Speaker 1: You're listening to Amma mea podcast.
Speaker 2: Mamma Mere acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on. Lean in close, friends,
Speaker 2: drop your voice. I'm going to talk about something we're
Speaker 2: not supposed to talk about in a way I wouldn't
Speaker 2: dream of doing if there were people under thirty round,
Speaker 2: or my teenage daughter, or even my very best self.
Speaker 2: But I've asked her to step out of the room
Speaker 2: for a moment so that I can be truthful, unvarnished
Speaker 2: about something we're really not supposed to say. I still
Speaker 2: struggle with my weight. You're laughing now. I can feel
Speaker 2: it because you're thinking, well, who doesn't. You're thinking, I've
Speaker 2: had years of that, decades of wasting hours and days
Speaker 2: of my life, probably worrying about the circumference of my thighs,
Speaker 2: the softness of my chin. How many roles can be
Speaker 2: tucked away into the waistband of a helpful g You're
Speaker 2: also laughing now because you're looking at whatever version of
Speaker 2: me you might have seen out there in the world,
Speaker 2: and depending on your own relationship with your own body,
Speaker 2: you're thinking I'm right or wrong to worry about it.
Speaker 2: You're holding yourself up against that imagined version, and you're
Speaker 2: making judgment calls because we all do that. We all
Speaker 2: still do that, We're just not allowed to say so.
Speaker 2: Generation X, I'm often told by my younger friends and colleagues,
Speaker 2: are toxic about weight. We were marinated in diet culture
Speaker 2: and cooked up in a world where women talked about
Speaker 2: being on a diet constantly, unthinkingly, as if it were
Speaker 2: a perpetual state of womanhood. We could tell you what
Speaker 2: Jennifer Aniston had for lunch for eight years straight, and
Speaker 2: what Oprah had to give up, which was eating by
Speaker 2: the way to drag that infamous wagon of fat across
Speaker 2: a TV soundstage, and we counted points and mercilessly cut
Speaker 2: out entire food groups. We lived through Kate Moss SI zero,
Speaker 2: just as our mothers had lived through the Dawn of Twiggy.
Speaker 2: We used words like slimming when it came to colors
Speaker 2: and cuts, and we positioned ourselves at the middle back
Speaker 2: of all group photos, safety in numbers when it came
Speaker 2: to hiding our true shape. Now we know better, We
Speaker 2: see the damage that it did. All that relentless self
Speaker 2: critique of being at war with our bodies, The vicious
Speaker 2: inner critic targeting our very flesh and the young people
Speaker 2: who have their own battles to fight against the perfect, filtered, smooth,
Speaker 2: shrunk bodies of Instagram, every bit as toxic as the
Speaker 2: airbrush magazine version, but now cloaked in the language of
Speaker 2: health and self care have taught us not to ever
Speaker 2: ever talk about it. But just as we know better
Speaker 2: and try to make friends with ourselves, a new era starts.
Speaker 2: Hormones shift and so does our shape. All those tricks,
Speaker 2: the good ones and the bad ones we've learned to
Speaker 2: keep ourselves in a bracket of fears. Okay about our
Speaker 2: bodies have stopped working, and a redistribution is upon us
Speaker 2: also now it really is about health. It's not a
Speaker 2: lie or a smoke screen to say that, somewhere in
Speaker 2: mid we realize that what we want to live long
Speaker 2: and well is a body we don't need to love,
Speaker 2: but we need to work all that. To say, in
Speaker 2: my hushed tones that it's okay, friends, that we're all
Speaker 2: a bit fucked up about this. It's okay that we're
Speaker 2: still figuring it out as proper grown up women. How
Speaker 2: to remove emotion and judgment from what really are merely
Speaker 2: numbers and facts. You're safe here. It's okay. Hello. I'm
Speaker 2: Holly Wainwright and I am Mid, Midlife, mid Family, mid Mouthful.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Mid. This is season six, and we
Speaker 2: are so happy to have you with us. We're doing
Speaker 2: something a bit different this season on MID. We are
Speaker 2: unpacking your dilemmas. You might have heard me do an
Speaker 2: episode about this with Marian Keyes in season five, where
Speaker 2: basically you sent in your problems big and small and
Speaker 2: we unpacked them together. It was so popular and we
Speaker 2: enjoyed it so much that we decided to do that
Speaker 2: as our theme for episode six, but on lots of
Speaker 2: different topics, so all things sex and relationships and faces
Speaker 2: and family and today about weight. Some of these episodes
Speaker 2: are going to sound a bit different to the ones
Speaker 2: you might be used to. Some of them are going
Speaker 2: to have a big, long thinking introduction like today's because
Speaker 2: I just couldn't help myself, but that will pour out
Speaker 2: of me. But sometimes we're going to get right down
Speaker 2: to business. But always, this season of Mid is going
Speaker 2: to be all about you, You and us and Mid
Speaker 2: and as I just confessed, I am as messed up
Speaker 2: about my body. As the next woman, But I've been
Speaker 2: trying to make friends with her for the longest time,
Speaker 2: and there's a woman in my orbit who at times
Speaker 2: has helped me do that while never trying to turn
Speaker 2: me into someone else, that is, someone who doesn't like food.
Speaker 2: Susie bar is a dietitian, and a few years ago
Speaker 2: she helped me lose a significant amount of weight after
Speaker 2: my doctor told me I should Many many of us
Speaker 2: have been in that doctor's appointment, right. Susie has all
Speaker 2: the qualifications that a lot of people shouting about weight
Speaker 2: management on social media do not, and she also has
Speaker 2: a very agnostic, practical attitude to this topic. She also
Speaker 2: knows about all the new developments in food world. Yes
Speaker 2: we're talking about GLP one's the new world of weight
Speaker 2: loss medications. And she knows that most women don't have
Speaker 2: loads of time for meal prepping and would probably still
Speaker 2: like to have a glass of wine or a piece
Speaker 2: of cake or a plate of dips sometimes to make
Speaker 2: life a little less. So I knew that Susie was
Speaker 2: the phone a friend I needed to help us answer
Speaker 2: your dilemmas about body, food and weight at this stage
Speaker 2: of our lives. Of course, I need to tell you
Speaker 2: that as we answer these dilemmas, you should never embark
Speaker 2: on any sea significant change to your diet or make
Speaker 2: any decisions about medication, weight management, or otherwise without seeing
Speaker 2: your doctor. The information discussed in this episode is not
Speaker 2: intended to replace professional medical advice. And also, this conversation
Speaker 2: is general and does include a few numbers. If any
Speaker 2: of that is triggering or difficult for you, I will
Speaker 2: not be offended if you skip this episode and links
Speaker 2: to organization who can help with any disordered eating issues
Speaker 2: in our show notes. But if you are here for
Speaker 2: the honest body chat, welcome to the Dilemma Couch. Susie Burrell. Susie,
Speaker 2: I couldn't think of anyone better to answer these dilemmas
Speaker 2: with me, because you're the person I text when I
Speaker 2: have dilemmas about these kind of.
Speaker 3: Things happen occasionally. I'm always happy to help her.
Speaker 2: I'm always happy to help just occasionally. So our first
Speaker 2: question from a mid listener, she says, I've always been
Speaker 2: a little over the weight that my doctor would like
Speaker 2: to say see me at As I've gotten older, it's
Speaker 2: gotten harder to shift a few kilos or so when
Speaker 2: I need to well I think we all hear you
Speaker 2: there and the scales of creptop. Now friends are telling
Speaker 2: me to get on the weight loss jabs. Those are
Speaker 2: her words, the weight loss jabs. But here's the thing.
Speaker 2: I love food. I love little treats. I love a
Speaker 2: glass of wine. My appetite, while it's not out of control,
Speaker 2: is part of my personality. To me, I don't want
Speaker 2: to become a different person. I don't want to remove
Speaker 2: a pleasure from my life. There are few enough pockets
Speaker 2: of joy with caring for my family and working hard.
Speaker 2: But I feel like I'm being guilted into this option
Speaker 2: that everyone is talking about. I guess the first place
Speaker 2: we have to go there is here's a woman who
Speaker 2: sounds kind of very normal in inverted commas, and that
Speaker 2: it is harder for all of us to shift weight
Speaker 2: as we get older. And if you're someone who has
Speaker 2: always loved little treats, should she address this first of all?
Speaker 3: First of all, it's complicated, as so many things are.
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 3: First, the first thing I gleaned off that case study
Speaker 3: for whatever better word, is the focus on weight. Now,
Speaker 3: working with women, as I have for almost thirty years now,
Speaker 3: I really don't focus a lot on weight. I really
Speaker 3: focus on waste measurement because waste measurement is so much
Speaker 3: more telling about what is going on with your health,
Speaker 3: particularly as we move into our forties and fifties and
Speaker 3: beyond and we have key hormonal changes.
Speaker 2: Why Why is that? Because so you literally saying, instead
Speaker 2: of standing on the scale, get a tape measure.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, absolutely, because it removes that whole idea of a
Speaker 3: number weight. Can you know, differ by as much as
Speaker 3: two kilos in a single day, It's not a really
Speaker 3: great measure. If you're stronger, if you've got more muscle mass,
Speaker 3: you're a more muscular frame, you'll be a heavier person.
Speaker 3: So some of those sort of standards we grew up with,
Speaker 3: wanting to be fifty kilos a're just never going to
Speaker 3: be relevant for some people.
Speaker 2: Is that kind of why people have started to question
Speaker 2: the idea of your BMI because they're like, it's not everybody.
Speaker 2: There isn't an ideal weight. We're so different and that
Speaker 2: we're learning more about it. Is that why.
Speaker 3: BMI is a population based measure to infer public health.
Speaker 3: It's not overly relevant for individuals. So for my women
Speaker 3: and I am a clinician I see women every week.
Speaker 3: I'm looking at a couple of key measurements. I'm looking
Speaker 3: at what I call where your small waist is, because
Speaker 3: for anyone who's had kids, you'll know your kind of
Speaker 3: waiste drops down a little bit. So I'll do the
Speaker 3: sort of leanest, tightest part which in a younger female
Speaker 3: maybe rand your belly button still and I do ideally
Speaker 3: you want it to be less than eighty centimeters. So
Speaker 3: that's the first measure, and then I'll get my ladies
Speaker 3: to do a second, which is what I call your
Speaker 3: lower waist. Now, for some of us that may be
Speaker 3: a hip, it may be where if you've had a
Speaker 3: C section, your weight's kind of moved down to and
Speaker 3: really we do want that to be less than ninety
Speaker 3: So that straightaway tells me so much metabolically what's going
Speaker 3: on with my clients and indirectly can be linked to
Speaker 3: where the people may need medical weight loss support.
Speaker 2: Why does why are those numbers more important than a
Speaker 2: number on a scale, and also what does that tell you?
Speaker 2: What does that waste number tell you? As an expert?
Speaker 3: That is telling me how well your insulin and glucose
Speaker 3: regulation is, and what we know as you go through
Speaker 3: perry and menopause, as we naturally lose our estrogen or
Speaker 3: it declines, we're more likely to deposit weight centrally. It
Speaker 3: also is indicative of those who may be at higher
Speaker 3: risk of diabetes or insulin resistance, which would suggest weight
Speaker 3: loss may be more difficult and in turn maybe down
Speaker 3: the track or require medical weight loss support. So it
Speaker 3: tells us so much. It also tells you if you're
Speaker 3: losing body fat, if you are trying to lose weight,
Speaker 3: because you can go and be on a calorie deficit
Speaker 3: or starve yourself or have a low carb diet, and
Speaker 3: you see the scales going down, But if your waist
Speaker 3: isn't going down, you're probably wasting muscle mass, which is
Speaker 3: the worst thing we can do as we get older
Speaker 3: because we want more muscle mass. So if my clients,
Speaker 3: I don't care if the scales don't go down, and
Speaker 3: certainly I have clients who are weighing themselves. I don't
Speaker 3: weigh them. I do everyone virtually, so it's up to them.
Speaker 3: But I want the waist down because if the waist
Speaker 3: is down, it's indicative of body fat loss.
Speaker 1: So it's a much.
Speaker 3: Better measure of what's going on with your health and
Speaker 3: your metabolism and basically optimizing body composition, because that's what
Speaker 3: it is for women in our forties and beyond. It's
Speaker 3: about building a healthy body that is functional. As we
Speaker 3: get into our seventies, our eighties, our nineties. You know,
Speaker 3: these generations of women will hopefully live old. You know
Speaker 3: we're going to be around long time. We need these
Speaker 3: bodies to be functional. So it's not about a weight
Speaker 3: on the scale. It's about functional fitness where you carry
Speaker 3: your weight, if you're still mobile and protecting your joints,
Speaker 3: more than just a number on the scales.
Speaker 2: Can I just ask you before we move on to
Speaker 2: the more emotional side of our what our listeners asking us.
Speaker 2: Everybody says this about you as you get older, muscle
Speaker 2: mass really important? Don't lose muscle mass? Don't lose muscle mass?
Speaker 2: Why is it important? Like for the people like me
Speaker 2: who don't really understand science, maybe should have taken more
Speaker 2: biology at school, Like why and particularly as you get older,
Speaker 2: is it really important that you're not losing muscle mass?
Speaker 3: Muscle mass is our metabolically active tissue. It burns calor
Speaker 3: is basically so it keeps our body healthy, but it
Speaker 3: keeps our body strong because if you think about what
Speaker 3: issues as we get older, we fall over, we have
Speaker 3: brittle bones. If you've got more muscle mass, or preserve
Speaker 3: your muscle mass, your body will be stronger. You'll be
Speaker 3: able to eat more, as our listener is talking about,
Speaker 3: because it actually burns calories, whereas you can if fat
Speaker 3: mass doesn't do anything, it's just dead weight. Really now,
Speaker 3: we do need some, but it's not got the metabolic benefits.
Speaker 3: It basically burns and processes our glucose. So the more
Speaker 3: muscle mass you have, the better it is for hormone control,
Speaker 3: for burning more calories, for keeping our bodies strong, to
Speaker 3: be able to lift heavy things as we get older,
Speaker 3: to be able to climb stairs, go downstairs and not fall,
Speaker 3: you know, hold on to things. You know, if you
Speaker 3: go to fall and you've got a strong bone and
Speaker 3: a strong muscle, you're more likely to be able to
Speaker 3: protect yourself as you fall.
Speaker 1: All those little things which are much more important.
Speaker 2: One of the things I think about a lot as
Speaker 2: I'm moving into my fifties. You don't want to move
Speaker 2: like an old person and inverted comments, I mean even
Speaker 2: just like having to dash for something, not having to
Speaker 2: think twice about going upstairs or walking here or doing that,
Speaker 2: or just like moving in a fluid, fast kind of way.
Speaker 2: This is what we're talking about, right, is like being
Speaker 2: able to do all that for longer rather than being
Speaker 2: we can debilitated.
Speaker 3: Picking up your grandkids term you know, carrying heavy shopping
Speaker 3: bags and not having to worry and.
Speaker 2: Being able to keep doing things you like, like if
Speaker 2: you love running, for example, and heaps of women in
Speaker 2: our mid age bracket hair will be runners or whatever
Speaker 2: it is that they love doing, like being able to
Speaker 2: do that.
Speaker 3: For longer, travel and go hiking for days at a time,
Speaker 3: walking for long periods of time, being able to stand
Speaker 3: on one leg and put your stockings on right, So
Speaker 3: all of these functional.
Speaker 1: Movement, and that's what it's about.
Speaker 3: It's getting your body fitter and healthier as you move
Speaker 3: through the lifespan. So the weight, for me, it's not
Speaker 3: a massive factor. It's much more about what's going on
Speaker 3: in your body composition and getting you as functionally fit
Speaker 3: and lean in a way as possible so your body's
Speaker 3: better able to age gracefully.
Speaker 2: All right, Obviously, our listener wants to talk about weight loss.
Speaker 2: She's calling them, we will call them what they're correctly called,
Speaker 2: which is medical weight loss. Correct Now, everybody knows what
Speaker 2: we're talking about when we're talking about that. I'm going
Speaker 2: to say a couple of brand names here. If you're
Speaker 2: wondering why we're not just saying them, it's because the
Speaker 2: regulations around this are type as they should be. Right,
Speaker 2: we're talking about medical weight loss injections like o Zempic,
Speaker 2: like Manjaro. You would have heard about these right now.
Speaker 2: You know a lot about this, SUSI. So I'd love
Speaker 2: to know because a couple of years ago, if a
Speaker 2: woman is in her midlife like me, and you're thinking,
Speaker 2: I do want to reduce that waste size, I want
Speaker 2: to lose some weight, I want to get in better shape,
Speaker 2: whatever it is. We're talking about diet and exercise now,
Speaker 2: and this is what's happening to this listener. Everybody's telling her,
Speaker 2: like her mates are telling her, get yourself to the doctor,
Speaker 2: get yourself on the japs. That's what everybody's saying, right.
Speaker 2: And the thing is is I know that it's not
Speaker 2: I know that it's not that simple, but it's certainly
Speaker 2: much more mainstream and widespread than it was a couple
Speaker 2: of years ago. Our listener is worry that she'll suddenly
Speaker 2: not want to eat it at all, and it's a
Speaker 2: massive pleasure in her life now. I know because I've
Speaker 2: worked with you before, that you actually take into consideration
Speaker 2: when you work with women, like is it important to
Speaker 2: you to have little treats? Is it important to you
Speaker 2: that you have that glass of wine on a Friday night?
Speaker 2: Is it what? Blah blah blah. Our listener is almost
Speaker 2: worried that she's not going to be herself if she
Speaker 2: does try this medication. What's your experience.
Speaker 3: I think the thing about medical weight loss is we
Speaker 3: don't necessarily understand what it is. So I'll try and
Speaker 3: explain it in as simple terms as possible, because for me,
Speaker 3: it's very much linked to metabolic variables. It's not a
Speaker 3: decision of whether or not you should try it or
Speaker 3: want to, it's whether you need to. So the GOLP
Speaker 3: one range of medical weight loss are basically working in
Speaker 3: two key ways. They work on the hormonal system that
Speaker 3: regulates glucose and insulin metabolism in the body, and they
Speaker 3: control food noise and appetite due to changes in digestion,
Speaker 3: so they basically slow down the movement of food through
Speaker 3: the digestive track.
Speaker 2: You hear people saying I have always thought about food
Speaker 2: and it's been a battle, and suddenly it's just not there.
Speaker 2: That drive is not there.
Speaker 1: For those individuals.
Speaker 3: But it's not a matter of whether I want it
Speaker 3: or not. It's whether you, as I said, whether you
Speaker 3: need to. Because first of all, if you're looking at
Speaker 3: relatively small amounts of weight. Now, so for example, I've
Speaker 3: talked in waste measurement, if your wist is under ninety
Speaker 3: or you've got a handful of kilos five or ten,
Speaker 3: as a dietitian, I would not be even suggesting anything
Speaker 3: like that unless you were predisposed to diabetes, you'd had
Speaker 3: gestational diabetes or insulin resistance, which is a clinical issue
Speaker 3: that may require clinical management. But as a dietitian, I
Speaker 3: would always try and do it with diet and exercise
Speaker 3: calories in optimizing metabolism for all those things. Now, once
Speaker 3: you're getting too people with metabolic issues so pre diabetic,
Speaker 3: they have insatiable appetite, they're carrying twenty thirty forty kilos,
Speaker 3: it may be a viable option, but it's not just
Speaker 3: a decision you make overnight. Start because the thing people
Speaker 3: don't understand is not a matter of just taking a jab.
Speaker 3: You have to change your diet, exercise, or they don't work.
Speaker 3: They just mask appetite for short periods of time and
Speaker 3: then as soon as you come off them, you just
Speaker 3: go back to your old habits. So we always like
Speaker 3: to focus on diet and exercise and lifestyle first. And
Speaker 3: as you know, if you work with a great dietitian
Speaker 3: and I must stress, please pay and see the right professionals.
Speaker 3: You know, everyone's an expert. Every influence is out there.
Speaker 3: Please make sure you see. If you need a psychologist,
Speaker 3: see a psychologist. If you need weight loss support, see
Speaker 3: a dietitian. For this reason, because you're dealing with people
Speaker 3: who will create sustainable models. So for me, I know
Speaker 3: that my women love to have a glass of wine
Speaker 3: and like to have a cheeky chocolate every now and again.
Speaker 3: So my job is to formulate plans that suit them
Speaker 3: and are sustainable. Because people think seeing having a diet
Speaker 3: is about restriction, it's not. A good diet will be
Speaker 3: something you can follow forever and as such will factor
Speaker 3: in eating out, it will factor in wine and things
Speaker 3: that you like. So coming back to the listener, in
Speaker 3: terms of her dilemma, I think the question is more
Speaker 3: where where is she sitting? In terms of is it
Speaker 3: a few kilos, Well, you probably can see a good
Speaker 3: dietician and sort it out. If it's more serious than that,
Speaker 3: and there is some high insulance, some high glucose, your
Speaker 3: waist is over ninety or one hundred, you're carrying twenty
Speaker 3: thirty kilos, it is possibly something that you could consider,
Speaker 3: but not before you sort of started the journey.
Speaker 1: And there's other options.
Speaker 3: First, because ten years ago, when we didn't have all
Speaker 3: these golp one medications targeting these issues, there were other
Speaker 3: options we use with people that were not perhaps as aggressive.
Speaker 3: And you know, they're quite an investment financially as well.
Speaker 3: So you know, I've got all ranges of clients. I've
Speaker 3: got clients who have used them from the start. I've
Speaker 3: got clients who have lost five or ten and then
Speaker 3: started it for a short period of time. But ultimately
Speaker 3: they are all working on the same thing, which is
Speaker 3: developing a sustainable model of eating, with or without that support.
Speaker 3: And yes, in answer, they do kill the food noise
Speaker 3: a little bit They certainly mean that you don't feel
Speaker 3: like craving and governed by food.
Speaker 1: But it's not like you can't have a glass of
Speaker 1: wine or things like that if you don't want to.
Speaker 2: So she's not. It's funny because I think that because
Speaker 2: there is so much media out there about this at
Speaker 2: the moment, you're reading headlines all the time of like
Speaker 2: I became more successful, I became better in bed, I
Speaker 2: became listening or whatever. It is, like I suddenly didn't
Speaker 2: want to drink, I didn't want to do this, I
Speaker 2: didn't want to argue with my partner. I didn't want
Speaker 2: to do anything I would like. It's like everyone's talking
Speaker 2: about it like that. You're making it clear. You get
Speaker 2: back to the basics. This is a medication. You see
Speaker 2: a professional for it. It's not going to be a
Speaker 2: magic bullet. It's not going to turn you into someone else,
Speaker 2: but it might be helpful if you need it. Is
Speaker 2: that kind of what you're saying.
Speaker 3: One hundred percent, And I only ever used it as
Speaker 3: a tool as part of the process because in my experience,
Speaker 3: for every ten people who have had them, eight it's
Speaker 3: are unsuccessful because they haven't committed to the lifestyle.
Speaker 1: Changes required.
Speaker 3: Either they use it as a short term solution to
Speaker 3: kill appetite, waist muscle mass, and inevitably they put all
Speaker 3: the weight back on again.
Speaker 1: So they're a tool to.
Speaker 3: Be used as part of a whole lifestyle approach and
Speaker 3: for the right person, and they can be incredibly effective,
Speaker 3: but there's certainly a serious medication and need consideration. It's
Speaker 3: not something you just pop in and have a job
Speaker 3: and think glory.
Speaker 1: Problems are solved.
Speaker 2: After the break. Susie gives us advice on another dilemma
Speaker 2: about a woman who wants to know exactly what clean
Speaker 2: eating is and weather she should be doing. Okay, here's
Speaker 2: another one. My daughter has become obsessed with clean eating.
Speaker 2: She's got clean and inverted commas. She's twenty four. She's
Speaker 2: never exhibited disordered eating or struggled with her weight that
Speaker 2: I know about, but now she reads every label in
Speaker 2: her house, refuses to eat most of the things I
Speaker 2: cook for dinner. When she comes over pasta, our listener
Speaker 2: says what's wrong with pasta and tells me I'm killing
Speaker 2: myself in inverted commas and dad with processed food and chemicals.
Speaker 2: She seems to be spending a fortune on everything organic
Speaker 2: and macro and all kinds of supplements I've never even
Speaker 2: heard of. Is this fashion or is she right? Is
Speaker 2: there such a thing as clean eating? And should I
Speaker 2: be looking into it or talking her out of it?
Speaker 2: That's interesting because it is true that there's sometimes it
Speaker 2: feels like there's a division in the world between people
Speaker 2: who you know, they look at what you're eating and
Speaker 2: they're like, all of that's toxic and you're like, what,
Speaker 2: I didn't know that what? And then there's people who like,
Speaker 2: I don't know, what do you think she should do?
Speaker 1: Well?
Speaker 3: I think a lot of it's dependent on the age
Speaker 3: of the child, isn't it, Because if she was sixteen,
Speaker 3: I would approach this very differently to a fully grown adult,
Speaker 3: which I would say have very limited control over.
Speaker 2: But you know, she wants to kind of understand it.
Speaker 1: So clean eating.
Speaker 3: You know, there was a term coined by a US
Speaker 3: physician back in the nineties who caught it authorexia, And
Speaker 3: whilst it's not a clinical eating disorder like bulimia and arexia,
Speaker 3: it's certainly disordered eating and some of the common themes
Speaker 3: of that are obsessed with all things healthy, you know,
Speaker 3: maintaining quite a low body way, often nutrient deficiencies, very restrictive,
Speaker 3: often minimizing social occasions, to avoid eating in social situations,
Speaker 3: and that's a key marker of certainly clinical eating disorders,
Speaker 3: and you know, making it difficult to live what we
Speaker 3: would describe as normally. You know, she's not being able
Speaker 3: to easily integrate into the family. So the thing that
Speaker 3: I thought when I had these briefing notes about this
Speaker 3: case study, if it had been my child, I would say, well,
Speaker 3: don't expect me to cook.
Speaker 1: If you're coming over it, you can cook all the
Speaker 1: that you want, I know.
Speaker 2: But I think the one of the things our listener
Speaker 2: is saying is that when someone and obviously someone very
Speaker 2: important to you, suddenly takes a like a like a
Speaker 2: detour like this, it makes you look at your own
Speaker 2: behavior because suddenly you're like, oh, is she right? Am
Speaker 2: I killing myself with pastor? Is half our food toxic?
Speaker 2: It feels like something that people are talking about more.
Speaker 3: And more certainly, And I think that clinically, the concern
Speaker 3: I would have is what's underlying that dry because usually
Speaker 3: not in all cases, but usually there's an underlying anxiety,
Speaker 3: sense of control. You know, some mental health aspects I'd
Speaker 3: be concerned about. And whilst as the mum, she may
Speaker 3: not be the right person to say you need to
Speaker 3: see someone, so certainly, in my clinical experience, it's an
Speaker 3: underlying anxiety coming out in the food and the need
Speaker 3: to control, and really encouraging that person to seek psychological
Speaker 3: support because it's a secondary symptom of that need for control.
Speaker 3: But in aren't so absolutely not. You know, food isn't
Speaker 3: clean and dirty. It doesn't quite work like that. I
Speaker 3: think it comes down to that people inferring a sense
Speaker 3: of superiority or virtue from eating in a certain way,
Speaker 3: and it just doesn't work like that. We don't get
Speaker 3: to the end of the big white gates at the
Speaker 3: end and you said you've been eating way too much
Speaker 3: process I mean, you go down here.
Speaker 1: Just doesn't work like that.
Speaker 3: It's like, you know, food the way we choose to eat.
Speaker 3: And I often say this in regards to whether you
Speaker 3: choose to eat vegan or vegetarian or not, you know,
Speaker 3: farm fish, whatever it is. That's a personal choice, but
Speaker 3: it's important to understand that, you know, it's basically common sense.
Speaker 3: You know, there's foods that are less processed and more
Speaker 3: natural they're going to be pretty good for us, and
Speaker 3: foods that are more process but by the sounds of it,
Speaker 3: it's the issue is perhaps the translation of obsession with
Speaker 3: all things healthy, and I'd be sort of worried about
Speaker 3: the daughter's mental health, anxiety and whether she might need
Speaker 3: some support in those areas.
Speaker 2: Do you tell your clientele to try and eat as
Speaker 2: close to whole food as possible, like, because even if
Speaker 2: you're not going as far as this lady's going, there's
Speaker 2: a lot of chat about process food. There's no question
Speaker 2: we're eating a lot more of it. Generally speaking. You
Speaker 2: read an ingredient list and none of it makes any sense,
Speaker 2: do you generally I remember you saying to me years
Speaker 2: ago when I was talking to you for a story,
Speaker 2: and you said, really, one of the things you tell
Speaker 2: people to do for healthy data is eat more vegetables.
Speaker 2: I always think about that because you were like, it's
Speaker 2: that simple, really, Like, but do you do you have
Speaker 2: a sort of position on process food or do you
Speaker 2: just think we need to make it more simple?
Speaker 3: I the position I have is the less ultra processed
Speaker 3: snack type food we consume, the better, Yes, but processed
Speaker 3: food is all around us. You know, vegetables, past, yeah,
Speaker 3: tin fish, So it's more that ultra process food. And
Speaker 3: I would say in my one on one consults with individuals,
Speaker 3: I'm always focused on what I want them to do,
Speaker 3: so I don't really spend a lot of time saying
Speaker 3: you shouldn't have.
Speaker 1: That or avoid that.
Speaker 3: I'm much more about where's your vegetables, where's your carbon
Speaker 3: protein balance? You know, because these are the things that
Speaker 3: I have to say to my clients every single day.
Speaker 3: They're not getting those basics right, let alone worrying about
Speaker 3: the other. But as a theoretical position, the less of
Speaker 3: that ultra process food. If I'm in a shop and
Speaker 3: I pick up something that's got an ingredient list a
Speaker 3: mile long, I'll certainly be putting it back and encouraging
Speaker 3: my clients not to consume that, because that's where the
Speaker 3: evidence in terms of health. You know, it's ultra processed foods,
Speaker 3: which have fake ingredients to make something high protein or
Speaker 3: high fiber. It's not whole natural foods. That's where you
Speaker 3: see all the numbers. They're ingredients we don't have in
Speaker 3: our kitchens at home. They don't act like regular minimally
Speaker 3: processed food. We don't feel as full when we have them.
Speaker 3: We don't recognize the hunger and satiety. We don't get
Speaker 3: the nutrition. So, for example, if you have one of
Speaker 3: those low carb high protein snack bars, you don't feel
Speaker 3: as full as you would if.
Speaker 1: You had a yogurt and nuts.
Speaker 3: Even though nutritionally it might have a similar amount of carbohydrate, protein,
Speaker 3: and fat, it operates differently metabolically, So that's the issue
Speaker 3: with it when it comes to our overall health. You
Speaker 3: don't get the same nutrients from it. You don't process
Speaker 3: it in the same way, so even though it looks
Speaker 3: the same, it's absolutely not. So that's the best take
Speaker 3: home message I think, you know, if you're going to
Speaker 3: and what I'll say to my clients about foods that
Speaker 3: we describe as treat type food, so chocolate or you
Speaker 3: really like a biskit crisps, whatever it is. But I
Speaker 3: always say to my clients, I want you to have
Speaker 3: the one that you love the most, you know, like,
Speaker 3: do you love an ic ovo or is it really
Speaker 3: a timtam? And if that's the thing you love, really
Speaker 3: isolate that right down to the thing that you really enjoy,
Speaker 3: rather than just seeing it all as good and bad
Speaker 3: and I'm going to have a bad day in eating
Speaker 3: all the rubbish. So it's sort a quality. But you
Speaker 3: don't need a degree in nutrition. Just check the ingredient
Speaker 3: list and if it's really long, it's probably not great
Speaker 3: for you.
Speaker 2: Can I just ask you on that thing where you
Speaker 2: just said about high protein, low carb whatever. Protein's so
Speaker 2: hot right now? Right everything in the supermarket that I'm
Speaker 2: picking up says more protein, high protein, protein, protein, protein.
Speaker 2: I'm like, how they're getting the protein and all this stuff?
Speaker 2: Is that nonsense? Or is that real? What about so
Speaker 2: with bread and yogurt? With so? I mean, I know
Speaker 2: yoga is a form of like it's a good source
Speaker 2: of protein. Anyway, Is high protein yogurt a real thing?
Speaker 2: Or is that just more processed yogurt? And should it? So?
Speaker 2: Should I be choosing those things as a mid woman?
Speaker 2: Should I be choosing everything that says high protein?
Speaker 3: Definitely in the mid years, late thirties right through, we
Speaker 3: need women All of us metabolically need slightly less carbohydrate
Speaker 3: and more protein because of the natural changes in metabolism.
Speaker 1: So that is not a fad. That is a real thing.
Speaker 3: What is a fad is supermarket foods labeling protein like
Speaker 3: I saw protein chocolate the other day. Now, that is
Speaker 3: not good because basically you want the protein from as
Speaker 3: natural sources as possible. So in a food that already
Speaker 3: has it, so dairy, for example, great, if you can
Speaker 3: get a protein enriched great, it's going to just be
Speaker 3: a concentrated way in the yoga to give it a
Speaker 3: bit more So, the foods that I sort of reach
Speaker 3: for that might have sort of extra.
Speaker 1: Protein would be anything dairy.
Speaker 3: In bread's a little bit different because what they do
Speaker 3: in protein bread is they either fill it with seeds
Speaker 3: and grain or they concentrate the flour down. So it
Speaker 3: is quite a good product the pasta. But if it's
Speaker 3: ultra processed food that's got a protein on it, pizza
Speaker 3: not good, chocolate not good, chips not good.
Speaker 1: So process even processed snack bars.
Speaker 3: You know, you'll see a lot of pro bars are
Speaker 3: ultra kind of processed, and yes they're going to be
Speaker 3: better than picking up a macas when you're hungry, but
Speaker 3: they're still not as good as the nuts and the yogurt.
Speaker 3: So and I think anyone listening most of us know
Speaker 3: this to be true. But what we want is that
Speaker 3: we want to be told that you can eat the
Speaker 3: crap that tastes good and not feel guilty.
Speaker 1: And you can if you get good.
Speaker 3: Quality I don't want to say good quality crap, but
Speaker 3: if you get good quality, like get really good chocolate
Speaker 3: and enjoy it. You know, if that's your biscuit is
Speaker 3: the one that you love, have it, but doesn't mean
Speaker 3: you need to eat all the other crap biscuits. So
Speaker 3: you know, just really be specific about how you want
Speaker 3: to use your calories. So it's not about being restricted
Speaker 3: or told you can't have it. It's empowering you to
Speaker 3: make the decision how do you want to use your calories.
Speaker 3: And that might be on a past to feast once
Speaker 3: a week with your friends, great, go for it in
Speaker 3: a bottle of wine. But that also means you can't
Speaker 3: eat like that all week. It's just a balance and
Speaker 3: working out what balance suits you.
Speaker 2: Next, Susie tells us why our bodies, including our feet,
Speaker 2: can change shape once we hit mid Stay with us.
Speaker 2: I'm forty four and my body seems to have suddenly
Speaker 2: changed shape. We were getting to this before. I'm not
Speaker 2: talking about weight, although there's been a bit more of
Speaker 2: that around the middle. We're talking about this before too.
Speaker 2: I mean more bits of me that used to be
Speaker 2: toned now aren't. And even my feet are bigger than
Speaker 2: they used to be. What the hell is going on?
Speaker 2: And why aren't the healthy foods I've always counted on
Speaker 2: and the workouts I've literally been doing consistently for years
Speaker 2: suddenly not having the same results. Are there just different
Speaker 2: rules for health now I've crossed some invisible line into
Speaker 2: middle age? And she's written, Ah, no, one likes the
Speaker 2: term middle age. We don't do that. Hit. We've grown ups.
Speaker 2: That's what we call ourselves here. We're grown ups. Why
Speaker 2: is life so unfair?
Speaker 1: That's all I've got to say.
Speaker 2: No, this is she imagining it? Or are her feet bigger?
Speaker 1: This is absolutely real.
Speaker 3: And of course it was me or who launched this
Speaker 3: whole dialogue in the mainstream media. Like ten years ago,
Speaker 3: we weren't speaking about it.
Speaker 2: It is she said, this is really funny. I remember
Speaker 2: you liked at the time she was saying that suddenly
Speaker 2: my body wants to be a circle, And that was
Speaker 2: what you were saying before about just the way that
Speaker 2: your weight is redistributed in the mid years.
Speaker 3: Anyway, go on, Yeah, these are key metabolic and hormonal changes.
Speaker 3: We literally have no control over. A lot of it
Speaker 3: will be genetic as well. You're probably noticing you're looking
Speaker 3: a bit more like your mother. You know, we are human.
Speaker 3: There's only so many things we can control. But basically,
Speaker 3: as we get older, naturally, even as adults, we lose
Speaker 3: muscle mass. Keep in mind that all of our women
Speaker 3: are so busy. They're working two or three jobs, they're
Speaker 3: being mums at home, they're working full time, they're caring
Speaker 3: for aging parents.
Speaker 1: They're exhausted.
Speaker 3: So you know, very few of us have the privilege
Speaker 3: of exercising daily at the level we want to because
Speaker 3: we're surviving. So we do lose muscle mass, and then
Speaker 3: that's naturally happening anyway. And then as our estrogen declines,
Speaker 3: we just become more predisposed to depositing around the middle
Speaker 3: and then naturally diet wise, Holly, you know, we're not
Speaker 3: saying carbs are bad, but we do all eat too
Speaker 3: many of them for the amount of activity we're doing.
Speaker 1: Carbohydrate is a fuel source.
Speaker 3: That's why sixteen year old boys can eat five buckets apart.
Speaker 3: For us, you know, the diets are different, and I
Speaker 3: have this conversation a lot because when I start with
Speaker 3: a client.
Speaker 1: The mum will often say to me, I'm.
Speaker 3: Worried about eating differently to the family, and I say, well,
Speaker 3: you need different things to the family.
Speaker 1: You're not a sixteen year old school girl.
Speaker 3: That's really You're a forty five year old woman, and
Speaker 3: it's okay to call out that your needs are different.
Speaker 2: Can I ask you about that, because that is so
Speaker 2: interesting because I have worried about that over time when
Speaker 2: I've been doing different things with you know, trying to
Speaker 2: eat correctly for my stage of life, particularly when we
Speaker 2: have daughters. And I have a teenage daughter. I am
Speaker 2: hyper conscious, as most mums I know are, of not
Speaker 2: talking about weight and diets and calories in front of her,
Speaker 2: not talking myself down in front of her, so not
Speaker 2: being like, oh, look at me in these jeens all that.
Speaker 2: I try really hard not to do that, and most
Speaker 2: women I know do that too, And I think it's
Speaker 2: been really good because although I mean, I think Instagramazon
Speaker 2: don all the good work that we've done on that front.
Speaker 2: But on the other hand, at least they're not seeing
Speaker 2: it at home, so it is a genuine concern that
Speaker 2: you're going that they're clocking. But Mum isn't eating the pasta.
Speaker 2: Mom is eating the meat and the salad. Like, what
Speaker 2: do you advise us to how to talk about that
Speaker 2: without imparting? Like you know, dangerous is an overstated word,
Speaker 2: but like difficult messaging too, I think it's.
Speaker 3: Very I don't think it's difficult. I think it's simple. I,
Speaker 3: as a forty five year old woman, have very different
Speaker 3: needs to you you're sixteen. Yeah, I sit down on
Speaker 3: its coll It's not a big deal and it doesn't
Speaker 3: have to be complicated. Just deconstruct the meal. If you're
Speaker 3: doing pasta, put the pasta out, put the veggies and
Speaker 3: salad out, put the meat out, and just have different proportions.
Speaker 1: It's not making a whole new meal.
Speaker 3: No one's saying you have eat steamfish and brocoli while
Speaker 3: everyone is having pasta. Yeah, you just need a couple
Speaker 3: of spoons versus your teenage son who needs the whole plate.
Speaker 1: So I think just call it for what it is.
Speaker 3: Just we have very different needs and this is about
Speaker 3: women acknowledging that and saying that actually, I have needs
Speaker 3: to and this is what I need. And unless you
Speaker 3: are able to do a couple of our exercise in
Speaker 3: a genetically blessed like a supermodel. Guarantee you most of
Speaker 3: us will need far less carbohydrate at night because we
Speaker 3: like to go on the weekend and have the pizza
Speaker 3: and the wine with our friends and all the stuff then,
Speaker 3: so you just can't have it all the time. So
Speaker 3: it's making that choice. And yeah, it's just because we're
Speaker 3: less metabolically active. These are physiological facts. This is not
Speaker 3: diet culture. This isn't about restricting. This is just our
Speaker 3: bodies change and our needs are far far different, particularly
Speaker 3: as we get older, which is another reason to maintain
Speaker 3: muscle mass because basically it can eate more. The more
Speaker 3: muscle mass you've got, the more calories you're going to burn,
Speaker 3: so that works in reverse as well.
Speaker 2: It's so interesting because I think that for a lot
Speaker 2: of women around my age, we have swum around diet
Speaker 2: culture for a lot of years. Right. We had the
Speaker 2: nineties when everyone was way thin, and then we were
Speaker 2: like had to be athletic, and then the Kardashians came along,
Speaker 2: and then everybody had to have big booties and whatever
Speaker 2: it was. You know, when I grew up, every advert
Speaker 2: on the TV talked about weight loss and calories in
Speaker 2: a very different way than they do now. It means
Speaker 2: that we there's so much emotion and value attached to
Speaker 2: all this that when you say to me, you should
Speaker 2: just talk about it like a normal person at the
Speaker 2: table that you want anything else, Like I don't need
Speaker 2: as much carbo hydrate as you because I'm a forty
Speaker 2: five Well I'm not. I'm a fifty three year old woman.
Speaker 2: That makes perfect sense, But for some reason, it's all
Speaker 2: just caught up in all this stuff in our minds
Speaker 2: that you're like, oh, I can't eat that naughty food,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Like, And it's kind of like,
Speaker 2: if you can just take the emotion out of it,
Speaker 2: it's just science, it's just facts.
Speaker 3: And what I would say is we get in our
Speaker 3: head a lot about it and just take it. And
Speaker 3: it's exactly what I say to my clients when we start,
Speaker 3: because they all too have years. They've I guarantee you,
Speaker 3: nine out of ten clients, I see you have done
Speaker 3: every diet in the book.
Speaker 2: They've been to every gym when they've fallen lost the.
Speaker 3: Way they've put it back on. They've probably been on
Speaker 3: weight loss medication. I've seen it all. Like that's why
Speaker 3: they end up finally with a dietitian. I say, just
Speaker 3: take each meal as it comes, don't get in your head,
Speaker 3: don't spend ours meal prepping, just breakfast. Where's my protein,
Speaker 3: where's my carb, where's my fresh food? Then wait, tillo
Speaker 3: hungry again, Just getting back to those cues because we're
Speaker 3: so in our head and influenced by social media, and
Speaker 3: we're not even listening to our bodies so many so
Speaker 3: feel my clients even know if they're hungry, they're just.
Speaker 1: Eating on autoqueue.
Speaker 3: I'll get food diaries back, and I do that because
Speaker 3: they can just be a great insight into what people
Speaker 3: are doing and understanding as opposed to a restriction model.
Speaker 3: And I'll say, my concern is that you're eating the
Speaker 3: same thing every single day. And they said to me,
Speaker 3: but it's on the plan, And I said, yeah, the
Speaker 3: plan is a guide, but you should have some difference.
Speaker 3: We shouldn't be hungry every single day the same level.
Speaker 3: Some days you're gonna be hungryer, some days less. Sometimes
Speaker 3: you've been out to dinner, you might not need breakfast.
Speaker 3: So yes, there's a basic guide, but it's also following
Speaker 3: our natural hunger and satiety, which will be different same
Speaker 3: as you'll feel like eating different things every single day.
Speaker 3: That's why I don't like people meal prepping for the week.
Speaker 3: How do you know you're going to want to have
Speaker 3: a stir for on Friday? You might want dumplings. So
Speaker 3: you're getting people back in touch with themselves, their natural body,
Speaker 3: what they like to eat, and reteach them hunger and fullness.
Speaker 3: And that takes time. It's an unraveling. And I say,
Speaker 3: you're in dietaryhab and this might take a while because
Speaker 3: you've had twenty thirty years of diet culture, and it
Speaker 3: may take three, six, twelve months.
Speaker 1: But I guarantee you after I've had them.
Speaker 3: For six they're getting back in touch with themselves again
Speaker 3: and feeling more confident in making those decisions.
Speaker 1: But everyone can do it. It's simple. Get your balance,
Speaker 1: more vegetables. Have you had your vegie today, Holly?
Speaker 2: For lunch, I had a veggie filled soup. I was like, Susie,
Speaker 2: I like this soup two to three cups.
Speaker 1: It has lunch in it too, protein.
Speaker 3: And you know, actually, how hungry am I? Do I
Speaker 3: need one slice of bread or do I need two?
Speaker 3: Rather than this? This is what I should eat? And
Speaker 3: then of course we're not happy with that and we
Speaker 3: end up eating the other rubbish anyway.
Speaker 2: So our listener who's like, suddenly things aren't working that
Speaker 2: have always worked for me, and it sounds to me
Speaker 2: like she's not just talking about way she's talking about it.
Speaker 1: You know, her body and training changes.
Speaker 2: She's imagining that.
Speaker 3: No, absolutely not, and your nutritional requirements change. Things like
Speaker 3: calcium becomes so much more important. You know, I can't
Speaker 3: tell you how many of my girls come and they
Speaker 3: do have low bone density.
Speaker 1: So please listening.
Speaker 3: If you haven't had a bone density scan and you're
Speaker 3: in your forties, you must go and get that done.
Speaker 1: Keep an eye on your cholesterol.
Speaker 3: Actually, I read a really interesting research paper from Mericle
Speaker 3: Harbor who said one of the first indications of peri
Speaker 3: and menopausal changes is slight increases in LDL cholesterol.
Speaker 1: That is fascinating.
Speaker 3: Because you might have always had normal cholesterol and then
Speaker 3: suddenly you go in your forty two happened to and
Speaker 3: your LDL is a bit higher. Then you know your
Speaker 3: estrogen's probably dropping, and then you know it's time to
Speaker 3: go and speak to the GP about what options there
Speaker 3: are for you in terms of optimizing metabolic health so
Speaker 3: that's a really powerful marker. We should all be doing that.
Speaker 3: You know, check getting your bower screen as well. You know,
Speaker 3: one of the most common increases in cancer is bowel cancer.
Speaker 3: You know, be on top of all your checks, and
Speaker 3: then ultimately you probably will need to change your diet,
Speaker 3: so see a good dietitian. There's plenty of experts in
Speaker 3: this area out there, and you probably will have to
Speaker 3: change your training because you will find what you did
Speaker 3: the cardio of the nineties won't work anymore for a
Speaker 3: number of different reasons. When it can increase inflammation, and
Speaker 3: the peri and menopausal phases are pro inflammatory. So anything
Speaker 3: that's inflammatory in the body, like cholesterol, like fatty liver,
Speaker 3: like insulin, will all increase as we get older unless
Speaker 3: and there's a lot of dietary things we can do
Speaker 3: for that. But certainly your training will likely need to change,
Speaker 3: and that's where you can, of course get expert advice
Speaker 3: on that as well, so you don't keep you know,
Speaker 3: flogging a dead horse, doing the same thing and expecting
Speaker 3: the same results.
Speaker 2: Susie, I love talking to you. You just make it
Speaker 2: all seem so like common sense.
Speaker 1: Well I think I really I like to eat.
Speaker 3: I'm no purest, you know, I factor in treats, so
Speaker 3: I think that I and also I'm this age myself now,
Speaker 3: so I'm living it, and I just speak to hundreds
Speaker 3: and hundreds of women, and I think that you get
Speaker 3: you know, what works and what doesn't, but in a practical,
Speaker 3: sustainable way, because all of the women I speak too
Speaker 3: are tired, they're overwhelmed. They're working two or three jobs,
Speaker 3: so you don't want to make it another chore. And
Speaker 3: when they first come, they'll say to me, and then
Speaker 3: I should do this, and then I should do that.
Speaker 3: I said, let's just start with food, because I don't
Speaker 3: want to be adding more and more and more to overwhelmed,
Speaker 3: busy women. And then hopefully once you know, the kids
Speaker 3: get older and they get into their fifties and they
Speaker 3: get a bit more time, perhaps maybe before grandkids, to
Speaker 3: really you know, put that time and energy back into
Speaker 3: self and recalibrate, given that we might live to one
Speaker 3: hundred and we need to make sure these bodies are
Speaker 3: in good nick.
Speaker 2: So yeah, thank you so much. We will of course
Speaker 2: show our listeners where they can find out more about
Speaker 2: you and your podcast and all of your stuff in
Speaker 2: our show notes, But Susie, thank you so much for
Speaker 2: solving some dilemmas with me today.
Speaker 1: It's always so nice to see your whole Thank you, MIDS.
Speaker 2: If you enjoyed that honest chat about food and weight
Speaker 2: and MID, I encourage you to scroll back in the feed.
Speaker 2: Last season, I had a really interesting conversation with a
Speaker 2: neurophysiologist called Louisa Nikola, about weightlifting, about protein, about all
Speaker 2: that stuff that meds are told to do. It's a
Speaker 2: bit of a different conversation to this one, but I
Speaker 2: think you'll find it really helpful. If you're not, if
Speaker 2: you're done with being told what to do, and told
Speaker 2: what you can and can't eat, and told what you
Speaker 2: should or shouldn't be doing with your body and your exercise,
Speaker 2: then mate, pour yourself something hot or cold that partickles
Speaker 2: you fancy, and put your feet up and just have
Speaker 2: a chill. Who cares? Life's hard anyway, Mids. If you
Speaker 2: have any dilemmas you would like us to address on
Speaker 2: this season of MID, do not hesitate. You can email
Speaker 2: us at help me at mamamea dot com dot au
Speaker 2: and just put MID in the subject line, or you
Speaker 2: can just DM me, or you can just DM the
Speaker 2: mid momamea account on Instagram. We would love to hear
Speaker 2: from you. The executive producer of MID is Nama Brown.
Speaker 2: The senior producer is Tylie Blackman, and we've had audio
Speaker 2: production from Jacob Brown. And we'll see you next week.