WEBVTT - A Joke That Went 'Too Far' & The Internet’s Biggest Cheating Scandal 0:00:08.193 --> 0:00:10.953 You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast. 0:00:16.154 --> 0:00:19.154 Hello, and welcome to MoMA Mia out Loud. It's what 0:00:19.194 --> 0:00:22.233 women are actually talking about on Monday, the twenty second 0:00:22.314 --> 0:00:25.434 of September. I'm Holly Waynwright and I am back from 0:00:25.474 --> 0:00:27.354 a sick bed where I have been laid up with 0:00:27.394 --> 0:00:29.994 the flu for a little while, dying to be back 0:00:29.994 --> 0:00:30.474 talking to you. 0:00:30.834 --> 0:00:31.794 I'm Jesse Stevens. 0:00:31.834 --> 0:00:34.594 I'm very excited that Holly is back and Maya has 0:00:34.594 --> 0:00:35.954 officially gone on holiday. 0:00:36.074 --> 0:00:38.594 She has, she's actually left the country. 0:00:38.714 --> 0:00:41.034 She did tell me she downloaded the entire three seasons 0:00:41.034 --> 0:00:43.714 of the Summer Return Pretty to watch on the plane, 0:00:43.793 --> 0:00:46.513 so prepare for that. When she returns, we'll fly. I 0:00:46.513 --> 0:00:49.753 should probably introduce myself. Hello, I'm Claire Murphy. You can 0:00:49.873 --> 0:00:53.354 usually hear me on Momma MIA's twice daily news podcast, 0:00:53.394 --> 0:00:56.874 The Quickie and on Well for all your women's health 0:00:56.954 --> 0:00:59.754 information and funny and gross stuff that our bodies do. 0:00:59.994 --> 0:01:02.874 Funny and gross stuff. My body's been doing some very 0:01:02.874 --> 0:01:08.033 funny and gross Murphy. We'll talk offline about that later. Anyway, 0:01:08.034 --> 0:01:09.954 Here's what's made our agenda for today. 0:01:10.274 --> 0:01:12.994 Jimmy Kimmel's late night show was pulled off the air 0:01:13.074 --> 0:01:18.314 last week. There's been a lot of conversation around it, politically, morally, constitutionally, 0:01:18.474 --> 0:01:19.794 but what does that all mean? 0:01:19.834 --> 0:01:21.674 Does it matter? And should we be freaking out? 0:01:21.914 --> 0:01:24.314 I don't want to alarm you out louders, but we 0:01:24.434 --> 0:01:26.834 know that you always have a little cry on your 0:01:26.874 --> 0:01:28.314 birthday and. 0:01:28.474 --> 0:01:29.554 We know why you do. 0:01:30.074 --> 0:01:33.434 And the wife guy is back, but this time without 0:01:33.434 --> 0:01:36.394 his wife. I'm going to explain one of the most 0:01:36.754 --> 0:01:39.354 ambitious comebacks in all of Internet history. 0:01:39.634 --> 0:01:42.554 But first, Jesse, in case you missed it. 0:01:42.794 --> 0:01:46.554 This morning Australian Time, a memorial service was held for 0:01:46.634 --> 0:01:51.154 conservative activist Charlie Kirk at a stadium in Phoenix, Arizona, 0:01:52.074 --> 0:01:56.154 and estimated two hundred thousand people gathered in and around 0:01:56.194 --> 0:02:00.874 the stadium and all the speakers were shielded by bullet 0:02:01.074 --> 0:02:03.554 proof glass on the stage, which is something we haven't 0:02:03.794 --> 0:02:08.594 seen before. Attendees were also encouraged to wear red, white or. 0:02:08.554 --> 0:02:09.674 Blue to the service. 0:02:10.314 --> 0:02:14.754 Speakers included Robert F. Kennedy, Charlie Kirk's wife Erica Kirk, 0:02:15.034 --> 0:02:18.074 Donald Trump Junior, who was very close to Kirk, and 0:02:18.234 --> 0:02:22.634 of course President Donald Trump, who spoke last. Erica Kirk 0:02:22.754 --> 0:02:26.274 declared that she had forgiven the man who allegedly killed 0:02:26.314 --> 0:02:29.674 her husband, and her address had this real focus on love, 0:02:29.714 --> 0:02:33.754 which was in stark contrast to Donald Trump's speech which followed. 0:02:34.594 --> 0:02:38.234 The President said I hate my opponents, and I don't 0:02:38.314 --> 0:02:41.754 want what's best for them. He referred to networks of 0:02:41.874 --> 0:02:45.194 radical left maniacs who were to blame for Kirk's murder. 0:02:45.594 --> 0:02:48.274 He also repeated the words fight, fight, fight, which you 0:02:48.354 --> 0:02:53.234 might remember from after his attempted assassination last year. He 0:02:53.274 --> 0:02:57.074 also referred to Kirk as a martyr, a patriot. He 0:02:57.394 --> 0:03:01.914 is awarding Kirk posthumously with the Presidential Medal of Freedom, 0:03:01.994 --> 0:03:05.994 which is a higher civilian honor. Many speakers cited this 0:03:06.114 --> 0:03:08.714 battle between good and evil and said that there was 0:03:08.754 --> 0:03:12.114 this struggle going on. Donald Trump Junior asked the crowd, 0:03:12.234 --> 0:03:14.554 will you surrender? Will you back down? Will you give 0:03:14.674 --> 0:03:19.194 up in fear? And Look, the headline is that Kirk 0:03:19.834 --> 0:03:22.954 was used as a symbol for all that is great 0:03:23.034 --> 0:03:25.794 about America. I think even with the colors that people 0:03:25.834 --> 0:03:30.434 were encouraged to wear, it was about patriotism and this, 0:03:30.874 --> 0:03:33.194 you know, almost a suggestion of some sort of civil 0:03:33.234 --> 0:03:35.034 war that's going on in the US at the moment. 0:03:35.234 --> 0:03:38.394 It's interesting though, because as you've said, that's not what 0:03:38.554 --> 0:03:42.474 Erica Kirk was talking about. And the parts of it 0:03:42.474 --> 0:03:45.194 that I've watched this morning, and obviously we're recording, you know, 0:03:45.234 --> 0:03:48.114 at eleven thirty, it's sort of just finished. It was 0:03:48.194 --> 0:03:51.474 like a show, and there was a very distinct difference 0:03:51.514 --> 0:03:58.794 between Erica Kirk, who was very clearly incredibly emotional, incredibly devastated, 0:03:59.034 --> 0:04:01.754 incredibly gracious, you have to say in saying what she 0:04:01.874 --> 0:04:06.034 said about her incredibly immoving, and she said. 0:04:06.034 --> 0:04:09.754 The answer to he is not hate. The answer we 0:04:09.834 --> 0:04:12.594 know from the Gospel is love and always love. 0:04:13.274 --> 0:04:16.834 And then, as you've said, Jesse, there's that beautiful, gracious 0:04:16.873 --> 0:04:19.873 message that I wonder if people can actually hear. And 0:04:19.914 --> 0:04:22.914 then you had like Donald Trump Junior treating it like 0:04:22.954 --> 0:04:25.034 a stand up show. He was throwing out some jokes. 0:04:25.073 --> 0:04:27.513 He made some Kamala jokes, some Hillary jokes, you know, 0:04:27.553 --> 0:04:31.354 all the old hits from the MAGA, right, Trump preaching 0:04:31.674 --> 0:04:34.273 how much he hates everybody. It just seemed like such 0:04:34.274 --> 0:04:36.193 a stark contrast. Like I think so much of this 0:04:36.274 --> 0:04:40.433 conversation is between the very human loss of a person 0:04:41.274 --> 0:04:46.914 and then this huge existential war that seems to have 0:04:46.914 --> 0:04:50.993 been very much fanned by this assassination. 0:04:50.914 --> 0:04:54.313 Which isn't about Kirk at all, really, you know, and 0:04:54.354 --> 0:04:57.354 there's a lot to be said for the left and 0:04:57.633 --> 0:05:01.113 the way that they've discussed, the rhetoric that they've used, 0:05:01.193 --> 0:05:04.154 the vitriol that's come in the aftermath. But it reminded 0:05:04.193 --> 0:05:06.594 me that while the left has dehumanized Kirk, so is 0:05:06.594 --> 0:05:09.433 a right like they've used Kirk as a symbol, and 0:05:09.474 --> 0:05:12.593 they very much did. And when Trump got up, he 0:05:12.674 --> 0:05:14.313 was at a rally. He was at a rally, and 0:05:14.354 --> 0:05:16.474 he talked about twenty twenty and how that election was 0:05:16.474 --> 0:05:17.753 stolen from him and Joe Biden. 0:05:17.914 --> 0:05:19.794 He made some kind of policy announcement too, in the 0:05:19.834 --> 0:05:21.513 middle of all of that, apparently. 0:05:21.433 --> 0:05:25.673 Exactly some medical announcement. And there are reports that people left, 0:05:26.034 --> 0:05:28.753 which I found really interesting when he started to speak, 0:05:28.753 --> 0:05:30.594 because it did feel really disrespectful. 0:05:30.753 --> 0:05:34.193 You know what's really crazy about looking at this memorial 0:05:34.234 --> 0:05:38.194 today is that until September ten, I had never even 0:05:38.234 --> 0:05:40.914 heard of Charlie Kirk. I have no idea who he was, 0:05:40.993 --> 0:05:44.513 except in real vague passing. I'd seen videos on my 0:05:44.594 --> 0:05:47.553 social media feed of him doing those debates with people, 0:05:47.633 --> 0:05:50.993 but it was most often positioned from the person who 0:05:51.073 --> 0:05:53.194 was debating him, rather than him. 0:05:53.354 --> 0:05:54.113 And his debate. 0:05:55.154 --> 0:05:57.594 But now, not only do I know who Charlie Kirk is. 0:05:57.674 --> 0:06:01.674 I watched that man die almost in real time, which 0:06:02.313 --> 0:06:05.873 was horrific to witness, and then not long after that, 0:06:06.433 --> 0:06:09.914 I was given conflicting stories as to who his alleged 0:06:09.914 --> 0:06:14.914 shooter was, his political allegiances, who he's chose to spend. 0:06:14.633 --> 0:06:15.273 His time with. 0:06:16.234 --> 0:06:20.713 This whole situation from the very get go, felt very 0:06:20.753 --> 0:06:24.553 dirty and awful, and we all have participated in it, 0:06:24.594 --> 0:06:27.153 whether it's from watching the videos, whether it's making a 0:06:27.193 --> 0:06:30.794 comment about Charlie Kirk or his rhetoric, whether it's about 0:06:30.993 --> 0:06:34.753 celebrating his death, which some have done, whether it's those 0:06:34.834 --> 0:06:37.234 right wing factions who've now collectively got together to bring 0:06:37.274 --> 0:06:40.753 down anyone who even mentions Charlie Kirk's name, to the 0:06:40.834 --> 0:06:45.433 politicians who are speaking at these particular events trying to 0:06:45.594 --> 0:06:47.914 muster up that same kind of energy that we heard 0:06:48.474 --> 0:06:52.873 for January six, it all feels very performative. It all 0:06:52.953 --> 0:06:55.873 feels like everyone is in it for themselves, and it 0:06:55.914 --> 0:07:00.033 feels like this is where we absolutely expected to be 0:07:00.753 --> 0:07:01.753 at this point in time. 0:07:01.993 --> 0:07:03.553 I'm really not shocked by any of it. 0:07:03.993 --> 0:07:05.953 Well, it's very hard to be shocked by anything now 0:07:05.993 --> 0:07:09.833 to be I'd suggest that Erica Kirk doesn't seem like 0:07:09.874 --> 0:07:11.554 she's in it for herself. I mean, she did say 0:07:12.114 --> 0:07:14.394 in her speech about Charlie, she said that she's going 0:07:14.434 --> 0:07:16.154 to take on his work and she's going to become 0:07:16.194 --> 0:07:19.273 the CEO of Turning Point USA and absolutely going to 0:07:19.354 --> 0:07:23.033 keep moving with that, which is deeply understandable given the 0:07:23.194 --> 0:07:26.114 kind of person Charlie Kirk was and the mission that 0:07:26.154 --> 0:07:29.714 she says their family shared. But it's just that juxtaposition 0:07:29.794 --> 0:07:34.833 between a very human grief and then this intense politicization. Anyway, 0:07:34.914 --> 0:07:38.314 what we're going to talk about next is kind of adjacent, right, Murphy. 0:07:38.674 --> 0:07:41.314 Yeah, because obviously the fallout, as I mentioned, there's been 0:07:41.354 --> 0:07:45.593 a lot of collective movements coming together to stop any 0:07:45.634 --> 0:07:50.194 conversation about Charlie Kirk's murder from anyone who's considered vaguely 0:07:50.274 --> 0:07:53.234 left of center. So obviously one of those big fallouts 0:07:53.434 --> 0:07:56.953 is Jimmy Kimmel. So, if you have not heard, late 0:07:57.034 --> 0:07:59.514 night talk show host Jimmy Kimmel is currently off the air. 0:07:59.754 --> 0:08:03.194 He's been indefinitely suspended by the ABC after making this 0:08:03.354 --> 0:08:05.514 comment about the Charlie Kirk assassination. 0:08:06.194 --> 0:08:06.954 New rose over. 0:08:06.834 --> 0:08:11.154 Then with the Magga Gang desperately trying to characterize this 0:08:11.274 --> 0:08:13.994 kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one 0:08:14.034 --> 0:08:17.154 of them and do everything they can to score political 0:08:17.194 --> 0:08:20.593 points from it. In between the finger pointing, there was grieving. 0:08:20.674 --> 0:08:23.393 On Friday, the White House flew the flags at half staff, 0:08:23.393 --> 0:08:26.593 which got some criticism, but on a human level, you 0:08:26.674 --> 0:08:30.273 can see how hard the President is taking this half. 0:08:30.114 --> 0:08:33.434 Indulghos on the low finger friend Charlie Kirk asked, sir personally, 0:08:33.674 --> 0:08:35.833 how are you holding up over the last day and 0:08:35.874 --> 0:08:36.514 a half served? 0:08:36.554 --> 0:08:38.674 I think very good. And by the way, right there 0:08:38.794 --> 0:08:39.834 you see all the trucks. 0:08:40.194 --> 0:08:41.954 They've just started construction of. 0:08:41.994 --> 0:08:44.914 The new Baurold to the White House, which is something 0:08:44.954 --> 0:08:45.994 they've been trying to get. 0:08:45.874 --> 0:08:48.234 As you know, for about one hundred and fifty years. 0:08:48.474 --> 0:08:49.674 And it's going to be a beauty. 0:08:50.474 --> 0:08:57.154 Yes, he's at the fourth stage of grief construction. There's demolition. 0:08:58.474 --> 0:08:58.994 Construction. 0:09:00.794 --> 0:09:02.874 This is not how an adult griefs the murderer of 0:09:02.914 --> 0:09:04.594 someone he called a friend. This is how a four 0:09:04.674 --> 0:09:06.274 year old morns a goldfish. 0:09:06.354 --> 0:09:08.874 Okay, can I just jump in and ask you about Kimmel, 0:09:09.274 --> 0:09:13.474 because if you're not massively conversant in American late night culture, 0:09:13.514 --> 0:09:16.194 we know that there are these big shows that have dominated, 0:09:16.394 --> 0:09:19.874 or they certainly used to dominate American political discourse in 0:09:19.914 --> 0:09:22.194 the late nights. But I always get my Jimmy's mixed. Ye, 0:09:22.874 --> 0:09:26.154 So there's Jimmy fallon. Yes, it was much as a 0:09:26.154 --> 0:09:28.674 little bit more like he always seems a bit more 0:09:28.714 --> 0:09:31.434 mischievous he used to be on Saturday Night. Like Kimmel 0:09:31.674 --> 0:09:34.114 is the one who's hosted the Oscars a couple of times, right, right, 0:09:34.194 --> 0:09:36.314 and Trump has always kind of hated him. I remembered 0:09:36.354 --> 0:09:39.514 alive on stage at the Oscars, Trump was tweeting about him, 0:09:39.514 --> 0:09:41.634 and he was reading out the quotes, right, And kim 0:09:41.674 --> 0:09:43.954 OL's been a big force there for a long time too. 0:09:44.114 --> 0:09:44.314 Yes. 0:09:44.434 --> 0:09:47.154 Also, after it was announced that Stephen Colbert, who's another 0:09:47.194 --> 0:09:49.634 one of these late night hosts, that his show was 0:09:49.634 --> 0:09:52.634 being canceled in twenty twenty six, Trump put out on 0:09:52.674 --> 0:09:55.954 his social media that Kimmel would be next, which and 0:09:56.034 --> 0:09:59.794 indeed indeed he is. So After those comments were made 0:09:59.834 --> 0:10:03.554 on Kimmel's show, conservative commentators came down really hard. One 0:10:03.634 --> 0:10:05.794 had said that he's painted all of the MAGA movement 0:10:05.794 --> 0:10:10.394 with the same brush, essentially calling all of them collectively murderers. 0:10:10.714 --> 0:10:13.554 Elon Musk then weighed in he was at the memorial today. 0:10:13.554 --> 0:10:17.234 Elon Musk was called Kimmel disgusting. X then was lit 0:10:17.354 --> 0:10:21.234 up with conservative voices, and that echo chamber spread out 0:10:21.234 --> 0:10:24.194 far and wide across the Internet. The ABC then received 0:10:24.234 --> 0:10:27.034 pressure from the Federal Communications Commission, which is a government 0:10:27.074 --> 0:10:31.274 department that oversees media in the US. The chairman warned 0:10:31.274 --> 0:10:34.154 the ABC that they would pull their broadcast license and 0:10:34.234 --> 0:10:38.834 calling Kimmel's comments truly sick. Now, there are also major 0:10:38.914 --> 0:10:42.354 broadcast companies that take Jimmy Kimmel Show and broadcast it 0:10:42.354 --> 0:10:46.074 to stations across America. So they came together and said 0:10:46.114 --> 0:10:50.034 that they would pull Kimmel's show. Advertisers were being targeted. 0:10:50.394 --> 0:10:53.754 Some employees were also receiving threatening messages. So they bowed 0:10:53.754 --> 0:10:57.114 to the pressure and ABC stood Kimmel down. There is, 0:10:57.154 --> 0:10:59.474 of course, a lot which we do not have time 0:10:59.514 --> 0:11:02.114 to fully deconstruct here today going on up and down 0:11:02.194 --> 0:11:06.074 that chain. So these big companies like the ABC, they 0:11:06.514 --> 0:11:10.554 need government approval for acquisitions because they've got many fingers 0:11:10.554 --> 0:11:13.194 in many pies, and they won't get that if they, 0:11:13.554 --> 0:11:15.954 for example, from himmat with them, if Trump is angry 0:11:15.954 --> 0:11:17.154 with them over Jimmy Kimmel. 0:11:17.394 --> 0:11:19.754 It's also worth pointing out that when we say the ABC, 0:11:19.994 --> 0:11:23.314 we don't mean the Australian Broadcasting Corporations. Yes, even though 0:11:23.754 --> 0:11:26.074 the Australian ABC says they've been getting a lot of. 0:11:26.074 --> 0:11:28.554 Complaints about they have hundreds and hundreds which they put 0:11:28.634 --> 0:11:31.474 up on their social media just yesterday, and they also 0:11:31.474 --> 0:11:34.514 put an email address for who to actually complain to 0:11:34.714 --> 0:11:35.154 if they. 0:11:35.074 --> 0:11:36.274 Were like, this is not us. 0:11:36.154 --> 0:11:37.474 Guys, Yes, it's not us. 0:11:37.554 --> 0:11:38.594 We did not do anything. 0:11:38.834 --> 0:11:41.634 Has he been fired forever Murphy or has he been like, 0:11:41.674 --> 0:11:45.074 has anyone given an indication of how long Kimmel is 0:11:45.114 --> 0:11:47.434 sitting on the bench for and he hasn't spoken about it. 0:11:47.474 --> 0:11:50.114 Has he has not? Sobly sitting with his lawyer? 0:11:50.274 --> 0:11:53.034 Yes, so he is currently in talks with his lawyers. 0:11:53.034 --> 0:11:55.834 The reports are is that he is very concerned about 0:11:55.834 --> 0:11:59.354 his staff because apparently reportedly he said that he's very 0:11:59.354 --> 0:12:01.994 worried about them. They're still financially recovering from the writers' 0:12:01.994 --> 0:12:04.874 strike that happened a year or two ago, so he's 0:12:04.914 --> 0:12:07.274 in talks, but obviously there is one of the those 0:12:07.314 --> 0:12:10.714 broadcast companies that I talked about pulling Kimmel show. They 0:12:10.794 --> 0:12:14.794 have asked for him to apologize formally to also pay 0:12:14.874 --> 0:12:18.834 Charlie Kirk's family money and pay Kirk's foundation money as 0:12:18.874 --> 0:12:22.234 well his nonprofit. So they said that will pave the 0:12:22.274 --> 0:12:25.434 path for his return to the airwaves. But of course, 0:12:25.554 --> 0:12:29.154 the conversation here is now, how do the late night 0:12:29.194 --> 0:12:33.234 show hosts respond to this, because they under threat of 0:12:33.314 --> 0:12:35.674 also being kicked off the air if they make jokes 0:12:36.114 --> 0:12:37.353 about this situation. 0:12:37.794 --> 0:12:40.953 Well, and also the conversation seems to have gone to Jesse. 0:12:41.874 --> 0:12:44.514 This is the beginning of the end of free speech, right, 0:12:44.554 --> 0:12:47.634 because when this happened on Thursday, my feeds were suddenly 0:12:47.674 --> 0:12:51.714 flooded by lots of well known American leftist comedians. When 0:12:51.714 --> 0:12:54.434 I say leftist, I just meant, you know, to be honest, 0:12:54.514 --> 0:12:59.034 Until very recently, almost everybody in Hollywood was an outspoken leftist. Yeah, 0:12:59.114 --> 0:13:01.194 and so lots of people saying it's happening. We said 0:13:01.234 --> 0:13:05.554 authoritarianism was coming. This is the first real sign of that, 0:13:06.514 --> 0:13:08.674 is that where this conversation is now, is it about 0:13:08.714 --> 0:13:10.794 the death of free speech, which is, let's be clear, 0:13:10.914 --> 0:13:13.674 something that the right side of politics, as in the 0:13:13.714 --> 0:13:17.234 megaside of politics, free speech was the thing that supposedly 0:13:17.314 --> 0:13:20.674 radicalized and evangelized the Elon Musks of the world, the 0:13:20.754 --> 0:13:23.194 Joe Rogan's of the world, the Mark Zuckerberg's of the world. 0:13:23.354 --> 0:13:26.074 Charlie Kirk himself as a free speech advocate, of course, 0:13:26.114 --> 0:13:28.274 And they're like, but they're saying that it was the 0:13:28.354 --> 0:13:31.314 left that we're trying to silence debate and that's what 0:13:31.474 --> 0:13:34.714 pushed them to the Trump side. Is this the first 0:13:34.754 --> 0:13:36.474 step in authoritarianism? 0:13:36.594 --> 0:13:41.914 To be clear, Trump campaigned on free speech. He talked 0:13:42.034 --> 0:13:45.074 in his inaugural address earlier this year. He said, after 0:13:45.154 --> 0:13:48.154 years and years of illegal and unconstitutional federal efforts to 0:13:48.194 --> 0:13:52.274 restrict free expression, I will sign an executive order to 0:13:52.354 --> 0:13:56.634 immediately stop all government censorship and bring back free speech 0:13:56.674 --> 0:14:00.434 to America. There his words months ago. And so I 0:14:00.474 --> 0:14:06.954 think everyone is going, hang on, this is absolute hypocrisy. 0:14:07.234 --> 0:14:10.034 It is a double standard. There are fractures within the 0:14:10.114 --> 0:14:13.594 party that are going this is what we fought for. 0:14:13.674 --> 0:14:15.474 As you say, Holly, it is something that has been 0:14:15.514 --> 0:14:18.754 pinned on the left in terms of cancel culture and 0:14:19.114 --> 0:14:23.474 workism and you know, political correctness gone mad. But the 0:14:23.594 --> 0:14:26.154 thing about that, and I would argue, we've talked about 0:14:26.194 --> 0:14:28.474 cancel culture on this show. There are definitely instances where 0:14:28.474 --> 0:14:33.234 there's been overreach, but that's often self censorship, a board 0:14:33.554 --> 0:14:37.034 maybe trying to be really really careful and not offend people. 0:14:37.954 --> 0:14:40.794 The difference here is that it's hard power, not soft power. 0:14:40.954 --> 0:14:42.634 That's why I think it feels so scary. 0:14:42.794 --> 0:14:44.714 When I spoke to John Barron about this and the Quickie, 0:14:44.754 --> 0:14:46.874 he said, the big difference is these directives are coming 0:14:46.874 --> 0:14:49.834 from the president down, which has not been the case. 0:14:49.874 --> 0:14:53.874 It's normally like a public opinion or is a business 0:14:53.954 --> 0:14:56.234 level decision, but this is very much coming from the 0:14:56.274 --> 0:14:57.194 White House itself. 0:14:57.354 --> 0:15:00.434 Often it's within the interests of like, for example, they 0:15:00.434 --> 0:15:02.794 don't want to lose advertisers. This happens in Australia. Someone 0:15:02.834 --> 0:15:05.394 says something offensive, they don't want to lose advertisers. Yeah, 0:15:05.394 --> 0:15:08.394 that's a soft power that it can be troubling. But 0:15:08.434 --> 0:15:10.994 this is a directive coming from within the White House. 0:15:10.994 --> 0:15:14.354 And that's why it feels like communist China. Like it 0:15:14.354 --> 0:15:17.594 feels as though you're living under a government who gets 0:15:17.594 --> 0:15:21.754 to decide what you can and cannot say. And the 0:15:21.874 --> 0:15:25.594 profound paradox in all of this is, of course they're going, 0:15:26.194 --> 0:15:29.754 even at the memorial, look at this bastion of free speech. 0:15:29.834 --> 0:15:32.794 You will look his opponents in the eye and speak 0:15:32.834 --> 0:15:37.114 to them. And now you're going, you can't disagree with 0:15:37.194 --> 0:15:40.994 what Kirk said, the man who got killed for saying 0:15:41.394 --> 0:15:44.234 things that like, that's where it leads. Suppression of free 0:15:44.234 --> 0:15:47.514 speech leads to something like a bullet because you say, 0:15:47.594 --> 0:15:49.594 I do not want that person to speak anymore. I 0:15:49.594 --> 0:15:52.274 do not think that person deserves a platform. It is 0:15:52.394 --> 0:15:55.034 where you go in terms of an authoritarian regime. This 0:15:55.074 --> 0:15:57.234 has played out throughout history, and I think that's why 0:15:57.234 --> 0:16:00.554 people My first reaction upon seeing this story was, this 0:16:00.594 --> 0:16:01.834 is really scary shit. 0:16:02.074 --> 0:16:04.594 It is scary shit. I think it comes from a 0:16:04.634 --> 0:16:08.874 basic place because, as has been widely what Jimmy Kimmel 0:16:08.914 --> 0:16:11.754 said there was not that shocking, right. And also on 0:16:11.794 --> 0:16:16.034 the day of Charlie Kirk's assassination, Jimmy Kimmel, like most 0:16:16.314 --> 0:16:20.874 mainstream democratic figures, said exactly what they should have said, 0:16:20.914 --> 0:16:23.114 which is, my heart goes out to his family. This 0:16:23.234 --> 0:16:26.234 is inexcusable. Like he did all of those things right, 0:16:26.554 --> 0:16:29.794 What this is actually about is that President Trump hates 0:16:29.874 --> 0:16:32.114 to be mocked. Let's face it, most of us do, right. 0:16:32.794 --> 0:16:37.034 But from all the way back before he was seriously 0:16:37.074 --> 0:16:40.114 standing for politics, the Jimmy Kimmels of the world, in 0:16:40.274 --> 0:16:43.874 Trump's view, people that he would broadly call the Hollywood elite, 0:16:44.314 --> 0:16:47.994 the leftist Hollywood elite, have taunted him, not taken him seriously, 0:16:48.114 --> 0:16:50.154 taken the piss out of him. It goes all the 0:16:50.194 --> 0:16:53.234 way back to President Obama at the White House correspondence 0:16:53.274 --> 0:16:55.674 dinner in twenty eleven, who stood up and roasted him, 0:16:56.034 --> 0:16:57.794 and he was in the room at the time. Trump 0:16:57.794 --> 0:17:00.474 he was a guest of Newsweek, and Seth Meyers stood 0:17:00.554 --> 0:17:02.714 up and said, Donald Trump says he's going to run 0:17:02.714 --> 0:17:04.794 for a president as a Republican, which is surprising since 0:17:04.834 --> 0:17:06.394 I just assumed he was running as a joke, and 0:17:06.513 --> 0:17:09.154 everybody just took the piss out of him. And many 0:17:09.194 --> 0:17:12.314 Trump insiders say that was the moment when Trump went, 0:17:13.034 --> 0:17:15.514 I'm coming for you lot, and look what's happened. He did, 0:17:15.834 --> 0:17:17.754 and he won, and he didn't need any of these 0:17:17.794 --> 0:17:22.154 guys who have been, let's be honest, trashing him for decades. 0:17:22.354 --> 0:17:24.074 He didn't need any of them to get him to power. 0:17:24.354 --> 0:17:27.034 He doesn't really need their approval, but he hates their 0:17:27.074 --> 0:17:31.074 derision and he's been waiting for this. As Murphy said, 0:17:31.354 --> 0:17:34.354 Colbert is going off air. He said that Jimmy Kimmel 0:17:34.474 --> 0:17:37.194 was next. Now he says that Falon's next, seth Myers 0:17:37.274 --> 0:17:40.794 is next. All these guys are going to go. It's 0:17:40.874 --> 0:17:43.514 interesting because their power is reduced in lots of ways 0:17:43.554 --> 0:17:46.674 since nobody watches network TV anymore. But they will all go, 0:17:46.914 --> 0:17:49.074 and as they lose their jobs from their networks, they 0:17:49.114 --> 0:17:52.234 will all go to YouTube, to podcast, to all the 0:17:52.274 --> 0:17:55.754 different tech platforms, and they will speak there and whether 0:17:55.874 --> 0:17:59.474 or not they really have clout anymore. I think it's 0:18:00.154 --> 0:18:03.474 that classic thing in a way that what may lead 0:18:03.514 --> 0:18:07.354 to this authoritarianism is like a man's bruised ego. 0:18:07.434 --> 0:18:07.674 You know. 0:18:08.274 --> 0:18:11.594 There's also some reports going around that people like Colbert 0:18:11.674 --> 0:18:13.634 and a bunch of others in the background are starting a. 0:18:13.714 --> 0:18:16.314 Rogue news network, which will. 0:18:17.074 --> 0:18:20.914 I'm guessing be Internet based in some way, shape or form. 0:18:20.714 --> 0:18:22.434 Which is what lots of the right guys have done. 0:18:22.474 --> 0:18:24.674 It's what Toker Carlson's done and not. You know, like 0:18:24.954 --> 0:18:27.114 this is where all these people are talking now. 0:18:27.034 --> 0:18:27.994 Yeah, exactly right. 0:18:28.074 --> 0:18:30.194 So it looks like it might create a whole new 0:18:30.234 --> 0:18:33.234 network of sort of left wing ideology there. But just 0:18:33.394 --> 0:18:35.434 before we stop talking about this, like do we need 0:18:35.474 --> 0:18:37.273 to check ourselves and just look at this from the 0:18:37.314 --> 0:18:38.554 other perspective for a minute. 0:18:38.594 --> 0:18:40.714 I've been thinking about this because I don't think that 0:18:40.794 --> 0:18:42.114 free speech is unlimited. 0:18:42.114 --> 0:18:42.914 It never has been. 0:18:43.154 --> 0:18:45.714 I think that there are things that Jimmy Kimmel could 0:18:45.714 --> 0:18:47.674 have got up and said that are so offensive that 0:18:47.794 --> 0:18:50.594 actually maybe would have warranted a little bit of censorship. 0:18:50.874 --> 0:18:55.434 So if he had come up and incited violence, excused violence, 0:18:56.074 --> 0:19:00.314 said I'm glad he died, he had it coming, who's next? 0:19:00.674 --> 0:19:00.914 Yep. 0:19:01.034 --> 0:19:03.114 Absolutely, I think that there would be a really important 0:19:03.194 --> 0:19:07.434 national conversation because there is a standard of speech that exists. 0:19:07.954 --> 0:19:10.474 But he didn't say any of those things. And my 0:19:10.634 --> 0:19:13.553 first response to this story was, oh, well, I'm going 0:19:13.594 --> 0:19:16.394 to look really closely at what Jimmy Kimmel said, because 0:19:16.394 --> 0:19:19.594 some left wing commentators have feared into that, and if 0:19:19.594 --> 0:19:21.553 that were on the other side, we would be just 0:19:21.594 --> 0:19:24.874 as horrified. But to me, it's the banality of what 0:19:24.874 --> 0:19:27.594 he said. His crime was being imprecise, Like what he 0:19:27.634 --> 0:19:30.273 said was actually factually wrong. It was early days. He 0:19:30.314 --> 0:19:33.674 didn't know it was wrong yet, and so that's something 0:19:33.754 --> 0:19:36.954 that you know. Inaccuracy, you can definitely charge him with that, 0:19:37.074 --> 0:19:40.594 But inaccuracy doesn't get anyone else pulled off the air. 0:19:40.634 --> 0:19:43.674 And then some people said, well, the ratings were shit, 0:19:43.714 --> 0:19:45.793 so they were just looking for an excuse. That's okay, 0:19:46.074 --> 0:19:48.394 but you don't pull people off immediately for bad ratings. 0:19:48.474 --> 0:19:49.234 You wind him up. 0:19:49.434 --> 0:19:52.434 You're right, Murphy in lots of ways. And I think 0:19:52.594 --> 0:19:54.874 that one of the things about this is is that 0:19:54.954 --> 0:19:57.314 when I looked at all the responses from the other 0:19:57.394 --> 0:19:59.474 late night guys, and they were all very clever, because 0:19:59.474 --> 0:20:02.834 these are very clever people, and they've got huge staffs 0:20:02.874 --> 0:20:05.234 of writing people who are also very clever people, and 0:20:05.274 --> 0:20:07.034 they are exactly as I said before, the kind of 0:20:07.114 --> 0:20:09.273 people that Trump would dismiss as Hollywood at least, and 0:20:09.314 --> 0:20:12.714 they're thinking of the cleverest, funniest ways to go viral 0:20:12.794 --> 0:20:17.234 by mocking the president. I would suggest that one of 0:20:17.234 --> 0:20:19.674 the things we learned last year is that you can 0:20:19.754 --> 0:20:24.514 have every famous, powerful Hollywood person on your side, from 0:20:24.554 --> 0:20:27.954 Taylor Swift to Bad Bunny to every single Hollywood starter. 0:20:28.034 --> 0:20:30.313 George Clooney and you're still not going to win the 0:20:30.314 --> 0:20:33.754 election because nobody likes being mocked and dismissed and taking 0:20:33.794 --> 0:20:35.634 the piss out of And that goes for Donald Trump, 0:20:35.874 --> 0:20:38.114