WEBVTT - Femme Fatale 0:00:12.850 --> 0:00:15.570 You're listening to a Mother and Me a podcast. 0:00:17.970 --> 0:00:21.290 Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of the land and waters. 0:00:21.330 --> 0:00:32.290 This podcast is recorded on acceptance. We all crave it 0:00:32.410 --> 0:00:35.170 because it makes us feel good, but it feels extra 0:00:35.250 --> 0:00:37.730 special when it comes at a time in need and 0:00:37.770 --> 0:00:41.290 from someone who you immediately fancy. This was very much 0:00:41.370 --> 0:00:43.090 the case when Sasha met Jay. 0:00:43.570 --> 0:00:46.570 They kind of zoned in on me, even though there 0:00:46.570 --> 0:00:49.490 were other women trying and she was getting annoyed with 0:00:49.610 --> 0:00:52.970 these other women, but she had eyes on me, and 0:00:53.010 --> 0:00:56.290 she said, well, what are you And I said, well, 0:00:56.290 --> 0:00:59.890 I'm queer, and then she goes, well, there's no such thing. 0:01:00.770 --> 0:01:03.490 You're either a lesbian or or not. And then I 0:01:03.970 --> 0:01:07.570 be me went well no, there's queer, and there's like 0:01:07.770 --> 0:01:11.530 that's not true, and that took her fancy. That was 0:01:11.730 --> 0:01:14.730 thing that ignited her interest to me. Then all of 0:01:14.770 --> 0:01:17.730 a sudden, she's sitting beside me with her hand on 0:01:17.810 --> 0:01:21.810 my lap, and I'm like, okay, and I must have 0:01:21.890 --> 0:01:22.530 been platted. 0:01:23.530 --> 0:01:26.330 But the thing about acceptance is that when you have it, 0:01:26.330 --> 0:01:29.530 it's something you're scared to lose, even if what originally 0:01:29.570 --> 0:01:33.930 felt so good starts to feel isolating and off. 0:01:33.930 --> 0:01:38.330 I was scared of homelessness. I was really scared of it, petrified. 0:01:38.450 --> 0:01:42.170 I was so terrified, and I wasn't building any connections. 0:01:42.170 --> 0:01:45.530 So Weirdly, even though I was so excited, I'm like, 0:01:45.810 --> 0:01:48.610 I'm not actually building a community here. I'm just getting 0:01:48.610 --> 0:01:51.210 more and more isolated with all these wealthy gay people 0:01:51.370 --> 0:01:53.090 who I don't have anything in common with. 0:02:02.770 --> 0:02:05.570 I'm Georgia Love and this is everyone has an ex 0:02:05.770 --> 0:02:07.970 come with me as we dive into a collection of 0:02:08.130 --> 0:02:12.330 unconventional stories about relationships passed through the eyes and the 0:02:12.370 --> 0:02:16.130 hearts of the very people who lived them, meet Sasha. 0:02:16.610 --> 0:02:19.490 Sasha is a proud member of the queer community, though 0:02:19.530 --> 0:02:21.890 at the time our story begins, they didn't really know 0:02:21.970 --> 0:02:24.850 exactly what that meant or where they fit in. They'd 0:02:24.890 --> 0:02:27.050 gone through a lot in their forty seven years. 0:02:27.210 --> 0:02:30.050 When they met Jay, I had just moved back from 0:02:30.130 --> 0:02:34.610 Sydney back to Brisbane. Since that age of forty, I'd 0:02:34.730 --> 0:02:37.850 been moving around a lot. I was managing a lot 0:02:37.890 --> 0:02:41.010 of the complex mental health issues that are sort of 0:02:41.010 --> 0:02:44.770 trauma related. So before that I had worked in public 0:02:44.810 --> 0:02:48.410 relations and i'd also worked as an event manager, but 0:02:48.810 --> 0:02:52.650 because of trauma from the past that I hadn't done 0:02:52.690 --> 0:02:55.490 any work on it kind of all imploded around the 0:02:55.530 --> 0:02:58.850 time I was forty, so I found myself suddenly being 0:02:58.890 --> 0:03:01.810 thrust out of my career and then into this sort 0:03:01.850 --> 0:03:04.850 of journey. So by the time I had met Jay, 0:03:05.090 --> 0:03:08.450 I think I was about forty seven years old, and 0:03:08.490 --> 0:03:10.930 by that time I'd moved twenty times, so I'd had 0:03:10.930 --> 0:03:14.850 been experiencing a lot of homelessness, couch surfing, living in 0:03:14.890 --> 0:03:19.690 boarding houses, struggling to get diagnoses, and also I had 0:03:19.730 --> 0:03:24.690 no family as well. I'm a survivor, a survivor of 0:03:24.810 --> 0:03:27.810 quite a few, I guess, sexual assaults within my family. 0:03:28.290 --> 0:03:31.130 So during that period I was very much definitely trying 0:03:31.130 --> 0:03:33.650 to work out what was wrong with me, trying to 0:03:33.650 --> 0:03:35.810 get over the fact that I had lost my career 0:03:36.210 --> 0:03:39.610 and I'd always been really, really independent always. By the 0:03:39.610 --> 0:03:42.610 time I got to Brisbane, I was exhausted. I still 0:03:42.690 --> 0:03:45.530 was pretty much homeless in the sense that when I 0:03:45.570 --> 0:03:48.490 got to Brisbane, I went to a hostel and then 0:03:48.530 --> 0:03:51.210 after that I was sharing a house with a woman 0:03:51.250 --> 0:03:55.130 and her two kids. But that was really problematic because 0:03:55.490 --> 0:03:58.810 I wasn't really allowed to have friends over. So, I mean, 0:03:58.850 --> 0:04:01.770 I'm forty seven at this time, but that was just 0:04:01.890 --> 0:04:06.090 what I was dealing with. So at that time, I 0:04:06.170 --> 0:04:09.570 was going to meet ups and I was spending a 0:04:09.570 --> 0:04:11.930 lot of time on my recovery. So by that time, 0:04:11.970 --> 0:04:15.890 I'd had my diagnosis, which was complex post traumatic stress disorder. 0:04:17.050 --> 0:04:20.050 So I went to the gym a lot. I had 0:04:20.170 --> 0:04:23.890 seen people bit more on a very transactional kind of level. 0:04:24.370 --> 0:04:27.330 I had had one relationship with a woman when I 0:04:27.490 --> 0:04:29.890 was thirty three, so I was definitely queer. I've been 0:04:29.970 --> 0:04:33.330 queer and out since the eighties. I'm more on the 0:04:33.410 --> 0:04:38.770 pan bisexual spectrum. So my main love interests are women 0:04:39.250 --> 0:04:43.170 and the lesbian space. So I was tooken up, you know. 0:04:43.290 --> 0:04:46.210 And I look great during my forties. I mean I 0:04:46.290 --> 0:04:49.570 looked amazing. I was like long blonde hair. I was 0:04:49.610 --> 0:04:51.770 a size eight, and that was the one thing I 0:04:51.810 --> 0:04:56.770 could control because while I was waiting to see a psychologist, 0:04:57.090 --> 0:05:00.610 I remember thinking, well, how turn it around, I could 0:05:00.650 --> 0:05:04.650 afford the gym. I was totally absolutely obsessed with the gym, 0:05:05.210 --> 0:05:07.410 and it was the one thing that kept me connected 0:05:07.450 --> 0:05:11.050 with professional people and city life. And I just wasn't 0:05:11.090 --> 0:05:14.970 really ready to give up that side of myself. And 0:05:15.010 --> 0:05:17.130 it was good. I was. I loved that period of 0:05:17.130 --> 0:05:19.690 my life. I love being healthy and fit. I loved 0:05:19.930 --> 0:05:23.690 everything about that period. But I wasn't dating, and I 0:05:23.730 --> 0:05:27.610 hadn't dated anyone since i'd left my first girlfriend. So 0:05:28.010 --> 0:05:30.410 what I left them when I was thirty six, I'd 0:05:30.450 --> 0:05:33.010 been a long time, been ten years, and yes I 0:05:33.050 --> 0:05:36.890 had some transactional affairs with men and women, but nothing 0:05:37.330 --> 0:05:39.930 you know, serious. So by the time I got to 0:05:40.290 --> 0:05:44.450 Queensland and I met Jay, I wasn't really thinking about 0:05:44.450 --> 0:05:48.170 a relationship, but I felt really good. I felt like, Okay, 0:05:48.250 --> 0:05:51.130 I'm going to accept the fact that I'm on a disability. 0:05:51.170 --> 0:05:52.930 I'm not going to be ashamed about it. I'm going 0:05:52.970 --> 0:05:56.090 to accept that I have complex PDSD. I'm going to 0:05:56.170 --> 0:06:00.370 accept this radical acceptance. I also looked good and my 0:06:00.450 --> 0:06:03.130 health was good, So that's how I'm That's where I 0:06:03.170 --> 0:06:03.570 met them. 0:06:03.930 --> 0:06:05.650 Where they met was a meetup. 0:06:06.090 --> 0:06:08.290 So meetup is an organization that was set up a 0:06:08.410 --> 0:06:11.130 new I think it's New York, and it's been around 0:06:11.210 --> 0:06:14.490 for a long time. So let's say you fly into Melbourne. 0:06:14.570 --> 0:06:16.650 You could go on to a meetup side of Melbourne 0:06:16.650 --> 0:06:19.090 and there'll be like a group you can just go 0:06:19.170 --> 0:06:21.690 and hang out at a bar, or you can do photography, 0:06:21.770 --> 0:06:24.370 or you can go on a hike. Now this group 0:06:24.530 --> 0:06:26.690 wasn't a gay group, but it was just a bunch 0:06:26.730 --> 0:06:28.690 of women who wanted to go to a gay venue 0:06:28.850 --> 0:06:32.090 because a lot of women feel safe in the queer community. 0:06:32.890 --> 0:06:35.810 And so I had organized the meetup because I actually 0:06:35.850 --> 0:06:38.170 did want to go. I guess I did want to meet, 0:06:38.330 --> 0:06:40.810 you know, a woman, and I was beginning to think, yeah, 0:06:40.810 --> 0:06:45.010 I'm definitely lesbian. Now I'd always I'm denared about. I 0:06:45.090 --> 0:06:47.690 have been in quiz spaces and this is what's always 0:06:47.690 --> 0:06:50.890 really frustrating. Like from the eighties, I've been part of 0:06:50.890 --> 0:06:54.610 the gay community, but because I'm paned, it's always been 0:06:54.610 --> 0:06:57.410 a bit weird. What people might not understand is if 0:06:57.410 --> 0:07:00.010 you're pan or buy there is this thing in the 0:07:00.050 --> 0:07:03.490 community where you're either a lesbian or you're a gay man. 0:07:03.890 --> 0:07:06.410 And I've always felt like I shouldn't be here unless 0:07:06.450 --> 0:07:10.890 I'm with somebody. So at the meetup, I looked amazing, 0:07:10.930 --> 0:07:13.210 I've still got the this this a little pink thing 0:07:13.330 --> 0:07:17.250 that I got a second hand shot with heels. I 0:07:17.290 --> 0:07:21.330 was very f a fembabe. So I had a big, 0:07:21.330 --> 0:07:25.250 big table and there was three people sat down and 0:07:25.410 --> 0:07:27.690 because I had booked it, and they said, can we 0:07:27.730 --> 0:07:30.890 sit down now? One of them was Jay. Now Jay 0:07:31.490 --> 0:07:33.810 got a lot of attention from all the women on 0:07:33.810 --> 0:07:37.410 the table. Very good looking, I guess, a mask presenting 0:07:37.650 --> 0:07:43.290 lesbian and blonde hair, very short men's clothing, very hot 0:07:43.370 --> 0:07:46.570 and in that kind of context, yeah, that everyone's going 0:07:46.690 --> 0:07:51.010 to go wow because masks presenting lesbians, well, for me anyway, 0:07:51.730 --> 0:07:54.490 very attractive and everyone else thought so as well. She 0:07:54.650 --> 0:07:58.010 was with her two mates, two gay boys, and they 0:07:58.050 --> 0:07:59.970 were very friendly and funny. So it was a really 0:08:00.050 --> 0:08:03.690 nice group of gay people that decided to sit down 0:08:03.930 --> 0:08:07.170 with this group of women. They kind of zoned in 0:08:07.210 --> 0:08:10.850 on me, even though there were other women trying and 0:08:10.930 --> 0:08:13.290 she was getting annoy with these other women, but she 0:08:13.450 --> 0:08:16.570 had eyes on me and she said, well what are 0:08:16.610 --> 0:08:18.770 you and that she just said it like that, and 0:08:18.810 --> 0:08:22.250 I'll never forget it because I remember going what and 0:08:22.330 --> 0:08:25.650 I said, well, I'm queer, and then she goes, well, 0:08:25.650 --> 0:08:29.050 there's no such thing. You're either a lesbian or you're not. 0:08:29.650 --> 0:08:32.770 And then I, being me, went well, no, there's queer, 0:08:33.050 --> 0:08:37.410 and there's like that's not true, and that took her fancy. 0:08:37.850 --> 0:08:40.170 That was a thing that ignited her interest to. 0:08:40.170 --> 0:08:43.170 Me, and the interest very much went both ways. 0:08:43.570 --> 0:08:46.930 I was attracted to them. They were very attractive. Then 0:08:46.970 --> 0:08:49.410 all of a sudden, she's sitting beside me with her 0:08:49.650 --> 0:08:53.690 hand on my lap, and I'm like, okay, and I 0:08:53.970 --> 0:08:57.850 must have been flattered. I'm not like normal people where 0:08:57.890 --> 0:09:00.530 I'm like, oh, yeah, they like me, and I don't 0:09:00.530 --> 0:09:03.410 even always get shot by that, to be honest, So 0:09:03.930 --> 0:09:06.330 but I went, okay, yeah, well they like me, and 0:09:06.370 --> 0:09:09.530 it was flirty, so okay, that's fine. And I really 0:09:09.610 --> 0:09:12.610 liked her friends. Her too gay friends were so nice 0:09:12.610 --> 0:09:14.490 and funny, and I did feel like, oh, this is 0:09:14.530 --> 0:09:17.890 exciting gay people because I really want to connect with 0:09:17.930 --> 0:09:22.210 the gay community, right, So then she gave me her number, 0:09:23.050 --> 0:09:25.530 and then I gave her mind, and then I left, 0:09:26.090 --> 0:09:28.290 and then I didn't hadn't even walked out, and they 0:09:28.450 --> 0:09:30.050 texted me, oh, I bet you don't like me, and 0:09:30.090 --> 0:09:32.690 I bet you're never going to contact me again. Now 0:09:32.730 --> 0:09:34.970 my thing was like a bit annoyed, like, of course 0:09:35.010 --> 0:09:38.450 I'm going to contact you again, But I obviously liked 0:09:38.450 --> 0:09:41.890 it because I knew they were attractive. I knew that 0:09:42.210 --> 0:09:44.370 I felt I wanted to be part of the crew. 0:09:44.810 --> 0:09:47.850 I was more interested in her like the crew, the 0:09:47.930 --> 0:09:50.770 three of them. I remember that. I remember being excited, Oh, 0:09:50.810 --> 0:09:52.530 I'm going to be part of the gay community. This 0:09:52.610 --> 0:09:56.290 is what I want. And then suddenly we started getting 0:09:56.330 --> 0:09:58.970 into the flirting and the and it sort of went 0:09:59.010 --> 0:09:59.410 from there. 0:09:59.810 --> 0:10:02.410 Sasha was brand new in this city and suddenly, for 0:10:02.450 --> 0:10:04.930 the first time in a long time, they'd begun to 0:10:04.970 --> 0:10:09.490 feel accepted, wanted and excited. And it moved really quickly. 0:10:09.730 --> 0:10:11.490 I met her on a Saturday, and then the next 0:10:11.810 --> 0:10:14.450 I know, I meet her on the Tuesday. And she's 0:10:14.810 --> 0:10:18.370 a business person. She's got a like a car that 0:10:18.490 --> 0:10:21.690 business people drive, like a very nice car, everything that 0:10:21.730 --> 0:10:25.170 I don't have. I'm definitely have none of those things. 0:10:25.290 --> 0:10:27.570 And they rock up and the first thing they do 0:10:27.650 --> 0:10:30.490 were in the car and they drove me to go 0:10:30.570 --> 0:10:33.090 on a date and have a meal, and they just 0:10:33.170 --> 0:10:36.290 kissed me. That's not how I saw what was going 0:10:36.330 --> 0:10:40.290 to happen. But the thing is with Jay is that 0:10:40.370 --> 0:10:44.730 they really are someone that they're very not forceful in 0:10:44.770 --> 0:10:48.330 an aggressive way. They're very charming, but they work very quickly. 0:10:49.170 --> 0:10:51.890 I have met that kind of person in the gay community, 0:10:52.130 --> 0:10:56.450 someone that's just talking a lot and moving very quickly. 0:10:57.410 --> 0:11:01.090 It's all very dramatic. They didn't want the date to end, 0:11:01.570 --> 0:11:03.370 and me being me, I'm going, oh, I'm tired now, 0:11:03.370 --> 0:11:05.370 I want to go home. That I know, let's do 0:11:05.450 --> 0:11:08.050 this and let's do that. I don't know how I felt. 0:11:08.170 --> 0:11:12.170 I must have liked them because I obviously kept hanging out. 0:11:12.250 --> 0:11:15.650 I was very lonely, and also I hadn't been in 0:11:15.690 --> 0:11:18.810 a car for a long time or driven around. I 0:11:18.850 --> 0:11:22.090 really liked that. There were things I definitely like, oh, 0:11:22.090 --> 0:11:25.330 this is nice, levels of comfort that I'd forgotten about. 0:11:25.930 --> 0:11:29.770 I wasn't really thinking anything. I had no expectations because 0:11:29.810 --> 0:11:32.890 I had so many weird adventures. My life had been 0:11:32.930 --> 0:11:35.930 one weird adventure, like I was in such a strange 0:11:36.010 --> 0:11:40.290 no person's land for such a long time. Most people 0:11:40.330 --> 0:11:43.690 have lived like, you know, maybe there's some little disruptions 0:11:43.690 --> 0:11:46.450 in the life. My life was one big disruption mentally, 0:11:46.730 --> 0:11:50.330 I'd been struggling with my mental health. So maybe I 0:11:50.330 --> 0:11:52.810 felt flattered too, because they made me feel quite pretty. 0:11:53.490 --> 0:11:55.330 And I did feel at that time I was really 0:11:55.330 --> 0:11:58.210 good looking, Like I really believed it, and I thought, 0:11:58.570 --> 0:12:01.810 I mean, yeah, it made me feel good about myself physically, 0:12:01.850 --> 0:12:04.290 and I think that's important, and they definitely made me 0:12:04.290 --> 0:12:07.290 feel pretty good. And also, when I think about it, 0:12:06.890 --> 0:12:10.090 they chose me out of a big group of attractive women, 0:12:10.970 --> 0:12:13.370 so yeah, they must have been really making me feel 0:12:13.410 --> 0:12:14.290 good about myself. 0:12:14.570 --> 0:12:16.370 There was part of it that made sash I feel 0:12:16.410 --> 0:12:20.090 a little uncomfortable, but they pushed it down. This woman 0:12:20.250 --> 0:12:23.530 was great and interested. They didn't want to sabotage it. 0:12:23.890 --> 0:12:27.410 There was another side of me going, ah, this is 0:12:27.810 --> 0:12:32.010 going very quickly, and this person's moving so fast, and 0:12:32.050 --> 0:12:35.090 I'm finding it a little bit overwhelming, but let's see 0:12:35.130 --> 0:12:38.250 what happens. So then I think maybe a week or 0:12:38.250 --> 0:12:40.530 two weeks into it, we went to Cans because why not. 0:12:41.770 --> 0:12:44.730 And I think it was me who actually went, but 0:12:44.850 --> 0:12:48.090 I didn't mean it. I was just like, oh, let's go, 0:12:48.130 --> 0:12:50.930 and wouldn't be great if we did this. I was 0:12:50.970 --> 0:12:53.450 not thinking, I'm a thinking, oh, yeah, we're going to 0:12:53.490 --> 0:12:55.890 do that. I hadn't been on a trip for ten years. 0:12:56.210 --> 0:12:59.570 It's just me going, oh, wouldn't that be nice? You know, daydreaming, 0:12:59.730 --> 0:13:01.450 you know, when you're flirting with people and you make 0:13:01.530 --> 0:13:03.410 up little I wouldn't it be nice to do this 0:13:03.450 --> 0:13:07.650 and that and something? It's happening and they're making it happen, 0:13:07.850 --> 0:13:09.850 and it's happening really quickly, and I'm going, oh, wait 0:13:09.850 --> 0:13:12.570 a minute, I have no money. No I can't, and 0:13:12.650 --> 0:13:15.330 now I'll pay for everything, and I'm like, oh, I 0:13:15.450 --> 0:13:18.850 don't feel very comfortable with that. But and then it 0:13:18.970 --> 0:13:21.290 was like a well, camp so we're going into this 0:13:21.330 --> 0:13:24.490 whole negotiation thing, and I'm like, okay, camping's fine. So 0:13:24.650 --> 0:13:26.570 in the end, we went on a bloody road trip 0:13:27.010 --> 0:13:30.730 to Cans. We all know that Cans road trip doesn't 0:13:30.730 --> 0:13:33.570 matter where you're coming from, it's you're in the car 0:13:33.690 --> 0:13:38.410 for a long time. So we went, and I must 0:13:38.450 --> 0:13:41.850 admit it was a really good trip. It was around 0:13:41.930 --> 0:13:43.770 New Year's so it must have been really quick. I 0:13:43.850 --> 0:13:47.810 met them December the seventeenth, and suddenly New Year's I'm 0:13:47.850 --> 0:13:50.690 there meeting her mate. So we stayed at a mate's place. 0:13:50.810 --> 0:13:53.170 So they were good like that. They made sure that 0:13:53.290 --> 0:13:56.090 I wasn't put into a financial I could pay a 0:13:56.210 --> 0:13:59.490 camping site thing and I could contribute because I said 0:13:59.530 --> 0:14:02.090 to them, look, I'm not a business person. I'm on 0:14:02.170 --> 0:14:05.130 a very low income and I don't like people paying 0:14:05.210 --> 0:14:07.330 for me. But they're like, oh, but that's how we 0:14:07.410 --> 0:14:10.210 show our love, and I'm like, you're just I just 0:14:10.730 --> 0:14:14.490 don't feel comfortable, and oh, but you deserve nice things, 0:14:14.570 --> 0:14:17.090 and I thinking, but I have nice things, Like I 0:14:17.250 --> 0:14:19.050 go to a knop shop and I buy my you know, 0:14:19.130 --> 0:14:22.010 I've got my life where exactly it gives me what 0:14:22.090 --> 0:14:24.850 I need? Anyway, So we go to Cannes. We end 0:14:24.970 --> 0:14:29.250 up at this New Year's party. I looked amazing. I 0:14:29.370 --> 0:14:35.370 was all like tanned, a long hair, sexy dress. They're 0:14:35.450 --> 0:14:37.970 they're being really like arm around me, making sure I'm 0:14:38.010 --> 0:14:41.810 not going too far. But this one, very very queer person, 0:14:41.970 --> 0:14:44.330 very creative person. He's going, you want to get away 0:14:44.370 --> 0:14:46.770 from them, you don't want to be with them. He 0:14:47.130 --> 0:14:51.450 followed me all night. He's going that person is a 0:14:51.570 --> 0:14:53.530 moneyed person and they're going to want to control you. 0:14:54.210 --> 0:14:57.490 And it's like this angel and they're finally like, you 0:14:57.610 --> 0:15:00.650 have to leave, you're too beautiful, and he's going to 0:15:00.850 --> 0:15:04.130 this person will control you. They just want to use you. 0:15:05.130 --> 0:15:06.690 And they ended up getting to the point where she 0:15:06.850 --> 0:15:09.610 got into a huge argument with him. I remember thinking 0:15:09.610 --> 0:15:12.210 it was very weird. He was gay. He was a 0:15:12.250 --> 0:15:16.810 gay man, Like it wasn't about that's why my Oh no, 0:15:18.130 --> 0:15:18.890 it was weird. 0:15:19.370 --> 0:15:21.450 This guy didn't even know Jay, he'd only met them 0:15:21.490 --> 0:15:25.170 that night, but Sasha pushed it aside. They really liked 0:15:25.290 --> 0:15:26.850 Jay and this was going well. 0:15:27.330 --> 0:15:30.930 She said, I'm so obsessed with you. You don't understand 0:15:31.010 --> 0:15:33.770 how obsessed I am with you. I just don't know 0:15:33.890 --> 0:15:38.170 what it is about you. I was pretty impressed with her. 0:15:38.770 --> 0:15:41.050 I actually had a lot of respect for them, and 0:15:41.210 --> 0:15:44.090 they were sexy, like I really found them very attractive. 0:15:44.170 --> 0:15:45.970 But I must have met I wasn't thinking, oh, yeah, 0:15:46.010 --> 0:15:48.970 I'm gonna live with this person forever. I really was 0:15:49.050 --> 0:15:50.970 thinking more like this is just an adventure. 0:15:52.890 --> 0:15:56.450 But soon that changed because as they spent more time together, 0:15:56.770 --> 0:15:59.690 they realized it wasn't really feasible when Sasha was living 0:15:59.730 --> 0:16:02.130 in someone else's house who didn't like visitors. 0:16:02.690 --> 0:16:06.610 They didn't like the fact that they couldn't come to 0:16:06.730 --> 0:16:10.730 my place. They owned a house. They lived upstairs with 0:16:10.850 --> 0:16:15.290 their mum and downstairs was like a unit, and they 0:16:15.370 --> 0:16:17.170 just said, well, why don't I rent that out to you? 0:16:18.090 --> 0:16:22.170 And I guess I just did it without thinking, yeah, 0:16:22.690 --> 0:16:26.730 I just did it. I think there was deep anxiety 0:16:26.810 --> 0:16:30.610 around homelessness and maybe a hope that this could be 0:16:31.050 --> 0:16:33.210 I could you know, I mean I don't think I 0:16:33.370 --> 0:16:36.250 was like thinking manipulative or anything like that. I was 0:16:36.330 --> 0:16:38.890 all very much like just doing what felt right at 0:16:38.890 --> 0:16:41.770 the moment without actually thinking. I was so used to 0:16:41.850 --> 0:16:44.810 you hauling my first relationship, we moved really quickly, I'd 0:16:44.850 --> 0:16:47.930 actually moved into state, and there is that thing, Oh, 0:16:48.050 --> 0:16:50.370 this is just normal, this is just what we do. 0:16:50.690 --> 0:16:54.170 I really wasn't questioning any of it. It's just that's 0:16:54.250 --> 0:16:56.650 what gay would they do. It's meant to be like this. 0:16:57.610 --> 0:17:00.410 So the thing is like, you know, tell us a 0:17:00.450 --> 0:17:02.450 story of the lead up of how you got married, 0:17:02.530 --> 0:17:04.890 and then the joke is, well, there is no lead 0:17:04.970 --> 0:17:07.570 up because we met, we dated, we had a really 0:17:07.650 --> 0:17:10.650 long date. Usually the date might last two days. You know, 0:17:10.730 --> 0:17:13.770 there's that joke, and then we moved in with each 0:17:13.810 --> 0:17:16.410 other and we've been married since and that's it. And 0:17:16.530 --> 0:17:21.810 that's kind of the lesbian bisexual, the queer woman fantasy. 0:17:22.770 --> 0:17:24.690 It's not like we talk about that because it's always 0:17:24.730 --> 0:17:27.850 the lesbian eu hall. That's what we all joke about. 0:17:27.930 --> 0:17:31.050 And falling in love really quickly, crushing really quickly, the 0:17:31.170 --> 0:17:33.770 awkwardness of it sometimes it can be a bit high 0:17:33.770 --> 0:17:35.330 school and the best way possible. 0:17:35.810 --> 0:17:38.490 So they packed the U haul and Sasha moved in 0:17:38.810 --> 0:17:39.850 with Jay and her mum. 0:17:40.250 --> 0:17:43.450 I was excited. It was not just the relationship with 0:17:43.570 --> 0:17:47.730 her or her friends, her family. She had a huge family. 0:17:48.210 --> 0:17:49.610 They were the things that we were really so I 0:17:49.850 --> 0:17:52.690 was excited, and I guess I moved in and also 0:17:52.730 --> 0:17:55.570 I thought, well, here's a roof over my head. But 0:17:55.730 --> 0:17:58.650 then all of a sudden it got Yeah, it just 0:17:59.050 --> 0:18:04.930 the honeymoon period just finished. As soon as I moved in, 0:18:05.050 --> 0:18:08.690 her grandmother died. So that was the end pretty much 0:18:08.810 --> 0:18:11.170 of our intimate life. Right at the beginning, we had 0:18:11.170 --> 0:18:15.570 this full on intimacy. And then I think I moved 0:18:15.610 --> 0:18:17.690 in with her maybe four weeks after I'd met her, 0:18:18.010 --> 0:18:21.890 and that was the end. She started to change. Suddenly 0:18:22.210 --> 0:18:25.690 we're caught up with the grief because also she was grieving. 0:18:25.810 --> 0:18:29.890 She had just broken up with a girlfriend of six 0:18:30.050 --> 0:18:34.090 years and that was very, very messy. So there was 0:18:34.290 --> 0:18:36.690 that so that everyone was still talking about that because 0:18:36.690 --> 0:18:39.730 it was so recent, so the ghost of her ex 0:18:40.050 --> 0:18:43.330 was there. But hey, that's another lesbian trope. There's always 0:18:43.370 --> 0:18:47.290 a third person, there's always an next girlfriend. Yeah, so 0:18:47.770 --> 0:18:50.170 I kind of wasn't really too shocked because every woman 0:18:50.250 --> 0:18:52.450 that I've even had a fling with I think. I 0:18:52.530 --> 0:18:54.290 remember I woke up once and there was a woman 0:18:54.410 --> 0:18:56.810 sitting at the end of the you know it's always 0:18:57.130 --> 0:19:01.050 you know whatever, but I remember it being really heavy. 0:19:01.770 --> 0:19:04.650 When I moved in, she started making comments. You go, Okay, 0:19:04.690 --> 0:19:07.610 how many men have you start with? And that made 0:19:07.650 --> 0:19:11.290 me feel so ashamed. She'd be like, oh, how many 0:19:11.370 --> 0:19:13.770 men if you slept with? And I'm like, this is 0:19:13.850 --> 0:19:15.650 making me feel really bad, and she go, I just 0:19:15.690 --> 0:19:18.410 don't know if I can, you know, compete with all 0:19:18.490 --> 0:19:21.810 those men, and You've got so much more experience than me. 0:19:21.930 --> 0:19:26.090 And I went into the shame like I just lost. 0:19:26.410 --> 0:19:29.210 I think that I lost complete interests in sex. 0:19:31.530 --> 0:19:33.770 So if sex was off the table at this stage 0:19:33.810 --> 0:19:36.570 in their relationship, all they really had to do was talk. 0:19:37.250 --> 0:19:40.530 But the thing is with Jay, they don't talk, and 0:19:40.610 --> 0:19:42.690 that I think is when I trauma bonded with her, 0:19:42.730 --> 0:19:46.130 because that's when I didn't find out about any of 0:19:46.250 --> 0:19:49.970 her past from her. They never spoke about their past. 0:19:50.050 --> 0:19:52.250 The only thing they ever talked about was their business, 0:19:53.010 --> 0:19:54.850 and that was it and how much money. The first 0:19:54.850 --> 0:19:56.410 thing they do in the morning is I'd look at 0:19:56.450 --> 0:19:58.410 their fine how much money they had in their account 0:19:58.450 --> 0:20:01.490 and work. So they were very very business and money 0:20:01.570 --> 0:20:04.330 focused and also buying stuff. The only thing they ever 0:20:04.450 --> 0:20:07.010 talked about was things they were going to buy. And 0:20:07.210 --> 0:20:10.690 I must admit, yeah, very boring, no interest at all 0:20:10.770 --> 0:20:15.530 in politics, interest in anything deep. But her mother was different. 0:20:15.610 --> 0:20:18.890 Her mother definitely loved talking about the past and it 0:20:19.010 --> 0:20:21.970 was very traumatic. And I would just get stuck with 0:20:22.130 --> 0:20:26.210 these conversations with her mother about really really traumatic, distressing 0:20:26.290 --> 0:20:30.330 conversations that even Jay didn't know about. Because I'd go 0:20:30.450 --> 0:20:32.530 back and go, I'm like, God, your mom's just told 0:20:32.570 --> 0:20:34.770 me all that. All I could see was the little 0:20:34.850 --> 0:20:37.570 girl in this person. And then that's when I started 0:20:37.570 --> 0:20:40.330 to see more of that person, that little girl. So 0:20:40.530 --> 0:20:45.330 suddenly Jay's sick all the time. They were sick all 0:20:45.410 --> 0:20:48.690 the time with ulcers, and I'm like, yeah, that's because 0:20:48.810 --> 0:20:51.730 you need to go see a psychologist. But they're like no, no, no, 0:20:51.850 --> 0:20:54.810 no no. And then I guess that's where I started 0:20:54.850 --> 0:20:57.250 become like I helped. I mean, here I am this 0:20:57.370 --> 0:20:59.850 new person I'm helping at the funeral, being the people 0:20:59.930 --> 0:21:02.610 pleaser I am. And then we're meeting all her family 0:21:02.690 --> 0:21:06.570 who don't like me. I think they're quite it's not me, 0:21:06.850 --> 0:21:10.610 but how they treated me, like the silent treatment her 0:21:10.690 --> 0:21:15.330 auntie had intellectually disabled son. And I said, oh, I'm 0:21:15.770 --> 0:21:19.970 Jay's girlfriend, and I got told off like he doesn't 0:21:20.010 --> 0:21:22.570 have capacity to understand that you're just a friend. And 0:21:23.250 --> 0:21:25.730 I'm like, oh, wait a minute, what's going on here? 0:21:26.330 --> 0:21:29.890 And it was a very straight, very I guess, let's 0:21:29.930 --> 0:21:33.290 just say country folk. But I was being dumped on 0:21:33.410 --> 0:21:36.290 and dumped on her mother just and I just was 0:21:36.330 --> 0:21:39.610 getting quieter and quiet and quieter, and I think the 0:21:39.730 --> 0:21:44.250 sex was going downhill. Jay was beginning to just close. 0:21:44.610 --> 0:21:48.370 They were totally ill and stressed and upset, and so 0:21:48.490 --> 0:21:49.770 there was no romance. 0:21:50.250 --> 0:21:52.770 This early in a relationship, it's pretty easy to just 0:21:52.810 --> 0:21:56.450 say whoa, Okay, this is not for me, right, That's 0:21:56.490 --> 0:21:57.410