the aisle 0:02:09.754 --> 0:02:12.714 to look lovingly into the eyes of your about to 0:02:12.714 --> 0:02:17.914 be spouse. Divorce is generally not top of mind, but 0:02:17.954 --> 0:02:20.874 a few years later there's every chance that it will be, 0:02:20.874 --> 0:02:23.394 because more marriages end than don't. 0:02:24.194 --> 0:02:26.434 And when a marriage does end, even. 0:02:26.234 --> 0:02:30.154 Though we've mostly left behind divorced stigma, thank god, the 0:02:30.314 --> 0:02:33.913 after maath, even if it's damicable, can rock every aspect of. 0:02:33.874 --> 0:02:36.514 Your world and your identity. You're crying for the loss 0:02:36.514 --> 0:02:39.834 of identity. You're crying for the family unit. You're crying 0:02:39.914 --> 0:02:42.594 for that, you know, dancing off into the sunset. After 0:02:42.594 --> 0:02:47.034 fifty years married. A lot changes in that first for 0:02:47.114 --> 0:02:49.274 me it was eighteen months, might be twelve months, might 0:02:49.314 --> 0:02:50.914 be two years, might be however long. 0:02:50.794 --> 0:02:52.154 For whoever else is going through it. 0:02:52.514 --> 0:02:55.794 But for me, you know, my family home changed, my 0:02:55.994 --> 0:03:00.434 location changed, my job changed, my title changed. I was 0:03:01.114 --> 0:03:05.554 very much someone's wife. I wasn't anymore. I was suddenly. 0:03:05.114 --> 0:03:08.514 Aware that I was, like, who the fuck was I? 0:03:08.514 --> 0:03:10.954 I'd been somebody's partner for thirteen years. 0:03:11.634 --> 0:03:14.474 My name is Mia Friedman and you're listening to No Filter. 0:03:15.394 --> 0:03:18.954 Catherine Mahoney is an oversharer, which is my favorite brand 0:03:18.994 --> 0:03:22.114 of guest on No Filter. She used to work in 0:03:22.234 --> 0:03:26.274 music pr before she accidentally fell in love with NRL 0:03:26.394 --> 0:03:29.594 legend Andrew Johns. You might have heard of him, and 0:03:29.754 --> 0:03:33.474 they've spent thirteen years married. But when their relationship fell 0:03:33.514 --> 0:03:38.834 apart very publicly and very messily, Catherine found herself in 0:03:38.874 --> 0:03:42.354 a very different life season to the one she expected. 0:03:41.914 --> 0:03:43.474 To be in in her forties. 0:03:43.914 --> 0:03:47.834 It's one that she calls currently between husbands, which also 0:03:47.914 --> 0:03:50.274 happens to be the title of the memoir that she 0:03:50.354 --> 0:03:54.514 wrote this conversation with Kath is loose and it's hilarious. 0:03:54.914 --> 0:03:57.314 And if you're heading into the new year suddenly single, 0:03:57.554 --> 0:04:01.194 or thinking that maybe perhaps you might be single by 0:04:01.234 --> 0:04:02.954 the end of this year, or maybe you just know 0:04:03.074 --> 0:04:06.194 someone who is suddenly single, or maybe you just need 0:04:06.194 --> 0:04:09.434 a laugh, this is the perfect episode for you. 0:04:11.554 --> 0:04:11.794 Kav. 0:04:12.274 --> 0:04:15.194 What does rock Bottom look like after a divorce? 0:04:15.594 --> 0:04:15.794 Oh? 0:04:15.874 --> 0:04:19.193 There were many, I think, but the book version is, yeah, 0:04:19.274 --> 0:04:20.274 happened to lax. 0:04:20.313 --> 0:04:22.193 As you know, we're in LA for work. 0:04:22.394 --> 0:04:25.713 You know, the marriage has ended, maybe two months prior 0:04:25.834 --> 0:04:29.513 to that, I've been on a working trip, but anyone knows, 0:04:29.553 --> 0:04:30.993 you know, when you're a parent and you leave your 0:04:31.034 --> 0:04:32.594 child and you're on a working trip, you can also 0:04:32.714 --> 0:04:34.553 enjoy a working trip because you're not parent. 0:04:34.953 --> 0:04:36.634 And lou was only five back then. 0:04:36.953 --> 0:04:38.874 So it's one of those moments where I was pretending 0:04:38.953 --> 0:04:40.993 that I wasn't about to come back to Australia and 0:04:40.993 --> 0:04:43.113 have a divorce. And as we're packing up, when we 0:04:43.154 --> 0:04:46.393 get into the uber and email pings from my divorce lawyer, 0:04:46.914 --> 0:04:49.514 and I think anyone that's listening who's gone through this, 0:04:49.633 --> 0:04:51.753 and certainly people who've read the book who've reached out 0:04:52.354 --> 0:04:55.553 resonated with this moment when your marriage ends and you 0:04:55.714 --> 0:04:59.234 have to start dealing with divorce lawyers and their terminology. 0:04:59.794 --> 0:05:02.953 It is like being winded. You feel like you're being punched. 0:05:03.274 --> 0:05:05.313 What kind of words like, what sort of things do 0:05:05.354 --> 0:05:06.554 you have to read? 0:05:06.674 --> 0:05:11.234 It's not you and your partner anymore. It's other people 0:05:11.474 --> 0:05:14.473 talking on behalf of you, and none of it centers 0:05:14.513 --> 0:05:17.674 around what you previously had as a couple or the 0:05:17.674 --> 0:05:20.154 fact that you're still parents. It is all coming down 0:05:20.234 --> 0:05:21.594 to the nitty gritty, and. 0:05:21.553 --> 0:05:25.954 It must feel very weird and exposing having strangers talking 0:05:25.993 --> 0:05:29.674 to each other in legal terms about something as personal 0:05:29.953 --> 0:05:33.914 and private and precious once as your marriage. 0:05:34.274 --> 0:05:36.354 Oh, it's they're just picking the bones out of it, 0:05:36.513 --> 0:05:38.674 I think, And you know I was. I was very lucky. 0:05:38.674 --> 0:05:41.753 I had a fabulous female lawyer and she was very fair. 0:05:42.154 --> 0:05:44.594 But there are moments, certainly when you're in a room 0:05:44.953 --> 0:05:47.753 with others and lawyers are talking about your life and 0:05:47.834 --> 0:05:50.633 you're part in the relationship where you just go got 0:05:50.674 --> 0:05:53.713 my rose quarts in my hand to bring in the love, 0:05:53.794 --> 0:05:55.513 but now I just maybe want to throw it at 0:05:55.513 --> 0:05:58.753 your head. You know, you kind of have those moments 0:05:58.794 --> 0:06:01.193 and it's all surreal. It's all very surreal in those 0:06:01.193 --> 0:06:03.354 first few months. But yeah, going back to getting into 0:06:03.393 --> 0:06:08.354 that uber, had the first horrendous exchange, decided to have 0:06:08.393 --> 0:06:10.753 a bit of vodka in the forty five minute trip 0:06:10.794 --> 0:06:13.474 to Lax, And it's somewhere in that sort of moment 0:06:13.553 --> 0:06:15.553 I decided, instead of having the value and I was 0:06:15.594 --> 0:06:17.674 going to have on the plane because I'm a nervous flyer, 0:06:18.274 --> 0:06:20.074 I sort of knocked about with a bit of vodka 0:06:20.154 --> 0:06:22.633 and then we got to Lax And that's sort of 0:06:22.633 --> 0:06:23.994 as much as I remember till the. 0:06:23.953 --> 0:06:25.753 Next day when you woke up. 0:06:25.953 --> 0:06:29.113 We're in a hotel, not on the flight, and I 0:06:29.234 --> 0:06:32.914 was in quantus pajamas that I hadn't put on, so 0:06:32.993 --> 0:06:36.154 there'd been a bit of a blackout situation. I did 0:06:36.234 --> 0:06:39.513 manage to get through the security being pushed in the wheelchair. 0:06:39.794 --> 0:06:43.753 Who explained what had happened in that blackout gap and 0:06:43.753 --> 0:06:44.674 what did they tell you? 0:06:45.513 --> 0:06:48.393 Two friends, two colleagues while who were like friends and family, 0:06:48.594 --> 0:06:51.274 and yeah, they just said, you just went floppy, and 0:06:51.313 --> 0:06:54.354 we just sort of, you know, commandeered a wheelchair, put 0:06:54.354 --> 0:06:56.433 the sunglasses on and hope for the best to get 0:06:56.433 --> 0:06:59.634 you through security. And anyone who's been to an American airport. 0:06:59.914 --> 0:07:01.954 They're pretty scary. I don't like a bed the best 0:07:01.953 --> 0:07:03.794 of time, so I'm amazed I got through. 0:07:04.154 --> 0:07:06.073 But yeah, I got as far as the lounge and 0:07:06.154 --> 0:07:10.953 wasn't very unwell in the bathroom. Not my finest moment, sorry, quantas, 0:07:11.354 --> 0:07:13.634 and was deemed unfit to get on the flight. 0:07:14.393 --> 0:07:17.833 And your friends had to undress you, put you in 0:07:17.874 --> 0:07:19.514 the show and wash the vomit out of your hair. 0:07:19.674 --> 0:07:22.394 Yes, not my finest moment, not. 0:07:22.393 --> 0:07:26.114 My butens good friends, and what a great way to 0:07:26.154 --> 0:07:27.593 start the movie version of the book. 0:07:28.354 --> 0:07:31.234 It's so true. It's a good scene, isn't It's a 0:07:31.274 --> 0:07:31.834 good scene. 0:07:31.874 --> 0:07:33.394 And since the book's been out, I've had quite a 0:07:33.434 --> 0:07:36.634 few ladies reach out who've had similar not at lax, 0:07:36.994 --> 0:07:40.713 but similar, you know, maybe more more alcohol and food 0:07:40.914 --> 0:07:43.074 scenarios that have happened and hit them like a ton 0:07:43.074 --> 0:07:45.554 of bricks, sort of going through the early stages of 0:07:45.554 --> 0:07:46.474 the separation too. 0:07:46.594 --> 0:07:48.953 So yeah, not my finest moment. 0:07:49.514 --> 0:07:52.714 When you tell people that your marriage is over and 0:07:52.714 --> 0:07:56.794 that you're getting a divorce, the first thing they say 0:07:57.794 --> 0:08:02.514 is why, what happened? What went wrong? What answer did 0:08:02.554 --> 0:08:06.994 you develop that you could wheel out in all those conversations. 0:08:07.354 --> 0:08:10.754 Look, I think our relationship had been we'd had a 0:08:10.794 --> 0:08:13.754 couple of trial separations in the lead up, and I 0:08:13.794 --> 0:08:17.634 think those close could see where we were going, and 0:08:17.674 --> 0:08:19.594 there was no big drama towards the end. 0:08:19.674 --> 0:08:21.154 I think it was just a case. 0:08:20.914 --> 0:08:24.434 Of we've really given this a good go for thirteen 0:08:24.514 --> 0:08:26.994 years and there is no point now where I, like, 0:08:27.194 --> 0:08:29.314 you know, wake at night. I can't speak for my 0:08:29.434 --> 0:08:31.634 X husband, but there's no point where I think we 0:08:31.714 --> 0:08:32.314 didn't try. 0:08:32.874 --> 0:08:34.473 You know, I think one of maybe. 0:08:34.234 --> 0:08:36.593 The first sort of one or two separations, you go, 0:08:37.074 --> 0:08:38.754 there's still something, it's not over. 0:08:38.914 --> 0:08:40.594 We've got a child together, we can do this. 0:08:40.834 --> 0:08:40.994 Well. 0:08:41.074 --> 0:08:44.034 You go back, Yeah, you go back, and I think 0:08:44.114 --> 0:08:47.594 we had just grown apart and it was ripping the 0:08:47.594 --> 0:08:50.674 band aid off because you do have that Is this 0:08:50.794 --> 0:08:53.554 as good as it gets? Is this just life? Or 0:08:53.674 --> 0:08:56.634 is there more to life? And you know, should we 0:08:56.674 --> 0:08:57.634 call it so? 0:08:57.714 --> 0:08:57.914 Yeah? 0:08:57.914 --> 0:09:01.554 But it's absolutely never easy telling someone that your marriage 0:09:01.554 --> 0:09:03.954 has ended. It's not a high five moment. 0:09:04.954 --> 0:09:09.234 People often project onto you their own situation. So part 0:09:09.274 --> 0:09:11.074 of why they ask you why this is people that 0:09:11.114 --> 0:09:15.154 don't know you very well, is to just go wait, why, 0:09:15.594 --> 0:09:17.474 like should mine end. What does this mean for me? 0:09:17.634 --> 0:09:21.554 It must test Yeah, yeah, what actually was it? And 0:09:21.634 --> 0:09:24.874 if it's not there was another person, there was a betrayal. 0:09:25.954 --> 0:09:28.674 It's harder to explain, isn't it. Particularly when there's a 0:09:28.674 --> 0:09:29.594 young child involved. 0:09:29.874 --> 0:09:30.954 It's really hard. 0:09:31.034 --> 0:09:34.234 And also I was really mindful, I think, because we'd 0:09:34.234 --> 0:09:37.794 had a couple of splits and I had the initial 0:09:37.834 --> 0:09:40.833 shock of thinking shared friends were shared friends, and then 0:09:40.834 --> 0:09:43.474 when it ended, going oh, you've gone to that side 0:09:43.474 --> 0:09:43.954 of the room. 0:09:44.514 --> 0:09:45.834 I'm at the other end of the room. 0:09:46.114 --> 0:09:49.194 So I think I'd had that experience of knowing some 0:09:49.234 --> 0:09:51.634 of those things were ahead when we finally ended, And 0:09:51.674 --> 0:09:54.474 so I just really brought like my gang in close 0:09:54.594 --> 0:09:57.914 and tight and just sort of, you know, as cheesy 0:09:57.954 --> 0:10:01.394 as it sounded, you know, I surrounded myself with bright, 0:10:01.514 --> 0:10:04.034 shiny people who were just going to make getting out 0:10:04.034 --> 0:10:05.794 of bed in the morning easier. 0:10:06.514 --> 0:10:08.314 And I call it ghouls, you know, like. 0:10:08.274 --> 0:10:10.274 Sort of people that suddenly reach out on Facebook. You 0:10:10.434 --> 0:10:13.154 I haven't seen you for ages, but suddenly you're reaching 0:10:13.194 --> 0:10:15.834 out and concerned and you just want the story. And 0:10:15.914 --> 0:10:18.034 I don't want to have to give it energy or 0:10:18.034 --> 0:10:21.074 relive it for you to go. Oh, you know, so 0:10:21.234 --> 0:10:24.194 and I say that in the book keep your network tight, 0:10:24.674 --> 0:10:25.474 especially in those. 0:10:25.354 --> 0:10:28.434 Early days, because you're all over the shop or I was. Anyway, 0:10:28.554 --> 0:10:30.074 it's like being and I've been warned, isn't it. 0:10:30.194 --> 0:10:35.274 Yes today, and they're like, oh, I just heard, You're right, 0:10:36.034 --> 0:10:37.954 you know what. Actually I was, it's like when someone 0:10:38.114 --> 0:10:40.234 like my mum yesterday goes you look tired, you go 0:10:40.274 --> 0:10:43.834 suddenly feel tired, sort of stay away from that. So yeah, 0:10:43.834 --> 0:10:48.394 that's it was more the moments that I wasn't expecting 0:10:48.434 --> 0:10:51.154 to feel upset about saying the marriage was over, like 0:10:51.194 --> 0:10:54.114 being in medicare having to change my card I Bursted 0:10:54.194 --> 0:10:56.474 tears with a woman, or having to go to school 0:10:57.114 --> 0:11:00.634 and say, oh, can we have two reports now? And 0:11:00.994 --> 0:11:04.114 if this can come to this address and when it's school, 0:11:04.314 --> 0:11:06.874 you know, kind of meeting teacher time, can we have 0:11:06.914 --> 0:11:09.354 two instead of what that stuff? 0:11:09.474 --> 0:11:11.234 Oh, it's just crushing. 0:11:11.314 --> 0:11:15.914 Because that's in situations where it's not personal friends or whatever. 0:11:16.634 --> 0:11:17.834 And then do you get that. 0:11:17.714 --> 0:11:20.154 Sort of head tilt Yeah, are you okay? 0:11:20.434 --> 0:11:21.274 Yeah? 0:11:21.314 --> 0:11:23.514 And you're like, you know, even we were saying off, Mike, 0:11:23.554 --> 0:11:26.234 I've got a lady procedure tomorrow and I'm filling out 0:11:26.274 --> 0:11:29.314 like you know the thesis for like the hospital and 0:11:29.354 --> 0:11:32.314 they want to know my status and I'm married, divorce single. 0:11:32.354 --> 0:11:34.674 I'm like, why is that even a box? How is 0:11:34.714 --> 0:11:38.074 that relevant? Yeah? Divorced? Why is divorced a box? 0:11:38.114 --> 0:11:38.314 You know? 0:11:38.634 --> 0:11:40.674 So for me when I there was a couple of 0:11:40.754 --> 0:11:43.674 names for the book, but currently between husbands is I'm 0:11:43.674 --> 0:11:45.874 a pretty positive person. And when people say to me, 0:11:46.274 --> 0:11:48.434 are you married? I don't like the word divorced, So 0:11:48.474 --> 0:11:51.714 I go, I'm currently between husbands and that's my stick, that's. 0:11:51.514 --> 0:11:52.834 My half glass fault. 0:11:52.874 --> 0:11:55.714 Yeah, you know, rather than you I'm divorced because it 0:11:55.754 --> 0:11:58.674 sounds like I failed, and you know what I didn't. 0:11:58.754 --> 0:12:00.794 You know, I had a thirteen year effort with someone 0:12:00.834 --> 0:12:03.634 I loved for most of that thirteen years, and we've 0:12:03.674 --> 0:12:06.194 got a great son, So I don't see that as failing. 0:12:07.354 --> 0:12:11.394 When you talk about how you felt in that time 0:12:11.714 --> 0:12:14.994 after your rock bottom in Lax and the couple of 0:12:15.074 --> 0:12:18.754 months leading up to that and the year really afterwards, 0:12:19.274 --> 0:12:20.994 there's a lot of crying. There's a lot of crying 0:12:21.074 --> 0:12:23.474 in the shower. You have a small child, so you 0:12:23.554 --> 0:12:27.914 find places to cry quietly. Someone who has maybe not 0:12:27.994 --> 0:12:32.234 been through that before might think, well, you're not in 0:12:32.274 --> 0:12:35.594 love with him anymore. You know that the marriage ending 0:12:35.634 --> 0:12:39.314 is the right thing. What are you crying about? I 0:12:39.354 --> 0:12:42.234 think for me, you're crying for the loss of identity. 0:12:42.394 --> 0:12:44.034 You're crying for the family unit. 0:12:44.194 --> 0:12:47.234 You're crying for that, you know, dancing off into the sunset. 0:12:47.274 --> 0:12:51.754 After fifty years married, A lot changes in that first 0:12:51.834 --> 0:12:53.953 For me, it was eighteen months, might be twelve months, 0:12:54.034 --> 0:12:55.794 might be two years, might be however long. 0:12:55.674 --> 0:12:57.034 For whoever else is going through it. 0:12:57.434 --> 0:13:00.514 But for me, you know, my family home changed, my 0:13:00.674 --> 0:13:05.074 location changed, my job changed, my title changed. I was 0:13:05.714 --> 0:13:09.714 very much someone's wife. I wasn't anymore. I was suddenly 0:13:09.714 --> 0:13:13.114 aware that I was, like, who the fuck was I? 0:13:13.114 --> 0:13:16.554 I'd been somebody's partner for thirteen years, you know, and 0:13:16.634 --> 0:13:19.634 even going to the park because Lewis was five. 0:13:19.754 --> 0:13:21.434 I'm so happy I don't have to go to the 0:13:21.434 --> 0:13:22.114 park anymore. 0:13:22.234 --> 0:13:23.914 But in those times where you were like, all right, 0:13:23.954 --> 0:13:26.234 I've got Saturday to Phil, I'll do an hour in 0:13:26.234 --> 0:13:28.154 the park, you know, like you bang, bang bang, I'm 0:13:28.194 --> 0:13:30.354 going to fill it out. And you'd be pushing him 0:13:30.394 --> 0:13:32.874 on the swings and some guy be talking, pushing his sunny. 0:13:33.674 --> 0:13:35.674 Suddenly the wife comes over with the coffees and looks 0:13:35.714 --> 0:13:37.274 at you spots you've got no ring and You're like, 0:13:37.314 --> 0:13:38.594 I'm not running on your husband. 0:13:38.994 --> 0:13:40.394 I'm just trying to fill two hours. 0:13:40.754 --> 0:13:42.874 But you know, those are the things where I suddenly 0:13:42.954 --> 0:13:46.754 felt really exposed. And I never cared about my rings, 0:13:47.514 --> 0:13:49.594 you know, really wasn't someone who was all about the 0:13:49.634 --> 0:13:53.034 wedding rings and then taking them off. And I don't know, 0:13:53.154 --> 0:13:55.434 there was things like that that I was not expecting. 0:13:55.554 --> 0:13:58.594 So they're the moments that you cry. They're the moments 0:13:58.594 --> 0:14:00.833 that you just go, I just didn't expect to be here. 0:14:00.914 --> 0:14:03.274 I've just turned forty. This was not how I saw 0:14:03.354 --> 0:14:07.434 my movie ending, you know, so I think I think 0:14:07.514 --> 0:14:10.434 the tears come at at different times for different people. 0:14:11.074 --> 0:14:15.074 How did you know it wasn't just another separation if 0:14:15.074 --> 0:14:16.394 it had been on again, off again? 0:14:16.634 --> 0:14:19.674 Yeah, when did you know? Oh this is really it? 0:14:21.314 --> 0:14:24.314 I think when you start to move out, when you 0:14:24.354 --> 0:14:27.434 start to just you know, like those signs. I love 0:14:27.434 --> 0:14:29.994 those signs on the Australian Freeway, wrong way, go back 0:14:30.114 --> 0:14:32.234 in case you're turning, No, don't turn that way, that's 0:14:32.234 --> 0:14:34.474 the wrong way. And I kept having moments of those, No, 0:14:34.594 --> 0:14:38.394 that is done. I'm really bad at letting go of 0:14:38.514 --> 0:14:41.954 love and people. So for me, I found that hard, 0:14:42.194 --> 0:14:44.314 but you do. You just have to let go and 0:14:44.394 --> 0:14:47.194 know that it's ran its course and you take the 0:14:47.274 --> 0:14:49.234 rose colored glasses off. And I look at the last 0:14:49.234 --> 0:14:52.114 sa twelve months of our relationship, and we were starting 0:14:52.114 --> 0:14:54.594 to be ships in the night. He liked to surf, 0:14:54.674 --> 0:14:56.714 so he'd do a surfing holiday. I'd do a holiday 0:14:56.714 --> 0:14:58.994 with the girls or a retreat. You know, he would 0:14:58.994 --> 0:15:02.114 be working nights. I would be doing this. Suddenly, are 0:15:02.154 --> 0:15:03.834 you sleep in the spare room because you're going to 0:15:03.834 --> 0:15:06.274 be home late from that game? And you know, suddenly 0:15:06.434 --> 0:15:09.914 you're you know, it's that sitting down at the dinner table, 0:15:09.954 --> 0:15:12.274 isn't it? And going I mean I could talk underwater, 0:15:12.314 --> 0:15:14.754 I talk the hind legs of a donkey, and I 0:15:14.754 --> 0:15:16.514 don't really know what we're going to talk about. You know, 0:15:16.794 --> 0:15:19.474 they're the moments where you go, No, seven years down 0:15:19.554 --> 0:15:22.994 the track, there's much more clarity about it really was time. 0:15:23.314 --> 0:15:24.714 But yeah, that was how it was for me. 0:15:25.674 --> 0:15:29.354 How did you find only being with your son for 0:15:29.474 --> 0:15:33.314 part of the time, Like, how did you navigate custody? 0:15:33.354 --> 0:15:34.274 Did you do shared? 0:15:34.754 --> 0:15:37.554 Yeah, that's one thing we never had a problem with 0:15:37.714 --> 0:15:39.674 For the first a year at least we were in 0:15:39.714 --> 0:15:42.114 the same kind of suburb. I moved slightly, you know, 0:15:42.154 --> 0:15:44.514 to the next suburb on the northern Beaches. We were 0:15:44.554 --> 0:15:47.554 always right from the start, fifty to fifty. Andrew's a 0:15:47.554 --> 0:15:51.394 fabulous dad. You know, our relationship didn't work, not his 0:15:51.514 --> 0:15:53.634 relationship as a father or mine as a mother. So 0:15:53.714 --> 0:15:55.354 I think for us it was quite easy for it 0:15:55.394 --> 0:15:57.034 to be black and white and fifty to fifty. 0:15:57.314 --> 0:16:00.754 But no one goes into having a child thinking I'll 0:16:00.754 --> 0:16:03.034 be with my child fifty percent of the time. So 0:16:03.074 --> 0:16:05.114 tell me about that adjustment. 0:16:04.714 --> 0:16:07.394 Just for you, for me, And I know you know 0:16:07.434 --> 0:16:09.754 her too, just in Culor. She gave me the greatest 0:16:09.794 --> 0:16:12.594 piece of advice early on. She's not being divorced, but 0:16:12.634 --> 0:16:15.314 she'd been separated from a you know, the father of 0:16:15.634 --> 0:16:18.194 two of her children. And she said to me once 0:16:18.234 --> 0:16:20.594 when I was probably crying into a glass of wine. 0:16:20.914 --> 0:16:24.554 When Lewis leaves your care, remember you have no control 0:16:24.594 --> 0:16:26.954 over what he hears, what he sees, what he eats, 0:16:26.954 --> 0:16:29.634 what time he goes to bed, who he's around. 0:16:30.114 --> 0:16:30.434 Wow. 0:16:30.714 --> 0:16:33.914 But you know, apart from you, he's with the other 0:16:33.994 --> 0:16:36.274 person in the world that loves him as much as 0:16:36.314 --> 0:16:39.674 you do. And I just even say it out loud 0:16:39.674 --> 0:16:43.074 and I go, oh, to wait off your shelters. 0:16:43.154 --> 0:16:44.274 Yeah, because you can't. 0:16:44.514 --> 0:16:47.714 I can't control any of that and that idea that 0:16:47.874 --> 0:16:51.114 people have that we have to be consistent. So everything 0:16:51.154 --> 0:16:53.354 that I do and all the rules I have, you 0:16:53.514 --> 0:16:54.794 have to have the same ones. 0:16:55.594 --> 0:16:58.594 But that's not necessarily the case. It's not right or wrong. 0:16:58.634 --> 0:17:00.194 And you know, I might want him in bed at 0:17:00.234 --> 0:17:02.674 eight and he might be up till nine with you 0:17:02.754 --> 0:17:05.234 and your your family might be down and they're up late. 0:17:05.634 --> 0:17:08.314 And also it's none of my business. You know, you're 0:17:08.354 --> 0:17:10.634 not taking to the cross, you're not shooting up drugs. 0:17:10.674 --> 0:17:13.234 You know, you'd kind of if you're giving him sugar, well, 0:17:13.234 --> 0:17:14.794 that's on your watch because he'll be up in the 0:17:14.794 --> 0:17:16.594 middle of the night waking you up. 0:17:16.954 --> 0:17:18.634 But that was a game changer for me. 0:17:19.394 --> 0:17:23.714 What I found probably harder was not my time with Lewis, 0:17:23.754 --> 0:17:24.874 but my time without him. 0:17:25.034 --> 0:17:28.394 Yeah, you know, because you just go, oh, is not here, Oh, 0:17:28.514 --> 0:17:30.674 it's not here, Like I'm a mother without a child. 0:17:30.914 --> 0:17:33.594 Yes, you know, And that there's a flip side. 0:17:33.634 --> 0:17:35.234 You can stay up later and you can you know, 0:17:35.274 --> 0:17:36.793 you can have a tin of tuna out of the 0:17:36.794 --> 0:17:38.593 can for your dinner if that's all you want, and 0:17:38.634 --> 0:17:40.834 not have to concern yourself with bedtimes and reading and 0:17:40.874 --> 0:17:43.954 all that stuff. But it can be a really lonely 0:17:44.074 --> 0:17:47.354 time because not only are you trying to navigate the 0:17:47.474 --> 0:17:51.434 new you that you've not got this wing person. 0:17:51.194 --> 0:17:53.553 Or people if you've got, you know, multiple children that. 0:17:54.514 --> 0:17:56.674 Can bring you joy or give you that hug or 0:17:56.674 --> 0:17:58.634 stop you from crying because you've got to be on 0:17:58.874 --> 0:18:00.474 you know, you've got a five year old. 0:18:00.554 --> 0:18:03.273 So I found the identity thing quite hard. It's like, 0:18:03.314 --> 0:18:06.914 I'm a mother whose child is not with me now 0:18:07.234 --> 0:18:09.234 and it's a different feeling to when they're at daycare 0:18:09.314 --> 0:18:10.234 or when they're at school. 0:18:11.114 --> 0:18:11.314 Yeah. 0:18:11.354 --> 0:18:12.514 I found the. 0:18:12.234 --> 0:18:15.194 Gear change of it, yeah, to be really challenging, certainly 0:18:15.234 --> 0:18:15.794 at first. 0:18:16.114 --> 0:18:18.434 Yeah, and it gets get used to it, you know, 0:18:18.714 --> 0:18:19.434 you totally do. 0:18:19.594 --> 0:18:21.914 And Lewis is now at thirteen and he's got his 0:18:21.994 --> 0:18:24.314 phone and oh, you're meant to be with me tonight, 0:18:24.354 --> 0:18:26.674 but you want to do that with da cool, no problem, 0:18:26.794 --> 0:18:28.674 I'll just put you know, dinner back in the freeze 0:18:28.754 --> 0:18:30.634 or whatever it is. And you do navigate it in 0:18:30.674 --> 0:18:33.234 an easier way. But it's really tough in the start. 0:18:33.834 --> 0:18:37.394 Did you want to have more kids? I'm not majorly maternal. 0:18:37.634 --> 0:18:38.634 I always used to laugh. 0:18:38.474 --> 0:18:40.194 With people say do you like kids? I'd be like, yeah, 0:18:40.274 --> 0:18:41.274 I couldn't it the whole one. 0:18:42.634 --> 0:18:45.114 I like children. I sound it such a cow. I 0:18:45.234 --> 0:18:45.754 like children. 0:18:45.794 --> 0:18:49.033 Once there's that communication, so from like once we're at 0:18:49.034 --> 0:18:50.474 school and you can have a bit of a chat 0:18:50.554 --> 0:18:54.154