1 00:00:06,415 --> 00:00:09,135 Speaker 1: You're listening to Amma Mia podcast. 2 00:00:12,375 --> 00:00:15,735 Speaker 2: The story of Jeffrey Epstein didn't just end with his death. 3 00:00:16,655 --> 00:00:20,174 Speaker 2: More pages of the Epstein files have been dumped online. 4 00:00:20,455 --> 00:00:23,975 Speaker 2: Powerful men across the UK and US are being arrested 5 00:00:24,135 --> 00:00:28,455 Speaker 2: or questioned, and even here in Australia, Anthony Albanezi has 6 00:00:28,495 --> 00:00:31,975 Speaker 2: written to Downing Street backing moves to strip Andrew Mountain 7 00:00:32,015 --> 00:00:36,415 Speaker 2: Batton Windsor from the line of succession. Today we're stepping 8 00:00:36,495 --> 00:00:39,374 Speaker 2: back from the headlines, asking what it all means for 9 00:00:39,455 --> 00:00:42,294 Speaker 2: the women at the center of these files, with the 10 00:00:42,335 --> 00:00:46,175 Speaker 2: help of Gloria Allread, the lawyer who's been fighting for 11 00:00:46,294 --> 00:00:50,335 Speaker 2: many of them. It's the Quickie for Wednesday, February twenty five. 12 00:00:50,495 --> 00:00:53,695 Speaker 2: I'm Taylor Strano for a look at the latest news headlines. 13 00:00:53,855 --> 00:00:54,815 Speaker 2: Here's Claire Murphy. 14 00:00:55,575 --> 00:00:58,775 Speaker 3: Thanks Taylor. US Today Show host Savannah Guthrie has posted 15 00:00:58,815 --> 00:01:01,255 Speaker 3: an emotional plea for the return of her mother, Nancy, 16 00:01:01,495 --> 00:01:03,455 Speaker 3: who was taken from her home in the early hours 17 00:01:03,455 --> 00:01:04,774 Speaker 3: of February first. 18 00:01:05,655 --> 00:01:09,695 Speaker 4: To say, it is day twenty four since our mom 19 00:01:11,095 --> 00:01:14,535 Speaker 4: was taken in the dark of night from her bed, 20 00:01:16,175 --> 00:01:20,655 Speaker 4: and every hour and minute, and second and every long 21 00:01:20,815 --> 00:01:27,735 Speaker 4: night has been agony since then. Of worrying about her, 22 00:01:28,935 --> 00:01:33,295 Speaker 4: and fearing for her, and aching for her, and most 23 00:01:33,375 --> 00:01:34,695 Speaker 4: of all just missing her. 24 00:01:35,575 --> 00:01:36,215 Speaker 1: Missing her. 25 00:01:36,455 --> 00:01:38,375 Speaker 3: She explains that she and her family are living in 26 00:01:38,415 --> 00:01:40,735 Speaker 3: that space. So many people who have a missing loved 27 00:01:40,735 --> 00:01:43,935 Speaker 3: one exists in the knowing, eating away at their hope. 28 00:01:44,095 --> 00:01:48,575 Speaker 4: We still believe in America, We still believe that she 29 00:01:48,615 --> 00:01:49,375 Speaker 4: can come home. 30 00:01:49,975 --> 00:01:54,815 Speaker 1: We also know that she may be lost, she may 31 00:01:54,855 --> 00:01:55,695 Speaker 1: already be gone. 32 00:01:56,295 --> 00:01:58,815 Speaker 3: With both of those realities existing at the same time, 33 00:01:58,855 --> 00:02:01,455 Speaker 3: for the Guthrie family, they've offered her reward for any 34 00:02:01,455 --> 00:02:04,255 Speaker 3: information that could lead them to their mum or her body. 35 00:02:04,575 --> 00:02:08,015 Speaker 1: We need to know where she is. We need her 36 00:02:08,055 --> 00:02:08,695 Speaker 1: to come home. 37 00:02:09,855 --> 00:02:14,775 Speaker 4: For that reason, we are offering a family reward of 38 00:02:14,895 --> 00:02:19,695 Speaker 4: up to one million dollars for any information that leads 39 00:02:19,775 --> 00:02:21,055 Speaker 4: us to her recovery. 40 00:02:21,455 --> 00:02:23,895 Speaker 3: Sa Theana also explained that the family are donating five 41 00:02:23,975 --> 00:02:27,175 Speaker 3: hundred thousand dollars to the Center for Missing and Exploited Children, 42 00:02:27,495 --> 00:02:29,255 Speaker 3: saying she wants to help others who are in the 43 00:02:29,255 --> 00:02:32,215 Speaker 3: same position they find themselves in. She ended the message 44 00:02:32,255 --> 00:02:34,695 Speaker 3: asking for whoever can help them to be the light. 45 00:02:35,095 --> 00:02:39,415 Speaker 4: Someone out there knows something that can bring her home. 46 00:02:39,975 --> 00:02:43,455 Speaker 4: Please come forward, tell what you know. And help us 47 00:02:43,495 --> 00:02:47,415 Speaker 4: bring our beloved mom home so that we can either 48 00:02:47,495 --> 00:02:54,855 Speaker 4: celebrate a glorious, miraculous homecoming or celebrate the beautiful, brave 49 00:02:55,095 --> 00:02:56,975 Speaker 4: and courageous and noble. 50 00:02:56,695 --> 00:03:01,055 Speaker 1: Life that she has lived. Please be the light in 51 00:03:01,135 --> 00:03:01,615 Speaker 1: the dark. 52 00:03:02,215 --> 00:03:04,614 Speaker 3: Eighty four year old Nancy Guthrie hasn't been seen since 53 00:03:04,695 --> 00:03:07,495 Speaker 3: January thirty one, when she was dropped home by family members. 54 00:03:07,855 --> 00:03:10,615 Speaker 3: Investigators have shared vision of a masked and gloved man 55 00:03:10,655 --> 00:03:13,815 Speaker 3: who appears to disable missus Guthrie's home ring doorbell camera 56 00:03:13,895 --> 00:03:16,495 Speaker 3: the night she disappeared, but so far the search has 57 00:03:16,535 --> 00:03:19,014 Speaker 3: not been able to locate the mother and grandmother. A 58 00:03:19,135 --> 00:03:21,695 Speaker 3: ransom demand was sent to local media outlets, but the 59 00:03:21,695 --> 00:03:26,255 Speaker 3: deadlines have now passed without successfully locating Nancy or her kidnapper. 60 00:03:26,895 --> 00:03:29,655 Speaker 3: A bomb scare has forced Federal police to evacuate Prime 61 00:03:29,655 --> 00:03:33,655 Speaker 3: Minister Anthony Albenezi from his official residence in Canberra. Australian 62 00:03:33,655 --> 00:03:36,935 Speaker 3: Federal Police responded to the lodge about six pm on Tuesday, 63 00:03:37,095 --> 00:03:39,175 Speaker 3: moving the Prime Minister from the building for a few 64 00:03:39,215 --> 00:03:42,735 Speaker 3: hours while they investigated. A spokesperson said in a statement 65 00:03:42,735 --> 00:03:46,175 Speaker 3: that a thorough search of a protection establishment was undertaken 66 00:03:46,255 --> 00:03:49,655 Speaker 3: and nothing suspicious was located. They explained that they believed 67 00:03:49,655 --> 00:03:52,495 Speaker 3: that there's no current threat to the community or public safety. 68 00:03:52,975 --> 00:03:55,455 Speaker 3: It's not the first time the Prime Minister has faced threats, 69 00:03:55,455 --> 00:03:58,135 Speaker 3: with a man convicted on February ten of using social 70 00:03:58,175 --> 00:04:01,415 Speaker 3: media to menace, harass and offend. The court hearing how 71 00:04:01,415 --> 00:04:03,975 Speaker 3: a death threat and a graphic slur were directed at 72 00:04:04,015 --> 00:04:07,175 Speaker 3: the Prime Minister and his wife Jo. Mister Albanzi and 73 00:04:07,215 --> 00:04:10,055 Speaker 3: his senior ministers have repeatedly called for the temperature to 74 00:04:10,095 --> 00:04:14,055 Speaker 3: be lowered as social conflicts heightened domestic tensions. The AFP 75 00:04:14,215 --> 00:04:17,654 Speaker 3: has reported an increasing number of threats directed towards MPs 76 00:04:17,695 --> 00:04:21,895 Speaker 3: in recent years, including harassment and offensive and threatening communications. 77 00:04:22,855 --> 00:04:26,335 Speaker 3: A warning that this next story contains details of sexual assaults. 78 00:04:26,775 --> 00:04:29,815 Speaker 3: British comedian and actor Russell Brand has pleaded not guilty 79 00:04:29,855 --> 00:04:34,015 Speaker 3: to two further sexual offenses, including rape. Brand previously denied 80 00:04:34,015 --> 00:04:36,775 Speaker 3: toccounts of rape, one count of indecent assault and two 81 00:04:36,815 --> 00:04:40,135 Speaker 3: counts of sexual assault in relation to alleged offenses between 82 00:04:40,215 --> 00:04:43,495 Speaker 3: nineteen ninety nine and two thousand and five involving four women. 83 00:04:43,895 --> 00:04:46,295 Speaker 3: At Southern Crown Court on Tuesday, the fifty year old 84 00:04:46,335 --> 00:04:49,094 Speaker 3: pleaded not guilty to one further count of rape and 85 00:04:49,135 --> 00:04:51,654 Speaker 3: another of sexual assaults, which are both alleged to have 86 00:04:51,695 --> 00:04:54,415 Speaker 3: taken place in two thousand and nine. The latest two 87 00:04:54,495 --> 00:04:57,055 Speaker 3: charges relate to two further women and are alleged to 88 00:04:57,135 --> 00:05:00,375 Speaker 3: have taken place in London. The court previously heard brand 89 00:05:00,415 --> 00:05:02,775 Speaker 3: as accused of raping a woman in a hotel room 90 00:05:02,775 --> 00:05:05,735 Speaker 3: while she attended a Labour Party conference in Bournemouth, and 91 00:05:05,815 --> 00:05:09,415 Speaker 3: grabbing a TV worker's breasts and orally raping her after 92 00:05:09,535 --> 00:05:12,295 Speaker 3: dragging her into a male toilet. He is also alleged 93 00:05:12,335 --> 00:05:14,895 Speaker 3: to have grabbed a radio station worker's face, putting her 94 00:05:14,895 --> 00:05:17,655 Speaker 3: against a wall and kissing her before groping her breasts 95 00:05:17,655 --> 00:05:20,855 Speaker 3: and buttcks. The other charge of the original five allegacy 96 00:05:20,855 --> 00:05:24,375 Speaker 3: actor and decently assaulted another woman after grabbing her forearm 97 00:05:24,415 --> 00:05:27,294 Speaker 3: and attempting to drag her into a male toilet. Brand 98 00:05:27,335 --> 00:05:29,415 Speaker 3: who carried a copy of the Bible into the court 99 00:05:29,415 --> 00:05:32,255 Speaker 3: building before his hearing, is due to face trial in June. 100 00:05:33,055 --> 00:05:35,455 Speaker 3: Rapper Flavor Flav, who in recent years has become a 101 00:05:35,535 --> 00:05:38,214 Speaker 3: champion of women's sports, has again taken up the mantle 102 00:05:38,495 --> 00:05:41,455 Speaker 3: after US President Donald Trump appeared to offend the US 103 00:05:41,535 --> 00:05:44,735 Speaker 3: ice hockey team Team USA scored gold in both the 104 00:05:44,775 --> 00:05:48,415 Speaker 3: men's and women's tournaments at the Milano Cortina Winter Olympic Games. 105 00:05:48,655 --> 00:05:51,815 Speaker 3: Donald Trump placing a congratulatory call to the men's team 106 00:05:51,855 --> 00:05:54,855 Speaker 3: on Sunday, inviting them to the State of the Union address, 107 00:05:55,015 --> 00:05:57,055 Speaker 3: but on the same call he mentioned the women's team, 108 00:05:57,135 --> 00:05:59,575 Speaker 3: saying I must tell you we're going to have to 109 00:05:59,615 --> 00:06:01,855 Speaker 3: bring the women's team. You do know that I do 110 00:06:01,935 --> 00:06:05,214 Speaker 3: believe I probably would be impeached. Mister Trump did also 111 00:06:05,255 --> 00:06:07,535 Speaker 3: extend an invitation to the women's team to visit the 112 00:06:07,575 --> 00:06:11,895 Speaker 3: White House, which they declined. Flavor Flav responded by posting online, 113 00:06:12,015 --> 00:06:15,015 Speaker 3: if the USA women's team wants a real celebration and invite, 114 00:06:15,175 --> 00:06:17,895 Speaker 3: I'll host them in Las Vegas. Do some nice dinners 115 00:06:17,895 --> 00:06:20,175 Speaker 3: and shows and good times. I'm sure I can get 116 00:06:20,175 --> 00:06:22,135 Speaker 3: a hotel and airline to help me out here and 117 00:06:22,215 --> 00:06:25,575 Speaker 3: celebrate these women for real. The comments under this post 118 00:06:25,655 --> 00:06:28,815 Speaker 3: are full of brands, including airlines and hotels, offering to 119 00:06:28,855 --> 00:06:30,295 Speaker 3: help celebrate the women's team. 120 00:06:31,095 --> 00:06:35,655 Speaker 2: Thanks clat Next, how far can the Epstein files really reach? 121 00:06:36,015 --> 00:06:38,815 Speaker 2: And what does justice look like when the man at 122 00:06:38,855 --> 00:06:48,295 Speaker 2: the center of it all is gone? If you've only 123 00:06:48,335 --> 00:06:51,415 Speaker 2: been half watching this latest round of news, it can 124 00:06:51,455 --> 00:06:55,335 Speaker 2: feel like a blur of names and documents. The Epstein 125 00:06:55,375 --> 00:06:58,135 Speaker 2: Files is the catch hold term for the material gathered 126 00:06:58,135 --> 00:07:02,055 Speaker 2: by US authorities during their investigations into convicted sex offended 127 00:07:02,095 --> 00:07:06,615 Speaker 2: Jeffrey Epstein. That's everything from FBI into view notes, internal 128 00:07:06,655 --> 00:07:11,095 Speaker 2: doo J memos, court transcripts, flight logs, emails, photos, and videos, 129 00:07:11,415 --> 00:07:14,535 Speaker 2: now running to about six million pages, one hundred and 130 00:07:14,575 --> 00:07:19,775 Speaker 2: eighty thousand images, and two thousand videos. Inside that document 131 00:07:19,855 --> 00:07:23,135 Speaker 2: dump are references to or images of some of the 132 00:07:23,255 --> 00:07:27,815 Speaker 2: most recognizable men on the planet, including Donald Trump, Bill Clinton, 133 00:07:27,935 --> 00:07:32,015 Speaker 2: Elon Musk, and former Prince Andrew. It's important to remember 134 00:07:32,255 --> 00:07:35,015 Speaker 2: being named or pictured in these files is not the 135 00:07:35,055 --> 00:07:37,855 Speaker 2: same as being accused of a crime, but it does 136 00:07:37,895 --> 00:07:42,135 Speaker 2: show how widespread Epstein's social network was, and it's already 137 00:07:42,215 --> 00:07:46,255 Speaker 2: driving real world consequences. If you followed this story over 138 00:07:46,295 --> 00:07:49,975 Speaker 2: the years, you'll also recognize the name Virginia Gufrey, the 139 00:07:50,015 --> 00:07:53,535 Speaker 2: woman who accused Epstein and Gelain Maxwell of trafficking her 140 00:07:53,615 --> 00:07:57,095 Speaker 2: as a teenager, and who reached a settlement with Andrew 141 00:07:57,255 --> 00:08:00,415 Speaker 2: after filing a civil sexual assault lawsuit against him in 142 00:08:00,455 --> 00:08:04,455 Speaker 2: the US. Her testimony and that of other women have 143 00:08:04,535 --> 00:08:07,375 Speaker 2: been central to how we understand the pattern of abuse, 144 00:08:07,975 --> 00:08:10,535 Speaker 2: even when the names of those they accuse are blacked 145 00:08:10,575 --> 00:08:14,335 Speaker 2: out in certain files. What can be easy to lose 146 00:08:14,495 --> 00:08:17,455 Speaker 2: as we obsess over whose name is mentioned where is 147 00:08:17,535 --> 00:08:21,295 Speaker 2: that this started and continues as a story about girls 148 00:08:21,295 --> 00:08:25,015 Speaker 2: and young women who were groomed, trafficked and abused, often 149 00:08:25,055 --> 00:08:28,215 Speaker 2: for years, by a network that still isn't fully mapped. 150 00:08:29,135 --> 00:08:32,495 Speaker 2: Many of them have watched Epstein dying custody, watch Gelaine 151 00:08:32,495 --> 00:08:35,934 Speaker 2: Maxwell be convicted, and now watching the form of Prince 152 00:08:36,015 --> 00:08:40,095 Speaker 2: and other UK officials, including former US Ambassttor Peter Mandelson, 153 00:08:40,455 --> 00:08:44,375 Speaker 2: come under investigation As material emerging from the Epstein files 154 00:08:44,415 --> 00:08:49,095 Speaker 2: continues to be examined by authorities. That's where Gloria already 155 00:08:49,135 --> 00:08:52,535 Speaker 2: comes in. She is one of America's most well known 156 00:08:52,575 --> 00:08:56,814 Speaker 2: civil rights attorneys. She spent decades representing survivors of sexual 157 00:08:56,815 --> 00:09:00,934 Speaker 2: harassment and abuse in cases involving OJ Simpson, Billy Riley, 158 00:09:01,095 --> 00:09:05,295 Speaker 2: Harvey Weinstein, and Larry Nassa. In the Epstein saga, She's 159 00:09:05,615 --> 00:09:08,295 Speaker 2: presented a number of alleged victims and has been a 160 00:09:08,375 --> 00:09:13,334 Speaker 2: vocal advocate for unsealing court records for greater transparency from authorities. 161 00:09:14,615 --> 00:09:17,255 Speaker 2: Over the past year, she's called out what she sees 162 00:09:17,255 --> 00:09:21,415 Speaker 2: as double standards in how the files are being handled. Victims' 163 00:09:21,455 --> 00:09:26,375 Speaker 2: names sometimes visible while powerful men's identities remain redacted, massive 164 00:09:26,415 --> 00:09:29,574 Speaker 2: data dumps with no index that make it harder, not easier, 165 00:09:29,735 --> 00:09:33,135 Speaker 2: for survivors and journalists to join the dots, and years 166 00:09:33,175 --> 00:09:36,975 Speaker 2: as what she describes as politics overriding justice when it 167 00:09:37,015 --> 00:09:42,255 Speaker 2: comes to holding Epstein's associates to account. So today we 168 00:09:42,335 --> 00:09:46,135 Speaker 2: want to talk about what these files actually are, what's fact, 169 00:09:46,375 --> 00:09:50,375 Speaker 2: what's speculation, what the recent developments in the UK really mean, 170 00:09:50,615 --> 00:09:54,495 Speaker 2: and most importantly, what justice looks like now for the 171 00:09:54,535 --> 00:09:58,175 Speaker 2: women at the heart of this case. Gloria, Let's start 172 00:09:58,255 --> 00:10:03,615 Speaker 2: at the beginning. In simple terms, what are the Epstein files. 173 00:10:03,615 --> 00:10:07,295 Speaker 2: When people hear that phrase, what does it actually refer to, 174 00:10:07,535 --> 00:10:08,735 Speaker 2: and what are you interested in? 175 00:10:09,375 --> 00:10:14,055 Speaker 5: Well, the Epstein files are the files from the United 176 00:10:14,054 --> 00:10:20,895 Speaker 5: States Department of Justice, which includes, allegedly and according to 177 00:10:20,935 --> 00:10:25,015 Speaker 5: the requirements of law, all of the Epstein files. Then, namely, 178 00:10:25,335 --> 00:10:30,175 Speaker 5: whatever was produced to the FBI, to Homeland Security, or 179 00:10:30,215 --> 00:10:34,334 Speaker 5: to prosecutors in the Department of Justice, and there are 180 00:10:34,415 --> 00:10:38,335 Speaker 5: certain exceptions that they don't have to produce like the 181 00:10:38,455 --> 00:10:42,535 Speaker 5: names of victims survivors should have been protected. 182 00:10:43,015 --> 00:10:43,895 Speaker 6: They haven't been. 183 00:10:44,655 --> 00:10:49,694 Speaker 5: They've been unredacted, and some of the alleged perpetrators, their 184 00:10:49,815 --> 00:10:55,175 Speaker 5: names have in fact been redacted, meaning blacked out. Some 185 00:10:55,415 --> 00:11:00,615 Speaker 5: very personal information of the victims which should have been redacted, 186 00:11:01,095 --> 00:11:07,935 Speaker 5: such as telephone numbers, addresses, emails, drivers, licenses's, passport information, 187 00:11:08,575 --> 00:11:13,135 Speaker 5: emails between them and Jeffrey Epstein have been revealed. And 188 00:11:13,175 --> 00:11:18,695 Speaker 5: it's been upsetting, humiliating, and it feels too many victims 189 00:11:18,735 --> 00:11:21,054 Speaker 5: as though they are the ones who are being punished, 190 00:11:21,215 --> 00:11:23,335 Speaker 5: not those who committed crimes against them. 191 00:11:23,735 --> 00:11:27,495 Speaker 2: What key information do you think still remain sealed or 192 00:11:28,015 --> 00:11:31,895 Speaker 2: redacted and what effect does that have on not just 193 00:11:31,975 --> 00:11:35,454 Speaker 2: the victims, but how the public understands what to make 194 00:11:35,535 --> 00:11:37,455 Speaker 2: sense of when it comes to all this information. 195 00:11:38,335 --> 00:11:42,375 Speaker 5: So, first of all, a lot of files, according to Democrats, 196 00:11:42,415 --> 00:11:46,095 Speaker 5: millions of files that should have been produced have still 197 00:11:46,135 --> 00:11:49,975 Speaker 5: not yet been produced. And it appears that the Department 198 00:11:50,015 --> 00:11:53,335 Speaker 5: of Justice is not taking the position that there are 199 00:11:53,375 --> 00:11:55,895 Speaker 5: not millions of our files, but they are taking the 200 00:11:55,935 --> 00:11:59,934 Speaker 5: position that they're not producing them. The reason is not clear. 201 00:12:00,655 --> 00:12:03,535 Speaker 5: One reason I've heard is they say, well they do book. 202 00:12:03,615 --> 00:12:07,815 Speaker 5: It's but Democrats say, and I say, well, if they're duplicates, 203 00:12:08,295 --> 00:12:11,455 Speaker 5: just produce them. It's upsetting because one of their major 204 00:12:11,535 --> 00:12:15,975 Speaker 5: goals in lobbying for the passage of the Epstein Files 205 00:12:16,095 --> 00:12:21,054 Speaker 5: Transparency Act, met with a lot of resistance from the President, 206 00:12:21,375 --> 00:12:25,175 Speaker 5: but ultimately he signed it into law and it required 207 00:12:25,215 --> 00:12:29,735 Speaker 5: all such files to be released by December nineteenth, but 208 00:12:29,855 --> 00:12:33,615 Speaker 5: they weren't. And then in the last dump, the Deputy 209 00:12:33,615 --> 00:12:38,095 Speaker 5: Attorney General said that's it, We're not producing anymore. He 210 00:12:38,175 --> 00:12:42,334 Speaker 5: also said, no man is going to be prosecuted. There's 211 00:12:42,375 --> 00:12:46,935 Speaker 5: not enough to prosecute any man. You can't compel the 212 00:12:46,975 --> 00:12:51,455 Speaker 5: Deputy Attorney General or the Attorney General Pam Bondi to 213 00:12:51,615 --> 00:12:55,535 Speaker 5: prosecute anyone, and you can't stop them. If they do, 214 00:12:55,575 --> 00:12:58,175 Speaker 5: you have to raise legal defenses. But this is a 215 00:12:58,175 --> 00:13:02,015 Speaker 5: great disappointment. I know that the way this has all 216 00:13:02,095 --> 00:13:05,295 Speaker 5: been handled by the Department of Justice has led many 217 00:13:05,535 --> 00:13:10,815 Speaker 5: survivors to feel no confidence, no more trust in the 218 00:13:10,895 --> 00:13:12,215 Speaker 5: Department of Justice. 219 00:13:12,415 --> 00:13:13,895 Speaker 6: They feel they've been betrayed. 220 00:13:14,695 --> 00:13:18,575 Speaker 2: Gloria, can you explain to listeners why they can't just 221 00:13:18,695 --> 00:13:22,495 Speaker 2: release absolutely everything and not have it all blacked out 222 00:13:22,535 --> 00:13:25,375 Speaker 2: and redacted. Who's making that decision, and why can't it 223 00:13:25,415 --> 00:13:27,055 Speaker 2: just all be publicly available. 224 00:13:27,495 --> 00:13:30,215 Speaker 5: I can't tell you that. I can't tell you whether 225 00:13:30,295 --> 00:13:34,255 Speaker 5: it's the president, because it used to be the Department 226 00:13:34,295 --> 00:13:39,375 Speaker 5: of Justice was independent of the President and the executive French, 227 00:13:40,175 --> 00:13:42,815 Speaker 5: but now it appears to be more like the arm 228 00:13:43,015 --> 00:13:46,575 Speaker 5: of the president, as though it's his private law offer, 229 00:13:47,095 --> 00:13:50,495 Speaker 5: and that they're doing what the president wants as opposed 230 00:13:50,535 --> 00:13:52,054 Speaker 5: to what the law requires. 231 00:13:52,775 --> 00:13:55,015 Speaker 6: And they are supposed to if. 232 00:13:54,855 --> 00:13:59,535 Speaker 5: They have redacted names, for example, perpetrators' names supposed to 233 00:13:59,575 --> 00:14:04,135 Speaker 5: give the reason they were redacted, because just to black 234 00:14:04,175 --> 00:14:07,615 Speaker 5: out the names of these men and what they allegedly 235 00:14:07,695 --> 00:14:11,655 Speaker 5: did without giving a reason is wrong. And also the 236 00:14:11,735 --> 00:14:15,175 Speaker 5: law says you can't just black it out because you're 237 00:14:15,175 --> 00:14:20,495 Speaker 5: trying to protect someone's reputation or protect them from humiliation. 238 00:14:20,975 --> 00:14:23,775 Speaker 5: So they're supposed to give Congress the reason. I haven't 239 00:14:23,815 --> 00:14:25,615 Speaker 5: heard that they've given it to them yet. 240 00:14:26,095 --> 00:14:30,695 Speaker 2: We've seen names and accusations in news reports, But you've 241 00:14:30,695 --> 00:14:33,175 Speaker 2: actually sat with these women, you, like I said, have 242 00:14:33,255 --> 00:14:36,775 Speaker 2: represented a number of them. What do you want people 243 00:14:37,055 --> 00:14:41,055 Speaker 2: to understand about who they are and what they've lived through. 244 00:14:41,055 --> 00:14:43,775 Speaker 2: What they're coming to you and telling you about some of. 245 00:14:43,735 --> 00:14:48,975 Speaker 5: Them were underage when they became victims survivors of Jeffrey 246 00:14:48,975 --> 00:14:53,135 Speaker 5: Epstein and when they were sex trafficked as children to 247 00:14:53,215 --> 00:14:57,015 Speaker 5: him and from him. It has been life changing. They 248 00:14:57,095 --> 00:15:00,495 Speaker 5: had hoped that there would be some justice once the 249 00:15:00,535 --> 00:15:04,775 Speaker 5: files were released, and some men would be prosecuted criminally. 250 00:15:05,575 --> 00:15:08,935 Speaker 5: They've had some civil compensation that they've been able to 251 00:15:08,975 --> 00:15:13,135 Speaker 5: obtain from the estate of Jeffrey Epstein that's well known, 252 00:15:13,455 --> 00:15:17,175 Speaker 5: and some from various banks which knew better and shouldn't 253 00:15:17,255 --> 00:15:21,055 Speaker 5: have provided funds to Jeffrey Epstein to sex traffick them. 254 00:15:21,375 --> 00:15:22,855 Speaker 6: But for many of them, they. 255 00:15:22,775 --> 00:15:26,215 Speaker 5: Would have liked to see third parties, in other words, 256 00:15:26,415 --> 00:15:31,215 Speaker 5: in addition to Jeffrey Epstein and mss Maxwell, third parties 257 00:15:31,335 --> 00:15:35,935 Speaker 5: who might have code conspired, enabled them, supported them in 258 00:15:36,335 --> 00:15:40,695 Speaker 5: their criminal scheme and plan. They would have liked them 259 00:15:40,775 --> 00:15:45,175 Speaker 5: to have been held criminally responsible. Face it, there's only 260 00:15:45,215 --> 00:15:49,375 Speaker 5: one person who's been convicted after trial. It's not a man, 261 00:15:50,215 --> 00:15:53,655 Speaker 5: it's Miss Maxwell, who is a British citizen. That doesn't 262 00:15:53,695 --> 00:15:57,335 Speaker 5: take care of the problem, and that's not full justice. 263 00:15:57,575 --> 00:16:00,135 Speaker 5: And many of these would have been willing to testify 264 00:16:00,135 --> 00:16:02,215 Speaker 5: in a court of law. There would be a prosecution. 265 00:16:03,095 --> 00:16:06,335 Speaker 5: But there's not going to be, you know. They kind 266 00:16:06,375 --> 00:16:08,895 Speaker 5: of hem and hall and say, well, there's more evidence. 267 00:16:08,975 --> 00:16:12,455 Speaker 5: Maybe there will be, but even Pam Bondi has said 268 00:16:12,735 --> 00:16:14,455 Speaker 5: there's not going to be more prosecution. 269 00:16:14,895 --> 00:16:16,175 Speaker 6: I characterize it, in. 270 00:16:16,095 --> 00:16:19,495 Speaker 5: My opinion as this, I made up my mind. 271 00:16:19,535 --> 00:16:22,855 Speaker 6: Don't confuse me with the facts. They're not going to 272 00:16:22,895 --> 00:16:23,255 Speaker 6: do it. 273 00:16:23,535 --> 00:16:26,695 Speaker 5: Unfortunately, I'm not the kind of person that can hide 274 00:16:26,735 --> 00:16:29,255 Speaker 5: that harsh reality from my clients. 275 00:16:29,295 --> 00:16:29,735 Speaker 6: I won't. 276 00:16:30,535 --> 00:16:33,535 Speaker 5: I have to know the truth, but I still should try, 277 00:16:34,095 --> 00:16:36,175 Speaker 5: and I think you will be hearing from some of 278 00:16:36,175 --> 00:16:39,695 Speaker 5: them tomorrow. They should continue to be courageous and do 279 00:16:39,775 --> 00:16:43,175 Speaker 5: what they can, and I think that's exactly what they're doing. 280 00:16:44,095 --> 00:16:46,735 Speaker 5: But the idea that they fought, they spoke out, and 281 00:16:46,775 --> 00:16:49,615 Speaker 5: they fought so hard to win the passage of the 282 00:16:49,735 --> 00:16:53,895 Speaker 5: Fteine Files Transparency Act, and now requirements are not being 283 00:16:53,935 --> 00:16:57,855 Speaker 5: met and they're being punished because the names are being revealed. 284 00:16:58,095 --> 00:17:00,775 Speaker 5: When they were promised years ago that their names would 285 00:17:00,775 --> 00:17:04,175 Speaker 5: never be revealed unless they testified the court of law. 286 00:17:04,534 --> 00:17:07,135 Speaker 5: But most of them never that because it was only 287 00:17:07,175 --> 00:17:09,814 Speaker 5: one trial and that was a miss maths well, and 288 00:17:09,854 --> 00:17:12,294 Speaker 5: only a few people were called out of a thousand 289 00:17:12,895 --> 00:17:14,215 Speaker 5: reported survivors. 290 00:17:14,534 --> 00:17:16,455 Speaker 6: So that's where we are today. 291 00:17:16,774 --> 00:17:18,814 Speaker 2: Gloria, I want to ask you about some of the 292 00:17:19,094 --> 00:17:22,734 Speaker 2: high profile names mentioned in the Epstein files. Now, as 293 00:17:22,734 --> 00:17:27,414 Speaker 2: you've said, being named dozen imply wrongdoing and further sexual 294 00:17:27,455 --> 00:17:33,254 Speaker 2: misconduct convictions seem unlikely. However, in the UK there are reports, 295 00:17:33,254 --> 00:17:36,175 Speaker 2: and we've seen of the last few days investigations into 296 00:17:36,294 --> 00:17:39,975 Speaker 2: possible misconduct in public office that involves figures such as 297 00:17:40,054 --> 00:17:44,654 Speaker 2: Prince Andrew and Peter Mandelson. Based on what we know, 298 00:17:45,215 --> 00:17:48,935 Speaker 2: is there any realistic prospect of these men being charged 299 00:17:48,935 --> 00:17:50,734 Speaker 2: and prosecuted in these cases. 300 00:17:51,534 --> 00:17:54,975 Speaker 5: Let's keep in mind that in reference to those two 301 00:17:55,734 --> 00:18:01,135 Speaker 5: individuals you just mentioned in the UK, Andrew montbak Windsor 302 00:18:01,655 --> 00:18:05,734 Speaker 5: formerly known as Prince and Lord mandelssh both have been 303 00:18:05,854 --> 00:18:11,254 Speaker 5: arrested for misconduct in office, not for crimes against women 304 00:18:11,294 --> 00:18:15,374 Speaker 5: and children. So that's very interesting. Will there be anybody 305 00:18:15,375 --> 00:18:18,774 Speaker 5: else arrested? I don't know and for what, but it 306 00:18:18,814 --> 00:18:21,975 Speaker 5: has not escaped my notice that the crime that is 307 00:18:22,014 --> 00:18:25,534 Speaker 5: alleged has to do with misconduct and office. So the 308 00:18:25,655 --> 00:18:30,975 Speaker 5: allegation that maybe there was a revelation of a state secret, 309 00:18:31,455 --> 00:18:36,134 Speaker 5: you know, a business development that a trade envoy like 310 00:18:36,334 --> 00:18:41,494 Speaker 5: Andrew or the you know, ambassador, UK ambassador to the 311 00:18:41,614 --> 00:18:47,455 Speaker 5: United States, might have the allegation is maybe shared a 312 00:18:47,614 --> 00:18:51,734 Speaker 5: secret of the UK on trade with someone else which 313 00:18:51,854 --> 00:18:55,054 Speaker 5: should not have been done. If in fact that was done, Yeah, 314 00:18:55,094 --> 00:18:59,734 Speaker 5: that's important. But what about women's bodies, what about sex 315 00:18:59,774 --> 00:19:05,095 Speaker 5: trafficking of children? What about rape? What about sexual assault, 316 00:19:05,574 --> 00:19:08,734 Speaker 5: child sexual abuse? We haven't seen a prosecution or even 317 00:19:08,774 --> 00:19:12,094 Speaker 5: an arrest for that yet in the UK. However, it 318 00:19:12,294 --> 00:19:17,734 Speaker 5: just came out yesterday there are UK police investigating the 319 00:19:17,854 --> 00:19:23,455 Speaker 5: fact that many flights landed in the UK which allegedly 320 00:19:23,534 --> 00:19:27,774 Speaker 5: carried women who are being sex trafficked to the UK 321 00:19:28,254 --> 00:19:32,494 Speaker 5: and possibly underage girls children. So that's a very welcome 322 00:19:32,574 --> 00:19:36,455 Speaker 5: development that the UK for me is the gold standard. 323 00:19:36,574 --> 00:19:40,854 Speaker 5: They are doing what they can do to help the 324 00:19:40,895 --> 00:19:43,895 Speaker 5: whole people accountable. We don't know if it'll end up 325 00:19:43,975 --> 00:19:46,695 Speaker 5: even in charges being filed. All we know is is 326 00:19:46,734 --> 00:19:48,455 Speaker 5: an arrest that we'll have to wait and see it. 327 00:19:48,895 --> 00:19:51,975 Speaker 2: So, with the men at the center of this, Jeffrey 328 00:19:51,975 --> 00:19:57,655 Speaker 2: Epstein deceased, what does justice look like feel clients? Then, 329 00:19:57,695 --> 00:20:01,375 Speaker 2: what would be the ultimate goal here? I mean, obviously, 330 00:20:01,455 --> 00:20:03,774 Speaker 2: having never had to have lived through it would be 331 00:20:04,175 --> 00:20:07,894 Speaker 2: the preference. But where you currently stand, what are you 332 00:20:07,975 --> 00:20:08,734 Speaker 2: searching for? 333 00:20:09,215 --> 00:20:11,414 Speaker 5: Well, I think what they're searching for is the truth, 334 00:20:11,655 --> 00:20:13,734 Speaker 5: the whole truth. They know their own truth. They don't 335 00:20:13,734 --> 00:20:17,254 Speaker 5: know the big picture how this could have happened. How 336 00:20:17,254 --> 00:20:20,095 Speaker 5: could women and children have been sex trafficked all over 337 00:20:20,135 --> 00:20:23,215 Speaker 5: the world. Certainly it wasn't just Jeffrey Epstein? 338 00:20:23,415 --> 00:20:23,975 Speaker 6: Who else? 339 00:20:24,375 --> 00:20:27,534 Speaker 5: Now? Also Congress is on the trail of a lot 340 00:20:27,574 --> 00:20:31,534 Speaker 5: of money, you know, being handled, for example, by Jeffrey Epstein, 341 00:20:31,614 --> 00:20:35,774 Speaker 5: by powerful men. Why why why did they trust him? 342 00:20:35,895 --> 00:20:39,094 Speaker 5: It's not like he had a very big background and financing. 343 00:20:39,814 --> 00:20:40,655 Speaker 6: But we'll see. 344 00:20:40,774 --> 00:20:44,254 Speaker 5: Look, they've become empowered, and I think that's positive. They 345 00:20:44,415 --> 00:20:47,855 Speaker 5: received some justices, the whole justices, but they've been let 346 00:20:47,935 --> 00:20:51,894 Speaker 5: down so many times by the criminal justices. Again, women 347 00:20:51,935 --> 00:20:54,415 Speaker 5: and children are being treated as though they're not quite 348 00:20:54,415 --> 00:20:55,134 Speaker 5: as deborant. 349 00:20:55,415 --> 00:20:58,494 Speaker 2: Can we briefly touch on Donald Trump? He's allegedly mentioned 350 00:20:58,494 --> 00:21:01,414 Speaker 2: a million times across the files, and as we said before, 351 00:21:01,534 --> 00:21:04,695 Speaker 2: being mentioned is not an indication of any criminal offense. 352 00:21:04,854 --> 00:21:06,415 Speaker 2: What's his in all of this? 353 00:21:07,254 --> 00:21:08,254 Speaker 6: What will his faith be? 354 00:21:08,895 --> 00:21:12,174 Speaker 5: Well, certainly, I think it's pretty certain that there's not 355 00:21:12,215 --> 00:21:15,174 Speaker 5: going to be any prosecution by this Department of Justice 356 00:21:15,415 --> 00:21:20,135 Speaker 5: of Donald Trump, even if they find evidence of criminal conduct, 357 00:21:20,814 --> 00:21:22,814 Speaker 5: which they indicate they have not found. 358 00:21:23,734 --> 00:21:26,695 Speaker 2: Why do you do this work? This is not the 359 00:21:26,734 --> 00:21:30,574 Speaker 2: first time you've taken on clients and caseloads like this. 360 00:21:31,254 --> 00:21:34,975 Speaker 2: You have a long career in defending women in these 361 00:21:35,054 --> 00:21:36,014 Speaker 2: kind of cases. 362 00:21:36,415 --> 00:21:40,455 Speaker 5: I've represented victims for fifty years. We've been the leading 363 00:21:40,494 --> 00:21:43,814 Speaker 5: women's rights law firm in the United States, frankly, if 364 00:21:43,854 --> 00:21:47,215 Speaker 5: not the world. We do it because women deserve respect, 365 00:21:47,294 --> 00:21:51,694 Speaker 5: They deserve dignity, and they deserve justice, and they deserve 366 00:21:51,774 --> 00:21:55,655 Speaker 5: to be empowered and not suffer in silence. That's why 367 00:21:55,695 --> 00:21:58,655 Speaker 5: we do it. I'm very happy to say that we've 368 00:21:58,695 --> 00:22:03,014 Speaker 5: been successful in many, many cases in asserting and protecting 369 00:22:03,054 --> 00:22:05,494 Speaker 5: and dedicating women's rights and victims rights. 370 00:22:06,774 --> 00:22:08,975 Speaker 2: Thanks for taking some time to feed your mind with 371 00:22:09,054 --> 00:22:11,054 Speaker 2: us today. Before your head off, make sure you are 372 00:22:11,094 --> 00:22:13,774 Speaker 2: following the Quikie in your favorite podcast staff and if 373 00:22:13,774 --> 00:22:16,375 Speaker 2: you are enjoying the programming, we would love to hear 374 00:22:16,415 --> 00:22:18,894 Speaker 2: from you. You can pop a five star rating up or 375 00:22:18,975 --> 00:22:22,094 Speaker 2: leave a nice little comment, a review, whatever you're into. 376 00:22:22,455 --> 00:22:25,455 Speaker 2: It all helps and we appreciate it. The Quikie is 377 00:22:25,534 --> 00:22:29,215 Speaker 2: produced by me Taylor Strano, Ilaria Brophy, and Clare Murphy, 378 00:22:29,415 --> 00:22:31,494 Speaker 2: with audio production by Lou Hill. 379 00:22:31,734 --> 00:22:34,815 Speaker 3: Momma MEA acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters 380 00:22:34,854 --> 00:22:36,575 Speaker 3: that this podcast is recorded on.