1 00:00:10,614 --> 00:00:15,254 Speaker 1: You're listening to a Muma Mea podcast. Mumma Mea acknowledges 2 00:00:15,334 --> 00:00:18,134 Speaker 1: the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast 3 00:00:18,214 --> 00:00:19,054 Speaker 1: is recorded on. 4 00:00:22,254 --> 00:00:25,454 Speaker 2: Hey, I'm table Strano. This is Mumma MIA's twice daily 5 00:00:25,494 --> 00:00:29,734 Speaker 2: news podcast, The Quickie. The conflict in Gaza has entered 6 00:00:29,774 --> 00:00:33,734 Speaker 2: a volatile new chapter with major implications for the region 7 00:00:34,014 --> 00:00:37,414 Speaker 2: and the world. Israeli leader Benjamin Etna, who has made 8 00:00:37,454 --> 00:00:41,334 Speaker 2: clear his intention for a full military occupation of the area. 9 00:00:42,094 --> 00:00:45,134 Speaker 2: So what would that actually look like? Before we get there, 10 00:00:45,214 --> 00:00:48,014 Speaker 2: He's Tarlie Blackman with the latest from the Quicki newsroom 11 00:00:48,094 --> 00:00:49,854 Speaker 2: for Wednesday, August six. 12 00:00:50,214 --> 00:00:53,934 Speaker 1: Thanks Taylor. James Blasakas, the youngest man convicted over South 13 00:00:53,974 --> 00:00:58,174 Speaker 1: Australia's infamous Snowtown murders, has been granted parole after twenty 14 00:00:58,214 --> 00:01:01,494 Speaker 1: six years behind bars. He was found guilty of four 15 00:01:01,534 --> 00:01:04,694 Speaker 1: of the eleven killings carried out between nineteen ninety two 16 00:01:04,894 --> 00:01:07,654 Speaker 1: and nineteen ninety nine, and was sentenced to life in 17 00:01:07,694 --> 00:01:11,494 Speaker 1: prison with the minimum term ofiring in August twenty twenty five. 18 00:01:11,814 --> 00:01:15,094 Speaker 1: At its monthly meeting on Tuesday, the South Australian Parole 19 00:01:15,134 --> 00:01:18,894 Speaker 1: Board approved his release, stating Blasarkus no longer poses a 20 00:01:18,974 --> 00:01:22,134 Speaker 1: risk to the community. He will first move to Adelaide's 21 00:01:22,134 --> 00:01:26,134 Speaker 1: pre release center for up to twelve months to undergo resocialization. 22 00:01:26,614 --> 00:01:29,254 Speaker 1: Blasarkus was nineteen at the time of the crimes and 23 00:01:29,374 --> 00:01:32,814 Speaker 1: later gave key evidence against co offenders John Bunting and 24 00:01:32,894 --> 00:01:36,694 Speaker 1: Robert Wagner, who were both serving life without parole. Victim's 25 00:01:36,734 --> 00:01:40,574 Speaker 1: advocates say the decision brings renewed pain, reminding the public 26 00:01:40,654 --> 00:01:43,974 Speaker 1: that for families of murder victims, the trauma continues long 27 00:01:44,014 --> 00:01:48,454 Speaker 1: after a sentence ends. Australia's e Safety Commissioner has accused 28 00:01:48,574 --> 00:01:52,214 Speaker 1: major tech firms, especially YouTube and Apple, of failing to 29 00:01:52,254 --> 00:01:55,854 Speaker 1: act on child sexual abuse material. In a report released 30 00:01:55,894 --> 00:01:59,534 Speaker 1: on Wednesday, Commissioner Julie Inman Grant said the company's are 31 00:01:59,534 --> 00:02:03,214 Speaker 1: turning a blind eye to online crimes against children. YouTube 32 00:02:03,254 --> 00:02:05,934 Speaker 1: and Apple were unable to disclose the number of user 33 00:02:06,014 --> 00:02:08,934 Speaker 1: reports they receive, all the time it took to respond, 34 00:02:09,134 --> 00:02:13,014 Speaker 1: and neither the company answered basic questions about their safety measures. 35 00:02:13,614 --> 00:02:16,734 Speaker 1: Last week, the federal government included YouTube in its under 36 00:02:16,734 --> 00:02:20,174 Speaker 1: sixteen social media ban, as the Commissioner ad buys, reversing 37 00:02:20,254 --> 00:02:24,774 Speaker 1: its exemption. The report found widespread safety gaps, including failure 38 00:02:24,814 --> 00:02:28,294 Speaker 1: to block abuse links, poor reporting tools, and limited use 39 00:02:28,334 --> 00:02:32,254 Speaker 1: of detection technology. While Google says it's using AI and 40 00:02:32,334 --> 00:02:35,694 Speaker 1: hash matching tools to remove content, the Commissioner says many 41 00:02:35,734 --> 00:02:40,854 Speaker 1: platforms had ignored repeated warnings to improve protections. Ukrainian President 42 00:02:40,934 --> 00:02:44,654 Speaker 1: Violonimi Zelensky has spoken with US President Donald Trump about 43 00:02:44,734 --> 00:02:48,054 Speaker 1: ways to end the war in Ukraine, tougher sanctions on Russia, 44 00:02:48,134 --> 00:02:51,534 Speaker 1: and a major drone deal between the two countries. Trump 45 00:02:51,534 --> 00:02:55,094 Speaker 1: has reportedly given Russian President Vladimir Putin a deadline of 46 00:02:55,174 --> 00:02:58,694 Speaker 1: Friday to agree to peace or face new sanctions, including 47 00:02:58,694 --> 00:03:01,934 Speaker 1: one hundred percent tariffs on countries that buy Russian oil. 48 00:03:02,414 --> 00:03:05,454 Speaker 1: Zelensky said Trump is aware of ongoing Russian strikes in 49 00:03:05,534 --> 00:03:09,094 Speaker 1: Kiev and other cities. Sources close to the Kremlin say 50 00:03:09,134 --> 00:03:12,254 Speaker 1: Pudin is unlikely to back down, still aiming to take 51 00:03:12,294 --> 00:03:16,174 Speaker 1: full control of four Ukrainian regions before entering peace talks. 52 00:03:16,654 --> 00:03:20,334 Speaker 1: Zelenski also confirmed progress on a US drone deal worth 53 00:03:20,334 --> 00:03:24,014 Speaker 1: around forty six billion dollars, highlighting the growing role of 54 00:03:24,054 --> 00:03:28,214 Speaker 1: defense commerce in the conflict. European allies have pledged more 55 00:03:28,254 --> 00:03:31,854 Speaker 1: than one point five billion dollars in extra support with Denmark, 56 00:03:31,934 --> 00:03:36,494 Speaker 1: saying the funds will be available immediately. Hollywood stars Jamie 57 00:03:36,574 --> 00:03:39,654 Speaker 1: Lee Curtis and Lindsay Lohan have reunited on the red 58 00:03:39,654 --> 00:03:43,814 Speaker 1: carpet in Sydney for the Australian premiere of Disney's Freakier Friday. 59 00:03:44,214 --> 00:03:46,854 Speaker 1: It's been more than twenty years since the original Freaky 60 00:03:46,894 --> 00:03:49,934 Speaker 1: Friday became a global hit, and now the iconic mother 61 00:03:50,094 --> 00:03:53,934 Speaker 1: daughter duo Tess and Anna Coleman are back. In the sequel. 62 00:03:53,974 --> 00:03:57,054 Speaker 1: Anna is now a mum herself, juggling a blended family 63 00:03:57,094 --> 00:04:01,014 Speaker 1: when things once again take a seriously freaky turn. At 64 00:04:01,014 --> 00:04:04,814 Speaker 1: the Sydney premiere in Bondai Junction, both stars shared heartfelt 65 00:04:04,814 --> 00:04:08,854 Speaker 1: reflections on their long friendship. Jamie Lee Curtis became emotional 66 00:04:08,934 --> 00:04:12,054 Speaker 1: recalling that Lindsay Lohan was just fifteen when they filmed 67 00:04:12,054 --> 00:04:14,614 Speaker 1: the original, saying I was a mother to her then 68 00:04:14,774 --> 00:04:17,654 Speaker 1: and now I'm a mother to her again. Freaky of 69 00:04:17,694 --> 00:04:21,294 Speaker 1: Friday marks Lohan's major return to Hollywood after years away. 70 00:04:21,614 --> 00:04:24,054 Speaker 1: The stars have toured the world promoting the film, where 71 00:04:24,054 --> 00:04:26,854 Speaker 1: it's Australian cinema release set for this Thursday. 72 00:04:27,414 --> 00:04:38,334 Speaker 2: Thanks Charlie. Next an update on what's happening in Gaza. 73 00:04:39,374 --> 00:04:42,494 Speaker 2: It was a weekend of extraordinary scenes in Sydney as 74 00:04:42,574 --> 00:04:44,934 Speaker 2: the city was brought to a standstill by one of 75 00:04:44,934 --> 00:04:49,734 Speaker 2: the largest pro Palestinian rallies in recent memory. The organizers 76 00:04:49,734 --> 00:04:52,414 Speaker 2: of the march, the Palestinian Action Group, say up to 77 00:04:52,534 --> 00:04:56,814 Speaker 2: three hundred thousand people marched across the CBD and Tubor Bridge, 78 00:04:57,094 --> 00:05:00,174 Speaker 2: while the police put attendants at closer to ninety thousand, 79 00:05:00,574 --> 00:05:03,214 Speaker 2: but everyone agrees it was one of, if not the 80 00:05:03,334 --> 00:05:07,854 Speaker 2: largest turnouts of a public demonstration in Australia's history. Now, 81 00:05:08,014 --> 00:05:11,214 Speaker 2: this outpouring came as the world media reported last week 82 00:05:11,294 --> 00:05:14,094 Speaker 2: of a rising death toll in Gaza due to starvation 83 00:05:14,294 --> 00:05:17,734 Speaker 2: and attacks on Palestinians trying to access the little aid 84 00:05:17,934 --> 00:05:21,734 Speaker 2: being allowed into the area. Meanwhile, last week Kamas and 85 00:05:21,894 --> 00:05:26,014 Speaker 2: Islamic Jihad that's an ally of the terrorist organization, released 86 00:05:26,014 --> 00:05:29,454 Speaker 2: footage and images of hostages in Gaza, showing two men 87 00:05:29,534 --> 00:05:34,174 Speaker 2: who appeared weak and emaciated. Back on October seven, twenty 88 00:05:34,254 --> 00:05:37,614 Speaker 2: twenty three, when Hamas launched an attack on Israel, two 89 00:05:37,654 --> 00:05:41,214 Speaker 2: hundred and fifty one hostages were taken. While the numbers 90 00:05:41,254 --> 00:05:44,454 Speaker 2: are hard to pinpoint exactly right now, there's about forty 91 00:05:44,534 --> 00:05:48,694 Speaker 2: nine still being held in Palestinian territory. Twenty seven of 92 00:05:48,734 --> 00:05:54,094 Speaker 2: those hostages, the Israeli military says are dead. Yesterday, there 93 00:05:54,134 --> 00:05:57,374 Speaker 2: was another major development in the region. Israeli Prime Minister 94 00:05:57,454 --> 00:06:01,054 Speaker 2: Benyumin Ntnyahu has reportedly ordered the military to move ahead 95 00:06:01,094 --> 00:06:04,534 Speaker 2: with a full occupation of the Gaza Strip, a decision 96 00:06:04,574 --> 00:06:09,014 Speaker 2: that pushes the conflict into uncertain territory. A memo sent 97 00:06:09,054 --> 00:06:11,974 Speaker 2: to cabinet members suggest that Netnya, who made the call 98 00:06:12,094 --> 00:06:14,854 Speaker 2: on his own and told military leadership to either get 99 00:06:14,894 --> 00:06:19,094 Speaker 2: on board or step aside. One senior official close to 100 00:06:19,134 --> 00:06:21,854 Speaker 2: the Prime minister was quoted in Israeli media as saying, 101 00:06:21,894 --> 00:06:25,374 Speaker 2: the die is caste. We are going full occupation of 102 00:06:25,454 --> 00:06:29,614 Speaker 2: the Gaza Strip, despite pushback from within the israel Defense 103 00:06:29,654 --> 00:06:33,334 Speaker 2: Forces and former military leaders. Netna who reportedly plans to 104 00:06:33,374 --> 00:06:37,814 Speaker 2: seek formal backing from his cabinet. As images of these 105 00:06:37,814 --> 00:06:40,294 Speaker 2: developments circled the globe, calls for a restraint and de 106 00:06:40,494 --> 00:06:44,814 Speaker 2: escalation grow louder. Leaders from the UN, European Union, and 107 00:06:44,974 --> 00:06:48,494 Speaker 2: human rights organizations warned that a full occupation could make 108 00:06:48,534 --> 00:06:54,014 Speaker 2: things even more dangerous for both Palestinians and hostages inside Gaza. 109 00:06:54,094 --> 00:06:57,414 Speaker 2: Back here, at Home. Prime Minister Anthony Albanesi has called 110 00:06:57,414 --> 00:07:00,054 Speaker 2: for a ceasefire and says he's been trying to speak 111 00:07:00,094 --> 00:07:03,414 Speaker 2: directly with Netna who to push for civilian protection and 112 00:07:03,494 --> 00:07:06,894 Speaker 2: aid access. He's also been in touch with the leader 113 00:07:06,894 --> 00:07:10,534 Speaker 2: of the Palestinian Authority, Mahmoudabas as part of those reports, 114 00:07:10,854 --> 00:07:14,094 Speaker 2: once again reiterating Australia's commitment to a two state solution 115 00:07:14,254 --> 00:07:18,454 Speaker 2: between Israel and Palestine. Australia has also pledged an additional 116 00:07:18,534 --> 00:07:23,494 Speaker 2: twenty million dollars in humanitarian aid to Gaza. Now, diplomatic 117 00:07:23,534 --> 00:07:26,614 Speaker 2: efforts do continue, but with the Israeli military ordered to 118 00:07:26,654 --> 00:07:29,534 Speaker 2: seize all areas of Gaza, the world is watching for 119 00:07:29,694 --> 00:07:32,894 Speaker 2: what happens next. To help us unpack the fallout from 120 00:07:32,894 --> 00:07:35,254 Speaker 2: this decision and what that could mean for the future 121 00:07:35,254 --> 00:07:38,214 Speaker 2: of the region, we're joined by senior lecturer in International 122 00:07:38,214 --> 00:07:42,774 Speaker 2: Relations at Flinders University, doctor Jessica Genawer. Jess So Benjamin 123 00:07:42,774 --> 00:07:47,014 Speaker 2: Netna who has ordered a full military occupation of Gaza, 124 00:07:47,094 --> 00:07:48,934 Speaker 2: what does that actually mean? What would it look like? 125 00:07:49,974 --> 00:07:54,454 Speaker 3: So this means that essentially Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netnya 126 00:07:54,574 --> 00:07:58,534 Speaker 3: who is making official which is that the Israeli government 127 00:07:58,974 --> 00:08:02,814 Speaker 3: is not planning a full military withdrawal from the Gaza Strip, 128 00:08:02,894 --> 00:08:05,734 Speaker 3: and that in fact the end point here for the 129 00:08:05,814 --> 00:08:09,534 Speaker 3: Israeli government some kind of military presence in the Gaza strips. 130 00:08:10,014 --> 00:08:12,894 Speaker 3: So it remains to be seen exactly what that looks like. 131 00:08:12,974 --> 00:08:16,294 Speaker 3: It could be to the full extent as Bnniminetna, who 132 00:08:16,334 --> 00:08:20,454 Speaker 3: was suggesting of full military control by Israel over the 133 00:08:20,614 --> 00:08:23,574 Speaker 3: entire Gaza Strip, or it might look more like a 134 00:08:23,894 --> 00:08:28,094 Speaker 3: buffer zone that's under military control from Israel. But it 135 00:08:28,174 --> 00:08:31,654 Speaker 3: does seem that the Israeli government has no intention of 136 00:08:31,694 --> 00:08:34,134 Speaker 3: a full military withdrawal from Gaza. 137 00:08:34,814 --> 00:08:38,014 Speaker 2: So we spoke about this previously, this idea of well 138 00:08:38,054 --> 00:08:41,174 Speaker 2: what is the end goal for Israel and for Benumintnya 139 00:08:41,214 --> 00:08:43,774 Speaker 2: who And at that point, jess You had said that 140 00:08:43,854 --> 00:08:46,774 Speaker 2: maybe they didn't even know what the point in this 141 00:08:46,894 --> 00:08:49,614 Speaker 2: conflict was and what they were continuing to do. Does 142 00:08:49,654 --> 00:08:51,814 Speaker 2: this feel like maybe there's more of a firmed up 143 00:08:51,854 --> 00:08:54,134 Speaker 2: idea of what the end goal is now? 144 00:08:55,454 --> 00:08:59,254 Speaker 3: I would say yes and no, because even something like 145 00:08:59,654 --> 00:09:03,694 Speaker 3: a military occupation of the Gaza Strip is not really 146 00:09:04,614 --> 00:09:08,814 Speaker 3: any sort of clear political end goal for Israel. So 147 00:09:09,294 --> 00:09:13,734 Speaker 3: there was this objective of eliminating Hamas as any kind 148 00:09:13,774 --> 00:09:18,374 Speaker 3: of governance or fighting force. But that's actually quite an 149 00:09:18,454 --> 00:09:21,654 Speaker 3: elusive goal that would be almost impossible to achieve because 150 00:09:21,654 --> 00:09:24,414 Speaker 3: when would you stop and say, yes, that objective has 151 00:09:24,494 --> 00:09:27,134 Speaker 3: been achieved. So at this point in time, her Maas 152 00:09:27,134 --> 00:09:32,574 Speaker 3: has certainly been severely degraded. Most of the Hamas level 153 00:09:32,574 --> 00:09:38,294 Speaker 3: of leadership that were in control when October seven happened 154 00:09:38,414 --> 00:09:43,254 Speaker 3: have essentially been assassinated since then, So you could say, yes, 155 00:09:43,414 --> 00:09:46,494 Speaker 3: a fair amount of that objective has already been achieved, 156 00:09:46,854 --> 00:09:48,974 Speaker 3: but you're never going to be able to say every 157 00:09:49,014 --> 00:09:52,134 Speaker 3: single person who ever took up arms for Hamas has 158 00:09:52,174 --> 00:09:54,974 Speaker 3: been completely eliminated. And then if we look at a 159 00:09:55,014 --> 00:10:01,174 Speaker 3: broader political objective, reoccupying the gars of Strip from Israel's perspective, 160 00:10:01,414 --> 00:10:06,574 Speaker 3: really just perpetuates an ongoing and intractable complex that's been 161 00:10:06,574 --> 00:10:10,614 Speaker 3: going on for many decades prior to those October seven 162 00:10:10,734 --> 00:10:13,694 Speaker 3: attacks from Hamas and then Israel's response to those attacks 163 00:10:13,694 --> 00:10:16,134 Speaker 3: with the military operation in the Gaza Strip, So it 164 00:10:16,214 --> 00:10:20,894 Speaker 3: still doesn't seem like there's any game plan or broader 165 00:10:20,934 --> 00:10:27,614 Speaker 3: strategy beyond military engagement. So ongoing military operations that are 166 00:10:27,614 --> 00:10:30,934 Speaker 3: going to lead to the kind of humanitarian situation that 167 00:10:30,934 --> 00:10:33,774 Speaker 3: we're seeing right now in the Gaza Strip and aren't 168 00:10:33,854 --> 00:10:38,174 Speaker 3: really resolving the conflict at any kind of more substantial level. 169 00:10:39,094 --> 00:10:41,694 Speaker 2: So this is a conflict, as we know, between Israel 170 00:10:41,774 --> 00:10:45,334 Speaker 2: and Hamas, the terrorist organization. But of course people living 171 00:10:45,454 --> 00:10:48,894 Speaker 2: in that area, that place that is constantly under fire 172 00:10:48,974 --> 00:10:52,974 Speaker 2: are Palestinians who don't necessarily have absolutely anything to do 173 00:10:53,014 --> 00:10:55,974 Speaker 2: with Hamas. What would it mean for them, the Palestinians 174 00:10:56,014 --> 00:11:00,494 Speaker 2: currently living in Gaza if a full military occupation were 175 00:11:00,494 --> 00:11:01,174 Speaker 2: to take place. 176 00:11:01,574 --> 00:11:05,814 Speaker 3: So none of this is good news for Palestinians living 177 00:11:05,814 --> 00:11:09,534 Speaker 3: in the Gaza Strip. People living in Gaza, the main 178 00:11:09,694 --> 00:11:15,654 Speaker 3: concern right now is getting food, getting water, getting military supplied, 179 00:11:15,694 --> 00:11:18,174 Speaker 3: So that's going to be the key focus of people 180 00:11:18,254 --> 00:11:20,774 Speaker 3: currently living in the Gaza Strip. This isn't going to 181 00:11:20,774 --> 00:11:25,174 Speaker 3: be helped by Israeli military presence in the Gaza Strip. 182 00:11:25,774 --> 00:11:28,134 Speaker 3: One of the things about the whole conflict that makes 183 00:11:28,174 --> 00:11:31,854 Speaker 3: it so complex and the situation so dire for people 184 00:11:31,894 --> 00:11:34,934 Speaker 3: in the Gaza Strip is that there's no free passage 185 00:11:35,094 --> 00:11:37,574 Speaker 3: in and out of Gaza for people who live there, 186 00:11:38,134 --> 00:11:41,934 Speaker 3: So really people within the strip are dependent on that 187 00:11:42,014 --> 00:11:46,454 Speaker 3: aid getting in and those borders are controlled partly by Israel, 188 00:11:46,614 --> 00:11:53,454 Speaker 3: partly by Egypt, but essentially Israel consolidating their military presence 189 00:11:53,934 --> 00:11:57,814 Speaker 3: is not going to alleviate that humanitarian crisis. 190 00:11:58,414 --> 00:12:01,934 Speaker 2: What led Benjamin naw Who to make this call? Do 191 00:12:01,974 --> 00:12:04,334 Speaker 2: you think, because it is quite an escalation, do you 192 00:12:04,374 --> 00:12:07,494 Speaker 2: think maybe the hostage photos and videos that were released 193 00:12:07,614 --> 00:12:10,374 Speaker 2: last week by Hamas and Islamic g Hard had anything 194 00:12:10,414 --> 00:12:10,974 Speaker 2: to do with this? 195 00:12:11,494 --> 00:12:14,854 Speaker 3: Well, that's right. I think that Binnim and Netna, who 196 00:12:15,134 --> 00:12:20,574 Speaker 3: is primarily motivated by domestic concerns and by his domestic populations, 197 00:12:21,054 --> 00:12:23,614 Speaker 3: So he has, on the one hand, people within his 198 00:12:23,654 --> 00:12:27,014 Speaker 3: own government who sit even further to the rights and 199 00:12:27,134 --> 00:12:31,894 Speaker 3: more hyper nationalists than even he is himself, and those 200 00:12:31,934 --> 00:12:35,854 Speaker 3: people would certainly be in favor of Israel maintaining a 201 00:12:35,934 --> 00:12:38,894 Speaker 3: military presence in Gaza. But then he also has the 202 00:12:38,934 --> 00:12:42,974 Speaker 3: broader Israeli population who, whilst they might not be happy 203 00:12:43,094 --> 00:12:47,414 Speaker 3: about the ongoing Israeli military operation in Gaza, are very 204 00:12:47,454 --> 00:12:51,174 Speaker 3: concerned about those Israeli hostages and Israeli hostages that are 205 00:12:51,254 --> 00:12:53,294 Speaker 3: known to still be alive. And we have the release 206 00:12:53,334 --> 00:12:56,814 Speaker 3: of videos of a couple of hostages just recently. For 207 00:12:56,934 --> 00:13:00,414 Speaker 3: Viniman Netna, who he thinking about his own political survival, 208 00:13:00,934 --> 00:13:03,574 Speaker 3: and he sort of knows that if he uses the 209 00:13:03,614 --> 00:13:09,534 Speaker 3: playbook of security, if he reinforces the narrative around Israel 210 00:13:09,854 --> 00:13:14,134 Speaker 3: being under attack and Israel's defense, that that is more 211 00:13:14,294 --> 00:13:18,214 Speaker 3: likely to consolidate his power domestically, which is partly why 212 00:13:18,214 --> 00:13:21,894 Speaker 3: I think he just keeps going down the road of 213 00:13:22,214 --> 00:13:27,974 Speaker 3: a military approach to the conflict between Israelis and Palestinians 214 00:13:28,054 --> 00:13:32,294 Speaker 3: and really not looking at any kind of political pathway. 215 00:13:33,014 --> 00:13:35,614 Speaker 2: How has this move been received then, both, I guess 216 00:13:35,654 --> 00:13:39,934 Speaker 2: internally within Israel and also on the world stage, So I. 217 00:13:39,894 --> 00:13:43,014 Speaker 3: Think that those are two quite separate things. I think 218 00:13:43,054 --> 00:13:47,654 Speaker 3: that within Israel, whilst there is a large proportion of 219 00:13:47,694 --> 00:13:52,614 Speaker 3: the population who are not in favor of Binyaminetnyahu himself, 220 00:13:53,254 --> 00:13:56,974 Speaker 3: probably a majority of the population thinks first and foremost 221 00:13:57,014 --> 00:14:02,174 Speaker 3: about Israel's security and defense as a primary objective. So 222 00:14:02,294 --> 00:14:06,734 Speaker 3: there's probably less resistance to the idea of some kind 223 00:14:06,774 --> 00:14:11,894 Speaker 3: of ongoing military presence for the Israeli defense force in Gaza, 224 00:14:12,294 --> 00:14:14,694 Speaker 3: less resistance to that idea within Israel than there would 225 00:14:14,734 --> 00:14:19,974 Speaker 3: be internationally. So internationally, the key concern right now is 226 00:14:20,054 --> 00:14:23,614 Speaker 3: the humanitarian crisis in Gaza and getting that humanitarian belief 227 00:14:23,894 --> 00:14:27,294 Speaker 3: into the Gaza strip. That's the thing that is uppermost 228 00:14:27,374 --> 00:14:30,214 Speaker 3: in the minds of most countries around the world, and 229 00:14:30,294 --> 00:14:32,454 Speaker 3: even to the extent that we've seen President Trump in 230 00:14:32,494 --> 00:14:35,494 Speaker 3: the US saying that he's also not happy about the 231 00:14:35,534 --> 00:14:39,614 Speaker 3: ongoing humanitarian crisis. So in that regard, the response to 232 00:14:39,654 --> 00:14:42,174 Speaker 3: this kind of statement from Prime Minister biniam and Netnia, 233 00:14:42,214 --> 00:14:45,454 Speaker 3: who would not be one of support, It would be 234 00:14:45,454 --> 00:14:48,654 Speaker 3: one of thinking, well, how is that actually going to 235 00:14:48,894 --> 00:14:53,014 Speaker 3: alleviate the humanitarian situation and is it going to help 236 00:14:53,054 --> 00:14:54,894 Speaker 3: it all with those conditions on the ground. 237 00:14:55,494 --> 00:14:58,614 Speaker 2: We know that the Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanizi has 238 00:14:58,654 --> 00:15:00,934 Speaker 2: secured a phone call with the Palace did in authority. 239 00:15:00,974 --> 00:15:03,654 Speaker 2: He used that call to call for more aid and 240 00:15:03,734 --> 00:15:07,374 Speaker 2: also doubling down on our commitment to a two state solution. 241 00:15:07,934 --> 00:15:09,574 Speaker 2: We also know that Albo has been trying to a 242 00:15:10,134 --> 00:15:13,054 Speaker 2: phone call with Benjamin Etnahu. What do you think the 243 00:15:13,134 --> 00:15:14,934 Speaker 2: nature of that call would be. What would he be 244 00:15:14,974 --> 00:15:16,894 Speaker 2: saying to him if he was able to get through. 245 00:15:17,774 --> 00:15:23,374 Speaker 3: Our Prime minister would be trying to emphasize the importance 246 00:15:23,734 --> 00:15:27,654 Speaker 3: of addressing the humanitarian crisis. I think he would certainly 247 00:15:27,694 --> 00:15:30,814 Speaker 3: support for example, Israel's right to exist, in Israel's right 248 00:15:30,854 --> 00:15:34,774 Speaker 3: to defend itself, but at the same time he would 249 00:15:34,814 --> 00:15:38,694 Speaker 3: want to bring up the fact that there is real 250 00:15:39,094 --> 00:15:42,294 Speaker 3: humanitarian issues on the ground in Gaza and that they 251 00:15:42,334 --> 00:15:46,414 Speaker 3: need to be dealt with. Unfortunately, I don't think that 252 00:15:46,774 --> 00:15:51,094 Speaker 3: Australia is front of mind for the Israeli government. I 253 00:15:51,094 --> 00:15:53,854 Speaker 3: don't think that necessarily we would have a lot of 254 00:15:53,934 --> 00:15:59,974 Speaker 3: leverage or a lot of sway over Israeli government's decision making. However, 255 00:16:00,454 --> 00:16:03,374 Speaker 3: I imagine that those would be the points that Prime 256 00:16:03,374 --> 00:16:05,574 Speaker 3: Minister Albanezi would want to emphasize. 257 00:16:05,814 --> 00:16:08,374 Speaker 2: I want to talk just quickly, Jess about a little 258 00:16:08,374 --> 00:16:10,374 Speaker 2: bit close at a home here in Australia. We saw 259 00:16:10,374 --> 00:16:13,934 Speaker 2: obviously at the weekend that very very large protest that 260 00:16:13,974 --> 00:16:16,854 Speaker 2: happened across Sydney and the Sydney Harbor Bridge and other 261 00:16:16,894 --> 00:16:20,134 Speaker 2: parts of Australia as well. We know that the Prime 262 00:16:20,134 --> 00:16:22,854 Speaker 2: Minister has put forward that call again or a two 263 00:16:22,934 --> 00:16:26,934 Speaker 2: state solution for a ceasefire and more aid in Gaza. Previously, 264 00:16:27,094 --> 00:16:29,854 Speaker 2: the Liberal leader Susan Lee had avoided saying there was 265 00:16:29,894 --> 00:16:32,974 Speaker 2: starvation in Gaza. She dodged questions on it there's now 266 00:16:33,214 --> 00:16:36,894 Speaker 2: mixed messaging from within the Liberals and Nationals in terms 267 00:16:36,894 --> 00:16:39,214 Speaker 2: of the rest of Federal Parliament. Where did they sit 268 00:16:39,254 --> 00:16:42,174 Speaker 2: because I feel like Labor it's been pretty clear where 269 00:16:42,174 --> 00:16:44,934 Speaker 2: they are coming from when it comes to this conflict. 270 00:16:45,054 --> 00:16:46,654 Speaker 2: But what about the other parties? 271 00:16:47,454 --> 00:16:51,254 Speaker 3: So the Liberals and the Nationals are generally going to 272 00:16:51,294 --> 00:16:56,694 Speaker 3: be supportive of Israel as a nation state, and they're 273 00:16:56,734 --> 00:17:01,774 Speaker 3: going to want to differentiate themselves from the Labor Party. 274 00:17:01,814 --> 00:17:05,294 Speaker 3: And actually, in this case, the Australian Labor Party has 275 00:17:05,374 --> 00:17:08,934 Speaker 3: taken a relatively centrist dance. So I think it's been 276 00:17:09,014 --> 00:17:15,054 Speaker 3: tricky for the coalition to distinguish themselves from Labor in 277 00:17:15,134 --> 00:17:19,774 Speaker 3: this instance. Given what we're seeing regarding the humanitarian crisis 278 00:17:19,774 --> 00:17:22,334 Speaker 3: and the kind of pictures that are coming out, I 279 00:17:22,414 --> 00:17:26,614 Speaker 3: think that this really goes across the political spectrum in Australia, 280 00:17:26,694 --> 00:17:31,054 Speaker 3: that populations are distressed to see the kind of conditions 281 00:17:31,094 --> 00:17:33,534 Speaker 3: on the ground in Gaza, and so I think that 282 00:17:33,574 --> 00:17:36,054 Speaker 3: the Liberals and the Nationals are aware, and I think 283 00:17:36,094 --> 00:17:40,174 Speaker 3: that's what led to Suzanlai's comments that they do need 284 00:17:40,214 --> 00:17:45,774 Speaker 3: to respond and condemn any kind of severe humanitarian crisis 285 00:17:45,774 --> 00:17:49,814 Speaker 3: that is becoming increasingly broadcast around the world. 286 00:17:50,774 --> 00:17:55,294 Speaker 2: Just finally, on the protest front, jess Police say that 287 00:17:55,534 --> 00:17:58,574 Speaker 2: they put figures at about ninety thousand people who attended 288 00:17:58,574 --> 00:18:01,894 Speaker 2: that Sydney rally at the weekend. Organizers say it was 289 00:18:01,934 --> 00:18:04,814 Speaker 2: closer to three hundred thousand, and an expert on crawd 290 00:18:04,854 --> 00:18:07,454 Speaker 2: management told The Guardian he also thought that it was 291 00:18:07,574 --> 00:18:11,054 Speaker 2: significantly higher than what the police estimated. Do you think 292 00:18:11,054 --> 00:18:14,254 Speaker 2: that's intentional that they're downplaying the number or is it 293 00:18:14,414 --> 00:18:16,254 Speaker 2: just that's how police clocked it up. 294 00:18:16,614 --> 00:18:20,494 Speaker 3: I mean, it is hard to estimate a crowd of 295 00:18:20,534 --> 00:18:26,414 Speaker 3: that size, and I think that crowd numbers do end 296 00:18:26,494 --> 00:18:30,854 Speaker 3: up inevitably becoming a political issue because it says something 297 00:18:31,094 --> 00:18:35,174 Speaker 3: about the sentiment in the broader Australian population. We know 298 00:18:35,254 --> 00:18:38,854 Speaker 3: that typically for every one person who actually goes out 299 00:18:38,894 --> 00:18:41,214 Speaker 3: and joins the protest, there'll be another ten or twenty 300 00:18:41,294 --> 00:18:44,814 Speaker 3: sitting at home who share similar sentiments but are actually 301 00:18:44,814 --> 00:18:47,094 Speaker 3: going to go out and protest. So as soon as 302 00:18:47,134 --> 00:18:50,454 Speaker 3: you see very large crowds, you're starting to think about, well, 303 00:18:50,574 --> 00:18:53,614 Speaker 3: what does this mean about the spread of public opinion 304 00:18:53,694 --> 00:18:57,654 Speaker 3: across the Australian society more broadly, so, yes, I think 305 00:18:57,654 --> 00:19:00,334 Speaker 3: there is a political aspect to it, But on the 306 00:19:00,334 --> 00:19:03,574 Speaker 3: other hand, I don't think that the exact number is 307 00:19:03,614 --> 00:19:07,254 Speaker 3: necessarily critical, in that it's obvious that there were tens 308 00:19:07,254 --> 00:19:10,934 Speaker 3: of thousands of people who were involved in the protest 309 00:19:11,454 --> 00:19:15,934 Speaker 3: over the weekend, and it's clear that that does represent 310 00:19:16,094 --> 00:19:19,294 Speaker 3: a shift in broader sentiment in Australian society, which I 311 00:19:19,334 --> 00:19:23,334 Speaker 3: think currently is starting to go across both sides of 312 00:19:23,334 --> 00:19:25,974 Speaker 3: the political spectrum. And I think that it's when it 313 00:19:26,014 --> 00:19:30,494 Speaker 3: becomes clear that public opinion has shifted towards a clear 314 00:19:30,974 --> 00:19:36,054 Speaker 3: majority opinion across the population that political actors really do 315 00:19:36,174 --> 00:19:40,214 Speaker 3: start to change their foreign policy stance as a result. 316 00:19:41,374 --> 00:19:43,574 Speaker 2: Thanks for taking some time to feed your mind with 317 00:19:43,654 --> 00:19:46,374 Speaker 2: us today. The quickie is produced by me Taylor Strano 318 00:19:46,534 --> 00:19:49,694 Speaker 2: and Charlie Blackman, with audio production by Lou Hill.