1 00:00:10,705 --> 00:00:13,425 Speaker 1: You're listening to Amma Mia podcast. 2 00:00:13,945 --> 00:00:17,465 Speaker 2: Mama Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters 3 00:00:17,505 --> 00:00:22,065 Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on Makeup is My Therapy. 4 00:00:22,265 --> 00:00:25,265 Speaker 2: I'm in love, I'm obsess and I don't even feel 5 00:00:25,305 --> 00:00:26,105 Speaker 2: guilty about it. 6 00:00:28,545 --> 00:00:31,505 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to you Beauty, the daily podcast for 7 00:00:31,545 --> 00:00:34,825 Speaker 1: Your Face. I'm Aaron Dougherty and welcome to the formula. 8 00:00:35,545 --> 00:00:37,705 Speaker 1: Every week I sit down with celebs and some of 9 00:00:37,745 --> 00:00:40,225 Speaker 1: the biggest names in beauty and take a look into 10 00:00:40,225 --> 00:00:43,865 Speaker 1: their skincare routines and newbies. Have you ever looked in 11 00:00:43,865 --> 00:00:47,985 Speaker 1: the mirror and wondered will these acne scars ever fade? Well, 12 00:00:48,185 --> 00:00:52,665 Speaker 1: you're not alone. Acney affects one point five million people 13 00:00:52,705 --> 00:00:56,145 Speaker 1: in Australia every year and the crolest bit about it 14 00:00:56,185 --> 00:00:59,385 Speaker 1: is that, according to Oxford studies, fifty five percent of 15 00:00:59,425 --> 00:01:03,225 Speaker 1: people with acne will then end up experiencing some form 16 00:01:03,225 --> 00:01:06,425 Speaker 1: of facial scarring, which is just the pits. It can 17 00:01:06,465 --> 00:01:09,385 Speaker 1: be super overwhelming to deal with and there's lots of 18 00:01:09,425 --> 00:01:13,945 Speaker 1: my information and stigma online. So today uvi's We've got 19 00:01:13,985 --> 00:01:17,865 Speaker 1: the ultimate guide for you. Joining us is Dtor Shammy Thesen, 20 00:01:18,105 --> 00:01:22,105 Speaker 1: a leading Australian dermatologist with degrees from Melbourne University and 21 00:01:22,225 --> 00:01:26,265 Speaker 1: Harvard under her belt and features in Vogue, Harper's Bizarre 22 00:01:26,305 --> 00:01:30,425 Speaker 1: and Mamma Mia. Doctor Shammy knows exactly what it takes 23 00:01:30,425 --> 00:01:34,505 Speaker 1: to transform skin that's been through the ringer. From understanding 24 00:01:34,545 --> 00:01:38,505 Speaker 1: what really causes acne scars to discovering the best treatments 25 00:01:38,545 --> 00:01:41,505 Speaker 1: and the best products to help fade them, Doctor Shammy 26 00:01:41,665 --> 00:01:44,265 Speaker 1: is here to break it all down for us. She's 27 00:01:44,345 --> 00:01:46,985 Speaker 1: also here to prove to us that you don't have 28 00:01:47,105 --> 00:01:50,785 Speaker 1: to spend so much on products and sometimes the simplest 29 00:01:50,825 --> 00:01:54,465 Speaker 1: and most affordable solutions are the best. So whether you're 30 00:01:54,505 --> 00:01:57,385 Speaker 1: into sav or spendye products, this one's for you. 31 00:01:57,945 --> 00:02:01,505 Speaker 2: You are such beautiful skill. But how. 32 00:02:03,105 --> 00:02:05,505 Speaker 1: Doctor Shammy, thank you so much for joining me on 33 00:02:05,545 --> 00:02:08,065 Speaker 1: the show today, all the way from Melvin. I'm so 34 00:02:08,105 --> 00:02:08,945 Speaker 1: excited to have here. 35 00:02:09,225 --> 00:02:11,705 Speaker 2: I know, well, I'm really excited to do this. Thank 36 00:02:11,745 --> 00:02:12,465 Speaker 2: you for having me. 37 00:02:12,745 --> 00:02:14,945 Speaker 1: I have all of the questions for you, approximately all 38 00:02:14,985 --> 00:02:18,905 Speaker 1: of the questions, But I want to focus on acne 39 00:02:19,025 --> 00:02:21,185 Speaker 1: scarring today because I think it's a lot of people 40 00:02:21,265 --> 00:02:23,985 Speaker 1: in our you Beauty Facebook group, we have so many 41 00:02:23,985 --> 00:02:27,825 Speaker 1: messages all the time about acne scarring. What's good in 42 00:02:27,905 --> 00:02:32,305 Speaker 1: terms of treatments products. Where do you start? So let's 43 00:02:32,305 --> 00:02:34,625 Speaker 1: get into it, shall we. Yes. First time, I want 44 00:02:34,625 --> 00:02:37,945 Speaker 1: to ask you, why do some people develop acne scars 45 00:02:38,065 --> 00:02:39,305 Speaker 1: and some people don't? 46 00:02:39,545 --> 00:02:42,105 Speaker 2: You know, it sounds like that's smoking analogy. You know, 47 00:02:42,185 --> 00:02:44,705 Speaker 2: how they are smokers that smoke forever and don't develop 48 00:02:44,825 --> 00:02:47,825 Speaker 2: anything bad, and then they're people who you know, smoke 49 00:02:47,825 --> 00:02:49,745 Speaker 2: a couple of cigarettes and they have that increased risk. 50 00:02:50,185 --> 00:02:52,825 Speaker 2: It's probably similar to that. I think your genetics comes 51 00:02:52,825 --> 00:02:56,625 Speaker 2: into play massively. So some people just scar a bit easier. 52 00:02:57,105 --> 00:03:00,505 Speaker 2: Some of us just have this massive wound healing response 53 00:03:00,625 --> 00:03:05,225 Speaker 2: after any injury. But I would say the more severe 54 00:03:05,305 --> 00:03:08,025 Speaker 2: your acne, the chances are you're going to scar more. 55 00:03:08,625 --> 00:03:12,265 Speaker 2: So every time you have a cystic nodule or you've 56 00:03:12,305 --> 00:03:16,785 Speaker 2: got those painful acne spots, your body is producing all 57 00:03:16,865 --> 00:03:21,545 Speaker 2: these cytokines and inflammatory cells that are going to break 58 00:03:21,545 --> 00:03:25,105 Speaker 2: down collagen. So I would probably say it's genetics, and 59 00:03:25,865 --> 00:03:28,105 Speaker 2: the more severe your acne is that you're going to 60 00:03:28,105 --> 00:03:28,585 Speaker 2: scar more. 61 00:03:28,625 --> 00:03:31,025 Speaker 1: It's a bugger hate when it comes down to genetics 62 00:03:31,065 --> 00:03:33,345 Speaker 1: like that. But you don't say genetics and you're like, 63 00:03:33,385 --> 00:03:34,505 Speaker 1: it's genetics Witie. 64 00:03:35,305 --> 00:03:37,385 Speaker 2: This is where you can change your genetics with that 65 00:03:37,465 --> 00:03:42,345 Speaker 2: whole epigenetics. So let's say you had an amazing skincare routine, 66 00:03:42,385 --> 00:03:44,425 Speaker 2: like tons of vitamin C and we'll get into all 67 00:03:44,505 --> 00:03:46,865 Speaker 2: of that. That's going to change the way your skin 68 00:03:46,945 --> 00:03:50,145 Speaker 2: responds to an injury. So it's genetics with a bit 69 00:03:50,185 --> 00:03:50,905 Speaker 2: of extra help. 70 00:03:51,025 --> 00:03:53,745 Speaker 1: Okay, I'm excited to get into that because that sounds 71 00:03:54,025 --> 00:03:56,105 Speaker 1: right up my alley. I want to know all about it. 72 00:03:56,545 --> 00:04:00,185 Speaker 1: What are the most effective treatments that you can have 73 00:04:00,345 --> 00:04:03,505 Speaker 1: for acne scars and how do you work out what 74 00:04:03,585 --> 00:04:06,305 Speaker 1: treatment is the best treatment for different people. 75 00:04:06,465 --> 00:04:08,425 Speaker 2: The first thing I'm going to say is acne scarring 76 00:04:08,945 --> 00:04:11,625 Speaker 2: mostly going to have to come in to see an 77 00:04:11,665 --> 00:04:16,185 Speaker 2: expert dermatologist or esthetition because it doesn't really work with 78 00:04:16,225 --> 00:04:16,945 Speaker 2: a home remedy. 79 00:04:17,145 --> 00:04:18,985 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not like you're going to go into the 80 00:04:19,065 --> 00:04:20,905 Speaker 1: chemist and then pick up a product and be like 81 00:04:20,945 --> 00:04:22,385 Speaker 1: that's going to fix my acne scarring. 82 00:04:22,665 --> 00:04:25,865 Speaker 2: No, And I think you're wasting your time really and 83 00:04:26,185 --> 00:04:29,385 Speaker 2: money unfortunately. So this is where you come in, and 84 00:04:29,465 --> 00:04:32,105 Speaker 2: I use a multi pronged approach. So first I'll be 85 00:04:32,145 --> 00:04:35,145 Speaker 2: working out whether you've got ice pick scars, where you 86 00:04:35,185 --> 00:04:38,145 Speaker 2: know these little tiny divots that are very deep, but 87 00:04:38,185 --> 00:04:41,545 Speaker 2: they're narrow on top. Have you got rolling scars where 88 00:04:41,545 --> 00:04:44,665 Speaker 2: it's wider on the top but it's shallow. Does it 89 00:04:44,785 --> 00:04:46,625 Speaker 2: have a box scar where it's like a cliff edge? 90 00:04:46,625 --> 00:04:48,145 Speaker 2: So you really want to work out what type of 91 00:04:48,145 --> 00:04:51,305 Speaker 2: acting scarring you have, how deep it is, does it 92 00:04:51,465 --> 00:04:53,945 Speaker 2: have any extra redness over it, or does it have 93 00:04:53,985 --> 00:04:58,225 Speaker 2: any extra pigmentation? And then I use that combination approach. 94 00:04:58,305 --> 00:05:01,585 Speaker 2: So I love this analogy. One of my regular interstate 95 00:05:01,625 --> 00:05:03,865 Speaker 2: of patients. Like you know, have you've seen things on 96 00:05:04,305 --> 00:05:06,585 Speaker 2: TikTok and insta where people go to Korea and have 97 00:05:06,705 --> 00:05:09,305 Speaker 2: like six different treatments and they just like, you know, 98 00:05:09,345 --> 00:05:10,265 Speaker 2: smash their face. 99 00:05:10,385 --> 00:05:13,545 Speaker 3: Yeah, she goes, I travel, Yeah, brand new face. So 100 00:05:13,585 --> 00:05:16,425 Speaker 3: she goes, I'll just travel to you know, Ode and Fitzroy. 101 00:05:16,505 --> 00:05:19,545 Speaker 3: Fitzroy's my career kind of thing. So she'll come in 102 00:05:19,745 --> 00:05:22,145 Speaker 3: and depending on her type of acne scarring, I might 103 00:05:22,185 --> 00:05:26,425 Speaker 3: do radio frequency micro needling. I'll do a combination of 104 00:05:26,705 --> 00:05:29,185 Speaker 3: a bladive and a non ablative laser so or something 105 00:05:29,225 --> 00:05:32,065 Speaker 3: like halo, and then I might inject the whole face 106 00:05:32,145 --> 00:05:36,745 Speaker 3: with salmon sperm DNA like read ran and just then 107 00:05:36,785 --> 00:05:39,305 Speaker 3: do some bbl in ten sixty four laser. You want 108 00:05:39,345 --> 00:05:42,265 Speaker 3: to really go hard, so you play hard I think 109 00:05:42,305 --> 00:05:43,225 Speaker 3: with acne scarring. 110 00:05:43,505 --> 00:05:45,305 Speaker 1: And it all comes to as you said, it's like 111 00:05:45,345 --> 00:05:48,665 Speaker 1: a prescription. You need like a completely individualized treatment. It's 112 00:05:48,785 --> 00:05:50,745 Speaker 1: not as if you're like, okay, I'll just get the 113 00:05:50,785 --> 00:05:52,145 Speaker 1: standard XYZ. 114 00:05:52,785 --> 00:05:54,625 Speaker 2: I know. I wish that we could just do like 115 00:05:54,665 --> 00:05:57,265 Speaker 2: the standard protocol where you know, you get like a 116 00:05:57,265 --> 00:05:58,905 Speaker 2: happy meal or something exactly. 117 00:05:58,945 --> 00:06:02,305 Speaker 1: But you're like, I'll take the small drink and toy thanks. 118 00:06:02,665 --> 00:06:05,665 Speaker 2: I know, but it just doesn't work. Yeah, And I 119 00:06:05,665 --> 00:06:08,865 Speaker 2: think that's where we as the consumer get really frustrated 120 00:06:09,105 --> 00:06:11,425 Speaker 2: because you know, do your research and you be like, oh, okay, 121 00:06:11,505 --> 00:06:14,625 Speaker 2: I think for me, radiofrequency micro needling will be it. 122 00:06:15,145 --> 00:06:16,985 Speaker 1: And I think because you say it on social media 123 00:06:17,025 --> 00:06:19,905 Speaker 1: as well, when you see so many people with great results, 124 00:06:20,025 --> 00:06:23,625 Speaker 1: they'll often say I got you know, radio frequency micro needling, 125 00:06:23,665 --> 00:06:25,425 Speaker 1: and you're like, okay, so that's it. That's the thing 126 00:06:25,465 --> 00:06:27,865 Speaker 1: I need that will help me. But as you said, 127 00:06:27,905 --> 00:06:29,265 Speaker 1: it's not a one size fit sole. 128 00:06:29,265 --> 00:06:31,385 Speaker 2: No, And then you know you might overdo it and 129 00:06:31,465 --> 00:06:34,145 Speaker 2: have loss of your fat pads and then look old 130 00:06:34,185 --> 00:06:34,785 Speaker 2: and saggy. 131 00:06:34,985 --> 00:06:38,545 Speaker 1: That terrifies me. I've heard that and I h I 132 00:06:38,825 --> 00:06:41,905 Speaker 1: I've had our f micronaedling before, and it's honestly in 133 00:06:41,945 --> 00:06:45,025 Speaker 1: the back of my mind constantly being like, sorry, was 134 00:06:45,025 --> 00:06:45,705 Speaker 1: that the right show? 135 00:06:45,825 --> 00:06:46,705 Speaker 2: We can fix that. 136 00:06:47,385 --> 00:06:50,185 Speaker 1: Let's talk a little bit about collagen and your collagen 137 00:06:50,305 --> 00:06:53,025 Speaker 1: levels in your body. Does this have anything to do 138 00:06:53,425 --> 00:06:55,465 Speaker 1: with the formation of acne scars. 139 00:06:55,785 --> 00:06:57,905 Speaker 2: So, if you think about it, acne scar really is 140 00:06:57,945 --> 00:07:02,825 Speaker 2: a loss or depletion localized of collagen and elastin. So 141 00:07:02,905 --> 00:07:07,065 Speaker 2: you'll bang on about that question. Yeah, we tend to 142 00:07:07,465 --> 00:07:11,545 Speaker 2: have fluxes in our collagen product. So at any given time, 143 00:07:11,665 --> 00:07:15,665 Speaker 2: we're breaking down collagen and we're producing collagen by our 144 00:07:15,825 --> 00:07:21,465 Speaker 2: clever cells call our fibroblasts. So theoretically, for example, if 145 00:07:21,505 --> 00:07:23,985 Speaker 2: you've got a wound and you think about an active 146 00:07:24,025 --> 00:07:27,625 Speaker 2: acne as a wound, having the right collagen peptides or 147 00:07:28,065 --> 00:07:31,065 Speaker 2: having enough protein in your diet that's going to then 148 00:07:31,145 --> 00:07:35,225 Speaker 2: be broken down into amino acids and making collagen makes sense. 149 00:07:35,865 --> 00:07:39,465 Speaker 2: So I would say anyway, women, we should have enough 150 00:07:39,505 --> 00:07:43,105 Speaker 2: protein because it's going to improve our dermis, which is 151 00:07:43,145 --> 00:07:44,505 Speaker 2: that second layer of our skin. 152 00:07:44,985 --> 00:07:45,905 Speaker 1: So having the. 153 00:07:45,985 --> 00:07:49,385 Speaker 2: Right polagen peptides on board makes sense because let's say 154 00:07:49,385 --> 00:07:51,985 Speaker 2: you've got enough collagen, your skin cells are going to 155 00:07:52,185 --> 00:07:57,185 Speaker 2: absorb those broken down amino acids. And sometimes when you 156 00:07:57,385 --> 00:08:01,625 Speaker 2: have those broken down collagen peptides, your body goes, oh, 157 00:08:01,985 --> 00:08:04,825 Speaker 2: maybe you've broken it down and it kind of artificially 158 00:08:04,905 --> 00:08:05,865 Speaker 2: stimulates production. 159 00:08:06,345 --> 00:08:08,305 Speaker 1: So you're talking about topical collagen. 160 00:08:08,665 --> 00:08:11,825 Speaker 2: No, all right, this is yeah, So I think that's 161 00:08:11,825 --> 00:08:13,785 Speaker 2: something everyone needs to be aware of. You know, skin 162 00:08:13,905 --> 00:08:18,025 Speaker 2: is not just topical, your internal wellness. What you're taking 163 00:08:18,065 --> 00:08:22,865 Speaker 2: in makes a big difference with collagen peptides. That's a 164 00:08:22,865 --> 00:08:25,985 Speaker 2: bit controversial because you know, it's such a big molecule topically, 165 00:08:26,145 --> 00:08:28,705 Speaker 2: so you're not really going to absorb into the right 166 00:08:28,785 --> 00:08:29,545 Speaker 2: layer of the skin. 167 00:08:30,065 --> 00:08:30,305 Speaker 1: Though. 168 00:08:30,345 --> 00:08:34,305 Speaker 2: Now with some products, the collagen is used almost as 169 00:08:34,345 --> 00:08:38,465 Speaker 2: a humactant, so to absorb water and improve hydration, so 170 00:08:38,505 --> 00:08:41,665 Speaker 2: it might improve the look of wrinkles. But what I 171 00:08:41,785 --> 00:08:44,665 Speaker 2: think the consumers looking into for the future is something 172 00:08:44,705 --> 00:08:48,025 Speaker 2: called peptides. So there are lots of peptides. Now, there's 173 00:08:48,105 --> 00:08:53,345 Speaker 2: peptides for increased signaling of collagen production, so that makes sense. 174 00:08:53,465 --> 00:08:56,225 Speaker 2: So perhaps the only thing I would recommend if you 175 00:08:56,265 --> 00:08:59,785 Speaker 2: couldn't get to an expert dermatologist to fix your acting 176 00:08:59,785 --> 00:09:02,985 Speaker 2: scarring would be to probably use the retinal because that's 177 00:09:03,025 --> 00:09:07,745 Speaker 2: been proven to improve the production of collagen and the 178 00:09:07,865 --> 00:09:09,105 Speaker 2: right peptide combination. 179 00:09:09,745 --> 00:09:11,665 Speaker 1: I feel like peptide is going to be such a 180 00:09:11,665 --> 00:09:13,905 Speaker 1: buzzword this year because I feel like more and more 181 00:09:13,945 --> 00:09:17,785 Speaker 1: people are beginning to learn more about the ingredient. So 182 00:09:17,825 --> 00:09:20,585 Speaker 1: that's really really interesting to hear you say that. I 183 00:09:20,665 --> 00:09:22,705 Speaker 1: want to talk a little bit about prevention as well. 184 00:09:22,905 --> 00:09:25,945 Speaker 1: From your point of view, what's probably the single most 185 00:09:25,985 --> 00:09:30,225 Speaker 1: important thing that someone can do to help prevent acne 186 00:09:30,265 --> 00:09:32,745 Speaker 1: scarring in the first place. If it's not, just have 187 00:09:32,825 --> 00:09:34,225 Speaker 1: good genetics. 188 00:09:34,465 --> 00:09:38,145 Speaker 2: That's the right skincare routine. And number two is don't 189 00:09:38,265 --> 00:09:39,585 Speaker 2: touch it. 190 00:09:39,585 --> 00:09:42,345 Speaker 1: It's so hard though it is so I've never had 191 00:09:42,385 --> 00:09:44,385 Speaker 1: to bear acne, but I know the feeling of having 192 00:09:44,425 --> 00:09:49,105 Speaker 1: those cistic, hormonal pimples just get out of my face immediately, 193 00:09:49,625 --> 00:09:49,945 Speaker 1: I know. 194 00:09:50,065 --> 00:09:53,985 Speaker 2: And they're the worst to touch because they're like, you know, 195 00:09:54,025 --> 00:09:57,425 Speaker 2: the Titanic iceberg. They look kind of all right, but 196 00:09:57,545 --> 00:09:59,625 Speaker 2: they are nasty underneath. 197 00:09:59,665 --> 00:10:00,225 Speaker 1: They're raging. 198 00:10:00,385 --> 00:10:04,705 Speaker 2: Yeah, they're raging little suckers. So you don't want to 199 00:10:04,705 --> 00:10:07,385 Speaker 2: touch them. You can use topical things like you can 200 00:10:07,385 --> 00:10:10,105 Speaker 2: buy as a lake acid over the counter, can spot 201 00:10:10,185 --> 00:10:12,585 Speaker 2: treat with that. I've got my home remedy where I 202 00:10:12,705 --> 00:10:15,865 Speaker 2: use a little bit of salt topical steroid just for 203 00:10:15,945 --> 00:10:18,705 Speaker 2: that two days, mix it all in. That's a great 204 00:10:18,785 --> 00:10:21,465 Speaker 2: hack with some azlaic acid and you just dab it on. 205 00:10:22,385 --> 00:10:24,985 Speaker 1: What do you think about pimple patches on cystic I 206 00:10:25,145 --> 00:10:27,545 Speaker 1: like them. I like pimples as well. 207 00:10:27,425 --> 00:10:29,465 Speaker 2: Yes, because firstly, you're not going to touch them, which 208 00:10:29,505 --> 00:10:31,745 Speaker 2: is going to be the biggest gain that you're going 209 00:10:31,745 --> 00:10:35,505 Speaker 2: to do for yourself. And that bit of silicon in 210 00:10:35,545 --> 00:10:39,625 Speaker 2: there also flattens the spot cosmetically. But the other trick 211 00:10:39,665 --> 00:10:41,945 Speaker 2: with pimple patches is not to leave them on for 212 00:10:42,065 --> 00:10:44,545 Speaker 2: like days on end, because then you've got a festering 213 00:10:44,585 --> 00:10:47,025 Speaker 2: thing that you're covering up, you know, cover it up 214 00:10:47,025 --> 00:10:49,865 Speaker 2: for a day or two and then start using your topical. 215 00:10:49,985 --> 00:10:53,665 Speaker 2: So in terms of hacking your genetics, like epigenetics, you'd 216 00:10:53,665 --> 00:10:57,825 Speaker 2: be incorporating a vitamin C serum long term, a vitamin 217 00:10:57,905 --> 00:11:00,785 Speaker 2: B three, So nic cinemide is vitamin B three that's 218 00:11:00,825 --> 00:11:04,945 Speaker 2: going to reduce cebin production or oil production. It's anti inflammatory, 219 00:11:04,945 --> 00:11:10,105 Speaker 2: it's antioxidant. It's just a multitasker and a retinol or 220 00:11:10,785 --> 00:11:12,105 Speaker 2: lactic acid serum at night. 221 00:11:12,465 --> 00:11:15,185 Speaker 1: I think that's some great advice for the ubi's out 222 00:11:15,225 --> 00:11:18,825 Speaker 1: there who especially. I think there's this thing that you know, 223 00:11:18,865 --> 00:11:20,785 Speaker 1: when you're like thirties and over, you're kind of like, 224 00:11:20,825 --> 00:11:22,145 Speaker 1: why am I still dealing with this? 225 00:11:22,265 --> 00:11:22,465 Speaker 2: Oh? 226 00:11:22,585 --> 00:11:25,625 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you're kind of like scrambling to find the answer. 227 00:11:30,825 --> 00:11:34,265 Speaker 1: What are some of the biggest myths about acne scarring 228 00:11:34,265 --> 00:11:37,545 Speaker 1: in particular that you wish people would stop believing in the. 229 00:11:37,505 --> 00:11:40,065 Speaker 2: Biggest thing would be, you know, the causes for acne. 230 00:11:40,145 --> 00:11:41,825 Speaker 2: A lot of people think that you've got to over 231 00:11:41,905 --> 00:11:44,945 Speaker 2: cleanse your face, like it's all about getting. 232 00:11:44,985 --> 00:11:45,705 Speaker 1: Con dirt off. 233 00:11:45,785 --> 00:11:48,305 Speaker 2: To dirt off, it's more like getting your makeup off 234 00:11:48,345 --> 00:11:51,385 Speaker 2: because that's pretty you know, overall going to be quite combatogenic. 235 00:11:51,865 --> 00:11:54,265 Speaker 2: Go slow with cleansing your face, so in fact, you 236 00:11:54,345 --> 00:11:56,945 Speaker 2: might drop it down to just once a day at nighttime. 237 00:11:57,345 --> 00:12:00,745 Speaker 2: And the other thing is that correlation between your gut health, 238 00:12:00,825 --> 00:12:05,385 Speaker 2: your sleep and acne. I think that's sometimes lost because 239 00:12:06,065 --> 00:12:09,345 Speaker 2: our gut is really just an extension of our skin 240 00:12:09,425 --> 00:12:11,465 Speaker 2: micro biome, So you really want to work on that 241 00:12:11,545 --> 00:12:13,065 Speaker 2: internal wellness. 242 00:12:12,985 --> 00:12:15,665 Speaker 1: More of a holistic approach rather than just yeah. 243 00:12:15,785 --> 00:12:17,625 Speaker 2: And I think the other biggest thing is for acne 244 00:12:17,745 --> 00:12:20,185 Speaker 2: is that, oh you see a dermatologist, She's just going 245 00:12:20,225 --> 00:12:23,145 Speaker 2: to put you on racketane. You know. I think there 246 00:12:23,305 --> 00:12:27,585 Speaker 2: is now, especially like atodematology. I've invested in a laser 247 00:12:27,625 --> 00:12:31,305 Speaker 2: that actually cures acne, something called the Abby Clear without 248 00:12:31,585 --> 00:12:35,705 Speaker 2: good things about this, I know, and without any drugs, 249 00:12:36,465 --> 00:12:39,025 Speaker 2: and you get better results than that strong vitamin A 250 00:12:39,145 --> 00:12:42,825 Speaker 2: tablets without any side effects. So technology is moving on, 251 00:12:43,385 --> 00:12:47,065 Speaker 2: and I think invest in all your options. 252 00:12:47,145 --> 00:12:49,425 Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's not always just got to go on 253 00:12:49,505 --> 00:12:52,865 Speaker 1: medication and that's yeah. Could you just jump into a 254 00:12:52,905 --> 00:12:56,265 Speaker 1: skincare routine, like a full skincare routine for someone with 255 00:12:56,345 --> 00:13:01,225 Speaker 1: acne scars? I mean, what is your self carotine? Give 256 00:13:01,305 --> 00:13:02,345 Speaker 1: us the dirty details. 257 00:13:05,345 --> 00:13:08,945 Speaker 2: Okay, So we spoke about how ultimately it's the inclinic 258 00:13:08,985 --> 00:13:11,185 Speaker 2: treatments are going to ge be that best bang. Should 259 00:13:11,185 --> 00:13:14,825 Speaker 2: we start with PM because I think everything starts at 260 00:13:14,905 --> 00:13:18,225 Speaker 2: night with healing. I would start with a very gentle, 261 00:13:18,305 --> 00:13:21,785 Speaker 2: creamy cleanser. So there's so many good options on the 262 00:13:21,825 --> 00:13:25,465 Speaker 2: market stead of film, make a seramide rich cleanser that's 263 00:13:25,545 --> 00:13:29,625 Speaker 2: very budget friendly, you do a double cleanse. You might 264 00:13:29,665 --> 00:13:32,745 Speaker 2: even use the Bioderma my cellar water that I'm obsessed 265 00:13:32,785 --> 00:13:34,105 Speaker 2: with to remove your makeup. 266 00:13:34,425 --> 00:13:34,985 Speaker 1: I love that. 267 00:13:35,185 --> 00:13:38,225 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just so non irritating and it's perfect to 268 00:13:38,265 --> 00:13:41,105 Speaker 2: start with that, and then a creamy cleanser. For those 269 00:13:41,145 --> 00:13:44,545 Speaker 2: who have extra money to spend, I would even recommend 270 00:13:44,545 --> 00:13:48,985 Speaker 2: the number four cleanser Birationale. That's gorgeous. That removing makeup 271 00:13:49,145 --> 00:13:52,545 Speaker 2: and still hydrating your skin. Then you want to keep 272 00:13:52,545 --> 00:13:54,425 Speaker 2: your pores under control. You want to keep your oil 273 00:13:54,465 --> 00:13:57,705 Speaker 2: glands under control when you have acne tendency, So you 274 00:13:57,705 --> 00:14:01,105 Speaker 2: would start with a lactic acid serum. There's a few 275 00:14:01,185 --> 00:14:04,305 Speaker 2: great ones on the market. Even make a really good 276 00:14:04,465 --> 00:14:08,785 Speaker 2: gentle lactic acid with sussanic acid call the Event Clearance Gel. 277 00:14:08,985 --> 00:14:11,065 Speaker 1: And that's when you get from the chemistru. Yeah. 278 00:14:11,185 --> 00:14:14,905 Speaker 2: Actually it's called the even Cleon serum. So if they've 279 00:14:14,905 --> 00:14:16,865 Speaker 2: got a cleansing girl with that too, But this is 280 00:14:16,905 --> 00:14:20,025 Speaker 2: the serum that's going to decongest your pause. And then 281 00:14:20,065 --> 00:14:23,505 Speaker 2: the right retinal. I say the right retinal because I 282 00:14:23,545 --> 00:14:26,585 Speaker 2: don't like people jumping onto that prescription retinal. 283 00:14:27,145 --> 00:14:29,865 Speaker 1: Tell me about the right retinal, because that's the thing 284 00:14:30,265 --> 00:14:32,905 Speaker 1: I think if you look in especially the ubud Facebook group, 285 00:14:32,945 --> 00:14:37,425 Speaker 1: there are so many people recommending prescription retinal. It's very 286 00:14:37,465 --> 00:14:39,905 Speaker 1: hard because I think when you've got a certain budget 287 00:14:39,945 --> 00:14:42,265 Speaker 1: as well, you kind of want to know what's worth 288 00:14:42,305 --> 00:14:42,785 Speaker 1: spending on. 289 00:14:43,185 --> 00:14:45,585 Speaker 2: Yes, and retinol is so important. I mean, it's the 290 00:14:45,585 --> 00:14:50,425 Speaker 2: most studied active that we have. As dermatologist. Give you 291 00:14:50,465 --> 00:14:53,065 Speaker 2: a little tip. I'm a dermatologist for years and I 292 00:14:53,185 --> 00:14:55,385 Speaker 2: never use prescription retinal. 293 00:14:55,745 --> 00:14:58,945 Speaker 1: So what would you recommend before just jumping into that 294 00:14:59,025 --> 00:15:00,945 Speaker 1: and being like, okay, everyone says that's the thing. 295 00:15:02,505 --> 00:15:04,865 Speaker 2: No, I would use a prescription retinal if you know 296 00:15:04,905 --> 00:15:09,385 Speaker 2: you're really used to using retinal for years and it 297 00:15:09,385 --> 00:15:12,345 Speaker 2: does not irritate your barrier. Really, I just use it 298 00:15:12,385 --> 00:15:15,065 Speaker 2: for back acne, So it's not something you put on 299 00:15:15,105 --> 00:15:20,345 Speaker 2: your face. So as a beginner, look for encapsulated retinals. Okay, 300 00:15:20,505 --> 00:15:24,065 Speaker 2: start with a low dose zero point three percent, because 301 00:15:24,465 --> 00:15:28,025 Speaker 2: a retinol that you use every night is way better 302 00:15:28,585 --> 00:15:30,705 Speaker 2: than a retinol that you just reach for once in 303 00:15:30,745 --> 00:15:31,225 Speaker 2: two weeks. 304 00:15:31,345 --> 00:15:33,185 Speaker 1: Yeah, and then be like it tore my face up. 305 00:15:33,305 --> 00:15:36,705 Speaker 2: Yeah, And because a lot of people have retinoid dermatitis, 306 00:15:36,785 --> 00:15:39,625 Speaker 2: which is like a perioral dermatatis. You're red, you're flaky, 307 00:15:39,665 --> 00:15:41,705 Speaker 2: you're breaking out, your barrier is shot, and then you 308 00:15:42,225 --> 00:15:45,545 Speaker 2: just go back to using QV forever and that's not fun. 309 00:15:45,625 --> 00:15:46,425 Speaker 1: No offense to QV. 310 00:15:46,825 --> 00:15:49,465 Speaker 2: But you know what I mean, Like we've we've alreaden that, 311 00:15:50,225 --> 00:15:50,865 Speaker 2: oh vastly. 312 00:15:51,185 --> 00:15:51,985 Speaker 1: Oh my god. 313 00:15:52,185 --> 00:15:54,585 Speaker 2: So find the right retinol. There are some great brands. 314 00:15:54,705 --> 00:15:57,105 Speaker 2: I like the is clinical point three percent retinol. I 315 00:15:57,145 --> 00:16:00,145 Speaker 2: think that's a game changer, worth the investment, and it 316 00:16:00,265 --> 00:16:01,865 Speaker 2: last ages. 317 00:16:01,945 --> 00:16:03,705 Speaker 1: Clinical I feel is very underrated. 318 00:16:03,825 --> 00:16:06,705 Speaker 2: Oh my god. It's one of the best brands out there, 319 00:16:06,745 --> 00:16:10,505 Speaker 2: I think because it's low toxicity, which is huge as 320 00:16:10,545 --> 00:16:12,705 Speaker 2: you get older, you want to reduce things that are 321 00:16:12,705 --> 00:16:16,625 Speaker 2: going to disrupt your endocrine function. So they're very little 322 00:16:16,665 --> 00:16:20,505 Speaker 2: endocrine disruptors or none. And it's all kind of botanical based, 323 00:16:20,745 --> 00:16:25,985 Speaker 2: so wherever possible, they using potent botanicals without sensitizing your. 324 00:16:25,825 --> 00:16:28,865 Speaker 1: Skin, for example, but recommendation, you know. 325 00:16:28,905 --> 00:16:32,425 Speaker 2: I like Keels. The Keels point three percent retinols Gorgeous 326 00:16:33,185 --> 00:16:36,425 Speaker 2: Rationales number six is also potent. It's got some DNA 327 00:16:36,545 --> 00:16:39,545 Speaker 2: repair enzymes in there, so it's kind of trying to 328 00:16:39,585 --> 00:16:42,785 Speaker 2: hack your genetics. I like the Laroche per se retinal. 329 00:16:43,585 --> 00:16:46,905 Speaker 2: You know, not a massive fan of the ordinary retinal. 330 00:16:46,905 --> 00:16:50,505 Speaker 2: I think it's a bit irritating. But laroche that's very 331 00:16:50,545 --> 00:16:52,745 Speaker 2: accessible and you could start with that. 332 00:16:53,105 --> 00:16:55,785 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd love that. I think it's just finding something 333 00:16:55,785 --> 00:16:57,785 Speaker 1: that works for your skin and as you said, not 334 00:16:57,825 --> 00:17:00,385 Speaker 1: going too hard, too fast, and kind of working your 335 00:17:00,385 --> 00:17:03,105 Speaker 1: way into it slowly. But that's so great to hear that. 336 00:17:03,145 --> 00:17:06,745 Speaker 1: There's so many affordable products on the market that, you 337 00:17:06,785 --> 00:17:11,265 Speaker 1: know a dermatologist would recommend, confusing and you think you've 338 00:17:11,265 --> 00:17:13,625 Speaker 1: got to spend lots. Talk to me a little bit 339 00:17:13,625 --> 00:17:15,225 Speaker 1: about a morning routine. 340 00:17:15,505 --> 00:17:18,425 Speaker 2: So your morning routine would be splash a bit of 341 00:17:18,425 --> 00:17:21,225 Speaker 2: water on your face, a little sprits with some thermal water, 342 00:17:21,825 --> 00:17:24,825 Speaker 2: and then I would put on your vitamin B three 343 00:17:25,265 --> 00:17:28,185 Speaker 2: and then your vitamin C or you can alternate them, 344 00:17:28,465 --> 00:17:30,985 Speaker 2: and then your sunscreen super super important. 345 00:17:31,105 --> 00:17:33,105 Speaker 1: Keep it simple like that, yeah. 346 00:17:33,185 --> 00:17:36,305 Speaker 2: Because sunscreen is very important for acting scarring because if 347 00:17:36,345 --> 00:17:41,785 Speaker 2: you think about minimizing further collagen or elastin breakdown, sun 348 00:17:41,865 --> 00:17:43,985 Speaker 2: damage is a big factor there. So you want to 349 00:17:44,185 --> 00:17:49,065 Speaker 2: mitigate that UV aspect to further loss of collagen. And 350 00:17:49,105 --> 00:17:52,305 Speaker 2: obviously never smoke. Get your sleep right you know, try 351 00:17:52,345 --> 00:17:54,865 Speaker 2: to go to bed by ten. You get that peaks 352 00:17:54,905 --> 00:17:57,185 Speaker 2: of deep sleep, you know, from ten to two am. 353 00:17:57,305 --> 00:17:59,705 Speaker 2: So really do all the right things to repair your skin, 354 00:18:00,225 --> 00:18:04,345 Speaker 2: and you might collagen supplement orally you might be obsessive 355 00:18:04,385 --> 00:18:05,745 Speaker 2: about your protein intake. 356 00:18:06,025 --> 00:18:09,025 Speaker 1: A holistic approach. That is such great advice. And I 357 00:18:09,185 --> 00:18:12,425 Speaker 1: love all of those product recommendations. I think there's both 358 00:18:12,465 --> 00:18:15,505 Speaker 1: budget and you know, spendier options there. 359 00:18:15,585 --> 00:18:16,905 Speaker 2: Should we talk about peptides. 360 00:18:17,065 --> 00:18:18,025 Speaker 1: Talk about peptides. 361 00:18:18,065 --> 00:18:19,825 Speaker 2: Tell me about the peptides so you know what you 362 00:18:19,865 --> 00:18:22,425 Speaker 2: recommend was a cynic for peptides in the past because 363 00:18:22,585 --> 00:18:25,585 Speaker 2: you know, there wasn't that efficacy data, but now things 364 00:18:25,585 --> 00:18:28,665 Speaker 2: have improved. So peptides, if you're using them, you would 365 00:18:28,745 --> 00:18:31,025 Speaker 2: use them the first thing on your cleansed face, so 366 00:18:31,065 --> 00:18:33,105 Speaker 2: you can incorporate them morning or night. 367 00:18:33,465 --> 00:18:36,065 Speaker 1: What would you look for when you're looking at peptides, 368 00:18:36,065 --> 00:18:38,065 Speaker 1: because I do feel like there are a lot of brands. 369 00:18:38,345 --> 00:18:39,945 Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of products that are kind 370 00:18:39,945 --> 00:18:42,705 Speaker 1: of just like, okay, we're doing peptides now. Ye, there's 371 00:18:42,745 --> 00:18:44,945 Speaker 1: been like one clinical study on one person and it 372 00:18:45,025 --> 00:18:46,145 Speaker 1: works totally. 373 00:18:46,265 --> 00:18:49,785 Speaker 2: And peptides is just a generic name for a sequence 374 00:18:49,785 --> 00:18:52,265 Speaker 2: of amino acids, and you've got peptides for rednets, you've 375 00:18:52,265 --> 00:18:55,465 Speaker 2: got peptides for collagen, So go for reputable brands. You know, 376 00:18:55,585 --> 00:18:59,265 Speaker 2: I think budget friendly options like the Ordinary make a 377 00:18:59,345 --> 00:19:02,985 Speaker 2: multi peptide, that's something to get into because peptides are 378 00:19:03,025 --> 00:19:05,705 Speaker 2: going to be little signaling molecules that will make your 379 00:19:05,745 --> 00:19:09,945 Speaker 2: collagen better or make you produce more collagen and at 380 00:19:10,545 --> 00:19:13,065 Speaker 2: so I think the Ordinary is good Paula's choice. Make 381 00:19:13,065 --> 00:19:17,425 Speaker 2: a multi peptide, They've got some good research behind them. Recently, 382 00:19:17,665 --> 00:19:21,785 Speaker 2: I've been trying the Allies of Skin multi peptide range. 383 00:19:22,065 --> 00:19:24,825 Speaker 2: You know, that's also got some growth factors in there. 384 00:19:25,065 --> 00:19:27,385 Speaker 2: The space is evolving, but I think if you've got 385 00:19:27,425 --> 00:19:30,305 Speaker 2: acne scarring, you want to be investing in the retinal 386 00:19:30,385 --> 00:19:41,145 Speaker 2: and a peptide hit you've made one of the greatest 387 00:19:41,145 --> 00:19:44,145 Speaker 2: discoveries of all time or a miss. 388 00:19:44,185 --> 00:19:49,505 Speaker 1: Never again. Never tell me about one skincare technique or 389 00:19:49,705 --> 00:19:53,745 Speaker 1: ingredient that you love one that you hate. It can 390 00:19:53,745 --> 00:19:57,065 Speaker 1: also be a viral trend or anything in the skincare world. 391 00:19:57,505 --> 00:20:00,145 Speaker 2: You know what I'm obsessed about is Gasha. 392 00:20:00,745 --> 00:20:05,865 Speaker 1: Yeah, tell me why, because I never hear dermatologist just 393 00:20:05,905 --> 00:20:09,545 Speaker 1: talk about you know, kind of using facial messaging to 394 00:20:10,105 --> 00:20:10,865 Speaker 1: tell me why. 395 00:20:10,865 --> 00:20:14,625 Speaker 2: Because I started off going this is total rubbish, you know, 396 00:20:15,425 --> 00:20:18,545 Speaker 2: but it's such an ancient technique and actually when you 397 00:20:18,665 --> 00:20:23,545 Speaker 2: start researching it, you realize that everything needs a daily 398 00:20:23,945 --> 00:20:26,345 Speaker 2: you know input, so even with your topicals using it 399 00:20:26,385 --> 00:20:29,865 Speaker 2: every day. So same thing. This is a very cost effective, 400 00:20:30,545 --> 00:20:34,105 Speaker 2: amazing technique which works on science when you actually look 401 00:20:34,145 --> 00:20:37,225 Speaker 2: into it. All the methods of how you use Squasha 402 00:20:37,505 --> 00:20:42,945 Speaker 2: ultimately drain into your lymphatics. So the lymphatic system is 403 00:20:43,065 --> 00:20:45,985 Speaker 2: like one of those gems that we need to talk about. 404 00:20:45,985 --> 00:20:49,105 Speaker 2: So everyone knows about the blood system, but the lymphatics 405 00:20:49,185 --> 00:20:52,745 Speaker 2: is where we remove all our toxins. It's this colorless 406 00:20:52,785 --> 00:20:56,625 Speaker 2: liquid that's all throughout our body. And the annoying thing 407 00:20:56,625 --> 00:20:59,705 Speaker 2: about it is it doesn't have valves, so it really 408 00:20:59,745 --> 00:21:02,425 Speaker 2: requires movement. So you know, the best thing you can 409 00:21:02,465 --> 00:21:04,585 Speaker 2: do for your wellness is probably to jump every day 410 00:21:04,665 --> 00:21:07,225 Speaker 2: like ten times. It's going to help your bones, but 411 00:21:07,265 --> 00:21:10,225 Speaker 2: it's going to push that lymphatic system and on your 412 00:21:10,225 --> 00:21:15,065 Speaker 2: face you sleep on it, your puffy gasher it's inexpensive 413 00:21:15,105 --> 00:21:19,825 Speaker 2: tool literally just pushes all that toxins. Your blood flow 414 00:21:19,865 --> 00:21:22,425 Speaker 2: improves and you look better? 415 00:21:22,745 --> 00:21:23,145 Speaker 1: Why not? 416 00:21:23,345 --> 00:21:25,345 Speaker 2: Why not? And it's like, what two minutes? 417 00:21:25,785 --> 00:21:29,265 Speaker 1: And you can use your hands as well, yes, it use. 418 00:21:29,185 --> 00:21:31,545 Speaker 2: Your knuckles, use your palm. And I think the other 419 00:21:31,545 --> 00:21:33,545 Speaker 2: thing with Guascher is that make sure you kind of 420 00:21:33,545 --> 00:21:35,265 Speaker 2: get your neck, you know, you want to kind of 421 00:21:35,585 --> 00:21:39,065 Speaker 2: push it all the way down and your armpits, so 422 00:21:39,185 --> 00:21:42,345 Speaker 2: that tap of your armpits and your clavical area. 423 00:21:42,425 --> 00:21:44,705 Speaker 1: That's huge too. A bit of self care in the 424 00:21:44,705 --> 00:21:46,185 Speaker 1: morning goes a long way, it doesn't. 425 00:21:45,905 --> 00:21:48,465 Speaker 2: It, I know, and you know, I'm like the case 426 00:21:48,545 --> 00:21:50,905 Speaker 2: result of one. But I look better on the days 427 00:21:50,945 --> 00:21:51,385 Speaker 2: that I. 428 00:21:52,345 --> 00:21:54,745 Speaker 1: You can definitely tell I think, tell me a little 429 00:21:54,745 --> 00:21:59,025 Speaker 1: bit about your missus. What is something that you're like, ah, no, needling, 430 00:21:59,345 --> 00:22:02,225 Speaker 1: micro needling, Okay, this is I think this is the 431 00:22:02,345 --> 00:22:05,705 Speaker 1: second time we had an expert talk about this. 432 00:22:05,825 --> 00:22:08,865 Speaker 2: I just think it's a lot of trauma for not 433 00:22:09,065 --> 00:22:09,585 Speaker 2: much gain. 434 00:22:10,585 --> 00:22:13,585 Speaker 1: And it's such a big treatment right now, it's so 435 00:22:13,705 --> 00:22:14,505 Speaker 1: buzz huge. 436 00:22:15,065 --> 00:22:17,185 Speaker 2: Don't get me wrong. I don't mind the whole micro 437 00:22:17,265 --> 00:22:19,265 Speaker 2: needling that you can get. You know, a low depth 438 00:22:19,385 --> 00:22:23,425 Speaker 2: needle doesn't really tear your skin. That has been shown 439 00:22:23,465 --> 00:22:29,545 Speaker 2: to improve absorption of your topicals. But this raging phase 440 00:22:29,705 --> 00:22:33,825 Speaker 2: of like everyone doing it, and you know in all 441 00:22:33,905 --> 00:22:34,705 Speaker 2: kinds of clinics. 442 00:22:35,065 --> 00:22:37,385 Speaker 1: That's the thing, because there's so much available and people 443 00:22:37,385 --> 00:22:39,785 Speaker 1: are looking for, you know, clinics that do it, you 444 00:22:39,825 --> 00:22:42,985 Speaker 1: know a little bit more affordable, and everyone's just going 445 00:22:43,025 --> 00:22:45,265 Speaker 1: no matter what your skin type. Yeah, should you see 446 00:22:45,265 --> 00:22:47,225 Speaker 1: so many people being like, it made my skin amazing. 447 00:22:47,425 --> 00:22:50,505 Speaker 2: The science behind it, you know, makes sense. So that's 448 00:22:50,545 --> 00:22:53,345 Speaker 2: the same science that we use for different laser therapies. 449 00:22:53,385 --> 00:22:57,185 Speaker 2: It's all about causing a trauma and then your wound response. Right, 450 00:22:58,185 --> 00:23:00,745 Speaker 2: But it's so I don't know, nineteen. 451 00:23:00,425 --> 00:23:01,705 Speaker 1: Hundreds, it's so hyped. 452 00:23:01,785 --> 00:23:04,705 Speaker 2: Do you think when there's such better alternatives, You know, 453 00:23:04,705 --> 00:23:07,385 Speaker 2: if I was on a desert island and that's my 454 00:23:07,465 --> 00:23:10,425 Speaker 2: only tool, sure, but even then terrible because they'll be 455 00:23:10,505 --> 00:23:11,345 Speaker 2: like terrible son. 456 00:23:12,065 --> 00:23:16,385 Speaker 1: So I think of your like, technically I'll be on 457 00:23:16,425 --> 00:23:18,505 Speaker 1: that island, so obviously the sun will be too much 458 00:23:18,545 --> 00:23:18,905 Speaker 1: to do that. 459 00:23:19,865 --> 00:23:23,185 Speaker 2: I think because it's so accessible and it feels natural. 460 00:23:23,825 --> 00:23:25,705 Speaker 2: Do you know, I've realized so many people are scared 461 00:23:25,745 --> 00:23:28,905 Speaker 2: of lasers because I don't know what they think. You know, 462 00:23:28,945 --> 00:23:29,985 Speaker 2: it's going to blind you. 463 00:23:30,185 --> 00:23:35,065 Speaker 1: Everyone always just thinks of I think that scene from friends, 464 00:23:35,145 --> 00:23:37,985 Speaker 1: even with like chemical peels and lasers. They're like, I'm 465 00:23:37,985 --> 00:23:40,185 Speaker 1: gonna end up like Ross, but I'd rather just get 466 00:23:40,225 --> 00:23:42,745 Speaker 1: stabbed multiple times in the face by a tiny device 467 00:23:43,825 --> 00:23:44,385 Speaker 1: and just. 468 00:23:44,425 --> 00:23:46,985 Speaker 2: Like tear your face. No chance. 469 00:23:47,105 --> 00:23:49,705 Speaker 1: Okay, So that's a hard miss and not the first 470 00:23:49,745 --> 00:23:53,345 Speaker 1: time we've had an expert say that. Oh good, very interesting, 471 00:23:53,745 --> 00:23:55,905 Speaker 1: Doctor Shemi. I'm gonna leave it here, but thank you 472 00:23:55,985 --> 00:23:59,745 Speaker 1: so much for all your amazing advice with acne scarring. 473 00:24:00,305 --> 00:24:02,225 Speaker 1: I learned so much. So I know there's lots of 474 00:24:02,305 --> 00:24:05,425 Speaker 1: ubi's listening who deal with acne scarring that you know 475 00:24:05,905 --> 00:24:08,025 Speaker 1: picked up some really great tips there, So thank you. 476 00:24:08,225 --> 00:24:10,625 Speaker 2: Oh pleasure and the men message, don't live with it, 477 00:24:10,665 --> 00:24:11,225 Speaker 2: get it better. 478 00:24:11,985 --> 00:24:14,505 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening to this episode of You Beauty. 479 00:24:14,705 --> 00:24:17,945 Speaker 1: How good was doctor Chami. Also, if you've got any 480 00:24:17,985 --> 00:24:21,145 Speaker 1: specific topics you'd like me to ask an expert about, 481 00:24:21,545 --> 00:24:24,105 Speaker 1: let me know. Send us a DM on Instagram at 482 00:24:24,185 --> 00:24:27,385 Speaker 1: You Beauty Podcast. We'd love to hear from you and 483 00:24:27,465 --> 00:24:37,905 Speaker 1: I'll see you next week to chat all things skin. Bye.