1
00:00:10,614 --> 00:00:15,294
Speaker 1: You're listening to a Mumma Mea podcast. Mumma Mea acknowledges

2
00:00:15,334 --> 00:00:18,134
Speaker 1: the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast

3
00:00:18,214 --> 00:00:19,054
Speaker 1: is recorded on.

4
00:00:21,734 --> 00:00:21,934
Speaker 2: Hi.

5
00:00:22,054 --> 00:00:24,974
Speaker 1: I'm Claire Murphy. This is Mumma MIA's daily news podcast,

6
00:00:25,014 --> 00:00:29,094
Speaker 1: The Quickie. A recent survey by Women's Health Victoria found

7
00:00:29,094 --> 00:00:33,454
Speaker 1: that one in ten respondents had considered getting labiaplasty to

8
00:00:33,494 --> 00:00:35,854
Speaker 1: fix what they believe to be a fault with their volver,

9
00:00:36,294 --> 00:00:39,654
Speaker 1: a surgery that is rising globally. But are there really

10
00:00:39,734 --> 00:00:42,254
Speaker 1: that many problems with our genitals that it requires so

11
00:00:42,334 --> 00:00:45,774
Speaker 1: much surgical intervention before we delve into the underwear of

12
00:00:45,774 --> 00:00:48,014
Speaker 1: Aussies with a laber, Let's get the latest from the

13
00:00:48,094 --> 00:00:51,974
Speaker 1: Quicki newsroom. Tuesday, July ninth, the main children's hospital in

14
00:00:52,014 --> 00:00:54,854
Speaker 1: the capital of Ukraine has been hit by Russian missiles

15
00:00:55,174 --> 00:00:57,974
Speaker 1: in a daylight attack that also saw missiles rain down

16
00:00:58,014 --> 00:01:00,574
Speaker 1: on other parts of the country, killing at least thirty

17
00:01:00,614 --> 00:01:04,134
Speaker 1: six civilians. Hundreds of residents in Kiev raced to the

18
00:01:04,174 --> 00:01:07,654
Speaker 1: hospital to help clear the debris. Parents holding their babies

19
00:01:07,694 --> 00:01:10,494
Speaker 1: sat outside in a state of shock as people work

20
00:01:10,574 --> 00:01:13,334
Speaker 1: to free those still trapped under the rubble. The government

21
00:01:13,374 --> 00:01:15,414
Speaker 1: has proclaimed a day of mourning for one of the

22
00:01:15,454 --> 00:01:18,654
Speaker 1: worst air attacks of the war, saying this exposes their

23
00:01:18,694 --> 00:01:21,854
Speaker 1: need for an upgrade of air defenses, which did manage

24
00:01:21,854 --> 00:01:24,574
Speaker 1: to shoot down thirty of the thirty eight missiles in

25
00:01:24,614 --> 00:01:28,974
Speaker 1: this attack. Russia has repeatedly denied targeting civilians in Ukraine,

26
00:01:29,094 --> 00:01:31,974
Speaker 1: although its attacks have killed thousands of civilians since the

27
00:01:32,054 --> 00:01:35,934
Speaker 1: invasion in February twenty twenty two. Diplomats say the United

28
00:01:36,014 --> 00:01:38,774
Speaker 1: Nations Security Council will meet today at the request of

29
00:01:38,814 --> 00:01:42,854
Speaker 1: the UK, France, Ecuador, Slovenia and the US to discuss

30
00:01:42,854 --> 00:01:46,494
Speaker 1: the incident. Alice Springs will awake today after their first

31
00:01:46,654 --> 00:01:49,134
Speaker 1: night of a curfew, hoping to reign in crime and

32
00:01:49,254 --> 00:01:52,974
Speaker 1: increase community safety. The Anti Police issued a three night

33
00:01:53,014 --> 00:01:56,494
Speaker 1: public Social disorder declaration yesterday for parts of the city

34
00:01:56,734 --> 00:02:00,414
Speaker 1: between ten pm and six am, following a brawl involving

35
00:02:00,454 --> 00:02:03,654
Speaker 1: eighty people, a knife attack on a woman, a robbery

36
00:02:03,694 --> 00:02:06,054
Speaker 1: at a service station, and the assault of four off

37
00:02:06,134 --> 00:02:09,694
Speaker 1: duty police officers over the weekend. The curfew applies to

38
00:02:09,734 --> 00:02:12,894
Speaker 1: all residents and visitors, with only those with a valid

39
00:02:12,934 --> 00:02:15,734
Speaker 1: reason such as work or attending an event or seeking

40
00:02:15,774 --> 00:02:19,294
Speaker 1: medical treatment allowed to enter the zone under curfew. The

41
00:02:19,294 --> 00:02:22,534
Speaker 1: emergency declaration was made using new laws brought in by

42
00:02:22,574 --> 00:02:25,414
Speaker 1: the territory Parliament in May that allows a three day

43
00:02:25,494 --> 00:02:28,174
Speaker 1: curfew to be brought in and extended to seven days

44
00:02:28,214 --> 00:02:32,294
Speaker 1: if the Police Commissioner approves. The federal government is delivering

45
00:02:32,414 --> 00:02:35,654
Speaker 1: hundreds of new safe spaces for women fleeing domestic violence

46
00:02:35,734 --> 00:02:38,334
Speaker 1: as the country reels from another cluster of women and

47
00:02:38,414 --> 00:02:42,094
Speaker 1: children killed by current or former partners. The government will

48
00:02:42,094 --> 00:02:44,694
Speaker 1: fund new projects that will help provide seven hundred and

49
00:02:44,774 --> 00:02:48,134
Speaker 1: twenty new safe spaces over the next three years, almost

50
00:02:48,134 --> 00:02:51,454
Speaker 1: doubling the number of emergency accommodation places already on offer

51
00:02:51,574 --> 00:02:54,654
Speaker 1: under their program. The new program will also focus on

52
00:02:54,734 --> 00:02:58,414
Speaker 1: improving access and inclusion for First Nations, women and children,

53
00:02:58,574 --> 00:03:02,174
Speaker 1: those with the disability, and others who face barriers to support.

54
00:03:02,614 --> 00:03:04,854
Speaker 1: In the past few days, a woman was stabbed to

55
00:03:04,894 --> 00:03:07,614
Speaker 1: death in a home in Western Sydney, a woman's body

56
00:03:07,694 --> 00:03:10,254
Speaker 1: was found at a rubbish dump in Melbourne, and three

57
00:03:10,374 --> 00:03:13,374
Speaker 1: children died after their father allegedly set fire to their

58
00:03:13,374 --> 00:03:16,814
Speaker 1: home in Sydney. Grown Up fans of the Ossie iconic

59
00:03:16,854 --> 00:03:20,374
Speaker 1: animated TV show Bluey are outraged that only five of

60
00:03:20,414 --> 00:03:22,654
Speaker 1: the seven new mini episodes of the show have been

61
00:03:22,694 --> 00:03:25,574
Speaker 1: released here when all seven have been made available to

62
00:03:25,614 --> 00:03:29,294
Speaker 1: those watching in the US. Forums across multiple social media

63
00:03:29,334 --> 00:03:33,494
Speaker 1: platforms saw Ossie's vent their frustration, accusing the streaming platform

64
00:03:33,534 --> 00:03:36,094
Speaker 1: that hosts the series of selling out to the Americans.

65
00:03:36,334 --> 00:03:40,014
Speaker 1: With the minieps Burger, Dog Bingo, three thousand, Letter Hungry

66
00:03:40,014 --> 00:03:43,454
Speaker 1: and animals available to watch here, but not Muffin, Unboxing

67
00:03:43,614 --> 00:03:46,454
Speaker 1: or three Pigs. The official Bluey page has not given

68
00:03:46,494 --> 00:03:49,334
Speaker 1: a reason for the holding back of episodes for Australians.

69
00:03:49,814 --> 00:03:52,174
Speaker 1: That's the latest from around the globe. Next, why are

70
00:03:52,214 --> 00:03:55,414
Speaker 1: so many Ozzie women ashamed of their Laber? We find

71
00:03:55,454 --> 00:03:58,454
Speaker 1: out from the og Dolly doctor and a woman who

72
00:03:58,494 --> 00:04:01,214
Speaker 1: takes photos of Labia for a living to find out

73
00:04:01,214 --> 00:04:14,294
Speaker 1: what's going on downstairs. Ellie Sedgwick is the founder of

74
00:04:14,414 --> 00:04:17,094
Speaker 1: Comfortable in My Skin, where she runs a gallery of

75
00:04:17,174 --> 00:04:21,494
Speaker 1: LaBier photos called Flip Through My Flaps, showcasing the differences

76
00:04:21,534 --> 00:04:25,174
Speaker 1: in size, shape, color, and consistency of LaBier when no

77
00:04:25,334 --> 00:04:28,734
Speaker 1: two are alike. But her love of Labia did not

78
00:04:28,854 --> 00:04:32,134
Speaker 1: come from an appreciation of her own. In fact, quite

79
00:04:32,134 --> 00:04:35,454
Speaker 1: the opposite. When Ellie was younger, a boy passed her

80
00:04:35,454 --> 00:04:37,654
Speaker 1: a note in class that would change her world.

81
00:04:38,534 --> 00:04:40,494
Speaker 2: Do you have an inny or an AUTI?

82
00:04:41,734 --> 00:04:45,694
Speaker 3: And what he was talking about was whether my inner

83
00:04:45,774 --> 00:04:47,694
Speaker 3: labia came outside of my out of labia or my

84
00:04:47,734 --> 00:04:51,174
Speaker 3: aude labia hung down low. And that was probably the

85
00:04:51,174 --> 00:04:54,374
Speaker 3: first time that I realized that I did have an audi.

86
00:04:54,774 --> 00:04:58,814
Speaker 3: Then it set off this really big insecurity inside my

87
00:04:58,934 --> 00:05:02,614
Speaker 3: head that my vulva was not good enough or ugly

88
00:05:02,694 --> 00:05:03,974
Speaker 3: because of the way it looked.

89
00:05:04,854 --> 00:05:07,374
Speaker 1: She says she became so paranoid that her LaBier was

90
00:05:07,414 --> 00:05:09,854
Speaker 1: weird that she went to a doctor to see about

91
00:05:09,894 --> 00:05:10,814
Speaker 1: surgical intervention.

92
00:05:11,854 --> 00:05:14,574
Speaker 3: Well, the first time I went to the doctor was

93
00:05:14,574 --> 00:05:16,894
Speaker 3: in Double Bay in Sydney. It was a cosmetic surgeon

94
00:05:17,054 --> 00:05:20,134
Speaker 3: and what scares me so much is that they didn't

95
00:05:20,134 --> 00:05:22,654
Speaker 3: even look at my volver. So they just booked me

96
00:05:22,734 --> 00:05:25,254
Speaker 3: in and they were just asking me what dates I

97
00:05:25,294 --> 00:05:27,454
Speaker 3: could do, told me what it would cost, and they

98
00:05:27,454 --> 00:05:28,494
Speaker 3: were just like yup.

99
00:05:29,094 --> 00:05:31,574
Speaker 2: I luckily didn't have the money at that time.

100
00:05:31,654 --> 00:05:33,614
Speaker 3: Once they told me what it costs, so I was

101
00:05:33,654 --> 00:05:35,254
Speaker 3: always going to just save safe, save, And.

102
00:05:35,254 --> 00:05:37,294
Speaker 2: Then I got a really good job over in India.

103
00:05:37,894 --> 00:05:40,134
Speaker 3: When I had saved the money, I went to get

104
00:05:40,174 --> 00:05:43,054
Speaker 3: the surgery done and so he asked me to take

105
00:05:43,094 --> 00:05:46,174
Speaker 3: my undies off, which was as you can imagine, someone's

106
00:05:46,374 --> 00:05:49,534
Speaker 3: hugely instae of their volver. It was very, very nerve

107
00:05:49,574 --> 00:05:52,094
Speaker 3: wracking and he just looked at my body. I think

108
00:05:52,134 --> 00:05:54,054
Speaker 3: the first thing he said was your poor girl, as

109
00:05:54,054 --> 00:05:57,374
Speaker 3: if like there's nothing wrong with you. And he was

110
00:05:57,414 --> 00:05:58,934
Speaker 3: the one who said to me, I don't think you've

111
00:05:58,974 --> 00:06:01,974
Speaker 3: seen enough. You need to go and see because he

112
00:06:02,094 --> 00:06:05,094
Speaker 3: was just like, madam, this is just your body. And yeah,

113
00:06:05,094 --> 00:06:06,974
Speaker 3: he gave me this advice to go and look at

114
00:06:06,974 --> 00:06:08,774
Speaker 3: what other volvers look like.

115
00:06:10,374 --> 00:06:12,534
Speaker 1: She took that advice from that doctor to go and

116
00:06:12,614 --> 00:06:15,774
Speaker 1: learn about labia very seriously and it would change what

117
00:06:15,814 --> 00:06:16,734
Speaker 1: she does with her life.

118
00:06:18,454 --> 00:06:25,094
Speaker 3: I photograph folvers. I've now done five hundred. It's so

119
00:06:25,094 --> 00:06:28,814
Speaker 3: so sad to see the results of the research that's

120
00:06:28,854 --> 00:06:33,534
Speaker 3: been done. I really feel like for me, seeing so

121
00:06:33,654 --> 00:06:36,934
Speaker 3: many different volvers throughout the process of shooting over six

122
00:06:37,054 --> 00:06:41,174
Speaker 3: years has helped me so much realize how different everybody's

123
00:06:41,254 --> 00:06:43,774
Speaker 3: laby is. You know, it's like your eyebrows, there's no

124
00:06:43,974 --> 00:06:45,494
Speaker 3: two that's the same.

125
00:06:45,734 --> 00:06:48,454
Speaker 2: Which is beautiful. It's what makes us so unique.

126
00:06:48,574 --> 00:06:53,214
Speaker 3: And I feel like now with the galleries up online,

127
00:06:53,494 --> 00:06:56,494
Speaker 3: the LaBier Library and my one flip through my flaps.

128
00:06:56,934 --> 00:06:59,374
Speaker 3: I hope that it would have the opposite effect on

129
00:06:59,974 --> 00:07:03,094
Speaker 3: people that they would say, Okay, like this, this is

130
00:07:03,134 --> 00:07:05,254
Speaker 3: a unique part of our bodies and it's beautiful that

131
00:07:05,294 --> 00:07:09,174
Speaker 3: they're all different. So I find it really superhaling and

132
00:07:09,214 --> 00:07:12,014
Speaker 3: for the people that I photograph, I know it's been very,

133
00:07:12,134 --> 00:07:12,694
Speaker 3: very healing.

134
00:07:13,894 --> 00:07:17,534
Speaker 1: The Lavier Library is the brainchild of Women's Health Victoria,

135
00:07:17,774 --> 00:07:20,894
Speaker 1: created to bust myths around what a normal laber looks like.

136
00:07:21,374 --> 00:07:24,734
Speaker 1: Spoiler alert, Everyone's is pretty much normal, no matter what

137
00:07:24,774 --> 00:07:27,254
Speaker 1: it looks like, and to celebrate ten years since it

138
00:07:27,334 --> 00:07:30,254
Speaker 1: was created. They commissioned the study into how women are

139
00:07:30,254 --> 00:07:33,054
Speaker 1: feeling about their volvers in twenty twenty four, and the

140
00:07:33,094 --> 00:07:35,774
Speaker 1: results were not what they'd hoped for. To talk us

141
00:07:35,774 --> 00:07:38,734
Speaker 1: through the findings is former Dolly doctor and Associate professor

142
00:07:38,734 --> 00:07:41,974
Speaker 1: at the University of Sydney in the General Practice Clinical School,

143
00:07:42,054 --> 00:07:46,214
Speaker 1: doctor Melissa Kang. Melissa, what was the most surprising result

144
00:07:46,254 --> 00:07:49,774
Speaker 1: of the real Bodies Understanding and celebrating LaBier diversity study?

145
00:07:49,814 --> 00:07:50,134
Speaker 1: You think?

146
00:07:50,934 --> 00:07:54,254
Speaker 4: I think it was the study that was quoted by

147
00:07:54,294 --> 00:07:58,654
Speaker 4: the research company that said that amongst Australian general practitioners,

148
00:07:58,894 --> 00:08:03,014
Speaker 4: over a third had consulted with patients under the age

149
00:08:03,054 --> 00:08:08,974
Speaker 4: of eighteen seeking advice or referral for laber plasty. As

150
00:08:08,974 --> 00:08:12,854
Speaker 4: the GP myself who works with young people, it wasn't

151
00:08:12,854 --> 00:08:16,174
Speaker 4: necessarily something I saw a lot of in practice. But

152
00:08:16,334 --> 00:08:18,534
Speaker 4: of course, you know, I'm just one of thousands and

153
00:08:18,574 --> 00:08:22,134
Speaker 4: thousands of Australian gps who would have seen more patients

154
00:08:22,174 --> 00:08:24,694
Speaker 4: than I do because most of my work is at

155
00:08:24,734 --> 00:08:28,214
Speaker 4: a university doing research, So I think that probably surprised

156
00:08:28,214 --> 00:08:28,934
Speaker 4: me the most.

157
00:08:29,134 --> 00:08:32,334
Speaker 1: The study does show that gen z's are particularly impacted

158
00:08:32,374 --> 00:08:34,854
Speaker 1: by laby a shame. Why do you think that might be.

159
00:08:36,094 --> 00:08:37,614
Speaker 2: I think there are a lot of reasons.

160
00:08:37,694 --> 00:08:39,654
Speaker 4: The one that's been put forward a lot is the

161
00:08:39,734 --> 00:08:43,854
Speaker 4: association between what they see online, whether it's through online

162
00:08:43,894 --> 00:08:46,974
Speaker 4: pornography or social media. I think that's probably having a

163
00:08:47,094 --> 00:08:51,454
Speaker 4: very powerful impact. If I think back to the days

164
00:08:51,454 --> 00:08:54,494
Speaker 4: when I was writing for Dolly Doctor, before the Internet,

165
00:08:54,494 --> 00:08:58,814
Speaker 4: well almost before the Internet, certainly before handheld devices and things,

166
00:08:59,094 --> 00:09:02,294
Speaker 4: there were a lot of concerns and shame and anxiety

167
00:09:02,334 --> 00:09:05,814
Speaker 4: about things like body shape and weight because of what

168
00:09:06,414 --> 00:09:10,774
Speaker 4: young adolescent women would be seeing in magazines. So I

169
00:09:10,854 --> 00:09:14,734
Speaker 4: suppose it's a similar kind of phenomenon where they're now

170
00:09:14,774 --> 00:09:19,934
Speaker 4: able to access pornography very easily, and they're also you know,

171
00:09:19,974 --> 00:09:23,854
Speaker 4: there's more sexual explicit material on social media that they're viewing,

172
00:09:24,214 --> 00:09:26,534
Speaker 4: and so there's a bit more or maybe a lot

173
00:09:26,574 --> 00:09:31,974
Speaker 4: more attention being drawn to genitals, particularly labor involvers, and

174
00:09:32,014 --> 00:09:34,494
Speaker 4: I think that it probably is driving a lot of

175
00:09:34,534 --> 00:09:38,494
Speaker 4: the anxiety around that. It may lead to shame, it

176
00:09:38,534 --> 00:09:41,934
Speaker 4: may but it may be anxiety about whether they're normal

177
00:09:42,054 --> 00:09:42,254
Speaker 4: or not.

178
00:09:43,094 --> 00:09:45,974
Speaker 1: Well that's interesting, isn't it, Because the finger is pointed

179
00:09:46,134 --> 00:09:50,774
Speaker 1: fairly squarely at pornography. But when we look at fashion

180
00:09:50,814 --> 00:09:53,414
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty four and maybe even the last five

181
00:09:53,494 --> 00:09:58,974
Speaker 1: years or so, bikini bottoms are minuscule, and you know,

182
00:09:59,094 --> 00:10:03,174
Speaker 1: there even there was some outrage around the Team USA's

183
00:10:03,174 --> 00:10:06,214
Speaker 1: Olympic uniform for the same reason because the scrap of

184
00:10:06,254 --> 00:10:10,454
Speaker 1: material covering the labia of the female leets was like

185
00:10:10,694 --> 00:10:13,774
Speaker 1: barely enough to withhold any movement, let alone an Olympic

186
00:10:13,814 --> 00:10:17,054
Speaker 1: athletes movement. So can the fashion industry kind of be

187
00:10:17,974 --> 00:10:21,534
Speaker 1: also held accountable for why some women might be worried

188
00:10:21,534 --> 00:10:22,534
Speaker 1: about that area.

189
00:10:23,094 --> 00:10:25,734
Speaker 4: Look, quite possibly, I think there's a sort of also

190
00:10:25,974 --> 00:10:29,494
Speaker 4: chicken or egg phenomenon, whatever we're talking about here, because

191
00:10:29,534 --> 00:10:33,934
Speaker 4: I think underpinning all of this is the fact that

192
00:10:34,054 --> 00:10:39,094
Speaker 4: girls and adolescent women grow up still believing that they

193
00:10:39,694 --> 00:10:43,174
Speaker 4: are sexual objects, that they're there to be looked at,

194
00:10:43,254 --> 00:10:47,294
Speaker 4: to be desired, that they don't have the sort of

195
00:10:47,334 --> 00:10:52,334
Speaker 4: agency that they deserve to have around just feeling confident

196
00:10:52,494 --> 00:10:57,534
Speaker 4: about their bodies and their sexual agency. So I think

197
00:10:57,574 --> 00:11:00,574
Speaker 4: that it's a bit of you know what came first?

198
00:11:00,654 --> 00:11:06,454
Speaker 4: So I think, yes, fashion, online images, pornography, they all

199
00:11:06,494 --> 00:11:12,694
Speaker 4: mix together with this underlying fact that we still have

200
00:11:12,854 --> 00:11:18,694
Speaker 4: young women believing that they must be sexually attractive, sexually desirable,

201
00:11:18,734 --> 00:11:22,934
Speaker 4: and must conform to a particular idea or a particular standard.

202
00:11:23,214 --> 00:11:25,294
Speaker 1: It's funny my friends will often laugh at me or

203
00:11:25,374 --> 00:11:28,774
Speaker 1: roll their eyes when I say essentially every news story

204
00:11:28,774 --> 00:11:31,214
Speaker 1: that we do, you could often just boil down to

205
00:11:31,254 --> 00:11:33,054
Speaker 1: the patriarchy being the problem.

206
00:11:33,534 --> 00:11:36,374
Speaker 4: Yes, and I was going to avoid using that word,

207
00:11:36,374 --> 00:11:39,934
Speaker 4: but yes, it is basically the root of all evil

208
00:11:39,974 --> 00:11:42,654
Speaker 4: I think, or part of this problem.

209
00:11:42,734 --> 00:11:46,494
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, can we talk about the labia plasty numbers

210
00:11:46,574 --> 00:11:50,134
Speaker 1: because they are on the rise and have been rising

211
00:11:50,214 --> 00:11:53,614
Speaker 1: for quite some time. Where do we draw the line

212
00:11:53,654 --> 00:11:56,494
Speaker 1: between needing a laby a plasty for medical reasons and

213
00:11:56,574 --> 00:12:00,654
Speaker 1: needing one for cosmetic purposes. Should doctors be held more

214
00:12:00,694 --> 00:12:03,894
Speaker 1: accountable for allowing these numbers to rise so dramatically?

215
00:12:04,454 --> 00:12:08,574
Speaker 4: Probably some doctors should be. It's very difficult to know that.

216
00:12:08,734 --> 00:12:12,014
Speaker 4: There's certainly, I mean, I think a much needed change

217
00:12:12,054 --> 00:12:16,334
Speaker 4: in philosophy around the practice of medicine, where we absolutely

218
00:12:16,374 --> 00:12:21,454
Speaker 4: want to give people patients, you know, much much more

219
00:12:21,534 --> 00:12:24,174
Speaker 4: say in what they want and what they need for

220
00:12:24,214 --> 00:12:27,734
Speaker 4: their health. So while I think there may well be

221
00:12:28,174 --> 00:12:31,894
Speaker 4: some people in the medical profession who are looking for

222
00:12:31,974 --> 00:12:34,894
Speaker 4: where they might get a lot of business or you know,

223
00:12:34,934 --> 00:12:38,814
Speaker 4: perhaps build up their own expertise in an area, there

224
00:12:38,854 --> 00:12:41,814
Speaker 4: can also be a lot of pressure potentially. I'm not

225
00:12:41,894 --> 00:12:45,574
Speaker 4: quoting any research here, I'm just speaking generally, where doctors

226
00:12:45,614 --> 00:12:48,774
Speaker 4: do feel, Okay, well, this person has gone away and

227
00:12:48,814 --> 00:12:51,214
Speaker 4: researched this, they know about it, and this is what

228
00:12:51,214 --> 00:12:54,734
Speaker 4: they're asking for. Am I wrong to withhold a referral

229
00:12:54,774 --> 00:12:59,134
Speaker 4: for example? So on the one hand, yes, the medical profession,

230
00:12:59,614 --> 00:13:02,614
Speaker 4: they are the gatekeepers to these procedures that may not

231
00:13:02,654 --> 00:13:06,214
Speaker 4: be medically necessary. On the other hand, we have the

232
00:13:06,254 --> 00:13:10,614
Speaker 4: technical skill to be able to perform certain procedures, and

233
00:13:11,174 --> 00:13:14,334
Speaker 4: who are we to say as doctors that this is

234
00:13:15,134 --> 00:13:18,174
Speaker 4: right or wrong. On the other hand, they do need

235
00:13:18,214 --> 00:13:21,654
Speaker 4: to be certain standards, like, you know, laber plasty for

236
00:13:21,734 --> 00:13:27,294
Speaker 4: cosmetic reasons should not be just routinely offered to young

237
00:13:27,374 --> 00:13:31,214
Speaker 4: adolescent women, perhaps those who are not yet adults, you know,

238
00:13:31,294 --> 00:13:36,054
Speaker 4: once you're an independent young adult or older adult. I

239
00:13:36,054 --> 00:13:39,854
Speaker 4: think that's partly where that difficulty might come in.

240
00:13:40,854 --> 00:13:44,294
Speaker 1: We've seen things like the LaBier Library help a lot

241
00:13:44,334 --> 00:13:47,494
Speaker 1: of women understand that labis come in so many different

242
00:13:47,494 --> 00:13:51,014
Speaker 1: shapes and sizes and colors, but it doesn't seem to

243
00:13:51,054 --> 00:13:53,254
Speaker 1: be having the impact that we'd hoped for where women

244
00:13:53,294 --> 00:13:56,174
Speaker 1: are more accepting of their LaBier. What else do you

245
00:13:56,214 --> 00:13:59,854
Speaker 1: think we can do to help women feel more comfortable

246
00:13:59,894 --> 00:14:01,374
Speaker 1: with their shape, size, and color.

247
00:14:02,254 --> 00:14:04,734
Speaker 4: What I really think is that we need to start

248
00:14:05,094 --> 00:14:09,814
Speaker 4: normalizing LaBier and everybody's genitals, not just people with.

249
00:14:09,814 --> 00:14:12,094
Speaker 2: Laber, from a very young age.

250
00:14:12,334 --> 00:14:17,014
Speaker 4: So this goes hand in hand with advocacy around sex education,

251
00:14:17,174 --> 00:14:21,294
Speaker 4: for example, of young for young people in school, where

252
00:14:21,334 --> 00:14:24,294
Speaker 4: all the experts all around the world say we need

253
00:14:24,334 --> 00:14:29,534
Speaker 4: to start giving children the correct terminology for their genitals,

254
00:14:29,574 --> 00:14:33,814
Speaker 4: for example, just normalizing these parts of the body. I

255
00:14:33,854 --> 00:14:36,454
Speaker 4: think the fact that there's so much shame and stigma

256
00:14:36,494 --> 00:14:41,334
Speaker 4: associated with something like LaBier as there is, for example,

257
00:14:41,374 --> 00:14:45,734
Speaker 4: still with something like periods, is simply because we're still

258
00:14:45,854 --> 00:14:52,654
Speaker 4: too shy, afraid, embarrassed, awkward as a society to start

259
00:14:53,214 --> 00:14:57,414
Speaker 4: normalizing all these aspects of the body and the body's

260
00:14:57,454 --> 00:14:59,374
Speaker 4: functions from a very young age.

261
00:14:59,454 --> 00:15:01,374
Speaker 2: So I think.

262
00:15:01,494 --> 00:15:07,174
Speaker 4: Resources like the Labia Library are absolutely fantastic for showing

263
00:15:07,294 --> 00:15:11,494
Speaker 4: people what diversity looks like like. For some, it's going

264
00:15:11,534 --> 00:15:13,054
Speaker 4: to be a little bit too late by the time

265
00:15:13,094 --> 00:15:16,094
Speaker 4: they come across that resource, you know, when they're already

266
00:15:16,494 --> 00:15:21,414
Speaker 4: feeling very anxious, very ashamed, very concerned. If we can

267
00:15:21,534 --> 00:15:25,894
Speaker 4: start talking to you know, children, particularly as they start

268
00:15:25,934 --> 00:15:29,014
Speaker 4: to go through puberty, but even younger sometimes about what

269
00:15:29,054 --> 00:15:32,174
Speaker 4: diversity looks like when it comes to their changing bodies,

270
00:15:32,254 --> 00:15:34,534
Speaker 4: I think that would also be really good thing.

271
00:15:36,134 --> 00:15:38,494
Speaker 1: If you're a straight woman, you may only ever see

272
00:15:38,534 --> 00:15:40,774
Speaker 1: your own laby, or in your lifetime you might see

273
00:15:40,774 --> 00:15:43,054
Speaker 1: someone on porn sites, or maybe one of your friends.

274
00:15:43,454 --> 00:15:45,374
Speaker 1: If you're a queer woman, maybe you'll see a dozen

275
00:15:45,414 --> 00:15:49,494
Speaker 1: depending on your lifestyle. That Ellie has seen hundreds so

276
00:15:49,574 --> 00:15:52,054
Speaker 1: now people often message her with request to see if

277
00:15:52,094 --> 00:15:55,174
Speaker 1: what they have is normal. She recently posted a request

278
00:15:55,174 --> 00:15:57,694
Speaker 1: for help from one of her many Ask Ellie responders

279
00:15:57,974 --> 00:16:00,494
Speaker 1: who show what looked like a little starburst coming from

280
00:16:00,534 --> 00:16:03,574
Speaker 1: her vagina, and Ellie says, after having seen so many

281
00:16:03,654 --> 00:16:06,294
Speaker 1: vaginas involvers, she knew exactly what it.

282
00:16:06,294 --> 00:16:09,014
Speaker 2: Was when that person sent in that photo.

283
00:16:09,094 --> 00:16:12,134
Speaker 3: Straight away, I wrote back to her saying, I think

284
00:16:12,174 --> 00:16:13,614
Speaker 3: this is the remains of your home. And then I

285
00:16:13,614 --> 00:16:15,934
Speaker 3: put it up and all the midwifes commented on the

286
00:16:15,974 --> 00:16:18,054
Speaker 3: post saying this is the home.

287
00:16:18,134 --> 00:16:20,374
Speaker 2: And she was really scared when she sent that in,

288
00:16:20,494 --> 00:16:21,694
Speaker 2: thinking that there was.

289
00:16:21,614 --> 00:16:23,654
Speaker 3: Something wrong with her. And I think this is the

290
00:16:23,694 --> 00:16:25,974
Speaker 3: problem with the lack of education. It's like when we

291
00:16:26,014 --> 00:16:27,694
Speaker 3: do get a mirror and we do look down there.

292
00:16:27,934 --> 00:16:30,454
Speaker 3: Usually it's post berth that people start doing that. Or

293
00:16:30,494 --> 00:16:32,374
Speaker 3: if they come to like a workshop of mine or

294
00:16:32,614 --> 00:16:34,574
Speaker 3: a sexologist and you're told to go and look at

295
00:16:34,574 --> 00:16:37,014
Speaker 3: your vulvar, you discover things that you know, maybe there's

296
00:16:37,054 --> 00:16:38,974
Speaker 3: little tiny bumps or lumps or.

297
00:16:38,894 --> 00:16:41,374
Speaker 2: Something that you've never seen.

298
00:16:42,494 --> 00:16:45,174
Speaker 3: Just feel like, I really want you to know that

299
00:16:45,414 --> 00:16:48,014
Speaker 3: whatever you have is unique to you, and it's normal

300
00:16:48,014 --> 00:16:51,454
Speaker 3: and it's beautiful, and usually whatever you're thinking in your head,

301
00:16:51,934 --> 00:16:53,574
Speaker 3: majority of other people are thinking too.

302
00:16:53,854 --> 00:16:56,014
Speaker 2: You're not the first one that's thought that about your volva.

303
00:16:57,614 --> 00:16:59,694
Speaker 1: We'll pop a link to the Labia Library and the

304
00:16:59,774 --> 00:17:02,334
Speaker 1: flip through my Flaps gallery in our show notes so

305
00:17:02,414 --> 00:17:05,134
Speaker 1: you can go check out what's a normal Labia for yourself.

306
00:17:05,374 --> 00:17:07,974
Speaker 1: The quickie is produced by me Claire Murphy and our

307
00:17:08,014 --> 00:17:11,574
Speaker 1: senior producer Taylostano, with audio production by Jacob Brown.