WEBVTT - Fear & Lothing

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<v Speaker 1>You're listening to a Muma Mea podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of the land and waters.

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<v Speaker 2>This podcast is recorded on. This episode deals with serious

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<v Speaker 2>themes including domestic violence, coercive control, and suicide. Listener discretion

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<v Speaker 2>is advised and there are links to support services in

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<v Speaker 2>the show notes. We always hear how great a relationship

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<v Speaker 2>is when it begins. Why else would it right? There's butterflies,

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<v Speaker 2>late night, staying up talking, a sense of belonging, desire

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<v Speaker 2>and comfort, having that one person to plan life with

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<v Speaker 2>who's just desperate to have you around all the time.

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<v Speaker 1>Live in each other's pockets. And that's what James really liked.

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<v Speaker 1>He liked to be very close, always knew what I

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<v Speaker 1>was doing, and always be right there. It was when

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<v Speaker 1>I was away that he would become quite nervous and unhinged.

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<v Speaker 1>But when we were together, and we would spend all

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<v Speaker 1>of this time together, and I was pregnant and were

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<v Speaker 1>always forced to stay home, he loved it. He loved me,

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<v Speaker 1>He loved the belly. He loved the idea of becoming

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<v Speaker 1>a dad and having a little girl.

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<v Speaker 2>But what about when that desperation becomes too much and

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<v Speaker 2>starts looking and feeling more like control, and then that

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<v Speaker 2>control becomes worrying, scary, and even dangerous.

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<v Speaker 1>I saw smoke starting to come under the door and

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<v Speaker 1>fill up the theater room, and my reaction was, We're

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<v Speaker 1>going to die. He's going to burn the house down,

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<v Speaker 1>and we're all going to be in it.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Georgia Love and this is everyone has an ex

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<v Speaker 2>Come with me as we dive into a collection of

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<v Speaker 2>unconventional stories about relationships past through the eyes and the

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<v Speaker 2>hearts of the very people who lived them. Meet Sky,

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<v Speaker 2>the twenty five year old single mum of a gorgeous

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<v Speaker 2>little four year old girl at the time our story begins,

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<v Speaker 2>and it begins with a meetcute with a guy called

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<v Speaker 2>James when Sky was moving into a new office and.

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<v Speaker 1>I was really upset about having to move out to

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<v Speaker 1>this new office. And I was lucky that one of

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<v Speaker 1>my best friends worked with me and we were moving

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<v Speaker 1>out to this office together, so that made it seem

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<v Speaker 1>a little bit better. And the day that we moved

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<v Speaker 1>out to the office, I bumped into James in the

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<v Speaker 1>car park and I thought, Oh, he's stunning. Where has

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<v Speaker 1>this man come from. I've never seen anyone like that

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<v Speaker 1>in my life. And after that it was kind of

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<v Speaker 1>He would walk back and past my desk and he

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<v Speaker 1>worked in a different department, so we didn't speak. We

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<v Speaker 1>didn't have anything to do with each other at work.

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<v Speaker 1>But one day one of my girlfriends said to me,

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<v Speaker 1>when we're having lunch, oh, I dare you to add

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<v Speaker 1>him on Facebook? And so goes the world of social media.

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<v Speaker 1>These days, you can just find someone and add them

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<v Speaker 1>on Facebook, and it's this avenue, this way into somebody's life.

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<v Speaker 1>And so I did. I added him and at five

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<v Speaker 1>oho two that night, I was driving home and he

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<v Speaker 1>had messaged me straightaway as soon as work had finished.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh I don't think we've formally met, is what I think,

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<v Speaker 1>he said to me. And we spoke a little bit

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<v Speaker 1>on and off for a couple of weeks, but nothing

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<v Speaker 1>too intense. Bit of banter back and forth on your

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<v Speaker 1>direct messager at work, a bit of talking a coffee

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<v Speaker 1>here and there, but nothing really that was escalating until

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<v Speaker 1>that point that he said, let's go for dinner, let's

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<v Speaker 1>do something outside of work. And I had arranged for

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<v Speaker 1>my auntie to look after my daughter so that I

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<v Speaker 1>could go and see him, and then I'd had to

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<v Speaker 1>go down south that day and i'd come back and

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<v Speaker 1>I wasn't feeling very well. So instead of going out

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<v Speaker 1>for dinner like he had planned, I said, I'll just

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<v Speaker 1>come over and see you if you like, rather than

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<v Speaker 1>going out for this dinner, because I'm really not feeling out.

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<v Speaker 1>The kids have been crazy all day, and I just

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<v Speaker 1>need to chill. But I still want to take the

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<v Speaker 1>opportunity to see you. So I went to his house.

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<v Speaker 1>We just ordered pizza. We were just watching I think

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<v Speaker 1>we watched Focus, which is my favorite movie, and I

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<v Speaker 1>ordered a supreme pizza. I remember it coming with anchovies,

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<v Speaker 1>and I hate anthobies, but I ate them anyway, because

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<v Speaker 1>I didn't just seem like I was pulling ingredients off

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<v Speaker 1>of my pizza. I went home at a fairly reasonable time,

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<v Speaker 1>about eleven o'clock. Nothing crazy happened. We kissed, but that

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<v Speaker 1>was really it. But we were basically inseparable from there.

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<v Speaker 1>Nearly every night we would spend it together, either he

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<v Speaker 1>would come to my house or I would go there,

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<v Speaker 1>and it just kind of blossomed from there. He is

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<v Speaker 1>four years older than me. He is big, musty, bit

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<v Speaker 1>of a body builder. He's got a gorgeous face, he

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<v Speaker 1>has really beautiful eyes. He was just magnetic in his personality,

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<v Speaker 1>and the way that he was drawn to me almost

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<v Speaker 1>made me reciprocate that towards him. He was very sort

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<v Speaker 1>of connected to me and put a lot of effort

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<v Speaker 1>into building that in the early days, and seemed very

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<v Speaker 1>mature and very invested, not like other people that I

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<v Speaker 1>had experienced previously. I hadn't really had a serious relationship

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<v Speaker 1>since my ex partner that I had separated with two

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<v Speaker 1>or three years prior, and I just sort of dated

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<v Speaker 1>here and there, but everyone seemed very immature, very lacking

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<v Speaker 1>in comparison to this man who really seemed to have

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<v Speaker 1>his life together and the reflection of someone that you

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<v Speaker 1>would want to build a future with rather than just

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<v Speaker 1>someone for the here and now to kind of give

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<v Speaker 1>that dopamine boost. We fell in love, as people do.

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<v Speaker 1>We would spend every weekend taking the dogs to the

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<v Speaker 1>beach with my daughter. We would go to the gym together,

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<v Speaker 1>we would go to work together. Because we had that

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<v Speaker 1>connection and that ease of just being able to go

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<v Speaker 1>everywhere together. It was really it just fit. It fit

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<v Speaker 1>together so well. My lease then came up on my

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<v Speaker 1>property about four months in and we made the decision

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<v Speaker 1>that rather than me getting another rental, I would move

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<v Speaker 1>in with him. So at that time, my daughter and

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<v Speaker 1>I both moved into his house with him and his

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<v Speaker 1>two dogs and my one dog and his two cats,

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<v Speaker 1>and we had somewhat of a farm going on down

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<v Speaker 1>there at the time. It was a big deal. I

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<v Speaker 1>think it was more of a big deal for me

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<v Speaker 1>because it wasn't someone moving into my house. I was

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<v Speaker 1>moving into his space and it would still be his

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<v Speaker 1>and it was his home and his house, and he

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<v Speaker 1>owned it, so he had all of the control over

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<v Speaker 1>that situation. And that did scare me a little bit,

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<v Speaker 1>just with the what ifs of relationships, but I was

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<v Speaker 1>willing to do it, thought, why not, We'll take a

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<v Speaker 1>leap of faith, we'll see what happens and hope the best.

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<v Speaker 1>And it wasn't long after I moved in that COVID

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<v Speaker 1>actually hit. So it turned out to be this blessing

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<v Speaker 1>that I had moved in with him, because others we

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<v Speaker 1>probably wouldn't have been able to see each other, and

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<v Speaker 1>that would have been really, really hard after the six

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<v Speaker 1>months we'd had by that point when COVID did hit,

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<v Speaker 1>So we probably would have moved in together at that

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<v Speaker 1>point anyway, just to get around all the rules.

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<v Speaker 2>It was quick and intense and wonderful. Sky absolutely loved

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<v Speaker 2>living with James. There were a great couple and for

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<v Speaker 2>a twenty nine year old who didn't have a child

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<v Speaker 2>of his own, James was great with Sky's daughter, Bonnie too.

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<v Speaker 1>There were challenges and teething issues with having a child

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<v Speaker 1>involved in the situation and the differences of what you

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<v Speaker 1>can and can't do and how much flexibility you have

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<v Speaker 1>in your life once there's a child involved, but it

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<v Speaker 1>didn't seem to bother him. It seemed to just sort

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<v Speaker 1>of we would just work around it, and his family

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<v Speaker 1>were really amazing. Bonnie developed a really strong relationship with

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<v Speaker 1>his dad, and his dad would come and take her

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<v Speaker 1>for walks with the dogs and take her to the

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<v Speaker 1>shops and they would get lollies and chocolates and do

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<v Speaker 1>all those sneaky things that grandparents do, and that was

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<v Speaker 1>a really really beautiful relationship to see blossom. She really

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<v Speaker 1>loved him and he was always very open and accepting

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<v Speaker 1>of her, similar to his mum. His mum was really

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<v Speaker 1>good with Bonnie in the early days and always made

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<v Speaker 1>room for her in their life, so yeah, it felt good.

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<v Speaker 1>We didn't have long before we found out that I

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<v Speaker 1>was actually pregnant. COVID happened, and you're spending a lot

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<v Speaker 1>more time together and TV shows start to diminish, And

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<v Speaker 1>in February twenty twenty, we found out that I was

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<v Speaker 1>pregnant with our daughter, so that was really exciting. James's

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<v Speaker 1>sister was also pregnant at the same time and had

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<v Speaker 1>told us two days earlier before we found out, and

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<v Speaker 1>she also had a little girl the same as us,

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<v Speaker 1>and they are two weeks apart. It was amazing. Our

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<v Speaker 1>relationship through the pregnancy was really good. We were sort

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<v Speaker 1>of forced to be quite close and liveing in each

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<v Speaker 1>other's pockets, and that's what James really liked. He liked

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<v Speaker 1>to be very close, always know what I was doing,

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<v Speaker 1>and always be right there. He loved it. He loved me,

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<v Speaker 1>he loved the belly, he loved the idea of becoming

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<v Speaker 1>a dad and having a little girl. And throughout the pregnancy,

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<v Speaker 1>I think we were sort of focused on having to

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<v Speaker 1>move to a bigger house because we didn't have enough

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<v Speaker 1>room for a baby as well as all of these animals,

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<v Speaker 1>so we eventually moved to a rental and he rented

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<v Speaker 1>his house out and we set up the rental and

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<v Speaker 1>we had all this room and we had room for

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<v Speaker 1>a baby, and things got really excited. I do remember

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<v Speaker 1>when I found out I was pregnant. I had thought,

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<v Speaker 1>something's not quite right in my body. I don't know

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<v Speaker 1>what's going on. And I had done a pregnancy test

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<v Speaker 1>and there was this faintest possible line that it was positive.

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<v Speaker 1>So I'd waited for him to get home and I

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<v Speaker 1>kept this little test in my hand. He was wrapped.

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<v Speaker 1>He was so excited. I remember him calling his mom

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<v Speaker 1>straight away after me, thinking, oh, we'll just wait and

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<v Speaker 1>we'll go and get an ultra sound before we tell anybody.

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<v Speaker 1>But he couldn't help himself. He called his mom, he

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<v Speaker 1>called his sister. He was so excited to have this baby,

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<v Speaker 1>and yeah, it was beautiful. Leah arrived just before Christmas

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<v Speaker 1>in December, and she was born prematurely. She just needed

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<v Speaker 1>to be monitored for things like jaundice. So I stayed

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<v Speaker 1>in the hospital for about five days, and after those

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<v Speaker 1>five days, I was very ready to come home, very

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<v Speaker 1>ready to bring her back into the family and have

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<v Speaker 1>ever run meet her. And get lots of time at

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<v Speaker 1>home with her, but I did go back to work

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<v Speaker 1>when Leah was four days old. In the time leading

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<v Speaker 1>up to Leah being born, James was very adamant that

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<v Speaker 1>my investment property was my responsibility and if I needed

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<v Speaker 1>to maintain that property that I would need to get

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<v Speaker 1>the money to be able to do that. And I

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<v Speaker 1>was on a maximum term contract at work at the time,

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<v Speaker 1>so I didn't get paid parntal leave. I was allowed

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<v Speaker 1>to take parental leave and keep my job, but I

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<v Speaker 1>wouldn't be paid, and to be able to maintain that

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<v Speaker 1>investment property and pay for our expenses, I just I

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<v Speaker 1>had to go back to work. They were very supportive.

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<v Speaker 1>They allowed me to work from home, they allowed me

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<v Speaker 1>some really flexible hours, and it wasn't until Leah was

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<v Speaker 1>about five nearly six months, that I started going back

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<v Speaker 1>to the office only part time. Generally it would be

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<v Speaker 1>one day a week and James's mum would look after Leah,

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<v Speaker 1>and then we eventually had to enroll her in daycare

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<v Speaker 1>when I started going back to work two and three

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<v Speaker 1>days a week after she was about six months. James

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<v Speaker 1>loved her, but he didn't know how to be a

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<v Speaker 1>dad and it became very apparent that the restriction of

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<v Speaker 1>a very small baby was really overwhelming for him. James

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<v Speaker 1>has ADHD and noises really set him off. Leah was

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<v Speaker 1>a very unsettled baby, and the crying would grind at him,

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<v Speaker 1>and you could just see that he was always so

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<v Speaker 1>uncomfortable at home and he really didn't know how to

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<v Speaker 1>react to when she would cry. And it was always

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<v Speaker 1>very much my responsibility to stop her from crying and

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<v Speaker 1>to give her everything that she needed. I had never

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<v Speaker 1>left James with Leah when she was a baby. I

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<v Speaker 1>never started leaving them together until she was much much

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<v Speaker 1>older walking could talk, those sorts of things. It wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>it just wasn't an option. His mum would come and

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<v Speaker 1>help look after her if I needed to go for

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<v Speaker 1>whatever reason, but most of the time it was just

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<v Speaker 1>I would look after her and I would take her

0:13:34.210 --> 0:13:37.170
<v Speaker 1>with me if I needed to go somewhere. It was

0:13:37.250 --> 0:13:41.250
<v Speaker 1>really hard having to feel that level of anxiousness if

0:13:41.250 --> 0:13:43.490
<v Speaker 1>you needed to ask for help or ask for support.

0:13:43.610 --> 0:13:46.970
<v Speaker 1>So me as a person, I feel like at the

0:13:47.050 --> 0:13:52.210
<v Speaker 1>time I just needed to absorb everything and do everything

0:13:52.330 --> 0:13:57.530
<v Speaker 1>and try and be everything for everyone, because no one

0:13:57.770 --> 0:14:00.530
<v Speaker 1>else was going to do it, and if I didn't

0:14:00.530 --> 0:14:05.210
<v Speaker 1>do it, it just wouldn't get done. It was very trying,

0:14:05.330 --> 0:14:07.570
<v Speaker 1>especially when you're working full time as well.

0:14:07.610 --> 0:14:10.010
<v Speaker 2>But moms do what they have to do. Right. With

0:14:10.090 --> 0:14:12.850
<v Speaker 2>two gorgeous daughters, a full time job, and soon a

0:14:12.890 --> 0:14:16.210
<v Speaker 2>new house, Sky didn't actually have time to get overwhelmed

0:14:16.330 --> 0:14:17.050
<v Speaker 2>or too worried.

0:14:17.490 --> 0:14:21.690
<v Speaker 1>We moved house into a smaller property in February twenty

0:14:21.730 --> 0:14:25.570
<v Speaker 1>twenty two. We decided that we could have somewhere smaller.

0:14:26.090 --> 0:14:29.330
<v Speaker 1>It was just that we needed three bedrooms rather than four,

0:14:29.610 --> 0:14:31.650
<v Speaker 1>and it would save us a bit of money. We

0:14:31.690 --> 0:14:34.930
<v Speaker 1>wanted to build a house. James and I had these

0:14:35.250 --> 0:14:39.810
<v Speaker 1>goals that we'd set and once we moved, he had

0:14:39.810 --> 0:14:43.410
<v Speaker 1>decided he wanted to do a bodybuilding competition. He was

0:14:43.450 --> 0:14:47.010
<v Speaker 1>always very into bodybuilding, and that comes with a lot

0:14:47.050 --> 0:14:50.090
<v Speaker 1>of other things that I was accepting of. It comes

0:14:50.090 --> 0:14:53.050
<v Speaker 1>with steroids and spending a lot of time at the

0:14:53.090 --> 0:14:56.370
<v Speaker 1>gym and a lot of time researching and focusing on

0:14:56.410 --> 0:14:59.970
<v Speaker 1>that sort of thing. And given the ADHD, James would

0:15:00.010 --> 0:15:03.170
<v Speaker 1>often become hyper fixated on certain things to do with

0:15:03.210 --> 0:15:07.530
<v Speaker 1>bodybuilding and diet and it was difficult sometimes but we

0:15:07.570 --> 0:15:10.290
<v Speaker 1>made it work. That was part of human I accepted

0:15:10.290 --> 0:15:13.610
<v Speaker 1>that and we just moved forward. So he decided to

0:15:13.650 --> 0:15:17.650
<v Speaker 1>do this bodybuilding competition. And there's something called a prep

0:15:17.690 --> 0:15:20.210
<v Speaker 1>which leads you up to this bodybuilding competition where you

0:15:20.250 --> 0:15:22.490
<v Speaker 1>have to eat a certain way, train a certain way.

0:15:23.370 --> 0:15:27.090
<v Speaker 1>And it was during this time that James had had

0:15:27.090 --> 0:15:29.610
<v Speaker 1>his work a proof for him to take parental leave,

0:15:30.170 --> 0:15:32.210
<v Speaker 1>paid parental leave, as you're allowed to take it as

0:15:32.210 --> 0:15:35.410
<v Speaker 1>a second partner, and he was taking it at fifty percent,

0:15:35.490 --> 0:15:36.930
<v Speaker 1>so he would have two and a half days a

0:15:36.930 --> 0:15:41.170
<v Speaker 1>week where he would effectively not be working, and then

0:15:41.210 --> 0:15:43.290
<v Speaker 1>the other two and a half he would And I

0:15:43.330 --> 0:15:45.890
<v Speaker 1>can remember during this time thinking, great, we won't have

0:15:45.970 --> 0:15:49.090
<v Speaker 1>to worry about daycare because his mum had looked after

0:15:50.050 --> 0:15:54.090
<v Speaker 1>our daughter and James's sister's daughter two days a week

0:15:54.130 --> 0:15:57.210
<v Speaker 1>at this time for both of us to work. So

0:15:57.250 --> 0:16:00.850
<v Speaker 1>I remember thinking, okay, well, Thursday and Friday she'll be

0:16:00.890 --> 0:16:03.530
<v Speaker 1>able to do that, and Monday and Tuesday James will

0:16:03.570 --> 0:16:06.250
<v Speaker 1>be able to look after Leah, and therefore we won't

0:16:06.250 --> 0:16:09.850
<v Speaker 1>have this daycare expense, which will be brilliant beneath to

0:16:09.930 --> 0:16:13.610
<v Speaker 1>me that he had, you know, laterally decided that Leah

0:16:13.610 --> 0:16:16.250
<v Speaker 1>would stay in daycare on Monday and Tuesday, and then

0:16:16.370 --> 0:16:19.210
<v Speaker 1>the Wednesday that I worked from home would also be

0:16:19.330 --> 0:16:21.490
<v Speaker 1>his half day, so I would be at home anyway.

0:16:22.130 --> 0:16:25.330
<v Speaker 1>And then the Thursday Friday that his mom would look

0:16:25.330 --> 0:16:28.170
<v Speaker 1>after the girls, they would be his days off. And

0:16:28.210 --> 0:16:32.850
<v Speaker 1>therefore he wasn't really spending parental leave looking after Leah.

0:16:32.970 --> 0:16:35.690
<v Speaker 1>He was just spending parental leave sleeping and doing the

0:16:35.730 --> 0:16:39.050
<v Speaker 1>things that he wanted to do as a break for himself.

0:16:39.090 --> 0:16:41.530
<v Speaker 1>He would call it. And I really didn't think that

0:16:41.530 --> 0:16:44.250
<v Speaker 1>that was fair, given that I hadn't had the opportunity

0:16:44.290 --> 0:16:46.730
<v Speaker 1>to have parental leave when I had just had a

0:16:46.770 --> 0:16:50.250
<v Speaker 1>baby and was breastfeeding and getting up every night in

0:16:50.290 --> 0:16:55.170
<v Speaker 1>the nighttime with Leah. But I just let it happen,

0:16:55.250 --> 0:16:57.770
<v Speaker 1>because sometimes you just don't have a say in these things,

0:16:57.810 --> 0:17:00.410
<v Speaker 1>and you just try and work it out for the better.

0:17:01.410 --> 0:17:05.930
<v Speaker 1>So in April, he did this bodybuilding competition and he

0:17:05.970 --> 0:17:09.890
<v Speaker 1>was really disappointed with the results. Afterwards, he had said

0:17:09.890 --> 0:17:13.850
<v Speaker 1>to me, would you mind if I smoked meth once today?

0:17:17.650 --> 0:17:20.970
<v Speaker 1>I've done it before, would you care. I'm really disappointed

0:17:21.010 --> 0:17:23.330
<v Speaker 1>in the results. Could you just let me have this.

0:17:24.570 --> 0:17:27.170
<v Speaker 1>I didn't know that he had done it before. I

0:17:27.650 --> 0:17:31.570
<v Speaker 1>just sort of put it down to boys doing things,

0:17:31.610 --> 0:17:35.490
<v Speaker 1>trying things, and I didn't think much of it. To

0:17:35.530 --> 0:17:38.170
<v Speaker 1>be fair, I at the time sort of thought, Okay,

0:17:38.370 --> 0:17:40.770
<v Speaker 1>if you want to do it one time. Yeah, you've

0:17:40.810 --> 0:17:44.290
<v Speaker 1>just been through this really difficult prep for this competition.

0:17:44.490 --> 0:17:47.690
<v Speaker 1>You're very disappointed with the result. Maybe if you just

0:17:47.730 --> 0:17:49.730
<v Speaker 1>do this one time, you have a good night, you'll

0:17:49.730 --> 0:17:53.090
<v Speaker 1>feel better Tomorrow we'll go back to our normal life.

0:17:53.930 --> 0:17:56.850
<v Speaker 1>The next day came and he sort of went out

0:17:56.930 --> 0:17:59.450
<v Speaker 1>with his friends and didn't come home for a really

0:17:59.490 --> 0:18:02.210
<v Speaker 1>long time, and when he did come home, I could

0:18:02.250 --> 0:18:07.130
<v Speaker 1>tell that he was high again. I was not concerned

0:18:07.170 --> 0:18:09.970
<v Speaker 1>at this point. Even I thought, oh, okay, he's just

0:18:10.490 --> 0:18:13.610
<v Speaker 1>disappointed with the results. And since we'd been together, he'd

0:18:13.690 --> 0:18:19.450
<v Speaker 1>never done drugs, he'd never drank, he didn't drink. I

0:18:19.610 --> 0:18:22.570
<v Speaker 1>thought that he was mature enough to be able to

0:18:22.610 --> 0:18:25.570
<v Speaker 1>monitor and manage that and have a couple of days

0:18:25.610 --> 0:18:28.090
<v Speaker 1>where he did whatever it was that he wanted to do,

0:18:28.970 --> 0:18:30.650
<v Speaker 1>and he would come back to his normal life. He

0:18:30.690 --> 0:18:33.850
<v Speaker 1>would come home and he would things would go back

0:18:33.930 --> 0:18:34.450
<v Speaker 1>to normal.

0:18:36.330 --> 0:18:38.930
<v Speaker 2>Sky was sure there was nothing to worry about. Things

0:18:38.970 --> 0:18:40.890
<v Speaker 2>would look up for both of them, and after the

0:18:40.970 --> 0:18:44.210
<v Speaker 2>letdown of his competition. James had something new and much

0:18:44.250 --> 0:18:45.890
<v Speaker 2>bigger picture to look forward to.

0:18:46.490 --> 0:18:50.650
<v Speaker 1>We had gotten engaged in December, and we had an

0:18:50.650 --> 0:18:53.690
<v Speaker 1>engagement party in April and it was fun. Our friends

0:18:53.730 --> 0:18:57.330
<v Speaker 1>and family came together that didn't normally happen. James did

0:18:57.330 --> 0:19:01.690
<v Speaker 1>not like my family. My family weren't particularly fond of James.

0:19:01.770 --> 0:19:04.930
<v Speaker 1>So for me to have everyone together, knowing that I

0:19:04.970 --> 0:19:07.050
<v Speaker 1>was going to marry this man, it meant a lot

0:19:07.090 --> 0:19:09.210
<v Speaker 1>to me that people could start to get past their

0:19:09.210 --> 0:19:13.330
<v Speaker 1>differences and be together and celebrate what I thought was

0:19:13.370 --> 0:19:15.890
<v Speaker 1>this amazing love that I was going to have forever.

0:19:16.610 --> 0:19:20.930
<v Speaker 2>Then just two weeks later, something big happened, something unexpected

0:19:21.010 --> 0:19:24.050
<v Speaker 2>but that Sky hoped could give James something new and

0:19:24.090 --> 0:19:27.370
<v Speaker 2>exciting to focus on, as well as a responsibility and

0:19:27.490 --> 0:19:29.450
<v Speaker 2>reason to get his life back on track.

0:19:30.010 --> 0:19:35.370
<v Speaker 1>In May, I felt pregnant with our son Kate. I

0:19:35.450 --> 0:19:38.490
<v Speaker 1>was very scared. I didn't think that I wanted to

0:19:38.530 --> 0:19:41.370
<v Speaker 1>have another baby. I especially didn't think that I wanted

0:19:41.370 --> 0:19:44.170
<v Speaker 1>to have another baby with this person at this time.

0:19:45.490 --> 0:19:50.330
<v Speaker 1>Every weekend he would start going out. Every Saturday, his

0:19:50.410 --> 0:19:54.130
<v Speaker 1>friends would come over and they would smoke meth and

0:19:54.170 --> 0:19:58.890
<v Speaker 1>then they would go out. His eyes were just starting everywhere,

0:19:58.930 --> 0:20:04.690
<v Speaker 1>and he was talking crazy, wouldn't stop speaking, would walk

0:20:04.730 --> 0:20:08.370
<v Speaker 1>around the house, would scratch himself like his fingers a lot,

0:20:09.050 --> 0:20:12.970
<v Speaker 1>and that got progressively worse, and he was just very

0:20:13.170 --> 0:20:16.690
<v Speaker 1>unsettled and couldn't sit down, was moving around a lot,

0:20:16.770 --> 0:20:20.050
<v Speaker 1>decided he was going to clean out the garage, went

0:20:20.090 --> 0:20:22.690
<v Speaker 1>into the garage and started tinkering around with all of

0:20:22.690 --> 0:20:25.610
<v Speaker 1>these things and just sort of stayed in there. And

0:20:25.690 --> 0:20:28.570
<v Speaker 1>I had two kids to look after at this point.

0:20:28.970 --> 0:20:33.490
<v Speaker 1>I was not in a position to be following him

0:20:33.490 --> 0:20:36.810
<v Speaker 1>around and babying him and wondering what he was doing,

0:20:36.850 --> 0:20:39.730
<v Speaker 1>so I just I left him to it. I remember

0:20:40.050 --> 0:20:42.890
<v Speaker 1>bathing Lea, putting Lee into bed, and getting into bed

0:20:42.930 --> 0:20:45.970
<v Speaker 1>myself and just thinking he'll come in when he's ready,

0:20:46.010 --> 0:20:49.610
<v Speaker 1>and he did. He eventually went to sleep, and Monday

0:20:49.690 --> 0:20:54.890
<v Speaker 1>started as Monday does. But by Tuesday he was very down.

0:20:55.130 --> 0:20:59.570
<v Speaker 1>He was on this come down cycle, and he would

0:20:59.610 --> 0:21:02.090
<v Speaker 1>just take it out on me. It would be my

0:21:02.210 --> 0:21:06.050
<v Speaker 1>fault that anything bad had happened. And there's one incident

0:21:06.370 --> 0:21:12.650
<v Speaker 1>that my older daughter, Bonnie remembers explicitly, and he had

0:21:12.650 --> 0:21:16.130
<v Speaker 1>made rice and he had put this rice on the

0:21:16.170 --> 0:21:19.050
<v Speaker 1>bench in the rice cooker, and I had cooked and

0:21:19.090 --> 0:21:22.290
<v Speaker 1>put food away, and I hadn't put the rice that

0:21:22.370 --> 0:21:24.210
<v Speaker 1>was in the rice cooker on the bench away, and

0:21:24.250 --> 0:21:26.730
<v Speaker 1>he'd fallen asleep on the couch, woke up from sleeping

0:21:26.810 --> 0:21:29.890
<v Speaker 1>and came into my room and it must have been

0:21:29.890 --> 0:21:33.810
<v Speaker 1>in about three or four am, and just started screaming

0:21:33.850 --> 0:21:36.690
<v Speaker 1>at me that this rice hadn't been put in the fridge,

0:21:36.690 --> 0:21:40.210
<v Speaker 1>and he woke up the whole house and it was

0:21:40.330 --> 0:21:44.330
<v Speaker 1>just my fault. And I was so uncaring, and I

0:21:44.370 --> 0:21:46.690
<v Speaker 1>didn't love him, and he was going to leave me,

0:21:46.890 --> 0:21:50.330
<v Speaker 1>and he hated me, and I was a disgusting excuse

0:21:50.370 --> 0:21:53.730
<v Speaker 1>of a human and just all these really awful profanities

0:21:53.770 --> 0:21:57.570
<v Speaker 1>that you could anything that you could imagine, and he

0:21:57.770 --> 0:21:59.850
<v Speaker 1>was just yelling at me that I hadn't put this

0:22:00.010 --> 0:22:04.850
<v Speaker 1>rice away, and I just remember thinking, rice is about

0:22:04.850 --> 0:22:08.530
<v Speaker 1>ten dollars. Why don't we just cook some more rice.

0:22:08.570 --> 0:22:11.010
<v Speaker 1>It's not the end of the world. But this rice

0:22:11.090 --> 0:22:13.450
<v Speaker 1>was specific, and he needed to eat his meal at

0:22:13.490 --> 0:22:16.730
<v Speaker 1>five am because of his diet, because of his bodybuilding,

0:22:16.770 --> 0:22:21.490
<v Speaker 1>and I had compromised that, and that was very confronting.

0:22:22.330 --> 0:22:25.050
<v Speaker 1>There were lots of instances like that in the weeks

0:22:25.090 --> 0:22:27.970
<v Speaker 1>that followed. I didn't know what to do. I didn't

0:22:27.970 --> 0:22:30.730
<v Speaker 1>know how to confront him. He didn't listen to anything

0:22:30.770 --> 0:22:33.090
<v Speaker 1>that I would say. He didn't care about how it

0:22:33.170 --> 0:22:35.490
<v Speaker 1>made me feel. He really didn't care about my opinion

0:22:35.570 --> 0:22:38.970
<v Speaker 1>at all. He had just sort of started to spiral

0:22:39.090 --> 0:22:45.490
<v Speaker 1>into this place where he was the most righteous, important

0:22:45.530 --> 0:22:50.730
<v Speaker 1>person in the world and nobody else mattered. And every

0:22:50.730 --> 0:22:52.410
<v Speaker 1>time I would bring it up, I would be met

0:22:52.450 --> 0:22:57.930
<v Speaker 1>with this complete shock, as though what I was asking

0:22:58.170 --> 0:23:00.130
<v Speaker 1>was for him to chop his leg off rather than

0:23:00.290 --> 0:23:07.130
<v Speaker 1>for him to stop abusing methamphetamines. Kid was born very prematurely.

0:23:07.410 --> 0:23:12.090
<v Speaker 1>He was born at thirty four weeks in December twenty

0:23:12.130 --> 0:23:16.570
<v Speaker 1>twenty three, but he was a trooper. He was two

0:23:16.650 --> 0:23:20.730
<v Speaker 1>point four kilos. He came out screaming he was ready

0:23:21.530 --> 0:23:23.770
<v Speaker 1>to just be in the world. So by the time

0:23:23.810 --> 0:23:27.450
<v Speaker 1>we got to that point, James and I were in

0:23:27.490 --> 0:23:30.890
<v Speaker 1>a reasonable place. He was still doing a lot of drugs.

0:23:30.930 --> 0:23:34.170
<v Speaker 1>He was still going out every weekend, but I had

0:23:34.450 --> 0:23:39.650
<v Speaker 1>numbed myself to it. When Cad was born, he had

0:23:39.690 --> 0:23:43.250
<v Speaker 1>to stay nick you and I was able to stay

0:23:43.290 --> 0:23:45.370
<v Speaker 1>at the hospital for the first night, but because there

0:23:45.450 --> 0:23:47.890
<v Speaker 1>was nothing wrong with me, I then was discharged from

0:23:47.930 --> 0:23:50.290
<v Speaker 1>the hospital the next day, and I had to go

0:23:50.370 --> 0:23:54.130
<v Speaker 1>back and forth in the following days to be there

0:23:54.170 --> 0:23:56.090
<v Speaker 1>for him and be at home for the kids and

0:23:56.170 --> 0:23:58.970
<v Speaker 1>cook dinners and do shopping and do all of those things.

0:24:00.330 --> 0:24:03.450
<v Speaker 1>So I would be at the hospital for about eight hours,

0:24:03.450 --> 0:24:05.850
<v Speaker 1>which would enable me to do two feeds and the

0:24:05.930 --> 0:24:07.890
<v Speaker 1>nappy change in the bath, and then I would come

0:24:07.930 --> 0:24:09.370
<v Speaker 1>home for three and a half hours, and then I

0:24:09.370 --> 0:24:12.570
<v Speaker 1>would go back for eight hours. It was Christmas Eve

0:24:13.210 --> 0:24:16.890
<v Speaker 1>and James was at home with his friends, and I

0:24:17.170 --> 0:24:20.370
<v Speaker 1>had been to the hospital. I was there with cad.

0:24:20.530 --> 0:24:23.530
<v Speaker 1>I was waiting for an eleven PM feed so that

0:24:23.570 --> 0:24:25.970
<v Speaker 1>I could come home and finish off what I needed

0:24:25.970 --> 0:24:29.010
<v Speaker 1>to get ready for Christmas Day the next day, so

0:24:29.050 --> 0:24:31.810
<v Speaker 1>that I could go to the hospital, feed Caid, come

0:24:31.850 --> 0:24:33.530
<v Speaker 1>back and be there for the girls in the morning.

0:24:34.610 --> 0:24:38.770
<v Speaker 1>And I got this message from James telling me that

0:24:38.930 --> 0:24:42.890
<v Speaker 1>he thought that he was overdosing and he didn't know

0:24:42.930 --> 0:24:44.850
<v Speaker 1>what he was going to say to his mom, and

0:24:44.890 --> 0:24:47.250
<v Speaker 1>his mum was going to be so devastated on Christmas

0:24:47.330 --> 0:24:50.490
<v Speaker 1>Day because he was dying and he was outside on

0:24:50.530 --> 0:24:55.930
<v Speaker 1>the road, and I just remember thinking, oh, well, if

0:24:55.930 --> 0:24:57.730
<v Speaker 1>that's the end of the story, then that's the end

0:24:57.770 --> 0:25:00.290
<v Speaker 1>of the story. And his friends were at the house,

0:25:00.330 --> 0:25:02.170
<v Speaker 1>but he had said that he was out the front

0:25:02.210 --> 0:25:04.970
<v Speaker 1>and he was walking up and down the street. He'd

0:25:05.010 --> 0:25:08.530
<v Speaker 1>done too much drugs, he wasn't overdosing. And one of

0:25:08.530 --> 0:25:11.810
<v Speaker 1>his friends that happened to be there that day, he

0:25:12.170 --> 0:25:16.170
<v Speaker 1>is an AMT for work, so I had called him

0:25:16.770 --> 0:25:20.490
<v Speaker 1>despite James asking me not to, and I had asked

0:25:20.530 --> 0:25:22.290
<v Speaker 1>him to go and check on James and tell me

0:25:22.330 --> 0:25:25.970
<v Speaker 1>whether an ambulance needed to be called, tell me what

0:25:26.130 --> 0:25:29.130
<v Speaker 1>the situation was. And his heart rate was slightly elevated,

0:25:29.170 --> 0:25:32.250
<v Speaker 1>but he was fine. He just needed to calm down,

0:25:32.370 --> 0:25:36.490
<v Speaker 1>drink some water, and go back inside. So James's friend

0:25:36.530 --> 0:25:38.890
<v Speaker 1>took him back inside and kept me updated for the

0:25:38.930 --> 0:25:41.250
<v Speaker 1>next couple of hours, and I didn't go home. I

0:25:41.290 --> 0:25:43.130
<v Speaker 1>waited to do the feed at the hospital, and I

0:25:43.170 --> 0:25:47.770
<v Speaker 1>went home afterwards. And I remember sitting next to him

0:25:47.770 --> 0:25:50.890
<v Speaker 1>that night and saying, it's enough. You've had your fun.

0:25:51.690 --> 0:25:53.890
<v Speaker 1>We have a baby that's going to be coming back

0:25:53.930 --> 0:25:55.890
<v Speaker 1>to this house in the next few days who needs

0:25:55.890 --> 0:25:58.970
<v Speaker 1>my attention. I don't have time for you to be

0:25:58.970 --> 0:26:03.330
<v Speaker 1>behaving like you're an eighteen year old juvenile. It's ridiculous.

0:26:04.010 --> 0:26:06.650
<v Speaker 1>James was thirty two at this point, he had been

0:26:06.690 --> 0:26:09.010
<v Speaker 1>a dad for a few years. He had a new son.

0:26:09.610 --> 0:26:11.770
<v Speaker 1>He needed to let go of the drugs and take

0:26:11.770 --> 0:26:17.210
<v Speaker 1>our relationship in our family life more seriously. Boxing day came.

0:26:17.410 --> 0:26:20.610
<v Speaker 1>I went to the hospital, I picked Caate up, I

0:26:20.650 --> 0:26:22.770
<v Speaker 1>got the all good from the doctors, and then there's

0:26:22.890 --> 0:26:25.650
<v Speaker 1>me walking out of the hospital with this premature baby,

0:26:26.210 --> 0:26:28.770
<v Speaker 1>car set in one arm, three bags in the other hand,

0:26:28.850 --> 0:26:31.530
<v Speaker 1>this little baby, and about to drive him home all

0:26:31.570 --> 0:26:37.130
<v Speaker 1>by myself. I got home and Leah and Bonnie saw

0:26:37.250 --> 0:26:40.770
<v Speaker 1>him and they were besotted by him. But he missed

0:26:40.810 --> 0:26:42.730
<v Speaker 1>all of that because he was in bed for two

0:26:42.770 --> 0:26:47.850
<v Speaker 1>days on a come down, sleeping. He barely came out

0:26:47.890 --> 0:26:51.130
<v Speaker 1>of the bedroom. During that time. I was by myself

0:26:52.010 --> 0:26:54.810
<v Speaker 1>figuring out how to look after this baby that I

0:26:54.970 --> 0:26:57.890
<v Speaker 1>just brought home, who was sick. We were supposed to

0:26:57.890 --> 0:27:00.890
<v Speaker 1>have visiting midwife services when we were discharged, and no

0:27:00.890 --> 0:27:04.410
<v Speaker 1>one ever contacted us. So I really was alone in

0:27:04.450 --> 0:27:10.730
<v Speaker 1>this situation, looking after an older daughter, my younger daughter,

0:27:10.810 --> 0:27:14.530
<v Speaker 1>and then this little baby with no support. So I

0:27:14.570 --> 0:27:18.370
<v Speaker 1>took ten weeks off and that was it. Because I

0:27:18.370 --> 0:27:22.610
<v Speaker 1>got ten weeks off paid and during that time, I

0:27:22.810 --> 0:27:26.490
<v Speaker 1>was expected to care for him, fully look after the

0:27:26.530 --> 0:27:29.810
<v Speaker 1>other two children, fully run the house, do all of

0:27:29.850 --> 0:27:32.450
<v Speaker 1>the things that I was meant to do because I

0:27:32.530 --> 0:27:35.250
<v Speaker 1>was on maternity leave and that was my job. Despite

0:27:35.290 --> 0:27:37.530
<v Speaker 1>the fact that when James had previously been on prin

0:27:37.610 --> 0:27:40.890
<v Speaker 1>to leave, that was time for him. So that didn't

0:27:40.930 --> 0:27:43.050
<v Speaker 1>go down too well with me, and I think that

0:27:43.130 --> 0:27:46.810
<v Speaker 1>I probably became a little bit more distant at this time,

0:27:46.850 --> 0:27:50.050
<v Speaker 1>and I was deliberately distancing myself from what he was

0:27:50.130 --> 0:27:54.850
<v Speaker 1>doing because the drug use didn't stop, it just kept

0:27:54.850 --> 0:27:57.010
<v Speaker 1>getting worse. There would be people at my house on

0:27:57.170 --> 0:28:00.970
<v Speaker 1>Sunday nights, Monday nights when I'm trying to keep the

0:28:01.050 --> 0:28:04.170
<v Speaker 1>kids in a good routine. Sunday night, his friends are

0:28:04.170 --> 0:28:07.530
<v Speaker 1>coming over. They're doing god knows what. They would send

0:28:07.650 --> 0:28:11.490
<v Speaker 1>me the randomest emails at one and two am that

0:28:11.530 --> 0:28:14.290
<v Speaker 1>I would wake up to the next day about gym

0:28:14.370 --> 0:28:17.690
<v Speaker 1>programs they were writing, or business ventures that they're going

0:28:17.730 --> 0:28:20.970
<v Speaker 1>to go on. You get this sense of grandeur when

0:28:21.010 --> 0:28:24.530
<v Speaker 1>you take math and you think you're suddenly invincible, and

0:28:24.570 --> 0:28:28.410
<v Speaker 1>that is exactly what he felt. He was invincible and

0:28:28.490 --> 0:28:30.450
<v Speaker 1>no one was going to stop him, and he could

0:28:30.490 --> 0:28:33.450
<v Speaker 1>do whatever he wanted, and he was untouchable.

0:28:34.210 --> 0:28:37.010
<v Speaker 2>But soon James got a new job. Maybe this would

0:28:37.090 --> 0:28:39.850
<v Speaker 2>change things, make him happier and give him more purpose.

0:28:40.290 --> 0:28:47.050
<v Speaker 1>He started a new, very high profile role, and this

0:28:47.170 --> 0:28:50.730
<v Speaker 1>did not take away from his sense of grandeur and

0:28:50.930 --> 0:28:54.850
<v Speaker 1>this entitlement that he had developed through the drug use.

0:28:54.970 --> 0:28:59.770
<v Speaker 1>His new job title CEO made him feel as though

0:29:00.010 --> 0:29:03.730
<v Speaker 1>he was even more invincible than ever now. At the

0:29:03.770 --> 0:29:07.730
<v Speaker 1>same time, he had suggested, let's move back to your

0:29:07.850 --> 0:29:10.890
<v Speaker 1>investment property. Let's get the tenants out, let's move back.

0:29:11.770 --> 0:29:14.530
<v Speaker 1>Let's go there so that we can save to build

0:29:14.610 --> 0:29:17.090
<v Speaker 1>this other house that we want to build. So we

0:29:17.170 --> 0:29:20.370
<v Speaker 1>had started looking at replacing things like the carpets and

0:29:20.410 --> 0:29:22.450
<v Speaker 1>getting it painted just so it was a bit fresh

0:29:22.490 --> 0:29:25.650
<v Speaker 1>for when our family moved back in. And I was

0:29:25.730 --> 0:29:28.370
<v Speaker 1>calculating square meterage of the carpet to do with the

0:29:28.450 --> 0:29:32.010
<v Speaker 1>quotes and stuff that I had received, And I picked

0:29:32.090 --> 0:29:35.650
<v Speaker 1>up James's work phone and I went to calculate one

0:29:35.690 --> 0:29:38.650
<v Speaker 1>of the rooms and I remember seeing the Snapchat app.

0:29:39.650 --> 0:29:42.610
<v Speaker 1>Now our whole relationship of until this point, I was

0:29:42.730 --> 0:29:45.970
<v Speaker 1>under the impression that James did not use Snapchat. I

0:29:46.010 --> 0:29:48.770
<v Speaker 1>had been made to delete my Snapchat account quite early

0:29:48.850 --> 0:29:52.850
<v Speaker 1>on because he didn't trust Snapchat. He thought, you don't

0:29:52.890 --> 0:29:55.850
<v Speaker 1>have Snapchat unless you're doing things that you shouldn't do

0:29:56.010 --> 0:30:00.010
<v Speaker 1>on Snapchat because the messages disappear. And I thought it

0:30:00.010 --> 0:30:02.610
<v Speaker 1>was so strange that this app would even be on

0:30:02.730 --> 0:30:05.610
<v Speaker 1>his phone when he didn't have an account. So I

0:30:05.690 --> 0:30:08.330
<v Speaker 1>clicked on the app and his account was just logged in,

0:30:09.450 --> 0:30:13.850
<v Speaker 1>and I started going through it, and much to my dismay,

0:30:14.050 --> 0:30:19.610
<v Speaker 1>there were hundreds of messages to girls that went back

0:30:19.770 --> 0:30:25.010
<v Speaker 1>over one hundred weeks, so that nearly two years. There

0:30:25.010 --> 0:30:30.530
<v Speaker 1>were photos being exchanged. There were things like him saying, well,

0:30:30.610 --> 0:30:32.690
<v Speaker 1>I have a seven and a half inch cock and

0:30:32.730 --> 0:30:37.450
<v Speaker 1>I know how to use it to women wherever they were,

0:30:37.810 --> 0:30:44.010
<v Speaker 1>and I was really confronted. There were videos of people

0:30:44.130 --> 0:30:49.170
<v Speaker 1>having sex, him having sex with this other woman, and

0:30:49.210 --> 0:30:53.850
<v Speaker 1>I just remember looking at all of these and thinking, Wow,

0:30:55.130 --> 0:30:58.530
<v Speaker 1>I've really missed this. I've had the wool pulled over

0:30:58.570 --> 0:31:04.170
<v Speaker 1>my eyes. He would often be quite abrasive towards me

0:31:04.290 --> 0:31:07.370
<v Speaker 1>and accused me of cheating on him, despite the fact

0:31:07.370 --> 0:31:09.730
<v Speaker 1>that I was at home with all of these kids

0:31:09.770 --> 0:31:12.850
<v Speaker 1>and this baby, and I was always the one doing

0:31:12.890 --> 0:31:18.450
<v Speaker 1>the wrong thing, and I didn't confront James about these

0:31:19.010 --> 0:31:22.010
<v Speaker 1>images or what I had found straight away, because I

0:31:22.090 --> 0:31:24.290
<v Speaker 1>was too scared of his reaction. I was scared of

0:31:24.330 --> 0:31:26.130
<v Speaker 1>what he would do to me, how he would treat me,

0:31:26.570 --> 0:31:28.970
<v Speaker 1>What would happen if he found out that I had

0:31:29.050 --> 0:31:31.650
<v Speaker 1>seen this on his phone. I knew that he would

0:31:32.170 --> 0:31:35.210
<v Speaker 1>blame me and make it my fault that I had

0:31:35.250 --> 0:31:37.530
<v Speaker 1>found it, rather than his fault that he had done it.

0:31:38.490 --> 0:31:43.330
<v Speaker 1>I called my best friend and I said to her,

0:31:43.570 --> 0:31:45.730
<v Speaker 1>this has happened. This is what I found. I took

0:31:45.770 --> 0:31:49.570
<v Speaker 1>photos of it all on my phone from his phone,

0:31:49.730 --> 0:31:52.530
<v Speaker 1>and I sent it all to her and I just said,

0:31:52.730 --> 0:31:57.050
<v Speaker 1>what do I do? And her reaction was, well, you're right.

0:31:57.090 --> 0:32:00.650
<v Speaker 1>You're not safe if you tell him or you confront him,

0:32:00.650 --> 0:32:03.050
<v Speaker 1>and nobody else is there, so you need to make

0:32:03.090 --> 0:32:06.170
<v Speaker 1>sure that you're in a safe environment when he finds

0:32:06.210 --> 0:32:10.050
<v Speaker 1>out that you know. So, given this new job, he

0:32:10.170 --> 0:32:14.730
<v Speaker 1>used to go away for work quite often, so I

0:32:14.810 --> 0:32:16.890
<v Speaker 1>knew that he would be going down south sometime in

0:32:16.930 --> 0:32:19.690
<v Speaker 1>the next few weeks. Now it was my birthday during

0:32:19.730 --> 0:32:23.250
<v Speaker 1>this time, and he pretended like nothing was wrong, but

0:32:23.330 --> 0:32:25.370
<v Speaker 1>I knew the whole time what was going on, what

0:32:25.410 --> 0:32:28.370
<v Speaker 1>he was doing when he was on his phone, and

0:32:28.410 --> 0:32:34.250
<v Speaker 1>it was honestly grating. You just feel as though you

0:32:34.290 --> 0:32:37.850
<v Speaker 1>could explode at any second. So I just I waited.

0:32:38.650 --> 0:32:42.130
<v Speaker 1>I held it together. I remember sitting in my office

0:32:42.170 --> 0:32:46.770
<v Speaker 1>at work and I sent him this message, and the

0:32:46.850 --> 0:32:52.250
<v Speaker 1>message said, I know this is how I know, this

0:32:52.410 --> 0:32:55.330
<v Speaker 1>is what I saw. How could you do this to

0:32:55.370 --> 0:32:59.810
<v Speaker 1>me and our family? Those typical disappointing statements that you

0:32:59.890 --> 0:33:04.010
<v Speaker 1>throw out there as like I just can't possibly understand.

0:33:04.930 --> 0:33:10.010
<v Speaker 1>And his response to it was really quite vulgar. It

0:33:10.130 --> 0:33:13.210
<v Speaker 1>was almost, why are you doing this to me when

0:33:13.250 --> 0:33:16.370
<v Speaker 1>you know that I'm at work? And okay, well I'll

0:33:16.450 --> 0:33:19.050
<v Speaker 1>just stay down here until you figure your head out.

0:33:21.250 --> 0:33:25.690
<v Speaker 1>And no apology. There was no I'm so sorries, There

0:33:25.770 --> 0:33:28.690
<v Speaker 1>was no let me beg for your forgiveness, There was

0:33:28.730 --> 0:33:32.610
<v Speaker 1>no explanation. It was just, oh, well, you know now,

0:33:32.730 --> 0:33:34.370
<v Speaker 1>so you figure out what you want to do and

0:33:34.450 --> 0:33:38.210
<v Speaker 1>let me know. Then, over the course of that night,

0:33:38.370 --> 0:33:43.410
<v Speaker 1>he spent it trying to manipulate me into believing that

0:33:43.490 --> 0:33:46.770
<v Speaker 1>it was my fault. I was the reason why he

0:33:46.810 --> 0:33:49.770
<v Speaker 1>had done this. I wasn't giving him enough attention. I

0:33:49.970 --> 0:33:54.290
<v Speaker 1>wasn't enough, and therefore he was doing this with other women.

0:33:54.730 --> 0:33:57.450
<v Speaker 1>He convinced me that he'd never seen any of these

0:33:57.450 --> 0:34:01.090
<v Speaker 1>women in person, that it was just a few images

0:34:01.170 --> 0:34:07.450
<v Speaker 1>here and there. He had stated that he hadn't engaged

0:34:07.530 --> 0:34:10.410
<v Speaker 1>in any sort of intercourse with the one woman that

0:34:10.450 --> 0:34:13.650
<v Speaker 1>I found these videos off of, and that I could

0:34:13.650 --> 0:34:17.450
<v Speaker 1>contact her if I wanted to, And I really did

0:34:17.450 --> 0:34:20.490
<v Speaker 1>think about contacting her, but I didn't think that he

0:34:21.050 --> 0:34:25.810
<v Speaker 1>meant it, and I felt like if I did contact her,

0:34:26.650 --> 0:34:29.850
<v Speaker 1>he would leave me anyway, because that was what he said.

0:34:29.970 --> 0:34:31.690
<v Speaker 1>He said, you can contact her if you want to,

0:34:31.730 --> 0:34:34.290
<v Speaker 1>but if we do and you don't believe me, whereover.

0:34:35.610 --> 0:34:39.810
<v Speaker 1>And I remember being so terrified of this concept of

0:34:39.850 --> 0:34:42.730
<v Speaker 1>having to have these three children on my own, one

0:34:42.770 --> 0:34:47.090
<v Speaker 1>of which was super high needs. I just I couldn't

0:34:47.090 --> 0:34:50.810
<v Speaker 1>even fathom it. I loved him. I thought that he

0:34:51.530 --> 0:34:55.970
<v Speaker 1>was my home and my family, and we had been

0:34:56.010 --> 0:34:59.090
<v Speaker 1>together for so long that that comfort was a really

0:34:59.130 --> 0:35:04.090
<v Speaker 1>hard thing to just walk away from. I didn't feel

0:35:04.250 --> 0:35:08.250
<v Speaker 1>as though I could walk away and not impact my children,

0:35:09.130 --> 0:35:11.650
<v Speaker 1>and that was the one thing that I never wanted

0:35:11.690 --> 0:35:15.690
<v Speaker 1>wanted to happen. I never wanted to leave him and

0:35:15.770 --> 0:35:19.330
<v Speaker 1>my children be so heavily impacted by that decision, and

0:35:19.410 --> 0:35:23.170
<v Speaker 1>so I just ended up staying and we sat down

0:35:23.210 --> 0:35:25.810
<v Speaker 1>and we had this conversation. I had arranged for his

0:35:25.930 --> 0:35:29.530
<v Speaker 1>mom to look after Cade for a couple of hours,

0:35:30.610 --> 0:35:35.250
<v Speaker 1>and we had this conversation about our relationship and what

0:35:35.370 --> 0:35:39.810
<v Speaker 1>he wanted and what I wanted, and I suppose he

0:35:39.890 --> 0:35:43.370
<v Speaker 1>persuaded me in a way to thinking that it would

0:35:43.370 --> 0:35:46.090
<v Speaker 1>be okay if our relationship was more of an open

0:35:46.170 --> 0:35:49.690
<v Speaker 1>style relationship. And that was never something that I had

0:35:49.770 --> 0:35:54.730
<v Speaker 1>thought about. But he brought up these ideas of this ethical,

0:35:55.250 --> 0:36:01.330
<v Speaker 1>non monogamous style relationship and his views on things that

0:36:01.410 --> 0:36:04.610
<v Speaker 1>he would like to do in a sexual nature that

0:36:05.010 --> 0:36:09.090
<v Speaker 1>I hadn't previously been open to or he had never

0:36:09.130 --> 0:36:13.530
<v Speaker 1>discussed anything like this with me before. So this person

0:36:13.570 --> 0:36:16.210
<v Speaker 1>that was talking to me and saying I want to

0:36:16.210 --> 0:36:20.370
<v Speaker 1>do all of these things didn't really sound like him

0:36:20.490 --> 0:36:22.530
<v Speaker 1>or like the person that I'd fallen in love with.

0:36:22.610 --> 0:36:26.450
<v Speaker 1>But I didn't want to lose him, so reluctantly I

0:36:26.490 --> 0:36:31.210
<v Speaker 1>agreed to him having this site that he already had.

0:36:31.970 --> 0:36:34.970
<v Speaker 1>It's big in the swinging community, it's big amongst people

0:36:35.410 --> 0:36:40.530
<v Speaker 1>who do engage in these ethical, non monogamous situations. And

0:36:41.010 --> 0:36:44.250
<v Speaker 1>I consented to him using some photos of us on

0:36:44.450 --> 0:36:48.850
<v Speaker 1>there for a period. Now he gave me access to

0:36:48.890 --> 0:36:52.410
<v Speaker 1>this account and I was able to see what he

0:36:52.530 --> 0:36:56.290
<v Speaker 1>was saying, but I wouldn't participate. I wouldn't talk on there,

0:36:56.690 --> 0:36:59.850
<v Speaker 1>I wouldn't engage in looking through it. I was more

0:36:59.850 --> 0:37:03.850
<v Speaker 1>of a silent observer at times. But it consumed him.

0:37:04.290 --> 0:37:06.650
<v Speaker 1>All he wanted to do was be on this site

0:37:06.690 --> 0:37:09.810
<v Speaker 1>and talk to these people and find someone and have

0:37:09.930 --> 0:37:14.050
<v Speaker 1>a threesome or him to have sex with somebody else,

0:37:14.090 --> 0:37:16.130
<v Speaker 1>and I was open to that at the time. I

0:37:16.210 --> 0:37:18.250
<v Speaker 1>sort of thought, Oh, well, if that's what's going to

0:37:18.290 --> 0:37:20.730
<v Speaker 1>make you happy, and I'm not able to give you

0:37:20.770 --> 0:37:23.610
<v Speaker 1>that right now because of our son, maybe that will

0:37:23.610 --> 0:37:26.530
<v Speaker 1>fix our relationship. Maybe that will make things better, Maybe

0:37:26.570 --> 0:37:30.690
<v Speaker 1>that will recenter us. Or you might do that and

0:37:30.730 --> 0:37:32.930
<v Speaker 1>then realize that you have everything that you need here.

0:37:33.090 --> 0:37:34.770
<v Speaker 1>Really was what was going on in the back of

0:37:34.810 --> 0:37:38.050
<v Speaker 1>my head. And I had never really been big on

0:37:39.210 --> 0:37:43.890
<v Speaker 1>the whole sending photos or anything like that before this time.

0:37:44.570 --> 0:37:46.970
<v Speaker 1>I wasn't someone who would create a lot of intimate

0:37:47.010 --> 0:37:50.010
<v Speaker 1>content of myself. I didn't really have that level of

0:37:50.050 --> 0:37:54.210
<v Speaker 1>self confidence, and I suppose going through this he would

0:37:54.210 --> 0:37:57.250
<v Speaker 1>always pump me up and make me feel better about

0:37:57.290 --> 0:38:01.090
<v Speaker 1>myself so that I would get the confidence to create

0:38:01.130 --> 0:38:03.690
<v Speaker 1>this intimate content for him to be able to use

0:38:03.770 --> 0:38:07.490
<v Speaker 1>in whatever way he wanted to. I was just desperate

0:38:07.530 --> 0:38:09.810
<v Speaker 1>for him to be happy so that things would be better,

0:38:09.890 --> 0:38:11.410
<v Speaker 1>even if it was just for a little while.

0:38:13.610 --> 0:38:16.290
<v Speaker 2>But after a few months of this, James hadn't changed

0:38:16.290 --> 0:38:19.610
<v Speaker 2>his ways or realized that Sky was in fact enough,

0:38:20.170 --> 0:38:23.290
<v Speaker 2>and she became uncomfortable. She asked him to stop using

0:38:23.290 --> 0:38:25.370
<v Speaker 2>the site and remove any photos of her.

0:38:25.850 --> 0:38:30.650
<v Speaker 1>That caused a really big argument between us because he

0:38:30.690 --> 0:38:34.010
<v Speaker 1>felt like I didn't care about him, because I wasn't

0:38:34.050 --> 0:38:39.130
<v Speaker 1>comfortable with this account being online, and I was trying

0:38:39.130 --> 0:38:40.890
<v Speaker 1>to explain to him that it's not him that I

0:38:40.930 --> 0:38:43.690
<v Speaker 1>don't care about. It's these other people that have this

0:38:44.850 --> 0:38:46.810
<v Speaker 1>content of me and I don't know them, I don't

0:38:46.850 --> 0:38:49.010
<v Speaker 1>have any sort of engagement with them. I'm not speaking

0:38:49.010 --> 0:38:52.490
<v Speaker 1>to them. You are, but you're very liberal with just

0:38:52.610 --> 0:38:56.130
<v Speaker 1>giving this to people, and I'm I want a career,

0:38:56.250 --> 0:39:00.890
<v Speaker 1>I have aspirations outside of this, and it seems to

0:39:00.890 --> 0:39:03.650
<v Speaker 1>be all consuming few at the moment, and I just

0:39:04.170 --> 0:39:07.330
<v Speaker 1>I don't want to participate anymore. And I even said

0:39:07.330 --> 0:39:10.210
<v Speaker 1>to him at that point, look, I'm happy if you

0:39:10.450 --> 0:39:14.090
<v Speaker 1>want to send content of yourself, as long as you

0:39:14.170 --> 0:39:15.890
<v Speaker 1>leave me with the login so that I can see

0:39:15.890 --> 0:39:21.450
<v Speaker 1>what you're saying to these people, that's fine. He fought

0:39:21.450 --> 0:39:24.050
<v Speaker 1>me for a lot on this, and I ended up

0:39:24.130 --> 0:39:25.970
<v Speaker 1>just giving in and feeling like I didn't really have

0:39:26.010 --> 0:39:28.410
<v Speaker 1>a voice, and I just let him keep using it

0:39:28.490 --> 0:39:32.810
<v Speaker 1>and under the same username or whatever it was that

0:39:32.850 --> 0:39:35.170
<v Speaker 1>he was doing, and I just wouldn't talk on it.

0:39:35.170 --> 0:39:38.850
<v Speaker 1>I wouldn't talk about it, We wouldn't. It just became

0:39:38.930 --> 0:39:42.490
<v Speaker 1>an annoying thing that he was doing and I just

0:39:42.530 --> 0:39:44.370
<v Speaker 1>had to live with it, kind of like the drug use.

0:39:45.210 --> 0:39:47.170
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, that was still going on too.

0:39:47.690 --> 0:39:49.810
<v Speaker 1>For a long time. I didn't tell anyone how bad

0:39:49.850 --> 0:39:53.930
<v Speaker 1>the drug use had gotten. It's started us every Saturday,

0:39:54.290 --> 0:39:56.810
<v Speaker 1>then it would be every Friday Saturday, and then just

0:39:56.850 --> 0:39:59.490
<v Speaker 1>snowboard from there until he was doing it full time.

0:40:00.010 --> 0:40:02.810
<v Speaker 1>I was just accepting of it at this point because

0:40:03.370 --> 0:40:06.970
<v Speaker 1>when he would be high and he would be on drugs,

0:40:07.090 --> 0:40:08.770
<v Speaker 1>that was the only time he was nice to us.

0:40:08.770 --> 0:40:12.770
<v Speaker 1>By this point, it's sort of got on downhill to

0:40:12.850 --> 0:40:15.330
<v Speaker 1>the point where he was doing it four times a

0:40:15.370 --> 0:40:17.610
<v Speaker 1>week and not doing it three times, and those three

0:40:17.690 --> 0:40:20.170
<v Speaker 1>days would be hell. I would be anxious for the

0:40:20.170 --> 0:40:23.650
<v Speaker 1>three days where he wasn't doing drugs rather than looking

0:40:23.650 --> 0:40:27.370
<v Speaker 1>forward to them. And I remember one day being at

0:40:27.410 --> 0:40:31.210
<v Speaker 1>work and him calling me about my friend who had

0:40:31.410 --> 0:40:36.010
<v Speaker 1>sometimes helped with Kate on Tuesdays, and he had asked

0:40:36.050 --> 0:40:38.330
<v Speaker 1>me what her last name was, and I thought, Oh,

0:40:38.410 --> 0:40:41.410
<v Speaker 1>that's really weird. And he said, what's Sally's last name?

0:40:41.490 --> 0:40:43.730
<v Speaker 1>Tell me right now, and he's yelling at me down

0:40:43.810 --> 0:40:46.770
<v Speaker 1>the phone, and I could tell that he was really frustrated.

0:40:48.050 --> 0:40:50.370
<v Speaker 1>And I told him what her last name was, and

0:40:50.530 --> 0:40:54.010
<v Speaker 1>he said, that's it. We've got a problem. He had said,

0:40:54.890 --> 0:40:58.890
<v Speaker 1>she's posted this on a Facebook page that is associated

0:40:58.930 --> 0:41:02.730
<v Speaker 1>to my work and said that she knows me and

0:41:02.770 --> 0:41:06.930
<v Speaker 1>that I'm no better than the previous CEO. It really

0:41:07.010 --> 0:41:12.290
<v Speaker 1>wasn't career ending, but because of the psychosis that comes

0:41:12.330 --> 0:41:16.290
<v Speaker 1>with drug addiction, he had taken it upon that I

0:41:16.490 --> 0:41:20.570
<v Speaker 1>had coerced her into doing it, or I had been

0:41:21.730 --> 0:41:24.090
<v Speaker 1>complicit in what had happened, and I knew it was

0:41:24.130 --> 0:41:25.730
<v Speaker 1>going to happen, and I was trying to take his

0:41:25.850 --> 0:41:29.450
<v Speaker 1>career down by having her post these things that really

0:41:29.490 --> 0:41:35.170
<v Speaker 1>seemed insignificant at the time, but the phone calls that

0:41:35.410 --> 0:41:39.730
<v Speaker 1>ensued and the abuse. He told me he was going

0:41:39.770 --> 0:41:42.490
<v Speaker 1>to drive to my mother's house and cut her tongue

0:41:42.490 --> 0:41:46.850
<v Speaker 1>out and that would be his revenge. He was adamant

0:41:46.850 --> 0:41:49.690
<v Speaker 1>that he would need to ruin my career in return

0:41:50.850 --> 0:41:55.050
<v Speaker 1>by sending intimate images that he had gained through this

0:41:55.410 --> 0:41:59.570
<v Speaker 1>process that he had requested to explore to my CEO

0:41:59.650 --> 0:42:04.650
<v Speaker 1>or my boss. And he sent me an image followed

0:42:04.650 --> 0:42:07.730
<v Speaker 1>by their email addresses, which were the correct emails. They're

0:42:07.770 --> 0:42:12.050
<v Speaker 1>not difficult to find, and said, I will ruin you.

0:42:12.130 --> 0:42:15.330
<v Speaker 1>I'll end your career, bitch. Maybe you'll have some empathy

0:42:15.490 --> 0:42:19.090
<v Speaker 1>when your career is on the line. And I was terrified.

0:42:19.650 --> 0:42:23.450
<v Speaker 1>I thought, well, I'm the only one supporting these children

0:42:23.530 --> 0:42:26.370
<v Speaker 1>right now. All of your money is going to just

0:42:26.530 --> 0:42:29.170
<v Speaker 1>like a little bit of rent and whatever you want

0:42:29.210 --> 0:42:33.410
<v Speaker 1>it to for drugs and computers and clothes for work,

0:42:33.450 --> 0:42:36.930
<v Speaker 1>and I'm paying for basically everything else. And now you're

0:42:36.930 --> 0:42:38.650
<v Speaker 1>going to put my career at risk. How am I

0:42:38.690 --> 0:42:40.410
<v Speaker 1>going to pay for these kids? How am I ever

0:42:40.450 --> 0:42:42.930
<v Speaker 1>going to get away from you when I have no money?

0:42:43.690 --> 0:42:47.770
<v Speaker 1>And James is a really smart person, So the way

0:42:47.810 --> 0:42:50.090
<v Speaker 1>that he can manipulate things and the way that he

0:42:50.210 --> 0:42:52.610
<v Speaker 1>understands the system and how to get what he wants

0:42:52.650 --> 0:42:58.410
<v Speaker 1>out of things is quite confronting, and when that is

0:42:58.450 --> 0:43:00.850
<v Speaker 1>put on you in a positive way, it makes you

0:43:00.890 --> 0:43:02.850
<v Speaker 1>feel on top of the world and you get that

0:43:03.770 --> 0:43:06.690
<v Speaker 1>joint sense of security when you're with him and he

0:43:06.930 --> 0:43:11.210
<v Speaker 1>wants the best for you. But similarly, when he wants

0:43:11.210 --> 0:43:13.250
<v Speaker 1>the opposite and you go against him, and you go

0:43:13.330 --> 0:43:17.450
<v Speaker 1>against what he wants, it makes you feel terrified and

0:43:17.690 --> 0:43:20.770
<v Speaker 1>like you have no control and whatever will happen to

0:43:20.770 --> 0:43:23.090
<v Speaker 1>you will happen to you, and you have no choice.

0:43:23.130 --> 0:43:28.290
<v Speaker 1>It's just it's what he wants. And so I went home,

0:43:28.450 --> 0:43:32.690
<v Speaker 1>I got my kids all into bed, and then I

0:43:32.930 --> 0:43:37.570
<v Speaker 1>remember he just wanted to have sex with me after

0:43:37.650 --> 0:43:40.370
<v Speaker 1>all of this that he had just been doing and

0:43:40.410 --> 0:43:42.810
<v Speaker 1>the way he had been treating me, and just to

0:43:42.810 --> 0:43:47.490
<v Speaker 1>stop him from yelling, I did it. And I don't

0:43:47.530 --> 0:43:51.970
<v Speaker 1>know if you can call that non consenting, but I

0:43:52.010 --> 0:43:56.570
<v Speaker 1>would definitely say that from then on, there were a

0:43:56.570 --> 0:43:59.250
<v Speaker 1>lot of times where that would just happen to shut

0:43:59.290 --> 0:44:03.090
<v Speaker 1>him up, just to stop him from escalating, to stop

0:44:03.130 --> 0:44:05.450
<v Speaker 1>him from waking the kids up, to stop him from yelling.

0:44:06.930 --> 0:44:08.290
<v Speaker 1>There was no way around it.

0:44:09.050 --> 0:44:12.930
<v Speaker 2>This abuse continued in its many forms sky was isolated

0:44:12.970 --> 0:44:15.490
<v Speaker 2>and scared and felt completely trapped.

0:44:17.690 --> 0:44:20.690
<v Speaker 1>I didn't recognize myself with him, but I also didn't

0:44:20.690 --> 0:44:23.290
<v Speaker 1>know how to be without him or how to let go.

0:44:24.250 --> 0:44:27.130
<v Speaker 1>I didn't really go anywhere. I didn't see my friends

0:44:27.250 --> 0:44:30.930
<v Speaker 1>very much. I just went to work and came home

0:44:30.970 --> 0:44:33.210
<v Speaker 1>and did what I needed to do because there was

0:44:33.330 --> 0:44:36.970
<v Speaker 1>no reprieve from him, and he was just starting to

0:44:37.010 --> 0:44:40.730
<v Speaker 1>make me feel like the world was five thousand kilos

0:44:40.730 --> 0:44:45.730
<v Speaker 1>on my shoulders and we were moving. So I had

0:44:45.770 --> 0:44:49.850
<v Speaker 1>packed everything up. We were moving to my house. It

0:44:50.010 --> 0:44:53.290
<v Speaker 1>was maybe a couple of weeks after this that he

0:44:53.370 --> 0:44:56.250
<v Speaker 1>had decided that he was keeping the rental property that

0:44:56.290 --> 0:44:59.370
<v Speaker 1>we had together, but he was keeping as an office,

0:44:59.690 --> 0:45:01.530
<v Speaker 1>so some of our furniture would stay there and that

0:45:01.570 --> 0:45:04.330
<v Speaker 1>would be his office where he would work from because

0:45:04.770 --> 0:45:07.090
<v Speaker 1>he couldn't be around the kids without crying all the time,

0:45:07.130 --> 0:45:10.610
<v Speaker 1>but he could work from home without crying. And I

0:45:10.690 --> 0:45:12.810
<v Speaker 1>knew he also couldn't go into the office because he

0:45:12.890 --> 0:45:15.770
<v Speaker 1>was always high, so when he would go into the office,

0:45:15.810 --> 0:45:18.010
<v Speaker 1>they would start to notice these things, and he obviously

0:45:18.090 --> 0:45:20.370
<v Speaker 1>knew that as well. So he needed somewhere else to work,

0:45:21.490 --> 0:45:26.490
<v Speaker 1>so he had decided to keep our rental property, and I,

0:45:26.570 --> 0:45:29.850
<v Speaker 1>despite saying that's a very terrible financial decision, given we

0:45:29.970 --> 0:45:35.170
<v Speaker 1>decided to move to save money, I was met with, well,

0:45:35.250 --> 0:45:37.770
<v Speaker 1>I am a CEO, and I can afford it because

0:45:37.850 --> 0:45:39.730
<v Speaker 1>I earned this amount of money, and don't tell me

0:45:39.770 --> 0:45:42.490
<v Speaker 1>what to spend my money on. So I lost that

0:45:42.610 --> 0:45:46.850
<v Speaker 1>argument as well. And the hot water unit went out

0:45:46.890 --> 0:45:50.610
<v Speaker 1>at the rental property, which was of course my responsibility

0:45:50.650 --> 0:45:53.090
<v Speaker 1>to resolve, and I wasn't able to get in one

0:45:53.210 --> 0:45:56.410
<v Speaker 1>day and I couldn't get in contact with him, and

0:45:56.450 --> 0:45:58.970
<v Speaker 1>he kept saying, I'm at work, I'm at work, stop

0:45:59.050 --> 0:46:02.250
<v Speaker 1>calling me, and then sending me these really abusive emails

0:46:02.290 --> 0:46:04.370
<v Speaker 1>saying that I'm the reason why the real estate's so

0:46:04.410 --> 0:46:06.730
<v Speaker 1>difficult to deal with, and it's because I'm a bitch,

0:46:06.770 --> 0:46:10.690
<v Speaker 1>and I don't respond to them. Eventually, I just went

0:46:10.730 --> 0:46:14.250
<v Speaker 1>there and when I went inside, his work laptop was there,

0:46:14.970 --> 0:46:19.010
<v Speaker 1>so I thought, I'm going to look at it. I

0:46:19.090 --> 0:46:20.970
<v Speaker 1>know you shouldn't do that. I know you should trust

0:46:21.010 --> 0:46:25.290
<v Speaker 1>your partner, but by this point it was gone. I

0:46:25.330 --> 0:46:27.370
<v Speaker 1>wanted to look and I was going to, so I did.

0:46:27.610 --> 0:46:31.290
<v Speaker 1>I opened the computer and it was a Mac and

0:46:31.330 --> 0:46:33.890
<v Speaker 1>therefore all of his text messages were on this computer

0:46:34.570 --> 0:46:43.450
<v Speaker 1>and there was another woman. I went through reams and

0:46:43.570 --> 0:46:48.330
<v Speaker 1>reams of text messages between him and another woman who

0:46:48.410 --> 0:46:53.210
<v Speaker 1>I later found to be Amanda. Amanda had a daughter

0:46:53.650 --> 0:46:59.050
<v Speaker 1>very similar age to Bonnie, and they had been away together.

0:46:59.850 --> 0:47:03.770
<v Speaker 1>They were both bodybuilders, so they shared this common interest,

0:47:04.010 --> 0:47:08.090
<v Speaker 1>and he would say things to her along the lines

0:47:08.130 --> 0:47:11.370
<v Speaker 1>of I can't wait for you to meet Leah. She's

0:47:11.410 --> 0:47:14.930
<v Speaker 1>gone to love you. She's going to adore you because

0:47:15.010 --> 0:47:17.570
<v Speaker 1>I adore you, and she's a mini me. And these

0:47:17.610 --> 0:47:21.330
<v Speaker 1>messages were heartbreaking to me. James is talking to this

0:47:21.490 --> 0:47:24.690
<v Speaker 1>other woman about my children and how much my children

0:47:24.730 --> 0:47:27.610
<v Speaker 1>are going to love her, and she meets them as

0:47:27.650 --> 0:47:29.810
<v Speaker 1>though they're going to be this happy family and I'm

0:47:29.850 --> 0:47:32.370
<v Speaker 1>just going to walk away and out of the picture,

0:47:34.210 --> 0:47:36.490
<v Speaker 1>and I didn't know what to do. I called his mom,

0:47:37.050 --> 0:47:40.170
<v Speaker 1>and I was beside myself by this point. I don't

0:47:40.210 --> 0:47:42.530
<v Speaker 1>even know if she could understand what I was saying.

0:47:42.730 --> 0:47:48.330
<v Speaker 1>It was through tears. I felt like I was suffocating

0:47:48.410 --> 0:47:52.690
<v Speaker 1>because I couldn't get breath in between the crying. It

0:47:52.810 --> 0:47:58.170
<v Speaker 1>was real devastation that this had happened. So his mom

0:47:58.210 --> 0:48:01.690
<v Speaker 1>got there and she said, what do you mean, what

0:48:01.850 --> 0:48:04.650
<v Speaker 1>is going on? I don't think he would do that

0:48:04.770 --> 0:48:07.530
<v Speaker 1>to you. He loves you off the bat. It was

0:48:07.570 --> 0:48:11.530
<v Speaker 1>already defending him before she'd even heard or scene or

0:48:11.970 --> 0:48:14.890
<v Speaker 1>come to terms with what had happened. So I just

0:48:14.930 --> 0:48:17.210
<v Speaker 1>sat her down with the screenshots and said, you go

0:48:17.290 --> 0:48:19.690
<v Speaker 1>through them and tell me if you think that they're

0:48:19.730 --> 0:48:23.890
<v Speaker 1>just friends. And then my friend had arrived and she

0:48:24.530 --> 0:48:27.130
<v Speaker 1>has a daughter the same age as Leah, so that

0:48:27.250 --> 0:48:29.050
<v Speaker 1>was good because they could go off and play and

0:48:29.130 --> 0:48:32.050
<v Speaker 1>it gave me a little bit of time while she

0:48:32.130 --> 0:48:34.650
<v Speaker 1>looked after Kate and I was talking to his mum.

0:48:36.050 --> 0:48:39.770
<v Speaker 1>But even so, his mum would just say things like, well,

0:48:40.450 --> 0:48:41.970
<v Speaker 1>I need to know how this is going to affect

0:48:41.970 --> 0:48:45.410
<v Speaker 1>my relationship with my grandchildren, and I need to know

0:48:45.490 --> 0:48:48.450
<v Speaker 1>what you're planning on doing. I don't think he would

0:48:48.490 --> 0:48:51.410
<v Speaker 1>have meant it, and you can figure it out. That

0:48:51.530 --> 0:48:55.010
<v Speaker 1>just isn't what you need to hear when you've just

0:48:55.090 --> 0:48:59.370
<v Speaker 1>found out that this person who you've been so flexible with,

0:48:59.890 --> 0:49:03.090
<v Speaker 1>who you've allowed to do things that stray so far

0:49:03.130 --> 0:49:08.650
<v Speaker 1>from your natural moral compass, has then gone further outside

0:49:08.730 --> 0:49:11.090
<v Speaker 1>that and tested the boundaries and to the point where

0:49:11.090 --> 0:49:15.730
<v Speaker 1>he's gotten in to this other relationship and you just think,

0:49:16.050 --> 0:49:18.170
<v Speaker 1>and you're telling me that all I should be worried

0:49:18.210 --> 0:49:20.610
<v Speaker 1>about is your relationship with my children. How am I

0:49:20.650 --> 0:49:23.370
<v Speaker 1>going to support these children? How am I going to

0:49:23.450 --> 0:49:26.090
<v Speaker 1>look after these kids by myself? And what are you

0:49:26.130 --> 0:49:29.530
<v Speaker 1>going to do to support me through that? I couldn't

0:49:29.530 --> 0:49:33.250
<v Speaker 1>say any of that at the time. And I then

0:49:33.570 --> 0:49:39.810
<v Speaker 1>called him and I said I know about Amanda, and

0:49:40.130 --> 0:49:42.250
<v Speaker 1>he lost it. He snapped. He said he was going

0:49:42.330 --> 0:49:44.650
<v Speaker 1>to beat me to my house and run through it,

0:49:44.690 --> 0:49:47.610
<v Speaker 1>and I wouldn't own anything that wasn't broken, and how

0:49:47.730 --> 0:49:52.050
<v Speaker 1>dare I go through his computer anyway. The days after this,

0:49:52.290 --> 0:49:55.530
<v Speaker 1>it turned into me begging for him back, as you

0:49:55.570 --> 0:49:58.090
<v Speaker 1>do when you're the ex that's been cheated on. You

0:49:58.130 --> 0:50:01.730
<v Speaker 1>feel so disheartened, you feel like nothing, your self confidence

0:50:01.770 --> 0:50:05.010
<v Speaker 1>is an all time low, and you just you get fomo,

0:50:05.170 --> 0:50:07.370
<v Speaker 1>for want of a better word, you feel like you're

0:50:07.410 --> 0:50:12.570
<v Speaker 1>missing out on this really amazing person. And I'd forgotten

0:50:12.610 --> 0:50:16.810
<v Speaker 1>all of the bad things. I wanted him to come

0:50:16.850 --> 0:50:19.250
<v Speaker 1>back and be part of our lives and have that

0:50:19.330 --> 0:50:21.970
<v Speaker 1>life and our kids. And I come from a broken

0:50:22.050 --> 0:50:25.890
<v Speaker 1>family and I didn't want that. I just wanted him

0:50:25.930 --> 0:50:28.690
<v Speaker 1>to be there and for us to repair what we had.

0:50:28.810 --> 0:50:32.330
<v Speaker 1>So it was weeks and weeks of me begging for

0:50:32.410 --> 0:50:35.330
<v Speaker 1>him back, doing whatever he wanted to try and make

0:50:35.410 --> 0:50:37.410
<v Speaker 1>him believe that I was better than her, and I

0:50:37.450 --> 0:50:40.170
<v Speaker 1>would constantly compare myself to her. And I was in

0:50:40.610 --> 0:50:48.450
<v Speaker 1>a real downward spiral depression. Wasn't eating anything, I was

0:50:48.490 --> 0:50:53.490
<v Speaker 1>not performing at work. I was very short tempered all

0:50:53.530 --> 0:50:56.010
<v Speaker 1>the time. The only thing I would do is really

0:50:56.090 --> 0:51:00.130
<v Speaker 1>look after my kids and then go home. I didn't

0:51:00.210 --> 0:51:03.970
<v Speaker 1>have anything else to cling onto, and all I would

0:51:03.970 --> 0:51:06.650
<v Speaker 1>think about was him and her and what they were

0:51:06.690 --> 0:51:11.810
<v Speaker 1>doing while I was just sat there with these kids.

0:51:11.930 --> 0:51:15.450
<v Speaker 1>And his birthday wasn't long after I discovered all of this,

0:51:15.610 --> 0:51:18.930
<v Speaker 1>It was a matter of days, and on his birthday

0:51:19.050 --> 0:51:21.170
<v Speaker 1>I still went there. I took the kids there. We

0:51:21.210 --> 0:51:24.810
<v Speaker 1>had a really beautiful day, and I thought maybe this

0:51:24.850 --> 0:51:27.690
<v Speaker 1>would be a turning point. That afternoon, he came to

0:51:27.730 --> 0:51:30.130
<v Speaker 1>my house and we had talked and he had sort

0:51:30.170 --> 0:51:33.570
<v Speaker 1>of said, I'm really sorry, I'll end it with her

0:51:33.850 --> 0:51:38.130
<v Speaker 1>and we can try. We'll see what happens. I barely

0:51:38.170 --> 0:51:40.450
<v Speaker 1>heard from James all weekend, and that to me was

0:51:40.490 --> 0:51:43.450
<v Speaker 1>normally an indicator that he was with a Manda or

0:51:43.570 --> 0:51:46.690
<v Speaker 1>somebody else. He was preoccupied, distracted, he didn't need to

0:51:46.730 --> 0:51:50.730
<v Speaker 1>talk to me, and I barely spoke to him. And

0:51:50.810 --> 0:51:54.010
<v Speaker 1>then Monday came around and it was like nothing had happened,

0:51:54.690 --> 0:51:57.530
<v Speaker 1>and he wanted to talk again. Because he was away.

0:51:57.730 --> 0:52:00.570
<v Speaker 1>I would speak to him, but I put a lot

0:52:00.570 --> 0:52:03.770
<v Speaker 1>of distance between us, and I would say that I

0:52:03.810 --> 0:52:07.010
<v Speaker 1>was working, and I was working, but normally I would

0:52:07.050 --> 0:52:10.090
<v Speaker 1>just sit there and text him all day, ferociously responding

0:52:10.130 --> 0:52:13.210
<v Speaker 1>to his copious amount of text message. His abused his

0:52:13.290 --> 0:52:16.450
<v Speaker 1>accusations that I was sleeping with people at work. It

0:52:16.570 --> 0:52:19.170
<v Speaker 1>was just out of control. But at this point I

0:52:19.250 --> 0:52:23.650
<v Speaker 1>started to stop responding to that, and when he came back,

0:52:24.730 --> 0:52:28.530
<v Speaker 1>he knew straightaway that something had changed in me. He said,

0:52:28.890 --> 0:52:30.930
<v Speaker 1>you're distant, you don't want anything to do with me,

0:52:31.930 --> 0:52:35.170
<v Speaker 1>and he even said, I can tell that you're getting better,

0:52:36.530 --> 0:52:38.930
<v Speaker 1>and I said, yeah, I am getting better. I'm starting

0:52:38.970 --> 0:52:42.770
<v Speaker 1>to accept who you are and that I can't change you.

0:52:42.850 --> 0:52:45.330
<v Speaker 1>But that means that I need to make decisions about

0:52:45.330 --> 0:52:48.730
<v Speaker 1>what I want. And I think that really hit home

0:52:48.770 --> 0:52:53.570
<v Speaker 1>for him, that he couldn't just control me anymore.

0:52:55.570 --> 0:52:59.210
<v Speaker 2>What Sky had always feared came true. This perceived loss

0:52:59.210 --> 0:53:01.410
<v Speaker 2>of control made things even worse.

0:53:01.970 --> 0:53:06.210
<v Speaker 1>Started threatening my house and my kids. He knew that

0:53:06.570 --> 0:53:09.810
<v Speaker 1>my kids were at my mum's house, and once again

0:53:10.050 --> 0:53:13.490
<v Speaker 1>he threatened to drive there and cut her tongue out

0:53:13.530 --> 0:53:16.930
<v Speaker 1>and then feed it to my stepdad, and my kids

0:53:16.970 --> 0:53:20.130
<v Speaker 1>would watch this process, but that would be okay because

0:53:20.170 --> 0:53:23.690
<v Speaker 1>it would be character building. Or he would drive to

0:53:23.770 --> 0:53:25.930
<v Speaker 1>my friend's house where I was and do the same

0:53:26.050 --> 0:53:28.570
<v Speaker 1>to her and I could watch, and that would be

0:53:28.650 --> 0:53:30.610
<v Speaker 1>okay because it was character building. And he wanted me

0:53:30.650 --> 0:53:33.130
<v Speaker 1>to choose which of these scenarios was going to go ahead.

0:53:34.170 --> 0:53:36.810
<v Speaker 1>He then started saying, well, I'm going to smash your house.

0:53:37.010 --> 0:53:39.770
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to ruin everything you own. And I remember

0:53:39.850 --> 0:53:42.850
<v Speaker 1>thinking he sounds quite serious this time, and he'd always

0:53:42.890 --> 0:53:44.850
<v Speaker 1>threatened suicide, and I'm going to hurt you, and I'm

0:53:44.850 --> 0:53:46.570
<v Speaker 1>going to hurt the people that you love. He never

0:53:46.650 --> 0:53:51.290
<v Speaker 1>sounded this serious. I got home, my garage door was open.

0:53:52.250 --> 0:53:55.530
<v Speaker 1>I went into my house and sure enough, he had

0:53:55.530 --> 0:53:59.410
<v Speaker 1>broken in. He had broken all of my sliding doors

0:53:59.450 --> 0:54:01.570
<v Speaker 1>to the point where the glass was out of the

0:54:01.610 --> 0:54:04.450
<v Speaker 1>frame and there were gaps between the frame and the door,

0:54:04.490 --> 0:54:07.290
<v Speaker 1>but he couldn't get the locks undone, so he then

0:54:07.450 --> 0:54:11.210
<v Speaker 1>proceeded to smash my side window of my house to

0:54:11.250 --> 0:54:14.330
<v Speaker 1>get you to the house. Now, he had taken our dog,

0:54:15.090 --> 0:54:17.530
<v Speaker 1>and he had taken his meth pipe, and he had

0:54:17.570 --> 0:54:20.010
<v Speaker 1>taken my wedding ring. I didn't speak to him. I

0:54:20.050 --> 0:54:22.850
<v Speaker 1>called my friend. She drove straight to my house. She

0:54:22.930 --> 0:54:25.570
<v Speaker 1>stayed there with me that night. And the next day

0:54:26.250 --> 0:54:29.690
<v Speaker 1>James's dad came over and he cleaned up all the window.

0:54:29.970 --> 0:54:32.610
<v Speaker 1>He tried to help put the doors back in, and

0:54:32.650 --> 0:54:35.650
<v Speaker 1>I just wouldn't respond to him. And we're talking hundreds

0:54:35.650 --> 0:54:39.690
<v Speaker 1>of text messages, thirty something miss phone calls, and he

0:54:39.770 --> 0:54:43.970
<v Speaker 1>just wouldn't stop. He was irate his dad had gone

0:54:43.970 --> 0:54:47.530
<v Speaker 1>there and gotten the dog back. He wouldn't stop messaging me.

0:54:47.690 --> 0:54:51.530
<v Speaker 1>He kept threatening suicide. He kept saying that, well, if

0:54:51.570 --> 0:54:53.770
<v Speaker 1>I didn't care anymore, there was no point in living,

0:54:53.890 --> 0:54:57.610
<v Speaker 1>and this is what he was going to do. And eventually,

0:54:58.290 --> 0:55:00.890
<v Speaker 1>as I always did, I started to feel guilty and

0:55:01.090 --> 0:55:04.690
<v Speaker 1>I responded to him and I talked him off the ledge.

0:55:04.850 --> 0:55:09.370
<v Speaker 1>He agreed to change, and we just had less and

0:55:09.490 --> 0:55:13.570
<v Speaker 1>less contact. It was just a weaning process for me

0:55:13.730 --> 0:55:17.090
<v Speaker 1>to try and get him away from me. It was

0:55:18.010 --> 0:55:20.450
<v Speaker 1>Monday evening that I had come home from work and

0:55:20.530 --> 0:55:23.130
<v Speaker 1>he was really angry at me because I had asked

0:55:23.170 --> 0:55:25.090
<v Speaker 1>him where he was that day, and he said that

0:55:25.130 --> 0:55:28.930
<v Speaker 1>he had to go to the doctors, and that Amanda

0:55:29.010 --> 0:55:31.610
<v Speaker 1>had gone to the doctors with him because he needed

0:55:31.650 --> 0:55:33.850
<v Speaker 1>somebody to go. He couldn't go by himself, and I

0:55:33.930 --> 0:55:36.290
<v Speaker 1>wasn't there because I was at work, and we got

0:55:36.290 --> 0:55:39.850
<v Speaker 1>into this really heated argument and he just started throwing things.

0:55:40.370 --> 0:55:42.730
<v Speaker 1>He picked up my coffee table, he threw it out

0:55:42.770 --> 0:55:45.530
<v Speaker 1>the window. He threw a bottle of coke in the house.

0:55:45.650 --> 0:55:48.610
<v Speaker 1>He picked up a computer stand, he threw it and

0:55:48.610 --> 0:55:50.730
<v Speaker 1>it ricocheted off the wall and I was holding our

0:55:50.810 --> 0:55:52.610
<v Speaker 1>son and I had to move and it hit me

0:55:52.650 --> 0:55:55.450
<v Speaker 1>in the head so that it didn't hit him. And

0:55:55.490 --> 0:55:59.490
<v Speaker 1>he just kept yelling and screaming, and I had put

0:55:59.570 --> 0:56:01.850
<v Speaker 1>Lee in to bed and was just hoping that he

0:56:01.890 --> 0:56:06.090
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't wake her up. And I eventually told him just stop,

0:56:06.570 --> 0:56:08.730
<v Speaker 1>and he didn't like that, and he was standing in

0:56:08.730 --> 0:56:11.050
<v Speaker 1>my kitchen at the time, and he just lunched at

0:56:11.130 --> 0:56:13.490
<v Speaker 1>me and he grabbed me by the throat and he

0:56:13.530 --> 0:56:15.930
<v Speaker 1>slammed me against the wall while I was holding on

0:56:16.050 --> 0:56:18.850
<v Speaker 1>to kid, and he just held me there and I

0:56:18.930 --> 0:56:22.330
<v Speaker 1>was just I was motionless. I couldn't do anything. I

0:56:22.490 --> 0:56:26.170
<v Speaker 1>just was so focused on not dropping my son and

0:56:26.250 --> 0:56:29.090
<v Speaker 1>hurting him. He was just a wee little baby. What

0:56:29.170 --> 0:56:30.690
<v Speaker 1>am I going to do if I drop him and

0:56:30.730 --> 0:56:35.130
<v Speaker 1>something happens? And I just I was silent. I couldn't breathe.

0:56:35.250 --> 0:56:39.370
<v Speaker 1>I remember feeling dizziness, and eventually he let go and

0:56:39.410 --> 0:56:42.010
<v Speaker 1>I just fell on the ground, still holding onto kid,

0:56:42.970 --> 0:56:45.170
<v Speaker 1>and he left. He got up and he walked out.

0:56:45.570 --> 0:56:48.610
<v Speaker 1>I sat on my shower floor crying for hours and hours,

0:56:48.650 --> 0:56:51.010
<v Speaker 1>and I didn't know again how I was going to

0:56:51.010 --> 0:56:53.490
<v Speaker 1>get out of this, because he'd gone to another level

0:56:53.490 --> 0:56:56.770
<v Speaker 1>and I didn't think it could get worse. Despite the

0:56:56.770 --> 0:56:58.730
<v Speaker 1>fact that I didn't think it could get worse.

0:56:58.770 --> 0:57:02.450
<v Speaker 2>But it did. James became paranoid, and that paranoia blew

0:57:02.530 --> 0:57:05.170
<v Speaker 2>over one night when he saw Sky's phone bill and

0:57:05.170 --> 0:57:07.490
<v Speaker 2>that she'd called a number he didn't recognize.

0:57:07.810 --> 0:57:10.810
<v Speaker 1>It was five am, and it had been a night

0:57:10.890 --> 0:57:14.010
<v Speaker 1>of just a use and threats and I'm going to

0:57:14.090 --> 0:57:17.050
<v Speaker 1>send these images to this person, and I'm going to

0:57:18.090 --> 0:57:20.210
<v Speaker 1>hurt your mom and your friends, and it just it

0:57:20.250 --> 0:57:24.410
<v Speaker 1>never stopped. And I had gotten up to get ready

0:57:24.450 --> 0:57:26.570
<v Speaker 1>for work, and there was a knock on the door

0:57:27.010 --> 0:57:30.810
<v Speaker 1>followed by, you better let me in, and I thought, oh,

0:57:30.850 --> 0:57:33.970
<v Speaker 1>something's happened to him, opened the door and he came

0:57:34.010 --> 0:57:37.130
<v Speaker 1>in in a fit of absolute rage, and he just

0:57:37.210 --> 0:57:40.050
<v Speaker 1>kept saying, whose phone number is this? Whose phone number

0:57:40.130 --> 0:57:43.450
<v Speaker 1>is this? And I didn't know what to do. He

0:57:43.530 --> 0:57:45.690
<v Speaker 1>picked up a vase in the front of my house

0:57:45.730 --> 0:57:48.970
<v Speaker 1>and smashed it all through the front entryway. There was

0:57:49.050 --> 0:57:53.810
<v Speaker 1>glass everywhere. Leah and Kaid both woke up. Luckily Bonnie

0:57:53.850 --> 0:57:59.530
<v Speaker 1>wasn't there, and he just started screaming and yelling and

0:57:59.610 --> 0:58:04.690
<v Speaker 1>having this absolute breakdown. I had had to put shoes

0:58:04.730 --> 0:58:07.050
<v Speaker 1>on the kids and get them settled and get them

0:58:07.090 --> 0:58:08.650
<v Speaker 1>breakfast and all the things that you're trying to do

0:58:08.690 --> 0:58:12.050
<v Speaker 1>in a normal mourning around this absolute, un pretty didictable

0:58:12.130 --> 0:58:15.610
<v Speaker 1>lunatic who's just throwing things around my house and screaming

0:58:15.650 --> 0:58:19.250
<v Speaker 1>at the top of his lungs. And I sat them down,

0:58:19.370 --> 0:58:21.370
<v Speaker 1>I got them breakfast, and then I went back to

0:58:21.450 --> 0:58:24.610
<v Speaker 1>him and he was in my garage at this point.

0:58:24.610 --> 0:58:26.450
<v Speaker 1>I shut him in the garage and locked it so

0:58:26.490 --> 0:58:29.650
<v Speaker 1>he couldn't get back into the internal house. And to

0:58:29.730 --> 0:58:32.170
<v Speaker 1>try and get back into the house, he pulled a

0:58:32.250 --> 0:58:35.730
<v Speaker 1>suitcase of clothes that I had packed to give back

0:58:35.770 --> 0:58:38.850
<v Speaker 1>to him over to the door and set it on fire.

0:58:39.850 --> 0:58:42.490
<v Speaker 1>I saw smoke starting to come under the door, and

0:58:42.690 --> 0:58:45.410
<v Speaker 1>my reaction was, we're going to die. He's going to

0:58:45.410 --> 0:58:47.490
<v Speaker 1>burn the house down and we're all going to be

0:58:47.530 --> 0:58:52.010
<v Speaker 1>in it. And there was smoke everywhere, and Leah had

0:58:52.010 --> 0:58:54.890
<v Speaker 1>come out asking me if it was okay, and he

0:58:54.970 --> 0:58:57.810
<v Speaker 1>had just said, get the kids out, Get the kids out.

0:58:58.210 --> 0:59:01.570
<v Speaker 1>It was terrifying. I didn't know what to do. He

0:59:01.810 --> 0:59:04.730
<v Speaker 1>was between me and the car. I couldn't get to

0:59:04.770 --> 0:59:06.890
<v Speaker 1>the car without going past him. I didn't know what

0:59:07.010 --> 0:59:09.930
<v Speaker 1>he was going to do in this manic episode to

0:59:10.170 --> 0:59:12.050
<v Speaker 1>me if he managed to get his hand on me

0:59:12.090 --> 0:59:15.050
<v Speaker 1>and the kids between there and the car. I had

0:59:15.090 --> 0:59:18.130
<v Speaker 1>called my friend and she had called his friend and

0:59:18.210 --> 0:59:21.930
<v Speaker 1>he came to the house. He talked James down. James

0:59:21.970 --> 0:59:23.850
<v Speaker 1>had put the fire out by this point, and he

0:59:23.930 --> 0:59:26.890
<v Speaker 1>was just coughing soot everywhere all through the house, just

0:59:26.930 --> 0:59:30.450
<v Speaker 1>walking through the house, just coughing this black soot. His

0:59:30.490 --> 0:59:32.490
<v Speaker 1>friend helped me get the kids in the car and

0:59:32.530 --> 0:59:35.490
<v Speaker 1>I drove away. My mum and my friend tried to

0:59:35.530 --> 0:59:38.290
<v Speaker 1>convince me that it's wrong and this shouldn't happen, and

0:59:39.170 --> 0:59:41.530
<v Speaker 1>you need to take some serious action here, but I

0:59:41.730 --> 0:59:45.290
<v Speaker 1>didn't know how. I just felt so stuck, and I

0:59:45.330 --> 0:59:48.730
<v Speaker 1>remember saying to them, this is my life now, this

0:59:48.890 --> 0:59:51.770
<v Speaker 1>is just how it is. There's no way out. He

0:59:51.930 --> 0:59:54.330
<v Speaker 1>has the upper hand, he is more powerful than me,

0:59:54.410 --> 0:59:57.650
<v Speaker 1>and there is nothing I can do about it. And

0:59:57.690 --> 0:59:58.570
<v Speaker 1>that was how I felt.

0:59:59.250 --> 1:00:01.970
<v Speaker 2>She was terrified of him, of what he was capable

1:00:02.050 --> 1:00:04.530
<v Speaker 2>of life on her own, and what he would do

1:00:04.610 --> 1:00:07.010
<v Speaker 2>if she tried to cut him off for good. She

1:00:07.210 --> 1:00:09.970
<v Speaker 2>just didn't see a way out. But only a week

1:00:10.090 --> 1:00:14.370
<v Speaker 2>later there was another episode. This one was the final straw.

1:00:14.810 --> 1:00:17.050
<v Speaker 1>We still weren't together, but there were talks about him

1:00:17.050 --> 1:00:20.010
<v Speaker 1>potentially moving back into the house because the lease was ending,

1:00:20.650 --> 1:00:22.570
<v Speaker 1>and I just I didn't know how to say no.

1:00:23.010 --> 1:00:25.890
<v Speaker 1>We'd sort of gotten past all this really heavy stuff,

1:00:26.330 --> 1:00:28.450
<v Speaker 1>and his family was still pushing him onto me, and

1:00:28.490 --> 1:00:31.570
<v Speaker 1>I didn't know how to say no. He had fallen

1:00:31.610 --> 1:00:35.170
<v Speaker 1>asleep and I had gone through his phone again to

1:00:35.250 --> 1:00:37.370
<v Speaker 1>see what he was doing, to see if I could

1:00:37.370 --> 1:00:39.410
<v Speaker 1>trust him, to see if there was a way to

1:00:39.930 --> 1:00:43.890
<v Speaker 1>mend all of this trauma that he had caused, and

1:00:43.970 --> 1:00:47.010
<v Speaker 1>I found that he had been paying women for sexual

1:00:47.010 --> 1:00:53.250
<v Speaker 1>gratification in money and in drugs, and I confronted him

1:00:53.290 --> 1:00:56.810
<v Speaker 1>about that the next morning, and I said, look, it's

1:00:56.850 --> 1:00:59.090
<v Speaker 1>time for you to start telling me the truth about things.

1:00:59.570 --> 1:01:02.090
<v Speaker 1>Are you capable of telling the truth? Prove that you're

1:01:02.090 --> 1:01:05.250
<v Speaker 1>capable of telling the truth. I asked him about it,

1:01:06.090 --> 1:01:10.050
<v Speaker 1>and he again just saw red and went into this

1:01:10.090 --> 1:01:12.490
<v Speaker 1>fit of rage. He picked up a deathque that was

1:01:12.610 --> 1:01:15.970
<v Speaker 1>in my living room and he started slamming it against

1:01:16.010 --> 1:01:18.650
<v Speaker 1>the roof and the ground and the couch and the walls,

1:01:18.690 --> 1:01:21.290
<v Speaker 1>and the desk was completely mangled by the end of it.

1:01:22.090 --> 1:01:24.890
<v Speaker 1>And I didn't see what else he was doing. He

1:01:24.970 --> 1:01:28.810
<v Speaker 1>sort of started throwing computer equipment around. But Leah came

1:01:28.850 --> 1:01:31.450
<v Speaker 1>and grabbed me by the hand, and I had kid

1:01:31.570 --> 1:01:34.650
<v Speaker 1>with me, and she took me into her bedroom and

1:01:34.730 --> 1:01:37.050
<v Speaker 1>she said, it's all right, Mummy, We'll be safe in

1:01:37.090 --> 1:01:41.730
<v Speaker 1>here while daddy breaks the house, just staying here. And

1:01:41.810 --> 1:01:46.570
<v Speaker 1>I broke down and just thought, how my kids should

1:01:46.690 --> 1:01:49.930
<v Speaker 1>not be thinking like that. They shouldn't be thinking that

1:01:50.010 --> 1:01:54.490
<v Speaker 1>they have to save me from anything. They should feel safe.

1:01:54.610 --> 1:01:58.010
<v Speaker 1>And I couldn't do it anymore. So that Friday, I

1:01:58.050 --> 1:02:02.250
<v Speaker 1>went to my mum's house. I stayed there and I

1:02:02.290 --> 1:02:04.370
<v Speaker 1>just made excuses to be away from the house as

1:02:04.450 --> 1:02:08.610
<v Speaker 1>much as I could all that weekend, and on the Monday,

1:02:08.690 --> 1:02:11.530
<v Speaker 1>I went to the corner. I filed for a violence

1:02:11.770 --> 1:02:15.850
<v Speaker 1>straining orner. Something clicked for me and I couldn't let

1:02:15.850 --> 1:02:18.250
<v Speaker 1>this person keep doing this to me, and I couldn't

1:02:18.290 --> 1:02:21.170
<v Speaker 1>let it keep happening in front of my kids. I

1:02:21.210 --> 1:02:26.690
<v Speaker 1>was really disappointed in myself. I didn't know how I

1:02:26.730 --> 1:02:30.010
<v Speaker 1>had let my life get to that point where I

1:02:30.050 --> 1:02:33.650
<v Speaker 1>was having to get a restraining order against someone that

1:02:34.330 --> 1:02:40.090
<v Speaker 1>six months earlier I could have married. I felt really

1:02:40.130 --> 1:02:43.410
<v Speaker 1>regretful that my kids had experienced so much and they

1:02:43.450 --> 1:02:48.650
<v Speaker 1>were so little, and I was ashamed. I was ashamed

1:02:48.690 --> 1:02:53.690
<v Speaker 1>that I had allowed him to compromise my moral values

1:02:54.250 --> 1:02:57.970
<v Speaker 1>to suit his agenda when I didn't need to, and

1:02:58.010 --> 1:03:00.410
<v Speaker 1>I could have gotten to the same outcome, potentially in

1:03:00.410 --> 1:03:04.450
<v Speaker 1>a less violent way. I was just so lost. You

1:03:04.570 --> 1:03:06.490
<v Speaker 1>hear it all the time, and you hear people talk

1:03:06.530 --> 1:03:10.530
<v Speaker 1>about these domestic violent situations, And before I was in

1:03:10.570 --> 1:03:15.650
<v Speaker 1>one would have said, why don't they just leave? And

1:03:15.690 --> 1:03:20.170
<v Speaker 1>it's such a common misconception that this leaving is something

1:03:20.170 --> 1:03:23.930
<v Speaker 1>that you can do because you never feel safe. The

1:03:24.050 --> 1:03:26.170
<v Speaker 1>day that the vero was served, he tried to go

1:03:26.250 --> 1:03:29.370
<v Speaker 1>to daycare and take Leah from daycare. He never really

1:03:29.370 --> 1:03:32.650
<v Speaker 1>had a relationship with kid, so I wasn't worried about

1:03:32.690 --> 1:03:36.930
<v Speaker 1>him taking CAID, but Leah, yes, it worries me. His

1:03:37.050 --> 1:03:40.770
<v Speaker 1>parents have taken the restraining order very seriously, mind you,

1:03:41.370 --> 1:03:45.650
<v Speaker 1>and I have had no contact from him directly and

1:03:45.690 --> 1:03:49.330
<v Speaker 1>I haven't seen him. I was tact for him when

1:03:49.330 --> 1:03:51.410
<v Speaker 1>I got my restraining order. I made sure that he

1:03:51.490 --> 1:03:53.730
<v Speaker 1>was living back with his parents, that he didn't have

1:03:53.810 --> 1:03:57.050
<v Speaker 1>access to income, he'd be made redundant at work so

1:03:57.090 --> 1:04:00.770
<v Speaker 1>he couldn't come after me. He had as little resources

1:04:00.810 --> 1:04:06.330
<v Speaker 1>as possible to use against me, and I then had

1:04:06.370 --> 1:04:10.290
<v Speaker 1>a lawyer assist me in drafting up a statement of

1:04:10.330 --> 1:04:13.250
<v Speaker 1>everything that had happened and helping me collate the evidence,

1:04:13.930 --> 1:04:16.450
<v Speaker 1>and I gave it to the police in early twenty

1:04:16.530 --> 1:04:21.090
<v Speaker 1>twenty four. The police investigated and came down to a

1:04:21.170 --> 1:04:26.970
<v Speaker 1>number of charges, and he was charged with those things

1:04:27.050 --> 1:04:31.570
<v Speaker 1>in March. Now it's really disappointing because a lot of

1:04:31.610 --> 1:04:37.010
<v Speaker 1>the assault charges couldn't be proven after the fact, and

1:04:37.090 --> 1:04:40.130
<v Speaker 1>there are a lot of things where it's really violent

1:04:40.450 --> 1:04:45.250
<v Speaker 1>coercive controlling behavior, but unfortunately coercive control isn't a crime

1:04:45.330 --> 1:04:48.010
<v Speaker 1>yet where I live, so we had to go down

1:04:48.050 --> 1:04:50.650
<v Speaker 1>to what is a crime? Revenge porn, so threatening to

1:04:50.690 --> 1:04:54.250
<v Speaker 1>send into images of me as a crime. Setting the

1:04:54.250 --> 1:04:57.450
<v Speaker 1>fire is a crime, and breaking into my house and

1:04:57.490 --> 1:05:00.330
<v Speaker 1>causing damage the way he did was a crime. So

1:05:00.370 --> 1:05:03.330
<v Speaker 1>he was charged with those things. They set a trial.

1:05:03.890 --> 1:05:06.290
<v Speaker 1>They ended up negotiating with him to get a guilty

1:05:06.330 --> 1:05:09.570
<v Speaker 1>plea to avoid trial, and he walked away with a

1:05:09.610 --> 1:05:13.370
<v Speaker 1>two and a half thousand dollar fine, which to me,

1:05:13.490 --> 1:05:18.970
<v Speaker 1>it's just insulting. And I don't blame the police, but

1:05:19.090 --> 1:05:23.370
<v Speaker 1>I think that the justice system is a really difficult

1:05:23.450 --> 1:05:27.130
<v Speaker 1>place to navigate, and they're not keeping up with the

1:05:27.250 --> 1:05:32.890
<v Speaker 1>expectations of the community or the social justice side of things.

1:05:33.570 --> 1:05:36.170
<v Speaker 1>There are so many women who die every year, and

1:05:36.210 --> 1:05:40.850
<v Speaker 1>this is why, because violent defenders like James are let

1:05:40.970 --> 1:05:43.250
<v Speaker 1>off the first time that they do something like this,

1:05:43.850 --> 1:05:45.850
<v Speaker 1>they're let off the second time that they do something

1:05:45.890 --> 1:05:48.090
<v Speaker 1>like this with a fine, and then the third time

1:05:48.130 --> 1:05:51.250
<v Speaker 1>that they do something like this, someone will die, and

1:05:51.610 --> 1:05:55.530
<v Speaker 1>naturally then they'll receive a harsher penalty. But it shouldn't

1:05:55.530 --> 1:06:00.450
<v Speaker 1>take someone to die for him to be in prison.

1:06:00.970 --> 1:06:04.730
<v Speaker 1>And sometimes I wish I did die he strangled me

1:06:04.970 --> 1:06:07.770
<v Speaker 1>on two separate occasions, and on both of those occasions,

1:06:07.770 --> 1:06:11.130
<v Speaker 1>I thought, well, this is it for me. I'm gonna die.

1:06:11.810 --> 1:06:14.250
<v Speaker 1>When he would constantly come into my house in the

1:06:14.290 --> 1:06:16.290
<v Speaker 1>middle of the night when I was asleep, and I

1:06:16.290 --> 1:06:19.650
<v Speaker 1>would wake up to him standing over me angry, I

1:06:19.690 --> 1:06:22.130
<v Speaker 1>always wondered what happens if one day he just brings

1:06:22.170 --> 1:06:25.450
<v Speaker 1>a knife and I'm just gone, or he gets a

1:06:25.490 --> 1:06:29.130
<v Speaker 1>gun and there's nothing I can do about it. And

1:06:29.170 --> 1:06:32.490
<v Speaker 1>I did think I wouldn't survive. I thought he has

1:06:32.570 --> 1:06:36.210
<v Speaker 1>so much control and power that it's just a matter

1:06:36.250 --> 1:06:38.530
<v Speaker 1>of time before he kills me. And I definitely didn't

1:06:38.530 --> 1:06:40.170
<v Speaker 1>think I would ever get out. I thought that I

1:06:40.170 --> 1:06:43.330
<v Speaker 1>would be living like this forever. And it's hard to

1:06:43.370 --> 1:06:45.530
<v Speaker 1>explain the way that it makes you feel. But when

1:06:45.570 --> 1:06:49.130
<v Speaker 1>you're getting these constant text messages every day and these

1:06:49.170 --> 1:06:52.210
<v Speaker 1>phone calls, and just this cycle of no matter what

1:06:52.330 --> 1:06:55.890
<v Speaker 1>you say, you get abused, and everything is your fault.

1:06:56.370 --> 1:06:59.130
<v Speaker 1>Every single thing that would go wrong in James's life

1:06:59.210 --> 1:07:01.450
<v Speaker 1>was my fault one way or another, and you just

1:07:01.530 --> 1:07:04.690
<v Speaker 1>had this way of manipulating things. And the best way

1:07:04.730 --> 1:07:07.690
<v Speaker 1>I can explain it is that your brain feels like

1:07:08.250 --> 1:07:12.490
<v Speaker 1>it's just being pressed down on someone's got a wet

1:07:12.610 --> 1:07:16.090
<v Speaker 1>rag and they're just ringing out your brain and you

1:07:16.250 --> 1:07:19.410
<v Speaker 1>just want it to stop, and it's so uncomfortable and

1:07:19.450 --> 1:07:21.770
<v Speaker 1>it just makes you so fuzzy, but you can't make

1:07:21.810 --> 1:07:24.810
<v Speaker 1>it stop, and it hurts so much. Your brain feels

1:07:24.810 --> 1:07:26.930
<v Speaker 1>like it's going to explode under all of this pressure

1:07:26.970 --> 1:07:30.130
<v Speaker 1>of someone ringing it out. But until that other person

1:07:30.250 --> 1:07:34.490
<v Speaker 1>is satisfied again and they stop abusing you and they

1:07:34.530 --> 1:07:38.210
<v Speaker 1>stop coming for you for that short period, it just

1:07:38.250 --> 1:07:40.530
<v Speaker 1>feels like that. So that's why you always just give

1:07:40.570 --> 1:07:43.610
<v Speaker 1>in and you do what they say and you're amenable,

1:07:43.770 --> 1:07:47.690
<v Speaker 1>because otherwise your brain feels like that, and it's you

1:07:47.730 --> 1:07:49.490
<v Speaker 1>can't deal with that. It feels like your ears are

1:07:49.490 --> 1:07:51.490
<v Speaker 1>going to start bleeding, your eyes are going to pop

1:07:51.530 --> 1:07:54.770
<v Speaker 1>out of your skull, and you feel like you're going

1:07:54.810 --> 1:07:58.970
<v Speaker 1>to die just from words, which is completely unrealistic, but

1:07:59.890 --> 1:08:04.010
<v Speaker 1>it's exactly how it feels. I think that if anyone

1:08:04.210 --> 1:08:07.610
<v Speaker 1>is listening and they are going through forms of domestic abuse,

1:08:07.730 --> 1:08:09.730
<v Speaker 1>it's really important to know that there are a lot

1:08:09.730 --> 1:08:13.930
<v Speaker 1>of community supports and you don't know it when you're

1:08:14.250 --> 1:08:16.170
<v Speaker 1>faced with it in the moment, but there are people

1:08:16.210 --> 1:08:18.890
<v Speaker 1>there that want to help you, and it's really important

1:08:18.930 --> 1:08:22.050
<v Speaker 1>to understand how to get out and who can help

1:08:22.090 --> 1:08:24.530
<v Speaker 1>you get out. And those people do exist, and their

1:08:24.610 --> 1:08:28.250
<v Speaker 1>numbers are available online, and if you can just get

1:08:28.290 --> 1:08:31.450
<v Speaker 1>five minutes to research them, do it, because there are

1:08:31.570 --> 1:08:35.530
<v Speaker 1>genuine businesses and associations that can help you get out.

1:08:36.130 --> 1:08:38.450
<v Speaker 1>If you are in a situation where you're feeling stuck

1:08:38.570 --> 1:08:40.690
<v Speaker 1>and you're feeling like there isn't going to be a

1:08:40.730 --> 1:08:42.890
<v Speaker 1>way out, there is definitely a light at the end

1:08:42.930 --> 1:08:45.970
<v Speaker 1>of the tunnel, and you can get there. You can

1:08:45.970 --> 1:08:52.050
<v Speaker 1>do it. It's been instrumental for me to recognize the

1:08:52.130 --> 1:08:55.370
<v Speaker 1>difference in how I feel when I'm at home, and

1:08:55.410 --> 1:08:57.890
<v Speaker 1>that's something that I've really honed in on for myself,

1:08:58.010 --> 1:09:00.690
<v Speaker 1>is when I'm at home now, I don't feel scared

1:09:00.810 --> 1:09:04.130
<v Speaker 1>and anxious because of him being there. I don't feel

1:09:04.130 --> 1:09:06.050
<v Speaker 1>like I need to act a certain way or not

1:09:06.170 --> 1:09:09.250
<v Speaker 1>speak or not laugh, or not have my friends over

1:09:09.570 --> 1:09:12.530
<v Speaker 1>or keep my kids quiet. I don't feel like I

1:09:12.610 --> 1:09:16.010
<v Speaker 1>need to conform to what somebody else wants of me,

1:09:17.170 --> 1:09:21.770
<v Speaker 1>which is unrealistic. I'm comfortable. I'm confident. My kids can play,

1:09:21.810 --> 1:09:24.010
<v Speaker 1>they can laugh, they can smile, they can do what

1:09:24.050 --> 1:09:27.770
<v Speaker 1>they need to do and it's not harming anybody else.

1:09:27.810 --> 1:09:29.570
<v Speaker 1>And I think that the way that I feel at

1:09:29.610 --> 1:09:33.250
<v Speaker 1>home is something that I reflect on a lot when

1:09:33.290 --> 1:09:39.330
<v Speaker 1>I'm thinking, Oh, this sucks, my family's broken. I still

1:09:39.370 --> 1:09:42.250
<v Speaker 1>lost that person. Even though he didn't turn out to

1:09:42.290 --> 1:09:45.130
<v Speaker 1>be a good person at the time, I still wanted

1:09:45.130 --> 1:09:49.770
<v Speaker 1>that person, so that gives me a lot of grounding.

1:09:51.130 --> 1:09:54.010
<v Speaker 1>I don't think you ever really can just move on

1:09:54.210 --> 1:09:56.530
<v Speaker 1>from something like this. I think you have to grow

1:09:56.650 --> 1:10:00.730
<v Speaker 1>into it, is my view, and I notice behaviors and

1:10:00.770 --> 1:10:07.130
<v Speaker 1>things in myself now trying to maybe start dating, and

1:10:07.210 --> 1:10:09.770
<v Speaker 1>those sorts of things that I just I'm not ready,

1:10:10.330 --> 1:10:13.050
<v Speaker 1>and I have to recognize that it's probably going to

1:10:13.050 --> 1:10:16.770
<v Speaker 1>be a long time before I'm ready to have that

1:10:16.930 --> 1:10:20.570
<v Speaker 1>kind of a relationship with a male again. And growing

1:10:20.610 --> 1:10:24.010
<v Speaker 1>into it, to me is accepting that there's limitations to

1:10:24.050 --> 1:10:26.050
<v Speaker 1>who I am now because of what's happened to me,

1:10:26.530 --> 1:10:29.570
<v Speaker 1>but not letting it become my entire personality. I don't

1:10:29.570 --> 1:10:33.010
<v Speaker 1>want to be known as the victim or as someone

1:10:33.050 --> 1:10:34.890
<v Speaker 1>that this has happened to. I want to be able

1:10:34.970 --> 1:10:38.250
<v Speaker 1>to help other people who are going through this situation,

1:10:38.530 --> 1:10:41.850
<v Speaker 1>and I want to harness the power that it's given

1:10:41.930 --> 1:10:44.690
<v Speaker 1>me as a woman to be able to speak out

1:10:44.730 --> 1:10:47.890
<v Speaker 1>and to be able to provide that support to other people.

1:10:48.850 --> 1:10:51.250
<v Speaker 1>I get overwhelmed from time to time. Three kids on

1:10:51.290 --> 1:10:54.690
<v Speaker 1>your own is a lot, and parenting wasn't meant for

1:10:55.170 --> 1:10:59.050
<v Speaker 1>single parents. But I have a lot of support in

1:10:59.090 --> 1:11:03.770
<v Speaker 1>my friends and my family. I'm quite far down the

1:11:03.890 --> 1:11:07.690
<v Speaker 1>journey now. I'm past the shock of what people are

1:11:07.730 --> 1:11:11.330
<v Speaker 1>still finding out about, and I'm more into the acceptance

1:11:12.090 --> 1:11:15.370
<v Speaker 1>part of my journey and trying to evolve from it.

1:11:15.850 --> 1:11:18.610
<v Speaker 1>And it's not easy. It's not easy to live with

1:11:19.570 --> 1:11:24.690
<v Speaker 1>this thing that's happened to you that tries to define you.

1:11:24.770 --> 1:11:27.690
<v Speaker 1>But I think I'm dealing with it as best as

1:11:27.690 --> 1:11:30.090
<v Speaker 1>I possibly can. And I just want to make people aware.

1:11:30.130 --> 1:11:32.810
<v Speaker 1>I want to try and help other people. I want

1:11:32.850 --> 1:11:36.490
<v Speaker 1>to use it for good rather than let it drag

1:11:36.570 --> 1:11:38.690
<v Speaker 1>me and my kids down. And don't want to be

1:11:38.730 --> 1:11:41.650
<v Speaker 1>branded as a victim or branded as viral. I'm just

1:11:41.730 --> 1:11:46.290
<v Speaker 1>me trying to get through every day. I'm living every

1:11:46.370 --> 1:11:48.810
<v Speaker 1>day in the hope that the system will have my back.

1:11:53.050 --> 1:11:55.490
<v Speaker 2>If you or anyone you know is a victim of

1:11:55.570 --> 1:11:59.050
<v Speaker 2>domestic violence, you can visit one eight hundred respect dot

1:11:59.130 --> 1:12:02.410
<v Speaker 2>org dot au or call one eight hundred Respect a

1:12:02.530 --> 1:12:07.650
<v Speaker 2>confidential information, counseling and support service for people impacted by domestic,

1:12:07.810 --> 1:12:15.770
<v Speaker 2>family or sexual violence. Everyone Has an X is a

1:12:15.770 --> 1:12:19.570
<v Speaker 2>Minti Media production and proudly part of the Mummamea network.

1:12:19.890 --> 1:12:23.090
<v Speaker 2>Is written and narrated by me Georgia Love and produced

1:12:23.130 --> 1:12:25.490
<v Speaker 2>by Linda Scott. If you have a story you'd like

1:12:25.570 --> 1:12:29.410
<v Speaker 2>to share, email podcast at momamea dot com dot au.

1:12:29.730 --> 1:12:31.730
<v Speaker 2>You can support us by following the show in your

1:12:31.770 --> 1:12:35.130
<v Speaker 2>favorite podcast app and leaving a five star review. We'll

1:12:35.170 --> 1:12:40.690
<v Speaker 2>see you for the next episode.