1 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:12,920 Speaker 1: You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast. Poor Mama Mia. 2 00:00:13,079 --> 00:00:16,960 Speaker 1: I'm your host, Ashannye Dante. Welcome to But Are You Happy? 3 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:20,319 Speaker 1: The podcast for people who need a reward snack after 4 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:21,199 Speaker 1: making one call. 5 00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:25,440 Speaker 2: And I'm doctor Anastagian Ronas, a clinical psychologist passionate about 6 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:29,319 Speaker 2: happiness and mental health. Now, over the next three weeks, 7 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:33,159 Speaker 2: we're bringing you special episodes focused on holiday season. 8 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,760 Speaker 1: If you celebrate Christmas and New Year's chances are your 9 00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:41,120 Speaker 1: calendar is filling up, filling up with family gatherings, social 10 00:00:41,160 --> 00:00:44,360 Speaker 1: events and end of view catch ups, and we want 11 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:47,040 Speaker 1: to have some real conversations to support you through it. 12 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:51,520 Speaker 2: Today we're diving into the psychology of alcohol, why social 13 00:00:51,600 --> 00:00:54,080 Speaker 2: drinking becomes such a big part of the holidays, and 14 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 2: how you can be more mindful about your relationship with 15 00:00:57,080 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 2: alcohol during this time. 16 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: This is a really important conversation of let's get into it. 17 00:01:06,039 --> 00:01:08,119 Speaker 1: So we're heading into that time of year where we 18 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 1: have end of year drinks and parties and all of that, 19 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 1: and the reality is alcohol is everywhere. But before we 20 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 1: dive into why we drink, I want to actually unpack 21 00:01:19,480 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 1: what is alcohol? 22 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 2: Good starting point. 23 00:01:22,320 --> 00:01:26,320 Speaker 1: I like this, I'm a podcast host. 24 00:01:26,960 --> 00:01:28,880 Speaker 2: I love that we're having this conversation. I think it's 25 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 2: so important. I'm very passionate about people understanding what they're 26 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:35,200 Speaker 2: consuming and putting in their body. So, the type of 27 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:38,000 Speaker 2: alcohol that we have in beverages that we drink is 28 00:01:38,080 --> 00:01:41,760 Speaker 2: called ethanol. It's the active ingredient in alcohol that leads 29 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 2: us to feel that tipsy and intoxicated feeling. Ethanol. When 30 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:51,800 Speaker 2: we drink it, it gets absorbed by the stomach and 31 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 2: it hits us in about ten minutes after drinking. So 32 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 2: if you're thinking about how long it takes to sort 33 00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:00,040 Speaker 2: of feel the effects, it's around ten minutes. And it 34 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:03,200 Speaker 2: crosses what we call the blood brain barrier, so it 35 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:06,520 Speaker 2: actually impacts the way the brain works, which is why 36 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:12,440 Speaker 2: we have all these, you know, experiences of feeling differently 37 00:02:12,519 --> 00:02:15,640 Speaker 2: but also cognitively functioning a little differently when we drink. 38 00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:19,760 Speaker 1: So what else is happening in the body when you 39 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:21,160 Speaker 1: are taking in that alcohol. 40 00:02:21,640 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, So alcohol does a few different things, especially with 41 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 2: the brain. So there's a couple of key pathways it activates. 42 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:32,639 Speaker 2: One is dopamine. We've talked about dopamine before. That dopamine 43 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 2: is that a chemical messenger between the brain and the 44 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:39,920 Speaker 2: body that gives us the feeling of pleasure and reward. 45 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 2: So dopamine is activated when we do or consume anything 46 00:02:44,160 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 2: that has the potential to be addictive. So that's one thing. 47 00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:52,560 Speaker 2: The other thing to know is GABBA. So GABA. Alcohol 48 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:57,359 Speaker 2: actually binds to GABA, and GABA is like our body's 49 00:02:57,400 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 2: own anti anxiety system. So when GABA is activated, we 50 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:05,760 Speaker 2: actually naturally feel calm, and alcohol binds to it and 51 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:08,920 Speaker 2: activates this system, which is why when we drink alcohol 52 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:11,360 Speaker 2: we might feel more kind of relaxed and calm. It 53 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 2: activates our body and brain's own anti anxiety system. Now, 54 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 2: the other thing that happens is that alcohol activates what 55 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:24,560 Speaker 2: we refer to as the endogenous opioids in the brain. 56 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:30,640 Speaker 2: Had to make sure I read that one clearly endogenous opioids. 57 00:03:31,280 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 2: So this is the body's natural pain relief system. So 58 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 2: we have a natural kind of pain relief system that's 59 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 2: activated through these naturally occurring opioids. So when we drink alcohol, 60 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:46,960 Speaker 2: we get a feeling of pleasure and reward, We feel calm, 61 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:51,280 Speaker 2: and it gets rid of anxiety and it provides pain relief. 62 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 2: So if you look at it from that lens, no 63 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 2: wonder people want to drink and feel better after they 64 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:56,960 Speaker 2: have a drink. 65 00:03:57,120 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 1: That's so true. It's so nice to unpack it from 66 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 1: that perspective as well, because we can get caught up 67 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:05,720 Speaker 1: with like the romantic side, you know, of having a drink, 68 00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:07,920 Speaker 1: and it's you know, like I don't mind a glass 69 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 1: of my girlfriends on special occasions, but I think it's 70 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 1: just nice to know what happens after you literally take 71 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 1: that first sip. 72 00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:19,640 Speaker 2: Right, Yes, absolutely, And as a result of all this happening, 73 00:04:20,400 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 2: alcohol is also kind of impacting the prefrontal cortex of 74 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:25,960 Speaker 2: the brain. So this is the part of our brain 75 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 2: that helps us rationalize, make reasonable decisions, plan, problem solve, etc. 76 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:34,720 Speaker 2: Which is why when we drink we have sort of 77 00:04:34,760 --> 00:04:38,440 Speaker 2: impaired reasoning and you know, we're not as good at 78 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:40,880 Speaker 2: judging situations or making good decisions. 79 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:44,520 Speaker 1: Gosh, I'm just I'm just literally thinking about when I 80 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:46,920 Speaker 1: was younger and I was like, oh God. 81 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:53,680 Speaker 2: Alcohol leading to poor decisions. Literally, that's the brain. So 82 00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:55,440 Speaker 2: if I just add one more thing onto that before 83 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:56,800 Speaker 2: we move on, because I like talking about the brain 84 00:04:56,839 --> 00:04:59,159 Speaker 2: and body. If we talk about the body for a minute, 85 00:04:59,839 --> 00:05:05,640 Speaker 2: the liver is very much involved in processing alcohol. So ethanol, 86 00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:09,600 Speaker 2: which is in alcohol doesn't naturally occur in the body, 87 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:11,719 Speaker 2: and the body actually sort of sees it as a 88 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:15,040 Speaker 2: toxin or a poison when we ingest it. So the 89 00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:19,680 Speaker 2: liver works very hard to process alcohol to get it 90 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 2: out of our system. And this might be through sort 91 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:25,159 Speaker 2: of perspiration, or it might be through kind of like 92 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,839 Speaker 2: urinating it out, etc. But the liver works really hard. 93 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:32,680 Speaker 2: What we see with people who've been drinking large quantities 94 00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:35,760 Speaker 2: of alcohol over long periods of time is that they 95 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:39,039 Speaker 2: actually start to have cirrhosis of the liver or the 96 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:42,240 Speaker 2: liver is impacted in some ways. Yeah, So one of 97 00:05:42,280 --> 00:05:45,320 Speaker 2: the first things I'll tell people who have had a 98 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:47,800 Speaker 2: history of heavy drinking to do is go to the 99 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:52,240 Speaker 2: doctor and get their liver checked. Because the liver can 100 00:05:52,280 --> 00:05:56,240 Speaker 2: also repair itself if we catch it early enough, the 101 00:05:56,360 --> 00:05:59,800 Speaker 2: impacts that the negative impacts of alcohol on the liver 102 00:05:59,880 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 2: can actually be reversed. There does come a tipping point 103 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,119 Speaker 2: where we can't reverse it anymore, but for many people, 104 00:06:05,160 --> 00:06:08,400 Speaker 2: if they have been drinking at high levels or unhealthy levels, 105 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:10,800 Speaker 2: the damage to the liver can be reversed. 106 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:13,600 Speaker 1: That's good to know. I didn't know that does that 107 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 1: mean as well, Like when you were talking about how 108 00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:19,040 Speaker 1: the liver's function is to excrete the ethanol out of 109 00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 1: the body. Is that why when someone who's been drinking 110 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:23,240 Speaker 1: a lot, like we've had that friend that's how to 111 00:06:23,280 --> 00:06:26,600 Speaker 1: bit like way too many glasses? Is that why we 112 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:30,000 Speaker 1: have to encourage them to drink more water? Is that why? 113 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, we want to sort of process the ethanol 114 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 2: the alcohol to get out of their Yeah. 115 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 1: Okay, that makes sense. So when I was doing a 116 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:40,680 Speaker 1: bit of research, something stood out to me, and it 117 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:44,320 Speaker 1: was speaking on how young women are actually drinking more 118 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:46,840 Speaker 1: than ever. What's going on there? 119 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:52,480 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, unfortunately, we are seeing a trend where young 120 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:56,400 Speaker 2: men are drinking less, but young women are actually drinking 121 00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:59,080 Speaker 2: more than they have before, which is really quite concerning. 122 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 2: And this is not necessarily regular drinking. It might be 123 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 2: comprised of binge drinking, but unfortunate we are seeing this rise. 124 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 2: So the gap between it's always historically been that men 125 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:12,280 Speaker 2: have had higher levels of alcohol consumption and more sort 126 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:14,600 Speaker 2: of risky levels of alcohol consumption than women, but we 127 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 2: are seeing that that's slightly changing at the moment. 128 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:19,760 Speaker 1: And when you talk about binge drinking, what does that 129 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 1: actually look like does that mean when it's just they've 130 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:24,040 Speaker 1: gone out to a party and they just have heaps 131 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:25,960 Speaker 1: and then they're not having another drink for a while. 132 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 2: Yes, So like a kind of isolated day or period 133 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:32,520 Speaker 2: of time where someone will drink, but usually drink quite heavily. So, 134 00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 2: as you say, usually it is if someone goes out 135 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,840 Speaker 2: in the weekend, maybe they haven't drunk anything throughout the week, 136 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 2: but they go out on the weekend and they drink 137 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:40,240 Speaker 2: quite heavily. 138 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:45,920 Speaker 1: They go hard after the break. Doctor Anastasia is going 139 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:52,600 Speaker 1: to debunk some myths around drinking alcohol. Stay with us, Okay, 140 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 1: I want to unpack one of the biggest myths that 141 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 1: I've heard recently, and that is that classic a glass 142 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:01,400 Speaker 1: a day keeps the doctors away. I don't know if 143 00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 1: you've heard that. I feel like so often we can 144 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 1: insert that phrase into anything, right, Yeah, is that true? 145 00:08:06,840 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 2: Yeah? 146 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:10,440 Speaker 1: Well, no, sorry to break. 147 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 2: Yeah. There there there was this sort of it did 148 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 2: the rounds that having a glass of wine I think 149 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:22,040 Speaker 2: it was red wine per day would in some way 150 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 2: be good for your health. Yeah, And you know, it 151 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:28,960 Speaker 2: only takes a headline like that to really kind of 152 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:32,440 Speaker 2: catch on and for people to really run with it. Unfortunately, 153 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:35,720 Speaker 2: it's not as true as we might like to believe 154 00:08:35,760 --> 00:08:38,840 Speaker 2: it is. It's very interesting, actually, So they did some research, 155 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:40,520 Speaker 2: and this is where this came from. They did some 156 00:08:40,599 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 2: research and they compared non drinkers to moderate drinkers to 157 00:08:44,520 --> 00:08:48,319 Speaker 2: heavy drinkers. And initially, when they looked at the data, 158 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:51,040 Speaker 2: what they found is that the moderate drinkers seemed to 159 00:08:51,079 --> 00:08:54,840 Speaker 2: be healthier than the non drinkers, and so this kind 160 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:58,319 Speaker 2: of spurred this idea that actually, a glass of wine 161 00:08:58,359 --> 00:09:00,240 Speaker 2: a day or alcohol a day might actually be good 162 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:03,960 Speaker 2: for your health. That's However, when they dug a little 163 00:09:03,959 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 2: bit further into the research, what they found is that 164 00:09:06,439 --> 00:09:12,119 Speaker 2: the group of non drinkers usually had reasons for not drinking. 165 00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 2: So it wasn't just that they decided to not consume alcohol. 166 00:09:15,359 --> 00:09:17,559 Speaker 2: It was because they had other health conditions, or they 167 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:20,600 Speaker 2: were on medication, or they were maybe recovering from alcohol 168 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 2: related problems, and that's why they were A large chunk 169 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:27,559 Speaker 2: of them were classified as non drinkers. So when they 170 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 2: compared rare drinkers, so people who do drink but very rarely, 171 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:36,759 Speaker 2: to those who are moderate drinkers, that kind of positive 172 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 2: result went away and it wasn't the case that the 173 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:42,559 Speaker 2: moderate drinkers were healthier than the rare drinkers. If anything, 174 00:09:42,599 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 2: the rare drinkers showed better health outcomes than the moderate drinkers. 175 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,279 Speaker 2: So it all goes to show that we've got to 176 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:49,640 Speaker 2: look at the data in the right way. 177 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, And also like I mean, I don't know if 178 00:09:52,280 --> 00:09:54,479 Speaker 1: people go to the depths of research studies. I mean 179 00:09:54,479 --> 00:09:56,960 Speaker 1: that's very people like you coming and do that for 180 00:09:56,959 --> 00:09:59,480 Speaker 1: a living. But also just like seeing how important it 181 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:02,280 Speaker 1: is to check the validity of research too. 182 00:10:02,599 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, that's right. And and the reality is is 183 00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 2: that there's no safe or risk free level of consumption 184 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 2: when it comes to alcohol. All alcohol carries risk. And 185 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:15,719 Speaker 2: when I talk about risk, I'm really talking about risk 186 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:19,839 Speaker 2: to our health. So one thing that I find surprising 187 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:22,800 Speaker 2: that often when I talk to people, they don't actually 188 00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:28,719 Speaker 2: know this. Alcohol is a category one carcinogen. Wow, alcohol 189 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:32,800 Speaker 2: is cancer causing and it's in the category one of castinogens, 190 00:10:32,839 --> 00:10:36,879 Speaker 2: which means there's very strong research and evidence proving that 191 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:41,280 Speaker 2: alcohol causes cancer. People don't often know this when I 192 00:10:41,319 --> 00:10:45,319 Speaker 2: talk about this, because what other things are in category 193 00:10:45,359 --> 00:10:51,679 Speaker 2: one of carcinogens asbestoso tobacco and radiation. 194 00:10:52,319 --> 00:10:57,320 Speaker 1: WHOA, yeah, okay, wow, so that like legit things serious stuff. Wow. 195 00:10:58,160 --> 00:11:02,959 Speaker 2: Yes, And in particular alcohol, Alcohol has been linked to 196 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:06,159 Speaker 2: breast cancer and soft for geal cancer, many cancers, but 197 00:11:06,199 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 2: they're the kind of two key ones that it's related 198 00:11:08,119 --> 00:11:11,040 Speaker 2: to causing. And so when it comes to kind of 199 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:13,319 Speaker 2: thinking about I come back to your question about like 200 00:11:13,359 --> 00:11:16,599 Speaker 2: a glass of wine keeps the doctors away not being 201 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 2: so true. If anything, it can have worse health outcomes 202 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:23,079 Speaker 2: for us. And so in Australia, the guidelines are that 203 00:11:23,119 --> 00:11:28,280 Speaker 2: we should not consume more than ten standard drinks per 204 00:11:28,319 --> 00:11:31,920 Speaker 2: week and we should not have any more than four 205 00:11:32,199 --> 00:11:35,040 Speaker 2: standard drinks on any one day. They're like the maximum. 206 00:11:35,079 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 2: So it's not like the guideline to aim for. It's 207 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:40,360 Speaker 2: like this is the absolute max that would be considered 208 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:41,119 Speaker 2: and recommended. 209 00:11:41,319 --> 00:11:44,199 Speaker 1: Yeah. Wow, there's so much truth being dropped on. 210 00:11:44,119 --> 00:11:46,319 Speaker 2: This podcast, sorry, guys, And I. 211 00:11:46,239 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 1: Think that's the reality. Like we don't want to be 212 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:50,760 Speaker 1: negative nancies, right, Like it's a bit of tough love, 213 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:53,040 Speaker 1: and also like we want to come back to the facts. 214 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:54,959 Speaker 1: I mean, this is you know, our podcast is all 215 00:11:55,000 --> 00:11:57,280 Speaker 1: around the no bullshit, so we give no bullshit. 216 00:11:57,439 --> 00:11:59,679 Speaker 2: Yes, we want to be informed, right, we can make 217 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:02,599 Speaker 2: choices for ourselves. We also know things like bacon cause cancer, 218 00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:05,280 Speaker 2: and yet people still eat bacon, right, Like it's into that. 219 00:12:06,400 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 2: I'm sorry, all the truth. 220 00:12:08,239 --> 00:12:09,480 Speaker 1: That's okay, I actually don't eat. 221 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:11,040 Speaker 2: I don't eat. Okay, there you go. 222 00:12:11,119 --> 00:12:11,520 Speaker 1: I'm good. 223 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 2: Okay. But yes, it's all about kind of having the information, 224 00:12:16,119 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 2: being informed so we can make informed choices for ourselves. 225 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:22,199 Speaker 2: Going in the sun increases our risk of sun cancer. 226 00:12:22,199 --> 00:12:23,719 Speaker 2: It doesn't mean that we never go in the sun. 227 00:12:23,839 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 2: It just means that we have the awareness and the 228 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 2: information to make healthier choices for ourselves. 229 00:12:28,479 --> 00:12:30,279 Speaker 1: Yeah, so true. So I think a lot of the 230 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 1: information has been really good. But I think something I 231 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:36,679 Speaker 1: think about is the social pressure, especially around drinking. 232 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:40,679 Speaker 2: Yes, in Australia, we have such a culture of drinking. 233 00:12:40,719 --> 00:12:45,239 Speaker 2: You know, alcohol is involved in all sorts of celebrations. 234 00:12:45,239 --> 00:12:48,479 Speaker 2: It's involved in like how we might relax and unwind. 235 00:12:48,880 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 2: You go to a footy cane, you might have you know, 236 00:12:51,199 --> 00:12:56,720 Speaker 2: some big It's very intertwined into the ways we connect 237 00:12:56,839 --> 00:13:00,160 Speaker 2: with other people. Yeah, the ways we deal with the 238 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 2: whole spectrum of emotions, the good emotions and the less 239 00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:04,520 Speaker 2: pleasant emotions as well. 240 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:07,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so true. And I know that feeling of 241 00:13:07,079 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 1: when someone's like, oh, so you're gonna have a drink, 242 00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:12,040 Speaker 1: and it's just this moment where you're like, oh, yes, 243 00:13:12,119 --> 00:13:14,959 Speaker 1: because I don't want to feel that fomo. But then 244 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:17,319 Speaker 1: it's like, oh, but what do I actually want? 245 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:20,400 Speaker 2: Yes? Yeah? What's actually driving me to say yes in 246 00:13:20,439 --> 00:13:24,120 Speaker 2: that moment? Do I actually want that alcoholic beverage? Or 247 00:13:24,599 --> 00:13:26,080 Speaker 2: do I want to feel like I fit in? Do 248 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 2: I want to feel like I belong to this social 249 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:31,719 Speaker 2: group or to this environment that we're in, Or am 250 00:13:31,719 --> 00:13:33,679 Speaker 2: I saying yes because it'll help me feel a bit 251 00:13:33,760 --> 00:13:36,760 Speaker 2: less awkward and less anxious? You know, it's really about 252 00:13:36,839 --> 00:13:39,759 Speaker 2: understanding what's driving the desire to say yes to alcohol 253 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 2: for us to be able to change our relationship with it. 254 00:13:42,520 --> 00:13:44,319 Speaker 1: It's so true, and it's interesting because I know you 255 00:13:44,439 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 1: unpacked Australian culture, but I know as well, like coming 256 00:13:48,079 --> 00:13:50,640 Speaker 1: from a Shri Lunkan background culturally, like even going back 257 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,079 Speaker 1: to Sholanka a couple of months ago and just noticing 258 00:13:53,239 --> 00:13:57,720 Speaker 1: how alcoholism and just alcohol is also so intertwined in 259 00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 1: our culture, Like I remember even when I was younger, 260 00:14:00,559 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 1: just like Uncle staying up till like twelve in the 261 00:14:03,920 --> 00:14:07,520 Speaker 1: night drinking whiskey, and it was just like a normal thing. 262 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,679 Speaker 1: And it's like, oh, what is that actually shaping for 263 00:14:10,959 --> 00:14:11,679 Speaker 1: younger people? 264 00:14:11,959 --> 00:14:14,479 Speaker 2: Yes, and part of the kind of social norm like 265 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:16,559 Speaker 2: this is what we do. We get together, we talk, 266 00:14:16,640 --> 00:14:19,440 Speaker 2: and we have a whiskey while we do it. It 267 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 2: then makes it hard for people to step out of that. 268 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:28,119 Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. So there's also this growing movement called sober 269 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:30,840 Speaker 1: curious movement. Can you tell me more about that? 270 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 2: I love this. I love this as a concept, as 271 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:37,840 Speaker 2: an idea, as a movement because it takes us away 272 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 2: from the dichotomy of you're someone who either drinks or 273 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 2: you're someone who doesn't. And I'll share a personal kind 274 00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 2: of example here. I don't often drink. It doesn't mean 275 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:52,400 Speaker 2: I never drink. I just don't often drink. I personally 276 00:14:52,479 --> 00:14:54,800 Speaker 2: don't really love the taste of alcohol. And if I 277 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:57,440 Speaker 2: have a drink, it's really intentional. It's because I want 278 00:14:57,440 --> 00:14:59,760 Speaker 2: that specific drink that I know i'll enjoy, or I'm 279 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 2: in a particular environment where I've made a really conscious 280 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 2: choice to drink. I typically won't yes to an alcoholic beverage. 281 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,560 Speaker 2: If someone just offers it to me, so I would 282 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:12,240 Speaker 2: I believe like I do drink. But it's so funny 283 00:15:12,239 --> 00:15:16,080 Speaker 2: because so many of my friends have categorized me as 284 00:15:16,119 --> 00:15:19,200 Speaker 2: a non drinker, and they've said this to me in conversation, 285 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 2: or they'll get out a bottle of wine or something 286 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:23,759 Speaker 2: and be like, honestly, she doesn't drink. I'll be like, no, way, 287 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:27,000 Speaker 2: do drink. It's just that I don't drink very much 288 00:15:27,119 --> 00:15:31,360 Speaker 2: or very often. So it's interesting how we naturally kind 289 00:15:31,359 --> 00:15:33,479 Speaker 2: of fall into this dichotomy when it comes to alcohol, 290 00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 2: if you do drink or you don't drink. And so 291 00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:39,480 Speaker 2: what sober Curious does is it gives space for that 292 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:43,519 Speaker 2: middle ground to exist. So it's really about people starting 293 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:47,160 Speaker 2: to be more mindful and intentional about their choices when 294 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 2: it comes to consuming alcohol, and really making that an 295 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:53,800 Speaker 2: active choice and a conscious choice rather than more of 296 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 2: an automatic habit. 297 00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 1: I really love this because I actually didn't know much 298 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:01,320 Speaker 1: about sober Curious until we started, you know, researching for this, 299 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:04,560 Speaker 1: and it's just really nice because I'm now like, ah, 300 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:06,359 Speaker 1: I think I'm sober Curious. 301 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:07,560 Speaker 2: I'm part of the movement. 302 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 1: So nice because like I'm similar, I think, you know, 303 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: I used to drink a lot more, especially when I 304 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:15,680 Speaker 1: was younger. Not saying I'm old now, but you know 305 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 1: what I mean, back in the day. Yeah, back in 306 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 1: the day. But I feel like now and it's probably 307 00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:23,720 Speaker 1: only recently, probably this year, where I'm really thinking more 308 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:26,399 Speaker 1: intentionally about when I want to have a drink as well, 309 00:16:26,440 --> 00:16:28,560 Speaker 1: Like similar to what I said before, like I can 310 00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: enjoy a glass of wine with my girlfriend sometimes or 311 00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:33,399 Speaker 1: maybe if I'm on a date night with Yo, Yo 312 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:36,000 Speaker 1: doesn't drink at all, but you know, sometimes I might 313 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:38,800 Speaker 1: have a drink. But Yeah, it's just really interesting to 314 00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:40,999 Speaker 1: know that it's okay to be in that middle ground 315 00:16:41,040 --> 00:16:42,960 Speaker 1: and it's just bringing intentionality to it. 316 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 2: I really love that, Yes, and stepping away from habits 317 00:16:47,119 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 2: or just the automatic go to drink alcohol or just 318 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:54,399 Speaker 2: because we're around other people who are drinking that sort 319 00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 2: of automatic pool to also drink with them. It's just 320 00:16:57,280 --> 00:16:59,160 Speaker 2: sort of shifting perspective on that. 321 00:16:59,960 --> 00:17:02,240 Speaker 1: And with this movement as well, Like I was reading 322 00:17:02,280 --> 00:17:05,320 Speaker 1: into it and I saw that gen Z generation, like 323 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:08,520 Speaker 1: that generation's really taking this movement forward. 324 00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:13,160 Speaker 2: Yes, Yes, there's a real active sense of choice over 325 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:16,240 Speaker 2: alcohol and not sort of choosing to maybe go out 326 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:18,719 Speaker 2: as much and have the big messy nights or binge 327 00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:21,679 Speaker 2: drink or just drink for the sake of it. So 328 00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:24,119 Speaker 2: I love that there's just more of a conscious awareness 329 00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:24,719 Speaker 2: around it. 330 00:17:24,919 --> 00:17:27,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that. And actually I saw something come 331 00:17:27,919 --> 00:17:29,280 Speaker 1: up on my phone the other day. One of my 332 00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:32,520 Speaker 1: friends posted it on her stories. Yeah, so it was 333 00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:36,800 Speaker 1: one of those carousels from doctor Mark. Heymann, I think 334 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:37,800 Speaker 1: I saw this as well. 335 00:17:37,919 --> 00:17:39,439 Speaker 2: Oh did you but remind me? 336 00:17:39,879 --> 00:17:41,560 Speaker 1: Yeah? Well, I mean I was reading it and was 337 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:43,799 Speaker 1: just literally just saying gen Z is going sober. New 338 00:17:43,879 --> 00:17:47,080 Speaker 1: data reveals that gen Z is twenty times more likely 339 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:49,800 Speaker 1: to abstain from alcohol than baby boomers. 340 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:51,560 Speaker 2: I'm like, twenty. 341 00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 1: Times more likely. And then it literally does like a 342 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:58,560 Speaker 1: longitudinal study and breaks down like the likelihood of cross generations. Yes, 343 00:17:58,679 --> 00:18:02,560 Speaker 1: and I'm like, this is incredible just to see that. Yeah, 344 00:18:02,679 --> 00:18:05,960 Speaker 1: Like we can sometimes, I mean, I'm very passionate about 345 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 1: young people, but we can underestimate them. And it's like wow, 346 00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:13,399 Speaker 1: for them to be making those decisions already early on. 347 00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:15,879 Speaker 1: And again it's not that they're not drinking, and it's 348 00:18:15,919 --> 00:18:20,000 Speaker 1: like they're more aware. I'm like, wow, that just shows 349 00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:20,480 Speaker 1: so much. 350 00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:24,440 Speaker 2: Yes, Yes, I think that's fantastic, And on the flip side, 351 00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 2: I think it also means we need to really think 352 00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:30,159 Speaker 2: about as a society how to best care for those 353 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:33,720 Speaker 2: who are maybe in older kind of age brackets who 354 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:36,759 Speaker 2: do have those more ingrained norms when it comes to 355 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:39,760 Speaker 2: alcohol and alcohol consumption, and how we can help them 356 00:18:39,879 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 2: also break away from those patterns. 357 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:44,840 Speaker 1: I love that helping across generations. 358 00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:48,680 Speaker 2: I love that we're talking about different generations and how 359 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:53,199 Speaker 2: patterns of drinking alcohol have changed over time, because I 360 00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:54,840 Speaker 2: don't know what was it like for you, Shany when 361 00:18:54,879 --> 00:18:58,080 Speaker 2: you were eighteen or younger and kind of in that 362 00:18:58,159 --> 00:19:00,399 Speaker 2: phase of maybe drinking a bit more. What was that 363 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:00,959 Speaker 2: period like. 364 00:19:01,159 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's really interesting because I don't think I had 365 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:05,799 Speaker 1: the typical I don't even know what typical is. But 366 00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:08,999 Speaker 1: for me, I didn't really go out much and go 367 00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:12,239 Speaker 1: clubbing because I know, I've been with Yo since I 368 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:16,119 Speaker 1: was really young, so I think if anything, Yo and 369 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:17,960 Speaker 1: I and some of our friends we might go out 370 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:20,439 Speaker 1: to like cocktail bars, because that's it was starting to 371 00:19:20,639 --> 00:19:23,119 Speaker 1: come into the scene, but they were still a bit underground, 372 00:19:23,159 --> 00:19:26,519 Speaker 1: so I did feel pretty cool. But we would go 373 00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:29,359 Speaker 1: out to cocktail bars and have a lot of drinks 374 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:32,239 Speaker 1: and enjoyed in that way and then just became the 375 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,400 Speaker 1: new thing because it we knew bars popping up as well. 376 00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 1: So yo, and I'll be constantly going out and enjoying that. 377 00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:42,879 Speaker 1: But yeah, we don't do that anymore. We've changed. Times 378 00:19:42,919 --> 00:19:44,000 Speaker 1: have definitely changed. 379 00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:48,999 Speaker 2: It's interesting how our relationship with alcohol can be so 380 00:19:49,159 --> 00:19:53,920 Speaker 2: influenced by those around us and how they drink as well, 381 00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:56,119 Speaker 2: because I know, for me, like I grew up in 382 00:19:56,159 --> 00:20:00,639 Speaker 2: a family where my parents rarely drink, like maybe a 383 00:20:00,639 --> 00:20:03,560 Speaker 2: glass of wine at Christmas and New Year's like that's 384 00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 2: about it. Maybe a birth but there's no a regular 385 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:11,160 Speaker 2: alcohol consumption or just like casual alcohol consumption. It's very 386 00:20:11,159 --> 00:20:13,199 Speaker 2: specific moments in the year. I could count them on 387 00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:15,879 Speaker 2: one hand, and so that was normal for me growing up. 388 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:18,520 Speaker 2: Alcohol wasn't really a thing that was a common part 389 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:20,679 Speaker 2: of what I saw day to day. But I know 390 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:23,959 Speaker 2: I've certainly worked with people who say that, you know, 391 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:27,280 Speaker 2: they saw their mum drink when they got home after 392 00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:29,560 Speaker 2: a hard day, or their dad, you know, had a 393 00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:31,959 Speaker 2: couple of beers before going to bed to unwind. And 394 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:35,320 Speaker 2: so I think the environments we grow up with or 395 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:38,759 Speaker 2: the people that were around during those influential years can 396 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:40,640 Speaker 2: really shape our own relationship to alcohol. 397 00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:43,119 Speaker 1: Well, it's interesting because I mean, just talking about that. 398 00:20:43,399 --> 00:20:45,679 Speaker 1: I just thought about this one time where because I 399 00:20:45,679 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 1: had a lot of cousins that were a lot older 400 00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:49,959 Speaker 1: to me, and I was always a younger cousin and 401 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:53,600 Speaker 1: that family gatherings, like I'd always just wonder why my 402 00:20:53,679 --> 00:20:56,239 Speaker 1: cousins would change as the night progress, and it was 403 00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:59,520 Speaker 1: like they will get really funny and louder, and I'm like, oh, 404 00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 1: I don't understand. But alcohol was always around at family events. 405 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:06,159 Speaker 1: So it's just again, like it interesting to hear different 406 00:21:06,159 --> 00:21:09,679 Speaker 1: people and how they were raised with alcohol around. Absolutely 407 00:21:11,159 --> 00:21:13,840 Speaker 1: after the break, doctor Anastasia is going to teach us 408 00:21:13,879 --> 00:21:16,240 Speaker 1: how we can manage our drinking over the holidays and 409 00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:20,960 Speaker 1: stay with us. Now, I know you mentioned a little 410 00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:24,919 Speaker 1: bit about sober curious before. How do we actually become 411 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,679 Speaker 1: more sober curious to. 412 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:28,919 Speaker 2: Like practically what it kind of looks like, because I 413 00:21:28,919 --> 00:21:32,600 Speaker 2: know we talked about being more intentional with our choices, 414 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 2: but some examples of what sober curious can look like 415 00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:39,760 Speaker 2: it might be doing something like dry January or dry July. 416 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,600 Speaker 2: I know dry January is a popular one after people 417 00:21:42,679 --> 00:21:45,919 Speaker 2: have been perhaps drinking more than usual over the Christmas period. 418 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:49,199 Speaker 2: But it could also be getting involved in the fundraising 419 00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:52,560 Speaker 2: initiatives that are behind some of these movements as well 420 00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:55,879 Speaker 2: around Dry July. But other things could be like making 421 00:21:55,879 --> 00:21:59,279 Speaker 2: sure you have alcohol free days during the week and 422 00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:03,640 Speaker 2: really setting yourself those intentions, choosing to drink less or 423 00:22:03,679 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 2: not at all social gatherings, so rather than feeling like 424 00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:10,760 Speaker 2: that you have an expectation on yourself to drink it 425 00:22:10,840 --> 00:22:14,359 Speaker 2: all social gatherings, choosing to only drink it some of them, 426 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:18,760 Speaker 2: and doing more activities where alcohol isn't really the focus. 427 00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:21,320 Speaker 2: There are so many things we can be doing over 428 00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:23,759 Speaker 2: the summer holidays with our friends, with our family that 429 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 2: don't need to involve alcohol or don't need to have 430 00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 2: alcohol as the focus. So really trying to lean into 431 00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:30,240 Speaker 2: those activities more. 432 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 1: I love that. So I know you were talking about 433 00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:36,519 Speaker 1: during the holiday period. So how does one manage their 434 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,840 Speaker 1: alcohol or just drinking generally around this time of year. 435 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:43,119 Speaker 2: It's a tricky time of year because we're generally going 436 00:22:43,159 --> 00:22:47,640 Speaker 2: out more, seeing people more, being more social, more functions, etc. Yeah, 437 00:22:47,879 --> 00:22:50,399 Speaker 2: so it's important to think about how we can manage alcohol. 438 00:22:50,879 --> 00:22:53,719 Speaker 2: One thing I want to say really clearly at the 439 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:57,080 Speaker 2: start is if you are someone who has been a 440 00:22:57,240 --> 00:23:02,200 Speaker 2: heavy drinker for a period of time, don't just stop drinking. 441 00:23:03,800 --> 00:23:07,640 Speaker 2: Alcohol with draw can actually be dangerous to the point 442 00:23:07,679 --> 00:23:08,400 Speaker 2: of life threatening. 443 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:09,119 Speaker 1: Wow. 444 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:13,359 Speaker 2: Yeah, So it's a key recommendation to not just stop. 445 00:23:13,399 --> 00:23:15,639 Speaker 2: If you think you're someone who has really been drinking 446 00:23:15,639 --> 00:23:19,600 Speaker 2: heavily over the past few months, then chat to a 447 00:23:19,639 --> 00:23:23,800 Speaker 2: GP before you decide to make that change for yourself 448 00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 2: to stop drinking completely. So that's just I'm just going 449 00:23:26,159 --> 00:23:27,919 Speaker 2: to put that out there for anyone that might be 450 00:23:27,919 --> 00:23:31,360 Speaker 2: important for if you don't fall into that category and 451 00:23:31,399 --> 00:23:34,600 Speaker 2: you're more a sort of casual drinker or sort of 452 00:23:34,639 --> 00:23:37,799 Speaker 2: mild to moderate drinker, I want to highlight that, like 453 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:41,760 Speaker 2: the conflict, the internal conflict to change is really normal, 454 00:23:42,399 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 2: but there are some really practical strategies we can put 455 00:23:44,639 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 2: in place, right So things like set yourself limits on 456 00:23:48,159 --> 00:23:51,199 Speaker 2: how many alcoholic beverages you're going to have when you 457 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 2: go out, write that number down in your phone and 458 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:57,119 Speaker 2: keep a log of it. Don't let people top up 459 00:23:57,119 --> 00:24:00,320 Speaker 2: your drinks because that is the easiest way to lose track. 460 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:03,800 Speaker 2: It really frustrates me. I get really worked up about 461 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,679 Speaker 2: these topics. You can probably tell when I go to 462 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:10,040 Speaker 2: events and people just top up the drink without even 463 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 2: asking me, I feel really furious. 464 00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:15,520 Speaker 1: But that's and they do it so nicely. Yeah. 465 00:24:15,639 --> 00:24:18,119 Speaker 2: Yeah, Or like suddenly I'm talking to someone and I 466 00:24:18,159 --> 00:24:20,240 Speaker 2: look back at my drink and it's full, and I'm like, 467 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:23,720 Speaker 2: hang on, hang on, what's going on here? It's really 468 00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:26,679 Speaker 2: hard to keep track. So don't let people top up 469 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:32,800 Speaker 2: your drinks. Don't get into rounds of buying drinks for people. Yeah, 470 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:36,479 Speaker 2: that's a very easy way to accidentally drink more than 471 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:38,919 Speaker 2: we were intending to because we feel obliged to be 472 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:40,919 Speaker 2: a part of the next round or to buy the 473 00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:43,719 Speaker 2: next round. Be in charge of buying your own drinks 474 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 2: and managing your own alcohol throughout the night. Avoid things 475 00:24:47,919 --> 00:24:52,920 Speaker 2: like pre drinking, make sure you are drinking water, eating food, etc. 476 00:24:53,399 --> 00:24:59,879 Speaker 2: While you are consuming alcohol, and also share your boundaries 477 00:24:59,879 --> 00:25:02,719 Speaker 2: and your limits with other people. I think a big 478 00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,600 Speaker 2: part of what can be really good about the sober 479 00:25:05,639 --> 00:25:08,759 Speaker 2: Curious movement is that it hopefully takes away some of 480 00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:12,320 Speaker 2: the stigma and shame of not drinking. You know, it's 481 00:25:12,399 --> 00:25:16,080 Speaker 2: okay to say no to drinking alcohol. It's okay to 482 00:25:16,159 --> 00:25:18,960 Speaker 2: go out with your friends and not drink. I had 483 00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:21,560 Speaker 2: an incident the other night where I was out at 484 00:25:21,639 --> 00:25:25,639 Speaker 2: karaoke and I can do karaoke completely sober. I can 485 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:29,840 Speaker 2: do anything sober, and so everyone you didn't. 486 00:25:29,639 --> 00:25:32,879 Speaker 1: Get a snippet and put it on the podcast, so good. 487 00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:37,439 Speaker 2: Everyone else was drinking alcohol and I didn't have a drink. 488 00:25:37,639 --> 00:25:40,279 Speaker 2: And someone actually came up and I didn't know them 489 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:42,879 Speaker 2: very well, and they asked me if I was pregnant. Wow, 490 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:46,600 Speaker 2: I like what? And I was actually really taken aback. 491 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:48,320 Speaker 2: I didn't know why they were asking me that question. 492 00:25:48,399 --> 00:25:50,360 Speaker 2: At first, I was like, why would you think I'm pregnant? 493 00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:52,359 Speaker 2: Have I gained weight? Like, you know, what is it? 494 00:25:52,399 --> 00:25:54,280 Speaker 2: And then I realized they said to me, because you're 495 00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:57,719 Speaker 2: not drinking, And I thought, oh my goodness. Wow, Like 496 00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:00,399 Speaker 2: there's such an expectation that when we're out socially in 497 00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 2: certain environments that we drink, that not drinking is kind 498 00:26:04,040 --> 00:26:05,479 Speaker 2: of seen as odd. 499 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:07,040 Speaker 1: So true. 500 00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:08,959 Speaker 2: I think if you're someone who wants to sort of 501 00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:12,359 Speaker 2: take that step to either reduce or stop your drinking, 502 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:16,000 Speaker 2: particularly over the holidays, lean into the courage of being 503 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:18,360 Speaker 2: able to share that with people that that's your intention. 504 00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,399 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's so good that you're talking about it, because 505 00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:24,640 Speaker 1: I feel like there's definitely times when people can keep 506 00:26:24,679 --> 00:26:27,479 Speaker 1: offering you drinks or they question why you're not drinking, 507 00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:29,720 Speaker 1: and that could be really hard, especially if like you're 508 00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:31,760 Speaker 1: the only one in that social group. 509 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, absolutely, And I think the other thing I'll 510 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,919 Speaker 2: add to this as well is if you are hosting 511 00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:42,400 Speaker 2: maybe a barbecue or a dinner or something over the holidays, 512 00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 2: if you're the host, I would encourage people to think 513 00:26:45,639 --> 00:26:50,119 Speaker 2: about how to accommodate those who don't want to drink alcohol, 514 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:54,480 Speaker 2: so making sure there's soft drinks, there's juices, or alcohol 515 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:59,080 Speaker 2: free beverages so you can get alcoholic beverages that don't 516 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:02,200 Speaker 2: actually have any alcohol in them, or low alcohol beverages 517 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:05,359 Speaker 2: as well. Just having a range of options available can 518 00:27:05,399 --> 00:27:06,879 Speaker 2: be really helpful for people as well. 519 00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:09,679 Speaker 1: I really love that because so often we think about, oh, 520 00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:11,960 Speaker 1: what are people's dietaries, but we don't actually think about, oh, 521 00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:15,440 Speaker 1: what's people's preference for beverages as well? So I really 522 00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:18,480 Speaker 1: love that. Yes, So Anastasia, you work in this space, 523 00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:21,400 Speaker 1: what are some practical resources people can go to for this? 524 00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:26,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, so look up Hello, Sunday morning. They have some 525 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,879 Speaker 2: great resources online and they also have an app that 526 00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:33,439 Speaker 2: can help you track your alcohol consumption, so whether it 527 00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 2: be sort of day to day or if you're out 528 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,040 Speaker 2: so you can use the app to help you track 529 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:40,159 Speaker 2: how you're progressing with alcohol. But they have great resources 530 00:27:40,159 --> 00:27:43,800 Speaker 2: on their website. If you are listening and you don't 531 00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:45,879 Speaker 2: live in the city and maybe you're in more regional 532 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:49,359 Speaker 2: rural areas, there's something called Sober in the Country, which 533 00:27:49,399 --> 00:27:55,119 Speaker 2: is a great movement for changing the social norms around drinking, 534 00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 2: particularly for folks who live in the country. Love that. 535 00:27:58,159 --> 00:28:00,280 Speaker 2: And then the other one is the Alcohol and Drug Foundation. 536 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 2: They have fantastic factual, evidence based information on their website 537 00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:06,720 Speaker 2: about drugs and alcohol. 538 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:14,639 Speaker 1: Anastasia, can you tell us the main takeaways from today's episode? 539 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:18,480 Speaker 2: Absolutely? First of all, there is no safe or risk 540 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:22,720 Speaker 2: free amount of alcohol that we can consume. Second, changing 541 00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 2: your relationship with alcohol doesn't need to be black or white. 542 00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:31,479 Speaker 2: Consider getting sober curious. And lastly, have a plan ahead 543 00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,159 Speaker 2: of situations where there is likely to be alcohol over 544 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:35,200 Speaker 2: the summer holidays. 545 00:28:35,399 --> 00:28:37,280 Speaker 1: If you have a burning question for us, there are 546 00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:39,600 Speaker 1: a few ways to get in contact with us. Links 547 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:40,239 Speaker 1: are in the show. 548 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:44,200 Speaker 2: Notes, and remember, while I am a psychologist, this podcast 549 00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 2: isn't a diagnostic tool, and the advice and ideas that 550 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:50,680 Speaker 2: we present here should always take into account your personal 551 00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:51,640 Speaker 2: medical history. 552 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 1: Next week's episode is all around how to handle money 553 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,239 Speaker 1: over the holiday period. Stay tuned for that one. 554 00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:02,280 Speaker 2: The senior producer of But Are You Happy is Charlie Blackman. 555 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:05,759 Speaker 1: The group executive producer is name A Brea, and social 556 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:09,519 Speaker 1: producer is Jemma Donaho. You can find us on Instagram 557 00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:12,160 Speaker 1: and TikTok search at but Are You Happy? Pod? 558 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:14,840 Speaker 2: Sound design and editing by Jacob Brown. 559 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:17,400 Speaker 1: I'm a Shani Dante and. 560 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:21,080 Speaker 2: I'm doctor Anithega Hernus. The names and stories of people 561 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:24,880 Speaker 2: discussed have been changed for the purpose of maintaining anonymity. 562 00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,959 Speaker 2: If this conversation brought up any difficult feelings for you, 563 00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:30,920 Speaker 2: we have links for more resources in the show notes 564 00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 2: around the topics we discussed today. You can also reach 565 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,720 Speaker 2: out to organizations like Lifeline or Beyond Blue if you're 566 00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:44,960 Speaker 2: wanting more immediate support. Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners 567 00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:48,360 Speaker 2: of the land and waters that this podcast is recorded 568 00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:48,520 Speaker 2: on