WEBVTT - INBOX: How To Have Scary Conversations At Work 

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<v Speaker 1>You're listening to a Mother with Me your podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Hello, and welcome to biz Inbox. I'm m Vernem and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm so first and every week we answer your burning

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<v Speaker 2>career questions in the simplest way possible because we're all

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<v Speaker 2>busy over here. So I hope you're really proud because

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<v Speaker 2>I've done some homework and I've adopted something that I

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<v Speaker 2>learned on the podcast, and I'm blocking. Yes, my calendar

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<v Speaker 2>has never looked better. Really, I've done like, I think

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<v Speaker 2>I've got a bit too hard into it because I've

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<v Speaker 2>done like a time for waking up, a time for

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<v Speaker 2>getting ready for work, a time for leaving home for work,

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<v Speaker 2>a time to get to work.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, no, it's working.

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<v Speaker 1>This is good. It's all about experimentation.

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<v Speaker 3>It's like, please relax, you can chill, all.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, M.

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<v Speaker 4>Today we're talking about scary work conversations, how to advocate

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<v Speaker 4>for more money for you.

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<v Speaker 1>And your team, and how to recover when you lied

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<v Speaker 1>to your manner.

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<v Speaker 2>Been there, don't tell anyone. So this first question came

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<v Speaker 2>in on LinkedIn and it is anonymous, and I know

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<v Speaker 2>exactly why it is anonymous, and said, hello, I have

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<v Speaker 2>a question for the podcast. I recently stepped into my

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<v Speaker 2>first management position after working as a project manager. I

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<v Speaker 2>was given a salary higher than what I was interviewed for,

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<v Speaker 2>but still low for the type of role, as they

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<v Speaker 2>knew it was my first management position. So our summarized arrest.

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<v Speaker 2>She says that there was no process before she started

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<v Speaker 2>and had a high turnover, and she has a growing

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<v Speaker 2>list of achievements, including her team's morale has been the

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<v Speaker 2>best it's ever been. She also said that the company

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<v Speaker 2>has advertised for other management roles at her level for

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<v Speaker 2>fifteen to thirty k higher, and that there's a huge

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<v Speaker 2>disparity in salaries between the project's teams and the sales teams.

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<v Speaker 2>So she asks, how do I advocate for my team

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<v Speaker 2>and myself when it comes to pay.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I just love this.

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<v Speaker 4>So there's so much unpack here, but I think this

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<v Speaker 4>situation can be really common throughout your career, so I

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<v Speaker 4>really wanted you to talk about it. So I first

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<v Speaker 4>just want to say that despite some kind of shitty

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<v Speaker 4>stuff at her company, she's delivering and her team are happy.

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<v Speaker 4>So that is awesome, and I know this person is brilliant.

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<v Speaker 4>I think there's a really interesting point of leverage that

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<v Speaker 4>she has, which is she says that turnover in the

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<v Speaker 4>company is quite high, but her team is the happiest

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<v Speaker 4>they've ever been. So that's a very important point of leverage.

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<v Speaker 4>And I want to come back to that.

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<v Speaker 1>What do we do.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm going to give you a mindset and if you

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<v Speaker 4>can embrace this mindset, this is like almost all you

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<v Speaker 4>need in your career if you work at a company, Like,

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<v Speaker 4>if you understand this, you'll be good. Like you can

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<v Speaker 4>start embracing this tomorrow, but most people don't do it.

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<v Speaker 4>It's incredibly powerful and it's based on Harvard research, so

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<v Speaker 4>it's like fully backed. Okay, So companies aren't driven by fairness,

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<v Speaker 4>and the way to persuade senior leaders is to actually

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<v Speaker 4>go in with a learning mindset. So the less you

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<v Speaker 4>try to persuade them, ironically, the more persuasive you'll actually be.

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<v Speaker 1>So what do I mean by that? You need to.

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<v Speaker 4>Park any assumptions that you have, Just try and park

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<v Speaker 4>them and switch into curiosity and ask questions as the

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<v Speaker 4>first thing that you do. So I want to ask you, like,

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<v Speaker 4>why do you think they're advertising these jobs that are

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<v Speaker 4>similar for fifty to thirty k higher? Or why do

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<v Speaker 4>you think that one of the other teams is getting

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<v Speaker 4>paid more than her team.

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<v Speaker 2>Is it because they're looking for people with experience, so

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<v Speaker 2>they want to hire more people in that position but

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<v Speaker 2>actually have experience so they can continue I guess, like

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<v Speaker 2>this sounds so shitty, but continue like doing the work

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<v Speaker 2>that she's already started.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it could be that.

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<v Speaker 4>It could be that there's more industry demand for people

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<v Speaker 4>in those roles. It could be that that team has

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<v Speaker 4>a different type of output. It could be that team's

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<v Speaker 4>working on different kinds of projects. It could be that

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<v Speaker 4>they're taking her team for granted, and that's like a

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<v Speaker 4>historical legacy.

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<v Speaker 1>Think.

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<v Speaker 4>The fact is that we don't know what the reasons are.

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<v Speaker 4>So the first thing that you want to do is

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<v Speaker 4>like genuinely go in with curiosity and be like, why

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<v Speaker 4>is this that, like this is happening. And what I

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<v Speaker 4>want this person to do is to be able to

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<v Speaker 4>arm herself with the same information that those leaders have.

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<v Speaker 4>So information is power, and if you can go in

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<v Speaker 4>and start asking some questions. So the first thing that

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<v Speaker 4>I would do is it depends what kind of relationships

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<v Speaker 4>you have with different scenior leaders, with your manager. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 4>and I just want you to start asking questions. So

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<v Speaker 4>it can be things like trying to uncover what the

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<v Speaker 4>A problems in the company are. So these are like

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<v Speaker 4>the really big things. You know, you'll have a strategy

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<v Speaker 4>at the start of the year, and often halfway through

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<v Speaker 4>the year those things aren't actually important anymore. You always

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<v Speaker 4>need to be trying to figure out what are the

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<v Speaker 4>A problems? Are her team contributing or working on those

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<v Speaker 4>A problems? And if they're not, can they be? But

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<v Speaker 4>really just be starting to ask lots of questions. And

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<v Speaker 4>then if this information is public about the roles that

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<v Speaker 4>they're posting that are at a higher salary, Like if

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<v Speaker 4>that information is public, it might be okay with people

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<v Speaker 4>she trust to kind of say, like, you know, I'm

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<v Speaker 4>interested to know why these roles are being advertised at

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<v Speaker 4>a higher rate. And then you know, what is it

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<v Speaker 4>that my team could be doing to deliver the same

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<v Speaker 4>kind of value that these teams.

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<v Speaker 1>Are delivering, or what could I personally be delivering to

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<v Speaker 1>kind of get that.

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<v Speaker 4>So I think just starting with curiosity is the first

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<v Speaker 4>place that I would start interesting. Yeah, and then the

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<v Speaker 4>next thing that you want to do there is a

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<v Speaker 4>hard truth that the single biggest factor there's some research

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<v Speaker 4>behind this that says, particularly for women, why you get

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<v Speaker 4>promoted it's whether or not your contributions are known. So

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<v Speaker 4>that piece around visibility and packaging your work. It is

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<v Speaker 4>true you really need to do it, but most people

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<v Speaker 4>do it in the wrong way. So if you think

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<v Speaker 4>about your sort of performance reviewer and your review and

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<v Speaker 4>you've got these like bullet points and you're bored writing them,

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<v Speaker 4>someone else's board reading them, So like you don't just

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<v Speaker 4>think about like you know, my team contributed ten percent

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<v Speaker 4>or like I did xy Z, you really have to

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<v Speaker 4>tell the story about your contribution and repeat it. There's

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<v Speaker 4>so much noise at companies, and so I think sometimes

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<v Speaker 4>we think like I shared my contributions in my annual

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<v Speaker 4>reviewer in a summary email. It's just like not how

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<v Speaker 4>it works. So there's a really simple way that I

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<v Speaker 4>like to do it, which is think about what it

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<v Speaker 4>was like before. So before she joined or before she

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<v Speaker 4>started working on a certain problem. Now, think about what

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<v Speaker 4>it's like now, So what is the tangible change, Like

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<v Speaker 4>what's been the actual difference? And then if you look

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<v Speaker 4>at how that change, what was like special or unique

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<v Speaker 4>about the way she did it? Like I know this

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<v Speaker 4>person is doing stuff that makes her team happy that

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<v Speaker 4>no one else, like other managers aren't doing. I know

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<v Speaker 4>this person is like doing excellly. She said, she's got

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<v Speaker 4>a growing list of achievements, so she's doing special things.

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<v Speaker 1>I know she is.

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<v Speaker 4>What you want to do is just pick like one

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<v Speaker 4>to three things that are like big problems for the company.

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<v Speaker 4>Do that change so like the before, the after, and

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<v Speaker 4>then what I did that was special, and repeat that

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<v Speaker 4>story to lots of different Oh my.

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<v Speaker 3>God, it's so good.

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<v Speaker 1>That's it, and like you just have to keep doing that.

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<v Speaker 4>And then don't go in and say, like the sales

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<v Speaker 4>team is getting paid more. We're often given this advice,

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<v Speaker 4>like you go in and you say, here's my achievements.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm worth this, this is what I want from the company,

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<v Speaker 4>Like you do sort of need to do those things,

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<v Speaker 4>but first to start with curiosity, then go with storytelling,

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<v Speaker 4>and then you can if you still like really feel

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<v Speaker 4>like you need to have it. It can be something like,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, I've been reflecting on the broader value that

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<v Speaker 4>I've been bringing and I've grown in this role. So

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<v Speaker 4>I started here and now i'm here. Can we talk

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<v Speaker 4>about my path to align my compensation to that, and

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<v Speaker 4>you want to give them like a bit of a runway,

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<v Speaker 4>so like to get to that, Like is it going

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<v Speaker 4>to be six months? What do I need to do

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<v Speaker 4>in that six months time to get there? What you

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<v Speaker 4>don't want to be doing is giving an ultimatum. So

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<v Speaker 4>I see me getting paid more. I want to get

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<v Speaker 4>paid more, ultimatum.

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<v Speaker 1>Don't do that.

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<v Speaker 3>That's so interesting. Oh my god. I hope she messages

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<v Speaker 3>us again.

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<v Speaker 4>Me too. I will do a follow up with her. Guys,

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<v Speaker 4>we love getting your voice notes. And this one came

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<v Speaker 4>in and it's a question I hear all the time,

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<v Speaker 4>so I think it's a really good one for us

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<v Speaker 4>to break down.

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<v Speaker 5>I find having tough conversations at work really difficult, and

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<v Speaker 5>I don't really like bringing things up that are uncomfortable.

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<v Speaker 5>I find once I get going, but getting started is

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<v Speaker 5>the worst part. So I generally put it off, and

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<v Speaker 5>most of the time I just avoid having those conversations

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<v Speaker 5>at all, which really isn't great. How do I start

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<v Speaker 5>scary talks with the boss of work?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, m how are you with tough convers I am

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<v Speaker 2>so bad at tough conversations.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know what it is.

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<v Speaker 2>I have a feeling. It's mainly like performance reviews or

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<v Speaker 2>talking about salary that I'm on the verge of tears

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<v Speaker 2>with every single of those conversations.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know what it is.

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<v Speaker 2>I think it's something about you trying to advocate for

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<v Speaker 2>yourself in a way that you've never done before in

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<v Speaker 2>your natural life. Yeah, and it's really hard seeing people

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<v Speaker 2>in your workplace, whether it's your manager or your manager's manager,

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<v Speaker 2>having to tell you that either you're not good enough

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<v Speaker 2>for this thing or you.

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<v Speaker 3>Need to do It's a weird like reverse therapy.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah way.

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<v Speaker 2>Instead of your therapist is trying to make you feel

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<v Speaker 2>really really good about yourself, you're getting someone who's like

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<v Speaker 2>doing kind of the opposite.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, it's very unusual, especially in a work context, and

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<v Speaker 4>like you know, you don't do them that often, so

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<v Speaker 4>it makes sense that you're going to be feeling always shakes, yes, exactly,

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<v Speaker 4>So something that I think can really help. And often,

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<v Speaker 4>like getting started is the hardest part. Like once you're

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<v Speaker 4>into the converse itself, it can be easier, but just

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<v Speaker 4>to focus in on getting started, which is what this

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<v Speaker 4>question is about. Want you to think about a frame

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<v Speaker 4>for the conversation, So a really good frame can sometimes

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<v Speaker 4>be just calling the conversation for what it is and

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<v Speaker 4>stating your intention for having the conversation in the first place. So,

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, there's lots of different types of scary conversations,

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<v Speaker 4>from like asking for four weeks holiday, through to you know,

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<v Speaker 4>trying to give someone feedback, through to raising something like

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<v Speaker 4>a request that you have. So I like to call

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<v Speaker 4>the conversation for what it is and state my intention

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<v Speaker 4>for having it. So an example might be, this isn't

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<v Speaker 4>going to be an easy conversation for us to have,

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<v Speaker 4>but I really care about the dynamic between us, so

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<v Speaker 4>I really want us to take the time to talk

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<v Speaker 4>to you about this. Or another one might be I

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<v Speaker 4>need to request something and I've actually been thinking a

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<v Speaker 4>lot about how this is going to impact you. So

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<v Speaker 4>I've come with some options, and I want to give

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<v Speaker 4>you the chance to kind of pick from those options.

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<v Speaker 4>Just creating a little frame and kind of saying this

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<v Speaker 4>is sort of how I feel about having the conversation.

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<v Speaker 4>You can be a little bit honest and then saying

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<v Speaker 4>this is my intention for having it. That can set

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<v Speaker 4>it up really nicely, even just as simple as saying, like,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, I've been feeling a little bit nervous to

0:10:14.410 --> 0:10:16.650
<v Speaker 4>have this conversation, or I've been feeling a little bit worried.

0:10:17.090 --> 0:10:17.970
<v Speaker 1>I heard a really good.

0:10:17.890 --> 0:10:19.610
<v Speaker 4>Piece of advice the other day, which was, if you

0:10:19.650 --> 0:10:22.450
<v Speaker 4>are trying to give feedback to someone, you can even

0:10:22.570 --> 0:10:25.209
<v Speaker 4>just say, you know, this might come out as a

0:10:25.250 --> 0:10:26.850
<v Speaker 4>little bit clumsy. I'm not sure if my words are

0:10:26.890 --> 0:10:29.570
<v Speaker 4>going to be perfect. It might not be perfectly articulated.

0:10:29.610 --> 0:10:33.490
<v Speaker 4>But I know that you really value honesty and directness,

0:10:33.490 --> 0:10:35.650
<v Speaker 4>so is it okay if I just try my best.

0:10:36.010 --> 0:10:37.890
<v Speaker 4>I think it's like this really nice frame you can

0:10:37.930 --> 0:10:40.730
<v Speaker 4>put on a conversation first before you actually get into

0:10:40.810 --> 0:10:43.490
<v Speaker 4>the detail of the conversation, to just kind of like

0:10:43.930 --> 0:10:46.130
<v Speaker 4>spend a minute talking about what the conversation is going

0:10:46.210 --> 0:10:48.850
<v Speaker 4>to be. It helps the other person prepare, and it

0:10:48.890 --> 0:10:50.890
<v Speaker 4>also just helps you prepare as well.

0:10:51.090 --> 0:10:51.370
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:10:51.490 --> 0:10:53.850
<v Speaker 2>I think that's so good because I feel like with

0:10:53.890 --> 0:10:58.370
<v Speaker 2>these conversations, exactly what this person says, like in the beginning.

0:10:58.410 --> 0:11:00.729
<v Speaker 2>I feel like sometimes the way you start the conversation,

0:11:01.170 --> 0:11:03.170
<v Speaker 2>you might psyche yourself out and take it in a

0:11:03.170 --> 0:11:05.690
<v Speaker 2>different place that you didn't plan to. But if you

0:11:05.690 --> 0:11:08.890
<v Speaker 2>do the framework, then you're locked in, like you've already

0:11:08.890 --> 0:11:09.569
<v Speaker 2>announced it.

0:11:09.850 --> 0:11:12.050
<v Speaker 4>That is exactly right. It makes it so much easier.

0:11:12.130 --> 0:11:15.250
<v Speaker 4>And there's one other tip that I think is really important.

0:11:15.250 --> 0:11:17.890
<v Speaker 4>If they know it's going to be a tough conversation, say,

0:11:17.890 --> 0:11:20.450
<v Speaker 4>for example, like you've had some issues with the client

0:11:20.530 --> 0:11:22.330
<v Speaker 4>and you're like, okay, you're on email and you're like,

0:11:22.370 --> 0:11:23.370
<v Speaker 4>we have to talk about this.

0:11:23.450 --> 0:11:24.569
<v Speaker 1>Can we have a phone call? Right?

0:11:24.610 --> 0:11:26.370
<v Speaker 4>So you're both coming into it knowing it's going to

0:11:26.410 --> 0:11:30.010
<v Speaker 4>be a tough conversation. Don't start with small talk. Just

0:11:30.090 --> 0:11:33.130
<v Speaker 4>say to them, thank you for giving me your time today,

0:11:33.210 --> 0:11:35.530
<v Speaker 4>thanks to taking the time. Don't start with like, how

0:11:35.610 --> 0:11:37.130
<v Speaker 4>are you, how's your day been. They know it's going

0:11:37.170 --> 0:11:38.930
<v Speaker 4>to be a tough conversation. They're just waiting for you

0:11:38.970 --> 0:11:41.530
<v Speaker 4>to start with the bad stuff. So no small talk.

0:11:41.650 --> 0:11:43.090
<v Speaker 4>If people know it's going to be a.

0:11:43.050 --> 0:11:47.449
<v Speaker 3>Still conversation, Okay, I have to try that, all right.

0:11:47.970 --> 0:11:51.490
<v Speaker 2>Coming up, we are talking about a TikTok that's gone

0:11:51.530 --> 0:11:55.970
<v Speaker 2>absolutely viral. It's about lying to your boss and it

0:11:56.050 --> 0:12:06.450
<v Speaker 2>hits too close to hope to close. Okay, So this TikTok,

0:12:06.530 --> 0:12:09.370
<v Speaker 2>I've seen it a few times on my social media feeds,

0:12:09.370 --> 0:12:12.650
<v Speaker 2>and it's probably because my algorithm knows exactly what I'm

0:12:12.690 --> 0:12:14.810
<v Speaker 2>going through, and I want to explain it to you

0:12:14.850 --> 0:12:16.890
<v Speaker 2>because it's a lot of text. So it's basically someone

0:12:16.930 --> 0:12:19.970
<v Speaker 2>sitting at their computer typing, and the text on the

0:12:20.050 --> 0:12:23.290
<v Speaker 2>video says me starting a task. I told my boss

0:12:23.290 --> 0:12:25.930
<v Speaker 2>that I'd started two weeks ago, and then it shows

0:12:25.970 --> 0:12:28.250
<v Speaker 2>them clicking a link into a Google Docs and it

0:12:28.330 --> 0:12:32.850
<v Speaker 2>comes up with the dreaded access denied, please request. So

0:12:33.410 --> 0:12:37.210
<v Speaker 2>I have been in this exact same position. I told

0:12:37.210 --> 0:12:39.050
<v Speaker 2>my boss I was working on I think it was

0:12:39.090 --> 0:12:42.449
<v Speaker 2>a podcast script. Georgie, our producer wasn't this one, don't

0:12:42.450 --> 0:12:44.890
<v Speaker 2>at me. I was working on a podcast script a

0:12:45.010 --> 0:12:48.290
<v Speaker 2>few years ago, and my producer was like, hey, just

0:12:48.330 --> 0:12:49.890
<v Speaker 2>checking you've done your script, Just done your script, and

0:12:49.890 --> 0:12:51.490
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, yep, yep, done it, done it, done it.

0:12:51.610 --> 0:12:53.610
<v Speaker 2>And then that night I went in to do the

0:12:53.610 --> 0:12:55.490
<v Speaker 2>script because I hadn't done it, and it came up

0:12:55.490 --> 0:12:58.530
<v Speaker 2>with please request access from my producer.

0:12:59.130 --> 0:13:00.970
<v Speaker 3>So I requested the access.

0:13:00.730 --> 0:13:02.690
<v Speaker 2>And then I slacked her and I was like, hey,

0:13:02.770 --> 0:13:06.170
<v Speaker 2>so weird. The access reverted and I made her problem.

0:13:06.210 --> 0:13:07.490
<v Speaker 2>I was like, I don't know how you did that,

0:13:07.650 --> 0:13:09.370
<v Speaker 2>but if you could please grant me access again.

0:13:11.130 --> 0:13:15.370
<v Speaker 3>I was like, I just have to make some forget it. Oh,

0:13:15.690 --> 0:13:16.810
<v Speaker 3>I love it, away with it?

0:13:16.970 --> 0:13:22.650
<v Speaker 4>Yeah if she listens to Yeah, I think you know,

0:13:22.770 --> 0:13:24.929
<v Speaker 4>this is a lesson that you learn the hard way.

0:13:25.010 --> 0:13:27.570
<v Speaker 1>I wonder if you would do something different now that.

0:13:27.450 --> 0:13:30.689
<v Speaker 3>You're really do like a win is a win.

0:13:30.850 --> 0:13:31.970
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Yeah, that's true.

0:13:32.330 --> 0:13:36.010
<v Speaker 4>Here's the thing, right, Managers don't actually care about mistakes,

0:13:36.210 --> 0:13:38.530
<v Speaker 4>I would even include like a little lie like this

0:13:38.690 --> 0:13:41.410
<v Speaker 4>in that category. What they care about is whether or

0:13:41.450 --> 0:13:43.850
<v Speaker 4>not they can trust you. And so the most important

0:13:43.890 --> 0:13:45.810
<v Speaker 4>thing that you want to protect is your long term

0:13:45.850 --> 0:13:48.050
<v Speaker 4>trust with your manager at all course, and like a

0:13:48.090 --> 0:13:50.490
<v Speaker 4>little silly thing like this doesn't need to get in

0:13:50.490 --> 0:13:52.610
<v Speaker 4>the way of that long term trust. So, honestly, the

0:13:52.650 --> 0:13:54.650
<v Speaker 4>best thing you can do is just to be totally honest.

0:13:54.930 --> 0:13:57.330
<v Speaker 4>Don't cover up a lie with another lie, and what

0:13:57.450 --> 0:13:59.290
<v Speaker 4>you find is like then you start trying to ghost

0:13:59.290 --> 0:14:02.929
<v Speaker 4>things and it just gets really bad. I honestly think

0:14:02.970 --> 0:14:05.690
<v Speaker 4>the best thing to do is to just say I

0:14:05.730 --> 0:14:08.410
<v Speaker 4>told you I started this task, and I haven't. And

0:14:08.450 --> 0:14:10.410
<v Speaker 4>the reason for that is I was feeling a bit

0:14:10.450 --> 0:14:12.290
<v Speaker 4>overwhelmed with the stuff I had on my plate, and

0:14:12.370 --> 0:14:13.970
<v Speaker 4>I didn't want you to think that I wasn't on

0:14:14.010 --> 0:14:16.810
<v Speaker 4>top of things, but I realized now that that wasn't

0:14:16.810 --> 0:14:18.530
<v Speaker 4>the right thing to do. It actually feels way worse

0:14:18.610 --> 0:14:21.210
<v Speaker 4>not being honest with you. So I just want to

0:14:21.290 --> 0:14:23.810
<v Speaker 4>let you know. I'm requesting access now. I'm starting the task.

0:14:23.850 --> 0:14:25.370
<v Speaker 4>It's at the top of my priority list. I'm going

0:14:25.450 --> 0:14:27.810
<v Speaker 4>to have it done in two hours, and like, I'm

0:14:27.810 --> 0:14:29.450
<v Speaker 4>not going to do this again because I really care

0:14:29.490 --> 0:14:31.930
<v Speaker 4>about my relationship with you. That's all you need to

0:14:31.930 --> 0:14:33.450
<v Speaker 4>do and then just like move on. It's not a

0:14:33.450 --> 0:14:35.810
<v Speaker 4>big deal. Like, honestly, I've manager, how.

0:14:35.610 --> 0:14:37.250
<v Speaker 3>Would you take that information so well?

0:14:37.290 --> 0:14:39.170
<v Speaker 4>I'd be like, I actually think I like you more

0:14:39.170 --> 0:14:42.090
<v Speaker 4>and trust you more now than before this happened. Okay, yeah,

0:14:42.290 --> 0:14:44.810
<v Speaker 4>because you're like that honesty that was the exact right

0:14:44.810 --> 0:14:47.290
<v Speaker 4>thing to do. I feel like I can really trust you.

0:14:47.770 --> 0:14:50.450
<v Speaker 4>Also as a manager, you know yourself, like you've done this.

0:14:51.130 --> 0:14:53.690
<v Speaker 4>It's like when your team does it too, it's way

0:14:53.690 --> 0:14:56.010
<v Speaker 4>worse to sort of try to keep lying to them

0:14:56.050 --> 0:14:58.690
<v Speaker 4>because you can kind of spot that too as a manager. Yeah,

0:14:58.690 --> 0:15:00.570
<v Speaker 4>So just like, don't undermine the trust that you have.

0:15:00.810 --> 0:15:03.090
<v Speaker 4>But I also do think maybe there's a sneaky little

0:15:03.090 --> 0:15:05.050
<v Speaker 4>is there anyone else who can give you access to

0:15:05.090 --> 0:15:05.370
<v Speaker 4>the thing.

0:15:05.690 --> 0:15:06.650
<v Speaker 1>I would probably do.

0:15:06.530 --> 0:15:09.050
<v Speaker 3>That first, your IT team exactly.

0:15:09.290 --> 0:15:11.730
<v Speaker 4>I've definitely done that. I have definitely done that and

0:15:11.770 --> 0:15:13.690
<v Speaker 4>you can get saved. So I'm pro that do a

0:15:13.690 --> 0:15:16.170
<v Speaker 4>little sneaky. Is there a way around this first? And

0:15:16.170 --> 0:15:17.450
<v Speaker 4>then if there's not, just be honest.

0:15:18.530 --> 0:15:20.130
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, just stop before you hack that email.

0:15:20.290 --> 0:15:21.050
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, exactly.

0:15:22.010 --> 0:15:24.210
<v Speaker 2>On that note, thank you so much for helping us

0:15:24.210 --> 0:15:26.250
<v Speaker 2>clear the biz Inbox this week. If you have a

0:15:26.290 --> 0:15:28.850
<v Speaker 2>work question, please send it our way. You'll find a

0:15:28.850 --> 0:15:31.090
<v Speaker 2>link to submit all of your questions in our show notes.

0:15:31.210 --> 0:15:33.050
<v Speaker 2>You can tell us your name or you can remain

0:15:33.130 --> 0:15:34.570
<v Speaker 2>completely anonymous.

0:15:34.610 --> 0:15:36.650
<v Speaker 4>And if you miss any of our episodes, just scroll

0:15:36.690 --> 0:15:39.090
<v Speaker 4>back in your feed. We'll be back in the biz

0:15:39.130 --> 0:15:40.330
<v Speaker 4>Inbox next week.

0:15:40.610 --> 0:15:44.609
<v Speaker 3>Bye Mia.

0:15:50.410 --> 0:15:53.770
<v Speaker 2>Mamma Maya acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

0:15:53.810 --> 0:15:55.370
<v Speaker 2>that this podcast is recorded on