1
00:00:08,193 --> 00:00:12,914
Speaker 1: You're listening to a Mom and mea podcast.

2
00:00:16,034 --> 00:00:18,354
Speaker 2: Welcome to Mama out Loud. What women are actually talking

3
00:00:18,393 --> 00:00:21,714
Speaker 2: about on Monday, the tenth of November. I am Jesse Stevens,

4
00:00:21,834 --> 00:00:25,514
Speaker 2: I am Amelia Lester, I'm Claire Murphy. And I don't

5
00:00:25,514 --> 00:00:27,474
Speaker 2: know if you know this, guys, but there's this actress

6
00:00:27,634 --> 00:00:30,594
Speaker 2: who's been really doing a great job on not a

7
00:00:30,594 --> 00:00:35,114
Speaker 2: great job at all acasm called Kim Kardashian. You might

8
00:00:35,114 --> 00:00:35,834
Speaker 2: be across her.

9
00:00:36,314 --> 00:00:39,434
Speaker 1: She's not been doing so well this week. She'd have

10
00:00:39,513 --> 00:00:40,993
Speaker 1: it a bit of a rough time. I think she

11
00:00:41,233 --> 00:00:45,193
Speaker 1: might have just hit failure era. And so I would

12
00:00:45,273 --> 00:00:47,793
Speaker 1: like to just have a moment with you all to

13
00:00:47,833 --> 00:00:50,353
Speaker 1: discuss how a multi up presuming she's a billionaire now

14
00:00:50,473 --> 00:00:53,754
Speaker 1: multimillion billionaire, whatever she is, woman who has a thousand

15
00:00:53,794 --> 00:00:54,994
Speaker 1: businesses is now failing?

16
00:00:55,474 --> 00:01:00,114
Speaker 3: Can you be friends with people who believe very different

17
00:01:00,154 --> 00:01:00,714
Speaker 3: things from you?

18
00:01:00,794 --> 00:01:01,354
Speaker 1: Politically?

19
00:01:01,834 --> 00:01:06,354
Speaker 3: I want to talk about Jennifer Lawrence's answer to that question.

20
00:01:06,674 --> 00:01:12,194
Speaker 2: And did women ruin the workplace? Allegedly they did? I

21
00:01:12,274 --> 00:01:15,234
Speaker 2: knew that we've done, say exactly exactly, in which case

22
00:01:15,274 --> 00:01:16,754
Speaker 2: my question is can we all go home now?

23
00:01:16,834 --> 00:01:18,953
Speaker 1: Yeah? I was feeling guilty at three am the other morning.

24
00:01:19,034 --> 00:01:22,354
Speaker 1: That must have been in first of though. Friends. In

25
00:01:22,354 --> 00:01:25,354
Speaker 1: case you missed it, the VIC government announced their big

26
00:01:25,474 --> 00:01:29,114
Speaker 1: Women's pain report from their inquiry yesterday. I don't know

27
00:01:29,114 --> 00:01:32,554
Speaker 1: if you heard. They announced this pilot initiative to give

28
00:01:32,594 --> 00:01:36,514
Speaker 1: women getting their IUDs inserted the green whistle. And first

29
00:01:36,554 --> 00:01:37,994
Speaker 1: of all, we need to establish who here has had

30
00:01:37,994 --> 00:01:40,874
Speaker 1: a green whistle experience. Jesse Emelia, I don't know what

31
00:01:40,954 --> 00:01:41,314
Speaker 1: that is.

32
00:01:41,554 --> 00:01:45,474
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, I'm obsessed with green whistles because I desperately.

33
00:01:45,154 --> 00:01:46,594
Speaker 1: Do you have one? When you broke you? Let no.

34
00:01:46,914 --> 00:01:49,314
Speaker 2: I was at the top of a mountain and there

35
00:01:49,354 --> 00:01:51,354
Speaker 2: was a little like lock box where they keep the

36
00:01:51,394 --> 00:01:54,114
Speaker 2: green whistle, and when they looked in there, it hadn't

37
00:01:54,154 --> 00:01:56,714
Speaker 2: been replaced from last time. And in fact, in the

38
00:01:56,754 --> 00:02:00,194
Speaker 2: whole town there was no green whistle. It just didn't exist.

39
00:02:00,274 --> 00:02:03,114
Speaker 2: And so I thought about that green whistle for about

40
00:02:03,154 --> 00:02:04,154
Speaker 2: eight straight hours.

41
00:02:04,434 --> 00:02:05,954
Speaker 1: Okay, well, let me tell you it was the only

42
00:02:05,994 --> 00:02:07,874
Speaker 1: one in the room who's had a green whil experience.

43
00:02:08,353 --> 00:02:11,114
Speaker 1: That it is one of those things. I don't know

44
00:02:11,114 --> 00:02:13,714
Speaker 1: what drug it is, actually, but it's something that's given

45
00:02:13,714 --> 00:02:15,354
Speaker 1: to you in the moment. We have had like an

46
00:02:15,394 --> 00:02:17,754
Speaker 1: extreme pain incident broke your leg. For me, it was

47
00:02:17,794 --> 00:02:20,913
Speaker 1: I snapped my cruci at tendon. It's so that say,

48
00:02:20,914 --> 00:02:23,594
Speaker 1: paramedics can help you deal with the pain whilst they

49
00:02:23,754 --> 00:02:27,674
Speaker 1: transfer you to hospital. So it's short acting, it's very effective,

50
00:02:27,674 --> 00:02:30,074
Speaker 1: so it kicks in really quickly, and I'm not sure

51
00:02:30,114 --> 00:02:32,514
Speaker 1: if it's actually helping with the pain or just your

52
00:02:32,554 --> 00:02:35,754
Speaker 1: brain is now having super super fun and is distracted

53
00:02:35,834 --> 00:02:38,394
Speaker 1: and doesn't care about the pain anymore. Because I went

54
00:02:38,394 --> 00:02:41,434
Speaker 1: from like howling and crying to being like, oh, that's

55
00:02:41,514 --> 00:02:44,394
Speaker 1: a pretty cartoon on the ceiling of the cubicle that

56
00:02:44,434 --> 00:02:46,914
Speaker 1: they landed me in at the hospital. So it's really

57
00:02:46,954 --> 00:02:48,554
Speaker 1: short acting and very effective.

58
00:02:48,674 --> 00:02:52,274
Speaker 3: So it's like a preloaded it's got drugs in a whistle.

59
00:02:51,954 --> 00:02:53,874
Speaker 2: And you just kind of like breathe it in. And

60
00:02:53,914 --> 00:02:57,434
Speaker 2: so it's always like sideline of kids sports, that kind

61
00:02:57,434 --> 00:02:59,234
Speaker 2: of stuff. And I thought when I read this headline,

62
00:02:59,274 --> 00:03:02,554
Speaker 2: I was like, this is genius, because I've interviewed women

63
00:03:02,674 --> 00:03:05,634
Speaker 2: in the past who have said that they got NIUD

64
00:03:05,754 --> 00:03:08,794
Speaker 2: inserted and it was turn out of ten pain. They

65
00:03:09,034 --> 00:03:11,474
Speaker 2: fainted on the train on the way home. Others say

66
00:03:11,714 --> 00:03:14,714
Speaker 2: it was absolutely fine. But the fact that that hasn't

67
00:03:14,794 --> 00:03:18,874
Speaker 2: been part of the process or something that you're off it.

68
00:03:18,994 --> 00:03:20,954
Speaker 2: I've even thought it with I remember the most painful

69
00:03:20,994 --> 00:03:25,074
Speaker 2: part of my labor was the stretcher sweep thing that

70
00:03:25,114 --> 00:03:26,554
Speaker 2: they did, and I was like, can I have a

71
00:03:26,554 --> 00:03:28,274
Speaker 2: green whistle for that? Maybe not, I don't know. It

72
00:03:28,354 --> 00:03:30,314
Speaker 2: might not be good for the baby. But the fact

73
00:03:30,394 --> 00:03:34,954
Speaker 2: that pain relief isn't at the forefront of the practitioner's

74
00:03:34,994 --> 00:03:38,394
Speaker 2: mind when you are going inside someone to a very

75
00:03:38,434 --> 00:03:41,594
Speaker 2: tender area. I think this is very exciting progress.

76
00:03:42,914 --> 00:03:46,394
Speaker 1: Have either of you watched a single episode of All's

77
00:03:46,554 --> 00:03:47,154
Speaker 1: Fair yet?

78
00:03:47,674 --> 00:03:48,074
Speaker 3: Nope?

79
00:03:48,314 --> 00:03:51,594
Speaker 2: No, I have not, But I must say I'm finding

80
00:03:51,634 --> 00:03:55,754
Speaker 2: the reviews very tantalizing. And the more I read, the

81
00:03:55,754 --> 00:03:58,594
Speaker 2: more zero stars I see, the more I'm leaning.

82
00:03:58,474 --> 00:04:02,354
Speaker 1: Oh, guys, you're in for a treat. It is obviously

83
00:04:02,474 --> 00:04:05,434
Speaker 1: Kim Kardashian's lady feature into acting. She's done a few

84
00:04:05,434 --> 00:04:07,674
Speaker 1: gigs before, but this is her latest. It is not

85
00:04:07,754 --> 00:04:11,554
Speaker 1: getting the reviews that we'd perhaps thought when this idea

86
00:04:11,714 --> 00:04:15,514
Speaker 1: was being formed. But maybe it's a little more strategic

87
00:04:15,594 --> 00:04:19,514
Speaker 1: than we thought. But Kim's flop era, we believe may

88
00:04:19,553 --> 00:04:21,914
Speaker 1: have just arrived because she's not just failing where it

89
00:04:21,954 --> 00:04:25,073
Speaker 1: comes to this particular venture. She's also failed in her

90
00:04:25,154 --> 00:04:28,353
Speaker 1: legal career this week as well, so we think maybe

91
00:04:28,393 --> 00:04:30,433
Speaker 1: she's starting to learn a few lessons on this new

92
00:04:30,513 --> 00:04:35,993
Speaker 1: pathway to failure. I am a great connoisseur of terrible things.

93
00:04:36,154 --> 00:04:39,313
Speaker 1: So if someone tells me that something has a bad review,

94
00:04:39,594 --> 00:04:41,954
Speaker 1: I will often like it. And I think it's because

95
00:04:41,993 --> 00:04:44,433
Speaker 1: I have very low brow taste buds, Like I just

96
00:04:44,474 --> 00:04:47,313
Speaker 1: go into these things purely for entertainment value. And so

97
00:04:47,433 --> 00:04:49,753
Speaker 1: this if you are not across All's fair. This is

98
00:04:49,834 --> 00:04:53,193
Speaker 1: the new Ryan Murphy drama. It's about a women only

99
00:04:53,354 --> 00:04:58,833
Speaker 1: divorce lawyers firm, which stars Kim Kardashian, Naomi Watts, Nissi Nash.

100
00:04:58,953 --> 00:05:01,633
Speaker 1: They're like your core three divorce lawyers who've come from

101
00:05:01,633 --> 00:05:04,593
Speaker 1: like this past of you know, middle aged white man

102
00:05:04,674 --> 00:05:07,434
Speaker 1: law firms where they're overlooked and undervalued, and so they

103
00:05:07,474 --> 00:05:10,674
Speaker 1: come out as these powerful women and they drop these

104
00:05:10,714 --> 00:05:16,594
Speaker 1: one liners which are awful, and they deal with cheating

105
00:05:16,753 --> 00:05:20,753
Speaker 1: husbands and controlling men, and like they get the best

106
00:05:20,794 --> 00:05:23,753
Speaker 1: for these women their clients that have you know, been

107
00:05:23,873 --> 00:05:26,394
Speaker 1: very poorly treated. And I can tell you now I'm

108
00:05:26,433 --> 00:05:30,714
Speaker 1: three episodes in the acting is like beyond terrible. I

109
00:05:30,873 --> 00:05:31,594
Speaker 1: don't know.

110
00:05:31,674 --> 00:05:34,753
Speaker 3: Why Naomi Watts and Sarah Paulson, who's also in it

111
00:05:34,794 --> 00:05:37,073
Speaker 3: and has kind of write like Ryan Murphy's News, and

112
00:05:37,193 --> 00:05:37,833
Speaker 3: Glenn Close.

113
00:05:38,313 --> 00:05:39,993
Speaker 1: How can the oh my god, Glenn Close?

114
00:05:40,073 --> 00:05:40,273
Speaker 4: Yeah?

115
00:05:40,274 --> 00:05:43,474
Speaker 3: How can these people be acting badly? They're very good actors.

116
00:05:43,993 --> 00:05:45,873
Speaker 1: It has got to be in the writing. And I

117
00:05:45,953 --> 00:05:47,553
Speaker 1: was trying to find it. Who was in the writer's

118
00:05:47,633 --> 00:05:49,433
Speaker 1: room for this, And as far as I can tell,

119
00:05:49,433 --> 00:05:53,193
Speaker 1: there's not a single woman on the writing style so

120
00:05:53,674 --> 00:05:55,714
Speaker 1: interesting take. I mean, if there is and I've missed it,

121
00:05:55,794 --> 00:05:57,714
Speaker 1: I apologized, But as far as I can tell, there

122
00:05:57,753 --> 00:06:00,713
Speaker 1: was not many women writing this, And so the way

123
00:06:00,794 --> 00:06:03,313
Speaker 1: in which these women have come together, like the friendship

124
00:06:03,354 --> 00:06:05,713
Speaker 1: that's supposed to be like the all encompassing part of

125
00:06:05,753 --> 00:06:09,034
Speaker 1: the backstory of them, feels very forced and uncomfortable. They're

126
00:06:09,034 --> 00:06:11,354
Speaker 1: delivering these one liners like they should have impact, but

127
00:06:11,393 --> 00:06:14,153
Speaker 1: they just seem kind of funny. But the big part

128
00:06:14,193 --> 00:06:18,274
Speaker 1: of it, I think is just it is bougie and classless,

129
00:06:18,393 --> 00:06:21,794
Speaker 1: and there is designer threads and loads of bling and

130
00:06:21,834 --> 00:06:24,234
Speaker 1: it just taps into that part of my brain that

131
00:06:24,393 --> 00:06:27,393
Speaker 1: just loves and it's like going on a roller coaster

132
00:06:27,594 --> 00:06:30,234
Speaker 1: at you know movie world, like you know it's going

133
00:06:30,274 --> 00:06:31,873
Speaker 1: to be awful, bit at the same time, like you're

134
00:06:31,873 --> 00:06:33,914
Speaker 1: adrenaline is pumping and you really love it. Like that's

135
00:06:33,953 --> 00:06:36,594
Speaker 1: all I can say is keeping me coming back because

136
00:06:36,633 --> 00:06:38,313
Speaker 1: the flash in the Glitz is everything.

137
00:06:38,553 --> 00:06:40,833
Speaker 2: What I can't work out is that Kim Kardashian is

138
00:06:41,034 --> 00:06:46,794
Speaker 2: known for her blankness right like, even she is expressionless.

139
00:06:47,154 --> 00:06:50,234
Speaker 2: Her face doesn't really move, she doesn't have any pause,

140
00:06:50,914 --> 00:06:54,474
Speaker 2: she doesn't emote at all. So the pivot into acting

141
00:06:54,594 --> 00:06:57,113
Speaker 2: is a very interesting one for me. But I wanted

142
00:06:57,113 --> 00:06:59,633
Speaker 2: to ask you, Claire. I read this incredible review in

143
00:06:59,674 --> 00:07:01,474
Speaker 2: The Atlantic, and I want to read you a line

144
00:07:01,513 --> 00:07:02,873
Speaker 2: and then I want you to tell me if this

145
00:07:03,034 --> 00:07:05,153
Speaker 2: was your experience of watching it, because I think that

146
00:07:05,193 --> 00:07:09,154
Speaker 2: this also might signify a broad a cultural shift towards

147
00:07:09,674 --> 00:07:13,994
Speaker 2: a very dire place. The author, who is Sophie Gilbert, wrote,

148
00:07:14,274 --> 00:07:17,514
Speaker 2: I can't call it a television show because it isn't one. Rather,

149
00:07:17,594 --> 00:07:21,554
Speaker 2: it's Instagram reels. At episode length, forty five minute collections

150
00:07:21,594 --> 00:07:25,634
Speaker 2: of bedazzled moving images targeted at the idly scrolling second

151
00:07:25,674 --> 00:07:28,754
Speaker 2: screen viewer seems pass quickly, as if to emulate the

152
00:07:28,794 --> 00:07:31,874
Speaker 2: true feed experience. If you're not already on your phone,

153
00:07:31,914 --> 00:07:32,794
Speaker 2: you may as well be.

154
00:07:33,234 --> 00:07:35,514
Speaker 1: Yeah, that seems pretty accurate, to be honest.

155
00:07:36,274 --> 00:07:39,274
Speaker 3: I did see one still from it which was Kim

156
00:07:39,393 --> 00:07:42,874
Speaker 3: wearing a sort of tweed skirt with a believe it's

157
00:07:42,914 --> 00:07:47,114
Speaker 3: called a whale tail, a visible G string poking.

158
00:07:46,714 --> 00:07:47,434
Speaker 1: Out the back.

159
00:07:47,794 --> 00:07:50,034
Speaker 3: I mean, look, I'm not a lawyer, but is that

160
00:07:50,354 --> 00:07:52,033
Speaker 3: to actually wear that to court?

161
00:07:52,434 --> 00:07:55,594
Speaker 1: This show, well, let me just prefers. I'm three episodes

162
00:07:55,594 --> 00:07:57,554
Speaker 1: in and they have yet to go to court. This

163
00:07:57,594 --> 00:08:00,554
Speaker 1: is all boardroom experiences at this point. So this is

164
00:08:00,634 --> 00:08:03,834
Speaker 1: like husband and wife sitting down across the table, very combative,

165
00:08:04,194 --> 00:08:06,153
Speaker 1: like they often come in with a bunch of men

166
00:08:06,194 --> 00:08:08,474
Speaker 1: and they sit down and they say things like oh,

167
00:08:08,874 --> 00:08:11,713
Speaker 1: all the ladies together, like that kind of vibe, and

168
00:08:11,714 --> 00:08:13,554
Speaker 1: then the ladies are like and we are going to

169
00:08:13,634 --> 00:08:16,394
Speaker 1: destroy you, and you're like, yes, girl, go get them.

170
00:08:16,434 --> 00:08:18,914
Speaker 1: And then they deliver these like terrible lines and you're

171
00:08:18,953 --> 00:08:22,274
Speaker 1: like cool, you still want like are really happy for

172
00:08:22,314 --> 00:08:26,114
Speaker 1: your client, but like these storylines are wrapped up in milliseconds.

173
00:08:26,154 --> 00:08:29,033
Speaker 1: You barely get to know the clients. Like Jessica Simpson

174
00:08:29,114 --> 00:08:33,754
Speaker 1: is a client and her role is like exceptional, like exceptional.

175
00:08:33,154 --> 00:08:36,234
Speaker 3: What do you mean by exceptional like she's a great actor.

176
00:08:36,634 --> 00:08:38,714
Speaker 1: No, no, no, nothing to do with her acting experience.

177
00:08:38,994 --> 00:08:40,634
Speaker 1: It is the fact that they brought her in to

178
00:08:40,714 --> 00:08:42,954
Speaker 1: play the character that they have and it kind of

179
00:08:42,994 --> 00:08:47,714
Speaker 1: plays very much into her real life plastic surgery experiences.

180
00:08:48,114 --> 00:08:50,154
Speaker 1: It's just great. And also Glenn Close, like, you cannot

181
00:08:50,154 --> 00:08:52,554
Speaker 1: fault this woman. She's incredible. And she delivers a line

182
00:08:52,594 --> 00:08:55,074
Speaker 1: to Sarah Paulson's character where she says, like the world

183
00:08:55,074 --> 00:08:57,354
Speaker 1: would be so much happier if your mother just swallowed

184
00:08:57,554 --> 00:09:01,514
Speaker 1: And that coming out of Len Close's mouth is like, whoa,

185
00:09:01,554 --> 00:09:06,514
Speaker 1: it's camp and it's terrible, Like it's just awful, awful, terrible.

186
00:09:06,554 --> 00:09:09,594
Speaker 1: But this is from Kim Kardashian American Horror Story because

187
00:09:09,594 --> 00:09:11,634
Speaker 1: she got Rave reviews for that, all right.

188
00:09:11,634 --> 00:09:14,994
Speaker 2: Because I have two theories as to why this has happened,

189
00:09:14,994 --> 00:09:17,954
Speaker 2: because I don't believe in twenty twenty five we are accidentally,

190
00:09:18,154 --> 00:09:22,154
Speaker 2: especially with Ryan Murphy who created Glee, like he is

191
00:09:22,434 --> 00:09:25,954
Speaker 2: a very incredible creator who knows what he's doing, I

192
00:09:25,994 --> 00:09:29,154
Speaker 2: don't believe that this happened by accident. Right, So the

193
00:09:29,194 --> 00:09:31,954
Speaker 2: first theory is one I've seen going around on substack,

194
00:09:32,114 --> 00:09:36,713
Speaker 2: which is Basically, the zero percent rating on Rotten Tomatoes

195
00:09:36,914 --> 00:09:40,034
Speaker 2: is a plant, and it's there on purpose because there

196
00:09:40,114 --> 00:09:42,594
Speaker 2: is nothing that makes you want to watch a show

197
00:09:42,674 --> 00:09:46,314
Speaker 2: more than the thought is it really that bad? Like

198
00:09:46,794 --> 00:09:48,714
Speaker 2: I want to go and prove for myself that this

199
00:09:48,914 --> 00:09:51,514
Speaker 2: is the worst show ever, And that's been part of

200
00:09:51,554 --> 00:09:56,834
Speaker 2: the attraction, and early indications suggests that people are flocking.

201
00:09:57,394 --> 00:10:02,874
Speaker 2: The second thing is that there are seventeen executive producers

202
00:10:02,874 --> 00:10:06,554
Speaker 2: on this show. They're used to it's wild, right, including

203
00:10:06,554 --> 00:10:09,354
Speaker 2: pretty much all of the actors. So you've got what's

204
00:10:09,514 --> 00:10:13,234
Speaker 2: is one? I think Kardashian is one, Paulhan is one,

205
00:10:13,674 --> 00:10:17,154
Speaker 2: And what that means is like decades ago, you'd have

206
00:10:17,194 --> 00:10:19,794
Speaker 2: three or four, So the room of people making decisions

207
00:10:19,834 --> 00:10:20,674
Speaker 2: is quite small.

208
00:10:20,954 --> 00:10:21,114
Speaker 3: Now.

209
00:10:21,154 --> 00:10:24,074
Speaker 2: It's like this flex that every actor sort of wants

210
00:10:24,114 --> 00:10:27,834
Speaker 2: to be an EP as well. And I think we're

211
00:10:27,874 --> 00:10:31,434
Speaker 2: starting to create these vanilla Frankenstein's like where we've got

212
00:10:31,474 --> 00:10:36,034
Speaker 2: too much input that it then just dilutes an idea

213
00:10:36,234 --> 00:10:40,234
Speaker 2: and becomes absolute garbage the next show you're watching. Have

214
00:10:40,314 --> 00:10:44,474
Speaker 2: a look at how many people had creative input, and

215
00:10:44,514 --> 00:10:47,994
Speaker 2: there is a threshold at which there is just too much,

216
00:10:48,034 --> 00:10:50,554
Speaker 2: Like did Kim Kardashian need a seat at the table

217
00:10:51,114 --> 00:10:51,514
Speaker 2: like that.

218
00:10:51,634 --> 00:10:53,634
Speaker 3: I think you're onto something there because and just like

219
00:10:53,674 --> 00:10:57,274
Speaker 3: that had the same issue. It did too the actors

220
00:10:57,314 --> 00:11:00,874
Speaker 3: were executive producers and Rotten Tomatos. For some time now,

221
00:11:00,914 --> 00:11:03,434
Speaker 3: people have been talking about the fact that because it's

222
00:11:03,514 --> 00:11:06,754
Speaker 3: so important, it is getting gained. Yeah, and I don't

223
00:11:06,754 --> 00:11:09,154
Speaker 3: know if you remember this, but about a year ago

224
00:11:09,394 --> 00:11:12,474
Speaker 3: it came out that Paddington iiO had the highest Rotten

225
00:11:12,474 --> 00:11:16,514
Speaker 3: Tomatoes rating of any movie ever, higher than Citizen Kane,

226
00:11:16,514 --> 00:11:20,634
Speaker 3: which is often regarded as the cinematic masterpiece of the

227
00:11:20,674 --> 00:11:23,714
Speaker 3: twentieth century. And you just got to wonder about any

228
00:11:23,834 --> 00:11:25,994
Speaker 3: rating system. I mean, look, I think Paddington Too is

229
00:11:26,034 --> 00:11:29,074
Speaker 3: delightful and Hugh Grant is as usual stealing the show.

230
00:11:29,194 --> 00:11:31,674
Speaker 3: But I just wonder if Paddington two really is the

231
00:11:31,714 --> 00:11:32,794
Speaker 3: best movie of all time.

232
00:11:33,034 --> 00:11:35,314
Speaker 1: So, as I mentioned, well, this is Kim's big fail

233
00:11:35,434 --> 00:11:39,794
Speaker 1: of the moment, but just quietly she failed again this

234
00:11:39,874 --> 00:11:44,474
Speaker 1: week because she didn't pass the bar. And anyone who's

235
00:11:44,474 --> 00:11:46,794
Speaker 1: been watching the Kardashians nose that, like this has been

236
00:11:46,834 --> 00:11:49,194
Speaker 1: a big theme throughout all of the seasons, and she's

237
00:11:49,234 --> 00:11:52,074
Speaker 1: been studying very hard, and she's been working advocating for

238
00:11:52,154 --> 00:11:56,034
Speaker 1: people in prison, and she failed the bar. So this

239
00:11:56,114 --> 00:11:59,314
Speaker 1: feels like Kim Kardashian is failing. In her personal life.

240
00:11:59,434 --> 00:12:01,994
Speaker 1: She's failing. I mean, she can't control the men that

241
00:12:02,074 --> 00:12:03,914
Speaker 1: come into her sphere, so I guess that's out of

242
00:12:03,914 --> 00:12:06,634
Speaker 1: her control. But career wise, like her actual career as

243
00:12:06,634 --> 00:12:10,394
Speaker 1: a lawyer is failing. Her alternate career as an actress,

244
00:12:10,754 --> 00:12:15,314
Speaker 1: she is failing. Are we now witnessing Kim Kardashian's flop era?

245
00:12:15,434 --> 00:12:17,474
Speaker 1: And what can she learn from all of this? We think?

246
00:12:17,474 --> 00:12:19,874
Speaker 1: I mean, she's fine. I love this for her.

247
00:12:19,994 --> 00:12:23,394
Speaker 3: I think this is why she is still just as

248
00:12:23,434 --> 00:12:26,914
Speaker 3: relevant today as she was ten years ago, fifteen years ago.

249
00:12:26,954 --> 00:12:31,154
Speaker 3: It's because she is willing to keep reinventing herself and

250
00:12:31,314 --> 00:12:34,674
Speaker 3: taking risks, and she's failed lots of times. Like I'm

251
00:12:34,674 --> 00:12:37,634
Speaker 3: thinking back to her skincare line that she tried to

252
00:12:37,714 --> 00:12:39,754
Speaker 3: launch a couple of times that never took off, and

253
00:12:39,834 --> 00:12:42,794
Speaker 3: it should have. Skims took off because she got really

254
00:12:42,834 --> 00:12:45,394
Speaker 3: smart people around her and she knew exactly what moment

255
00:12:45,474 --> 00:12:48,474
Speaker 3: she was in. But I love her failing the California Bar.

256
00:12:48,634 --> 00:12:50,994
Speaker 3: Isn't this the second or third time that she's failed?

257
00:12:51,034 --> 00:12:53,314
Speaker 1: At this point, I don't know which bar she's failed,

258
00:12:53,314 --> 00:12:56,314
Speaker 1: becausemember she failed the baby bar last time, and whether

259
00:12:56,354 --> 00:12:58,554
Speaker 1: this is the full fledged one or a retake of

260
00:12:58,554 --> 00:13:00,834
Speaker 1: the baby bar, I'm not sure, but yeah, she has.

261
00:13:00,754 --> 00:13:03,274
Speaker 2: Failed before, so I believe that she has now passed

262
00:13:03,274 --> 00:13:05,354
Speaker 2: the baby bar, but that it was the last time

263
00:13:05,434 --> 00:13:08,194
Speaker 2: she could possibly do it the time that she passed,

264
00:13:08,194 --> 00:13:10,314
Speaker 2: and then she studied really hard with this. She did

265
00:13:10,314 --> 00:13:12,754
Speaker 2: say she relied heavily on chat GPT and she has

266
00:13:12,794 --> 00:13:15,714
Speaker 2: some firm words for chat GPT. She says that sometimes

267
00:13:15,754 --> 00:13:18,754
Speaker 2: it's more like a go girl, believe in yourself, and

268
00:13:18,754 --> 00:13:21,714
Speaker 2: she's like, I just need the answer, which yes, I agree,

269
00:13:21,994 --> 00:13:24,674
Speaker 2: But I think she has entered her flop era. Kim

270
00:13:24,754 --> 00:13:28,314
Speaker 2: Kardashian is nothing if not self aware, and that is

271
00:13:28,314 --> 00:13:31,874
Speaker 2: her superpower. So even her caption on Instagram about the

272
00:13:31,874 --> 00:13:35,514
Speaker 2: All Fairs All's Fair thing, which was like, have you

273
00:13:35,554 --> 00:13:39,194
Speaker 2: guys watched the critically acclaimed All's Fair yet? Like she

274
00:13:39,434 --> 00:13:43,354
Speaker 2: thought that was funny that it was bad and she

275
00:13:43,554 --> 00:13:45,874
Speaker 2: posted about failing. She didn't have to post that she

276
00:13:45,954 --> 00:13:50,314
Speaker 2: failed that exam. But I mean, we all enter flop eras,

277
00:13:50,634 --> 00:13:53,274
Speaker 2: we've got to own them. There is humor in them,

278
00:13:53,634 --> 00:13:55,593
Speaker 2: and all power to Kim Kardashian.

279
00:13:55,834 --> 00:13:58,274
Speaker 1: I think this is amazing because I've had these conversations

280
00:13:58,274 --> 00:14:00,874
Speaker 1: with my daughter very recently, because when I pick her

281
00:14:00,914 --> 00:14:02,554
Speaker 1: up from school, I'd ask her about, you know, tell

282
00:14:02,594 --> 00:14:04,674
Speaker 1: me one thing that happened today, what did you succeed

283
00:14:04,714 --> 00:14:06,833
Speaker 1: at today? And We've had these kind of conversations, and

284
00:14:06,874 --> 00:14:09,074
Speaker 1: then one day I just asked her, did you fail

285
00:14:09,114 --> 00:14:12,554
Speaker 1: at anything today? And she was like, oh, I don't know.

286
00:14:12,714 --> 00:14:14,634
Speaker 1: I don't want to think about that. And then I

287
00:14:14,674 --> 00:14:16,554
Speaker 1: was like, but we learn from that, Like if you

288
00:14:16,594 --> 00:14:19,314
Speaker 1: fail at something, you learn some really big lessons from failing.

289
00:14:19,354 --> 00:14:22,114
Speaker 1: And she was like, oh, And now we have conversations

290
00:14:22,154 --> 00:14:25,154
Speaker 1: about successes and failures, so that as she grows up,

291
00:14:25,154 --> 00:14:26,874
Speaker 1: she's going to be like, Okay, what did I learn

292
00:14:26,954 --> 00:14:29,074
Speaker 1: from that fail rather than oh my god, I failed.

293
00:14:29,114 --> 00:14:31,394
Speaker 1: I'm the worst human in the world, and now I

294
00:14:31,394 --> 00:14:33,474
Speaker 1: can never do that again because I've failed at it

295
00:14:33,514 --> 00:14:36,434
Speaker 1: and I must be terrible. I love talking about failure,

296
00:14:36,634 --> 00:14:38,154
Speaker 1: and I'm like you, Amelia. I think this is a

297
00:14:38,194 --> 00:14:40,914
Speaker 1: really great moment for her because she's embracing it, she

298
00:14:40,994 --> 00:14:44,074
Speaker 1: learns from it, she keeps moving forward, she keeps trying,

299
00:14:44,314 --> 00:14:46,554
Speaker 1: she does things that gets her out of her comfort zone.

300
00:14:46,714 --> 00:14:50,314
Speaker 1: She does something new and different and incredible, and then sure,

301
00:14:50,394 --> 00:14:52,994
Speaker 1: sometimes it succeeds and sometimes it fails. But she's not

302
00:14:53,154 --> 00:14:56,234
Speaker 1: just hanging off of the Kardashian success for the rest

303
00:14:56,274 --> 00:14:58,674
Speaker 1: of her life. It's really quite interesting this time of

304
00:14:58,674 --> 00:14:59,314
Speaker 1: her life.

305
00:14:59,394 --> 00:15:03,194
Speaker 3: I've got another little tidbit of gossip related to the Kardashians,

306
00:15:03,314 --> 00:15:06,874
Speaker 3: and it's about Chris Jenner, who's not failing at anything

307
00:15:07,194 --> 00:15:07,594
Speaker 3: right now.

308
00:15:07,714 --> 00:15:10,914
Speaker 1: She is in whatever the opposite of a floppy era is.

309
00:15:10,954 --> 00:15:13,754
Speaker 3: She's got her brand new face that has been critically acclaimed,

310
00:15:13,874 --> 00:15:17,634
Speaker 3: unlike Kim Show. And she just celebrated her seventieth birthday

311
00:15:17,754 --> 00:15:20,834
Speaker 3: on Friday night in Los Angeles in Beverly Hills at

312
00:15:20,874 --> 00:15:25,634
Speaker 3: Jeff Bezos's mansion, and the guest list was very impressive.

313
00:15:25,874 --> 00:15:30,394
Speaker 3: It was everyone from Mark Zuckerberg to Oprah and Gail

314
00:15:30,674 --> 00:15:34,034
Speaker 3: to Rita Wilson. Tom Hanks's wife is also an actress

315
00:15:34,074 --> 00:15:37,674
Speaker 3: in her own right, to Miranda Kerr and the Snapchat

316
00:15:37,754 --> 00:15:39,034
Speaker 3: guy she's married.

317
00:15:38,674 --> 00:15:40,674
Speaker 1: To, Evan Adele, was there.

318
00:15:40,794 --> 00:15:44,714
Speaker 3: Interestingly, she covered her face with her handbag on the

319
00:15:44,754 --> 00:15:48,314
Speaker 3: way in, which reminded me of remember when Leonardo DiCaprio

320
00:15:48,394 --> 00:15:50,554
Speaker 3: went to the Bezel's wedding and just pulled his hat

321
00:15:50,634 --> 00:15:50,874
Speaker 3: down on.

322
00:15:51,674 --> 00:15:53,914
Speaker 2: I would absolutely go to christ Janna's seventieth and I

323
00:15:53,954 --> 00:15:56,154
Speaker 2: would absolutely hide my face on my way in and

324
00:15:56,194 --> 00:15:58,234
Speaker 2: out because I think the out louders would be, you know,

325
00:15:58,394 --> 00:16:00,554
Speaker 2: probably call me out fairly, but I'd be like, guys,

326
00:16:00,594 --> 00:16:01,434
Speaker 2: I'm there for the gossip.

327
00:16:01,874 --> 00:16:04,634
Speaker 3: But what I found really interesting about this is that

328
00:16:05,354 --> 00:16:08,834
Speaker 3: Chris Jenna was not always Hollywood royalty. In fact, she

329
00:16:09,114 --> 00:16:12,074
Speaker 3: was on the outs in Hollywood all through the twenty tens.

330
00:16:12,114 --> 00:16:15,674
Speaker 3: The Kardashian family was seen as very naff, sort of embarrassing.

331
00:16:15,994 --> 00:16:18,954
Speaker 3: They certainly didn't have any credibility in the sort of

332
00:16:19,034 --> 00:16:22,834
Speaker 3: moneyed halls of Beverly Hills. And now Chris Jenna seems

333
00:16:22,874 --> 00:16:25,794
Speaker 3: to be the queen of Hollywood, and she's bringing together

334
00:16:25,914 --> 00:16:28,554
Speaker 3: not just actors like the Riata Wilson's of the world,

335
00:16:28,594 --> 00:16:31,474
Speaker 3: but also like media moguls like Oprah and then tech

336
00:16:31,554 --> 00:16:35,194
Speaker 3: moguls like Mark Zuckerberg and Jeff Bezos. And my genuine

337
00:16:35,234 --> 00:16:38,434
Speaker 3: question is, how did she pull this off? And why

338
00:16:38,594 --> 00:16:41,554
Speaker 3: does everyone feel that they need to be there at

339
00:16:41,594 --> 00:16:42,954
Speaker 3: Chris Jenna's birthday party?

340
00:16:43,074 --> 00:16:46,714
Speaker 2: I reckon behind the scenes. She must be an incredible networker, right,

341
00:16:46,834 --> 00:16:48,874
Speaker 2: Like she must be one of those people that everyone

342
00:16:49,114 --> 00:16:52,754
Speaker 2: actually quite likes. This happens in like Australian media circles,

343
00:16:52,754 --> 00:16:55,154
Speaker 2: where it's not who you'd expect who were like the

344
00:16:55,194 --> 00:16:58,954
Speaker 2: most connected and almost the most popular. Did I read

345
00:16:58,994 --> 00:17:01,994
Speaker 2: though that Chris Jenna had Harry and Meghan Harry the.

346
00:17:02,034 --> 00:17:04,554
Speaker 3: Duke and Duchess of Sussex were there. But I want

347
00:17:04,554 --> 00:17:07,794
Speaker 3: to just push you on that, Jesse, because we knew

348
00:17:07,834 --> 00:17:09,554
Speaker 3: there were friends, by the way, because Megan had sent

349
00:17:09,634 --> 00:17:12,634
Speaker 3: her Rose when she launched her Rose, so that's when

350
00:17:12,754 --> 00:17:16,594
Speaker 3: that connection first came about. But I want to distinguish

351
00:17:16,594 --> 00:17:19,114
Speaker 3: between someone who's a good networker and someone who's just

352
00:17:19,154 --> 00:17:21,154
Speaker 3: a lot of fun to be around, because that's what

353
00:17:21,194 --> 00:17:23,314
Speaker 3: I'm trying to figure out with her. Do people think

354
00:17:23,314 --> 00:17:25,714
Speaker 3: it's strategic to show up at her party or is

355
00:17:25,714 --> 00:17:28,394
Speaker 3: she just the best fun in Hollywood? Oh?

356
00:17:28,434 --> 00:17:30,354
Speaker 1: I think she might be really fun. I think she

357
00:17:30,434 --> 00:17:32,593
Speaker 1: might be really fun too. But I also feel like

358
00:17:32,914 --> 00:17:37,674
Speaker 1: the Kardashian power has shifted over the years. Remember when

359
00:17:37,994 --> 00:17:40,513
Speaker 1: their power was kind of intangible, like they were famous

360
00:17:40,514 --> 00:17:42,313
Speaker 1: for being famous. There was all of that, and I

361
00:17:42,314 --> 00:17:45,834
Speaker 1: think as we've kind of progressed, and these women have

362
00:17:45,914 --> 00:17:50,034
Speaker 1: become incredibly successful business women in their own right, and

363
00:17:50,314 --> 00:17:52,194
Speaker 1: you know, Chris still at the head of that family

364
00:17:52,194 --> 00:17:54,834
Speaker 1: as their agent and taking care of business, and her

365
00:17:54,874 --> 00:17:57,754
Speaker 1: influence has grown and grown and grown, and I think

366
00:17:58,154 --> 00:17:59,714
Speaker 1: just the nature of the world that we now live

367
00:17:59,714 --> 00:18:02,313
Speaker 1: in that's less about the old money and about the

368
00:18:02,354 --> 00:18:04,834
Speaker 1: old ways and more about the you and the flashy

369
00:18:04,874 --> 00:18:07,674
Speaker 1: and the next and the latest. I think her power

370
00:18:07,754 --> 00:18:09,714
Speaker 1: is actually shifted into a place where I think people

371
00:18:09,994 --> 00:18:12,794
Speaker 1: probably are also networking with her in a way that

372
00:18:12,794 --> 00:18:15,154
Speaker 1: they wouldn't have done ten years ago. I have a

373
00:18:15,154 --> 00:18:19,034
Speaker 1: little piece of gossip about Jeff Bezos. He has a house.

374
00:18:18,834 --> 00:18:21,394
Speaker 3: In Washington, DC, where I used to live, and I

375
00:18:21,474 --> 00:18:23,834
Speaker 3: have a friend who once went to a party at

376
00:18:23,834 --> 00:18:25,273
Speaker 3: his Washington DC mansion.

377
00:18:25,434 --> 00:18:26,794
Speaker 1: And here is the little tidbit.

378
00:18:27,274 --> 00:18:30,194
Speaker 3: He owns two mansions and they're on other sides of

379
00:18:30,234 --> 00:18:32,194
Speaker 3: the street from each other there, and one of the

380
00:18:32,234 --> 00:18:35,114
Speaker 3: mansions is just for parties, and it's full of like

381
00:18:35,274 --> 00:18:39,594
Speaker 3: really historic, pricey memorabilia and beautiful frange pictures and it's

382
00:18:39,634 --> 00:18:43,074
Speaker 3: specifically designed to entertain people and impress people. And then

383
00:18:43,114 --> 00:18:44,914
Speaker 3: on the other side of the Street is his actual

384
00:18:44,914 --> 00:18:46,794
Speaker 3: house that he lives in, And what's the bet that

385
00:18:46,794 --> 00:18:50,634
Speaker 3: that's just got some comfy sofas and some oh some

386
00:18:50,674 --> 00:18:53,794
Speaker 3: big big screen TVs. And I just love the idea

387
00:18:53,834 --> 00:18:56,394
Speaker 3: of a dedicated party house for Jeff Bezos.

388
00:18:56,874 --> 00:19:00,154
Speaker 2: After the break, the New York Times asked a very

389
00:19:00,154 --> 00:19:02,634
Speaker 2: simple question, nothing wrong with asking a question. They just

390
00:19:02,634 --> 00:19:06,714
Speaker 2: wanted to know if women ruined the workplace? And the

391
00:19:06,714 --> 00:19:09,674
Speaker 2: internet got really mad, and we are here to dissect it.

392
00:19:15,634 --> 00:19:20,154
Speaker 2: Did women ruin the workplace? The New York Times? They did,

393
00:19:20,194 --> 00:19:22,674
Speaker 2: and they took the words right out of our mouths.

394
00:19:23,274 --> 00:19:26,474
Speaker 2: They are reading our minds. Last week, the New York

395
00:19:26,474 --> 00:19:29,994
Speaker 2: Times published that headline, and as tends to happen on

396
00:19:30,034 --> 00:19:33,394
Speaker 2: the internet, there was a lot of blowback to the headline.

397
00:19:33,474 --> 00:19:37,114
Speaker 2: I think most people didn't actually read what was beyond it.

398
00:19:37,154 --> 00:19:40,634
Speaker 2: That's not to say the headline isn't offensive or problematic,

399
00:19:40,994 --> 00:19:46,794
Speaker 2: but the article itself was somewhat more complicated, and we'll

400
00:19:46,874 --> 00:19:47,353
Speaker 2: get to that.

401
00:19:47,514 --> 00:19:48,954
Speaker 1: They also changed the headline.

402
00:19:49,074 --> 00:19:51,674
Speaker 2: Oh, they changed the headline like six times.

403
00:19:51,714 --> 00:19:54,594
Speaker 3: So it did start off as did women ruin the Workplace?

404
00:19:54,634 --> 00:19:57,434
Speaker 3: And people were upset, they said, we've heard you. They

405
00:19:57,594 --> 00:20:01,513
Speaker 3: changed it to did liberal feminism ruin the workplace?

406
00:20:01,714 --> 00:20:04,434
Speaker 2: Yes, they kept trying to kind of hedge hedge hedge,

407
00:20:04,434 --> 00:20:06,674
Speaker 2: and you could just hear the panic in the newsroom,

408
00:20:06,754 --> 00:20:11,994
Speaker 2: which a it's quite enjoying. Host Ross Douthat interviewed two

409
00:20:12,114 --> 00:20:16,314
Speaker 2: conservative female writers. One is named Helen Andrews, the other

410
00:20:16,554 --> 00:20:21,114
Speaker 2: is Leah Libresco Sergeant, and they make two very different points,

411
00:20:21,114 --> 00:20:23,834
Speaker 2: but he sits down with them and basically they all

412
00:20:23,914 --> 00:20:28,674
Speaker 2: explore the idea that workplaces have become more woke, and

413
00:20:28,874 --> 00:20:33,874
Speaker 2: wokism is of course a result of the feminization of

414
00:20:34,234 --> 00:20:37,954
Speaker 2: the workplace. So apparently women they care more about this

415
00:20:38,034 --> 00:20:43,394
Speaker 2: equality bullshit. They are more driven by empathy, social justice, priorities,

416
00:20:43,714 --> 00:20:45,593
Speaker 2: consensus over decision making.

417
00:20:45,994 --> 00:20:47,474
Speaker 1: God, we're awful, I know.

418
00:20:47,714 --> 00:20:50,794
Speaker 2: And this shift has meant that we have lost important

419
00:20:50,794 --> 00:20:54,634
Speaker 2: things like hierarchy, assertiveness, and risk taking, which are all

420
00:20:54,754 --> 00:20:59,914
Speaker 2: essential to a thriving workplace. Helen Andrews says that feminine

421
00:21:00,034 --> 00:21:04,033
Speaker 2: vices such as gossip and an inability to deal with

422
00:21:04,074 --> 00:21:06,834
Speaker 2: conflict directly have led to very corrosive things like the

423
00:21:06,874 --> 00:21:07,714
Speaker 2: meter movement.

424
00:21:07,834 --> 00:21:09,074
Speaker 3: Don't get her started on.

425
00:21:08,994 --> 00:21:13,833
Speaker 2: The TV show All's Fair, while in fact, can we

426
00:21:13,874 --> 00:21:17,034
Speaker 2: pin that on men? Because men wrote that they delivered

427
00:21:17,034 --> 00:21:19,553
Speaker 2: the scripts the poor women, which I feel like is

428
00:21:19,554 --> 00:21:21,474
Speaker 2: actually kind of a metaphor for what's going on here.

429
00:21:21,554 --> 00:21:25,354
Speaker 2: But before we go to did women ruin the workplace?

430
00:21:25,394 --> 00:21:28,434
Speaker 2: I want to explore the idea of did women in

431
00:21:28,554 --> 00:21:31,594
Speaker 2: fairness change the workplace? What do you reckon?

432
00:21:32,034 --> 00:21:34,834
Speaker 1: I mean, of course they did, moving from this notion

433
00:21:34,874 --> 00:21:37,434
Speaker 1: that a man's only role in this world is to

434
00:21:37,514 --> 00:21:40,714
Speaker 1: go to work and make money and come home. This

435
00:21:40,994 --> 00:21:43,674
Speaker 1: is an opportunity that I feel men have maybe let

436
00:21:43,714 --> 00:21:46,474
Speaker 1: them pass by, but inviting women into the workplace freed

437
00:21:46,514 --> 00:21:49,954
Speaker 1: them up to have more life than breadwinner. And when

438
00:21:49,994 --> 00:21:53,514
Speaker 1: women came in it of course introduced things like maternity

439
00:21:53,554 --> 00:21:59,714
Speaker 1: leave initiatives. It also created things like workplace discrimination legislation

440
00:21:59,874 --> 00:22:03,994
Speaker 1: came on board, so things definitely changed when women came

441
00:22:03,994 --> 00:22:06,474
Speaker 1: into the workforce. But like I said, men lost an

442
00:22:06,474 --> 00:22:09,634
Speaker 1: opportunity to pull back from the workforce, to not have

443
00:22:09,714 --> 00:22:11,994
Speaker 1: that be their entire identity. And I think this is

444
00:22:12,034 --> 00:22:15,474
Speaker 1: where we're failing men in particular, as no one taught

445
00:22:15,474 --> 00:22:17,874
Speaker 1: them what to do once they weren't the only ones

446
00:22:17,954 --> 00:22:21,154
Speaker 1: doing that important role, and they've kind of been left

447
00:22:21,874 --> 00:22:24,754
Speaker 1: wondering what their purpose is in life now because they

448
00:22:24,834 --> 00:22:26,954
Speaker 1: did not take the on id to say this. Conservative

449
00:22:26,994 --> 00:22:30,434
Speaker 1: men in particular didn't take the opportunity to explore becoming

450
00:22:30,514 --> 00:22:33,954
Speaker 1: better and more involved fathers, or finding ways to better

451
00:22:33,954 --> 00:22:37,394
Speaker 1: their society and community, or you know, looking beyond their

452
00:22:37,394 --> 00:22:39,874
Speaker 1: worth as a dollar sign. Like it's a really interesting

453
00:22:40,474 --> 00:22:45,073
Speaker 1: moment where we could have collectively made everyone's lives different

454
00:22:45,114 --> 00:22:49,314
Speaker 1: and more interesting, and instead, conservative men in particular chose

455
00:22:49,354 --> 00:22:50,074
Speaker 1: to stand still.

456
00:22:50,354 --> 00:22:52,754
Speaker 2: All right, I'm going to play Devil's advocate here because

457
00:22:52,794 --> 00:22:56,434
Speaker 2: I would be lying if I didn't confess that I

458
00:22:56,474 --> 00:23:00,034
Speaker 2: have sat with lots of people who are very high

459
00:23:00,114 --> 00:23:03,234
Speaker 2: up in businesses, who work across lots and lots of

460
00:23:03,234 --> 00:23:06,354
Speaker 2: different industries, young people, older people, lots of different people

461
00:23:06,514 --> 00:23:11,554
Speaker 2: who have said some version of this right when they're

462
00:23:11,594 --> 00:23:13,994
Speaker 2: in private. So they will say something like women are

463
00:23:13,994 --> 00:23:17,514
Speaker 2: harder to manage workplaces with more women are bit here

464
00:23:18,154 --> 00:23:22,594
Speaker 2: they will say women are conflict avoidant, And so what

465
00:23:22,674 --> 00:23:24,354
Speaker 2: you get is a lot of they're not honest with

466
00:23:24,434 --> 00:23:27,553
Speaker 2: each other. We are finding that a lot of this

467
00:23:27,714 --> 00:23:30,513
Speaker 2: social justice stuff is impacting our bottom line. I'm not

468
00:23:30,554 --> 00:23:33,714
Speaker 2: saying I agree with any of this, but like, if

469
00:23:33,754 --> 00:23:37,033
Speaker 2: this is a conversation that is happening, and people are

470
00:23:37,034 --> 00:23:39,874
Speaker 2: going the workplace is changing. And that's the thing is

471
00:23:39,914 --> 00:23:42,394
Speaker 2: that once you get women in, even when the subject

472
00:23:42,434 --> 00:23:45,914
Speaker 2: of minorities, it's like yeah, and those people are going

473
00:23:45,994 --> 00:23:48,674
Speaker 2: to change a workplace. That's also why we want to

474
00:23:48,754 --> 00:23:52,754
Speaker 2: diversify and have a more inclusive workplace. But is that

475
00:23:52,874 --> 00:23:56,513
Speaker 2: worth discussing. I mean, if that is a true phenomenon, yeah, Look.

476
00:23:56,354 --> 00:23:58,234
Speaker 3: I'm going to piggyback on that and say I was

477
00:23:58,234 --> 00:24:01,154
Speaker 3: really interested to listen to this conversation because Helen Andrews

478
00:24:01,194 --> 00:24:04,474
Speaker 3: starts from an accurate place. The place she starts from

479
00:24:04,714 --> 00:24:07,074
Speaker 3: is that we are losing trust in all these affe

480
00:24:07,114 --> 00:24:11,273
Speaker 3: authority figures and institutions that we used to believe and trust.

481
00:24:11,594 --> 00:24:14,273
Speaker 3: So I'd think of government, I'd think of yes, media,

482
00:24:14,714 --> 00:24:17,194
Speaker 3: I think of churches, I'd think of all sorts of

483
00:24:17,274 --> 00:24:20,914
Speaker 3: institutions that are failing us now because we don't trust

484
00:24:20,914 --> 00:24:23,434
Speaker 3: them like we used to. And so her question is why,

485
00:24:23,914 --> 00:24:27,234
Speaker 3: and her answer happens to be women. And you know,

486
00:24:27,594 --> 00:24:29,674
Speaker 3: I think that's what we're spending time unpacking here. But

487
00:24:29,754 --> 00:24:32,754
Speaker 3: it's a reasonable question to ask why did institutions start

488
00:24:32,794 --> 00:24:35,754
Speaker 3: to fail us? And her basic point is that women

489
00:24:35,874 --> 00:24:40,114
Speaker 3: care more about relationships than men, and men care more

490
00:24:40,154 --> 00:24:44,474
Speaker 3: about rules than women do. That's the sort of premise

491
00:24:44,554 --> 00:24:47,354
Speaker 3: of what she's saying here. And I think it's very

492
00:24:47,394 --> 00:24:51,073
Speaker 3: silly to say that men care more about rules than

493
00:24:51,114 --> 00:24:54,634
Speaker 3: women while we're watching the world burn, because a bunch

494
00:24:54,674 --> 00:24:57,914
Speaker 3: of men who are probably at Chris Jenner's birthday party

495
00:24:58,154 --> 00:24:59,754
Speaker 3: don't care about rules at all.

496
00:24:59,954 --> 00:25:03,394
Speaker 2: Her other point is that men are warriors and they

497
00:25:03,434 --> 00:25:07,874
Speaker 2: have been like evolutionarily primed to go to right, so

498
00:25:07,914 --> 00:25:12,434
Speaker 2: they are all about conflict, aggression and resolution. And I'm like,

499
00:25:12,474 --> 00:25:14,514
Speaker 2: I don't know if you've read a story about war,

500
00:25:14,594 --> 00:25:17,513
Speaker 2: but war is not often a story of resolution, Like

501
00:25:17,594 --> 00:25:19,793
Speaker 2: it takes a lot of time and a lot of death.

502
00:25:20,394 --> 00:25:24,434
Speaker 2: And if that is the blueprint of our corporate workforce,

503
00:25:24,514 --> 00:25:26,274
Speaker 2: then I have a few criticians.

504
00:25:26,314 --> 00:25:29,514
Speaker 3: World War One was followed by World War yes exactly.

505
00:25:29,554 --> 00:25:31,394
Speaker 2: I don't think that they all then hold hands and go.

506
00:25:31,474 --> 00:25:34,554
Speaker 2: Now we all agree where she says women obviously their

507
00:25:34,554 --> 00:25:38,114
Speaker 2: only job is to have and look after children, and

508
00:25:38,194 --> 00:25:43,154
Speaker 2: therefore they are more about social dynamics talking.

509
00:25:42,914 --> 00:25:45,114
Speaker 1: Jesse are not being fair about this book that she loves.

510
00:25:45,234 --> 00:25:46,274
Speaker 1: What she says is.

511
00:25:47,234 --> 00:25:50,794
Speaker 3: Then are warriors, meaning they go out and fight battles.

512
00:25:51,274 --> 00:25:56,434
Speaker 3: Women are warriors, meaning they worry about things exactly.

513
00:25:56,994 --> 00:26:00,553
Speaker 2: And what we need is the workforce is best run

514
00:26:01,034 --> 00:26:05,594
Speaker 2: by warriors, which is the war ones. And if you

515
00:26:05,674 --> 00:26:06,434
Speaker 2: can see it.

516
00:26:06,394 --> 00:26:12,274
Speaker 3: Sounds better in an American access, I will say.

517
00:26:10,994 --> 00:26:16,914
Speaker 1: I am just I'm really frustrated obviously at these conversations

518
00:26:16,914 --> 00:26:20,754
Speaker 1: because it's not conversation, it's provocation. And it makes feminism

519
00:26:21,114 --> 00:26:24,554
Speaker 1: this idea that women want to be seen as same

520
00:26:24,954 --> 00:26:27,314
Speaker 1: and it's not that at all. We obviously are different

521
00:26:27,354 --> 00:26:29,394
Speaker 1: to men, like that's not the question, and that was

522
00:26:29,474 --> 00:26:32,594
Speaker 1: never what feminism was about. Feminism is about equality. It's

523
00:26:32,594 --> 00:26:36,514
Speaker 1: about political equality, it's about social equality, it's about economic equality.

524
00:26:36,554 --> 00:26:39,754
Speaker 1: It's not about being the same as men. Women bring

525
00:26:39,794 --> 00:26:42,513
Speaker 1: different things to the table. It doesn't mean they're worse things.

526
00:26:42,714 --> 00:26:44,954
Speaker 1: We are flawed just as men are. We're going to

527
00:26:45,034 --> 00:26:47,714
Speaker 1: make mistakes and do things just as men do. But

528
00:26:47,754 --> 00:26:49,514
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, if we can together

529
00:26:49,594 --> 00:26:53,394
Speaker 1: work together to make it an equal experience, regardless of

530
00:26:53,394 --> 00:26:55,474
Speaker 1: what skills we bring to the table, that is what

531
00:26:55,514 --> 00:26:59,274
Speaker 1: feminism aimed to do. And the problem with the word

532
00:26:59,354 --> 00:27:01,874
Speaker 1: feminism is it has the word feminine in it, and

533
00:27:02,594 --> 00:27:06,234
Speaker 1: men conservative men in particular, see that as lesser. We

534
00:27:06,314 --> 00:27:08,553
Speaker 1: don't want to be that that is a threat to

535
00:27:08,594 --> 00:27:13,634
Speaker 1: my masculinity instead of seeing it as an accompaniment or

536
00:27:13,754 --> 00:27:17,313
Speaker 1: a way to improve yourself is by aligning with that

537
00:27:17,354 --> 00:27:20,714
Speaker 1: femininity and exploring that and seeing how that can work

538
00:27:20,794 --> 00:27:24,674
Speaker 1: better together. Because the patriarchy, yes, started with men who

539
00:27:24,714 --> 00:27:29,434
Speaker 1: will worry yours and who decided that this combatitive nature

540
00:27:29,514 --> 00:27:32,514
Speaker 1: of government and the way that people should be put

541
00:27:32,554 --> 00:27:34,954
Speaker 1: in their place. That's why that was created at a

542
00:27:34,994 --> 00:27:38,354
Speaker 1: time where that difference between men and women was because

543
00:27:38,394 --> 00:27:41,354
Speaker 1: men were physically stronger, and so that was how that

544
00:27:41,434 --> 00:27:43,874
Speaker 1: had to play out in that time. In our existence

545
00:27:43,954 --> 00:27:48,674
Speaker 1: right now, we understand we do jobs that don't require physicality,

546
00:27:48,914 --> 00:27:51,114
Speaker 1: and for that you don't need to be a man

547
00:27:51,274 --> 00:27:54,194
Speaker 1: or a woman or any gender in particular. You can

548
00:27:54,594 --> 00:27:57,874
Speaker 1: actually be the same on the same playing field. But

549
00:27:57,954 --> 00:28:00,634
Speaker 1: you have to understand that that system has to be

550
00:28:00,674 --> 00:28:04,513
Speaker 1: dismantled first. And men are so unwilling to let that

551
00:28:04,634 --> 00:28:06,954
Speaker 1: go because when you're at the top of the food chain,

552
00:28:07,314 --> 00:28:08,914
Speaker 1: why would you want to share that with anyone?

553
00:28:09,114 --> 00:28:11,754
Speaker 2: Well, I think some men are and interestingly here some

554
00:28:11,834 --> 00:28:13,994
Speaker 2: women are right, And there's a question at the end

555
00:28:14,034 --> 00:28:17,354
Speaker 2: of the interview where Helen is asked to name a

556
00:28:17,394 --> 00:28:20,474
Speaker 2: feminine attribute that she thinks is good and she can't

557
00:28:20,514 --> 00:28:23,074
Speaker 2: do it. She can's going back and forth and being

558
00:28:23,354 --> 00:28:26,674
Speaker 2: like she really struggles to go. Is there anything about

559
00:28:26,714 --> 00:28:30,634
Speaker 2: the feminine or female inclusion in the workplace that might

560
00:28:30,754 --> 00:28:33,714
Speaker 2: be read as positive? But I see your point clear

561
00:28:33,794 --> 00:28:36,794
Speaker 2: that it's like it's about the workplace is going to change.

562
00:28:36,794 --> 00:28:38,474
Speaker 2: And if you look at your Jeff Bezos as the

563
00:28:38,514 --> 00:28:42,634
Speaker 2: example of your masculine vices, So let's pillage the environment,

564
00:28:42,874 --> 00:28:46,754
Speaker 2: let's exploit people. Let's money at all costs a certain.

565
00:28:46,634 --> 00:28:49,074
Speaker 3: Pe in water bottles instead of having toilet breaks if

566
00:28:49,074 --> 00:28:50,234
Speaker 3: they work at an Amazon.

567
00:28:49,914 --> 00:28:53,114
Speaker 1: Fashion exactly, and you know what, that is profitable.

568
00:28:53,194 --> 00:28:56,514
Speaker 2: And if that's the world that Helen Andrews is advocating for,

569
00:28:56,834 --> 00:28:59,994
Speaker 2: then you are right. But I think that a lot

570
00:29:00,034 --> 00:29:02,754
Speaker 2: of us men and women are going that's not the

571
00:29:02,834 --> 00:29:06,994
Speaker 2: kind of workplace that's actually functional or sustainable or works

572
00:29:07,114 --> 00:29:07,554
Speaker 2: long term.

573
00:29:07,634 --> 00:29:10,114
Speaker 1: It's really hard for women to pea and water bottles

574
00:29:10,114 --> 00:29:12,794
Speaker 1: really difficult unless you have a shi wi that will

575
00:29:12,794 --> 00:29:13,194
Speaker 1: make things.

576
00:29:14,194 --> 00:29:16,194
Speaker 3: And number two, i'd just say, if you've got a

577
00:29:16,234 --> 00:29:19,474
Speaker 3: party house in a regular house, maybe you should interrogate

578
00:29:19,514 --> 00:29:22,074
Speaker 3: how you're running a business that made that possible exactly.

579
00:29:22,114 --> 00:29:24,674
Speaker 2: Maybe you just need one house there. The female said it,

580
00:29:24,834 --> 00:29:26,794
Speaker 2: I said it, How dad are you?

581
00:29:29,034 --> 00:29:31,754
Speaker 3: If you were born before nineteen ninety seven, I've got

582
00:29:31,754 --> 00:29:33,874
Speaker 3: a few things I want to update you on, and

583
00:29:33,914 --> 00:29:36,594
Speaker 3: if you were born after nineteen ninety seven, I'd suggest

584
00:29:36,634 --> 00:29:37,674
Speaker 3: you should listen along.

585
00:29:37,754 --> 00:29:39,434
Speaker 1: You might learn something. How about that?

586
00:29:40,114 --> 00:29:44,594
Speaker 3: Respect your olders, sorry, respect your elders. The first thing

587
00:29:44,674 --> 00:29:47,394
Speaker 3: I wanted to tell us people born before nineteen ninety

588
00:29:47,394 --> 00:29:49,514
Speaker 3: seven is that I went to an oasis this weekend.

589
00:29:50,754 --> 00:29:53,754
Speaker 3: Oh okay, I went to their concert and it was

590
00:29:53,874 --> 00:29:56,434
Speaker 3: so great well that I had the best time. Holly

591
00:29:56,554 --> 00:29:58,554
Speaker 3: was there too. We were singing our heart out to

592
00:29:58,594 --> 00:30:01,354
Speaker 3: Don't Look Back in Anger. The second thing I want

593
00:30:01,394 --> 00:30:05,194
Speaker 3: to tell you about is that we are apparently doing

594
00:30:05,354 --> 00:30:06,554
Speaker 3: something else wrong.

595
00:30:06,754 --> 00:30:09,594
Speaker 1: Now, can we just add it to the list of things? Okay,

596
00:30:09,634 --> 00:30:12,554
Speaker 1: what are we doing wrong today? Amelia? Millennials go around?

597
00:30:12,554 --> 00:30:14,234
Speaker 1: Because I just found out that we were getting made

598
00:30:14,234 --> 00:30:17,154
Speaker 1: butter for something called the millennial Smile.

599
00:30:17,474 --> 00:30:21,594
Speaker 3: Yeah, so the millennial smile. It's essentially what Tyra Banks

600
00:30:21,594 --> 00:30:23,994
Speaker 3: told us to do when she said to smiles, remember that.

601
00:30:25,034 --> 00:30:27,194
Speaker 1: It's smiling with your eyes, smiling with your eyes.

602
00:30:27,234 --> 00:30:30,274
Speaker 3: Your lips are closed, you're smiling with your eyes, You're

603
00:30:30,274 --> 00:30:32,874
Speaker 3: looking very benevolent about the world. And look, I would

604
00:30:33,034 --> 00:30:36,474
Speaker 3: rather be accused of having the millennial smile than the

605
00:30:36,554 --> 00:30:39,114
Speaker 3: gen z stare. I'm just going to put that out there.

606
00:30:39,674 --> 00:30:43,074
Speaker 3: But also I did feel deeply shamed and guilty when

607
00:30:43,114 --> 00:30:46,994
Speaker 3: I watched this video because I absolutely do the millennial smile,

608
00:30:47,114 --> 00:30:48,314
Speaker 3: particularly in selfies.

609
00:30:48,474 --> 00:30:51,434
Speaker 2: Okay, because what was distinctive about this smile too, is

610
00:30:51,474 --> 00:30:54,514
Speaker 2: that you don't open your lips, right, I like yours.

611
00:30:54,514 --> 00:30:59,394
Speaker 1: First raised up. But it's not dark faced. No, it's

612
00:30:59,394 --> 00:31:01,594
Speaker 1: just like a very gentle like I don't even know

613
00:31:01,634 --> 00:31:02,234
Speaker 1: how to smirk.

614
00:31:03,794 --> 00:31:07,554
Speaker 2: It's how I smiled when I had braces, which was

615
00:31:07,634 --> 00:31:11,194
Speaker 2: like I'm trying to hide my dental work. Now, I

616
00:31:11,194 --> 00:31:13,834
Speaker 2: think because I had braces on my teeth, I was scappy,

617
00:31:13,874 --> 00:31:16,474
Speaker 2: and I had that two years. I feel like now

618
00:31:16,554 --> 00:31:20,034
Speaker 2: I'm still just stoked. I don't have races anymore, so

619
00:31:20,114 --> 00:31:22,794
Speaker 2: I smile with all the teeth. But we had to

620
00:31:22,914 --> 00:31:25,834
Speaker 2: have a smile in our bank for when we took

621
00:31:25,994 --> 00:31:29,914
Speaker 2: our forty eight MySpace photos like an album of our

622
00:31:29,994 --> 00:31:33,114
Speaker 2: night out where we just looked exactly the same at

623
00:31:33,114 --> 00:31:35,754
Speaker 2: the nightclub with our digital camera, where we would do

624
00:31:36,394 --> 00:31:38,314
Speaker 2: that face with our like good angle.

625
00:31:38,434 --> 00:31:40,554
Speaker 3: That's interesting because I've got a slightly different theory ast

626
00:31:40,554 --> 00:31:43,794
Speaker 3: how originated, which is maybe because I'm an elder millennial

627
00:31:43,914 --> 00:31:46,514
Speaker 3: and you are a baby millennial. Yes, that the term

628
00:31:47,274 --> 00:31:51,834
Speaker 3: us elder millennials still remember taking the little camera roll

629
00:31:52,154 --> 00:31:56,754
Speaker 3: to the chemist to get the photos printed. Yes, And

630
00:31:56,794 --> 00:31:58,714
Speaker 3: there was always this moment that you went to pick

631
00:31:58,794 --> 00:32:00,954
Speaker 3: up the photos once they were printed, and your hands

632
00:32:00,954 --> 00:32:03,754
Speaker 3: will practically be shaking as you open this envelope to

633
00:32:03,834 --> 00:32:07,074
Speaker 3: see if amongst the twenty four photos that you had careful,

634
00:32:07,674 --> 00:32:09,874
Speaker 3: there may be one that is good enough for you

635
00:32:09,954 --> 00:32:13,074
Speaker 3: to perhaps frame. Yeah, and you put up on your

636
00:32:13,114 --> 00:32:18,274
Speaker 3: walls venue. And so we didn't have endless, endless opportunities

637
00:32:18,314 --> 00:32:20,994
Speaker 3: to take photos. We only had the photos that we

638
00:32:21,034 --> 00:32:24,074
Speaker 3: had on our twenty four photo role, Okay, And so

639
00:32:24,114 --> 00:32:26,994
Speaker 3: we had to develop a fool proof way of smiling.

640
00:32:27,074 --> 00:32:29,034
Speaker 3: And I see you not in Claire, You know what

641
00:32:29,074 --> 00:32:29,714
Speaker 3: I'm talking about.

642
00:32:29,714 --> 00:32:31,314
Speaker 2: Okay, So we couldn't risk it with teeth.

643
00:32:31,634 --> 00:32:33,794
Speaker 1: Here's what you're saying, we couldn't. We can teek it

644
00:32:33,834 --> 00:32:38,034
Speaker 1: with teeth. Teeth changes everything. And that's the thing. Is

645
00:32:38,074 --> 00:32:40,554
Speaker 1: like when you are looking at your face in a camera,

646
00:32:40,914 --> 00:32:43,674
Speaker 1: like if you don't smile with your teeth, it like

647
00:32:43,834 --> 00:32:46,634
Speaker 1: elongates your cheeks a little bit, and like you don't

648
00:32:46,674 --> 00:32:49,274
Speaker 1: look like a crazy person. And sometimes when you smile

649
00:32:49,314 --> 00:32:51,674
Speaker 1: with all your teeth, it changes the whole shape of

650
00:32:51,714 --> 00:32:54,354
Speaker 1: your face and like it broadens out your cheeks and

651
00:32:54,394 --> 00:32:56,754
Speaker 1: it like changes squints up your eyes a little bit.

652
00:32:56,834 --> 00:32:58,834
Speaker 1: Sometimes you want your eyes to be the focus, not

653
00:32:58,914 --> 00:33:02,314
Speaker 1: the mouth. So it's been practiced in a way that

654
00:33:02,394 --> 00:33:05,594
Speaker 1: you know that if I deliver this photo in a

655
00:33:05,634 --> 00:33:08,514
Speaker 1: certain way, it'll probably turn out kind of okay. The

656
00:33:08,594 --> 00:33:11,714
Speaker 1: smile is unpredictable and it depends on who you're standing

657
00:33:11,794 --> 00:33:14,074
Speaker 1: next to, what angle you're looking at, Like, there's a

658
00:33:14,114 --> 00:33:17,194
Speaker 1: lot of unknowns with a smile. Oh, I've been practicing forever.

659
00:33:17,394 --> 00:33:20,634
Speaker 2: I lose my eyes, Like there are lots of issues. Also,

660
00:33:20,834 --> 00:33:24,914
Speaker 2: my chin scrunches. There is a high probability of error.

661
00:33:24,994 --> 00:33:27,114
Speaker 2: I just wish that I had maybe had this advice

662
00:33:27,194 --> 00:33:27,874
Speaker 2: before my wedding.

663
00:33:27,954 --> 00:33:30,514
Speaker 1: Well, can I just say I went to my niece's

664
00:33:30,554 --> 00:33:34,234
Speaker 1: twenty first birthday very recently, and she had like this

665
00:33:34,394 --> 00:33:38,074
Speaker 1: glorious setup with like draped fabric and candles and like

666
00:33:38,114 --> 00:33:39,874
Speaker 1: things that people were posing in front of to have

667
00:33:39,874 --> 00:33:42,394
Speaker 1: their photos taken. And someone handed me a camera and

668
00:33:42,434 --> 00:33:44,434
Speaker 1: said can you take some photos for us? And I

669
00:33:44,474 --> 00:33:47,394
Speaker 1: was like, of course, I'm cool. I can hang with

670
00:33:47,394 --> 00:33:49,434
Speaker 1: twenty one year olds and take a decent photo. I've

671
00:33:49,434 --> 00:33:50,954
Speaker 1: been doing this for a long time.

672
00:33:51,074 --> 00:33:54,274
Speaker 3: I think that you using the phrase I can hang

673
00:33:54,394 --> 00:33:56,354
Speaker 3: with twenty one year olds was your first.

674
00:33:56,154 --> 00:33:58,594
Speaker 1: I mean internally, yes, but I would never say that

675
00:33:58,634 --> 00:34:00,434
Speaker 1: out loud in front of the young people for fear

676
00:34:00,474 --> 00:34:02,914
Speaker 1: of being judged. But I walked up and I held

677
00:34:02,994 --> 00:34:06,034
Speaker 1: up the camera and before I'd even like gone to press,

678
00:34:06,034 --> 00:34:07,834
Speaker 1: they were like no, no, no, no, no, no, no no,

679
00:34:07,914 --> 00:34:10,553
Speaker 1: this is all wrong. Step back. I now have to

680
00:34:10,554 --> 00:34:13,714
Speaker 1: take the photos from like under boob height. Oh I

681
00:34:13,714 --> 00:34:17,114
Speaker 1: thought of the camera. No no, no, we do not

682
00:34:17,194 --> 00:34:20,194
Speaker 1: take from above. You take from below. And then you

683
00:34:20,234 --> 00:34:23,354
Speaker 1: take forty eight photos speech shots, whatever you want to

684
00:34:23,394 --> 00:34:27,114
Speaker 1: do of them, kind of subtly shifting without smiling, and

685
00:34:27,154 --> 00:34:30,194
Speaker 1: then some with smiles and then some with them on

686
00:34:30,234 --> 00:34:32,074
Speaker 1: the opposite sides. But it's all done from like this

687
00:34:32,194 --> 00:34:34,794
Speaker 1: under boob height, because they want the whole fit in

688
00:34:34,834 --> 00:34:38,274
Speaker 1: the photo. There's no more above shots anymore. That is gone,

689
00:34:38,354 --> 00:34:41,234
Speaker 1: that is out. There's a whole new law coming up

690
00:34:41,274 --> 00:34:44,433
Speaker 1: through the ranks of how to take a photo, when

691
00:34:44,514 --> 00:34:46,514
Speaker 1: is appropriate to take a photo, and what faces you

692
00:34:46,554 --> 00:34:49,074
Speaker 1: pull in that photo. Like these are lessons that I

693
00:34:49,074 --> 00:34:50,274
Speaker 1: am still learning, Claire.

694
00:34:50,434 --> 00:34:53,194
Speaker 3: There might be law, there might be new lessons, but

695
00:34:53,314 --> 00:34:56,674
Speaker 3: all I have to say to my gen z's is yes.

696
00:34:56,914 --> 00:35:00,714
Speaker 3: This weekend I took a millennial smile photo from above

697
00:35:01,114 --> 00:35:06,874
Speaker 3: as a selfie while singing Wonder War, and I regret nothing.

698
00:35:08,194 --> 00:35:08,994
Speaker 1: After the break.

699
00:35:09,234 --> 00:35:12,074
Speaker 3: Do you have any friends who you don't agree with politically,

700
00:35:12,234 --> 00:35:15,033
Speaker 3: maybe even you don't agree with your partner politically. Well,

701
00:35:15,114 --> 00:35:19,154
Speaker 3: Jennifer Lawrence and Sydney Sweeney have some differing theories on

702
00:35:19,194 --> 00:35:19,954
Speaker 3: how you should.

703
00:35:19,754 --> 00:35:20,154
Speaker 1: Deal with that.

704
00:35:21,154 --> 00:35:24,474
Speaker 2: Every Tuesday and Thursday, we drop new segments of Mummyer

705
00:35:24,514 --> 00:35:28,074
Speaker 2: out Loud just for MUMMYA subscribers. Follow the link in

706
00:35:28,114 --> 00:35:30,114
Speaker 2: the show notes to get your daily dose of out

707
00:35:30,114 --> 00:35:32,354
Speaker 2: Loud and a big thank you to all.

708
00:35:32,274 --> 00:35:33,473
Speaker 1: Our current subscribers.

709
00:35:39,194 --> 00:35:42,714
Speaker 3: So I've started getting the newspaper delivered because I'm regressing

710
00:35:42,754 --> 00:35:46,354
Speaker 3: into my old man era, and my.

711
00:35:46,354 --> 00:35:48,634
Speaker 1: Best friend still buys the newspaper, but she buys it

712
00:35:48,634 --> 00:35:51,594
Speaker 1: almost specifically for the TV guide. She's such a nana.

713
00:35:51,634 --> 00:35:52,314
Speaker 1: I don't love it.

714
00:35:52,794 --> 00:35:54,714
Speaker 3: I was reading it on the weekend and I was

715
00:35:54,794 --> 00:35:58,474
Speaker 3: millennial smiling as I turned the pages, modeling healthy reading

716
00:35:58,474 --> 00:35:59,514
Speaker 3: habits for my children.

717
00:35:59,714 --> 00:36:01,874
Speaker 1: Do you sniff your newspaper? No?

718
00:36:01,994 --> 00:36:02,154
Speaker 3: Oh?

719
00:36:02,194 --> 00:36:05,554
Speaker 1: I love, Oh God, the smell of a newspaper. I

720
00:36:05,594 --> 00:36:07,114
Speaker 1: do miss it. Well, I must do that.

721
00:36:07,674 --> 00:36:12,034
Speaker 3: I stopped and I read this survey result that really

722
00:36:12,794 --> 00:36:16,594
Speaker 3: surprised me, shocked me, appalled me. It was a survey

723
00:36:16,634 --> 00:36:20,914
Speaker 3: conducted by McKinnon, an Australian firm, and basically the headline

724
00:36:20,994 --> 00:36:24,394
Speaker 3: is it says that young people are much more likely

725
00:36:24,594 --> 00:36:28,194
Speaker 3: to cut ties in a friendship if someone disagrees with

726
00:36:28,234 --> 00:36:31,593
Speaker 3: them politically. Basically, different political views have become a deal

727
00:36:31,594 --> 00:36:34,274
Speaker 3: breaker for young people. And the stats are quite striking.

728
00:36:34,354 --> 00:36:35,274
Speaker 2: And this was Australian.

729
00:36:35,394 --> 00:36:36,234
Speaker 1: This is Australia.

730
00:36:36,554 --> 00:36:40,314
Speaker 3: One in five eighteen to twenty four year old Australians

731
00:36:40,554 --> 00:36:44,194
Speaker 3: say that different political views are a deal breaker. But

732
00:36:44,314 --> 00:36:46,554
Speaker 3: you compare that to people who over sixty five, and

733
00:36:46,594 --> 00:36:48,274
Speaker 3: that's only one in twenty.

734
00:36:48,074 --> 00:36:50,274
Speaker 1: Say that different political views are a deal breaker.

735
00:36:50,714 --> 00:36:53,873
Speaker 3: And it's interesting because we've been seeing a lot of

736
00:36:53,914 --> 00:36:58,594
Speaker 3: celebrities recently, mostly in the US, being sort of called

737
00:36:58,634 --> 00:37:00,594
Speaker 3: to question about their political.

738
00:37:00,274 --> 00:37:02,154
Speaker 1: Views, and they know.

739
00:37:02,474 --> 00:37:05,274
Speaker 3: I think they know instinctively that this has become the

740
00:37:05,314 --> 00:37:08,434
Speaker 3: third rail, particularly for young people. Like celebrities used to

741
00:37:08,474 --> 00:37:10,953
Speaker 3: be comfortable showing political views with us, but now they

742
00:37:11,034 --> 00:37:14,074
Speaker 3: sense that the vibe has shifted. So, for instance, here's

743
00:37:14,154 --> 00:37:17,754
Speaker 3: Jennifer Lawrence talking about this exact issue recently to The

744
00:37:17,794 --> 00:37:18,514
Speaker 3: New York Times.

745
00:37:18,594 --> 00:37:23,594
Speaker 5: I think I'm in a complicated recalibration because I'm also

746
00:37:23,634 --> 00:37:28,513
Speaker 5: an artist, and I with this temperature and the way

747
00:37:28,514 --> 00:37:32,594
Speaker 5: that things can turn out, I don't want to start

748
00:37:32,634 --> 00:37:36,834
Speaker 5: turning people off to films and too art that could

749
00:37:36,994 --> 00:37:40,994
Speaker 5: change consciousness or change the world because they don't like

750
00:37:41,834 --> 00:37:43,074
Speaker 5: my political opinions.

751
00:37:43,474 --> 00:37:45,834
Speaker 3: Now, look, Jennifer Lawrence, yes, she says she's an artist,

752
00:37:45,874 --> 00:37:47,554
Speaker 3: she's a very good actor. But I think this is

753
00:37:47,594 --> 00:37:51,154
Speaker 3: relevant to everyone right because right now everyone's living in

754
00:37:51,154 --> 00:37:53,834
Speaker 3: this heightened political environment. The temperature is high for all

755
00:37:53,874 --> 00:37:56,393
Speaker 3: of us. We may not be artists, but we are

756
00:37:56,434 --> 00:37:58,754
Speaker 3: still having to figure out how to interact with other

757
00:37:58,794 --> 00:38:02,194
Speaker 3: people who might not agree with us. So Jennifer Lawrence,

758
00:38:02,354 --> 00:38:05,074
Speaker 3: very vocal during Trump one, basically has stepped back and

759
00:38:05,074 --> 00:38:06,953
Speaker 3: said I'm not going to talk about politics now during

760
00:38:07,154 --> 00:38:10,994
Speaker 3: second Shomp administration. So I am curious whether you feel

761
00:38:10,994 --> 00:38:13,914
Speaker 3: this vibe shift too, Jesse. Do you feel like politics

762
00:38:13,914 --> 00:38:15,674
Speaker 3: has become a real no go?

763
00:38:16,354 --> 00:38:18,513
Speaker 2: Yes, And I feel as though there's a shift. I'm

764
00:38:18,554 --> 00:38:23,074
Speaker 2: certainly seeing it among celebrities that they're sort of going.

765
00:38:23,314 --> 00:38:25,114
Speaker 2: I know, it doesn't make a difference, and that's what

766
00:38:25,194 --> 00:38:27,594
Speaker 2: Jennifer Lawrence said, doesn't make a difference when I come

767
00:38:27,594 --> 00:38:29,274
Speaker 2: out and tell you how to It's not like it's

768
00:38:29,274 --> 00:38:32,393
Speaker 2: shifting the needle and suddenly everyone votes for Harris. That's

769
00:38:32,674 --> 00:38:36,274
Speaker 2: simply not what happened. And the second thing is my

770
00:38:36,554 --> 00:38:40,274
Speaker 2: work tells my story, so for a lot of creatives,

771
00:38:40,314 --> 00:38:42,234
Speaker 2: and I think that we put this pressure on a

772
00:38:42,234 --> 00:38:45,714
Speaker 2: lot of different types of artists, whether it's writers or

773
00:38:45,794 --> 00:38:49,873
Speaker 2: journalists or actors or musicians. It's like I have a

774
00:38:49,914 --> 00:38:52,354
Speaker 2: certain set of politics. It might not reveal how I vote,

775
00:38:52,794 --> 00:38:55,594
Speaker 2: but what my values are and what I believe that

776
00:38:55,674 --> 00:38:58,834
Speaker 2: I convey through my work. And I don't owe you

777
00:38:59,674 --> 00:39:02,873
Speaker 2: my ballot card. I don't need to tell you that.

778
00:39:03,114 --> 00:39:06,674
Speaker 2: And in fact, Sidney Sweeney did an interview recently as well,

779
00:39:06,714 --> 00:39:09,914
Speaker 2: which has been widely criticized, but I thought some of

780
00:39:09,954 --> 00:39:13,034
Speaker 2: her answers were actually masterful. And she was asked about this,

781
00:39:13,154 --> 00:39:13,913
Speaker 2: and here's what she said.

782
00:39:14,234 --> 00:39:18,234
Speaker 4: The criticism of the content, which was basically that maybe

783
00:39:18,274 --> 00:39:21,634
Speaker 4: specifically in this political climate, like wait, people shouldn't joke

784
00:39:21,714 --> 00:39:25,354
Speaker 4: about genetic superiority like that was kind of like the

785
00:39:25,394 --> 00:39:28,554
Speaker 4: criticism broadly speaking. And since you were talking about this,

786
00:39:28,594 --> 00:39:30,473
Speaker 4: I just wanted to give you an opportunity to talk

787
00:39:30,514 --> 00:39:31,554
Speaker 4: about that specifically.

788
00:39:32,074 --> 00:39:35,393
Speaker 1: I think that when I have an issue, though, I

789
00:39:35,474 --> 00:39:36,794
Speaker 1: want to speak about people.

790
00:39:36,954 --> 00:39:39,634
Speaker 3: Here the subtext of that they're referring, of course, to

791
00:39:39,714 --> 00:39:40,554
Speaker 3: that American eagle.

792
00:39:40,754 --> 00:39:41,393
Speaker 1: Yeah, she did.

793
00:39:41,594 --> 00:39:45,194
Speaker 3: That. Whole interview with GQ was basically trying to go

794
00:39:45,514 --> 00:39:49,514
Speaker 3: Sydney Sweeney into distancing herself from rumors that she supports

795
00:39:49,554 --> 00:39:53,234
Speaker 3: Donald Trump. The whole interview, it wasn't about her acting.

796
00:39:53,474 --> 00:39:56,034
Speaker 3: It wasn't about even her personal life really, even though

797
00:39:56,074 --> 00:39:58,434
Speaker 3: she is dating Scooter Braun, which is weird. It was

798
00:39:58,634 --> 00:40:01,634
Speaker 3: all about trying to get at whether or not she

799
00:40:01,994 --> 00:40:04,354
Speaker 3: is a Trump supporter, and she was not playing that game.

800
00:40:04,514 --> 00:40:05,074
Speaker 3: And this is the thing.

801
00:40:05,154 --> 00:40:08,393
Speaker 2: She's twenty eight years old, she grew up in a

802
00:40:08,674 --> 00:40:10,954
Speaker 2: red state or whatever, and we all know from Australia

803
00:40:11,034 --> 00:40:13,034
Speaker 2: to the US, pretty much anywhere in the world. You

804
00:40:13,114 --> 00:40:15,234
Speaker 2: know what, the biggest thing that dictates how you voted,

805
00:40:15,434 --> 00:40:18,074
Speaker 2: your post code. That's why I think that even the

806
00:40:18,234 --> 00:40:23,234
Speaker 2: story of how our tolerance for people who vote differently

807
00:40:23,314 --> 00:40:25,634
Speaker 2: to us changes over a lifetime, I think that's a

808
00:40:25,714 --> 00:40:28,234
Speaker 2: story of wisdom. I think that people over sixty five

809
00:40:29,154 --> 00:40:32,274
Speaker 2: know something about having met a lot of different people

810
00:40:32,314 --> 00:40:34,154
Speaker 2: from a lot of different walks of life, and they're

811
00:40:34,234 --> 00:40:37,674
Speaker 2: just more comfortable going. I'd like to align on values

812
00:40:37,714 --> 00:40:39,154
Speaker 2: with you, but that doesn't mean that we have to

813
00:40:39,234 --> 00:40:40,954
Speaker 2: vote the same. Do you agree, Claire?

814
00:40:41,234 --> 00:40:43,114
Speaker 1: Look, I just want to point out that we have

815
00:40:43,234 --> 00:40:47,674
Speaker 1: played grabs from two young white women whose experience in

816
00:40:47,714 --> 00:40:50,953
Speaker 1: the political sphere is very different to say, if they

817
00:40:51,034 --> 00:40:55,234
Speaker 1: were from a minority, and the politics that is current

818
00:40:55,954 --> 00:40:58,834
Speaker 1: affects those people quite deeply, and I feel like it's

819
00:40:58,834 --> 00:41:01,234
Speaker 1: a very privileged place to come from to say I

820
00:41:01,314 --> 00:41:04,754
Speaker 1: will no longer discuss it because in reality, they do

821
00:41:04,914 --> 00:41:06,994
Speaker 1: have a platform. Whether it makes a big difference for

822
00:41:07,154 --> 00:41:08,714
Speaker 1: who people vote for or not, they still have a

823
00:41:08,754 --> 00:41:11,953
Speaker 1: platform on which they can disagree with politics. It hurts people,

824
00:41:12,714 --> 00:41:16,194
Speaker 1: and I think that should be noted. But I come

825
00:41:16,274 --> 00:41:19,034
Speaker 1: from a time as a kid where you never spoke

826
00:41:19,034 --> 00:41:21,834
Speaker 1: about your politics. I very distinctly remember going to my

827
00:41:21,874 --> 00:41:23,913
Speaker 1: local primary school with my mum on election day one

828
00:41:24,034 --> 00:41:26,034
Speaker 1: year and I said to her, like, who did you

829
00:41:26,114 --> 00:41:27,634
Speaker 1: vote for? When she came out, and she said, we

830
00:41:27,674 --> 00:41:30,194
Speaker 1: don't share that information. We don't talk about that. And

831
00:41:30,274 --> 00:41:32,354
Speaker 1: it was very much like politics and religion were no

832
00:41:32,474 --> 00:41:34,714
Speaker 1: go zones when it came to discussing anything with your

833
00:41:34,914 --> 00:41:38,154
Speaker 1: friendship circle, especially around the dinner table. You just didn't

834
00:41:38,314 --> 00:41:41,554
Speaker 1: because it was divisive and because it could end in tears,

835
00:41:41,634 --> 00:41:45,714
Speaker 1: and so you saved your relationships by not discussing those things.

836
00:41:46,114 --> 00:41:48,594
Speaker 1: But I think now we more understand just how much

837
00:41:48,674 --> 00:41:50,914
Speaker 1: politics hurts people. And I think if we are in

838
00:41:50,994 --> 00:41:53,754
Speaker 1: a position to say something, to say something out loud,

839
00:41:53,914 --> 00:41:57,114
Speaker 1: that maybe might make a difference to somebody somewhere. I

840
00:41:57,194 --> 00:42:00,914
Speaker 1: think that's really important to do. But in whether you

841
00:42:00,954 --> 00:42:03,314
Speaker 1: should end a relationship because you think differently from someone,

842
00:42:03,354 --> 00:42:05,594
Speaker 1: I think that is where we're really falling down, because

843
00:42:06,194 --> 00:42:09,914
Speaker 1: we have an opportunityy to burst through people's echo chambers,

844
00:42:10,394 --> 00:42:14,114
Speaker 1: and instead we're fortifying echo chambers for people. So if

845
00:42:14,194 --> 00:42:16,514
Speaker 1: you say to somebody because they believe differently to you

846
00:42:17,154 --> 00:42:19,074
Speaker 1: that you no longer want to spend any time with them.

847
00:42:19,474 --> 00:42:22,554
Speaker 1: They will organically move into spheres of people who are

848
00:42:22,594 --> 00:42:25,274
Speaker 1: more like minded. And all that does is create these

849
00:42:25,354 --> 00:42:28,674
Speaker 1: little loops of people, never busting out of that bubble

850
00:42:28,754 --> 00:42:31,114
Speaker 1: to explore anything outside of the world that they live in.

851
00:42:31,354 --> 00:42:34,954
Speaker 1: So we are doing ourselves a disservice by not allowing discourse.

852
00:42:35,194 --> 00:42:36,834
Speaker 1: We just shut it down and we say we are

853
00:42:36,914 --> 00:42:39,594
Speaker 1: no longer friends, instead of trying to talk things through

854
00:42:39,674 --> 00:42:42,914
Speaker 1: and understand. And that's what we see happening in politics everywhere.

855
00:42:43,394 --> 00:42:46,074
Speaker 1: They have echo chambers in their own party systems, and

856
00:42:46,154 --> 00:42:49,794
Speaker 1: so they don't even consider what's happening outside of that bubble.

857
00:42:49,874 --> 00:42:51,914
Speaker 1: They just automatically shut it down and move forward with

858
00:42:51,994 --> 00:42:54,473
Speaker 1: whatever it is is they're on their agenda for that day.

859
00:42:54,554 --> 00:42:57,594
Speaker 1: So we are creating just more fortified echo chambers from.

860
00:42:57,434 --> 00:43:00,553
Speaker 2: That, including ourselves, right, because we're not allowing our own

861
00:43:00,634 --> 00:43:03,234
Speaker 2: echo chamber to be challenged. But I want to ask

862
00:43:03,314 --> 00:43:06,074
Speaker 2: you on the Sydney thing. So she said, I've always

863
00:43:06,314 --> 00:43:09,553
Speaker 2: believed that I'm not here to tell people what to think.

864
00:43:09,634 --> 00:43:11,954
Speaker 2: I'm just here to open their eyes to different ideas.

865
00:43:11,994 --> 00:43:16,154
Speaker 2: And Jennifer Lawrence sort of said a similar thing, which is,

866
00:43:16,474 --> 00:43:19,594
Speaker 2: I think the focus should be on decision makers, right,

867
00:43:19,794 --> 00:43:23,154
Speaker 2: So when a big thing happens politically, we do see

868
00:43:23,194 --> 00:43:26,114
Speaker 2: a lot of people jump to Taylor Swift say something

869
00:43:26,514 --> 00:43:29,034
Speaker 2: like and I think that that's sometimes easier to run

870
00:43:29,074 --> 00:43:32,114
Speaker 2: to a comment section of even your favorite influencer or

871
00:43:32,234 --> 00:43:35,873
Speaker 2: your favorite musician, rather than lobbying a politician.

872
00:43:36,074 --> 00:43:38,834
Speaker 1: It's because we don't have that direct influence on the

873
00:43:38,914 --> 00:43:42,714
Speaker 1: decision makers. Even though they are elected by us, they

874
00:43:42,994 --> 00:43:46,554
Speaker 1: very rarely listen to us. So when you can reach

875
00:43:46,594 --> 00:43:49,154
Speaker 1: out to a celebrity and be seen in the comment

876
00:43:49,194 --> 00:43:52,674
Speaker 1: section and have maybe a news service pick up your

877
00:43:52,714 --> 00:43:55,314
Speaker 1: comments and have that bit like that feels like you

878
00:43:55,554 --> 00:43:59,154
Speaker 1: actually have some agency in all of this, whereas talking

879
00:43:59,234 --> 00:44:01,554
Speaker 1: to your decision makers, sending an email to some nameless,

880
00:44:01,594 --> 00:44:03,554
Speaker 1: faceless person in a front office that may or may

881
00:44:03,634 --> 00:44:06,554
Speaker 1: never respond to you like it feels very powerless.

882
00:44:06,874 --> 00:44:10,234
Speaker 3: I just feel like you both are talking about celebrities

883
00:44:10,354 --> 00:44:12,754
Speaker 3: like they're different from us in this day age, and

884
00:44:12,914 --> 00:44:15,314
Speaker 3: on this score, I don't think they are. What I

885
00:44:15,434 --> 00:44:18,594
Speaker 3: mean is Jennifer Lawrence and Sydney Sweeney. Yes, they both

886
00:44:18,674 --> 00:44:22,314
Speaker 3: have movies to sell, but all of us have to

887
00:44:22,394 --> 00:44:24,474
Speaker 3: work with other people, have to figure out how we

888
00:44:24,554 --> 00:44:26,754
Speaker 3: get what we want from other people, have to nurture

889
00:44:26,794 --> 00:44:29,314
Speaker 3: relationships with other people, whether they be our fans, or

890
00:44:29,394 --> 00:44:32,994
Speaker 3: our family or our colleagues. And what I found interesting

891
00:44:33,034 --> 00:44:35,594
Speaker 3: about both these women who are sort of we think

892
00:44:35,794 --> 00:44:38,593
Speaker 3: coming from different sides of a political spectrum. We don't

893
00:44:38,674 --> 00:44:40,754
Speaker 3: know that in Sydney Sweeney's case, but we think that

894
00:44:41,314 --> 00:44:43,393
Speaker 3: they've both come to the same conclusion, which is, to

895
00:44:43,474 --> 00:44:46,033
Speaker 3: get what you want from other people in twenty twenty five,

896
00:44:46,314 --> 00:44:50,593
Speaker 3: you cannot talk about politics. And that's what I found

897
00:44:50,674 --> 00:44:53,274
Speaker 3: so relatable about it. Yes, they both talked about their

898
00:44:53,434 --> 00:44:55,634
Speaker 3: art and about their craft, but really that's what it

899
00:44:55,714 --> 00:44:58,473
Speaker 3: comes down to. I think, if you want to get

900
00:44:58,514 --> 00:45:01,714
Speaker 3: what you want from other people without having them shut down,

901
00:45:01,794 --> 00:45:04,514
Speaker 3: without having them cut you off. We've seen the survey results.

902
00:45:04,554 --> 00:45:06,634
Speaker 3: People will cut you off if they think that you

903
00:45:06,714 --> 00:45:09,594
Speaker 3: have different politics to them. Is that a good situation

904
00:45:09,794 --> 00:45:11,594
Speaker 3: to be in? Maybe it's just a return to what

905
00:45:11,714 --> 00:45:13,554
Speaker 3: you were saying, Claire. In the olden days, there was

906
00:45:13,634 --> 00:45:16,354
Speaker 3: the conventional wisdom you didn't talk about politics, and then

907
00:45:16,394 --> 00:45:18,873
Speaker 3: we had this moment for a few decades where that

908
00:45:19,074 --> 00:45:21,394
Speaker 3: was seen as perfectly fine fault of the conversation.

909
00:45:21,634 --> 00:45:23,754
Speaker 2: I think that that's a good point, Amelia, that it's like,

910
00:45:24,554 --> 00:45:28,314
Speaker 2: have we returned to a family Christmas? We will not

911
00:45:28,394 --> 00:45:31,354
Speaker 2: talk about it around the dinner table, we wint I'm

912
00:45:31,434 --> 00:45:31,913
Speaker 2: sensing that.

913
00:45:31,954 --> 00:45:32,354
Speaker 1: A little bit.

914
00:45:32,474 --> 00:45:35,314
Speaker 3: I mean, Australia invented the secret ballot. We have always

915
00:45:35,354 --> 00:45:38,553
Speaker 3: been at people who is reluctant to share our political views,

916
00:45:38,634 --> 00:45:42,074
Speaker 3: certainly compared to our friendzy Americans who when you register

917
00:45:42,154 --> 00:45:44,434
Speaker 3: to vote, that you register to vote with a particular

918
00:45:44,554 --> 00:45:46,914
Speaker 3: party and you can look up anyone's party affiliation.

919
00:45:47,114 --> 00:45:48,513
Speaker 1: That is not the Australian way.

920
00:45:48,994 --> 00:45:52,274
Speaker 3: But I'm wondering if the last couple of decades of

921
00:45:52,554 --> 00:45:55,274
Speaker 3: everyone talking about politics all the time was just an

922
00:45:55,274 --> 00:45:58,393
Speaker 3: anomaly and was maybe just bad manners. Maybe we do

923
00:45:58,674 --> 00:46:00,754
Speaker 3: just need to regress to what our grandmothers told us,

924
00:46:00,754 --> 00:46:02,594
Speaker 3: which is do not talk about politics.

925
00:46:02,954 --> 00:46:04,473
Speaker 1: I would like to go back to a time where

926
00:46:04,554 --> 00:46:09,674
Speaker 1: politics wasn't such an atainment like it felt like back

927
00:46:09,714 --> 00:46:12,513
Speaker 1: in the day, politicians were beige and they did beij

928
00:46:12,634 --> 00:46:16,754
Speaker 1: things like make policy decisions and try to balance budgets

929
00:46:16,834 --> 00:46:18,913
Speaker 1: like it was beije as hell, and we didn't care

930
00:46:19,074 --> 00:46:22,354
Speaker 1: enough and a lot of Australians would prefer to be

931
00:46:22,514 --> 00:46:25,114
Speaker 1: fined then go to the polling station, not because you

932
00:46:25,194 --> 00:46:27,154
Speaker 1: know it's an imposition for them, but that it's literally

933
00:46:27,234 --> 00:46:29,473
Speaker 1: just don't care. And I feel like we should care

934
00:46:29,554 --> 00:46:31,594
Speaker 1: less about politics because they should be getting on with

935
00:46:31,634 --> 00:46:33,674
Speaker 1: the business of just running a freaking country and doing

936
00:46:33,794 --> 00:46:36,314
Speaker 1: right by the citizens of said country. But instead we

937
00:46:36,434 --> 00:46:39,953
Speaker 1: have this big entertainment system now where it's like they're

938
00:46:39,994 --> 00:46:43,794
Speaker 1: outdoing each other with stunts and terrible things, and like

939
00:46:43,994 --> 00:46:47,194
Speaker 1: it's become a different beast now and that's why we

940
00:46:47,314 --> 00:46:49,554
Speaker 1: talk about it so much, because it's lost its beige

941
00:46:49,594 --> 00:46:52,754
Speaker 1: intentions and now it's less about running a country than

942
00:46:52,834 --> 00:46:53,914
Speaker 1: making a statement.

943
00:46:54,754 --> 00:46:57,194
Speaker 2: Claire, I swear this question is relevant. Do you have

944
00:46:57,234 --> 00:46:57,994
Speaker 2: your handbag on you?

945
00:46:58,514 --> 00:47:01,034
Speaker 1: Yes, hang on, it's on the floor. Okay, don't judge me.

946
00:47:01,074 --> 00:47:01,634
Speaker 1: It's a bum bag.

947
00:47:01,674 --> 00:47:02,354
Speaker 2: Oh it's a bum bag.

948
00:47:02,834 --> 00:47:04,873
Speaker 1: A bum bag, but it's a Mimco bum bag. Does

949
00:47:04,954 --> 00:47:07,034
Speaker 1: that make me you were cross body or you were

950
00:47:07,194 --> 00:47:10,194
Speaker 1: as a Yes? Yeah, me too. Sometimes I carried around

951
00:47:10,194 --> 00:47:11,074
Speaker 1: with its little handle.

952
00:47:11,234 --> 00:47:13,393
Speaker 3: I'm not ready to like calf de night it and

953
00:47:13,434 --> 00:47:15,114
Speaker 3: wear it around my I.

954
00:47:15,394 --> 00:47:17,794
Speaker 1: Know I've seen some people do it out in the wild.

955
00:47:17,954 --> 00:47:19,913
Speaker 1: And they look amazing, but it's not me. Claire.

956
00:47:19,954 --> 00:47:21,714
Speaker 2: Can you tell me three things that are in that bag?

957
00:47:21,954 --> 00:47:23,754
Speaker 1: Can tell you that there is a key chain of

958
00:47:23,794 --> 00:47:26,514
Speaker 1: Sylvester hanging off the front of it, which I got it.

959
00:47:26,674 --> 00:47:27,994
Speaker 2: Yep, you've dazzled it.

960
00:47:28,914 --> 00:47:31,993
Speaker 1: I have my foh balm, which I can't say out

961
00:47:31,994 --> 00:47:33,834
Speaker 1: loud because it's a swear word, but it's f off

962
00:47:33,874 --> 00:47:36,354
Speaker 1: herpes because I have a cold sail. Oh, it's not

963
00:47:36,514 --> 00:47:38,953
Speaker 1: very exciting. I have some toothpicks that I stole from

964
00:47:38,994 --> 00:47:39,514
Speaker 1: the restaurant.

965
00:47:39,834 --> 00:47:42,074
Speaker 2: Excuse me, Claire. Can I see in your other hand

966
00:47:42,114 --> 00:47:43,314
Speaker 2: that you're holding a wallet?

967
00:47:44,914 --> 00:47:45,154
Speaker 3: Yes?

968
00:47:45,434 --> 00:47:46,394
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness.

969
00:47:46,474 --> 00:47:49,994
Speaker 2: Okay, this is very interesting because we did an episode,

970
00:47:50,034 --> 00:47:54,033
Speaker 2: a subscriber episode with myself, m Vernon and Holly where

971
00:47:54,034 --> 00:47:55,393
Speaker 2: we went through our bags. We did a What's in

972
00:47:55,434 --> 00:47:55,714
Speaker 2: your back?

973
00:47:55,834 --> 00:47:56,354
Speaker 1: Just surprise?

974
00:47:56,434 --> 00:47:59,314
Speaker 2: They were horrific things we found in there that were

975
00:47:59,434 --> 00:48:01,714
Speaker 2: very embarrassing. But between the three of us, I don't

976
00:48:01,714 --> 00:48:02,714
Speaker 2: think we had a single wallet.

977
00:48:02,834 --> 00:48:05,474
Speaker 1: I not only have one, No, I have.

978
00:48:09,554 --> 00:48:10,914
Speaker 3: Yes. Do you have coins?

979
00:48:11,754 --> 00:48:14,993
Speaker 1: What do you do with them? I sometimes use them

980
00:48:15,154 --> 00:48:18,194
Speaker 1: to pay for goods and services, which their intended purpose?

981
00:48:19,794 --> 00:48:20,834
Speaker 2: This is wild?

982
00:48:21,834 --> 00:48:23,393
Speaker 1: Am I nannying out? Right now?

983
00:48:23,554 --> 00:48:23,954
Speaker 3: Is this? Like?

984
00:48:24,194 --> 00:48:26,354
Speaker 1: Am I in my old Lady era? Is this what happening?

985
00:48:26,434 --> 00:48:28,794
Speaker 1: I don't understand. There's also keysy do you want a

986
00:48:29,034 --> 00:48:30,834
Speaker 1: phone that has pay on it? No?

987
00:48:30,954 --> 00:48:33,873
Speaker 2: But I would love that, But no you don't Apple pay,

988
00:48:34,234 --> 00:48:36,634
Speaker 2: Like do you know? Okay, this is this is a

989
00:48:36,714 --> 00:48:38,554
Speaker 2: whole It is a whole intervention.

990
00:48:39,034 --> 00:48:40,794
Speaker 1: A bank gave me cards to.

991
00:48:40,874 --> 00:48:43,314
Speaker 2: Do that with, Like why do I need to Okay,

992
00:48:43,354 --> 00:48:45,794
Speaker 2: all right, I need an intervention? This is incredible?

993
00:48:45,874 --> 00:48:46,234
Speaker 1: All right?

994
00:48:46,434 --> 00:48:50,554
Speaker 2: On last Thursday Subscribe episode you can listen Claire to

995
00:48:50,674 --> 00:48:53,514
Speaker 2: how the world has moved on from wallets and you

996
00:48:53,634 --> 00:48:56,994
Speaker 2: can also find out the disgusting things we found in

997
00:48:57,074 --> 00:48:59,554
Speaker 2: our bags and they just they reveal some awful, awful

998
00:48:59,634 --> 00:49:02,873
Speaker 2: things about us. There is a link to that episode

999
00:49:03,154 --> 00:49:06,714
Speaker 2: in the show notes. Thank you out louders for joining us,

1000
00:49:06,754 --> 00:49:10,234
Speaker 2: and thank you Claire for filling in today. Move over,

1001
00:49:10,354 --> 00:49:12,514
Speaker 2: mister Beast. Do any of you guys even know him?

1002
00:49:12,754 --> 00:49:14,074
Speaker 2: We don't watch mister Bates.

1003
00:49:14,594 --> 00:49:16,593
Speaker 1: I have a small child. Of course, you have taught

1004
00:49:16,594 --> 00:49:17,474
Speaker 1: me who mister Beast is.

1005
00:49:17,554 --> 00:49:19,914
Speaker 2: Well have they taught you who we are? Claire? Because

1006
00:49:19,954 --> 00:49:21,354
Speaker 2: we are on YouTube in a big way?

1007
00:49:21,914 --> 00:49:22,674
Speaker 1: Are we YouTuber?

1008
00:49:22,754 --> 00:49:26,114
Speaker 2: We're YouTubers, so you can go and watch us on YouTube.

1009
00:49:26,474 --> 00:49:28,634
Speaker 2: And I found a comment that I really liked, and

1010
00:49:28,914 --> 00:49:31,274
Speaker 2: it was saying that our friend Amelia Lester over here

1011
00:49:31,394 --> 00:49:34,114
Speaker 2: looks like Maggie gillenhole. Have you ever had that she does?

1012
00:49:34,834 --> 00:49:37,434
Speaker 3: I used to get it constantly, I see him and

1013
00:49:37,554 --> 00:49:40,914
Speaker 3: I actually was one time in a shop in Brooklyn

1014
00:49:41,794 --> 00:49:44,314
Speaker 3: and guess what happened. My dog will Ganger walked in

1015
00:49:45,234 --> 00:49:47,194
Speaker 3: and Maggie and I and we used to look much

1016
00:49:47,274 --> 00:49:48,674
Speaker 3: more similar than we do now.

1017
00:49:48,914 --> 00:49:50,794
Speaker 1: Did you like? Spider Man me and each other like

1018
00:49:51,114 --> 00:49:52,594
Speaker 1: point at each other like you know?

1019
00:49:53,514 --> 00:49:53,914
Speaker 5: Are you me?

1020
00:49:54,034 --> 00:49:56,913
Speaker 3: Am I? You? You know? There's nothing more pathetic than

1021
00:49:57,034 --> 00:49:59,714
Speaker 3: someone who was not a celebrity going up to a

1022
00:49:59,794 --> 00:50:00,754
Speaker 3: famous person.

1023
00:50:00,514 --> 00:50:04,034
Speaker 1: And saying we look the same. So I chose not

1024
00:50:04,314 --> 00:50:07,993
Speaker 1: to draw attention to it. I love that so much.

1025
00:50:08,074 --> 00:50:10,513
Speaker 2: Well, if you want to see how much Amelia looks

1026
00:50:10,634 --> 00:50:14,314
Speaker 2: like our friend Maggie, you can see us over on YouTube.

1027
00:50:14,714 --> 00:50:16,674
Speaker 2: We will be back in your ears tomorrow.

1028
00:50:17,074 --> 00:50:18,473
Speaker 1: Bye bye bye.

1029
00:50:24,634 --> 00:50:24,914
Speaker 3: Mamma.

1030
00:50:24,994 --> 00:50:28,154
Speaker 2: Maya acknowledges the traditional owners of the land on which

1031
00:50:28,234 --> 00:50:29,594
Speaker 2: we have recorded this podcast.