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Speaker 1: You're listening to a MoMA Mea podcast. Mama Mea acknowledges

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Speaker 1: the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast

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Speaker 1: is recorded on. Hello, it's Mia Friedman and I'm dropping

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Speaker 1: into your ears with not an episode of No Filter,

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Speaker 1: but a brand new podcast from Mama Mea that I

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Speaker 1: wanted to share with you, which is kind of in

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Speaker 1: the same family as No Filter, because if you like

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Speaker 1: No Filter, you are going to love Little Love Stories.

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Speaker 1: If you are a longtime listener of Muma Mea podcast,

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Speaker 1: you may have heard of or even listened to at

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Speaker 1: one stage, our family podcast called This Glorious Mess. It

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Speaker 1: was our third ever podcast. The first one was Muma

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Speaker 1: Mer Out Loud, then No Filter, and then This Glorious

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Speaker 1: Mess back in the day. It was hosted by my

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Speaker 1: friend Holly Wainwright and the very entertaining Andrew Daddo, and

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Speaker 1: over the years with a roster of incredible hosts who

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Speaker 1: have aged in and out depending on the ages of

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Speaker 1: their children, the podcast has solved many a parent dilemma.

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Speaker 1: We've spoken to experts, We've vented about breastfeeding, and daycare

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Speaker 1: and mental load, pretty much everything our identity, all of

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Speaker 1: those things that are connected to parenting and a few

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Speaker 1: weeks ago we started changing things up at this Glorious

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Speaker 1: Mess and it entered its new era. Joining our co

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Speaker 1: host Tigan Natoli, who is a mother of three little kids,

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Speaker 1: including twins, we have Annalise Todd, who is in a

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Speaker 1: different phase of parenting. You may know Annalise as the

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Speaker 1: person from our socials who's the elder millennial who's been

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Speaker 1: trying to understand socks. She's often walking around the Mama

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Speaker 1: Mea office wearing a promotional blanket from Binge that got

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Speaker 1: sent in for something because she gets very cold. We

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Speaker 1: have welcomed her to the show. She is a single

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Speaker 1: mother of two boys who are older than Tiger Natolei's kids.

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Speaker 1: And we've also welcomed Sarah Marie Fad to the Mum

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Speaker 1: and Mea family and you'll know her from seeing her

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Speaker 1: on TV on goggle Box. But it's not just new

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Speaker 1: hosts that we've got. We've got new stories and experts

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Speaker 1: and guests to reflect exactly what it means to be

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Speaker 1: a parent or too parent in twenty twenty four, little

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Speaker 1: people and big people of all ages. And as part

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Speaker 1: of this glow up, we have introduced a new episode

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Speaker 1: every week and it's called Little Love Stories, and each

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Speaker 1: episode is an open hearted interview with someone who has

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Speaker 1: a story about love in all kinds of different forms.

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Speaker 1: It might be about a person, or an object or

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Speaker 1: an event. It's all under the broad umbrella of families

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Speaker 1: and love. Little Love Stories explores gratitude through writing, first

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Speaker 1: in the form of a love letter, and that letter

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Speaker 1: then becomes a heartfelt conversation about that topic. And there

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Speaker 1: is such a wide range of stories. There are poignant

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Speaker 1: stories with a love letter from a woman to her

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Speaker 1: breasts after a mastectomy. They've all got so much heart.

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Speaker 1: There is one writing to a mother who's no longer around,

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Speaker 1: also pivoting a full one eighty to complete silliness, sharing

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Speaker 1: a love letter to a therma mix. People are obsessed

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Speaker 1: with therm mixes for making parenting that little bit easier.

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Speaker 1: Apparently it does. I don't know. I don't have one.

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Speaker 1: Little Love Stories is great because it just shows that

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Speaker 1: it's inspiring, it's good news, it's happy news, and it

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Speaker 1: shows these little moments of love and magic. And the

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Speaker 1: episode I'm going to share with you today in case

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Speaker 1: you're wondering if I'm ever going to get to the

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Speaker 1: point and stop talking. It is a love note essay

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Speaker 1: by This Glorious Mess host and Elise Todd, who I

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Speaker 1: told you about. As I said, she's a single parent

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Speaker 1: to two boys who are tweens, and it certainly hasn't

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Speaker 1: been easy for her to transition to this new lifestyle

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Speaker 1: in a new city as a single mother. But she

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Speaker 1: had a moment recently that really gave her some hope

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Speaker 1: and inspiration and a little bit of perspective. This is

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Speaker 1: Little Love Stories by This Glorious Mess. And if you

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Speaker 1: want to hear that podcast, search This Glorious Mess in

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Speaker 1: your podcasts and follow it. I love you.

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Speaker 2: Have you lived with your From Mamma Mia and This

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Speaker 2: Glorious Mess. Welcome to Little Love Stories. I'm Grace Ruvey,

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Speaker 2: the producer of This Glorious Mess, and if my voice

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Speaker 2: sounds familiar, you may have heard me on Mumma MIA's news.

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Speaker 3: Podcast, The Quickie.

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Speaker 2: As I've gotten older, I've enjoyed hearing stories about bravery.

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Speaker 2: When we're young, bravery is really only marketed to us

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Speaker 2: as physical strength or maybe standing up to.

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Speaker 3: The bad guy or the bully.

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Speaker 2: All these sensationalized Hollywood ideas of bravery. But with age

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Speaker 2: and experience, I realized bravery comes in many forms and

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Speaker 2: unexpected moments. Our story today is our very own host

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Speaker 2: of this glorious mess. Annelie Todd, our wise cracking and

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Speaker 2: open hearted writer, podcaster and single mum of two. There

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Speaker 2: has been such a stigma for so many years about

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Speaker 2: single mums. It's portrayed us as negative. I don't take

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Speaker 2: this position lightly or responsibility lightly, to just normalize that

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Speaker 2: this is what a family can look like. But Annelie's

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Speaker 2: Todd isn't just deep in the throes of parenting. She's

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Speaker 2: been demonstrating strength to her two sons in some less

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Speaker 2: obvious ways. Oh well, here's an opportunity that I can

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Speaker 2: give this to my sons. Now, I can show them

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Speaker 2: that women can be strong and brave and capable. So

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Speaker 2: I was really drawn to today's little love story as

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Speaker 2: it asks the question, how do you instill and teach

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Speaker 2: respect to people children, even when you're still learning how.

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Speaker 3: To respect yourself.

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Speaker 2: But first, here's what a little bit of love sounds

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Speaker 2: like today?

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Speaker 3: Uh, oh my god, what's the word? Excellent question? I

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Speaker 3: want to get my answer right.

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Speaker 2: Okay, what does love mean to you?

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Speaker 3: Safety? Support, passion, support, adoration, comfort, Yeah, safety, intimacy and.

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Speaker 2: Heart stressful, interesting and fun.

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Speaker 1: Eating, sexy, communicating.

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Speaker 3: Dedication, compromise and trust, warm.

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Speaker 2: Full and safe an alys. I've been looking forward to

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Speaker 2: this conversation. Welcome to little love Stories. You have so

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Speaker 2: many stories, but this one, it's a pretty important one

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Speaker 2: for you right now.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it is. I think it's important for me, and

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Speaker 3: I think I love sharing single parents stories and voices.

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Speaker 3: You wanted to redefine what it is to be a

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Speaker 3: single parent, or at least the perceived perception of what

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Speaker 3: it is to be a single parent. What do you

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Speaker 3: feel like those perceptions are. I mean, look at the fifties,

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Speaker 3: they weren't even allowed out of the house. And I

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Speaker 3: think there has been such a stigma for so many

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Speaker 3: years about single mums. It's portrayed as negative. And I

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Speaker 3: don't take this position lightly or responsibility lightly to just

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Speaker 3: normalize that this is what a family can look like

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Speaker 3: and it's okay, and it's actually not all doom and gloom,

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Speaker 3: and it's far from it. There really are silver linings

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Speaker 3: to any situation in life. So I'm just happy to

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Speaker 3: share it and be here with your beautiful, soothing voice.

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Speaker 2: So your little love story essay. It's full of vivid

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Speaker 2: examples of your life as a single mum. It begins

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Speaker 2: with you describing your unique commune life as you call it. Yes,

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Speaker 2: I can confirm I have been to the commune. So

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Speaker 2: you had a moment Alice where your perspective of being

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Speaker 2: a single parent. I won't say it started to change immediately,

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Speaker 2: but it opened up the possibility for change. Can you

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Speaker 2: talk me through that trigger point, what happened and how

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Speaker 2: it started to evolve.

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Speaker 3: I had a beautiful friend over who'd been a single

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Speaker 3: mom for many, many years, and she also has two

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Speaker 3: sons very similar ages to mine, and so I was

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Speaker 3: very much sort of leaning in on her because, especially

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Speaker 3: in those early times, you just lean in on other

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Speaker 3: singles parents because they just get it. It was like

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Speaker 3: a Friday night, we'd had a commune dinner, and of

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Speaker 3: course I can never get the TV or internetworking in

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Speaker 3: my house. It's just a permanent pain point, and we

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Speaker 3: were trying to set up the TV. It was just

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Speaker 3: so frustrating, but obviously I was trying to hide in

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Speaker 3: front of the kids and my girlfriend. She was just

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Speaker 3: so calm under pressure, and her little boy, I think

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Speaker 3: he would have been gosh nine. He just said, my

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Speaker 3: mum will figure it out. She can do anything, and

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Speaker 3: she did figure it out. In that moment, I just

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Speaker 3: saw this hope for a positive that can come out

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Speaker 3: of the experience for children of divorce. Because of course,

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Speaker 3: when you have kids, and especially if you separated, the

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Speaker 3: first thing you think about is inflicting pain and trauma

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Speaker 3: and how it's going to impact them and the blueprint

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Speaker 3: of their life. But in that moment, I saw a

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Speaker 3: positive from the child's perspective of how he viewed his mum,

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Speaker 3: that faith, and how he viewed her as so strong

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Speaker 3: and capable and brave. And I thought, oh, well, here's

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Speaker 3: an opportunity that I can give this to my sons.

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Speaker 3: Now I can show them that women can be strong

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Speaker 3: and brave and capable, and I can make them feel

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Speaker 3: very connected with women, and that's hopefully going to set

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Speaker 3: them up for relationships, whether it's romantic or any women

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Speaker 3: in their lives. I felt like, great, they can have

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Speaker 3: that connection and that respect to women.

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Speaker 2: In another part of your essay, you talk about how

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Speaker 2: you would never have chosen this life, but then you

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Speaker 2: go on to speak about how it's given you identity.

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Speaker 2: Could you read that part out for us.

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Speaker 3: Yes, nobody has kids thinking they will only see them

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Speaker 3: half the time. It's incomprehensible, even nearly two years on.

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Speaker 3: I miss them when I'm not with them. It goes

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Speaker 3: against the very instinct we form from the moment they're

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Speaker 3: planked on our chest to sniff their heads and kiss

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Speaker 3: them good night every night. When I'm with them, there's

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Speaker 3: a feeling of wholeness that I don't have when they're

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Speaker 3: not there. But I didn't get a choice, so I'm

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Speaker 3: choosing to make the best of it. And I do

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Speaker 3: like many things in life that test us, that breaks

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Speaker 3: down the very fiber of our being. When we do

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Speaker 3: manage to rebuild ourselves back together again, it can be

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Speaker 3: the making of us. And I would go as far

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Speaker 3: as saying that as a single mum, I am a

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Speaker 3: more present, better parent than I was before. And for that,

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Speaker 3: and for all the reasons above, I can only have

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Speaker 3: gratitude for all the silver linings that brings.

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Speaker 2: When you're reading parts of your article out, it kind

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Speaker 2: of hit you in a different way. What did it

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Speaker 2: bring up and what are you feeling now?

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Speaker 3: In order to function in fifty to fifty custody, you

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Speaker 3: have to be able to compartmentalize. When I'm with my kids,

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Speaker 3: I'm all in, But when I'm not with them, I

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Speaker 3: have to be able to have a wall because it's

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Speaker 3: just too painful. No one has kids thinking they'll only

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Speaker 3: see them half the time. It's a grief.

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Speaker 2: And we know so much about these silver linings of

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Speaker 2: your beautiful commune life, but can you talk us through

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Speaker 2: a few of those.

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Speaker 3: I think it's so important to caveat because I get

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Speaker 3: a lot of feedback from single mums when I talk

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Speaker 3: about my experience who don't get breaks, who have soul custody.

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Speaker 3: I cannot speak to them and their experience because that

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Speaker 3: would be the kind of relentless, exhausting experience that I

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Speaker 3: can't even imagine, and most of us couldn't fathom doing

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Speaker 3: that on your own twenty four seven. For those of

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Speaker 3: us who do get breaks, it's kind of like a

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Speaker 3: double life. You know. When I'm in mum mode, I'm

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Speaker 3: all in, But then when I don't have my kids,

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Speaker 3: I get to be really selfish. For the first time

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Speaker 3: in ten years, I was able to be selfish, and

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Speaker 3: I think that's such a foreign concept, particularly for mums,

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Speaker 3: to be able to have the freedom and the luxury

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Speaker 3: to be selfish. Well, let's dig into what you've found

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Speaker 3: about yourself through having this time to rediscover who you are.

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Speaker 3: What are the parts about your identity that you've discovered

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Speaker 3: by being a single parent. I love not being someone's wife.

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Speaker 3: I do. I love it. I absolutely love it, and

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Speaker 3: I will never be someone's wife again. I just don't

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Speaker 3: want that label. I was so young when I got married,

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Speaker 3: and I feel like at forty, I finally can focus

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Speaker 3: on me and my career and I've got the time

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Speaker 3: and space to do that. Now. I can go to

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Speaker 3: the gym, I can go to the beach and read

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Speaker 3: a book. This is when I don't have my kids, obviously,

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Speaker 3: I go out a lot with friends, and I feel

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Speaker 3: like I refound joy, you know, like that character and

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Speaker 3: inside out too, the function of joy that takes over

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Speaker 3: your brain. And I feel like she was lost and

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Speaker 3: she was lost in the back brain for a long

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Speaker 3: time and she's back and it's just I feel joy

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Speaker 3: in life again. And how do you put that joy

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Speaker 3: that you've found back into parenting? Do the two go

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Speaker 3: hand in hand? They definitely do. And it goes back

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Speaker 3: to having the breaks because I don't see them, so

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Speaker 3: I get rested, and I have that time and space

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Speaker 3: to be selfish. So when I am with them, I'm

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Speaker 3: just so grateful for all of the time that I have,

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Speaker 3: and I just cherish every second. I don't take them

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Speaker 3: for granted anymore. I truly believe I took them for granted.

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Speaker 3: I used to be like ugh, parent burnout and I'm tired,

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Speaker 3: and I just want to go out with my friends.

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Speaker 3: Well now I would like to see them more and

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Speaker 3: I can't. So when I'm with them, I just breathe

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Speaker 3: them in, Yes, creepily. When they're asleep, I'll just walk

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Speaker 3: past and sniff their heads.

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Speaker 2: Yes, will you do that with small children that aren't yours?

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Speaker 3: I know I am a head sniffer. It's a beautiful smell.

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Speaker 3: It's intoxicating.

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Speaker 2: We've heard all about the duality of balancing roles as

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Speaker 2: a single parent, but next up we hear the importance

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Speaker 2: of reclaiming personal time and identity. Annalie's the final part

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Speaker 2: of your essay talks about who you are defining yourself as. Now,

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Speaker 2: could you read that out for us?

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Speaker 3: I am good good at filling my social calendar, but

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Speaker 3: have also gotten good at being on my own, and

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Speaker 3: I am proud of that. Being single and having half

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Speaker 3: my time to myself, I got my identity back. But

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Speaker 3: more than that, there's a strength and resilience ingrained in

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Speaker 3: my new identity. When I am with my kids, I

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Speaker 3: cherish every second I get with them. I have more

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Speaker 3: patience and am just so appreciative of the time I

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Speaker 3: do have with them that I used to take for granted.

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Speaker 3: I've become a fun mum and I'm way more relaxed.

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Speaker 3: I don't sweat the small stuff like ice cream for dinner. Sure,

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Speaker 3: I mean sometimes picnick in front of the Telly watching

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Speaker 3: age inappropriate Reality TV. Definitely. We love doing that. And

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Speaker 3: we get to do activities together now that I enjoy

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Speaker 3: doing with the kids, And even though I see them less,

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Speaker 3: I don't feel like a spectator on.

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Speaker 2: The sidelines anymore. What age inappropriate reality TV? Did you watch?

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Speaker 1: There?

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Speaker 3: Real Housewives Sydney is our favorite. Yes, that's probably our favorite.

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Speaker 3: We just finished Young Sheldon. We've just started modern family. Like,

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Speaker 3: we just have these little rituals and things that we

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Speaker 3: do together now that all three of us just enjoy

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Speaker 3: and just love so much.

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Speaker 2: I can see it now that there's this beautiful spark

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Speaker 2: and this energy as you're talking about it. So what

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Speaker 2: is the most exciting part of this part of your

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Speaker 2: journey and rediscovering yourself. I think the biggest misconception about

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Speaker 2: a marriage ending is that your life ends when your

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Speaker 2: marriage does. And one part of your life definitely ends,

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Speaker 2: that's dead, but it's also this new opportunity for a

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Speaker 2: new life and a new story, and you get to

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Speaker 2: write that story. I'm just very excited about my current

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Speaker 2: story and where it's going to go next. I'm just

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Speaker 2: excited if someone is listening and they're a single parent

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Speaker 2: and they're holding that sense of shame or failure that,

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Speaker 2: as you've said, one part of their life's completely over.

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Speaker 2: What do you want them to take away from this

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Speaker 2: or what do you want them to.

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Speaker 3: Start to work towards.

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Speaker 2: I guess they're thought process around how they see themselves

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Speaker 2: and relationships.

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Speaker 3: If anyone's early on in the journey, there's so many

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Speaker 3: beautiful bits of advice I've been given. One of them

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Speaker 3: is nothing is permanent. Everything's temporary, So no matter how

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Speaker 3: bad it feels in that moment, it literally won't feel

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Speaker 3: like that forever. And then the other beautiful piece of

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Speaker 3: advice that someone gave me was don't focus on the

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Speaker 3: light at the end of the tunnel. Just look out

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Speaker 3: for the glimmers while you're in it, and then at

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Speaker 3: some stage you'll wake up and you'll realize that you're

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Speaker 3: back in the light without even realizing it, and you're

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Speaker 3: living and loving life, and the light's actually brighter than

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Speaker 3: it was before.

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Speaker 2: It really is similar to that beautiful grief metaphor. I

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Speaker 2: don't know if you've seen it, where there's like a

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Speaker 2: ball and over time people think the ball gets smaller,

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Speaker 2: but it's actually the space around it that gets bigger.

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Speaker 2: So that divorce or that separation could always be a

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Speaker 2: pain point, but you're always going to find more space

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Speaker 2: around it, and you're going to find space for the

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Speaker 2: joy to come in or for new opportunities and new experiences.

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Speaker 2: And it sounds like that's something that you've really found

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Speaker 2: in your life over the past two years.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just time. It just takes time and building new, beautiful,

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Speaker 3: positive memories.

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Speaker 2: We always end our little love stories with the question

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Speaker 2: what qualities do you hold most dear about love now?

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Speaker 2: And what's that for you? Annalise to feel safe with love.

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Speaker 2: It's light and it's joy, and there's a doctor Sue saying,

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Speaker 2: which I love.

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Speaker 3: We're all a little weird and life's a little weird,

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Speaker 3: and when we find someone whose weirdness is compatible with ours,

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Speaker 3: we join up with them and fall in mutual weirdness

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Speaker 3: and call it love. Love, mutual weirdness, mutual weirdness. That's

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Speaker 3: our whole office, isn't it It is. That's why I

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Speaker 3: love coming to work every day. We're all just being weird.

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Speaker 2: Oh, Annalise, thank you so much for sharing your little

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Speaker 2: love story and having this conversation today. Annalise is very

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Speaker 2: clever and you can hear her on This Glorious Mess

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Speaker 2: every week, and her full little love story essay will

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Speaker 2: be dropped.

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Speaker 3: In our episode of show Notes. Thank you so much,

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Speaker 3: Thank you for having me, Gracey Greece.

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Speaker 2: If you have a story you'd like to share with us,

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Speaker 2: we'd love to hear it. We're always on the lookout

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Speaker 2: for great stories.

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Speaker 3: And new perspectives.

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Speaker 2: To submit your story, you can leave us a voice

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Speaker 2: note or email us. All the details will be in

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Speaker 2: our show notes.

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Speaker 1: If you love this podcast, you can listen to more

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Speaker 1: of This Glorious Mess. There's a link in the show

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Speaker 1: notes