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Speaker 1: You're listening to I'm Ama Mia podcast.

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Speaker 2: Mama Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on.

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Speaker 3: Makeup is My Therapy.

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Speaker 1: I'm in love, I'm obsessed and I don't even feel

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Speaker 1: guilty about it.

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Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to you Beauty, the daily podcast for

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Speaker 2: Your Face. I'm Aaron Dougherty and welcome to the formula.

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Speaker 2: Every week I sit down with celebs, experts, and some

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Speaker 2: of the biggest names in beauty and take a look

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Speaker 2: into their skincare of tenes and if you've been scrolling

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Speaker 2: through social media lately, you might have noticed a rising

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Speaker 2: trend in the beauty world cosmetic acupuncture. It seems like

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Speaker 2: this ancient practice is making a massive comeback as people

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Speaker 2: search for natural alternatives to injectables and invasive procedures. Today,

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Speaker 2: I'm thrilled to be sitting down with doctor Lilly, a

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Speaker 2: Chinese medicine practitioner specializing in acupuncture, cupping and quigong across

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Speaker 2: regional New South Wales. She's helping clients transform their health

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Speaker 2: and skin using techniques at date back thousands of years.

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Speaker 3: So today we're going to be.

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Speaker 2: Diving into acupuncture treatments and whether these tiny needles can

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Speaker 2: actually reduce wrinkles, lift sagging skin, and create a glowing appearance.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Lily is going to explain what's happening beneath the

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Speaker 2: surface when those tiny needles go in, and why so

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Speaker 2: many people are turning to this natural approach for wellness

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Speaker 2: and beauty. So, whether you're dealing with dullness, battling breakouts,

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Speaker 2: or you're simply curious about alternatives to conventional treatments, this

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Speaker 2: episode is for you. Plus we'll get into the nitty

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Speaker 2: gritty of how to maximize your results with the right

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Speaker 2: skincare routine, products that complement acupuncture treatments, and Doctor Lilly

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Speaker 2: will share her insights on how Chinese medicine approaches beauty

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Speaker 2: from within. So let's get into it.

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Speaker 1: You are such beautiful skill, but how hello doctor Lilly.

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Speaker 2: Thank you so much for coming on the show today.

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Speaker 2: I've been seeing so much about cosmetic acupuncture lately. My

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Speaker 2: Instagram is suddenly full of people with needles sticking out

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Speaker 2: of their faces, but they all look surprisingly relaxed. So

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Speaker 2: I've brought you in here. I need to pick your brain.

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Speaker 2: Thank you so much for coming on the show.

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Speaker 1: I appreciate it. So much. There is that calm serenity

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Speaker 1: that you see through that social media feed of all

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Speaker 1: of those intense needles.

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Speaker 2: It looks terrifying, but everyone looks like they're having a

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Speaker 2: good time. So I need to find out more about it.

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Speaker 2: I want to start with the basics here.

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Speaker 3: Acupunctures. It's often seen as a mystical practice.

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Speaker 2: Can you give us a little bit of a rundown

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Speaker 2: on exactly what it is and what's happening in the

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Speaker 2: body when all those little tiny needles go in.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely well, you're quite right, and when you say that

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Speaker 1: it is mystical and Chinese medicine, acupuncture as a whole

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Speaker 1: has a very very deep, rich history through China, So

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Speaker 1: that in itself is something that speaks volumes because it's

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Speaker 1: made it into the twenty first century with a lot

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Speaker 1: of credibility and a lot of background research. And we're

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Speaker 1: looking at how energy and circulation impact overall help and

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Speaker 1: that is what these different lines and channels on these

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Speaker 1: different charts and things that people would see around about acupuncture,

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Speaker 1: that's what we're really talking about. We're talking about this

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Speaker 1: internal pathway of energy as well as physical matter, and

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Speaker 1: that's what acupuncture is tapping into again. It all sort

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Speaker 1: of depends on your belief system and your own personal

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Speaker 1: understanding of what you think health is. But the bottom

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Speaker 1: line is it's very very effective, otherwise I wouldn't be

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Speaker 1: practicing in well.

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Speaker 2: I've seen some really great results on social media, and

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Speaker 2: I guess that's why I really want to dive into

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Speaker 2: the cosmetic acupuncture technique itself. But I also saw that

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Speaker 2: you offer things like cupping and some thing called is

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Speaker 2: it qui gong am?

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Speaker 3: I saying that.

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Speaker 1: Right, chigong? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Oh, tell me a little bit about how these different

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Speaker 2: Chinese medical practices work together for you know, overall wellness

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Speaker 2: and beauty.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely. So if you try and imagine an octopus and

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Speaker 1: you name that octopus Chinese medicine, every arm is going

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Speaker 1: to have some purpose. So one tentacle or one arm

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Speaker 1: might be cupping, which is great for moving fluid, it's

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Speaker 1: great for contouring in terms of facial cupping when you're

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Speaker 1: looking at the cosmetic world, and so is one of

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Speaker 1: those lovely things that is quite accessible and easy to

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Speaker 1: do at home. The same with things like glasha and

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Speaker 1: the rolling that's become really popular. So there's parts of

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Speaker 1: Chinese medicine that can be accessed by the everyday person.

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Speaker 1: And then there are parts of Chinese medicine that are

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Speaker 1: a little bit more specialized, like needling and chigong is

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Speaker 1: form of exercise therapy. So that's another tentacle of the

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Speaker 1: octopus that's looking at how movement keeps us healthy.

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Speaker 2: That's so interesting, QUI going, Okay, I'm not going to

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Speaker 2: embarrass myself again and say how I said it. I

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Speaker 2: love that analogy of the octopus. And you know, there's

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Speaker 2: so many different techniques that give you that holistic, overall

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Speaker 2: approach to well being and beauty.

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Speaker 1: Exactly because there's so much dynamism and movement and possibility

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Speaker 1: with one of those tentacles or one of those branches,

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Speaker 1: people forget that it's actually a whole octopus. So that's

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Speaker 1: where you get that exciting natural benefit through cosmetic acupunction.

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Speaker 3: Amazing.

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Speaker 2: Well, that's what I wanted to ask you a little

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Speaker 2: bit more about. There's obviously been a surge in people

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Speaker 2: turning to this form of treatment instead of things like injectables.

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Speaker 2: Tell me a little bit about what's happening on a

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Speaker 2: cellular levels that makes it effective for things like anti aging,

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Speaker 2: whether it's fine lines and wrinkles, you know, dullness in

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Speaker 2: the skin.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, So again, if I can kind of dip into

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Speaker 1: that aquatic analogy, I had a beautiful teacher at university

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Speaker 1: who taught biology, and she described the effects of acupuncture

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Speaker 1: as looking at the internal pH yucidity and alkaline nature

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Speaker 1: of a fish tank. The same thing is happening in

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Speaker 1: the human body. We are full of fluid and intracellular

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Speaker 1: fluid and extracellular fluid. Acupuncture has a very very profound

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Speaker 1: effect on balancing that internal fish tank environment without us

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Speaker 1: actually having to do anything extra. Needles tap into that

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Speaker 1: naturally and help balance that system that has that knock

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Speaker 1: on effect of our skin. The same way you would

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Speaker 1: look at a fish tank and go oh, the water's murky,

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Speaker 1: but there's something up, and the same with acupuncture. You know,

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Speaker 1: you can look at someone's face and go, oh, complexion

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Speaker 1: is red or dull or pale or lotchy, so there's

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Speaker 1: something up.

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Speaker 2: Well, as someone who is very pregnant right now, and

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Speaker 2: how is all the fluid for about ten people, I

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Speaker 2: feel like this could be a very good time for

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Speaker 2: my face. I've obviously not been having any injectible treatments.

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Speaker 2: Tell me a little bit about the benefits of acupunction.

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Speaker 2: Can it really lift and firm the face? And how

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Speaker 2: does it compare to treatments like facials or injectibles like

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Speaker 2: anti wrinkle injections or fillers or whatnot.

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Speaker 1: So facials as in terms of gentle massage and getting

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Speaker 1: that kind of work done in a salon versus injectibles,

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Speaker 1: that's a huge sliding scale because you're talking about introducing

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Speaker 1: a foreign matter into the body directly, which would never

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Speaker 1: happen in nature. You're not really going to fall on

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Speaker 1: a needle full of botox. In nature, maybe you're going

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Speaker 1: to get stung by something or run into a plant

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Speaker 1: or something like that, and that's going to have its

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Speaker 1: own effects. But what we've really done with inject stables

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Speaker 1: is introduce this really really extreme substance into the body,

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Speaker 1: and not everyone is instinctively okay with that, just because

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Speaker 1: we have this world around us that feeds into our

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Speaker 1: sense of insecurity. What we think beauty is what our

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Speaker 1: self value sits at. It's much much nicer to gravitate

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Speaker 1: towards those gentler interventions for our skin because they're more forgiving,

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Speaker 1: whereas those intense interventions like injectibles. That's where you tend

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Speaker 1: to hear more horror story.

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Speaker 2: I feel like we're in an interesting stage right now

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Speaker 2: in terms of injectable treatments and you know what we're

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Speaker 2: doing to our faces. I feel like there is a

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Speaker 2: little bit of a shift in terms of how we

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Speaker 2: approach aging and how we're embracing treatments that are a

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Speaker 2: little bit less invasive.

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Speaker 1: So this is just started or well spotted, and that's

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Speaker 1: an exciting thing when you talk to a lot of

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Speaker 1: people who go, oh, is the world really going in

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Speaker 1: this direction?

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Speaker 2: Tell me a little bit about different approaches that you

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Speaker 2: might take in terms of tackling different skin issues when

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Speaker 2: it comes to cosmetic acupuncture. So if someone's struggling with

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Speaker 2: things like acne or rosasia, are there different approaches that

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Speaker 2: you would take.

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Speaker 1: In terms of looking at that octopus analogy? Again, what

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Speaker 1: you really have to do is diagnose the underlying condition

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Speaker 1: of what is causing that redness. So you might have

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Speaker 1: ten people in front of you, all with red skin.

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Speaker 1: The unique thing about Chinese medicine is that it would

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Speaker 1: say all of these different red skin conditions could possibly

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Speaker 1: arise from different internal states. So let's give attention to

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Speaker 1: the individual. Let's look at that person's unique constitutions. Instead

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Speaker 1: of saying to the world, oh you have red skin,

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Speaker 1: that means this. It says your body is unique, find

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Speaker 1: out about you. Not one product is going to work

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Speaker 1: for everyone, but it's up to us as individuals to

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Speaker 1: have that unique intelligence that we've always tapped into and

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Speaker 1: use that again in terms of diet products, what we

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Speaker 1: respond to in terms of our sleep routines and our

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Speaker 1: massage routines.

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Speaker 2: And I think that's becoming such a common thing, even

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Speaker 2: just with Di Whi, Skinker and Diddy at home. As

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Speaker 2: you mentioned, Guasha and facial massaging and all these different

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Speaker 2: kinds of techniques that are drawn from traditional Chinese medicine.

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Speaker 3: You've kind of.

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Speaker 2: Touched on it before in terms of the octopus analogy,

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Speaker 2: But there's that idea that acupuncture can help you with

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Speaker 2: just upping that glow or radiance of your skin. Tell

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Speaker 2: me again, what's the mechanism behind that. Is it more circulation,

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Speaker 2: is it the lymphatic drainage. Is it just a combination

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Speaker 2: of all of the above.

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Speaker 1: It's a lot of delightful things happening at once. So

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Speaker 1: it's the things that you mentioned, plus a lot more

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Speaker 1: so we're talking about how skin is absorbing, how pores

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Speaker 1: are opening and closing, how blood circulation is moving through

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Speaker 1: superficial blood vessels and deeper blood vessels, because that will

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Speaker 1: impact things like coloration, dullness, and it's that glow that

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Speaker 1: we want, right And that's all about If you look

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Speaker 1: at Chinese medicine, it loves to simplify things into yin

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Speaker 1: and yang, fire and water. You get that lovely mysterious

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Speaker 1: poetry that comes along with Chinese medicine. So straight away,

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Speaker 1: the majority of what's going on with skin conditions is dehydration,

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Speaker 1: the simplest thing.

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Speaker 2: I can feel that a lot right now as someone

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Speaker 2: who needs to up their hydration a little bit. I

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Speaker 2: want to move on to the routine. I want to ask,

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Speaker 2: are there any specific kind of skin care products or

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Speaker 2: ingredients that help with these acupuncture results? Like should someone

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Speaker 2: focus on specific ingredients in their skin caredine?

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Speaker 1: It really is one of those exciting things where it says, Okay,

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Speaker 1: if your skin type is oily, then you need to

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Speaker 1: find a compatible product with that that might be more suitable,

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Speaker 1: something like hemp oil, or if your skin is more

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Speaker 1: prone to dryness. Then we need to look at a

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Speaker 1: product that's going to give you a lot of moisture,

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Speaker 1: something like Maringa oil. So again, it's about having someone

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Speaker 1: that you trust and doing your own personal research and

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Speaker 1: experimentation with products. And I'm always a big fan of

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Speaker 1: please flip that thing over and read the back.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes it can seem too complicated, but there's a lot

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Speaker 2: of information I feel that we just take from the

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Speaker 2: marketing slap on the front of packaging and we don't

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Speaker 2: read that to your back of the ingredients place right.

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Speaker 1: And just understanding the face as a skin structure in

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Speaker 1: comparison to the rest of the body. The face has very,

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Speaker 1: very delicate skin arounding all of its structures, particularly around

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Speaker 1: the eyes. We're using things like coconut oil, which a

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Speaker 1: lot of people will see is more naturalistic, is not

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Speaker 1: always ideal for the faith because we want those paws

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Speaker 1: to be able to breathe. So we're looking at how

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Speaker 1: we can maintain that glow, that beauty, that cosmetic aspect

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Speaker 1: right alongside am I healthy?

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Speaker 2: Does acupuncture actually help skincare absorb better? I know you

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Speaker 2: mentioned about the pores and how it obviously increases circulation

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Speaker 2: and lymphatic flow. Is skin care absorption an effect of

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Speaker 2: this as well.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, the great thing about acupuncture is that it can

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Speaker 1: work on improving your absorption pathways not only through your skin,

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Speaker 1: but through your digestive system and through your digestive tract.

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Speaker 1: So having that added effect, you might be taking a

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Speaker 1: lot of collagen, you might be taking a lot of supplements,

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Speaker 1: you might be taking a lot of nutrients, and people

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Speaker 1: should stop after a year and say is that effective?

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Speaker 1: Is that working? Is that doing something for me? If not,

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Speaker 1: we potentially have an absorption problem somewhere in the body

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Speaker 1: and that gets addressed with acupuncture points as well.

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Speaker 2: And are there any ingredients that you'd tell your clients

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Speaker 2: to completely avoid before or after acupuncture? Is there any

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Speaker 2: ingredients that could potentially interfere with treatment, like retinol or all.

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Speaker 1: Of those high steroidal creams and all of those heavily

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Speaker 1: medicated different aspects that people have prescribed need to be

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Speaker 1: used carefully alongside with acupuncture. It becomes one of those

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Speaker 1: things where you don't want to interfere with anyone's pharmaceutical

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Speaker 1: routine alongside what you're doing for their skin care. But

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Speaker 1: it's something that you can always avoid on the day,

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Speaker 1: and then that lets you know is acupuncture working or

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Speaker 1: am I looking at the effects of what I've been

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Speaker 1: using on the side. But natural is always best. So

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Speaker 1: if you come in for your cosmetic with fresh skin,

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Speaker 1: that allows for your practitioner to use an appropriate healthy

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Speaker 1: oil or lubricant and you can go on your way

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Speaker 1: and see how compatible that is.

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Speaker 3: That's a really good intel.

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Speaker 2: Tell me, if someone's really terrified of needles, what's your

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Speaker 2: best pitch to convince them to give face you like

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Speaker 2: you puncture or try.

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Speaker 1: Well, you don't need needles, you don't need a lot.

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Speaker 1: It's always a really really great thing to say to someone.

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Speaker 1: Let's just start with one small point and if that's

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Speaker 1: not okay, then that's absolutely fine. There are lots of

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Speaker 1: other techniques that we can try that are less invasive,

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Speaker 1: so you can still get good benefits without compromising someone's

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Speaker 1: sense of safety. But most people find after they try

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Speaker 1: one needle that they've probably stepped on a bindi on

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Speaker 1: their front lawn. They've given them a much worse experience.

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Speaker 1: So once you break that spell of what a needle

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Speaker 1: means or what you are dudgeon needling to me, it

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Speaker 1: becomes a pleasant, nice experience, and before you know it,

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Speaker 1: you're laying there with fifty needles in your face.

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Speaker 3: Double down.

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Speaker 2: If you could only recommend one acupuncture point for beauty

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Speaker 2: and skin health, what would it be and why?

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Speaker 1: Absolutely? A point called yintang, which is located between the eyebrows.

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Speaker 1: This tends to be an area that women love to botox.

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Speaker 1: It tends to be that area where we're getting the

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Speaker 1: most frown lines and the most expression lines right between

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Speaker 1: the eyebrows there. That also tends to be the area

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Speaker 1: that women will point to first and say, do something

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Speaker 1: about that exist, So it becomes a lovely area that

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Speaker 1: you can massage gently in an outward fashion. So if

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Speaker 1: you imagine a line down the middle of your face,

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Speaker 1: the point is going to lie roughly between your eyebrows,

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Speaker 1: right at that third eye area, a little bit.

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Speaker 2: Lower, so it's kind of where those eleven lines appear

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Speaker 2: to pop.

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Speaker 1: Up, exactly where those eleven lines.

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Speaker 3: Often sign me up for that. That sounds amazing.

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Speaker 1: It's one of those lovely points that helps you feel

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Speaker 1: calm as well.

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Speaker 3: Hit you've been one of the greatest discoveries.

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Speaker 1: Of all time or miss never again never.

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Speaker 2: I want to now move on to our hits and

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Speaker 2: missus Doctor Lilly. This is my favorite part of the

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Speaker 2: show because sometimes we get quite controversial opinions.

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Speaker 3: Oh we love a good controversial opinion.

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Speaker 2: I want to know what is a skincare technique or

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Speaker 2: ingredient that you love and one that you hate?

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Speaker 1: Okay, Well, one skincare technique that I love in particular

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Speaker 1: is gwasher, which of course has become so popular through

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Speaker 1: TikTok and through social media. People are doing their own

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Speaker 1: skincare routines at home, and I think that's fantastic because

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Speaker 1: people find it accessible and they find it useful, and

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Speaker 1: they get to see the benefits. And that's something that

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Speaker 1: I'd love to do for myself all the time. Just

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Speaker 1: use my simple, glacious stones and roller and just get

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Speaker 1: all of that fluid moving and drained down for my face.

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Speaker 2: And you don't even need fancy tools too. You can

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Speaker 2: use your hands as well.

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Speaker 1: That's exactly right. If anything, that pressure and that connection

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Speaker 1: is more important because we live in a society where

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Speaker 1: intimacy and our own relationship with our bodies is so compromised.

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Speaker 1: So having that chance to just touch your face in

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Speaker 1: a skincare routine and massage through, there's a reconciliation that happens.

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Speaker 3: And what about something that you hate, Oh, something.

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Speaker 1: That I hate for sure is these skincare routines that

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Speaker 1: involve a lot of aggressive force, especially around the eyes. Again,

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Speaker 1: that's that kind of delicate area that you want to

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Speaker 1: be treating gently. So when I see skincare routines that

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Speaker 1: are particularly aggressive, I always get that voice in my head.

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Speaker 1: It's like, oh no, no, no, no, no, no, that's no good.

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Speaker 3: We don't need to be doing that to our eye area.

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Speaker 1: That's exactly right. So again, one of the other things

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Speaker 1: is that people will sometimes push and massage upward or

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Speaker 1: treat themselves very aggressively in that manner and not drain

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Speaker 1: any of that down. And it's so easy in modern

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Speaker 1: society to get things like headache anxiety. That's all that

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Speaker 1: energy that's already stuck up. You don't want things stuck

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Speaker 1: up in the heads. You want the head to be

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Speaker 1: able to think clearly so you can make good decisions

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Speaker 1: for your life. So even just a gentle massage down.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Lily, I already want you to please make a

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Speaker 2: space for an appointment for me. Oh, anytime, ready for

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Speaker 2: my cosmetic acupuncture?

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Speaker 3: And for you to message my face.

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Speaker 1: It is a beautiful experience to give someone you see

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Speaker 1: them relax and remember that they just good things too.

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Speaker 2: That's so nice, Doctor Lily. Thank you so much for

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Speaker 2: coming on the show today. I've learned so much from

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Speaker 2: this convo, so I hope I Ubis have too. Thank

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Speaker 2: you so much for coming on.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me.

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Speaker 2: Ubis. Thank you so much for listening to this episode

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Speaker 2: of You Beauty, which will also be my last episode

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Speaker 2: for a while.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to be leaving my.

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Speaker 2: Beautiful little pod baby to go and have a real

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Speaker 2: human baby, but I want to thank you all so

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Speaker 2: much for having me in your ears every week. I've

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Speaker 2: absolutely loved hosting the show and having the chance to

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Speaker 2: speak with so many interesting experts and names.

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Speaker 3: In the beauty industry.

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Speaker 2: I know I've learned a lot over the past couple

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Speaker 2: of years, and I really hope you have too. So

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Speaker 2: until next time, thank you so much for listening to

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Speaker 2: me on the show, and I can't wait to get

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Speaker 2: back in your ears soon. The producer of You Beauty

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Speaker 2: is Steph McPhee, with audio production by Lou Hill, and

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Speaker 2: I'll see you next time.

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Speaker 3: Bye.

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Speaker 2: He