WEBVTT - Leg Hair Harassment & The Age We’d Be Again 0:00:03.000 --> 0:00:05.520 Hello, and welcome to bathera mea out loud. 0:00:05.640 --> 0:00:08.440 It's what women are actually talking about on Friday, the 0:00:08.520 --> 0:00:10.000 thirty first of July. 0:00:10.640 --> 0:00:11.800 My name's Holly Wayine Wright. 0:00:12.160 --> 0:00:13.720 I'm me a Friedman and I'm. 0:00:13.560 --> 0:00:16.200 M Vernham and here's what made our gender. 0:00:16.239 --> 0:00:20.240 For today's show, Dolly Alderton has shared her single women 0:00:20.520 --> 0:00:23.840 manifesto for anyone who is struggling with dating right now, 0:00:23.960 --> 0:00:25.840 which I think is every single person. 0:00:26.320 --> 0:00:29.640 Well, I'm not really you're not a single person. 0:00:29.960 --> 0:00:32.400 Oh yeah, I'm not a single Oh every single person. 0:00:33.040 --> 0:00:34.680 I'm a single He's. 0:00:34.560 --> 0:00:39.839 An English fun The biggest best selling books tend to 0:00:39.880 --> 0:00:42.640 have one thing in common, and it's not great news 0:00:42.640 --> 0:00:43.320 for women. 0:00:43.360 --> 0:00:46.680 Or is it. And it's Friday, so we've got the 0:00:46.680 --> 0:00:50.159 things that we've actually been buying and wearing and slapping 0:00:50.159 --> 0:00:53.000 on our faces. Yay, it's recos. 0:00:53.040 --> 0:00:57.560 But first Emily Vernon, Oh my god, are actually Oh? 0:00:57.800 --> 0:00:59.400 But first me a Friedman? 0:00:59.800 --> 0:01:05.160 No Christ on a bike. This is what happens when 0:01:05.160 --> 0:01:07.560 I don't have a fidget toy. Things just turn to 0:01:07.720 --> 0:01:08.959 ship and. 0:01:09.000 --> 0:01:10.840 You've got a seating chart update for me. 0:01:11.319 --> 0:01:11.720 I'm so. 0:01:15.400 --> 0:01:16.640 Friday. It's Friday. 0:01:16.800 --> 0:01:18.160 I cannot work with amateurs. 0:01:18.280 --> 0:01:20.280 I'm thinking about as much. I'm so sorry. 0:01:20.720 --> 0:01:23.399 We do have a seating update, so if you if 0:01:23.440 --> 0:01:25.880 you don't know, you should have because last week we 0:01:25.920 --> 0:01:28.959 talked about where we sit on the podcast and Holly 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:32.360 said quite aggressively that she'd love to sit in the 0:01:32.400 --> 0:01:35.000 middle seat. There's a power seat, the seed that I'm 0:01:35.040 --> 0:01:37.000 sitting in currently, that me and you were sitting in 0:01:37.080 --> 0:01:37.520 last week. 0:01:37.720 --> 0:01:40.080 I was, but then I remember that I prefer my 0:01:40.200 --> 0:01:43.520 profile to my front on, so it's not the power 0:01:43.520 --> 0:01:44.000 seat for me. 0:01:45.880 --> 0:01:49.040 You wanted to give it to me, So we did 0:01:49.040 --> 0:01:51.200 a poll out louders on our Instagram. Also, if you 0:01:51.200 --> 0:01:53.640 don't follow us on Instagram, please follow us because we 0:01:53.720 --> 0:01:55.760 do a lot of socials on that behind the scenes, 0:01:55.800 --> 0:01:57.560 lot of behind the scenes, and we asked you to 0:01:57.640 --> 0:01:59.800 vote on who you think should get the middle seat. 0:02:00.760 --> 0:02:03.400 Eighty seven percent of people vot and thinks you should 0:02:03.440 --> 0:02:03.720 be here. 0:02:03.720 --> 0:02:04.360 That's not fair. 0:02:04.880 --> 0:02:06.640 I'm here, and yet here I am. 0:02:06.680 --> 0:02:08.840 Well, that's like us bringing a knife to a gunfight 0:02:09.000 --> 0:02:15.400 because Holly is always the favorite. Like whatever time, anyway, 0:02:15.760 --> 0:02:17.639 wait taken, keep voting, keep voting. 0:02:17.680 --> 0:02:18.840 Maybe one day we'll get that. 0:02:19.080 --> 0:02:22.760 Anyway, In case you missed it, I have news about 0:02:22.800 --> 0:02:26.440 leg hair. Tokyo is having a very brutal summer. I 0:02:26.600 --> 0:02:29.399 was there probably about a month or six weeks ago, 0:02:29.919 --> 0:02:32.519 and I crammed my trip in quickly because I knew 0:02:32.600 --> 0:02:34.239 it was going to be super hot at this time 0:02:34.240 --> 0:02:37.360 of year. And so it is forty degrees over forty 0:02:37.360 --> 0:02:40.680 degrees most days, and the governor has told public servants 0:02:40.720 --> 0:02:45.520 that they can ditch the suit and wear shorts to work. Oh, however, 0:02:45.680 --> 0:02:48.280 it's not that nice. Thirty percent of Japanese women say 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:51.080 they I don't like it, and some are even claiming 0:02:51.160 --> 0:02:52.239 leg hair harassment. 0:02:52.760 --> 0:02:55.400 Oh, leg hair harassment. How does that go? 0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:57.720 Well, there is a word for it, which I love. 0:02:57.760 --> 0:03:01.360 It's called sunnihara, and that buying the Japanese words for 0:03:01.440 --> 0:03:05.520 shin and harassment together, which I love. But the twist 0:03:05.639 --> 0:03:09.280 is that this term was actually not coined by women. 0:03:09.960 --> 0:03:14.760 It was pioneered by men's hair removal clinic in Japan 0:03:14.880 --> 0:03:21.040 in twenty fourteen. So it's like the manufactured insecurity playbook 0:03:21.120 --> 0:03:23.280 aimed at men for once welcome boys. We've been here 0:03:23.320 --> 0:03:25.640 since about nineteen twenty exactly. 0:03:25.639 --> 0:03:26.200 God, I love. 0:03:26.280 --> 0:03:29.000 When I was reading about this, I saw an interview 0:03:29.120 --> 0:03:31.560 with someone who does work at a hair removal clinic 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:34.040 in Japan, and they said that they have had an 0:03:34.120 --> 0:03:36.840 uptick in men wanting to remove their leg hair to 0:03:36.880 --> 0:03:38.960 make the women around them feel more comfortable. 0:03:38.960 --> 0:03:42.560 It's true because Japanese people are very polite. I'm here 0:03:42.560 --> 0:03:44.840 to testify. I experienced it myself. 0:03:45.120 --> 0:03:47.920 I'm still stuck on what leg hair harassment looks like. 0:03:48.040 --> 0:03:50.400 Is it that you might be on a train and 0:03:50.440 --> 0:03:53.320 their leg hair may rub up against your leg or 0:03:53.360 --> 0:03:54.400 is it just looking at it? 0:03:54.480 --> 0:03:57.160 Looking at it's visual? I think it's visual. I don't know. 0:03:57.200 --> 0:03:59.200 They wouldn't be touching on a train. I mean, even 0:03:59.200 --> 0:04:02.080 though the train can be quite crowded. It's not so 0:04:02.160 --> 0:04:04.360 much that I think that it's just they don't want 0:04:04.400 --> 0:04:06.720 to see it. It's considered too intimate. They don't want 0:04:06.720 --> 0:04:08.520 to see men's leg hair. 0:04:08.800 --> 0:04:10.600 I like a hairy leg on a man. I I'm 0:04:10.640 --> 0:04:11.400 just going to say it. 0:04:11.440 --> 0:04:11.680 I do. 0:04:12.040 --> 0:04:13.680 What's the feeling about it? I mean, I know you 0:04:13.760 --> 0:04:14.360 like hairy chat. 0:04:14.440 --> 0:04:17.159 I like it's just the general hairiness. The thing that's 0:04:17.200 --> 0:04:21.239 funny is that Brent, my partner, he hates wearing long pants. 0:04:21.240 --> 0:04:24.159 It's like one of those schoolboys who would just like 0:04:24.200 --> 0:04:27.039 to wear shorts all the time. And so there is 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:29.080 like one month in the middle of winter in it 0:04:29.120 --> 0:04:31.680 now where he will have to wear long pants and 0:04:31.720 --> 0:04:34.039 he just it's like he's a dog wearing clothes. You 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:36.320 know how you always say about Jesse when she's wearing Yeah, 0:04:36.320 --> 0:04:38.560 it's just like he's always like pulling out it, like 0:04:38.920 --> 0:04:41.760 he would wear shorts all the time. And sometimes you 0:04:41.839 --> 0:04:44.480 just have to say not appropriate. Baby, if we're going 0:04:44.520 --> 0:04:47.280 to a fancy restaurant, you're going to a wedding, something 0:04:47.320 --> 0:04:50.839 no one needs to see you. So I'm happy to 0:04:50.920 --> 0:04:53.360 hear about this because now I've got a new term 0:04:53.480 --> 0:04:55.120 to say, don't harass people. 0:04:55.360 --> 0:04:56.320 True if you like hair. 0:04:56.360 --> 0:04:58.960 The great news about Brent is that it's actually the 0:04:59.000 --> 0:05:04.040 same pair of pants just zips the bottom to the shorts. 0:05:03.640 --> 0:05:09.440 You know, the pants like cargoy pants that zip and 0:05:09.480 --> 0:05:10.560 become musical. 0:05:10.680 --> 0:05:13.320 He pulls them off like he's a bushwalker. And they 0:05:13.320 --> 0:05:15.640 have those like pants that can be short or can 0:05:15.720 --> 0:05:16.080 be long. 0:05:16.240 --> 0:05:18.240 Can also be made into a tint if you need 0:05:18.279 --> 0:05:19.480 shelter in an emergency. 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:22.039 Same, Oh my god, I want a pay bless him. 0:05:22.240 --> 0:05:23.640 Keep your leg hair to yourself. 0:05:25.880 --> 0:05:29.080 You might have seen some headlines around about the UK 0:05:29.320 --> 0:05:34.640 book charts and specifically the takeaway that dead women sell books. 0:05:35.279 --> 0:05:38.440 Author Wendy Jones made an Instagram post that traveled with 0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:41.919 speed about how on any given week, So the particular 0:05:41.960 --> 0:05:44.520 week that she was talking about. In Britain, they post 0:05:44.520 --> 0:05:47.320 the Sunday Times bestseller list every week. We don't really 0:05:47.360 --> 0:05:50.760 have an exact equivalent of that here, but they post 0:05:50.760 --> 0:05:53.400 a Sunday Times bestseller list every week. And she wrote 0:05:53.440 --> 0:05:57.000 a post and then subsequently a Financial Times feature about 0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:59.640 how in that particular week, but pretty much in every week. 0:06:00.200 --> 0:06:02.560 Seven to nine of the books in the top ten 0:06:02.640 --> 0:06:07.680 fiction all featured a dead woman of some kind. Now, right, 0:06:07.720 --> 0:06:11.440 so everybody goes, WHOA, that's terrible, and obviously it is. 0:06:11.720 --> 0:06:15.440 Titles range from historical fiction to domestic noire, police procedurals, 0:06:15.520 --> 0:06:17.760 so on and so on and so on. Writers from 0:06:17.960 --> 0:06:20.599 Robert Galbraith, who is JK Rowling, She's in the top ten, 0:06:20.800 --> 0:06:23.440 but also Lisa Jewel, Dan Brown, lots of different kinds 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:23.960 of writers. 0:06:24.560 --> 0:06:29.039 Now, sorry, did you say that JK Rowling is Robert Gulbraith. Yes, 0:06:29.360 --> 0:06:30.719 she doesn't write under her name. 0:06:30.960 --> 0:06:33.560 Well, she has a series of books like crime books 0:06:33.600 --> 0:06:36.080 that she writes under Robert Galbraith, and they do very 0:06:36.080 --> 0:06:40.120 well and she's in the top ten. Okay, right, So 0:06:40.400 --> 0:06:43.000 Wendy wrote this post. She said, eighty four percent of 0:06:43.000 --> 0:06:44.960 the books people brought and read in the UK this 0:06:45.040 --> 0:06:48.600 week involved a woman being murdered for entertainment. What is 0:06:48.640 --> 0:06:49.400 going on here? 0:06:50.200 --> 0:06:50.520 Now? 0:06:51.240 --> 0:06:53.839 On the face of it, that's very confronting. We've talked 0:06:53.839 --> 0:06:56.480 a lot about people talk a lot about how throwing 0:06:56.480 --> 0:06:58.800 a body in the beginning of a TV show or 0:06:58.839 --> 0:07:01.640 a movie, and very often the female body is a 0:07:01.720 --> 0:07:05.920 trope that's been with us forever and it's kind of disgusting. 0:07:06.720 --> 0:07:09.800 But the nuance in this list, a lot of writers 0:07:09.840 --> 0:07:12.200 came out and said, hold on. Most of the people 0:07:12.200 --> 0:07:15.520 who've written these books, not necessarily these specific books, but 0:07:15.560 --> 0:07:18.080 the books that populate these lists are written by women. 0:07:18.920 --> 0:07:21.400 Most of the people who buy these books are women. 0:07:21.760 --> 0:07:24.480 More than eighty percent of the fiction buying public a 0:07:24.600 --> 0:07:27.560 female right. So if women are writing these books and 0:07:27.600 --> 0:07:32.120 women are consuming these books, what does that say about 0:07:32.160 --> 0:07:34.320 the idea that a lot of them are about female crime? 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:37.520 Because it kind of up ends the neat narrative that 0:07:37.640 --> 0:07:42.920 like men are using violence against women as a tantalizing 0:07:43.000 --> 0:07:45.720 plot point before I get into whether or not the 0:07:45.720 --> 0:07:48.520 same is true here in Australia, What are our first 0:07:48.560 --> 0:07:49.200 thoughts about that? 0:07:50.520 --> 0:07:54.000 Well, when I was reading about this, I was thinking 0:07:54.040 --> 0:07:57.400 of my favorite books, and two books I came into 0:07:57.520 --> 0:08:01.360 mind was Mela Luca that we did for book club 0:08:01.840 --> 0:08:04.040 and a book that I've given for the book giveaway 0:08:04.080 --> 0:08:07.280 that we're doing right now at Mama Mia Yellow Face 0:08:07.360 --> 0:08:10.720 by R. F. Kuan, and they both center around a 0:08:10.760 --> 0:08:13.880 woman's death. And when I was trying to analyze why 0:08:14.160 --> 0:08:16.400 I found those books so appealing and why they're my 0:08:16.440 --> 0:08:21.000 favorite books, I think it's because it's when I read 0:08:21.040 --> 0:08:23.840 about a woman's death in a book and a novel, 0:08:24.480 --> 0:08:27.520 it's so different to what we experience in real life, 0:08:27.560 --> 0:08:31.000 where the whole story is revolved around that and her life, 0:08:31.200 --> 0:08:34.880 and like the investigation into a death and like the 0:08:35.000 --> 0:08:37.880 ramifications of what happens after she dies. It's like a 0:08:37.920 --> 0:08:41.200 full story with all of these characters just focusing on 0:08:41.280 --> 0:08:44.080 her death and her as a person, and that's never 0:08:44.160 --> 0:08:47.160 reflected in real life, where it's kind of like feels 0:08:47.200 --> 0:08:49.280 a bit of like a takeaway moment. 0:08:49.520 --> 0:08:51.040 What do you mean I don't understand? 0:08:51.160 --> 0:08:53.360 As in, like when a character dies in a book 0:08:53.400 --> 0:08:56.120 and that whole story's revolved around that death. It's something 0:08:56.160 --> 0:08:58.200 that I've never seen happen in real life, where if 0:08:58.200 --> 0:09:00.560 a woman dies in real life, we just know her name, 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:02.800 what happened, and then we move on to the next woman. 0:09:03.000 --> 0:09:05.400 Well, so you feel like it's behind the scenes a 0:09:05.400 --> 0:09:06.760 little I feel like it's behind. 0:09:06.520 --> 0:09:09.120 The scenes a little bit. And it also like shows 0:09:09.160 --> 0:09:12.439 that when you immerse yourself in a story, you feel 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:14.800 like that there are all these people that exist who 0:09:14.840 --> 0:09:17.240 want to find out why she died, how she died, 0:09:17.280 --> 0:09:17.840 what her life. 0:09:17.880 --> 0:09:21.520 But couldn't you do that without immerse yourself in a 0:09:21.559 --> 0:09:23.720 story without someone dying. 0:09:24.240 --> 0:09:25.000 I don't think so. 0:09:25.160 --> 0:09:27.800 I think it's more about like the control, and it's 0:09:27.800 --> 0:09:30.360 something that's so different that's reflected in real life. And 0:09:30.400 --> 0:09:32.920 I think it's similar to why so many women love 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:35.640 true crime in the same vein, because there's all this 0:09:35.800 --> 0:09:38.760 research and attention put on the story that they haven't seen. 0:09:38.840 --> 0:09:41.400 Yes, there's a name for this, and it's called threat rehearsal. 0:09:41.920 --> 0:09:46.280 So it's that women we're sort of programmed in a 0:09:46.280 --> 0:09:51.160 way to retell stories about terrible things happening to other 0:09:51.200 --> 0:09:55.959 women and read them and you know, through word of mouth, 0:09:56.520 --> 0:10:01.160 rehearse and prepare ourselves and protect ourselves against that happening 0:10:01.160 --> 0:10:01.600 to us. 0:10:02.080 --> 0:10:04.600 Yeah, maybe it's that, But I also think it's just 0:10:04.679 --> 0:10:07.800 about the focus, Like it's just the focus on the 0:10:07.840 --> 0:10:10.000 woman's life, and I find that. 0:10:09.840 --> 0:10:13.480 Like always just a character. 0:10:13.760 --> 0:10:16.880 Like it's interesting because some of the writers who've come 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:19.640 out to defend, well, not defend, I don't want this 0:10:19.720 --> 0:10:23.520 to sound in any way like people are defending frivolous 0:10:23.600 --> 0:10:25.840 use of women's lives or violence against women or whatever, 0:10:25.840 --> 0:10:27.760 but defend the fact that this is such an explored 0:10:27.800 --> 0:10:30.200 topic in fiction. Some of them have said something very 0:10:30.200 --> 0:10:32.200 similar to what you're saying, and which is that The 0:10:32.200 --> 0:10:35.400 thing is is that very often in true crime detective 0:10:35.440 --> 0:10:39.960 procedural books, you get an answer, so you get you 0:10:40.000 --> 0:10:43.520 get the crime, and then you get investigation of it, 0:10:43.559 --> 0:10:45.560 and then you get the baddie gets caught. Like that's 0:10:45.600 --> 0:10:48.840 nearly always what happens, right, and that's very satisfying, and 0:10:48.880 --> 0:10:52.480 we like stories that like justice is done, good bang. 0:10:52.760 --> 0:10:54.160 And the thing is too is a lot of these 0:10:54.200 --> 0:10:56.640 books are very different in terms, even the two you 0:10:56.679 --> 0:10:59.680 mentioned then, right, Samala Luka, which was the biggest selling 0:10:59.760 --> 0:11:03.640 day in Australia last year, written by an Indigenous author. 0:11:03.760 --> 0:11:07.040 It focused on the death of an Indigenous woman investigated 0:11:07.040 --> 0:11:10.560 by an Indigenous cop. It was really interesting about a 0:11:10.559 --> 0:11:14.760 particular community yellow Face. That's an accidental death, different thing altogether, right, 0:11:14.800 --> 0:11:18.000 So it's in a way saying all these books have 0:11:18.040 --> 0:11:21.520 something in common. It isn't necessarily true in Australia though, 0:11:21.600 --> 0:11:23.000 right If you look at the best selling books of 0:11:23.040 --> 0:11:26.640 last year, they do bear this out, generally speaking. Jane 0:11:26.640 --> 0:11:29.760 Harper last one out right crime book, Gravity, Let Me 0:11:29.800 --> 0:11:33.880 Go by Trent Dalton crime book, right, Mad Mabel by 0:11:33.880 --> 0:11:36.959 Sally Herpworth Crime Book. But those three books are so different, 0:11:37.160 --> 0:11:39.120 like they're so different in what they are, what they're 0:11:39.160 --> 0:11:41.920 trying to say, how they explore it, the tone. It 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:46.000 feels like a very simplistic way to look at that, 0:11:46.200 --> 0:11:48.440 because if women are writing most of these books and 0:11:48.480 --> 0:11:51.000 buying most of these books for all kinds of different reasons. 0:11:51.320 --> 0:11:55.520 Another reason is just about stakes, right, is that when 0:11:55.600 --> 0:11:58.560 you're writing or reading fiction, you often want the stakes 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:01.440 to be very high. And the true crime obsession that 0:12:01.480 --> 0:12:04.120 has sort of gripped everybody over the past twenty years 0:12:04.280 --> 0:12:07.520 has spun off into lots of different directions, and it 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:12.240 feels like something that we want to investigate for the 0:12:12.240 --> 0:12:14.760 reason that you said threat rehearsal. We want to see 0:12:14.800 --> 0:12:18.040 resolutions too, but also we know that it's real life 0:12:18.040 --> 0:12:18.440 as well. 0:12:18.720 --> 0:12:19.520 It's relatable. 0:12:19.760 --> 0:12:22.480 Yeah, and it's kind of like proof too when it 0:12:22.520 --> 0:12:24.520 does happen in real life. It's kind of proof of 0:12:24.559 --> 0:12:29.240 like when you sear these stories of you going like oh, 0:12:29.360 --> 0:12:31.520 when I hear these stories, it's like, I want to 0:12:31.559 --> 0:12:33.720 know what to do if I'm in that situation. Yeah, 0:12:33.840 --> 0:12:35.760 or it's proved that, like it does happen to women 0:12:35.840 --> 0:12:36.600 in real life as well. 0:12:37.240 --> 0:12:39.320 That's what Sally said. I asked, So, I asked Sally Hepworth. 0:12:39.600 --> 0:12:42.000 She has got obviously one of the best selling books 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:45.240 of last year. I'd Mabel still is in the best 0:12:45.240 --> 0:12:48.520 selling top ten. That book has been so huge. She 0:12:48.600 --> 0:12:51.320 often writes crime, not always women on women, but she 0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:53.800 writes crime, but her books are so much more than that. 0:12:54.240 --> 0:12:56.280 And I said to her, why do you think women 0:12:57.080 --> 0:12:59.719 love to read about this? And she said pretty much 0:12:59.760 --> 0:13:01.719 what he has said. She said, we know it's a 0:13:01.760 --> 0:13:04.360 real life threat in our lives. We know it's something 0:13:04.360 --> 0:13:08.080 that happens and we want to protect ourselves almost by 0:13:08.080 --> 0:13:10.679 exploring it in a way that is safe and accessible. 0:13:10.920 --> 0:13:14.920 It's not just novels, though, And what disturbs me more 0:13:15.320 --> 0:13:19.120 is the genre of TV shows which have been going 0:13:19.120 --> 0:13:22.720 for a really long time. And Laura in Order, for example, 0:13:22.880 --> 0:13:26.360 is pretty much always that it's a what's called procedural 0:13:27.080 --> 0:13:29.640 there's a murder at the beginning, it's almost always a woman. 0:13:29.840 --> 0:13:33.760 True crime podcasts almost always tell gruesome stories about women. 0:13:33.960 --> 0:13:35.080 What disturbs me the. 0:13:34.920 --> 0:13:38.839 Most, and I can't believe this is actually on air, 0:13:39.559 --> 0:13:43.920 is Laura and Order SVU. I can't like Special Victims Unit. 0:13:44.640 --> 0:13:48.880 That's a show entirely about the crimes around sexual assault 0:13:49.040 --> 0:13:53.200 murder of women. And to me, that is just the 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:56.439 most I mean, I guess it's an aspect of threat rehearsal, 0:13:56.480 --> 0:13:59.880 and I don't know what the demographic breakdown is between 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:03.560 male and female viewers of that, but to me, that 0:14:03.760 --> 0:14:09.120 is just like sexual assault porn. It's I find that 0:14:09.200 --> 0:14:10.080 really grotesque. 0:14:10.240 --> 0:14:13.839 I agree, And I also think when we were just 0:14:13.880 --> 0:14:16.960 talking about why women are the biggest consumers of true 0:14:16.960 --> 0:14:20.080 crime content, which they generally are, and the biggest readers 0:14:20.080 --> 0:14:24.400 of these kind of crime books, women are smart Newsplash. 0:14:23.880 --> 0:14:25.320 I don't know if anyone needing that book. 0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:30.640 And we can tell when we're consuming content whether our 0:14:30.760 --> 0:14:35.280 lives and our safety is being taken almost in a 0:14:35.320 --> 0:14:39.000 titillating fashion. If you watch like old movies from the 0:14:39.040 --> 0:14:42.480 seventies and eighties about that have crimes in them, the 0:14:42.560 --> 0:14:44.960 gratuitous nature of the way that women will turn up 0:14:44.960 --> 0:14:49.160 in those shows horor in horrific circumstances, you can almost 0:14:49.200 --> 0:14:54.120 feel that it is designed to be exciting, right, what 0:14:54.160 --> 0:14:57.560 do you mean exploitative? So it'll be you know, let's 0:14:57.640 --> 0:14:59.760 open on a shot of a naked woman in a 0:14:59.800 --> 0:15:01.800 shit and then something terrible happens to her. 0:15:02.000 --> 0:15:04.360 You know, it's still that like those shows are. 0:15:04.880 --> 0:15:07.320 But I feel like what I'm getting to is that 0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:11.440 I think that women can understand deeply the difference between 0:15:11.480 --> 0:15:15.360 that kind of exploitative violence and reading a book that 0:15:15.520 --> 0:15:20.000 thoughtfully explains a story that does feature a death. 0:15:20.120 --> 0:15:21.720 Do you know what I mean? They're not necessarily the 0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:22.240 same thing. 0:15:22.320 --> 0:15:24.240 Do you have pressure to put dead bodies in your 0:15:24.280 --> 0:15:26.800 stories in your novel I have had. 0:15:27.120 --> 0:15:31.560 I have had that because the thing that's interesting is 0:15:31.600 --> 0:15:35.720 that crime as a genre has become so enormous. Remember, 0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:39.600 publishing is a business, right, So most publishers want, obviously 0:15:39.600 --> 0:15:42.440 one to published books that sell, and the most sure 0:15:42.480 --> 0:15:44.440 fire way of doing that, in as far as anything 0:15:44.480 --> 0:15:45.440 is sure fire, is to. 0:15:45.440 --> 0:15:46.480 Look at what's sold before. 0:15:46.520 --> 0:15:50.040 So that's why when there is one, you know, cozy 0:15:50.080 --> 0:15:52.280 crime as they call it, that's what Richard Osmond writes. 0:15:52.280 --> 0:15:57.400 For example, he doesn't write books where women are murdered. 0:15:57.760 --> 0:15:59.000 Well, a lot. 0:15:58.960 --> 0:16:02.000 Different people are murdered, sometimes women, sometimes men, but they're 0:16:02.040 --> 0:16:06.240 not it's they call it cozy crime. And sal might 0:16:06.360 --> 0:16:08.360 be a little bit cozy crime in what she does, 0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:10.720 which is that there might be there'll probably be a 0:16:10.760 --> 0:16:13.160 crime as part of the storyline. Yeah, but they're very 0:16:13.240 --> 0:16:19.640 character whosome. It's not gratuitous, it's not gory. And then 0:16:19.720 --> 0:16:23.120 the plot of the book is much more about the characters, 0:16:23.160 --> 0:16:25.920 the procedures that they'll have something to say. If you 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:28.560 think about Mad Mabel by Sally Hepworth, right, there is 0:16:28.600 --> 0:16:30.920 a woman's death in that book, but that book has 0:16:31.000 --> 0:16:33.320 so many interesting things to say about what can happen 0:16:33.400 --> 0:16:35.920 to a young woman. And the hero is female and 0:16:35.960 --> 0:16:38.360 all the great characters are female, and it's a very 0:16:39.400 --> 0:16:43.040 it's a very feminist book, right, really anyway, crime being 0:16:43.080 --> 0:16:47.239 massive and now splintering off into some kind of procedural cozy, 0:16:47.360 --> 0:16:49.960 all these kinds of genres. Everybody's like, we want more 0:16:49.960 --> 0:16:52.160 of that, more of that. I kind of think maybe 0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:54.080 we're getting to a tipping point with it. 0:16:54.120 --> 0:16:58.360 To me, it's about what is propulsive about a book 0:16:58.520 --> 0:17:02.000 is mystery and unraveling a mystery, so you keep turning 0:17:02.040 --> 0:17:04.879 the pages to find out what happened. Like even with Yesteryear, 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:07.239 I can't remember if anyone was murdered in that or not, 0:17:07.280 --> 0:17:10.639 but I kept turning the pages to find out how 0:17:10.680 --> 0:17:14.400 this time shift thing happened and to unravel the mystery 0:17:14.440 --> 0:17:17.439 of what was seated at the beginning. And there's no 0:17:17.640 --> 0:17:21.760 higher stakes than someone dying, And particularly when you then 0:17:21.840 --> 0:17:23.879 get to know their character through the course of the 0:17:23.920 --> 0:17:26.919 book and you know that someone's died or you know 0:17:26.960 --> 0:17:30.800 that they've died, then it's really propulsive. So isn't it, 0:17:30.880 --> 0:17:35.320 in part way just a fictional device. It's a plot device. 0:17:35.560 --> 0:17:36.520 It absolutely is. 0:17:36.600 --> 0:17:38.359 But then I think that's one of the things that 0:17:38.359 --> 0:17:40.840 people object to, is they like, we're using. 0:17:41.119 --> 0:17:43.840 We care more about the murder of women than we 0:17:43.920 --> 0:17:46.679 do about the murder of men. Is that when I 0:17:46.720 --> 0:17:49.800 say we care more, I mean it feels higher stakes, 0:17:50.160 --> 0:17:53.119 like or is it that women relate more? Because well, 0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:55.240 I think female readers, and. 0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:58.880 If the audience is female readers, I personally would care 0:17:58.960 --> 0:18:01.240 more if it was woman who died versus a man 0:18:01.280 --> 0:18:03.960 who died. But I understand what you were saying about 0:18:04.000 --> 0:18:08.040 comparing it with the TV show. I do feel like 0:18:08.359 --> 0:18:12.240 they're two separate audiences. And with the TV show, like, 0:18:12.240 --> 0:18:14.879 even when I see these books get made into movies 0:18:14.880 --> 0:18:17.400 and TV show, I noticed that they have to lean 0:18:17.480 --> 0:18:20.600 way more into the cozy to not make it so extrested. 0:18:20.680 --> 0:18:24.160 I was thinking about that with The Thursday Murder Club, 0:18:24.440 --> 0:18:26.000 and they had to in the show. They had to 0:18:26.040 --> 0:18:29.080 really lean into the cozy element of it and the 0:18:29.119 --> 0:18:31.840 setup and the set design and stuff for the death 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:33.400 to not seem so like. 0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:36.280 So it's not it's the death almost is not a 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:38.160 main character. Like when you just said that about Mad 0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:42.119 Mabel and sales books, I was like, wait, did people 0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:45.080 just sell it write books where women die? Like I 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:48.679 couldn't even think of a single yeah example of that, 0:18:48.760 --> 0:18:51.959 Because you're right, that's not the point. That's kind of 0:18:52.040 --> 0:18:54.720 like a plot point, but it is not the point, 0:18:54.800 --> 0:18:56.360 it's not the central narrative. 0:18:56.520 --> 0:19:00.600 No, exactly out loud as in a moment, a single 0:19:00.680 --> 0:19:03.520 girl's manifesto that everyone needs to read. 0:19:04.000 --> 0:19:06.600 You keep saying manifesto, but maybe that's okay? 0:19:07.440 --> 0:19:14.639 Is it manifesto? Manifest isn't there an esther? No, so good? Okra, 0:19:15.080 --> 0:19:17.560 Sorry wait wait, I've got the giggles. 0:19:17.560 --> 0:19:28.199 Wait you can have the giggles. It's sorry, Okay, okay, okay, manifesto. Sorry, sorry, 0:19:28.760 --> 0:19:30.040 you thought it was manifesto. 0:19:30.160 --> 0:19:31.360 I thought it was manifesto. 0:19:31.640 --> 0:19:33.639 It is really not like this is in my mind 0:19:33.800 --> 0:19:35.800 it's manifesto. 0:19:36.119 --> 0:19:37.080 There is in it. 0:19:37.119 --> 0:19:40.800 There's just not two manifesto manifesto. 0:19:41.280 --> 0:19:45.000 Moving on now, she's got the giggle. 0:19:45.600 --> 0:19:47.520 It's okay. We'll add it to the list of things 0:19:47.560 --> 0:19:48.479 none of us can pronounce. 0:19:48.520 --> 0:19:49.960 To say this word so many more time. 0:19:50.040 --> 0:19:51.439 Do you have other words that you can't pronounce? 0:19:51.440 --> 0:19:51.520 Oh? 0:19:51.560 --> 0:19:57.200 Yeah, permanent, I say sometimes say is a permanent? But 0:19:57.320 --> 0:19:59.360 it's fine. You're amongst friends. 0:19:59.640 --> 0:20:04.240 Oh, exciting news for me. The premiere of Victoria and 0:20:04.320 --> 0:20:05.040 resigned this week. 0:20:05.080 --> 0:20:06.960 We can't go back there, come back there. 0:20:08.359 --> 0:20:09.760 No, I don't want to be thirty again, but I 0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:11.960 would take forty four. I think I think it's life 0:20:11.960 --> 0:20:12.800 starts at forty four. 0:20:12.960 --> 0:20:15.560 Who tell me why why forty four was so good? 0:20:15.680 --> 0:20:18.480 Because you come into yourself in a way that you're 0:20:18.520 --> 0:20:23.119 not You're no longer trying to please everybody else. I 0:20:23.160 --> 0:20:25.919 do have some girls now that I've mentored who are 0:20:25.960 --> 0:20:28.960 in their early thirties who've gotten to it sooner, But 0:20:29.119 --> 0:20:31.520 for me, it was forty four where I lucked in. 0:20:32.240 --> 0:20:35.919 That was Oprah on Keihy Palmer's podcast last week. She 0:20:36.119 --> 0:20:39.920 was asked by Keiki if she'd go back to being thirty. 0:20:40.080 --> 0:20:41.919 I don't know what the context is, but it was 0:20:41.960 --> 0:20:47.879 a really interesting question because what she said about the 0:20:47.960 --> 0:20:53.840 ideal age, she was very specific forty four, and it 0:20:53.960 --> 0:20:58.120 made me think and wonder about that, about the age 0:20:58.119 --> 0:21:00.560 that you'd go back to if you could choose, And 0:21:00.600 --> 0:21:03.880 I really liked her reasoning. You know, there was recently 0:21:03.920 --> 0:21:06.520 a survey where two thousand people in America, men and women, 0:21:06.560 --> 0:21:09.760 were asked what age they'd be forever if they could choose. 0:21:11.000 --> 0:21:14.280 And what's really interesting is that it was thirty. 0:21:14.000 --> 0:21:15.600 Six, thirty six. 0:21:15.680 --> 0:21:18.560 What happens at thirty six, Well, it's a little hard 0:21:18.560 --> 0:21:22.080 to say, because if you had separated that between men 0:21:22.119 --> 0:21:25.760 and women, It would probably be different because women are 0:21:25.760 --> 0:21:29.119 more likely if you say what age would they like 0:21:29.200 --> 0:21:31.080 to be and what age do they think is the 0:21:31.119 --> 0:21:33.919 best age if you ask them sort of obviously the 0:21:33.960 --> 0:21:36.439 older they are, the more ages they have to choose from. 0:21:36.520 --> 0:21:42.399 But women who are older will say fifties, and that's 0:21:42.680 --> 0:21:47.600 much older than men will say usually a younger age. 0:21:48.160 --> 0:21:51.440 And the reason this is, which I think is so interesting, 0:21:52.760 --> 0:21:56.800 it's around freedom. But it's sort of been speculated that 0:21:56.800 --> 0:22:00.960 that's the first time than it's not about your body 0:22:00.960 --> 0:22:03.480 and how you look. It's the first time people aren't 0:22:03.480 --> 0:22:06.879 demanding things of you because your kids have grown up, 0:22:07.119 --> 0:22:09.119 you might be divorced, or you might you're not in 0:22:09.160 --> 0:22:12.919 that kind of high need state if you've had kids, 0:22:13.200 --> 0:22:16.080 and if you haven't had kids, you're not probably thinking 0:22:16.080 --> 0:22:19.159 about having kids because that's off the table. So it's 0:22:19.640 --> 0:22:23.200 really interesting because you might think that every person would 0:22:23.240 --> 0:22:26.280 say the age that society tells you you're most valuable, 0:22:26.280 --> 0:22:28.760 which for women would be probably twenties, right. 0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:30.280 Interesting. 0:22:30.880 --> 0:22:34.159 I love this question. It's a question that I always 0:22:34.160 --> 0:22:37.000 play with like my extended family, like we always do 0:22:37.080 --> 0:22:39.400 this at every family Readunia, and there's so many of us. 0:22:39.720 --> 0:22:42.959 But It's really interesting when I ask like my older 0:22:43.040 --> 0:22:47.280 aunties and uncles, especially all of them above fifty, because 0:22:47.280 --> 0:22:49.960 I've noticed a lot of my uncles would say their 0:22:50.200 --> 0:22:52.560 age that they'd go back to, or their like glory 0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:56.480 age was always in their twenties or like late teens, 0:22:56.520 --> 0:23:00.359 and it's always around like friends, being in school, doing bought, 0:23:00.640 --> 0:23:03.879 being like the best in college, no responsibilities, no responsibilities. 0:23:03.880 --> 0:23:06.560 And for all my aunties, it's always in their like 0:23:06.880 --> 0:23:09.720 mid thirties early forties, where they still have their kids 0:23:09.760 --> 0:23:12.679 at home and it's always surrounded my family. And for men, 0:23:12.760 --> 0:23:16.800 it's like when I was single, and yeah, that's to 0:23:16.800 --> 0:23:17.320 look after. 0:23:17.880 --> 0:23:18.640 That's interesting. 0:23:18.640 --> 0:23:20.399 What about how do you feel about the idea that 0:23:20.440 --> 0:23:22.800 life starts at forty four, which is still fourteen years 0:23:22.840 --> 0:23:25.120 away for you, so you're not even living real life here. 0:23:26.119 --> 0:23:28.000 I feel like the older I get, the further it 0:23:28.040 --> 0:23:30.320 moves up, Like you guys like, oh no, it's actually fifty. 0:23:30.359 --> 0:23:31.560 Oh no, it's actually sixty. 0:23:31.800 --> 0:23:31.960 Oh. 0:23:32.000 --> 0:23:35.080 What do you think about the trade off between as 0:23:35.119 --> 0:23:39.560 a woman, Obviously, if you're younger, your body might look better, 0:23:39.640 --> 0:23:44.040 so physically you might get more validation from society about 0:23:44.080 --> 0:23:48.760 how you look, but mentally is your twenties, your happiest. 0:23:48.800 --> 0:23:51.480 Well, I know any women who would say twenties exactly, 0:23:51.560 --> 0:23:52.680 I wouldn't say twenties. 0:23:52.720 --> 0:23:54.440 I would like, it wouldn't even occur to me. 0:23:54.440 --> 0:23:57.439 But for me, and women don't. Women don't take twenties generally. 0:23:57.600 --> 0:24:00.560 So I think that tells you that that isn't important, really, 0:24:00.600 --> 0:24:03.240 isn't it, Because when I think about what age I 0:24:03.240 --> 0:24:06.159 would go back to, it's impossible to unpick it from 0:24:06.200 --> 0:24:09.240 your own life, because I think I might choose to 0:24:09.280 --> 0:24:11.280 go to freedom years, in which case it would be 0:24:11.320 --> 0:24:14.360 about thirty two for me definitely at post thirty would 0:24:14.400 --> 0:24:17.280 have to be And then I think, oh, but what 0:24:17.320 --> 0:24:19.399 about little kid these years? Because now I'm old, My 0:24:19.480 --> 0:24:20.280 kids are old enough that. 0:24:20.240 --> 0:24:22.320 I would nostalgic for those, So I'm like. 0:24:22.280 --> 0:24:23.280 That would be forty two. 0:24:23.320 --> 0:24:25.240 And then I think, maybe like when my parents are 0:24:25.240 --> 0:24:27.320 really healthy, you know what I mean, Like I can. 0:24:27.840 --> 0:24:31.359 It's about traveling back to a time in your life, 0:24:32.000 --> 0:24:37.359 and I think to Oprah's point, I mean, it's it 0:24:37.400 --> 0:24:39.760 would be very cheesy to say right now, I'm living 0:24:39.760 --> 0:24:42.280 my best life right now, but in lots of ways 0:24:42.320 --> 0:24:44.720 I am like, you know, she's right about your feeling 0:24:45.240 --> 0:24:47.560 a certain level of self assurance, and you know your 0:24:47.560 --> 0:24:49.679 careers in a certain place, and you're doing things you 0:24:49.720 --> 0:24:50.919 want to do and all those things. 0:24:51.520 --> 0:24:52.480 But yeah, I do. 0:24:54.119 --> 0:24:56.879 And all the young petarents who we work with would 0:24:57.040 --> 0:24:59.040 kill me for that answer. But there is a bit 0:24:59.080 --> 0:25:01.560 of me these days. I watched the kids move away. 0:25:01.560 --> 0:25:03.480 That's like I'd like to travel back to them being 0:25:03.520 --> 0:25:06.320 really little. I'd like to take a holiday there. I'd 0:25:06.359 --> 0:25:07.960 like to, like, yes, the year, you know, I'd like 0:25:08.000 --> 0:25:11.240 to take a holiday for just a few days when 0:25:11.240 --> 0:25:13.560 the kids were really little and cute, and take a 0:25:13.600 --> 0:25:16.400 holiday when I was like, my parents are really well 0:25:16.400 --> 0:25:18.760 and we were having lots of adventures together, and I'd 0:25:18.760 --> 0:25:20.960 love to take little holidays in bits. 0:25:20.720 --> 0:25:22.840 Of Oh, that would be so lovely. I mean, that's 0:25:22.840 --> 0:25:25.800 what grandparenting is, I guess it is. It's like taking 0:25:25.880 --> 0:25:29.800 a little holiday in little children so you. 0:25:29.760 --> 0:25:30.440 Can give them back. 0:25:30.600 --> 0:25:33.120 Yeah, I think that. It's so interesting what you said. 0:25:33.119 --> 0:25:36.960 I'm about men say teens or early twenties. No, women, no, 0:25:37.160 --> 0:25:40.560 say that. So the biggest group was women, saying fifties 0:25:41.040 --> 0:25:46.080 and twenties were the smallest group out of four hundred 0:25:46.119 --> 0:25:48.720 and sixty sixth women who asked the question. Eleven said 0:25:48.760 --> 0:25:52.640 they were happiest before they were twenty eleven women, do. 0:25:52.640 --> 0:25:55.040 You think that part of that twenty Do you think 0:25:55.080 --> 0:25:59.520 that tells us that the whole idea of the youth 0:25:59.560 --> 0:26:02.240 and beauty piece that you mentioned before me that. 0:26:02.359 --> 0:26:05.159 It just fucks with us. Yeah, so like one. 0:26:05.000 --> 0:26:09.480 Of us ever feel fontiful. So when you're wrestling with 0:26:09.520 --> 0:26:11.400 all that and am I enough? And am I good enough? 0:26:11.800 --> 0:26:14.280 Which which I'm not going to pretend goes away magically, 0:26:14.359 --> 0:26:16.399 I don't think that's true. I think you're always wrestling 0:26:16.400 --> 0:26:20.040 with it to a point. But it's interesting that when 0:26:20.040 --> 0:26:22.600 we've got the most of that, we're still really riddled 0:26:22.600 --> 0:26:25.600 with anxiety about it. We don't long for those days. 0:26:25.720 --> 0:26:27.479 How many times people say I wouldn't be a teenager 0:26:27.520 --> 0:26:28.440 again for a quid? 0:26:28.920 --> 0:26:31.400 I think what's interesting also about your fifties is that 0:26:31.440 --> 0:26:34.320 a lot of your choices have closed off right, and 0:26:34.680 --> 0:26:37.520 there can be a lot of angst with a lot 0:26:37.560 --> 0:26:40.080 of choice. That's why women should never have been given 0:26:40.119 --> 0:26:43.160 the vote or control over our own finances or deciding 0:26:43.359 --> 0:26:47.240 we marry. So in your twenties it's about who you're 0:26:47.280 --> 0:26:49.840 going to be, and in your thirties, You're a bit 0:26:49.920 --> 0:26:54.119 like am I doing this right? And the very wise stage? 0:26:54.160 --> 0:26:56.000 Jennifer and Neiston once said you need to have therapin 0:26:56.080 --> 0:26:58.679 your thirties so that you can enjoy your forties. And 0:26:58.760 --> 0:27:01.879 I think that's true too, because by you forties, I 0:27:01.960 --> 0:27:04.800 get why Oprah said forty four, because I think when 0:27:04.800 --> 0:27:09.720 you go into your late forties, I personally had a 0:27:09.760 --> 0:27:12.320 lot of doubt creep back in again, like I found 0:27:12.840 --> 0:27:16.920 with perimenopause and everything. Who am I identity? I got 0:27:17.040 --> 0:27:20.280 really lost again in my late forties and early fifties. 0:27:20.800 --> 0:27:24.359 I feel like I'm getting back to it mostly now, 0:27:25.000 --> 0:27:29.600 but I found that time almost reminiscent of my twenties 0:27:30.480 --> 0:27:33.120 in that who am I? Am I doing this right? 0:27:33.200 --> 0:27:35.359 What am I meant to be? I'm not really sure. 0:27:35.840 --> 0:27:38.560 Does this make you hopeful for your future? 0:27:38.760 --> 0:27:41.200 For my forties? Yeah, can't wait? 0:27:41.280 --> 0:27:43.720 Yeah, way, forties are really good. 0:27:44.440 --> 0:27:47.879 Also, Dolly Alderton has an agony on column in the 0:27:47.920 --> 0:27:51.639 Sunday Times where she answers dilemmas, and last week someone 0:27:51.640 --> 0:27:54.800 wrote in saying, dear Dolly, I'm thirty two with a 0:27:54.920 --> 0:27:59.400 great career, but very very single. So this woman who 0:27:59.400 --> 0:28:03.200 wrote in say that she loves her career. She's found 0:28:03.200 --> 0:28:05.800 her place at work, but it's not the source of 0:28:05.840 --> 0:28:07.880 her joy, and all she wants to do is get 0:28:07.920 --> 0:28:11.320 into a long term loving relationship. And she also has 0:28:11.440 --> 0:28:13.800 kids on her mind, and she says that she doesn't 0:28:13.800 --> 0:28:17.480 want kids unless she finds someone who's like a partner 0:28:17.520 --> 0:28:20.360 that she can have kids with. So Dolly gave a 0:28:20.400 --> 0:28:22.720 list of advice, and some of the things she says 0:28:23.080 --> 0:28:24.920 was get ahead of your fertility, like. 0:28:25.000 --> 0:28:26.480 Just her manifesto, not. 0:28:26.400 --> 0:28:28.160 Yet, it's not her manifesto yet. 0:28:28.240 --> 0:28:29.880 Some of the other things she said was get ahead 0:28:29.920 --> 0:28:33.240 of your fertility, make single girlfriends who are also in 0:28:33.280 --> 0:28:33.800 their thirties. 0:28:33.840 --> 0:28:37.399 Sorry, what does that mean, get ahead of your fertility, 0:28:37.560 --> 0:28:41.120 freeze your eggs, or just like check it out, just get. 0:28:41.040 --> 0:28:43.080 Get a handle and get a handle on it before 0:28:43.120 --> 0:28:46.800 you meet someone. Make single girlfriends who are also in 0:28:46.840 --> 0:28:49.360 their thirties asked to be set up, which I know 0:28:49.400 --> 0:28:50.920 Amelia would definitely say yes. 0:28:50.960 --> 0:28:52.920 To change the pattern. 0:28:53.000 --> 0:28:55.200 So don't just date your type or people in your 0:28:55.240 --> 0:28:57.400 area or people on the same app that you're using. 0:28:57.800 --> 0:29:01.480 Don't obsess over your age. And then she wrote, write 0:29:01.480 --> 0:29:06.400 a single girl's manifesto. So she said when in years 0:29:06.400 --> 0:29:08.840 even twenty twenty two, she got together with a friend 0:29:09.240 --> 0:29:12.520 over Spicy Marks and they wrote everything that they wanted 0:29:12.560 --> 0:29:16.120 from dating, and she said the premise was what we 0:29:16.160 --> 0:29:18.680 would accept from dating and what we wouldn't how we 0:29:18.720 --> 0:29:21.120 wanted to balance the task of looking for a partner 0:29:21.240 --> 0:29:24.200 while remaining present and grateful in our lives as they were. 0:29:24.600 --> 0:29:27.320 I love that because it's not about what they wanted 0:29:27.320 --> 0:29:30.400 in a man particularly or a partner. It was what 0:29:30.440 --> 0:29:31.680 they wanted in the process, in. 0:29:31.720 --> 0:29:34.320 The process of dating, And she says, I think it 0:29:34.400 --> 0:29:37.520 helped us shed some panic and find more calm, joyful 0:29:37.520 --> 0:29:41.000 intention in our single dim. When I read this manifesto 0:29:41.880 --> 0:29:45.000 exactly what she said, I immediately felt calm, Like it's 0:29:45.040 --> 0:29:47.640 one of those big pieces where you read all of 0:29:47.640 --> 0:29:49.600 these little points that she has and it makes you 0:29:49.680 --> 0:29:52.360 realize there are women also in their thirties who are 0:29:52.360 --> 0:29:55.080 going through the same thing you're going through mentally we're dating, 0:29:55.480 --> 0:29:57.479 and then putting it all on a piece of paper 0:29:57.600 --> 0:30:01.120 just makes you go, okay, okay, kind of tellus, tell 0:30:01.160 --> 0:30:04.080 us what's on there. So she shared hers and her friends, 0:30:04.400 --> 0:30:06.880 and she said, we are open to connecting with people 0:30:06.960 --> 0:30:09.640 we least expect. We are not driven by long held 0:30:09.680 --> 0:30:11.920 ideas of who our future partners should be. 0:30:12.920 --> 0:30:18.160 No DJs, no preconceptions except DJs. 0:30:18.800 --> 0:30:19.400 DJs. 0:30:19.680 --> 0:30:22.880 We recognize that any self esteem issues and past experience 0:30:22.920 --> 0:30:25.800 with rejection are entirely our jobs to address and not 0:30:25.840 --> 0:30:27.440 the responsibility of a man. 0:30:27.360 --> 0:30:31.200 We are dating. That's very therapy, that's very therapy. 0:30:31.440 --> 0:30:33.680 We do not convince ourselves that we like a man 0:30:33.800 --> 0:30:36.960 we are not interested in because he has withdrawn his attention. 0:30:37.120 --> 0:30:40.920 Yes, yes, Or I would always like people just because 0:30:40.920 --> 0:30:44.200 they liked me. I felt this was somehow obliged to 0:30:44.360 --> 0:30:44.960 like them back. 0:30:45.440 --> 0:30:48.480 Really yeah, somebody like. 0:30:47.880 --> 0:30:49.920 Yeah, I'm like, oh, he likes me, And it didn't 0:30:49.920 --> 0:30:51.959 occur to me that you don't like him, I think 0:30:51.960 --> 0:30:54.320 because I'd internalized that idea about you don't want to 0:30:54.320 --> 0:30:57.760 make him out uncomfortable or embarrassed. You don't want to 0:30:57.760 --> 0:30:59.280 disappoint a man. 0:30:59.480 --> 0:30:59.920 So to. 0:31:03.240 --> 0:31:05.720 We know that Aaron Taylor Johnson is the exception and 0:31:05.800 --> 0:31:07.880 not the rule, and that most men under the age 0:31:07.880 --> 0:31:10.680 of thirty two are not emotionally advanced or equipped with 0:31:10.840 --> 0:31:13.000 enough self knowledge to commit in the way we want 0:31:13.040 --> 0:31:13.520 to deserve. 0:31:15.000 --> 0:31:17.880 So that is her stay away from younger men. So 0:31:18.080 --> 0:31:22.600 Aaron Taylor Johnson is a young British actor who ran 0:31:22.680 --> 0:31:27.440 away with the director Sam Wood. She's called Yeah Yes, 0:31:27.640 --> 0:31:30.520 and he starred in a movie that she made and 0:31:30.560 --> 0:31:31.600 he was really young. 0:31:31.680 --> 0:31:32.840 I think he was like nineteen. 0:31:32.920 --> 0:31:33.760 He was really young. 0:31:33.760 --> 0:31:37.400 And yeah, so they're still married to the age difference 0:31:37.440 --> 0:31:41.560 was really significant and they're very happy, happily married and 0:31:41.640 --> 0:31:44.520 have kids whatever. And I think the point of that 0:31:45.000 --> 0:31:47.880 is that when a lot of women get newly single 0:31:47.960 --> 0:31:51.160 and they get you get into some situationships with hot 0:31:51.200 --> 0:31:51.640 young men. 0:31:52.640 --> 0:31:56.320 He's a bit of a like a patron stay. They're like, yeah, 0:31:56.320 --> 0:31:58.120 but look at what happened with Aaron Taylor Wood. 0:31:58.160 --> 0:32:01.080 And I think she's making the point. Yeah, but that's 0:32:01.200 --> 0:32:03.840 not the normal. Yeah, they're usually just trying a few 0:32:03.880 --> 0:32:07.200 things on Bridget Jones four, one hundred and two. 0:32:08.240 --> 0:32:10.640 What about we run a mile from men who are 0:32:10.720 --> 0:32:13.280 nasty about their ex girl, that's a huge one. 0:32:13.320 --> 0:32:16.600 You should have that tattooed on your hands and mother's 0:32:16.760 --> 0:32:19.440 that's the other thing one of the lines that my 0:32:19.840 --> 0:32:20.280 I think my. 0:32:20.280 --> 0:32:21.360 Mother probably told me. 0:32:21.400 --> 0:32:23.959 Of course, like a man who isn't nice to his 0:32:24.000 --> 0:32:25.280 mother one hundred percent. 0:32:25.960 --> 0:32:27.760 This has become such a thing. When I was having 0:32:27.840 --> 0:32:29.960 drinks with my friends. My friend had just gone on 0:32:30.000 --> 0:32:31.080 a date with this guy and she was like, it 0:32:31.080 --> 0:32:34.440 was perfect, it was amazing. He called his ex girlfriend crazy, 0:32:34.480 --> 0:32:35.960 and then we were like, ah, yeah, so you. 0:32:36.200 --> 0:32:38.200 See him again. I went on a date with a 0:32:38.200 --> 0:32:38.600 guy once. 0:32:38.640 --> 0:32:40.360 We went to yom Cha, right, and he was putting 0:32:40.400 --> 0:32:42.600 loads of chili on his dumplings and he was saying, Oh, 0:32:42.640 --> 0:32:44.000 it's so nice to be able to put chili on 0:32:44.000 --> 0:32:47.239 my dumplings because my ex girlfriend hated chili. And then 0:32:47.240 --> 0:32:49.200 he said, so sometimes I just put it in things 0:32:49.240 --> 0:32:50.360 just to piss her off because she. 0:32:50.320 --> 0:32:54.800 Was all which is very okay. I think it's very 0:32:54.840 --> 0:32:57.200 Brad Pitt coated as well. We're talking about that on 0:32:57.320 --> 0:33:00.960 yesterday's subscriber episode about how well wouldn't that be a 0:33:01.000 --> 0:33:04.840 red flag for his new girlfriend that none of his 0:33:05.360 --> 0:33:08.160 keeps trying to sue his ex wife and none of 0:33:08.200 --> 0:33:09.320 his kids are speaking to him. 0:33:09.760 --> 0:33:11.959 We hope and wish that the women we know and 0:33:12.000 --> 0:33:14.360 love are granted all the things we want most. We 0:33:14.440 --> 0:33:17.200 celebrate when these things happen. We know that it takes 0:33:17.240 --> 0:33:18.880 nothing from us and our future. 0:33:19.000 --> 0:33:21.440 That's a mantra that you repeat to yourself while rocking 0:33:21.440 --> 0:33:23.760 in a corner because your friend is, you know, having 0:33:23.800 --> 0:33:24.480 something that you want. 0:33:24.520 --> 0:33:27.400 But it's such a it's such a very true and 0:33:27.480 --> 0:33:32.000 Dolly said that two months after they both wrote this manifesto, 0:33:32.520 --> 0:33:34.000 friend met her husband. 0:33:34.760 --> 0:33:37.840 I really like this because what it does is that 0:33:37.920 --> 0:33:44.080 it really formalizes an attitude about a process. Rather than 0:33:44.240 --> 0:33:46.560 looking at the end point of that process and the 0:33:46.640 --> 0:33:50.000 outcome that you want, it's actually looking at the journey 0:33:50.080 --> 0:33:52.360 and the experience that you want to have along the way, 0:33:52.440 --> 0:33:55.680 and how you can try and make sure you don't 0:33:55.760 --> 0:33:58.880 sort of make too many wrong turns and go down 0:33:58.920 --> 0:34:01.360 to too many dead ends. And it's about it's all 0:34:01.400 --> 0:34:05.560 about we. It's about what we want, not what he 0:34:05.640 --> 0:34:08.200 should be. Jesse made a list. 0:34:07.960 --> 0:34:09.120 But she did make the list. 0:34:09.360 --> 0:34:11.520 She Didni Boley told her to do it because she 0:34:11.560 --> 0:34:12.600 also made a list. 0:34:13.200 --> 0:34:14.399 But yeah, Jesse wrote a list. 0:34:14.400 --> 0:34:16.200 And then she said that when she and Lucramen dating 0:34:16.200 --> 0:34:18.600 for a while and she looked back at the list, Yeah, a. 0:34:18.560 --> 0:34:20.000 Lot of the things were on there. 0:34:19.880 --> 0:34:22.200 That was more about what she wanted in a partner, 0:34:22.280 --> 0:34:26.279 Wasn't it like humor? I just think kindness is the 0:34:26.280 --> 0:34:31.120 most top underrated virtue in a partner. Kindness top of 0:34:31.160 --> 0:34:33.800 the list every time, and nice shoulders. 0:34:34.480 --> 0:34:35.360 And leg hair. 0:34:39.960 --> 0:34:43.120 After the break, our very best rerecos to help set 0:34:43.200 --> 0:34:44.480 up your weekend. 0:34:45.840 --> 0:34:49.720 Vibes, ideas, atmosphere, something casual, something fun. 0:34:50.239 --> 0:34:51.759 This is my best recommendation. 0:34:52.760 --> 0:34:54.640 It is Friday, and we want to set up your 0:34:54.640 --> 0:34:57.120 weekend with our very best recommendations. 0:34:57.320 --> 0:34:59.759 Who wants to go? I will? 0:35:00.120 --> 0:35:04.880 Mine's a little bit funny on first pass. It's do 0:35:04.920 --> 0:35:08.839 you call them hairbands, hair elastics, hair ties, hair tied? 0:35:09.120 --> 0:35:12.000 I never say hair ties. I think that feels American. 0:35:11.560 --> 0:35:14.160 Hair is a big one you put over your Yeah, 0:35:14.239 --> 0:35:19.640 that's hair tie, elastics, hair elastic. 0:35:20.120 --> 0:35:24.400 No, maybe I say hair band in headband is the 0:35:24.400 --> 0:35:25.879 one that you put over their hair band? 0:35:25.920 --> 0:35:29.080 I say a hairband, They say hair lackeys. I'm pretty 0:35:29.080 --> 0:35:30.640 sure short for elastic. 0:35:31.600 --> 0:35:35.280 Anyway. I know that sounds a little bit like sad 0:35:35.600 --> 0:35:38.560 just saying it's a hair tye. But I have found 0:35:38.719 --> 0:35:41.279 a type of hair tie that is a cult and 0:35:41.320 --> 0:35:45.120 a collectible. There are seven hundred color combinations and there 0:35:45.160 --> 0:35:50.520 are seasonal drops. What I know they're called kiniki headbands 0:35:50.520 --> 0:35:52.960 wire hair bands, which almost always makes me think of 0:35:53.600 --> 0:35:56.320 Kiniki and Grease, the character the kind of do weeby one. 0:35:56.840 --> 0:35:59.440 I first discovered them when I ordered a bunch of 0:35:59.520 --> 0:36:03.920 pillows from a friend of the pod Jumbled, which is 0:36:03.960 --> 0:36:07.399 a fantastic store in Orange and they're online. They self 0:36:07.440 --> 0:36:10.919 fashion Homewar's art. I buy loads of things from there, 0:36:11.280 --> 0:36:12.960 and so I ordered a whole lot of pillows for 0:36:13.080 --> 0:36:17.480 my couch and they they sent just a few of 0:36:17.520 --> 0:36:21.560 these just as a little present. And I've never seen 0:36:21.600 --> 0:36:23.480 anything like them. They are brightly colored. 0:36:23.719 --> 0:36:26.680 I thought they were like bracelets, yes. 0:36:26.440 --> 0:36:29.360 And that's why I like them. They're brightly colored, they 0:36:29.520 --> 0:36:33.359 have a backstory. They're woven, not molded, so they're very 0:36:33.480 --> 0:36:35.719 very good and gentle on your hair. There they have 0:36:35.840 --> 0:36:40.120 over sixty interwoven threads and they are made on Korean 0:36:40.160 --> 0:36:43.480 vintage looms from the nineteen sixties that were originally built 0:36:43.480 --> 0:36:47.440 to make upholstery webbing. That's some little fun fact research 0:36:47.840 --> 0:36:50.920 no metal, no snag, no crease, but the fact that 0:36:50.960 --> 0:36:53.279 they come in all these amazing colors. I wear them 0:36:53.320 --> 0:36:56.799 all day every day, like I just choose some nice 0:36:56.840 --> 0:37:00.560 colored ones and it doesn't leave that sort of red 0:37:01.760 --> 0:37:05.360 you know, valley around your cut off your circulation around 0:37:05.400 --> 0:37:06.799 your wrist. They're decoratives. 0:37:06.840 --> 0:37:08.400 They're like thin scrunchies. 0:37:08.520 --> 0:37:10.680 Yeah, and they don't crease your hair when you put. 0:37:10.520 --> 0:37:11.040 By like that. 0:37:11.520 --> 0:37:14.839 So the thing that I lose most often in my house. 0:37:14.880 --> 0:37:16.960 I'm always running around my house going has anyone seen 0:37:17.000 --> 0:37:17.880 a hair tie? 0:37:18.080 --> 0:37:18.959 I need some of those. 0:37:19.360 --> 0:37:24.520 Yeah, a word for the feeling, the very specific, intense 0:37:24.560 --> 0:37:27.360 feeling of when you need a hair tye because you 0:37:27.480 --> 0:37:30.560 just have to put your hair back. I feel like 0:37:30.600 --> 0:37:32.560 there needs to be a word for that out louders 0:37:32.640 --> 0:37:36.200 help us out because it is. It's such a specific 0:37:36.280 --> 0:37:39.040 feeling and it's actually quite unbearable. It is that you 0:37:39.080 --> 0:37:40.360 can't find the hair tye. 0:37:40.440 --> 0:37:41.320 Really angry. 0:37:41.360 --> 0:37:43.680 It does desperate even. 0:37:43.640 --> 0:37:47.360 Yes, I'm also recommending a product. It is a blush. 0:37:47.440 --> 0:37:50.839 I'm wearing it right now. It's from Merit and it's 0:37:50.840 --> 0:37:53.560 in the color Fox, but they have thirteen different shades. 0:37:53.600 --> 0:37:55.920 Can I put my hand up and ask what merit is? 0:37:55.960 --> 0:37:58.000 Because I've seen this everywhere, but I've never. 0:37:58.000 --> 0:37:58.560 It's seen it. 0:37:58.680 --> 0:38:00.919 You would have seen it all over your TikTok. It's 0:38:00.960 --> 0:38:05.080 like the It's Girl beauty brand of the season. It 0:38:05.360 --> 0:38:08.799 came into Australia recently in the past few years. You 0:38:08.840 --> 0:38:11.239 can buy their products from their website and they now 0:38:11.280 --> 0:38:15.160 ship directly to Australia. It is kind of I would 0:38:15.200 --> 0:38:18.320 say pricey aside, the blush itself is forty eight dollars. 0:38:18.560 --> 0:38:20.960 That is exy rasy for me. It's fine for some 0:38:21.000 --> 0:38:21.600 other people. 0:38:21.800 --> 0:38:23.080 Did you buy it from the website? 0:38:23.120 --> 0:38:27.239 I bought it from the website when they came into Australia. 0:38:27.280 --> 0:38:29.520 But it's one of those blushes that I use for everything. 0:38:29.640 --> 0:38:30.839 Is there anywhere I can touch it? 0:38:31.160 --> 0:38:32.200 I've got it on my desk. 0:38:32.440 --> 0:38:35.000 No, But like, is it sold in a shop or only. 0:38:34.960 --> 0:38:35.600 You can't get it? 0:38:35.640 --> 0:38:37.200 I thought you could get into four but it's only 0:38:37.280 --> 0:38:40.359 in the USA, so it's only their website you can 0:38:40.400 --> 0:38:44.080 get it from. I bought it after our beauty editor 0:38:44.200 --> 0:38:45.399 Aaron recommended it. 0:38:45.560 --> 0:38:47.640 How did you know if you were buying online what 0:38:47.800 --> 0:38:50.600 color to get? If there were thirteen different colors. 0:38:50.280 --> 0:38:50.800 Of blood have? 0:38:50.880 --> 0:38:52.960 They put them in like little category so they have 0:38:53.080 --> 0:38:55.000 like a pop of color category, and then in a 0:38:55.040 --> 0:38:57.320 neutrals category and then in a darker category. And I 0:38:57.360 --> 0:38:59.360 always go neutraols with blush because I feel like with 0:38:59.400 --> 0:39:01.719 my skin tone and they sit better. So this is 0:39:01.800 --> 0:39:03.879 kind of like a warm talk. You can also see 0:39:03.880 --> 0:39:05.719 which ones are cool which ones are warm depending on 0:39:05.719 --> 0:39:07.239 your color here and is it a stick, is it 0:39:07.239 --> 0:39:09.600 a powder? What is it's a little pot. It's a 0:39:09.640 --> 0:39:12.200 cream blush. I've also got it on my eyelids and 0:39:12.280 --> 0:39:14.280 on my lips, so I use it for all three. 0:39:14.920 --> 0:39:17.480 And that's why I feel like I will keep buying 0:39:17.480 --> 0:39:19.360 it because the price point for me is extually. 0:39:19.360 --> 0:39:21.520 But because I use it for all three, I like it. 0:39:21.680 --> 0:39:23.920 Have you got anything on over it on your lips? 0:39:24.000 --> 0:39:26.200 Just lined it. I've just lined my lips. 0:39:25.920 --> 0:39:27.359 And then it looks quite moist. 0:39:27.520 --> 0:39:29.120 It's all in the middle. Yeah, because it's creamy. 0:39:29.320 --> 0:39:31.640 Then you've got a bit of a shimmer on your cheek. 0:39:31.840 --> 0:39:34.160 It's very nice, I have to say. 0:39:34.880 --> 0:39:36.560 And then because it's so good for travel, you just 0:39:36.600 --> 0:39:39.279 need the one pot for all three. They have so 0:39:39.400 --> 0:39:41.440 many different shades. So if you want to check it out, 0:39:41.520 --> 0:39:43.520 highly recommend it to marry It will put a link 0:39:43.560 --> 0:39:44.600 to the website for you. 0:39:45.120 --> 0:39:48.120 I am recommending something that I have a suspicion i've 0:39:48.160 --> 0:39:50.520 recommended before, but that's because I love it and it's 0:39:50.520 --> 0:39:52.399 been a way a long time and it's back. And 0:39:52.440 --> 0:39:56.920 that is the new season of Kitchen Cabinet with Annabel Crab. 0:39:57.000 --> 0:39:58.120 Who's she interviewing. 0:39:59.000 --> 0:40:02.560 First episode was the Prime Minister Now, so em said 0:40:02.600 --> 0:40:04.960 to me, what's kitchen cabinet? 0:40:05.080 --> 0:40:06.399 And I went, what do you mean? 0:40:06.480 --> 0:40:09.760 And then our social producer test was like, what's kitchen cabinet? 0:40:09.760 --> 0:40:12.120 And they thought it was a cooking show. So I 0:40:12.200 --> 0:40:14.799 need to just quickly explain me and I would know 0:40:14.880 --> 0:40:16.759 that it's not quite a cooking show. And it kind 0:40:16.760 --> 0:40:19.560 of is too. It's a show where Annimal Crab who 0:40:19.600 --> 0:40:22.440 obviously has all the credibility as a political reporter at 0:40:22.440 --> 0:40:24.839 the ABC. She was for years, so she's very well 0:40:24.920 --> 0:40:25.800 versed in that world. 0:40:25.680 --> 0:40:28.520 And also someone who is an outstanding cook. 0:40:28.719 --> 0:40:30.360 Yes, loves cooking and baking. 0:40:30.840 --> 0:40:32.200 She's author of cookbooks. 0:40:32.239 --> 0:40:34.680 She has a show that she's been doing for years 0:40:34.719 --> 0:40:38.480 and years where she goes to a politician's house and 0:40:38.600 --> 0:40:42.160 they have to cook her dinner and she brings dessert 0:40:42.400 --> 0:40:45.120 and over the course of this quite short half hour, 0:40:45.560 --> 0:40:48.920 over the course of the episode, they have dinner and 0:40:48.960 --> 0:40:50.839 she you know, gets to the bottom of them. 0:40:50.960 --> 0:40:52.520 Right, do they talk politics? 0:40:52.560 --> 0:40:52.799 Well. 0:40:52.880 --> 0:40:55.200 The thing that's interesting about the show is in recent 0:40:55.320 --> 0:40:59.160 years it became quite it's become quite controversial because they 0:40:59.200 --> 0:41:02.680 do talk politics, but it isn't seven thirty, like she 0:41:02.760 --> 0:41:06.520 isn't grilling them. So, for example, the first episode of 0:41:06.560 --> 0:41:08.600 this one was with the Prime Minister as it should be, 0:41:08.760 --> 0:41:11.760 I guess, and she goes to the lodge and Albo 0:41:11.880 --> 0:41:13.440 cooks for her in the lodge kitchen. 0:41:13.560 --> 0:41:14.160 What does he cook? 0:41:14.239 --> 0:41:16.520 And they so the politician chooses what they're going to cook, 0:41:16.520 --> 0:41:19.720 and they always choose something that's going to tell us story. 0:41:20.000 --> 0:41:23.240 So he cooks a traditional Italian or a keta actually 0:41:23.239 --> 0:41:26.720 my mom makes this, or a ketti pasta with broccoli 0:41:26.760 --> 0:41:30.840 and Anchovi's, Oh, we love. He makes that, and obviously 0:41:30.840 --> 0:41:33.480 he has Italian heritage, so that's his thing. And she 0:41:33.719 --> 0:41:37.319 brings him homemade wagon Wheel biscuits because he grew up 0:41:37.320 --> 0:41:40.480 near a biscuit factory in Marrickville. Right over the course 0:41:40.520 --> 0:41:44.439 of this short interview, you discover that Albo is very 0:41:44.480 --> 0:41:47.200 anal like obsessed with the. 0:41:47.040 --> 0:41:50.680 Word I didn't expect to hear. I'm just imagining. I 0:41:50.680 --> 0:41:53.360 was thinking about wagon wheel to say that, and I 0:41:53.480 --> 0:41:57.600 was thinking about beautiful pasta, and now we're talking about. 0:41:58.000 --> 0:42:00.880 He is obsessed with prosit process. 0:42:00.920 --> 0:42:02.879 He doesn't like any of his food to touch each 0:42:02.880 --> 0:42:06.040 other except for Pastor that's allowed obviously, and he doesn't 0:42:06.120 --> 0:42:07.960 like Amanavella in his kitchen with him. 0:42:08.280 --> 0:42:11.399 So, like, it's one of those shows watching you just. 0:42:11.480 --> 0:42:14.719 Learn about the person and then when they sit down, 0:42:14.800 --> 0:42:16.520 she does grill him a bit on politics in terms 0:42:16.560 --> 0:42:18.399 of she says, what do you think young Albo would think? 0:42:18.440 --> 0:42:21.000 You know, the one who protested about X y Z. 0:42:21.120 --> 0:42:22.560 What do you think he'd think about you? 0:42:22.600 --> 0:42:22.799 Now? 0:42:22.880 --> 0:42:24.520 Like, so she doesn't age would you like to go 0:42:24.560 --> 0:42:27.680 back to Yes, she does bring that, but it's not 0:42:28.080 --> 0:42:28.600 a grilling. 0:42:28.680 --> 0:42:28.839 Now. 0:42:28.880 --> 0:42:32.200 That's why it became kind of controversial in recent years 0:42:32.200 --> 0:42:35.440 because I think as our political discourse has become more heated, 0:42:35.920 --> 0:42:39.560 a lot of people are like, how very dare you 0:42:39.600 --> 0:42:42.320 go to this person's house and present them like a human. 0:42:42.440 --> 0:42:44.759 So during the course of this season, she's going to 0:42:44.840 --> 0:42:47.200 go to all the politicians' houses. Right, whether or not 0:42:47.239 --> 0:42:50.040 she's got Hanson, nobody quite knows. Maybe me or no, 0:42:50.160 --> 0:42:52.080 She's not going to tell me, but she's the second 0:42:52.120 --> 0:42:54.200 one was with Angus Taylor, said, the leader of the opposition. 0:42:54.239 --> 0:42:56.279 In the past, she's been to Barnaby Joyce's house, she's 0:42:56.280 --> 0:42:58.640 been to Scomo's house, she's been a Pete Dunton's house. 0:42:58.760 --> 0:42:59.759 She goes to everyone's house. 0:42:59.840 --> 0:43:00.000 Yeah. 0:43:00.280 --> 0:43:02.799 And the reason I like it do you get to 0:43:02.800 --> 0:43:04.719 see the house? A You get to see the house. 0:43:04.960 --> 0:43:07.239 And the thing that's funny about this is Albo's dog 0:43:07.360 --> 0:43:09.919 is just constantly running up and down the stairs behind them. 0:43:11.760 --> 0:43:13.160 And you're just getting steps in. 0:43:13.640 --> 0:43:15.399 What's Toto doing? 0:43:15.440 --> 0:43:18.800 I don't know anyway, But is that, even without the grilling, 0:43:19.400 --> 0:43:22.160 you learn so much about somebody. So I remember in 0:43:22.160 --> 0:43:25.080 Pete Dutton's one, she was asking him questions about his 0:43:25.160 --> 0:43:28.120 time as a police officer and stuff that was really 0:43:28.160 --> 0:43:31.120 revealing to his character without her sitting there and going 0:43:31.480 --> 0:43:33.439 you think this, and you think that. So I find 0:43:33.480 --> 0:43:36.480 it really interesting. I also think it never does any 0:43:36.520 --> 0:43:38.959 harm us any harm to remember that everybody is human, 0:43:38.960 --> 0:43:42.440 whether you like them or not, or agree them or not. 0:43:43.040 --> 0:43:45.880 And I really find it. I really like the format. 0:43:45.960 --> 0:43:48.200 I really like that. Not everybody does, but I do anyway. 0:43:48.280 --> 0:43:48.839 So it's back. 0:43:48.880 --> 0:43:50.439 It's been off air for a year, for a good 0:43:50.440 --> 0:43:53.120 few years. I'm delighted to see it back. The first 0:43:53.200 --> 0:43:55.399 two are up and then it's going to drop week 0:43:55.440 --> 0:43:55.759 to week. 0:43:56.120 --> 0:43:57.080 Yeah, I watch this. 0:43:57.160 --> 0:44:00.200 I agree with you. I have absolutely no time for 0:44:00.360 --> 0:44:06.799 people who want to not humanize anyone not you know 0:44:06.840 --> 0:44:09.440 that everything has to be antagonistic, and that if you 0:44:09.600 --> 0:44:13.560 somehow talk to someone you don't agree with, that means 0:44:13.560 --> 0:44:17.520 you're endorsing everything they've ever said, everything they've ever done. 0:44:17.680 --> 0:44:19.440 And even if you watch it, like I think I've 0:44:19.480 --> 0:44:23.120 probably watched all of them, and I never walk away going, oh, 0:44:23.160 --> 0:44:24.880 you know what, I really agree with all that guy's 0:44:24.920 --> 0:44:27.000 policies now that I really couldn't agree with before, because 0:44:27.000 --> 0:44:29.319 I'm a smart human being who can handle that, and 0:44:29.400 --> 0:44:32.120 most people are like I can handle hearing that point 0:44:32.120 --> 0:44:34.759 of view without it meaning that I've signed off on 0:44:34.840 --> 0:44:35.480 that point of view. 0:44:35.560 --> 0:44:38.359 Yeah. It drives me crazy because these people only say 0:44:38.400 --> 0:44:40.800 it about the people they disagree with. They're very happy 0:44:41.200 --> 0:44:44.040 for the people they agree with to be portrayed in 0:44:44.400 --> 0:44:48.000 whatever positive light, but if they don't agree somehow, it 0:44:48.080 --> 0:44:50.879 means that that can't No one can have a comboise so. 0:44:51.080 --> 0:44:53.840 Be I mean, you know, Annabel Krab, who has bags 0:44:53.880 --> 0:44:58.000 of credibility in political reporting, she like, her questions are great. 0:44:58.080 --> 0:45:00.960 She's not you know, she's not in any way letting 0:45:00.960 --> 0:45:03.279 everybody off the hook. Like and also she does it 0:45:03.440 --> 0:45:06.279 very She always does across the political spectrum. So she'll 0:45:06.320 --> 0:45:08.680 going to a Green's house, a national house, a labor house, 0:45:08.680 --> 0:45:12.600 a liberal house. It's like, I find that really interesting. Yeah, anyway, 0:45:12.640 --> 0:45:14.640 it's a great show. It's back and also part of 0:45:14.680 --> 0:45:16.840 the fun it is seeing what Annabel bakes. How is 0:45:16.880 --> 0:45:19.680 she such a good baker who makes their own wagon wheel? 0:45:19.760 --> 0:45:22.160 That's insane. I need to see those immediately. It's on 0:45:22.200 --> 0:45:23.480 ABC IVW Friends. 0:45:23.800 --> 0:45:25.200 She's just phenomenal. 0:45:25.880 --> 0:45:28.440 Oh, We've got one more reco because there's a new 0:45:28.480 --> 0:45:30.640 Mama Mia show this week, and I believe that it's 0:45:30.719 --> 0:45:32.560 for your people, em and by that I mean the 0:45:32.640 --> 0:45:33.160 young one. 0:45:33.239 --> 0:45:37.560 So Mom and Mia, we have a new gen Z podcast. 0:45:37.600 --> 0:45:41.120 It's a comedy podcast. It's hosted by two girls here 0:45:41.160 --> 0:45:41.760 in the office. 0:45:41.840 --> 0:45:42.439 Live and Live. 0:45:42.600 --> 0:45:44.920 Oh you'll know at least one of the Lives because 0:45:44.960 --> 0:45:47.800 she is so great on social it's so funny. 0:45:48.760 --> 0:45:51.399 Live James if you you might know her name. She's 0:45:51.440 --> 0:45:54.160 always on our Instagram. She does these video explainers and 0:45:54.200 --> 0:45:57.280 she's so good at them. Live Coleman also really funny. 0:45:57.320 --> 0:45:59.880 They're both in their twenties and what they do is 0:46:00.120 --> 0:46:03.280 they go through the comments and all of these viral 0:46:03.400 --> 0:46:07.200 tiktoks and viral Instagram videos and they kind of do 0:46:07.280 --> 0:46:10.800 it a big explainer on what's happening about this viral 0:46:10.880 --> 0:46:14.960 moment just through the comments and the dynamic is so good, 0:46:15.400 --> 0:46:16.280 so funny. 0:46:16.520 --> 0:46:18.440 I think the first episode comes out this week. 0:46:18.520 --> 0:46:22.359 It does came out yesterday. It's I love this show 0:46:22.400 --> 0:46:25.759 because I learn, like I don't understand a lot of it. Yeah, 0:46:25.760 --> 0:46:27.960 but it's you know how sometimes you can just be like, 0:46:28.600 --> 0:46:31.360 what's that I don't understand? And I just listened to 0:46:31.400 --> 0:46:34.200 this and it keeps me. I feel like it keeps 0:46:34.239 --> 0:46:36.920 me in touch with what gen Z's are talking about. 0:46:36.680 --> 0:46:37.960 And they're so themselves. 0:46:38.320 --> 0:46:42.720 Live James recently did an explainer on The Odyssey before 0:46:42.760 --> 0:46:44.600 you go watch it. Oh, I loved it, and it's 0:46:44.760 --> 0:46:47.520 so funny because she pronounces all the names wrong and 0:46:47.520 --> 0:46:48.879 she's like, you know what, I don't care. 0:46:49.200 --> 0:46:50.080 It went absolutely via. 0:46:50.160 --> 0:46:52.520 I love that. We said that in the promo for 0:46:52.600 --> 0:46:54.560 it was like with Sada, there weren't enough shows out 0:46:54.560 --> 0:46:56.759 there that were hosted by two. 0:46:56.320 --> 0:46:59.000 Two women called live in their twenties. Try to get 0:46:59.000 --> 0:47:00.680 it's true. You have to find a gap in the mask. 0:47:00.880 --> 0:47:03.480 Now I have a listen, we'll put a link in 0:47:03.560 --> 0:47:04.400 our show notes. 0:47:04.680 --> 0:47:06.080 That is all we have time for today. 0:47:06.120 --> 0:47:08.440 Out loudert, thank you for being with us all week. 0:47:08.680 --> 0:47:10.719 It has been a joy as ever. Thank you to 0:47:10.760 --> 0:47:12.640 our team and we will be back into your ears 0:47:12.640 --> 0:47:13.120 on Monday. 0:47:13.320 --> 0:47:15.120 Bye bye bye. 0:47:16.080 --> 0:47:18.920 Mamma Maya acknowledges the traditional owners of the land on 0:47:19.000 --> 0:47:20.640 which we have recorded this podcast.