Speaker 1: Welcome to Parenting out Loud, the podcast that takes parenting
Speaker 1: culture seriously, but not too seriously. We sort of talk
Speaker 1: about the news and the trends and the culture. We
Speaker 1: basically read everything on the internet so that you don't
Speaker 1: have to, and then we make sense of it.
Speaker 2: I'm on a Bowley, I'm Amelia Lester, and I'm Stacey Higgs.
Speaker 3: Okay, from the podcast that brought you six seven. I
Speaker 3: just have to interject with a new slang term that
Speaker 3: I think we all need to know. All right, I
Speaker 3: know how Stacey bought us six seven before anyone had
Speaker 3: ever heard of it?
Speaker 1: Is this so like we haven't even talked about what's
Speaker 1: coming up on the show today is so urgent?
Speaker 3: Okay, all right, guy, fifteen year old, an actual, real
Speaker 3: life fifteen year old told me about a new word
Speaker 3: that I'm actually finding sort of useful in.
Speaker 2: Everyday life, and you may first.
Speaker 3: I want to be first, and I want our listeners
Speaker 3: to be able to use this and embarrass themselves just
Speaker 3: like I am. Okay, the word is low cer canuinely.
Speaker 3: Oh sorry, I got it wrong, low canuinely Okay. It's
Speaker 3: a mix of low key and genuinely start So I
Speaker 3: find it hard to actually pronounce. You have to say,
Speaker 3: first of all, Stacy, say say genuinely genuinely, Now say
Speaker 3: canuinely canuinely, Now say low canuinely, Low canuinely.
Speaker 1: This is not going to catch on.
Speaker 3: No, it is. I'm using it. It's it sort of
Speaker 3: has a certain like.
Speaker 1: Can you use it in a sentence?
Speaker 3: You can? But okay, there's one Oh, yes, can you
Speaker 3: use it in a sentence?
Speaker 2: Yes?
Speaker 3: One rule is you cannot start the sentence with it,
Speaker 3: So you can't be like, no, low canuinely I really
Speaker 3: want a coffee. It has to be like I low
Speaker 3: canuinely really want a coffee.
Speaker 1: It's just not going to catch it.
Speaker 3: I challenge both of you, and also the parenting out
Speaker 3: loud listeners to use it at least once this week,
Speaker 3: ideally in a meeting with a lot of other people around,
Speaker 3: and see whether it takes off.
Speaker 1: I'm really struggling with this. How would you use it in
Speaker 1: a sentence?
Speaker 4: I'm trying to think how you'd say, I think I'm
Speaker 4: like ready for bed, low canuinely.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 3: Middle of the sentence, I think I'm low canuinely ready
Speaker 3: for bed. Ok Wait, So you have to use it
Speaker 3: the front of the sentence, anywhere in the sentence, but
Speaker 3: not at the end.
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, cool God, I.
Speaker 3: Think we should get on with the show.
Speaker 2: I actually feel very unsettled that you knew a cool
Speaker 2: word before me.
Speaker 3: Look, I have an fhew and he may be trolling me,
Speaker 3: but I felt it was my duty to past knowledge.
Speaker 1: I'm like genuinely into it in an Adelaide accent.
Speaker 2: Yep, all right.
Speaker 4: Coming up on today's show, do you change the way
Speaker 4: you parent around other people? You might just be a
Speaker 4: popcorn mum.
Speaker 3: And the TV show that everyone is watching made a
Speaker 3: huge parenting error.
Speaker 1: Prince Harry Hamish Blake this week. I'm on the dad beat.
Speaker 3: But first, you might, even if your kids are well
Speaker 3: past this stage, still have nightmares about not being able
Speaker 3: to swaddle. Yep, you know you don't mind. You were
Speaker 3: perfect at swaddling. I can just tell. Well. TV's favorite doctor,
Speaker 3: who was Doctor Robbie on the Pit, has ignited a
Speaker 3: firestorm online because while he knows how to do all
Speaker 3: sorts of medical procedures, he knows how to intubate people
Speaker 3: and perform heart surgery.
Speaker 1: On the fly, he does not know how to swaddle.
Speaker 1: I saw this because I'm a huge fan of the pit.
Speaker 1: It was the season finale last week, so everyone was
Speaker 1: watching it. This is a show that prides itself on
Speaker 1: attention to detail. There are doctors who watch this and go, wow,
Speaker 1: they really nailed that procedure and what they can't? He can't.
Speaker 1: He's just fallen at the final hurdle.
Speaker 3: He just so. It was meant to be this really
Speaker 3: moving tender scene where a baby that was abandoned in
Speaker 3: the hospital waiting room is crying and doctor Robbie goes
Speaker 3: in and picks up the baby and he says, what's wrong?
Speaker 3: Do you need a swaddle? And then he proceeds to
Speaker 3: put the baby down on a blanket and just kind
Speaker 3: of fold it or flop it over the baby.
Speaker 1: Oh so the baby's not secure and smart, holding its
Speaker 1: little arms like that like the Origami.
Speaker 3: And then he picks the baby up and the baby
Speaker 3: stops crying. I'm sorry, that's never happened.
Speaker 1: Did you yell at the screen like that?
Speaker 3: I did not, because I cannot swaddle. And I think
Speaker 3: I've spoken on this show before about an amazing Australian
Speaker 3: startup business called baby or a Gami that sells swaddles
Speaker 3: for dummies, which are basically numbered so you can just
Speaker 3: like follow the numbers to learn how to swaddle. I
Speaker 3: send this to everyone who has a new baby because
Speaker 3: I find it very difficult. So I didn't yell at
Speaker 3: the screen, but did you.
Speaker 1: I texted my husband. I said, he cocked up the
Speaker 1: swaddle no context? Yeah, yeah, do you know what he needed?
Speaker 2: Though? Just one of the ones with the zips. I
Speaker 2: could never do it. I just gave up. We got
Speaker 2: the ones with the zips with the little with the
Speaker 2: hands out. Yeah, like, that's so cute.
Speaker 3: Look in other TV news, something equally controversial. The star
Speaker 3: of Shits Creaked, Dan Levy. He has said something very divisive.
Speaker 3: He was interviewed in one of those like New York
Speaker 3: Man on the Street segments that seemed to be a
Speaker 3: dimer dozen these days, and this is what he had
Speaker 3: to say.
Speaker 2: What is a hell you're willing to die on?
Speaker 5: I firmly believe there should be one airline flight with
Speaker 5: no babies.
Speaker 3: Mons were you offended?
Speaker 1: Do you know what was really interesting was the reaction
Speaker 1: to this, because it was a lot people agreed with
Speaker 1: Dan Leeby people were saying, you know what, I'm kind
Speaker 1: of with you like I have kids, and I agree
Speaker 1: that not having the anxiety and the stress of my
Speaker 1: baby interrupting the whole plane cabin would be kind of nice.
Speaker 1: It would be kind of nice. Like when you go
Speaker 1: to the movies and they run those sessions that are
Speaker 1: just for kids. The air equivalent of that would be
Speaker 1: very helpful to a lot of anxious parents.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but I also want to be on the plane
Speaker 4: with no babies. I don't want to be on a
Speaker 4: plane that's now got more babies on it because you're
Speaker 4: having your child free plane.
Speaker 2: I don't want to be around other people's babies either.
Speaker 3: I think you're both wrong once you get past the
Speaker 3: crying baby stage. To me, the most soothing sound in
Speaker 3: the world is a baby crying that is not my baby.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I would get on the plane with all the babies
Speaker 3: just to enjoy the fact that it was none of
Speaker 3: my business and I didn't have to swaddle them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, guys, Prince Harry was in Australia last week. He
Speaker 1: realized had.
Speaker 2: A million photos.
Speaker 1: I know, and will I felt like my algorithm was
Speaker 1: full of Megan coverage, right. It was Megan this, Meghan that,
Speaker 1: And I did see Prince Harry in the periphery and
Speaker 1: I saw he went to Bondi, he went to the rugby.
Speaker 1: He kicked a football. But there was something he did
Speaker 1: which I think got buried and I'm digging it up.
Speaker 1: He did this thing with Novamba, which is you know,
Speaker 1: the mustache charity. They actually do a lot of advocacy
Speaker 1: for men's health, and they released a report last week
Speaker 1: about new dads and mental health and guys, the dads
Speaker 1: are not okay. In this report, it said three out
Speaker 1: of five dads say no, one not a doctor, not
Speaker 1: a midwife, not a friend, asked them if they were
Speaker 1: doing okay, and one in five dads is really lonely.
Speaker 1: And I just want to say, it's screened for it.
Speaker 1: And that's what this men's health program are asking there, saying, Hey,
Speaker 1: we think we should probably do a post natal screening
Speaker 1: for dads like we do for mums, because there's all
Speaker 1: these dads that are just kind of falling through the gaps.
Speaker 1: And I wanted to talk about it today because I
Speaker 1: feel like we ask dads to step up all the time,
Speaker 1: and this cultural movement of good dads and great dads,
Speaker 1: and we talk a lot on this show about how
Speaker 1: dadding has changed in the last you know, decade or
Speaker 1: in this generation even, But it does feel like we
Speaker 1: want more from them, but the structural supports are not
Speaker 1: there to help them get there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and Harry actually spoke about his own challenges as
Speaker 3: a new dad. He said to the dads and soon
Speaker 3: to be dads, Yes, it's messy. You'll have a roller
Speaker 3: coaster of emotions, and don't judge yourself.
Speaker 1: There's lots of crazy science behind it. Like there's all
Speaker 1: this science saying that when you become a parent for
Speaker 1: the first time, the neurological changes are the most you'll
Speaker 1: ever have in your life. Like it's really significant the
Speaker 1: way that your brain chemistry changes.
Speaker 3: Well, and they've discovered also that men who have just
Speaker 3: had children their testoster own drops as well. So there's
Speaker 3: hormonal changes happening that we don't want to talk about
Speaker 3: or recognize.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's brain chemistry changes that happen where you're a
Speaker 1: min deala flies fires off a lot more so you're
Speaker 1: more anxious. Not just mums, dads as well.
Speaker 4: But I have to admit when you first raised this
Speaker 4: with me, I kind of I did roll my eyes
Speaker 4: a little bit because I think I was like oh,
Speaker 4: Harry's got all the privilege in the world, Like, do
Speaker 4: I have to feel bad for Prince Harry in this situation?
Speaker 4: And then when I was thinking more carefully about my
Speaker 4: reaction to that, I think it was like a weird
Speaker 4: little bit of jealousy maybe or resentment or something, because
Speaker 4: I started thinking, well, I didn't really get asked that
Speaker 4: much if I was okay when I had my baby either,
Speaker 4: and I had you know, what would be considered a
Speaker 4: traumatic birth. I had a long hospital stay and you know,
Speaker 4: the poor overworked midwife that the community nurse that came
Speaker 4: to check on me afterwards. When I kind of half
Speaker 4: that subject, it was pretty quickly brushed over.
Speaker 1: Okay, did you get the post natal screening for depression
Speaker 1: and anxiety?
Speaker 2: I you remember my question naire?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I did.
Speaker 4: But I think that it's something that needs to be
Speaker 4: looked at a lot more across the board. But Harry,
Speaker 4: I love how I'm just calling him Harry has When
Speaker 4: has raised this, it made me think a lot about
Speaker 4: my reaction now to friends of mine that have babies,
Speaker 4: because I had a hard time. Now when people I
Speaker 4: know have babies, I'm very much in their face being like, no,
Speaker 4: don't just tell me you're okay surface level? Are you?
Speaker 2: Actually?
Speaker 4: What can I do here? I'm going to just start
Speaker 4: doing stuff for you and you can tell me to
Speaker 4: stop if you want, but at least I'm there. But
Speaker 4: I realized I have never asked the dads. In fact,
Speaker 4: I have completely ignored the dad friends and focused in
Speaker 4: on the mum. And you're right, it's just not really considered.
Speaker 4: So there needs to be a recalibration of how like
Speaker 4: they are much more involved now, so of course they'd
Speaker 4: be more affected postpartum.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's hard though, isn't it. Because actually, just this
Speaker 3: week a friend of mine has not newborn but a toddler,
Speaker 3: and she was struggling with really serious sleep deprivation and
Speaker 3: she was sending me texts which made me think that
Speaker 3: she needed someone closer in geographic terms to her to
Speaker 3: check on her, because she was saying she hadn't slept
Speaker 3: in days. She was thinking that she'd have to like
Speaker 3: call into work and say she couldn't come into work.
Speaker 3: She was worried about even getting in the car and driving,
Speaker 3: and that kind of like amorphous issue where it's like,
Speaker 3: I'm not sleeping, I don't feel right. It's really hard
Speaker 3: as friends to know what to do about it.
Speaker 1: But I think the point is that you checked in
Speaker 1: with this woman, right, Yeah, so women have this village.
Speaker 1: I know we talk in the show about how the
Speaker 1: village has broken down, but we do have some sort
Speaker 1: of village. We have midwives checking in, we have a
Speaker 1: doctor checking in on doing the postnatult screening. We have
Speaker 1: friends that all text, We have WhatsApp groups, we have
Speaker 1: social media algorithms and Facebook groups that feed us constantly. Right,
Speaker 1: so we do feel like we are in touch. Men
Speaker 1: have a WhatsApp group where they share memes with each other.
Speaker 3: You know, maybe it is changing though, at least in
Speaker 3: Australia because this week Mon's You've mentioned to me that
Speaker 3: Hamish Blake came on a podcast to talk about the
Speaker 3: fact that he does lean on informal social networks to
Speaker 3: educate him or to inspire how he parents.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. So their podcast was Hamish Blake talking
Speaker 1: to Mark Burris on straight Talk And it's such a
Speaker 1: great listen. But if you don't have the sort of
Speaker 1: nineteen minutes free because you're too busy listening to us
Speaker 1: and the back catalogs of us, I'll give you the
Speaker 1: cliff notes. He did talk about how modern dads don't
Speaker 1: have a lot of information, there is not a lot
Speaker 1: out there for them to draw on, and he's a
Speaker 1: little bit from that.
Speaker 5: Actually, I think men really do want to talk about
Speaker 5: being dads and the fact that anyone that's a younger
Speaker 5: dad or any dad is trying to do it different
Speaker 5: than their dad did it. And sometimes you're borrowing from
Speaker 5: your father's playbook, but other times, and i'd include myself
Speaker 5: in this, with all due respect to my old man,
Speaker 5: I'm not borrowing from his playbook if I really dig
Speaker 5: down it. Some of my core philosophies are just like
Speaker 5: things I overheard someone say at a barbecue and I'm like, Oh,
Speaker 5: that's a cool thing to do with you.
Speaker 2: I'll try that.
Speaker 5: How might do that? And I was like, I think
Speaker 5: we're doing that a lot as dads because there's not
Speaker 5: tons of resources necessarily for dads these days.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So, I mean this is the philosophy behind his
Speaker 1: podcast How other Dad's Dad?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 1: He was like, there is this yawning gap where no
Speaker 1: one is talking about what they do and we're not
Speaker 1: sharing this information like women do, like mums do.
Speaker 3: I guess it's almost like women are kind of overwhelmed
Speaker 3: with guidance to the point where sometimes it can feel
Speaker 3: a bit oppressive that this is the way that you
Speaker 3: should parent, this is the way you should be a mum.
Speaker 3: But dads don't have a complete dearth or vacuum of
Speaker 3: information about how to go about things.
Speaker 1: Do you think it's cultural as well? Is it a
Speaker 1: bit of Australian like she'll be right, and is it
Speaker 1: kind of man up, you know, get on with it?
Speaker 4: Maybe because it's that thing they say, isn't it about
Speaker 4: how women like bond face to face, like we'll lean
Speaker 4: into one another across a dinner table, across a coffee
Speaker 4: But men need to do that shoulder to shoulder like
Speaker 4: they need to be playing golf for like walking next
Speaker 4: to one another or in a car to be able
Speaker 4: to share what's going on with them, like they find
Speaker 4: it a lot harder to do. So I do think
Speaker 4: it's that thing of oh, like, just you know, you're fine,
Speaker 4: You wouldn't need that, you know, that feels like a
Speaker 4: feminine thing to do. But it's great that there are
Speaker 4: people now saying, well, no, like we where do we turn?
Speaker 2: Like what do we look at?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Okay, I burst into the studio today with a
Speaker 1: TikTok trend that I feel I have discovered, and I.
Speaker 3: That you low canuinely feel you've discovered.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, I wasn't low genuinely about it. I was super
Speaker 1: excited about it. It's called the Analog Bag and it's
Speaker 1: the smug parents substitute for screen time.
Speaker 2: Have you heard of this?
Speaker 3: I have? Yes?
Speaker 1: But what is that face, Stacy?
Speaker 4: I think one of us is kind of the the
Speaker 4: mistro the smothest of us all.
Speaker 2: Look.
Speaker 4: I feel like a failure in a lot of elements
Speaker 4: of parenting, one of which we'll get to later. But
Speaker 4: this is my this is my area.
Speaker 3: Okay. What is it?
Speaker 1: The Analog Bag? For anyone that hasn't heard of, it
Speaker 1: is a flex It is is a tiny, little like
Speaker 1: sort of linen bag that you pack.
Speaker 2: We need to.
Speaker 1: I think everyone I've seen so far has been why
Speaker 1: would you have plans?
Speaker 3: What about my son's minecraft show bag?
Speaker 1: No? I don't think that's going to fit. The aesthetic
Speaker 1: of the bag, and inside it is kind of like
Speaker 1: very wholesome screen free activities for children. So there might
Speaker 1: be a crayon, a pine.
Speaker 3: Cost single that will use that two seconds.
Speaker 4: Yeah, do you want to leave this to an expert
Speaker 4: and I can show you everything that's in my bag.
Speaker 1: I'm so not surprised you have an analog bag because
Speaker 1: we know that you are the mother on this show
Speaker 1: who is highly organized. You also have a bag in
Speaker 1: the back of your car as well. Yeah, I do,
Speaker 1: all right, show us yourself.
Speaker 2: I brought it in to show you. Okay. We call
Speaker 2: it the cafe.
Speaker 4: So it's like if you're going to a restaurant or
Speaker 4: a cafe and you don't want them to make a scene.
Speaker 4: It's purely driven from me wanting my child to be
Speaker 4: quiet and behave. You'll love the things I haven't. It's
Speaker 4: quite large for any it is listening.
Speaker 1: Yes, it's the size of sort of a library bag
Speaker 1: that you take to a local library, and it is
Speaker 1: chock full that Virgin Australia would have you weigh that
Speaker 1: before you.
Speaker 4: It ain't got stick of books, okay, okay, mermaids the
Speaker 4: first thing mermaid sick book. This is the thing that
Speaker 4: people are always impressed by. A clipboard so that they
Speaker 4: can stick the piece of paper they're coloring on into
Speaker 4: the clipboard so it doesn't roll away.
Speaker 3: Are you not sitting at a table at the cash Yeah,
Speaker 3: but just you know, stay contained.
Speaker 1: We're now on vodcast. Can you please hold it up
Speaker 1: and display it to the camera.
Speaker 4: There we go with texts inside so you don't lose them.
Speaker 3: So that just loose paper inside, loose.
Speaker 4: Paper inside to draw mini magnetic tiles to do at
Speaker 4: the table. Magnetic Everyone loves doing them, including the at all.
Speaker 4: She thinks she's better than us magnetic tiles. No, I
Speaker 4: really don't, and I don't want to be that person's
Speaker 4: like screens because we watch it a lot at home,
Speaker 4: but this is.
Speaker 3: What we do out in public, so that I look
Speaker 3: like a lot of US screens at home.
Speaker 4: I definitely do like poppers, fidget spines, more coloring in
Speaker 4: this little tube. Okay, oh, this is my wankiest one
Speaker 4: pine cone. This is my wankiest one. Sewing. It's little
Speaker 4: sewing kids. Sorry for the scrunch for anyone listening.
Speaker 2: And slime.
Speaker 3: Okay, okay, this is almost too much stuff.
Speaker 2: Okay, and walkie talkies.
Speaker 4: What so if she meets a random kid in the
Speaker 4: cafe and they want to play, they can go and
Speaker 4: do the walkie talkies.
Speaker 1: Did you just make this up? Did you see this
Speaker 1: on Pinterest. What happened now?
Speaker 4: I've just added random crap to this over the last
Speaker 4: five years.
Speaker 1: Was this an idea that you came up with yourself
Speaker 1: or did you see it and copy someone?
Speaker 4: No, I literally did this myself. I was ahead of
Speaker 4: the curve and now someone's just given it a cool name.
Speaker 1: She is ahead of the curve, Yeah, she is. I've
Speaker 1: actually got an analog bag too that I brought in.
Speaker 2: What hell did you actually? What is it?
Speaker 1: Also, Linen, do you want to see what's in my
Speaker 1: analog book?
Speaker 6: They're a iPad for the She stuck her finger of
Speaker 6: her Yeah, it's just a finger, it's a middle finger.
Speaker 6: That's what's in my analo bag.
Speaker 4: No.
Speaker 1: Look, honestly, I don't want to judge it, right, I
Speaker 1: don't want to be judging because I actually think it's
Speaker 1: a great trend. Like I hadn't seen it before, and
Speaker 1: I think I saw it and I felt this weird
Speaker 1: emotional reaction of I hate it. But I think I
Speaker 1: felt that because I was jealous and I was like, ah,
Speaker 1: I want one.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I honestly, it is really handy and like I said, yes,
Speaker 4: you look a bit smug, like I do. Look smug
Speaker 4: out in public when I pull out the things when
Speaker 4: other kids are bored, and they kind of then gather
Speaker 4: around and share with my daughter. You do feel like you,
Speaker 4: but what it comes from is just wanting, you know, yeah,
Speaker 4: to have some peace. It's actually smart, That's all it is.
Speaker 2: Peace. Do you think we should.
Speaker 1: Merchandise some analog?
Speaker 2: Bawn analog?
Speaker 1: What would you put in it? What would be representative
Speaker 1: of you?
Speaker 4: Is this for us or for all people's I feel
Speaker 4: like it should be stuff that we like. I would
Speaker 4: put slime. I just love touching slime. I would touch
Speaker 4: that all day.
Speaker 3: I love the crayons.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well you need some and some paints in there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just go the pine cone.
Speaker 4: Okay, I'm going to knock myself down a few pegs
Speaker 4: now so that you don't think that I think I'm
Speaker 4: too much of a good mother.
Speaker 1: That's what you're allowed to show. What you're actually allowed
Speaker 1: to be a good mother on this show. You are.
Speaker 1: And I don't want to sound like snarky, because what
Speaker 1: we do on this show is here about all kinds
Speaker 1: of motherhood and optimizing mums and relaxed mums, and don't
Speaker 1: ever feel like you can't talk about how you mum
Speaker 1: on this show like there is space for all of it.
Speaker 1: And any time that we start even feeling a little
Speaker 1: bit snarky, we have to stop ourselves and check ourselves.
Speaker 3: It's so too much self deprecation amongst mothers. Yeah I'm
Speaker 3: a mess. Yeah, well I'm about to.
Speaker 1: I'm proud of what a great mummy are.
Speaker 2: Okay, thank you, but this bit was not my finest.
Speaker 4: I sent my daughter to school this week for school
Speaker 4: photos without her hair done. And I'm not talking like
Speaker 4: I wasn't in a pony. I'm talking she looked like
Speaker 4: Albert Einstein. I'm talking fresh out of the bed. Knots
Speaker 4: in the back of my photos was on.
Speaker 3: I knew they, but parents of curly head kids have
Speaker 3: it particularly we do.
Speaker 1: We do.
Speaker 4: And I tried every trick in the book. I tried riberry,
Speaker 4: I tried treats. I tried pretending I was a hairdressing
Speaker 4: robot who had arrived to do her hair.
Speaker 2: Nothing, nothing.
Speaker 1: Did you put it in front of an iPad? Stacey
Speaker 1: didn't tried the TV.
Speaker 2: I did everything. I did everything I could think. Uzzle,
Speaker 2: where's the analog? Save you?
Speaker 1: Now?
Speaker 4: I got so frustrated like that I ended up storming
Speaker 4: out of before I said I have to leave work now.
Speaker 4: I love you very much in the least loving tone
Speaker 4: I've ever said. It stormed out of the house, sat
Speaker 4: in my car, and ice creamed.
Speaker 2: I actually did let out a scream.
Speaker 4: I was so frustrated that I could not make this basic,
Speaker 4: easy task happen, like beyond irritated at myself. But when
Speaker 4: I think about this, was I that bothered that she's
Speaker 4: gonna have messy hair in her school photo?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 4: I think that's funny, Like her hair does look like that,
Speaker 4: it's funny. Was I bothered that every other parent and
Speaker 4: teacher is going to see that photo and think that
Speaker 4: I wasn't capable of doing hair? You felt embarrassed? Yes,
Speaker 4: I felt embarrassed. And it was all about outward perception, okay.
Speaker 4: And it then this article that I read a couple
Speaker 4: of weeks ago. I sent it to you guys at
Speaker 4: the time. It sprung up in my mind, and it's
Speaker 4: called are you a Popcorn Mum? So the writer Ellen Strong.
Speaker 4: She tells this story about being in the park with
Speaker 4: her kids, really busy park, and a little near her
Speaker 4: started opening popcorn packets and they're flying everywhere, Like he's
Speaker 4: flinging popcorn everywhere. And I want to know when I'm
Speaker 4: telling you both that, what would be your immediate reaction
Speaker 4: if that's your kid and they start flinging popcorn?
Speaker 2: What are you doing or what are you saying?
Speaker 3: I would be aghast. I would be like shouting. I
Speaker 3: would be doing the opposite of gentle parenting for some reason.
Speaker 3: This would like really bother me that the popcorn was
Speaker 3: everywhere at the park, and I would hate myself.
Speaker 1: I'd scrambled to clean it up.
Speaker 4: I reckon, Yeah, I would be on my hands and
Speaker 4: knees scooping that stuff up before I even did anything else.
Speaker 2: And that's what she says as well.
Speaker 4: She says, that is what I immediately envisioned in my head, saying.
Speaker 2: You need to pick that up straight away.
Speaker 4: Like she said, she would have been down there trying
Speaker 4: to figure it out. And this mum had no reaction
Speaker 4: to the popcorn, pulled the son over and said the
Speaker 4: kids with good behavior get to go on the slide,
Speaker 4: and he said yes, and she said, well, I'd be
Speaker 4: picking up the popcorn, bud, and he went and did it.
Speaker 4: But my favorite quote from this is that she said
Speaker 4: Aside from being in total or of this woman, I
Speaker 4: was struck by how she didn't seem to notice anyone
Speaker 4: else the witnesses. The whole experience made me realize I
Speaker 4: care way too much about what other people think about
Speaker 4: parenting in public. When all of us are in a mood,
Speaker 4: it feels like a full on performance. And don't you
Speaker 4: just think that is exactly what it is. When you
Speaker 4: start to notice that other people are perceiving your parenting,
Speaker 4: you start narrating so that they know that you're on
Speaker 4: top of it.
Speaker 2: Like you'll be like, oh, you're very.
Speaker 4: Tired, aren't you. Oh yes, no, no, we don't do
Speaker 4: that in our house. Like you start vocalizing everything.
Speaker 3: This actually just happened to me this week. I took
Speaker 3: my kids to the museum for an exhibition that I'm
Speaker 3: sure they found very edifying, and I noticed that I
Speaker 3: was saying that thing you say when a lot of
Speaker 3: kids want to use the one screen in the museum.
Speaker 3: By the way, museums just stop putting screens in their
Speaker 3: exhibitions because it's all kids want to look at. It.
Speaker 3: Be like, Okay, we're spending fifteen seconds here and then
Speaker 3: we're moving on.
Speaker 2: To the next with that, and then the.
Speaker 3: Parents were kind of out out educating each other with
Speaker 3: their kids. This is how this particular insect works, you know,
Speaker 3: and like narrating the exhibition, and I was part of
Speaker 3: the problem.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what were you saying?
Speaker 3: I think we were all trying to prove to the
Speaker 3: other parents how wonderfully stimulating our company is for our kids,
Speaker 3: and how we were so generous and considerate of other
Speaker 3: kids when our kids want to see a particular exhibit.
Speaker 2: And it just turned me into a bit of a punish.
Speaker 1: Why are we doing it? Is it because we feel
Speaker 1: like we're being surveiled all the time because we live
Speaker 1: in a world where everything is content and everything shared
Speaker 1: on social media, and so we're used to having screens
Speaker 1: in our faces all the time, filming us. We're filming
Speaker 1: our kids, we're filming ourselves. Is it that? Is it
Speaker 1: that we are putting.
Speaker 3: Easies walking around like judging us because our kids are
Speaker 3: making noise?
Speaker 1: Is it just are we just performing NonStop?
Speaker 4: Yeah? I think so, And I think it makes you
Speaker 4: a worse parent, like because I think if you think
Speaker 4: about that woman who was very chill on the bench,
Speaker 4: like she got the end result, She got the result
Speaker 4: that her child listened to her and cleaned up himself,
Speaker 4: whereas all of us would have immediately jumped in to
Speaker 4: try and either fix that or make that very clear
Speaker 4: to everyone around us that we knew that it wasn't
Speaker 4: okay and that we were going to get get rid
Speaker 4: of it, that it was all going to be done.
Speaker 3: It doesn't even have to actually be as strangers. I've
Speaker 3: noticed that I do it with my parents when they're
Speaker 3: around to proveuve that I'm an amazing parent, and also
Speaker 3: with friends. And sometimes that's why I prefer not to
Speaker 3: socialize with my friends and their kids, because I worry
Speaker 3: that they're going to judge my parenting or decide that
Speaker 3: it's not as good as theirs, Whereas if I'm hanging
Speaker 3: out with other parent friends from say school, it feels
Speaker 3: less judgmental.
Speaker 1: How do we break the cycle of being a popcorn mom?
Speaker 1: Because I'm Matt, I'm a mega popcorn mom.
Speaker 3: Once is eating popcorn, he's.
Speaker 2: Brought popcorn in. Is she going to start throwing it?
Speaker 2: Are we going to start correcting you? You're going to
Speaker 2: freak out.
Speaker 3: I think the problem is not that you know, obviously
Speaker 3: you've got to teach a kid's manners, and you've got
Speaker 3: to teach them not to fling popcorn around. But I
Speaker 3: think the problem is that it's very counterproductive the way
Speaker 3: that we act in these situations because we end up shouting,
Speaker 3: we end up performing. It's very over the top. And
Speaker 3: as the story that you told at the start illustrates Stacy,
Speaker 3: you don't get the best results from kids when you
Speaker 3: harayu and shout them. You don't get the best results
Speaker 3: from anyone when you're harangung and shout at them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Popcorn parenting is where you parent for other people
Speaker 1: instead of putting your child at the same of it.
Speaker 1: And you're right, it is what we are doing in public.
Speaker 1: And so I guess.
Speaker 3: That that's so well put. That's exactly what it is.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And so I guess it's about a discipline of going.
Speaker 1: I don't I'm not going to pay attention to what
Speaker 1: people are thinking or they are, what all these other
Speaker 1: people are, what's swelling around me. I need to just
Speaker 1: focus and hone in on my child and give them
Speaker 1: what they need in this moment. But I was my
Speaker 1: biggest pop comparenting moment was when you know when you're
Speaker 1: totally gets in a tantrum loop, and no amount of
Speaker 1: like reasoning with them will work because they're stuck in
Speaker 1: the loop. I remember I was in a shopping center,
Speaker 1: really busy shopping center, and my child got stuck in
Speaker 1: one of these tantrum loops. And because everyone's staring, I
Speaker 1: got down on my knee and I said, Mmmm, you're
Speaker 1: having some big feelings, aren't you. She's not hearing what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, just stuck in the loop. What needed to
Speaker 1: happen was I probably just need to pick her up
Speaker 1: and walk out, because there's no changing, there's no coming
Speaker 1: back from that situation. But instead I just did what
Speaker 1: I thought people would expect a good parent to do in.
Speaker 3: That moment, and it didn't actually happen.
Speaker 1: It doesn't work.
Speaker 2: But I think that's what it is.
Speaker 4: What she was saying about it being a performance, That's
Speaker 4: what it is. I think it's like the way you
Speaker 4: would be able to change it is to go Would
Speaker 4: I say this to her if we were at home.
Speaker 2: Probably not.
Speaker 4: You know, like, if you're not doing it in that way,
Speaker 4: then you are performing, You're outwardly performing.
Speaker 2: How are you parenting? That's the part we need to stop.
Speaker 3: Or all else fails. To shout out Jessica.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that'll work too.
Speaker 1: You know the other way U popcorn parent is when
Speaker 1: like at the doctor, I'm like safe, thank you for
Speaker 1: the flu shot, Darling. No kid wants to say thanks
Speaker 1: for a flu shot.
Speaker 4: Oh.
Speaker 3: I actually have a little bit of a suggestion on that.
Speaker 3: A friend pointed out to me that you can just
Speaker 3: sit instead of asking a child to say thank you
Speaker 3: or please.
Speaker 2: You just model it.
Speaker 3: You just say it, and then that's actually much more
Speaker 3: powerful than you forcing them to say it.
Speaker 1: Actually, that reminds me. It is flu season. We're coming
Speaker 1: into flu season and all the reports are saying it's
Speaker 1: going to be a bad one. So if you haven't
Speaker 1: booked in for your flu shot, do it. Kids under
Speaker 1: five are free, and that's a great one. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Robert F. Kennedy Junior just came out and said he
Speaker 3: doesn't like it, so that probably oh.
Speaker 2: God, it's excluded.
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, let's move on to recommendations. This is
Speaker 1: the part of the show where we bring you the
Speaker 1: things that we love sick that we would kind of
Speaker 1: text each other in a group chat and say you've
Speaker 1: got to get on this or try this, Stacy, what
Speaker 1: have you got mine's weird.
Speaker 4: This week, I'm doing an anti reco I'm going to
Speaker 4: recommend you stop something to save money.
Speaker 1: Right, I'm going to make some money saving tip.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, So tip is just stop doing your nails.
Speaker 2: Just stop. I stopped.
Speaker 4: Were you in a bit of a cycle? I was
Speaker 4: in a cycle. I was in a shellac pyramid scheme.
Speaker 4: I could not get out of it. I was going
Speaker 4: every two weeks and sitting there for forty five minutes
Speaker 4: and then chewing them off three days later, like it
Speaker 4: was the stupidest cycle. It's not me time to sit
Speaker 4: in a salon with a million other people around me
Speaker 4: that you don't know. It's not it's not a good
Speaker 4: use of your time alone, the use of your time
Speaker 4: with the kid there even like scroll your phone, No, no,
Speaker 4: you can't. You're stuck in those little finger solariums.
Speaker 2: I hate them.
Speaker 4: So I just stopped and the sky didn't fall, and
Speaker 4: nothing's happened. They don't look great, especially now we're on camera,
Speaker 4: but that's okay, there they are.
Speaker 1: I think it's the new flex. I think new nails
Speaker 1: is a new.
Speaker 4: Spoke about it on mom and mir out loud this
Speaker 4: week as well, that all the cool girls. All the
Speaker 4: Vogue girls are not doing their nails anymore. So there's
Speaker 4: your permission, just stop. You never did my nails, so
Speaker 4: that's good. My recommendation is The Secrets of Bees.
Speaker 3: It is a documentary on Disney plus so boring.
Speaker 1: What bees don't have any secrets. We know what they're doing.
Speaker 1: They make the honey, they get the pollen, like it's.
Speaker 2: Real Housewives of bees in the hive. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Look, I was sick of my kids watching documentaries on
Speaker 3: YouTube that were probably like enlisting them into the manisphere.
Speaker 3: So I wanted something big budget. I wanted something beautiful.
Speaker 3: I wanted something that we could watch intergenerationally. You know,
Speaker 3: that's hard with the grandparents and the parents and the kids.
Speaker 3: That's really hard to find something that everyone wants to watch.
Speaker 3: And I'd seen an ad for this new lavish Disney production,
Speaker 3: The Secrets of Bees. It features a soothing British voice.
Speaker 3: It features sweeping panoramics cinematography, and a lot of weird
Speaker 3: bee facts which I won't bore you with.
Speaker 1: No, they're not boring their greats.
Speaker 3: Let me give you one.
Speaker 2: These are actually incredibly smart, I know.
Speaker 3: And there are these scientists who've set up these tiny
Speaker 3: little obstacle courses for the bees to get like to
Speaker 3: get to sugar. Now, you might think that if there's
Speaker 3: anything bees good on, it's a sugar hit. But apparently
Speaker 3: the bees also love sugar, and they like go through
Speaker 3: the odds to cook a horse and find the sugar.
Speaker 3: And I'm telling you that at least two generations of
Speaker 3: people watching the.
Speaker 2: Show gasped at that particular scene.
Speaker 3: Now, it was not, unfortunately the project of this podcast
Speaker 3: the children. But you know what, eventually they're going to say,
Speaker 3: thanks mum for introducing me to the secrets of the bees.
Speaker 3: That was really fascinating. And when that moment comes, I
Speaker 3: will be smug.
Speaker 1: Any more secrets you want to spillfud.
Speaker 3: Just tell the bees secrets. It's not they're not my
Speaker 3: secrets to Townlands. I'd like you to watch the show
Speaker 3: and report back.
Speaker 1: I like the title, like they had to give it
Speaker 1: something kind of clicking, like I do want to watch it.
Speaker 2: You know what they were doing.
Speaker 4: They were getting the basic bitches like me that watch
Speaker 4: the Secret Life of Mormon Wives and.
Speaker 3: You go a little bit like, yeah, I think that
Speaker 3: what's the name for swinging in that show?
Speaker 2: Taylor Frankie poul who does swinging.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a bit of sauce swinging. I'm going to
Speaker 3: leave it at that.
Speaker 2: Oh, I mean, but it's family.
Speaker 3: Friendly sauce swinging.
Speaker 1: Has it made you want to get a hive? Yes?
Speaker 3: You know. The other fascinating thing is bees just want love.
Speaker 3: They're just like all And there's this woman in there
Speaker 3: in Mexico who's so lovely and loves her bees, and
Speaker 3: they crawl all over her hands and they never sting
Speaker 3: her because they love her and she loves them.
Speaker 1: Is this then you remember that octopus that came there.
Speaker 3: Not quite as good that my octopus, teacher, It's not
Speaker 3: quite as good as that, But you know, the bees
Speaker 3: they deserve a second look.
Speaker 1: That's a lovely recommendation. Honey, thank you.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 1: I do have a recco other than the Hamish Blake
Speaker 1: podcast with Mike Buris. Do you have a child that
Speaker 1: struggles with socks?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 2: Oh God, and hair, if you've got any two.
Speaker 1: I have a very sensory child struggles with socks. I've
Speaker 1: tried every sock under the yet.
Speaker 2: I thought this was just my own cross to bear.
Speaker 1: Jetproof sensory socks. They are a seamless sock. You buy
Speaker 1: them online in a pack of five, ten you can
Speaker 1: buy them in a pack of twenty. That's where we're at.
Speaker 1: These socks have changed mine mornings, my marriage, my will
Speaker 1: to live. They are they? Honestly? Whoever invented these socks? Like?
Speaker 1: I want to I want to give them a way
Speaker 1: am I want to embrace them? It has really been
Speaker 1: such a game change of Plass's secret.
Speaker 3: So I have a question because when you mentioned this
Speaker 3: to me, I ran, not walked, and went to the
Speaker 3: website to order the socks. It had one of those
Speaker 3: like minimum delivery situations on it, and I was clicking around,
Speaker 3: and I guess it's a whole shop devoted to sensory products,
Speaker 3: not just for children, but also for adults. Yes, and
Speaker 3: I noticed that for children they have these plush blankets
Speaker 3: that I was thinking of giving his birthday gifts.
Speaker 2: Okay, everything on there looks lovely.
Speaker 3: Have you used any of the others?
Speaker 1: Yes? Was it a set like a heavy weighted blanket? Yes,
Speaker 1: I've also got a weighted blanket. But with weighted blankets
Speaker 1: you have to be you have to take into account
Speaker 1: the child's size and weight, because you can't give them
Speaker 1: too heavy a blanket, so just no. So just make
Speaker 1: sure that you are getting the appropriate size and weight
Speaker 1: for whatever child you've got.
Speaker 3: That's really important.
Speaker 2: Tip one hundred.
Speaker 1: I am your neuro affirming correspondent. I am, yeah, of
Speaker 1: that rack.
Speaker 2: I would like a way to blanket. Actually, I'm going
Speaker 2: to get myself for.
Speaker 1: The best, all right. And if you're looking for something
Speaker 1: to do this weekend, can I recommend baking my ans
Speaker 1: biscuit recipe.
Speaker 2: You're famous for these biscuits slip.
Speaker 1: My one legacy on the internet is my famous ANZC
Speaker 1: biscuit recipes, which I won the Blue Ribbon that the
Speaker 1: Royal Adelaide's show for. And I also when I was
Speaker 1: on the Great Australian Bakeoff, I won Star Baker that
Speaker 1: week for my amazing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm determined to find these episodes of you on
Speaker 4: Great Australian Bakeoff.
Speaker 2: I want to see you on the recipe.
Speaker 1: It's on the mum of Mere website and we'll put
Speaker 1: a link in the show notes. Great, well, that's all
Speaker 1: we have time for this week on Parenting Out Loud,
Speaker 1: and I will say like, if you are interested, we'll
Speaker 1: put all the links in the show notes, the socks,
Speaker 1: the analog bag, the popcorn mums, all of it so
Speaker 1: that you can read and go deeper on anything that
Speaker 1: you like. And if you're a new dad listening to
Speaker 1: this or you know one, just ask them how they're going.
Speaker 2: Yeah yep, just low canuinely how are you doing? Yeah yep?
Speaker 1: All right, have a great week, enjoy your weekend if
Speaker 1: you get a long one, and we'll see brighton shiny
Speaker 1: back in this feed next week. MoMA Mea acknowledges the
Speaker 1: traditional owners of the land on which we have recorded
Speaker 1: this podcast.