1 00:00:01,970 --> 00:00:05,329 Speaker 1: This episode of 456 club is made in partnership with 2 00:00:05,340 --> 00:00:09,719 Speaker 1: Priceline Pharmacy for expert advice and all your beauty health 3 00:00:09,728 --> 00:00:14,060 Speaker 1: and wellness needs. Visit Priceline Pharmacy in store or online 4 00:00:14,069 --> 00:00:16,040 Speaker 1: at Priceline dot com dot A U. 5 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:36,668 Speaker 1: Have you ever felt invisible when I go shopping for clothes? Now, 6 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:39,129 Speaker 1: I've noticed that the shop assistants don't come and ask 7 00:00:39,139 --> 00:00:41,779 Speaker 1: me if I need help. I always have to seek help. 8 00:00:41,790 --> 00:00:43,958 Speaker 1: It's almost like I'm invisible. 9 00:00:43,970 --> 00:00:48,229 Speaker 2: Being single and childless can make a woman feel invisible. 10 00:00:48,250 --> 00:00:50,439 Speaker 2: You start to get left out of your friendship groups 11 00:00:50,450 --> 00:00:52,180 Speaker 2: when your friends start to couple up and you're the 12 00:00:52,189 --> 00:00:54,040 Speaker 2: only single one I noticed when I 13 00:00:54,220 --> 00:00:57,220 Speaker 2: with my daughter in her mid twenties, men don't look 14 00:00:57,229 --> 00:00:57,950 Speaker 2: at me anymore. 15 00:00:58,180 --> 00:01:00,580 Speaker 1: They look at her. Do you remember the day? You 16 00:01:00,590 --> 00:01:04,830 Speaker 1: first felt like that the day you disappeared or are 17 00:01:04,839 --> 00:01:07,809 Speaker 1: you feeling more relevant than ever in your forties? Fifties 18 00:01:07,819 --> 00:01:11,519 Speaker 1: and sixties. This is 456 club. The show that helps 19 00:01:11,529 --> 00:01:14,679 Speaker 1: women in their forties, fifties and sixties, feel seen, heard 20 00:01:14,690 --> 00:01:16,369 Speaker 1: and better about everything. 21 00:01:16,639 --> 00:01:19,730 Speaker 1: I'm Nelda Jacobs and you will usually find me on 22 00:01:19,739 --> 00:01:22,269 Speaker 1: the couch at studio 10 at 10 am from Monday 23 00:01:22,279 --> 00:01:29,400 Speaker 1: to Friday. Sometimes you might see a pony on the couch. Oh, 24 00:01:29,410 --> 00:01:31,819 Speaker 1: I know. It was so exciting. You went to my 25 00:01:31,830 --> 00:01:36,120 Speaker 1: work the other day you went there. I wasn't, I, 26 00:01:36,169 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 1: I bring your friend to work somewhere else. You were 27 00:01:41,019 --> 00:01:43,330 Speaker 1: at my work on studio 10. How was it? You 28 00:01:43,339 --> 00:01:44,309 Speaker 1: were fantastic. 29 00:01:44,410 --> 00:01:47,160 Speaker 1: I tell you, I was so nervous and it's live TV, 30 00:01:47,169 --> 00:01:49,059 Speaker 1: isn't it? You were talking about this podcast? I was 31 00:01:49,069 --> 00:01:51,089 Speaker 1: talking about this podcast and you and how much I 32 00:01:51,099 --> 00:01:53,550 Speaker 1: loved you. And we talked about all sorts of things 33 00:01:53,559 --> 00:01:58,610 Speaker 1: including dryness down there, which was interesting having Tristan your 34 00:01:58,620 --> 00:02:02,150 Speaker 1: co-host just have to sit there while the other three 35 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:04,309 Speaker 1: ladies on the couch talked about it. He was just 36 00:02:04,319 --> 00:02:07,889 Speaker 1: taking it and then I asked you on the party, 37 00:02:07,900 --> 00:02:11,059 Speaker 1: you also talk about being invisible and your reply was, well, 38 00:02:11,070 --> 00:02:12,259 Speaker 1: we haven't talked about it yet, 39 00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:16,960 Speaker 1: which brings us to today. But yes, we are here 40 00:02:16,970 --> 00:02:20,350 Speaker 1: today to talk about feeling invisible. Later in this episode, 41 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:22,869 Speaker 1: we'll hear from women in the 456 club who are 42 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:27,619 Speaker 1: all too familiar with feeling invisible. We'll hear how it 43 00:02:27,630 --> 00:02:28,049 Speaker 1: impacts 44 00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:31,970 Speaker 1: at them and how they navigated it to take back power. 45 00:02:31,979 --> 00:02:34,490 Speaker 1: And we'll hear from Carly Lyon who runs the brand 46 00:02:34,500 --> 00:02:38,399 Speaker 1: in New. She specializes in helping women rebrand themselves and 47 00:02:38,410 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 1: making them feel relevant again. But first, Keith, is this 48 00:02:41,369 --> 00:02:43,229 Speaker 1: something you've felt or experienced before 49 00:02:44,038 --> 00:02:49,009 Speaker 1: feeling invisible? Look to be honest, not in my forties. 50 00:02:49,020 --> 00:02:52,820 Speaker 1: I'm at late forties. Now. 48 I felt quite visible 51 00:02:52,830 --> 00:02:56,410 Speaker 1: in my thirties. I definitely felt invisible. I was married 52 00:02:56,419 --> 00:02:59,579 Speaker 1: to a high profile sportsman. And, um, you know, let 53 00:02:59,589 --> 00:03:01,758 Speaker 1: me tell you when you sort of walked into a 54 00:03:01,779 --> 00:03:04,589 Speaker 1: room of chaps at an event or something, I could 55 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:06,309 Speaker 1: have been stood there like in a bikini and people 56 00:03:06,320 --> 00:03:06,869 Speaker 1: would have just pushed 57 00:03:06,953 --> 00:03:08,643 Speaker 1: me out of the way to talk to my husband. 58 00:03:08,931 --> 00:03:11,222 Speaker 1: So invisible that one time when we were at a 59 00:03:11,233 --> 00:03:13,941 Speaker 1: stadium and some guys came over and wanted a photo, 60 00:03:13,953 --> 00:03:16,952 Speaker 1: one of them sat on me to get closer to 61 00:03:16,962 --> 00:03:19,892 Speaker 1: my ex-husband to get the photo. I was like, am 62 00:03:19,901 --> 00:03:23,322 Speaker 1: I even here? Oh, my goodness, Keith. I never do 63 00:03:23,332 --> 00:03:25,901 Speaker 1: to you. It was just bizarre. I don't know. I, 64 00:03:25,912 --> 00:03:28,263 Speaker 1: it made me laugh. I used to sort of think, 65 00:03:28,272 --> 00:03:29,782 Speaker 1: oh my gosh, we've got like a real 66 00:03:30,565 --> 00:03:33,345 Speaker 1: but 12 o'clock we got two incoming. So I'd be 67 00:03:33,356 --> 00:03:36,636 Speaker 1: like you walk into a room though and heads turn. 68 00:03:36,755 --> 00:03:39,335 Speaker 1: That's the presence that you have. Oh, do I say 69 00:03:39,345 --> 00:03:43,345 Speaker 1: that again? Say it again. Well, my head turns. I really, 70 00:03:43,606 --> 00:03:46,305 Speaker 1: because I really tall and I bounce like when I 71 00:03:46,315 --> 00:03:48,725 Speaker 1: walk I think you just have, you just look really 72 00:03:48,735 --> 00:03:52,636 Speaker 1: cool as you walk in. Like I arrived 73 00:03:53,639 --> 00:03:56,169 Speaker 1: as I've just tripped up getting out of the list. 74 00:03:56,199 --> 00:03:58,100 Speaker 1: But I like the way you make me sound. Is 75 00:03:58,110 --> 00:04:01,389 Speaker 1: that your profession? In your professional life. You're a publicist. Yes. 76 00:04:01,399 --> 00:04:03,550 Speaker 1: So does that I feed into that as well. I 77 00:04:03,559 --> 00:04:05,250 Speaker 1: think you've hit the nail on the head because the, 78 00:04:05,259 --> 00:04:08,729 Speaker 1: my entire career you do have to be invisible. You know, 79 00:04:08,740 --> 00:04:10,940 Speaker 1: you're with a superstar or a singer or an actress. 80 00:04:10,949 --> 00:04:14,899 Speaker 1: Whoever you're presenting, you do have to be there but 81 00:04:14,910 --> 00:04:16,750 Speaker 1: invisible at all times whilst 82 00:04:16,825 --> 00:04:20,066 Speaker 1: control. So, yeah. So maybe I just learned the art 83 00:04:20,075 --> 00:04:23,555 Speaker 1: of camouflage, which can be a blessing sometimes I know 84 00:04:23,565 --> 00:04:26,635 Speaker 1: it can be good, but I'm back out now. Yes, 85 00:04:26,805 --> 00:04:30,515 Speaker 1: I'm wearing loud red colors. Tell me, what about you? 86 00:04:30,526 --> 00:04:32,555 Speaker 1: Have you ever felt invisible? Well, like you as well 87 00:04:32,565 --> 00:04:35,196 Speaker 1: when I was younger. So I'm the youngest of five 88 00:04:35,226 --> 00:04:38,794 Speaker 1: girls in my family. So as I was growing up, 89 00:04:38,805 --> 00:04:39,795 Speaker 1: I always was 90 00:04:40,111 --> 00:04:42,242 Speaker 1: for like somebody always did the speaking for me, I 91 00:04:42,252 --> 00:04:45,981 Speaker 1: never actually was called upon to speak. I know that 92 00:04:45,992 --> 00:04:48,481 Speaker 1: sounds odd and I was always kind of the cute one, 93 00:04:48,492 --> 00:04:50,661 Speaker 1: you know, and so nothing's really expected of the cute 94 00:04:50,671 --> 00:04:53,571 Speaker 1: one and everyone else feels seen, but I kind of 95 00:04:53,582 --> 00:04:55,481 Speaker 1: feel like I kind of just slipped under the radar, 96 00:04:55,492 --> 00:04:59,501 Speaker 1: but now I feel more seen than ever because I'm 97 00:04:59,511 --> 00:05:06,582 Speaker 1: sharing opinions and speaking and being looked upon for wisdom, 98 00:05:06,962 --> 00:05:07,342 Speaker 1: you know, 99 00:05:08,250 --> 00:05:12,140 Speaker 1: I think you're very wise. Yeah, which I think that's 100 00:05:12,149 --> 00:05:14,579 Speaker 1: something that comes with age and especially in first nations 101 00:05:14,589 --> 00:05:18,618 Speaker 1: culture where you reach a point where you're called auntie. 102 00:05:18,630 --> 00:05:22,558 Speaker 1: So I'm called auntie. I'm an auntie now, I didn't 103 00:05:22,570 --> 00:05:25,540 Speaker 1: know that. So with that comes a level of respect 104 00:05:25,549 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: that comes with age and lived experience. So for those reasons, 105 00:05:31,510 --> 00:05:34,159 Speaker 1: I feel more seen than ever. So, Kath, there's this 106 00:05:34,290 --> 00:05:37,179 Speaker 1: unwritten rule and it's become a bit of a joke 107 00:05:37,190 --> 00:05:40,109 Speaker 1: that women have got to be 39 or younger to 108 00:05:40,119 --> 00:05:42,480 Speaker 1: make it in TV. So we have this joke that 109 00:05:42,488 --> 00:05:46,380 Speaker 1: we're forever 39. And I think Anne used it on 110 00:05:46,390 --> 00:05:48,660 Speaker 1: the day that you were at studio T S and 111 00:05:48,670 --> 00:05:50,399 Speaker 1: we were like 456 club. And she's like, well, I'm 112 00:05:50,410 --> 00:05:54,019 Speaker 1: not 48 or something. I mean, she looks absolutely fabulous. 113 00:05:54,029 --> 00:05:54,279 Speaker 1: But 114 00:05:54,769 --> 00:05:57,359 Speaker 1: I was, and, and I was told that before I 115 00:05:57,369 --> 00:06:00,769 Speaker 1: decided to move to Sydney from Perth, I was already, 116 00:06:00,779 --> 00:06:03,349 Speaker 1: I think 43 or something. And I was asked by 117 00:06:03,359 --> 00:06:06,640 Speaker 1: someone I was getting advice from and he who was 118 00:06:06,649 --> 00:06:08,510 Speaker 1: in the industry for a long time, not working at 119 00:06:08,519 --> 00:06:11,269 Speaker 1: channel 10, by the way, he said, so, how old 120 00:06:11,279 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: are you? And I said 43 he said, oh, it's 121 00:06:14,890 --> 00:06:17,179 Speaker 1: getting a bit old. Um, they say women have to 122 00:06:17,190 --> 00:06:19,799 Speaker 1: be 39. And so I was like, oh, wow, I 123 00:06:19,809 --> 00:06:21,739 Speaker 1: just experience that, that thing. 124 00:06:21,959 --> 00:06:23,969 Speaker 1: And so then I came over and I'm like, looking 125 00:06:23,980 --> 00:06:26,010 Speaker 1: around at all the women at channel 10, they're all 126 00:06:26,019 --> 00:06:26,450 Speaker 1: like 127 00:06:26,730 --> 00:06:31,459 Speaker 1: my age or older and thinking like they're running the network. 128 00:06:31,470 --> 00:06:33,420 Speaker 1: These are women who are running the network. And it's like, 129 00:06:33,428 --> 00:06:36,420 Speaker 1: excuse me, because all I can see are women in 130 00:06:36,428 --> 00:06:39,979 Speaker 1: their absolute prime leading all the conversations that we're having 131 00:06:39,988 --> 00:06:42,570 Speaker 1: as a nation, which is fabulous. I mean, even being 132 00:06:42,579 --> 00:06:45,910 Speaker 1: part of this podcast is empowering, isn't it? I think? 133 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:47,649 Speaker 1: And it sort of sets the agenda for everyone to 134 00:06:47,660 --> 00:06:50,690 Speaker 1: talk about aging because we're all aging and it's actually 135 00:06:50,700 --> 00:06:53,709 Speaker 1: not that bad. So, get on board. He sounds like 136 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:54,419 Speaker 1: a dinosaur. 137 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:03,809 Speaker 1: We're gonna be talking to Cathy o'brien who's in her 138 00:07:03,820 --> 00:07:06,339 Speaker 1: fifties and a writer and she's going to share with 139 00:07:06,350 --> 00:07:11,239 Speaker 1: us her invisibility experiences, Cathy. Do you remember the day? 140 00:07:11,250 --> 00:07:12,709 Speaker 1: You first felt invisible? 141 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:15,890 Speaker 2: Look, being a mum, you feel invisible a lot? I 142 00:07:15,899 --> 00:07:20,660 Speaker 2: reckon I felt invisible when my son was born. All 143 00:07:20,670 --> 00:07:22,929 Speaker 2: of a sudden the focus was on him 144 00:07:23,190 --> 00:07:29,640 Speaker 2: and I hastily changed my name from my maiden name 145 00:07:29,649 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 2: to my married name when I got married. And then 146 00:07:32,010 --> 00:07:34,140 Speaker 2: all of a sudden when I had this little baby 147 00:07:34,149 --> 00:07:37,140 Speaker 2: in my arms, I was like, oh, hang on. I'm 148 00:07:37,209 --> 00:07:42,130 Speaker 2: nobody now. Like I'm just somebody's mum and I'm somebody's 149 00:07:42,140 --> 00:07:45,859 Speaker 2: wife and who am I in all of this? So 150 00:07:46,190 --> 00:07:50,170 Speaker 2: it probably was like a slow burn 22 years ago 151 00:07:50,179 --> 00:07:51,579 Speaker 2: when my son was born 152 00:07:52,070 --> 00:07:56,959 Speaker 2: and then my daughters were born three days after my birthday. 153 00:07:56,970 --> 00:08:00,119 Speaker 2: And I can remember my mother-in-law saying to me not 154 00:08:00,130 --> 00:08:03,019 Speaker 2: long after my twins were born. 155 00:08:03,459 --> 00:08:06,529 Speaker 2: Oh, well, I hope you enjoyed this year's birthday because 156 00:08:06,540 --> 00:08:09,250 Speaker 2: you'll never have another one to celebrate again. And I 157 00:08:09,260 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 2: looked at her and I was like, oh, ah, I 158 00:08:12,029 --> 00:08:17,399 Speaker 2: don't think so. It's my birthday. So, yeah. Oh, 159 00:08:17,410 --> 00:08:20,359 Speaker 1: listen to someone whose birthday is on Christmas Day. Once 160 00:08:20,369 --> 00:08:22,559 Speaker 1: I became a mum, I was like, oh, it's gonna 161 00:08:22,570 --> 00:08:24,260 Speaker 1: have to be about the kid for a bit, isn't it? 162 00:08:24,290 --> 00:08:26,559 Speaker 1: Why is your birthday on Christmas? 163 00:08:27,660 --> 00:08:31,269 Speaker 1: Yes. How did you feel then when your birthdays rolled around? 164 00:08:31,709 --> 00:08:34,080 Speaker 1: Just all the gifts on the one day? I love 165 00:08:34,090 --> 00:08:35,989 Speaker 1: it because generally it's a day that most people are 166 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,739 Speaker 1: happy but Cathy, do you have to remain vigilant that 167 00:08:38,750 --> 00:08:42,159 Speaker 1: you don't slip into that sort of losing your identity? 168 00:08:42,169 --> 00:08:46,619 Speaker 1: Because when we get married, we're told to take on 169 00:08:46,630 --> 00:08:51,700 Speaker 1: our husband's last names, like in a traditional heteronormative sense, 170 00:08:51,859 --> 00:08:53,549 Speaker 1: I don't really think, oh, I can retain my name. 171 00:08:53,559 --> 00:08:56,270 Speaker 1: I can retain my identity. How do you then reclaim 172 00:08:56,280 --> 00:08:56,468 Speaker 1: your 173 00:08:56,479 --> 00:09:00,369 Speaker 2: identity for the last, I don't know, 18 years. I 174 00:09:00,380 --> 00:09:04,909 Speaker 2: really didn't. It was a very difficult process. I was 175 00:09:04,919 --> 00:09:09,630 Speaker 2: lost in the identity of the family and the identity 176 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:12,979 Speaker 2: of being a mother to three Children, a mother to 177 00:09:12,989 --> 00:09:15,969 Speaker 2: twins because that's something different again 178 00:09:16,289 --> 00:09:21,479 Speaker 2: and being my husband's wife. And it wasn't really until 179 00:09:21,489 --> 00:09:24,679 Speaker 2: I had my breakdown, I guess, with a lot of 180 00:09:24,690 --> 00:09:29,419 Speaker 2: work on myself and a lot of support from my 181 00:09:29,429 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 2: medical team and my mental health team 182 00:09:32,260 --> 00:09:36,130 Speaker 2: working out who am I in all of that? And 183 00:09:36,140 --> 00:09:41,210 Speaker 2: that kind of morphed into looking for something that I 184 00:09:41,219 --> 00:09:45,900 Speaker 2: wanted to do that made me happy in life. And, yeah, 185 00:09:45,909 --> 00:09:48,270 Speaker 2: so it's really in the, only in the last kind 186 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:51,289 Speaker 2: of few years, three or four years, maybe that I've 187 00:09:51,299 --> 00:09:55,210 Speaker 2: started to think about who am I in my family, 188 00:09:55,284 --> 00:09:59,354 Speaker 2: family and who am I in this world? How did 189 00:09:59,364 --> 00:10:01,544 Speaker 1: it feel when you say you felt invisible? 190 00:10:01,655 --> 00:10:05,994 Speaker 2: Nothing was about me. Nothing at all was about me. 191 00:10:06,005 --> 00:10:10,294 Speaker 2: It was always, if I wanted to go to work, 192 00:10:10,304 --> 00:10:14,155 Speaker 2: it was about how can I do this in the 193 00:10:14,164 --> 00:10:20,733 Speaker 2: smallest and the quietest possible way that doesn't impact the 194 00:10:20,744 --> 00:10:23,554 Speaker 2: family because we needed 195 00:10:23,919 --> 00:10:26,479 Speaker 2: me to be there to pick the kids up or 196 00:10:26,489 --> 00:10:29,150 Speaker 2: to take them to dance or to run them to 197 00:10:29,159 --> 00:10:35,239 Speaker 2: football training or medical appointments or whatever. So losing myself 198 00:10:35,250 --> 00:10:38,080 Speaker 2: in all of that, I really didn't think that that 199 00:10:38,090 --> 00:10:42,109 Speaker 2: would happen. I thought that I would have a career 200 00:10:42,119 --> 00:10:45,630 Speaker 2: and I would balance having a career and being a 201 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 2: mother and you know, being the best friend and being 202 00:10:49,210 --> 00:10:51,989 Speaker 2: the best wife and all of those things. And 203 00:10:52,270 --> 00:10:55,099 Speaker 2: you know, I'm a total gen X baby. We were 204 00:10:55,109 --> 00:10:59,358 Speaker 2: told go to school, get a degree. You can have 205 00:10:59,369 --> 00:11:02,619 Speaker 2: a great career, you can have a family, you can 206 00:11:02,630 --> 00:11:05,150 Speaker 2: do all of these things, but they left out the 207 00:11:05,159 --> 00:11:08,218 Speaker 2: little bit, the little caveat at the end, you can't 208 00:11:08,229 --> 00:11:11,760 Speaker 2: have it all at the same time, you can, but 209 00:11:11,770 --> 00:11:13,200 Speaker 2: not all at the same time. 210 00:11:13,210 --> 00:11:15,500 Speaker 1: Kay and cat, there's one thing that strikes me 211 00:11:15,590 --> 00:11:18,400 Speaker 1: out of this and, and is that heteronormative has a 212 00:11:18,409 --> 00:11:22,299 Speaker 1: lot to answer for. We slip into gendered roles, don't we? 213 00:11:22,309 --> 00:11:26,080 Speaker 1: And societal expectations of us no matter what we're told 214 00:11:26,090 --> 00:11:28,750 Speaker 1: exactly what you've said, Cathy, like go and achieve all 215 00:11:28,760 --> 00:11:31,439 Speaker 1: your dreams, you know, the world is your oyster. But 216 00:11:31,450 --> 00:11:36,960 Speaker 1: when society expects that you will be the primary caregiver of, 217 00:11:36,969 --> 00:11:38,679 Speaker 1: you know, your Children and then 218 00:11:38,909 --> 00:11:42,239 Speaker 1: potentially aging parents as well. Like you said, you know, 219 00:11:42,250 --> 00:11:43,848 Speaker 1: you've got to keep yourself small to be able to 220 00:11:43,859 --> 00:11:46,329 Speaker 1: go out and achieve the things that you want. So 221 00:11:46,340 --> 00:11:48,900 Speaker 1: that doesn't upset the household too much. I mean, everything 222 00:11:48,909 --> 00:11:50,690 Speaker 1: else should be able to fit around you so that 223 00:11:50,700 --> 00:11:52,250 Speaker 1: you can go and do these things because it would 224 00:11:52,260 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 1: make you a better person, which then your Children will 225 00:11:54,770 --> 00:11:56,849 Speaker 1: look up to. I think this is wild 226 00:11:56,859 --> 00:12:01,609 Speaker 2: 100%. I completely agree with you. No, it's ridiculous to 227 00:12:01,619 --> 00:12:02,140 Speaker 2: think that 228 00:12:02,229 --> 00:12:05,709 Speaker 2: that so many women think that they need to be 229 00:12:05,719 --> 00:12:10,199 Speaker 2: small so that they can not impact the family or 230 00:12:10,210 --> 00:12:12,669 Speaker 2: they want to have their career. But how do they 231 00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:16,280 Speaker 2: juggle this coming through? That was really, really hard and 232 00:12:16,289 --> 00:12:19,719 Speaker 2: trying to get back into the workforce when you've been 233 00:12:19,729 --> 00:12:25,460 Speaker 2: out of the workforce for 15 years is ridiculously difficult. 234 00:12:25,789 --> 00:12:29,409 Speaker 1: Is that where you notice the age adding to the 235 00:12:29,419 --> 00:12:31,669 Speaker 1: invisibility and difficulty of that 236 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:39,340 Speaker 2: landscape, 100% and the amount of people including recruiters, they say. So, 237 00:12:39,469 --> 00:12:42,789 Speaker 2: can you give us a reference? I was like, well, 238 00:12:42,799 --> 00:12:47,119 Speaker 2: I can give you my last job, which was in 239 00:12:47,130 --> 00:12:52,059 Speaker 2: 2006 and this is in 2000 and, 240 00:12:52,125 --> 00:12:55,734 Speaker 2: and 18. And they're like, well, that's no 241 00:12:55,744 --> 00:12:59,534 Speaker 1: good but Cathy all those unpaid jobs that you were 242 00:12:59,544 --> 00:13:02,914 Speaker 1: doing at home and probably in the school community, you 243 00:13:02,924 --> 00:13:05,544 Speaker 1: can't necessarily put that on your CV. Can you? Because 244 00:13:05,554 --> 00:13:08,724 Speaker 1: it doesn't really count for anything in the eyes of employers. 245 00:13:08,734 --> 00:13:09,195 Speaker 1: It was 246 00:13:09,205 --> 00:13:12,934 Speaker 2: really, really challenging. I did do a lot of volunteer 247 00:13:12,945 --> 00:13:18,395 Speaker 2: work with model, both association and one of my 248 00:13:18,820 --> 00:13:22,319 Speaker 2: colleagues who I sat on the national board with, she 249 00:13:22,330 --> 00:13:26,219 Speaker 2: actually was a referee for me. Ultimately, I did have 250 00:13:26,229 --> 00:13:28,799 Speaker 2: to put down my volunteer work. And that was really 251 00:13:28,809 --> 00:13:31,940 Speaker 2: hard because it's like, well, can't you just give me 252 00:13:31,950 --> 00:13:35,340 Speaker 2: a chance? And they're like, oh, but you're so old, 253 00:13:35,349 --> 00:13:38,229 Speaker 2: what have you been doing? It's like, yeah, I know. 254 00:13:38,429 --> 00:13:43,719 Speaker 2: But I've been raising humans. Like, that's a big deal, right? 255 00:13:43,729 --> 00:13:44,359 Speaker 2: Like 256 00:13:44,729 --> 00:13:49,089 Speaker 2: raising a human is a very important job. 257 00:13:49,190 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 1: I'd love to explore the idea that there is power 258 00:13:52,890 --> 00:13:55,070 Speaker 1: in being invisible sometimes. 259 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:58,340 Speaker 2: Yeah, 100%. I think that when you 260 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:03,609 Speaker 2: are invisible and when people don't expect anything of you, 261 00:14:03,619 --> 00:14:07,689 Speaker 2: people underestimate you and then all of a sudden you'll 262 00:14:07,700 --> 00:14:10,939 Speaker 2: do something amazing at work. Or you might do something 263 00:14:11,299 --> 00:14:16,690 Speaker 2: with your friends or whatever and everybody has really underestimated 264 00:14:16,700 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 2: you along the way. So when you're watching, you get to, 265 00:14:20,869 --> 00:14:23,010 Speaker 2: I don't know, you get to take a lot more in, 266 00:14:23,020 --> 00:14:25,469 Speaker 2: you get to listen, you get to 267 00:14:26,059 --> 00:14:29,710 Speaker 2: get all of the input, you get to take all 268 00:14:29,719 --> 00:14:34,169 Speaker 2: of that information on board because no-one's expecting anything from 269 00:14:34,179 --> 00:14:37,150 Speaker 2: you and they tell you a lot of things as well. 270 00:14:37,159 --> 00:14:40,510 Speaker 2: That's what I find. I find that so many people 271 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:42,940 Speaker 2: will come to me and tell me all sorts of 272 00:14:42,950 --> 00:14:46,500 Speaker 2: information that probably they shouldn't share with me. Then I 273 00:14:46,510 --> 00:14:50,299 Speaker 2: use my powers for good. My little invisibility powers for 274 00:14:50,309 --> 00:14:53,359 Speaker 2: good and go oh toddle off and do this or 275 00:14:53,369 --> 00:14:54,309 Speaker 2: do that. And, 276 00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:58,210 Speaker 2: and you can sometimes have real influence and you know, 277 00:14:58,219 --> 00:15:03,429 Speaker 2: you can shape conversations when people don't even really realize 278 00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:04,929 Speaker 2: that that's where it came from. 279 00:15:10,119 --> 00:15:12,510 Speaker 1: So Sandra is about to join us. Now, she lives 280 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:15,239 Speaker 1: in regional New South Wales and was 56 when she 281 00:15:15,250 --> 00:15:19,640 Speaker 1: was made redundant. After a company restructure. Six months later, 282 00:15:19,760 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 1: she went for her first interview and sadly, this was 283 00:15:23,530 --> 00:15:27,109 Speaker 1: the first time she's actually felt invisible. Yes or worthless. 284 00:15:29,609 --> 00:15:32,489 Speaker 1: Yeah. Or pass your expiry date. So when have you 285 00:15:32,500 --> 00:15:36,289 Speaker 1: felt like that? I had an interview at an accountancy 286 00:15:36,299 --> 00:15:40,059 Speaker 1: firm four years ago. Not quite. And during the interview, 287 00:15:40,070 --> 00:15:42,869 Speaker 1: they were sort of leading sort of asking questions, you know, 288 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:44,700 Speaker 1: about how long do you think you'll stay in? 289 00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:47,780 Speaker 1: I thought, hm, shouldn't really ask these sort of questions. 290 00:15:47,789 --> 00:15:49,719 Speaker 1: But anyhow, I sort of answered. I said, oh, well, 291 00:15:49,729 --> 00:15:51,539 Speaker 1: you know, I usually give a good five years or, 292 00:15:51,549 --> 00:15:54,650 Speaker 1: or something and maybe even longer. And then when the 293 00:15:54,659 --> 00:15:57,989 Speaker 1: person rang to say that I didn't get the job, 294 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:01,119 Speaker 1: they said they wanted someone younger because I was the 295 00:16:01,130 --> 00:16:02,919 Speaker 1: same age as the person I was going to be 296 00:16:02,929 --> 00:16:06,369 Speaker 1: eventually replacing and would be retiring at the same age 297 00:16:06,460 --> 00:16:07,549 Speaker 1: at the same time. 298 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:10,359 Speaker 1: And I thought, well, when this person knew me, I 299 00:16:10,369 --> 00:16:13,090 Speaker 1: considered him a family friend to one of the other 300 00:16:13,099 --> 00:16:15,770 Speaker 1: girls on the interview panel, went to school with me. 301 00:16:15,780 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 1: So she would have known how old I was. Why 302 00:16:17,890 --> 00:16:20,789 Speaker 1: did you waste my time interviewing me and then telling 303 00:16:20,799 --> 00:16:25,330 Speaker 1: me I was too old Sandra. How old were you 304 00:16:25,340 --> 00:16:29,880 Speaker 1: at the time? Not quite 56. Oh, you were a baby. 305 00:16:29,950 --> 00:16:36,690 Speaker 1: The thing is right. Ok. Let's ask you, what were 306 00:16:36,700 --> 00:16:37,750 Speaker 1: you angry about? 307 00:16:38,010 --> 00:16:40,739 Speaker 1: Sort of been written off that someone might think that 308 00:16:40,750 --> 00:16:43,169 Speaker 1: I didn't know when I was going to retire. So 309 00:16:43,179 --> 00:16:45,179 Speaker 1: they sort of made up presumption that I was going 310 00:16:45,190 --> 00:16:47,609 Speaker 1: to retire at the same time. This other person was. 311 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:50,549 Speaker 1: And I thought, well, who's to say I'm not gonna 312 00:16:50,559 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 1: work until I'm 66. So I'm older. I wouldn't even 313 00:16:54,789 --> 00:17:01,619 Speaker 1: call you middle aged care change in you at that age. Funny, 314 00:17:01,630 --> 00:17:02,760 Speaker 1: you should say that I've had one 315 00:17:04,140 --> 00:17:08,109 Speaker 1: excellent. The thing that I was angry about was that 316 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:10,849 Speaker 1: when you ask people, you know, how long you've been 317 00:17:10,859 --> 00:17:12,839 Speaker 1: in your job for or whatever? Like, and I've been 318 00:17:12,849 --> 00:17:14,719 Speaker 1: at channel 10 for 23 years. It's, it's a really 319 00:17:14,729 --> 00:17:17,619 Speaker 1: long time. I started to get embarrassed because I was 320 00:17:17,630 --> 00:17:19,160 Speaker 1: in the same job for such a long time because 321 00:17:19,170 --> 00:17:20,010 Speaker 1: everybody 322 00:17:20,260 --> 00:17:23,500 Speaker 1: moves on after a, just a number of years and 323 00:17:23,510 --> 00:17:27,040 Speaker 1: younger people have career changes after like, five years. So 324 00:17:27,050 --> 00:17:29,989 Speaker 1: for them to, like, I'm offended on your behalf that 325 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:32,300 Speaker 1: they would expect that you wouldn't be in the job 326 00:17:32,310 --> 00:17:35,180 Speaker 1: for very long because you go off and retire. Yeah, 327 00:17:35,189 --> 00:17:38,180 Speaker 1: I mean, I thought, well, no one knows exactly when 328 00:17:38,189 --> 00:17:40,859 Speaker 1: they're going to, like, depends on your health and circumstance too, 329 00:17:40,869 --> 00:17:44,060 Speaker 1: but I certainly had no plans of retiring before 60 330 00:17:44,069 --> 00:17:46,329 Speaker 1: and I'm 60 now and I don't have any 331 00:17:46,430 --> 00:17:50,199 Speaker 1: plans to retire before 63 still. So I could have 332 00:17:50,209 --> 00:17:53,839 Speaker 1: done easily five years, eight years, probably. But anyway, they 333 00:17:53,849 --> 00:17:56,688 Speaker 1: decided that because they were wanting someone to replace this 334 00:17:56,699 --> 00:17:59,469 Speaker 1: person who was the same age. Well, don't damn will 335 00:17:59,479 --> 00:18:02,050 Speaker 1: interview me then. You know how old I am? I 336 00:18:02,060 --> 00:18:04,439 Speaker 1: feel like we're gonna have a Julia Roberts moment towards 337 00:18:04,449 --> 00:18:07,469 Speaker 1: the end of this conversation with the, you going back 338 00:18:07,479 --> 00:18:11,260 Speaker 1: in the shop with your bags going big mistake feeling 339 00:18:11,270 --> 00:18:12,160 Speaker 1: that coming. 340 00:18:12,829 --> 00:18:15,229 Speaker 1: Did this knock your confidence? So when you had to 341 00:18:15,239 --> 00:18:17,459 Speaker 1: apply for a job after that? Did it knock your 342 00:18:17,469 --> 00:18:21,119 Speaker 1: confidence or did you think, hey, screw you. Well, I 343 00:18:21,130 --> 00:18:23,449 Speaker 1: thought most people you're going to have an interview with 344 00:18:23,459 --> 00:18:25,250 Speaker 1: won't have a clue how old you are anyway. Unless 345 00:18:25,260 --> 00:18:27,688 Speaker 1: you advertise it. It's just that it was some people 346 00:18:27,699 --> 00:18:30,219 Speaker 1: I happen to know in this case, I got some 347 00:18:30,229 --> 00:18:32,530 Speaker 1: temp work at the local hospital and then I was 348 00:18:32,540 --> 00:18:35,839 Speaker 1: there for three years. And did you feel visible? 349 00:18:35,935 --> 00:18:39,584 Speaker 1: Those jobs? Yes. Yes, I felt no problem at all. 350 00:18:39,665 --> 00:18:42,775 Speaker 1: I like that. Now, you've just turned 60 and five 351 00:18:42,785 --> 00:18:46,063 Speaker 1: months ago you started a new career in an industry 352 00:18:46,074 --> 00:18:48,425 Speaker 1: you've always wanted to work in. This is your Julia 353 00:18:48,435 --> 00:18:54,734 Speaker 1: Roberts moment. Sandra. How does it feel? Amazing? Amazing. Yes. Travel. Oh, 354 00:18:54,744 --> 00:18:58,584 Speaker 1: so good company who does tours in the Outback? And 355 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:01,659 Speaker 1: I do their rooming list. So for all the tours 356 00:19:01,670 --> 00:19:04,229 Speaker 1: that they do, if you want a bed, your name 357 00:19:04,239 --> 00:19:07,609 Speaker 1: needs to be on that rooming list. So, um, very busy, 358 00:19:07,619 --> 00:19:15,770 Speaker 1: very busy and no retirement in sight. Absolutely not. So, Sandra, 359 00:19:16,010 --> 00:19:18,819 Speaker 1: I really hope this hasn't happened to other people. But 360 00:19:18,829 --> 00:19:21,448 Speaker 1: what is your advice to others who do experience this 361 00:19:21,459 --> 00:19:24,369 Speaker 1: sort of a thing? I'd just say keep trying, essentially, 362 00:19:24,380 --> 00:19:28,050 Speaker 1: keep trying. Not everybody thinks like that. Obviously just 363 00:19:28,135 --> 00:19:30,984 Speaker 1: keep hanging in there. I always think up comeback lines 364 00:19:30,994 --> 00:19:33,665 Speaker 1: way after the fact. Is there anything that you would 365 00:19:33,675 --> 00:19:35,395 Speaker 1: like to say to them if you were in the 366 00:19:35,405 --> 00:19:38,165 Speaker 1: room with them again. Now that you've had some time 367 00:19:38,175 --> 00:19:42,385 Speaker 1: to think about, we're gonna have to beat this. I'd say, well, 368 00:19:42,395 --> 00:19:44,764 Speaker 1: I went to school with you. Why did you interview 369 00:19:44,775 --> 00:19:49,925 Speaker 1: me and we've been family friends for 30 years. Why 370 00:19:49,935 --> 00:19:51,935 Speaker 1: did you interview me when you thought I was too old? 371 00:19:53,069 --> 00:19:56,109 Speaker 1: I'd put it back on them. That's fabulous. And also 372 00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:58,430 Speaker 1: look at how it's ended. I'm a big believer in 373 00:19:58,439 --> 00:20:00,790 Speaker 1: the universe. Like you've ended up doing something that you've 374 00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:03,899 Speaker 1: always wanted to do. Love that, love that. I hope 375 00:20:03,910 --> 00:20:06,199 Speaker 1: one day you can turn the tables on them, Sandra 376 00:20:06,209 --> 00:20:08,218 Speaker 1: and give them some of their own medicine. 377 00:20:09,474 --> 00:20:12,145 Speaker 1: I mean, we like to take revenge, but I feel 378 00:20:12,175 --> 00:20:14,604 Speaker 1: like we don't mind a little bit of revenge doing. 379 00:20:15,685 --> 00:20:18,555 Speaker 1: I hope sometimes they might have some trouble or some 380 00:20:18,564 --> 00:20:21,344 Speaker 1: loved ones who might want some trouble. But they'll be like, oh, yeah. No, 381 00:20:21,354 --> 00:20:26,555 Speaker 1: I'm sorry. There's nothing for you. Computers, Sandra. Thank you 382 00:20:26,564 --> 00:20:28,524 Speaker 1: so much for taking the time to share your story 383 00:20:28,535 --> 00:20:31,344 Speaker 1: with us. No, no worries. Thanks for having me. 384 00:20:32,130 --> 00:20:35,969 Speaker 1: How much do we love Sandra? She was fantastic. She 385 00:20:35,979 --> 00:20:38,770 Speaker 1: was fantastic. I loved her. But also just to have 386 00:20:38,780 --> 00:20:41,619 Speaker 1: such a positive outlook on life and think, you know, well, 387 00:20:41,630 --> 00:20:45,199 Speaker 1: you didn't deserve me and I won in the end. Yeah. Well, 388 00:20:45,209 --> 00:20:47,520 Speaker 1: she's having a great time now. She's into a career 389 00:20:47,530 --> 00:20:50,060 Speaker 1: that she never thought she'd have that she wants brilliant. 390 00:20:50,069 --> 00:20:53,349 Speaker 1: And that office can remain miserable. But, yeah, living her 391 00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:55,629 Speaker 1: best life. Exactly. Here's to more Sandra. 392 00:21:08,530 --> 00:21:11,869 Speaker 1: Do you ever feel invisible? Well, new research from Priceline 393 00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:15,649 Speaker 1: has found over two in five Australian women aged over 394 00:21:15,660 --> 00:21:18,339 Speaker 1: 40 do cat. That's two in five. Wow, that's a 395 00:21:18,349 --> 00:21:21,979 Speaker 1: high sta Priceline wants to make sure all Australian women 396 00:21:21,989 --> 00:21:26,109 Speaker 1: feel seen, heard and understood across every one of their 397 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:29,900 Speaker 1: stores and in, in their communities. That's why Priceline Pharmacy 398 00:21:29,910 --> 00:21:33,140 Speaker 1: has approachable pharmacists and beauty advisors who 399 00:21:33,209 --> 00:21:36,060 Speaker 1: you can provide tailored advice to suit all your beauty 400 00:21:36,069 --> 00:21:39,629 Speaker 1: health or wellness needs at any age. Priceline has a 401 00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:43,359 Speaker 1: wide selection of amazing products at great prices. So you 402 00:21:43,369 --> 00:21:46,050 Speaker 1: can treat yourself without breaking the bank for all your 403 00:21:46,060 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 1: beauty health and wellness needs. Visit Priceline Pharmacy in store 404 00:21:49,770 --> 00:21:53,170 Speaker 1: or online at Priceline dot com dot A U, visit 405 00:21:53,180 --> 00:21:56,369 Speaker 1: Priceline Pharmacy and chat to a beauty advisor or Price 406 00:21:56,380 --> 00:21:57,780 Speaker 1: time pharmacist today. 407 00:22:02,089 --> 00:22:05,849 Speaker 1: Now we're joined by Rose from Melbourne. She's 43. She's 408 00:22:05,859 --> 00:22:11,179 Speaker 1: single and doesn't have Children and that's why she feels invisible. Rose. 409 00:22:11,189 --> 00:22:15,479 Speaker 1: Have you ever felt invisible? Oh, probably like the last 410 00:22:15,489 --> 00:22:19,319 Speaker 1: 10 years for me because I'm single, no kids. So 411 00:22:19,369 --> 00:22:22,839 Speaker 1: I kind of don't fit in with my friends and 412 00:22:22,849 --> 00:22:23,179 Speaker 1: then 413 00:22:23,449 --> 00:22:25,930 Speaker 1: with people at work. So yeah, what do you mean? 414 00:22:25,939 --> 00:22:30,180 Speaker 1: Usually you hear parents say it's the other way around 415 00:22:30,189 --> 00:22:32,089 Speaker 1: that as soon as they have kids, they stop being 416 00:22:32,099 --> 00:22:35,750 Speaker 1: invited to things by their single friends or you know, 417 00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:38,579 Speaker 1: they kind of overlooked for things because they have kids. 418 00:22:38,589 --> 00:22:42,290 Speaker 1: You're finding it the opposite when they coupled up. It 419 00:22:42,300 --> 00:22:44,089 Speaker 1: wasn't too bad. It was just sort of, I guess 420 00:22:44,099 --> 00:22:44,698 Speaker 1: more 421 00:22:45,079 --> 00:22:49,310 Speaker 1: once the last friend sort of got married and then, yeah, 422 00:22:49,319 --> 00:22:52,540 Speaker 1: it felt outside that because they would all catch up 423 00:22:52,550 --> 00:22:54,540 Speaker 1: without me. And then I find out later and then 424 00:22:54,550 --> 00:22:58,010 Speaker 1: once I started having kids, so I just found out 425 00:22:58,500 --> 00:23:01,780 Speaker 1: that they were pregnant a lot after the fact of 426 00:23:01,790 --> 00:23:05,510 Speaker 1: everyone else. So. Yeah. Wow. That must have been hurtful. 427 00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:08,050 Speaker 1: It's kind of like lining up for a royal show 428 00:23:08,060 --> 00:23:10,780 Speaker 1: ride and you have to go two by two because 429 00:23:10,790 --> 00:23:15,250 Speaker 1: you are on your own. You can't ride. No, you can't. 430 00:23:15,324 --> 00:23:18,573 Speaker 1: Oh, that's rough. Ah, I mean, I've, I've experienced that 431 00:23:18,584 --> 00:23:21,024 Speaker 1: certainly as a single person, you know, that friends have 432 00:23:21,035 --> 00:23:23,464 Speaker 1: had dinner parties and get togethers instead of being the 433 00:23:23,474 --> 00:23:27,175 Speaker 1: fifth or seventh chair. I've just seen on Instagram. So Rose. I, 434 00:23:27,185 --> 00:23:30,294 Speaker 1: I certainly know how that feels. Are you left wondering 435 00:23:30,305 --> 00:23:32,055 Speaker 1: why is this happening to me? 436 00:23:32,839 --> 00:23:34,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, because I don't really like to bring it up 437 00:23:34,650 --> 00:23:37,319 Speaker 1: because then I think, oh, maybe it's just, I'm reading 438 00:23:37,329 --> 00:23:40,369 Speaker 1: too much into it or, like, I remember talking to 439 00:23:40,380 --> 00:23:42,780 Speaker 1: someone about it and they're like, well, they probably just 440 00:23:42,790 --> 00:23:45,729 Speaker 1: feel awkward having me there as a single person. I 441 00:23:45,739 --> 00:23:46,770 Speaker 1: was like, ok. 442 00:23:47,219 --> 00:23:52,089 Speaker 1: Wow, that's an interesting way of looking at it. So Rose, 443 00:23:52,099 --> 00:23:56,669 Speaker 1: you're feeling invisible from people. You know, but what about people? 444 00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:58,619 Speaker 1: You don't know, what's it like when you walk into 445 00:23:58,630 --> 00:24:01,260 Speaker 1: a room or you, you know, you're ordering something at 446 00:24:01,270 --> 00:24:03,780 Speaker 1: a restaurant or, you know, you, you're at a public place, 447 00:24:03,790 --> 00:24:04,909 Speaker 1: do you feel invisible then? 448 00:24:05,270 --> 00:24:10,438 Speaker 1: No, not then. But if you're gone to something specific or, 449 00:24:10,449 --> 00:24:13,020 Speaker 1: and then you get asked around, you know, do you 450 00:24:13,030 --> 00:24:15,688 Speaker 1: have kids like that? Whole conversation starts right. And then 451 00:24:15,699 --> 00:24:18,270 Speaker 1: you go, no. And then I've had people at some 452 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,229 Speaker 1: places just sort of turn around and then go and 453 00:24:20,239 --> 00:24:21,500 Speaker 1: talk to someone else. You need 454 00:24:21,964 --> 00:24:25,514 Speaker 1: my friends, nobody likes their Children. I know everyone will 455 00:24:25,525 --> 00:24:28,714 Speaker 1: be really happy to hang out with your rose. And 456 00:24:28,724 --> 00:24:31,655 Speaker 1: then yeah, so it can be a little awkward, I guess. 457 00:24:31,665 --> 00:24:34,405 Speaker 1: And then there's, you know, a lot of, I guess 458 00:24:34,415 --> 00:24:36,885 Speaker 1: in especially social media, you just see a lot of 459 00:24:36,895 --> 00:24:38,694 Speaker 1: things around moms and 460 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,359 Speaker 1: how important their role is and that type of thing 461 00:24:42,369 --> 00:24:44,738 Speaker 1: and then you just feel like things that you do 462 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:47,739 Speaker 1: aren't so important. And I mean, and you hear any politicians, 463 00:24:47,750 --> 00:24:51,228 Speaker 1: for example, like every budget speech, working families, working families, 464 00:24:51,239 --> 00:24:54,239 Speaker 1: working families. So I'm sitting here going please have inclusive 465 00:24:54,250 --> 00:24:58,238 Speaker 1: language around. It's not just working families, single people that 466 00:24:58,250 --> 00:25:01,449 Speaker 1: are being hurt or couples. So, you know, there's 467 00:25:01,859 --> 00:25:06,369 Speaker 1: impacting the economy that aren't just for a particular section 468 00:25:06,380 --> 00:25:09,099 Speaker 1: of our society. That is so true. That's a really 469 00:25:09,109 --> 00:25:11,688 Speaker 1: good point. But you sound like someone who's really positive 470 00:25:11,699 --> 00:25:13,790 Speaker 1: and that you're not just sort of sat in there. So, 471 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:15,739 Speaker 1: what are the other ways that you've maybe taken your 472 00:25:15,750 --> 00:25:16,790 Speaker 1: power back? 473 00:25:17,094 --> 00:25:20,545 Speaker 1: So, I got a couple of friends who, um, have 474 00:25:20,555 --> 00:25:23,864 Speaker 1: either got older kids or, you know, there's a couple 475 00:25:23,875 --> 00:25:26,104 Speaker 1: who don't have any, you know, they chose not to 476 00:25:26,114 --> 00:25:28,875 Speaker 1: kind of just then look at things and I think, well, 477 00:25:28,885 --> 00:25:31,594 Speaker 1: some people, they're just coming from their own perspective, right? 478 00:25:31,604 --> 00:25:32,185 Speaker 1: Like 479 00:25:32,489 --> 00:25:35,250 Speaker 1: they're in that particular mode of, you know, being a 480 00:25:35,260 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 1: mother and they look at that and go, well, this 481 00:25:37,569 --> 00:25:40,089 Speaker 1: is the most important thing that they're probably doing and 482 00:25:40,099 --> 00:25:42,429 Speaker 1: it's probably the language that people use. What would you 483 00:25:42,439 --> 00:25:45,859 Speaker 1: say to someone who's listening, who might now want to 484 00:25:45,869 --> 00:25:48,669 Speaker 1: sort of change the way they speak to some of 485 00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:51,010 Speaker 1: their friends who are in a similar situation to you, 486 00:25:51,290 --> 00:25:54,609 Speaker 1: I think just be a bit more inclusive 487 00:25:55,079 --> 00:25:57,650 Speaker 1: in it and not assume that because they don't have 488 00:25:57,660 --> 00:26:02,020 Speaker 1: kids that they're off having this massive, wonderful, beautiful life 489 00:26:02,060 --> 00:26:04,339 Speaker 1: because at the end of the day, we still have 490 00:26:04,349 --> 00:26:06,879 Speaker 1: to work, we have our mortgages. Like I haven't had 491 00:26:06,890 --> 00:26:10,520 Speaker 1: a holiday in years, but even pre COVID, right? And 492 00:26:10,530 --> 00:26:11,530 Speaker 1: that's just because you have 493 00:26:11,709 --> 00:26:14,939 Speaker 1: commitments and you've got work commitments. So, so like, you know, 494 00:26:14,949 --> 00:26:18,020 Speaker 1: you're going out every single night in a bar, living 495 00:26:18,030 --> 00:26:20,770 Speaker 1: it up. So just being inclusive with your friends and 496 00:26:20,780 --> 00:26:24,229 Speaker 1: reach out to them. So when I was in my 497 00:26:24,239 --> 00:26:27,339 Speaker 1: early twenties. So I nearly died. Like I had an 498 00:26:27,489 --> 00:26:28,420 Speaker 1: antic reaction 499 00:26:29,010 --> 00:26:31,180 Speaker 1: and I made it to hospital just in time and 500 00:26:31,189 --> 00:26:33,629 Speaker 1: I was really good. Like about the, the dying part, 501 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,790 Speaker 1: I reconciled that in the moment, which was fine. And 502 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:41,140 Speaker 1: then it's just recently that I thought what's really my 503 00:26:41,150 --> 00:26:45,420 Speaker 1: purpose because if I died in that moment, it's not 504 00:26:45,430 --> 00:26:47,979 Speaker 1: like there are Children who would never have been born. 505 00:26:48,810 --> 00:26:51,260 Speaker 1: So there's not like a, you know, like that sliding 506 00:26:51,270 --> 00:26:54,050 Speaker 1: doors moment. And I just thought, oh, well, because that 507 00:26:54,060 --> 00:26:57,250 Speaker 1: whole motherhood part that people talk about and how it's 508 00:26:57,260 --> 00:27:01,179 Speaker 1: so important. And I thought, oh, is that meaning that 509 00:27:01,189 --> 00:27:05,439 Speaker 1: my life is not worth anything? So sorry, I'm just 510 00:27:05,449 --> 00:27:07,739 Speaker 1: a bit. It makes me a little bit sad 511 00:27:08,540 --> 00:27:11,189 Speaker 1: when I think about it. It can be difficult when 512 00:27:12,319 --> 00:27:14,329 Speaker 1: everyone just talks about this 513 00:27:15,380 --> 00:27:18,020 Speaker 1: life that they have and how awesome it is and 514 00:27:18,030 --> 00:27:19,629 Speaker 1: these Children that they have 515 00:27:20,239 --> 00:27:24,349 Speaker 1: and then when you don't have that, that's powerful stuff rose. 516 00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:27,239 Speaker 1: You know, and I think mothers don't always talk about 517 00:27:27,250 --> 00:27:29,209 Speaker 1: how it isn't all the things that we're told it 518 00:27:29,219 --> 00:27:32,579 Speaker 1: will be. And sometimes it's difficult to disassociate yourself from 519 00:27:32,589 --> 00:27:35,639 Speaker 1: this role when you're also, you know, a person in 520 00:27:35,650 --> 00:27:37,050 Speaker 1: your own. Right? I suppose. 521 00:27:37,410 --> 00:27:40,659 Speaker 1: So. I think there is a lot of Hallmark moments 522 00:27:40,670 --> 00:27:44,849 Speaker 1: around things like motherhood when the reality, either way, whether 523 00:27:44,859 --> 00:27:48,439 Speaker 1: you are or not is, is very layered, isn't it? Yeah. 524 00:27:48,449 --> 00:27:51,319 Speaker 1: All the emotions that you're feeling are so valid. We 525 00:27:51,329 --> 00:27:54,689 Speaker 1: really appreciate you being so open. Yeah. And being vulnerable 526 00:27:54,699 --> 00:27:57,819 Speaker 1: because this stuff's not easy to talk about. No, that's ok. 527 00:27:58,650 --> 00:28:01,040 Speaker 1: I think what was most interesting about Rose is that 528 00:28:01,050 --> 00:28:04,699 Speaker 1: she felt invisible amongst people that she knows that she's 529 00:28:04,709 --> 00:28:06,579 Speaker 1: known for a long time and as soon as he 530 00:28:06,589 --> 00:28:09,780 Speaker 1: turns a certain age and they grow apart by the sounds. 531 00:28:09,790 --> 00:28:10,959 Speaker 1: But just because of life, 532 00:28:16,619 --> 00:28:19,849 Speaker 1: we're joined by Carly Lyon. She's a personal brand coach 533 00:28:19,859 --> 00:28:23,198 Speaker 1: and runs the brand in you Carlie. You work with 534 00:28:23,209 --> 00:28:26,609 Speaker 1: women in their forties and beyond every day. So what 535 00:28:26,619 --> 00:28:28,949 Speaker 1: would you say are some of the most common concerns 536 00:28:28,959 --> 00:28:31,790 Speaker 1: people are facing in this era of their lives. 537 00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:35,530 Speaker 1: So I'm going to answer that with a story. So 538 00:28:35,579 --> 00:28:38,900 Speaker 1: a client of mine that I was working with had 539 00:28:38,910 --> 00:28:41,790 Speaker 1: just gone through a bit of a career change and 540 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 1: she was wanting to work on her personal brand. And 541 00:28:43,890 --> 00:28:45,420 Speaker 1: we were talking about all the different ways that she 542 00:28:45,430 --> 00:28:49,050 Speaker 1: might put herself out there. And she said to me, well, 543 00:28:49,060 --> 00:28:53,229 Speaker 1: I'm almost turning 50 and the reality is nobody wants 544 00:28:53,239 --> 00:28:55,989 Speaker 1: to look at or listen to an old lady. 545 00:28:56,910 --> 00:29:01,229 Speaker 1: And that to me showed where her mindset was at. 546 00:29:01,239 --> 00:29:05,579 Speaker 1: And that is really the perfect example of what a 547 00:29:05,589 --> 00:29:09,260 Speaker 1: lot of these women, you know, 40 plus the biggest 548 00:29:09,270 --> 00:29:13,189 Speaker 1: struggle when it comes to them being visible and being 549 00:29:13,199 --> 00:29:16,140 Speaker 1: seen that is really where it starts, Carlie. Is it 550 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:20,439 Speaker 1: her that can't look at herself or is that her 551 00:29:20,449 --> 00:29:22,119 Speaker 1: perception of other people not being able to look at? 552 00:29:22,130 --> 00:29:24,869 Speaker 1: What is it 100%? So it, to me, what that 553 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:28,420 Speaker 1: showed me was she had this fundamental belief that now 554 00:29:28,430 --> 00:29:31,209 Speaker 1: that she was over a certain age that she didn't 555 00:29:31,219 --> 00:29:32,410 Speaker 1: look good enough or 556 00:29:32,900 --> 00:29:34,890 Speaker 1: that she didn't have anything good enough or nobody would 557 00:29:34,900 --> 00:29:37,569 Speaker 1: want to hear her speak because she was of a 558 00:29:37,579 --> 00:29:41,709 Speaker 1: certain age. So that was 100% her own thoughts and feelings. 559 00:29:41,719 --> 00:29:43,989 Speaker 1: And the thing is there is a thing in psychology 560 00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:48,410 Speaker 1: called confirmation bias. We like to prove ourselves, right? 561 00:29:48,709 --> 00:29:50,410 Speaker 1: So at the end of the day, if you have 562 00:29:50,420 --> 00:29:54,920 Speaker 1: a fundamental belief that oh, now that I'm over 40 563 00:29:54,930 --> 00:29:58,109 Speaker 1: 50 60 I'm too old to be seen and heard, 564 00:29:58,140 --> 00:30:01,719 Speaker 1: then you are going to be looking for and experiencing 565 00:30:01,729 --> 00:30:04,699 Speaker 1: things that confirm that it's not to say that there 566 00:30:04,709 --> 00:30:07,739 Speaker 1: aren't external forces. So 100% 567 00:30:08,310 --> 00:30:12,380 Speaker 1: ageism may exist, there are certain stereotypes that exist, you know, 568 00:30:12,390 --> 00:30:17,069 Speaker 1: media is infatuated with youth and things like this. Like 569 00:30:17,079 --> 00:30:21,479 Speaker 1: this podcast, this helps to counteract those external forces. But 570 00:30:21,489 --> 00:30:23,489 Speaker 1: a lot of the work that I do and really 571 00:30:23,500 --> 00:30:26,520 Speaker 1: focus on, which I think is ultimately more empowering for 572 00:30:26,530 --> 00:30:30,219 Speaker 1: the individual is the internal focus. Well, how do you 573 00:30:30,229 --> 00:30:32,890 Speaker 1: coach women into feeling visible again? 574 00:30:33,910 --> 00:30:38,599 Speaker 1: So I have four kind of top tips. So firstly, 575 00:30:38,609 --> 00:30:41,199 Speaker 1: I think it's about acting your spirit, not your age. 576 00:30:41,209 --> 00:30:43,770 Speaker 1: So I have a perfect example of this. A friend 577 00:30:43,780 --> 00:30:46,760 Speaker 1: of mine had a grandmother who's now sadly passed away. 578 00:30:46,770 --> 00:30:51,140 Speaker 1: We affectionately called her Nana Anna. Right up until her nineties. 579 00:30:51,375 --> 00:30:55,305 Speaker 1: She dressed impeccably. She'd walk into a room, she'd command attention. 580 00:30:55,314 --> 00:30:58,385 Speaker 1: She had just this beautiful air of grace and elegance 581 00:30:58,395 --> 00:31:01,905 Speaker 1: about her. And it really did start with her own 582 00:31:01,915 --> 00:31:05,155 Speaker 1: opinion of herself. Her, her, it was her energy that 583 00:31:05,165 --> 00:31:09,925 Speaker 1: was attractive, not just the physicality. So act your spirit, 584 00:31:09,935 --> 00:31:11,685 Speaker 1: not your age, lean into that 585 00:31:12,290 --> 00:31:15,859 Speaker 1: forge a standout style. I have a client who's in 586 00:31:15,869 --> 00:31:19,619 Speaker 1: her sixties. She's the CEO of a very large company. 587 00:31:19,630 --> 00:31:21,979 Speaker 1: She has pink hair and she wears the most amazing 588 00:31:21,989 --> 00:31:26,119 Speaker 1: pra glasses. She walks into the room, she just owns 589 00:31:26,130 --> 00:31:30,699 Speaker 1: it and she's dressed in a way that helps her 590 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:34,219 Speaker 1: really be seen. So I think forging a style like 591 00:31:34,229 --> 00:31:35,680 Speaker 1: the beautiful jacket you've got today. 592 00:31:35,770 --> 00:31:41,949 Speaker 1: There's no way you could be invisible today. That is fine. 593 00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:50,859 Speaker 1: It's amazing. So, you know, leaning into that, really using 594 00:31:50,869 --> 00:31:54,290 Speaker 1: your clothing to show up and to be seen and 595 00:31:54,300 --> 00:31:56,569 Speaker 1: perhaps that starts to change as you go through the 596 00:31:56,579 --> 00:31:59,140 Speaker 1: different decades and as you get older, 597 00:31:59,819 --> 00:32:03,890 Speaker 1: I always say to my clients invest in a profile image, 598 00:32:03,900 --> 00:32:07,359 Speaker 1: a digital profile image. And here is why it's really 599 00:32:07,369 --> 00:32:09,140 Speaker 1: important in the world that we live in that you 600 00:32:09,150 --> 00:32:12,719 Speaker 1: have a digital presence. So anyone who's 40 plus we 601 00:32:12,729 --> 00:32:15,880 Speaker 1: didn't grow up with social media. So there's probably still 602 00:32:15,890 --> 00:32:17,920 Speaker 1: a mindset of, oh, maybe I'll do a bit of 603 00:32:17,930 --> 00:32:20,810 Speaker 1: social media. That's not how the world is anymore. There's 604 00:32:20,819 --> 00:32:23,569 Speaker 1: the physical world, there's the digital world, 605 00:32:23,655 --> 00:32:25,425 Speaker 1: but both of the real world and you need to 606 00:32:25,435 --> 00:32:28,305 Speaker 1: be visible in both. The linkedin world is really like, 607 00:32:30,635 --> 00:32:41,385 Speaker 1: it is actually sorted me out in the linkedin sketch. 608 00:32:42,035 --> 00:32:44,145 Speaker 1: You got to be there. And I think when you 609 00:32:44,155 --> 00:32:46,234 Speaker 1: invest not, I think I know when you invest in 610 00:32:46,244 --> 00:32:49,385 Speaker 1: a great portrait chart and research shows that this is 611 00:32:49,395 --> 00:32:50,484 Speaker 1: really important. 612 00:32:51,060 --> 00:32:54,589 Speaker 1: It will make you feel more confident in that online space. 613 00:32:54,599 --> 00:32:57,729 Speaker 1: And if you think about it, that profile shop, perhaps 614 00:32:57,739 --> 00:33:04,150 Speaker 1: you'll use it no more than five years. You don't 615 00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:06,229 Speaker 1: want anything. You can't have a profile 616 00:33:06,564 --> 00:33:10,185 Speaker 1: that's 10 years old MC events and they still use 617 00:33:10,194 --> 00:33:14,685 Speaker 1: ones that are like over 10 years old. Ok? You 618 00:33:14,824 --> 00:33:21,145 Speaker 1: need to take 456 club vote. Lovely. Just cut me out. 619 00:33:22,390 --> 00:33:24,750 Speaker 1: I've got, I've got a serious attitude in that photo too. 620 00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:25,479 Speaker 1: Cut me out. 621 00:33:27,119 --> 00:33:29,939 Speaker 1: I love it. I love it, but it's a worthwhile investment. 622 00:33:29,949 --> 00:33:32,030 Speaker 1: And if you run the numbers, you know, it's a 623 00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:36,180 Speaker 1: worthwhile investment. That's all I'll say. And then lastly create 624 00:33:36,300 --> 00:33:40,400 Speaker 1: a multi age network. So do not only spend time 625 00:33:40,410 --> 00:33:43,099 Speaker 1: with people of your own age 626 00:33:43,410 --> 00:33:45,959 Speaker 1: when I was younger, I loved hanging out with people 627 00:33:45,969 --> 00:33:48,300 Speaker 1: who are older because I loved the wisdom that they 628 00:33:48,310 --> 00:33:51,449 Speaker 1: would give, as you get older, it's important to hang 629 00:33:51,459 --> 00:33:54,109 Speaker 1: out with people that are younger because it keeps you 630 00:33:54,119 --> 00:33:57,770 Speaker 1: tapped into not only youth culture, but they will bring 631 00:33:57,780 --> 00:34:00,260 Speaker 1: out a different side of yourself. If you're always spending 632 00:34:00,270 --> 00:34:00,640 Speaker 1: time with them, 633 00:34:00,729 --> 00:34:04,819 Speaker 1: women or men in the same age bracket, as much 634 00:34:04,829 --> 00:34:07,750 Speaker 1: as you've got that sense of, uh, we know what 635 00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:11,330 Speaker 1: we're all going through. I think it's important to have 636 00:34:11,340 --> 00:34:14,399 Speaker 1: younger friends to perhaps give you a different perspective of 637 00:34:14,409 --> 00:34:17,479 Speaker 1: yourself and you shortcuts on your phone as well. 638 00:34:18,939 --> 00:34:23,549 Speaker 1: I always my camera, the long way you go in, 639 00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,060 Speaker 1: you unlock your phone, you go to the camera icon, 640 00:34:26,270 --> 00:34:28,669 Speaker 1: you can just love it. There's one button you can 641 00:34:28,679 --> 00:34:31,729 Speaker 1: press when it's locked. Do we all know this? Listen, I, 642 00:34:31,739 --> 00:34:34,679 Speaker 1: I only recently knew about the torch. So don't look 643 00:34:34,689 --> 00:34:35,199 Speaker 1: at me, 644 00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:40,760 Speaker 1: Richard Wilkins showed me. I mean, he could, he definitely, 645 00:34:40,770 --> 00:34:42,570 Speaker 1: he could definitely listen to in the, 646 00:34:45,530 --> 00:34:47,609 Speaker 1: oh my God. But I'm all for that. I've got 647 00:34:47,620 --> 00:34:49,929 Speaker 1: a mentor who's, you know, I think she's late sixties 648 00:34:49,939 --> 00:34:53,139 Speaker 1: now and I love what she sort of, it's gold, 649 00:34:53,149 --> 00:34:54,949 Speaker 1: what she said to me. And it's funny when you 650 00:34:54,959 --> 00:34:57,449 Speaker 1: were talking about your client with the Prada glasses and 651 00:34:57,459 --> 00:34:59,739 Speaker 1: the pink hair when I talked to my mentor about 652 00:34:59,750 --> 00:35:02,399 Speaker 1: this space because she was in corporate for a long time, 653 00:35:02,699 --> 00:35:04,399 Speaker 1: you know, and I said, did you ever feel invisible? 654 00:35:04,409 --> 00:35:08,030 Speaker 1: And she said no, because I specifically dressed in a 655 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,449 Speaker 1: really strong way that was sort of like, you know, 656 00:35:10,459 --> 00:35:12,469 Speaker 1: because she was up the front, always kind of leading 657 00:35:12,479 --> 00:35:14,989 Speaker 1: the discussions and I was like, great, cool. So I 658 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:18,729 Speaker 1: will stick with a red lip. You've got it works 659 00:35:18,820 --> 00:35:21,790 Speaker 1: on you, you talk about branding in business. Ok, because 660 00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:23,080 Speaker 1: there'll be a lot of women sort of, you know, 661 00:35:23,090 --> 00:35:26,310 Speaker 1: listening in that space. What do you mean by rebrand 662 00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:28,270 Speaker 1: and how, how do women do it? 663 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:31,408 Speaker 1: Yeah. So when I talk about branding, I always talk 664 00:35:31,419 --> 00:35:34,439 Speaker 1: about the four PS. So you've got your promise, packaging 665 00:35:34,449 --> 00:35:36,969 Speaker 1: position and promotion. So what's your promise? What do you 666 00:35:36,979 --> 00:35:39,830 Speaker 1: want people to know you for and, and know about you. 667 00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:43,590 Speaker 1: What's your packaging? This is where it comes into your styling, 668 00:35:43,629 --> 00:35:47,820 Speaker 1: your social media sites. What's the message that you're putting 669 00:35:47,830 --> 00:35:50,389 Speaker 1: out there when it comes to positioning? 670 00:35:50,489 --> 00:35:53,500 Speaker 1: Who are you spending time with, who's in your network? 671 00:35:53,510 --> 00:35:55,780 Speaker 1: You know, who are you aligning yourself with? Where are 672 00:35:55,790 --> 00:35:58,540 Speaker 1: you working? Uh where are you showing up? And this 673 00:35:58,550 --> 00:36:02,399 Speaker 1: can work in a professional sense and in a personal sense, 674 00:36:02,409 --> 00:36:06,939 Speaker 1: if you're wanting to reinvent your personal life, this also applies. 675 00:36:06,949 --> 00:36:09,589 Speaker 1: You want to change your life, change the things you do, 676 00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:11,729 Speaker 1: the places you go and the people you spend time 677 00:36:11,739 --> 00:36:12,100 Speaker 1: with 678 00:36:12,459 --> 00:36:15,870 Speaker 1: and then the promotion piece is that visibility piece. How 679 00:36:15,879 --> 00:36:18,259 Speaker 1: are you putting yourself out there? How are you making 680 00:36:18,270 --> 00:36:20,570 Speaker 1: sure that you're seen and heard by the people that 681 00:36:20,580 --> 00:36:21,549 Speaker 1: actually matter. 682 00:36:21,989 --> 00:36:24,489 Speaker 1: You gave me this great advice years ago when we 683 00:36:24,500 --> 00:36:27,080 Speaker 1: were talking about social media and linkedin and anywhere that 684 00:36:27,090 --> 00:36:29,189 Speaker 1: you promote yourself, you know, we were talking about, oh, 685 00:36:29,199 --> 00:36:31,250 Speaker 1: but sometimes you, you might have a great image of 686 00:36:31,260 --> 00:36:33,560 Speaker 1: yourself or something, but you don't want to put it 687 00:36:33,570 --> 00:36:36,760 Speaker 1: out there because you're like, oh, what are people gonna think? 688 00:36:36,770 --> 00:36:39,699 Speaker 1: And then we nutted it down to who are those people? 689 00:36:39,709 --> 00:36:42,209 Speaker 1: And it's usually maybe someone you worked with once. So 690 00:36:42,219 --> 00:36:43,419 Speaker 1: it was a bit of a bully or like you 691 00:36:43,429 --> 00:36:45,550 Speaker 1: go to these three people that we're not very nice 692 00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:47,609 Speaker 1: to you. And you're like, what will Jane think from 693 00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:47,810 Speaker 1: a 694 00:36:48,077 --> 00:36:51,547 Speaker 1: Exactly. And it's like Jane doesn't stop doing anything because 695 00:36:51,558 --> 00:36:54,607 Speaker 1: of me. Does she. And so that really years ago 696 00:36:54,617 --> 00:36:57,147 Speaker 1: empowered me to just go if I believe in it. 697 00:36:57,157 --> 00:36:59,397 Speaker 1: And it's true and it's authentic and it's something I 698 00:36:59,407 --> 00:37:02,808 Speaker 1: want to share, whether it's life stuff or work stuff, 699 00:37:02,818 --> 00:37:05,616 Speaker 1: put it out there 100%. This whole conversation. I've been 700 00:37:05,627 --> 00:37:11,857 Speaker 1: picturing the devil wears Prada, is that the person, the person, 701 00:37:12,377 --> 00:37:13,988 Speaker 1: but that is 702 00:37:14,166 --> 00:37:17,335 Speaker 1: like the sharp dress up. Everything is so stylish, but 703 00:37:17,344 --> 00:37:19,825 Speaker 1: you don't have to be harsh about it. Like sometimes 704 00:37:19,835 --> 00:37:22,966 Speaker 1: when we think of an assertive older woman who knows 705 00:37:22,976 --> 00:37:25,525 Speaker 1: what they want, who's stepping into their power. That is 706 00:37:25,535 --> 00:37:27,614 Speaker 1: kind of the image that we see. But we need 707 00:37:27,625 --> 00:37:31,216 Speaker 1: to stop thinking along those lines 100% and there's no 708 00:37:31,226 --> 00:37:35,365 Speaker 1: one definition of powerful. There's no one style that's powerful. 709 00:37:35,375 --> 00:37:39,524 Speaker 1: So your style, your packaging, your promise, it might be 710 00:37:39,535 --> 00:37:40,145 Speaker 1: really relax 711 00:37:40,694 --> 00:37:43,503 Speaker 1: and down to earth it. What matters is that you 712 00:37:43,513 --> 00:37:47,694 Speaker 1: come at everything with a certain level of intentionality. What 713 00:37:47,704 --> 00:37:50,493 Speaker 1: is that message? What are you standing for? And what's 714 00:37:50,503 --> 00:37:53,832 Speaker 1: the deer that you want people to walk away with 715 00:37:53,843 --> 00:37:56,312 Speaker 1: when they meet you? What's the story that you want 716 00:37:56,323 --> 00:37:59,703 Speaker 1: them to, to experience? We all have clothes that we 717 00:37:59,714 --> 00:38:02,073 Speaker 1: keep for a special occasion, don't we? Why can't we 718 00:38:02,083 --> 00:38:05,924 Speaker 1: just wear them every day? Isn't that beautiful? Why do 719 00:38:05,964 --> 00:38:06,093 Speaker 1: we have 720 00:38:06,372 --> 00:38:08,701 Speaker 1: the good China for a special? Why can't we eat 721 00:38:08,710 --> 00:38:12,342 Speaker 1: on the good China on the good China since COVID, 722 00:38:12,352 --> 00:38:14,892 Speaker 1: since COVID, nothing's been the best. So you put a 723 00:38:14,902 --> 00:38:18,102 Speaker 1: good frock on with sneakers, you just, and you just 724 00:38:18,112 --> 00:38:22,431 Speaker 1: rockets has transformed everything, hasn't it? You can wear sneakers 725 00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:26,651 Speaker 1: with everything you can in the bedroom a bit awkward 726 00:38:26,661 --> 00:38:29,481 Speaker 1: with hi armies when you go to bed, get them 727 00:38:29,491 --> 00:38:32,052 Speaker 1: off first, take your shoes off. But I I 728 00:38:32,429 --> 00:38:37,239 Speaker 1: here for, don't keep anything for bear. Yes. 100% 100%. 729 00:38:37,250 --> 00:38:39,570 Speaker 1: All right. So what's the best advice you've got for 730 00:38:39,580 --> 00:38:42,919 Speaker 1: women who are listening, who do feel invisible, take the 731 00:38:42,929 --> 00:38:46,569 Speaker 1: steps that we've spoken about today and really look at, 732 00:38:46,580 --> 00:38:50,040 Speaker 1: sit with yourself and think about what is the mindset? 733 00:38:50,050 --> 00:38:53,840 Speaker 1: What are those beliefs that decisions that you've made about 734 00:38:53,850 --> 00:38:57,320 Speaker 1: getting older, that perhaps you need to reframe and change. 735 00:38:57,459 --> 00:38:58,459 Speaker 1: And that 736 00:38:58,770 --> 00:39:02,699 Speaker 1: to me is the most important step because if you 737 00:39:02,709 --> 00:39:07,379 Speaker 1: start to change the way you're thinking about getting older 738 00:39:07,389 --> 00:39:10,799 Speaker 1: and what that means and this new form of visibility 739 00:39:11,479 --> 00:39:15,090 Speaker 1: that to me has such a huge ripple effect in 740 00:39:15,100 --> 00:39:17,189 Speaker 1: all areas of your life. So that would be the 741 00:39:17,199 --> 00:39:20,439 Speaker 1: first and most important step to take. I love that. 742 00:39:20,449 --> 00:39:22,600 Speaker 1: I love that too. I've loved this entire chat. It 743 00:39:22,610 --> 00:39:25,239 Speaker 1: makes so much sense because self confidence is the best 744 00:39:25,250 --> 00:39:27,469 Speaker 1: kind of confidence because if you're confident in yourself, then 745 00:39:27,479 --> 00:39:31,080 Speaker 1: other people can be 100%. It's so true and we 746 00:39:31,090 --> 00:39:33,600 Speaker 1: need one another, which is why I love what you're 747 00:39:33,610 --> 00:39:34,959 Speaker 1: doing with this show. 748 00:39:35,649 --> 00:39:39,739 Speaker 1: We need to change the narrative together collectively. So the 749 00:39:39,750 --> 00:39:43,120 Speaker 1: more that women do put themselves out there and make 750 00:39:43,129 --> 00:39:48,870 Speaker 1: themselves visible, it will continue and that narrative will change. 751 00:39:48,879 --> 00:39:52,239 Speaker 1: So it's, yeah, you're definitely contributing to that. I'm gonna 752 00:39:52,250 --> 00:39:55,439 Speaker 1: have to write some of this down. Yeah, I feel 753 00:39:55,449 --> 00:39:59,439 Speaker 1: like there's a lot of post it note and stick 754 00:39:59,449 --> 00:40:03,580 Speaker 1: on my laptop. Carli. Thank you so much. Thank you 755 00:40:03,590 --> 00:40:04,270 Speaker 1: for having me. 756 00:40:04,929 --> 00:40:07,510 Speaker 1: How did you feel about Carlie? Oh, well, listen, I'm 757 00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:10,790 Speaker 1: just crazily writing everything down. It's just post to heaven 758 00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:13,330 Speaker 1: over here. What about so many things? I think it 759 00:40:13,340 --> 00:40:17,219 Speaker 1: was a reminder about what we feel on the inside 760 00:40:17,229 --> 00:40:19,879 Speaker 1: is reflected in what people see on the outside and 761 00:40:19,889 --> 00:40:23,050 Speaker 1: it's not about being beautiful and it's about how you 762 00:40:23,060 --> 00:40:27,179 Speaker 1: carry yourself. Absolutely. It's like sitting up straight and smiling sometimes, 763 00:40:27,189 --> 00:40:29,069 Speaker 1: isn't it basic stuff that you just go? I feel 764 00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:31,169 Speaker 1: better about myself. Yes. Yes. Yeah. 765 00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:39,060 Speaker 1: Well, we're at that time again in the episode where 766 00:40:39,070 --> 00:40:42,590 Speaker 1: we give recommendations. Nelda, what do you have for us 767 00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:45,659 Speaker 1: this week? Well, after listening to Carlie, I really resonated 768 00:40:45,669 --> 00:40:48,939 Speaker 1: with what she said about wearing clothes that you feel 769 00:40:48,949 --> 00:40:53,060 Speaker 1: fabulous in almost reinventing yourself a little bit. Like stepping 770 00:40:53,070 --> 00:40:53,629 Speaker 1: out like 771 00:40:53,709 --> 00:40:59,699 Speaker 1: full of confidence. I went to Paris recently. Can you 772 00:40:59,709 --> 00:41:03,169 Speaker 1: name drop a city? Like I went to Paris recently 773 00:41:03,270 --> 00:41:05,050 Speaker 1: just for the week. My daughter was over there. Now 774 00:41:05,060 --> 00:41:08,169 Speaker 1: I live by Cary through your social media and she 775 00:41:08,179 --> 00:41:09,719 Speaker 1: was like mom, I'm going to be in Paris, come 776 00:41:09,729 --> 00:41:14,219 Speaker 1: and meet me and I was like, yes, she also said, 777 00:41:14,229 --> 00:41:16,159 Speaker 1: don't expect to have all of your meals with me 778 00:41:16,169 --> 00:41:18,199 Speaker 1: or talk to me the whole time, wasn't it too? 779 00:41:18,209 --> 00:41:19,239 Speaker 1: They were guidelines. 780 00:41:20,209 --> 00:41:23,149 Speaker 1: So anyway, what I packed knowing that I had a 781 00:41:23,159 --> 00:41:27,600 Speaker 1: limited time in Paris was all of my best clothes. 782 00:41:27,610 --> 00:41:30,719 Speaker 1: I packed all my best clothes and she incidentally had 783 00:41:30,729 --> 00:41:33,009 Speaker 1: done the same. She was in Europe for a lot 784 00:41:33,020 --> 00:41:34,770 Speaker 1: longer than I. So she already had her best clothes. 785 00:41:34,780 --> 00:41:35,899 Speaker 1: But I was there for 786 00:41:35,969 --> 00:41:40,979 Speaker 1: five days. I curated my wardrobe, best clothes every day 787 00:41:40,989 --> 00:41:43,860 Speaker 1: when I stepped out of my room I knew I 788 00:41:43,870 --> 00:41:46,989 Speaker 1: looked good and I felt so good. And the thing 789 00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:51,100 Speaker 1: about being overseas or somewhere new is no-one knows who 790 00:41:51,110 --> 00:41:51,669 Speaker 1: you are. 791 00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:54,800 Speaker 1: No-one has a story about you. You haven't kind of 792 00:41:54,810 --> 00:41:57,979 Speaker 1: stepped out already thinking that you are invisible. So go 793 00:41:57,989 --> 00:42:01,000 Speaker 1: somewhere somewhere fresh, mix it up. Take all of your 794 00:42:01,010 --> 00:42:04,030 Speaker 1: best things. Love this. It's all about our best, isn't it? 795 00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:07,360 Speaker 1: This episode so visible even if it's in the lift 796 00:42:07,379 --> 00:42:08,209 Speaker 1: in the mirror, 797 00:42:08,909 --> 00:42:11,350 Speaker 1: that's when it started for me, you know, taking selfies 798 00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:13,729 Speaker 1: in the lift. Actually finding out the best way to 799 00:42:13,739 --> 00:42:16,830 Speaker 1: take a selfie in the lift to tip the tip 800 00:42:17,939 --> 00:42:19,790 Speaker 1: the down lights. I always end up with a down light. 801 00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:21,779 Speaker 1: I look like I'm in a horror movie. I always 802 00:42:21,790 --> 00:42:24,408 Speaker 1: go to smile at the camera thinking that the reflection 803 00:42:24,419 --> 00:42:27,429 Speaker 1: is going to make contact with my eyes. But the 804 00:42:27,439 --> 00:42:29,159 Speaker 1: best thing to do is look down at your phone. Oh, 805 00:42:29,169 --> 00:42:31,330 Speaker 1: is it? Yeah. Apparently I don't know for me or 806 00:42:31,340 --> 00:42:31,520 Speaker 1: what 807 00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:33,888 Speaker 1: gonna try. I'm gonna try a bit of that in the, 808 00:42:34,709 --> 00:42:37,729 Speaker 1: see what we can pull out. What's your recommendation? Well, 809 00:42:37,739 --> 00:42:41,120 Speaker 1: after last week and obviously the disaster that was passing 810 00:42:41,129 --> 00:42:44,290 Speaker 1: someone and ending it was red lipstick everywhere. He and I, 811 00:42:44,300 --> 00:42:48,969 Speaker 1: I have been road testing some Priceline red lipstick stains. 812 00:42:50,060 --> 00:42:52,679 Speaker 1: They do not come off. Let me tell you, I mean, 813 00:42:52,689 --> 00:42:54,489 Speaker 1: I've only been kissing my hands sadly 814 00:42:56,020 --> 00:42:58,870 Speaker 1: a loser. I admitted that on a podcast maybe we 815 00:42:58,879 --> 00:43:00,739 Speaker 1: edit that out if I'm ever to go on a 816 00:43:00,750 --> 00:43:03,359 Speaker 1: date again. No. So it keep it in. So that's 817 00:43:03,370 --> 00:43:05,610 Speaker 1: my tip. I'm trying. The stains are the stains good. 818 00:43:05,620 --> 00:43:09,040 Speaker 1: They're really good. And there is a red for everyone 819 00:43:09,050 --> 00:43:11,209 Speaker 1: in Priceline because some people say to me, I couldn't 820 00:43:11,219 --> 00:43:13,899 Speaker 1: wear a red. I'm like, listen, there's a red out 821 00:43:13,909 --> 00:43:15,570 Speaker 1: there for every face. 822 00:43:16,679 --> 00:43:19,929 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to this episode of 456 Club. 823 00:43:19,959 --> 00:43:23,000 Speaker 1: If you loved the show, then make sure you rate 824 00:43:23,010 --> 00:43:26,379 Speaker 1: and review and share it with your friends and join 825 00:43:26,389 --> 00:43:31,020 Speaker 1: us next week when we talk about parenting your aging parents. 826 00:43:31,030 --> 00:43:34,889 Speaker 1: The executive producer of 456 Club is Talisa Baza with 827 00:43:34,899 --> 00:43:36,770 Speaker 1: audio editing by Madeleine Joan 828 00:43:37,659 --> 00:43:41,589 Speaker 1: and we'll see you next week. Bye bye. We know 829 00:43:41,600 --> 00:43:45,300 Speaker 1: that everybody's experience in their forties, fifties and sixties looks 830 00:43:45,310 --> 00:43:48,500 Speaker 1: and feels different. So we want to hear from you, 831 00:43:48,610 --> 00:43:51,389 Speaker 1: head to the show notes and complete a short survey 832 00:43:51,399 --> 00:43:53,909 Speaker 1: and to thank you for your time, you could win 833 00:43:53,919 --> 00:43:55,229 Speaker 1: a $50 voucher. 834 00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:04,689 Speaker 1: This episode of 456 Club was made in partnership with 835 00:44:04,699 --> 00:44:08,770 Speaker 1: Priceline Pharmacy for expert advice and all your beauty health 836 00:44:08,780 --> 00:44:12,919 Speaker 1: and wellness needs. Visit Priceline Pharmacy in store or online 837 00:44:12,929 --> 00:44:14,770 Speaker 1: at Priceline dot com dot A U.