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Speaker 1: So much.

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Speaker 2: You're listening to a Mamma Mia podcast.

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Speaker 1: Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and borders

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Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on.

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Speaker 3: From Mamma Maya. Welcome to the Spill your daily Pop

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Speaker 3: Culture Fixed.

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Speaker 1: I'm m Burnham and I'm Laura Brodnick.

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Speaker 3: And on the show today, we are talking about some

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Speaker 3: photos that have been leaked of Kylie Jenna and Timothy

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Speaker 3: Shalla May who have been spotted together.

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Speaker 2: We're also talking about.

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Speaker 3: The Kardashian family as a whole and all of their

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Speaker 3: previous relationships and what that kind of means for their

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Speaker 3: family dynamic.

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Speaker 1: But first, but first, Nicola Cochlan has come off the

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Speaker 1: press tour for Bregist in season three, just it has

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Speaker 1: to be said, just looking like a perfect celebrity angel.

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Speaker 1: People fell in love with her. She had multiple interviews,

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Speaker 1: she traveled the world, so many of her interviews went viral.

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Speaker 1: And now she's taken things one step further by taking

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Speaker 1: her viral interviews and turning them into a song. So

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Speaker 1: now she's a singer songwriter to add her like list

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Speaker 1: of accolades, including being an amazing actress. So what happened

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Speaker 1: was as she was doing the press tour for Bridgitt

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Speaker 1: in season three. She said in a radio interview for

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Speaker 1: a UK station that her dream job was to write

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Speaker 1: pop songs in the style of Real Housewives. Who I'm

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Speaker 1: not a big Real Housewives fan. I don't think you

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Speaker 1: are either, but there are a few of them who

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Speaker 1: have released pop songs with like quite funny, ridiculous lyrics

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Speaker 1: that people like their fandom have become obsessed with. So

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Speaker 1: someone like Countess Lawman who released money Can't Buy Your Class,

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Speaker 1: which is also just a fact I feel, or Erica

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Speaker 1: Jane har released Expensive That's Not with two x's, and

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Speaker 1: so Nicholas said that that would be her dream, and

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Speaker 1: she started throwing out a few lyrics in the interview.

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Speaker 2: I do you know she's a big reality TV fan.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, she loves her Housewives and now it's been turned

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Speaker 1: into a song.

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Speaker 4: Sometimes, So you know, when the Real Housewives release pop

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Speaker 4: songs just exclusively the gay men, that's like my dream

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Speaker 4: job because they don't ever really sing, they just list things,

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Speaker 4: and she is and private, Yes, yeah, Cavio, more shoes.

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Speaker 3: I think I'd probably be singing because I love to sing.

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Speaker 2: So maybe you can we can do it. We can

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Speaker 2: release an album.

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Speaker 4: This would be the perfect color.

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Speaker 1: So what happened then is that Nicola teamed up with

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Speaker 1: a songwriter and producer called Ellis Me Out to release

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Speaker 1: the song titled Shoes Dot Dot Dot more Shoes, and

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Speaker 1: it's a banger.

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Speaker 2: This one goes out.

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Speaker 4: To all the girly pops. You know when Real Housewives

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Speaker 4: released songs exclusively.

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Speaker 2: For gay man. It's like my dream job shoes.

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Speaker 4: Cavia more shoes.

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Speaker 3: So it's literally just the word she said in that

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Speaker 3: interview and they put it into it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they added a few more words around it, but

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Speaker 1: it's basically that Sorry, that's a real bop.

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Speaker 2: That is the head banger.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god, I think she's on her way to

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Speaker 3: be an EGOT recipient.

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Speaker 1: She wins a Grammy. I mean, never say never. I

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Speaker 1: mean the good thing about this song, Shoes more Shoes,

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Speaker 1: is that all the proceeds brackets shoes. It's dot dot

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Speaker 1: dot more shoes. Got it just to keep the inflection correct.

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Speaker 1: One of the best things about this is that all

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Speaker 1: the proceeds from this song are going to LGBTQ plus organizations,

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Speaker 1: not a Phase and the Trevor Project in support of

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Speaker 1: Pride Month. This month, and so anytime you stream this

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Speaker 1: song on Spotify or you know any of your players,

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Speaker 1: but you can get it on Spotify. All the proceeds

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Speaker 1: go to these charities. That's so nice.

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Speaker 2: She's so brilliant.

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Speaker 3: I was really nervous after Bridgeton of like her kind

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Speaker 3: of just disappearing in the void. But I love that

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Speaker 3: she's still one hundred percent.

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Speaker 1: She's kind of in the Far Away Tree movie, the

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Speaker 1: adaptation of the Amazing Books. So she's she's a proper

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Speaker 1: movie star. Now she'd better be so.

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Speaker 3: Celebrity gossip page De Noir has dispelled all rumors that

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Speaker 3: Kylie and Timothy Chala May has split up. They did

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Speaker 3: this by posting paparazzi shots of them going to see

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Speaker 3: a movie together. I know this sounds very like what

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Speaker 3: the hell, but trust me, there's a biggert story behind this.

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Speaker 3: So the last time they were seen in public was

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Speaker 3: at the Golden Globes, which happened in January. They have

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Speaker 3: been sources saying that they've been on dates every now

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Speaker 3: and then, but that was the last time we've seen

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Speaker 3: photographs of them together. So in the past few months,

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Speaker 3: there were so many roomor spiraling of people saying they've

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Speaker 3: definitely broken up. We haven't seen them in like what

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Speaker 3: six months until these photos were released. So the photographs

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Speaker 3: are casual looking.

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Speaker 2: They're both wearing.

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Speaker 3: Face masks, which made me think that they're sick and

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Speaker 3: they're about to enter cinema and spread germs around to

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Speaker 3: every single person.

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Speaker 1: I hope that that's not the case, but I just

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Speaker 1: think people were really angry in the comments when these

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Speaker 1: photos came out on the weekend, and it did seem

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Speaker 1: like such a big deal. And obviously their paparazzi shots

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Speaker 1: and we don't condone that, but we did look at

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Speaker 1: them because they were all throwing newsfeeds and so it

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Speaker 1: was such a big deal because people were so sure

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Speaker 1: they had broken up. I mean, there used to be

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Speaker 1: a photo of Timothy and Kylie's look screen on her phone,

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Speaker 1: so anytime she's that in public. Now, all the pat photos,

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Speaker 1: it's quite intense. I've been like zeroing in on the

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Speaker 1: phone trying to see if he's on there, and no

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Speaker 1: one's been able to put it together, and so everyone

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Speaker 1: assumes they had broken up. And because this is such

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Speaker 1: a public outing, it felt kind of like a statement.

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Speaker 1: Because they went to a theater in LA that's in

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Speaker 1: a super busy packed tourist area, a real well known

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Speaker 1: movie theater. They walked in like they weren't trying to

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Speaker 1: hide their faces except for the face masks, so I wonder.

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Speaker 1: I mean, also a lot of cities people just do

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Speaker 1: wear face masks. He's probably filming, He's trying not to

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Speaker 1: get sick, and maybe she's not trying to get sick.

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Speaker 1: I'm all for a face mask, but I understand why

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Speaker 1: celebrity would wear it because it helps to them. They

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Speaker 1: both got caps pulled down right over their faces and

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Speaker 1: then a face mask, and so unless you were looking

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Speaker 1: for them, you would not with them.

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Speaker 3: They looked like they were literally in the middle of nowhere,

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Speaker 3: like there's no one around them, not even security guards

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Speaker 3: or anything. So for me, I was like, Oh, they

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Speaker 3: literally just want to put these rumors to rest and

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Speaker 3: show everyone that they're still together, Which was really interesting

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Speaker 3: because I didn't think of this as such a big

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Speaker 3: deal until every single person I met on the weekend,

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Speaker 3: we're talking about these photos. Really, there are so many

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Speaker 3: people who love the idea of them being together, and

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Speaker 3: it reminded me when we first saw rumors of them

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Speaker 3: together I think it was like the Scissor concert when

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Speaker 3: they were like being really coddly together. And I think

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Speaker 3: it was the fact that so many people were, like,

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Speaker 3: I didn't even know they knew each other, Like they

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Speaker 3: seemed like there would be in such different social circles,

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Speaker 3: like someone from the Kadashian family and that reality TV

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Speaker 3: influencer world, and someone like Timothy who's very much in

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Speaker 3: these very artsy movies. Seeing them together just felt really

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Speaker 3: weird and real.

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Speaker 2: But everyone just loves it. So many people are rooting

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Speaker 2: for them to stay together.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I think also because I've always found it kind of

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Speaker 1: interesting that people are so shocked there together because they

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Speaker 1: are both in that kind of young Hollywood world. And

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Speaker 1: I think that became very apparent at the Golden Globes

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Speaker 1: the first time that they were filmed, and because those

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Speaker 1: videos were quite long of them saying to each other

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Speaker 1: like I love you and kissing and holding hands and like,

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Speaker 1: because they're in a public room full of cameras and

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Speaker 1: so it was such a big statement. But remember they

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Speaker 1: had that whole issue with Selena Gomez. I've forgotten Taylor

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Speaker 1: Swift and Kayleie Teller because you know, they're all in

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Speaker 1: that same world. And then that was like the biggest

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Speaker 1: takeaway that Kylie had apparently told Selena no photos with

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Speaker 1: Timothy with Timothy and then she'd gone back to her

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Speaker 1: table to tell Taylor Swift, and then Taylor Swift had

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Speaker 1: that big reaction, And we don't know if that's what happened,

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Speaker 1: but I think that was pretty clear that they're all

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Speaker 1: in the same circle of people.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it also reminds me that what we see on

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Speaker 3: the Kardashians, like the people they hang out with on

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Speaker 3: the TV show and you see paparazzi photos are so

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Speaker 3: different to the actual people behind the scenes, and you

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Speaker 3: forget that that family has so much power in Hollywood.

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Speaker 3: And it's only when you get like glimpses of them

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Speaker 3: having like dinner would Beyonce and JYZ and stuff like that,

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Speaker 3: when you're like, oh my god, I forgot, like they're

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Speaker 3: actually really well connected.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a very old school thinking to be like

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Speaker 1: they're just reality stars when they mix with like the

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Speaker 1: top people in Hollywood. And I don't know, a lot

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Speaker 1: of people are speculating that these photos are a setup.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's hard to say because it is such

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Speaker 1: a public place and there's smaller theaters they could have

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Speaker 1: gone to that they could have bought out the theater

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Speaker 1: or had privacy, Like I think it's easy to get

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Speaker 1: around if you've got the money in connections and not

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Speaker 1: be seen.

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Speaker 3: I don't know it was a setup, but I think

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Speaker 3: they were like, if we get photograph, we get photograph.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I think it was more that of just I think

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Speaker 1: sometimes even if you're super fan as their deer, having

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Speaker 1: to sneak into a brought out movie theater as opposed

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Speaker 1: to just having that urge to just wanted to walk

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Speaker 1: into a movie theater because I still.

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Speaker 3: Look beautiful, Like they look good, they look done up,

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Speaker 3: they look really well dressed.

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Speaker 1: I love that you've done like a recap of what

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Speaker 1: they look like. So he's got a long sleeve black

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Speaker 1: top one and like baggy pants and sneakers and watch

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Speaker 1: to say they're in a cap. And then she's got

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Speaker 1: long black pants and a white boob tube bringing back

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Speaker 1: the boobtube and I kind of love it cap. A

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Speaker 1: lot of people are commenting on her enormous bag, saying

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Speaker 1: that they bag, saying that it's definitely full organic snack.

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Speaker 3: She's got her vitamin water. Maybe like a little hydrolit moment. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: she's got like maybe like a little face dy Mar.

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Speaker 3: She could put a face mask on.

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Speaker 1: So they're wearing masks and caps. They've got their heads down.

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Speaker 1: They're walking separately. Like there's five photos posted to the

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Speaker 1: Dumar account of them together. They all look identical until

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Speaker 1: you start looking closer the way people have picked these

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Speaker 1: photos apart. But they're looking ahead, they're not talking, they've

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Speaker 1: got their faces covered. They're obviously trying to stay really private.

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Speaker 1: So I understand that you wouldn't go hang around the

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Speaker 1: snack counter. No, you're not going to pop.

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Speaker 3: Over to Woollies to get like your coke and chips,

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Speaker 3: Like you're definitely bringing your own snacks.

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Speaker 1: That's why she's got it in the bag.

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Speaker 3: I also love how like I think the first photo

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Speaker 3: on the slide shows like the counter where it says

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Speaker 3: twenty five dollars slat rate.

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Speaker 1: Because they're walking past the path the parking area.

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Speaker 2: Like they're just like us, twenty five dollars for a

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Speaker 2: parking way too much a.

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Speaker 1: Flat feet well coming up next. These photos have triggered

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Speaker 1: a conversation around the currency of the Kardashian Jenna family

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Speaker 1: in regards to the men in their lives, and Timothy

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Speaker 1: Chalameay has just waited right into that. So that's coming

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Speaker 1: up next. Nan. So, one interesting thing about the Timothy

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Speaker 1: and Kylie relationship, apart from the fact that we would

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Speaker 1: love them to be in some sort of a feud

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Speaker 1: Whistlin and Greenments and Taylor Swift, but I don't think that.

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Speaker 1: I don't think that's in any way happening, is how

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Speaker 1: I guess heightened her like hashet and cool factor in

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Speaker 1: a way by dating him, because I feel like when

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Speaker 1: the news first came out, it was obviously splashed over

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Speaker 1: every different news outlet and social media account that tracks celebs,

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Speaker 1: and there were so many conversations about it, and it

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Speaker 1: was just seen as almost like she had like won

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Speaker 1: a prize by bagging this very cool young Hollywood actor,

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Speaker 1: and all of a sudden there was more like social

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Speaker 1: relevance around her because of who she was dating.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I didn't actually think like that, but it did

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Speaker 3: kind of make me see her and I guess a

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Speaker 3: different sort of light. Like I think obviously getting older,

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Speaker 3: having kids, and going through a very public breakup, I

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Speaker 3: think she's now also playing into that social role of

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Speaker 3: like every little thing I do impacts my future and

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Speaker 3: especially my career, similar to what her older sisters have

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Speaker 3: also gone through.

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Speaker 1: I mean, obviously there's so many questions around how the

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Speaker 1: Kardashians track their fame and make headlines and that sort

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Speaker 1: of thing, and I think they definitely do, but I

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Speaker 1: don't think that they're in that world they would have

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Speaker 1: a full blown, months long relationship just for a few headlines.

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Speaker 1: So I think that this idea of people saying it's

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Speaker 1: a pr setup is not exactly the case behind the scenes,

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Speaker 1: especially for him, because he was already a famous movie

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Speaker 1: star with like all of these huge franchises, Like being

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Speaker 1: entangled with a famous family is not going to change that.

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Speaker 1: I just think it's interesting how like in the Kardashians,

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Speaker 1: if you look back over the twenty something years that

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Speaker 1: they've been on our screens, if you watch that show

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Speaker 1: and watch like the intricacies of it, the power dynamics

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Speaker 1: within the family often change depending on who the women

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Speaker 1: are dating, which for a show that's all about, like, say,

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Speaker 1: we want about Kadashians, but you know all about women

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Speaker 1: having businesses, making money, being really ruthless, and how they

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Speaker 1: speak and kind of being like the Alphas and their relationships.

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Speaker 1: It's interesting that, like, say, when Kim was with Kanye,

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Speaker 1: it seemed like she had a bigger power and a

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Speaker 1: bigger relevancy within the family, like people were more sort

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Speaker 1: of leaning around her to make decisions, check what she

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Speaker 1: was doing. And then I feel like that happened when

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Speaker 1: Courtney and Travis got together. There seemed to be this

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Speaker 1: more importance placed around her, more of decision making in

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Speaker 1: the family, that sort of thing hooked on her, and

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Speaker 1: even going all the way back to when Chloe married Lamar,

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Speaker 1: it's like she had been seen as like the younger sister,

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Speaker 1: the one without the relevance in the family, and then

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Speaker 1: when that happened, it's like she was elevated to more

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Speaker 1: of importance of like you can see in the family

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Speaker 1: conversations they're talking about making plans and when they're available,

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Speaker 1: or wanting to see what they think about things, or

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Speaker 1: making like changes to where they go and film their

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Speaker 1: like infamous family trips, because that's always such like a

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Speaker 1: big part of getting ratings in for those seasons. And

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Speaker 1: it's interesting how this season the dynamic with the Kadashian

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Speaker 1: seems a little bit off because for the first time ever,

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Speaker 1: Like Chloe's not in a relationship Kim's. Well, there's thoughts

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Speaker 1: that she's been in a relationship behind the scenes with

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Speaker 1: someone not famous for a while. They've just broken up,

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Speaker 1: but she wasn't with someone who was in that Davidson. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Kendall keeps her relationships very out of the show. After

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Speaker 1: Kylie and Travis broke up, there was that kind of moment.

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Speaker 1: And now because her relation and she is the one

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Speaker 1: the headlines, the currency has built around her a bit

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Speaker 1: more and.

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Speaker 3: You can even see it from the episodes, Like I

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Speaker 3: think the recent episode about her not wanting to go

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Speaker 3: on the family vacation and get on the plane, Like

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Speaker 3: it's always the person who's like the most famous in

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Speaker 3: that moment is always also like the villain of the show. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: the other sisters band together and like fully and make

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Speaker 3: fun of that one sister, And it feels like this

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Speaker 3: season Courtney's completely pulled herself out of that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so I guess you guys deal with this.

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Speaker 3: I'm gonna be here with my super famous husband. But

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Speaker 3: also I'm really interested in like Kendall because she is

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Speaker 3: really private. But I think that also changed when she

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Speaker 3: started dating bad bunny, and then he became really famous

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Speaker 3: and became one of like the chairs for the met

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Speaker 3: Gala and stuff like that. Like, it's so interesting that

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Speaker 3: the minute one of their partners or potential partners are

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Speaker 3: thrown into the spotlight, not only does the Kardashian's currency

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Speaker 3: like evolve, but also that person that they're dating as well.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent. It's so interesting again because you've

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Speaker 1: got these like group of women who again stand for

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Speaker 1: so many bad things in terms of like you know,

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Speaker 1: body image and beauty standards, but also have become these

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Speaker 1: pinnacles of like being the leader in their relationship or

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Speaker 1: being the business owner, or being like the head of

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Speaker 1: the family and having this very female dominated world. And

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Speaker 1: then at the same time, it always boils down to

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Speaker 1: them being defined by the men in their lives and

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Speaker 1: also not just in their family unit. I don't think

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Speaker 1: it's like Chloe doesn't have a boyfriend so she doesn't

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Speaker 1: get to choose where they go for dinner or I

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Speaker 1: don't think it's like that. I think it's kind of

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Speaker 1: a bigger cultural conversation. Like Kim was definitely seen as

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Speaker 1: much cooler and chica for a long time there when

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Speaker 1: she first started dating Kanye West, and I feel that

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Speaker 1: also happened with Kylie and Travis, like to an extent,

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Speaker 1: but it's even more heightened with Timothy Shalomy. And then

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Speaker 1: Courtney was never seen in that light with Scott Disick

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Speaker 1: if it was always seen as this, like it was

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Speaker 1: kind of like poor Courtney, the not cool sister with

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Speaker 1: this shady boyfriend who doesn't seem to like her, and like,

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Speaker 1: you're having kids together and he doesn't want to have kids,

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Speaker 1: and that was like the main central plotline of the

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Speaker 1: show for so long. And then when Travis and obviously

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Speaker 1: they were very public with their relationships, so that was

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Speaker 1: a whole different sort of situation. But it was like

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Speaker 1: her cool cachet changed and she became more culturally relevant

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Speaker 1: because of that. And in a way, I guess it

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Speaker 1: kind of like it's something you could see in real

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Speaker 1: life to an extent, like not that our families act

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Speaker 1: like the Kardashians. I don't know what your family does

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Speaker 1: behind closed doors.

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Speaker 2: My family are the Kardashians.

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Speaker 1: But I think in any family group or social group,

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Speaker 1: a lot of the time, if you're in a partnership,

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Speaker 1: you are sort of relegated to a higher status symbol. No,

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Speaker 1: no one wants say it out loud, it's very true.

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Speaker 1: You're relegated to a highest status symbol within the group

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Speaker 1: because there's this idea, not just because there's two of you,

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Speaker 1: also depending on who you're seeing.

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Speaker 2: An a job and then and where they live and

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Speaker 2: how the.

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Speaker 1: Rest of the group reacts to them, and you definitely

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Speaker 1: are down a few pegs and a lot of cases.

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Speaker 1: No one wants to say that loud, but it's true.

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Speaker 1: If you're the single person in the group or family,

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Speaker 1: that's true because I guess there's can be more of

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Speaker 1: like a power dynamic build up. So I think why

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Speaker 1: it's interesting is that we see that in the Kardashians

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Speaker 1: and it gets reflected back to us in real life.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so true.

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Speaker 3: Like it definitely gets reflected with partnerships. I don't think

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Speaker 3: it gets reflected the same way with friendships though, because

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Speaker 3: I think the same thing happened with the Kardashian family

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Speaker 3: and their friendship. I always think about, like how much

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Speaker 3: Kylie Jenner elevated Jordan Wood's profile when they were best

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Speaker 3: friends and then like the whole scandal happened. But she's

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Speaker 3: also really well connected to the Smith family, like Will

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Speaker 3: and Jada Smith, and I think just having those like

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Speaker 3: people who are usually behind the scenes and throwing them

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Speaker 3: in the spotlights, similar to Courtney Kardashian when she was

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Speaker 3: hanging out with Addison Ray and Megan Fox and then

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Speaker 3: they would have like all these brand deals together and

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Speaker 3: be on like TV shows and movies together.

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Speaker 1: It's different how they can change depending on who the

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Speaker 1: celebrity is, Like I think Megan Fox upped her cultural cachet,

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Speaker 1: whereas in a way, Addison Ray brought it down a

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Speaker 1: little bit, not because of who she was, just because

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Speaker 1: I guess of how that relationship was framed.

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Speaker 3: But it also gave Addison Ray an edit of like, oh,

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Speaker 3: she's really famous because she's actually hanging out with the

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Speaker 3: Kardashian Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So interesting. We won't post these photos to our Instagram

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Speaker 1: fee because they are pap shots, but I mean they're

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Speaker 1: there if you want to look at them. And I

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Speaker 1: don't know, I just hope too crazy kids make it work.

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Speaker 3: Thank you so much for listening to the Spill today.

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Speaker 3: If you love listening to the Spill, we would.

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Speaker 2: Love to know what you thought of our weekend watches.

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Speaker 2: We recommended last week.

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Speaker 3: Last week we talked about Presumed Innocent on Apple TV

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Speaker 3: and I Am sleein Dion on Prime Video.

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Speaker 2: Jump into our DMS.

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Speaker 3: Also, if you have any suggestions of what you want

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00:17:30,824 --> 00:17:32,944
Speaker 3: us to talk about, something you're watching that you really

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00:17:32,984 --> 00:17:35,424
Speaker 3: want to hear us talk about, you can jump into

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Speaker 3: our DMS again.

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Speaker 2: And let us know.

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Speaker 3: We will also link Friday's episode in the show notes

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Speaker 3: for you to listen to if you haven't already. Otherwise,

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Speaker 3: we will see you back in your podcast speed at

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Speaker 3: three pm tomorrow.

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Speaker 2: Bye bye, Lan