WEBVTT - I Am Woman, Hear Me Giving No Shits

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<v Speaker 1>You're listening to a Mamma Mia podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Mamma Mere acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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<v Speaker 2>that this podcast is recorded on. Well, shit, here we are, hey,

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<v Speaker 2>and how many of us are exactly where we thought

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<v Speaker 2>we'd be at the midway mark. Those lists we made,

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<v Speaker 2>the ones of the things we wanted. By twenty thirty forty,

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<v Speaker 2>we don't even know them because we're here in the

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<v Speaker 2>middle of our lives, with more, with less, with everything different.

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<v Speaker 2>When I was twenty, I wanted to live in New

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<v Speaker 2>York City. I imagined a life of shoulder pads and

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<v Speaker 2>magazine meetings in gleaming skyscrapers, of rightily brown stones with stoops,

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<v Speaker 2>cocktail parties and dive bars. Do you know where I live?

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<v Speaker 2>I live in a tiny town by the sea on

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<v Speaker 2>the opposite side of the world. It has one pub

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<v Speaker 2>and a bowling club, a butcher, a baker, and something

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<v Speaker 2>called a bottle o that twenty year old me would

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<v Speaker 2>have happily frequented despite not knowing what the hell was.

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<v Speaker 2>Would my twenty year old self be disappointed, Well, she'd

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<v Speaker 2>be confused because she thought she knew who we were

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<v Speaker 2>and that we panicked when the pavement ran out.

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<v Speaker 1>We didn't drive.

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<v Speaker 2>We like the energy of crowds and endless choice and

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<v Speaker 2>people everywhere. And she was right, But we changed. We're

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<v Speaker 2>allowed to do that, my mid friends. Change our minds,

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<v Speaker 2>our opinions, our lives, make a choice, fuck it up,

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<v Speaker 2>make another one, take a turn, go oh wrong way,

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<v Speaker 2>go back, make another one. Find ourselves somewhere we don't

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<v Speaker 2>want to be, find ourselves doing things we don't want

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<v Speaker 2>to do, Find ourselves with someone we really shouldn't be with.

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<v Speaker 2>Surprise ourselves with the strength we have inside us. To

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<v Speaker 2>pull ourselves out of relationships that don't fit us, jobs

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<v Speaker 2>that don't value us, friendships that only take make mistakes

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<v Speaker 2>and apologize for them, Learn something we didn't know, Try

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<v Speaker 2>something we've never tried. Return to a passion we'd talked

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<v Speaker 2>ourselves out of. Leave something behind that's making us sick.

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<v Speaker 3>We're allowed to.

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<v Speaker 1>Do all of that.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's not too late. It's not too late. It

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<v Speaker 2>was just too early before. It was too early when

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<v Speaker 2>we were twenty to truly know what it was we wanted.

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<v Speaker 2>It was too early when we were thirty to understand

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<v Speaker 2>what it was we needed. It was too early to settle,

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<v Speaker 2>too early, to choose, too early, to limit to closed doors,

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<v Speaker 2>too early, to turn our backs on experiences we didn't

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<v Speaker 2>even know that we wanted to have.

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<v Speaker 1>So shit.

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<v Speaker 2>Here we are, at midway and thinking, well, that escalated quickly.

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<v Speaker 2>A lot has happened, some of it joyful, some of

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<v Speaker 2>it boring, some of it devastating, some of it entirely unexpected, blindsiding, shocking.

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<v Speaker 2>But all of that, Bess has woven a life, a great,

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<v Speaker 2>big everything life, and it's not too late or too

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<v Speaker 2>early for us to reset. In fact, it's the perfect time,

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<v Speaker 2>because we're wise enough now to know what's in it

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<v Speaker 2>that matters and how little everything else does. Twenty year

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<v Speaker 2>old me really just wanted adventure and she got it.

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<v Speaker 2>It just didn't look anything like she imagined, and that

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<v Speaker 2>is exactly what mid has taught me. Hello. My name

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<v Speaker 2>is Holly Wainwright, and I am mid midlife, mid family,

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<v Speaker 2>mid identity crisis, and this is our show where we

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<v Speaker 2>unpick all of that. So far in season one, we've

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<v Speaker 2>talked about mental health, dating, alcohol, burnout, bodies, big kids, grief,

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<v Speaker 2>and today we're finishing off our first season with a

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<v Speaker 2>conversation about well, all of it that's not how this

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<v Speaker 2>interview is meant to go, which kind of fits in

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<v Speaker 2>very nicely with that intro about how things are rarely

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<v Speaker 2>how you think they're going to be. It wasn't even

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<v Speaker 2>supposed to be the interview that was going to be

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<v Speaker 2>our final episode. It was meant to be a conversation

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<v Speaker 2>about something very familiar to me many many midwomen divorce,

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<v Speaker 2>and look, it is a conversation about that, but it

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<v Speaker 2>also became one about something much, much bigger, and it

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<v Speaker 2>became clear that it needed to be our first resting point,

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<v Speaker 2>because well, it's everything. Christine r Nu is an Australian icon.

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<v Speaker 2>I can't tell if she'd liked me saying that about

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<v Speaker 2>her or not, because she's certainly a no bullshit kind

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<v Speaker 2>of woman who has no time for me blowing smoke.

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<v Speaker 2>She's a Generation X icon, that's for sure. Christine became

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<v Speaker 2>a huge star here in Australia in the nineties, a

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<v Speaker 2>Torres Strait islander woman whose song my Island Home became

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<v Speaker 2>an anthem, and with it she an enormous star.

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<v Speaker 1>You might be struggling to relate to that.

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<v Speaker 2>We might never have met me in you, but it's

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<v Speaker 2>possible you've never performed on a musical theater stage in

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<v Speaker 2>front of thousands, sung at an Olympic closing ceremony, or

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<v Speaker 2>one swags of shiny awards for the work you do.

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<v Speaker 1>But there will.

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<v Speaker 2>Be something in this wildly honest, raw conversation that brings

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<v Speaker 2>it close you. Maybe you've had days when you couldn't

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<v Speaker 2>get out of bed, when the choices you've made and

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<v Speaker 2>the people you've put your faith in turned to shit,

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<v Speaker 2>and it's not clear how you're going to climb out.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe you've had to apologize to your kids for the

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<v Speaker 2>mistakes you've made and allowed them to hold you up

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<v Speaker 2>on a difficult day. Maybe you've struggled with addiction. Maybe

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<v Speaker 2>you've wondered where all your friends have gone when the

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<v Speaker 2>shit hits the fan. Maybe you've been told you're too

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<v Speaker 2>old to keep chasing the thing you've always wanted. And

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<v Speaker 2>maybe you've finally decided to stop letting other people tell

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<v Speaker 2>you who you should be and what you're capable of.

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<v Speaker 2>That is what this very mid conversation with the extraordinary, brilliant, honest,

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<v Speaker 2>and supremely talented Christine are.

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<v Speaker 1>Knew is all about. Enjoy it, Christine. This is a podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>For midlife women who feel all powerful and also midlife

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<v Speaker 2>women who are still wondering when it's all going to

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<v Speaker 2>start making sense.

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<v Speaker 3>Where on the.

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<v Speaker 2>Spectrums you reckon you sit in that.

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<v Speaker 1>I sit on the Let me just take bits and

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<v Speaker 1>pieces of what you just said. Hello, by the way,

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<v Speaker 1>it's so lovely to be.

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<v Speaker 3>Here catching up much.

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<v Speaker 1>What's it been like eight years since my last Mamma

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<v Speaker 1>Mia chat? And this would be kind of like a

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<v Speaker 1>pickup from that, wouldn't it. Really, that's true. I've been

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<v Speaker 1>through a lot, and I think I'm at that time

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<v Speaker 1>in my life. Char answer your question is that now

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<v Speaker 1>that everything that's happened and gone before me is all

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<v Speaker 1>starting to fall into place, not necessarily like ducks in

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<v Speaker 1>the road, because that's your future. It's all beginning to

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<v Speaker 1>make sense. And I go, God, I wish I knew

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<v Speaker 1>this when I was, you know, twenty, Yeah, geez, I

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<v Speaker 1>wish I knew this at the beginning of my year.

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<v Speaker 1>But you know that's when you just go, well, wow,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, there have been great times, there have been

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<v Speaker 1>not so great times, and all of them make up.

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<v Speaker 1>You're the sum of all of that, aren't you. That's

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<v Speaker 1>all of who I am right now? And you just

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<v Speaker 1>take it when you're going through it. It's a cloudy day.

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<v Speaker 1>My mindset has always whenever I do get to those

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<v Speaker 1>sort of like, oh, it's a rut. It's not moving today,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, it's I'm bumping into it like a like

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<v Speaker 1>a getting over a hump that won't I can't get over.

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<v Speaker 1>I always look at a sunny day that I'm going

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<v Speaker 1>to have some day. I imagine it. It's there, it's coming.

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<v Speaker 3>Do you literally do that?

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<v Speaker 1>I literally do that. It's a practice, it's an absolute

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<v Speaker 1>visual practice of mine. And then it becomes just this

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<v Speaker 1>beautiful hum a hum that just a vibration that takes

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<v Speaker 1>over your entire self because you know that you just

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<v Speaker 1>got to get through, just ride it through, because there's

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<v Speaker 1>no way to do it. Can't go over it, can't

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<v Speaker 1>go around, it can't go under it. You got to

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<v Speaker 1>go through it. That is so true.

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<v Speaker 2>That's a really good point. Right, So eight years since

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<v Speaker 2>your last conversation at MoMA Mia and you relatively recently divorced,

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<v Speaker 2>and this amount of time is actually a perfect time

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<v Speaker 2>to look back on, Like when you're in the middle

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<v Speaker 2>of things, you don't know, like you don't know what

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<v Speaker 2>is this? Teach me how am I what's going to

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<v Speaker 2>it's going to turn over next. But with a bit

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<v Speaker 2>of hindsight, as you say, you can kind of go, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm beginning.

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<v Speaker 1>To see that now.

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<v Speaker 2>What would you say to you then, like or a

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<v Speaker 2>woman who's listening to this, who's having one of those

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<v Speaker 2>moments in life that we all have where you're like,

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<v Speaker 2>this isn't how I thought it was going to go.

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<v Speaker 1>Again, always waking up with that positive vibration of like,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to get through this. I am going through

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<v Speaker 1>what I'm going through now because Christine at the other

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<v Speaker 1>end of this is what I'm informing. And to do that,

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<v Speaker 1>I have to write these letters right now, these words.

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<v Speaker 1>I've got to build them to get to that person

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<v Speaker 1>that I'm going to be, whatever that is. And looking

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<v Speaker 1>back on that, it's like you never go into a

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<v Speaker 1>partnership marriage thinking that it's that you're going to end

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<v Speaker 1>up not being on the same page together. You don't

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<v Speaker 1>do that, and when it happens, it's not like a

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<v Speaker 1>clean cut of a pie, you know, knife slice, beautifully

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<v Speaker 1>cut down the middle. It's like a cookie, Yeah, break it,

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<v Speaker 1>and it's never perfectly down the middle, and there's bloody

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<v Speaker 1>crumbs everywhere and along and those crumbs are the people

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<v Speaker 1>that are involved in that. You got kids, and in

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<v Speaker 1>my situation, two children with two different fathers, so the

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<v Speaker 1>man that I married wasn't their father, so there was

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of relationship building and that there were relationships

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<v Speaker 1>right there and that were going to be affected with

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<v Speaker 1>the decision to do that. But you have to do it,

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<v Speaker 1>and you have to move on, and you have to

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<v Speaker 1>let them see you be a bumbling mess and allow

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<v Speaker 1>them to be there for you in that way. Oh kids. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>and also know that you've got to assure them that

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<v Speaker 1>you're they're not your parent, that it's okay that you're

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<v Speaker 1>not having those great days, and that at the other

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<v Speaker 1>end of it, we're all going to celebrate and be happy.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's exactly what happened. There were some days where

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<v Speaker 1>they were they be breamy coffee in bed, or they'd

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<v Speaker 1>be seeing how I was and you know, kind of

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<v Speaker 1>taking on that parental role. But then you know that,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, you wake up one day and it's not

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<v Speaker 1>like that anymore, that you have picked up the pieces

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<v Speaker 1>and you've moved on. But gosh, it changes them when

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<v Speaker 1>they see that. Momentarily they're having to take on parental

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<v Speaker 1>responsibilities for themselves.

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<v Speaker 2>That's really interesting because I spoke to a woman recently

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<v Speaker 2>about burnout who said, your children are waiting to take

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<v Speaker 2>care of you, like I don't, not necessarily just when

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<v Speaker 2>you're old, but like in the moments that you need them,

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<v Speaker 2>because you've been giving, giving, giving, and it's okay to

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<v Speaker 2>receive as well. Is your sort of point around that

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<v Speaker 2>is that I think so often women in particular, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>sure maybe men do it too, Like we've got to

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<v Speaker 2>pretend everything's fine, like this hasn't gone according to plan,

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<v Speaker 2>but Mom's fine, Everything's going to be great.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm not sad, I'm fine. Look at me smiling. What

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<v Speaker 3>you're saying is.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like it's actually fine to not be smiling and

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<v Speaker 2>be like, actually, kids, I need you to hold me

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<v Speaker 2>a bit.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you know that's absolutely true, And like I find

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<v Speaker 1>I look after my mom now or I am responsible

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<v Speaker 1>for the care and the welfare of my mother. She's

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<v Speaker 1>in a home. We never wanted her to be there,

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<v Speaker 1>but that's where she is. And I really take that

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<v Speaker 1>idea as of being there with my mum in her

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<v Speaker 1>later part of her life as a huge privilege, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>the same way that you give your own children, or

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<v Speaker 1>I gave my children the sense of that privilege to

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<v Speaker 1>take care of me and my emotions. Like the world

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<v Speaker 1>that I've built for you isn't a perfect world. It's

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<v Speaker 1>you know, it's not. It's not going to always be

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<v Speaker 1>feel like it's secure. I have to be able to

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<v Speaker 1>have a wobbly day and you need to be able

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<v Speaker 1>to see that, and I'm giving you permission to hold

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<v Speaker 1>me up on either side when that. When those days

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<v Speaker 1>arrive and they do they see I think that they

0:12:08.127 --> 0:12:11.847
<v Speaker 1>really saw those moments as a real privilege to be

0:12:12.007 --> 0:12:15.447
<v Speaker 1>there for me because I reached out to help from them,

0:12:15.727 --> 0:12:19.327
<v Speaker 1>not from others, and we kept that within our world

0:12:19.527 --> 0:12:20.327
<v Speaker 1>amongst each other.

0:12:20.447 --> 0:12:24.047
<v Speaker 2>That's really beautiful, Really, it's really beautiful, because, as I say,

0:12:24.047 --> 0:12:26.407
<v Speaker 2>I think that sometimes we really punish ourselves if we're

0:12:26.447 --> 0:12:31.167
<v Speaker 2>not painting this very secure, safe, like you know, scrubbed

0:12:31.247 --> 0:12:34.847
<v Speaker 2>clean world for our kids. Because I'm imagining the woman

0:12:34.847 --> 0:12:36.927
<v Speaker 2>who's sitting where you were sitting at that time and

0:12:36.967 --> 0:12:39.647
<v Speaker 2>finding it hard to get out of bed because it's

0:12:39.687 --> 0:12:41.567
<v Speaker 2>not the world she thought she was going to have.

0:12:41.607 --> 0:12:45.447
<v Speaker 2>She's not Is there a period of time that it

0:12:45.527 --> 0:12:49.407
<v Speaker 2>sort of took you for the sunny day mantra or

0:12:49.487 --> 0:12:55.127
<v Speaker 2>those practices to start like moving you in that direction.

0:12:55.767 --> 0:12:58.487
<v Speaker 2>You know, did you feel like there was there a

0:12:58.527 --> 0:13:00.047
<v Speaker 2>pivotal moment where you began to.

0:12:59.967 --> 0:13:05.207
<v Speaker 1>Feel like, oh, okay, the moment started changing was when

0:13:05.527 --> 0:13:10.407
<v Speaker 1>I took what I felt was the very thing that

0:13:10.607 --> 0:13:15.007
<v Speaker 1>wasn't making me and therefore the family happy. Was when

0:13:15.007 --> 0:13:17.207
<v Speaker 1>I decided to make the decision to have to have

0:13:17.527 --> 0:13:22.567
<v Speaker 1>the divorce and remove the component that was really not

0:13:23.247 --> 0:13:26.807
<v Speaker 1>making things happy and bubbling along as they should.

0:13:26.967 --> 0:13:29.127
<v Speaker 2>And that's a difficult place to come to, right.

0:13:29.047 --> 0:13:32.247
<v Speaker 1>It is, And it's why isn't this working? And why

0:13:32.247 --> 0:13:35.647
<v Speaker 1>aren't I happy? It's because the other person's not happy,

0:13:36.167 --> 0:13:39.567
<v Speaker 1>and you've got to have that conversation. It's a it's

0:13:39.607 --> 0:13:42.807
<v Speaker 1>a really big conversation to arrive at. You're not happy

0:13:42.927 --> 0:13:45.007
<v Speaker 1>and you're not admitting that to yourself.

0:13:45.167 --> 0:13:47.127
<v Speaker 2>It's one of those conversations that come up in a

0:13:47.167 --> 0:13:51.327
<v Speaker 2>life where you go, if we have this conversation, everything

0:13:51.367 --> 0:13:54.087
<v Speaker 2>will be different, and sometimes you're very you have to

0:13:54.127 --> 0:13:56.167
<v Speaker 2>take a deep breath for that because you're like, am

0:13:56.207 --> 0:13:57.927
<v Speaker 2>I ready for everything to be different?

0:13:58.167 --> 0:14:02.567
<v Speaker 1>You know that's right? Because starting in your own backyard,

0:14:03.407 --> 0:14:07.247
<v Speaker 1>and arriving at that place, you start to look around

0:14:07.247 --> 0:14:09.087
<v Speaker 1>the second part of your world, you know, when it

0:14:09.087 --> 0:14:12.887
<v Speaker 1>goes around in this concentric thing and you I started

0:14:12.887 --> 0:14:18.087
<v Speaker 1>looking at the flow in my business, in my professional

0:14:18.127 --> 0:14:21.607
<v Speaker 1>life outside of the home, and it starts to effect everywhere.

0:14:22.287 --> 0:14:24.527
<v Speaker 1>You start to see, well, okay, there's a chink in

0:14:25.327 --> 0:14:28.727
<v Speaker 1>here that's not working, and that's all a good thing

0:14:29.327 --> 0:14:32.207
<v Speaker 1>because you've got to shed. When you're shedding, you've got

0:14:32.247 --> 0:14:36.127
<v Speaker 1>to properly do that. But there is everything is a process,

0:14:36.287 --> 0:14:37.887
<v Speaker 1>and you've got to do one thing at a time

0:14:37.927 --> 0:14:41.207
<v Speaker 1>because you're only human and learning as you go. What

0:14:41.247 --> 0:14:43.647
<v Speaker 1>do I look like? I've never been married before and

0:14:43.687 --> 0:14:47.207
<v Speaker 1>going through a divorce and now I'm going to divorce

0:14:47.647 --> 0:14:50.007
<v Speaker 1>a partnership that is like a marriage with your management,

0:14:50.367 --> 0:14:54.167
<v Speaker 1>so that all of a sudden there's all of these yeah, yeah, yeah,

0:14:54.207 --> 0:14:57.607
<v Speaker 1>work and family was enmeshed. Yeah. You start to really

0:14:58.487 --> 0:15:02.247
<v Speaker 1>see how time is such a precious thing. Is that

0:15:02.407 --> 0:15:05.407
<v Speaker 1>what I was actually grieving was the time I can't

0:15:05.447 --> 0:15:10.687
<v Speaker 1>get back and what and the time I perhaps missed

0:15:11.447 --> 0:15:14.967
<v Speaker 1>with with just sweeping the children up and making them

0:15:15.007 --> 0:15:18.207
<v Speaker 1>be a part of all of these decisions. But now

0:15:18.287 --> 0:15:22.007
<v Speaker 1>because the divorce is happening. They're a part of that

0:15:22.087 --> 0:15:25.487
<v Speaker 1>process of rebuilding who we are as a team as

0:15:25.487 --> 0:15:29.727
<v Speaker 1>a unit. And then that, until that was ready, I

0:15:29.727 --> 0:15:32.167
<v Speaker 1>couldn't move on to the next development of what that

0:15:32.207 --> 0:15:36.007
<v Speaker 1>would look like. And that looked amazing because my son

0:15:36.087 --> 0:15:39.087
<v Speaker 1>went on to find his own feet and not live

0:15:39.327 --> 0:15:41.847
<v Speaker 1>that dream that I had had for him, you know,

0:15:42.487 --> 0:15:45.087
<v Speaker 1>you know what, and he was you know, yeah, well

0:15:45.087 --> 0:15:47.087
<v Speaker 1>the first he's there's six years between the two kids,

0:15:47.127 --> 0:15:50.527
<v Speaker 1>so his leaving was it was a it was a

0:15:50.567 --> 0:15:54.247
<v Speaker 1>hard thing, very hard for me to let my oldest

0:15:54.447 --> 0:15:57.807
<v Speaker 1>not be around helping me with his little sister. You know,

0:15:57.927 --> 0:15:59.247
<v Speaker 1>Now I've got to do it on my own, like

0:15:59.287 --> 0:16:02.327
<v Speaker 1>single parenting sort of. I look at my life and go,

0:16:02.487 --> 0:16:04.527
<v Speaker 1>maybe I was always supposed to be that single parent,

0:16:04.567 --> 0:16:07.127
<v Speaker 1>because I was before I was married, a single parent,

0:16:07.247 --> 0:16:09.447
<v Speaker 1>and then after that I was ultimately going to be

0:16:09.487 --> 0:16:11.927
<v Speaker 1>a single parent, but only for a couple of years

0:16:11.967 --> 0:16:14.927
<v Speaker 1>still with a dependent Yeah, and then it just feels

0:16:14.927 --> 0:16:17.207
<v Speaker 1>like I've just had this beautiful little shadow in my

0:16:17.327 --> 0:16:21.327
<v Speaker 1>daughter that that whole time we've had these triumphs together,

0:16:21.967 --> 0:16:25.927
<v Speaker 1>like so many wins, and you know, she's she's brighter

0:16:25.967 --> 0:16:28.727
<v Speaker 1>and she's better as a human for having been a

0:16:28.767 --> 0:16:32.487
<v Speaker 1>part of seeing me as her role model go through

0:16:32.527 --> 0:16:35.767
<v Speaker 1>the things I have and see my inner strengths and

0:16:35.887 --> 0:16:38.887
<v Speaker 1>what that looks like and how what's the result and

0:16:38.887 --> 0:16:41.887
<v Speaker 1>how do I repair? And she's been there to watch

0:16:42.087 --> 0:16:45.567
<v Speaker 1>what it is to be a woman, and she's watched

0:16:45.567 --> 0:16:48.447
<v Speaker 1>that and she's it's been great to have her to

0:16:48.487 --> 0:16:51.007
<v Speaker 1>talk to about you know what it's like, you know,

0:16:51.167 --> 0:16:56.727
<v Speaker 1>grieving my son, leaving home, who's now a father. You know,

0:16:56.767 --> 0:16:58.287
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to be like my parents. Do you want

0:16:58.287 --> 0:16:58.847
<v Speaker 1>to see a video?

0:16:59.927 --> 0:17:00.447
<v Speaker 3>Definitely?

0:17:00.447 --> 0:17:01.847
<v Speaker 1>Afterwards? I wanted a video. Yes.

0:17:02.527 --> 0:17:05.807
<v Speaker 2>So when you just said before, maybe I was meant

0:17:05.807 --> 0:17:09.607
<v Speaker 2>to be a single mom. Yeah, when your divorce happened,

0:17:09.687 --> 0:17:11.447
<v Speaker 2>and as you said that you had your your kids

0:17:11.487 --> 0:17:13.847
<v Speaker 2>were relative. Actually, you know, I was reading that the

0:17:13.887 --> 0:17:16.487
<v Speaker 2>average age from Australian momented divorces in a early to

0:17:16.527 --> 0:17:18.687
<v Speaker 2>mid forties. That's when it happens, right, And I think

0:17:18.727 --> 0:17:20.207
<v Speaker 2>that's actually when when you I.

0:17:20.167 --> 0:17:21.127
<v Speaker 1>Got married at forty.

0:17:21.247 --> 0:17:21.887
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, there you go.

0:17:22.647 --> 0:17:24.487
<v Speaker 2>And then but the thing is is it's a time

0:17:24.527 --> 0:17:26.647
<v Speaker 2>of life when you do have a lot of responsibilities

0:17:26.647 --> 0:17:29.567
<v Speaker 2>around you, right, like financial and all those things.

0:17:29.447 --> 0:17:31.047
<v Speaker 1>As you were saying with work, and.

0:17:31.367 --> 0:17:35.567
<v Speaker 2>It's it's a really stressful period of adulthood anyway. And

0:17:35.607 --> 0:17:37.807
<v Speaker 2>then you throw this in on it when you say

0:17:37.807 --> 0:17:39.087
<v Speaker 2>maybe I was meant to be a single mother.

0:17:39.407 --> 0:17:41.287
<v Speaker 3>Do you think like you're.

0:17:41.127 --> 0:17:41.687
<v Speaker 1>Good at it?

0:17:41.767 --> 0:17:43.567
<v Speaker 3>Like because you're you know, you're.

0:17:43.407 --> 0:17:45.607
<v Speaker 2>A strong woman, who know you don't think you're.

0:17:45.527 --> 0:17:45.927
<v Speaker 3>Good on it?

0:17:46.007 --> 0:17:48.687
<v Speaker 1>Oh god, I know it, don't much. Rather not do not.

0:17:49.047 --> 0:17:51.767
<v Speaker 1>I will not rewrite that book. I had two children

0:17:51.807 --> 0:17:55.327
<v Speaker 1>and that's all that I could manage in my lifetime.

0:17:55.647 --> 0:17:57.807
<v Speaker 2>And how did you always juggle the work? Like the

0:17:57.847 --> 0:18:00.727
<v Speaker 2>fact that your work takes you traveling and away and

0:18:00.727 --> 0:18:02.527
<v Speaker 2>all those things, because that's another thing when you're.

0:18:02.367 --> 0:18:05.647
<v Speaker 1>By yourself, right, that's harder. You know, my son always says,

0:18:05.727 --> 0:18:08.847
<v Speaker 1>or you're such a different mom to supporr was also different.

0:18:08.887 --> 0:18:11.847
<v Speaker 1>And you know I say two different things, mate. When

0:18:11.847 --> 0:18:17.087
<v Speaker 1>I had you, I was like twenty six and six

0:18:17.167 --> 0:18:20.487
<v Speaker 1>years later, I'm a very different human being. Not only

0:18:20.527 --> 0:18:23.767
<v Speaker 1>am I now a single mom and I'm single mom

0:18:23.807 --> 0:18:28.407
<v Speaker 1>traveling and I've got between you know, that beautiful babysitting

0:18:28.447 --> 0:18:33.367
<v Speaker 1>company called Angel, Yeah, I another one you yes, and

0:18:33.647 --> 0:18:37.767
<v Speaker 1>grandparents or friends or my family, my sister, Between all

0:18:37.807 --> 0:18:40.767
<v Speaker 1>of these people and not to mention my beautiful, beautiful

0:18:40.767 --> 0:18:44.447
<v Speaker 1>family and friends who who you know. It takes a village,

0:18:44.447 --> 0:18:47.527
<v Speaker 1>doesn't it. And it's the village that are helping raise

0:18:47.567 --> 0:18:49.847
<v Speaker 1>my children. I never felt that they were without or

0:18:49.887 --> 0:18:53.287
<v Speaker 1>I was without because I wasn't with their respective fathers.

0:18:54.087 --> 0:18:57.647
<v Speaker 1>Things happened and I just couldn't. Relationships and raising children

0:18:57.647 --> 0:19:01.087
<v Speaker 1>were just not something that a partnership we saw eye

0:19:01.087 --> 0:19:04.447
<v Speaker 1>to eye, and you know, strangely enough, before children, the

0:19:04.527 --> 0:19:06.407
<v Speaker 1>thought of them and I always said I'd never get

0:19:06.407 --> 0:19:08.687
<v Speaker 1>married because looking at my parents, it's like shit, you

0:19:08.727 --> 0:19:13.007
<v Speaker 1>guys should get it together. And I just didn't have

0:19:13.087 --> 0:19:15.527
<v Speaker 1>great role models or a good example on how to

0:19:15.607 --> 0:19:18.887
<v Speaker 1>do that right. And I just thought, well, maybe that's it.

0:19:18.967 --> 0:19:20.447
<v Speaker 1>I'm not built for it, and I think I know

0:19:20.487 --> 0:19:23.247
<v Speaker 1>how to raise my kids and am I a good mother.

0:19:24.727 --> 0:19:26.967
<v Speaker 1>My son and I really really had it out about that.

0:19:27.087 --> 0:19:29.807
<v Speaker 1>He said, you know, you you should have married that guy.

0:19:29.927 --> 0:19:32.807
<v Speaker 1>You're stuffed up big time, mum. And I said, we

0:19:32.887 --> 0:19:35.887
<v Speaker 1>can lower our voices now and not yell at each

0:19:35.927 --> 0:19:38.447
<v Speaker 1>other because I'm on the same page as you. I agree,

0:19:39.087 --> 0:19:42.247
<v Speaker 1>I agree with you, I agree that I'm not you know,

0:19:42.527 --> 0:19:45.527
<v Speaker 1>let's come to terms with or be on the same

0:19:45.567 --> 0:19:47.567
<v Speaker 1>page about the fact that I'm not a perfect human

0:19:47.607 --> 0:19:52.687
<v Speaker 1>being and I have stuffed up majorly along the way,

0:19:54.167 --> 0:19:56.487
<v Speaker 1>but we've still got each other. I've come out the

0:19:56.487 --> 0:19:58.567
<v Speaker 1>other end, or I've woken up every day just knowing

0:19:58.607 --> 0:20:01.407
<v Speaker 1>that I've still got you and your sister, that I

0:20:01.447 --> 0:20:05.167
<v Speaker 1>will always be someone's mother, and I've always got you

0:20:05.247 --> 0:20:07.127
<v Speaker 1>two to love. And it's what got me up every

0:20:07.207 --> 0:20:08.727
<v Speaker 1>day and moved on to the next thing.

0:20:09.607 --> 0:20:12.407
<v Speaker 2>Always so back to that point of the dark place

0:20:12.447 --> 0:20:14.687
<v Speaker 2>after that when you're trying to picture the sunny day.

0:20:15.007 --> 0:20:17.287
<v Speaker 1>They are a big part of it, right, big part

0:20:17.287 --> 0:20:20.047
<v Speaker 1>of it. They're faces. And now my grandson, my little

0:20:20.047 --> 0:20:23.807
<v Speaker 1>grandson Mondna his face. I mean, do you know I

0:20:23.807 --> 0:20:26.527
<v Speaker 1>don't sit there on TikTok looking at all the funny videos.

0:20:27.167 --> 0:20:30.487
<v Speaker 1>I just rewind all of the photographs and the videos

0:20:30.487 --> 0:20:32.567
<v Speaker 1>that my son sends me through. Do you know it's

0:20:32.647 --> 0:20:35.927
<v Speaker 1>love on a next level. It's what I hear. It's

0:20:36.167 --> 0:20:38.487
<v Speaker 1>it really is like people say, you like your children,

0:20:38.487 --> 0:20:42.127
<v Speaker 1>but you love your grandchildren good A little bit they

0:20:42.287 --> 0:20:44.247
<v Speaker 1>true there, I think, is it.

0:20:44.327 --> 0:20:47.487
<v Speaker 2>Because mea obviously who baba me?

0:20:47.887 --> 0:20:48.647
<v Speaker 1>Is MIA's business.

0:20:48.647 --> 0:20:51.287
<v Speaker 2>But she's recently become a grandmother, and she says, it's

0:20:51.407 --> 0:20:54.567
<v Speaker 2>just all the joy and not the stress of parenting.

0:20:54.767 --> 0:20:57.607
<v Speaker 3>So it's like the love that you have for your kids.

0:20:57.647 --> 0:20:58.727
<v Speaker 1>But then you also.

0:20:58.607 --> 0:21:00.967
<v Speaker 2>Don't have to do all of the things. I can

0:21:01.007 --> 0:21:04.327
<v Speaker 2>take full responsibility for them. So it feels like it's

0:21:04.407 --> 0:21:06.247
<v Speaker 2>like lift it is it is.

0:21:06.567 --> 0:21:09.367
<v Speaker 1>Having said that, though it's just your kind of you

0:21:09.367 --> 0:21:10.967
<v Speaker 1>do want to steal a I want to steal more

0:21:11.007 --> 0:21:13.927
<v Speaker 1>cuddles than I can because we live in different states, right,

0:21:14.567 --> 0:21:17.527
<v Speaker 1>I don't have to go through the pregnancies, gosh, and

0:21:17.527 --> 0:21:21.087
<v Speaker 1>they were two very difficult ones for me personally. I

0:21:21.127 --> 0:21:25.247
<v Speaker 1>look at the parents and go, yeah, I can, I

0:21:25.287 --> 0:21:27.567
<v Speaker 1>can give the baby back, and there's all of that,

0:21:27.607 --> 0:21:30.607
<v Speaker 1>but you do stress a little bit about the decisions

0:21:30.607 --> 0:21:33.167
<v Speaker 1>that they make. Just quietly, you just you just don't.

0:21:33.487 --> 0:21:36.287
<v Speaker 1>It would never turn out as a great conversation because

0:21:36.607 --> 0:21:38.247
<v Speaker 1>you have to learn to bite your tongue. You do

0:21:38.327 --> 0:21:40.367
<v Speaker 1>have to learn to bite your tongue. And I'm not

0:21:40.407 --> 0:21:44.327
<v Speaker 1>a bite your tongue person, but along comes your children

0:21:44.607 --> 0:21:46.687
<v Speaker 1>as first time parents, and you've got to learn to

0:21:47.047 --> 0:21:50.047
<v Speaker 1>decide what you're going to bring up or anything like that,

0:21:50.167 --> 0:21:52.927
<v Speaker 1>or just make sure that your ears are big and

0:21:53.007 --> 0:21:56.127
<v Speaker 1>waving around and waiting to hear anything that they that

0:21:56.167 --> 0:21:59.847
<v Speaker 1>they come to you with, because if you know, all

0:21:59.887 --> 0:22:02.767
<v Speaker 1>I can do is go, I've got two kids, and

0:22:02.807 --> 0:22:04.647
<v Speaker 1>I did it on my own, and I've got a

0:22:04.647 --> 0:22:07.087
<v Speaker 1>lot of advice for both of you, if and when

0:22:07.127 --> 0:22:07.607
<v Speaker 1>you want to.

0:22:07.727 --> 0:22:10.287
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, if and when you want to, And I'm sure

0:22:10.287 --> 0:22:16.367
<v Speaker 2>they will want it up next when your kids are

0:22:16.407 --> 0:22:20.327
<v Speaker 2>grown and they look back at how your choices affected

0:22:20.367 --> 0:22:22.487
<v Speaker 2>them and they want to tell you all about that.

0:22:22.927 --> 0:22:25.447
<v Speaker 2>How do you have that conversation and is it helpful

0:22:25.487 --> 0:22:27.287
<v Speaker 2>and healing or is it a bit like pressing on

0:22:27.327 --> 0:22:33.007
<v Speaker 2>an old bruise that's after the break. That's a big thing.

0:22:33.007 --> 0:22:35.287
<v Speaker 2>When you were just saying that your son and you

0:22:35.447 --> 0:22:39.327
<v Speaker 2>had a conversation about you know, that period of time

0:22:39.687 --> 0:22:41.327
<v Speaker 2>and like whether or not you were a good mother

0:22:41.367 --> 0:22:43.087
<v Speaker 2>and whether or not you made the right calls. That's

0:22:43.127 --> 0:22:44.567
<v Speaker 2>a tough conversation.

0:22:44.087 --> 0:22:46.407
<v Speaker 1>To have with your kids. Right. It wasn't a conversation.

0:22:46.527 --> 0:22:49.847
<v Speaker 1>It was pretty much a yelling match. It was a

0:22:49.847 --> 0:22:52.647
<v Speaker 1>screaming match. I remember that. And he'd never had it

0:22:52.687 --> 0:22:55.447
<v Speaker 1>out with me as an adult as well ever as

0:22:55.487 --> 0:22:58.807
<v Speaker 1>a kid both, so it's like it was going to

0:22:58.847 --> 0:23:00.807
<v Speaker 1>come it was a thing that was coming. And there

0:23:00.807 --> 0:23:02.607
<v Speaker 1>were several points that he wanted to up and leave,

0:23:02.607 --> 0:23:05.007
<v Speaker 1>and eye would go, no, you're not. I'm giving you

0:23:05.047 --> 0:23:08.767
<v Speaker 1>permission all of it. Just put it. I want you

0:23:08.807 --> 0:23:12.967
<v Speaker 1>to everything that you hate about the decisions that I've

0:23:13.007 --> 0:23:17.927
<v Speaker 1>made in your life, you know, because it is your life.

0:23:18.367 --> 0:23:21.367
<v Speaker 1>And once that happened, it just became it went from

0:23:21.447 --> 0:23:24.927
<v Speaker 1>a raw to a beautiful little hum.

0:23:25.327 --> 0:23:28.487
<v Speaker 2>But you must have That's those kind of conversations they

0:23:28.887 --> 0:23:30.967
<v Speaker 2>you know, as you say, the raw turned into a hum.

0:23:31.207 --> 0:23:33.887
<v Speaker 2>But did you feel bruised or did you feel well?

0:23:33.927 --> 0:23:36.127
<v Speaker 2>I'm glad now I know, Like you know what I mean.

0:23:36.767 --> 0:23:41.927
<v Speaker 1>I'm glad now I know. But also I think I'd

0:23:41.927 --> 0:23:45.247
<v Speaker 1>always given him permission to tell me. I always the

0:23:45.247 --> 0:23:48.847
<v Speaker 1>permission was always there. I just the needed to be

0:23:48.887 --> 0:23:51.287
<v Speaker 1>a moment for it to cross over and for him

0:23:51.327 --> 0:23:54.967
<v Speaker 1>to get to that point where right, and the fact

0:23:55.007 --> 0:23:58.367
<v Speaker 1>that he was yelling and it was emotion, it's built up,

0:23:58.407 --> 0:24:01.167
<v Speaker 1>it's his whole life where I'm looking at here, I'm

0:24:01.167 --> 0:24:05.327
<v Speaker 1>looking at this him metamorphosizing, and I'm going he needs

0:24:05.767 --> 0:24:07.247
<v Speaker 1>and I was looking at him and I say, you

0:24:07.287 --> 0:24:09.447
<v Speaker 1>need to let it out. Tell me. I'm I'm not

0:24:09.447 --> 0:24:11.687
<v Speaker 1>going to disagree with anything that you've got to say,

0:24:12.167 --> 0:24:15.407
<v Speaker 1>because how whatever those decisions were, you had to deal

0:24:15.487 --> 0:24:17.487
<v Speaker 1>with that in your life, with the people that I

0:24:17.727 --> 0:24:21.567
<v Speaker 1>put you in your world, with some things that he

0:24:21.647 --> 0:24:24.207
<v Speaker 1>told me. It was they were really hard to swallow,

0:24:24.367 --> 0:24:26.767
<v Speaker 1>but I was ready for it at the same time.

0:24:26.967 --> 0:24:30.087
<v Speaker 2>That's incredible, Yeah, because a lot of families never ever

0:24:30.687 --> 0:24:32.647
<v Speaker 2>ever all these things.

0:24:32.727 --> 0:24:34.687
<v Speaker 1>Well, I've got one of each, right, I've got a

0:24:34.687 --> 0:24:36.087
<v Speaker 1>boy and a girl, but I've also got a black

0:24:36.087 --> 0:24:38.247
<v Speaker 1>one and a white one. And you know so and

0:24:38.287 --> 0:24:42.047
<v Speaker 1>their parents, so their fathers are from completely two different worlds.

0:24:42.207 --> 0:24:46.407
<v Speaker 1>My girl's father is a Caucasian white man, Australian, you know,

0:24:46.567 --> 0:24:50.927
<v Speaker 1>sixth generation, and Quiam's father is Torrestrate Islander, same as

0:24:50.927 --> 0:24:54.847
<v Speaker 1>my background. You know, We've got the same values, same everything.

0:24:54.927 --> 0:24:58.327
<v Speaker 1>And her world is a completely different world that she

0:24:58.527 --> 0:25:03.047
<v Speaker 1>juggles every day. You know, he gets treated like a

0:25:03.047 --> 0:25:05.287
<v Speaker 1>black man when he was growing up. Oh you're a

0:25:05.287 --> 0:25:07.247
<v Speaker 1>black kid. You're running around and you must be a

0:25:07.327 --> 0:25:13.447
<v Speaker 1>naughty little black fellow. Both in modeling agencies and she

0:25:13.567 --> 0:25:15.367
<v Speaker 1>got more work and he got mum. But you know,

0:25:15.647 --> 0:25:17.287
<v Speaker 1>they were happy to take them along, but they looked

0:25:17.407 --> 0:25:20.047
<v Speaker 1>very different, and you know, we were in a very

0:25:20.087 --> 0:25:23.647
<v Speaker 1>different editorial world now, like it's very different we see

0:25:23.807 --> 0:25:27.927
<v Speaker 1>in advertising, isn't it. We are representing the truer, you know,

0:25:28.807 --> 0:25:31.567
<v Speaker 1>landscape of Australia than what it was when I was

0:25:31.647 --> 0:25:34.327
<v Speaker 1>raising my kids, because I'd get I'd walk down, you know,

0:25:34.367 --> 0:25:38.687
<v Speaker 1>the streets of Newtown where we lived, and people would go, oh,

0:25:38.767 --> 0:25:41.807
<v Speaker 1>she must be the old pair or the nanny, because

0:25:41.807 --> 0:25:44.047
<v Speaker 1>they'd look at them and look at her and look

0:25:44.087 --> 0:25:47.087
<v Speaker 1>at him, and they would be Their relationship to me

0:25:47.687 --> 0:25:51.167
<v Speaker 1>would be clearly like, oh, she's the mum. But that's strange.

0:25:51.327 --> 0:25:53.567
<v Speaker 1>They look like a very you know, an odd bunch

0:25:53.567 --> 0:25:56.167
<v Speaker 1>of people walking down the streets and the odd bunch.

0:25:56.247 --> 0:26:00.207
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it must be a particular thing for a mother too,

0:26:00.247 --> 0:26:03.087
<v Speaker 2>As you were just telling me about that, about raising

0:26:03.127 --> 0:26:06.847
<v Speaker 2>your two kids in the world treating them so differently. Gosh,

0:26:06.887 --> 0:26:11.327
<v Speaker 2>how as the parent do you relate to that, because

0:26:11.367 --> 0:26:13.647
<v Speaker 2>you know, you're obviously bringing all your culture and your

0:26:14.567 --> 0:26:17.847
<v Speaker 2>own experience to that, Like, it must be strange not

0:26:17.927 --> 0:26:18.447
<v Speaker 2>for that to be.

0:26:19.247 --> 0:26:21.767
<v Speaker 1>What does that conversation look like? What do those what

0:26:22.287 --> 0:26:25.527
<v Speaker 1>are the dialogues? What are the words in your household

0:26:25.567 --> 0:26:28.127
<v Speaker 1>when you're talking to your children about relating to the

0:26:28.127 --> 0:26:32.287
<v Speaker 1>world around them, Well, it was important to ask themselves

0:26:32.327 --> 0:26:34.927
<v Speaker 1>how they relate to each other first. How they relate

0:26:34.967 --> 0:26:37.407
<v Speaker 1>to each other is how they relate to the world

0:26:37.407 --> 0:26:41.567
<v Speaker 1>outside of them, and keeping that dialogue very open. And

0:26:41.607 --> 0:26:45.207
<v Speaker 1>because I'm not he wasn't raised with a man showing

0:26:45.287 --> 0:26:47.927
<v Speaker 1>him the road or the ropes or whatever. It was

0:26:48.087 --> 0:26:51.487
<v Speaker 1>very hard. That part of it was always really hard

0:26:51.687 --> 0:26:56.327
<v Speaker 1>to juggle because in our culture, a man goes through

0:26:56.367 --> 0:27:01.887
<v Speaker 1>his own initiations into the world to become a man,

0:27:02.207 --> 0:27:06.247
<v Speaker 1>stages in the world, marks on his life that will

0:27:06.647 --> 0:27:11.207
<v Speaker 1>show him progressively as he is being acknowledged and validated

0:27:11.527 --> 0:27:13.767
<v Speaker 1>to become a man. There are those things that happen

0:27:13.887 --> 0:27:17.447
<v Speaker 1>in our society as tryst rd Islanders. But she's just

0:27:17.567 --> 0:27:19.407
<v Speaker 1>you know, she looks like the run of the mill

0:27:19.407 --> 0:27:21.567
<v Speaker 1>Australian kid, and you know she doesn't have to go

0:27:21.607 --> 0:27:24.767
<v Speaker 1>through the same prejudices as what he does. But I

0:27:24.927 --> 0:27:29.367
<v Speaker 1>made sure that his coming of age ceremonies always happened,

0:27:29.727 --> 0:27:32.407
<v Speaker 1>and that his father, you know, as much of his

0:27:32.847 --> 0:27:36.367
<v Speaker 1>drag and him along, they happened. I made sure that

0:27:36.407 --> 0:27:39.047
<v Speaker 1>they happened. And again with the help of the village

0:27:39.087 --> 0:27:40.687
<v Speaker 1>that we're helping me raise my children.

0:27:40.887 --> 0:27:43.487
<v Speaker 2>I was going to ask you about the village and

0:27:43.527 --> 0:27:47.807
<v Speaker 2>that and culture and family and how that helps at

0:27:47.807 --> 0:27:51.247
<v Speaker 2>the dark moments like those, the days you're talking about

0:27:51.287 --> 0:27:54.367
<v Speaker 2>after the divorce, when you're like, what the hell does

0:27:54.407 --> 0:27:55.407
<v Speaker 2>my life look like now?

0:27:55.527 --> 0:27:59.127
<v Speaker 1>My family look like? Now? How does that help? How

0:27:59.127 --> 0:28:04.447
<v Speaker 1>does it work? My friends? When it came my family,

0:28:04.607 --> 0:28:06.807
<v Speaker 1>I'll call them my family because that's exactly who they are,

0:28:06.927 --> 0:28:11.887
<v Speaker 1>and it's a really large lgbtque family. And because I've

0:28:11.927 --> 0:28:14.447
<v Speaker 1>only got one sister who lives in Sydney, the other

0:28:14.487 --> 0:28:17.127
<v Speaker 1>one in Newcastle, and then the rest of the family

0:28:17.167 --> 0:28:23.007
<v Speaker 1>are in Queensland and the Torres Strait. Sometimes it's really

0:28:23.047 --> 0:28:25.367
<v Speaker 1>hard because I look at myself and it's really hard

0:28:25.407 --> 0:28:29.047
<v Speaker 1>to see somebody that you care so much about going

0:28:29.087 --> 0:28:32.767
<v Speaker 1>through something in their life because you don't know what

0:28:32.887 --> 0:28:35.847
<v Speaker 1>to say, You don't know how to first of all,

0:28:35.927 --> 0:28:39.207
<v Speaker 1>if you find the question, are you okay to actually

0:28:39.207 --> 0:28:40.847
<v Speaker 1>sit there and then listen to what they're going to

0:28:40.847 --> 0:28:44.807
<v Speaker 1>tell you and find a way to process it? And

0:28:44.847 --> 0:28:46.327
<v Speaker 1>I think for most of us we don't know how

0:28:46.327 --> 0:28:48.487
<v Speaker 1>to process it because we don't know how to help

0:28:48.527 --> 0:28:52.007
<v Speaker 1>them fix that situation when often, more often than not,

0:28:52.047 --> 0:28:54.967
<v Speaker 1>it's just about sitting there and being with somebody, even

0:28:55.007 --> 0:28:58.167
<v Speaker 1>if it's in silence, Like I am there for my mother,

0:28:58.247 --> 0:29:01.727
<v Speaker 1>It's like, it's not about having conversations, it's her knowing

0:29:01.727 --> 0:29:05.207
<v Speaker 1>that you're there, just sitting there with her physical process. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

0:29:05.247 --> 0:29:07.087
<v Speaker 1>And a lot of times I would think, God, they're

0:29:07.127 --> 0:29:09.487
<v Speaker 1>just fair with the friends. Everybody just wants to be

0:29:09.567 --> 0:29:12.927
<v Speaker 1>around for the laughter and the smiles and the happy

0:29:13.007 --> 0:29:16.207
<v Speaker 1>times and the joy, happy, joy, joy, but nobody really

0:29:16.207 --> 0:29:18.647
<v Speaker 1>wants to talk about the pain that you're going through.

0:29:19.847 --> 0:29:23.887
<v Speaker 1>I understand it now. I understand it now because my

0:29:24.447 --> 0:29:28.727
<v Speaker 1>son is in the process of building his village and

0:29:28.847 --> 0:29:31.607
<v Speaker 1>I am a part of it. I'm a matriarch, so

0:29:31.647 --> 0:29:33.527
<v Speaker 1>I've got a very different role to play in what

0:29:33.567 --> 0:29:37.127
<v Speaker 1>that looks like. But now I'm seeing what his village

0:29:37.167 --> 0:29:40.167
<v Speaker 1>looks like, and now how he's choosing those people that

0:29:40.207 --> 0:29:43.567
<v Speaker 1>are going to be around to help him through those

0:29:43.967 --> 0:29:47.167
<v Speaker 1>not so sunny days. That's not up to me. But

0:29:47.567 --> 0:29:49.967
<v Speaker 1>the people that I chose to be around are people

0:29:50.007 --> 0:29:54.207
<v Speaker 1>that I've made godfather for my daughter, and you know

0:29:54.327 --> 0:29:57.447
<v Speaker 1>they have or godmother for my daughter, and being there

0:29:57.607 --> 0:30:01.287
<v Speaker 1>as really important people that my son calls uncles and

0:30:01.327 --> 0:30:05.447
<v Speaker 1>aunts and he calls them grandma and grandpa. They did

0:30:05.447 --> 0:30:08.327
<v Speaker 1>what they did, and I'm very grateful to the village.

0:30:08.327 --> 0:30:10.967
<v Speaker 1>I'm very very great to them because they could. They

0:30:11.007 --> 0:30:12.887
<v Speaker 1>only did what they thought they could, you know, as

0:30:12.967 --> 0:30:15.167
<v Speaker 1>far as they could. You can only ask so much

0:30:15.167 --> 0:30:19.887
<v Speaker 1>of someone. Really, then beyond that, it's like, I'm very grateful.

0:30:19.927 --> 0:30:22.927
<v Speaker 1>I'm happy. I'm grateful. At the time, it's like where

0:30:22.967 --> 0:30:25.647
<v Speaker 1>is everybody? They've left me standing here holding the babies.

0:30:26.167 --> 0:30:29.327
<v Speaker 1>But it's not that simple, it really isn't it. Really,

0:30:29.367 --> 0:30:30.967
<v Speaker 1>it's not cut and dry, and you do find I

0:30:31.007 --> 0:30:35.727
<v Speaker 1>did find places that where I could just but mostly

0:30:35.767 --> 0:30:38.047
<v Speaker 1>it was with my children at home. Really yeah.

0:30:38.087 --> 0:30:40.607
<v Speaker 2>Really, It's interesting because I think for a lot of

0:30:40.607 --> 0:30:43.927
<v Speaker 2>women when they go through a divorce and their children

0:30:43.927 --> 0:30:46.807
<v Speaker 2>are small, that loneliness is quite common. Like there's sudden

0:30:46.887 --> 0:30:49.927
<v Speaker 2>thing of like where has everybody gone, particularly if you

0:30:50.087 --> 0:30:52.687
<v Speaker 2>had a social But the strength, the strange.

0:30:52.367 --> 0:30:54.127
<v Speaker 1>Thing is that they're there. Yeah, they're there.

0:30:54.287 --> 0:30:58.047
<v Speaker 2>I like that advice about you know, just being like

0:30:58.207 --> 0:31:00.847
<v Speaker 2>just being there because it is hard when you've got

0:31:00.887 --> 0:31:03.807
<v Speaker 2>your people who you love going through really difficult things

0:31:03.847 --> 0:31:07.007
<v Speaker 2>and you don't know what to say.

0:31:07.087 --> 0:31:12.167
<v Speaker 1>Yes, but also as some who's going through it, don't

0:31:12.327 --> 0:31:14.407
<v Speaker 1>feel like you always have to just be talking about

0:31:14.407 --> 0:31:17.327
<v Speaker 1>that every time you see somebody, and you know, we're

0:31:17.367 --> 0:31:19.367
<v Speaker 1>so encouraged to just talk about it. You know, you

0:31:19.407 --> 0:31:21.847
<v Speaker 1>just get it off your chest. D da da da.

0:31:21.967 --> 0:31:24.567
<v Speaker 1>I think there are other ways to talk about it

0:31:24.607 --> 0:31:27.367
<v Speaker 1>and get it off your chest other than it. Yeah,

0:31:27.367 --> 0:31:29.927
<v Speaker 1>what that way is is different for everybody. It might

0:31:29.967 --> 0:31:32.127
<v Speaker 1>be going to the gym and punching the crap out

0:31:32.127 --> 0:31:35.087
<v Speaker 1>of a punching bag, and it could be different for everyone.

0:31:36.007 --> 0:31:40.127
<v Speaker 1>But sometimes I think you have to shut the noise down,

0:31:40.687 --> 0:31:44.407
<v Speaker 1>and that means stop talking about it. Listen to the

0:31:44.447 --> 0:31:47.047
<v Speaker 1>noise in your head. Let it be. It'll actually go

0:31:47.127 --> 0:31:50.207
<v Speaker 1>from a boisterous cacophony down to something that's just a

0:31:50.247 --> 0:31:53.607
<v Speaker 1>beautiful hum It really does. And don't feel like you

0:31:53.687 --> 0:31:56.567
<v Speaker 1>have to talk about it to everyone because everyone's scared.

0:31:56.927 --> 0:31:59.127
<v Speaker 1>Everybody's scared that they can't help you because they love

0:31:59.127 --> 0:32:02.327
<v Speaker 1>you so much. Yeah.

0:32:02.407 --> 0:32:05.407
<v Speaker 2>I remember reading an interview with you not long after

0:32:05.407 --> 0:32:08.607
<v Speaker 2>the divorce. Why you said, I'm done, I'm done with love?

0:32:08.727 --> 0:32:11.047
<v Speaker 2>You said, did you silly?

0:32:11.167 --> 0:32:11.207
<v Speaker 1>Go?

0:32:11.447 --> 0:32:13.127
<v Speaker 2>I mean, who knows whether you really said it?

0:32:13.127 --> 0:32:13.327
<v Speaker 3>It was.

0:32:14.327 --> 0:32:18.167
<v Speaker 2>They may have made, they may have embellished. No, I'm

0:32:18.207 --> 0:32:20.527
<v Speaker 2>thinking again about people listening to this who may be

0:32:20.687 --> 0:32:24.247
<v Speaker 2>like I am. Here's something I see sometimes is with

0:32:25.047 --> 0:32:27.527
<v Speaker 2>people in my world they're like, that's it, never ever, ever,

0:32:27.847 --> 0:32:29.487
<v Speaker 2>And then maybe after a year or so, they're like.

0:32:29.567 --> 0:32:34.527
<v Speaker 3>Hm, things are like things are coming back together, like.

0:32:34.527 --> 0:32:38.687
<v Speaker 2>Did you did you think I'm done after the devastation

0:32:38.807 --> 0:32:39.647
<v Speaker 2>of that situation.

0:32:40.247 --> 0:32:43.407
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's no embellishments. I think it's sometimes context. They

0:32:43.447 --> 0:32:46.607
<v Speaker 1>take what you say and then put the context in

0:32:46.967 --> 0:32:49.927
<v Speaker 1>their own context to create the story. I will have

0:32:49.967 --> 0:32:52.247
<v Speaker 1>to say sorry, I'm just I get emotional talking about

0:32:52.287 --> 0:32:57.487
<v Speaker 1>all of it. For me, the emotions of getting in

0:32:57.567 --> 0:33:00.967
<v Speaker 1>touch with emotions again was something that I felt I

0:33:01.007 --> 0:33:03.167
<v Speaker 1>could that is, that is the part of love that

0:33:03.207 --> 0:33:05.407
<v Speaker 1>I can I can wait. I'm going to put the

0:33:05.447 --> 0:33:09.207
<v Speaker 1>pause button on on the fields as they call it

0:33:09.327 --> 0:33:12.607
<v Speaker 1>these days. What I crave and what if you're if

0:33:12.607 --> 0:33:16.527
<v Speaker 1>any woman's honest is the physical love? Yeah, the physical

0:33:16.607 --> 0:33:22.527
<v Speaker 1>side of it, the touching, the eyeballs, the words, you know,

0:33:22.647 --> 0:33:26.207
<v Speaker 1>it's those sorts of immediate you know, the smells and

0:33:26.567 --> 0:33:29.367
<v Speaker 1>all of that. It's those sorts of powerful things. The

0:33:29.407 --> 0:33:32.447
<v Speaker 1>physical sides of things that I think you miss immediately

0:33:32.767 --> 0:33:36.687
<v Speaker 1>that's not there anymore, the cuddles, but the emotional stuff

0:33:36.727 --> 0:33:40.647
<v Speaker 1>I wasn't ready to be invested in in right away.

0:33:41.727 --> 0:33:45.367
<v Speaker 1>Love though. Love is where it is where you place it.

0:33:45.407 --> 0:33:48.207
<v Speaker 1>I placed love in my children, and because I know

0:33:48.407 --> 0:33:52.927
<v Speaker 1>how that will be not just reciprocated, but reciprocated immediately

0:33:53.007 --> 0:33:56.807
<v Speaker 1>and tenfold compared to what you think you've just lost.

0:33:56.887 --> 0:33:59.847
<v Speaker 1>You think you've just lost something, but that can be

0:33:59.887 --> 0:34:02.247
<v Speaker 1>replaced in a lot of things. You can find love

0:34:02.287 --> 0:34:05.247
<v Speaker 1>in a lot of places. You can find love in

0:34:05.847 --> 0:34:09.927
<v Speaker 1>just simple passions. And what is your passion? Find it immediately,

0:34:10.087 --> 0:34:12.367
<v Speaker 1>come out here and look for it. It's not a person.

0:34:12.647 --> 0:34:14.647
<v Speaker 1>It could be a thing, and it could be an activity.

0:34:14.687 --> 0:34:17.607
<v Speaker 1>It could it's it's everywhere as long as you're looking

0:34:17.607 --> 0:34:19.567
<v Speaker 1>for it, to not just be invested in one thing.

0:34:20.087 --> 0:34:23.567
<v Speaker 1>If that makes sense, it does make sense for you.

0:34:23.687 --> 0:34:26.767
<v Speaker 2>I wanted to obviously talk about music. Is that does

0:34:26.807 --> 0:34:27.487
<v Speaker 2>that help you?

0:34:27.687 --> 0:34:27.847
<v Speaker 3>Oh?

0:34:27.927 --> 0:34:29.487
<v Speaker 1>Gotcha?

0:34:29.607 --> 0:34:32.967
<v Speaker 2>I was going to say, because it's obviously it was

0:34:32.967 --> 0:34:38.807
<v Speaker 2>there before. Obviously, it's what your world has been. Is

0:34:38.847 --> 0:34:40.367
<v Speaker 2>it one of the things that helped you at your

0:34:40.407 --> 0:34:42.687
<v Speaker 2>lowest or not? Does it feel like pressure.

0:34:43.527 --> 0:34:47.647
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, well no, I mean it depends the management

0:34:47.687 --> 0:34:51.127
<v Speaker 1>that I was in before I changed. There was always

0:34:51.167 --> 0:34:55.167
<v Speaker 1>pressure to be something right now, and in not necessarily

0:34:55.207 --> 0:34:58.727
<v Speaker 1>the ways that I wanted to, because see, music is

0:34:59.047 --> 0:35:04.447
<v Speaker 1>so connected to my core that it just did not

0:35:04.607 --> 0:35:08.447
<v Speaker 1>feel right to be getting the end, to be getting

0:35:08.487 --> 0:35:13.247
<v Speaker 1>something that's the result for a very pure monetary reason.

0:35:13.927 --> 0:35:16.567
<v Speaker 1>The remuneration part of it is just it was just

0:35:16.647 --> 0:35:19.727
<v Speaker 1>driving me insane and in fact away from something that

0:35:19.807 --> 0:35:22.407
<v Speaker 1>I love, that is like my passion. You know. I

0:35:22.407 --> 0:35:27.527
<v Speaker 1>always think about, you know, that weird ball that's got

0:35:27.527 --> 0:35:29.447
<v Speaker 1>this electricity inside of it and you put your hand

0:35:29.447 --> 0:35:30.007
<v Speaker 1>and you can see it.

0:35:30.087 --> 0:35:32.327
<v Speaker 2>And it goes yeah, yeah, yeah, you put your hand.

0:35:32.527 --> 0:35:35.447
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. It just wasn't doing music. Wasn't doing that for

0:35:35.527 --> 0:35:40.087
<v Speaker 1>me under that relationship, under that marriage, you know, and

0:35:40.127 --> 0:35:43.047
<v Speaker 1>that was a seventeen year marriage that I needed. I

0:35:43.087 --> 0:35:45.167
<v Speaker 1>didn't know, I didn't know what it was going to

0:35:45.167 --> 0:35:47.207
<v Speaker 1>look like beyond on the other side of that in

0:35:47.247 --> 0:35:49.327
<v Speaker 1>a different way, but I just didn't want it to

0:35:49.327 --> 0:35:52.567
<v Speaker 1>be that anymore where it was just driven monetarily for

0:35:53.287 --> 0:35:55.767
<v Speaker 1>you know, for all of these reasons, that just sucked

0:35:55.807 --> 0:35:59.127
<v Speaker 1>the total love out of the room. I don't want

0:35:59.127 --> 0:36:00.367
<v Speaker 1>to do music like that.

0:36:00.367 --> 0:36:02.607
<v Speaker 2>That's a fine line, right is that with your I

0:36:02.607 --> 0:36:05.447
<v Speaker 2>mean art sounds like a hatty word, but it's true.

0:36:05.607 --> 0:36:09.087
<v Speaker 2>When your art pays the bills, it's hard to be

0:36:10.127 --> 0:36:13.567
<v Speaker 2>to marry those things when this is pulling the love

0:36:13.567 --> 0:36:16.247
<v Speaker 2>of it away. Yeah, And there must have been pressure

0:36:16.287 --> 0:36:18.127
<v Speaker 2>for you. You know, you're a single mom. You've got

0:36:18.167 --> 0:36:19.287
<v Speaker 2>to make a living like.

0:36:19.847 --> 0:36:22.647
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And that was the pressures, wasn't it, As is

0:36:23.127 --> 0:36:26.247
<v Speaker 1>the roof over the head and the food on the table,

0:36:26.967 --> 0:36:30.327
<v Speaker 1>education and everything that comes with, you know, giving them

0:36:30.647 --> 0:36:34.687
<v Speaker 1>the extra curriculars as well, providing for them in every

0:36:34.727 --> 0:36:37.167
<v Speaker 1>single sense of the word. Especially as a single mom.

0:36:37.167 --> 0:36:39.007
<v Speaker 1>You've got to you've got to put it out there,

0:36:39.247 --> 0:36:43.647
<v Speaker 1>har Yeah, to form, to create that the world that's

0:36:43.687 --> 0:36:45.447
<v Speaker 1>going to bounce back to them in ways that you

0:36:45.487 --> 0:36:49.567
<v Speaker 1>want them to be rewarded by. And I found that

0:36:49.807 --> 0:36:54.767
<v Speaker 1>it changed me in that my responses to say emails

0:36:54.847 --> 0:36:58.967
<v Speaker 1>would stop, my answering or returning answering the phone or

0:36:59.007 --> 0:37:02.967
<v Speaker 1>returning phone calls would stop. So it was affecting my

0:37:03.047 --> 0:37:07.687
<v Speaker 1>business relationships. Every writing I was hiding, hiding from something

0:37:07.687 --> 0:37:09.767
<v Speaker 1>I didn't want. But but it was It's like, well,

0:37:10.127 --> 0:37:11.967
<v Speaker 1>It took a long time to realize that that's what

0:37:12.047 --> 0:37:15.007
<v Speaker 1>it was, because, like, hey, it's music, haven't I got

0:37:15.007 --> 0:37:17.367
<v Speaker 1>the best job in the world. I'm making money from

0:37:17.367 --> 0:37:20.527
<v Speaker 1>something that I love. It's my passion. It can very

0:37:20.847 --> 0:37:23.047
<v Speaker 1>very quickly, and if you're not aware of it becomes

0:37:23.047 --> 0:37:25.887
<v Speaker 1>something that you didn't always want it to be. And

0:37:26.247 --> 0:37:29.607
<v Speaker 1>with creating the type of music that I want to create,

0:37:29.647 --> 0:37:32.927
<v Speaker 1>which is the current shell that I live in with

0:37:33.007 --> 0:37:36.927
<v Speaker 1>the right types of me feelings inside. With that, it

0:37:37.127 --> 0:37:40.727
<v Speaker 1>just again, I've just reconnected with that. You know, that

0:37:40.847 --> 0:37:44.327
<v Speaker 1>buzzy twenty two year old that signed a record deal

0:37:44.367 --> 0:37:47.047
<v Speaker 1>back when I was twenty one, back in nineteen ninety one,

0:37:47.167 --> 0:37:51.447
<v Speaker 1>ninety ninety two, and I've rediscovered her. But I'm an

0:37:51.487 --> 0:37:54.727
<v Speaker 1>older person now and I've had all of this stuff

0:37:54.767 --> 0:37:58.327
<v Speaker 1>happen in the world, and with raising kids along the way,

0:37:58.367 --> 0:38:02.087
<v Speaker 1>and relationships and a divorce. My god, it would have

0:38:02.127 --> 0:38:05.367
<v Speaker 1>thought I had a divorce in there as well, and

0:38:05.447 --> 0:38:10.687
<v Speaker 1>it all adds to the wonderful It's Yea flavors the

0:38:10.767 --> 0:38:12.967
<v Speaker 1>music in quite a different way, I'm sure.

0:38:13.207 --> 0:38:13.407
<v Speaker 3>Well.

0:38:13.487 --> 0:38:17.207
<v Speaker 2>This album I was reading that, I was listening to

0:38:17.287 --> 0:38:21.167
<v Speaker 2>the single today It's Beautiful. I was reading that it's

0:38:21.287 --> 0:38:25.487
<v Speaker 2>taken you to different places Papua New Guinea, New Zealand.

0:38:25.607 --> 0:38:26.127
<v Speaker 1>Is that right?

0:38:26.607 --> 0:38:29.687
<v Speaker 2>For the influences and the sounds of it, you clearly

0:38:29.767 --> 0:38:36.487
<v Speaker 2>still have like the adventurer, like a passion there for this,

0:38:36.767 --> 0:38:39.407
<v Speaker 2>Like you clearly still you're like, I'm not done. I'm

0:38:39.447 --> 0:38:41.927
<v Speaker 2>not just taking an easy road.

0:38:42.247 --> 0:38:45.127
<v Speaker 3>Like is that true? You've still got the fire burning.

0:38:45.447 --> 0:38:47.767
<v Speaker 1>I've still got the fire burning. Definitely. You get the

0:38:47.887 --> 0:38:50.847
<v Speaker 1>right people, you get in contact with the right team

0:38:50.887 --> 0:38:52.847
<v Speaker 1>of people. I feel like I'm in the right team

0:38:52.887 --> 0:38:57.367
<v Speaker 1>of people right now, working with mostly women, which I

0:38:57.407 --> 0:39:01.087
<v Speaker 1>haven't done in my life before. I've really been in

0:39:01.207 --> 0:39:04.367
<v Speaker 1>that world that people describe as a male dominated industry.

0:39:04.687 --> 0:39:08.447
<v Speaker 1>I feel like that that's where I put a stop

0:39:08.487 --> 0:39:10.807
<v Speaker 1>to that and decide that, you know, there are women

0:39:10.847 --> 0:39:13.487
<v Speaker 1>doing a lot more in this field than ever, ever,

0:39:13.607 --> 0:39:17.127
<v Speaker 1>ever before. And I know that because I judge for

0:39:17.167 --> 0:39:20.847
<v Speaker 1>the Australian Women's Music Awards and just seeing the women,

0:39:21.127 --> 0:39:23.407
<v Speaker 1>the vastness of women and what they've done in their

0:39:23.447 --> 0:39:28.847
<v Speaker 1>careers over the last thirty years is incredible. And maybe

0:39:28.847 --> 0:39:31.847
<v Speaker 1>that was the secret too, is just placing women as

0:39:31.927 --> 0:39:34.367
<v Speaker 1>part of my team to make that because you know,

0:39:34.407 --> 0:39:38.087
<v Speaker 1>women know how to repair very quickly, and we decision

0:39:38.167 --> 0:39:41.847
<v Speaker 1>make It's innate, It's instinctive, isn't it that a survival

0:39:41.927 --> 0:39:43.487
<v Speaker 1>is like you know where to go to It's not

0:39:43.607 --> 0:39:46.527
<v Speaker 1>too far to know how to pick yourself up and

0:39:46.567 --> 0:39:50.927
<v Speaker 1>move right along. So that's how I've found where my

0:39:51.087 --> 0:39:53.207
<v Speaker 1>music feels the best at the moment because it's got

0:39:53.247 --> 0:39:56.407
<v Speaker 1>the right team, mostly women. But then I've got to

0:39:56.487 --> 0:39:59.047
<v Speaker 1>sort of now shine a light to the producer that's

0:39:59.167 --> 0:40:03.047
<v Speaker 1>done that I've worked with for this album. David Bridy

0:40:03.567 --> 0:40:09.327
<v Speaker 1>is from a band called Not Drowning Waving, and his

0:40:09.367 --> 0:40:11.327
<v Speaker 1>work goes way back to when he was in his

0:40:11.407 --> 0:40:15.407
<v Speaker 1>early to mid twenties and the like minded people that

0:40:15.447 --> 0:40:18.087
<v Speaker 1>were in the band with him getting a job in

0:40:18.247 --> 0:40:21.647
<v Speaker 1>Rabawel in Papua New Guinea, falling in love with the

0:40:21.687 --> 0:40:24.127
<v Speaker 1>place and the people so much that he now speaks

0:40:24.127 --> 0:40:27.607
<v Speaker 1>the language fluently and has worked with a lot of

0:40:28.207 --> 0:40:32.967
<v Speaker 1>Melanesian musicians, and I'm from a Melanesian culture and so

0:40:33.087 --> 0:40:38.927
<v Speaker 1>having his sensitivity and sensibilities about our cultures because they

0:40:38.927 --> 0:40:42.207
<v Speaker 1>are different. You know, Solomon's to public and inst Torrestraate Islanders.

0:40:43.247 --> 0:40:46.287
<v Speaker 1>I did revisit him way back with the last management.

0:40:46.327 --> 0:40:48.607
<v Speaker 1>He said, it's not We're never ever going to make

0:40:48.647 --> 0:40:52.967
<v Speaker 1>another Stylin' Up. It was going to be a reissue

0:40:53.407 --> 0:40:56.927
<v Speaker 1>or a reimagining of Stylin Up, the first album. He said,

0:40:56.967 --> 0:40:59.847
<v Speaker 1>you can't. You can't reproduce a first album, not that

0:40:59.967 --> 0:41:02.927
<v Speaker 1>as iconic as it is and was the first of

0:41:02.967 --> 0:41:05.887
<v Speaker 1>its kind from an artist that was being introduced to

0:41:05.927 --> 0:41:10.367
<v Speaker 1>the world with a Melanesian background, who's female. You're the first,

0:41:10.407 --> 0:41:13.247
<v Speaker 1>You've opened the door for the rest to come along.

0:41:13.847 --> 0:41:16.007
<v Speaker 1>We can't make another, not the way that you want to.

0:41:16.087 --> 0:41:19.407
<v Speaker 1>So that saddened me, and I knew instantly that that

0:41:19.527 --> 0:41:23.207
<v Speaker 1>there was something wrong in my style and in my

0:41:23.327 --> 0:41:28.007
<v Speaker 1>direction of the way I wanted to create music. So

0:41:28.127 --> 0:41:30.127
<v Speaker 1>I sat with that for a long time, and then

0:41:30.327 --> 0:41:33.647
<v Speaker 1>the pandemic happened, and so too did the end of

0:41:33.847 --> 0:41:37.207
<v Speaker 1>my management at the time, and it was time to

0:41:37.207 --> 0:41:41.407
<v Speaker 1>revisit that conversation with David and say to him, but

0:41:41.647 --> 0:41:44.767
<v Speaker 1>you know what, as well, David, I'm not just shedding

0:41:44.847 --> 0:41:50.167
<v Speaker 1>my management, but I'm shedding also this really dark relationship

0:41:50.167 --> 0:41:55.167
<v Speaker 1>with alcohol as well. And in order to do where

0:41:55.207 --> 0:41:56.847
<v Speaker 1>I want to go, I've got to get rid of

0:41:56.887 --> 0:41:59.887
<v Speaker 1>all of that. So he was like yeah, I really

0:41:59.887 --> 0:42:02.407
<v Speaker 1>respect that. And if you're ready to go in that direction,

0:42:03.047 --> 0:42:04.527
<v Speaker 1>just give us a buzz and we'll do it. We

0:42:04.607 --> 0:42:08.007
<v Speaker 1>caught up on life and what had happened since that

0:42:08.047 --> 0:42:12.687
<v Speaker 1>first album till that very moment, and he took on

0:42:13.567 --> 0:42:19.567
<v Speaker 1>this idea of waku, which is something that women make.

0:42:19.807 --> 0:42:23.887
<v Speaker 1>Women make mats. We make them out of coconut leaves.

0:42:23.927 --> 0:42:26.647
<v Speaker 1>And my mother taught us how to prepare the coconut leaves,

0:42:27.327 --> 0:42:29.967
<v Speaker 1>drying them out and then wrapping them in these circles

0:42:29.967 --> 0:42:31.607
<v Speaker 1>and then leaving them out in the sun to dry

0:42:32.087 --> 0:42:35.087
<v Speaker 1>from that process of the tree to the process, and

0:42:35.087 --> 0:42:38.727
<v Speaker 1>then making them mat itself out of pandanus leaves, coconut

0:42:38.807 --> 0:42:41.807
<v Speaker 1>leaves and this wild read that grows on Sideby Island

0:42:41.807 --> 0:42:45.767
<v Speaker 1>where my mum was born. He took the idea of

0:42:45.847 --> 0:42:52.927
<v Speaker 1>weaving the songs that my grandfather had composed and the

0:42:52.967 --> 0:42:57.727
<v Speaker 1>story of my life, and we came up with this

0:42:57.767 --> 0:43:02.287
<v Speaker 1>beautiful concept of weaving all of these stories together. And

0:43:02.327 --> 0:43:07.007
<v Speaker 1>the music just came naturally, because it's if you're talking

0:43:07.527 --> 0:43:13.927
<v Speaker 1>from your soul, your heart, it's music, it's melodies, it's

0:43:14.407 --> 0:43:18.887
<v Speaker 1>floating around and this might sound trite, but was it healing?

0:43:19.927 --> 0:43:24.047
<v Speaker 1>This is my healing album. Addiction is so hard. Like

0:43:24.567 --> 0:43:27.967
<v Speaker 1>people have addictions, it's okay, And no one talks about

0:43:27.967 --> 0:43:34.287
<v Speaker 1>those addictions publicly in my family at least, well yeah,

0:43:34.687 --> 0:43:35.287
<v Speaker 1>or in my SOAC.

0:43:35.407 --> 0:43:37.527
<v Speaker 2>I wonder if we're getting any better at talking about

0:43:37.567 --> 0:43:39.567
<v Speaker 2>it or if it still comes with a lot of shame,

0:43:39.687 --> 0:43:40.607
<v Speaker 2>which it shouldn't have.

0:43:41.327 --> 0:43:44.527
<v Speaker 1>Well for me, it comes with addiction. For me, it

0:43:44.527 --> 0:43:49.167
<v Speaker 1>comes with a lot of shame, it really does. I'm

0:43:49.167 --> 0:43:51.687
<v Speaker 1>going to be dealing with it to my grave, you know,

0:43:51.807 --> 0:43:54.927
<v Speaker 1>And not that I have any plans on getting out

0:43:54.927 --> 0:43:58.207
<v Speaker 1>of my life anytime soon, but you know, I guess

0:43:58.687 --> 0:44:00.647
<v Speaker 1>it was the end of my last management when it

0:44:00.687 --> 0:44:02.207
<v Speaker 1>was brought up. You've got to be dealing with your

0:44:02.207 --> 0:44:08.167
<v Speaker 1>addiction and actually somebody mentioning it and you going, I know,

0:44:08.527 --> 0:44:11.807
<v Speaker 1>and then you actually dealing with it. Are so different

0:44:11.807 --> 0:44:17.327
<v Speaker 1>components of dealing with addiction. My choice of addiction has

0:44:17.527 --> 0:44:22.447
<v Speaker 1>changed throughout my life. But whatever that is, whatever the

0:44:22.487 --> 0:44:24.807
<v Speaker 1>reason for getting to a place where you feel like

0:44:24.847 --> 0:44:27.807
<v Speaker 1>you need to do something very bad to your body

0:44:28.647 --> 0:44:32.287
<v Speaker 1>and your soul and your mind, working that out and

0:44:32.327 --> 0:44:34.967
<v Speaker 1>why you actually like, what is the reason that you're

0:44:35.007 --> 0:44:37.687
<v Speaker 1>running away from is the big thing isn't. It's the

0:44:37.727 --> 0:44:44.167
<v Speaker 1>big question, what is what is making you do? So? No,

0:44:44.247 --> 0:44:47.727
<v Speaker 1>I don't think I have. Maybe that's it. Maybe I'm

0:44:47.767 --> 0:44:50.927
<v Speaker 1>through the process of using my music to help me

0:44:51.127 --> 0:44:54.727
<v Speaker 1>answer what that is for me, you know, And you

0:44:54.767 --> 0:44:57.847
<v Speaker 1>can hear my voice now it's changed because it is

0:44:57.887 --> 0:45:02.967
<v Speaker 1>I'm living it. I'm still living the process of putting

0:45:05.327 --> 0:45:07.527
<v Speaker 1>finding out how to heal myself through music.

0:45:09.247 --> 0:45:11.967
<v Speaker 2>Now, how do you continue to be heard in an

0:45:12.047 --> 0:45:15.247
<v Speaker 2>industry that's committed to keeping the mic away from mid women?

0:45:16.327 --> 0:45:19.207
<v Speaker 2>I ask Christine next, at a time when so many

0:45:19.207 --> 0:45:21.247
<v Speaker 2>of us have so much to say, how do you

0:45:21.247 --> 0:45:24.167
<v Speaker 2>find the strength to speak up when everybody's telling you

0:45:24.447 --> 0:45:27.607
<v Speaker 2>that they might rather listen to someone you know, younger?

0:45:28.207 --> 0:45:33.647
<v Speaker 2>That's coming up next. The music industry isn't all that

0:45:33.727 --> 0:45:36.607
<v Speaker 2>kind either to women getting older as well. They have

0:45:36.687 --> 0:45:38.767
<v Speaker 2>a mind of bringing all your wisdom with you.

0:45:39.607 --> 0:45:43.887
<v Speaker 1>And you know, if if I if I can say

0:45:43.887 --> 0:45:47.487
<v Speaker 1>it and be honest, yeah, it's you know, it's not

0:45:47.687 --> 0:45:51.207
<v Speaker 1>kind because it's just not made for old women, is it.

0:45:51.047 --> 0:45:55.247
<v Speaker 1>It's a whole other If music's about making is about

0:45:55.247 --> 0:45:58.967
<v Speaker 1>becoming as famous as famous as possible and making shit

0:45:59.047 --> 0:46:02.047
<v Speaker 1>tons of money, then the older you get. It's definitely

0:46:02.087 --> 0:46:04.527
<v Speaker 1>not designed for older women like that, unless you had

0:46:04.567 --> 0:46:09.087
<v Speaker 1>a crazy, crazy successful youth and then it just follows

0:46:09.127 --> 0:46:12.687
<v Speaker 1>you as you reinvent yourself and then you know, become

0:46:12.687 --> 0:46:15.567
<v Speaker 1>this money machine. It's that would be easy, but it's

0:46:15.647 --> 0:46:19.927
<v Speaker 1>just really hard to get the same recognition as an

0:46:19.927 --> 0:46:22.927
<v Speaker 1>older musician than what you got when you're in your

0:46:23.207 --> 0:46:26.287
<v Speaker 1>twenties or when you were younger than being in your mids.

0:46:26.407 --> 0:46:27.447
<v Speaker 3>I reckon, that's say.

0:46:27.767 --> 0:46:29.687
<v Speaker 2>It's kind of a mirror to the way that a

0:46:29.727 --> 0:46:33.807
<v Speaker 2>lot of women's stories go, which is that as you

0:46:33.847 --> 0:46:37.207
<v Speaker 2>get older, people are like looking away a bit like

0:46:37.407 --> 0:46:38.407
<v Speaker 2>what has she got to offer?

0:46:38.567 --> 0:46:38.607
<v Speaker 1>What?

0:46:38.847 --> 0:46:41.247
<v Speaker 2>Actually, we're at the time in our life when we

0:46:41.327 --> 0:46:44.527
<v Speaker 2>have the most to offer, because listening to you tell

0:46:44.567 --> 0:46:48.607
<v Speaker 2>your story today and knowing all the depth you know,

0:46:48.687 --> 0:46:52.087
<v Speaker 2>all the things you obviously behind that, and the depth

0:46:52.127 --> 0:46:56.247
<v Speaker 2>of culture and experience, like, how could you not have

0:46:56.327 --> 0:46:59.287
<v Speaker 2>interesting things to be saying and see putting into the

0:46:59.287 --> 0:47:03.367
<v Speaker 2>world rather than if you were twenty Again, we do

0:47:03.487 --> 0:47:06.007
<v Speaker 2>not to say you weren't interesting when you were twenty Christie.

0:47:07.087 --> 0:47:11.687
<v Speaker 1>And it was only in Sting because no one had

0:47:11.727 --> 0:47:13.287
<v Speaker 1>heard of the Torres Straight Islands. And I'm not going

0:47:13.367 --> 0:47:15.927
<v Speaker 1>to say that I'm obviously interesting because I can sing,

0:47:15.927 --> 0:47:17.767
<v Speaker 1>and it's like, where did you come from? Oh my god,

0:47:17.807 --> 0:47:20.687
<v Speaker 1>where have we unearthed you from? It was only interesting

0:47:20.687 --> 0:47:24.207
<v Speaker 1>because people hadn't heard of where I'd come from, and

0:47:24.247 --> 0:47:28.087
<v Speaker 1>it was just new. It just wasn't wasn't seen before

0:47:29.047 --> 0:47:32.327
<v Speaker 1>I read. I read and look at I read magazine articles,

0:47:32.367 --> 0:47:34.487
<v Speaker 1>I read all of that stuff that I did when

0:47:34.487 --> 0:47:38.127
<v Speaker 1>I was younger, like, and I cannot believe that. I yeah,

0:47:38.167 --> 0:47:42.247
<v Speaker 1>it's a bloody shut up, you idiot. Oh god, what

0:47:42.247 --> 0:47:44.167
<v Speaker 1>what the heck? Why did I say that?

0:47:44.447 --> 0:47:45.087
<v Speaker 2>Or oh?

0:47:45.087 --> 0:47:46.727
<v Speaker 1>They blew the context out of that one. It's like,

0:47:47.127 --> 0:47:49.767
<v Speaker 1>I cannot stand things that came out of my mouth

0:47:49.807 --> 0:47:50.567
<v Speaker 1>when I was younger.

0:47:50.647 --> 0:47:51.367
<v Speaker 2>I like, what.

0:47:52.807 --> 0:47:55.247
<v Speaker 1>Just different, just things. It's like, oh, that's so silly.

0:47:55.247 --> 0:47:57.847
<v Speaker 1>It was so twenty three. Oh god, you know, just

0:47:57.927 --> 0:47:59.127
<v Speaker 1>like the younger woman.

0:47:59.047 --> 0:48:00.967
<v Speaker 2>Again, that's that's like all of us, but all of

0:48:01.007 --> 0:48:02.327
<v Speaker 2>us don't have it in magazines.

0:48:02.967 --> 0:48:04.847
<v Speaker 1>I can. I've got I've got evidence of how I

0:48:04.927 --> 0:48:07.087
<v Speaker 1>used to say. But one thing never changed my love

0:48:07.687 --> 0:48:11.647
<v Speaker 1>was the fact that I always I'm culture first, very

0:48:11.687 --> 0:48:15.767
<v Speaker 1>proud of my my heritage, very proud. And this album

0:48:16.007 --> 0:48:22.367
<v Speaker 1>is that right? Oh but I must see, music makes

0:48:22.367 --> 0:48:22.967
<v Speaker 1>me get emotional.

0:48:23.127 --> 0:48:24.687
<v Speaker 3>My kids make me get I wanted to.

0:48:24.887 --> 0:48:26.847
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna, I promise, I'm going to stop making you

0:48:26.887 --> 0:48:27.967
<v Speaker 2>get emotional in a minute.

0:48:28.167 --> 0:48:28.567
<v Speaker 3>But I do.

0:48:28.687 --> 0:48:30.327
<v Speaker 1>You're saying that like it's a bad thing.

0:48:30.407 --> 0:48:33.767
<v Speaker 3>This is You're right, I should really be I shouldn't be.

0:48:33.927 --> 0:48:36.607
<v Speaker 1>No, no, no, I'm in a really happy place. I'm in

0:48:36.607 --> 0:48:40.407
<v Speaker 1>a good place. I don't I don't obviously talk about

0:48:40.407 --> 0:48:43.487
<v Speaker 1>my addiction a lot. So if that's the very thing

0:48:43.527 --> 0:48:46.087
<v Speaker 1>that's made me emotional, remember we are here talking about

0:48:46.087 --> 0:48:49.447
<v Speaker 1>my music as well, and I'm so so happy about

0:48:49.487 --> 0:48:53.407
<v Speaker 1>my music. But as David Bradley says to me, Annud,

0:48:55.247 --> 0:48:59.407
<v Speaker 1>this album was never meant to be until now. M

0:49:00.807 --> 0:49:07.287
<v Speaker 1>it's my best music because it's my life. It's got

0:49:07.327 --> 0:49:08.607
<v Speaker 1>my life experiences.

0:49:08.727 --> 0:49:14.007
<v Speaker 2>But so when you listen to it as you should be,

0:49:14.767 --> 0:49:15.647
<v Speaker 2>menopause is ship.

0:49:15.767 --> 0:49:18.527
<v Speaker 1>Menopause is shit because you know, people say about your

0:49:18.527 --> 0:49:20.807
<v Speaker 1>hormans and everything, but just oh my god, I've just

0:49:20.847 --> 0:49:24.247
<v Speaker 1>got I've always got like a bag of tears that

0:49:24.607 --> 0:49:27.927
<v Speaker 1>I have to pack when I get to virgin and quantas.

0:49:28.327 --> 0:49:29.847
<v Speaker 1>You know, it's like they say, how many you know,

0:49:29.847 --> 0:49:31.487
<v Speaker 1>how many kilos have you got in your bag. It's like,

0:49:31.527 --> 0:49:34.847
<v Speaker 1>can I also count the bags tears that come along

0:49:34.847 --> 0:49:35.127
<v Speaker 1>with me?

0:49:35.327 --> 0:49:39.447
<v Speaker 2>You're so right, like you just so teary, emotional post

0:49:39.447 --> 0:49:40.007
<v Speaker 2>of the surface.

0:49:40.047 --> 0:49:42.127
<v Speaker 1>I one relate to that.

0:49:42.567 --> 0:49:44.647
<v Speaker 2>But what I was asking you is when you were

0:49:44.687 --> 0:49:46.887
<v Speaker 2>just saying that and that this album is you and

0:49:46.927 --> 0:49:49.807
<v Speaker 2>it's your culture and it's this is the moment. Does

0:49:49.847 --> 0:49:51.447
<v Speaker 2>it make so when I asked you at the very

0:49:51.447 --> 0:49:54.207
<v Speaker 2>beginning of this, are you a midwoman who is in

0:49:54.287 --> 0:49:56.727
<v Speaker 2>her power and proud? Do you feel it when you

0:49:56.767 --> 0:49:57.407
<v Speaker 2>think of that?

0:49:57.767 --> 0:50:01.807
<v Speaker 1>Because that, I mean, oh gosh, I am woman. Hear

0:50:01.887 --> 0:50:07.367
<v Speaker 1>me raw? You know? Is such It sums everything up

0:50:07.687 --> 0:50:12.007
<v Speaker 1>for this stage in my life, Like I don't care

0:50:12.087 --> 0:50:14.967
<v Speaker 1>what I look like. I don't care what I'm wearing,

0:50:15.687 --> 0:50:20.807
<v Speaker 1>and I don't givet flying epps if anybody doesn't like

0:50:20.847 --> 0:50:24.607
<v Speaker 1>what I've got to say. I don't care about saying

0:50:24.607 --> 0:50:28.767
<v Speaker 1>that I'm a bloody addict. I don't I'm not apologizing.

0:50:29.007 --> 0:50:34.327
<v Speaker 1>I'm not apologetic. I have got no sorries and I'm

0:50:34.327 --> 0:50:39.807
<v Speaker 1>not going to defend myself anymore. This is the music

0:50:40.647 --> 0:50:44.727
<v Speaker 1>that I was meant to record ten years ago. But

0:50:44.767 --> 0:50:47.287
<v Speaker 1>as David Brady said, you know this is the music

0:50:47.287 --> 0:50:50.127
<v Speaker 1>that you were supposed to be making now, because now

0:50:50.327 --> 0:50:53.807
<v Speaker 1>is the time that you're already not your audience, not

0:50:53.967 --> 0:50:55.247
<v Speaker 1>the world, but you.

0:50:56.687 --> 0:50:58.087
<v Speaker 2>There's one more thing I want to ask you about

0:50:58.127 --> 0:51:00.527
<v Speaker 2>music that also ties back to where we started this,

0:51:00.647 --> 0:51:04.327
<v Speaker 2>which was talking about your kids and your family. Your

0:51:04.407 --> 0:51:07.247
<v Speaker 2>daughter is a singer too, right, Oh? Yes, and you

0:51:07.327 --> 0:51:09.967
<v Speaker 2>sing with her, right will you?

0:51:10.287 --> 0:51:12.687
<v Speaker 1>Well? Hang on, she sings with me? Oh that's y.

0:51:13.047 --> 0:51:16.807
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, let's just get that order of the hierarchy. She

0:51:16.927 --> 0:51:21.407
<v Speaker 4>sings with you, of course, she'd love that though, you

0:51:21.447 --> 0:51:23.167
<v Speaker 4>sing with your daughter, don't you.

0:51:23.167 --> 0:51:26.047
<v Speaker 2>No, I didn't mean it like that. I meant exactly

0:51:26.047 --> 0:51:28.767
<v Speaker 2>the way that you correct she sings with you?

0:51:29.567 --> 0:51:32.007
<v Speaker 1>Is that a joy? Oh? My gosh?

0:51:32.567 --> 0:51:34.087
<v Speaker 3>And did she?

0:51:33.127 --> 0:51:36.967
<v Speaker 1>And she got of course. So it's the obvious answer

0:51:37.127 --> 0:51:41.447
<v Speaker 1>is she's joyful. It's a joy. But this she is,

0:51:41.487 --> 0:51:44.607
<v Speaker 1>she's like a little manager. She's like a little she

0:51:44.847 --> 0:51:47.247
<v Speaker 1>is a tutor force. She's a little pocket rocket. So

0:51:47.287 --> 0:51:49.647
<v Speaker 1>she didn't get the annu height in the family. And

0:51:49.687 --> 0:51:52.367
<v Speaker 1>I'm not saying many accounts that I'm a hom a

0:51:52.447 --> 0:51:56.527
<v Speaker 1>tall person, but she is. She's she's larger than life.

0:51:56.527 --> 0:51:58.287
<v Speaker 1>And that's what I feel like she was trying to

0:51:58.287 --> 0:52:01.167
<v Speaker 1>tell me she's this person who just she has this

0:52:01.327 --> 0:52:07.087
<v Speaker 1>knowing beyond what young people her age should know. And

0:52:07.127 --> 0:52:10.207
<v Speaker 1>she sings like an angel, but she doesn't sound like me,

0:52:10.807 --> 0:52:13.887
<v Speaker 1>but we but yet we do compliment each other. People

0:52:13.887 --> 0:52:15.807
<v Speaker 1>say you sound like your mom, and it's like, oh god, no,

0:52:15.887 --> 0:52:18.407
<v Speaker 1>you should slap those people when they say that she

0:52:18.407 --> 0:52:21.087
<v Speaker 1>sounds like herself. She sounds like herself, but she's also

0:52:21.127 --> 0:52:29.047
<v Speaker 1>this impressive being and that wonderful part of motherhood that

0:52:29.127 --> 0:52:32.287
<v Speaker 1>makes me feel like, gosh, you really did do well

0:52:32.327 --> 0:52:32.847
<v Speaker 1>with that one.

0:52:34.807 --> 0:52:36.647
<v Speaker 2>You know you were saying before that the work you

0:52:36.687 --> 0:52:39.807
<v Speaker 2>were doing that you didn't feel connected to. Is it

0:52:39.887 --> 0:52:42.727
<v Speaker 2>really nerve wracking pushing something out there that you are

0:52:42.807 --> 0:52:43.887
<v Speaker 2>really connected to.

0:52:44.127 --> 0:52:47.527
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And we talked about pressure before and I'd live.

0:52:47.647 --> 0:52:49.727
<v Speaker 1>I said, I didn't feel that pressure, but it is

0:52:49.767 --> 0:52:51.967
<v Speaker 1>nerve wracking. And I've always said because I've had two

0:52:52.047 --> 0:52:54.807
<v Speaker 1>years to, you know, work on you know, if people

0:52:54.927 --> 0:52:57.527
<v Speaker 1>don't aren't attracted to the album and don't take it

0:52:57.607 --> 0:53:00.327
<v Speaker 1>just you know, don't don't feel so personal about It's

0:53:00.327 --> 0:53:04.047
<v Speaker 1>hard not to because it's your child, it is, but

0:53:04.567 --> 0:53:06.567
<v Speaker 1>you know, if they don't, it's I've got to go

0:53:06.647 --> 0:53:09.527
<v Speaker 1>back to why did I make this album? What have

0:53:09.567 --> 0:53:12.647
<v Speaker 1>I been through to get to this point? And am

0:53:12.687 --> 0:53:20.327
<v Speaker 1>I proud of it? Regardless? Fuck? Yeah, that was so great.

0:53:20.807 --> 0:53:22.047
<v Speaker 3>I feel like I want to give you a hug.

0:53:22.087 --> 0:53:22.927
<v Speaker 3>Is that appropriate or not?

0:53:23.127 --> 0:53:24.007
<v Speaker 1>No, it's appropriate.

0:53:29.007 --> 0:53:32.967
<v Speaker 2>Well I told you that was unexpected. I can't leave

0:53:33.007 --> 0:53:36.967
<v Speaker 2>that conversation or leave Mid without telling you to listen

0:53:37.127 --> 0:53:40.327
<v Speaker 2>to Christine our news new album. If you want to

0:53:40.367 --> 0:53:42.567
<v Speaker 2>hear what it sounds like for a woman to return

0:53:42.607 --> 0:53:45.807
<v Speaker 2>to her soul after years of battling with all kinds

0:53:45.807 --> 0:53:47.327
<v Speaker 2>of bullshit, it's for you.

0:53:54.287 --> 0:53:57.847
<v Speaker 1>Coming back my weaving.

0:53:59.367 --> 0:54:03.447
<v Speaker 2>It's called Wakou mineral a Minila. And if you want

0:54:03.447 --> 0:54:05.647
<v Speaker 2>to support a woman who's been told she's probably a

0:54:05.647 --> 0:54:08.207
<v Speaker 2>bit too old for all this pop music stuff despite

0:54:08.287 --> 0:54:11.327
<v Speaker 2>being at the napsolo top of her game, then it's

0:54:11.367 --> 0:54:13.687
<v Speaker 2>for you. And if you just want to listen to

0:54:13.807 --> 0:54:18.047
<v Speaker 2>exceptionally beautiful music deeply connected to culture, it's for you.

0:54:19.007 --> 0:54:20.167
<v Speaker 1>And now that I've stopped.

0:54:19.927 --> 0:54:21.447
<v Speaker 2>Telling you how to live your life, I want to

0:54:21.487 --> 0:54:24.327
<v Speaker 2>thank you and Christine of course, and all the MID

0:54:24.327 --> 0:54:27.087
<v Speaker 2>women and one man who've come on to share their

0:54:27.127 --> 0:54:30.407
<v Speaker 2>stories on the season one of this podcast. It's meant

0:54:30.447 --> 0:54:33.047
<v Speaker 2>everything to me as we've pushed this new little podcast

0:54:33.047 --> 0:54:36.487
<v Speaker 2>boat out into the open ocean. So please, if you

0:54:36.527 --> 0:54:39.287
<v Speaker 2>love this conversation, go find MID in your feed and

0:54:39.327 --> 0:54:42.447
<v Speaker 2>scroll back and listen to Julie Goodwin talk about mental health.

0:54:42.727 --> 0:54:45.487
<v Speaker 2>Listen to Helen Thorn talk about bodies, Catherine May talk

0:54:45.487 --> 0:54:49.007
<v Speaker 2>about burnout, Jackie Bailey talk about grief. Listen to all

0:54:49.047 --> 0:54:50.847
<v Speaker 2>of them, and if you love them and they mean

0:54:50.927 --> 0:54:54.247
<v Speaker 2>something to you and they helped you, then share. And

0:54:54.287 --> 0:54:57.247
<v Speaker 2>we will be back with Mid season two in just

0:54:57.447 --> 0:55:01.007
<v Speaker 2>a few weeks. Look out for us in your feeds

0:55:01.047 --> 0:55:03.647
<v Speaker 2>in early August. I can't wait to bring it to you.

0:55:04.087 --> 0:55:06.367
<v Speaker 2>Keep sending in the feedback to me. You can DM

0:55:06.407 --> 0:55:09.207
<v Speaker 2>me on Instagram. You can jump onto the mid by

0:55:09.247 --> 0:55:11.207
<v Speaker 2>my Mom and Mia Paige and tell me what you

0:55:11.207 --> 0:55:12.767
<v Speaker 2>think of the show and what you think we should

0:55:12.807 --> 0:55:15.047
<v Speaker 2>be talking about. I also just want to send out

0:55:15.087 --> 0:55:18.007
<v Speaker 2>an enormous thank you to our excellent producer, to Elysabizaz,

0:55:18.327 --> 0:55:21.247
<v Speaker 2>to all of the Mom and Mia podcast and editorial team,

0:55:21.687 --> 0:55:24.407
<v Speaker 2>and of course to you again for listening to MID.

0:55:24.647 --> 0:55:26.047
<v Speaker 1>I couldn't be happier that you're here.

0:55:26.807 --> 0:55:29.447
<v Speaker 2>Follow us, tell us what you think, and we'll see

0:55:29.487 --> 0:55:31.367
<v Speaker 2>you in a couple of weeks