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Speaker 1: You're listening to I'm MoMA Mia podcast. Hello and welcome

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Speaker 1: to MoMA Mire out Loud. It's what women are actually

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Speaker 1: talking about on Wednesday, the fourth of February. My name

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Speaker 1: is Holly Wayne right. I am am.

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Speaker 2: Vernham and I am Jesse Stevens, and I have come

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Speaker 2: from a morning full of appointments and I am so unprepared.

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Speaker 2: So I think this is going to be a little bit.

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Speaker 3: Of punt well to make yourself feel better while you're away,

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Speaker 3: holl And, I attempted to do an ad and all

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Speaker 3: we did was break the studio.

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Speaker 1: I kicked out a cord, I broke things. Things were

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Speaker 1: too loud, things are too quiet. So things have going

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Speaker 1: really well.

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Speaker 2: I'm severely lacking in facts. But what I did find

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Speaker 2: is that I have a lot of facts on hand

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Speaker 2: about Lewis Hamilton.

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Speaker 3: What that I die have to fall in here?

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Speaker 1: In here, Oh my goodness, I'm going to be here

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Speaker 1: for the girlies who do not know what F one

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Speaker 1: even is. Anyway, that's a hint about what's made our

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Speaker 1: agenda for today. But here is what is on it.

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Speaker 1: A neighbors star, a rewritten pop song, and a South

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Speaker 1: Park knockoff. Inside the Australian political campaign that seems to

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Speaker 1: be working.

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Speaker 3: Plus, as Jesse mentioned before, Kim Kardashian has ruined my

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Speaker 3: life specifically, which was quite mean.

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Speaker 2: We haven't spoken about and we've been saving it and

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Speaker 2: I just neede Holy to leave the room and you

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Speaker 2: and I.

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Speaker 1: Are going to be talking about Kim's new boyfriend. I've

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Speaker 1: heard he's a big day stop just stop.

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Speaker 2: And a viral sub stack this week says it's almost

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Speaker 2: never a bad idea to shut up. So what matters

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Speaker 2: more being right or not being annoying?

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Speaker 1: But first, in case you missed it, I don't think

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Speaker 1: he did. Did who watch the Grammys or bits of

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Speaker 1: the Grammys or snippets of the Grammys?

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Speaker 2: I just saw chapel grown snipples.

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Speaker 1: Well that's lucky because that's what we're going to be

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Speaker 1: discussing out of the whole Grammys.

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Speaker 3: That's what we're going to be discussing.

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Speaker 1: I also saw Harry Styles in green ballet flats and

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Speaker 1: a cropped crossed jacket. That interesting. Someone said he's in

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Speaker 1: this millennial Mum era jeans and the nice top here

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Speaker 1: for it. And of course the amazing Benito who bad

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Speaker 1: Bunny super Bowl next week? I think, yeah, so that's

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Speaker 1: all exciting. But anyway, blah blah blah blah blah, nipples.

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Speaker 2: Right, were they her real nipples? No?

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Speaker 1: They were not, thank God.

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Speaker 3: Like I was so stressed out that whole time because

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Speaker 3: she was wearing this dress and it looked like the

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Speaker 3: dress was hanging off nipple piercer. Yes, and I was like,

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Speaker 3: someone better not pull that dress by actually lot or.

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Speaker 1: Tread on the edge of the dress like oral grabbing

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Speaker 1: our nipples and sympathy. But so Chapel Rowan, who is

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Speaker 1: a big deal pop star and who is probably arriving

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Speaker 1: in the country like right now, because she's about to

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Speaker 1: play around the country for Laneway, So she's probably right

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Speaker 1: now prepared, like looking up shoey on her like how

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Speaker 1: do I do one? On her phone? Have you got

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Speaker 1: your ticket?

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Speaker 2: Hole?

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Speaker 1: I wish I did, but I'm too old to go.

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Speaker 1: If she was doing a side show, I'd be there,

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Speaker 1: like at the back like with a baseball. Come see me,

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Speaker 1: but I can see you.

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Speaker 4: But no.

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Speaker 1: Anyway, So Chapel wore this outfit, she wore this cape

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Speaker 1: and then she took it off and as you've said, Emma,

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Speaker 1: it was dangling off her nips. But we got a

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Speaker 1: full rundown today from the experts behind the look about

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Speaker 1: what was really going on there. Here's a little grab

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Speaker 1: from Pop Sugar Fashion about what was happening.

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Speaker 5: We're prosthetics, and we got the inside scoop from the

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Speaker 5: artists who designed that dress is literally suspended from NIPPLORINGX.

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Speaker 5: Asthetics artist Sasha Glasser used a custom prosthetics from out

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Speaker 5: of Kity, enforced it with powermash and pierced the jewelry

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Speaker 5: directly through it so it could actually halt.

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Speaker 1: It sounds like a lot of work, a lot of work.

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Speaker 1: So there's something called apparently prosthetic pasties. Pasties are the

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Speaker 1: things you stick on your.

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Speaker 3: Nips, which is what I thought it was because when

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Speaker 3: I zoomed in there wasn't an areola.

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Speaker 1: Yes, but apparently they also said that was very deliberate.

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Speaker 1: So Sasha Glassner, who was just named, checked in that

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Speaker 1: she's a big deal, like aesthetic makeup artist, so she

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Speaker 1: does those things that you know, make you look like

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Speaker 1: you've got those pointy cheekbones and you know, howns or whatever.

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Speaker 1: She posted about it said this is my work, and

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Speaker 1: apparently they wanted as well as obviously to protect hashtag

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Speaker 1: save the nips. But also they gave it this look

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Speaker 1: which was very deliberate. Apparently I think maybe they get

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Speaker 1: around Instagram and social media is not people band, but

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Speaker 1: they said, for artistic purposes to give it a completely

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Speaker 1: blank Barbie like.

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Speaker 2: Appearance, because that was the thing, right, is that the

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Speaker 2: Grammys is happening the most talked about outfit. We were

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Speaker 2: sitting here in the office going, I don't know if

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Speaker 2: we're a large to post that on Instagram because we're

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Speaker 2: per Measured's guidelines. They would have removed it or said

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Speaker 2: it was nudity, right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. So you couldn't quite see it. I mean

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Speaker 1: you could see nips, be you couldn't quite see it.

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Speaker 1: But also because she's savvy, she had this sometimes her

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Speaker 1: hair was covering them so you could still get the

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Speaker 1: chaps on the more conservative sites.

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Speaker 2: And what did you think? Because I thought it was fun.

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Speaker 2: I thought it loved it, very.

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Speaker 1: Fun, loved it, loved it. What are the Grammys for

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Speaker 1: if it's not that kind of caper? But I do

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Speaker 1: want to say, what's up with the soft kids these days?

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Speaker 1: Because when that dress was first on the runway, so

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Speaker 1: it's designed by tiery mugler. I think he's French. He

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Speaker 1: was like a big deal in the nineties. He was

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Speaker 1: like the guy with the oh you wouldn't know the reference.

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Speaker 1: Don't worry. I don't understood anything, only just did a

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Speaker 1: little just doing, like George Michael for Anywhere, Never Mine.

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Speaker 1: He's a big deal fashion designer and he first put

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Speaker 1: that dress down the runway in nineteen ninety eight, and

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Speaker 1: the model did have the real deal nipple rings holding

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Speaker 1: it up. So all I'm saying is, kids these days

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Speaker 1: not tough enough. It's catching strays.

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Speaker 3: Okay, I have breaking scarless gossip news that made me cry.

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Speaker 1: Talk us through it.

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Speaker 3: Okay, this is what happened. Talk us through It was

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Speaker 3: the day of the Grammys, right, My whole feed was

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Speaker 3: all Grammy's, Grammys, Grammies, Grammyes, Grammys. Something else cut through.

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Speaker 2: So you woke up. It was just an ornery dat.

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Speaker 1: It's just any hey.

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Speaker 3: It was an article on page six and it was

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Speaker 3: sources say Kim Kardashian has checked into a manner in

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Speaker 3: the countryside with Lewis Hamilton.

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Speaker 1: The English Countryside, English Country.

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Speaker 2: Talk to me about your first visceral, emotional, physical reaction.

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Speaker 3: My first reaction was like, no, no, no, it's only

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Speaker 3: also say, can you.

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Speaker 1: Tell some of us to Lewis Hamilton is. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I do know, but like not everybody is quite as

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Speaker 1: sat as you.

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Speaker 3: Lewis Hamilton is, I will say, the most famous driver

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Speaker 3: in Formula one right now. I think, in my opinion,

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Speaker 3: he's the best driver in history. He's won seven championships

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Speaker 3: age depending who you are. There's a lot of controversy

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Speaker 3: around that.

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Speaker 1: We can we not go into that. Okay, it's been

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Speaker 1: around a long time, right, he's been.

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Speaker 3: Around a long time. Anyway. I was like, no, no, no,

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Speaker 3: this isn't happening. The next day I woke up to

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Speaker 3: some grainy photos. There was photos and a video, and

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Speaker 3: the video was them getting out of the same car

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Speaker 3: in front of a very romantic looking hotel in Paris

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Speaker 3: and then going into the hotel together. And I had

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Speaker 3: a bit of a cry, Oh you please please tell

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Speaker 3: me that is an overstatement, because why would you cry

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Speaker 3: that Kim Kardashian, who dates loads of sportsmen all the time,

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Speaker 3: and Lewis Hamilton, who dates loads of famous people all

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Speaker 3: the time, at dating each other.

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Speaker 1: It's the least surprising news of all time.

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Speaker 3: Okay, firstly, I do have to say I was pmsing,

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Speaker 3: so if you have to factor tact check me on

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Speaker 3: that fact check back. But have you heard of the

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Speaker 3: Kardashian Curse?

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, with the K the K.

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Speaker 3: Kendall Jenner recently did a Super Bowl ad with a

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Speaker 3: sports betting company and she poked fun of the Kardashian curse,

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Speaker 3: which a lot of sports fans believe that if a

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Speaker 3: Kardashian dates a sports person like an NBA player, then

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Speaker 3: their career ends up tanking.

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Speaker 1: So your tears are not because you were like but

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Speaker 1: I thought Lewis was waiting for me or something. Your

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Speaker 1: tears were because, right do you think this.

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Speaker 3: Is going to make him lose both things? I think

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Speaker 3: right now the F one season hasn't started. They're doing

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Speaker 3: the testing. He's doing really well in testing as and

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Speaker 3: like could potentially get an eight championship.

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Speaker 1: How is he distracting himself with hot sex?

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Speaker 3: Because I think he's telling us that he actually doesn't

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Speaker 3: want to go for it anymore and now he just

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Speaker 3: wants to have No I'm not okay, I'm not Jesse.

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Speaker 2: Here's a thing. Well, Luca came over and told me

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Speaker 2: and I think that this happened in a lot of

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Speaker 2: relationships where it was like, the third leg of our

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Speaker 2: relationship has revealed itself, and my friend's dating your friend.

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Speaker 2: And so he came over and he was like, I

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Speaker 2: have gossip because he knows that that will excite me

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Speaker 2: and cheer me up. And he said, Louis, do you

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Speaker 2: ever get excited when he has gossip for you? Yes, yes,

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Speaker 2: because he knows that that's my lovely page. So he's like,

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Speaker 2: sit down. Lewis Hamilton and Kim Kardashian are dating. And

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Speaker 2: I was like what. And then I woke up the

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Speaker 2: next morning and I said, I feel as though I

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Speaker 2: didn't give you enough, Like I feel as though I

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Speaker 2: didn't truly express my feelings about it. I actually haven't

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Speaker 2: stopped thinking about it. I lost sleep over it. Here

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Speaker 2: are my feelings right. Lewis Hamilton, to my mind, is

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Speaker 2: the most eligible bachelor on the planet. He is a

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Speaker 2: forty one year old man who is worth something like

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Speaker 2: seven hundred million Australian dollars.

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Speaker 1: Like small potatoes compared to what kimm You.

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Speaker 2: Say, yes, exactly, he's the poor one in that relationship.

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Speaker 3: But also he sold his private jet because he wanted

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Speaker 3: to be more climate friendly, Yes, exactly so he could

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Speaker 3: just if he wanted to.

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Speaker 2: A good As far as I can see, Touchwood a

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Speaker 2: good man. He came from very humble beginnings, which is

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Speaker 2: very rarely the case in formula one. He has done

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Speaker 2: so much for the representation of the black community in

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Speaker 2: a very white, very rich sport. He's gentle, and he's

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Speaker 2: like sportsmanship and the way he speaks like I just

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Speaker 2: I have.

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Speaker 1: He's also dated a lot of the world's hottest women. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so not a crime to like a celebrity, No, it's not,

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Speaker 1: but it doesn't exactly suggest like humble model like. It's

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Speaker 1: not like he's been dating nurses until this point, is

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Speaker 1: my point.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's hard for him to meet them and because

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Speaker 2: of where he socializes hard. What's important is that he

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Speaker 2: dated Nicole.

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Speaker 3: Quite a long time.

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Speaker 1: You wish your girlfriend was hot like her.

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Speaker 2: According to the reports that I have read prior to today,

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Speaker 2: because I didn't have time but children, big discussion between

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Speaker 2: both of them whether or not they wanted them, blah

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Speaker 2: blah blah.

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Speaker 1: Kim has lots of those.

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Speaker 2: Yes, no bad blood, and Kim's a few years older

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Speaker 2: than him, and so I'm kind of going Lewis like,

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Speaker 2: how we feeling?

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Speaker 4: Like?

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Speaker 2: Are we thinking that we're moving into our family era?

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Speaker 1: He's just so speaking laid in a fancy hotel in

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Speaker 1: the Cotswolds. Guys like I don't think they're burried.

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Speaker 2: It does feel like a distraction from the upcome.

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Speaker 3: Because if you also think about it, like most most

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Speaker 3: most importantly, they're height appropriate. She's five two and he's

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Speaker 3: like five eighths?

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Speaker 2: Is he under six one?

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Speaker 1: He's a tiny man. Don't you have to be kind

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Speaker 1: of Look, I'm gonna inflame a lot of people now

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Speaker 1: when I say this.

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Speaker 3: Don't make me cry, Please, don't make He is beneath her.

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Speaker 1: There is no question about why you have to be

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Speaker 1: mean in this discussion. Wrong beneath Kimmy, who straddles all

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Speaker 1: before her, right, Like I feel a little bit betrayed

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Speaker 1: because I put myself through two hours of a Kim

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Speaker 1: Kardashian interview this week, because remember we talked on what

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Speaker 1: day was That seems like a year ago. It was Monday.

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Speaker 1: So much has happened. We talked on Monday about how

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Speaker 1: on her interview with her sister Chloe, she talked about

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Speaker 1: Harry and Meghan. Right. So I listened to two hours

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Speaker 1: of that interview, and there is a point at which

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Speaker 1: Chloe is very straightforward and says, everyone wants to know

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Speaker 1: who you're dating. You haven't dated anyone for ages, like ages,

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Speaker 1: and she's like, not dating, not dating at all, don't

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Speaker 1: care about it. It's just all about my kids now.

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Speaker 1: I just blah blah blah blah blah. Five seconds later,

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Speaker 1: when she is with a Cotswolds fella.

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Speaker 2: You have famously predicted that she one day.

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Speaker 1: But you know what, I think I've sold her short

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Speaker 1: in that because I know that a lot of you

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Speaker 1: people think that the Kimmi has no principles.

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Speaker 3: She does like, okay, the dog thing, we need to

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Speaker 3: talk about the dog thing.

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Speaker 1: She clears that up in that Chloe interview too. She

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Speaker 1: says she's got six dogs living in her house.

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Speaker 3: Where are they?

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Speaker 1: Well, why would she show them to you?

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Speaker 3: Or she just says they're here. I'm like, no, they're not,

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Speaker 3: they're not here.

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Speaker 2: And lowis Lewis's dog, Rosco.

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Speaker 3: His dog passed away and it was his best friend,

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Speaker 3: you know, and he doesn't even know Kim's dogs.

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Speaker 1: They're probably all bonding over the dogs and all the things.

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Speaker 1: He is perfect for her, right because when I was

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Speaker 1: listening to that interview, I mean perfect for a fling.

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Speaker 1: I mean I'm not saying that they should be getting married.

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Speaker 1: I think I sold her short in the Elon. I

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Speaker 1: think even Kim would be getting a big ick from

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Speaker 1: Elon these days. She does like to get people out

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Speaker 1: of prison and stuff. Just don't diss my Kim. But

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Speaker 1: also when she was talking about how she's not into dating,

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Speaker 1: I was thinking, well, who the hell is she going

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Speaker 1: to date? Because I was thinking, take billionaire guys. They

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Speaker 1: used to be hot to date, you know, like Miranda

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Speaker 1: Kerm married one, but these days they're all a bit

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Speaker 1: on the nose and they're getting a bit older. She

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Speaker 1: and all the Karadashians have said how they're so done

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Speaker 1: with sportsman. You know my controversial position that Lewis Hailton

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Speaker 1: probably really a sportsman. Okay, all I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: What I've enjoyed thinking about is Christmas at Chris Jenna's house.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, so she's going to host Christmas this year.

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Speaker 2: I know we're early, but you know it.

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Speaker 3: We're getting ahead of our February the fourth, it is.

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Speaker 2: Timothy is obviously going to be there, Timothy shall May

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Speaker 2: will be there with Timmy Kylie. Who knows where they'll be.

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Speaker 2: I mean, will they be pregnant, will they be engaged?

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Speaker 1: We don't know.

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Speaker 2: And then Lewis Hamilton walks in. It's like, I just

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Speaker 2: love the mingling of all these different people from all

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Speaker 2: these different worlds. I also read that Kendall, like there

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Speaker 2: were roomors about Kendall and Lewis Hamilton friends.

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Speaker 1: For very long, seem to be friends with a lot

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Speaker 1: of suit models. Anyway, Look, we have to move on,

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Speaker 1: but I want to need to pull back the curtain

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Speaker 1: on one thing. Jesse, when I sent this to you

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Speaker 1: on Instagram, I sent you the story probably one of

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Speaker 1: the twenty million people who did what did you reply?

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Speaker 1: Do you remember?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 1: She replied, what is it with those Kardashians. They must

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Speaker 1: have magic vaginas? Is there any man that they can't get?

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Speaker 2: True? You can pull anyone, like imagine living in the

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Speaker 2: world knowing that you could point at all those like yeah,

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Speaker 2: especially going.

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Speaker 3: From David sent to Lewis Hamilton. Yeah, like in my head,

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Speaker 3: that doesn't make sense, Like they're from a different worlds.

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Speaker 3: And then Kanye like they're just not.

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Speaker 2: On the same continue wom It's like she doesn't have

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Speaker 2: a type. That's what kind of surprises me.

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Speaker 1: Lewis Hamilton has a type though, that's what she wants.

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Speaker 3: Anyway, I think they had a lovely night.

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Speaker 1: Okay, try to move on, to move on.

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Speaker 2: You know. The weirdest thing about that story is it

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Speaker 2: they checked out at eleven am, which is like, I

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Speaker 2: didn't think checkout applied to them.

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Speaker 3: They then for the late checkout.

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Speaker 2: No.

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Speaker 3: I was like, he's teaching her, He's bringing her back

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Speaker 3: down to earth. Holly, they got a call frugal.

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Speaker 1: She lives on a budget. Guys, she lives on a budget.

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Speaker 1: She told Chloe that too. I'm sure enough. Up next,

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Speaker 1: I promise we are moving on. How an Australian former

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Speaker 1: pop star became one of the world's most effective political influences,

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Speaker 1: and why she's turned her attention back home.

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Speaker 4: Hey out loud as it's mea. I'm back in your

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Speaker 4: ears on Tuesdays and Thursdays in subs episodes, and yesterday

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Speaker 4: Holly m and I had a great chat about Karl

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Speaker 4: Stefanovic's new podcast, Sydney Sweeney's new only fans adjacent lingerie line,

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Speaker 4: and also the Millennia documentary. Tomorrow. I'm going to pick

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Speaker 4: up my chat about the female emaciation era. You loved it,

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Speaker 4: and I really wanted Holly and Jesse to weigh in

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Speaker 4: loll literally on the topic because you're interested in it

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Speaker 4: and so we So if you're not already a subscriber

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Speaker 4: and you want to hear what we've got to say,

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Speaker 4: follow the link in the show notes to get us

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Speaker 4: in your ears five days a week.

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Speaker 1: All right, who remembers Holly Valance? You would certainly perfect,

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Speaker 1: absolutely millennial territory right, yeap.

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Speaker 3: She was big for me, but you still don't really

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Speaker 3: know who she is.

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Speaker 1: Okay, let me refresh you or indeed to introduce it

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Speaker 1: to you. Here meet Holly Valance. You need to google

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Speaker 1: this video where not now because that would be unprofessional.

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Speaker 1: But as soon as we get out of here, we

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Speaker 1: should have a little blast of Kiss Kiss, the two

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Speaker 1: thousand and two pop smash from Holly Valance that I

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Speaker 1: remember and the world remembers, mostly because she was naked

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Speaker 1: in the video for it, and at the time that

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Speaker 1: was really shocking, do you remember, Yeah, lots of writhing

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Speaker 1: around looking really gorgeous, and that was because she was

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Speaker 1: one of neighbour's big breakout stars. So she was on

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Speaker 1: neighbors for ages and then in those days, back in

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Speaker 1: those times, they used to pluck people from neighbors and

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Speaker 1: send them to Britain and say, turn this person into

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Speaker 1: a pop star.

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Speaker 2: She was like a contemporary of Delta Gudrun.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so she went to London to become a pop star,

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Speaker 1: and indeed she did. And then she married a billionaire,

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Speaker 1: a big deal property developer called Nick Candy, and then

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Speaker 1: she became an al right, power player. Plot twist, because

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Speaker 1: that's not usually what happens.

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Speaker 3: But they're still making songs.

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Speaker 1: No, well until now. We're going to get to that, right,

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Speaker 1: So if you've been paying attention, you'd know that she

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Speaker 1: married Nick Candy, who's the bazillionaire. They have just broken up.

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Speaker 1: So they broke up last year. They were married for

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Speaker 1: thirteen years, they've got kids, they haven't finished their settlement yet.

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Speaker 1: It's going to be big, right, because he's worth a

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Speaker 1: lot of money, Nick Candy. For a while, there was

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Speaker 1: the treasurer of the Reform Party, which in UK politics,

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Speaker 1: the Reform Party used to be the Brexit Party. Is

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Speaker 1: kind of and these comparisons are imperfect. But let's go

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Speaker 1: with it for the purposes of this. They're kind of

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Speaker 1: one nation. They're like a very right wing, very anti

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Speaker 1: immigration party led by Nigel Farage, right who's kind of

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Speaker 1: a British Trump, or certainly fancies himself as a British

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Speaker 1: Trump and is besties with Nigel. She herself because as

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Speaker 1: a part of that power couple with Nick Candy, they

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Speaker 1: became very influential in conservative politics in Britain. She's spoken

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Speaker 1: this big rally called Popcorn. She gives lots of soundbites

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Speaker 1: about how Britain's gone to the dogs, you know, and

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Speaker 1: blah blah blah. She doesn't believe in climate change. She

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Speaker 1: thinks that Nigel farg is going to save them. She

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Speaker 1: held one of the biggest Trump fundraising parties in Britain

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Speaker 1: for the twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 3: Election in Britain.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, because he wants support from all over the world.

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Speaker 1: Money funding, money, money, money, money, money, Yeah right, so

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Speaker 1: she had one of the big parties there. Faraj and

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Speaker 1: her have been over to mar A Lago lots of

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Speaker 1: times lately. She's been seen since the split with Candy.

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Speaker 1: Not that anyone's insinuating there's anything romantic going on. I

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Speaker 1: don't think, but she's been seen a lot with this

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Speaker 1: guy called Tommy Robinson, who's a really controversial dude who's

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Speaker 1: the leader of a party called the English Defense League,

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Speaker 1: which sounds exactly like it is. He's been in jail

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Speaker 1: lots of times. But she basically has positioned herself as

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Speaker 1: a big deal power player, not just some kind of

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Speaker 1: like post a child, but she actually is a power

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Speaker 1: player in that which is of right wing politics in Britain.

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Speaker 1: Right She has said, I think everyone starts off as

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Speaker 1: lefty and then wakes up at some point after you

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Speaker 1: starty the making money, working, trying to run a business,

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Speaker 1: trying to buy a home, and you realize what crap

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Speaker 1: ideas they are and you go to the right. She

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Speaker 1: thinks that Australia has become too woke. So that brings

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Speaker 1: us to why we're talking about it today. So Reform,

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Speaker 1: which is the party she supports in Britain, is polling

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Speaker 1: really well in the UK at the moment, and partly

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Speaker 1: because they're conservative, they're traditional conservative opposition are in disarray.

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Speaker 1: They're really like coming through, surging through as a populist alternative.

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Speaker 1: Does that sound familiar to anyone to what's going on

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Speaker 1: here right now? Yes, so, Holly the Lance has collaborated

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Speaker 1: with One Nation, apparently at the request of Pauline Hanson,

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Speaker 1: on a song for their new movie. If you are

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Speaker 1: confus used about why One Nation has a movie, would

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Speaker 1: you like me to like you or would you like

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Speaker 1: me to stop talking now? Because it's all making you

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Speaker 1: feel a bit better?

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Speaker 2: No, I would like to know that because it's feeling

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Speaker 2: a bit Millennia.

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Speaker 3: Yes, well it's not very.

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Speaker 1: Milania because it's a cartoon, right, an animation, So the movie, yeah,

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Speaker 1: an animation. So the movie is called a super progressive movie,

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Speaker 1: and what it actually is is it's a full length

436
00:20:30,194 --> 00:20:33,994
Speaker 1: feature film built from all the cartoon clips that One

437
00:20:34,114 --> 00:20:36,554
Speaker 1: Nation have been using for more than a year now

438
00:20:36,594 --> 00:20:39,434
Speaker 1: to kind of invigorate their bass, take the piss out

439
00:20:39,434 --> 00:20:41,674
Speaker 1: of woke politics, do lots of kind of set the

440
00:20:41,714 --> 00:20:42,434
Speaker 1: limbs on hair.

441
00:20:42,754 --> 00:20:45,634
Speaker 2: Can I if I wanted to this weekend? Can I

442
00:20:45,834 --> 00:20:46,674
Speaker 2: go to the cinema?

443
00:20:46,794 --> 00:20:50,514
Speaker 1: So it hasn't been widely released, like you know, Anaconda

444
00:20:50,794 --> 00:20:55,034
Speaker 1: or something, but it has been doing screenings around the country,

445
00:20:55,154 --> 00:20:58,674
Speaker 1: funded by obviously political donations, and Pauline's been traveling around

446
00:20:58,674 --> 00:21:01,754
Speaker 1: and appearing at them and it is available for streaming anyway.

447
00:21:01,754 --> 00:21:03,594
Speaker 1: The song from it, because every movie needs a song,

448
00:21:04,074 --> 00:21:07,674
Speaker 1: brings us back to Holly. Holly Valance has re recorded

449
00:21:07,714 --> 00:21:12,033
Speaker 1: a version of Kiss Kiss called please Hold This is

450
00:21:12,114 --> 00:21:17,834
Speaker 1: very important. It's called kiss Kiss My Ass and it's

451
00:21:17,834 --> 00:21:22,273
Speaker 1: a smart take, I know. And the song's lyrics have

452
00:21:22,314 --> 00:21:25,314
Speaker 1: been rewritten to poke the bear of transphobia. Basically, I'm

453
00:21:25,354 --> 00:21:26,954
Speaker 1: not going to give you the lyrics because they are

454
00:21:27,634 --> 00:21:30,914
Speaker 1: pretty gross, but let's just say that in the lyrics

455
00:21:30,954 --> 00:21:36,114
Speaker 1: there's lots of talk about pronouns, penises, vaginas. You get

456
00:21:36,114 --> 00:21:39,234
Speaker 1: the gist. The thing is, it's all supposed to be

457
00:21:39,314 --> 00:21:41,674
Speaker 1: comedy and satire.

458
00:21:41,514 --> 00:21:42,674
Speaker 3: And why am I not laughing?

459
00:21:42,834 --> 00:21:48,474
Speaker 1: Well and yet right, So it's very interesting because this

460
00:21:48,834 --> 00:21:52,194
Speaker 1: is a very deliberate strategy copied from America, really right,

461
00:21:52,354 --> 00:21:57,714
Speaker 1: which is use humor. Use humor again in inverted commas,

462
00:21:57,874 --> 00:22:01,074
Speaker 1: there's notically funny, but you know, use humor and piss

463
00:22:01,154 --> 00:22:05,514
Speaker 1: taking and poking lots of culture war issues that will

464
00:22:05,514 --> 00:22:07,914
Speaker 1: get shared. So these clips, until it became a full

465
00:22:07,954 --> 00:22:10,114
Speaker 1: length movie, just live on social and they're shared around

466
00:22:10,274 --> 00:22:13,754
Speaker 1: probably on somebody related to all of our Facebook somewhere,

467
00:22:13,914 --> 00:22:16,194
Speaker 1: and you know, they're on TikTok and they kind of

468
00:22:16,194 --> 00:22:20,434
Speaker 1: play into that strategy very much. For an Ossie audience

469
00:22:20,594 --> 00:22:23,954
Speaker 1: is probably smarter again because we like to pride ourselves

470
00:22:23,994 --> 00:22:27,434
Speaker 1: on not taking ourselves too seriously. Right, But Holly has

471
00:22:27,514 --> 00:22:29,594
Speaker 1: said that Pauline asked to do it, she thought it

472
00:22:29,634 --> 00:22:32,354
Speaker 1: was hilarious and she really wants to support one nation

473
00:22:32,554 --> 00:22:34,434
Speaker 1: in this election, not that there's an election.

474
00:22:34,554 --> 00:22:38,194
Speaker 2: She's also Holly was doing an interview in the last

475
00:22:38,434 --> 00:22:42,194
Speaker 2: twenty four hours with someone on a free speech channel

476
00:22:42,514 --> 00:22:45,914
Speaker 2: where she used the R word very flippantly and the

477
00:22:45,954 --> 00:22:49,474
Speaker 2: person said, we don't use that word on this channel,

478
00:22:49,514 --> 00:22:51,593
Speaker 2: and then she had a big kind of blow up

479
00:22:51,634 --> 00:22:56,034
Speaker 2: about free speech. And I think that that really shows

480
00:22:56,474 --> 00:22:58,553
Speaker 2: where they're all at and who they're trying to appeal to.

481
00:22:58,674 --> 00:23:01,154
Speaker 2: They're trying to appeal to the person who feels as

482
00:23:01,154 --> 00:23:03,394
Speaker 2: though they've been on the wrong side of the culture

483
00:23:03,434 --> 00:23:08,033
Speaker 2: wars for the last ten twenty years. And I watched

484
00:23:08,114 --> 00:23:10,834
Speaker 2: a few clips from the film to try and get

485
00:23:10,874 --> 00:23:15,434
Speaker 2: a sense of it, and the music clip it's like

486
00:23:15,434 --> 00:23:16,833
Speaker 2: an attempt at south Park.

487
00:23:17,114 --> 00:23:20,634
Speaker 1: It's like a sort of south parky knockoff. It's sort

488
00:23:20,674 --> 00:23:26,474
Speaker 1: of it follows for alleged progressives traveling around Australia, and

489
00:23:26,474 --> 00:23:28,274
Speaker 1: you can imagine like the kind of situation.

490
00:23:28,474 --> 00:23:31,033
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's also there's one scene where and I

491
00:23:31,034 --> 00:23:34,754
Speaker 2: don't understand the full context of this, but where they

492
00:23:34,834 --> 00:23:38,954
Speaker 2: appeared to blow up Ularu. There are jokes about, oh,

493
00:23:39,034 --> 00:23:41,434
Speaker 2: we wake up every morning and we do our apology

494
00:23:41,634 --> 00:23:43,714
Speaker 2: and you know, white men are in shackles and all

495
00:23:43,754 --> 00:23:48,594
Speaker 2: that kind of stuff feels very one note. But I

496
00:23:48,634 --> 00:23:53,274
Speaker 2: was reading what the creators of it have said, and

497
00:23:53,674 --> 00:23:56,754
Speaker 2: clearly this is an attempt to appeal to young people.

498
00:23:57,154 --> 00:23:59,234
Speaker 3: So one nation is which you I'm young people.

499
00:24:00,114 --> 00:24:02,474
Speaker 2: Well, I think that it's like because this is clearly

500
00:24:02,474 --> 00:24:06,754
Speaker 2: a social media YouTube TikTok, Instagram play right, Like, I

501
00:24:06,834 --> 00:24:10,954
Speaker 2: can't imagine that boomers are necessarily looking at this.

502
00:24:11,114 --> 00:24:14,234
Speaker 1: I don't know they'd be seeing it on Facebook's on YouTube.

503
00:24:14,314 --> 00:24:16,634
Speaker 1: There's a significant boomer population.

504
00:24:16,754 --> 00:24:18,914
Speaker 2: But it's funny how the right are trying to like

505
00:24:19,034 --> 00:24:20,114
Speaker 2: reclaim comedy.

506
00:24:20,234 --> 00:24:21,674
Speaker 1: Yes, that's what's really interesting.

507
00:24:21,914 --> 00:24:25,474
Speaker 2: Yeah, that they're trying to go where funny, we don't

508
00:24:25,514 --> 00:24:29,994
Speaker 2: take ourselves too seriously and now one, two three the

509
00:24:30,074 --> 00:24:33,794
Speaker 2: left loses it. And that's why in the mainstream press

510
00:24:33,874 --> 00:24:36,834
Speaker 2: or whatever, which is necessary. People go, I watched it,

511
00:24:36,994 --> 00:24:39,394
Speaker 2: so you don't have to, and here's what I think.

512
00:24:39,914 --> 00:24:41,513
Speaker 2: And you can call it offensive and you can call

513
00:24:41,554 --> 00:24:45,394
Speaker 2: it crude, and they're like and they go, yeah, that's

514
00:24:45,394 --> 00:24:51,434
Speaker 2: the point. And Pauline Hanson twenty years ago was She's

515
00:24:51,474 --> 00:24:57,513
Speaker 2: always been dismissed as unseerious and as unrefined, and.

516
00:24:57,634 --> 00:25:00,354
Speaker 3: That's kind of like what my opinion of her has

517
00:25:00,394 --> 00:25:03,474
Speaker 3: been has been just a joke, a joke. She's been

518
00:25:03,514 --> 00:25:05,954
Speaker 3: a joke, a non dangerous one in the sense of,

519
00:25:06,034 --> 00:25:08,314
Speaker 3: like I was told she could never really rise up

520
00:25:08,474 --> 00:25:11,474
Speaker 3: in yeah politics here in Australia, and the fact that

521
00:25:11,514 --> 00:25:15,954
Speaker 3: she's leaning into her being a joke makes me go, oh.

522
00:25:15,874 --> 00:25:20,394
Speaker 2: No, yeah, is now being a joke doesn't marginalize you.

523
00:25:20,434 --> 00:25:23,594
Speaker 2: It might mainstream you. And I think that I've had

524
00:25:23,754 --> 00:25:27,154
Speaker 2: so many different people in different circles, from politics, to

525
00:25:27,234 --> 00:25:31,274
Speaker 2: media to friends say in the last fortnight, I'm really

526
00:25:31,314 --> 00:25:34,114
Speaker 2: worried about this Pauline Hanson one Nation thing and how

527
00:25:34,114 --> 00:25:34,954
Speaker 2: it's building women.

528
00:25:35,074 --> 00:25:37,834
Speaker 1: Well you should be if it's not. You know, I

529
00:25:37,834 --> 00:25:40,834
Speaker 1: don't want to assume the way that everybody feels about

530
00:25:41,234 --> 00:25:43,674
Speaker 1: one Nation and Pauline Hanson. I don't think it would be,

531
00:25:43,714 --> 00:25:46,194
Speaker 1: as we said on Monday, surprising to know where we stand.

532
00:25:46,234 --> 00:25:50,553
Speaker 1: But people should take them seriously because as the like

533
00:25:50,594 --> 00:25:52,914
Speaker 1: in Britain, as the traditional right here is kind of

534
00:25:52,954 --> 00:25:54,914
Speaker 1: in a bit of disarray at the minute. Obviously the

535
00:25:54,994 --> 00:25:58,033
Speaker 1: Nationals and the Libs have fallen out. Liberal Party voting

536
00:25:58,114 --> 00:26:00,754
Speaker 1: is in the toilet one nation are coming through strongly.

537
00:26:00,794 --> 00:26:03,074
Speaker 1: They have never pulled so strongly. The polls are and

538
00:26:03,074 --> 00:26:05,594
Speaker 1: this isn't just being reported in you know, what you

539
00:26:05,674 --> 00:26:09,154
Speaker 1: might term as right leaning press, it's everywhere. They're polling

540
00:26:09,154 --> 00:26:11,634
Speaker 1: as high as twenty six percent, which is a lot.

541
00:26:11,434 --> 00:26:14,914
Speaker 2: Right and Pauline specifically as like a preferred.

542
00:26:14,554 --> 00:26:17,674
Speaker 1: Leader, yes, higher than Susan Lee. Like they're definitely. And

543
00:26:17,714 --> 00:26:20,954
Speaker 1: the thing is about that is it's easy to dismiss

544
00:26:20,994 --> 00:26:22,954
Speaker 1: and roll your eyes and go, I remember when she

545
00:26:23,074 --> 00:26:24,874
Speaker 1: was just a joke. I remember when she wore burker

546
00:26:24,874 --> 00:26:28,114
Speaker 1: in Parliament, which she's done twice, which is, you know, ridiculous.

547
00:26:28,354 --> 00:26:30,194
Speaker 1: But if you look at what's happening in Britain and

548
00:26:30,194 --> 00:26:32,234
Speaker 1: you look at what's happened in the US, it's something

549
00:26:32,274 --> 00:26:35,474
Speaker 1: to take seriously. And the thing is that's interesting about

550
00:26:35,514 --> 00:26:38,394
Speaker 1: the British comparison is that it was only twenty twenty

551
00:26:38,394 --> 00:26:41,354
Speaker 1: four when their labor government won in a landslide. Right

552
00:26:41,434 --> 00:26:45,554
Speaker 1: and now Reform, who are the populist right Party, are

553
00:26:45,594 --> 00:26:48,874
Speaker 1: preferred government by quite a long way. Right, they're saying

554
00:26:48,874 --> 00:26:51,634
Speaker 1: if there was an election today. So I think one

555
00:26:51,674 --> 00:26:54,274
Speaker 1: of the things that's interesting about this is we should

556
00:26:54,274 --> 00:26:57,593
Speaker 1: absolutely take them seriously. It might not be Pauline Hanson

557
00:26:57,674 --> 00:26:59,874
Speaker 1: because she actually is a senator and it's quite confusing

558
00:26:59,914 --> 00:27:01,754
Speaker 1: whether or not she could jump to be you know,

559
00:27:01,794 --> 00:27:04,754
Speaker 1: the private story a long time. Yeah, But also there's

560
00:27:04,794 --> 00:27:09,033
Speaker 1: Barnaby Joyce, more traditional liberal labor ANDPS are defecting to

561
00:27:09,114 --> 00:27:11,874
Speaker 1: one nation. So basically they've got momentum. They've got some

562
00:27:11,914 --> 00:27:14,554
Speaker 1: momentum at the minute, and it's like take them seriously.

563
00:27:14,674 --> 00:27:17,754
Speaker 1: But also I would say take a leaf out of

564
00:27:17,794 --> 00:27:20,194
Speaker 1: listening to some of the messages in this. And I

565
00:27:20,234 --> 00:27:23,074
Speaker 1: don't mean about the culture war issues. I mean about

566
00:27:23,114 --> 00:27:28,194
Speaker 1: the people's exhaustion with feeling constantly scolded, lecture, told off.

567
00:27:28,314 --> 00:27:31,674
Speaker 1: Is it's become a tired thing to say, But there

568
00:27:31,834 --> 00:27:34,594
Speaker 1: is a portion of that that this kind of comedic

569
00:27:34,714 --> 00:27:39,314
Speaker 1: campaigning really works for. So dismissing it, just as dismissing

570
00:27:39,354 --> 00:27:42,313
Speaker 1: Trump as a crazy orange guy or Nigel Farage's an

571
00:27:42,394 --> 00:27:46,793
Speaker 1: unseerious reality star. It's not helping. Holly Valance really is

572
00:27:47,314 --> 00:27:50,674
Speaker 1: an influential power player, not just the person from Kiss Kiss.

573
00:27:51,634 --> 00:27:51,794
Speaker 2: Oh.

574
00:27:51,874 --> 00:27:55,554
Speaker 1: I need to jump in with a gorilla recommendation because

575
00:27:55,554 --> 00:27:57,954
Speaker 1: I'm not on Friday's show Friends, because this week it's

576
00:27:57,994 --> 00:28:00,513
Speaker 1: my daughter's sixteenth and I have to go and spend

577
00:28:00,514 --> 00:28:01,513
Speaker 1: some time with my children.

578
00:28:01,594 --> 00:28:03,754
Speaker 3: Imagine that it's rude.

579
00:28:04,194 --> 00:28:06,874
Speaker 1: Anyway, I can't not tell you about the Take That

580
00:28:06,914 --> 00:28:08,914
Speaker 1: Door documentary I watched on the weekend.

581
00:28:08,634 --> 00:28:10,553
Speaker 2: Okay, because that kid's popping up on my Netflix and

582
00:28:10,554 --> 00:28:11,874
Speaker 2: I can't decide whether I'll watch it or.

583
00:28:11,914 --> 00:28:13,754
Speaker 1: Our quick question for em do you know who take

584
00:28:13,794 --> 00:28:14,073
Speaker 1: that up?

585
00:28:14,154 --> 00:28:18,874
Speaker 3: I watched the documentary where he was a monkey, Ronnie Williams.

586
00:28:19,874 --> 00:28:23,594
Speaker 1: So Robbie Williams was the Harry Styles of take That, right,

587
00:28:23,754 --> 00:28:25,754
Speaker 1: And yes, so Robbi Williams used to be and take that.

588
00:28:25,794 --> 00:28:27,954
Speaker 1: But in the nineties Take That were huge.

589
00:28:28,114 --> 00:28:29,034
Speaker 3: They were the boy band.

590
00:28:29,034 --> 00:28:31,194
Speaker 1: They were the British boy band, like modeled on Backstreet

591
00:28:31,194 --> 00:28:33,754
Speaker 1: Boys and that kind of stuff. Right, They were massive anyway,

592
00:28:33,834 --> 00:28:36,674
Speaker 1: so new documentaries dropped about them on Netflix. Now is

593
00:28:36,714 --> 00:28:40,714
Speaker 1: the whole documentary amazing, not really if you've watched all

594
00:28:40,754 --> 00:28:43,314
Speaker 1: the Robbie ones like better Man and also his documentary

595
00:28:43,314 --> 00:28:47,034
Speaker 1: that he did that was definitely a procumentary, you know. Yeah,

596
00:28:47,194 --> 00:28:50,154
Speaker 1: although it was very interesting, you've probably heard all these stories.

597
00:28:50,474 --> 00:28:53,274
Speaker 1: But it's very satisfying because the music's great. It's all

598
00:28:53,394 --> 00:28:55,834
Speaker 1: really fun. But the thing I particularly wanted to call

599
00:28:55,874 --> 00:28:58,034
Speaker 1: out because it talks to something that we've been talking

600
00:28:58,034 --> 00:29:01,114
Speaker 1: about lately with heated rivalry, right, is that take that.

601
00:29:01,154 --> 00:29:03,074
Speaker 1: I don't think I realized this, but back in nineteen

602
00:29:03,114 --> 00:29:05,114
Speaker 1: ninety one, where they've got they like the spic skills,

603
00:29:05,114 --> 00:29:07,674
Speaker 1: they kind of got formed, you know, like fake formed

604
00:29:07,714 --> 00:29:10,114
Speaker 1: by a producer who went, we need an English boy band,

605
00:29:10,394 --> 00:29:12,194
Speaker 1: got a load of kids from across the North of England,

606
00:29:12,234 --> 00:29:15,194
Speaker 1: stuck them together. They became them. They did all their

607
00:29:15,234 --> 00:29:19,234
Speaker 1: training ground for years playing gay clubs and schools, right,

608
00:29:19,314 --> 00:29:21,754
Speaker 1: so they would go and do school halls in the

609
00:29:21,794 --> 00:29:25,314
Speaker 1: afternoon and then two or three gay clubs every night

610
00:29:25,554 --> 00:29:28,954
Speaker 1: around all of the North of England. So they're honing

611
00:29:28,994 --> 00:29:33,354
Speaker 1: their talents at driving the audience crazy in these two

612
00:29:33,514 --> 00:29:38,314
Speaker 1: distinct categories of young girls and gay men at nightclubs

613
00:29:38,314 --> 00:29:41,154
Speaker 1: at night, were any of the members gay. None of

614
00:29:41,194 --> 00:29:43,594
Speaker 1: them have ever come out as gay, so I can't

615
00:29:43,634 --> 00:29:45,514
Speaker 1: really answer that question, but not that we know of.

616
00:29:46,034 --> 00:29:48,394
Speaker 1: It's just amazing to watch because what it makes you

617
00:29:48,474 --> 00:29:50,434
Speaker 1: realize is you see how they built this fan base

618
00:29:50,474 --> 00:29:53,634
Speaker 1: and then how the sort of you know, the machiavellian

619
00:29:53,714 --> 00:29:57,074
Speaker 1: mind behind it. The producer realizes that if he can

620
00:29:57,194 --> 00:29:59,554
Speaker 1: get the girls to go crazy and he can get

621
00:29:59,594 --> 00:30:01,914
Speaker 1: you know, in inverted commas, the gays to go crazy,

622
00:30:01,954 --> 00:30:05,634
Speaker 1: then the mainstream will come. Is also just makes me

623
00:30:05,634 --> 00:30:07,514
Speaker 1: think about this conversation we've been having a lot lately

624
00:30:07,554 --> 00:30:11,154
Speaker 1: about straight women loving heated rivalry and were all like, oh,

625
00:30:11,234 --> 00:30:13,914
Speaker 1: why did the straight women like watching these handsome gay

626
00:30:13,914 --> 00:30:16,674
Speaker 1: men getting it on? And you're like, there's always been

627
00:30:16,714 --> 00:30:19,434
Speaker 1: a lot of crossover there, right, And hormones are hormones.

628
00:30:19,794 --> 00:30:20,434
Speaker 1: That's so true.

629
00:30:20,474 --> 00:30:21,554
Speaker 3: So I loved that part of it.

630
00:30:21,594 --> 00:30:23,434
Speaker 1: All the history is really good, and then it gets

631
00:30:23,474 --> 00:30:26,554
Speaker 1: really into the fallout between the main guy of take that,

632
00:30:26,554 --> 00:30:28,634
Speaker 1: which is Gary Barlow, who wrote all the songs and

633
00:30:28,714 --> 00:30:31,434
Speaker 1: kept all the money, and Robbie who was going off

634
00:30:31,474 --> 00:30:33,354
Speaker 1: the rails. He was only sixteen when he joined and

635
00:30:33,434 --> 00:30:36,474
Speaker 1: was doing this like school slash gape anyway, it's really

636
00:30:36,794 --> 00:30:40,714
Speaker 1: such a rough time. From the documentary, he's been through

637
00:30:40,754 --> 00:30:43,394
Speaker 1: a lot, but they all have. It's really good. It's

638
00:30:43,394 --> 00:30:44,594
Speaker 1: on Netflix. It's called Take That.

639
00:30:44,874 --> 00:30:45,914
Speaker 2: Is it a series or one?

640
00:30:45,954 --> 00:30:49,074
Speaker 1: I think there are three? Okay, and they're like, you know,

641
00:30:49,394 --> 00:30:50,354
Speaker 1: fifty minutes long.

642
00:30:50,434 --> 00:30:53,554
Speaker 2: All right, I'm going to watch that after the break.

643
00:30:53,714 --> 00:31:05,154
Speaker 2: The social politics of being right, it didn't matter that

644
00:31:05,234 --> 00:31:08,234
Speaker 2: I was correct. It mattered that I wasning. That's a

645
00:31:08,314 --> 00:31:10,834
Speaker 2: quote by Rob Long for The Ankler, in a piece

646
00:31:10,954 --> 00:31:14,594
Speaker 2: where he grapples with the social politics of being right.

647
00:31:15,154 --> 00:31:18,794
Speaker 2: He writes in this substack post, it's almost never a

648
00:31:18,834 --> 00:31:22,274
Speaker 2: bad idea to shut up when someone you're speaking to

649
00:31:22,634 --> 00:31:25,434
Speaker 2: is wrong. And he tells a few great stories. So

650
00:31:25,674 --> 00:31:29,234
Speaker 2: the first is when he was a young up and

651
00:31:29,274 --> 00:31:31,514
Speaker 2: coming writer in a writer's room. It was actually for

652
00:31:31,554 --> 00:31:34,834
Speaker 2: the television show Cheers, and they were putting together a

653
00:31:34,874 --> 00:31:39,194
Speaker 2: storyline and he interjected when it wasn't really his job

654
00:31:39,234 --> 00:31:42,394
Speaker 2: to interject, and said, oh, well, what you're talking about,

655
00:31:42,434 --> 00:31:44,554
Speaker 2: I mean that wouldn't technically be a crime, and kind

656
00:31:44,554 --> 00:31:46,234
Speaker 2: of corrected them, and he said they all looked at

657
00:31:46,274 --> 00:31:51,074
Speaker 2: him like, mate, that actually doesn't matter, that's not important.

658
00:31:51,194 --> 00:31:55,354
Speaker 2: It was sort of a youthful know it all moment

659
00:31:55,674 --> 00:31:58,994
Speaker 2: and he learned something from that, and then he tells

660
00:31:59,034 --> 00:32:03,834
Speaker 2: his other story about being much older sitting there in

661
00:32:03,834 --> 00:32:05,874
Speaker 2: New York after the New York Marathon had wrapped up,

662
00:32:05,874 --> 00:32:08,554
Speaker 2: and the waitress came over and said, the winner of

663
00:32:08,594 --> 00:32:11,234
Speaker 2: the New York Marathon is in this restaurant. He's got

664
00:32:11,234 --> 00:32:13,474
Speaker 2: this medal on and it's amazing and I'm so excited.

665
00:32:13,794 --> 00:32:15,914
Speaker 2: And he took one look at him and went, I

666
00:32:16,034 --> 00:32:18,354
Speaker 2: know for an absolute fact that man did not win

667
00:32:18,394 --> 00:32:20,474
Speaker 2: the New York Marathon today. I know that it was

668
00:32:20,514 --> 00:32:25,034
Speaker 2: an Ethiopian man and that is not him. And you're confused,

669
00:32:25,394 --> 00:32:27,874
Speaker 2: but he went, what's the point. I'm not going to

670
00:32:27,914 --> 00:32:29,354
Speaker 2: say it. I'm not going to ruin her day. She's

671
00:32:29,434 --> 00:32:31,714
Speaker 2: new to New York. She thinks everyone who has a medal,

672
00:32:31,754 --> 00:32:35,394
Speaker 2: which is fifty thousand people one great. I'm just going

673
00:32:35,474 --> 00:32:38,434
Speaker 2: to go with it. And so the big question that

674
00:32:38,514 --> 00:32:43,434
Speaker 2: he kind of asks is what is the currency of

675
00:32:43,514 --> 00:32:48,114
Speaker 2: being right? And I thought this was an almost countercultural idea,

676
00:32:48,394 --> 00:32:53,674
Speaker 2: because every comment section is people correcting and owning people

677
00:32:53,754 --> 00:32:57,114
Speaker 2: has become a genre of entertainment in its own right.

678
00:32:57,954 --> 00:33:01,154
Speaker 2: Everyone has their own sets of facts and a conversation

679
00:33:02,114 --> 00:33:06,674
Speaker 2: very easily descends into an argument. My question is how

680
00:33:06,714 --> 00:33:10,434
Speaker 2: important is it being right? You're out at dinner tonight,

681
00:33:10,994 --> 00:33:13,994
Speaker 2: someone's saying something, You're going, I'm pretty sure that's wrong.

682
00:33:14,674 --> 00:33:17,634
Speaker 2: How often do you let it go? And in what

683
00:33:17,714 --> 00:33:20,554
Speaker 2: instances are you like, Okay, I'm actually going to correct you,

684
00:33:20,674 --> 00:33:23,714
Speaker 2: even if it means I'm being really annoy It's.

685
00:33:23,634 --> 00:33:28,514
Speaker 3: Very important being right. The only instance I would say

686
00:33:28,554 --> 00:33:31,994
Speaker 3: where maybe you shouldn't be right publicly is if it

687
00:33:32,154 --> 00:33:36,354
Speaker 3: leads to embarrassment. And that story he said about the

688
00:33:36,394 --> 00:33:41,234
Speaker 3: girl who mistook the person as winning the marathon, he

689
00:33:41,314 --> 00:33:43,994
Speaker 3: later said that he just wait till she posted on

690
00:33:43,994 --> 00:33:46,594
Speaker 3: her Instagram and then all of her followers on Instagram

691
00:33:46,634 --> 00:33:48,674
Speaker 3: can correct her. I'm like, no, the nice thing would

692
00:33:48,714 --> 00:33:51,114
Speaker 3: have been to pull her aside and be like, hey,

693
00:33:51,274 --> 00:33:53,434
Speaker 3: that guy should probably pay for his own meal because he,

694
00:33:53,474 --> 00:33:55,474
Speaker 3: in fact did not win the marathon.

695
00:33:55,674 --> 00:33:58,714
Speaker 2: That's actually very true, because sometimes someone says something and

696
00:33:58,754 --> 00:34:02,554
Speaker 2: you think, do I soften the blow? And this is

697
00:34:02,634 --> 00:34:06,594
Speaker 2: I reckon that with family, you always choose annoying, like

698
00:34:06,674 --> 00:34:08,993
Speaker 2: you have no second guessing. I'm like, I'm annoying with

699
00:34:09,034 --> 00:34:11,153
Speaker 2: my family all the time. I will always correct them.

700
00:34:11,274 --> 00:34:13,473
Speaker 3: But I don't know if this is a culture thing.

701
00:34:13,554 --> 00:34:16,274
Speaker 3: I'm not allowed to correct anyone older than me. I

702
00:34:16,354 --> 00:34:18,714
Speaker 3: really have been. Tell me, it's just like a thing

703
00:34:18,754 --> 00:34:20,554
Speaker 3: that you just never did. Like if I were to

704
00:34:20,594 --> 00:34:23,634
Speaker 3: correct my mum or dad in public, oh my god,

705
00:34:23,754 --> 00:34:26,433
Speaker 3: I would get it at home? Really yeah yeah yeah,

706
00:34:26,474 --> 00:34:29,314
Speaker 3: yeah yeah, And even till this day, I would never

707
00:34:29,354 --> 00:34:31,754
Speaker 3: do it publicly. Maybe in private, I'll be like, just

708
00:34:31,794 --> 00:34:34,754
Speaker 3: so you know what you said, you can't say that,

709
00:34:34,834 --> 00:34:36,674
Speaker 3: and they'll be like, oh okay. But if I did

710
00:34:36,674 --> 00:34:39,074
Speaker 3: it in public, there's no way. I even do feel

711
00:34:39,194 --> 00:34:41,554
Speaker 3: with his story about work, I also felt that in

712
00:34:41,594 --> 00:34:44,794
Speaker 3: the workplace sometimes where I feel like sometimes people are

713
00:34:44,914 --> 00:34:46,914
Speaker 3: older than me are allowed to correct me in public,

714
00:34:47,074 --> 00:34:48,754
Speaker 3: and I have to accept that. But if I were

715
00:34:48,794 --> 00:34:51,114
Speaker 3: to correct someone older than me, it's like, no way.

716
00:34:51,274 --> 00:34:54,674
Speaker 1: There's a hierarchy of power about that. Right, is that

717
00:34:54,834 --> 00:34:57,714
Speaker 1: as per this story the young person in the writer's room.

718
00:34:58,114 --> 00:35:00,794
Speaker 1: But that example, what that speaks to more is about

719
00:35:00,794 --> 00:35:03,514
Speaker 1: the experience. So I think, if you're a creative person

720
00:35:03,674 --> 00:35:05,954
Speaker 1: and you're working in a creative field, you like dealing

721
00:35:05,994 --> 00:35:08,194
Speaker 1: with ideas, right, and you'll figure out the details later.

722
00:35:08,354 --> 00:35:11,194
Speaker 1: So it's like and then the car started flying, but

723
00:35:11,314 --> 00:35:13,194
Speaker 1: cars don't like, Look, we'll find a way to make

724
00:35:13,194 --> 00:35:14,714
Speaker 1: the car flying, do you know what I mean? Like

725
00:35:15,154 --> 00:35:18,473
Speaker 1: that's kind of how it works. I'm generally of the

726
00:35:18,474 --> 00:35:21,074
Speaker 1: camp of let it go, like let if people say

727
00:35:21,074 --> 00:35:23,433
Speaker 1: the wrong word, if they've got a couple of facts wrong,

728
00:35:23,514 --> 00:35:25,714
Speaker 1: like just let it go unless it really matters. But

729
00:35:25,754 --> 00:35:27,954
Speaker 1: then is that a slippery slope to what we keep

730
00:35:28,394 --> 00:35:31,194
Speaker 1: talking about now, which is like a post facts world

731
00:35:31,314 --> 00:35:34,154
Speaker 1: and it's so important to get your facts straight, Like

732
00:35:34,314 --> 00:35:39,314
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think that in personal conversations there

733
00:35:39,354 --> 00:35:42,074
Speaker 1: are lots of cliches about this, which is like it's

734
00:35:42,074 --> 00:35:45,114
Speaker 1: better to be happy than right. I wonder if you

735
00:35:45,154 --> 00:35:47,154
Speaker 1: believe that, Jesse. You like to be right, I mean

736
00:35:47,234 --> 00:35:47,913
Speaker 1: I like to be right.

737
00:35:48,114 --> 00:35:51,913
Speaker 2: You have to be right. But I also have a

738
00:35:51,914 --> 00:35:56,714
Speaker 2: people pleasing element. That is, if I was speaking to

739
00:35:56,834 --> 00:36:01,034
Speaker 2: my neighbor to a you know, small talk, yea, and

740
00:36:01,154 --> 00:36:03,674
Speaker 2: often we're not going to correct then nah, And it's

741
00:36:03,714 --> 00:36:05,913
Speaker 2: like I might have done something. I might be talking

742
00:36:05,914 --> 00:36:09,074
Speaker 2: to someone later who says Lewis Hamilton, you know, thirty

743
00:36:09,154 --> 00:36:12,674
Speaker 2: nine year old Lewis Hamilton. I'd go and I'd probably

744
00:36:12,674 --> 00:36:17,474
Speaker 2: bite my tongue, even though I know, of course matter.

745
00:36:17,794 --> 00:36:20,474
Speaker 2: It's like when someone starts telling you this is a

746
00:36:20,474 --> 00:36:23,674
Speaker 2: pet peeve of mine, a story you've already heard. I

747
00:36:23,674 --> 00:36:26,354
Speaker 2: think you've got to let him tell the story. Come on, Like,

748
00:36:26,634 --> 00:36:29,393
Speaker 2: I think it's rude to kind of stop someone and go,

749
00:36:29,834 --> 00:36:30,714
Speaker 2: you've already told me.

750
00:36:30,674 --> 00:36:32,154
Speaker 3: This whatever time.

751
00:36:32,674 --> 00:36:34,473
Speaker 2: I know there's got to be a limit, doesn't there

752
00:36:35,114 --> 00:36:40,514
Speaker 2: There are people who tell the same story every time, Yeah, exactly,

753
00:36:40,674 --> 00:36:46,594
Speaker 2: and then you break your leg. But I think it's

754
00:36:46,594 --> 00:36:49,594
Speaker 2: a similar principle, which is, like, what do you do

755
00:36:49,754 --> 00:36:54,913
Speaker 2: for like social cohesion and comfort and peace because we

756
00:36:54,954 --> 00:36:56,754
Speaker 2: all know that feeling of having a know it all

757
00:36:56,794 --> 00:36:59,914
Speaker 2: at the table? Yeah, And I feel like the only

758
00:36:59,994 --> 00:37:02,034
Speaker 2: time you get to scream when you know you're right

759
00:37:02,154 --> 00:37:04,554
Speaker 2: is trivia, Like I think that's really important.

760
00:37:04,234 --> 00:37:06,474
Speaker 1: Yes, pob trivia, which obviously I do a lot of.

761
00:37:07,154 --> 00:37:09,154
Speaker 1: And the thing is is that it's nothing more embarrassing.

762
00:37:09,194 --> 00:37:11,594
Speaker 1: And I've done that on this show actually too, where

763
00:37:11,674 --> 00:37:15,474
Speaker 1: you're wrong but you are absolutely convinced of your rightness.

764
00:37:15,514 --> 00:37:17,594
Speaker 1: I remember once being on Mike and being like, I

765
00:37:17,594 --> 00:37:20,034
Speaker 1: said a thing and our producer picked me up and said, no,

766
00:37:20,114 --> 00:37:22,394
Speaker 1: that's not right, and I was so convinced of my rightness,

767
00:37:22,434 --> 00:37:25,074
Speaker 1: I got a bit crazy. Yeah, and I was wrong.

768
00:37:25,714 --> 00:37:28,354
Speaker 2: That's a thing too right, is that I saw that

769
00:37:28,474 --> 00:37:31,473
Speaker 2: headline on not being right doesn't matter to be right,

770
00:37:31,514 --> 00:37:35,794
Speaker 2: and I was like, I mostly assume I'm wrong. Like

771
00:37:35,834 --> 00:37:39,034
Speaker 2: if someone starts talking and maybe you know there are

772
00:37:39,034 --> 00:37:41,033
Speaker 2: a few facts or whatever. I think you learn more

773
00:37:41,074 --> 00:37:43,634
Speaker 2: by kind of sitting back and being like, oh, where

774
00:37:43,674 --> 00:37:47,274
Speaker 2: are you coming from? Or they might have read something

775
00:37:47,514 --> 00:37:49,553
Speaker 2: completely different. But often you're wrong.

776
00:37:49,754 --> 00:37:53,554
Speaker 1: I'll never forget when I hadn't been in Australia long

777
00:37:53,594 --> 00:37:55,594
Speaker 1: and I was like trying to worm my way into

778
00:37:55,714 --> 00:37:58,274
Speaker 1: a new friend group, like this cool friend group. We

779
00:37:58,274 --> 00:38:01,234
Speaker 1: were in a bottle shop and I said that I

780
00:38:01,274 --> 00:38:04,994
Speaker 1: really liked I think. I said I really liked Savignon

781
00:38:05,074 --> 00:38:09,074
Speaker 1: Blanc right, and this girl literally corrected me right there

782
00:38:09,114 --> 00:38:11,033
Speaker 1: at the counter. Like this girl in the friend group

783
00:38:11,154 --> 00:38:14,354
Speaker 1: was like, you say so whatever she said, and I

784
00:38:14,394 --> 00:38:16,554
Speaker 1: was like, well, I'm fucking done here, aren't I Like,

785
00:38:16,634 --> 00:38:18,274
Speaker 1: that's rude. That's rude.

786
00:38:18,474 --> 00:38:22,514
Speaker 2: Every time I say moey or moet. Yeah, I get corrected.

787
00:38:22,634 --> 00:38:25,354
Speaker 1: Someone who someone who will correct you to make you

788
00:38:25,394 --> 00:38:27,634
Speaker 1: feel small, as opposed to help you.

789
00:38:27,954 --> 00:38:30,794
Speaker 3: Well, the worst thing someone's ever done to me was

790
00:38:30,874 --> 00:38:32,594
Speaker 3: I was at dinner and we were talking abou high

791
00:38:32,594 --> 00:38:34,554
Speaker 3: school musical and I was like, oh, did you know

792
00:38:34,674 --> 00:38:37,354
Speaker 3: Vanessa Hudgens is part Indian and Indian people love saying

793
00:38:37,394 --> 00:38:39,433
Speaker 3: people are Indian, so I was like, really excited about

794
00:38:39,434 --> 00:38:41,033
Speaker 3: this fact. I was like, Vanessa Hudgens a part Indian.

795
00:38:41,114 --> 00:38:42,194
Speaker 3: They're like, really is she?

796
00:38:42,274 --> 00:38:43,314
Speaker 1: Oh my god, amazing And.

797
00:38:43,434 --> 00:38:46,114
Speaker 3: One of the girls got out her phone and looked

798
00:38:46,114 --> 00:38:48,754
Speaker 3: it up and was it wrong? I think I was wrong,

799
00:38:50,034 --> 00:38:52,433
Speaker 3: but like, why would you do it from me?

800
00:38:52,714 --> 00:38:54,473
Speaker 1: Let it stands look it up.

801
00:38:54,674 --> 00:38:55,953
Speaker 2: Just look fun.

802
00:38:56,274 --> 00:38:56,954
Speaker 1: That's the problem.

803
00:38:57,074 --> 00:38:58,034
Speaker 3: Actually, you're so right?

804
00:38:58,114 --> 00:39:01,074
Speaker 1: Is that being able to search things sometimes this whole thing,

805
00:39:01,234 --> 00:39:04,234
Speaker 1: So let's just roll with it. Yeah, she's totally half

806
00:39:04,234 --> 00:39:08,154
Speaker 1: Indian and correct the record, but did it really matter

807
00:39:08,194 --> 00:39:11,314
Speaker 1: around that table? Right then? Affecting your life? I have

808
00:39:11,394 --> 00:39:12,994
Speaker 1: to just put one note like I don't want to

809
00:39:13,034 --> 00:39:15,754
Speaker 1: be generalizing here, but in my house I live with

810
00:39:15,794 --> 00:39:20,074
Speaker 1: some neurodivergent people. And heart goes out to everyone who's

811
00:39:20,114 --> 00:39:23,593
Speaker 1: had this argument where you're like, why are last night's

812
00:39:23,594 --> 00:39:26,034
Speaker 1: pajamas on the floor and they'll be like, they're not

813
00:39:26,114 --> 00:39:29,754
Speaker 1: last night's. They have pajamas from two nights ago, and

814
00:39:29,794 --> 00:39:36,514
Speaker 1: you're like, it could be infuriating, but it also cannot

815
00:39:36,554 --> 00:39:38,953
Speaker 1: be helped. There are some people who are very they

816
00:39:39,034 --> 00:39:42,754
Speaker 1: need like the rightness is very important. The facts are

817
00:39:42,874 --> 00:39:46,154
Speaker 1: very important, even if they don't matter, and you need

818
00:39:46,434 --> 00:39:49,433
Speaker 1: to move past that and correct the record before you're

819
00:39:49,434 --> 00:39:50,274
Speaker 1: going to get any action.

820
00:39:50,394 --> 00:39:53,474
Speaker 2: I also wonder if it's a thing that younger people do,

821
00:39:53,874 --> 00:39:57,154
Speaker 2: the correcting. It's a thing that much older people do,

822
00:39:58,074 --> 00:40:00,954
Speaker 2: and in the middle we kind of have the wisdom

823
00:40:01,194 --> 00:40:04,354
Speaker 2: to not like I cringe thinking about myself in the

824
00:40:04,394 --> 00:40:08,314
Speaker 2: workplace in early years, and it wasn't so much. I

825
00:40:08,314 --> 00:40:10,873
Speaker 2: remember correcting someone on something I knew I was right,

826
00:40:11,474 --> 00:40:14,354
Speaker 2: but it was everything. It was my tone. I wanted

827
00:40:14,514 --> 00:40:17,314
Speaker 2: to die on this hill that probably wasn't that important,

828
00:40:17,354 --> 00:40:19,354
Speaker 2: and the way that I did it had embarrassed the

829
00:40:19,394 --> 00:40:21,514
Speaker 2: person that we were inevitably going to get into a

830
00:40:21,554 --> 00:40:25,474
Speaker 2: bit of a stalemate with it. So maybe you just

831
00:40:25,554 --> 00:40:27,873
Speaker 2: learn as you get older, I mean, to let things go,

832
00:40:28,034 --> 00:40:32,033
Speaker 2: or just a more kind of humble way to guide someone.

833
00:40:32,074 --> 00:40:34,034
Speaker 1: I'd love to know if the outlouders have any like

834
00:40:34,434 --> 00:40:37,274
Speaker 1: kind ways to correct someone, you know what I mean,

835
00:40:38,034 --> 00:40:41,274
Speaker 1: because I think that's really tricky. Is like, as you

836
00:40:41,314 --> 00:40:44,274
Speaker 1: said before, do you choose to embarrass somebody in public

837
00:40:44,314 --> 00:40:46,234
Speaker 1: by correcting them in front of everybody, or do you

838
00:40:46,274 --> 00:40:48,433
Speaker 1: take them aside afterwards or is there like a nice

839
00:40:48,434 --> 00:40:48,794
Speaker 1: way you.

840
00:40:48,794 --> 00:40:51,954
Speaker 3: Can be Like, it's interesting that your brain works that way. Yeah,

841
00:40:51,994 --> 00:40:53,394
Speaker 3: it's interesting that you think.

842
00:40:53,234 --> 00:40:57,993
Speaker 2: That I've a terrible dis I've had Lucas say things

843
00:40:58,034 --> 00:40:59,754
Speaker 2: to me like six years on going. You know, you

844
00:40:59,994 --> 00:41:02,594
Speaker 2: say that word wrong. That's the word I use all

845
00:41:02,634 --> 00:41:04,954
Speaker 2: the time, and I'm like, no, that was a first

846
00:41:04,954 --> 00:41:09,513
Speaker 2: time thing. You needed to said that on this microphone.

847
00:41:10,794 --> 00:41:12,914
Speaker 1: Friends, That is all we have time for on today's

848
00:41:12,954 --> 00:41:15,634
Speaker 1: Mamma Mia out loud. But if you're hungry for more banter,

849
00:41:16,034 --> 00:41:18,634
Speaker 1: more laughs, a bit of a holiday from the bonfire

850
00:41:18,674 --> 00:41:20,114
Speaker 1: of the world, we may have given you a bit

851
00:41:20,154 --> 00:41:22,114
Speaker 1: of that today. That Louise Hamilton thing.

852
00:41:23,594 --> 00:41:25,514
Speaker 3: That went on a long time, It's the smartest segment

853
00:41:25,554 --> 00:41:26,714
Speaker 3: in the whole episode.

854
00:41:27,394 --> 00:41:30,714
Speaker 2: I'm voting to actually edit the rest hour and just

855
00:41:30,794 --> 00:41:33,954
Speaker 2: call it Lewis Hamilton thoughts discussed exactly.

856
00:41:35,274 --> 00:41:39,194
Speaker 1: We have another show. Mama Mia has launched another big

857
00:41:39,234 --> 00:41:41,674
Speaker 1: show this week, and in fact, one of the main

858
00:41:41,714 --> 00:41:43,714
Speaker 1: hosts of its sitting in the studio with us right now,

859
00:41:43,794 --> 00:41:47,393
Speaker 1: Catherine Mahoney. She's been watching us be terribly undisciplined on

860
00:41:47,434 --> 00:41:50,834
Speaker 1: the mics today. It's called Unleashed. It's MIA's baby. You

861
00:41:50,914 --> 00:41:52,794
Speaker 1: might have heard about it. It's a show for gen

862
00:41:52,954 --> 00:41:55,714
Speaker 1: X women who just really want to laugh. It has launched,

863
00:41:55,714 --> 00:41:58,034
Speaker 1: it has dropped, It is happening. Everybody's listening to it.

864
00:41:58,074 --> 00:41:58,674
Speaker 1: Go find it.

865
00:41:58,954 --> 00:42:00,354
Speaker 2: Incredible feedback.

866
00:42:00,434 --> 00:42:03,114
Speaker 1: It has so press follow, make sure you never miss

867
00:42:03,114 --> 00:42:06,154
Speaker 1: an episode and get that in your ears. We will

868
00:42:06,154 --> 00:42:09,234
Speaker 1: be back with you tomorrow with Mia. Oh you know

869
00:42:09,274 --> 00:42:13,114
Speaker 1: what tomorrow is, Jesse. Mia made me and Jesse like

870
00:42:13,274 --> 00:42:16,553
Speaker 1: grabbed us by our ears almost and said, I need

871
00:42:16,594 --> 00:42:18,514
Speaker 1: to talk to you about that skinny stuff I was

872
00:42:18,554 --> 00:42:21,554
Speaker 1: talking about with Amelia Yea, the new age of skinny

873
00:42:21,594 --> 00:42:23,674
Speaker 1: and how we felt about it. And she knows that

874
00:42:23,714 --> 00:42:26,834
Speaker 1: we disagree with her a little bit, so she wanted

875
00:42:26,874 --> 00:42:27,194
Speaker 1: to have it.

876
00:42:28,754 --> 00:42:31,634
Speaker 2: Specifically, said, I listened to that episode and you were

877
00:42:31,634 --> 00:42:34,074
Speaker 2: wrong on this point and this point, on this point,

878
00:42:34,434 --> 00:42:37,074
Speaker 2: I was very you are wrong, and I am.

879
00:42:37,074 --> 00:42:38,594
Speaker 1: Actually, but that's you can correctly.

880
00:42:38,794 --> 00:42:42,194
Speaker 2: That's fine, Like, yeah, it's important to correct me because

881
00:42:42,194 --> 00:42:44,473
Speaker 2: otherwise she gets carried away and.

882
00:42:44,394 --> 00:42:46,354
Speaker 1: Then I agreed with her on a surprising number of

883
00:42:46,354 --> 00:42:50,194
Speaker 1: points too. So that episode, the subscriber episode with me

884
00:42:50,354 --> 00:42:57,913
Speaker 1: and Jesse and myself talking about the emaciated celebrities yead celebrities,

885
00:42:58,394 --> 00:43:04,274
Speaker 1: drops tomorrow. Anyway, I keep talking. Goodbye friends, Bye bye.

886
00:43:09,314 --> 00:43:12,194
Speaker 2: Mother. Mayor acknowledges the traditional owners of the land on

887
00:43:12,274 --> 00:43:13,994
Speaker 2: which we have recorded this podcast.