Speaker 1: Hello, lovely neighborhood. I'm back in your ears today for
Speaker 1: the second time this week. We are double dropping because
Speaker 1: I have a special treat from Mama MEA's daily news podcast,
Speaker 1: The Quickie.
Speaker 2: I was thrilled to join the.
Speaker 1: Show with an episode all about my adoption story and
Speaker 1: the journey over the past year or so to meeting
Speaker 1: my first blood relative, my beautiful son Teddy. November was
Speaker 1: Adoption Awareness Month, so if you've ever thought about adoption
Speaker 1: as a way to expand or start your family, I
Speaker 1: know it can be a really overwhelming area if it
Speaker 1: hasn't been in your network before. This episode has some
Speaker 1: information that hopefully might help or give you some insights
Speaker 1: you haven't heard before. I was asked a few questions
Speaker 1: I've never answered before, which was a really interesting occasion
Speaker 1: and opportunity to reflect, and also found that some of
Speaker 1: my answers to the questions I have discussed before had
Speaker 1: changed since I've had Teddy, so I really enjoyed this chat.
Speaker 1: Please take a listen to the episode, let us know
Speaker 1: what you think, and I will be back with another
Speaker 1: episode of CZA very soon. Hi.
Speaker 3: I'm Claire Murphy. This is Mumma MEA's twice daily news
Speaker 3: podcast The Quickie. It's Adoption Awareness Month and if you've
Speaker 3: ever thought about it, even just for a second, as
Speaker 3: a way to expand or start your family, we have
Speaker 3: some info that might help. We'll speak to Sarah Davidson,
Speaker 3: host of the CSDA podcast, who was herself adopted, to
Speaker 3: also help us understand what her experience has been like
Speaker 3: growing up adopted in Australia. Sarah Davidson shares her story
Speaker 3: as we mark National Adoption Awareness Month. I recently read
Speaker 3: through a thread asking for those who were adopted how
Speaker 3: old they were when they found out. The responses showed
Speaker 3: just how varied the adoption experience can be for those
Speaker 3: who were given up by or taken away from their
Speaker 3: biological families. Some felt like they were treated like not
Speaker 3: really a part of the family. Some experience trauma even
Speaker 3: those who were adopted as tiny babies. There were struggles
Speaker 3: to locate biological families, especially for those adopted from overseas,
Speaker 3: and both sad and joyous stories of biological family reunions.
Speaker 3: There were celebrations for families who finally felt complete with
Speaker 3: their adopted children, to those who mapped the dos and
Speaker 3: don'ts of adoptee life like changing a child's first or
Speaker 3: surname without their permission. Adoption is not the same for everyone,
Speaker 3: but the truth here in Australia is that we face
Speaker 3: significant challenges in providing permanent homes for thousands of children
Speaker 3: in need. The most recent data from the Australian Institute
Speaker 3: of Health and Welfare reveals that only two hundred and
Speaker 3: one adoptions were finalized in Australia during twenty twenty two
Speaker 3: to twenty three. This represents a ninety eight percent decline
Speaker 3: from the nearly ten thousand adoptions recorded in nineteen seventy one.
Speaker 3: Seventy two of those recent adoptions, one hundred and seventy
Speaker 3: three were domestic, well twenty eight were international. Reality is
Speaker 3: that over fifty five thousand children currently reside in out
Speaker 3: of home care across Australia. More concerningly, around four thousand
Speaker 3: of these children are not living in home based care,
Speaker 3: instead staying in group homes, motels or hotels. This situation
Speaker 3: highlights the critical need for permanent, stable family environments. Modern
Speaker 3: adoption in Australia follows a plenary open model, where children
Speaker 3: maintain knowledge of their heritage while forming new legal relationships
Speaker 3: with adoptive families. The system encompasses three main categories. Local
Speaker 3: adoptions within Australia into country adoptions through international partnerships can
Speaker 3: known child adoptions, including step parent and relative arrangements. All
Speaker 3: adoptions in Australia must now be open, ensuring children grow
Speaker 3: up knowing their adoption story. Now this approach recognizes the
Speaker 3: importance of identity and cultural connections, particularly for First Nations
Speaker 3: children who are overrepresented in the out of home care system.
Speaker 3: The disparity between adoption rates and the number of children
Speaker 3: requiring permanent homes is concerning, but those in the field
Speaker 3: know there are some serious barriers to adopting a child
Speaker 3: in this country. The stringent eligibility process, while necessary, may
Speaker 3: overlook a candidate due to a criminal history or health issue.
Speaker 3: There's the financial considerations and associated costs with adoption, which
Speaker 3: with the cost of living crisis, has made it worse
Speaker 3: for many. The adoption process also is not a quick
Speaker 3: one and it requires a certain level of legal assistance,
Speaker 3: and of course, the needs of the child should be
Speaker 3: held above all else for example, those with a disability
Speaker 3: who might need more support, or First Nations children who
Speaker 3: require connection to culture and need an appropriate family who
Speaker 3: can guide them. Research shows that early stability is crucial
Speaker 3: for children's development and their ability to thrive. Without permanent
Speaker 3: family arrangements, many children face uncertain futures and potential negative outcomes.
Speaker 3: The current system leaves thousands of young Australians without that
Speaker 3: security and that nurturing and environment that they really need
Speaker 3: for healthy development. That stable environment is something Sarah Davidson
Speaker 3: appreciates more than she can ever express. The author, TV
Speaker 3: and radio presenter and host of The Seas the Yay
Speaker 3: Podcast was adopted from Korea into an Australian family. She says,
Speaker 3: whether she and her younger brother were adopted or not
Speaker 3: was never even a question.
Speaker 1: My brother and I were born in South Korea and
Speaker 1: our parents are not South Korean by heritage, so it
Speaker 1: sort of wasn't possible in our family scenario to get
Speaker 1: very far into our lives without us wondering why we
Speaker 1: were completely Asian looking and they were completely Caucasian. So
Speaker 1: it wasn't ever going to last very long for there
Speaker 1: to be any illusion that we weren't adopted, or that
Speaker 1: there wasn't some kind of question to be asked. And
Speaker 1: because of that, I think it worked out beautifully because
Speaker 1: I don't ever remember not knowing, And I think that
Speaker 1: might be maybe the difference between some people feeling like
Speaker 1: they've had one narrative and then it's changed later on
Speaker 1: in their life, or you know, that.
Speaker 2: Just was no choice for us.
Speaker 1: So I was told before I even understood what the
Speaker 1: word adoption was. There's no before and after the news.
Speaker 1: I don't actually remember what the conversation was because I
Speaker 1: was so young.
Speaker 3: I think for those of us who haven't been exposed
Speaker 3: to adoption, there's a real movie narrative around it. For us,
Speaker 3: So we presume that as soon as you're kind of
Speaker 3: aware that you're adopted, that the initial thing would be
Speaker 3: to find out who your biological family is, and there's
Speaker 3: that real draw to find out where you come from.
Speaker 3: Did you experience that?
Speaker 1: Of course, there's a curiosity from a medical background perspective,
Speaker 1: or what you look like.
Speaker 2: There's always a curiosity there.
Speaker 1: But because our family here, like I never have you know,
Speaker 1: been like my adopted parents versus my biological parents. I've
Speaker 1: had one set of parents who raised me, who are
Speaker 1: their only family I ever knew, who are the most loving,
Speaker 1: incredible family, Like there was no sense of a gap
Speaker 1: that might drive that search for something else. I think
Speaker 1: maybe if you don't get along with your adoptive family
Speaker 1: or you feel like something's missing, that might drive the search.
Speaker 2: So I've never had that desire.
Speaker 1: But then there's also the fact that there's a big
Speaker 1: bureaucratic and logistical barrier as well. So Korea in the
Speaker 1: eighties had like no digitization of record. Often there is
Speaker 1: no information even if you did go on a really
Speaker 1: big search. There's a language barrier. But then there's also
Speaker 1: the fact that there's a big possibility that you'll find
Speaker 1: out something that you probably didn't necessarily want to know,
Speaker 1: like and you can't know that until you find out.
Speaker 1: And I just thought, what is it going to add
Speaker 1: to my life if it's positive, and what if it's
Speaker 1: going to add to my life if it's negative.
Speaker 2: And I don't know, it's just to me.
Speaker 1: I sort of thought, if it is something that's quite traumatic,
Speaker 1: I personally don't feel any trauma, and that would unner
Speaker 1: things that maybe I don't need to know. I have
Speaker 1: loved the family life that I've had. The way I
Speaker 1: put it to people to kind of explain, is if
Speaker 1: you found out now that you were adopted. It wouldn't
Speaker 1: change that you call your mum and dad your mum
Speaker 1: and dad. It might change that you feel you might
Speaker 1: have sense of betrayal, and you know, all that kind
Speaker 1: of stuff, But if someone pointed out your biological parents
Speaker 1: in an audience, you wouldn't immediately go. Yes, I know
Speaker 1: that if you told me they were outside, I'd be so.
Speaker 2: Curious to go and meet them.
Speaker 1: But if you told me it would take me twenty
Speaker 1: years of really hard work to go and find them,
Speaker 1: I probably wouldn't bother with it, if that makes sense.
Speaker 3: Do you think this stigma around adoption has changed over
Speaker 3: the years because there was this idea that and I
Speaker 3: guess maybe stigma's not even the right word. It's almost
Speaker 3: like you said that, sometimes adoption is seen of having
Speaker 3: some kind of I don't know, shame attached to it,
Speaker 3: like whether your parents experience that with not having in
Speaker 3: quotes their own children and having to go through that
Speaker 3: process of bringing you and your brother into their family.
Speaker 3: And then there's this idea that because you're a different
Speaker 3: sort of family, there's something wrong with that, you know,
Speaker 3: And now do you feel like that has changed over time?
Speaker 3: That we're so much more accepting of different kinds of
Speaker 3: families now in whatever way they come together.
Speaker 2: Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 1: I think when we were in primary school, so my
Speaker 1: brother's four years younger than me, I definitely think it
Speaker 1: was much more the nuclear family. It was a much
Speaker 1: more conventional family unit time in society, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1: And the things that we were bullied about. Parts of
Speaker 1: it were sort of the racism of the nineties because
Speaker 1: we were very Asian looking, but there were a lot
Speaker 1: of questions of sort of like that's not your real
Speaker 1: mum or that's not your real dad, and yeah, the
Speaker 1: implication that they're not your real family and you don't
Speaker 1: know your parents. And it's funny now looking back on that,
Speaker 1: we're so much more accepting of a myriad of different
Speaker 1: ways that people become a family. There is so much
Speaker 1: less I don't know if it's stigma, but it's just
Speaker 1: more common that families are combined in very unique and
Speaker 1: different ways. In fact, being adopted is kind of vanilla
Speaker 1: on the spectrum now it's not really considered that quirky's
Speaker 1: so true. Yeah, like it's not even a story like okay, cool,
Speaker 1: like what else? But yeah, I think we did have
Speaker 1: a much harder time when we were younger, and it does.
Speaker 1: It does kind of eat away at you that people
Speaker 1: are asking questions about the legitimacy of your family bond.
Speaker 1: And it's only because our parents, we were so communicative
Speaker 1: and open and helped us be really well adjusted around
Speaker 1: that part of our identity. They always sort of said,
Speaker 1: if you want to go on a pursuit, we will
Speaker 1: support that, if you want your Korean culture to be
Speaker 1: part of your identity, like we've always had traditional Korean hahnbach,
Speaker 1: you know, the traditional dress. We've gone back and met
Speaker 1: our foster parents, they've always kind of supported us as
Speaker 1: much or as little as we wanted to investigate that
Speaker 1: there's obviously never been any secrets.
Speaker 2: About it because there couldn't be.
Speaker 1: And they've also brought us up to believe that blood
Speaker 1: is not the only way that you can find your family.
Speaker 1: So we actually aren't biologically related, my brother and I,
Speaker 1: we were born in two different biological families, and yet
Speaker 1: we have the same birthday exactly four years apart. The
Speaker 1: narrative that our parents have always kind of encouraged us
Speaker 1: with is that you know, you were obviously meant to
Speaker 1: be together, even if you weren't born in the same family.
Speaker 1: Kind of the universe conspired for you to grow up together,
Speaker 1: and we've been super close our whole lives, and that
Speaker 1: narrative really helps you sort of combat when we were younger,
Speaker 1: at least combat that feeling of well, you guys don't
Speaker 1: think there are real parents, but we were.
Speaker 2: Meant to be together. You know. It's just really they
Speaker 2: did it in a really beautiful way.
Speaker 3: I think it was literally just ring because my cousin
Speaker 3: and I were born on the same day too, and
Speaker 3: I was looking at when you have a family member
Speaker 3: who is born on the same day as you, it
Speaker 3: means you were also family members that are passed line.
Speaker 3: I really love that.
Speaker 2: Oh well, you know what's so like wild?
Speaker 1: My husband's father and grandfather were born on the first
Speaker 1: of April, and the whole of my pregnancy that was
Speaker 1: our baby's do date was the first of April, and
Speaker 1: then he ended up being born on the twenty first
Speaker 1: of March, which is like three days before my brother
Speaker 1: and I, but would have come out on the twenty
Speaker 1: four Like just so many weird alignments of family, even though.
Speaker 2: You know it's not all through blood relation and genetics.
Speaker 3: Do you remember teenage you having conversations with your mum
Speaker 3: and dad about this, because you know, we struggle with
Speaker 3: so many things during that transition in our lives, and
Speaker 3: we often, you know, we might withdraw, or we might
Speaker 3: you know, get a bit angry, or we might just
Speaker 3: be annoying teenage behavior. But do you remember how teenage
Speaker 3: you handled that?
Speaker 1: Yeah? I think in primary school it was very sort
Speaker 1: of one dimensional. The way that I accepted it. It was like,
Speaker 1: kids are bullying me, but I'm okay because my mum
Speaker 1: and dad loved me and end of story. When I
Speaker 1: got to high school, it became a little bit more
Speaker 1: layered and it wasn't so much asking mom and dad
Speaker 1: the questions. It was more how much I lent into
Speaker 1: my Asian nos if that makes sense. And I think
Speaker 1: a lot of cross cultural adoptees go through that where for.
Speaker 2: A long time.
Speaker 1: Because I grew up in a suburb and went to
Speaker 1: a primary school that wasn't very multicultural, and in the
Speaker 1: nineties we were a lot less kind of embracing of
Speaker 1: multicultural identities. I spent a lot of time suppressing that
Speaker 1: and trying to be really Bogan and Australian and prove
Speaker 1: that my grandparents were dairy farmers in the countryside, and
Speaker 1: you know, I kind of ramped up the Australian side
Speaker 1: of me, and then I went a little bit the
Speaker 1: other way at the start of high school and sort
Speaker 1: of lentinto oh, maybe being Korean, Like, now being Korean
Speaker 1: is so cool. It wasn't when I was in primary school,
Speaker 1: but in high school it started to be. And then
Speaker 1: I came back out and was like, oh no, but
Speaker 1: I don't resonate with a lot of the things that
Speaker 1: are associated with an Asian upbringing, so maybe I shouldn't
Speaker 1: represent myself that way because people would then seek me
Speaker 1: out and be like, oh, you must get it because
Speaker 1: you had tiger parents, and you must be studying really
Speaker 1: hard academically because your parents, you know. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: oh no, that wasn't me at all. So then I
Speaker 1: came back and I kind of swung back into the middle.
Speaker 1: Somewhere when I really started to drive harder questions was
Speaker 1: just around fertility. That was the first time I really thought, wait,
Speaker 1: hold on. I always knew that Mum did IVF. I
Speaker 1: always knew that obviously, with the end result was adoption,
Speaker 1: but I didn't really know when the decisions were made,
Speaker 1: or how difficult it was to do, and how expensive
Speaker 1: it is to adopt a child.
Speaker 2: And then it's really since.
Speaker 1: I've had a baby that I was adopted at five
Speaker 1: months old, sort of thinking the bit where Teddy was
Speaker 1: zero to five months, Mom didn't get that. And then
Speaker 1: this five month old that was sort of a little
Speaker 1: bit baked just was dropped into her lap, and then
Speaker 1: she got on a plane and brought them across the
Speaker 1: world and then just had to get to know this
Speaker 1: baby as if it was her own without the hormonal
Speaker 1: support that you get, you know, postpartum, And that has
Speaker 1: suddenly all dawned on me. So I've had a lot
Speaker 1: more questions this year, even than I kind of ever
Speaker 1: had in my lifetime.
Speaker 3: Actually, what's really interesting is one of my colleagues here
Speaker 3: at Mamma Mia mentioned this the other day. She works
Speaker 3: on another podcast called This Glorious Miss and they were
Speaker 3: talking about how your brain changes when you have a baby.
Speaker 3: And most people think that's only happening to the mother
Speaker 3: who biologically birth's a child, but they have found those
Speaker 3: changes actually happen in the brains of dads, and it
Speaker 3: happens in the brains of parents who adopt children too,
Speaker 3: so well, you don't have that biological bond. Her brain
Speaker 3: changed when you came into her life.
Speaker 2: That makes you want to cry.
Speaker 1: It's so beautiful, and I've always thought that it's interesting
Speaker 1: that there's now like scientific evidence behind it.
Speaker 2: Anecdotally, I've always thought of that.
Speaker 1: We have a couple of photos of the day that
Speaker 1: I arrived and then the day that my brother arrived,
Speaker 1: sort of at the airport, like the minute that we
Speaker 1: stepped onto Australian soil, and we had only met mum
Speaker 1: and dad, like maybe forty eight hours before. I think
Speaker 1: you actually pick up your child at the time you
Speaker 1: did anyway, and then within forty eight hours you're on
Speaker 1: a plane back home. Because I know that she's my mum,
Speaker 1: I'd always look back at the photos and be like, oh.
Speaker 2: Cute, Like look I'm cuddling her. It's you know, we're
Speaker 2: so close.
Speaker 1: But now I think, oh my god, we weren't close
Speaker 1: at the time, like she had just picked me literally
Speaker 1: doesn't matter, and yet I look so like that's my mom.
Speaker 1: I'm hugging into her. We just look like we have
Speaker 1: this bond. And now I'm asking her like, was I scared, like,
Speaker 1: I had no idea you were. I got on a
Speaker 1: plane for the first time. Was I crying the whole time?
Speaker 1: And She's like, no, you just kind of cuddled into
Speaker 1: me and that was it. Now I look back at
Speaker 1: those photos with that new knowledge of what having Teddy
Speaker 1: was like. I mean, I've always thought that she was
Speaker 1: the most selfless, incredible, loving person ever, but now I'm like,
Speaker 1: I just have this whole new level of Wow, you
Speaker 1: didn't need a transition period.
Speaker 2: I was your daughter straight away. That's bananas.
Speaker 3: I'm really interested to know how you feel about DNA
Speaker 3: testing like twenty three and me, because it has made
Speaker 3: tracking down relatives for people who don't know who their
Speaker 3: biological family is a hell of a lot easier, even
Speaker 3: if what they find out isn't necessarily what they wanted
Speaker 3: to find out.
Speaker 2: How do you feel about that?
Speaker 1: I probably if I had the option to add on
Speaker 1: the ancestry part as well as the medical history part,
Speaker 1: I probably wouldn't. It's not that I'm closed off to it,
Speaker 1: but I think I've maybe been influenced as well by
Speaker 1: a couple of people in our network having found out
Speaker 1: some pretty traumatic stuff and then really not knowing how
Speaker 1: to resolve that later on, because you can't unnow information
Speaker 1: as well.
Speaker 2: And the other thing was when I did the medical testing,
Speaker 2: I sort of thought, oh, this worked out really well.
Speaker 1: I don't have any precursors for Alzheimer's, I don't have
Speaker 1: any precursors for Parkinson's.
Speaker 2: But now I think, what if I had found out
Speaker 2: at eighteen that I did have those?
Speaker 1: Like sometimes I think in this day and age, we
Speaker 1: feel like we need more information, and that's necessary a
Speaker 1: good thing sometimes. I think if you know that you've
Speaker 1: got a high likelihood of something, sometimes it changes the
Speaker 1: way that you live your life, even though there's a
Speaker 1: chance you won't get that. My view changes a bit
Speaker 1: as time goes on. But maybe we don't necessarily need
Speaker 1: to know everything all the time, but it is good
Speaker 1: that if you do want to, you can.
Speaker 3: What's it like for you being a mum now and
Speaker 3: having a biological relative.
Speaker 1: It's at once incredibly profound and also at the same
Speaker 1: time not as profound as I expected, if.
Speaker 2: That makes any sense at all.
Speaker 1: It is so mind blowing, Like once a day, if
Speaker 1: not multiple times a day, I stare at him and
Speaker 1: just think, I grow that, Like what the actual like,
Speaker 1: I cannot comprehend it. That is half my husband, half me.
Speaker 1: He looks a little bit like a middle ground blend
Speaker 1: of us. And when he smiles, his cheeks are like
Speaker 1: exactly my cheeks, and no one's ever looked like me before.
Speaker 1: I've never seen my feet reflected in anyone, knowing that
Speaker 1: that was a biological thing or genetic thing, and that's fascinating,
Speaker 1: Like remembering the kicks and then knowing that those are
Speaker 1: the same little feet that have come out, and you know,
Speaker 1: all of those things are just mind blowing. Nature blows
Speaker 1: me away. But at the same time, kind of comparing
Speaker 1: that to mum being so fascinated, like watching her c
Speaker 1: zero to five months for the first time has been
Speaker 1: so moving because she never got that with us, watching
Speaker 1: her learn about breastfeeding, because she never got that, watching
Speaker 1: her be in the hospital and being like I'm useless here,
Speaker 1: like I'll help you from five months on, but I'm
Speaker 1: a newbie with you, like that was so beautiful to
Speaker 1: share that with her. But at the same time, I've
Speaker 1: sort of thought when he was five months old on
Speaker 1: that day, that was quite profound for me. My anniversary
Speaker 1: of coming to Australia was at the same day as
Speaker 1: his five month anniversary, and I sort of thought, if
Speaker 1: I met him now and I knew that he wasn't
Speaker 1: my biological child, I would love.
Speaker 2: Him the same.
Speaker 1: So it's sort of been incredibly profound and also like
Speaker 1: not as big of a deal as I thought it would.
Speaker 1: At the same time, like if we wanted to become
Speaker 1: parents and we hadn't been able to do so biologically,
Speaker 1: and we did have a really rough ride to get here,
Speaker 1: we would have adopted without thinking. And I don't think
Speaker 1: how love would have been any different. And Nick's mum
Speaker 1: is also adopted, which is wild. She was the first
Speaker 1: Asian adopted into Australia, so adoption is not foreign to us.
Speaker 1: It's always been very very clear examples that. You know,
Speaker 1: people say blood is thicker than water. I think like
Speaker 1: love is thicker than both.
Speaker 3: National Adoption Awareness Month serves as a crucial reminder of
Speaker 3: the thousands of Australian children awaiting permanent homes. It's an
Speaker 3: opportunity to discuss how we as a society can better
Speaker 3: support vulnerable children and ensure they have access to stable,
Speaker 3: permanent family environments. But while we explore the challenges and
Speaker 3: the solutions. We have to remember that behind every statistic
Speaker 3: is a child waiting for permanency, security and the chance
Speaker 3: to thrive in a stable family. Thanks for taking the
Speaker 3: time to feed your mind with us today. The Quickie
Speaker 3: is produced by me, Claire Murphy and our executive producer
Speaker 3: Taylor Strano, with audio production by Teak and Sadler.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening to this bonus episode
Speaker 1: for you of The Quickie. If you'd like to hear
Speaker 1: more episodes of The Quickie, it's one of my very
Speaker 1: favorite shows. Make sure you follow or subscribe to the
Speaker 1: show in your podcast app and there'll be a link
Speaker 1: for you all in the show notes. I hope you're
Speaker 1: having an amazing week and are seizing your ya