1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:02,800 Speaker 1: This episode of Seize the A is brought to you 2 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:06,200 Speaker 1: by zero online accounting software that helps you do business 3 00:00:06,320 --> 00:00:06,880 Speaker 1: but better. 4 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:08,760 Speaker 2: I've never regretted anything I've done. 5 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:11,400 Speaker 3: I've made bad decisions, but that's not to say I've 6 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:15,520 Speaker 3: necessarily regretted it, right, because everything has contributed to what 7 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:18,319 Speaker 3: my story is, and I'm still writing my story. I 8 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 3: don't know if you ever do have that aha moment 9 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:22,600 Speaker 3: that my life makes sense. I think that's a very 10 00:00:22,640 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 3: simplistic way of looking at life. Life is about moments. 11 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:29,880 Speaker 3: It's about opportunities. It's about seizing those opportunities and enjoying it. 12 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Sees the YA Podcast. Busy and happy 13 00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 1: are not the same thing. We too rarely question what 14 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:39,839 Speaker 1: makes the heart seeing. We work, then we rest, but 15 00:00:40,040 --> 00:00:43,120 Speaker 1: rarely we play and often don't realize there's more than 16 00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:45,920 Speaker 1: one way. So this is the platform to hear and 17 00:00:46,080 --> 00:00:49,440 Speaker 1: explore the stories of those who found lives. They adore, 18 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: the good, bad and ugly. The best and worst days 19 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 1: will bear all the facets of Seizing your YA. I'm 20 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:00,320 Speaker 1: Sarah Davidson or A spoonful of Sarah, a lawyer turned 21 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:03,160 Speaker 1: funentrepreneurs who swapped the suits and heels to co found, 22 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:06,880 Speaker 1: matcha Maiden and matcha Milk bar CZA is a series 23 00:01:06,920 --> 00:01:10,000 Speaker 1: of conversations on finding a life you love and exploring 24 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:13,600 Speaker 1: the self doubt, challenge, joy and fulfillment along the way. 25 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: Lovely yighborhood. How crazy but wonderful that we've made it 26 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:23,440 Speaker 1: to Easter already. I hope you're all looking forward to 27 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:27,600 Speaker 1: a long weekend and have some playta scheduled in this week. 28 00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 1: I've got the second guest, who was originally scheduled in 29 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 1: for International Women's Day, who is an incredibly inspiring and 30 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 1: powerful woman and who you'll very soon hear is well 31 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:40,039 Speaker 1: worth the wait. If you've been listening long enough to 32 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:42,480 Speaker 1: know a bit about how my brain works, you'll probably 33 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:45,840 Speaker 1: notice as quickly as I did, how similarly Raver Keeley 34 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,720 Speaker 1: and I think with many parallels earlier on in our 35 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:52,480 Speaker 1: story starting studies in law to gratify our inner nerds, 36 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:56,840 Speaker 1: Ray however, went off on an equally nonlinear but completely 37 00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:00,240 Speaker 1: different pathway that in a parallel universe would pretty much 38 00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:03,640 Speaker 1: be my absolute dream life. I'll let her tell you 39 00:02:03,680 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 1: most of it herself, particularly because it's her very first podcast. 40 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:11,560 Speaker 1: I have no idea how she's remained such an undiscovered gem. 41 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,280 Speaker 1: So it's my privilege to bring you her fascinating story 42 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:18,640 Speaker 1: for the first time. But to give you a little 43 00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 1: sneak peek, let's just say. She's an Ivy League graduate 44 00:02:21,560 --> 00:02:25,120 Speaker 1: from Yale University. Worked in the International Criminal Court for 45 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:29,440 Speaker 1: Sierra Leone, has an MBA from Stanford. Worked as Anna 46 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:33,320 Speaker 1: Wintour's assistant, the editor in chief of Vogue, Living the 47 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:36,800 Speaker 1: Devil Weares Prita out in real life, moved from New 48 00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:40,359 Speaker 1: York into startups in London, and has now moved back 49 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 1: home to Sydney, and she's just getting started. Buckle in 50 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:47,880 Speaker 1: for a serious dose of inspiration and just a quick note. 51 00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:50,760 Speaker 1: About ten minutes in the battery in Ray's headphones died, 52 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:53,359 Speaker 1: so the sound changes a little bit, but it becomes 53 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:57,639 Speaker 1: more clear after that. Ray Verkiley, welcome to Seize the 54 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:00,640 Speaker 1: A or sees the Ray Should I say thank you? 55 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:03,000 Speaker 3: Very excited. It's my first podcast. 56 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,720 Speaker 1: I know, I still can't believe that, and I'm so 57 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 1: honored to be your first podcast. This is amazing. 58 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:11,799 Speaker 3: It's the first for everything. 59 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 1: I just don't get it, because you have such a 60 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 1: uniquely interesting and inspiring story and I just don't know 61 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:23,360 Speaker 1: how you've remained such an undiscovered gem. 62 00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 3: I don't know. I think I feel a bit weird 63 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:28,800 Speaker 3: talking about myself when it's your life. I think you 64 00:03:28,960 --> 00:03:31,840 Speaker 3: just don't really think about sharing it. I don't know. 65 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:35,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's so interesting that you said that, because one 66 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:36,440 Speaker 1: of the things we talk about a lot, and that 67 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 1: we'll obviously talk about today is self doubt and the 68 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,560 Speaker 1: imposter syndrome and how it skews our view of our 69 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 1: own achievements and leads us to really play them down 70 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:48,480 Speaker 1: because I think we tend to believe that if we've 71 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:50,280 Speaker 1: done it, it couldn't have been that hard, so why would 72 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:53,600 Speaker 1: it be interesting? But you have the most interesting story, 73 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:56,040 Speaker 1: and I still don't understand how no one's discovered you. 74 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:58,520 Speaker 1: So it really is such an honor to have you 75 00:03:58,560 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 1: here today. 76 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:01,400 Speaker 3: Thank you, And yeah, you're definitely right, I think I 77 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 3: think when you're not just a high achiever, but that 78 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 3: imposter syndrome is definitely something that I've experienced in my life, 79 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:11,920 Speaker 3: always feeling like every chapter is an absolute fluke of 80 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:12,480 Speaker 3: a chance. 81 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:13,800 Speaker 1: Definitely. 82 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:16,240 Speaker 3: Then along and you're like, oh, it can't be that 83 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:18,880 Speaker 3: much if it happened like three or four times in 84 00:04:18,920 --> 00:04:19,479 Speaker 3: a row, and. 85 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:25,640 Speaker 1: As we'll hear, that extraordinarily high achieving nature of yours 86 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:28,440 Speaker 1: really started all the way back in the early days. 87 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:31,000 Speaker 1: Such an a type personality which I can identify with 88 00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 1: so strongly. But before we kick off with the story, 89 00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 1: I love to start every episode by asking everyone what 90 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:39,320 Speaker 1: the most down to earth thing is about them, just 91 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:41,760 Speaker 1: to kind of break the ice. And even if none 92 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 1: of us have heard you on a podcast before, a 93 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:47,640 Speaker 1: mere look at your LinkedIn alone reveals a very impressive 94 00:04:47,640 --> 00:04:51,640 Speaker 1: list of amazing achievements, which could easily lead people to 95 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 1: believe that you're some kind of superhuman that no one 96 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 1: can relate to in any way. I definitely feel like 97 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:58,839 Speaker 1: you're a bit of a superwoman. So what's something really 98 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 1: normal about you? 99 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:03,920 Speaker 3: Gosh, definitely not true, and I think I'm very normal, 100 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:06,720 Speaker 3: not extraordinary. 101 00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:06,839 Speaker 2: But I guess. 102 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:08,920 Speaker 3: Look, I love Harry Potter. I know a lot of 103 00:05:08,920 --> 00:05:11,479 Speaker 3: people can relate to that. Something else might be a 104 00:05:11,480 --> 00:05:14,719 Speaker 3: bit polarizing, I guess, But I love cats like a crazy, 105 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 3: crazy cat lady. 106 00:05:17,320 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: Wait, so should we even bother? Continuing with this conversation. 107 00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 3: Golden Retriever puppies love Golden Retriever puppies. 108 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 1: Oh, well, you've just redeemed yourself my golden Retriever sitting 109 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 1: right next to me heaven and back to Harry Potter. 110 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:33,159 Speaker 1: I feel like it's such a universal leveler like people 111 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: all around the world. As soon as you say that, 112 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:39,240 Speaker 1: it breaks down all cultural barriers, age barriers, language barriers. 113 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:40,599 Speaker 1: What house are you? 114 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:43,000 Speaker 3: Look? I've always thought I was raven Claw. 115 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:44,839 Speaker 1: I know you are a raven Claw. 116 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 3: Yeah. Do you think I do want it to be 117 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:51,479 Speaker 3: like Slytherin a little bit, a little bit naughty, but 118 00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:53,680 Speaker 3: my real goody two shoes. Yeah, I think I think 119 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 3: raven Claw. 120 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:59,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you're raven Claw too. Wow. See, it's 121 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:01,520 Speaker 1: just like a languide that everyone can understand. 122 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:03,120 Speaker 3: What are you? 123 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 1: Oh, I'm Gryffindor, like something that. 124 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:06,600 Speaker 3: Everyone can stay Gryffindor like. 125 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:07,719 Speaker 2: I'd love to speak Gryfindor. 126 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, everyone wants to speak Gryndor. 127 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:11,560 Speaker 1: As opposed to what the sorting hat would actually say 128 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:15,920 Speaker 1: about you. I think I could be Ravenclaw definitely, Yeah, 129 00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:18,160 Speaker 1: I definitely could be. But I think what makes a 130 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 1: Gryffindor is that you would you know, you'd ask the 131 00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:22,840 Speaker 1: hat to make you one. I'd have to be one. 132 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 1: I think i'd have to ask. 133 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, no, you see, I definitely wouldn't. 134 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:30,640 Speaker 1: But yeah, well that's why you're a raven claw. So 135 00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 1: the very first section is your Wayta, which is where 136 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 1: we trace back right back from the very beginning, all 137 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:38,840 Speaker 1: the chapters and all the different phases you went through, 138 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:41,480 Speaker 1: because I think we get introduced to people by their 139 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:44,000 Speaker 1: current titles, and you know, just getting a quick bio 140 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:46,960 Speaker 1: from a friend or in your case, a former guest 141 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 1: Michelle battersby one of your best friends who introduced me 142 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 1: to you. You know, you hear what you do now 143 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:56,279 Speaker 1: and all these incredibly impressive and purposeful things. But it's 144 00:06:56,279 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 1: so easy to skate over the many, many chapters and 145 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:01,320 Speaker 1: the fact that many you had no idea what your 146 00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:02,920 Speaker 1: purpose was or where you were going at all. 147 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:06,479 Speaker 3: I still have no idea what you neither. It's a 148 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:09,720 Speaker 3: process as long as you embrace that and realize that 149 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 3: you have no idea where this chapter is going to 150 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,240 Speaker 3: take you. But so long as you give it your 151 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:16,840 Speaker 3: all and you try your hardest, it doesn't really matter 152 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 3: what the outcome is, because you can have the confidence 153 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 3: that you did your best. Yeah, I'm not take you 154 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 3: to the next chapter. 155 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:26,320 Speaker 1: And One of the things I talk about all the 156 00:07:26,400 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: time in this section is you don't have to see 157 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 1: the whole staircase to take the first step. You don't 158 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:33,880 Speaker 1: even have to know what the next step is. Everything 159 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:37,040 Speaker 1: in your life is a chapter and it's teaching you something, 160 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 1: even if you're not sure what that is. Which is 161 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:41,360 Speaker 1: why I think it's so important to go back to 162 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:43,600 Speaker 1: that very first step, to when you were a school 163 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:45,600 Speaker 1: kid and you didn't know what careers were and how 164 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 1: you made all those decisions, never envisioning that you would 165 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 1: end up where you have and who knows where you'll 166 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:54,760 Speaker 1: end up next. So take us back to young Ray 167 00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 1: at pinball, which is where you met Michelle, and I 168 00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 1: have to drop you in it head prefect and super 169 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 1: high achiever. 170 00:08:03,080 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, look from that intro, I think you 171 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:09,640 Speaker 3: can gather that I was a real nerd, probably didn't 172 00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 3: speak to a boy till I was in year twelve. 173 00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 3: Like my head was honestly always in the books, not 174 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:20,680 Speaker 3: for any reason other than the fact that I've always 175 00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 3: expected a lot from myself. Look, my parents immigrants. I 176 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 3: think like with that comes a lot of sort of 177 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:28,600 Speaker 3: things that probably a lot of people can relate to. 178 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 3: That are children of immigrant parents, like hard working, sort 179 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:36,599 Speaker 3: of real focus on your academic studies. I mean I 180 00:08:37,160 --> 00:08:39,920 Speaker 3: tried every single musical instrument there was. I think I played, like, 181 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 3: oh gosh, the flute, the piano, the violent, the cello, 182 00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:48,920 Speaker 3: even like literally everything. I was not musically gifted, even sports. 183 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:53,439 Speaker 3: Like I've always tried things right, tried every sport, tried 184 00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:56,120 Speaker 3: every musical instrument, and then some things have kind of 185 00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:59,600 Speaker 3: just stuck. So look, I really loved tennis, that kind 186 00:08:59,600 --> 00:09:04,000 Speaker 3: of stuff. I was very into drama and debating at school, 187 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:07,880 Speaker 3: so that's really stuck and sort of carried on into 188 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:10,160 Speaker 3: my UNI years as well. But I was a real 189 00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:12,320 Speaker 3: goal setter as well. Like one of the things that 190 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:15,520 Speaker 3: sort of I remember very clearly about my school years 191 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:17,280 Speaker 3: was these letters that I'd. 192 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 2: Write to myself. 193 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:22,000 Speaker 3: It sounds so nervy that I recount every landmark year. 194 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:27,200 Speaker 3: So year two, so you're moving into junior school. Year 195 00:09:27,280 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 3: six was a landmarkt because it's the last year of 196 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:34,000 Speaker 3: junior school year seven, moving into senior school year ten, 197 00:09:34,040 --> 00:09:36,480 Speaker 3: because you're moving into like the upper school. And then 198 00:09:36,880 --> 00:09:39,120 Speaker 3: in year eleven, I wrote another letter and like I 199 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:42,000 Speaker 3: would write like where I was in my life, who 200 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:44,160 Speaker 3: my friends were, what I thought I wanted to be 201 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:46,520 Speaker 3: when I was older, what I wanted to do, and 202 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:49,280 Speaker 3: it was kind of it was kind of a process 203 00:09:49,400 --> 00:09:52,839 Speaker 3: of manifestation that a kid you're not from about. I mean, 204 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 3: look for year two letter was basically mimicking what my 205 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 3: sister wanted to do in year because she was four 206 00:09:58,440 --> 00:09:59,880 Speaker 3: years older than me, so she would have been like, yes, 207 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:02,440 Speaker 3: So I think I wanted to be like a fashion designer. 208 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:06,520 Speaker 3: I loved Dolphin. I had like one friend that was 209 00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:08,440 Speaker 3: my best friend and I was never gonna have another 210 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:11,800 Speaker 3: friends just weird stuff like that. But by year seven, 211 00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:15,959 Speaker 3: it's funny, I still kept all these letters and it's 212 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 3: very much the process that I ended up taking in 213 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:24,440 Speaker 3: year twelve and the years sort of straight after your 214 00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:26,920 Speaker 3: twelveth So like I had my UAI on that piece 215 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 3: of paper and year in me like ten, I think, 216 00:10:29,320 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 3: or I probably had a bague one in year seven, 217 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:34,080 Speaker 3: but in year ten I had it to the like 218 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:38,120 Speaker 3: point that I actually got so yeah, I know it's crazy. 219 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:39,680 Speaker 3: And then I had that I wanted to go to Yale. 220 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 3: I think I had that I wanted to be school 221 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:44,440 Speaker 3: catas like it sounds really nerdy. It's but when I 222 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 3: look at these, I'm just like, how did that happen? 223 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 1: And I think it's cause you wrote it down. 224 00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:50,720 Speaker 3: It's because you wrote it down. And when you write 225 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 3: it down, it just, all of a sudden, this thought 226 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:57,119 Speaker 3: in your head becomes something concrete that you can work towards. 227 00:10:57,200 --> 00:10:59,400 Speaker 3: And I think when you don't know what you want 228 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 3: to do, it's really scary to write the goals down, right, 229 00:11:02,200 --> 00:11:04,560 Speaker 3: because you're like, I just have no idea what I 230 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:06,760 Speaker 3: want to do. I don't even know what I want 231 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 3: to do next year, let alone in five years time. 232 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:12,559 Speaker 3: And that's something I felt was really difficult after I 233 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:14,800 Speaker 3: finish school, where you don't have these clear landmarks like 234 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 3: get this mark in this test or you know, get 235 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:21,719 Speaker 3: into this program at UNI, Like those are really clear goals, right, 236 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 3: but once you finish school, those landmark events are not 237 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 3: so clear. But again I find when you just put 238 00:11:28,920 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 3: pen to paper, things start like formulating. Right. So again, 239 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:34,240 Speaker 3: I still have no idea what I want to do 240 00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:38,160 Speaker 3: in the long but I've learned, yeah who does. But 241 00:11:38,200 --> 00:11:41,280 Speaker 3: I've learned to like break it up into into like 242 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 3: one year, three year, five year goals. You know they 243 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:46,360 Speaker 3: might change. But at least if they're there and they're 244 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 3: written down, you can work towards something and everything just 245 00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:53,440 Speaker 3: becomes a little clearer and a little less overwhelming. I 246 00:11:53,520 --> 00:11:56,600 Speaker 3: find to deal with because I'm also a very anxious person, 247 00:11:56,800 --> 00:12:00,559 Speaker 3: like have been all through school, and I just it's 248 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:02,880 Speaker 3: like it's a way to help break down the steps. 249 00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:04,840 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I feel like we're gonna hang up 250 00:12:04,920 --> 00:12:08,480 Speaker 1: right now. You've just summarized everything CZA is about. I 251 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:10,319 Speaker 1: also feel like we should be best friends, so look 252 00:12:10,400 --> 00:12:13,520 Speaker 1: with new parts of our stories are similar. I didn't 253 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:16,560 Speaker 1: quite write myself that letter in year two, but I 254 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:19,360 Speaker 1: was academic enough to be ducks as well, and also 255 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:22,680 Speaker 1: tried lots of different things and just to see what sticks. 256 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:25,920 Speaker 1: And you'll never find out the things that stick unless 257 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: you're also prepared to try stuff that might not stick 258 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:31,000 Speaker 1: and that you might never do again. It's all just 259 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:33,680 Speaker 1: this big chigsaw puzzle, and you're trying to put pieces 260 00:12:33,679 --> 00:12:35,920 Speaker 1: together and get rid of pieces that don't work or 261 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:38,679 Speaker 1: don't suit you. And I think it's so valuable what 262 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:41,920 Speaker 1: you said too, about the importance of just writing things 263 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:45,400 Speaker 1: down and breaking them down into smaller goals too. One 264 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:47,360 Speaker 1: of the things I talk about in the CZA book 265 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 1: is that it's so valuable to dream big beyond what's 266 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 1: possible for you, so that you know you have these 267 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:55,960 Speaker 1: huge visions for the future, but to break it down 268 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: into the right now or this week, this month, so 269 00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:01,959 Speaker 1: you actually feel like you're achieving things along the way 270 00:13:01,960 --> 00:13:03,920 Speaker 1: and it never overwhelms you too much so that you 271 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 1: don't get anywhere. So I think from a goal setting perspective, 272 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:09,760 Speaker 1: that technique is so valuable, and I can imagine it's 273 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:11,880 Speaker 1: helped you a lot to get to where you have. 274 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 3: One hundred percent, And I think to the flip side 275 00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:16,600 Speaker 3: of that, right, you should also have those big dreams, 276 00:13:16,640 --> 00:13:18,240 Speaker 3: like even if you don't know how you're going to 277 00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 3: get there, just having that in the ethos it's I 278 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 3: don't know, good good vibes, I guess, and then you'll 279 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:27,720 Speaker 3: just find that those smaller steps that you make will 280 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 3: eventually somehow culminate in that bigger goal, or maybe it 281 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 3: will take you somewhere else, but at least you have 282 00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:36,319 Speaker 3: a sense of direction for where you're actually going. And 283 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 3: I think what you were saying like about trying everything, 284 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:41,679 Speaker 3: like if you can put your pride aside, there's really 285 00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:44,360 Speaker 3: nothing to lose by trying. It's like, if you're not 286 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 3: in the race, you can't even win it. 287 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:49,120 Speaker 1: So, oh my gosh, that's one of my favorite quotes ever. Y. 288 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,520 Speaker 3: It's true though I know you're a big quote person, 289 00:13:52,559 --> 00:13:55,160 Speaker 3: but I'm a really big quote person too, And like, 290 00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:57,839 Speaker 3: I think my favorite one it's a quote by Roomy. 291 00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:01,840 Speaker 3: So my parents actually Rainian at version, how politically I 292 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:05,719 Speaker 3: get anyway, And there are very well known poets and 293 00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:09,840 Speaker 3: Rumy is one of these poets, and he has this 294 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:12,480 Speaker 3: sort of line that says, live life like everything's rooted 295 00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 3: in your favor. So for me, it's like, you know, 296 00:14:15,559 --> 00:14:18,079 Speaker 3: if you just have that optimism and sort of enter 297 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:21,400 Speaker 3: everything thinking that the best is going to work out. 298 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:23,520 Speaker 2: Just be bold, take a chance. 299 00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 3: Might not work out, but if you think that like 300 00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 3: fate or whatever it is, is on your side, you're 301 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:31,080 Speaker 3: a lot more likely to give it a go. That's 302 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:34,240 Speaker 3: kind of been my guiding philosophy in life. And I 303 00:14:34,280 --> 00:14:35,920 Speaker 3: think it sort of does go back to that if 304 00:14:35,920 --> 00:14:37,960 Speaker 3: you're not in it, like how will you even know 305 00:14:38,280 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 3: if you have a chance? 306 00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:42,360 Speaker 1: And I think that's such a powerful quote to come 307 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:46,080 Speaker 1: from someone who ended up with everyone's dream job as 308 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 1: assistant to the editor in chief of Vogue, the inimitable, 309 00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:51,720 Speaker 1: and a win Tour who's like the coin of the 310 00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:55,680 Speaker 1: entire universe, which I'm sure still blows your mind. But again, 311 00:14:56,080 --> 00:14:58,840 Speaker 1: someone had to get that job. And you're such a 312 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:01,600 Speaker 1: good example of the fact that if you don't apply, 313 00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:04,640 Speaker 1: there's no chance. So even if there's only a one 314 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:07,480 Speaker 1: percent chance of happening, if you put yourself forward, it 315 00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:09,000 Speaker 1: could actually happen. 316 00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:10,560 Speaker 2: And physically, I had. 317 00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 3: No idea I wanted to work at Vogue. That was 318 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 3: just me again, casting a wide net, trying a bunch 319 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,280 Speaker 3: of things, applying to a job at Vogue that I 320 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 3: didn't even really want. I mean, I don't know if 321 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:23,920 Speaker 3: we should go back a bit, but. 322 00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:26,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, let's go back. So before we get to the 323 00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:29,160 Speaker 1: Vogue chapter, let's go back to you mentioned that in 324 00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:31,640 Speaker 1: the letters, you know, you were often reflecting on what 325 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:34,080 Speaker 1: you thought you wanted to be. And I think one 326 00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 1: of the really big parts of our youth is translating 327 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:39,800 Speaker 1: the things that stick, the things that we enjoy, the 328 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:42,320 Speaker 1: things that we're good at, and putting that into some 329 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:44,400 Speaker 1: kind of career path, Like what are you actually going 330 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:46,880 Speaker 1: to do with all of that? And I wonder if 331 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 1: for you whether at some point, like it does for 332 00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:51,840 Speaker 1: many of us, you stop basing your decisions on what 333 00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 1: you're good at and what you like pretty straightforward, and 334 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:59,880 Speaker 1: start letting concepts blur that with societal norms, expectations, prey, 335 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:02,360 Speaker 1: and what you think is successful. 336 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:05,480 Speaker 3: I will say one thing is that my parents have 337 00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 3: never pressured me into doing what they thought or what 338 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 3: I thought was the right thing to do. My dad's 339 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,080 Speaker 3: an entrepreneur. He's always, you know, been very open of, 340 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 3: you know, trying your own things, starting your own business. 341 00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:21,560 Speaker 2: One thing that I found. 342 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 3: Difficult is that you just don't know what else is 343 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:26,320 Speaker 3: out there, right so at school, and I think this 344 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 3: is changing a little bit more at schools, and I'm 345 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:31,720 Speaker 3: happy to see that because you know, but at school, 346 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:36,200 Speaker 3: I really thought you could be a lawyer, adoptor, and 347 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:38,720 Speaker 3: like just don't know what else is out there. So 348 00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 3: it's really hard to even visualize that stuff when you 349 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:45,720 Speaker 3: don't yeah, you don't even know it exists. 350 00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:49,360 Speaker 2: So for me, it was, you know, what's the hardest course. 351 00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:52,960 Speaker 3: To get into again, because like a lawyer or adopt Okay, 352 00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:55,200 Speaker 3: so I don't want to be a doctor, although I did, 353 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:56,760 Speaker 3: I did think about it for a little bit. But 354 00:16:57,160 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 3: law was kind. 355 00:16:58,120 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 2: Of this idea in my head. 356 00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 3: I thought it was also the most applicable to different 357 00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 3: fields if I ever did want to go into different fields, 358 00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:05,440 Speaker 3: and you. 359 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:08,400 Speaker 1: Study law, right am I And that was my exact 360 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 1: justification for ending up there. 361 00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, and so and then you do. 362 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:14,400 Speaker 3: Wait. The scary thing is you do end up there, right, 363 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 3: and then you're in this path and you're like, oh, 364 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 3: I don't think this is what I want to do. 365 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:21,760 Speaker 3: But it then actually making the decision to leave that 366 00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:25,640 Speaker 3: becomes it's sort of like a proactive choice rather than 367 00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:27,520 Speaker 3: just sort of just going with the flow, which is 368 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:29,280 Speaker 3: kind of what I've been doing my whole life. 369 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:33,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I thought I wanted to be a lawyer. 370 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:35,480 Speaker 3: I thought I wanted to study law, and I did 371 00:17:35,520 --> 00:17:38,800 Speaker 3: get into law, and I think if I didn't get 372 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:43,120 Speaker 3: into Yale, I would definitely have been in a corporate 373 00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:45,760 Speaker 3: law firm, you know, And there's nothing wrong with that, 374 00:17:45,800 --> 00:17:48,160 Speaker 3: but I just it's just so crazy to think how 375 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:51,480 Speaker 3: different my path ended up being by the mere fact that, 376 00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:52,480 Speaker 3: you know, I. 377 00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:54,119 Speaker 2: Did end up going to Yale. I had a liberal 378 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:54,920 Speaker 2: arts education. 379 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:57,560 Speaker 3: I went and worked out in the real world, for 380 00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:00,200 Speaker 3: a few years and then was like, Okay. 381 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:02,359 Speaker 2: What do I want to do. Let's go back to school. 382 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:04,720 Speaker 2: And so the US system. 383 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:07,480 Speaker 3: Is really different to Australia or the UK in that 384 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:12,200 Speaker 3: sense because they really encouraged this sort of broad, try 385 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:16,760 Speaker 3: everything approach and then go and apply that approach, because 386 00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:18,960 Speaker 3: it's very difficult to get into grad school in the 387 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:22,439 Speaker 3: States straight out of the UNI, and actually for business 388 00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:25,879 Speaker 3: school it virtually never happens. The law school, sometimes it happened. 389 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:27,400 Speaker 3: I feel like a real genius. 390 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:31,040 Speaker 1: But they prefer well, you could have done it. 391 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:32,639 Speaker 2: I don't know. 392 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:35,159 Speaker 3: So in one of my letters, I did write that 393 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:36,840 Speaker 3: I wanted to go to Yale and I got to 394 00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:39,080 Speaker 3: year twelve, and I found it really overwhelming with the 395 00:18:39,240 --> 00:18:42,639 Speaker 3: HC and the whole US application process because you've got 396 00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:46,399 Speaker 3: to sit the SATs, there's references, there's you've got your 397 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:49,679 Speaker 3: personal essays, so it's just a lot of stuff on 398 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:51,680 Speaker 3: top of your HC. 399 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:52,880 Speaker 2: I was school captain. 400 00:18:53,560 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 3: I took my academics for the HC very seriously as well. 401 00:18:56,760 --> 00:18:58,240 Speaker 1: Oh wait, you took it seriously. 402 00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:02,439 Speaker 3: What do you mean? But I did get in, but 403 00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:04,600 Speaker 3: you don't find out that you get in until April 404 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:08,480 Speaker 3: and obviously the HC thin she's in November December, and 405 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:10,240 Speaker 3: so I just wanted to have a backup plan. So 406 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 3: I still applied to UNI here and I started at 407 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 3: Sidney UNI combined aunts law degree. 408 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 1: We're the actual same person. 409 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:21,480 Speaker 3: And then in April I found out that I got 410 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:23,359 Speaker 3: into Yale, and for me, it was a no brainer, 411 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:25,919 Speaker 3: Like I'd always said, if I get in, I have 412 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:28,919 Speaker 3: to go, like no turning back. So I finished the 413 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:33,960 Speaker 3: first semester and moved overseas and started this whole new chapter. 414 00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 3: And it was truly the best decision of my life. 415 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:43,160 Speaker 3: I couldn't recommend it more highly. I mean, unfortunately it's 416 00:19:43,240 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 3: changed a little bit with COVID because I think that 417 00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:51,640 Speaker 3: whole face to face networking experience has been modified. Yeah, 418 00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:53,840 Speaker 3: it's been modified because now a lot of it is 419 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 3: online and whatever. But that's going to change very soon, 420 00:19:57,080 --> 00:20:01,240 Speaker 3: I'm confident of it. So, yeah, was it was amazing. Yeah, 421 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:02,719 Speaker 3: it was a really special place. 422 00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:04,640 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, what are And it. 423 00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:07,640 Speaker 3: Was like what it felt like everyone had to live 424 00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:11,600 Speaker 3: on campus and everyone was coming from somewhere else in 425 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:14,439 Speaker 3: the world, like, and you have access to just the 426 00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:20,680 Speaker 3: most incredible professors, resources, you know, you're right next door 427 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:21,640 Speaker 3: to New York in my. 428 00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:23,480 Speaker 2: Case, which was amazing. 429 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:27,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, and look, even through UNI, I did a lot 430 00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:31,360 Speaker 3: of things that were geared towards this so called career. 431 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:32,600 Speaker 2: In law that I thought I wanted to have. 432 00:20:33,119 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 3: I kept up a debating I was on the Model 433 00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:38,200 Speaker 3: un team at Yale. It was a lot of fun. 434 00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:41,119 Speaker 3: They were my favorite favorite team there. And then I 435 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:43,600 Speaker 3: did a lot of internships. So one of my internships 436 00:20:43,680 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 3: was at the Special Court for Sierra Leone. 437 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:46,200 Speaker 1: I saw that. 438 00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:49,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, that was an incredible experience. So the Special Court 439 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 3: is the first tribunal, international tribunal to trial and convict 440 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 3: someone for child soldiering. And I was working on the 441 00:20:57,680 --> 00:21:01,360 Speaker 3: Charles Taylor trial. So Charles Taylor for President of Liberia. 442 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:03,879 Speaker 3: Who I mean, if you've seen the movie Blood Diamond 443 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:07,160 Speaker 3: or you know heard of Blood Diamonds, he's the guy. Basically, 444 00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,359 Speaker 3: you know, no matter how many movies you watched or 445 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:14,280 Speaker 3: articles you read, I don't think anything can prepare you 446 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:18,399 Speaker 3: for like how harrowing some of those stories are so 447 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 3: part of my job. I was working as a legal 448 00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:24,639 Speaker 3: intern for Brenda Hollis, who was the main prosecutor on 449 00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:25,679 Speaker 3: the trial at the time. 450 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:28,159 Speaker 2: For the US. Yeah, it was. 451 00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:31,679 Speaker 3: It was really crazy to think that people have actually 452 00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:36,160 Speaker 3: lived these kinds of lives, you know. And as part 453 00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:39,119 Speaker 3: of the internship I spent you know, I think it 454 00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:41,400 Speaker 3: was three weeks in the Hague and then the rest 455 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:44,479 Speaker 3: of it about two months in Sierra Leone and Freetown, 456 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:48,240 Speaker 3: Sierra Leone. It's just another world and I'm so grateful 457 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:51,439 Speaker 3: for those experiences. It's not what I ended up doing. 458 00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:54,680 Speaker 3: But again, you know, everything in my life seems very 459 00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:59,240 Speaker 3: non linear. But at the same time, everything, every decision 460 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 3: I've made has gotten me to the next point, right, 461 00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 3: So I don't think I would have ever gotten that 462 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:06,679 Speaker 3: job at BOTH if in one for the fact that 463 00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:08,400 Speaker 3: I went to see if it weren't for the fact 464 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:10,720 Speaker 3: that I had this sort of different background that maybe 465 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 3: stand out from the typical applicants in the position. 466 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 2: And then I look at. 467 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:17,880 Speaker 3: The business school chapter and I don't think I would 468 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:22,200 Speaker 3: have gotten into business school with literally no business acumen 469 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:24,280 Speaker 3: or like or not the fact, but I had this 470 00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:29,200 Speaker 3: really quirky role at BOTH. So I think, yeah, it's 471 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:32,040 Speaker 3: it's nonlinear and none of it makes sense, but it 472 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:32,720 Speaker 3: all makes. 473 00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:36,159 Speaker 1: Sense in the end, oh right. Literally the catchphrase of 474 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 1: Yta is that life is nonlinear. There's even a necklace 475 00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:42,240 Speaker 1: we made last year that's a disc that's kind of 476 00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:45,680 Speaker 1: got a waved surface to represent the nonlinear nature of 477 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:49,040 Speaker 1: our journey and remind us to embrace the vicissitudes of 478 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:52,679 Speaker 1: life and it's perfect imperfections. So much of what you 479 00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:55,720 Speaker 1: said is so representative of everything you know I want 480 00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:58,200 Speaker 1: to talk about. I of course I want to jump 481 00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 1: straight to the Anna winter A chapter. I want to 482 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 1: hear all about the nitty gritty of Vogue. But I 483 00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:05,639 Speaker 1: don't want to jump straight there because people miss the 484 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:08,800 Speaker 1: many different dot points that didn't necessarily connect at the 485 00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:11,119 Speaker 1: time that it took to get you there. And I 486 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:13,960 Speaker 1: can also never be reminded too many times about the 487 00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:17,040 Speaker 1: concept of sliding doors moments. If you had never gone 488 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:19,000 Speaker 1: to Yale, would you have met the people who would 489 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:20,480 Speaker 1: have led you to the Vogue role, who would have 490 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 1: led you to what comes next? You know, there's always 491 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:25,960 Speaker 1: this parallel life going on, but you do have to 492 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:29,199 Speaker 1: take a risk sometimes, so I've become really preoccupied with 493 00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:33,440 Speaker 1: helping other people spark those sliding doors moments on purpose. 494 00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:36,320 Speaker 1: But I think your story also represents something I'm super 495 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,920 Speaker 1: passionate about, which is that nothing is ever a waste. 496 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:41,960 Speaker 1: The things you do along the way often don't make sense, 497 00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,040 Speaker 1: sometimes aren't connected at all to skills that you end 498 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:47,920 Speaker 1: up using later. You know, the International Court for Sierra 499 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 1: Leone is not the most logical step that precedes a 500 00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 1: career at Vogue, and you probably don't have that much 501 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:57,040 Speaker 1: overlap of using the same skills. But still it's led 502 00:23:57,080 --> 00:23:59,560 Speaker 1: you to where you are. And I think people always 503 00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:02,840 Speaker 1: lament wasting time if it doesn't immediately lead to the 504 00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:06,160 Speaker 1: next thing, But if you don't attach to that end 505 00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:08,720 Speaker 1: goal and realize everything's a learning curve and it's the 506 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,119 Speaker 1: process that could lead you to unimaginable things. 507 00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, one hundred percent. I think so long as you're 508 00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:16,359 Speaker 3: I've always been a big believer of like a little 509 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 3: bit of discomfort, Like sometimes that level is going to 510 00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:21,639 Speaker 3: be a little higher than that. It's constant, Like you 511 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:25,280 Speaker 3: shouldn't always be super uncomfortable, But as soon as you 512 00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:28,760 Speaker 3: start feeling comfortable, something's not right right, Like you're not 513 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:32,640 Speaker 3: pushing yourself, you're not growing. And so again, like that 514 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:35,640 Speaker 3: in a lot of ways has been a guiding principle 515 00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 3: for me because I'm just like, Okay, Sydney feels at 516 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 3: this point in my life comfortable it's time to like leap. 517 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:44,640 Speaker 3: So can you just you just never know? 518 00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 2: I'm such a you. 519 00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:48,960 Speaker 3: Never know what lesson is going to come handy, what 520 00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:52,200 Speaker 3: people you meet, will you know return the favor later 521 00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:52,920 Speaker 3: down the road? 522 00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:54,680 Speaker 2: Like and that's another thing, like just. 523 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:57,480 Speaker 3: Always be kind. I don't mean that you know everything 524 00:24:57,520 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 3: you should do. Everything you do should be with the 525 00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:02,080 Speaker 3: expectation that it will be reciprocated later in life. But 526 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:04,840 Speaker 3: I think it's just that idea that you just never 527 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,680 Speaker 3: know where that next opportunity. 528 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 2: Is going to come from. 529 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:11,120 Speaker 1: Totally, So how did you then? I mean, I know 530 00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:14,160 Speaker 1: Yale would have just been the most incredible experience. I'd 531 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,160 Speaker 1: love to have more time to go into the nippiki 532 00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:19,399 Speaker 1: details of an Ivy League college experience in the US. 533 00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:22,880 Speaker 1: It sounds so fascinating. I actually went to Seance Poe 534 00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 1: in Paris, so too. 535 00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:29,560 Speaker 3: That was like my next chapter after like I know why, yes, 536 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:30,679 Speaker 3: true story. 537 00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:35,199 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, but yeah, same view. Like I'm the 538 00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:38,600 Speaker 1: biggest proponent of studying or working overseas. I don't think 539 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:41,200 Speaker 1: anything could open your mind as much as throwing yourself 540 00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:44,240 Speaker 1: into a different culture. But you studied political science and 541 00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:47,240 Speaker 1: global affairs at Yale, which is again not something I 542 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:50,600 Speaker 1: would think will necessarily lead to a career at Vogue. 543 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:53,800 Speaker 1: So firstly, how did you get there? I want to 544 00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:58,560 Speaker 1: hear everything about the Anna Winter chapter, but then also 545 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,080 Speaker 1: talk as through how you agitate for change in different chapters. 546 00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 1: How do you know it's time to move on because 547 00:26:04,040 --> 00:26:06,520 Speaker 1: obviously now you're not still at Vogue, so there's been 548 00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:08,720 Speaker 1: quite a few chapter moves. But yeah, first tell us 549 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:10,119 Speaker 1: everything about Vogue now? 550 00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:10,840 Speaker 2: Was everything? 551 00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:15,240 Speaker 3: Okay? It was a crazy, wild experience and sometimes I 552 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,640 Speaker 3: am in awe of the fact that I stumbled across 553 00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:22,439 Speaker 3: this opportunity to As I mentioned, I thought I was 554 00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:23,399 Speaker 3: going to be a lawyer. 555 00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 2: The political science. 556 00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:28,280 Speaker 3: Global affairs it is like what most lawyers do in 557 00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:32,800 Speaker 3: their undergrad before going into a postgraduate law degree. But 558 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,680 Speaker 3: as I mentioned, in America, you're also sort of expected 559 00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:37,840 Speaker 3: to work for a few years, and I knew I 560 00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:40,679 Speaker 3: didn't want to go into consulting or finance, and they 561 00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:44,280 Speaker 3: were the main sort of visa sponsoring roles in the US. 562 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 3: So I kind of just cast a wide net when 563 00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:50,960 Speaker 3: I graduated, And this was just just before graduation as well. 564 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,440 Speaker 3: I left things pretty last minute and I started freaking 565 00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:55,920 Speaker 3: out because I didn't feel ready to. 566 00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,280 Speaker 2: Move back to Australia. Yeah, so I. 567 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:02,000 Speaker 3: Cast a really wide net and applied to everything in 568 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:05,520 Speaker 3: every field. And a friend at Yale at the time 569 00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:08,640 Speaker 3: was like, Oh, I think I know someone at Bogue. 570 00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:12,480 Speaker 3: There is an editorial position as assistant to one of 571 00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:14,160 Speaker 3: the editors, some random editor. 572 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:16,359 Speaker 2: You should apply there and I'll put in a good 573 00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:16,840 Speaker 2: word for you. 574 00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:17,800 Speaker 1: Amazing. 575 00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:20,359 Speaker 3: I think that the connection with Vogue was that I 576 00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:23,080 Speaker 3: was also very interested in journalism. That was sort of 577 00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:26,360 Speaker 3: a side option if the law thing didn't work out. 578 00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:29,640 Speaker 3: So I thought, Okay, it's a magazine. It's a very 579 00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 3: well reputed magazine. I could be a serious journalist at Vogue. 580 00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:37,439 Speaker 3: Comma Nas obviously owns a bunch of publications. 581 00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:38,640 Speaker 2: It's a foot in the door. 582 00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:41,639 Speaker 1: I think you're the only person in the entire world 583 00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:44,919 Speaker 1: who got the dream job at Vogue. And was like, Oh, 584 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,000 Speaker 1: this could be a stepping stone into something else. It's 585 00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:49,800 Speaker 1: something more intellectual, and. 586 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:52,639 Speaker 3: I now have so much respect for like, it is 587 00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:56,520 Speaker 3: such a fast paced industry, it is so stressful. So 588 00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:59,800 Speaker 3: I did apply to this assistant editorial position at Vogue. 589 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:02,880 Speaker 3: My friend's friend was like, Oh, you're not American. We're 590 00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:04,040 Speaker 3: never going to sponsor. 591 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:06,119 Speaker 2: A visa for this. It's Vogue doesn't do that. Cone 592 00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:07,040 Speaker 2: Nast doesn't do that. 593 00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:11,080 Speaker 3: I kind of suspected that because again, very few places 594 00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:15,080 Speaker 3: sponsored visas unless they're like a Baying McKinsey BCG or 595 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:19,199 Speaker 3: like a Morgan Stanley. So I was just like, oh, whatever, like, 596 00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:22,719 Speaker 3: still put my application in. A week later, I was 597 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:27,320 Speaker 3: graduating and a girl called Asriel called telling me that 598 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:32,280 Speaker 3: HR had handed her my resume and she was trying 599 00:28:32,280 --> 00:28:33,040 Speaker 3: to fill a role. 600 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:35,400 Speaker 2: Would I be interested? Tell me more about the role. 601 00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,320 Speaker 3: Well, look, we don't really publicize this role. It's not 602 00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:43,840 Speaker 3: really advertised, but it's assistant to Anna Winter. 603 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:45,760 Speaker 1: Oh my god. 604 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:49,560 Speaker 3: Really, She's like, yeah, like one of Anna's assistants is leaving. 605 00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 3: She has three, of course, and we're looking for a 606 00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:56,520 Speaker 3: new role. And HR handed me your resume. And I 607 00:28:56,560 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 3: also went to Yale. I actually did know of Adria 608 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 3: because she was two years above me at Yale. I 609 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 3: was friends with a few of her friends, but I 610 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:05,000 Speaker 3: had actually never. 611 00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:06,360 Speaker 2: Directly been introduced to her. 612 00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:10,600 Speaker 3: But again, in America, there is a very strong network factor. 613 00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:12,440 Speaker 3: In play, you know, if you went to the same UNI, 614 00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 3: if you were on the same fraternity, if you played 615 00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:15,200 Speaker 3: the same sport. 616 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 2: They're very supportive of that, which is wonderful. 617 00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:20,960 Speaker 3: So I graduated and went to New York and my 618 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,120 Speaker 3: parents were all here, like everyone was here. I was 619 00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:25,480 Speaker 3: going back to Sydney in a week and I didn't 620 00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:29,320 Speaker 3: have a weblind up and the whole interview process started 621 00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:31,760 Speaker 3: and I met with about five different people at Bow, 622 00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:35,960 Speaker 3: finally met with Adriel. Adrial was like, everything's gone well, 623 00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 3: it's time to meet Anna. Your interview is going to 624 00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:42,480 Speaker 3: be very short. Don't be worried. It'll be like two 625 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:45,200 Speaker 3: minutes long. And sure enough it was. It was literally 626 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:49,719 Speaker 3: two minutes long. Left thinking I hadn't said anything about myself. 627 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 3: I felt like I hadn't displayed my best assets, feeling 628 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:56,720 Speaker 3: a little bit down and thinking it didn't go that well. 629 00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 3: And I remember I was going back to Sydney the 630 00:29:58,800 --> 00:29:59,280 Speaker 3: next day. 631 00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 2: That night I got a pull. 632 00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,520 Speaker 3: From Adriel and she's like, you got the job? Are 633 00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:05,760 Speaker 3: you ready to start? Like, as soon as we sought 634 00:30:05,760 --> 00:30:08,280 Speaker 3: out your viza so so exciting, and then how can 635 00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:09,080 Speaker 3: you say no to that? 636 00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 2: You just can't like it? 637 00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:13,520 Speaker 3: Was such a special opportunity that I knew it would open. 638 00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:16,200 Speaker 3: I just knew that it was going to open a 639 00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:16,800 Speaker 3: lot of doors. 640 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 1: I mean every door in the world, every door. 641 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:21,840 Speaker 3: And I think what I didn't realize was just how 642 00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 3: many doors it was going to open and how incredible 643 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:28,440 Speaker 3: the opportunity was going to be. So then I went 644 00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,400 Speaker 3: back to City for a week. They sort it out 645 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:32,800 Speaker 3: my visa. I came back and I literally started like 646 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:35,520 Speaker 3: a week out of school, very stressful. 647 00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:36,600 Speaker 2: It was. 648 00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 3: It was tough, and it was remarkable, and I met 649 00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:43,240 Speaker 3: so many incredible people along the way. 650 00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:48,160 Speaker 1: Okay, but most importantly, how accurate is Devil Wears Praduct? 651 00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 1: What parts of it are reminiscent of the actual job, 652 00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:53,520 Speaker 1: What parts of it are you like, that's absolutely not 653 00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 1: how it works. 654 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,680 Speaker 3: I don't know how much I can divulge to a 655 00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:00,160 Speaker 3: high level. Yeah, the book was written by one of 656 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:04,440 Speaker 3: Amma's assistants, so like in terms of like, I think 657 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:08,240 Speaker 3: that stuff's all out in the open, and it's accurate. 658 00:31:08,280 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 3: She's tough, She's really really tough, but amazing, and you know, 659 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,640 Speaker 3: I learned so many lessons from her, and I'm so 660 00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:20,560 Speaker 3: grateful for the two and a half year experience as 661 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:23,680 Speaker 3: stressful as it was. So, I mean it's accurate in 662 00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,120 Speaker 3: the sense that the job is round the clock, it's 663 00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:27,160 Speaker 3: seven days a week. 664 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:28,720 Speaker 2: You don't get a holiday. 665 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,080 Speaker 3: I mean you get a holiday when she gets a holiday, 666 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 3: but she apparely never takes a day. And then and 667 00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 3: then when she's on makation, you kind of split it 668 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:40,920 Speaker 3: up between the other three systems, so someone's always on call. 669 00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:44,120 Speaker 3: And it's also accurate in the sense that you sort 670 00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 3: of start your way from third assistant and you work 671 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:46,800 Speaker 3: your way up. 672 00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:47,760 Speaker 2: There was two in the movie. 673 00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,160 Speaker 3: I think she might actually have two now, and each 674 00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:54,640 Speaker 3: role has different responsibilities. But you know, just to give 675 00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 3: you some of the lessons that I learned, I learned that, 676 00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:58,120 Speaker 3: you know, discipline. 677 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 2: These people get to they are because. 678 00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:03,600 Speaker 3: Of hard work and discipline and discipline, you know, for 679 00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:05,680 Speaker 3: her was waking up at five o'clock in the morning 680 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:08,680 Speaker 3: every day, being the first person in the office, like 681 00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:12,120 Speaker 3: routine habits, that everything was always the same, you know. 682 00:32:12,160 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 3: I learned that the little things matter as well, no 683 00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 3: matter who you are, no matter how important you are 684 00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:21,000 Speaker 3: or you know what role you occupy, thank you notes, 685 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,040 Speaker 3: birthday messages, and she would never forget any of them, 686 00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:27,080 Speaker 3: so like anyone, you know, and also just noticed how 687 00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:30,160 Speaker 3: she surrounded herself with the best and brightest minds, right, 688 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:32,000 Speaker 3: And that's something I took for granted, was just how 689 00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:34,800 Speaker 3: smart people at BOG are, Like they're really smart, and 690 00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:38,400 Speaker 3: they work so hard and you get paid like nothing, 691 00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:42,080 Speaker 3: so you're really working around the clock with very little 692 00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 3: return in that sense. And another thing that was really 693 00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:49,080 Speaker 3: amazing is just how involved she is in every aspect 694 00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:49,959 Speaker 3: of the magazine. 695 00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:51,800 Speaker 2: Like I don't think there's a book or a. 696 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:54,800 Speaker 3: Film or a you know, theater production that has gone 697 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:59,160 Speaker 3: into that magazine that she hasn't watched, reviewed, gone through very. 698 00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:01,920 Speaker 2: Closely, Like she just had a foot in every door. 699 00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:04,880 Speaker 3: And for me, that was the most amazing, eye opening 700 00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:08,760 Speaker 3: experience in the world. She just knew everyone and was 701 00:33:08,800 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 3: an amazing networker. 702 00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:11,040 Speaker 2: Like it was. 703 00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:14,480 Speaker 3: It was truly truly remarkable, and I think my time 704 00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:20,160 Speaker 3: there sort of ignited this love of business and smart 705 00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:23,120 Speaker 3: powerful women in business and just this belief that you 706 00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:25,600 Speaker 3: could do anything. You know. The great thing about editorial 707 00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:28,600 Speaker 3: is that it is a very female dominated space, you know, 708 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,400 Speaker 3: and it was it was a fun, crazy girl. 709 00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:35,120 Speaker 1: Lovely neighborhood for all my fellow business owners out there, 710 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:38,200 Speaker 1: I've got a tip that will absolutely change your life 711 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:41,280 Speaker 1: for the better. Since the very beginning, we've been using 712 00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:44,880 Speaker 1: Zero as our accounting software, and for over five years, 713 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,640 Speaker 1: it's been the glue that holds all of our businesses 714 00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:51,640 Speaker 1: and my sanity together. It's easy to use online accounting 715 00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:56,160 Speaker 1: software that simplifies everyday business tasks such as invoicing customers, 716 00:33:56,480 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 1: managing cash flow and inventory, reconciling your bank transaction so 717 00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 1: your books are always up to date, and collating all 718 00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:07,960 Speaker 1: of your data into clear and invaluable reports. It's hosted online, 719 00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:10,960 Speaker 1: but there's also a zero mobile app, so wherever you go, 720 00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:13,319 Speaker 1: you've got access to the tools you need to run 721 00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:16,000 Speaker 1: your business. Whether you're part of a team or out 722 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:18,720 Speaker 1: on your own. It has options and features for everyone. 723 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:24,160 Speaker 1: It's so easy to get started. Search XRO today and 724 00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:33,640 Speaker 1: start your thirty day free trial. That's xer dot com. 725 00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,320 Speaker 1: And I mean it doesn't really matter what the subject 726 00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:38,920 Speaker 1: matter was of what you did. I think most of 727 00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 1: us would have probably paid them to have had that opportunity. 728 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:44,839 Speaker 1: And you know, just to be in the orbit of 729 00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:47,799 Speaker 1: someone like that, every second with her must have been 730 00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:51,120 Speaker 1: such a learning experience just to get all of her 731 00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:52,280 Speaker 1: wisdom by ales mosis. 732 00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,880 Speaker 3: It's hard worked, Like these people, they work so hard 733 00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:58,760 Speaker 3: and nothing comes easily. 734 00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:00,759 Speaker 2: And I think you know that. You know, people talk 735 00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:01,919 Speaker 2: about corporate. 736 00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:05,120 Speaker 3: Banking as being a really great training ground. This was 737 00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:09,319 Speaker 3: corporate banking on crack. I don't even know. It was 738 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:14,240 Speaker 3: such a great training for you know, developing a solid 739 00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:18,440 Speaker 3: work ethic, for being honest, for being learning all those 740 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:23,560 Speaker 3: little tiny details of what goes into being like such 741 00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 3: a remarkable leader. 742 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,400 Speaker 1: Yeah. So you mentioned about being exposed to the mentality 743 00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:30,960 Speaker 1: that anything is possible, and I think that's such an 744 00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:34,520 Speaker 1: amazing antidote to self doubt and imposter syndrome. To be 745 00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:37,040 Speaker 1: a woman where self doubt is one of the most 746 00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:41,040 Speaker 1: pervasive and destructive reactions that we can have to uncomfortable situations. 747 00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:44,359 Speaker 1: To then be around powerful women who reiterate to you 748 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:47,560 Speaker 1: that you can push through that is so powerful. So 749 00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:49,880 Speaker 1: I'd love to know how that has played out for 750 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:52,840 Speaker 1: you in that chapter, particularly being in such a coveted 751 00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:55,240 Speaker 1: role and thinking, you know, why am I here? Everyone 752 00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:56,840 Speaker 1: in the world wants this position, and why are me? 753 00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: How do I live up to this? What kind of 754 00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:00,680 Speaker 1: thoughts did go through your mind. This is starting to 755 00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:03,200 Speaker 1: weave into the next section, which is your nata and 756 00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:05,920 Speaker 1: all the things that really challenged your joy. And I 757 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:08,560 Speaker 1: imagine the same with burnout. You were on call twenty 758 00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,200 Speaker 1: four to seven. And there are actually chapters of your 759 00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:13,480 Speaker 1: life where balance does look a little bit different, or 760 00:36:13,480 --> 00:36:15,960 Speaker 1: maybe it is not something that you can strive for. 761 00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:18,600 Speaker 1: I mean, sometimes there are short lived chapters where you're 762 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:21,239 Speaker 1: not going to be able to prioritize rest as much. 763 00:36:21,719 --> 00:36:22,959 Speaker 1: How did you survive that time? 764 00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:25,080 Speaker 2: I don't know how I survived. 765 00:36:26,560 --> 00:36:28,560 Speaker 3: Sometimes I look back, I know, honestly, sometimes I look 766 00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:30,120 Speaker 3: back and I'm like, oh my god, this a super 767 00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:31,880 Speaker 3: human I like didn't sleep for two years. 768 00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:34,759 Speaker 2: No, that's not a good thing to be advocating for. 769 00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:37,000 Speaker 1: But there are chapters where you do it right. Sometimes 770 00:36:37,080 --> 00:36:39,040 Speaker 1: you have to put yourself on the line and it's 771 00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:39,600 Speaker 1: not forever. 772 00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:41,919 Speaker 3: In hindsight, you look back and you're like, how did 773 00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:44,799 Speaker 3: I do that? Like I still feel like that. I 774 00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:47,480 Speaker 3: can't believe I did it. But you have these amazing 775 00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:49,680 Speaker 3: abilities in yourself if you just back yourself. So I 776 00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:51,640 Speaker 3: think I think that's one thing, Like you have to 777 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:53,760 Speaker 3: be willing to back yourself and have faith in yourself 778 00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:56,640 Speaker 3: that if you give it a goal and if you 779 00:36:56,640 --> 00:36:59,960 Speaker 3: put all your energy into it, that things will eventue 780 00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:01,880 Speaker 3: start to make sense. I think. I think for me, 781 00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:04,680 Speaker 3: like the first six months were really tough, like I 782 00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:07,960 Speaker 3: just I didn't know what I was doing or how 783 00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:10,000 Speaker 3: I was doing. There were days I wanted to quit. 784 00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:12,920 Speaker 3: I would cry myself to sleep, like it was a 785 00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,839 Speaker 3: difficult time. But then all of a sudden, it just 786 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,640 Speaker 3: makes sense, Like things just fall into place, and as 787 00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:22,640 Speaker 3: you start to learn and become used to you know, 788 00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:25,000 Speaker 3: no job is easy when you first start, but at 789 00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:28,040 Speaker 3: some point you learn those skills and they become second 790 00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:29,799 Speaker 3: h to you. And I think that's kind of what 791 00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:32,520 Speaker 3: happened after two years for me, so that I had 792 00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:34,520 Speaker 3: plateaued a little bit and I was looking for the 793 00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:38,719 Speaker 3: next chapter, and it was also feeling exhausted and burnt out, 794 00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:41,360 Speaker 3: as you sort of phrased it. And now you know, 795 00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:43,120 Speaker 3: now I'm like, oh, should I have stayed it? Both? 796 00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:46,360 Speaker 3: I don't know, but I did know that after two years, 797 00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:48,120 Speaker 3: and I had a conversation She's like, what do you 798 00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,200 Speaker 3: want to do next? You know, I think you'd be 799 00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:52,840 Speaker 3: really good in pr And one of her things was 800 00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,640 Speaker 3: sort of you know, she would just hire these incredibly smart, 801 00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:58,880 Speaker 3: accomplished young women straight out of school. 802 00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:00,560 Speaker 2: A lot of people are like, why would you do that? 803 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:01,840 Speaker 3: If you because you're just going to have such a 804 00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:05,000 Speaker 3: high turnover right like every two years she's got new assistants. 805 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:08,759 Speaker 3: But I think it was actually genius because she was 806 00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:12,920 Speaker 3: training her future you know, head of marketing, head of events, 807 00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:16,120 Speaker 3: director of PR, like all of them, and she was 808 00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:21,080 Speaker 3: basically instilling that incredible work ethic, that sense of you know, 809 00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:25,680 Speaker 3: discipline and self and a lot of the times like 810 00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:28,719 Speaker 3: they would stay on and go on to do amazing things, 811 00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:31,719 Speaker 3: and if they didn't, it was somewhere in the industry 812 00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:35,000 Speaker 3: somehow related and you know, kind of that idea of 813 00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:37,480 Speaker 3: like all the dots would connect in the end. 814 00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:38,400 Speaker 2: Even if they moved on. 815 00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 3: So she was like, I think you'd be great in PR? 816 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:43,960 Speaker 3: What about events? But I was pretty sure, Like I 817 00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:46,799 Speaker 3: just I wanted to change. As I mentioned, I was 818 00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:51,600 Speaker 3: really interested in this this business idea, and sort of 819 00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:53,600 Speaker 3: I loved the fashion space as well. 820 00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:55,640 Speaker 2: I love how fast paced it. 821 00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:58,840 Speaker 3: Is and how creative, and you know, it's that hype 822 00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:01,120 Speaker 3: and excitement that you would get from a corporate job, 823 00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:03,600 Speaker 3: but in a completely creative field. 824 00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:06,759 Speaker 1: At the met Girala, I loved it, and so I 825 00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:08,680 Speaker 1: knew I wanted to stay in the space. 826 00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:09,520 Speaker 2: I knew I wanted to. 827 00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:13,080 Speaker 3: Do my own sort of thing or work at a startup. 828 00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:16,000 Speaker 3: And one of my favorite things working at Vogue was 829 00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:18,879 Speaker 3: the CFDA Fashion Awards, So like just seeing these young 830 00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:22,480 Speaker 3: designers building up new businesses and you know how Vogue 831 00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:25,280 Speaker 3: would basically you know, there was a big prize money 832 00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:28,120 Speaker 3: and then you know there was that incubator aspect at 833 00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:30,840 Speaker 3: Vogue as well. That was really exciting to watch and 834 00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:32,759 Speaker 3: for me it was one of my favorite parts of 835 00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:33,840 Speaker 3: working there as well. 836 00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:37,880 Speaker 1: Actually, yeah, quickly to digress, what were the coolest pinch 837 00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:41,400 Speaker 1: me moments, like you know, meeting Obama, Like what were 838 00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:45,719 Speaker 1: the big things eating? And you got to meet Michelle. 839 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:46,800 Speaker 2: I love Michelle. 840 00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:50,080 Speaker 3: I know the met bulls were fabulous, Like I was 841 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:53,200 Speaker 3: very involved with those because for the most part of 842 00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:56,240 Speaker 3: my time there, I was secondnsistent. So that was looking 843 00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:59,320 Speaker 3: after the met ball and it's like everyone at seven 844 00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:02,920 Speaker 3: am and it was spectacular, Like it was empty that 845 00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:04,759 Speaker 3: early in the morning, there's no one there and you're like, oh, 846 00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:05,520 Speaker 3: this is amazing. 847 00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:07,040 Speaker 2: You just like walk through the Net. 848 00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:11,280 Speaker 3: They're just like memories that I just can't believe. 849 00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:12,440 Speaker 2: You were there, you know. 850 00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:15,520 Speaker 3: You know, we worked on that Kim and Kanye cover. 851 00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:18,400 Speaker 3: She was super involved with them alk Clooney's wedding, Like 852 00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:19,760 Speaker 3: it just very cool. 853 00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:21,640 Speaker 2: I think the best part of the job. 854 00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:24,120 Speaker 3: I mean, obviously like you get a lot of perks, 855 00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:28,480 Speaker 3: but prs and like theater people they just love you. 856 00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:31,520 Speaker 3: So we remember for some Kanye West concert because they 857 00:40:31,560 --> 00:40:34,560 Speaker 3: really wanted Anna to go. Obviously, they just were obsessed 858 00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:36,360 Speaker 3: with me and they were like, what you want to 859 00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:37,840 Speaker 3: come to the Kanye show, We'll get you in tickets 860 00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:40,239 Speaker 3: to the Carne show. So I'm like amazing, Like I 861 00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:42,560 Speaker 3: kind of assumed we'd have good seats, but I did 862 00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:46,200 Speaker 3: not expect like literally had security take us to a 863 00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:48,759 Speaker 3: place that Kim kartash In was like sitting in this 864 00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,799 Speaker 3: barricaded area and we were like escorted into the barricaded 865 00:40:51,840 --> 00:40:54,680 Speaker 3: area and like is this crazy, Like we're like watching 866 00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 3: the concert standing right next to her. 867 00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:58,040 Speaker 2: It was like it was amazing. 868 00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:01,200 Speaker 3: And that went with like theater because the theater, so 869 00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:03,760 Speaker 3: we were always just the most amazing shows on Broadway. 870 00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:07,560 Speaker 3: You always had tickets for Manolo's. 871 00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:08,960 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. 872 00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:11,880 Speaker 3: Manolo Prs loved us really good quirks. 873 00:41:12,320 --> 00:41:15,360 Speaker 1: Okay, So my next question then, is, you know, moving 874 00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:17,759 Speaker 1: back to the shift out of that incredible chapter, I 875 00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:20,440 Speaker 1: would love to just keep talking forever about Vogue. But 876 00:41:21,040 --> 00:41:24,400 Speaker 1: I think what's really interesting is when you move out 877 00:41:24,440 --> 00:41:27,040 Speaker 1: of roles like that, you know, your identity gets so 878 00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:30,680 Speaker 1: tied up in that title and that prestige and everything 879 00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:34,359 Speaker 1: associated with that, like the productivity and success of it all. 880 00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:36,759 Speaker 1: And I can imagine it'd be so hard to walk 881 00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:39,640 Speaker 1: away from something where you know, you do have all 882 00:41:39,640 --> 00:41:42,000 Speaker 1: these incredible connections and people do want to be around 883 00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:44,600 Speaker 1: you all the time. So how did you start to 884 00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:48,160 Speaker 1: redefine your identity and your ideas of who you were 885 00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:50,320 Speaker 1: when it came to a bold new chapter. 886 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,839 Speaker 3: That's definitely something I still struggle with. 887 00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:56,600 Speaker 2: I would say, is like, what's the next big thing? 888 00:41:56,880 --> 00:41:59,319 Speaker 3: You know? I've often spoken to Michelle about this as well. 889 00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:02,160 Speaker 3: When she moved on from her role at Bumble, she 890 00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:04,360 Speaker 3: was like, it was such a prestigious, big role, Like, 891 00:42:04,400 --> 00:42:06,880 Speaker 3: it's really hard to take that leap of faith to 892 00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:09,200 Speaker 3: take that next step. I think if you just it's 893 00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:11,960 Speaker 3: kind of like that that staircase, right, like every decision 894 00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:15,680 Speaker 3: you make, it's just it's just another step, and nothing's 895 00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:18,719 Speaker 3: definitive or final, and at some point you've got to 896 00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:20,680 Speaker 3: take the leap, and at some point you're probably gonna 897 00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:22,880 Speaker 3: start at the bottom of the ladder, right like you're 898 00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:26,040 Speaker 3: never gonna get to the top of the stairs, these analogies. 899 00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,600 Speaker 3: But I think for me, to be completely friend, it 900 00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:32,760 Speaker 3: was a combination of burnout and just really I needed 901 00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:35,640 Speaker 3: some time away from that space, which is why I 902 00:42:35,680 --> 00:42:39,000 Speaker 3: moved to London, and I just needed something different. I 903 00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:43,520 Speaker 3: think defining yourself by titles it's a dangerous game because 904 00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:46,200 Speaker 3: then you're like where does it end? You know, and 905 00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:50,160 Speaker 3: it's so much pressure to put on yourself. But I 906 00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:53,600 Speaker 3: think you can define your own roles and if you're excited, 907 00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:56,600 Speaker 3: and this is something I want, Okay, if you're excited 908 00:42:56,640 --> 00:42:58,759 Speaker 3: and passionate about what you do, no. 909 00:42:58,680 --> 00:42:59,920 Speaker 2: One really cares what you're role. 910 00:43:00,200 --> 00:43:02,560 Speaker 3: Everyone's just like happy for you, and everyone is just 911 00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:04,680 Speaker 3: like envious of the fact that you love your job 912 00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:07,719 Speaker 3: and you're like killing it in whatever you're doing, and 913 00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:09,880 Speaker 3: it doesn't really matter what you were doing. 914 00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:11,320 Speaker 2: So I moved to a startup. 915 00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:13,680 Speaker 3: Well, it was especially I can't you can't really call 916 00:43:13,719 --> 00:43:15,319 Speaker 3: it a startup now because they are a very big 917 00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:19,480 Speaker 3: company called reward Style and they monetize this influencer platform 918 00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:25,239 Speaker 3: that monetizes content for bloggers and influencers affiliate marketing, and 919 00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:27,600 Speaker 3: they're a Dallas based company, but they just opened their 920 00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:30,799 Speaker 3: London office at the time. And again, this job was 921 00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:34,960 Speaker 3: very serendipitous in the facts that I was talking to Whitney, 922 00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:37,959 Speaker 3: who is Whitney is the founder of Bumble, who I. 923 00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:38,719 Speaker 2: Introduced the shell to. 924 00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:42,319 Speaker 3: That's right, I was talking to Whitney and this was 925 00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:44,799 Speaker 3: like when I was ready to leave Vogue. She's like, 926 00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:47,480 Speaker 3: come work for me. I would love to have you, 927 00:43:47,600 --> 00:43:50,279 Speaker 3: blah blah blah. But at the time, Bumble was a 928 00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:52,319 Speaker 3: dating app and I was just like, I don't know 929 00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:54,279 Speaker 3: if that's like my Space. I told her that I 930 00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:57,000 Speaker 3: was interested in fashion. She goes, you need to meet 931 00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:00,120 Speaker 3: my friend. And so one of Whitney's best friends, this 932 00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:03,480 Speaker 3: is Amber Dan's Box, who is the founder co founder 933 00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:07,120 Speaker 3: of broad Stuff. She introduced me to Amber and Amber 934 00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:10,200 Speaker 3: was telling me all about reward Style, and it was 935 00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:14,799 Speaker 3: that connection actually that basically propelled me to jump over 936 00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:17,400 Speaker 3: to London. It was that and a boy I'd be 937 00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:19,640 Speaker 3: I'd be lying if I couldn't say there was a. 938 00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:20,680 Speaker 2: Boy involved as well. 939 00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:22,480 Speaker 3: So it kind of all just made sense and I 940 00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:23,920 Speaker 3: was like, you know what, I'm just gonna go with it, 941 00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:26,479 Speaker 3: and I loved it. It was it was so much 942 00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:29,160 Speaker 3: fun and it was so different to vote going from 943 00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:32,680 Speaker 3: like a very corporate structure to an office which at 944 00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:35,040 Speaker 3: the time was like less than ten people. It was 945 00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:37,799 Speaker 3: you take on as much responsibility as you want. You 946 00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:40,239 Speaker 3: really are the driver of the car and you can 947 00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:43,279 Speaker 3: make the decisions that you want to make. And that 948 00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:46,040 Speaker 3: role took me to the most incredible places as well, 949 00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:49,480 Speaker 3: because I was basically working on their business development into 950 00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:52,960 Speaker 3: like new markets. Australia was one of the areas of focus, 951 00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:54,799 Speaker 3: but also the Middle East, so I ended up going 952 00:44:54,840 --> 00:44:57,839 Speaker 3: to like cool wait and you know, spend a lot 953 00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:01,120 Speaker 3: of time in Dubai with like the UA influencers. 954 00:45:01,239 --> 00:45:01,480 Speaker 1: It was. 955 00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:06,720 Speaker 3: It was a really amazing job and journey watching Amber 956 00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:09,319 Speaker 3: and Baxter who are They had become like mentors to 957 00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:13,000 Speaker 3: me that they're amazing operators and build this incredible business 958 00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:17,520 Speaker 3: And for me, this reward style step was a stepping 959 00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:23,680 Speaker 3: stone to my interest in entrepreneurship in the startup space, 960 00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:26,880 Speaker 3: and it really made sense with my narrative when it 961 00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:30,280 Speaker 3: came time for business school, and like my business school applications, 962 00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:33,920 Speaker 3: I had Anna as a reference, I had my boss 963 00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:36,279 Speaker 3: in London as a reference. And then I ended up 964 00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:38,480 Speaker 3: going to Stanford and doing a business degree there. 965 00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:39,399 Speaker 2: And the reason for. 966 00:45:39,400 --> 00:45:42,800 Speaker 3: That was, as much as I loved my Vogue experience, 967 00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:46,600 Speaker 3: I needed to strengthen my quantitative skills a little bit more. 968 00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:50,200 Speaker 3: I wanted to take those classes in finance and econ 969 00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:53,320 Speaker 3: that I just hadn't taken in undergrad either, to be honest, 970 00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:56,800 Speaker 3: and I was becoming progressively more interested in this startup 971 00:45:56,840 --> 00:46:00,279 Speaker 3: space and Stanford was sort of the epicenter of all 972 00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:03,320 Speaker 3: things startup tech entrepreneurship. 973 00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:05,799 Speaker 1: I love how you just added casual like I didn't 974 00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:07,359 Speaker 1: know what was coming next, So I just did an 975 00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:08,600 Speaker 1: NBA at Stamford. 976 00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:12,520 Speaker 3: I don't know, I just yeah. It was incredible. And 977 00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:14,399 Speaker 3: even at Stamford, I really didn't know what I was doing. 978 00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:16,719 Speaker 3: A lot of people knew exactly what they were doing. 979 00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:19,320 Speaker 3: But Stamford was great. Stamford was so different to Yale. 980 00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:22,640 Speaker 3: It was West coast versus East coast, and you know 981 00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:24,759 Speaker 3: that's a big There is a big difference, believe it 982 00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:29,640 Speaker 3: or not. Like East Coast people are like very high intensity, very. 983 00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:30,440 Speaker 2: Busy, busy, busy. 984 00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:31,920 Speaker 3: The West Coast is super. 985 00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:35,000 Speaker 1: Relaxed and it's warm on. 986 00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:36,720 Speaker 2: The weather was beautiful, it was happened. 987 00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:39,440 Speaker 3: It was really really a great place to do a 988 00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:44,240 Speaker 3: postgraduate degree. They basically train you to become little startup people. 989 00:46:44,680 --> 00:46:47,880 Speaker 3: And like I had Eric Schmidt as a professor, Evan 990 00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:51,960 Speaker 3: Spiegel would come in for a few classes Stanford and 991 00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:53,600 Speaker 3: the caliber of professors. 992 00:46:53,640 --> 00:46:55,640 Speaker 2: Oh had Tyra Banks as a professor. 993 00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:59,600 Speaker 3: That was awesome, so cool, it was great, and that 994 00:46:59,640 --> 00:47:02,880 Speaker 3: was all about like personal branding. Else. 995 00:47:03,880 --> 00:47:06,719 Speaker 1: Do you know what I love though, your willingness to 996 00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:09,560 Speaker 1: you know, Firstly, I think people get really bogged down 997 00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:13,239 Speaker 1: about starting from the beginning again with anything, and you know, 998 00:47:13,360 --> 00:47:15,520 Speaker 1: even in their earlier years of life will be like, nah, 999 00:47:15,520 --> 00:47:18,280 Speaker 1: I'm too old for that. But it's never too late 1000 00:47:18,520 --> 00:47:21,799 Speaker 1: to start something new and be a beginner. And also, 1001 00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:24,359 Speaker 1: as a discomfort junkie who likes to be a bit 1002 00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:27,000 Speaker 1: of a beginner, you know you're always going back to 1003 00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,080 Speaker 1: the start. But that means the self doubt is almost 1004 00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,440 Speaker 1: on steroids because you're always in situations where you have 1005 00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:35,480 Speaker 1: absolutely no idea what you're doing and no qualifications. But 1006 00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:39,040 Speaker 1: one of the most practical ways to combat imposter syndrome 1007 00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:41,319 Speaker 1: is to go on upskill, like go and do a 1008 00:47:41,360 --> 00:47:43,920 Speaker 1: new degree, or go and learn new stuff, and it's 1009 00:47:44,080 --> 00:47:45,600 Speaker 1: never too late to go back. 1010 00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:47,319 Speaker 3: It's so funny you say that, because I was talking 1011 00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:48,719 Speaker 3: to Michelle last night and I was like, I'm really 1012 00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:52,320 Speaker 3: nervous for this podcast, like I've never spoken about myself. 1013 00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:54,880 Speaker 3: She's like, now you've got the most interesting story. You 1014 00:47:54,880 --> 00:47:57,400 Speaker 3: need to start seeing about yourself a bit more, and like, 1015 00:47:57,520 --> 00:47:59,440 Speaker 3: I think it actually comes from the background. I'm like, 1016 00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:02,640 Speaker 3: I'm not that interesting. I'm not, you know, but I 1017 00:48:02,640 --> 00:48:04,680 Speaker 3: think when you put yourself out there a little bit, 1018 00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:08,680 Speaker 3: you realize that it's reciprocated. People will You're never going 1019 00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:10,640 Speaker 3: to door is never going to be closed in your 1020 00:48:10,680 --> 00:48:11,960 Speaker 3: face and slam shut. 1021 00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:14,680 Speaker 2: So thank you for taking interest in my stories. 1022 00:48:15,960 --> 00:48:19,480 Speaker 1: It is the most fascinating story. And Michelle and I 1023 00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:22,520 Speaker 1: were laughing about how you know, now you've launched, now 1024 00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:24,719 Speaker 1: you're out in podcast land, you won't be able to 1025 00:48:24,719 --> 00:48:26,920 Speaker 1: get rid of people asking you to be on podcasts. 1026 00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:30,919 Speaker 1: You're not an undiscovered Jeb anymore. But what I love 1027 00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:33,359 Speaker 1: about you is that you know we've covered eighty five 1028 00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:35,920 Speaker 1: chapters already and you're not eight hundred years old. So firstly, 1029 00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:40,280 Speaker 1: that's amazing, But I also fully believe that you've only 1030 00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:42,959 Speaker 1: reached ten percent of the story. You have so much 1031 00:48:43,040 --> 00:48:45,520 Speaker 1: more that you haven't even started thinking about. 1032 00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:48,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we probably are at ten percent of the story. 1033 00:48:48,680 --> 00:48:51,160 Speaker 3: I agree with you in the sense that making all 1034 00:48:51,200 --> 00:48:56,000 Speaker 3: these changes and starting from scratch so many times. 1035 00:48:56,480 --> 00:48:57,920 Speaker 2: It's a little destabilizing. 1036 00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:00,719 Speaker 3: Sometimes you're like, what if I did take linear path, 1037 00:49:00,920 --> 00:49:02,440 Speaker 3: Like I'd be killing it? 1038 00:49:03,040 --> 00:49:04,160 Speaker 2: You know what, I think? 1039 00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:07,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, I wouldn't give up the experiences I've had for anything. 1040 00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:10,759 Speaker 3: Something to keep in mind, at least for people that 1041 00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:13,840 Speaker 3: are worried that the decision might not be the right one. 1042 00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:15,640 Speaker 2: I've never regretted anything I've done. 1043 00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:18,520 Speaker 3: I've made bad decisions, but that's not to say I've 1044 00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:22,680 Speaker 3: necessarily regretted it, right, because everything has contributed to what 1045 00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:23,680 Speaker 3: my story is. 1046 00:49:23,760 --> 00:49:25,360 Speaker 2: And I'm still writing my story. 1047 00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:26,839 Speaker 3: And it's funny, like, I don't know if you ever 1048 00:49:26,920 --> 00:49:29,920 Speaker 3: do have that aha moment, my life makes sense, like 1049 00:49:30,040 --> 00:49:33,279 Speaker 3: everything makes sense. I think that's a very simplistic way 1050 00:49:33,280 --> 00:49:36,640 Speaker 3: of looking at life. Life is about moments, It's about opportunities. 1051 00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:40,560 Speaker 3: It's about seizing those opportunities and enjoying it, enjoying the right. 1052 00:49:40,760 --> 00:49:43,280 Speaker 1: I don't know, but I do think you've mentioned something 1053 00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:45,759 Speaker 1: really important here that you have to enjoy it. This 1054 00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:49,040 Speaker 1: is why it's called CZA because otherwise, you know, you 1055 00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:51,480 Speaker 1: can get very bogged down in seizing the day and 1056 00:49:51,520 --> 00:49:55,440 Speaker 1: just grabbing every opportunity because learning and self development is 1057 00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:58,399 Speaker 1: really addictive. But because of that, you can end up 1058 00:49:58,520 --> 00:50:01,239 Speaker 1: just doing all these self developments things, even if it's 1059 00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:03,520 Speaker 1: not really going in any direction. You might just be 1060 00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:07,560 Speaker 1: running on the spot and accumulating achievements without actually enjoying 1061 00:50:07,600 --> 00:50:10,440 Speaker 1: it because you're never taking a bird's eye view, or 1062 00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:13,799 Speaker 1: because you're burning yourself out. So the last section is 1063 00:50:13,840 --> 00:50:18,319 Speaker 1: called your playta, which is where particularly a type personalities 1064 00:50:18,360 --> 00:50:22,480 Speaker 1: like us, whose identity is very much intertwined with productivity 1065 00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:25,840 Speaker 1: and achievement, it can be really hard to find you 1066 00:50:26,120 --> 00:50:29,040 Speaker 1: outside of all that. So obviously there's a lot of 1067 00:50:29,080 --> 00:50:32,400 Speaker 1: gratification and all the incredible experiences you've done and continue 1068 00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:35,680 Speaker 1: to do. But outside of that, where do you find 1069 00:50:35,760 --> 00:50:39,000 Speaker 1: joy in activities that aren't related to growth. 1070 00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:41,080 Speaker 3: Sure, I mean this is going to sound like it's 1071 00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:43,600 Speaker 3: related to growth, and my book club will be very 1072 00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:46,120 Speaker 3: upset that I'm saying it's not related to growth, because 1073 00:50:46,120 --> 00:50:49,680 Speaker 3: they're a very serious book club. But we are, we 1074 00:50:49,719 --> 00:50:52,319 Speaker 3: are are, But like I've joined the book club since 1075 00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:54,000 Speaker 3: coming back to city. For me, coming back to City 1076 00:50:54,040 --> 00:50:56,960 Speaker 3: was actually really tough. Like, you know, had this really 1077 00:50:57,040 --> 00:51:01,799 Speaker 3: fast paced life overseas constantly, and then I moved and 1078 00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:03,520 Speaker 3: all my friends are over there now too, because I 1079 00:51:03,560 --> 00:51:06,040 Speaker 3: think I think that period of like eighteen to twenty 1080 00:51:06,080 --> 00:51:08,839 Speaker 3: four it's it's a very formative time and I spent 1081 00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:13,000 Speaker 3: that all their living and breathing life with these girls. 1082 00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:14,120 Speaker 2: So it was hard. 1083 00:51:14,200 --> 00:51:17,200 Speaker 3: It was hard moving back because I hadn't been very 1084 00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:20,520 Speaker 3: good at keeping in touch with my school friends and 1085 00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:24,799 Speaker 3: Sydney's pace was a little slower. And then compound that 1086 00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:27,960 Speaker 3: with the fact that covid here, it was really really tough. 1087 00:51:28,239 --> 00:51:30,840 Speaker 3: I actually ended up joining a book club with a 1088 00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:32,520 Speaker 3: group of random girls. 1089 00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:34,160 Speaker 2: I knew one of the girls in the book. 1090 00:51:33,960 --> 00:51:36,480 Speaker 3: Club, but eight of the girls I didn't know, and 1091 00:51:36,520 --> 00:51:37,879 Speaker 3: they didn't really know each other either. 1092 00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:38,399 Speaker 2: They were all. 1093 00:51:38,280 --> 00:51:41,799 Speaker 3: Connected by this one girl, and I joined that very 1094 00:51:41,800 --> 00:51:44,600 Speaker 3: early on when I moved back, and they are truly 1095 00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:46,879 Speaker 3: some of my favorite people in the world. We meet 1096 00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,319 Speaker 3: once a month. We pick a book, we talk about 1097 00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:51,400 Speaker 3: the book for ten minutes. It's our content chat. We 1098 00:51:51,600 --> 00:51:57,680 Speaker 3: liked every interview, every Netflix show and it is such smart, amazing, 1099 00:51:58,280 --> 00:52:01,120 Speaker 3: interesting women. And I think the act that you now 1100 00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:03,440 Speaker 3: of us really knew each other before coming into this, 1101 00:52:04,080 --> 00:52:07,319 Speaker 3: it's just made us so much closer. And for me, 1102 00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:11,880 Speaker 3: I love reading and sort of sharing that unified love 1103 00:52:12,239 --> 00:52:17,480 Speaker 3: of books and friendship and food. We have lots of 1104 00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:20,120 Speaker 3: dinners and stuff like that. Oh I love cooking too, 1105 00:52:20,239 --> 00:52:20,879 Speaker 3: that's another thing. 1106 00:52:21,040 --> 00:52:22,160 Speaker 1: Oh as a. 1107 00:52:22,280 --> 00:52:24,680 Speaker 3: COVID happened though I've never cooked overseas. 1108 00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:27,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, what did bring you home? Was it? COVID? 1109 00:52:27,680 --> 00:52:28,080 Speaker 2: It was? 1110 00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:31,399 Speaker 3: Look, I always knew that I wanted to come home. 1111 00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:34,759 Speaker 3: For me, I'm very close to my family and I've 1112 00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:36,879 Speaker 3: always felt like a little part of. 1113 00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:38,200 Speaker 2: Me was missing overseas. 1114 00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:41,359 Speaker 3: You know, my sister and my brothers have kids and 1115 00:52:41,640 --> 00:52:43,120 Speaker 3: they were growing up so quickly. 1116 00:52:43,520 --> 00:52:46,799 Speaker 2: It was just really important for me to make a 1117 00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:47,399 Speaker 2: life here. 1118 00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:48,520 Speaker 3: And there really is. 1119 00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:49,719 Speaker 2: Nowhere life Australia like. 1120 00:52:50,200 --> 00:52:53,799 Speaker 3: It's such a safe, amazing place and the quality of 1121 00:52:53,840 --> 00:52:57,359 Speaker 3: life like, the average quality of life is so incredible, 1122 00:52:57,520 --> 00:53:00,920 Speaker 3: accessibility to the beaches, the weather like, it's a pretty 1123 00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:04,120 Speaker 3: special place. So I always knew I wanted to come back. 1124 00:53:04,200 --> 00:53:06,719 Speaker 3: I don't know, if I felt ready straight out of 1125 00:53:07,480 --> 00:53:10,040 Speaker 3: business school, I probably could have stayed. 1126 00:53:09,719 --> 00:53:10,440 Speaker 2: A little longer. 1127 00:53:10,719 --> 00:53:12,359 Speaker 3: But I also realized that, you know, if I were 1128 00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:14,600 Speaker 3: to take a job there, I'd probably be committing for 1129 00:53:14,719 --> 00:53:17,080 Speaker 3: like another three to five years. 1130 00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:18,439 Speaker 2: And it just. 1131 00:53:18,320 --> 00:53:21,040 Speaker 3: Felt like it was time to build a network here, 1132 00:53:21,440 --> 00:53:24,759 Speaker 3: you know, strengthen my friendships with old friends, and just 1133 00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:25,720 Speaker 3: make new friends. 1134 00:53:26,120 --> 00:53:26,800 Speaker 2: All of the above. 1135 00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:29,080 Speaker 3: It it just it felt like the right timing. And 1136 00:53:29,120 --> 00:53:31,839 Speaker 3: then when COVID hit. I'm actually grateful that COVID hit, 1137 00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:34,799 Speaker 3: because I probably would have gone back overseas were it 1138 00:53:34,840 --> 00:53:35,520 Speaker 3: not for COVID. 1139 00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:38,959 Speaker 2: Since being here, I've just I've found my Yay. 1140 00:53:39,160 --> 00:53:41,880 Speaker 3: I love it. 1141 00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:45,560 Speaker 1: So how are you now? What is next? What's the now? 1142 00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:49,200 Speaker 3: It's great, I've got a great group of friends. I 1143 00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:53,040 Speaker 3: am working on a new business which I'm very excited about. 1144 00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:55,600 Speaker 3: I can't I don't want to say too much about 1145 00:53:55,640 --> 00:53:57,240 Speaker 3: it yet, just because we're sort. 1146 00:53:57,080 --> 00:53:58,320 Speaker 2: Of in the process of launching. 1147 00:53:58,360 --> 00:54:01,799 Speaker 3: But it's kind of combining all of my chapters in 1148 00:54:01,840 --> 00:54:05,920 Speaker 3: one and it's bringing my love for overseas businesses to. 1149 00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:09,200 Speaker 1: Australia and TBC TVC. 1150 00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:13,760 Speaker 3: But it feels very authentic to me. It's very tailored 1151 00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:14,880 Speaker 3: to my skill set. 1152 00:54:15,520 --> 00:54:19,719 Speaker 1: And it just even more reinforces that chapters. You know, 1153 00:54:19,880 --> 00:54:22,440 Speaker 1: you need different things at different times of your life, 1154 00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:25,279 Speaker 1: and then you needed the fast paced, dynamic world of 1155 00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:28,320 Speaker 1: big cities in the US, and now maybe you're home 1156 00:54:28,440 --> 00:54:31,680 Speaker 1: for some ground and at some point you do need 1157 00:54:31,719 --> 00:54:36,720 Speaker 1: to like put some roofs down somewhere and moving around 1158 00:54:36,880 --> 00:54:39,239 Speaker 1: is fun and exciting, but it's exhausting. And I don't 1159 00:54:39,239 --> 00:54:41,760 Speaker 1: think I realized how exhausting it was until I couldn't 1160 00:54:41,800 --> 00:54:45,680 Speaker 1: travel anymore. I literally was on a plane every single weekend. 1161 00:54:45,719 --> 00:54:47,759 Speaker 1: Like I cannot think of a weekend that I was 1162 00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:50,640 Speaker 1: not on a plane, either you know, going to. 1163 00:54:50,880 --> 00:54:54,600 Speaker 3: LA or New York or it was a lot. And now, 1164 00:54:54,680 --> 00:54:57,600 Speaker 3: having not been on a plane for over a year now, 1165 00:54:57,840 --> 00:54:59,320 Speaker 3: the thought of getting on a plane isn't. 1166 00:54:59,120 --> 00:55:02,880 Speaker 2: Anxiety now, like how did they do that all the time. 1167 00:55:03,000 --> 00:55:05,200 Speaker 3: It's just really slowed things down in a way that 1168 00:55:05,239 --> 00:55:08,040 Speaker 3: I think has been beneficial for everyone. Like there's been 1169 00:55:08,080 --> 00:55:11,080 Speaker 3: some really great things to come out of this obviously 1170 00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:13,399 Speaker 3: a lot horrible things as. 1171 00:55:13,320 --> 00:55:16,399 Speaker 1: Well, but I think it's almost the breaker of that 1172 00:55:16,640 --> 00:55:21,360 Speaker 1: autopilot circuit of adrenaline and momentum and relentless forward motion 1173 00:55:21,640 --> 00:55:25,440 Speaker 1: that without stopping, you don't often realize how far beyond 1174 00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:29,040 Speaker 1: your limits you've gone, and you know, how far beyond 1175 00:55:29,080 --> 00:55:32,080 Speaker 1: even making conscious choices you've gone and just acting out 1176 00:55:32,120 --> 00:55:34,759 Speaker 1: of habit. And we would never have wished it to 1177 00:55:34,800 --> 00:55:37,640 Speaker 1: happen this way, but it was probably a much needed 1178 00:55:37,800 --> 00:55:40,920 Speaker 1: global reset for many of us. I'd love to know 1179 00:55:41,080 --> 00:55:43,480 Speaker 1: on this Plata thing before we wrap up. You have 1180 00:55:43,719 --> 00:55:46,640 Speaker 1: such an intellectual which is what makes me fan girl 1181 00:55:46,680 --> 00:55:49,440 Speaker 1: you so much. And I love that your plata is 1182 00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:52,279 Speaker 1: a book club. But is there anything that you do 1183 00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:55,279 Speaker 1: that's just silly just to let your brain have a 1184 00:55:55,320 --> 00:55:56,960 Speaker 1: break from the intellectual gosh? 1185 00:55:57,040 --> 00:55:58,680 Speaker 3: Like watching Netflix? 1186 00:55:58,960 --> 00:55:59,919 Speaker 1: Exactly do you watch? 1187 00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:02,959 Speaker 3: I love Netflix show. I love a Netflix show. 1188 00:56:03,360 --> 00:56:08,759 Speaker 1: Okay, good, that makes me feel better. What's your go 1189 00:56:08,880 --> 00:56:12,720 Speaker 1: to ultimate slothy lazy rest things? 1190 00:56:13,120 --> 00:56:13,960 Speaker 2: I love Monopoly? 1191 00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:15,560 Speaker 1: Oh love board games? 1192 00:56:15,640 --> 00:56:18,399 Speaker 3: Yeah, Monopoly is fun. I love the movies. I love 1193 00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:21,400 Speaker 3: cinema like I've actually been, I haven't gone in a 1194 00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:23,680 Speaker 3: long time, but I'd love to start going again. 1195 00:56:23,760 --> 00:56:26,600 Speaker 2: That's something I used to love doing pre COVID. 1196 00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:32,160 Speaker 3: Times, Netflix cooking. As I mentioned, like, I just love 1197 00:56:32,239 --> 00:56:34,200 Speaker 3: I like them. I'm a bit of a foodie, like 1198 00:56:34,320 --> 00:56:36,400 Speaker 3: trying new recipes, love. 1199 00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:37,360 Speaker 2: Hanging out with my family. 1200 00:56:37,920 --> 00:56:39,719 Speaker 3: I don't know what else is slothy. 1201 00:56:39,800 --> 00:56:44,880 Speaker 1: I feel like, No, they're great. So second last question, 1202 00:56:45,280 --> 00:56:48,040 Speaker 1: what are three interesting things about you that don't normally 1203 00:56:48,080 --> 00:56:51,040 Speaker 1: come up in conversation? And this is generally pretty hard 1204 00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:53,120 Speaker 1: for people who are on podcasts all the time, but 1205 00:56:53,160 --> 00:56:54,959 Speaker 1: you could pretty much tell us anything and we find 1206 00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:55,560 Speaker 1: it interesting. 1207 00:56:56,239 --> 00:56:58,000 Speaker 3: I'm really allergic to horses. 1208 00:56:58,280 --> 00:56:58,760 Speaker 1: Horses. 1209 00:56:59,120 --> 00:57:03,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, actually I'm very allergic top in general, which 1210 00:57:03,239 --> 00:57:05,120 Speaker 3: is why it's so sad that I'm obsessed with cats 1211 00:57:05,160 --> 00:57:09,840 Speaker 3: and gold and retriever puppies. Oh no, but particularly allergic 1212 00:57:09,880 --> 00:57:12,640 Speaker 3: to horses. So like horses is like the physical reaction. 1213 00:57:12,719 --> 00:57:14,760 Speaker 1: I don't know why that's so random. 1214 00:57:15,040 --> 00:57:15,840 Speaker 2: I'm fine if. 1215 00:57:15,680 --> 00:57:18,000 Speaker 3: I'm around them, but as soon as I touch them, 1216 00:57:18,040 --> 00:57:19,960 Speaker 3: like I get I get boils. 1217 00:57:19,480 --> 00:57:21,680 Speaker 1: And like it's that, oh my god, that boils. 1218 00:57:21,920 --> 00:57:22,480 Speaker 2: It's weird. 1219 00:57:23,360 --> 00:57:24,040 Speaker 1: Wow. 1220 00:57:24,920 --> 00:57:25,920 Speaker 2: Too much information. 1221 00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:27,560 Speaker 1: No, that's such a good one. 1222 00:57:27,760 --> 00:57:31,480 Speaker 3: Other than that, what don't people normally know about me? 1223 00:57:32,000 --> 00:57:34,120 Speaker 1: Tattoos? Oh, do you speak FARSI. 1224 00:57:34,160 --> 00:57:36,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, I do. I can't read or write, so I'm 1225 00:57:36,280 --> 00:57:39,400 Speaker 3: technically illiterate, but I do speak it. 1226 00:57:39,320 --> 00:57:42,600 Speaker 2: My parents like I've grown up with it all around. 1227 00:57:42,920 --> 00:57:43,840 Speaker 1: It's amazing. 1228 00:57:45,120 --> 00:57:47,440 Speaker 3: And what else don't people know? 1229 00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:49,560 Speaker 1: And that you're a ravenclaw. I think that's also a 1230 00:57:49,600 --> 00:57:53,720 Speaker 1: really really important one. I also think you'll actually understand 1231 00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:55,640 Speaker 1: when I talk about the whole you don't have to 1232 00:57:55,640 --> 00:57:57,800 Speaker 1: see the whole staircase to take the first step. All 1233 00:57:57,880 --> 00:57:59,600 Speaker 1: I can see in my mind is those a Harry 1234 00:57:59,640 --> 00:58:02,560 Speaker 1: Potters staircases that all I don't connect in a moving away. 1235 00:58:03,600 --> 00:58:04,800 Speaker 2: That's so true. 1236 00:58:05,320 --> 00:58:08,320 Speaker 1: And since I love quote so much, let's finish with 1237 00:58:08,520 --> 00:58:09,680 Speaker 1: your favorite quote. 1238 00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:13,000 Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, I've got so many favorite quotes. 1239 00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:14,400 Speaker 2: Okay, can I give you two? 1240 00:58:14,800 --> 00:58:15,560 Speaker 1: Absolutely? 1241 00:58:15,800 --> 00:58:19,840 Speaker 3: So. One of them is a pretty obvious well it's 1242 00:58:19,880 --> 00:58:23,640 Speaker 3: not obvious, but a spirit famous one is Churchill. Success 1243 00:58:23,720 --> 00:58:26,840 Speaker 3: is not final, failure is not fatal. It's the courage 1244 00:58:26,840 --> 00:58:28,120 Speaker 3: to continue that counts. 1245 00:58:28,640 --> 00:58:30,120 Speaker 1: Ah, that's amazing. 1246 00:58:30,840 --> 00:58:33,720 Speaker 3: Yeah. And then another one that I just really love 1247 00:58:33,920 --> 00:58:38,840 Speaker 3: because I feel like it's been really important to me 1248 00:58:39,080 --> 00:58:42,840 Speaker 3: in how I find my friends and the people I 1249 00:58:42,960 --> 00:58:47,240 Speaker 3: choose to surround myself with. But it's Mark Twain, and 1250 00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:50,920 Speaker 3: it is keep away from people who try to belittle 1251 00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:54,240 Speaker 3: your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really 1252 00:58:54,320 --> 00:58:57,800 Speaker 3: great people make you feel that you two can become great. 1253 00:58:58,320 --> 00:59:01,400 Speaker 3: I love so I'm all about having cheerleaders in your 1254 00:59:01,440 --> 00:59:04,760 Speaker 3: life and people that want you to succeed. And you know, 1255 00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:08,600 Speaker 3: like I want that for my friends. When my friends succeed, 1256 00:59:08,760 --> 00:59:11,800 Speaker 3: I'm so happy and I truly want the best for 1257 00:59:11,840 --> 00:59:14,000 Speaker 3: the people that I love. And I think that's just 1258 00:59:14,040 --> 00:59:16,800 Speaker 3: a real indicator of like, if you love people, you 1259 00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:19,720 Speaker 3: should want them to do well and to be the 1260 00:59:19,720 --> 00:59:20,840 Speaker 3: best version of themselves. 1261 00:59:20,920 --> 00:59:22,200 Speaker 2: So be a cheerleader. 1262 00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:26,360 Speaker 1: Absolutely well, I've just become your biggest cheerleader. I feel 1263 00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:29,440 Speaker 1: like we should be best friends forever. Now. You have 1264 00:59:29,640 --> 00:59:33,840 Speaker 1: such a fascinating story and such valuable insights. Thank you 1265 00:59:33,920 --> 00:59:36,439 Speaker 1: so much for jumping on this podcast for the very 1266 00:59:36,520 --> 00:59:38,720 Speaker 1: first time, too. I so appreciate it. 1267 00:59:38,800 --> 00:59:42,400 Speaker 3: Yes, for making this experience so effortless and easy. 1268 00:59:42,440 --> 00:59:44,760 Speaker 2: It was so nice to shout to you what. 1269 00:59:45,160 --> 00:59:48,720 Speaker 1: A fascinating human being. I hope you guys enjoyed that. 1270 00:59:48,800 --> 00:59:51,480 Speaker 1: I could have kept talking to Rape for hours about 1271 00:59:51,480 --> 00:59:55,760 Speaker 1: the many amazing things she's done, especially since it's raised 1272 00:59:55,960 --> 00:59:59,000 Speaker 1: very first time sharing her story. I would love the 1273 00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:01,680 Speaker 1: neighborhood to shout power her with love. It would be 1274 01:00:01,720 --> 01:00:04,000 Speaker 1: so wonderful if you enjoyed to share this up in 1275 01:00:04,040 --> 01:00:07,680 Speaker 1: any takeaways or AHA moments you had, tagging at Raver 1276 01:00:07,840 --> 01:00:11,000 Speaker 1: Keeley and myself so we can shine the light on 1277 01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:14,479 Speaker 1: her that she deserves. I can't wait to hear what's next, 1278 01:00:14,480 --> 01:00:16,840 Speaker 1: and we'll keep you all updated as things unfold with 1279 01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:20,040 Speaker 1: her latest project. Perhaps a little update on yeas of 1280 01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:23,400 Speaker 1: our lives. We are off to the countryside for the 1281 01:00:23,440 --> 01:00:26,000 Speaker 1: Easter weekend, which is a tradition in my family. We've 1282 01:00:26,040 --> 01:00:29,080 Speaker 1: been doing it for over twenty maybe even over thirty 1283 01:00:29,160 --> 01:00:32,040 Speaker 1: years now. Last year during lockdown was the first time 1284 01:00:32,120 --> 01:00:35,240 Speaker 1: in my memory that we haven't been. So we'll be 1285 01:00:35,280 --> 01:00:38,000 Speaker 1: taking a week off next week and a break from 1286 01:00:38,040 --> 01:00:42,040 Speaker 1: episodes to fully unwind and make some memories all the platya, 1287 01:00:42,640 --> 01:00:45,560 Speaker 1: but we'll be back after that. Hope you make some 1288 01:00:45,680 --> 01:00:57,360 Speaker 1: time for yourselves too, and that you're seizing your ya.