WEBVTT - Molly Mae, Divorce & A Very Flawed PR Strategy 0:00:10.327 --> 0:00:13.047 You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast. 0:00:13.727 --> 0:00:16.767 Mamma Mere acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters 0:00:16.807 --> 0:00:23.407 that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to 0:00:23.447 --> 0:00:26.207 Mamma Mia out Loud. It's what women are actually talking about. 0:00:26.207 --> 0:00:29.567 On Wednesday, the twenty eighth of August. I'm Holly Wainwright, 0:00:29.607 --> 0:00:30.487 I'm mea Friedman. 0:00:30.727 --> 0:00:31.807 I'm Jesse Stephens. 0:00:32.007 --> 0:00:35.727 An on today's show, two very famous women have closed 0:00:35.847 --> 0:00:39.047 their clothing businesses this week? Are we seeing the end 0:00:39.167 --> 0:00:42.887 of the celebrity side hustle? And there are tears in 0:00:42.927 --> 0:00:45.687 the Mommamea office about the divorce of a celebrity that 0:00:45.727 --> 0:00:49.727 I've literally never heard of. Jesse is bringing us all 0:00:49.767 --> 0:00:52.847 the gossip about the benefit scale split of someone called 0:00:53.327 --> 0:00:55.127 Molly May. I had to check. 0:00:55.007 --> 0:01:00.167 Ons also, are dancing sexy centers enough to make you 0:01:00.247 --> 0:01:01.687 walk out of a work meeting. 0:01:02.847 --> 0:01:08.007 Some media business employees just found their limit. But first, 0:01:08.207 --> 0:01:09.087 Jesse Stevens. 0:01:09.567 --> 0:01:13.447 Women's voices and faces are forbidden to be heard or 0:01:13.487 --> 0:01:17.287 shown outside the home in Afghanistan, following new virtue laws 0:01:17.287 --> 0:01:21.527 introduced by the Taliban three years ago. The militant group 0:01:21.607 --> 0:01:24.527 retook control of the country and as one woman from 0:01:24.647 --> 0:01:27.887 Kabul said, day by day they are trying to erase 0:01:27.967 --> 0:01:29.607 women from society. 0:01:29.847 --> 0:01:33.287 This news honestly took my breath away. It's unimaginable. 0:01:33.727 --> 0:01:37.727 And the penalties for if you were to show your 0:01:37.887 --> 0:01:39.927 face or you were to use your voice, and this 0:01:40.007 --> 0:01:42.127 includes if you are inside your home and you are 0:01:42.167 --> 0:01:43.887 talking or you are singing and it can be heard 0:01:43.887 --> 0:01:46.527 outside your home, there are penalties for that. This is 0:01:46.567 --> 0:01:50.607 from the Justice Ministry. The penalties include advice, warnings of 0:01:50.607 --> 0:01:54.607 divine punishment, verbal threats, confiscation of property, detention for one 0:01:54.647 --> 0:01:58.407 hour to three days in public jails, and any other 0:01:58.447 --> 0:01:59.927 punishment deemed appropriate. 0:02:00.007 --> 0:02:00.927 That is so sinister. 0:02:01.247 --> 0:02:04.327 I remember when the Taliban took back control of Afghanistan 0:02:04.607 --> 0:02:07.407 and the world was like, oh no, and they were 0:02:07.447 --> 0:02:10.927 like no, guys, don't worry. Were actually fine, like women 0:02:10.967 --> 0:02:13.647 are going to be fine. And then over the last 0:02:13.727 --> 0:02:18.167 few years since that happened, they've systematically raised women from 0:02:18.167 --> 0:02:21.287 public life, preventing women from going to university, preventing them 0:02:21.327 --> 0:02:25.247 from going to school, preventing them from leaving their house unaccompanied. 0:02:25.727 --> 0:02:30.247 Now face voice. Also, you're not allowed to have photographs of. 0:02:30.007 --> 0:02:32.487 A living thing, of a living person, So if you 0:02:32.487 --> 0:02:35.087 know we think about our homes, or if you've got 0:02:35.367 --> 0:02:38.207 a loved one or a child or a mother or 0:02:38.327 --> 0:02:40.327 anything that's just maybe on the other side of the 0:02:40.327 --> 0:02:43.247 country or living overseas, then that's punishable to have a 0:02:43.247 --> 0:02:44.207 photograph in your home. 0:02:44.327 --> 0:02:48.687 I just find this so moving. Over the past three years, 0:02:48.767 --> 0:02:50.767 one of the things that's happened is that female journalists 0:02:50.807 --> 0:02:54.327 in Afghanistan have slowly had to adjust and Titan and 0:02:54.367 --> 0:02:57.167 adjustin Titan. So when the Taliban took over, there were 0:02:57.247 --> 0:03:01.527 quite a few female news anchors journalists on Afghan television 0:03:02.087 --> 0:03:05.287 and they had to tighten their hit ups so that 0:03:05.407 --> 0:03:08.367 absolutely no hair was visible. Then the laws changed again 0:03:08.407 --> 0:03:10.607 and they had to wear face masks while they were 0:03:10.607 --> 0:03:14.367 delivering the news, and some of the media organizations have 0:03:14.527 --> 0:03:16.767 insisted on keeping like they really want to keep these 0:03:16.807 --> 0:03:18.927 women on screen, so they've been doing this. Okay, a 0:03:19.007 --> 0:03:21.807 mask is fine now because their voices aren't allowed to 0:03:21.807 --> 0:03:25.167 be heard. Live feeds of press conferences where women are 0:03:25.167 --> 0:03:28.447 asking questions get cut in the middle of broadcast because 0:03:28.487 --> 0:03:30.487 their voices are allowed to be heard, so it's literally 0:03:30.527 --> 0:03:34.007 pushing them off. The bravery of those women and also 0:03:34.047 --> 0:03:35.807 the men who are working around them, who are trying 0:03:35.847 --> 0:03:37.887 to protect them and keep them on screens is just 0:03:38.567 --> 0:03:40.927 I just salute them. It's just so sad. 0:03:41.007 --> 0:03:44.167 And what you're saying about media the photographs is really 0:03:44.207 --> 0:03:46.887 important too, because if you're trying to report from inside 0:03:46.887 --> 0:03:49.607 Afghanistan about what's happening and about the lives of women, 0:03:50.127 --> 0:03:52.927 you can't if you can't publish a photograph, which is 0:03:53.087 --> 0:03:56.167 another way in which what's happening inside Afghanistan is being 0:03:56.167 --> 0:03:56.967 rendered invisible. 0:03:57.287 --> 0:04:01.807 We have more information about this devastating story on Muma Maya. 0:04:01.847 --> 0:04:03.687 There's a link in the show notes. 0:04:04.487 --> 0:04:07.327 Until this week. If you're in New York City and 0:04:07.367 --> 0:04:10.167 you wanted to spot Sarah Jessica park in the wild, 0:04:10.407 --> 0:04:12.727 your best bet was to head to a shoe shop 0:04:13.127 --> 0:04:15.767 on the corner of Bleeker and Perry Street, just around 0:04:15.767 --> 0:04:19.487 the corner from where Carrie Bradshaw's very famous apartment is. 0:04:19.687 --> 0:04:21.847 Really because I've been to that apartment two times. 0:04:21.927 --> 0:04:25.247 There you go. She used to literally work in the 0:04:25.367 --> 0:04:29.167 SJP by Sarah Jessica Parker shop some days, saying that 0:04:29.207 --> 0:04:32.247 staying close to her customer, watching them hold and feel 0:04:32.287 --> 0:04:34.887 and try on her shoes, was the key to keeping 0:04:34.927 --> 0:04:37.007 the designs relevant to the women who wanted a little 0:04:37.007 --> 0:04:39.607 bit of carry magic on their feet. They had shoes 0:04:39.727 --> 0:04:43.687 like bridleheels that had Hello Lover stamped on their toes 0:04:43.687 --> 0:04:46.447 and things like that. But no more, because this week 0:04:46.687 --> 0:04:50.167 SJP quietly announced a fashion press that after nine years, 0:04:50.567 --> 0:04:53.767 the shoe brand was closing, and there's currently an everything 0:04:53.847 --> 0:04:56.167 must Go sale on their website to shift the last 0:04:56.207 --> 0:05:00.207 of the stock. Another high profile woman much closer to home, 0:05:00.367 --> 0:05:03.967 is also shuddering her business this week. Constance Hall is 0:05:03.967 --> 0:05:06.767 a name I'm sure you're all very familiar with. This week, 0:05:06.807 --> 0:05:09.207 she announced on Facebook and Instagram, where she has million 0:05:09.447 --> 0:05:12.967 of followers, that Queen the Label, her online clothing business 0:05:13.007 --> 0:05:16.847 that specialized in floaty boho fashion and always donated a 0:05:16.887 --> 0:05:19.847 portion of the profit to charity, was closing down. The 0:05:19.887 --> 0:05:21.887 conflict she was feeling about this was evident in the 0:05:21.927 --> 0:05:25.767 announcement she posted with trademark honesty. She said, I have 0:05:25.887 --> 0:05:28.807 dreaded telling you guys this because I've tried everything to 0:05:28.887 --> 0:05:31.527 avoid it, and I'm still losing my breath with anxious 0:05:31.567 --> 0:05:34.767 butterflies swirling in my stomach every second. I have put 0:05:34.847 --> 0:05:38.727 Queen the Label into voluntary administration after a week long 0:05:38.767 --> 0:05:41.767 panic attack with confusion over bookwork that I simply do 0:05:41.847 --> 0:05:44.847 not understand. I was told that nobody should have to 0:05:44.887 --> 0:05:47.567 live with the stress that this company puts on me 0:05:47.647 --> 0:05:50.487 in my life, and they were right. I've been stressed 0:05:50.527 --> 0:05:53.127 out for seven years, seven years of not giving my 0:05:53.207 --> 0:05:55.447 kids the time they deserve, seven years of not enjoying 0:05:55.487 --> 0:05:58.087 my life while the impending doom of not having made 0:05:58.207 --> 0:06:02.287 enough money hung over me. And it stops now now. 0:06:02.287 --> 0:06:04.327 To be clear, these women have a lot of other 0:06:04.327 --> 0:06:06.687 things going on right. Hall is a content creator. She 0:06:06.727 --> 0:06:08.927 still has another business called The Lover's Heart Club where 0:06:08.927 --> 0:06:11.967 she set like Art and Home was SJP of course 0:06:12.087 --> 0:06:15.687 different scale altogether, still has a wine label a fragrance, 0:06:15.767 --> 0:06:18.567 and of course she's an actress who's filming season three 0:06:18.567 --> 0:06:22.087 of them just like that at the moment. But mea 0:06:22.207 --> 0:06:26.527 as our out loud business correspondent, is this just the 0:06:26.567 --> 0:06:28.967 economy and these are high profile examples of something that's 0:06:28.967 --> 0:06:32.807 happening everywhere on very different scales, or is it symptomatic 0:06:32.887 --> 0:06:35.367 of the end of the celebrity side hustle. 0:06:35.887 --> 0:06:38.727 I think it's a little bit of both. I mean, 0:06:38.767 --> 0:06:42.767 the economy is incredibly hard, retail is incredibly hard, and 0:06:42.807 --> 0:06:46.647 the apparel is among the hardest. I mean, all you 0:06:46.727 --> 0:06:51.447 have to do is search for genes or pretty much anything, 0:06:51.607 --> 0:06:55.167 any item of clothing, shoes, or accessories, and you'll probably 0:06:55.167 --> 0:06:58.487 be served a bunch of ads from like Temu, where 0:06:58.487 --> 0:07:00.367 you can buy them for like six dollars. 0:07:00.967 --> 0:07:02.167 The little guys. 0:07:02.327 --> 0:07:07.287 Are finding it increasingly tough because when you're an enormous 0:07:07.287 --> 0:07:11.807 company who manufactures off sor you can do it quite cheaply, 0:07:11.927 --> 0:07:14.647 and you can sell it quite cheaply for a decent markup. 0:07:14.727 --> 0:07:16.727 The way I understand it is that the bottom line 0:07:16.727 --> 0:07:19.367 of the big businesses is getting bigger and bigger, whereas 0:07:19.367 --> 0:07:22.647 the small businesses are crumbling as a result. So even 0:07:22.767 --> 0:07:24.687 you know, yeah, there's the example of the big like 0:07:24.767 --> 0:07:26.527 next day delivery all that kind of stuff. 0:07:26.567 --> 0:07:30.887 And so if Zara or Tema Orchine making a T shirt, 0:07:31.167 --> 0:07:33.607 they'll put in an order for a million units, maybe 0:07:33.607 --> 0:07:36.767 two million units. If Constance Hall is making a T shirt, 0:07:37.127 --> 0:07:40.407 she'll put in an order for five hundred units. So 0:07:40.447 --> 0:07:43.287 you can imagine the cost of two million units is 0:07:43.527 --> 0:07:47.327 maybe forty cents a unit, and the cost of ordering 0:07:47.407 --> 0:07:51.127 five hundred is probably four dollars or ten dollars a unit. 0:07:51.727 --> 0:07:54.207 So it's really tough. And I think what's been interesting 0:07:54.247 --> 0:07:57.087 about the Internet and social media in particularly, it's allowed 0:07:57.487 --> 0:08:00.447 women to not just sell other people's products because women 0:08:00.447 --> 0:08:03.967 have always done that, famous women, but to go direct 0:08:03.967 --> 0:08:05.407 to consumer and sell their own. 0:08:06.047 --> 0:08:07.287 You know, it's not all doom and gloom. 0:08:07.287 --> 0:08:09.007 I mean you just have to look at business women 0:08:09.087 --> 0:08:12.687 in Australia like Zoe Foster Blake, who has built a 0:08:13.007 --> 0:08:15.487 company worth hundreds of millions of dollars which she then 0:08:15.567 --> 0:08:18.087 sold and then brought back again at a fraction of 0:08:18.127 --> 0:08:21.807 the price. So it's not that it is impossible. And 0:08:22.287 --> 0:08:26.367 we've seen Celeste Barbara just start her beauty line, so 0:08:26.447 --> 0:08:28.967 there's lots of women who are still doing it, famous 0:08:28.967 --> 0:08:31.887 women who are still doing it. But it is really 0:08:31.967 --> 0:08:33.367 hard to compete. 0:08:33.167 --> 0:08:35.647 Because there's someone who I'm not a business person. I 0:08:35.687 --> 0:08:38.167 don't claim to understand the ins and outs, and in fact, 0:08:38.207 --> 0:08:40.807 I take such pride in knowing I will never have 0:08:40.887 --> 0:08:43.087 a product. It's sort of like knowing I'll never run 0:08:43.127 --> 0:08:45.447 a marathon. It's like a very relieving. 0:08:45.087 --> 0:08:47.527 But I thought I'd never work for myself. I never 0:08:47.567 --> 0:08:49.007 thought I would be self employed. 0:08:49.087 --> 0:08:51.727 I just think never. It looks like the hardest thing 0:08:51.727 --> 0:08:52.847 in the world, but it is. 0:08:52.887 --> 0:08:54.167 I mean, it's the hardest thing in the world, but 0:08:54.207 --> 0:08:54.647 it's hard. 0:08:54.767 --> 0:09:00.447 Part of the marketing of having a brand is to 0:09:00.647 --> 0:09:03.407 promote almost like a scarcity mindset and to go, it's 0:09:03.447 --> 0:09:05.967 flying off the shelves, get it now, we're having a 0:09:06.047 --> 0:09:10.207 last sale. Like part of marketing is to project this 0:09:10.407 --> 0:09:14.487 image that your business is thriving, which I imagine compounds the 0:09:14.527 --> 0:09:17.727 pain of most business owners who feel as though they're 0:09:17.727 --> 0:09:18.327 not thriving. 0:09:18.487 --> 0:09:20.967 Constance always did that really, really well, which is why 0:09:21.247 --> 0:09:23.967 it was a big surprise even to me to read 0:09:24.087 --> 0:09:29.727 that it was closing, because she's an outstanding marketer, and 0:09:29.767 --> 0:09:33.487 she said in that post, so much of the investment 0:09:33.687 --> 0:09:36.367 of building this label was from the proceeds of her book, 0:09:36.367 --> 0:09:38.727 because she again didn't go with a publisher, took a 0:09:38.807 --> 0:09:41.887 risk ten years ago and self published a memoir and 0:09:42.047 --> 0:09:44.727 made a fortune, a fortune like several million. 0:09:44.487 --> 0:09:46.487 Dollars on precedent and unprecedented. 0:09:46.607 --> 0:09:49.567 It was like change the game in publishing, and no 0:09:49.607 --> 0:09:52.847 one's been able to replicate that, including her. But no 0:09:52.887 --> 0:09:55.167 one's been able to replicate that, even other big name 0:09:55.207 --> 0:09:58.567 authors or go with big companies. So being really good 0:09:58.567 --> 0:10:01.767 at marketing is different to being really good at business, 0:10:02.367 --> 0:10:05.087 and if you don't have the right partners. I know 0:10:05.167 --> 0:10:07.687 a lot of things, but if I hadn't been a 0:10:07.727 --> 0:10:11.087 co founder of Muma Mia with my husband Jason, who 0:10:11.127 --> 0:10:14.367 was CEO, there's no way I could have done this. 0:10:14.487 --> 0:10:16.967 There's no way or could continue to do this. I 0:10:17.007 --> 0:10:19.287 want to ask if there's a vibe shift, right. I mean, 0:10:19.287 --> 0:10:22.167 there are obviously very specific reasons for these people that 0:10:22.207 --> 0:10:24.487 we're talking about now for their businesses to work or 0:10:24.487 --> 0:10:26.407 not work, or whether or not they've just run their course. 0:10:26.527 --> 0:10:29.047 Whether you know sjp's Shoes was always going to have 0:10:29.287 --> 0:10:29.807 a ceiling. 0:10:29.927 --> 0:10:30.967 Really the other. 0:10:30.807 --> 0:10:33.487 Thing whole is social media and the algorithm, because it 0:10:33.607 --> 0:10:38.087 used to be SJP and Constance have millions of followers, right, 0:10:38.127 --> 0:10:39.567 and if you can go direct to them on social 0:10:39.607 --> 0:10:41.647 media and sell something, you don't need to spend money 0:10:41.647 --> 0:10:43.967 on advertising. You don't need to, you know, take out 0:10:44.007 --> 0:10:47.207 ads on TV or in Mama Mia. You can go direct. 0:10:47.487 --> 0:10:50.767 But as soon as you're reliant on someone else and 0:10:50.807 --> 0:10:54.007 an algorithm to deliver your customers to you so that 0:10:54.047 --> 0:10:56.967 they see what you're putting out there, it's not a 0:10:56.967 --> 0:10:58.127 reliable business model. 0:10:58.247 --> 0:11:00.127 When I say I wonder if there's been a vibe shift. 0:11:00.167 --> 0:11:03.647 I wonder if it's the means of operation have changed, because, 0:11:03.687 --> 0:11:07.007 as you say, social media has changed, but also there 0:11:07.087 --> 0:11:08.807 was a moment, and I think we're still in this moment. 0:11:08.807 --> 0:11:11.207 To be fair, that anyone with a big following or 0:11:11.207 --> 0:11:14.207 a big fame is very much encouraged now to own 0:11:14.247 --> 0:11:17.327 things like business. Didn't used to be cool twenty years 0:11:17.367 --> 0:11:20.887 ago if you were an artist or a creative, saying 0:11:20.887 --> 0:11:23.087 that you had a business mind or that you were 0:11:23.127 --> 0:11:26.127 interested in bottom lines and spreadsheets was very uncool, right, 0:11:26.407 --> 0:11:28.567 But we live in a time now where billionaires are 0:11:28.567 --> 0:11:32.447 pinups and every celebrity has a liquor brand, a skincare line. 0:11:32.687 --> 0:11:34.967 It's kind of cool to know a lot about business. 0:11:35.327 --> 0:11:38.447 But I wonder if there's a shift because we've realized 0:11:38.487 --> 0:11:41.887 the reality of just because you do have lots of followers, 0:11:42.367 --> 0:11:46.687 it doesn't guarantee success. And as what Constance expressed there, 0:11:46.967 --> 0:11:49.927 as I understand it because obviously when you were very 0:11:49.967 --> 0:11:52.847 involved in Ladies startup and we were always listening to 0:11:53.127 --> 0:11:56.687 female founders, it is incredibly stressful. When she was explaining 0:11:56.687 --> 0:12:01.007 that about staying awake at night, stressing about employees, bottom lines, payments, 0:12:01.007 --> 0:12:03.767 Do I have enough money? That's very common, right, That's 0:12:03.887 --> 0:12:05.047 that's what business women. 0:12:06.887 --> 0:12:07.887 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 0:12:08.007 --> 0:12:10.767 Is it just not bloody worth it for a lot 0:12:10.807 --> 0:12:11.207 of people. 0:12:11.407 --> 0:12:13.727 I think there's a lot of different reasons why people 0:12:13.807 --> 0:12:17.327 start businesses, you know, and it's not always just about money. 0:12:17.487 --> 0:12:19.887 I mean, obviously everyone has to make their own decisions 0:12:19.887 --> 0:12:22.447 about what they're willing to put up with, you know, 0:12:22.567 --> 0:12:25.487 and what's the return on investment in their life that 0:12:25.807 --> 0:12:27.727 makes it worth it to continue or not. But a 0:12:27.727 --> 0:12:30.407 lot of women, particularly women with side hustles, women with 0:12:30.447 --> 0:12:36.087 small businesses, start them for reasons around identity, around boredom, 0:12:36.447 --> 0:12:39.127 around wanting something to do that's not just being at 0:12:39.127 --> 0:12:41.207 home with kids, or being at home being a care 0:12:41.367 --> 0:12:43.687 for someone, or being at home being unwell. 0:12:43.527 --> 0:12:44.687 Or more flexible work. 0:12:44.767 --> 0:12:47.647 Yeah. I remember one woman I interviewed who had had 0:12:47.647 --> 0:12:51.687 a terrible car accident and became a wheelchair user, and 0:12:52.847 --> 0:12:56.287 she started a business like knitting. She lived on farm, 0:12:56.487 --> 0:12:59.087 bulls blankets and scars and stuff, and that was never 0:12:59.127 --> 0:13:01.207 going to set the world on fire. But that's not 0:13:01.247 --> 0:13:04.687 why she started it. It made enough to pay for itself, 0:13:05.207 --> 0:13:08.047 and she says that it saved her because it gave 0:13:08.087 --> 0:13:11.007 her purpose and I used to those stories all the 0:13:11.087 --> 0:13:12.527 time from we Yes. 0:13:12.567 --> 0:13:14.967 But then there's this other thing going on, right, which 0:13:15.007 --> 0:13:17.887 is that if you have a following, and we've talked 0:13:17.887 --> 0:13:21.727 about this, you don't necessarily make money from having two 0:13:21.807 --> 0:13:24.407 hundred thousand followers on Instagram, right, No, you don't. It's 0:13:24.447 --> 0:13:28.247 about monetizing a following. So I heard this said recently. 0:13:28.407 --> 0:13:30.407 You'll remember the other week we're talking about the person 0:13:30.447 --> 0:13:33.127 who coined the word demure, and she was talking about it, 0:13:33.167 --> 0:13:36.167 and suddenly her words are the most famous words in 0:13:36.207 --> 0:13:39.127 the world. I think it's like she must be so rich, yes, 0:13:39.207 --> 0:13:40.767 and I think she made a little bit of money 0:13:40.807 --> 0:13:43.207 just from views or something. But I heard people say 0:13:43.847 --> 0:13:45.967 she needs a product, she needs a product right now 0:13:46.047 --> 0:13:47.567 so that she can sell it, so that she can 0:13:47.607 --> 0:13:51.447 capitalize on it. I don't think that there is a 0:13:51.607 --> 0:13:56.647 clear recipe necessarily for making sure that's a product people 0:13:56.687 --> 0:13:59.527 actually want to buy, or making sure that she would 0:13:59.567 --> 0:14:04.407 be around the right people to create and also monetize instantly. 0:14:04.487 --> 0:14:07.967 It doesn't happen instantly. And the nature of fame and 0:14:08.047 --> 0:14:10.847 virality now is that the person who was famous story 0:14:10.847 --> 0:14:14.287 weeks ago is invisible today. But I'm not sure that 0:14:14.647 --> 0:14:17.167 a vibe shift is totally what's happening. I was listening 0:14:17.247 --> 0:14:20.087 to an interview with one of the guys from The 0:14:20.087 --> 0:14:23.247 Inspired Unemployed this week, Jack Steele. They made better beer. 0:14:24.167 --> 0:14:27.327 That is the fastest growing beer in Australian history. And 0:14:27.407 --> 0:14:30.767 I would say, just looking at those two guys, because 0:14:30.767 --> 0:14:33.007 they were making TikTok videos and they've got into lots 0:14:33.007 --> 0:14:36.647 of different projects from the outside, I go, whoever you're 0:14:36.687 --> 0:14:39.847 working with is giving you fantastic advice. 0:14:39.967 --> 0:14:41.527 Like, clearly the beer was a great thing. 0:14:41.687 --> 0:14:42.527 It was a good match. 0:14:42.607 --> 0:14:43.727 It was a really good match. 0:14:43.767 --> 0:14:48.607 They knew who their audience was, so there's still clearly potential. 0:14:49.127 --> 0:14:52.367 Back to the woman who had the very demure moment, 0:14:52.487 --> 0:14:56.407 Jules Lebron, she had two choices very quickly. One is 0:14:56.407 --> 0:14:59.447 to make her own products, which you can't do instantly. Well, 0:14:59.487 --> 0:15:01.287 you can with like a drop shit model, like you 0:15:01.287 --> 0:15:04.287 can get t shirts sort of printed in China or 0:15:04.287 --> 0:15:05.567 something and quickly get them shipped. 0:15:05.567 --> 0:15:06.087 You could do that. 0:15:06.567 --> 0:15:09.207 The other is to quickly take all the brand deals 0:15:09.367 --> 0:15:12.567 so everybody would be coming to her and its influencer work. 0:15:12.887 --> 0:15:15.927 So it's saying, okay, I've probably got two months to 0:15:16.047 --> 0:15:19.447 make good coin, I need to fish weather, fish are 0:15:19.607 --> 0:15:22.487 and do that as opposed to the longer lead and 0:15:22.847 --> 0:15:23.207 sell us. 0:15:23.207 --> 0:15:24.327 Barber's a great example of that. 0:15:24.367 --> 0:15:26.447 I mean, she's been famous for a really long time now, 0:15:26.487 --> 0:15:30.407 but she was the face of ModelCo and someone else's makeup, 0:15:30.447 --> 0:15:32.607 and she obviously decided, well, hang on, I know that 0:15:32.647 --> 0:15:35.527 I can move make up for them. Why aren't I 0:15:35.567 --> 0:15:38.327 doing this for myself? And so that's what she's doing 0:15:38.367 --> 0:15:42.207 now with a business partner. But it's very different because 0:15:42.247 --> 0:15:44.567 when you work for someone else, they have the infrastructure. 0:15:45.047 --> 0:15:48.087 When you work for yourself, suddenly you've got to be 0:15:48.167 --> 0:15:51.327 out there selling all the time, and not everybody's comfortable 0:15:51.327 --> 0:15:54.007 with doing that. Like, one thing you can say about 0:15:54.127 --> 0:15:57.567 Constance is that she knows how to sell things, and 0:15:57.607 --> 0:16:01.847 she was out there constantly working it, and yet that 0:16:01.927 --> 0:16:02.847 still wasn't enough. 0:16:03.127 --> 0:16:06.687 The most successful celebrity brands you can think of eventually 0:16:06.687 --> 0:16:10.247 transcend the celebrity. Right, So sample of the better beer 0:16:10.767 --> 0:16:13.087 that might be going really well right now, but in 0:16:13.167 --> 0:16:15.447 ten years, when the inspired unemployed have been I mean 0:16:15.447 --> 0:16:17.207 they'll be fine. I don't mean I'm worried about them, 0:16:17.247 --> 0:16:19.207 but like there'll be a new inspired on employed there'll 0:16:19.207 --> 0:16:21.087 be a new cool young guys who all the young 0:16:21.087 --> 0:16:24.887 people want to emulate better. Beer will only remain successful 0:16:24.927 --> 0:16:28.087 if it's bloody great and it's like solidified itself separate 0:16:28.127 --> 0:16:30.287 to them. It's kind of like fenty beauty or you 0:16:30.327 --> 0:16:33.207 know there are celebrity brands you can think of that. Yes, 0:16:33.247 --> 0:16:36.647 the celebrity helped get that out there, but now it's 0:16:36.767 --> 0:16:38.687 every time I think of fenty beauty and I see it, 0:16:38.727 --> 0:16:40.967 I don't immediately go Rhianna. I mean, I know this 0:16:41.007 --> 0:16:41.807 is a different scale. 0:16:41.967 --> 0:16:43.087 I don't know, I know, you know what I mean. 0:16:43.287 --> 0:16:46.447 It's like the thing with Sjp's shoes, for example. And 0:16:46.727 --> 0:16:49.607 I'm not a business expert, but this is my vibe 0:16:49.887 --> 0:16:51.767 is there was always going to be a ceiling on 0:16:51.847 --> 0:16:54.687 how long people were obsessed with one and carry Bradshaw's heels, 0:16:54.767 --> 0:16:55.527 do you know what I mean? 0:16:55.727 --> 0:16:59.647 Everyone went to her with opportunities to either endorse or 0:16:59.687 --> 0:17:03.567 do a collab with a big brand, a big existing 0:17:03.607 --> 0:17:06.487 shoe brand, including like a Minola blank and then cheaper ones, 0:17:06.687 --> 0:17:10.687 but the price point for celebrity like Jessica Simpson, for example, 0:17:10.727 --> 0:17:13.567 who doesn't release music anymore, but she's a billionaire because 0:17:13.607 --> 0:17:17.287 she sells like dresses and shoes and sheets, and she's 0:17:17.287 --> 0:17:20.007 an entire lifestyle brand, and so she could have gone 0:17:20.007 --> 0:17:22.447 that way, but she wanted to go do her own thing, 0:17:22.487 --> 0:17:24.207 and she wanted it to be a certain quality. So 0:17:24.247 --> 0:17:26.407 the price point of these shoes were like five hundred dollars, 0:17:26.527 --> 0:17:28.527 and anyone that's got five hundred dollars to spend on 0:17:28.607 --> 0:17:32.087 shoes SJP is not She's a person who's known for 0:17:32.127 --> 0:17:35.087 having great shoes, but it's not like a Manolo Blanik 0:17:35.167 --> 0:17:36.247 or a Christian Liverton or. 0:17:36.247 --> 0:17:37.247 A Gucci or whatever. 0:17:37.367 --> 0:17:40.247 So I think there was that disconnect because people want 0:17:40.247 --> 0:17:43.767 to be adjacent to famous people. But that's why celebrities 0:17:43.807 --> 0:17:46.247 have fragrances, because you can buy a little bit of 0:17:46.367 --> 0:17:49.207 SJP for thirty bucks at Chemist Warehouse, you. 0:17:49.127 --> 0:17:51.887 Know, Lazy Girls. 0:17:52.247 --> 0:17:56.167 We have another Lazy Girl giveaway and this time we're 0:17:56.207 --> 0:18:01.447 giving away five GHD styling tools. We've got three GHD 0:18:01.807 --> 0:18:05.767 Jewet Styles and two GHD Jewet blow drys, which I 0:18:05.767 --> 0:18:08.127 am so excited to try. I've tried the Jewet Style. 0:18:08.607 --> 0:18:11.487 I actually have one, and it is the best straightener 0:18:11.527 --> 0:18:14.847 hair tool I own. Both tools take your hair from 0:18:14.887 --> 0:18:18.647 wet to styled with one tool and no heat damage, 0:18:18.687 --> 0:18:21.527 which is a lazy girl's stream because who has the 0:18:21.607 --> 0:18:24.887 time or energy for brushing, blow drying, straightening, and or curling. 0:18:25.367 --> 0:18:27.647 I do not know a single lazy girl who actually 0:18:27.687 --> 0:18:29.127 knows how to blow dry her own hair. 0:18:29.207 --> 0:18:30.047 It can't be done. 0:18:30.327 --> 0:18:32.967 All you need to do to enter all current and 0:18:33.127 --> 0:18:36.767 future Lazy Girl giveaways is to subscribe to Muma Maya. 0:18:37.007 --> 0:18:40.407 It is one simple step. As always, we have a 0:18:40.407 --> 0:18:43.127 discount code for the lazy girls. That's what they need 0:18:43.127 --> 0:18:45.647 sometimes to get them over the line. The code is 0:18:45.927 --> 0:18:48.927 lazy Hair for twenty percent off. There's a link in 0:18:48.967 --> 0:18:52.167 the show notes that will automatically apply the code if 0:18:52.207 --> 0:18:54.847 you are too lazy to type it. If you are 0:18:54.887 --> 0:18:57.247 yet to be convinced, let me tell you that last 0:18:57.287 --> 0:18:59.927 week a lazy girl did just one job in a 0:18:59.967 --> 0:19:02.007 whole week, and it was that she became a subscriber. 0:19:02.047 --> 0:19:03.687 And guess what happened to her. She won a trip 0:19:03.687 --> 0:19:06.127 for two to Turkey, so it was worth it. The 0:19:06.207 --> 0:19:08.847 prize draw is on the tenth of September. Teas and 0:19:08.887 --> 0:19:09.527 Season Life. 0:19:17.767 --> 0:19:19.807 I've been thinking about this all day ever since the 0:19:19.847 --> 0:19:22.687 Molly and Tommy breakup was announced and I just don't 0:19:22.767 --> 0:19:25.927 think that people understand the severity of how this is 0:19:25.967 --> 0:19:29.647 going to impact society. Think about it. Molly May has 0:19:29.687 --> 0:19:35.247 created a generation of girlies who like a slip back bone, 0:19:35.487 --> 0:19:37.847 a free at five hundred. They've got a new lip 0:19:37.887 --> 0:19:40.687 on and the most flawless, faked hand that you will 0:19:40.727 --> 0:19:43.567 ever see in your life. Every single one of them 0:19:43.647 --> 0:19:46.367 right now is sitting there thinking if it could happen 0:19:46.407 --> 0:19:47.527 to them, it could happen to me. 0:19:47.887 --> 0:19:50.727 When news reached the Mum Mayor office last week that 0:19:50.807 --> 0:19:54.207 a woman named Molly May Haig and a man named 0:19:54.247 --> 0:19:57.767 Tommy Fury was separating, there were literal tears. 0:19:58.607 --> 0:20:00.847 There were tears. Holly, don't understand. 0:20:00.447 --> 0:20:02.407 The words coming out of her mouth? Do you understand them? 0:20:02.767 --> 0:20:06.727 The statement this is our Princess Diana and Prince Charles 0:20:06.727 --> 0:20:12.247 moment was atted. Team felt blindsided and emotionally unequipped to 0:20:12.367 --> 0:20:15.647 deal with the news that on August fourteen, and otherwise 0:20:15.767 --> 0:20:19.647 normal quiet Wednesday, Molly May and Tommy were over. 0:20:19.607 --> 0:20:20.607 See these people? 0:20:21.447 --> 0:20:23.647 Before I go any further, Holly and Maa, do you 0:20:23.687 --> 0:20:24.847 have any questions regarding what. 0:20:24.807 --> 0:20:27.967 I just heard? All of the questions because I've seen 0:20:27.967 --> 0:20:29.727 this story around obviously, I work My May, and I've 0:20:29.727 --> 0:20:31.647 seen it on site. I haven't clicked on it because 0:20:31.687 --> 0:20:33.647 I'm like, I don't know who they are. So I 0:20:33.647 --> 0:20:35.207 looked at the picture. I was like, surely I'll just 0:20:35.207 --> 0:20:36.247 recognize their faces. No. 0:20:36.407 --> 0:20:41.807 Still, no, their English, Holly. I think that they might 0:20:41.847 --> 0:20:43.967 be friends with your parents because they live in Greater Manchester. 0:20:44.047 --> 0:20:46.287 Oh my goodness, so your parents. I bet they're talking 0:20:46.327 --> 0:20:49.447 about it all over this. Oh your mom's going to 0:20:49.527 --> 0:20:52.207 go Did you know Molly May and Toyo? 0:20:53.327 --> 0:20:55.847 That sounds embarrassing though I don't know what's happening yet. 0:20:56.007 --> 0:20:59.047 Okay, So Molly May Haig was on season five of 0:20:59.087 --> 0:21:01.887 Love Island obviously right, and she also had like a 0:21:01.927 --> 0:21:04.327 YouTube channel and everyone loves her just for she. 0:21:04.367 --> 0:21:06.367 An influencer who went on Love Island. Or was she 0:21:06.607 --> 0:21:08.087 went on Love Island and became an influence. 0:21:08.087 --> 0:21:11.327 She reminded me her Love works. I'm going back to base. 0:21:11.607 --> 0:21:14.327 She was an influencer who went on Love Island. It 0:21:14.367 --> 0:21:16.527 is an island full of love where there are just 0:21:16.567 --> 0:21:19.327 a bunch of people who like have mad sex together. 0:21:19.487 --> 0:21:21.647 And her and Tommy were runner UNPD. 0:21:21.687 --> 0:21:22.487 Is that the whole plot? 0:21:23.007 --> 0:21:25.647 Yeah? And they're hot and they walk around in bikinis. 0:21:25.327 --> 0:21:27.807 Run around bad So who wins the person who has 0:21:27.807 --> 0:21:29.327 the sex the most and doesn't get a UTR? 0:21:29.407 --> 0:21:32.047 No, no, no, the couple that's the most couple. They were 0:21:32.047 --> 0:21:34.367 the second most couple, the second most people. And so 0:21:34.487 --> 0:21:36.767 this was twenty nineteen. So this was five years ago, 0:21:36.807 --> 0:21:39.607 which is fifty years ago in reality. Okay, time, Yeah, 0:21:39.647 --> 0:21:43.247 you're right they're part of the establishment. Yeah, they're brad Nanch. 0:21:43.567 --> 0:21:46.247 Since then they've got married. They have a daughter. Her 0:21:46.287 --> 0:21:48.167 name is Bambi. She's about one and a half. 0:21:48.287 --> 0:21:52.287 No, all right, I quite like. 0:21:55.447 --> 0:21:57.447 Now you two are thinking, why should I care? 0:21:57.727 --> 0:21:58.487 A lot of nouns. 0:21:58.527 --> 0:22:00.487 There's a lot of proper nouns, none of which I 0:22:00.527 --> 0:22:01.087 can recall. 0:22:01.327 --> 0:22:03.207 Friends, if we were sitting at dinner and I said 0:22:03.207 --> 0:22:05.287 to you, friends of mine just broke up and there's 0:22:05.287 --> 0:22:07.807 something fishy going on, would you or would you not? 0:22:07.887 --> 0:22:10.767 Lean in? Of course you'd lean in. Okay, Well that's 0:22:10.807 --> 0:22:11.367 what we're gonna do. 0:22:12.007 --> 0:22:14.567 First of all, I'd express disapproval because it's my brand. 0:22:14.567 --> 0:22:16.727 I'd be like, are we really gossiping about this? Jesse? 0:22:16.847 --> 0:22:19.367 And then I would put down my wife class and 0:22:19.407 --> 0:22:20.607 I'd go, tell. 0:22:20.407 --> 0:22:21.687 Me, so, what have they done. 0:22:21.807 --> 0:22:23.767 Do they have jobs like or they just famous people? 0:22:23.847 --> 0:22:26.687 Okay, Tommy Fury in a weird way is related to 0:22:26.727 --> 0:22:28.487 a very famous boxer or something. 0:22:28.647 --> 0:22:31.327 Oh yeah yeah, Tyson Fury. Yes, it's really famous. 0:22:31.527 --> 0:22:32.167 I know that is. 0:22:32.287 --> 0:22:32.527 Yeah. 0:22:32.527 --> 0:22:34.407 Okay, so that's and then there was like a Netflix 0:22:34.447 --> 0:22:36.487 show about blah blah blast the British people. 0:22:36.487 --> 0:22:37.087 Are we so? 0:22:37.367 --> 0:22:41.527 Holly's family friend Molly May post an Instagram story to 0:22:41.567 --> 0:22:45.087 her eight point two million followers eight eight point two Okay. 0:22:45.967 --> 0:22:48.727 It says, never in a million years did I think 0:22:48.767 --> 0:22:51.407 I'd have to write this after five years of being together. 0:22:51.567 --> 0:22:55.207 I never imagined our story would end, especially not this way. 0:22:55.447 --> 0:22:56.607 What does that tell you? What's if? 0:22:56.887 --> 0:22:58.647 But also can I just put my hand up? 0:22:58.727 --> 0:22:59.967 So dirty, dirty cheetah? 0:23:00.047 --> 0:23:02.967 I love it, of course, But also did anyone really 0:23:03.007 --> 0:23:05.087 think she was never going to have to write that? 0:23:05.127 --> 0:23:07.567 They met on a reality show five years ago, quickly 0:23:07.607 --> 0:23:08.527 got married and had a baby. 0:23:09.287 --> 0:23:10.927 Don't think you understand her love work? 0:23:11.007 --> 0:23:12.807 Didn't we all think she was going to come to 0:23:12.847 --> 0:23:14.127 a day when she was going to write this? 0:23:14.247 --> 0:23:17.087 They were Charles and Diana, right, they were, I've been 0:23:17.087 --> 0:23:19.247 together four five years? 0:23:19.287 --> 0:23:19.767 What about that? 0:23:19.807 --> 0:23:23.207 Are you're not understanding five years pre covid. Oh my god, 0:23:23.527 --> 0:23:26.367 now everyone's yelling Molly, tell us what happened. 0:23:26.647 --> 0:23:26.927 Well. 0:23:27.087 --> 0:23:29.127 She then went on, she said our priority was her daughter. 0:23:29.207 --> 0:23:32.527 That's all lovely, and then she said that she will 0:23:32.567 --> 0:23:34.287 return to social media when it feels right. 0:23:34.927 --> 0:23:37.487 That was today she. 0:23:35.887 --> 0:23:40.287 Did, and how many an hour later and she said, 0:23:40.327 --> 0:23:42.727 thank you for your support. Have you too been supporting? 0:23:43.127 --> 0:23:49.327 Apparently we've been very supportive. All right, do we want 0:23:49.367 --> 0:23:51.527 to know what happened? Do we want to know what happened? 0:23:52.167 --> 0:23:52.527 All right? 0:23:52.567 --> 0:23:55.807 Well, the Sun knows what happened, so sit tight the Sun. 0:23:55.927 --> 0:23:57.927 Oh sorry, I thought you meant her son. I was confused. 0:23:59.927 --> 0:24:04.447 Guess the Sun is a tabloid newspaper and only ever 0:24:04.487 --> 0:24:07.767 tells the truth. Tommy, he was on holiday in North 0:24:07.807 --> 0:24:12.487 Macedonia and he was seen kissing a blonde woman in 0:24:12.487 --> 0:24:15.407 front of hundreds of people in a nightclub. Tommy just 0:24:15.567 --> 0:24:19.367 days before Mollie may announce very smart as he's not 0:24:19.487 --> 0:24:22.487 very smart. A nightclub girl was interviewed and said that 0:24:22.527 --> 0:24:24.967 Tommy didn't even seem to care that he was kissing 0:24:25.007 --> 0:24:27.967 a girl in front of everyone. And Tommy's security guard 0:24:28.207 --> 0:24:30.527 went up to people and was deleting pictures and videos 0:24:30.567 --> 0:24:32.847 off their phone, going you can't film Tommy cheating on 0:24:32.887 --> 0:24:34.007 his wife. 0:24:35.207 --> 0:24:39.047 It seems like an imperfect pr strategy for everybody. Give 0:24:39.047 --> 0:24:42.447 me your phone. I need your phone. You over there, 0:24:42.687 --> 0:24:45.967 give me your phone, and it's just one security guard 0:24:46.047 --> 0:24:46.967 trying to do all the work. 0:24:47.727 --> 0:24:50.167 Allegedly, he was then seen speaking to the same girl 0:24:50.207 --> 0:24:51.207 the following evening. 0:24:51.567 --> 0:24:53.847 You are the sun. What are you try and do next? 0:24:54.047 --> 0:24:55.567 Come on, hollod, We've trying to find the girl. 0:24:55.967 --> 0:24:59.447 We've found the girl, haven't we. We found her. She's Danish. 0:24:59.647 --> 0:25:01.207 She probably wasn't very hard to find. 0:25:01.327 --> 0:25:03.407 She wasn't. She just posted on her stories. 0:25:03.527 --> 0:25:05.687 She said, I've had to delete all my posts due 0:25:05.727 --> 0:25:07.007 to the hate and nasty comments. 0:25:07.047 --> 0:25:08.727 She's also taking a break from social media. 0:25:09.687 --> 0:25:12.047 She had to delete her things. As stated in the 0:25:12.087 --> 0:25:14.927 news story, I gave. I didn't do anything with Tommy Fury. 0:25:15.007 --> 0:25:17.847 I didn't even know who he was. We only shared 0:25:17.847 --> 0:25:20.927 a kiss. Nothing else happened. I wouldn't kissed himfu you 0:25:21.127 --> 0:25:24.407 is with Molly May Now back to the timeline, right, 0:25:24.407 --> 0:25:26.487 because he goes and cheats with this Danish This is 0:25:26.527 --> 0:25:29.927 all allegedly h but he's gone over there he's kissed her. 0:25:30.407 --> 0:25:33.007 Then he gets on a flight home to Manchester, right, 0:25:33.647 --> 0:25:38.327 and the flight's delayed. Always important, this important information. And 0:25:38.367 --> 0:25:42.167 it lands at two forty five pm. Right by three 0:25:42.167 --> 0:25:46.127 point fifty two pm, Molly May has announced their split 0:25:46.207 --> 0:25:49.527 to her Instagram followers. This suggests to me a video 0:25:49.807 --> 0:25:53.287 photo was sent to Molly May that quickly ended their 0:25:53.287 --> 0:25:56.327 relationship in what's that? Just over an hour? Just over 0:25:56.367 --> 0:25:57.727 an hour since he landed. 0:25:58.087 --> 0:26:00.407 It depends how far from the airport they. 0:26:00.407 --> 0:26:01.847 Leave, Yes, exactly right. 0:26:01.927 --> 0:26:05.727 Would you end a relationship and post about it in 0:26:05.767 --> 0:26:08.367 an hour after receiving a photo? 0:26:08.647 --> 0:26:09.207 It's a great way. 0:26:10.967 --> 0:26:14.327 No, okay, But I don't live in Molly May's world. 0:26:14.447 --> 0:26:17.807 I would if this was a pattern of behavior. Yeah, right, 0:26:17.847 --> 0:26:21.567 for sure, because I've seen Tommy. I've seen his face, 0:26:21.767 --> 0:26:22.967 and I just have a vibe. 0:26:23.047 --> 0:26:26.527 This is what I mean about everybody pretending they're surprised, Like, 0:26:27.087 --> 0:26:30.887 why would we be surprised? Do we really think that 0:26:30.967 --> 0:26:34.887 Tommy and Molly, two very good looking humans who found 0:26:34.927 --> 0:26:38.647 love on reality TV, were going to be monogamously together 0:26:38.727 --> 0:26:40.567 forever and ever and ever till they die? 0:26:40.687 --> 0:26:43.247 It's Laura Burne and Maddie Jay announced that they broke 0:26:43.287 --> 0:26:49.367 up tomorrow different, Oh, so upset. I'd be so upset 0:26:49.567 --> 0:26:51.847 because what it is is that been through a lot. 0:26:52.087 --> 0:26:56.207 Molly May has eight point two million girlfriends, right, so 0:26:56.247 --> 0:26:58.367 you know how like May Or if you got cheated 0:26:58.367 --> 0:27:03.407 on tomorrow, Holly and I would be giving Jason dirties. Right, 0:27:03.567 --> 0:27:05.407 we wouldn't be very friendly with him in the lift, 0:27:05.447 --> 0:27:06.727 I'll tell you that that's true. 0:27:06.767 --> 0:27:08.647 So now he's in a world of pain. 0:27:08.847 --> 0:27:11.207 Tommy took a little Bambi out for ice creamy the 0:27:11.207 --> 0:27:14.447 all day had to have security because people are just 0:27:14.527 --> 0:27:18.287 going you dirty, dirty dog. Imagine how brazen you have 0:27:18.367 --> 0:27:18.687 to be. 0:27:19.087 --> 0:27:21.487 Do you know what was interesting because when this happened, 0:27:21.807 --> 0:27:23.567 I was about to say to us, to Holly and 0:27:23.567 --> 0:27:27.927 I at the point when our friend Jennifer Aniston got 0:27:28.007 --> 0:27:31.767 cheated on by Brad Pitt, no one turned on Brad Pitt, like, 0:27:31.807 --> 0:27:33.727 not one person everyone because they all. 0:27:33.647 --> 0:27:34.487 Tend to know Jelina. 0:27:35.047 --> 0:27:36.967 Yeah, no one turned on Brad Pitt. 0:27:37.087 --> 0:27:40.727 So this might be progress. If Tommy Fiury is being 0:27:40.767 --> 0:27:44.087 harassed and beaten up in the street by angry ladies 0:27:44.607 --> 0:27:49.647 who were throwing their shoes at him with bamby like, well, no, 0:27:49.727 --> 0:27:51.807 of course, and I'm joking. Of course it's not okay 0:27:51.847 --> 0:27:56.207 then harass anyone in the street. But I'm just saying, like, culturally, 0:27:56.727 --> 0:27:59.327 at least they haven't all gone round to Danish lady's 0:27:59.407 --> 0:28:02.487 house and they're like painting evil slogans on her. I 0:28:02.487 --> 0:28:03.247 mean maybe they are. 0:28:03.447 --> 0:28:05.767 So what happens now to Molly May? She's back on 0:28:05.807 --> 0:28:10.127 social She's back on social. Who she's dating A Kennedy, No, she's. 0:28:09.967 --> 0:28:12.167 Not dating anyone yet because she's spending time with Bambi 0:28:12.327 --> 0:28:16.007 because she is a mother. And Tommy also he's denying 0:28:16.367 --> 0:28:18.447 that he cheated. But what I say to Tommy is 0:28:18.487 --> 0:28:21.407 the photos a giller leak, probably and the Danish woman 0:28:21.967 --> 0:28:24.487 has said that you cheated, so I think you definitely 0:28:24.487 --> 0:28:26.687 did cheat. I think he was a dirty dog. I 0:28:26.727 --> 0:28:29.967 think that Molly May good on her for finally ending this. 0:28:30.047 --> 0:28:32.247 I think that will be very good for her. But 0:28:32.567 --> 0:28:35.767 I also think that we're so invested because they have 0:28:35.967 --> 0:28:38.607 an eighteen month old and not only did he go 0:28:38.647 --> 0:28:42.367 to North Macedonia clubbing at two am, but he cheated 0:28:42.407 --> 0:28:45.287 on her in public. The sh oh, I'm so angry 0:28:45.287 --> 0:28:49.247 at him. I reckon Holly's Mom's gonna when he walks 0:28:49.247 --> 0:28:50.487 past Holly's mum on the street. 0:28:50.687 --> 0:28:52.087 She's going to tut at him. 0:28:52.007 --> 0:28:54.687 Because your mums drop over Orchestral I think maybe she 0:28:54.687 --> 0:28:57.287 should write Yeah, if you want to know more about 0:28:57.287 --> 0:29:00.807 Molly May and frankly, who doesn't come on. I've got 0:29:00.847 --> 0:29:02.047 a lot of questions remaining. 0:29:02.127 --> 0:29:02.407 Yeah. 0:29:02.527 --> 0:29:05.007 There is a link in the show notes to the 0:29:05.127 --> 0:29:07.527 extensive coverage we've offered on my man. 0:29:07.687 --> 0:29:13.607 My mom is providing i''s life blogging from Manchester doing 0:29:13.647 --> 0:29:15.927 a live cross. 0:29:15.607 --> 0:29:20.647 To all his parents. Every Tuesday and Thursday. 0:29:20.327 --> 0:29:22.327 We drop new segments of Mum and Me are Out 0:29:22.327 --> 0:29:25.207 Loud Just for Mum and Me A subscribers follow the 0:29:25.247 --> 0:29:27.167 link in the show notes to get your daily dose 0:29:27.207 --> 0:29:29.807 of out Loud and a big thank you to everyone 0:29:29.887 --> 0:29:40.647 who has already subscribed. Last Friday, the Seven Networks parent 0:29:40.727 --> 0:29:43.567 companies Seven West Media held a staff meeting in Perth 0:29:44.007 --> 0:29:47.207 to introduce some new senior stuff. They wanted everyone to 0:29:47.207 --> 0:29:49.527 get to know them, including their new male editor in 0:29:49.607 --> 0:29:52.927 chief of the West Australian newspaper and a new female editor, 0:29:52.927 --> 0:29:56.047 the first one in the paper's history, as well as 0:29:56.047 --> 0:29:59.967 the first LGBT appointment. A man who is the head 0:30:00.007 --> 0:30:02.727 of the Sunday Times. I mean, I was a bit 0:30:02.767 --> 0:30:04.807 confused when I read that, because presumably it's not the 0:30:04.847 --> 0:30:08.567 first LGBT appointment to management, but perhaps it's the first 0:30:08.567 --> 0:30:10.367 person who's public about it. 0:30:10.367 --> 0:30:12.927 Doesn't if it is, is that something. 0:30:12.607 --> 0:30:13.287 To be proud of? 0:30:13.847 --> 0:30:14.447 My gods? 0:30:14.527 --> 0:30:15.607 And like this is the first? 0:30:15.687 --> 0:30:17.527 I guess what they're trying to say. The Seven Network, 0:30:17.527 --> 0:30:19.127 as we know, has been under a lot of fire 0:30:19.207 --> 0:30:22.607 lately for sexism and such things, and maybe they're trying 0:30:22.647 --> 0:30:24.287 to say it's a new chapter. 0:30:25.087 --> 0:30:27.967 We also are inclusive. 0:30:27.887 --> 0:30:31.287 We're woke, We're welcoming well done to everyone with a 0:30:31.327 --> 0:30:33.967 new job. The company was feeling celebratory, and why wouldn't 0:30:33.967 --> 0:30:38.127 you be. But after welcoming the newbies, discussion turned to 0:30:38.167 --> 0:30:42.287 the company's annual upfront's presentation to advertisers. Out louders might 0:30:42.327 --> 0:30:45.167 be familiar with upfronts. They're the torturous thing that media 0:30:45.207 --> 0:30:47.527 companies have to go through every year, where you go 0:30:47.807 --> 0:30:50.607 and basically say, here, all the good things we've. 0:30:50.447 --> 0:30:52.567 Got coming up with lots of times, haven't we we have? 0:30:52.887 --> 0:30:55.327 Anyway, So they talked about what shows they'll be announcing, 0:30:55.367 --> 0:30:58.447 and one of those shows is Perth's Christmas pageant, which 0:30:58.487 --> 0:30:59.607 is apparently an institution. 0:31:00.087 --> 0:31:01.487 I can't believe I've never watched it. 0:31:01.567 --> 0:31:03.927 And that's when things took a turn. All I Want 0:31:03.967 --> 0:31:06.647 for Christmas by Mariah Carey started playing. 0:31:07.807 --> 0:31:08.367 That wasn't the. 0:31:08.287 --> 0:31:11.007 Bad part, obviously, because who doesn't love that song for 0:31:11.167 --> 0:31:17.487 bagger and yet, according to the Australian Financial Review, the 0:31:17.887 --> 0:31:21.767 seven deputy news director was talking about the Christmas pageant 0:31:22.247 --> 0:31:26.727 and out came a group of female dancers dressed in 0:31:28.407 --> 0:31:31.727 well they said, not much at all, but I would 0:31:31.807 --> 0:31:34.247 say from having seen the video which was leaked and 0:31:34.247 --> 0:31:36.447 looking at the photos, it seemed like sort of i'm 0:31:36.487 --> 0:31:39.887 gonna say, skimpy red dresses, like red dresses, and they 0:31:39.927 --> 0:31:41.607 were doing they were sexy. It was a bit of 0:31:41.647 --> 0:31:44.087 a sexy Santa situation. They were doing like high kicks, 0:31:44.207 --> 0:31:46.367 a bit of a DCC vibe, a bit of a 0:31:46.407 --> 0:31:49.207 DCC vibe. But I was saying they probably were more covered. 0:31:49.207 --> 0:31:52.247 There was no midroof anyway. Pictures of the event pinned 0:31:52.287 --> 0:31:55.527 around Perth media circles, with one likening them to slutty elves, 0:31:55.727 --> 0:31:59.767 which I think is very udgy, judgy and unreasonable and 0:31:59.807 --> 0:32:02.807 also slight shaming of elves, but also those women who 0:32:02.847 --> 0:32:05.887 were al seriousness of professional dancers they dance at the pageant. 0:32:06.647 --> 0:32:10.447 That seems harsh. Another it was like the girls dancing 0:32:10.487 --> 0:32:13.887 around bill Ny in love. Actually yeah, that scene, and 0:32:14.367 --> 0:32:16.727 some compared it to the pageants scene from Mean Girls. 0:32:16.887 --> 0:32:20.167 But the point is that some female employees and potentially 0:32:20.207 --> 0:32:23.007 some male ones were dumb struck and horrified at what 0:32:23.007 --> 0:32:28.047 they were sitting through and some walked out in disgust. Now, 0:32:28.367 --> 0:32:32.927 entertainers during media parties are pretty common. A Christmas party 0:32:33.007 --> 0:32:35.527 might have some dances. I've been at a media conference 0:32:35.567 --> 0:32:39.367 where there were like Brazilian dancers, which I'll be honest, 0:32:39.807 --> 0:32:41.927 was a bit weird. They were kind of wearing nothing 0:32:41.927 --> 0:32:44.247 and they were sort of shaking bits and it was 0:32:44.247 --> 0:32:47.207 a work event. It for a little bit strange. A 0:32:47.247 --> 0:32:51.807 seven spokesperson said that it was for the pageant, you know, 0:32:51.927 --> 0:32:54.607 so what's wrong with it? But others have said, you know, 0:32:54.687 --> 0:32:58.447 it's midday, it's a work day, and what's so sexy 0:32:58.447 --> 0:33:01.727 about Christmas? Some have said, Jesse, you offended. Would you 0:33:01.727 --> 0:33:03.247 have been offended? Would you have walked out? 0:33:03.727 --> 0:33:05.807 I probably wouldn't have walked out, but just because I 0:33:05.847 --> 0:33:09.927 don't like confrontation and I don't like kind of spotlight, 0:33:10.087 --> 0:33:13.327 but I totally support. When I saw that footage, I 0:33:13.327 --> 0:33:15.727 had a few thoughts all at once. I kind of went, oh, well, 0:33:15.727 --> 0:33:18.607 they were consensually dancing and it was to promote something. 0:33:18.607 --> 0:33:21.567 And then I went and watched the footage and I thought, oh, no, 0:33:21.687 --> 0:33:22.167 I get it. 0:33:22.287 --> 0:33:22.767 I get it. 0:33:23.047 --> 0:33:25.847 If I am a woman working for Channel seven in 0:33:25.887 --> 0:33:28.167 my business suit at the front and I could see 0:33:28.207 --> 0:33:32.007 the women in particular, and it is eleven fifteen, it 0:33:32.087 --> 0:33:34.687 is not even midday, and these women come out and 0:33:34.807 --> 0:33:39.527 dance in their sexy Santa outfits, the messaging about what 0:33:39.567 --> 0:33:43.207 we value about women is very confused, and also it 0:33:43.607 --> 0:33:46.647 encapsulates this paradox of the modern moment, where we're going, 0:33:46.927 --> 0:33:50.167 look our first female editor, Look the sexy Santas doing 0:33:50.167 --> 0:33:50.807 sexy dance. 0:33:51.127 --> 0:33:51.687 I think it. 0:33:51.647 --> 0:33:54.047 Makes you so mad to play Devil's advocate. Isn't it 0:33:54.167 --> 0:33:56.607 just the spectrum of options that are available for women? 0:33:57.447 --> 0:34:00.927 I don't think so, because it's meant to be a 0:34:00.967 --> 0:34:04.567 work event, and it also makes me feel as a woman. 0:34:04.687 --> 0:34:07.287 It can make me feel very visible and oggl dat 0:34:07.767 --> 0:34:10.087 if that's the job is We're meant to be looking 0:34:10.087 --> 0:34:12.927 at these women's bodies and these women dancing and everything. 0:34:13.567 --> 0:34:16.767 I don't think we can tell this story without just 0:34:16.927 --> 0:34:21.887 adding in the context of Channel seven and the last 0:34:21.927 --> 0:34:25.087 few months. Obviously there was an ABC four corners investigation 0:34:25.247 --> 0:34:29.927 done about claims of sexism and sexual assault, and there 0:34:29.967 --> 0:34:33.727 has also been the Bruce Laman claims about Channel seven 0:34:33.807 --> 0:34:37.967 paying for sex workers. So within that context this looks bad. 0:34:38.247 --> 0:34:40.007 Imagine the meeting where they. 0:34:39.967 --> 0:34:47.247 Decided, having worked in the media business, like several media businesses, 0:34:47.727 --> 0:34:51.447 just imagine where they were going. So we're getting everyone together, 0:34:51.847 --> 0:34:53.407 We're going to introduce everybody. 0:34:53.407 --> 0:34:54.407 It's going to be great. 0:34:54.767 --> 0:34:56.287 And then someone's like, you know, we always have the 0:34:56.367 --> 0:34:58.487 Christmas pageant dancers at that and there would have been 0:34:58.527 --> 0:35:00.447 a one woman in that meeting going like, I don't 0:35:00.447 --> 0:35:02.367 think that's a very good idea, and there's right. 0:35:02.887 --> 0:35:03.847 Fun and then the. 0:35:05.367 --> 0:35:08.567 Meeting probably one woman, the woman who is the new editor. 0:35:08.487 --> 0:35:11.767 And the man in the definitely said you can't even 0:35:11.887 --> 0:35:17.847 have women in sexy Sanna outfits dancing in August. 0:35:17.887 --> 0:35:20.527 Having organized those meetings and like, you know, we've got 0:35:20.567 --> 0:35:22.687 our all hands at me coming up tomorrow, and you're 0:35:22.687 --> 0:35:24.367 always like, okay, we've got to do this, and we've 0:35:24.367 --> 0:35:25.687 got to do that. How can we make it a 0:35:25.687 --> 0:35:28.207 bit more fun, How can we do something that's just 0:35:28.247 --> 0:35:28.767 to be fun. 0:35:28.887 --> 0:35:31.087 I know everyone loves Christmas. 0:35:30.567 --> 0:35:32.327 This is one of those meetings that should have been 0:35:32.327 --> 0:35:33.767 an email. They should have just sent. 0:35:33.607 --> 0:35:39.127 Out a phono Santa Me to all the women employees 0:35:39.207 --> 0:35:43.207 and just said new business uniform at seven Media. 0:35:43.607 --> 0:35:46.167 Anyway, because at first I was like, wow, would I 0:35:46.207 --> 0:35:48.527 have walked out? I probably would not have walked out. 0:35:49.047 --> 0:35:51.767 I actually read a lot of quotes from anonymous employees 0:35:51.767 --> 0:35:54.007 who they weren't outraged like they're being presented like they 0:35:54.007 --> 0:35:56.487 were outraged. They weren't outraged. They were just eye rolly, 0:35:56.607 --> 0:35:59.607 and they were saying. One anonymous woman said, it's the 0:35:59.647 --> 0:36:03.287 contrast four men talking about business, then four women come in, 0:36:03.407 --> 0:36:05.527 doled up and scantily clad. What is the role of 0:36:05.567 --> 0:36:10.287 women at this company? That's the right, That's the thing, 0:36:10.527 --> 0:36:14.967 because you know, I understand that you can I roll 0:36:15.007 --> 0:36:18.127 about the outrage here like, oh, calm down, everybody, it's 0:36:18.127 --> 0:36:18.927 a Christmas pageant. 0:36:18.927 --> 0:36:20.927 We always have sexy senters. 0:36:21.247 --> 0:36:22.527 They cheer everybody up. 0:36:22.847 --> 0:36:25.847 The news cycles very rough. We all you know what 0:36:26.687 --> 0:36:30.287 it's just immediately says this is what we think of women. 0:36:30.527 --> 0:36:33.007 I've been in a couple of those situations where it's 0:36:33.087 --> 0:36:37.127 been I've felt so offended is not the right word, 0:36:37.687 --> 0:36:40.807 but I think appalled is probably the right word. The 0:36:40.807 --> 0:36:43.727 one that I think about all the time is about 0:36:43.727 --> 0:36:47.047 eight years ago I was invited to be a keynote 0:36:47.047 --> 0:36:51.607 speaker at another institutional event. It's like a big lunch 0:36:51.727 --> 0:36:54.807 that they have up in Brisbane for like media agencies 0:36:54.807 --> 0:36:56.127 and advertising agencies. 0:36:56.727 --> 0:36:57.687 There would have been about. 0:36:57.487 --> 0:37:00.727 A thousand people there and the MC was like a 0:37:00.767 --> 0:37:03.047 guy from like a I want to say, like a 0:37:03.127 --> 0:37:05.007 radio station. He's quite well known. I can't remember what 0:37:05.047 --> 0:37:06.567 his name he's but everybody in the room knew who 0:37:06.687 --> 0:37:09.647 was and he was, you know, introducing all this because 0:37:09.687 --> 0:37:12.967 and the room was packed. It was probably equally male 0:37:13.007 --> 0:37:16.487 and female professionals. It was lunchtime on a weekday. And 0:37:16.527 --> 0:37:21.127 then he said, Okay, all the women in the room, 0:37:21.647 --> 0:37:24.607 I want it all stand up. And I just got 0:37:24.647 --> 0:37:27.087 that sense that something was up and I didn't stand up, 0:37:27.127 --> 0:37:27.887 but a lot of women did. 0:37:27.927 --> 0:37:29.327 Most women stood up because you. 0:37:29.247 --> 0:37:30.727 Don't want to be you know, you don't want to 0:37:30.767 --> 0:37:34.487 be that person. And then he goes, now, all the blokes, 0:37:34.527 --> 0:37:36.087 I just want you to lean back a bit and 0:37:36.207 --> 0:37:41.647 check out the lovely view of all. And I was 0:37:41.687 --> 0:37:43.847 sitting there, and again there was like a bit of 0:37:43.887 --> 0:37:47.207 a groan, but not like what you would think. This 0:37:47.247 --> 0:37:50.727 is probably just pre me too. I would like to 0:37:50.727 --> 0:37:53.887 think it wouldn't happen today. And I was sitting there, 0:37:54.367 --> 0:37:56.127 and I wanted to get up and walk out, but 0:37:56.167 --> 0:37:59.887 I thought, I'm being paid to be to give a 0:37:59.967 --> 0:38:03.607 keynote speech. If I walk out, I make this whole 0:38:03.647 --> 0:38:07.807 thing about me. It then becomes about me, and it 0:38:07.887 --> 0:38:11.887 also puts the mental load and the reputational load of 0:38:11.887 --> 0:38:13.527 that whole story becoming about me. 0:38:13.967 --> 0:38:17.167 I also can't I sat there. Yeah, I also can't 0:38:17.167 --> 0:38:19.407 make a decision in the moment. I overthink things. So 0:38:19.447 --> 0:38:22.527 I've been in exactly the same situation as in a 0:38:22.567 --> 0:38:25.247 work situation, where I've felt like something sexist has been 0:38:25.287 --> 0:38:28.007 said or an environment is making me uncomfortable, and the 0:38:28.007 --> 0:38:31.487 thought has crossed my mind. If I were a different person, maybe, 0:38:31.487 --> 0:38:34.207 if I were a braver person, I would stand up 0:38:34.247 --> 0:38:36.607 and leave, and I think that would say everything I 0:38:36.687 --> 0:38:38.847 need to say. But instead I have just sat there. 0:38:39.327 --> 0:38:41.527 And it's because I can't make up my mind. 0:38:41.287 --> 0:38:43.167 About what's the most Because. 0:38:42.927 --> 0:38:45.007 If I left, the cost would be on me. 0:38:45.207 --> 0:38:48.847 But also in that instance, when you just told that story, 0:38:48.887 --> 0:38:51.327 my immediate mind goes to, first of all, I'm like, no, 0:38:51.367 --> 0:38:53.687 wonder women are so fucking angry like that one my 0:38:53.727 --> 0:38:56.927 first thought. But my second thought was what's the plausible 0:38:56.967 --> 0:38:59.887 deniability of that guy? And you could go, well, maybe 0:38:59.967 --> 0:39:02.447 he could argue I wanted to make the point that 0:39:02.487 --> 0:39:05.207 we employ all these women, and isn't it lovely to 0:39:05.327 --> 0:39:08.607 see all these women there? Like yeah, you know immediately 0:39:09.047 --> 0:39:11.407 that the defense like if you'd have then stood up 0:39:11.447 --> 0:39:14.207 and made your speech and said, all the blokes stand up, 0:39:14.247 --> 0:39:16.767 and what a lot of dickheads they are in this room. No, 0:39:16.927 --> 0:39:19.287 it's like check out their packages. But if you'd have 0:39:19.327 --> 0:39:21.967 done that, then it would have been what an overreaction? 0:39:22.407 --> 0:39:24.767 Like I just meant, aren't these women great? 0:39:25.007 --> 0:39:25.127 No? 0:39:25.127 --> 0:39:26.567 No, he implicitly said. 0:39:26.647 --> 0:39:29.007 It wasn't like, look at all the beautiful women, It 0:39:29.247 --> 0:39:30.847 was look at their ass. 0:39:32.527 --> 0:39:34.847 I reckon that our resistance to walking out is that 0:39:34.887 --> 0:39:37.207 we don't want to be seen as like a buzzkill 0:39:37.327 --> 0:39:39.927 or someone who like, isn't fun. The way that it's 0:39:40.447 --> 0:39:43.447 it's framed, and in my situation too, is that we're 0:39:43.447 --> 0:39:44.407 all just having a bit of fun. 0:39:45.207 --> 0:39:47.607 That wasn't the mood. I mean, it was the mood 0:39:47.607 --> 0:39:51.007 from that guy. There was an understanding that that was shit, 0:39:51.687 --> 0:39:56.647 but it was also like, oh, that's just Jacko exactly, 0:39:56.967 --> 0:39:59.287 let's move on. So I didn't want to pull focus 0:39:59.327 --> 0:40:01.287 because I didn't want to then make it all about me. 0:40:01.327 --> 0:40:04.447 So instead I sat there and seethed and felt like 0:40:04.487 --> 0:40:07.007 I was selling out women, like I was selling out myself. 0:40:07.647 --> 0:40:09.247 And all the women who stood up felt the same 0:40:09.287 --> 0:40:09.607 way too. 0:40:09.687 --> 0:40:12.687 Oh, and they were utterly humiliated. Every woman who stood 0:40:12.727 --> 0:40:14.047 up felt amiliate. 0:40:14.167 --> 0:40:16.007 A lot of friends say, we have a group chat 0:40:16.047 --> 0:40:18.087 and we're talking about what we do in that situation. 0:40:18.127 --> 0:40:20.847 A lot of friends said, I am so delusionally tired 0:40:20.927 --> 0:40:23.567 right now that I can see myself bopping along tapping 0:40:23.647 --> 0:40:24.367 my thin being like. 0:40:24.407 --> 0:40:29.887 Oh, I like this is. 0:40:29.887 --> 0:40:35.127 That's just Jacko. Perfectly encapsulates what women have been trying 0:40:35.167 --> 0:40:37.567 to say with me too, and ever since everything is like, 0:40:37.767 --> 0:40:40.607 we are done with that's just Jacko, you know, I mean, 0:40:40.687 --> 0:40:42.967 it's outrageous. Just to give you a bit of an idea, though, 0:40:43.087 --> 0:40:46.407 this story and the screenshot in particular of the sexy 0:40:46.407 --> 0:40:48.887 Sidner has gone around the world, It's in the papers 0:40:48.887 --> 0:40:51.847 in America, the New York Post, It's all over the place. 0:40:51.847 --> 0:40:56.287 Everybody's like, what is going on in Australia, This is 0:40:56.327 --> 0:41:00.127 a business meeting, blah blah blahlah blah, and you're just great. 0:41:01.247 --> 0:41:03.847 The serious part of this is that you were talking 0:41:03.927 --> 0:41:06.647 about the people in the room when those conversations happen. 0:41:07.007 --> 0:41:10.167 This is why inclusion is so important, because because it 0:41:10.247 --> 0:41:12.327 might be women, it might be people of color, it 0:41:12.367 --> 0:41:16.047 might be people of different sexualities, different religions. If everybody 0:41:16.047 --> 0:41:19.567 in the room has the same lived experience and doesn't 0:41:19.567 --> 0:41:23.967 know what it feels like to feel uncomfortable offended, even 0:41:24.007 --> 0:41:26.687 if the intention was not to offend anyone, and I 0:41:26.727 --> 0:41:30.487 accept that it isn't. That's why you need different people 0:41:30.527 --> 0:41:33.007 in boardrooms, you need different people in newsrooms. You need 0:41:33.007 --> 0:41:36.447 different people in management who can be the decision makers 0:41:36.447 --> 0:41:40.247 who are saying, hey, jacko, you can't do that, or hey, 0:41:40.487 --> 0:41:43.927 let's not get those dances because this is why. And 0:41:43.967 --> 0:41:47.047 the guys around that table would probably go They'll either go, oh, 0:41:47.047 --> 0:41:50.967 come on, you can't even just ogle sexy sounds anymore. 0:41:50.887 --> 0:41:53.327 Or they'll be like, oh shit, I hadn't thought about it, 0:41:53.327 --> 0:41:55.447 but you. Also, it's not really enough to just have 0:41:55.487 --> 0:41:57.127 the person at the table. The culture has to be 0:41:57.167 --> 0:42:00.247 that you'll listen, because it's not really fair to put 0:42:00.247 --> 0:42:02.207 one woman in the room and say you tell us 0:42:02.207 --> 0:42:04.487 if you think things are problematic to a culture that's 0:42:04.487 --> 0:42:06.887 all just going to dismiss you. Like it has to 0:42:06.927 --> 0:42:09.367 be an open minded listening thing. 0:42:09.447 --> 0:42:10.207 It does, you know? 0:42:10.367 --> 0:42:12.807 I wanted to say about meetings. Elon Musk has a 0:42:12.807 --> 0:42:15.247 famous quote that he's given his He gives his staff 0:42:15.287 --> 0:42:17.327 permission to walk out of any meeting as soon as 0:42:17.367 --> 0:42:19.807 they realize they can no longer add value. And I 0:42:19.927 --> 0:42:22.007 just feel like if all the women. 0:42:22.487 --> 0:42:25.367 Had been able to stand up at that minute and 0:42:25.407 --> 0:42:27.967 walk down, it would have been perfect because you'd be like, clearly, 0:42:28.487 --> 0:42:30.167 we are not adding value to this room. 0:42:30.527 --> 0:42:33.007 I put on a sound to hat out louders. 0:42:33.247 --> 0:42:35.527 So many of you have had a lot to say 0:42:35.647 --> 0:42:39.167 about trigger warnings in the mummey out Louder's Facebook group, 0:42:39.287 --> 0:42:42.207 and our conversation hasn't stopped. It continue in the group chat, 0:42:42.247 --> 0:42:45.607 and there was new evidence that needed to be submitted. 0:42:46.087 --> 0:42:50.087 So what we did is we recorded yesterday's subscriber episode 0:42:50.247 --> 0:42:53.007 all about trigger warnings. Here is a sneak peak from 0:42:53.007 --> 0:42:53.927 that episode. 0:42:54.167 --> 0:42:57.807 Why are we treating adults like children. As adults, we 0:42:57.887 --> 0:42:59.847 are responsible to protect oursel. 0:43:01.007 --> 0:43:03.567 We have the same emotional capacity every single one of us, 0:43:03.567 --> 0:43:06.767 regardless of what we've experted. To listen, follow the link 0:43:06.807 --> 0:43:08.847 in our show notes and jump in the Facebook group 0:43:08.887 --> 0:43:09.647 and join chat. 0:43:10.087 --> 0:43:12.527 A massive thank you to all of you out louders 0:43:12.527 --> 0:43:15.087 for listening to us today and always, and of course 0:43:15.087 --> 0:43:17.087 to our fabulous team for putting it together. We're going 0:43:17.127 --> 0:43:18.647 to be back in your ears tomorrow. 0:43:18.847 --> 0:43:20.487 Bye bye bye. 0:43:21.367 --> 0:43:24.247 Shout out to any Mamma Mia subscribers listening. If you 0:43:24.407 --> 0:43:27.247 love the show and you want to support us, subscribing 0:43:27.287 --> 0:43:29.727 to Mamma Mia is the very best way to do it. 0:43:29.927 --> 0:43:31.767 There's a link in the episode description.