Speaker 1: You're listening to a MoMA Mea podcast.
Speaker 2: Mamma Mea acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to
Speaker 2: Mamma Mia out loud. It's what women are actually talking
Speaker 2: about on Monday, the fifth of August.
Speaker 1: I'm Holly Wainwright, I'm Mere Friedman.
Speaker 3: And I'm m Vernon filling in for Jesse today. She's
Speaker 3: a bit sick.
Speaker 2: She is a bit sick. Blessed us sending healing vibes
Speaker 2: your way, my friend. On today's show, how a very
Speaker 2: non expert Olympic roundup, including an apparent gender panic, exes,
Speaker 2: women gold together, and a river of poop.
Speaker 1: I watched so.
Speaker 4: Much Olympics on the weekend. Good It's like my background.
Speaker 2: It's very soothie.
Speaker 3: Are you a sporty girl?
Speaker 5: Now?
Speaker 4: No, but I've got a lot of opinions.
Speaker 2: Also, the Royal Sussexes of Montecito have given their first
Speaker 2: joint interview since that Oprah show, And it's not about
Speaker 2: jam and movie star maths. What George Clooney, Glenn Powell
Speaker 2: and Ryan Gosling have in common that Tom Cruise, Bradley
Speaker 2: Cooper and Ben affleck definitely do not. But first m Vernon.
Speaker 2: In case you.
Speaker 3: Missed it, the real star of the Olympics is a
Speaker 3: chocolate muffin.
Speaker 2: Oh you know, the muffin man, the modern man, the
Speaker 2: muffin Man.
Speaker 3: The Olympic village cafeteria has gone viral on TikTok. Athletes
Speaker 3: are rating and reviewing all the food that's been served
Speaker 3: to them. One athlete in particular, named Henry Christiansen, who's
Speaker 3: on Norwegian distance swimmer, has taken the ranking of.
Speaker 1: The foods very seriously.
Speaker 3: So he gave the village an eleven out of ten
Speaker 3: for their chocolate muffin and has now made over ten
Speaker 3: tiktoks dedicated to the Seth muffin.
Speaker 1: Oh I love him.
Speaker 4: I'm so fascinated by the Olympic dining room. I mean,
Speaker 4: I imagine there's lots of them, because there's you got
Speaker 4: ten thousand athletes or more in the village. But I
Speaker 4: also heard that there's a shortage of protein. Yeah, because
Speaker 4: they tried. The French wanted to contribute a little less
Speaker 4: to global warming by using more plant based proteins. And
Speaker 4: there are some people who aren't happy because there's not enough.
Speaker 3: Like steak no, and they've been going in on like
Speaker 3: all the Pasta's like a lot of it's serve cold.
Speaker 3: We got a car bload if you're trying old. But
Speaker 3: not everyone likes our friend Henrik, who's now called the
Speaker 3: muffin Man. Other atleasts have been making tiktoks going I'm
Speaker 3: trying to get a chocolate muffin, but I think that
Speaker 3: one Norwegian swimmer has taken them all, so he's like
Speaker 3: stashing them, he's hoarding them. He's been commenting on all
Speaker 3: of their tiktoks as well, going you'll never find that.
Speaker 6: Do you know what.
Speaker 4: I've been in trouble a lot of times at buffets
Speaker 4: because I'm often not that hungry in the morning, but
Speaker 4: when you're somewhere and there's a great buffet, I like
Speaker 4: to just grab a few things for later. It always
Speaker 4: mortifies my family that I do this. And one time
Speaker 4: I was at a restaurant and we're having breakfast at
Speaker 4: this hotel and the waiter came over and said, you
Speaker 4: can't take the food, and I went I didn't, and he.
Speaker 2: Said, madam, would you empty your bag please. You might
Speaker 2: have heard that a gender war has broken out at
Speaker 2: the Paris Olympics, you might have seen a picture from
Speaker 2: a boxing final accompanied by a message from perhaps JK
Speaker 2: Rowling jd vance Elon Musk claiming that a man just
Speaker 2: broke a woman's nose in the Olympic boxing ring in
Speaker 2: a natural conclusion of a radical transagenda. So let's unpack
Speaker 2: this a little bit. On Thursday, Paris time, Algerian boxer
Speaker 2: Imane Khalif fought Italian boxer Angela Karini in a boxing heat. Right,
Speaker 2: obviously I am not a boxing expert, but they're in
Speaker 2: weight divisions. They're in the sixty six kilo weight division,
Speaker 2: and they had a boxing match. At forty five seconds,
Speaker 2: Karini pulled out of the fight after a heavy blow
Speaker 2: to the face. She said at the time that she
Speaker 2: had never felt a punch like it, and that's when
Speaker 2: a storm erupted. Because last year, in an unexplained move,
Speaker 2: Khalif was one of two boxers suspended from the World
Speaker 2: Boxing Championships by the International Boxing Association, who cited that
Speaker 2: she and another athlete who's also at the Olympics, a
Speaker 2: Taiwanese boxer called Lynn Uting, had failed the organization's gender
Speaker 2: eligibility test. Now at the time, the IBA, So that's
Speaker 2: the Boxing Association would not disclose what kind of testing
Speaker 2: the women had failed. And it's worth noting that the
Speaker 2: organization itself is under a serious cloud of corruption allegations.
Speaker 4: Well, they've been deregistered and disqualified as a governing body
Speaker 4: because of corruption, bribery, fraud, a whole bunch of things.
Speaker 4: And it's worth noting that this mysterious gender test that
Speaker 4: was conducted on the two boxers happened after Imani, the
Speaker 4: Algerian boxer, beat a Russian boxer. And the IBA, the
Speaker 4: International Boxing Association is run, well, it's.
Speaker 2: President is Russia. Its president is a Russian man who
Speaker 2: is a close ally of Putins. So yes, there's a
Speaker 2: lot of controversy surround the IBA, And as you say,
Speaker 2: the Olympic Committee does not recognize them, nor do lots
Speaker 2: of other like the American Boxing Committee, lots of places don't.
Speaker 2: Just a bit of a sidebar to explain how this works, right,
Speaker 2: the International Olympic Committee no longer runs any gender testing,
Speaker 2: so they don't do gender testing. Individual sports all have
Speaker 2: their own federations and they all have their own different
Speaker 2: rules for gender eligibility. And you probably would understand why
Speaker 2: this has been under a spotlight a lot in recent years.
Speaker 2: There have been some high profile controversies. The swimmers who
Speaker 2: are competing at the Olympics, for example, have all passed
Speaker 2: and fallen in line with the gender eligibility rules of
Speaker 2: the swimming authority.
Speaker 3: And then do the swimming authorready send that to the IOC.
Speaker 2: So the only thing the IOC will check is that
Speaker 2: the athletes their passport matched the gender that they're competing in.
Speaker 2: But you pass the tests by doing it within your
Speaker 2: own sport, and those tests themselves vary depending on what
Speaker 2: your sport is. So it might involve a testosterone test,
Speaker 2: it might involve a raft of other medical tests like
Speaker 2: a physical exam, an ultrasound, a chromosome test. But the
Speaker 2: test that these boxes are alleged to have failed has
Speaker 2: not been no details of it right from this now
Speaker 2: shady organization. So back to Emmani Khalif the story was
Speaker 2: immediately picked up and you would have seen the images
Speaker 2: everywhere as a cultural.
Speaker 4: Issue, and I think, you know, I just want to
Speaker 4: say what I think a lot of people probably saw
Speaker 4: over the weekend, reading a headline, flicking through something on
Speaker 4: social media. It seemed like this was a transgender issue,
Speaker 4: and that it was the two female boxers were trans women.
Speaker 1: That is actually not the case.
Speaker 2: So jd Vance tweeted, this is where Kamala Harris's ideas
Speaker 2: about gender lead to a grown man pommeling a woman
Speaker 2: in a boxing match. This is disgusting. All our leaders
Speaker 2: should condemn it. The problem with this is, well, there
Speaker 2: are many problems with this, but is they're missing something
Speaker 2: very important. There is no evidence at all that Calif
Speaker 2: is not exactly who she says. She is a woman
Speaker 2: who has always boxed as a woman, has had a long,
Speaker 2: long career in women's boxing, and has identified as a
Speaker 2: woman since birth.
Speaker 1: She's lost to women. She has made women just like
Speaker 1: every other athlete.
Speaker 2: The IOC president Thomas Back had to make a statement,
Speaker 2: and this is what he said.
Speaker 7: Let's be very clear here. We are talking about women's boxing,
Speaker 7: and we have her two boxers who were born as
Speaker 7: a woman, who have been raised as a woman, who
Speaker 7: have a passport as a woman, and who have competed
Speaker 7: for many years as woman. And this is the clear
Speaker 7: definition of a woman. There was never any doubt about
Speaker 7: them being a woman. What we see now is that
Speaker 7: some her want to own the definition of who is
Speaker 7: a woman.
Speaker 2: After that match, she went on to win her next
Speaker 2: match against a Hungarian boxer. That was a long drawn
Speaker 2: out match. She won it on points. She broke down
Speaker 2: afterwards because the attention around her has become absolutely hysterical.
Speaker 2: There are lots of reporters talking about the hordes of
Speaker 2: presser at these things. Now you know, obviously she is
Speaker 2: just being absolutely pummeled with questions and no doubt online abuse.
Speaker 2: She broke down in tears after that win, and she said,
Speaker 2: this is a matter of dignity and honor for every
Speaker 2: woman or female. For years, I've been boxing in international
Speaker 2: federation competitions. I want to tell the entire world that
Speaker 2: I am a female and I will remain a female. Mia.
Speaker 2: Is this just a big, ugly distraction.
Speaker 1: It is, and it's devastating.
Speaker 4: My heart goes out to Imiani and to the other
Speaker 4: female boxer, the Italian woman that Amiani bate, who withdrew
Speaker 4: from the man and screamed, it's not fair, it's not fair.
Speaker 4: She then clarified, I was talking about my career ending
Speaker 4: this way. She was very careful. She did not say
Speaker 4: anything about that a money shouldn't have competed.
Speaker 2: Because she's also copying a lot of abuse.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I feel so sorry for these athletes, and I think
Speaker 4: that it is such a good example of how people
Speaker 4: will latch onto something and weaponize it to advance a
Speaker 4: cause that they might believe in. The messages in my
Speaker 4: group chats were all like, can someone explain to me
Speaker 4: what this is? Because I thought it was a transgender thing,
Speaker 4: but now I think maybe it's not. But everybody's being
Speaker 4: a little bit opaque about what's going on. I think
Speaker 4: at the heart of it, and if you've watched any
Speaker 4: Olympics or any sport or being to the beach, women
Speaker 4: look a lot of different ways. And if we are
Speaker 4: now going to be looking at women and making judgments
Speaker 4: based on how they look and whether they conform to
Speaker 4: certain stereotypical ideas about what a woman should look like,
Speaker 4: or how they perform, and if they particularly strong or
Speaker 4: particularly good at their sport, which I thought was the
Speaker 4: point of the Olympics, then I think this is just
Speaker 4: the most shocking regressive thing to happen to us. And
Speaker 4: I think it's so important to say this is not
Speaker 4: what people like J. K Rowling and Elon Musk and
Speaker 4: jdie Vans are trying to make you think it is.
Speaker 1: It's not, and these poor women.
Speaker 3: I think it goes beyond the athletes as well. I
Speaker 3: think it's become a full culture thing. Like I have PCOS,
Speaker 3: which means that my testosterone levels are quite high.
Speaker 4: Polycystic ovarian syndrome, Yes, I had that too. I don't
Speaker 4: know if I've got no ovaries anymore, but I had
Speaker 4: that too, and it can What are some of the symptoms, Well.
Speaker 3: Before I was diagnosed. I was diagnosed around fifteen, but
Speaker 3: I had really severe effects from I guess the ages
Speaker 3: of nine up until and then I went on the
Speaker 3: pill and it helped a bit.
Speaker 2: Can have things like facial hair, a.
Speaker 3: Lot of like dark thick facial hair, body hair. My
Speaker 3: voice was deeper. I had like not I guess stereo
Speaker 3: typical woman's body. And at that age I remember like
Speaker 3: the boys in my class because I had more hair
Speaker 3: than them and I had a deeper voice. They would
Speaker 3: ask me, are you a man? And I was probably
Speaker 3: like nine to ten. And then I grew up and
Speaker 3: it felt like every woman understood. Like every woman I
Speaker 3: talked to has been like, oh, yeah, I get facial
Speaker 3: hair as well. Yeah, like it feels like PCOS is
Speaker 3: now being talked about more, and this what happened in
Speaker 3: the boxing ring just shows that it isn't.
Speaker 2: It's also shows the complexity of As I've said before,
Speaker 2: the gender eligibility tests are very complicating because it is
Speaker 2: not as simple as testosterone levels or all kinds of
Speaker 2: different things. So yeah, as Mia said, if you've just
Speaker 2: glanced this story or you've seen some particularly emode of
Speaker 2: imagery being shared around because some of the pictures selection
Speaker 2: has been shocking, shock gemes just always like we've talked
Speaker 2: about rage baiting last week, and this is a bit
Speaker 2: of an example of rage baiting, right, It's like, take
Speaker 2: a breath, see what's really going on? What else is
Speaker 2: happening in the Olympics.
Speaker 4: Well, I thought it would be good to check in
Speaker 4: on the state of the Senn River and all the
Speaker 4: pooh that's been running through it.
Speaker 3: Shouldn't they fix it?
Speaker 4: They spent one and a half billion dollars trying to
Speaker 4: fix it, and the Paris mayor even took a dip
Speaker 4: herself to say nothing to see here the water is safe.
Speaker 1: Oh darling.
Speaker 2: She would have had her mouth close such times like
Speaker 2: don't make me do it?
Speaker 7: Please.
Speaker 2: It's like in Jaws when they were like, you go
Speaker 2: for a swim in that you go for a swim. God,
Speaker 2: I'll show everybody that the beach is safe.
Speaker 4: Out loud As might remember that there was a pooh
Speaker 4: protest by Parisians who were not happy about the Senn
Speaker 4: having all that money spent on it, or perhaps they
Speaker 4: were unhappy about the Olympics coming unclear, but there was
Speaker 4: an organized go poo in the Seinn campaign where you
Speaker 4: got a time where you would have.
Speaker 1: To go anyway.
Speaker 4: So they claimed that it was all okay, but it
Speaker 4: was checked recently and it still has pretty.
Speaker 1: Dangerous high levels of E.
Speaker 4: Coli bacteria, which is essentially pooh.
Speaker 1: Now, the triathlon.
Speaker 4: Happened over the last few days and it look it
Speaker 4: didn't go well for a lot of the athletes who
Speaker 4: had to swim in the Sein.
Speaker 1: They had to push it back.
Speaker 4: Originally they did because there was a lot of rain,
Speaker 4: as we saw in the opening ceremony, and a lot
Speaker 4: of stormwater came into the Sein, and we know what
Speaker 4: storm water is full of. So Canadian athlete you might
Speaker 4: have seen this. It's gone viral. His name's Tyler Mislachuk
Speaker 4: and he came in ninth place in the men's triathlon
Speaker 4: earlier this week. He crossed the finish line and immediately
Speaker 4: started vomiting. He said that he started he vomited times.
Speaker 3: I've actually seen for videos of this.
Speaker 4: Yes, there are pictures of something like a Renaissance painting
Speaker 4: or the car park at the Melbourne Cup. It's just
Speaker 4: athletes vomiting lying on the ground. People weren't great in
Speaker 4: terms of how they felt afterwards. But the men's triathlon
Speaker 4: was actually postponed. But something that I just will never
Speaker 4: be able to get out of my mind. One of
Speaker 4: the male triathletes, American Seth Ryder. He said he had
Speaker 4: a special plan this is before it happened, to combat
Speaker 4: all the E coli. He said that he was going
Speaker 4: to try and increase his body's resistance to it. He said,
Speaker 4: we know there's going to be some E coli exposure,
Speaker 4: so I just tried to increase my E coli threshold
Speaker 4: by exposing myself to a bit of E coli in
Speaker 4: my day to day life. And he said it's backed
Speaker 4: by science. Just little things throughout your day, like not
Speaker 4: washing your hands after you go to the bathroom. Oh no,
Speaker 4: so I mean that's Olympic commitment. Eating your own food.
Speaker 4: It sort of acclimatize your body to eating other people's. Now,
Speaker 4: in case you're wondering, the women triathletes did not have
Speaker 4: a better time. In fact, Belgian triathlete Jolly and Vermelin
Speaker 4: made it sound like she'd lived through a horror film.
Speaker 4: She said, while swimming under the bridge, I felt and
Speaker 4: saw things that we shouldn't think about too much.
Speaker 1: She said. I drank a.
Speaker 4: Lot of river water, so well know tomorrow if I'm
Speaker 4: sick or not. It did not taste like sprite.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I also with the guy who didn't wash his hands,
Speaker 3: I'm like, was it worth it? Like I don't think
Speaker 3: he played.
Speaker 5: That's the worst.
Speaker 3: I really feel bad for these athletes, especially because they
Speaker 3: had no choice. They just had to do it, like
Speaker 3: hold their breath, Well, you have to hold your breath anyway.
Speaker 4: Well, there's a long distance swim happening I think in
Speaker 4: the next few days, which is going to be really bad.
Speaker 3: I think they should have bought I have a new
Speaker 3: Roman Empire check. Tennis players Katerina Sinakova and Thomas Mahach
Speaker 3: have won gold in the mixed doubles tennis tournament. When
Speaker 3: they won, they embraced each other and kissed. Now this
Speaker 3: is a big deal, Like they kissed on the lips
Speaker 3: because they used to date. They were in a relationship
Speaker 3: for four years, and then they broke up just before
Speaker 3: the Olympics, and it cause like this whole content. They
Speaker 3: break up because they wanted to focus on getting gold
Speaker 3: even though they're playing together.
Speaker 4: I would have thought that breaking up would have been
Speaker 4: a distraction because you've got it like four years. Probably
Speaker 4: they are living together, Like you've got to move, you
Speaker 4: gotta find something that's disruptive.
Speaker 2: Do you think it's like you know how there's a
Speaker 2: sex band that some footballers have to have and stuff
Speaker 2: before they play to like really build up that tension.
Speaker 1: I swear god, these people are so committed. We've got
Speaker 1: one guy eating his own poop.
Speaker 4: You've got another couple who were breaking up just so
Speaker 4: that they can focus.
Speaker 1: It seems like it turned out better for them.
Speaker 3: I think it worked out, guys.
Speaker 2: I think also know if they're like, because everybody is
Speaker 2: obsessed now with whether or not they're getting back together
Speaker 2: because they won gold.
Speaker 3: I think they're together. They haven't confirmed, but they cheekily
Speaker 3: said we love making you guys confused. Oh but they
Speaker 3: said it's private between us.
Speaker 2: They know how to play the game.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but I think this is a reason why you
Speaker 3: never date your colleagues, because this is what happened. They
Speaker 3: could be solely responsible for you getting a gold medal
Speaker 3: or not.
Speaker 2: Oh my god. Years ago, Brent was training this like
Speaker 2: walking team who were doing this really like you know,
Speaker 2: one of those charity walks that goes through the night
Speaker 2: twenty four hours. And there was a couple in it
Speaker 2: and they broke up a week before the war and
Speaker 2: I had to walk together and they had to walk
Speaker 2: together for twenty four hours, and they literally wouldn't walk.
Speaker 2: One of them would be sent to it.
Speaker 8: Can you, Brent, can you tell Sally she's not walking
Speaker 8: fast enough? Well, Brent, could you tell Bobby that he's
Speaker 8: being too greedy with that water and he needs to
Speaker 8: share it around?
Speaker 1: That's what this would be like.
Speaker 2: Imagine the coach of the doubles team and she's like,
Speaker 2: can you tell him that he really needs to pull
Speaker 2: his pants out of his bomb? It's very unflattering.
Speaker 4: Well, I've got a theory about working together as a
Speaker 4: couple who has worked together with I've worked on my
Speaker 4: husband for the last.
Speaker 1: Fifteen or more years.
Speaker 4: Sometimes I wonder if every relationship has got it's like
Speaker 4: how long you can go on your tire right before
Speaker 4: the tire wears out, how long your relationship can go.
Speaker 1: And when you work together.
Speaker 4: I wonder if you just wear it out faster, that
Speaker 4: you get to the end of that period of time faster.
Speaker 1: Like dogies like, yeah, like you burn through it faster.
Speaker 3: I think it works if you have a hard like split.
Speaker 3: What I'm thinking happened with these two was that they
Speaker 3: said it was mutual, but obviously then much break up.
Speaker 3: I think they were in a I think they were
Speaker 3: in a situationship just because they kissed at the end,
Speaker 3: so I think there's been something learning. So I don't
Speaker 3: think they fully broke up when they said they broke up.
Speaker 3: I think they were like, let's just separate for a bit,
Speaker 3: let's see what happens when we win.
Speaker 4: I've certainly been in times where I've just gone, oh, look,
Speaker 4: the relationships not great, but it's just would be too
Speaker 4: complicated to break up because we also work together.
Speaker 1: And then you move past it and then you're like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm glad I didn't break up.
Speaker 3: I'm surprised they won because if I was her, I'd
Speaker 3: just be going, oh, I wonder if I'm standing okay,
Speaker 3: is he looking at me? Because he'll probably be back
Speaker 3: there right looking and she'll be in the front.
Speaker 2: They can't have had a feel like a really long
Speaker 2: term relationship. They're not thinking about it.
Speaker 3: They're in a situationship, and I think they're back together.
Speaker 2: We've all heard about the Olympic village beds and how
Speaker 2: they're no good for having sex. I hope they celebrated
Speaker 2: their gold with the hotel room.
Speaker 3: I would have been on the floor.
Speaker 9: Let's talk about royals, please, Let's talk about Harry and Meg's.
Speaker 9: Let's talk about.
Speaker 1: All the good things and the good things.
Speaker 9: That makes them. Let's talk about royals. Let's talk about royals.
Speaker 9: Let's talk about royals. Let's talk about royals.
Speaker 4: In Royal News, the Duke and Duchess of Sussex have
Speaker 4: still not released any jam. I should say the Duchess
Speaker 4: because I don't think the Duke's involved in the jam.
Speaker 1: I check every day. Yeah, and that's the end of
Speaker 1: the segment.
Speaker 3: All the dog biscuits, I'm keen on the dog biscuits.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Harry and Meghan have actually sat down for their
Speaker 4: first TV interview together in three years since they chatted
Speaker 4: to Oprah and we all remember where we were that day.
Speaker 1: And that was a great day of work. Great.
Speaker 4: It really was a preview from the Duke and Duchess.
Speaker 4: I'm just going to call them Harry and Meghan. A
Speaker 4: preview of their conversation from CBS Sunday Morning, a program
Speaker 4: with Jane Pauley, who's like, you know, just like Elsa Wilkinson,
Speaker 4: a very well respected commentator of interviewer journalist. This time
Speaker 4: they're not discussing the royal family. They're discussing the online
Speaker 4: threats facing children and they've launched a new campaign all
Speaker 4: about children and mental health and the impact of social media.
Speaker 4: They've been similar campaigns in Australia. There's been the thirty
Speaker 4: six Months campaign, which we talked about here, which is
Speaker 4: trying to increase the amount of time before which children
Speaker 4: legally allowed to be on social media by three years.
Speaker 4: And they've put together this incredibly moving video that they're
Speaker 4: not in that his interviews with a number of couples
Speaker 4: who have lost children to suicide after things that have
Speaker 4: happened to them on social media. Bullying and harassment. The
Speaker 4: campaign's called no Child Lost to social media, and in
Speaker 4: this interview, Megan revealed her own struggles with mental health
Speaker 4: and suicidal adiation, which she says really made her want
Speaker 4: to do something for kids.
Speaker 10: When you've been through any level of pain or trauma,
Speaker 10: I believe part of our healing journey, certainly part of mine,
Speaker 10: is being able to be really open about it. I
Speaker 10: haven't really scraped the surface on my experience, but I
Speaker 10: do think that I would never want someone else to
Speaker 10: feel that way, and I would never want someone else
Speaker 10: to be making those sort of plans, and I would
Speaker 10: never want someone else to not be believed. If me voicing
Speaker 10: what I have overcome will save someone or asks or
Speaker 10: encourage someone in their life to really genuinely check in
Speaker 10: on them and not assume that the appearance is good
Speaker 10: so everything's okay, then that's worth it. I'll take a
Speaker 10: hit for that anyone watching this or anyone who's able
Speaker 10: to make change, So look at it through the lens
Speaker 10: of what if it was my daughter now?
Speaker 4: As captain of the Eye roll is usually when it
Speaker 4: comes to Harry and Meghan stories, I'm not going to
Speaker 4: go down the path of the predictable respons which is
Speaker 4: they should shut up.
Speaker 1: I don't want to be lectured by them.
Speaker 4: Although I don't like being lectured by them, I think
Speaker 4: this is a really great thing to do for them.
Speaker 4: I think that the criticism has been of the psychobabble.
Speaker 4: You could hear a little bit of it there, and
Speaker 4: I should disclose. At the time we're recording this, the
Speaker 4: full interview hasn't been released, so we haven't actually watched
Speaker 4: the whole thing, but we've seen quite a few excerpts
Speaker 4: of it and read some things about it. So I
Speaker 4: think the backlash is predictable. But surely it's a good
Speaker 4: thing whole, right if they're using their voice or is
Speaker 4: it a bad thing?
Speaker 2: Oh, it's a good thing. It's definitely a good thing.
Speaker 2: The thing that's really interesting about I mean, it just
Speaker 2: speaks of Roman Empires. My obsession with the strategy, the
Speaker 2: Sussex strategy is never ending.
Speaker 1: Because do you think it is?
Speaker 2: Because it's multi pronged, right, So this is part of
Speaker 2: the parents network. They've set up this organization. It's part
Speaker 2: of their arch Well Foundation, which is their sort of
Speaker 2: overarching charitable arm. So in their post rural life have
Speaker 2: different sort of quadrants of business. I guess right, they
Speaker 2: have a portfolio. If they do, they have a portfolio
Speaker 2: career exactly that. So they've got their Netflix Steal, which
Speaker 2: was obviously that documentary that made a bajillion dollars for
Speaker 2: Netflix because it was so massive. And Megan has been
Speaker 2: filming a lifestyle series which, oh, oh my god, I
Speaker 2: just cannot wait. That will be a very happy day
Speaker 2: for me when that drops, and very well placed sources.
Speaker 2: So that's close and that it's real. We don't know
Speaker 2: exactly what form it takes.
Speaker 1: Is it a cooking show.
Speaker 2: I don't think it's exactly a cooking show, but everyone's
Speaker 2: just saying a lifestyle story. And I think that probably
Speaker 2: this is where my jam hole will be filled, because
Speaker 2: surely the jam has come with it. So anyway, we've
Speaker 2: got TV production, We've got Harry's book, which remains one
Speaker 2: of the best selling books of all time and is
Speaker 2: just like a money machine, just churning the dollars into
Speaker 2: that house. They've got the jam, which we don't know
Speaker 2: where that is.
Speaker 1: Where do they keep going on these faux royal tours?
Speaker 2: Then another thing, so and then they've got actual right,
Speaker 2: which is their Charitable arm and this is of that,
Speaker 2: the Parents' Network, and also as part of that are
Speaker 2: these sort of outreach tours they're doing. Earlier this year,
Speaker 2: they went on a trip to Nigeria, which was hailed
Speaker 2: a big success actually, and one of the things and
Speaker 2: now whose point of view.
Speaker 1: Like, what was the point of these trips?
Speaker 2: So the point of these trips is and this this
Speaker 2: all folds in together with what they're talking about now.
Speaker 2: Mental health is their thing, right, So they were there
Speaker 2: in Nigeria at the invitation of one of the military
Speaker 2: defense officials because of Harry's connection to the Invictus Games,
Speaker 2: which is another quadrant, right, So they've got the Invictor's Games,
Speaker 2: and so he was invited there. And so while they're
Speaker 2: five quadrants, Yeah, that's not how quadrants work, is it? Anyway,
Speaker 2: everybod who listens to this, No, math's not my thing.
Speaker 2: It's a very complicated pie chart.
Speaker 4: We have going on now, but anyway, we need a
Speaker 4: bigger pie chart.
Speaker 2: In Nigeria, they were also going to lots of youth
Speaker 2: mental health charities and that's they're going to be doing
Speaker 2: in Columbia. So they've been invited to Columbia by the
Speaker 2: vice president and they are going to go for three
Speaker 2: or four days and they are going to visit lots
Speaker 2: of youth mental health services. The idea is obviously to
Speaker 2: raise awareness, raise funds for different charities, and to you know,
Speaker 2: walk their walk. If you go to the Archwell Foundation
Speaker 2: page the Big Laders, it says show up, do good. Now,
Speaker 2: there are parts of the world where they're more welcome
Speaker 2: to show up and do good than others. Right, they
Speaker 2: can't go to England, for example, because a they are
Speaker 2: very on the nose there with the general public. But
Speaker 2: also Harry has stated on the record quite recently he
Speaker 2: will not take Meghan to England because he worries about
Speaker 2: his safety. They don't get proper police protection there. I mean,
Speaker 2: Columbia is not exactly a safe country, guys. I just
Speaker 2: somebody might need to tell them that. I'm sure they know.
Speaker 2: But it's really interesting because obviously Nigeria was deemed a success,
Speaker 2: so they're going to continue this as part of their strategy.
Speaker 2: And it is as you've said, Mire, it's interesting because
Speaker 2: no one else does that. Right. Sometimes a celebrity will
Speaker 2: go and visit a developing nation as part of their
Speaker 2: ambassadorship with the charity, So that's an equivalent, right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: and celebrity goes I work with U NHCR, so I'm
Speaker 2: going to go and visit a refugee camp in X
Speaker 2: and they'll go and do that. But these sort of
Speaker 2: independent rules, there's no other way of looking at them
Speaker 2: than that they are a mini royal tours. All the
Speaker 2: sources say that the King is very irritated by it,
Speaker 2: as are William and Kate, particularly because they can't go
Speaker 2: anywhere at the minute for all their well documented health reasons.
Speaker 4: Although as we know, yes, so it doesn't dumb question.
Speaker 4: Is Columbia Commonwealth country?
Speaker 2: No, No, it's not right. I will double check that.
Speaker 4: And it doesn't mean that royals don't also do tours
Speaker 4: of non Commonwealth countries. They will often to the United
Speaker 4: States for example.
Speaker 2: Yea, and so they'll have to kind of pick and
Speaker 2: choose their destinations carefully. But it's really interesting because this
Speaker 2: parents Network, which is without question a very good and
Speaker 2: very of the moment campaign, because there's a lot of
Speaker 2: talk at the minute about age gating social media, about
Speaker 2: putting a lot of pressure on big tech companies to
Speaker 2: make their platform safer. We'd all remember the hearings where
Speaker 2: Mark Zuckerberg was faced by the grieving parents of children
Speaker 2: lost to social media bullying. And that's what this is.
Speaker 2: So they are making online bullying in particular a big
Speaker 2: part of their charitable arm.
Speaker 1: Do you like it?
Speaker 3: I don't like it, only because I find what they're
Speaker 3: doing just very confusing. I'm not as across the Royals.
Speaker 3: Too many quadrants, too many quadrants, because I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 3: they want me to buy jam, they want me to
Speaker 3: go to the lifestyle brand, they want me to read
Speaker 3: a book, they want me to listen to a podcast,
Speaker 3: and now they want me to look at mental health
Speaker 3: for kids. And I feel like the mental health kids
Speaker 3: is way too important for me to also be looking
Speaker 3: at all of this other stuff. And it's like they're
Speaker 3: trying to they're minimizing it by being so distracting with
Speaker 3: everything else.
Speaker 4: But hasn't m I mean, I totally get what you're saying.
Speaker 4: Hasn't that always been the case with people choosing to
Speaker 4: use their celebrity to shine a light on charitable causes
Speaker 4: or causes that they believe in. For example, Megan the
Speaker 4: Stallion performing at a rally for Kamala Harris last week
Speaker 4: it's like, is she singer or is she about politics?
Speaker 4: Or Angelina Joli going to these tours in summer heck,
Speaker 4: and lots of other celebrities have done them.
Speaker 3: I agree they a lot of celebrities do this, but
Speaker 3: I think it's the whole like having to announce everything,
Speaker 3: like they announce every little thing they do, and then
Speaker 3: I don't hear from it ever again. And I'm worried
Speaker 3: that this is what's going to happen with the Parents
Speaker 3: Network that I went into. Firstly, navigating their website is
Speaker 3: a whole thing. They used to be like Sussex Royal,
Speaker 3: but now that website's closed or takes you to Sussex
Speaker 3: dot com. And then they have projects like film projects.
Speaker 3: And you said there was a video about Parents Network,
Speaker 3: so I went into their production side. That's a blank page.
Speaker 3: I had to come back out of it, go into
Speaker 3: it like it's so it's I have questions. I went
Speaker 3: through nine pages before I actually found out what we
Speaker 3: were talking about today.
Speaker 2: It's interesting too, because you know, we talked a while
Speaker 2: ago about the female billionaires who are putting their money
Speaker 2: in really good causes, and one of the really effective
Speaker 2: ways they do that is they find out who's the
Speaker 2: best in that space, who's doing the best work in
Speaker 2: that space, and then they give them money so they're
Speaker 2: not necessarily I'm setting up a foundation now, Harry and
Speaker 2: Meg's are very much going the other way. This isn't
Speaker 2: to criticize them, but it's interesting to me that you'd
Speaker 2: start a parent's network that then when I went to
Speaker 2: understand what they do, again, that's confusing because it's like
Speaker 2: they have like support call meanings for parents who are
Speaker 2: struggling with their children with social media. They've got lobbying
Speaker 2: groups to try and pray. But it's all very bitsy again,
Speaker 2: and it feels like the messaging is confusing. However, I
Speaker 2: want to press on the fact that you are opening
Speaker 2: your arms to this mea, which is great because one
Speaker 2: of the criticisms of Megan and I have to say
Speaker 2: that any time I open x formerly known as Twitter,
Speaker 2: which I do only really for professional purposes, there is
Speaker 2: not a day that I won't open that when some
Speaker 2: version I hate Megan Markel or Megan Mirkle is a
Speaker 2: complete monster, isn't trending? She cops an enormous amount of
Speaker 2: online hate for reasons that we've talked about many times,
Speaker 2: but usually there is a certain portion of the Internet
Speaker 2: that ayrol's so hard. As you mentioned about her claiming
Speaker 2: sort of what you could frame as victim status, but
Speaker 2: you really understand what she's talking about when she talks
Speaker 2: about the effect that all that online bullying had on her, Right.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I do, because I think that anyone who has
Speaker 4: been attacked online or canceled, or been at the receiving
Speaker 4: end of a huge amount of online hate for whatever reason,
Speaker 4: they all pretty much say the same thing.
Speaker 1: They all say, I had.
Speaker 4: Suicidal ideation because I did not know what else to do,
Speaker 4: and I did not know how to make it stop.
Speaker 4: So I think it's good that she's saying that, and
Speaker 4: it's something that we've heard and that we need to
Speaker 4: continue to hear, because when people are just like, oh,
Speaker 4: she's famous, she's rich, she doesn't care, she's basically saying, no,
Speaker 4: I did care, and it did affect me. What's a
Speaker 4: little tricky is threading that needle back to someone going.
Speaker 4: And I think her logic is I want people to
Speaker 4: know that if it could happen to me, with all
Speaker 4: of my privilege and power, what hope is there for kids?
Speaker 4: Because their kids are very little. Obviously, they're not experienced
Speaker 4: as parents, so they can't come out and talk about
Speaker 4: this from the point of view of parents, except hypothetically
Speaker 4: in the future, because they've never experienced it yet.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 4: If you'd look at that and go like, I don't
Speaker 4: know what I'm meant to do. I mean, as far
Speaker 4: as awareness, yes, but I think that back to your
Speaker 4: point whole about a lot of philanthropists, mostly women, Mackenzie Bezos,
Speaker 4: Melinda Gates, and Lauren Powell jobs. A lot of those
Speaker 4: women give money to these big charities and the amazing
Speaker 4: rather than saying they're going to do it themselves. But
Speaker 4: Harry and Meghan would argue that they don't have money
Speaker 4: to give. They're not billionaires.
Speaker 1: And it's true. Not everybody does have money to give.
Speaker 4: Some people volunteer their time, some people volunteer their fame,
Speaker 4: and that's what they're essentially doing. They're like, look, the
Speaker 4: media is going to be interested in whatever we have
Speaker 4: to say, so we may as well use that attention
Speaker 4: to say something positive.
Speaker 1: And I agree with you.
Speaker 4: We are very uncomfortable with this idea of mixed messages,
Speaker 4: even though that is what everybody's doing now. Like Jennifer
Speaker 4: Aniston's got her hair products and she's also on TV
Speaker 4: and she's also speaking out about Jadie Vance and Child's
Speaker 4: cat Ladies. I feel like and almost if someone stays
Speaker 4: in just one lane. Taylor Swift is often criticized for
Speaker 4: not using her platform to speak out about all of
Speaker 4: these social issues, but I think it speaks to Harry
Speaker 4: and Meghan and their brand and the sort of the
Speaker 4: impatient and some cynicism that everything's greeted with.
Speaker 1: I don't know what the way out of that would be.
Speaker 3: I'm just worried about what happens because we say they
Speaker 3: don't have money and they're relying on donations for this
Speaker 3: parent network, which is meant to be I guess, like
Speaker 3: a forum for parents to connect and talk to each other.
Speaker 4: The world doesn't need another one, like everyone doesn't need
Speaker 4: to start their own foundation.
Speaker 1: To me, that speaks of more.
Speaker 4: Ego because there are people who are in the grassroots
Speaker 4: organizations who've been doing this, who are set up to
Speaker 4: do it, who are qualified to do it.
Speaker 1: You don't need to replicate that.
Speaker 3: And what happens when the donations run out and all
Speaker 3: these parents are in this group.
Speaker 2: It is interesting as I say, I obsess about their strategy,
Speaker 2: but watching the video part of this not as it's
Speaker 2: very high production values, like it's very good, right, so
Speaker 2: I can see that they're sitting there. Everything's taking a
Speaker 2: long time if it's to roll out, probably because they're
Speaker 2: doing it well, right, they're doing it really well, in
Speaker 2: a really considered way. But it is just like, I
Speaker 2: don't know. I agree, it's kind of scatter gun. But
Speaker 2: I also think that MEA's right and that we all
Speaker 2: want to roll our eyes at them because we're like, well,
Speaker 2: what are they? We don't understand what they are anymore?
Speaker 2: Are you royal? Are you famous? Are you business people?
Speaker 2: Are you charitable for?
Speaker 7: Like?
Speaker 2: What are you? And the thing is, as you've pointed
Speaker 2: out me is these days I don't know that you
Speaker 2: have to pick a lane.
Speaker 4: I also think that they are doing something that no
Speaker 4: one's done before because they're royal, but they're living in
Speaker 4: la and they're making money and they're not under the
Speaker 4: umbrella of the royal family.
Speaker 1: There's a reason that we're all confused.
Speaker 4: It's because they are forging a new path, which is
Speaker 4: why they wanted to leave in the first place.
Speaker 1: Do you want daily outloud access. Why wouldn't you?
Speaker 4: We drop episodes every Tuesday and Thursday exclusively for Mum
Speaker 4: and MEA subscribers.
Speaker 1: Follow the link in the show notes to get us
Speaker 1: in your.
Speaker 4: Ears five days a week, and a huge thank you
Speaker 4: if you're already a subscriber.
Speaker 3: Writer Ann Helen Peterson, who has a newsletter called culture Stuf.
Speaker 3: He wrote about a unified theory of Glenn Powell.
Speaker 2: So, Glen, I'm so jealous. I wanted to write this
Speaker 2: after I saw Twisters. Should have done it.
Speaker 3: I should have done as well. So Glen Powell's like
Speaker 3: a big movie star right now. He was in Twisters.
Speaker 3: Recently he's been in Top Gun, He's been in the
Speaker 3: Idea of View with Sidney Sweeney.
Speaker 2: We suddenly caught the public's imagination in a big way.
Speaker 3: In it, she talked about how she never really got him,
Speaker 3: she found him kind of bland and boring because she
Speaker 3: never watched anything with him in And then she started
Speaker 3: watching movies with him in it and starring in it,
Speaker 3: and she immediately became obsessed, like to the point where
Speaker 3: she would watch tiktoks of him, interviews with him. So
Speaker 3: she came up with these ideas on why she thinks
Speaker 3: she went from him being like bland and like nothing
Speaker 3: to her to becoming obsessed with him, And one of
Speaker 3: the theories was because he likes women. So she says,
Speaker 3: it's different than knowing you can get women, or wanting
Speaker 3: to control women, or even loving women. He likes them,
Speaker 3: He appreciates them, he enjoys their company. So it's about
Speaker 3: the idea of how women like celebrity men who also
Speaker 3: like women. And then she went into all the other
Speaker 3: celebrity men who like or not like that.
Speaker 4: Men such an interesting lens on it, because yeah, it's
Speaker 4: not about men who love women in a I want
Speaker 4: to call the women way, or even just like women
Speaker 4: are so sexy. It's men who are comfortable around women,
Speaker 4: who like women.
Speaker 1: That's so interesting.
Speaker 2: Her evidence for this seems to be it's his persona
Speaker 2: right both on enough screen. So if you're also like,
Speaker 2: who the hell's Glenn Powell. He played the sort of
Speaker 2: battie in Top Gun Maverick. Yeah, and he is in
Speaker 2: Someone Like You and all those things, and he is like,
Speaker 2: he's handsome, but he's not like you would fall down
Speaker 2: dead hands. But the thing is, as soon as you
Speaker 2: see him on screen, and in these roles that she's
Speaker 2: talking about, his riz is so.
Speaker 1: Really, what's his vibe?
Speaker 2: His vibe is very very hot.
Speaker 4: Compare him to another celebrity that I'm might not.
Speaker 2: So the most. No, he's not gonna Paul Mescal's to torture.
Speaker 2: He's not tortured at all. Travis Kelsey, No, No, but
Speaker 2: his vibe is the thing I thought when I saw Twisters,
Speaker 2: And it might have been about the cowboy hat, but
Speaker 2: do you remember the first time he saw Thelma and
Speaker 2: Louise and you saw Brad Pitt the first time? Right,
Speaker 2: it was like this energy on the screen, like you're
Speaker 2: talking about your sexual awaken you.
Speaker 1: I don't even know what you're.
Speaker 2: Talking It's not it's like it's the energy of it.
Speaker 2: Like you're sure he's beautiful, but you could be a
Speaker 2: model and you're not, Like you look nice, but you
Speaker 2: don't have the vibe. It's just and this is this energy,
Speaker 2: this playful friend.
Speaker 4: Kay, So tell me what are some other celebrities that
Speaker 4: like women in this same way?
Speaker 3: So I'm going to read at the excerpt that she
Speaker 3: wrote in her newsletter. Tom Cruise doesn't like women. Neither
Speaker 3: does Miles Teller Channing Tatum likes women, so does Ryan Gosling.
Speaker 3: Brad Pitt used to like women, but doesn't anymore. Leonardo
Speaker 3: DiCaprio only likes them occasionally. By Cooper doesn't. George Cliney does,
Speaker 3: Matt Damon doesn't. Ben Affleck only does in that one
Speaker 3: scene in the j Loo documentary. Marlon Brando didn't, Montgomery
Speaker 3: Cliff did. Paul Newman didn't on screen, but did I R. L.
Speaker 3: Carrie Grant did. John Wayne definitely definitely didn't. Will Smith
Speaker 3: pretends he doesn't, but I'm not convinced. Mark Wahlberg absolutely
Speaker 3: does not. But Daniel day Lewis does. So does yes, so.
Speaker 4: Does Paul Mescal likes women. Okay, I'm going to add
Speaker 4: a few politicians. Obama likes women, likes women very much.
Speaker 4: Albow likes women definitely. Scott Morrison doesn't like women. Boris
Speaker 4: Johnson likes women. I would say, obviously doesn't like women.
Speaker 4: Joe Biden just too old.
Speaker 2: I don't know. One of the pieces of evidence here,
Speaker 2: and you will Jadvan hates women. He hates men, my goodness,
Speaker 2: he hates them. One of the pieces of evidence here
Speaker 2: is how they treat their coastars right so you know,
Speaker 2: how big movie. Then you go on the tour and
Speaker 2: it's like you've got to hang out with in Twister's case,
Speaker 2: Daisy Egga Jones, who's his co star, who is in
Speaker 2: normal people, who's in you know all that stuff. Often
Speaker 2: what will happen is everyone think they're dating, which is
Speaker 2: what happened with him and Sydney Sweeney. But they weren't,
Speaker 2: or at least it doesn't seem so. But there's a
Speaker 2: lot of affection and piss taking and like friendly between them.
Speaker 2: He looks at them like he likes them. He's not creepy.
Speaker 2: And I think that women have a very good radar
Speaker 2: for this because in real life we do right, you
Speaker 2: know how, When men these days will often say.
Speaker 1: Oh, you can't even talk to a woman in a
Speaker 1: bar anymore, or.
Speaker 2: You can't flirt with a woman at work or whatever,
Speaker 2: it's sort of very confusing. And I think that women
Speaker 2: fundamentally understand that it's not confusing because we know when
Speaker 2: someone is talking to us in a playful, respectful, flirty way,
Speaker 2: and when someone is being a creep. It's hard to articulate,
Speaker 2: but we know it and we see it when we
Speaker 2: see the glen Powells or the Channing Tatums sort of
Speaker 2: be playful and friendly and respectful of the women around
Speaker 2: them rather than pervy, creepy, diminishing.
Speaker 4: Okay, I want to throw out some more names. Okay,
Speaker 4: Robert Downey Jr.
Speaker 3: I don't think he likes women.
Speaker 2: He likes his wife, but I don't think he's allowed
Speaker 2: to like any other women, because that's the sobriety issue.
Speaker 1: Ryan Gosling Death like women.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And the way you can tell that is that
Speaker 2: obviously he's in a long term relationship and he's very
Speaker 2: respectful of her, but he is really friendly and playful
Speaker 2: with all his co stars. Emma Stone, Oh my god.
Speaker 3: I don't even think it's a creepy thing. It's more
Speaker 3: like an attention thing, like you can tell, Like, say
Speaker 3: we were all at dinner together and our waiter was
Speaker 3: George Quinney. He would come and give each of us
Speaker 3: individual time, asking for our order, making eye contact. If
Speaker 3: it was Bradley Cooper, he'd come look at one of us,
Speaker 3: be like she's a hot one in the group, and
Speaker 3: like turn his back to the rest of us because
Speaker 3: maybe I don't want to say it, but Jacquemin like
Speaker 3: like Swimen Harry styles like like swimmen.
Speaker 2: If they give him attention, don't say anything about it.
Speaker 4: Travis Kelsey, I can't My Roman Empire is this bit
Speaker 4: of vision that I saw of him at one of
Speaker 4: the year's tours in the vip box and someone was
Speaker 4: filming and Julia Roberts came up to him. I don't
Speaker 4: know if you've seen it. She was also in the
Speaker 4: vip box, right, and she was talking to him, and
Speaker 4: she had her hands on his chest, one hand on
Speaker 4: it side of his chest, and she was sort of
Speaker 4: touching him on his chest while she was talking, and
Speaker 4: she was being very effusive about something Taylor probably.
Speaker 1: I'm sure. And what he did was such an interesting thing.
Speaker 4: He put his hands on her hands to try and
Speaker 4: take them off him, and I could see the mental
Speaker 4: struggle of I don't really want her touching me, but
Speaker 4: I don't want to be rude, and I don't like
Speaker 4: I'm a much bigger guy. But I also really struck
Speaker 4: me as just the most upstanding. It told me a
Speaker 4: lot about who he is, and that's why I think
Speaker 4: he's not a man who's threatened by women. The media
Speaker 4: would have found something in his past if he'd been
Speaker 4: a dickhead nothing.
Speaker 1: I think he really likes women.
Speaker 3: I think he likes Taylor Swift.
Speaker 2: Didn't he want to go on a reality show?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 2: Girlfriend?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 2: And was he really nice to all that too? I
Speaker 2: think he was.
Speaker 3: Okay, we'll give him the benefit. I think Jason Kelsey
Speaker 3: likes women.
Speaker 2: Yes, brother.
Speaker 4: I think that they've been brought up by really strong
Speaker 4: mother who's taught them that women are great.
Speaker 2: I'm they're the best kind of guys.
Speaker 1: Is a good guy, You're proud.
Speaker 2: I'll be really upset if something comes because we always
Speaker 2: talk about how I guess all movie stars are good
Speaker 2: dudes until it's proved that they're not right, until something
Speaker 2: slips out and you're like, oh.
Speaker 4: Tim challame, Oh well, I was thinking about challow May
Speaker 4: what I don't think.
Speaker 2: I don't think he likes I don't think that's a
Speaker 2: real shame.
Speaker 4: And to be clear, we're not talking about misogyny any
Speaker 4: We're just talking about like kind of doesn't want to
Speaker 4: hang out, which just doesn't like their company.
Speaker 2: Really out louders.
Speaker 4: We want to hear from you about which men you
Speaker 4: think do or don't like women.
Speaker 1: You might have disagree. We're not the arbiters of this.
Speaker 1: It's just a really a vibe check. It's a vibe check.
Speaker 2: It's a vibe check. He's also very good at leaning
Speaker 2: into holding his puppy, like he knows how to play
Speaker 2: the game. He's got a puppy and he's always you
Speaker 2: know a lot about him, oh mate, And I don't
Speaker 2: even fancy him. I'm just obsessed with, like the the
Speaker 2: birth of a movie star. He's very ambitious. You can
Speaker 2: tell he's like, I am going to ride this train,
Speaker 2: and he's doing it very well.
Speaker 5: Hi Jesse, Holly and maya long time listener about loud
Speaker 5: Beck from Melbourne. I just wanted to say, firstly, you.
Speaker 6: Guys are amazing and I could send you a voice
Speaker 6: message and you've received several of mine all the time,
Speaker 6: but I don't want to bother you too much because
Speaker 6: I just my brain pops every time I listen to
Speaker 6: our Loud.
Speaker 5: But I revisited one of your subscriber sessions subscriber sort
Speaker 5: of episodes today back I think it was a couple
Speaker 5: of years ago around phases and seasons of life and
Speaker 5: when your seasons are different to your friends, which I've
Speaker 5: always kind of found that my seasons are a bit
Speaker 5: of Celtic because I don't have kids. I'm very much
Speaker 5: mit now.
Speaker 6: And I've got friends who are in the same boat.
Speaker 6: But I'm now also not working, looking for work, but
Speaker 6: enjoying not working. And again, different season and you just
Speaker 6: your episode just I'd re listened to it because I
Speaker 6: remembered it from before, and it's so important that we
Speaker 6: are kind to ourselves and we remember that it's only
Speaker 6: a season and things can wax and way, and sometimes
Speaker 6: you're always out of sync with your mates and sometimes
Speaker 6: you're not, and whatever it is, it's okay to enjoy
Speaker 6: life and just keep listening to Mom and Me Are
Speaker 6: Out Loud and other Muma Me a podcast because that
Speaker 6: just Enrich's life, but very thoughtful, thought provoking and life
Speaker 6: affirming really and I just always feel seen by you guys.
Speaker 6: So I just wanted to say thanks.
Speaker 2: Massive, thank you out loud as for listening to today's show,
Speaker 2: and of course to all our fabulous team for putting
Speaker 2: this show together. Hey listen if you liked that little
Speaker 2: show I made recently called mid with the Talented People
Speaker 2: that Mum were back in your rays tomorrow, So good
Speaker 2: season two.
Speaker 1: Who's of the first episode?
Speaker 2: First episode is about sex, my friends, about your sex life,
Speaker 2: not about my sex life. It's about a woman called
Speaker 2: Leslie Morgan who's an American writer, and she when she
Speaker 2: was forty nine, her marriage fell apart. Husband did not
Speaker 2: like women, let's just put that out there. And she
Speaker 2: had been in a sexless, disappointing marriage for a long time,
Speaker 2: and she was about to turn fifty, and so she
Speaker 2: decided to really rev up her sexual identity and find
Speaker 2: at least five lovers in the first gem and she did,
Speaker 2: and her stories are fantastic and it's really great. And
Speaker 2: also big thank you to all that out loud as
Speaker 2: admitterers who sent me their little sex tipbits for my intro.
Speaker 2: Anyway back in your ears tomorrow, friends, wherever you get
Speaker 2: your podcasts, and of course Mama Mia out loud is
Speaker 2: also back in your ears tomorrow for all subscribers. See
Speaker 2: you then by